Unzipping Taboos: Candid Conversations about Sex - Holding Onto Hope: Turning Celebration into Change

Episode Date: November 12, 2025

In this post-election episode, we take a breath—and a moment to celebrate. After the November elections, we found ourselves feeling something we hadn’t in a while: optimism. In this episode, we talk about what it means to hold onto that feeling and how to turn it into action.We talk about the power of showing up and how to move from celebration to sustained action.  From reproductive rights to education, equality, and justice, we explore how real progress depends on everyday engagement, not just election cycles. Highlighting that inclusive education and community care, and everyday actions—big and small—can shift the conversation and create lasting change.Hope isn’t passive—it’s a practice. And keeping it alive means continuing to question, challenge, and participate in shaping the world we want to live in.If you have a story, thoughts and/or a topic or question for Dr. Sue and Charlie please share your ideas here:  ⁠Show suggestions

Hey, everyone. Welcome to Unzipping Taboos, candid conversations about sex with Dr. Sue and Charlie. We're here to explore the questions you've always been curious about, but don't always feel comfortable asking out loud. No judgment, no shame, just open, honest conversations. So let's zip down and get candid. Before we get started, we have now partnered with jackandjilladult.com, one of the top online adult stores. And because you're here with us, you get 20% off with code UNZIPPING20. So go check them out. Now that that bit of business is out of the way today, we are excited about this episode. For those of you that may have listened to us at the beginning of the year, this will be a little bit different than an episode we

recorded earlier. But coming off of the election, election Tuesday, that just happened. And a lot of the results that we saw, especially in local governments that make us feel hopeful, and talking about the power of doing something. So holding on to this hope, basking in this hope, but staying focused, because we need to there's still work to be done. Yeah. But before we do that, I'm here with Dr. Sue. Hey, Dr. Sue. Hey, Charlie. How's it going? It's going way better than it has in a couple months, at least, as truth be told. You want to give our listeners a little bit about your background before we unzip? Sure. So I actually started my career, I wanted to be a high school health teacher. And so I have a bachelor's and a master's in health education.

And I bring that up in this capacity because I witnessed censorship happening in classrooms, even way back when. Although that might not surprise anyone when I say way back when, like they think censorship was back when. I decided to specialize and get my Ph.D. in human sexuality education. And then I started teaching college. And that's been the main focus of the work that I do. So I do the professor thing. I teach undergraduate classes. I write books. I speak places. But it's always been really important to me to do work outside of academia. And so I work with basically anyone who says, come talk to our people. And those people could be anywhere from like 13 to mid 80s. I think mid 80s is my highest recorded. um answering sex questions giving information um i've worked in reproductive health clinics you know i've been in a lot of ways while i've been in in the ivory tower with one foot i've been boots on the ground with the other and so like i do a lot of this talking about what can

you do in your local community and so i'm i'm really excited about tuesday um when we say tuesday we're talking about last tuesday which was november 4th 2025 um so i just just i don't know when people are going to find this episode wait it's 20 for the archives um so yeah so just i mean my background both in academia and outside of academia dealing with things like censorship and um the power of people and making change or stopping change unfortunately sometimes um so yeah that's me but you already have heard the voice of our curious co-host charlie for those of you who do and do not know charlie charlie is really just one of those people who likes to challenge all the things just challenge all the things yeah um the only things i care about are

things around sex and sexuality and relationships those who just challenge everywhere else but charlie you should tell us more about you i mean that really sums it up i um am someone who has always enjoyed challenging, um, societal expectations, especially of me as a woman in this, um, American Western society, um, and the roles that are expected or behaviors or how I present myself. Um, when really for me from the, the earliest time I can remember, I have always felt like, well, I can do it. I've never felt inhibited by being a woman or a young girl. You know, I've never felt inhibited by my gender or my sex. And so really, it is just that that it's very much that and that breeds my curiosity of like, why were we conditioned

that way. Why do we perpetuate these things? Why can't we undo them? Or why are we hesitant to undo them? So really having conversations, not just with my darling friend, Dr. Sue, but other people in my life, just really digging in, you know, I, for, I would say about 10 years ago, when we saw the evolution of the current, um, MAGA movement. Um, there was just a lot of people that came across where pieces of it resonated with them. And rather than being dismissive, I met it with skeptical curiosity, because I'm not going to say I stayed completely open. That would be a lie. That would be a misrepresentation. Um, but curiosity of like, okay, you're saying this, but really how, how does that impact you? Or are you hearing it somewhere? And, you know,

so those, um, it's that curiosity and it is that, that need to deconstruct that I think has always been an inherent trait of mine. And, um, probably to the chagrin of any mental health professionals listening, describe myself as a psychology hobbyist, you know, just enough to be slightly dangerous. But I also know that I don't know enough to be an expert, but I do find psychology and humanity and how we all figure out how to navigate our existence, our time here together, how we figure that out and what we do and how societies react to certain things. So that's why I'm here I did it yay so I'm gonna totally take credit for this episode because this was yes you should yeah you absolutely should so for those of you who are unaware of how

of how um of how episodes come to be um sometimes we're responding directly to you so we do have a way that you can reach out and send us ideas or topics or even if it's not like a full-fledged idea if you're just like i kind of need to know more about this like we'll make it into a show um and we'll have a link to that in the description so you sometimes we're responding directly to people who have submitted anonymously it is anonymous so don't worry that we're going to judge you um sometimes we're responding to things people are saying to either of us offline sometimes we're responding to things that happen in my classroom sometimes we're responding to things that you send me by social media that piss me off i piss

you off first you piss you off and then you send it to me and then she's absorbing your anger and um but this one was this one this one came to be because we sat down and we said okay where are we going you know we kind of plot out where we're going um in the next few weeks months things like that. And it was very soon after November 4th. And there was just this overwhelming feeling of hope, which for me as a New Yorker is not a feeling I'm familiar with. And it wasn't just about what happened in the mayoral race in New York City. It was about what happened in Virginia and what happened in Bucks County, Pennsylvania, and what happened in New Jersey and what happened in North Carolina and the fact that all Moms for Liberty Board of Ed candidates didn't

win, like Prop 50, like in California, it was all of these things. It was the first time in a long time that we were excited about where things were going. And we also thought it was important to do, and correct me if I'm wrong, but we had done an episode back in January about, you know, we had this conversation of like, do we still do this? Do we still do this podcast? is it safe for us to do this podcast is it and we decided that doing it was an act of resistance and we still check in very regularly about safety um and and what i know i more feel like i'm

banging my head against the wall than you are but um you're more optimistic than maybe maybe different walls so we don't see it but it was it was really the first time that we felt like there had been change and and what we're really cognizant of the fact is that the change was made by people whether it was people voting or people voting and canvassing or voting and canvassing and marching or voting i mean it comes down to voting at the end of the day november 4th was about voting but it was all the things that went into it it was about doing something simple like sharing information on your social media to going out if you went to a no kings rally or canvassing if you were doing that I know I've done phone banking to try to get people aware of upcoming

votes I've sent out postcards of like if you need to know how to you know do voter registration here's how you do it it's about all these things that people were doing this was people driven and it the just the joy and I'm like we have to do an episode about the joy and the hope because these are weird feelings for me Yeah. Well, I mean, we certainly give, give ourselves space for the frustration and the anger. Um, and we did so back in January, we recorded that episode, um, before the inauguration and I think it aired maybe early, mid February, but, but the part of that discussion, it was that we did that episode we need to give ourselves the the joy and the space to feel this and and those

of you that listen with us um it was a really different night election night and that hasn't happened in a long time yeah and because this hasn't happened in a long time we would have been remiss not to give ourselves the space for this episode since we, as I say, give our space for the anger, the fear, the other things. It's time to talk about this, but also important while we're doing this to remember that this doesn't mean that we take our eye off the ball either. And it doesn't mean that things are going to get better instantly because because i've always had conversations with folks about fear um and the fear of people getting angry about some of the things that happened and finding ways that are both legal and illegal to strike

back and you know trans folks are still being attacked and denied their rights and the supreme court has still agreed to hear a case that could overturn same-sex marriage like we're not what we did what we did as a country was huge on Tuesday it's it's a step it's not the end I think it's a reminder yeah more importantly it is a reminder for the power of showing up because look I know that some of that I had these conversations recently with some people not not versed in american politics because they don't live in america and some of them were surprised when talking about the 2024 election when i said this happened because a third of our voting public didn't show up to vote and i know and i know many reasons why um because the the democratic

campaign stayed centrist when the the progressive democrats were saying please pay this is what we need you to do this is what we need to see for us to show up so not showing up was because of very little to no faith in in that vote and in some ways um but there is power in showing up no matter what's on the ballot yeah no matter and especially i'm gonna say especially i mean it's always important to show up. It's always, always important to show up and vote. Um, but it is, I, sometimes I think a little bit more tantamount to do so when you have local or special elections, because then that feeds up. So we knew the joy and the hope wasn't going to last long for me. The number of young folks that I know, and I know quite a few young folks who are in that

like just new 18 year old, they didn't vote because they're like, why do I care about who's my mayor? And I'm like, I shouldn't have to explain that to you. First of all, you should have learned that in school. Second of all, I feel like you should have learned that from your parents and caregivers. And yeah, I'm calling you out if you happen to be listening to this. Like I learned very early on about civic responsibility and civic duty. And one of those was to vote. My parents would take, I don't have their consent to sell this story, but it's my story too. So I'm you know it used to be like we went into the booth and you pulled the thing and like the curtain closed it was very dramatic and they brought me in with them until i was old enough

to know how they were voting once i was old enough to read they're like no no or like understand like this is a private vote um but like they they taught me the importance and so when i hear young people young people who are going to be some of the most damaged people by by this because it takes decades to turn around bad generations yeah it takes decades and generations to turn around bad um legislation and and and like you have the most well we all have the most to lose right now but for you to say something like that i don't why do i care who my mayor is i'm just like i don't even know how to begin to explain the importance of this you you have and it shouldn't be the right to vote you have the responsibility to vote and so there was some well that that was the surprise

of the people that i was having a conversation with who aren't who don't live in america when i said that because their their argument was well everybody that i've talked to from america feels this way about the current administration not a favorable way is the majority of what this um these people were hearing and i and then i explained the percentage that didn't show up and one of them asked oh is it not compulsory i said no it's not yeah other countries and that was like a light bulb because i think they had always been operating under the assumption that we have compulsory voting similar to where they're from and so it was confusing to them that they hear all this feedback this anecdotal feedback um from americans that don't have a

favorable view and but yet we have the administration we have and then it it really was fascinating to go to see that oh that makes sense now yes yeah well let's get back to let's get back to the exciting things and and and the momentum that this can create because i think um from my early political edification um i don't think many of us have felt this at least um since the first time barack obama came into the political mainstream yeah and that's a little bit of what this feels like to me yeah a lot of hope a lot of change a lot of motivation yeah but but i want to come back because i know people like why are you talking about this on a sex show like seriously sure yeah because it is about the power of showing up and it's it's maybe you are

not trans but you show up for the person who is whether you know them or not you don't have to know someone who's being impacted by having their lives threatened to give a damn um it's it's showing up and having your voice heard about topics like abortion and same-sex marriage and the number of of people i kind of want to throw words in front of that but i don't want to be too inflammatory that i basically heard saying that this is this this whole vote was proof that women shouldn't have the right to vote oh gosh yeah like if we want can we talk about that new york times title no because i will lose my ever-loving mind about that we can do it another day but not today it's supposed to be about hope damn it yes stay focused yes so so it's about

showing up it's about showing up and casting your ballot for yourself and your children if you have them or about the kids in your lives that maybe you're not related to directly it's a it's about protecting the people who need you to protect them it's about using your power and your privilege in one of the most basic ways that you can um and so it doesn't just stop at the voting though and that's so that's where i get a lot into it so there are some classes that i teach at a graduate level that piss people not the content pisses them off because it's the first time they're learning some of it and it's not necessarily around sex so though sometimes it is and they get to this like first they get to this oh my god i didn't know about this why and then we have a

discussion about why they never learned it and then they get into this phase and it's where they are right now so it was interesting to see it kind of come together where they're like i can't do anything and i'm like but she can yes but you can well i'm just one voice you're not one voice you can be one of many and maybe sometimes you will be that lone person screaming into the wind but you may be giving hope to someone who's listening to you say it and so when i start talking about this from a sex perspective, I had, when I was not living in New York, I was living somewhere else. And I was on a citizens committee that was helping to relook at the incredibly outdated health curriculum. And we spent months, months working on this. Like we took advice from

professionals. We took advice from teachers. We took advice from parents. We took advice from stakeholders. And we come up with this thing and suddenly there's community pushback. They don't like, I don't want anyone falling out of their chair. I'm sitting down. Don't worry. That we wanted to use the term parent or guardian because it was recognized that sometimes people are raised by single parents or by aunties or as by grandmas or by like that was their it wasn't even about like gay marriage, gay parents don't have a place in the curriculum.

it was about using the singular parent slash guardian they derailed the entire curriculum so that was supposed to be about hope um the curriculum did get passed they basically asked all of us to leave like somehow it was our fault and they brought a whole new group and then the grassroots organization moved on to fight somewhere else because it wasn't really grassroots it was really not supported by locals it was supported by larger organizations that were trying to pretend to be local. You can go to school board meetings. You can have an interest in what's going on in the curriculum in your county. Even if you don't have children, you still have the right to have to have your say there. So from a sex perspective, you can you can go to school board meetings. You

can find out what's being taught. You can ask questions about why they're not teaching inclusive sex or why they're not teaching sex in general or consent or the number of states in the U.S. that do not make you teach things that are medically accurate. You can write to the school board and say, why, why is this okay? So that's the first way. I feel like I should take a breath before I lost all that hope, man. It's all gone. This is the power of doing something though. And it's the power of the awareness because I think that's the reminder. It's, it's being aware because they think so often just based on how our, our society and consumerism is built, it's about what's making headlines what's clickbaity what's making the rounds and

everybody's for you page on your social medias um what what winds up showing in your algorithm on uh instagram out of the blue you're like why am i seeing this um and so it's it's that that whole holistic awareness because that's all meant to influence and distract Yep. And so if you find a way, I mean, none of us are not going to consume some level of that stuff. So we're always, it's good to be aware that you're always exposed to it. But that awareness is the key. Yep. Because it makes you a little bit more analytical, maybe question the tenor, the person pushing the message, is this really their message, all of that stuff. And that that awareness, that habit of awareness then starts to radiate in your, in your ether. So

then you start to pay attention to maybe what's happening at your county board, your school board, your city, um, your city government, local government is so important. It really is. Local elections are so important, but they don't make the mainstream news cycles a lot of the time, unless something until afterwards. And unless something extraordinary happens, like what we saw this past Tuesday in Oklahoma with their school board and all the all the elections you named at the top of the show, Virginia, Bucks County, New Jersey, all of that. Never thought I'd be proud of New Jersey, man. So always makes me think of that whenever I hear that kind of tone about New Jersey. It just makes me think of that line in Hamilton, everything's legal in Jersey. Yeah.

So, but, but maintaining that awareness and that curiosity, you know, I talked in my intro about a lot of what I think and, and how I approach things locally and nationally comes from curiosity and awareness and it can be exhausting. So it is important to recognize when you need to step away but try and time it so that you're not stepping away when we need your ballot yeah so can i i have a list yeah yes please so i wanted i want to there's a couple things i want to talk about with social media but there's one i want to tie in that has nothing to do with social media to what you just said and i know i've said it on the show before and i've said it on my social media and i stole it from someone and i really wish i remember who so i could give them credit

But it was this idea that this is going to be a long process. Change is going to be a long process. Fixing what's breaking right now, what's shut down right now is going to be a process. And what the person said was, we don't need all of you all of the time. It's okay to back off and take rest. It's okay to back off and do self-care. It's okay to just give a little bit if a little bit is what you can do today. and I've had people quote that back to me like yeah I saw that on your social media and it was really important and then I've had people be like hey you need a break and I'm like but I but you need a break um so I do want to remind folks we don't need like Charlie was saying like just try not to take that step back when it's time to show up for things like voting but we we don't need all of you all the time we we need what you can give us when you can give us and when I say us I mean all of all of our fellow humans right now who are going through this struggle um but for the social media i there you touched on a really important thing about awareness and i know

i've said this on this show and i say it actually i make it an unofficial homework assignment for all my classes because my students are on social media and i was like i need you to follow someone who does not look like you and that can be someone who's a different race someone who's a different um religion someone who's a different age group someone who's a different socioeconomic class someone who's a different orientation as long as you know what it is though some folks are very open i need you to listen to people who are not you so you are getting that awareness and it is changing your algorithm and you are hearing about these things that you didn't you're not going to hear about if you just hear the same 15 voices with different faces on them right so yeah that's

your unofficial homework everyone who's listening i need you to follow folks who aren't you and if you don't know who you should send us a thing send us a link in our not a links go to the link in the description say hey i really want to listen to people who talk about reproductive justice or i really want to talk about um what's being done to help women of color in areas where they're stripping them or their rights or i really tell us what you're tell us what topic you want to know about and we'll give you a list of who you can listen to and who you can put in your social media yeah the other thing i had a i told you it was a list did you check that one off i did I crossed it out. Does that count? Okay, good. Yes. Okay. The other thing is, and I think we've

talked about this before, and I tell my students this all the time, when it comes to spreading awareness, if you don't want to go, you don't want to rally, you don't want to march, you don't want to go out and do, you can post something on your social media. And what we know from research is that if someone follows you on social media and they're buddies with you, and then they happen to find my Instagram page or our the podcast Instagram page if I if we post that as like the expert and then you're posting it as just you your friends will listen to you because they know you so even if I'm sitting here saying like x equal y and then you say it they're going to believe you so there's power to you going hey I just heard about this happening and I thought people should

No, it doesn't. It could just be a, it could be a two second post. It doesn't have to be a long discourse. It doesn't have to be a graded paper, but you sharing that information with your networks is so incredibly important. So when you read something that pisses you off, share it. Although I know you can't really do that easily on some of the social media platforms. And I think that's by design. But share the information as you learn things, as things piss you off, as you hear about great things that are happening share it because you maybe influence people in your community who are not hearing it in other places yeah i'm crossing that off now so proud of you with your checklist thank you it's done now we can move on

oh it was a list of two things it was three because i'm just kidding i'm just kidding it was three so how can people show up i i have ideas but how else you like when we think about showing up because a lot of what i heard was i couldn't go to no kings and i'm like okay cool that wasn't the end all being love show that was amazing the millions of people who showed up that was amazing some people couldn't do it because the weather some people couldn't do it because of caring for others some people couldn't do it because they were injured and didn't want to stand or they didn't want to be out around people. Like there's a thousand reasons why people don't go. It doesn't mean you don't care and it doesn't mean there's not stuff you can do. Yeah. So what can you do?

Well, I think one way is to engage with any kind of local organization that supports communities or causes that you that you support that resonate with you. And they look for volunteering in a variety of ways. You don't have to be there physically, you don't always have to give money, there are a variety of ways that they look for, for support, and, and resources, resources don't always, like I just said, don't always equal physical presence and time, and don't always equal money. So engage with those organizations and then begin to make yourself aware of what's happening in your county and your city. Even if you can't show up for a public comment, make yourself aware. I know in my city, in my county, when we have local elections,

a lot of the candidates canvas for themselves so get their name get their flyer and make yourself aware outside of their stump the stump that they're giving you the pitch that they're giving you say okay you know engage with them I had one show up to my door last year and um and through questions and what, what they were saying, it became very clear that it was someone I was not going to support. Um, and upon further research, you know, they left their flyer behind and, and in that, in that regard, start to look at who's funding them, who's giving them money. Yeah. That's a huge thing. And that's, that's where I've gotten a lot of, um, success with friends who have had that that bit of apathy maybe maybe they vote only in the general election

on general election years and they're only voting on the federal level because propositions and and different initiatives on the ballot can be overwhelming especially when you have a big year with all those extra ballot measures and and propositions so a good place to start look at who's funding it yeah look at who's funding the messaging that's one that is a very important way to show up i think okay go i have another list it's got five things on it let's do it it comes back to what you were saying about donations because it's not just about money i mean if you can give money great like there's lots of places i could use money um right now i mean i don't i

you and i are so much more than just talking about sex um don't just take up an inordinate amount of my day um but you and i are so many other things so and but i want to make sure we're focusing on that but there are other issues right now especially food and and food insecurity um especially people being deported and without lack of due process if that's something that matters to you donate there there are a ton of make sure it's a you know a valid charity check how they score on charity navigator but one of the things that i'm finding when i'm going to places to be like what can i do and there's a limit to my funding i'm a professor i don't make a lot of money they need people to do things and you may be like well i don't know what to do i

I don't have any skills. Sometimes it's about canvassing for them. So especially during campaigns. I mean, the turnout in New York for canvassing was amazing. Sometimes they need someone to stuff envelopes for them to get information out. Sometimes they need people to work phone banks. Like I said, I have been part of phone banking to states to let them know about upcoming elections and make sure that they're registered and find out if they have questions. That's all volunteer run. You got an hour of your time. It's like an hour commitment in 20 minutes is teaching you how to use the software like it's not really that long a commitment um i personally and i know i don't usually talk about myself but um we've we've talked about this before

i volunteer for i need an abortion.com um we have the director on that of of i need an a on on the podcast on back in march march thank you yeah yeah so you can go back and listen to that episode it's amazing to hear about the work that she did um i volunteer for them once a month i give them about an hour, hour and a half of my time doing database stuff. If you want to get out there and be on the front lines, go see if your reproductive health clinics need people who can escort people in. Go see what they need. People need things. The two I want to throw out that most people don't think of is if you have any kind of fundraising skills, board of directors will need you. Or if you can just volunteer your time without being on a board. And the one that I

think is really big especially right now are translators if you can speak other languages if you can speak languages i don't even know if i qualify as speaking english right this second if you if you can speak languages other than english to be able to translate for folks is incredibly powerful um and it's one of those things that sometimes can get overlooked but if you're looking for reproductive health services and it's only in english that's not helping a ton of people so if you speak other languages if you can donate your time to either do live translation or sometimes they need I mean I know a ton of times I've needed educational materials translated by someone who can speak the language because I can look it up but it ain't gonna

translate right right right yeah if you can donate your time to like hey I speak another language I'd be happy to look at something and translate it for you I mean it's gonna take time absolutely will take time and i know time is important for folks but there are so many things that we can do to show up that don't require a financial donation although if you can do that there are a lot of abortion funds which could use the money right now yeah yeah yes that was my whole list yes all of that really what that's what you got i gave you time to create your list so can we talk about i don't know do you have any more hoper because i'm going to go in the non-hope direction because it feels more comfortable i don't know how far i want to

let you wade into those waters on this episode i just i it's really important to highlight that there is hope and there there is i i hope that this has invigorated a lot of people who felt hopeless last year um and and exercised their right not to vote i mean or their their choice not to vote their right to choose um because it is and i've and i said it earlier it is a reminder that there's more of us than there are of them and not to make this an othering thing but it's true it really is true and and it can get it can feel like that's not true um or like that that it hope is lost because so much of what we consume spotlights the fascism that has been daylighted and normalized in our country right now but to me and i was talking with a good friend of mine

about this as well um a couple years ago actually who is actually in the political sphere to me this is always what we are what we have been witnessing for the last 10 years to me is a primordial roar of a dying beast do you want to explain that term i learned about that term actually from a sociologist and i was oh really that's a i dig that term do you want to explain that term to folks who may not be familiar with it uh maybe um to it's it's really that last like push of aggression and energy before something dies yeah yeah but what it feels like is it's going to get a whole lot worse before it's going to get a whole lot better right because they're giving everything they got because of

their fear because their fear of dying irrelevance being pushed out all of those things it's a very kind of nature thing but it is it is that last fever pitch before something dies and there has been a lot more of that discord that discussion of that i think over these last the last couple of years that that that is a bit of what this is but but it's important to know that that means i think that there's always been vigor in the progressive movement and it has felt like diminishing returns because those who who progressives were left to vote for weren't that in my opinion were there to maintain some some sort of status quo because it benefited them the status quo benefited them but with um the campaigning the enthusiasm

the the the show up for mom donnie and others shows us we're we're here we're energetic and and if not now when yeah no matter how lord how loud that death roar is we are louder and there's more of us yep i want to go off the mom mom donnie is it's just he's very exciting for me it feels like when obama was first elected as a senator that's what it feels like to me um so here's where i'm going to couch the negative yeah in the pot it'll be positive i'll allow it there's there's a and i'm i've been having so many of these conversations over the last few days and i'm so i'm trying to be really careful about not making one person feel like they're outed i've literally had half a dozen of these conversations in the last 72 hours

so imagine if you're listening to this no i'm not referring to you it may be an amalgam of like all the conversations just because i didn't ask it's a collage of experience Yeah. I just because I didn't I didn't ask for consent to talk about some of these. But one of the things that I'm hearing and some of them are from New Yorkers and some of them are not from New Yorkers is that the reaction to him is really it's really different in that for some people they it's about racism, but they don't want to seem racist. and it was weird i wish i could remember the phrasing of how it was put out it was like well it was okay to hate him for other reasons like but you can't hate him because of his race because that would be wrong so i'm gonna say that i hate him because he's a a socialist or yeah there's a great video of someone calling him a communist and he's on a bike and he goes i think you pronounce it cyclist yeah i saw that yeah so it's it's this great it's it's weird because people because you

can't come out and be like, well, I don't want people to have, you know, have to pay more in rent. Although the people I have heard say that are very comfortable in their houses that they no longer have to pay mortgages on. You know, when it comes to feeding people, it's not like you can be like, I don't want people to be fed. So instead, I'm going to attack this idea. But it's not the idea. It's, it's really racism that's, that's showing their people's racism are showing in a way that's not overt which makes it even scarier for me because I'm looking at it going oh my god I didn't realize how racist you are and you're like no it's not that it's it's about this it's about this I'm like no no this is about you feeling your power and privilege is

going to be threatened and you being a fucking racist um it's done some damage in some relationships ships actually because it's bringing it to the light and i think for some people i would encourage those of you who are already having a visceral reaction to me going but that's not me and you just sit on that for a second and you just sit with it for a second and if you can honestly look at yourself and go okay it's not about that i really don't want people to be fed i really don't want people to be able to get around the city cheaper i really not that anyone gets around the city at all because nothing moves um if you can really sit there and say no it's about the issues fine but if you can really take that look at yourself and go shit i'm uncomfortable

with the fact that he's muslim i'm uncomfortable the fact that he's not white i'm uncomfortable the fact that he's an interracial and you know interracial interfaith right yeah like yeah that's not christian based yes i would encourage you to see if you can check yourself and and do the work that needs to come next and if you need things to read if you're finally like oh shit yeah maybe maybe this is about race for me again let us know we're happy to provide a reading list um so for me like that the way the racism is coming out is really interesting one of my friends is like well there's racist and then there's racist i'm like no not anymore i'm not making that excuse anymore

yeah because i've heard people say that like there's there's new york racism and i still don't understand what that is having been born and raised in new york it's like california sober what the hell is california sober you don't you don't do anything but get high okay um so so i've heard that excuse well there's racism and there's racism i'm like no more there's just racism um other reasons for you to stay involved so i just i wanted to bring that up because what's coming to the highlight for me is like how much work there still is to be done in my own circle though i think some of those people have exited my circle and to be honest bye bye felicia i'm done with you yeah um but but reasons to stay active because i want to i'm

trying to focus on the negative but still kind of call it positive so you don't yell at me um reasons to focus on the on the negative crap on the positive wait what am i doing focusing on you're balancing the negative that you just gave yes well i'm trying to point out the negatives as a reason for us to do things the reason it's the reason we're not done the reason we need you to show up tomorrow take a day celebrate take three days have a spa day rest in do a lion i don't care but the reason we have to keep showing up is one we know it works we saw that charlie you've said it like three times today it's so important to all the people who aren't voting need to be need to understand why this is important as much as i don't want to

to explain to these 18 to 25 year olds in my life why they should be voting and not my students because i don't cross that like they can make that decision for themselves um i don't want people being like oh see professors influence things no i just educate for the 18 to 25 year olds who are in my life outside of my teaching role as much as i don't want to make that my responsibility i'm sure as hell going to make that my responsibility to tell them why this is important so we need to be active um because things aren't done we still need you to do the work we need you to get other people to care we need you to care about the things that are coming up i mean i we know that the supreme court has agreed to take on a case that will potentially overturn same-sex marriage

and i heard grumblings i don't actually know if it became a case that they've agreed to hear about possibly um interracial marriage i mean we're going back to reversing the loving decision back from, ooh, crap, 1950s. Well, look, as women who just experienced Roe v. Wade being overturned, are we surprised? No, and that's, I mean, if you look, well, I don't want to get in touch. I can't say positive, but.

The other thing, and I am in by no way, shape, or form a political scholar, but one of the things that has become very evident to me and from the people that I follow that do know a lot more than me is we have just now realized how many people have held seats that we thought were untouchable who are now vulnerable because of the shit they've been saying and because they didn't speak up the way they should have and it doesn't matter if

you've been the senator or the representative for five terms two terms five days i don't give a shit we just realized how many people that we thought were untouchable are now vulnerable look at all the districts where incumbents got got got got ousted so if you've if you're living in one of these areas we're like no it's always going to be red no we're always going to limit people's rights we're realizing that's not true anymore and so is it missouri or mississippi where the dems got three mississippi yeah i want to say but someone should fact check me yeah um you know like like we're realizing that there is no set in stone running anymore and so that's a reason to keep the fight going because if you and i do i the senator from the from the from the place i grew

up literally still in power 40 years later and he's going to be really vulnerable after this because of the things he said and the things he didn't do and the things he didn't do and so if if you've ever had the hope of or never had the hope of this can change now i want you to have that hope that it can change but we need you to do the work we need you to show up we need you Canvas. We need you to get involved. We need you to go to town halls. We need you to talk to your fellow people living in your community. We need you to become educated. Whether it's on sex, I mean, I feel like we keep, I feel like we missed the sex mark on this episode, but I think it's okay. But I think that radiates into what we talk about the majority of the time is that showing up

in all of these ways influences and impacts heavily sex and sex health, public information, public health all of those things because and and i also i i want to say there is room for you to not wholeheartedly agree with a candidate that is a better safer choice for the causes but hold them to to hold them to your standard i think that's a lot of a lot of it is that oh well i wasn't i i wasn't gonna vote because xyz okay i get that we have a very broken system and we are in currently in the early stages of fascism but what tuesday showed us is that we still have the we the people still have the power and still have the privilege and the responsibility to show up so it's not just a privilege it is a responsibility especially for those of us that can because

there are many that can't yep because uh for a variety of reasons so if you have a candidate that you know would be better in many regards but you don't like you you don't agree with where they're getting their contributions from or what they're stumping or in it hold them hold their feet to the fire push back because i i believe kennedy said this but i i kind of give credit to um the graphic novel and movie v for vendetta because they do a a summation of it but people should not be afraid of their government government should be afraid of its people because we have the goddamn fucking power and they work for us despite where they're getting contributions and i think donnie's campaign showed that oh yeah it did it really highlighted that and that's why

this feels like that that hope from 2000 2005 2006 2008 um is we we truly let's continue to roar louder because we have the vigor not because it's a primordial roar we are stronger there are more of us and it is fundamentally

the right thing to do for human rights in this country across the board across the board so make them afraid of us all of them whether you support them or not make them all fucking afraid of us

in a non-threatening way because we do because we because we will make them respond we will hold them responsible yeah no make them afraid of us non-violently um with our with our voices and our activism and our um showing showing up through letters and challenging their votes challenging what they're saying. Like we still have the power to do that. And those of us that can, those of us that can be louder than maybe some others, let's do that. Let's be loud for our fellow humans, especially those that are vulnerable, highly vulnerable, because it is just a matter of time before we're all vulnerable to the modern fascism that's in this country right now. Can we sum up with homework? Yes. I don't think we have a list. Yeah, I don't

have a list. It's all stuff we've said before. I mean, it's been a long time, actually, since you've asked me to do a summary or homework. Yeah, well, you've always I've trained you so well that you just you go into it without needing prompting all right so here we go and i add to my homework so homework number one is to um throw in some people in your social media feed who are different from you and if you don't know who and this actually leads you to number two um reach out to us and say hey i want to really i really want to follow someone who's got their pulse on what's happening with um same-sex marriage i really want to you know follow i really want to learn more about the legal aspects of what's going on with some of these cases

if I don't know and Charlie doesn't know we'll ask people who know but homework number one is to find people who aren't you who are different from you in some capacity and start following them on social media homework number two is then to share that if someone says something really interesting

you find an article that's interesting share it with the people in your community I cannot stress enough how important it is that you are sharing with your people the information that you want that you think is interesting and important reach out to us If you want ideas for how to volunteer your time, who to follow, anything you need, that's what we're here for. My ask is that if you have a great organization that you don't think we know about or maybe we do and we just don't mention it, let us know.

We're happy to highlight organizations that need time and effort or just need attention because that's part of what we need to do is share it. And start having those conversations with people that may be hard. start talking about what's going on right now and if and if you don't feel safe don't please don't ever put yourself in unsafe situations but i i am stunned by the number of people who do not know that the supreme court has agreed to hear the case that could potentially overturn same-sex marriage like they don't even know what's happening um now i know a decision's not going to come for a while but you got to know what happens so start having those conversations with the people around them hold people to their to hold people to values and and and there's no

more acceptable the fact that someone said to me there's racism and then there's racism no more it's no more um homophobia no more transphobia no more like call these people out if you can if you can do it safely and if you don't maybe limit how often you're around them if that's possible i lost track of how many homework that how simon said is but we want to help you with your homework yeah we're here yeah if we can again if you want recommendations on who to follow or who to read or who to listen to or watch um that's not us share our there you go there's your other homework there it is um or if you want organizations that you can contribute time money effort to um if you want to know about i'm like i'm happy to share not here because i don't have it in front

of me which is horrible because i volunteer for them all the time i just like oh yeah there's the email if you want to learn how to phone bank if you want to learn how to send postcards like we're happy to share that information but also if you have organizations i know i just said this but if if you have organizations you're like hey charlie dr sue you should really know about these people they're doing great work in this space let us know we'll highlight them maybe we'll even reach out and see if someone from the organization wants to come on and talk about about the work they do that's your homework it's a lot you have your whole life to do it so pace yourself yeah yeah awesome well on that note we ended positive we did we did it yeah i want to

thank you all for joining us on this episode of unzipping taboos uh we hope today's really we hope yes i hope you got all that um that's also your homework we hope today's episode sparked new thoughts and will open up conversations worth having and remember your curiosity and compassion are the keys to breaking down barriers and embracing a healthier understanding of sex and relationships if you enjoyed the show please describe this show this episode or any other episode please subscribe leave a review and share it with someone who might need to hear this and if you've got a question or a topic you want us to dive into or any other general questions reach out to us via the link in the episode description

a huge thanks to jackandjilladult.com for supporting unzipping taboos don't forget you can get 20 off your order with code unzipping 20 we also want to give a very special shout out to ali o'brien for our incredible theme music thank you so much ali and until next time keep the conversation going keep unzipping those taboos and everyone take care © transcript Emily Beynon