Up and Vanished - S1E21: Statute of Limitations

Episode Date: June 20, 2017

Payne Lindsey explores new evidence of the 2005 orchard search and Philip Holloway weighs in on the statute of limitations. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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but especially if you're somewhere at night rambling around the county, just be careful. I just, I have a lot of distrust because of things that I've seen. And when my father-in-law was sheriff, I know for, I'll say, 95% facts that a murder was covered up as a suicide. Things go on there. I don't put anything past anybody. Everybody can have a dark night of the soul. More than 40 GBI agents swarmed a pecan orchard in Ben Hill County this afternoon. Not one, but two former students from that school under arrest. With the intent to and did cause serious bodily harm to the person of Tara Grinstead.

Charging Ryan Alexander Duke with the murder of Tara Grinstead. Charging Ryan Alexander Duke with the murder of Tara Grinstead. From Tenderfoot TV at Industrious Atlanta, this is Up and Vanished, the investigation of Tara Grinstead. I'm your host, Payne Lindsey. She told me in 011, it was a tan shirt like sheriff deputies wear. And then there was dark brown pants with a tan stripe down each side. What kind of uniform does this look like? Sheriff's department. Several months ago, before the arrest of Ryan Duke and Bo Dukes, Maurice Godwin shared a tip with me that he felt was very important.

Right around the time I began looking into this information, the news of the arrest broke, and the entire focus of my investigation shifted instantly. But now that the dust is settling, I've gone back through all this information. And this tip, in particular, stood out to me. It all started with an email. He received an anonymous email from someone

who claimed that they had found an old sheriff's uniform buried in the woods in Osceola. This is how the email read. A law enforcement type uniform was found buried approximately six feet within the embankments of what is now a dry creek bed. The 911 dispatcher asked that I remove the items from the location I'd found them in and bring them to the sheriff's department. The items I turned in are one beige short-sleeved law enforcement type shirt with circular dark brown patches on each shoulder, having no visible markings on them,

one pair of size 42 dark brown trousers with beige stripes down each leg and with the words, Comfort Action 3, printed on the inside waistband. I asked to leave my name and number with the Irwin County Sheriff's Department dispatcher in the event anyone needed to know the location of where I'd found the clothing. I wrote my name and number and was told he, I didn't ask his name, would turn over the items to Investigator Rogers in the morning. It appears the rushing current caused by heavy rains in the past has eroded the creek's embankments, exposing the clothing that was deeply embedded in the root system and barely

visible. I found the shirt on the embankment directly across from the trousers. I stopped looking for anything more and left the location in the event the area needed to be investigated. I'm not sure what, if anything else, is in the mounds of dirt. This creek fills quickly after heavy rainfall, and the area the items were found in may be covered in water soon. This may have nothing at all to do with Tara Grinstead's case, but many people I've spoken with suggested I write to your agency because the area hasn't been investigated. Whether related to Ms. Grinstead's case or not, it seems suspicious to find such items,

with no other clothing found, buried or not, in the same vicinity. I wasn't sure what, if anything, I should do about contacting someone other than the sheriff's department. Please accept my apologies if I have inconvenienced anyone by writing this." This person found an entire uniform buried in the woods. Shirt, pants, shoes, everything. So she bagged it. She took it to the Irwin County Sheriff's Department. And the Irwin County Sheriff's Department, they never got back with her.

Of course, you know, with so much mud and water and stuff, anything forensically is probably lost out of it. It is odd that you would find something like that buried in the middle of nowhere. And finally, I got her contact information and talked to her, and I have that recording. Eventually, Marie spoke to her on the phone to get some more details, and this is what she told him. I contacted the police department, and they told me just to put it in a bag and bring it up there to them. And so I did that, and I never heard anything out of it. It was a short

sleeve shirt, and the pants were tan, and they had a dark brown stripe of them. And I even went to the point of calling my uncle, who was in law enforcement in Port Eel. I even called him to come down here with me because it scared me so bad, and I didn't want to mess with it. And he's the one that told me that policemen aren't supposed to dispose of uniforms like that. You're supposed to turn them back in. Besides the fact that this was a strange way to dispose of a police uniform, there was something else about the uniform in particular that made this discovery appear a bit more ominous.

It had the circle on the sleeve of it, but there was no patch there. There was a brown spot where a patch was supposed to be. On each side were badges, but the center area of the badge, each side on the sleeve, had been cut out. The sheriff patches on both sides of the uniform that would normally indicate the department and the officer's name had been ripped off. When the creek beds dry,

it's about a seven foot from the ground to the dirt road. So I actually found it buried kind of when they redid the road. That's the only thing I can figure out when it got there. So somebody made a quick stop and went in the middle of the night and buried that? Or they threw it out when they knew that somebody was going to come back in and fill it up the next day. I don't know. And this place isn't that terribly far away from the place that burnt down

right after it happened either. You mean Snapdragon? Right. It's not terribly far. It's within five miles of there. Osceola is pretty tiny, so the fact that this was found relatively close to the house

that mysteriously burned down on Snapdragon Road wasn't that big of a surprise, but it was definitely interesting. This story grabbed my attention, but as far as its relevance to Tara, I was pretty unsure, and even doubtful. If this lady did in fact find this uniform buried in the woods, I wanted to at least see some pictures of it, to prove that this was even real. She actually photographed it and videotaped it, but she said that the computer was old and it had a broken screen and she couldn't get the video or anything

to work, couldn't pull it off the hard drive or whatever. Even had somebody offer to pay for it, but they never went through it. She claimed that her computer's hard drive wasn't working and she couldn't recover the files. So at this point, I was ready to drop the lead entirely. Even if she was telling the truth about this, it having any link to Tara seemed like a big stretch. And without being able to see the items myself and prove that they even existed, this was just a lost cause. But then about a month later, she called Maurice again and said that she fixed her computer and recovered the files. And to my surprise, she sends over several pictures of the uniform and a video of it. Now she had my attention.

Here is the spot where the pants were found. where the pants were found. Right down below it is the shoe that I found that was buried in the ground just a little bit deeper than it is now. Maybe six, seven feet away from where I found the pants. That's where the shirt was found. That's the patch on the left sleeve. Look, show them the zipper. There's the zipper. It zips up and it buttons up. But see, there's a patch. There's a size 42 and on the inside it says comfort action. This is the embankment up to the dirt road. It's about seven feet from the top of the dirt road to where we're at now. These items were found approximately six feet in the ground. After examining the pictures and video of the uniform

and comparing it to the uniforms worn by local law enforcement, Maurice and I determined that it was a sheriff's uniform, likely an Irwin County sheriff's uniform. So, what exactly did all this mean? I'll be honest with you, I still don't know.

But as I learned more and more about this search that happened in the pecan orchard shortly after Tara went missing, it got my gears turning. Let's back up for a moment. According to Dusty Vassie and several inside sources I have, local law enforcement conducted a search of the pecan orchard not too long after Tara went missing. Based on a tip they received that Ryan and or Bo had mentioned killing Tara to some friends at a party. And according to my source, the agency that conducted this search was both the Irwin County and Ben Hill County Sheriff's Department.

Irwin County deputy drove to the Ben Hill County line, met a Ben Hill County deputy, and they went to the pecan orchard. They didn't look in the right spot, but they did look around in the pecan orchard. I believe this party happened on the following Friday after she went missing. There was a bonfire that Bo and Ryan were having with several friends. This also lined up with what one of Bo's friends told me, a former Army buddy. What I remember is that he helped get rid of a body on the pecan farm and he burned it. There was a party spot, I guess, that they talked about.

I kind of remember Bo saying that they had a party out there. I remember it being real haunting. Enough for me to remember, if you're having parties out there routinely, that gives you a way to conceal. A fire just burning out there is going to raise questions. But a fire out there where a bunch of people are partying, that's not as peculiar. And I think that could have even been, you know, the plan. It was possible that on that night, Bo and Ryan were still burning Tara's remains in front of people. Perhaps Bo or Ryan mentioned to

one of their friends at this party in a drunken state what had happened to Tara, while they were still destroying evidence right there in front of everybody. I've since learned all the names of those who were there that night, and almost all of them are in that picture I'd been sent back in August of 2016, when this podcast first started. The guy with his arm around Bo in the picture, who I'm calling Jim Deal, was also listed on the suicide note.

And as you heard at the end of the last episode, The day that they arrested Brian, me and him was talking in the store there in Osceola. He said, you know, I think it was Bo that said something about this is where Tara died or we burned her or something of that nature. And somebody told the cops that they just didn't pursue it. One of his friends confirms that Jim Deal knew what happened to Tara too, because someone at that party, either Ryan or Bo, likely told him. And then Jim Deal, along with a few other friends from the party, informed local law enforcement.

Then they went out to search there. And for whatever reason, they searched in the wrong spot and never found anything. Didn't inform the GBI about it, and just went about their business. So with one or both of the local sheriff's departments having conducted this search, the discovery of that sheriff's uniform found buried in the dirt seemed a little more ironic. Is it related? I don't know. But right now, I'm putting all the cards out there on the table. All this is happening in real time right now. And every time I mention something new on the podcast, someone new reaches out to me with more information. For example, in the last episode, I was going through the old newspaper

archives with Dusty Vassie, and we found an article about a search that happened in Queensland, which is essentially right where the pecan orchard is. The officers listed as those in charge of the searches were Alan Morgan and Nelson Polk, both from the Irwin County Sheriff's Department. Within 24 hours of releasing the last episode, I got a phone call from someone who had more information about these officers and that search in the Pecan Orchard. I mean, he was one of the main investigators. He took on, you know, took on the diagramming of the search, telling the search party where to go. And he rode with Nancy Grace. When she came down here, he was the one that took

her around, showed her everything they had searched. From what Alan said to us, and I mean, this is back like, this goes all the way back to when they went to that pecan orchard the first time. Alan Morgan, both Nelson Polk and Alan Morgan, were part of that first investigation just a couple of weeks after she went missing in that pecan orchard. They learned of the party scenario. And where the party was, there was a tip given to them from what I understand about the party and fire. Allen Morgan never made it up to the Pekin Orchard. Allen was told when he got to about the Ben Hill County line that he was to turn around and go back.

He was told to turn around about the time he got to the county line. Somebody had to be up there in that orchard in order to tell him to turn around and go back. I don't know if there wasn't anything that they found, there wasn't anything substantial, or he was just turned around because they didn't want him up there. Newt Hudson was Bo's granddaddy. And back then, he had a lot of pull, and you didn't mess with him. He was a state representative at the time.

A lot of money in the community. He was just powerful. That search happened. And according to her, Alan Morgan from the Irwin County Sheriff's Department was called out there to the pecan orchard, but was then told to turn around right when he got there. I think it's safe to assume that any police officer

sent to investigate something in a murder case would not just turn around and go back home unless somebody else in law enforcement they trusted told them to do so, not just some random person. So who told him that? And why? And what about the other officer, Nelson Polk? Was he the one who made it out there that day?

It's possible. This case has become very muddy. It's very sad, but it seems like a lot of people knew what happened to Tara all these years and kept it a secret. And my goal is not to assign blame to anyone. My goal is to find the truth. If law enforcement searched the pecan orchard in 2005, that needs to be known. If this case could have been solved 12 years ago, that needs to be known. How do you think people like Marcus Harper or Heath Dykes feel about that?

And if several friends of Bill and Ryan knew about this too, why did they never say anything else? Think of the last time you bought something to wear. Something to decorate your house. this too. Why do they never say anything else? out anything you buy from over 750 stores. If you've ever bought electronics, home decor, fashion and beauty, or booked a trip, well, you could have got cash back. But don't worry, it's not too late. It's free and easy to use, and you get cash back deposited into your PayPal account or sent to you as a check. Earn cash back at stores like Sephora, Old Navy, and Expedia. It's the smartest way to shop, plain and simple. Start your shopping at Rakuten.ca or get the Rakuten app. That's R-A-K-U-T-E-N.ca. Experience basketball like never before with BetMGM, an authorized gaming partner of the NBA. Ready to shoot your shot? We've made the BetMGM experience an authorized gaming partner of the NBA. Ready to shoot your shot? We've made the BetMGM experience more immersive and fun for all types of basketball fans.

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Visit BetMGM.com for terms and conditions. Must be 19 years of age or older. Ontario only. Please play responsibly. If you have any questions or concerns about your gambling or someone else close to you, please contact ConnexOntario at 1-866-531-2600 to speak to an advisor free of charge. As I've been digging around in these areas, to put it point blank, it's become a very

uncomfortable task. Those who knew about this don't want me digging around anywhere. And many of these people have made that very clear to me. uncomfortable task. Those who knew about this don't want me digging around anywhere, and many of these people have made that very clear to me. I've offered to protect their identity, disguise their voice, and I've even offered for them to go off record entirely just to find out the whole truth here, but none of them will do it. If you truly have nothing to lose, then why are you still keeping a secret? The obvious answer is, maybe there's more to this story. A few weeks after I started digging into this, I hit a frightening road bump. My Facebook account was hacked.

Yeah, I mean, Facebook is in there trying to do something too, so I'm not sure how much. I just logged into the account. What's the email address? It's upandvanished at yahoo.com, and they also made it painlindsay06 at yahoo.com. They also deleted your one that was affiliated with your Facebook account, and theirs was there. At first, I wasn't sure if this hack was related to the case at all. My wife Cassie had one of her IT friends trying to trace down who did this, while I was in a cab on the way to the airport in New York City. A very inopportune time.

I'm going to actually look up the name that I sent you, though, Payne, on that picture and see if I can find anything with it. But I think he's using software that you use to trace IP addresses. He's like, you know, we should be able to find who this person is. But what we really needed to do was get back into your Facebook, but now that's gone too. When I looked it up after, it was super late. I looked it up and it was still active.

And there was nothing new on your page or the Up and Badge page as far as posts. You're back. You just came back. You don't have a picture. This is so weird. What the hell? Whoever did this somehow compromised my email account associated with my Facebook. And when my wife was able to regain access to the email account,

she saw that whoever did this had made two new email addresses. And one of them was up and vanished at Yahoo.com. I didn't make that email address. Clearly, this hack was related to the case. Eventually, I was able to regain access, but I was still pretty unnerved by it. Everything in this case right now has a new aura to it. People in this case are pushing back, but I'm not stopping. stopping. With so many secrets in this case, it makes the gag order look even more suspicious. A gag order in general is supposed to be the last resort, but in this case, it was signed by the judge and put into effect just four days after Ryan's arrest. The gag order states that anyone in law enforcement cannot talk or comment on this case in any way. What is

everyone so afraid of? I have a couple theories on that, and the first one I'll share with you is this. Remember Beau's friend Darren, the former army friend who sent me all those screenshots of his text message conversations with Beau? In one of Darren's conversations, Beau told him this. Maybe they have some problems with their case due to the statute of limitations. It turns out there was an earlier search done by local guys who never reported it to the GBI. I don't know when it occurred, but the clock starts ticking on the statute then. I showed this to Dusty Vassie while sitting in my car one night recently in Osceola.

Do you mean that that actually couldn't allow him to get off? That's what he's saying. That's why they want to keep that shit quiet. That's why they want to keep that shit so fucking quiet. Because it might jeopardize their case. It might jeopardize all of it. At least in the charges against Bo. I don't know about Ryan. I don't think so about Ryan. But it said something about statute of limitations being waived because they were not aware of the crime until a certain date and the charges, the arrest warrants against Bo.

Holy shit, dude. I don't know if Bo Dukes was part of what they were told about, but would that matter? Because they knew the crime happened. Damn, that's huge, dude. No wonder they were so concerned about it. But it's shady. I mean, I hate that the law says this, that somebody can actually get away

with all this. But it's shady if the GBI was trying to keep it quiet just so that their case wouldn't fall apart when they're supposed to uphold the law. If the search happened back in 2005, then according to the statute of limitations on the crimes Bo committed, he may be able to get off scot-free. This seemed insane. And right or wrong, it seemed to make sense that a gag order would be in place to prevent that from becoming public. But could he really get away with this?

I asked Philip Holloway to elaborate on this. Here's the thing about the statute of limitations. If a law enforcement officer knows that a person has committed an act, not necessarily knows that the person committed a crime, but knows that somebody committed an act, or the offender is unknown to the authorities. But that tolling exception cannot be based on the subjective opinion of a district attorney as to whether or not there was enough evidence to file charges against a particular person at that time. That actually comes from a case from 2015 called Holloman v. State. Of course, there's no statute of limitations on murder. So if there's any evidence that ties Bo in any way to committing the actual murder, even if he's a party to the crime or an accessory rather than the actual perpetrator, then theoretically he could be charged with a murder because there is no statute of limitations on murder. But basically for every other crime, there is a statute of limitations. For example, other crimes that are punishable by death or life imprisonment,

the statute of limitations on those sort of things is seven years. And anything else other than rape, which happens to be a 15-year statute of limitations, everything else is basically four years. So any felony that Bo's currently facing, the statute of limitations would be four years. And that raises some interesting possibilities. For example, Bo's lawyer figures this out and decides, hey, For example, Bo's lawyer figures this out and decides, hey, we want to challenge the charges against Bo. Then he can file with the court something called a demurrer. In other words, it's something called a plea and bar. It's basically a challenge to whether or not the charges cannot proceed because they're barred by the statute of limitations, the question then becomes what leverage, if any, does the district attorney have over Bo and how can he coerce, if you will, or force or encourage Bo to continue to cooperate, to come to court and provide truthful testimony. Because if they don't have a criminal prosecution to hang over his head, he's a lot less motivated to participate in the process.

But here's the other side of that coin. We have, of course, lots of reason to believe that Beau has made statements to authorities. We know that he's made statements to third parties. We know that he's made statements to third parties. We know that he has information at a minimum about what happened to Tara after she died. And we know that he's talked about that stuff. So if they drop a subpoena in his hand, that subpoena is a court order to come testify. And the law says when you testify, you have to testify truthfully. So if he comes to court under a subpoena and he testifies in a way that the authorities believe to be untruthful, he could then be prosecuted for perjury. So unless Bo just completely goes off the grid and can't be found and they can't drop a subpoena

in his hand, they still have some leverage because he's made statements. They can make him come to court. If he refuses to honor a subpoena, the sheriff can literally pick him up and drag him into court, kicking and screaming in handcuffs if necessary, because both sides, the prosecution and the defense, are entitled to what's called compulsory process. That means they have the subpoena power of the court. They can also be subject to contempt of court if they don't comply with a court order. But

usually what happens is the judge would issue what's called a writ of attachment and basically authorizes the sheriff to go pick the person up if they don't honor a subpoena. So if his testimony in court differs in any way from the statements that he made to law enforcement, not only could he potentially face a perjury charge, but his testimony in court could be impeached, that is shown by the prosecutor or the defense, to be different from what he said in the past. And a prior inconsistent statement is, in fact, what we call substantive evidence. So if a person is talking out of both sides of their mouth, they're saying one thing in court, but they said something else previously, then either side can argue that their previous statement is the statement that the jury should rely on. The ironic thing about this, if, in fact, there is a statute of limitations problem and Bo can't be prosecuted, then it takes away a very strong defense argument.

Because what happens is defense lawyers will attack the credibility of a witness who's testifying under some grant of immunity or pursuant to some type of a plea deal that's conditioned on truthful testimony. In other words, they get in front of the jury and they say, look, the only reason this person came in here and said this is because they have a lot to gain. The jury would be entitled to hear all about any deals that Bo may have on the table, whether it's immunity or probation or whatever. And the defense can then use that as a way of saying this witness is not credible

because he's simply being paid in the sense for his testimony, paid in the currency, which is leniency from the prosecution. So if Bo is simply testifying at a trial pursuant to a subpoena and doesn't have any deal on the table because he can't be prosecuted, it takes away that argument and could actually play better for the prosecution. Of course, the downside would be that Bo simply gets away with doing whatever it is that he is alleged to have done and can't be prosecuted. The best adventures are the ones we share. So explore together with the 2023 Defender 130,

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Hi there. My name is Alameen Abdul-Mahmood. I am the host of the CBC Podcast Commotion. That's a show where we talk about all things pop culture. We talk about what people are watching, what people are listening to. We get into everything from celebrity beefs to TikTok trends. And look, we're not afraid to get a little controversial.

We're talking about things like the Oscar snubs or is Drake really a hip hop artist? Commotion with Elamin Abdelmahmoud, available now on Spotify. Chantin is going to take me on a trip to the place he's from. From the producer of Megan, Spotify. Believing in them doesn't mean they're gone. Here he comes. And they're angry you left. Imaginary, now playing only in theaters. A few episodes back, Dusty told me that he was called in by the GBI and questioned about a possible leak from the grand jury.

Dusty spoke to somebody about this leak, who provided some inside information, but he wouldn't tell me his source. I don't blame him. But thankfully, just recently, they came to me. Their voice has been disguised to protect them. He said that I was standing over her when she woke up, and that it freaked him out, so he hit her. And I said, with what? And he said, well, hold on. So he started telling me, he said he hit her, and then I guess it scared him, and he left. He came back the next day, or he went back the next day

and wrapped her up in a blanket or quilt. What was so crazy was his cousin was telling him, yeah, just right there in daylight, middle of the day. I'm thinking the morning time. Then he went back and got her and put her in, wrapped her in a blanket and put her in the back of a truck. I guess took her out to the orchard. Mostly, I guess, happened in the dark whenever he hit her.

And then he freaked out and he left. And then he came back the next day. This is what the guy told me that he said. He didn't say anything about what he hit her, and then he freaked out and left, and then he came back the next day. That's what, this is what the guy told me that he said. He didn't say anything about what he hit her with to me, you know, and then that's when it all came out about the hand thing, about it went from hands to hand, and I'm thinking when I, you know, all that came out, and then they started saying that all the GBI came down asking Dusty about the leak. Then I'm freaking out. I'm like, God dang, can I do anything without getting in fucking trouble for it?

The guy did not tell me, don't tell, and he didn't say. And I'm thinking, if he's telling me that, I mean, there's no telling who else they're telling that. This was relatively detailed information. Though it sounded pretty crazy, it had some detail to it. And the only way the GBI would have that much detail about how Tara was murdered is if Ryan Duke or Bo Dukes told them. So where's the story coming from? Did Ryan confess when he was questioned?

Or did Bo tell the GBI this story? I've been in Osceola several times recently, and I can tell you from being there that most locals aren't buying this narrative. But for all we know, that could be exactly how things happened. And maybe we're just missing the vital pieces that make this whole story make sense. I recently talked to a local from Osceola who told me what he's been hearing, apparently directly from the horse's mouth. A friend of mine who I trust, he told me he has some friends that's in the gbi and that he actually i guess it would be illegal but he did a ride along with these these gbi agents

that he he grew up with and uh they basically told him that uh the story that they were told, or I guess the GBI is following along to, was that Bo and Ryan were together that night. And that they basically drove by our house and Bo dropped Ryan off and rode around the block. I don't know if he parked or what, but came back around and Ryan was there and just told her, told Bo, she's dead. GBI are claiming that it was one punch to the temple and that from there they took her body out to the corn orchard. From what they're kind of gathering is that, I know this is really creepy and I don't even know if it's been rumored around, but that he's done this before, like entered into her house, maybe watched her sleep.

You kind of have an obsession. That made me think, you know, why she had the new door lock and all those things, too. I don't know if I believe that story or not. I think all they're going off of is what Bo and Ron's saying. believe that story or not. I think all they're going off of is what Bo and Ron are saying. That makes me not believe the story altogether because I know if I was Bo, somebody who claims they were not involved whatsoever, willingly involving yourself in a murder, it just doesn't make sense. I mean, I wouldn't do that for my wife.

They also said that his immunity is off the table. That's what the Gbi agent told my friend they called him in a lie breaking the terms of his uh immunity or something something along his lines they did they'd say it was off the table i'll tell you all of this is secondhand but it comes from people i trust i don't i don't see any of these people making up stories like this so i fully believe that's what the gBI knew and believed at the time based off of testimony. But to me, it seems like, I don't know. I'm not that big of a conspiracy nut, but it seems like Bo corroborated stories with people he told.

Just have the GBI go and check up his story that he tells them. Even their personalities, the story doesn't fit. The GBI said, too, that they took her car basically on a joyride, a terrorist car. So that makes absolutely no sense. None of the GBI's story made sense to me. Even as my friend was telling me, I was like, this doesn't add up at all. You know, a terrorist's car the seat was pushed all the way back you know and i know ryan he's he's about as tall as i am about five seven

five six i tell you we're not pushing any seats back what i gathered from it was that if the seat was pushed back then someone tall was driving that car i think tara was five three maybe five three five four you know i just i don't understand it. Even Ryan's Facebook posts and everything. He's not a man of his own words. You know what I mean? It's a lot of quotes from other people. Seems like a follower. Or Bo's more of a manipulator. I can tell you there's nobody down here that believes a single word of the official story. I know people who's close personal friends with the Hudson's and the Duke's and they're like,

I think Bo did it. You know, just based off of knowing him and hearing the story. Because I mean, I don't think someone who's sane even believes that somebody wasn't involved in a crime willingly involves himself and hides his body. None of that makes sense. Personally, I don't even think it happened at the house. I mean, it would make more sense that it happened at the pecan orchard. I just don't see these two pulling off a perfect crime, transporting bodies, leaving nothing behind.

It makes more sense that gloves were planted than it was they accidentally dropped them. I mean, how do you pull off the perfect crime but leave gloves? Not one guy who's real good friends with the GBI people. He's pretty up to date on what the GBI knows. From what he told me, they honestly had no choice but to believe it at this point. I think it's more of a thing they're happy to close the case. Wanting to get it over and not hang over their heads kind of thing. But inside, I don't I don't believe anybody believes it at this point or at that point.

You had Ryan confessing to it. You had Bo Bo's testimony with people to corroborate it. So it was leading down that path. I believe maybe Ryan's lawyer spoke some sense into him, hopefully. I'm not sure. But for him to basically enter into the not guilty plea, I think it's about to flip upside down. A lot of rumors in this case end up being true. So what's going to happen next in this case? No one around Osceola seems to believe what they're being told anymore.

And frankly, I don't either. Is the possibility of a search early on in this case going to let Bo Duke skate Scott free? Well, according to the breaking news that came out just today in this case, the answer might be no. today in this case, the answer might be no. Hey, Payne, I don't know if you'll get this, but it's Monday, 12.15 here. I just caught the tail end of this on the local news today. Seems like there's something going on in the Ocilla today. I thought you might want to check into that. Okay? Bye-bye.

Big news came today in the Tara Grinstead case, and the first person to hear about it was my grandma. Today, a grand jury hearing was held in Ben Hill County, and they indicted Bo Dukes on all charges. A grand jury has indicted in Ben Hill County, has indicted Bo Dukes for his alleged role in the cover-up of the murder of Tara Grinstead. WGXA's Eric Mock is live outside of the Ben Hill County Courthouse where he picked up that indictment. And Eric, what do we find in that document? They're moving forward with all the charges for Bo Dukes.

As far as Ryan Duke is concerned, it's unclear if the GBI will continue their current narrative when it comes time for a trial, or if newfound information between now and then might affect that. Even though the whole story of what happened to Tara is still very unclear, one thing is very clear. Bo's admission to burning Tara Grinstead's body. It's all the events surrounding this known fact that are still so murky.

Like I said, I don't know who you're connected to, but especially if you're somewhere at night rambling around the county, just be careful. I just, I have a lot of distrust because of things that I've seen. And when my father-in-law was sheriff, I know for, I'll say, 95% facts, that a murder was covered up as a suicide. Things go on there.

I don't put anything past anybody. Everybody can have a dark night of the soul. Oh, honey, I'll tell you what. There's so many dark and dirty secrets in those cells, it is not to be believed. I could tell you things that would make your hair stand on end. Ryan is related to Nelson Park, who is the deputy that walked him into the courtroom for his arraignment that day. He's a deputy sheriff.

Thanks for listening, guys. There's only three main episodes left this season. Our story on the investigation of Tara Grinstead will conclude with episode 24. There's so much more to come in the final chapters of this story, and we hope by the end of this season, we know all the truth in this case. Today's episode was mixed and mastered

by Resonate Recordings. If you want to improve the quality of your podcast or start a podcast of your own, go to resonaterecordings.com and get your first episode produced for free. This episode was recorded at Industrious Atlanta, Ponce City Market. For $250 off your first month's office rent, visit industriousoffice.com slash vanished. This Thursday, we're holding a Q&A episode. So if you have any questions for Philip Holloway or myself, please leave us a voicemail at 770-545-6411.

And be sure to stay tuned for K7 is next Monday, June 26, and episode 22 on July 3rd. Thanks, guys. I'll see you soon.