Up First from NPR - Democratic Divisions, Hezbollah On Gaza Ceasefire Talks, Big Weekend for Soccer

Episode Date: July 13, 2024

President Biden continues to work to overcome calls from within his own party to step aside. A Hezbollah spokesman says the Lebanese militant group will follow Hamas' acceptance or rejection of any potential ceasefire agreement with Israel. Two major international soccer tournaments electrify fans this Sunday.Learn more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

Some Democratic lawmakers say it's time to go, Joe. But others say they will continue to support his re-election. Divisions within President Biden's party as he continues to campaign. I'm Scott Simon. I'm Aisha Roscoe, and this is Up First from NPR News. Last night at a rally in Detroit, the president pushed back hard against the idea that his campaign is floundering. I learned a long time ago that when you get knocked down, you get back up. We'll have analysis in a moment from NPR's Ron Elving.

Also, Hezbollah keeps its eyes on renewed ceasefire talks in the war in Gaza. And it's a big weekend for soccer fans. We'll have a preview of the final matches in the European Championship and Copa America. Go! Stay with us. We have the news you need to start your weekend. This message comes from NPR sponsor

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Try a show on HBO's Industry or a roundtable on rom-coms to take a step back from the news of the day, at least before you plunge back in tomorrow. New episodes every week on Pop Culture Happy Hour from NPR. Nielsen says that more than 24 million people watched a press conference about NATO on Thursday. And it wasn't necessarily concerned about the future of the alliance that drew so many viewers. It was curiosity. How would President Biden do amid scrutiny over whether he's fit to serve a second term? How is his performance reassured or perhaps worried Democrats? We're joined now by NPR senior editor and correspondent Ron Elving. Ron, thanks for being with us.

Good to be with you, Scott. The president gave strong and detailed answers about complicated foreign policy questions, even as he did mix up a couple of names. Three more Democratic members of Congress asked him to end his re-election campaign. Why? In all likelihood, those statements were written before the NATO press conference and set up to be issued soon after. That may have created the impression they were reactions to the news conference more than they probably were. What was striking, though, was that news reports

had suggested far larger numbers of members had prepared statements just like those, and they were ready to be released after the news conference based on previous fears about Biden, and we did not hear or see those statements. Now, we don't know what those 24 million people thought about that news conference, and of course, he was far from perfect, but at least it was a strong reiteration of Joe Biden. It was hard to escape the feeling that he and his advisors had finally gotten him ready to debate Donald Trump two weeks after the debate. There is still a deep well of affection for Joe Biden among Democrats in Congress. So even if many want the president to quit, they want him to do it without their having to come out against him in public.

President was reminded at that press conference that in 2020 he'd referred to himself as a bridge to the next generation of leaders. And then he was asked why he didn't step back and let Vice President Harris lead the ticket. He said she was prepared to step into his shoes in case something happened, but added, The consideration is that I think I'm the most qualified person to run for president. I beat him once and I will beat him again. How do you read that answer? Two ways you could interpret that, either as an answer to the generic question about being a bridge to a new generation or as a more specific comeback on Vice President Kamala Harris in particular. What he said was he's better positioned to be Trump than anyone else in the party, and that would include Harris. No specific disrespect

there, but he didn't make an exception for her either. Let's remember that incumbents usually do have a certain advantage. The previous three incumbents before Trump all ran for re-election and won. That's been the pattern through our history. And as for the vice president, many in the party remember her own campaign for the nomination that Biden won. She had some strong moments in the early debates, but after that she faded and didn't even make it to the first round of caucus and primary voting. Later on, of course, as part of the ticket, she broadened Biden's appeal in the November contest against Trump. She helped with women, younger voters, people of color. And she has been poised to play that role again in the current cycle with a special new aside as the work of elites, pundits, big donors, celebrities, who he feels have always underestimated him as a working class son of Scranton, Pennsylvania.

Has the criticism he's been under been rubbing something personal? He has long felt much as you described, disrespected by elements of the party and intellectuals on campus and in government and in the media. And surely we would include in this the Hollywood creatives who have become major fundraisers and influencers over the past 30 years. These categories taken together have become a powerful force in the party. Some call them the Brahmin left, signifying their elevated cultural standing and power. Biden never liked, well, let's put it this way, he never felt like he was one of them. He wasn't a candidate, a Clinton or an Obama. And he has doubtless felt put down at times, even as other glamorous candidates turned to him

to help them win blue-collar voters. And by the way, on that note, Scott, last night, Biden was on that theme big time in Detroit, reminding everyone he had walked the picket line, not just as a candidate, but as a president. And Pierre's Ron Elvin, thanks so much. Particularly good to speak with you. Well, any week, but certainly this week. Thanks so much. Always good to be with you, Scott. Thank you. There was a restart of ceasefire negotiations in the war in Gaza this week.

Talks are taking place in Qatar and Egypt. Hezbollah, the Lebanese militant and political group, is closely watching these negotiations. And a spokesman for the group, Ibrahim al-Moussaoui, has told NPR the only way to avert the threat of an all-out war on the border between Israel and Lebanon is to end the war in Gaza. He spoke at length with NPR's Jane Araf, who joins us now from Beirut. Jane, thanks for being with us. Thank you. It does seem like a tense time with attacks on both sides of the border. What did the spokesman say about the risks of a wider war? Well, Scott, he didn't discount it, but basically he said that because everyone, Lebanon, Israel, the United States, understands the tremendous risks, it's less likely to happen on purpose. Let's listen.

Everybody knows now that Hezbollah has only used 5% of its military capabilities and might against Israel. Why didn't we start an all-out war? Because we don't want that. He said if war did start, it wouldn't be contained just to Israel and Lebanon. It's going to be the war of the axis, of the whole axis. It will start. They can never control. They cannot monopolize.

They cannot know the domino effect where it reaches. And that whole axis includes Iran, which al-Musui says supplies and supports Hezbollah, and Iran-backed armed groups in Iraq and Yemen, which have also been attacking Israel. How powerful is Hezbollah right now? Well, it's a lot more powerful than the Lebanese military. It was founded for that reason, really, to fight Israel after Israel invaded Lebanon in 1982. It's classified in the United States as a terrorist organization, but in addition to its fighters, it's also a key player in the Lebanese parliament and in government. Moussaoui, the spokesman, is himself a member

of parliament. The important thing, Scott, is that Hezbollah in 2024 is much more powerful and much better equipped than it was almost two decades ago when Israel invaded again and Hezbollah fought them to a standstill. How is Hezbollah more powerful today? They have more sophisticated weapons. Hezbollah has drones that have penetrated Israel's air defenses. They have huge stockpiles of rockets that can reach most of Israel. They have an extremely committed fighting force in the largely Shia south of Lebanon. I spoke with former intelligence analyst Harrison Mann. He resigned from the U.S. Defense Intelligence Agency to protest what he sees as a deeply flawed U.S. policy in Gaza. He says Hezbollah's defensive capabilities are as good as any military in the region. He said until the Gaza war started in October,

Israel and Hezbollah were conducting tit-for-tat attacks designed not to escalate. But after that... What's different now, of course, is that Hezbollah feels it cannot let up until there's a ceasefire in Gaza. As an organization founded to resist Israel, they feel like they can't totally stand down until the Gaza issue is resolved. And he says that puts Israel in a position of feeling they can't stop either. What would stop this, Jane?

Here's El Moussoui on that subject. First, the doorway to start all of this is stop the killing in Gaza to reach a ceasefire, and then the whole front would stop. Israel and Hamas have been holding indirect negotiations. Hamas had insisted on a permanent ceasefire, but has now said it will accept an initial temporary one. Al-Musui said either way, Hezbollah would follow the lead of Hamas. And Piers Jane Araf speaking with us from Beirut. Thanks so much. Thank you, Scott. Soccer fans, are you ready?

Sunday, Sunday might be the biggest day in international soccer until the 2026 World Cup. England will take on Spain in the final match of the European Championship. And here in the U.S., Colombia will play Argentina in the Copa America final in what could be the last major tournament match for the all-time great Lionel Messi. NPR Sports correspondent Becky Sullivan joins me now with a preview. Hi, Becky. Good morning. So before we hear about the games, are you excited about this? Yes, Sunday is going to be an excellent day for soccer. When it comes to national teams, these two tournaments are second

only to the World Cup. So this is a huge deal. COPA is South America's tournament. This year, they invited some North American teams to join, too, including the USA. As you said, it's hosted here in the U.S. The final is Sunday night in Miami. So that's going to be a big deal. And then the Euros, of course, this is like all the European national, of course, the very best players in the world. Some of them, like Messi, as you mentioned, at the end of their career. Some who are just beginning to shine. So we're going to get to see all of that in Sunday's matches. I'm very excited. OK, so let's talk about the Euro final between England and Spain. What are you watching for? Well, the big narrative for England, at least, is that they are trying to end this very famous, infamous, even long drought

that they have gone without having won a major international tournament. It's been almost 60, six zero years. So they're going to try to reverse that. But however, they're going to run into a big challenge in Spain. Spain is extremely good. Just to give you like a little sense of this, they have had nine different players score a goal in this tournament, meaning the threat can sort of come from anywhere on the field. They've won every game they've played in this tournament so far. So Spain will be the favorites. England, on the other hand, keeps kind of getting through at the last minute, a little sort of like last minute magic, late game goals, penalty kicks. We'll see if that can carry them through for one more match to get them that trophy that England has craved

for so long. Okay, so how about the Copa final? So Argentina is the big dog in the Copa. They won the World Cup in 2022. And then in the history of the Copa, they have won 15 times, including the most recent one in 2021. Colombia, by contrast, has only won once. But in this tournament, they have maybe looked a little better, I might say. They especially were impressive in this semifinal match against Uruguay, in which they had a player sent off with a second yellow card just before halftime, meaning they had to play the second half down a man against Uruguay. Won anyway, so that's a big deal.

That performance ended up being, I would say, maybe overshadowed by this ugly brawl in the stands afterward. Hopefully that doesn't happen tonight. But they'll be a fierce challenger to Argentina, which, as you said, is led by the great Lionel Messi. They've honestly kind of coasted a little bit to reach this final. Messi hasn't played his very best. But as you say, this might be his last major tournament match. So hopefully they'll turn it on for all the spectators.

OK, well, speaking of Messi, a series of photos of him as a young man has gone viral this week. In a good way. Yes. OK, so tell us why. In a very good way. This is like actually totally wholesome and wonderful. So back in 2007, Messi was 20 years old. He was this like budding superstar at FC Barcelona. The team did this like calendar photo shoot for charity in which Messi and a bunch of other players, you know, took part. But Messi's photos in particular, he gave this bath to like a six-month-old baby with like the baby's mom there. And sort of like in an unbelievable happenstance, insane coincidence, that baby is Laminia Malt, who is the superlative young winger for Spain, who is one of the very

best young players in the game today. He just turned 17 Saturday. And his family had held on to the photos all these years to sort of like avoid any unwanted comparison to Messi. But Jamal has been amazing in this tournament. He had like this divine goal against France in the semifinal that made him the youngest goal scorer in the history of the tournament. And now with Spain on the precipice of winning the Euros, his family decided now was an OK time to put these photos out. And they have just charmed the entire soccer world. Wow. Maybe something rubbed off in the bath. Yeah. So NPR sports correspondent Becky Sullivan, thanks so much for joining us.

You're so welcome. And that's a first for Saturday, July 13, 2024. I'm Scott Simon. And I'm Aisha Roscoe. Danny Hensel produced today's episode with help from Martin Patience, Gabe O'Connor, and Andrew Craig, who also did double duty as the director of this podcast. Our editors were Matthew Sherman, James Heider, Catherine Laidlaw, Fernando Narro, and Melissa Gray. Nisha Hynes is our technical director with engineering help from a constellation of all-stars, Ted Meebane, Arthur Halliday-Lorent, Stacey Abbott, and Andy Huther. Evie Stone is our senior supervising editor. She's fabulous. Sarah Lucy Oliver is our wonderful executive producer, and Tony Cabin is our deputy managing editor.

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Or, you know. I was thinking of, well, right.