Up First from NPR - Ukraine-Russia Peace, Noncitizens And Due Process, Khartoum Destroyed

Episode Date: April 25, 2025

Ukraine says a ceasefire must be in place first before it will accept a peace deal with Russia, President Trump claims it's not possible for all of the people he wants to deport to get a trial, and after two years of brutal fighting, Sudan's once-vibrant capitol city of Khartoum is in ruins.Want more comprehensive analysis of the most important news of the day, plus a little fun? Subscribe to the Up First newsletter.Today's episode of Up First was edited by Tara Neill, Anna Yukhananov, Ryland Barton, Janaya Williams and Jan Johnson. It was produced by Ziad Buchh, Nia Dumas and Christopher Thomas. We get engineering support from Arthur Laurent. Our technical director is Carleigh Strange. And our Executive Producer is Jay Shaylor. Learn more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

The Trump administration is demanding that Ukraine accept a peace deal favoring the Kremlin. Ukraine says a ceasefire must be in place first. With so little progress on the ceasefires, there is still a chance for peace. I'm Michelle Martin, that's Amy Martinez, and this is Up First from NPR News. President Trump says it's not possible for all of the people he wants to deport to get a trial. Top officials in his administration have said that due process is only for U.S. citizens. What rights do non-citizens have in this process?

And the civil war in Sudan started in the capital city of Khartoum. After two years of brutal fighting, the once vibrant city is in ruins. NPR is one of the few Western news outlets to gain access to the city to see the destruction. We'll have a report from our correspondent. Stay with us. We've got all the news you need to start today. This message comes from NPR sponsor Air Canada. Ready for your next adventure? How about taking in views upon views in Athens, browsing mouthwatering night markets in Bangkok, or dancing to Carnival in the Caribbean? With amazing beach breaks, city breaks, and bucketless trips to choose from, Air Canada has you covered. Start planning your trip to over 180 destinations

today at aircanada.com or contact your travel agent. Air Canada, nice travels. or contact your travel agent. Air Canada, nice travels. Keeping up with the news can feel like a 24-hour job. Luckily, it is our job. Every hour on the NPR News Now podcast, we take the latest most important stories happening and we package them into five minute episodes. So you can easily squeeze them in between meetings and on your way to that thing. Listen to the NPR News Now podcast now. Aviv Regev is the co-founder of the Human Cell Atlas. It's a huge leap in understanding how human cells work.

She says it's like upgrading from a 15th century map of the world to Google Maps. If I want to develop a medicine that would only go to the place where something is broken, I need to know how to get there. The new wave of biotechnology that's on the TED Radio Hour podcast from NPR. Ukraine is marking a day of mourning today. At least 12 people died in Russian drone and missile strikes on the Ukrainian capital of Kiev. President Trump scolded Russian President Vladimir Putin on social media for the attacks. Trump says he wants peace quickly. He says Ukraine must accept

concessions and that Russia is making a pretty big concession by not occupying all of Ukraine. MPR's Ukraine correspondent, Joannika Kisses joins us now from Kiev. Joannika, tell us more about this latest Russian attack on the capital. Well, A, there is a lot of anger and grief here, as to be expected. We spoke with 40-year-old Maria Rumyantseva, who scrambled to evacuate her elderly mother before a Russian missile destroyed their home. She said Russian attacks on Ukraine seem to have escalated after Trump started accommodating Russia in peace talks, and she had this question for President Trump.

How do I get my mother, a disabled person in a wheelchair, down from the second floor to the first floor to the bomb shelter alone in eight minutes? We also spoke to Elena Krakowska, who ran out of her home in her bathrobe just before the walls caved in. She believes Trump is sacrificing Ukraine for a quick deal. Trump is simply selling Ukraine and giving it away. And Ukraine cannot give up its territories. Even though these are occupied, this is our territory.

Ukrainians live here. Now, A, most Ukrainians refuse to recognize Ukrainian land occupied by Russia as part of Russia and Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky has refused to accept demands by the Trump administration to do so. For this attack Trump blamed Zelensky for prolonging the war and he was largely seen as accommodating Russian demands. Has this attack changed that at all? Well no, I mean Trump did chide Putin on social media for the attack but he also said that

Russia is already making a big concession by not occupying all of Ukraine and statements like this obviously make Ukrainians very nervous, especially coming from the leader of the US, which was once Ukraine's strongest single ally. Now Zelensky says his country wants peace, he has agreed to an unconditional 30-day ceasefire brokered by the US last month, something Russia did not agree to, and Zelensky's team is finalizing a minerals deal that could make the US a lot of money. So in return, Ukraine wants the US to provide security guarantees so Russia does not invade their country again, but the Trump administration so far is only offering vague promises. I remember being in

Kiev with you, Joanna, three years ago and everyone I spoke to just tell me how much they love America, I mean adoration for America. I'm wondering now if Ukrainians still have that optimism about the US coming to their aid at this point. Well I'm still hearing some hope in the northeastern city of Sumi recently. I spoke to commander Oleg Shariayev, he is with the 225th Separate Assault Brigade, and here's what he had to say. He's saying, I do not believe in friendship between the United States and Russia. It is impossible.

He said such a friendship defies history and the interests of the West, but when I pressed him about the US cutting off military aid to Ukraine last month, he admitted that this could happen again. And then he said, Ukraine will try to defend itself on its own as long as it can. That's NPR's Joanna Kokissis in Kyiv. Joanna, thanks. You're welcome. President Trump is working hard to implement a campaign promise for mass deportations. Officials are moving quickly to arrest, detain, and remove people from the country.

But critics say such fast action skirts due process that all people in the U.S. should receive. NPR's immigration policy reporter Jimena Bustillo joins us now to unpack all of this. So Jimena, has the administration addressed what due process means for their mass deportation goals? Yes, earlier this week Trump said that it wasn't possible for all the people he wants to remove to get a trial. And I hope we get cooperation from the courts because, you know, we have thousands of people that are ready to go out and you can't have a trial for all of these people. Vice President JD Vance went as far as to call it a quote fake legal process on social media and in another post deputy chief of staff Stephen Miller has said quote the

judicial process is for Americans immediate deportation is for illegal aliens but critics broadly point to the Fifth Amendment of the US Constitution that states that no person can quote be deprived of life liberty or property But critics broadly point to the Fifth Amendment of the US Constitution. That states that no person can quote be deprived of life, liberty or property without due process of law. The administration seems to be banking on Americans believing that non-citizens don't get the same due process as citizens. That's according to Muzaffar Chishti from the Migration Policy Institute.

That may be politically a good slogan. Unfortunately, the constitution does not make any distinction between citizens and non-citizens for the application of the protections of due process and judicial review. The ultimate concern, he says, is that if you strip due process for one group, that's a slippery slope for others. All right, so let's get into that because let's assume that some people are good with the argument that due process rights are not owed to everyone. What's the argument then about why that's not just incorrect, that it is a slippery

slope for absolutely everyone? You know, put simply because mistakes are made. It's central to the Constitution that if the government makes any accusation, people accused have a chance to respond. Immigration courts were designed specifically as a neutral space where both the government and immigrants could both make their cases. Not every person gets the same rights though. It's a spectrum of rights, you know, the lie experts tell me. It depends on how long you've been in the country and other factors.

I spoke with Ashley Tabador, she's a former immigration judge, and she said the government can't just act on the basis of allegations. Government is not immune from making errors and errors that can cost someone's life. So what is at stake is oftentimes a life and death situation.

Are there any examples of such errors already? You know, the case of Kilmar Abrego-Garcia brought the question of due process to the forefront. In 2019, an immigration judge had decided that he could not be deported to El Salvador, but last month officials arrested him. Within days and by mistake, he was sent to a prison in El Salvador. Other lawyers fighting Trump's policies have alleged their clients didn't have deportation orders yet and were due in court and suddenly they ended up in other countries. And lawyers have told me that they've defended US citizens or others with legal status who

got arrested or detained when they shouldn't have. But Trump administration is making other changes too. They increased the number of people who can be removed without a court hearing. And they've terminated contracts that provide legal services to over 20,000 minors without legal status. And they fired and accepted resignations from over 100 court staff, including dozens of judges. Critics warn that erodes those due process protections America was founded on.

That's NPR's immigration policy reporter, Jimena Bustio, thanks a lot. Thank you. Our final story this morning doesn't often make it into the headlines in the US, although a lot of people have argued it should. Sudan's capital city of Khartoum has been systematically destroyed. The once vibrant city at the junction of the white and blue Nile has been

hollowed out after two years of civil war. The conflict between the Sudanese army and the paramilitary rapid support forces or RSF started in Khartoum. Then over a month ago in a major shift, the city was liberated by the Sudanese army. Now for the first time, the outside world is getting a glimpse of what has been left behind. NPR is one of the few Western news outlets that's made it into Khartoum. With us now is NPR's Emmanuel Akinwotu, who has just returned from there and joins us now from the de facto capital of Port Sudan.

So tell us, Emmanuel, what you saw as you traveled through Khartoum. Good morning. It's utterly devastating and surreal. Before Khartoum became the center of the war, this was a really vibrant, proud, historic city of a 6 million people. But then two years of war between these two former allies and then occupation by the rapid support forces

until just the last month really has left the city emptied, almost eerie. The swathes of it are torched, damaged, destroyed by artillery and gunfire. And this is from everyday areas to the presidential palace, to hospitals, schools, museums, even the airport has been burnt to a crisp. Before the RSF were forced out of Khartoum, they stripped the city almost like locusts, looting it to a degree that's honestly just really hard to grasp. And that's from the National Museum where they took tens of thousands of ancient artifacts, and even down to electric wires ripped from the walls in almost every building that they occupied. And they stripped

them for copper. The city is without power, there's a shortage of water, virtually no state services, although they're gradually returning. So if the city is missing power, shortage of water, I mean basic services, I mean can people return? Well there are tractors at the moment clearing debris, teams of sweepers cleaning the streets, and they're still finding unexploded bombs and human remains. But you're right, it's mostly uninhabitable. There's a trickle of people returning, but mainly to find out or confront what's happened to their property and their belongings. We went to a bakery and spoke to the owner Yousuf Aldi.

He said the RSF looted his home above the shop and they lived there and for a period they even kept the bakery open and ran it like it was their own business. And Manuel, also wondering about what you may have witnessed around the humanitarian crisis. I mean, the United Nations says Sudan is experiencing the worst famine anywhere in the world in decades. Yes, it's unprecedented. We visited the Al-Baluk Hospital, which is the main and largest pediatric health facility in the Khartoum state region. The wards were packed with

malnourished children. The hospitals expanded again and again through the war but it's still overwhelmed. I spoke to the lead doctor Ahmed Khology. At the beginning of January 1 2024 we served like 4,000 patients per month. Now it's 30 to 36,000 per month. So the fighting has stopped in Khartoum, but the toll of the war is really just coming to the surface. And of course, the fighting continues. Tell us about where the fighting has shifted. Well, it's shifted to the outskirts of the capital region

and has become really intense towards the Western region of Darfur, which is overwhelmingly controlled by the RSF. It's where there was a genocide 20 years ago by Arab militias that evolved into the RSF against African ethnic groups and it's happening again now according to the UN, US and others. That's NPR's Emmanuel Akinwotu in Sudan. Thank you very much. Thank you very much. Thank you. Music

Morningers from around the world are lining up to see Pope Francis lying in state at St. Peter's Basilica. The Vatican said more than 90,000 people had paid their respects by yesterday evening, waiting in long lines for hours. Among them was Kelly Gaffigan from Virginia. Here's how she said she'll remember Frances. He really like had the best interest of the people as a whole, Catholic and everyone and the planet. And even though that rubbed people the wrong way, I think he was always doing what was best for us in our world. When the viewing ends tonight, the coffin will be sealed for the funeral mass Saturday

morning. That will be a traditional Catholic requiem mass for the dead with prayers mostly in Latin, but also in Chinese, Polish, Portuguese, and Arabic. Then nine days of official mourning begins leading up to the papal conclave. Once the conclave gets underway, voting cardinals are sequestered in a Sistine Chapel and a nearby house until a new pope is selected. This Sunday on a First Day, whistleblower inside the federal government shares evidence that Doge employees may have taken sensitive data from government

computers and cover their tracks. Unfortunately, because of the way that the database was manipulated, there's really no way to tell where that data is now. What the whistleblower found this weekend on the Sunday story right here in the Up First podcast. And that's that first for Friday, April 25th. I'm your host, Amy Martinez. And I'm Michelle Martin. And a reminder, Up First airs on weekends too. Ayesha Roscoe and Scott Simon will have the news.

Look for it wherever you get your podcasts. Today's episode of Up First was edited by Tara Neal, Anna Yukhanov, Rylan Barton, Jan Johnson and Janaya Williams. It was produced by Ziad Butch, Nia Dumas and Christopher Thomas. We get engineering support from Arthur Laurent and our technical director is Carly Strange. Our executive producer is Jay Shaler. Have a great weekend, everyone. Do you want to hear this podcast without sponsor breaks? Amazon Prime members can listen to Up First sponsor free through Amazon Music, or you can also support NPR's vital journalism and get Up First Plus at plus.npr.org.

That's plus.npr.org. Hey, it's Amartinez. Even as the host of a news show, it can be hard to keep up with the headlines. That is why we make the Up First podcast. Every morning in under 15 minutes, we cover three major stories with context and analysis from reporters around the world so you can catch up on lo que está pasando while getting ready, making desay breakfast, or going to work. So listen to the Up First podcast from NPR. Having news at your fingertips is great, but sometimes you need an escape. And that's where Shortwave comes in. We're a joy-filled science podcast driven by wonder and curiosity that will get you out of your head and in touch with the world around you.

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