Upgrade - 158: New Theater Smell

Episode Date: September 13, 2017

Apple unveiled three new iPhones, a new Apple Watch, a 4K Apple TV, and the new Steve Jobs Theater at its September media event. Jason was there and returned home just in time to join with Myke in recapping and analyzing everything that went on at Apple Park.

from relay fm this is upgrade episode 158 today's show is brought to you by squarespace encapsula and sanebox my name is mike hurley i am joined by mr jason snell hello jason snell hello mike hurley how are you i'm well, but nobody cares about that because we have a super packed show today. I'm going to start off, I should say, with a hashtag Snell Talk question from me to you, Jason Snell. What? Huh? I wanted to know if you had a comfortable seat for the Apple keynote today. Of course I did. Why would I not have a comfortable seat?

Well, I saw lots of pictures of different types of seats, and some of them look more comfortable than others. Yeah, so the front area of the theater, which is more flat, has these sort of bench seats with pull-down armrests, like you might find in a car or something. The upper bowl of seats, which is where i was um there are just regular old arm armrests but they're padded and they're comfortable and it turns out there's a power plug in the foot of each chair so there's one outlet beneath each chair wow so yes comfy very very fancy indeed all that leather of course you know is just sort of outgassing a little bit into the air. So you get that new theater smell.

So, of course, we are talking about the chairs inside of the Steve Jobs Theater in Apple Park. Because today we are going to be talking about the iPhone keynote, the September event, which wrapped up just a couple of hours ago. which wrapped up just a couple of hours ago. Jason sped his way within legal speed limits all the way back from Apple Park to Six Colors headquarters to join me here today. But of course, before we go any further, we must address the scores of the draft, Jason Snell. We must address.

Yes. I know that's the only reason people have truly tuned in today is just to find out the the scores of the draft and uh as i had hoped and and predicted uh many upgradians out there in the world were playing along i love to see people playing along i saw some people which i think is amazing who print out the scorecard which i think is really funny um i I score on my iPad. I had Notability in the little slide-over window. I had Twitter and I had my Notes app

while I was watching the keynote on my Apple TV. And I would just slide over Notability and just check things off every now and then. So here we go, Jason. I have something interesting for you here. So just flat out, you won the draft yes you won the draft there is some contention in not a bad way but there is there is a discussion to be had as to whether you achieved a clean sweep i don't think i did because i thought we said last time that if they just show like a picture,

historical picture of Steve Jobs with a Mac, that doesn't count. I know I mentioned that contingency. I can't remember whether I said that did count or it didn't count, but I thought it needed to be, um, that didn't feel like that, that, that was, I don't know, unless I was being super sneaky and like there was that in there. There is him holding a MacBook air, maybe a laptop of some kind in one of the photos that they showed of steve and if that is a mac reference then i guess i got a perfect score but i don't think i'd give that to me unless it mattered maybe and it doesn't yeah it doesn't matter um you got uh so let's say you got

it was five three then you got face unlock an ar demo on stage 4k hdr apple tv cellular apple watch explanation of why oled is superior screen technology um i got three iphones no touch id on the high-end iphone and picture of steve jobs on a slide um i knew uh over the weekend that i wasn't going to win the draft because there were just just enough stuff came from all of the leaks over the weekend which I wasn't going to win the draft because there were just enough stuff came from all of the leaks over the weekend which kind of confirmed to me we had the leaks that revealed this yes

so that puts you now you have picked up another keynote victory you are undefeated in keynotes just standard keynote events I am undefeated at WWDC and you are undefeated at keynote events so far. But that is more total victories.

So you've had three total victories so far, and I've had two. So as it stands for 2017, we're neck and neck. So I guess we're going to have to really – I mean, that's the only reason, though, I want Apple to have another event this year is so there can be an undisputed champion in 2017. But we're going to have to wait and see about that. As it stands right now, we have a point each on the drafts for this year so there can be an undisputed champion in 2017 but we're going to have to wait and see about that as it stands right now we have a point each on the drafts for this year I don't think there's going to be another event but you never know

well we'll have to try and put a call in to somebody just a real short one just so we can get a little drafting come on Tim any kind of time breaker maybe we have to just as it gets if we like pass october we may have to come up with some maybe a quiz or something uh that that we could be administered so we can uh we can we can call a winner of something for the year

what do you think about that uh i think it's okay if we tie for the year that's what i think well we'll see i have many harebrained schemes sometimes you don't know they're coming and that might be one of them let's talk about your impressions of steve jobs theater so first off before we talk about the theater itself what was apple park like the whole campus what were your impressions from what i could see i mean people were sent like posting pictures all day and it looked unbelievable yeah so you know it starts out with it's the next exit down the freeway so it's a totally different way to get there and the way they actually had the the street blocked off

they had the street closed that the um that the visitor center is on it was blocked off and so there was one way to kind of get in and then you went uh and parked and then i ended up parking in the um beneath the visitor center there is a multi there's a there's a service lot but they didn't have me park there they had me park in on the second sub level of it so it's a brand new park underground parking garage so it's just brand new concrete and all the spaces are lined and everything. And there's electric car chargers on every level, which is pretty funny. So I go two levels down. All the air conditioning and stuff, I guess, was running because it was super noisy in there, like really noisy of machinery running. We emerged kind of up into the courtyard in front

of the visitor center. I got to see the visitor center on the way out. And it's really nice. It's a big glass building in typical Apple style. It's kind of a box though. It's not round like the stuff across the street. And this is where people will make their pilgrimages if they want to see Apple Park. Half of it is a cafe and half of it is an Apple store.

And, you know, it's an Apple store. The only difference being like the company store at One Infinite Loop, it's got like t-shirts. They have six colors of t-shirts plus, you know, some other things, but they've got some six colors of different t-shirts. They've got an Apple Park t-shirt. There's a, with a big ring on it.

There, yeah. So there's that stuff is going to be there. And I don't know if it's open to the public soon. I don't know when later this year, I think is all that all the Tim Cook set on stage. So that was pretty cool. So you can go get your Apple Park t-shirt or your Apple logo and one of the six colors t-shirts. And then you go across the street and there's a, there's a building that we had to walk through that's like one of the entry gates, basically, it seems, to Apple Park. And then up a winding path, up a hill, to the Steve Jobs Theater, which is, I would say, it's maybe a five-minute walk up a hill to get there in this winding path. And from the top, where the theater is, you can see across what will be a

grassy field someday, but is mostly dirt with stuff planted in it. It's like to grow over time, but it's not, you know, it's not there yet. Across the way is the enormous ring of Apple Park. And in fact, driving in, you know, I drove on Homestead Road, which borders one side of the campus. And, you know, on one side of the street are houses. And on the other side of the street is a sidewalk and then some trees and then a sidewalk and then some trees and then a fence and then some more trees and then the ring of Apple Park. So, yes, you could potentially live in a house just across the street from Apple Park, but it's going to be pretty soon completely obscured i think by trees um so huge just huge it's huge like we all like we all have have known but then you see it and yes it is an enormous structure um that's kind of far off across this field and

then the steve jobs theater is another circular building it's got a little little roof on the top but it's a round glass thing that there's like a, you go in to the main level and that's the ground level basically. And it is, you know, it reminded me of like, there's a circular restaurant kind of bar place on the top of the Guinness storehouse in Dublin. It reminded me of that, except there was no beer, but it was just like a big round space with glass to look out at the Apple Park campus. It felt very much like that you could have a wedding reception there or something like that. And then on two sides of it, on both sides of this circular, the outside of the circular structure, there are steps down. And so you take the steps down. And on the way down, you take the

steps down, and it leads to the entrance to the theater. And then the theater is down from there. So you actually enter down from the top of the theater. On the way back out, on that level that's at the back of the theater there is a part of that that turns so on our way down there was nothing nowhere to go except into the theater but on the way back out that had turned around and now um we could enter that area and that's actually the hands-on area which is right below the entry lobby and that's where all of their hands-on area, which is right below the entry lobby. And that's where all of their hands-on stuff for the press was afterwards. So it's obviously purpose-built for that, for that, for an Apple event with, with those details. So very impressive. It's all brand new. It's all

still kind of being planted and under construction. And, and, and I talked to a couple people who who said how fragrant it was at apple park because the fact is it's basically covered in fertilizer right now because they're growing all these new plants so not the best smelling location but i imagine that will pass as uh the plants grow so from uh like a checking in perspective and a general logistics perspective how did that feel because i'm assuming apple have got their own people or something which seems peculiar because i can't imagine these people are hired all the time what what was your sense for for that kind of stuff i mean apple's got a lot of people who work there so i i imagine that some of this was like hired maybe event security but i

would bet a lot of it is apple security it's a huge it's a huge campus they're gonna have to have security for it and i think that there was also um they were also apple employees who were there where they brought in whether those were maybe retail employees or they were they were people who just work at apple and were were called into service but there were lots of people they were everywhere. It was because they don't, the last thing they wanted was people wandering down some unapproved path.

And on the way out, it was funny because they tried to stand in the shade if they could because it was a pretty warm day. And then some of them would be, have no option and they'd just be standing there in the sun sweating, but they wanted to make sure that we were going the right direction and not going off the official path.

And you got some sweet little enamel pins as well. That's fun, huh? I just opened the box right as I sat down. Yeah, they gave everybody, as they were leaving, a little box, and I didn't know what was in it. It could be like $1,000 in iTunes money, but it wasn't. It was four cute little enamel pins. me tell you right now jason snow if you want a thousand dollars in money you could probably get close to it by trying to sell these pins on ebay

because these pins are even more exclusive than the wwdc pins because it's just a small amount of press right it's not 1500 attendees plus press i suppose that's true 1,500 attendees plus press. I suppose that's true. You know, press didn't get the pins at WWDC. Oh, so this is your makeup pins. But these pins are even better because they're emoji pins. Yeah, so I got an Apple logo. I got an Apple Park ring.

And I got a robot emoji and a monkey emoji. It is a robot emoji. I just want to, you know, we're obviously going to talk about this later on, but like, oh my God, an emoji. I'll just say that right now, and later on you can hear my voice. I've done it now.

I can tell you all about it, but we'll save that. Oh my God, I'm so excited. I'm so excited to hear your opinions. All right, look, we have a ton, a literal ton of stuff to cover today. So why don't we take a break and then we'll go through chronologically the keynote. How does that sound? Sounds good. All right. Today's show is brought to you in part by Sanebox, a new sponsor for this show. I imagine that every single person listening right now has something that they don't

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It was a clip of Steve. I don't know where this came from, but a clip of Steve talking about making things and what makes Apple, Apple. Were these quotes, was this speech familiar to you at all? I did not recognize it, although I saw some people on Twitter who said that this is where it was from.

But I didn't recognize it yeah no i mean there there are many you know there are many famous steve quotes right and and this could have been from from anywhere but it was clearly something very cool and it was a nice one to play because obviously the the apple park stuff and the steve Jobs theater is kind of the intersection of Steve Jobs and Apple, right? Like this is where those two things cross over. And I really loved Tim's line. I think this was the opening line saying that it was only fitting that Steve Jobs should open his theater. And then he spent some time talking about Steve. They actually spent, whilst we both really expected heavily that they would do this, they spent more time on this than i was expecting but not and not too much time if that makes sense yeah i it's exactly i mean when we were planning our draft and all of that i mean this was one of

the things that came to me is that there will there's got to be a dedication at the start, right? How can they let the first event in the Steve Jobs Theater go by without mentioning it? And so they did. They had Steve's words open it up. And then Tim Cook came out and talked about Steve. And he talked about Apple Park, which is inexorably linked to Steve Jobs. The last public appearance he made was to the Cupertino City Council about this project. This is sort of his last product that he envisioned. And so they talked about the park campus a bit.

And then they got on with the show. But I think it was a must. I don't think they're going to be doing anything. This is a one-shot deal, right? But I think that it was a must. I don't think they're going to be doing anything. This is a one-shot deal, right? But I think that it was a must for them to do it. And one other quote that I liked, he says, today and always we honor him.

I like that. It was really nice. I mean, you could tell. I mean, I think if you were watching that event, you know, there is a very strong likelihood that you have an affinity for Steve Jobs. And obviously the people working at Apple, especially people like Tim who are friends with the guy, right?

Like this is an emotional thing. And I thought he did a really good job getting through that as well as he did. Yeah. I mean, he clearly was wrestling with his emotions there, but he did a good job and it was fine. Tim also spent some time talking about Apple Park itself and the fact that it is 100% powered by renewable energy. And then kind of also going through, like, again, everything has been designed of extreme attention to detail. That was the thing that he really kept pushing on.

And we were talking about the Visitor Center a moment ago. That's going to be opening later this year. And I think what is going to be a buzzword term for Apple for a little while, it has an AR experience inside to learn more about Apple Park. Of course it has an AR experience because all of our experiences will be AR experiences

in just a couple of weeks. And you mentioned the cafe. Is this, like, what is the deal with this cafe? Like, is it just a regular coffee shop that people can go into? They had it set up. They had it set up. There's a big bar on one side with coffee machines, and they had it set up with food and stuff for basically event attendees.

I actually went there afterward and had a sandwich and a soda and uploaded some pictures and things like that before I left. And so it looks very much like, think of it this way. Think of it almost like a museum or, I mean, they're calling it a visitor center, but it's that kind of thing where there's an Apple store. Maybe they'll do tours, I don't know, but there's an Apple store and there's this cafe. So you can go there to the Apple Park

and you can get a coffee and sit at a table. And it's all in Apple store design. Even the cafe is in Apple store design. It's got the light wood and tables everywhere. And it's exactly what you'd expect. And it's sort of a fifth maybe of the size of the, of the rectangular building. And then, and then on the rest of it is the Apple store. And there's a, there's a wall and a wall in between them. And then there are walkways doors

between them on, on the far sides. So you can get from one to another, but it's not a wide open space. That's a cafe and Apple store. It's a cafe on one side and the rest of it is the apple store so i guess that i guess that's the idea i mean they i think apple has struggled with the fact that people want to visit apple and one infinite loop is not infinite loop in general it's not really made for that and they tried they put in some guest parking but which they well they didn't even use how it used to have guest parking there so people would like pull up to the curb and things tried they put in some guest parking but which they well they didn't even use used to have guest parking there so people would like pull up to the curb and things and they put in the the company store which is now the apple store they redid it as a full-on apple store it's better but you know it was it's an office park it was never designed for that with that mind

and there's nothing they can do even the apple store at one infinite loop is is kind of a bad apple store it's so small. It's very small. It's almost like if you imagined an Apple Store in an airport, that's what it would be like. It's tiny. So this one is bigger because it's built to do this. This is intended to work this way. And so, yeah, and people are going to go there.

So people can roll their eyes and be like oh of course apple's building a visitor center but the thing is people are going to visit apple park i'm gonna go next year apple decided to make part of the apple park experience that they would actually okay people are going to come here what can we do and so they put in an apple store and a cafe and who knows what else they'll do but uh yeah yeah like next wwdc i'm gonna take a trip there i really really want to go i i would be shocked if next wwdc there aren't some specific events to go to take people to apple park because they everybody at wwdc is going to want to see it yeah exactly like they may as well try and organize it in some way to stop just a constant stream of people i think and

i think that encapsulates the whole thing is people are going to visit it so you might as well build just embrace it build a visitor center so they did and it's a and it'll be you know and it's an apple store too and it seems ready to go i mean it was a fully stocked apple store people were buying stuff from the media event were buying stuff the i the new stuff was not available they do also have things that you can only buy there i mean i'd be super surprised if people were walking away with an ipad um no they have they have apple park t-shirts that's exactly in in six colors interesting just gonna and uh and and Apple logo t-shirts in six colors too. So, yeah.

Next up was Angela Arendt came on stage to talk about retail, which was a surprise. I haven't had a retail update in a while. No. And this really felt like it wasn't going to be the event for that because there was so much stuff. But it turns out that whilst going through some stuff we already knew, Angela had a bunch of new things to say about retail. And I also think that maybe this is an important thing for the efforts that she's put in.

And also, I think for the the company their retail stores are so important that maybe they wanted to get this we talk about this right the iPhone event is where if Apple really wants to tell you something they will tell you it during this event because this is when everybody's watching so they may

have had this segment in here so Angela got to go on stage and talk about you know the today apple program which is the this this i think they're mostly on the weekends where they tend to do like these events um stuff like that which is really cool especially in some of the bigger stores where they have these outside areas uh she spoke about some really impressive, huge projects for retail that Apple are going to be working on, including a store that has a cinema in Milan. And what was the library that they're buying?

I missed where that was. But yeah, it's like a disused library that they're going to turn into a new sort of public engagement space. Look, I don't think there was a lot new here in the retail update. This is basically stuff that they've been doing, they've been working on for the last year in a large part. Like the Town Square store idea

with the Genius Grove and all of that. They've been working on this. But the point is, it actually is a little bit like what I just said about how you build a visitor center because you know you're going to have visitors. It's like the Apple stores, from the moment they first were opened, people go there and use the Wi-Fi and use the computers and things like that.

They were becoming places where people would go and hang out and they would get packed and people would want to be there. And so this is Apple in their largest locations just leaning into that and saying, all right, this is what we're going to do. And I think that their feeling is that making the Apple store a destination, even if there's lots of things you can do there that don't require you to buy an Apple product, it's all good because it all accumulates, it all accrues to the value of Apple. You're going to buy stuff from Apple one way or another, they're going to get you in and by making the Apple Store such a valuable

place for people to go, that's good for Apple. So yeah, it's, it's, you know, some of this stuff is, I mean, this is this, a lot of retail trends reflected here, the idea that it's about an experience that's, that's definitely a trend in especially upscale retail. And Apple viewing their stores as a destination for people to go to. It seems weird that the new public square, the new town square would be an Apple store instead of an actual town square. But it's no different, I think, in a lot of ways from a Starbucks being a place that people go and work and meet and all of those things, right? A lot of these private, you know, corporate locations that are actually, they want to be part of the public geography. And that's what Apple's doing here, too.

So, as per the chat room, it is the Carnegie Library in DC, Washington DC, which is the big library. Good knowledge chat room. Once again, you learn a lot more when you're not at the event. Yes, yes, you definitely do. Taking notes. They mentioned that the Fifth Avenue store

is being completely rebuilt, it looks like, but they're going to make sure they retain the glass cube. There's a store in Chicago opening up. they're renovating a big building in paris um and they did say and you mentioned this slightly but the one the one eye rolly thing is you know they don't call them stores anymore they call them town squares and i understand what they're going for but you know there is this part of just like okay company please just like understand what what you actually are it is a store like i know it's also a meeting place but it is a store yeah right no that there there was a lot in um i i think yeah i think the way

that angela erin's talks is very much in line with how retail executives talk about what they're doing and about the high-end retail and luxury retail market. Yeah, because she's from the luxury world, right? Yes. And so for those of us not exposed to that, we hear this and we're like, really? It's not a store anymore. It's a town square. Well, what's happening in the Union Square town square in San Francisco? It's retail stores is what it is, but whatever.

I view that as being that they're doing some classification of it. Certain stores are the ones with the trees and with the Today at Apple program and all of those things. Anyway, it's good that retail got a little time because it's a huge part of Apple's strategy. It's a huge part of Apple's employee base, and it generates a huge amount of money for Apple. It is how Apple reaches people in their everyday lives, where they live, even though there isn't a lot of news here.

And it's sort of beside the point in some ways. I get why they need to do this from time to time. I'm glad it's not as often as it was, but I'm glad that they do. I think it's valuable for them to remind people about it. All right. So we next up have the first product. So Tim Cook comes back out and has a couple of numbers about the apple watch uh phenomenal growth with series two 50 year over year um i know that these things infuriate

you because i mean that could have just gone from one watch to two watches right two watches yeah you know it doesn't infuriate me but it is important to note that in the grand tradition of Jeff Bezos, Tim Cook does not detail numbers of Apple Watch. It's all in sort of relative or just positivity. And we already heard this number up 50% from last year was in the financial call. So it's not new news. was in the financial call so it's not new news um it's now the number one watch in the world and there is 97 customer sat which i quote is blow away i don't fully know what that means does that mean it blows me away is that is that what that term means that that is it's it's it's an item so full of awesomeness that when you see it you are blown away apparently is this a phrase that

people use the first time i ever heard anybody use it was scott forestall at another apple event and i'm not sure i've heard anybody outside of apple use it except perhaps ironically so it's an apple term then maybe like maybe they all use it internally right? So it's just one of those things that gets out into the world. Yeah, it's blow away at 97% customer satisfaction. They then roll a video of people using the Apple Watch. The conceit of the video is these are customers that have written in. They've written letters, written emails. And then Apple has gone and filmed them,

and they're reading the letters. And they're people that are talking about the ways that the Apple Watch has helped save their lives, and it's either through fitness or sickness or some kind of emergency situation or something like that. And there was a surprise to me in this video because good friend of the show and listener kyle seth gray was in this video i i thought it looked like him and then i thought nah it's nah it can't be now kyle has over the last couple of years, he's really gotten into fitness. And he's a big, big Apple Watch user. And I assume he wrote a letter and they picked him for this. Yeah, it was unbelievable.

I'm actually going to link to Kyle's website. unbelievable. I'm actually going to link to Carl's website because there's some cool stuff on here about the types of things that he gets into. And you can see all the fitness stuff. And I think he may have actually published the letter that he sent to them because there's a post there called Dear Apple. So you can go and check that out. my my brain nearly blew up because i saw his face and i was like hang on wait what and then uh then i didn't really pay too much attention to the rest of the video but it did look really good uh because i was too busy freaking out and tweeting at kyle so great video uh even better because a friend of mine was in it so hooray super strange but kind of wonderful I was really pleased to see that

because he is a crazy fitness person now and that has been rewarded I guess by being in an Apple video so there you go Jeff Williams runs down the WatchOS 4 features, WatchOS 4 is

going to be available september 19th i don't really know a lot about watch os 4 really because i haven't tested it um i don't put watch betas on devices uh no i just don't in the same way that i i tend not to put betas on my iphone i don't have 11 on my iphone i have it on my iPads. And that works out fine for me. But yeah, so I will be upgrading to watchOS 4 when that comes out next week. But something which is surprising, I can't recall Apple doing this with a device in this way before, they're adding more features to watchOS 4 that I don't think have been in the betas. And it's all about heart rate stuff.

So they're adding a heart rate app, which is giving you more kind of detailed information about your heart rate over the day and how it changes. And the Apple Watch can now notify you if it detects an elevated heart rate at a time when it believes there shouldn't be one. If a notification motivates you, is it notivate? Notivate. Yes, this is a new word that we are pioneering on the Upbreed podcast.

Summer of... No, it's not. No, it's not. It's the autumn of naming. It's not really. No, we're not going to do that. But yeah, so if the Apple Watch detects that your heart is racing and it shouldn't be, you know, based upon the other information it's collecting about you, it will say, hey, something's going on. So I got to dig down more on this because I'm really interested in this. One of my complaints, I was just talking to my friend Scott McNulty about this yesterday. We were talking about the Apple Watch and one of our frustrations with the Apple Watch as a fitness device, which it should be better at, is it

doesn't seem to pay attention to you and realize things about what you're doing. And so when they talk about how it's going to be sampling your heart rate and then noticing if your heart rate is altered, I thought to myself, is it sampling my heart rate now? Or is this a watchOS 4 feature where they're now going to turn on the sensor every so often and keep track? Because my complaint is always, if I go for a run or a hike or something, and I forget to set the fitness app, it should know that, right? The inverse of like your heart rate is elevated and you seem to be

inactive so maybe you have a problem would be oh your heart rate is raised and you are active maybe you're doing a workout and have it like capture that data or buzz you and say you seem to be doing a workout would you like me to capture this and that's one of my that's like my number one complaint about the fitness features of the watch is that it doesn't seem to be paying attention to me i have to tell it so i look at this heart related stuff and i think oh well this is a good sign because this suggests that apple is turning on that sensor and paying attention and that's that's really good um yeah i think it does an element of that already you you know, because you can get points for your exercise throughout the day, right? I will tell you that the difference between me saying I'm going for a run and the credit I get versus just running without saying it is night and day.

Of course. It's going to be way more granular, you know, and I don't think the apple watch is going to start tracking us for the no but i don't that's stupid it should if i start running and the apple watch realizes i'm moving and my heart rate is elevated it should say i think you're running and start capturing or ask me i know but i'm not i'm not arguing that point i'm just saying that like i know that it's it's not going to be detecting at that rate because it would destroy the battery able to see, oh, you may have a heart problem, it should also be capable of saying, oh, I think you're exercising. Maybe I'll flip into capturing this or I'll ask you to capture this. That was always the question. I agree.

It would be great, right? Like it would be great if it did that. Yeah. it'd be great if it did that yeah so uh so i think it's good that they they announced these features because this is uh this is stuff that is uh in the long run these devices need to do which is monitoring you not just when you tell it but just sort of monitoring you and saying i think there's a problem and that's uh that's good uh they're also going to be doing another one of these health studies they've done these other times i think i did the one with diabetes they've done they've done a bunch um since the addition since health kit actually was was introduced they've done these other times. I think they did the one with diabetes. They've done a bunch since HealthKit actually was introduced.

They've done some with the iPhone and some with the Apple Watch. This is a heart study where Apple is trying to get better at detecting heart arrhythmias, so weird patterns in your heartbeats. They believe, Apple believes in the testing that they've done, that they are able to accurately track some of this stuff and recognize it. So they are going to be starting an opt-in study to see just how good this data can be. And I guess a lot of this stuff is to see if they're able to roll it out on a wider scale

to actually give us that information. But really, the only way you can do something like this is by actually getting people to give you access to their data right like that's how you find out if it is possible that's how medical studies work exactly so this is yeah yeah i saw a tweet go by while i while i was at the keynote that was uh somebody asking i want saying i wonder how many um mds are employed by apple i don't know um but i would they obviously have a lot of relationships with medical professionals because that's this this is in part a medical related device and you can see it with stuff like this you know like i think like every human being every now and then i may

get some kind of weird feeling you know or like a weird pain and i'm like what is that and i would love if i if my apple watch could start being like don't worry buddy or or go to the hospital your doctor you know what i mean like i think that in the future having that kind of data could be very very interesting um but at the same time i would want it to be with a company that I trust. Because I don't want them to, without my knowledge, be selling that data to an insurance company. Now, I know that there was some news recently about Apple maybe partnering with an insurance agency, but it's like on this totally opted thing, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But yeah, you get my point.

I don't want that information to be shared with people that i don't want it to be shared with but it would be kind of cool if they could tell me like oh we think that there's something wrong with you like you should get that checked out so yeah i'm i'm looking forward to it uh but there was a new apple watch of course as we predicted um and we're going to talk about that just after we take a moment to thank our friends at Encapsula for supporting this week's episode of Upgrade. Encapsula has the website security tools and content delivery network that you're going to want to make your website faster, safer, and more reliable. Every single day, websites of all sizes are attacked. It doesn't matter if it's just one person or a huge, huge company, and Encapsular does protect huge companies, Fortune 500 companies they protect. And basically, you can see this

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your free month as well. Thank you so much to Encapsula for their continued support of Upgrade and RelayFM. Apple Watch Series 3. Cellular connectivity is built right in, and as Jeff Williams said, this has been our vision from the beginning, which makes perfect sense. These devices are great. They're great when they're paired to your phone, but really all it's doing is adding another device, right? Like you're just adding another thing. Ideally, these devices should be independent of each other

as well as they are connected. And that's kind of what the Apple Watch Series 3 with LTE, with cellular, is promising. As we've spoken about on this show a bunch, you're going to have the same number as your iPhone. So, you know, it will call when needed and people will be able to call you on their phone, the phone number that they have for you, or send text messages. And it will come through to your Apple Watch, even if your phone is nowhere near.

And sometime next month, Apple Music Streaming will be available on the Apple Watch as well, which is a really, really big deal. Yeah, I have two notes about this. One is, obviously, you're going to have to work with your carrier, and there's going to be a fee to add a device to your account. Like, on my AT&T account, it's $10 a month to add my iPad to the pool. I imagine it'll be something like that. There'll be a fee that you pay that adds your Apple Watch to your account. And that also limits the rollout. It's rolling out in nine countries by the end of the year. But obviously, the cellular version requires carrier support. And that means that they won't be able to just sort of drop it in everywhere in the world. So there is a Series 3 version without

the cellular that's also going to be available. So you can take your pick. But it will be a longer rollout for countries because as a cellular device just as with the iphone they've got to they got to do some uh company partnerships the other thing i want to mention because it happens every time this comes up and it happened again today is um whenever we talk about cellular apple watch i hear people who say this is stupid and when i say it's convenient they'll say and when i probe them about it when i say why do you say this is stupid? They say, well, I don't want it. It's like, well, first off, that is an awful lack of perspective that you've got there.

That just because you don't want it in your personal life, or at least you don't think you want it in your personal life, it's therefore stupid. And why would anybody else want it is the implication there, which is, I can tell you people want it because I want it. And then the other thing I get is I get the, oh, well, sometimes I just want to be free and not connected to anyone. If I leave my phone behind, but then they can reach me on my watch, it's like, you have a bigger problem. You don't have to do that. Leave your watch behind or don't get the cellular watch or turn off cellular when you're there. There are lots of other options to draw the line there. It's like, oh, I can carry my phone with me everywhere and people can reach me. But my watch, what have we become, right? And it's like, come on. is I, I, everywhere I go, my watch or my phone comes with me. It's, it's obligatory because what if I need to call someone? What if my kids need something? What if my wife needs something? I bring my phone with me everywhere I go. And when I think about a cellular Apple watch, what I think is there are going to be times when I don't need all of the apps and all the power of my iPhone, the only thing I need is to be reachable in case of a problem. And right now that means the iPhone comes everywhere with me.

With a cellular Apple Watch, it means I can leave the iPhone behind if I want to, if the only reason I'm bringing it is to be reachable. And it's a big phone in my pocket when i'm running especially i hate it because the iphone is kind of bouncing around in my pocket and i don't want to buy one of those straps that goes on my arm in order to keep it attached to me so look it's not for everybody it's extra money but i will say this i think it's interesting that we are now so far down the road with these kind of satellite devices that the phone, which was the thing we always brought with us because it had our entire lives on it, is now going to be with this product optional in certain circumstances. And that's something that's going to take a little time to think about. Like, well, wait a second. If I'm

going to walk the dog, I don't need to bring my iPhone because all I'm going to do a little time to think about like, well, wait a second. If I'm going to walk the dog, I don't need to bring my iPhone because all I'm going to do is listen to music. Now, if you want to listen to a podcast, good luck. But if you want to listen to music, that's perfect. So I don't know. I think it's not for everybody, but I think it will make the product better over time. I think watchOS has a lot of work to do to become more independent of the iPhone. I feel like because it started so closely tethered to the iPhone, it's a work in progress. I feel my hope is at least that watchOS 5 pushes even further in this direction. It's been true. The watch has been able to operate independently on Wi-Fi since watchOS 3, but still when you talk to developers, you know, it's still not all together. It's like, it's got a lot of limitations and it, and it needs to be

better, but at least there's this promise of always being connected that you can have with this device and that could potentially make the apps that much better so it's going to be launching with uh limited carriers um and jeff said there are introductory offers whatever that means um i my carrier in the uk ee is the only supported carrier um in the UK. They are only supporting LTE, though. So if there's no LTE, there's no connection. Some carriers are doing LTE and 3G, but we're LTE only. Oh, so it's not a hardware limitation.

It's a carrier limitation. Interesting. It's a carrier limitation, yeah. And I was really interested about this that this about what apple was going to do here like what was the sim going to be i think they that this is not an apple sim or if it is an apple sim they're not calling it that um they they called it an electronic sim and i think the reason for this is because i think this is going to be locked to your carrier not Not like with the Apple SIM, where you can jump backwards and forwards

and go in and out whenever you need it. I reckon this is going to be a, you pay this amount every single month to your network for this, right? This is how I imagine this is going to end up working. The display is the antenna, which is cool. I don't know what the red, everyone was expecting when the leaks came out

as there have been many leaks, there were some images of the red digital crown, right? This just looks like to be an Apple Watch Series 3 thing. I thought that that was like a little bit of plastic for the antenna, but no, it's a screen. No, it's basically to tell you that

I have a cellular watch and you don't. Does the Wi-Fi one doesn't have the red? I don't think so. I'm going to take a look. I'm going to take a look. I thought that it did. So I'm going to the page right now. So red literally just means three?

I think it might do. I'm going through the pricing information right now. No, it means cellular. You're right. It means cellular. Which is interesting. I mean, okay. I think it's $399.

I am surprised. I would have actually guessed the rare Apple product I probably would have guessed higher for. Yeah, I mean, it's not going to be $399 for you, I don't think. It's $399, and it's a $70 premium over the non-cellular, which is $329. And then they lower the price of the Series 1, Series 2, RIP. Series 1 continues. Of course, technically, Series 1 and Series 2 are the same age. Yeah.

Because the Series 0 that came before. Do you wear a 42 or a 38 millimeter? Oh, well, that's true. I wear the 42. Yeah. So. so for me and you it's it's more it's a good um but but as a from from 399 is pretty good 429 yeah yeah you and me yeah that's less that's less good but but for cellular i i my gut feeling was that it was going to be way higher than that so that's not bad yeah i'm a little bit disappointed that um they're still selling the series one i think that's it's that's a strange thing to do um i'm not i i feel like the series difference between the series one and the series two was so specific it was waterproofing right yeah and i forget that and

g waterproofing and gps yeah and i think the idea there is just get it as low a price as possible. That is the goal is just get it as low as possible. And under $250 is great. Yep. 18-hour battery life. There is gold, silver, and space gray aluminum. There are new sport loop bands, which are really cool. You'd be excited by that yeah it's then the nylon bands that i love but with magnets in them like the milanese loop

and there are new colors across the board um new amaze products and the white ceramic is has been joined by a gray ceramic so there's now two ceramic watches in the edition line now well i'll point out to you too that the word edition was not uttered on stage it was not it was not but it is still on the product pages yeah yeah it's still called that but they are they are leaning away from that because the gold one was an embarrassment i think i think everybody knows that now uh so which is you know maybe one of the reasons that they they would probably never use that name for any other product. The case is the same size, but the back crystal, so the little sensors on the back, is 0.25 millimeters thicker, which is apparently as thin as two pieces of paper. So it's still thicker, right?

It's exactly the same size, for the back right like which is kind of the way that they uh just dig into your skin a little bit further than before yay but still it's impressive that they that they plugged all of this new tech in there and it didn't because remember between series one and series two they and sort of zero and Series 0 and Series 2, they had to expand. It's thicker. Not a lot, but it's a little bit thicker. And I had that moment while they were talking about this, I was like, oh no,

is the Apple Watch going the other direction? Is every future Apple Watch going to be just that much thicker than that which came before it? And the answer is kind of. And also, it depends on your definition of thicker. If you're thinking, how far away is it from my skin? Well, the answer is further, right? It's still bigger.

It's just like, oh, only the watches are a millimeter thicker. It's still thicker, right? But like, okay, you can do whatever you need to do to argue your points. Fine. There is a new dual core processor, which boggles my mind. I cannot believe the Apple Watch is already a dual-core processor. Like, wild. 70% higher performance, which has now enabled the ability for Siri to talk to you, which is great.

I'd never thought of that before. Big missing feature. Big missing feature on the Apple Watch. So I'm wondering how that's going to work out. I'm looking forward to playing with that. There is a new W2 chip inside, which has 85% faster Wi-Fi speed

and 50% more power efficient. And they did a phone call demo with a lady called Deirdre paddleboarding on a lake which was awesome and then jeff williams did this great thing where he was like i'm gonna go rogue for a minute and it was really nice what he said about like you know we can sometimes get lost in this stuff but that was almost like magic it was a really cool little thing that he said i enjoyed that yeah she was like on a paddleboard at lake tahoe or something unbelievable like yeah she was so funny as well it's just like uh i'm really nervous about falling just trying not

to not to fall unbelievable 18 hour battery life uh pre-orders on september 15th shipping september 22nd um i'm gonna get one of these uh i i didn't really want to update to the series two but i had a series of issues that meant that i needed to get a new apple watch and there was nothing else available and i was traveling the next day so i have a series two a bad one for a while um but this is a this is a really worthwhile upgrade. 70% faster performance and the ability to make phone calls and leave it completely untethered. This really feels like Apple Watch version one.

You know, like this feels like this is what we would have wanted the product to be from day one. The product they originally envisioned. Yeah, I think to a certain degree, that's true. It does really feel like that like this is what you would want this little wrist computer to do and i mean seriously if you're if you're a runner and an apple music subscriber the idea that you can pop in

uh pop in airpods and uh and play your playlist and just leave and the music will just keep streaming and you'll keep going is that is uh again not everybody's use case but that's pretty cool that's pretty compelling yeah i mean like can it get better than like you know if this is the type of thing that you do can it get better than that like i don't you know what i mean like it's it seems very very very impressive yeah the answer is thinner longer battery life more power better operating system there are lots there are lots of improvements the apple watch can make oh no i don't mean the product oh i just i just meant to say there are lots of improvements they can make but it's all the pieces feel like they're there now this feels

like a good like now you can start making it thinner and stuff like that right yes you've got everything it needs yes at this point i think they have no excuses this is this is the this is the fattest that the apple watch will should ever get right yep oh and hey remember all those rumors about how the apple watch was going to add a uh a camera so that you could do facetime up your nose i believe that they were going to do that and then just canned it because it's dumb. Yeah. You know, but I guess putting LTE in it means that it's more likely for that to happen now

than it was before, right? Because in theory, you could have calls when you're away, but like, I don't want that. I really want a design refresh to the Apple Watch and that's what I hope for. I think that should be next time the focus for series four but we'll see i mean because every apple watch is amazing and then you get it and you see all the things that are wrong with it right so um i'm i'm keen i'm keen this this is

going on my list i assume you're buying one um i'm gonna get one too um so yeah that yeah i will i will probably get i will probably get one of these. Yeah. Apple TV next. Tim Cook did the product introduction. I've noticed this isn't a new thing, but this tends to be the way that this is done now. Tim Cook makes the initial introduction for every product and then introduces somebody to talk about it in more detail. It's the CEO's prerogative.

Tim gets the first first blows right he gets to be like all right boom he gets the first and last word on all the products exactly right because if i remember you know he he tried his hand at introducing products in full and he's it's not tim's strong suit he's better tactically deployed and then have somebody else come out and do the meat of the presentation. I think that that works a lot better. So throughout the history of TV, there have been a few inflection points. He talks about color.

He talks about HD. And now we're at the next one, 4K. The product is called the Apple TV 4K, and it features two key technologies, both 4K and it features two key technologies both 4K and HDR Apple try their best to do demos of this of a presentation where nobody can see it which is funny I believe they had a 4K

projector I don't know how good a job that would have done in the room at showing a difference but all I know at home is they just made the colors different you didn't actually show me a HDR image because the Apple TV can't output that. It was a funny way. It was different.

It was different. It's in that weird way where you look at an image one way and then you see it in a different way and you realize your eyes have kind of calibrated for the first image so it looks like the colors are weird and all of that. I'm not sure that that demo really worked for me but i you know i get it i know what hdr is and how it's probably more beneficial than the uh the extra pixels of 4k and you put them both together and they're supporting hdr 10 and dolby vision here and this is the this is a big deal if you've got a big tv like or you're going to buy a big beautiful 4k

hdr tv and you know to to see the difference between 1080 and 2160 lines of resolution from from 1080 hd to 4k you need to either be very close to your tv or it needs to be a very very large tv hdr a little bit different. But so, you know, this is a high end-ish kind of thing, but it's a big deal. And I think there's a lot of, there's a lot of good stuff in here. It's Apple's competitors

were playing in this space. And this is a very Apple kind of space. Apple's customers are much more likely to be the kind of people who have big, expensive, beautiful TVs. And so Apple wants to be there for them. So I sit in the middle of those two things that you proposed. I have a 42 inch TV, which is a big TV, but not a very, very, very big

TV. And we're not super close, but we're not far away at all from the TV, right? Like we are in the other sweet spot, which is we have a relatively big TV and we're relatively close. Yeah. So I benefit whenever we watch things in 4k because our TV has apps built into it, which can show things in 4k and I love it. But basically, you know, as you've said, as many people said, the money is in HDR, right? Like that is a bigger, at least for me, I find a much bigger leap. The color is, is really unbelievable. Um, leap the the color is is really unbelievable um and i was gonna buy this apple tv as long as they did one thing and they'd done that thing which is to remaster the screensavers into 4k hdr i love the apple tv screensavers we very frequently just have them on in the house and i just sit and

look at them i just watch them um and you know me and ind, we talk about them. Every now and then, I feel like, oh, have I seen this one before? Or like, oh, did you see that? Because there's so many of them now that they cycle through and that kind of stuff. And I'm super excited to see them in 4K HDR because I bet they look unbelievable because they look unbelievable already

in just regular HD. So I'm really excited for that. Obviously, the UI is in 4K now as well. The Apple TV 4K features an A10X Fusion chip, which is the chip which is inside of the iPad Pros. This is twice as fast and four times better graphics than the current Apple TV. They are working with Hollywood Studios,

all the big Hollywood studios, to bring movies in 4k hdr um they showed spider-man homecoming as a movie that they're going to have it's very soon yep look look great great uh i wouldn't know just look just look like a nice uh hd i've seen i've seen a minute of spider-man homecoming in 4k and the steve jobs theater now yay yay i guess that's that's an intersection of a bunch of jason stuff right there um it is actually these movies this is kind of unbelievable same price automatic upgrades for old movies that you've bought that go on to the store with 4k hd i was so impressed and happy with that because there have been i've been reading stories that have talked about apple's

negotiations and they were saying and it's not everybody who's involved. They listed, they listed, uh, what, uh, studios were there. And there were some that were not there like Disney, but, um, you know, they, the idea that if you've bought it in HD, you own it in 4k, they're not going to differentiate. I think Apple wants that flow to be, I think Apple wants to get away from the what quality level did you buy this video in, right? I think it's a much better experience if you just buy it and it scales to whatever quality level your device can take and your internet connection can take. And so having like, oh, well, I bought an SD. Can I buy an HD? Do I have to upgrade it?

Now I need a 4K. And so for them to just say, look, 4K movies are the same as HD. We're going to upgrade your HD movies to 4K HDR. It's done. Don't worry about it. There's just the cost of renting a movie. um that it's still stupid that they price s sd and hd differently now they should just give up and just say here's the price and you you'll get it in whatever format you can take they also announced some partners that are going to have this content uh netflix and amazon which is now yeah later this year later this year um it was supposed to be done by now it was summer right summer was the the time frame? I don't think that was right. I think they were more vague than that, but it's clearly not going to be summer now.

I think Apple would have loved it to be with this Apple TV, though, right? Like, I think that would have been real good, but no. The TV app is rolling out to more countries this year, including mine. They showed a slide where they were like, oh, we need the content people want.

There was one channel from the United Kingdom on that list. So yeah, can't wait for that. Welcome. Welcome to the TV app because that's what it's like in the US. There are channels and apps that say we love it. And then there are ones that say, nope, we're not interested in playing your game. And yeah, that's just, that's where we are. Same with the single sign-on stuff where there's TV providers that have it and TV providers that don't. So it's a real work in progress. The

TV app is very much like Apple's vision of how nice things could be if we could all just get along, but we do not yet have the ability to get along apparently so now the rest of the world gets to discover that yay that is rubbish uh live sports looks like they're on a bunch of live sports things um yep i didn't really understand this jason is this good stuff like i don't really have a a way of being able to gauge this type of thing yeah you don't have an opinion about about sports well what i'll say is um it all comes down to what the just as with all the other content what the apps that are being provided provide to you it would be nice if you had espn and um and you had the uh nbc sports app and you had the NBC Sports app

and you had the Fox Sports app and whatever other sports apps you had, if they all did this, then you could have that moment of, any MLB app, you can have that moment of, oh, look what's on. It's all unified in one place.

Isn't that nice? But it comes down to all of those content providers providing that information in a way that works with the TV app. And it's right now, it's all really spotty. So it's a, it's a nice idea, especially when, you know, if you, it's them trying to say for cord cutters, basically, this is the TV app is like, you should live in the TV app it's got all your stuff there and that should include live sports and live news as well but you know it's they're still uh limited in terms of what app content providers they're working with and so you know it's a nice idea they had a game demo from that game company which is the company behind journey i was so excited

yeah i love i love journey and um and so when they said that jenova chen from that game company was going on stage i was like oh my god and it's and it's sky which is kind of like minor spoiler for journey on the last level of journey one of the things you do is fly around a little bit and it's a little bit like that because people fly around and then there's totally like lots of gameplay cues lots of familiar things that feel like things right out of journey that uh and uh and it's coming this winter for iphone and apple tv so i guess it's a platform exclusive at least for a little while i don't know um but i was really excited to see that because that's actually a

developer whose stuff i like and i liked i like journey a lot and so i think it's kind of cool that they got them out on stage to make this big announcement in an apple event yeah it was mario last time um yeah exactly and now it's that game company this time who they're they are in the gaming world they're very well respected this is to land their game because i assume that there is some level of platform exclusivity um this is a this is a big deal this is a big deal because uh microsoft and sony would have been in that line to get that game. Sure, and instead it's Apple, although he was like, oh, and it's so easy to control that you can

use the Siri remote. Yeah, nothing changed with the Siri remote except the menu button has a ring around it, which looks like it's kind of raised, which I guess that is how you orient it. That's not the worst thing in the world, but it's not enough. So, for example example we are watching the office right now um and we're watching it on the apple tv

because uh turns out the office isn't available for streaming anywhere in the in the uk so we're buying seasons on itunes again uh i say again i have some seasons uh some seasons fell off the back of a truck when i was a younger man but now i'm i have the ability the means to buy these things so i do um and so we've been watching through it again and so you know i'll set up an episode i'll put the remote down and then i'll move and then pause the episode or you know or like click it and then you go back 30 seconds just that remote like i feel like it needs to be suspended in animation above me so nothing can possibly ever touch it because if anything touches it in any way even just glances against it something happens right like it's still

a problem that remote in a way that my other remote controls aren't maybe because they're not so slight right like you know if you sit on any remote you'll press a button but this one because it's so thin it's like easier to move again like it's just not you know it isn't a good remote um and it's a shame uh and i know my ios devices can do this but like i want to be able to reuse the remote but whatever like it's you know i i don't get really mad about it you know like i know that many of our friends do um but it's it's frustrating but i'll live with it you know whatever yeah apple tv 4k starts at 179 dollars what do you think about that again why are there two sizes i mean like seriously we're still doing this

i don't know and and i'm disappointed i was hoping this would be 149 but i guess that goes back to the classic apple pricing argument which is find search your feelings for the price you wish it was and then add money to it because it will never be the price you wish it was but i had really hoped that this was a gonna be a repricing thing where this became the standard 149 and then they lowered the price of the other ones because uh there is there is a 149 apple tv but it's the one that you expect it to be which is the old one which i'm pleased that they're still selling because it would be really annoying to buy the 4K one if you don't have a 4K TV. I'd be like, I know I'm paying more for this than I should be.

Like for a feature I can't even take advantage of. But yeah, they have $149 for the 32GB regular and then for the 4K it's $179 for the 32 gigabyte. So $199 for the 64 gigabyte model. For all of the games, I guess? For all of the many games? I don't know. I don't know.

Yeah, and I think you should be able to get in. I wish they would take that fourth generation Apple TV and price it at $99 and just say, look, we want people on the Apple TV platform. At $ platform at 149 given you know the just to be clear here amazon and roku have 4k streaming boxes for 99 so it's it's a big price gap between apple for and what are the differences i mean i i appreciate that it's got this powerful processor and the 4K model, and that it's going to be able to run apps like, you know, in 4K, run games,

and it's got iPad Pro power. That's all great. But it would be nice if there were some other, you know, entryways into the platform, because I don't think Apple is, we can argue with Apple's ahead at all, but they're certainly not so far ahead that they can say you will pay $180 for a 4K box from us

or 90 from someone else. I don't think. Yeah, especially when... I mean, I know you must have seen the news about the next Amazon Fire TV may have an Echo built into it. Right. Which is like, that's really interesting. Yeah, I'm skeptical of that, but sure, they're trying.

That feels a little bit like everybody loves the Echo, so let's stick it on everything that we sell. Yeah, sure. But yes, isn't that their point, though? They want it everywhere, right? Because then the more places it is, the more attempts they have to get you to do things with it. But yeah, it's like Apple with Siri, but they don't seem to add a consistent Siri message everywhere.

Just one quick thing, because I guess this is tangentially related. The HomePod wasn't mentioned in any way during this presentation. Was that your expectation? Were you surprised about that? What was your thought there? That was my expectation. Okay.

It's already been announced. It's not ready to ship. Why say anything about it? Sure. All the stuff that they announced, they didn't mention the iMac Pro either, right? They already announced it, and it's not ready to ship. So what is there to say about it?

I don't know if you were aware, but macOS is shipping on September 25th. Yes, I was aware of that. But to those out there, I actually talked to somebody from Mac PR. No, because then I would have gotten six points in the draft, but it was not mentioned, but they did update the Mac OS High Sierra index page, which means it's coming out a week after iOS 11. I think that's good. I mean, I think Apple should make these big splashes, but also spread their rollouts out because I think that that gives them more publicity. I think it's good for them. I think it's good for us who talk and write about this to have a week where we talk about macOS High Sierra

and a week where we talk about iOS 11 and a week where we talk about the iPhone X and a week where we talk about the HomePod. I feel like that's way better. And when they release all their products in a week, there's a limit to what you can say and stuff gets lost. So having High Sierra have a little more time on its own, speak what can you know there's a limit to what you can say and stuff gets lost so having high sierra have a little a little more uh time on its own i think is actually a good thing for high sierra

yeah it's funny you should say that because i was thinking the exact same thing about the iphone we have a we have a staggered period of time to talk about the iphone no i i think that's absolutely true the focus is going to be on the ip iPhone 8 at the start and then the iPhone X later, which I think is not bad for... If I'm Apple, it's going to be more coverage. And if I'm a person who writes or talks about Apple, it's more time to cover those things. Speaking about iPhone, should we move on to the main event?

I think it's time. All right, let's take a final break for today and thank Squarespace for supporting this week's very special episode of Upgrade. If you want to get a fantastic 10% off your first purchase at Squarespace, enter the offer code UPGRADE at checkout and you'll get that. Make your next move with Squarespace.

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Squarespace, make your next move, make your next website. So we have three iPhones announced today. Three! Are you getting it yet? Three iPhones! Three products. These iPhones now join maybe the biggest iPhone line currently on Apple's website there is the iPhone X, the iPhone 8 the iPhone 7, the iPhone 6S and the iPhone SE

they are all there, they're all available either to buy or to learn about pre-ordering the fact that you can still buy the 6S now makes me assume you will probably still be able to buy the 6s um i find this really interesting that's a lot of iphones it is they're the fact that they kept the um the six around but this is their strategy right is to just spread them out this is this is how apple does the low end is they keep the older products around and cut the prices on them this is just this has been their strategy for a while now and it still is so uh tim set off by talking about looking back at 10 years of the iphone this is exactly

how i assumed they would introduce this phone months ago i was talking about this like i because there's been a lot of people arguing right over the last maybe six to eight months maybe even longer what are apple gonna do here are they going to acknowledge the 10-year anniversary or are apple a company that doesn't look back i think at this point we can say apple used to be a company that doesn't look back tim cook's apple likes to look back and i think they should i think they should um you know i mean this even comes down to like the wallpapers in the in the iphone 10 seem to be either they got a six color rainbow on them or they're remasters of original wallpapers, right? Of the original iPhone. Like they, they do look back, you know, the rainbow Apple logo is all over the place now, right?

Like, which it wasn't for a long time. Like, I think that they do. And I think this was right because Apple changed the world with this product. Um, maybe, you know, it may be that we look back on this in, or people look back on this in like 100 years' time and come to the conclusion that the iPhone changed the world even more than the Mac did. This may be the biggest thing Apple ever did, was the iPhone. That may be. I don't know. I don't have a sense of that right now, but this could be it. And I think if you get to 10 years honor it and they did so Tim kind of looks back at the big features that have been added over the years hardware and software and then he's like

we've got some amazing stuff today and he brings out Phil and Phil rapid fire goes through the iPhone 8 and iPhone 8 plus he says new design, and I'm going to give him that, because there aren't really many places you can take that the way that an iPhone, as it has looked with the Home button, there aren't many places you can take it anymore.

And I think, with the glass back and all that sort of stuff, this warrants a new design. I think it does. What do you think? You've seen them. What do you think? I don't know. I mean, I don't think if you saw someone holding one of these, you would be like,

oh, check it out, that's the iPhone 8. I don't think that is the case. Okay. Well, I mean, I just think it's just as much as you could do with it. Which is why they created the X. Because there isn't really much more you can do. And at least going from aluminium to glass like that's a big that's a big change. Right. Like that is a big change.

Like when they weren't from plastic to glass, like these are big changes. But I don't know, maybe I'm in the minority here and probably will be in the lower end. And you know what? I haven't seen one either. Right. I'm only going on press shots. You've actually seen them. I get that from Apple's perspective, this is an all new design, but I think that it looks so much like the previous ones

for the people who are not particularly attentive that I'm not sure that it will have that kind of effect on people. Okay, I'm willing to accept that because you have a much better opinion than i do because i haven't actually ever seen one of these things the glass is apparently the most durable ever in a smartphone hello huge investment in corning that's what that got you um they have an aluminium band that goes around the outside this is the only aluminium on the

phone now which is a big change um we haven't had that since the iphone 4 right 4s 4s is the last phone yeah and then everything's been aluminium since then they have silver space gray and a new gold now jason have you seen the new gold i haven't okay do you just so they did you so the ones that they saw were either silver or space gray yeah the the um i focused my time in the hands-on area on the iphone 10 not the iphone 8 gotta be honest yeah because i don't know what that color is it looks like a mix between rose gold and gold it looks like they kind of just threw them together and called it gold if if i had seen them you still shouldn't ask me about colors so you know my my. You know, my second question was going to be, was anyone around you and what did they say?

Because I know that colors aren't necessarily your strong suit. Not my strong point, no. New Retina HD display. Finally, True Tone has found its way to the iPhone. Yes. This is great. I'm really pleased about this. We both love True Tone. Right? Or do you not have

opinion about True Tone? I don't remember. I like True Tone. I wish I could have it adjust the color temperature without being as aggressive with the brightness adjustment because I find myself disagreeing with the brightness adjustments when they happen and I get frustrated

and have to manually adjust the brightness to be what I want it to be i don't like that about it um new stereo speakers they're 25 louder deeper bass big fan of that sure great um the a11 bionic chip which is the most powerful and smartest chip ever in a smartphone. Everything is significantly faster, basically. Everything's faster. What they did, the last generation, what they did is they had high performance cores and high efficiency cores, and it would sense, the system would sense when you needed high performance and it would switch. And when you didn't, it would go back to the high efficiency cores which use less power very clever this version has six cores two high performance for high efficiency and it can use

all six at once so if it really needs to crank it up it can actually use all six cores it can put the really hard stuff on the high the high power It can put the low-level stuff that isn't that intensive on the high-efficiency cores. And that controller is deciding what goes where. And this is Apple's chip design saying, what's the profile of processor power of our devices? And how can we be most efficient? And so the last time it was switchable cores, and now it's just different kinds of cores that are addressed separately. It's pretty, pretty cool. Cameras. Now, I don't understand enough about camera

technology. So I'm going to be very general about this um the camera on the 8 i was i will say i think of everything that i picked one of the things that i was so sure of in my mind is that the iphone 8 would have dual cameras i really thought they were going to do this as you know they have some really cool stuff that they're doing for portrait mode which they were going to do this. You know, they have some really cool stuff that they're doing for portrait mode, which we're going to talk about in a minute. But just the API that they're adding made me think that they were really going to do

a lot of this stuff, that it was going to be on this phone as well. But it's not. It's just a single camera, 12 megapixel sensor. It's got a bunch of new sensors in it. This is the stuff that I don't understand. There's a bunch of new sensors. Yes, suffice it that i don't understand there's a bunch of new sensors and yes suffice it to say it's a better camera according to apple with lots of nice new sensors and deeper pixels the pixels are deep the new how deep is your

pixel like i think it was maybe about three years ago where the camera segment stopped making sense to me in any way right because it got to the point where they were like adding in things that only really people that super care about cameras can fully understand right like why such a thing is really good like even to the point where they're like the aperture is this i don't i have like a vague idea of what that really means like my camera is my iphone yeah right like that's me you know i don't know enough about this stuff um but lower noise and a wider range of color they're things i can understand and that sounds great um in the eight plus uh this dual cameras both 12 megapixel

which i think is new now uh they have all the new sensors in them as well and then we're looking at portrait mode portrait mode on the 8 plus looks fantastic they're doing a bunch of stuff to make it better but this lighting effects thing looks so cool so this is a beta but it's shipping with the iphone this time and it's using machine learning of course and depth maps to detect everything that's going on in a portrait so the person in the background or all that sort of stuff. And you can choose from lighting effects, so different types of portrait lighting,

and it will change the light that is appearing on someone's face. It's not actually there, right? Like it's all being added in. And you can change these effects in real time through the camera viewer and even later on go into an already taken portrait mode photo and change the lighting effect this looks so cool yeah it looks good i i played with it a little bit in the demo room and it looked pretty good but again they're using demo photos of course so you've got to wait how it will work in reality, but it's a fun idea. And again, it's sort of like,

what can they calculate with a depth map and a powerful processor? How can they do that? I think what, one of the things that I thought was interesting is they're saving all the depth information. So you can change the effect later. You know, in photos,

you can go to edit and on one of these photos, portrait photos and change the effect. And it just updates it because it's saving that depth map and all of the associated data. And that makes it adjustable, which is kind of fun. But we'll see how it works in practice. It's like portrait mode. I don't use it that much, but I'm happy I have it.

And I feel like I'm going to feel the same about the portrait lighting effects. I'm not going to use them that much, but I'm happy that I'm going to have them because every now and then I might want to do it, right? Like, and then it's cool that I got going to have them because every now and then I might want to do it. It's cool that I got it. For me, with the Plus, having the second camera to be able to zoom in is the thing that I like the most.

Phil said that this has the highest quality video capture ever in a smartphone. You can shoot 4K video at 60 frames per second, and they have some more chips and stuff to analyze movement and all kinds of things there's lots of stuff being analyzed uh and slow motion is at 1080p 240 frames per second now i love when they make it slower and slower and crisper and crisper because i love doing that slow motion stuff every now and then um and also all of these new chips um and all of the new processor stuff it's all the new and all of the new processor stuff all the new camera stuff, all the new processor stuff

it's all going to make ARKit even better they're really excited about that and they showed off some cool AR apps that are coming, there was an MLB app bat thing which looked kind of cool and a bunch of game demos as well so ARKit

yep, not a surprise that's why I picked it in the draft right it's like they're gonna show off ar kit and they did but they didn't give it as much time as i was expecting they were going to give it i will say that and i think that's why we saw those demos a couple of weeks ago they were maybe meant to be on stage and they got bumped yeah yeah i'm really surprised really surprised that the ip iPhone 8 line got wireless charging. This was a big surprise to me. Apple imagines that...

Phil was talking about no more plugging in as being a thing. This is awesome, no more plugging in. And they were talking about how they can imagine cafes and airports and cars starting to support all of this more, and they were showing iPhones in all these places. Underlying all of this more and they were showing iphones in all these places and i was like underlying all of this is apple's confidence that the iphone has such a huge impact on the world around it that now that the iphone supports wireless charging now everybody's going to get on board with it and you know what it's probably true it's probably so here was the thing i was thinking okay phil right like are, I understand how big you are,

but like, let's not assume that everybody's just going to implement just for the app, for the iPhone. But Apple is supporting an open standard. It is pronounced chi, but spelled Q-I, which- Quite interesting. I never would have pronounced it that way.

So I'm pleased that I got to hear it before I said it for the first time. And Apple showed a bunch of companies and products that already use this stuff, including Ikea stuff, which I'm really excited about, because I'd stayed away from any of these types of things. Yeah, it's a popular standard and Apple's just going to use it, which is funny. And they're also going to, as was revealed later, try to extend it. They built some stuff that's based on it, but extends it, and it's not part of the standard.

But they've said that they're working with the standards body to— To add their information back, which is great. Yeah, to propose it as a standard. So this is an interesting example where I think if you had asked any of us about Apple doing wireless charging, we probably would have said it'll be proprietary. And instead— Turns out. It's not, right? apple doing wireless charging we probably would have said it'll be proprietary and instead um it's not right i mean there's there is some proprietary story about one of the accessories that apple announced today that's not going to come until next year but bottom line if you're someplace that's got a chi wireless charging pad or whatever the iphone 8 will charge on it

pad or whatever the iphone 8 will charge on it um turns out that means seven in chinese i was just was just told yeah that's what the glass back is for right that's why they went with a glass back like that's that's one of the great things that you get for having a glass back is you can have the charging go through it um because at this point in the presentation they're showing third parties and they're like oh there's a bunch of stuff out there, like Bell can have a charging pad, and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Yeah. This device starts at 64 gigabytes and has a 256 gigabyte Model 2,

only two storage sizes now in the iPhone. We've left the 32 gig world behind in the new devices. 64 is now the new base. Only two choices, which is kind of interesting that so we've said a lot of iphones out there but i wonder what the analysis is here that let them decide look two is enough like two price points is enough normal and and big i bet it was we're selling three phones this year i bet that was the one of the big things about it it's like this is too much it's is too much.

It's just too much to handle from a stock and inventory management and costs. Right. And I think maybe they did an analysis of who buys what and said there's the people who buy the low and there's people who buy the medium and high and why don't we just combine those together.

The base price is up from the iPhone 7, though. It's 799 now keeping in mind these are 64 gig phones instead of 32 so you're getting some more storage for that you're getting twice the storage but it doesn't change the fact that the base price to get into this model is more than the base price was yesterday to get into the 7. Okay. Yeah. Well, and today, I guess, right? Because it's still around. I guess.

Yeah, but have they repriced? I think they repriced it, though. Probably. They probably did. Pre-ordering on September 16th. Shipping September 22nd. But we have one more thing. And as Tim said,

we have great respect to these words and we don't use them lightly. I think the only time they've used it was the Apple Watch. I think it's the only time they've used one more thing since Steve died, I think. Tim introduced this new iPhone as a product that will set the path of technology for the next decade. That is a bold, that's very bold, very bold. that is a bold that's very bold very bold um because you know like everything that we think that we knew about this phone beforehand all of the rumors would suggest that it's kind of similar-ish to what a lot of companies are going for right now but i'll say the iphone 10 is what

it is called in my mind i keep saying. I'll get used to that, right? Like I will get used to calling it the iPhone X. But I was, in my mind, they were calling this the iPhone X, right? I mean, I used to call OS X OS X because that's what people called it, right? But like iPhone X made more sense to me in my mind. I can see why they went with X, because it's like the future of phones today, right?

Like they went with X. I expect that there will be an iPhone 9 next year, but we can talk about that another time. Edge-to-edge display. This is the big thing. This is the big thing, right? This is what it's all about. They have made so many changes to this device

to accommodate the fact that they wanted to have a screen that went for the entire front of the phone this is what a flagship phone is in 2017 this is apple had to make this phone this year they could not have let this go another year because all of their competitors are making phones that are attempting to or achieving this right like this is this is the trend this is what people expect from phones today they want all screens so as big a screen as it can possibly be you know and they've done that and i think it looks amazing a good friend of the show mr james thompson the developer of peak out he's already in the simulator kind of been playing around and has got peacock working with going all the way up to the very top of the

screen it looks amazing i've put a link in the show notes for this i'm really excited about this jason what do you think about this look well i mean when we were talking about the watch reaching its ideal configuration by having cellular data access i feel like it's very clear and i think johnny i've even said it in the video which is that the iphone 10 is where they've been headed from the beginning yeah which is the iphone as it was originally formulated was a device that was almost entirely screen, right? There was no big keyboard or anything. It was almost entirely screen on the front, except, you know, it had bezels and a button and, you know, it's got the

place where you put your ear and, and there's sensors and all that. But the idea was it's almost entirely screen because that's the most important thing is that big, bright touchscreen. So here we are where they're this much closer, much, much closer to reaching that ideal that they set out with 10 years ago. So, yeah, I think it looks great. I think the way they've done it with curves, see some design sense where they've got the the notch that's out of it with the sensor stack is it's kind of a curved notch and then the edges of the phone are all curved which goes into the whole round rect curved iphone design language so it all kind of fits together um i'm sure they'd love all those sensors to be invisible and not take up

any space but it is it is still there and they've sort of leaned into it a little bit yeah that's the next couple of years right the next couple of years are all right how do we get rid of that right like i feel like that's that's where it goes from here you know like or minimize it or yeah yeah i mean like i don't think that the next phone gets rid of it but it's like makes it smaller makes it smaller until they can completely get rid of it but this is this is the ultimate design this is the final form right like this is it like yeah i i think i think that's exactly right i think that everything now is details of thinness and things like that and maybe one day foldability or transparency or something like that right it's a thing but basically this is it like so the iphone 6 was the end of the line for

that design which is why we've now had like four of them right that look basically the same that is the end of what that phone can look like an iphone with these big thick bezels right at the top of the bottom that was it that's what that was and that's and now i think i think we're with this now right like for maybe for the next five years or four years however many years it's going to be our iphones will look like this right and then there will be revisions on this but this is it and i will say personally i am more excited about this than i was the iphone 6 iphone 6 was a great looking phone but it was you know they made the plus which i was really happy about but it was just like drag you know you made it bigger this is it right like this is the phone

i wanted this is the phone i want this this is my question for you is this is a smaller phone but with more pixels um so end of the end of the plus club for you so let's let's take a real diversion before we start talking about this phone in more detail. I am sad about the fact that there will be some things here that I'm not going to like, and I know that. This phone is narrower, way narrower, so it's going to feel weird for me for a while. Like, typing on the screen is going to feel strange and stuff like that. But my whole thing about the Plus was I wanted what I considered to be the best iPhone. I wanted the iPhone with the most, right? That was it for me. I want to have the biggest screen

I can have so I can have the most information on it. I want to have the best camera. I want to have the best battery life. That was always it. That was what I wanted. And the whole screen thing for me was I want to see as much as I can on display at all times. And I feel like for the most part, I will continue to get that with the iPhone X because the screen is really big. Now, there are a bunch of different tradeoffs. It looks like it's not going to have as much information as the Plus, but I never expected that. But this is like a good middle point plus a bunch of other amazing stuff. This is the best iPhone, so it's the iPhone I want. Right?

And for me, I felt like the Plus was the best iPhone. I know that many people don't, and I understand why, but I feel like this is the best iPhone, and it will take me a little while to get used to that going to a smaller size, but I wouldn't want an 8 Plus.

I want this phone because I would regret every day buying the 8 plus this is the phone that i want because it looks incredible um talking about those looks it has a glass front and back but it has a stainless steel band oh jason i'm not gonna want a case on this one no i'm not gonna want to i think i might not i think i might go AppleCare. In no case. Do it. I want to hold one because I need to understand

the slipperiness but I'm expecting glass will have a bit more grip to it. You have held one. Do you have any sense of that at all? Hard to say. I didn't feel it being

substantially different from the iphone 7 but i only held it for a little bit i mean it felt like an iphone to me and i use an iphone 7 without a case now so that might be an answer but we'll have to see it definitely was super comfy and you know nice it was a it didn't feel overly large either, which is nice. It's really not that much bigger. Your friend of mine, Mr. Dan Moran, he tweeted out a kind of tail of the tape. And I'll put this in the show notes. It's really not much bigger. So the iPhone 7 is 5.44 inches by 2.64.

And the iPhone X is 5.65 inches by 2.64 and the iphone 10 is 5.65 inches by 2.79 it's like it's you know it's it sits in the middle but closer i think to the 7 um then yeah yeah oh no it's it's definitely the idea here is is what if you could have a phone that's basically the size of the 7 but has um has pixels that are more toward the plus. I think that's definitely part of what's going on here. And then the glass versus anodized aluminum I think maybe is why it's more grippy

potentially like the Jet Black because that's a very different size. I will say though and I'm not trying to put the cart before the horse but whenever they make a big one of these, whoa, then I will be even happier than I already am. Because I assume that eventually...

I'm sure they will someday. There will be multiple sizes of this phone, and that will be something to behold. I'm sure that'll happen. That'll happen. But the advantage, in addition to the inductive charging, that glass, and we'll see how amazingly rugged it is, but that glass back and front gives you that, I think, maybe a better, more grippy feel. So it's good.

Yeah, yeah. It's quite a little device. I'm looking forward to spending more time with it, but I'm glad I got a little bit of time with it. And one of the things that I took away from it is that obviously this is the iPhone X doesn't have a home button. And I think it will take people almost no time to adapt because if you're like me,

you're holding the phone in your hand, you move your thumb down to hit the button and there's no button there, right? Well, what do you do? You just take your thumb and flip up from the bottom of the screen. It does the same thing. It's not a big deal. So I think everybody's going to kind of get over it.

And there are a lot of advantages to that phone. It's awfully pretty, I got to say. It's like, again, controlled environment, only images provided by Apple, right? So I can't say, I look forward to what the display experts say about it when they get their hands on them, right? And how it feels to watch a movie on it and what it looks like. There's a lot more to be done outside of Apple's area of complete control. But yeah, it's pretty nice. It's not like you look at it and say,

this is a premium product. It's like, no, this is the future. It's what we said when these rumors started, which is the whole pitch here is this is the future of the smartphone today. But you got to pay. But you gotta pay. Space Gray and Silver. Silver has a white back. Both have black fronts.

Which was a very good move. Super Retina display is what this display is being called. 5.8 inches. 2446 by 1125. 2.7 million pixels at 468 pixels per inch, which is the highest pixel density on an iPhone.

It has an OLED, which Shilla called the first OLED screen good enough for the iPhone. Features HDR and True Tone. You can tap the screen to wake it. Obviously, there is no home button. As Jason mentioned a moment ago you swipe up to go home you swipe further with a i think a slight pause for to access multitasking yeah basically you start you start that swipe and then you stop and the cards come up it's not like

the ipad multitasking it's it's definitely more like the equivalent gesture to the double tap on the home button is today and you hot you uh tap double tap the sleep wake button which is bigger now and i think called the side button now because it does more than just sleep wake uh for you double i think you double tap it double tap for app double tap for apple pay tap and hold for siri so it's the same gestures you used to do on the home button you now do on the side button for those yeah face id um apple has a camera system called the true depth system which features an ir camera a flood illuminator a dot projector and a front camera all of this stuff will work in the dark it doesn't illuminate your face. It was a little bit confusing initially from the images they were showing. I know they were trying to be illustrative, but I was like, does it light up your face? What is a flood illuminator? No, it's all invisible. And it obviously

employs neural networks and machine learning. And the A11 chip has a neural engine inside, specifically, well not specifically, but primarily for face recognition. Apple has done a lot of testing with face id as which is the replacement to touch id it should all work no matter how your face looks if you put on glasses grow a beard put on makeup it doesn't matter it will learn your face over time they say it cannot be spoofed by photos and they even had masks made of people's faces by special effects companies, and apparently they've worked so those won't spoof it either. All of the face detection happens on device, and it requires user attention to unlock. So if your eyes are closed or you're looking away, it won't unlock your phone.

And this was a really impressive statistic. So the whole time we've been talking about security is this secure enough apple said of course there is a there is an error rate for all biometrics and for touch id it was a one in 50 000 error rate for face id it's one in a million so they say i i would love to know how they how they got this but it's basically their false their false positives rate is the idea here what they're what they're trying to sell is that this is not a less secure thing than touch id it's more secure and i also appreciated that they were super upfront by saying that um if someone shares genetics with you

especially if they're a twin, it is more likely to be tricked. Yeah. Mr. Spock and Mr. Spock with a beard, great little Star Trek reference. If you have an evil twin, you might want to put a passcode on your phone. And that's true.

I wonder if that will happen, if we'll get a bunch of stories about how somebody's brother can open his iPhone or something because their face similarity is just so even if they're not a twin or their or their father or whatever, you know, a mother and a daughter can open the iPhone because they have this face similarity in it and it confused the phone. It could happen. I'm looking forward to testing it. I'm going to walk around with my iPhone and just put it in all my family's faces and see if it unlocks. We'll see.

going to walk around with my iphone and just put it in all my family's faces and see if it unlocks we'll see did you get to play with this at all a little bit i i so you it sounds like you can only um for now at least train one face that's a shame that's a shame um and i think the idea is uh you know you have to go through a training procedure that I didn't go through. So the person who had the Apple employee who had the iPhone 10 that I was looking at, she was trained on it. So and she showed me like, you know, lift to lift awake and she's not looking at the phone. And then she looks at the phone and it unlocks. The little lock just pops open and then you flip up. The little lock just pops open. And then you flip up.

It's the same gesture as to get to the home screen is to unlock. It's very much like swipe to unlock is back to a certain degree, except now you're swiping up. So it doesn't auto-unlock and go to the home screen. It auto-unlocks and just sits at the lock screen with notifications and things yeah i don't know about that you're gonna have to see how it works in practice and if there's a if there's an option to carry you straight to the home screen but i think what they want is for you to use to have the opportunity to interact with notifications and yeah um and widgets and things like that with the phone unlocked but at that screen.

I actually do like that. But the thing is, is it's going to be slower because all I need to do is one action on the current iPhone and it unlocks. It's more than one action on this current phone. It will be my assumption. And maybe over time i will just learn to like just swipe up but like you know with with the with the current touch id i don't feel

like i'm ever having to like authenticate and then click it's just clicking right i just click and it goes i can't like pick my iphone 10 out of my pocket and start swiping it before it goes in front of my face right because it won't unlock but that's the thing that you can do with the current iphone so you know i don't know it's in the details it wouldn't surprise me if you flipped up from the bottom when it was locked and then it unlocked if it wouldn't just say okay i hope i see where you're going here right like great you were you made the gesture to go to the home screen and i've unlocked you so i'm going and if it wouldn't just say, okay, I see where you're going here. That would be great. You made the gesture to go to the home screen,

and I've unlocked you, and it's been a certain amount of time. Ideally, that's what it would do. If it can understand your intent and that you wanted to go there, it should be able to take you there. Yeah, because I bet if you swipe up, it will be like, look at me or put in your passcode. So yeah, maybe it will do it. Because me or put in your passcode right like yeah so yeah maybe it will do it and then then because that's all i want really like and you've already given that that

command basically but it's like i'm sorry to do that i need to just check and see that it's you oh it's you mike because i will learn the new way of doing it and it will be quick again if that's the way it is right that would be great i'll learn the new thing like i'll get my phone out of my pocket and i'll put my my thumb on the display and it will wake up and i'll i'll swipe up and then i'll hold it in front of my face and i'm in i i really want that to be the case i hope that that's the thing but either way right like this looks really cool i'm excited about it i think it looks awesome i like the idea of this i i think it's a fun feature right like it's just going to feel fun and new and different and an emoji an emoji oh you know so i feel like an emoji has the is probably going to be like i message stickers where everybody's going to play

with it and then it's just going to kind of fade away a little bit this is what people are saying to me today jason but i use stickers and use stickers with other people every single day i know there are people that stopped but i know that i am going to be using this and i'm not going to make a prediction about like what percentage will continue to use it i guess what i'll say is everybody's going to be playing with it when they get one of these and it is amazing like i so animoji works whether or not you're the person who has face ID on the phone. It will work with any human face. So I was able to test this and it's weird and it's just, I mean, I don't even know what to say.

It's, it's, it's just totally bizarre and enjoyable. It's, um, you know, you're making faces and a little animated creature is making faces back at you. It is, um, going to lead to a lot of, yes, weird iMessage conversations. And the fact that you can record and send them to people. I suddenly had that vision of like, there's this whole new class of things that's going to happen where there's going to be homemade animated movies starring Animoji acting things out. Because you could literally like you're talking and the animated character is speaking and yes it is frivolous but it's also incredibly fun

and there will be some unanticipated applications for this that will just will i think end up being hilarious there will be lots of memes there will be lots of funny videos there will be you know whole movies that are conversations between the fox and the and the pile of poo and the chicken and the unicorn or whatever um and i i i feel like this will lead to other interesting areas because once your phone can do face detection there's so many uh potentially weird things that it can do and so there will be apps that will also tie into this. But yeah, it was super fun. It's basically an app in messages.

So you tap on it and you can pick your emoji and you can tap to make it big. And then you're just, you know, it's like looking in a mirror if what you see in a mirror is a cartoon pig. And so you can make a face and you can send it as a sticker or you can make a little movie and send it as a little movie.

Yes. And it's with sound. Yeah. When Federighi was demoing this, I was screaming with laughter. I was just going wild. In the demo area, the woman who was in front of me using the iPhone X while I was waiting patiently, and she brought that feature up

and started talking with one of the Animojis and I just started laughing. I was howling with laughter. It was so funny. You're just going to lose it. So funny. Oh, man. Because she brings up the fox,

or no, it was the pig, and she has this look of amazement and then the pig is amazed. It was just like, whoa, wait a second. Like I'm watching a cartoon pig be amazed that it's a cartoon pig because it's using her amazed facial expression. I was able to do like lift one eyebrow, lift both eyebrows, raise both eyebrows, drop both eyebrows, and like tilt my chin, all this stuff. And it totally did all of it. It's pretty cool. It is, it is the fact that all that happens in real time,

based on your face, you know, this is the kind of thing where they do motion capture for video games and movies and things like that. And facial capture and all that to just have you standing there in front of your phone doing that. It's pretty cool stuff. Again, not going to change the world in the sense of making everybody's uh you know lives healthier and uh happier and all that well it will make people happier because it's fun and not every feature this is like the iMessage sticker conversation Mike there are going to be curmudgeons out there who are like oh that's stupid they're just people that don't don't use it right don't use it if you don't want to have fun every day because this is i use emoji

all the time i use stickers all the time and now i can like i can mix them all up um i i said this i tweeted this i believe it i think an emoji will sell iphones like photobooth used to sell max like i think people are gonna be right and they're gonna go like i need that like how do i get that like we need to buy an iphone 10 like all right maybe i will go like, I need that. How do I get that? We need to buy an iPhone 10. Alright, maybe I will. I can see that. I'm really excited about this. iOS 11 has some additional features for the iPhone

10. So Craig Federighi came on to demo this. Really unfortunate. Face ID's first demo failed. Now, Stephen Hackett, our good friend and adjudicator of the draft that we didn't need this time because it was a landslide, he went

back and watched some of the video again to try and work out what happened here. So Craig Federighi, he raises the phone to his face and it doesn't work and he's thrown up with an enter your passcode. What maybe I didn't see or what was difficult to see at the

time because it was like shock and horror that the warning says enter your passcode is required to enable face id this phone may have been rebooted and that's why it didn't work and he picked up another phone and he does it and it works straight away but it i don't necessarily think this is a fate like any looking at this and seeing that message i don't think that it's fair to say this this like this doesn't work my my guess is actually similar to what chris wells from the verge guest which is my guess is that on this on this uh pre-release uh iphone 10 some process died where it didn't necessarily reboot but it got to a point where it needed to demand authentication again um it's either that or craig picked up the wrong phone which i doubt but is not entirely impossible but they had the right one on the

monitor so my guess is the only one demoing, right? Like both of those phones were trained to his face. Were meant for him. So, yeah. So that's my guess is that while they were sitting out there, it basically got in a state where it reset and needed to authenticate. And rather than put in the password and explain what was going on, he was like, okay, this isn't working. I'm going to move on to the next one. I had a similar experience in the demo room where the woman who was demoing face id to me she had a false start

and i thought it was funny that the same thing happened with her and with her it was she it happened twice and once was she accidentally pushed the side button and so the phone went off and she's like oh and then the next time she woke it up and was explaining the feature to me again something you wouldn't do in real life but she was explaining the feature to me and by the time she got it held up and her looking at it it went off because it had gone it timed out yeah and put the screen back to sleep so it was like and let's try that again and And on the third try, she did it. And it was, you know, it was, she was not looking at it and it was locked. And then she looked at it and it unlocked. And when that happens, it's magical. I think the challenge here is we can't necessarily

glean from this what a percentage of reliability this is. And what I think everybody who looks at this has been saying all along is it needs to be about as reliable as Touch ID. It't necessarily need to be more reliable than touch id but it needs to not be less reliable than touch id it's just going to be in the bullpup i think there's a learning curve here but i think ideally if the phone is um not requiring a passcode and uh you pick it up and with race right raised awake you pick it up and look at it and it unlocks. That needs to work. That needs to be bulletproof. And we'll see. We're just not going to know until we try it out. Keeping in mind that this phone isn't even shipping for a while. So we'll see. As well as the fact that you can activate multitasking by swiping up, you can also swipe left and right on the bottom area where that

line is and it goes backwards and forwards between your most recently used applications which i think is really nice i think that's really cool i like that um and they demoed new snapchat filters that use the face tracking and they look really detailed so very very cool very cool okay last few things cameras they got the dual cameras on the back they seem to be mostly the same as the 8 plus but they have dual optical image stabilization there's a quad led true tone flash and the front camera which is the true depth camera has portrait mode on the front so you can take amazing selfies you've got all the you've got

all the sensing equipment for the face detection which means you've also got all the sensing that's required to do portrait mode and the and and the light you know portrait lighting mode because it's it's got to do all the face stuff you've got to have this really great set of sensors in the front which means it's a great selfie camera too, kind of as a secondary thing. It's like, oh, and also that means that it can be a great selfie camera. I'm wondering what cameras might take the better portrait mode photos

because the back cameras don't have all that IR stuff. And, you know, it's- No, they have to do a different kind of thing, I think, than what the front does. Yeah, the front's probably got way better data is my guess than the back. But the back is probably good enough for what they're doing. I wanted to mention, too, this is one of those features where

Samsung made a big deal with the Note 7. Note 7, Note 8, the one that didn't explode, the new one. That they've got OIS, optical image stabilization, on both their cameras. And they did a whole demo of how a zoomed-in iPhone 7 Plus didn't look as good.

And at the time, I was like, well, I'm going to guess that Apple's going to do dual optical image stabilization. And here it is on the iPhone X, but they've got that. And I'll point out that this means that there's an iPhone 7 and 8 sized phone with two cameras on the back for the first time. Yep. They gave a sneak peek of something called air power which is like a like a big i don't like the name like a big mat surprise type thing which will charge your watch iphone and a upcoming airpods case okay yeah so here's what apple did apple wanted to do uh their own charging mat and they felt like it was really dumb that it would only charge one of their devices and not

more of their devices because of course we all have all of these devices so many of us have all these devices so like okay what can we do to build something that would support that and so they built they built um this air power thing which is not going to come out until next year. But what they said is that the Qi standard didn't support this. So this is their extension of the Qi standard. They would like in the future for the Qi standard to support this. But this is an Apple-only thing for now, because they want the devices to be able to talk to each other and give each other their charging status and charge all these devices at the same time. And they said that's not possible with what's in the

standard today. So it's Apple Watch Series 3 only. It does not work with previous model. Obviously, they had to change the inductive charging system in the Apple Watch Series 3 to also support this. And apparently, it did not support this before, even though it does have inductive charging. All Apple Watches have inductive charging. It's the latest iPhones and it's this new case. The rumor, the leak was that there were new AirPods coming because they had a picture of the case and the case looked different. It turns out that's the new case that you can buy for your old AirPods that is the wireless charging case. And basically, it sounds like it's just a slightly redesigned AirPods case that supports this new wireless charging standard or Apple's extension of it.

So in the end, sometime next year, you'll be able to buy a pad from Apple and lay your watch and your phone and your AirPods on it, and they'll all charge like magic and other devices, presumably to maybe maybe your Apple Pencil someday. Who knows? 64 gigabytes and 256 starting at $999. Thanks. $99 um thanks uh october 27th for pre-order november 3rd for shipping heartbreak hotel oh wow yeah this is a shame right you know it uh like i said i i for people who are desperate for it yeah you're gonna have to wait and that's uh that's tough but i think everybody kind of

expected that this would be late i thought early november was good i was concerned that this was going to be like a december kind of product so i thought that that was it's interesting that it was not that far away i always assumed shipping in october i thought it would ship in october ah well no wonder you're so sad yeah and 9.99 which is I think the the predicted price like and the fact that they raised the price with the 8s um kind of kind of which I was surprised by but actually closes the gap a little bit between the 8s in this model but $999 to start for 64 gigs uh yeah that's that's pretty much I think what we all expected oh one other thing I want to mention because this has come up in a few places the um the notch in the screen.

Like, how does that work? Like apps are going to need to be aware of it. How do you work around it? It's got the status bars in two different places. Control center comes down when you swipe from the right side. I think notification center needs the left side. You may be able to do it from the middle too,

but you can do it from the left side at the top. It's going to be different. And there's, of course, the little black bar at the bottom that represents the home swipe area. So apps are going to potentially have to be modified so that you don't have like key information that appears like blocked by the notch if it tries to spread it out. But I've got the feeling that there's probably an API for this for app developers to use to detect. But I've got the feeling that there's probably an API for this for app developers to use to detect this. I don't know that for sure. What I do know is that when I actually tested this with a video on the iPhone 10, and when it played, it actually played

with the edge of the screen of the video, the edge of the video image up against the notch instead of over, right? Now, if you double tap, it zooms across and then you can see with the notch there. Because you can currently do that, right? You can zoom in on videos now if you want to. Right, but it's all based on the screen, you know, the horizontal and the vertical. you want to right but it's it's all based on the on the screen uh you know the horizontal and the vertical but it seems like what they've done here is they've calculated it out because the idea is you don't want to watch a movie and have the side of the movie cut off by the notch of the front-facing sensors and it sounds like uh as far as i could tell because i looked today uh

that doesn't do that it doesn't force you to like view everything in the world through this weird notch on the side. You can if you want, but it's not required. But this is something that all the developers have between now and November 3rd, I guess, to sort of figure out if their apps need to do be updated to support it. But my gut feeling is that the worst case scenario, there's probably a way that Apple makes available, I hope, to app developers to basically say, look, just don't draw on that part. Like pretend that the screen is slightly narrower so that you don't cut off any of my stuff. And that's probably an option. And then other developers will work around it to take advantage of that space.

I bet developers are happy about the November 3rd ship date. Yeah, right? If anyone's happy happy i bet it's them right you get you get some time to actually i mean you can't test it you'll have the gold master of ios 11 and you'll presumably have this in the simulator and you can test it out in the simulator and you can get an update to your apps if there's something really broken i think that they'll be very happy to have more time to do that and you can do provisional provisional support right i mean a lot of people i understand won't if there's something really broken. I think that they'll be very happy to have more time to do that. And you can do provisional support, right? I mean, a lot of people I understand won't want to make big changes before they actually have the device. I totally get that.

But I would expect quite a few developers will play around and will be willing to push a build like just tested in the simulator to the App Store. I would expect that many people will be willing to do that. So that's the keynote, Jason Snell. There was one piece of breaking news during the show that I just want to touch on before we leave today,

which is our old friend iTunes. There has been an update to iTunes today, iTunes 12.7, which has ripped out the App Store. The iOS App Store is no longer in iTunes. It's almost the opposite of what we expected. As of today, there is just going to be music, movies, TV shows,

podcasts, and audiobooks in iTunes. iTunes U, Ringtones, and the iOS app store have been pulled out of the iTunes app. How about that? This isn't what we expected for iTunes, right? I think the expectation was we're going to get a bunch of apps. It's weird that, yeah, they're just pulling stuff out of iTunes instead. Rather than making standalone apps, which is what everybody expected,

instead of doing kind of the same thing but in the reverse, which is really weird. It looks like, even though they're removing sort of the same thing, but in the reverse, which is really weird. It looks like even though they're removing sort of like the ringtone section, it sounds like if you attach your device to a Mac with iTunes and it shows up, you can still drag custom ringtones onto that device. Because I actually have custom ringtones. I wish that was in iOS. I wish I could just put an audio file in files and say, make this a ringtone, but they're not there yet. But this is better than, better than nothing.

Cause I do use custom tones, but I don't like, I only attach my iPhone to my Mac to do, or to do stuff like copy ringtones over and things like that. So I'm happy to, to have them pull this stuff out. But that's an interesting step. And we'll probably discover other things that nobody's noticed that Apple secretly did today. Did we mention on the show? I'm not sure we did that High Sierra has a release date. It's September 25th. So that was something that they didn't mention in the show, but they did do it. So, you know, it allows us more time to talk about all these things. If you would like to find our show notes

for this week's Bomber episode, go to relay.fm slash upgrade slash 158. I'm sure that Jason will have lots more coverage of everything over the next few weeks, especially over the next week, in between now and next week's show, over at sixcolors.com. I'm going to be talking about all of this stuff

in many other places, Connected tomorrow being the first place, so you can go subscribe at relay.fm.com. So we'll be 24 hours removed and we'll be able to talk about our feelings. I'm really intrigued on Federico's feelings about iOS and some of the changes there, as I know he's hard at work on his iOS 11 review.

So now he has a date, so I'm really intrigued to see how his mental state will be tomorrow, knowing that he has a firm deadline for his iOS 11 review. Are you writing any reviews? Yeah, I'm writing an iOS 11 review for Macworld that is very short, and then I will supplement it with lots of other iOS 11-related stuff.

And then High Sierra, I assume that I am writing a review of High Sierra, but I actually am happy that it's released a week after iOS 11 because I haven't really started on that. If you'd like to find us online and other places, you can do that. You can go to Twitter and find Jason Snell. He's at Jay Snell.

I am at I Mike, I M Y K E. Thanks to the fine folk over at Squarespace in capsular and sane box for supporting this week's show. And we'll be back next time. We're in, We're in peak season right now. I'm very excited and

I'm sure we'll have a little more to say next week. Until then, say goodbye Jason Snell. Bye everybody.