Upgrade - 34: The 1.0 Experience

Episode Date: April 27, 2015

Jason and Myke recount their first weekends with the Apple Watch, answer your Apple Watch questions, talk about Jason’s trip to the Yosemite by CocoaConf conference, and do a little follow-up about Photos for Mac and iCloud Photo Library.

from relay fm this is upgrade episode number 34 today's episode of upgrade is brought to you by hover simplified domain management mail route a secure hosted email service for protection from viruses and spam and go to meeting make it easy to meet with your team whenever you need to wherever you are. My name is Mike Hurley and I am joined as always by the one and only Mr. Jason Snell. Hi Mike, it's good to have you back. Thank you sir. I keep forgetting which shows I'm on and which shows I'm not. So yes, I wasn't on last week's episode and I really enjoyed listening to the show. I like Upgrade, I think it's a good show. So it's always nice when I can hear it without it being ruined by me having to listen to myself.

So it was a good show. You both, you and Stephen, were very kind about my extremely nerdy hobbies. So thank you for that. Yeah, we dove into the pen world there briefly. And then we came right back out. But like I said, i love people who are enthusiastic and and that was really fun to even though i didn't literally had no idea what you guys were talking about on the pen addict it was fun to listen and hear your enthusiasm and that

that was all awesome so but it's good to have you back we're we're in this weird period now where we've got a lot of travel and stuff going on and uh you know it's good to it's good to be back to normal here dan and i will be back to normal here. Dan and I will be back on Clockwise together this week for the first time. And I think we've only been on like one show out of the last five together. So, you know, it's all kind of settling back into normalcy. Even though I'm about to take a trip for a few days again. I'm getting tired of this travel.

But this is the last big trip for a while. So that's good because I like to – I'm going to settle back and wait for people to come to san francisco for wwdc yeah that's my next that's my next trip i'm taking a very short weekend break to somewhere in uh england so that doesn't really count for me i think but my next big trip is going to be wwdc which is not far away it's like seven weeks weeks or something? Something like that, yeah. It's the second week in June. So we've got to jump through May. But it's close, six or seven weeks, yeah.

So I'm wishing May away already. So we do have some follow-up and out today. We do. Last week we talked about Apple Cloud Services. Nick, listener Nick, said, last week we talked about Apple cloud services. Nick, listener Nick said, I mentioned Microsoft when I was talking about Apple sort of nickel and diming people for cloud services and not bundling things together.

And he points out quite rightly, I didn't really mean to say, I meant sort of like it reminded me of old Microsoft. He's right. I actually have Office 365 and it does include a terabyte of OneDrive and 60 Skype minutes a month and a whole bunch of other stuff that they bundle in, like Microsoft Office. So, you know, I sort of meant what we think of as Microsoft,

not Satya Nadella's brave new Microsoft. But I appreciate that bit of feedback. And it's true, that is a great example of Microsoft taking a whole bunch of its services and just bundling them together. And this is what you get for this price. Whereas Apple, I've got iTunes Match over here, and I've got iCloud Drive data over on this side, and I've got Beats over here. And it would be cool if there was some sort of super platinum magic Apple plan that contained everything that I could buy and just not worry about it. And maybe that would be a good deal too. But Apple would get their money and I would get the simplicity

of just sort of being on the Apple gold plan or whatever. Talking about Microsoft as build this week, are you going to be watching along? Nope. You're not interested? Don't you write for a Windows website? I'm just kidding. Boy, if I tried to act like I knew what I was talking about, about Windows, they would run me out on a rail.

I'm always interested to see, but I'm going to take this one secondhand. I'm going to take this one from the people who are analyzing it and see what they say. Honestly, I've just been so overwhelmed with stuff, with finishing my photos book and the Apple Watch. Did you know the Apple Watch came out? That happened. And all this travel. And there's just so much going on. And actually, as we're recording this,

Apple's financial results are happening later today. We'll get some This Is Tim on the phone. We'll get some more color. All of that good stuff. Gene Munster trying to find out if there's a new Apple TV by asking riddles. All that good stuff. So there's a lot going on. So Microsoft Build, I'm going to let – I'm looking forward to the coverage of that because I think what Microsoft is doing these days is fascinating.

But I don't have the brainpower to devote to it, honestly. I'm going to keep my eye on it. I'm on a call uh for some of the time that the conferences have like the the presentation will be happening um but i do plan to watch it because i mean microsoft's last couple of um big keynotes have been very interesting yeah maybe there'll be some more holograms i expect there to be more hologram stuff uh because build last year was kind of like Nadella's coming out party.

He really set his vision of the future, I think, if I'm remembering it correctly. So I'm excited to see more about what they're up to. Because I think, and I do genuinely believe this, I said this after, I can't remember what the purpose of that hololens that presentation was i don't think it was build no it was a it was a special event i think microsoft you know windows 10 etc ah yes it was the windows 10 event wasn't it yep so like i uh i said it then and i kind of stand

by i think microsoft are one of them one of the more interesting companies to watch right now because they're kind of they're doing some interesting stuff. They're trying some new stuff as well as being stick in the muds of other things. Yeah. So I'm excited to see what they're doing this week. Cool. Adam wrote in, listener Adam, and this is a little bit of an ask upgrade, but it is tied into talking about photos which we've been talking about what's the best way for a couple to manage

their photos together preferably using photos for Mac and unfortunately the best way is the only way right now which is everybody needs to use the same iCloud account and this is one of these problems and I think it's just owing to the fact that it's the first version and we saw this with it took apple a while to get the family um the family sharing linked id thing even to exist and uh this is a brand new product iCloud photo library so i feel like they're still working out the kinks um that may be an understatement so i feel like um right now if you want to have the same photos on all your devices between a couple, you actually can only do it by being logged into the same iCloud account. And that's ridiculous. And what's really ridiculous is you can't add a new iCloud account just for photos and log into that account. It won't let you. The master iCloud account has to be the one that you use for photos. So this is a big hole. You can put them on your family plan and

drag things manually into the family album, but that's not the same. And those are down-res'd versions that are on the sharing version. It's not the full-res version like is on iCloud Photo Library. So this is definitely a hole in the offering that you basically have to be on the same iCloud account or you can't share the whole library. You can only share using iCloud sharing. Yeah, yeah. They'll get there, I think. I think Apple has shown that they're actually paying attention

to family stuff a little bit more now, but it's just a huge gap that you can't. It could be as easy as just saying, look, I want to add this iCloud library or the iCloud account for my photo syncing. But right now you can't do that on the Mac. It wants that to be your primary. And there's a whole bunch of things

that can only be in the primary iCloud. It's this, I see it as like, you know how in messages you can open up preferences and sign in with different accounts? Like you can sign in with iMessages or AIM or whatever. I feel like there should be just a preferences where it's like sign in with this iCloud account and you'll download all these photos. Yeah, I mean, you could even put it in the photos app. Although because it's using the iCloud syncing infrastructure, I think that's what complicates it. And they pick up, you know, they're using the same infrastructure as everything else that syncs via iCloud, which is great.

But it has some issues. I think the whole pausing and throttling of bandwidth for the uploads and downloads is related. And I think this account requirement is related. And it's not good. It needs, we can try to guess account requirement is related. And it's not good. We can try to guess why this is happening, but the bottom line is if a husband and a wife want to share their photo library, which is perfectly reasonable, my wife and I want to do that. But I'm going to have to log her out of her iCloud account and into mine if she wants to do that. And that's going to have other side effects. And, you know, we'll probably do it because she wants access to the library.

But it's kind of dumb that there's no other way to do it or that she can't just be logged in for that one thing. And that's a terrible solution to the problem. It's just so bad. Like, because iCloud is so important now, in theory, unless, you know, your wife doesn't use a lot of the features. But in theory, it's supposed to be so important. Like like making that the only option seems kind of seems kind of crazy the more and more i hear about photos because again like i haven't used it i just am not

there's just too many complaints for me to want to jump into this right now but like the more and more i hear about it the more and more i think it's maybe not done. It reminds me of Final Cut. Like they released it. I think you said this. They released it before it was kind of finished. I don't know. I feel like it is, what it is, is done. But it's very clear that there are features that just aren't in there that they need to add.

I mean, the fact that you can't do geotagging in the app is ridiculous. That's one of those things. I feel like the iCloud stuff is separately. This is hard, right? You've got huge libraries that you have to import. You've got this whole new cloud services thing that you have to sync to, and you've rewritten this app. And then there's a lot of moving parts here. And actually, I'm really liking it. I'm enjoying the fact that I have access to my whole library and that it's in the cloud. But there are definitely issues. One of the big issues is your iOS devices. If you've got a 50,000 or 40,000 image library, you tap on like the photo sharing button in an app and it just

sits there for like 20 seconds because it's parsing whatever it's doing. It's like parsing the 50,000 records in your library or something. And Apple's got to fix that. So there are a lot of little things I would say. I would say it's not a disaster at all. It is enjoyable. It brings a lot to the party. But at the same time, it is it is most definitely early days. And if you just don't want to deal with it yet, nobody's going to make you. and if you just don't want to deal with it yet, nobody's going to make you. So really, you have to be a little bit of a pioneer, but I do feel like I'm getting something out of being a pioneer,

but it is rougher than it will be later because they'll add in features and figure out some of the cloud-syncing stuff. And I think like Final Cut and even iMovie and some of the other apps that they've rewritten, the philosophy seems to be let's just get it out there. And getting it out there, we can start making it better once it's out there. We can't just sit here and not ship it forever. And they've reached the point where it's like, we're going to ship this, and then we're going to see what people's issues are, and we're going to fix it.

And hopefully, this stuff will get fixed rapidly in the next few months. But we'll we'll see we'll see but i i'm kind of glad they got it out there and now you know those of us on the on the frontier here we'll we'll just have to deal with it so we'll probably talk about this point later but i think like my feeling is when something is new like this and uh see if you can guess my hinting here if something is new like this and you don't necessarily need it like you don't need photos right now because like ifotos did exist um i get like that you can that there can be things that aren't 100 like there's things that

are missing um or there are things that need to be added but it's like i think there's more of a problem when like say for example if something already exists like we all hated ios 7 for the many bugs and problems that it had because there was kind you kind of had no option it was kind of like that was what you needed to use because ios existed your iphone existed but like something completely brand new where you're not it's not replacing something completely i think it's it's kind of fine do you get do you get what i'm what i'm driving at yeah yeah and i think i mean i think calling it i think there's a reason this is an iphone 10 is calling it file cut pro 10 made people say hey are you saying we

need to replace our old final cut with this new thing that we don't like and you know i think the idea is no you don't need to and i think that's what Apple is saying about photos is photos is here. We're not going to update the old things, but they're not going away. They don't get deleted. Your old libraries remain. I mean, there's lots of, you know, there's lots of things like that. So it doesn't, it doesn't feel like this is quite the forced upgrade. I think though, that if you're an iPhoto user, you know, you, you're kind of starving for something better than iPhoto. And so that that's the thing that's pushing you into jumping into this. Not that not that Apple is forcing you to do it, but that like you really would like to be out of iPhoto. That's certainly

how I felt is like, please let me get out of here. So so we'll see how it goes. I I'm going to be optimistic. I feel like this is this is a place where some of this stuff just obviously is missing and needs to be added or things that are broken that need to be fixed. And we've seen with, I think certainly with Final Cut, that Apple did a good job of addressing what the issues were. So I hope that they do that with this. This is super important to them as a company. They need to do this and do it right. So we'll see where it goes. But yeah, the geotagging thing is the one that really kills me. They got to fix that because not being able to take your pictures and say, I shot them here is bad. We have a little bit more follow-up, follow-out stuff. listener zach uh wrote in to suggest we were talking we're speculating last

week about the future of os 10 and how it would be maybe its name would change because somebody was asking about will we ever see os 11 um and zach suggested apple os with merged os's and a new naming scheme and this is upgradian zach he has self-identified as an Upgradian. And I don't know. I heard from a lot of people who said, well, there'll just be one Apple OS and there'll be a Mac version of it and an iPhone and iPad version of it. And I don't believe that. I mean, it could happen, I suppose. But I kind of feel like those OSs are not converging. I think this is something that was a very Scott Forstall era way of thinking and that the current people at Apple do not view a convergence of operating systems so much as shared resources and shared services, but not like it's the same OS with the same branding. I just kind of don't believe that. And although iOS, you know, you could rebrand it Apple OS, I don't think they're going to rebrand the iPhone as the Apple phone and the iPad as the Apple pad. So iOS for iPhone and iPad kind of makes sense to me. But OS 10 is the one that I still am kind of high on my feeling that it might end up going back to Mac OS at some point. Anyway,

I don't think they're going to merge. No, the fact that the watch is called WatchOS, like they don't even call that iOS, even pushes that further away from me. If this ran iOS 8, like if it said it ran iOS 8, then I might buy it, but they've just introduced a new product and they've given it a new OS name. Yeah, which is good because it doesn't behave like, we'll talk about this, but it doesn't behave like iOS,

so it's good that they don't say that it's ios because it is so not it does not we've got a couple uh like in the family in the family uh follow-up do you want to talk about some stuff that's going on at relay yeah so today uh we announced that the incredible mac power users the insta podcasting institution that is mac power users has joined RelayFM. And just we are beyond thrilled that we have the fantastic Katie Floyd and David Sparks as part of the Relay family now. So the entire back catalog of Mac Power Users now lives at Relay.fm slash MPU. You can subscribe to the new feed there. If you are already subscribed to the 5x5 feed, it will transfer over.

But my recommendation, if you're listening to this now, is to subscribe to the new relay feed so you don't get episode duplicates and all that kind of stuff. It can be a bit messy. Podcast feeds are the worst. So I know that there are ways

to not get episode duplicates, but then it brings up more potential risks. So we're just taking the path of believe it or not, least resistance with it. Jason can attest to. Yeah, man. It's the worst.

So we are just so thrilled. If you've not heard Mac Power Users, you really should because it is just incredible. Katie and David have been doing this since 2009. It was so much fun because we did an import of the the show notes and i was going through and just tidying some things up and it was really fun to like follow it through from episode one because i was like oh the ipad's been released now and like you know just looking at how things changed it's really great and if you've not heard the show what i'm going to do and go put in our show notes today which you can find at relay.fm upgrade 34 i'm going to put the two workflow

episodes mine and jason's because that might be a nice little uh taster for you in case you've not you've not yet heard it so yeah that's a great it's a great show that those are great people um david david lives not far from my in-laws house house, so we have breakfast or lunch when I'm down in Southern California. And it's great to have them on Relay. That's a great show. They have a huge following. MacPower users, listeners was in the hospital, which is a great story. Yeah, he wrote that on his site on MacStory.

I'll put that in the show notes too because he said to me, he was like, I have a little story to tell in my link today. And I was like, okay. That's a good one. Also in the Relay family, we should mention that there's now a Clockwise t-shirt. There's not yet, Mike, not yet an Upgrade t-shirt. That's in the Ask Upgrade. Do you want to talk about that now

or should we leave it for the Ask Upgrade? Let's tease that we'll talk about it in the Ask Upgrade. But anyway, you can go to teespring.com slash clockwise and it'll also be in the show notes, which are in your podcasting app or at relay.fm slash upgrade slash 34 and uh you can go to teespring.com slash clockwise and buy a clockwise t-shirt which is the clockwise logo of the clockwise arrow inside the gear on the front and on the back it says keep watching the clock and uh has the

clockwise url from relay and it comes in a gold color which is the closest match to what the actual podcast logo is so it's very colorful it's the hypercritical gold john syracuse would point out it's the classic hypercritical gold and there's also a tie-dye version if you want to spend 25 you can get a tie-dye t-shirt with the clockwise logo on it because why not tie-dye hey california i just for everybody that likes the yellow and for everybody that doesn't like the yellow i've really pushed jason to make this t-shirt yellow because at one at one point it was gray and you said make it yellow and i said okay because it should be yellow because the show's yellow and i have about a thousand gray t-shirts now. So yellow is the best.

That's why we went blue with the connected one. We want to put a bit more color into our wardrobes. So that's great. So you can find those there. So go support Clockwise. It's a great show. Support those guys, Jason and Dan, by buying a t-shirt. All right.

And we're on to topics. So would you like to tell us before we get there about a friend this week's episode of upgrade is brought to you by hover hover is the best way to buy and manage domain names i love hover i love them very dearly because they make the horrible process of finding names and buying names a breeze when i come up with a name for a project or i have a great idea for a domain name that I must own immediately, I don't want to be faced with a thousand screens with a ton of add-ons with stupidly high prices. I just want to get in, select what I need, buy it for a fair price, and get on with building my new idea. Hover make it super easy to search for domains. They have all

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getting emails from them due to the ICANN policy that they want to remind you that your information is there and it should be up to date. And I'm having a lot of, I bought that moments. Why do I own this? Okay.

But I did go on a frenzy in August when I was trying to find Six Colors. I bought a lot of crazy domains then. So this August, I'll have to decide whether I want to keep them or let them go back into the world. Can I just do one very, very, very quick piece of follow-up

on follow-up? Yes. Because in last week's episode you did a bit of follow-up about the Magic Mouse. Oh yes and somebody pointed out that somebody said that the Magic Mouse had a speaker in it and it was a fake click and people wrote in to say it's not. It's a real click. There was an Apple Mouse that had a speaker and it, and it was a fake click. And people wrote in to say, it's not.

It's a real click. There was an Apple Mouse that had a speaker and a fake click, but the current Magic Mouse that we're thinking of does not have that. That's what I was going to say. Because I was going to say, I didn't know this, but there's no way that that is a fake click. Like 100% that is real. I think as we said at the time,

we had no idea about what was real or not. We were just taking people's word for it. Yeah, and I wanted to clarify, I do own one and use one one because you said that we didn't use one but i do and and so i didn't know about the tapping thing and i need i still need to check that out so there was that app that you mentioned that allows you to do to do tapping steven and i were completely just baffled we had no way to deal with that so i'm glad you can come in and say, yes, it's a real mechanical click. So you were at the Yosemite conference. I was. So what was the Yosemite conference?

Did you just learn about OS X for a week? So people were saying, hey, you went to Yosemite. That's like the OS version. That's a funny coincidence. And it's like, I mean, so Dave Klein and his family who do the CocoConf series of conferences, which are developer conferences with like technical developer presentations.

They're like a sort of more of a roaming WWDC than some of these other conferences that are more like inspirational and big thoughts and kind of stuff. That's the impression I get. I've never been to one because I'm not a developer. But they decided when OS X Yosemite was announced that it was a perfect excuse to do an event in Yosemite National Park devoted to Apple stuff and make it more of the thinky, inspirational, big picture kind of things rather than the let's look at code kind of stuff that they usually do. And it was great. We all said, the big question is, should they just do it in Yosemite again next year? Or are they going to move to wherever Apple's next code name is? I don't know. If it's OS X Death Valley, then maybe we'll just

go back to Yosemite. I would be very surprised. Yeah, it seems like putting death in the name of your product would be a bad idea, but you never know. It's Apple. They could do anything. Mavericks. Mavericks. Seriously, Mavericks. Anyway, it was great.

Yosemite National Park is spectacular. If people haven't been, you should go sometime. People come. I grew up very near there, and people from all over the world come to see it. In fact, they would often go, I grew up in a little gold rush town, so people would often come to the little gold rush town after or before they went to Yosemite as part of their sort of California adventure that they were taking. And we had, in that little gold rush town where I worked summers at a deli,

we had European and Asian tourists. It was just crazy, like all the time in the summer. And they were there because they were also going to Yosemite. Every single one of them was also going to Yosemite. So it was spectacular. We were at the Yosemite Lodge, which is right by the waterfalls. There's a huge set of waterfalls. There's an upper and a lower falls.

And yes, even though it's California, there was water in the waterfall. We haven't run out of it quite yet. Probably in another month or two, we'll be out. And I, yeah, so I was standing at a waterfall and I sent you a picture of a waterfall. It looked so beautiful. I was so jealous. Yeah, it was. It was beautiful.

A ski man in the chat room is asking if we had internet. The Wi-Fi was, you know, tech conferences kill the Wi-Fi anyway. And the Wi-Fi at Yosemite Lodge is tenuous at best. But it turns out I had a couple bars of 4G in the valley. So that was, depending on where you were, you could get, because there are these huge, tall granite monoliths all around you. And so depending on where you are, signal can vary wildly. But we had, you are, signal can vary wildly. But we had, you know, I did have a couple of bars of 4G for, so I use that a lot. So that's what I, I sent you the picture of the waterfall. It was really beautiful. We were soaking wet. It was raining. But it was, it was beautiful. So I hope they do

it again. I imagine that the Klein family will probably do something like this again. And I think they're just really hoping for some great picturesque uh resort destination for the name of the next version of os 10 so that they can so that they can choose that you gave a talk as well right yeah i gave uh i gave a little uh presentation on the first day and it was um yeah i i can never tell how how how presentations go. I don't know if it was any good or not. I wanted to talk about enthusiasm. I'm hoping that I'll give that presentation again sometime and refine it a little bit more.

But I wanted to talk about enthusiasm and how enthusiasm drives us. And you can be enthusiastic about a lot of different things. You can be super enthusiastic about one thing or mildly enthusiastic about a lot of things, which sort of parallels the incomparable. Why is it not about one thing in particular, that podcast that I do? Why is it not about Doctor Who or not about science fiction novels or not about superhero movies or something like that? And the answer is because I want to kind of, I'm enthusiastic about all that stuff and I don't want to dive deep.

I kind of want to be able to spread it around a little bit. And so I talked about that a little and how I feel like the web especially is very much kind of distorted in rewarding people who are wildly enthusiastic about something and not moderately enthusiastic about something. And the example I always give is comic books that there are all these comic book websites that post 20 or 30 stories a day about what's going on in the comics industry, and I just don't care enough. I kind of care a little bit, but there's no, it's a lot harder to serve somebody like me who wants to read, you know, 30 minutes of comic book news a week, let's say, or maybe a month, because you can't, it's harder to build a business on that. You better to cater to the people who will read 20 or 30 articles a day. So that was it.

It was about enthusiasm and all the different forms it comes in and how I feel fortunate that my career is about things I'm enthusiastic about. And yeah, it was interesting. And the other talks were great. It was a great group. Yeah, it was an awesome lineup.

I was just looking at it then. And they did they did morning sessions and evening sessions and then the afternoon was free to to um there were groups and stuff going you know on hikes and photo walks and stuff we went with james duncan davidson and uh took a photo walk around the falls which was where i sent you that picture and that was pretty awesome and dave whiskus was there and serenity caldwell and um on the on that photo walk and then and andy and i co was was kind of um, uh, on the, on that photo walk. And then, and Andy and I co was, was kind of shadowing us cause he'd gone on the photo walk the day before,

but he wanted to retrace his steps and take more pictures and got to chat with Jim Dalrymple a little bit. Just, I mean, it was a, it was a, uh, Michael Lopp was there. Um, so many good, Nevin and Krista Morgan, Morgan were there. Um, and it was good to see them. I haven't seen them in a while. It was just a great, yeah, it was a fantastic, all the speakers were there. And it was good to see them. I haven't seen them in a while. It was just a great, yeah, it was fantastic. All the speakers were great, every single one of them. It was a good time. I was very jealous. Well, you'll just have to take some extra time sometime when you're in Northern California

and you can go see it. Maybe I'll have to. It's pretty good. Should we start talking about the Apple Watch? I mean, that's what people were here for today. Yeah, I guess. I mean, yeah, sure. Might as start talking about the apple watch i mean that's what people were here for today yeah i guess i mean yeah sure might as well so about the apple watch we have i mean in in true upgrade style we we have a bunch of questions um yes from listeners which we'll get to because they a few of them highlight some interesting points about the the watch itself

but i mean you posted your initial reactions and i kind of want to get an like if you can sum it up like give me an overall feeling i figure we'll both do this first what is your overall feeling about the apple watch and then we'll get into like for example how you got your hands on yours because it's quite interesting i i i like it it's fun i feel like i am only now kind of starting to figure out how i'm going to use it like there's the act of like let's see what everything everything is and how it all works which is not how you use it day to day and so i feel like i'm starting to settle down into like getting some idea of how i use it day to day but it it's a neat gadget. It tells the time. It is really well connected to my iPhone, which I really like. And I'm starting to understand it. But I'm

enjoying it so far. I think it's been a lot of fun. I definitely, I posted my thing and I heard it from a couple of people who were like, oh, well, here's another article where, you know, people are not raving about it and just dancing around saying that it's not that interesting. It's like, I don't know what article you read, but it wasn't mine because I think it's really interesting. Me not understanding things about it

and trying to figure out how it fits into my life is not the same as not being enthusiastic about it. I think it's pretty cool. I'm pretty enthusiastic about it. Do I have things I can critique about it? Absolutely. I think there are some things in it that are probably mistakes. And I still am trying to wrap my head around some of the decisions that they made and try to figure out whether that works for me or not.

But, you know, it's a new, weird, different kind of product. So I think that is all to be expected. The Apple Watch is 1.0. Like, it is very 1.0 oh yeah like there are you know you say there are mistakes there are just like there it's it's littered with tiny problems but i'm okay with that and this is what kind of what i was trying to explain earlier i'm okay with that because i understand what this product is um and and part of the reason that it has problems is because it is very ambitious.

So, I mean, I've used Android Wear and found Android Wear to have some bugs, but to be pretty stable overall. And when I originally tried Android Wear, it was way more stable than what the Apple Watch is. But the Android Wear Watch just gave me some notifications. That was all it did. And I could play and pause music and archive email. But the Android Wear watch just gave me some notifications.

That was all it did. And I could play and pause music and archive email. Like, I mean, I know that it's changed now and it's also more advanced, but I'm like comparing my original kind of feelings from both. And the Apple Watch is way more advanced than that. And it does some really incredible things that we can talk about. But the watch started to make more sense for me when i realized its purpose so i think i think the problem that i had initially and i think the problem that many people are having is they are treating this device like it's a tiny iphone

like they are thinking about it in that way because so many of the the watch's problems come from when you are going into it and asking it to do something for you so you're going into it and trying to open an app or play a game or something that is not what this device is for like i've i feel that the apple watch is a device that comes and grabs you when it needs you as opposed to you going to it to get information and that is a fundamental difference between the iphone and the apple watch and i think once i understood that i feel a lot better about the product but when i'm trying to go to it for things it's there are some issues

with it and we can maybe talk about home screen and apps in general and why i think apple's made some mistakes there but i think that I feel a lot better about this product once I actually spent some time not using it and just having it grab me when it should rather than me just going to it and just playing and tinkering around. Yeah, I agree with you that part of the complication of this product is that it's so ambitious. It's trying to do a lot.

And then when you settle back and sort of like let it come to you, it makes a lot more sense. I think that is philosophically what they went for. I think that's where I feel like there's a little bit of a lack of focus is that they want it to come to you, but they also want to have a billion apps in that crazy app interface. And I'm not sure those go together. But what I realized, it started to make sense to me when I realized the two most important

things I could do on the watch are swipe down and swipe up. That if I swipe down, I'm going to see my notifications. And if I swipe up, I'm going to see glances. And that if I have a small number of glances and the glances are important to me, then that is a very quick way to access stuff without going out to the app launcher and finding an app and launching it. It's a little bit like the dock. It's like a shortcut kind of thing because you can always tap on the glance and end up in an app. But that, once I started doing that and thinking, I don't need to go out to the app launcher every time I want to do something, then I was like, oh, okay. This makes a little more sense to me now. The third-party apps not being integrated, like third-party apps should be able to do complications in the watch face. That would be easier that if I want to stick data from one of my apps on the watch face and then tap on that little corner of the watch face to launch that app and get more information. That would be nice. I hope they get there eventually.

That feels like an SDK thing to me. That feels like that is what would be in the SDK is how I see it. I heard some developers say that they actually looked and discovered that complications are extensions. They are extensions. So theoretically, a developer could write a complication if Apple allowed it. So, you know, yeah, it's a 1.0 product. I feel like the hardware, this is total Apple, modern Apple, right? I feel like the hardware is spectacular.

It's spot on. And then the software is like, let's figure it out. We both have the sport, don't we? Yeah. Yeah, I have the green as it happens. A green sport watch appeared. I have the sport don't we yeah yeah i have the i have the green as it happens a green uh sport watch appeared i have the developer edition i have the blue oh nice nice um everything about the hardware is amazing it's it's so beautiful the screen I said this before, but the screen on this thing is about 10 times better than it should be. Oh, yeah.

Like, there is no reason. Sometimes I catch things. Like, some of the notifications, like the calendar alert notification, is one of the most beautiful screens I've seen on an Apple product. The colors and, like, just the way it is designed, it's, like, it's mind-blowing.

To me, it just looks so good because the screen is so good, and it's so small, so everything's so crisp. And there are parts where this, even in software design as well, where the two of them meet together, and it blows my mind. One of my most favourite things is when you are centred on the home screen to the watch and you zoom in to the watch with the digital crown and it comes into focus by building the watch face as you zoom.

Have you tried that? Do you know what I'm talking about here? I don't know. So if you go to the home screen, if you just press the crown and go to the home screen, and then zoom in on the watch slowly, it builds the face. Oh, yeah, yeah. I have noticed that. Yeah. And that, to me, is one of the – I just find that so beautiful.

That, to me, is one of the... I just find that so beautiful. Yeah, it does sort of make me want to be able to, at any time, zoom out with the crown out of the watch face, and you can't. Once you're in there, you're in there. But yeah, the animations on some of the faces where it sort of sweeps around the dial, there's some amazing stuff there.

A lot of the animations, general are really good i mean so there are parts of it that are just so good and i really like the sport band um i found it a little bit sweaty by the end of the day but i'm totally fine with that um i do want another band because the blue sport band is not a goes of everything kind of band um and i'm waiting to get the Milanese. But I'm not ordering it online because I'm not going to wait until June for it to ship. I expect to be able to either get it in the UK or in San Francisco before then. I'm not going to pay £129 and wait for something until June. I'll just get it when it's available in the store.

Even if it's not available until July. I just think that's crazy. Yeah, okay, here's 129 pounds now and i'll just wait until june i know they don't charge you but it just seems like a crazy thing to me i'll just wait um yeah i want to talk about the home screen okay because i think that this so fundamentally I think that the fact that Apple call where the apps go the home screen is is is like problem number one because I don't think Apple consider the app screen as the home screen I think they consider the watch face as the home screen yes and I checked in the documentation I checked in the user guide because I wanted to double check this they call the app screen the home screen it's like it's not home like no and and the lock screen on the iphone is not the watch face right

because if you think like on the iphone you you look at the watch face and then you so you look at the lock screen and then you go to the apps right but the utility of the watch face on the watch is way more, and the purpose of it is way more than the lock screen is to the iPhone. The lock screen on the iPhone exists so you don't accidentally launch apps. That's why it's there, right? So it's in your pocket and it's not just pressing apps all the time. But the watch face, that is the primary function of this device. That is home.

And the fact that the home screen is the app screen, it just makes no sense to me because it just doesn't feel like a place where I want to be a lot of the time. I agree. I mean, a bunch of us have been saying this. I agree with you completely. The face is home. and then from home, the directly accessible things are notifications and glances.

this place that looks like the iPhone home screen, but it's not home on the watch. It's, it's, uh, in some ways I feel like, um, it's not necessarily that I've, I've failed when I have to go to the app launcher screen because there's some stuff that's just not, I want to get to it and I don't have a notification from it and it's not in my glances and I want to go look it up, but it's definitely like leafing through the back of the book. It's like going through the index. It's like, Oh, I need to go and look something up. I'm going to go to the app screen and go find it. It's like a last resort, not the comfy, you know, a comfy place that's home. It's the index of apps.

It's the last resort to get something. I need to get this thing and I don't have it in front of me. I'm going to go get it in the app screen. Yeah. Yeah. All right. We're in the app screen. Yeah. Yeah. All right. We're in violent agreement here. Yeah.

Because so like one other thing is like the way the buttons work. Like I because when you press the crown, it takes you to the apps, not to the watch face. Right. And I want it to take me to the watch face does that make sense like if i'm in an app and i press the crown i want to go back to the watch face yeah so my my theory on this is i think that the tapping the crown should take you to the watch and tapping the other button should take you home to the apps i. And you hold the long button to bring up the friend circle. I agree.

I think devoting that button to the friend circle is a mistake. But I've thought that since day one and I still feel that way. But this is when we talk about 1.0, it's stuff like this. I feel like we're all going to learn and Apple's going to learn

how people use this and is going, I would like to believe that there will be a software update for the watch that is very much like all right we've heard you we figured out this out we've got here's our new take and you know those those emojis are not there anymore you know just we're not going to even talk about them they're gone i love them in an ironic way i like sending them to people. Because they're so bad?

Because they're so ridiculous. They're just ridiculous. The animations on them, again, are really great. They just look ridiculous. With the creepy, creepy glove hand. Oh, yeah. Yeah, it's weird. So I feel like I don't know if Apple's going to let us set what the buttons do so much as that Apple may rethink what the buttons do.

And I think that would be fine because I think you're right. In my mental map of the watch, like you, I kind of want take me to the watch face, take me to the app list, and not this sort of like take me to my friends, my little list of 12 friends where I spin the dial. And I'm not sure that's the most efficient way. It's a fun interface, but yeah, it's not my favorite. Should I mention, I have two things that I want to mention before we get to the questions and answers and maybe hear from a friend. One is how I got the watch. Yes.

Because you promoted that in advance. It's not a super secret way. I don't have a watch from Apple. I talked to them and they said, we're probably not going to be able to get you one on launch day. It's like, oh, well. And I ordered like three minutes or five minutes into the order period, but I ordered the one that everybody else ordered, which was the Space Gray Sport. And so it's marked as shipping in May. So I thought, well, you know what? I'm not going to order a watch just, I don't know what I was thinking. It was after midnight.

I'm not going to order a watch just to get it on day one. That's a watch I don't want, which I probably should have just gone ahead and done that. So the day before the Apple Watch comes out, I just got home from yosemite checking my email and a friend of mine former co-worker of mine sends me an email it's not a not an editor it's a technical guy uh says um i've got a watch coming tomorrow and i don't want it um i was going to put it on ebay or something, but I figure six colors could use it. Do you want it? And I say, yeah, actually, yes, I will write you a check. I do want it. I've got a lot of other things going on, but I should probably have the Apple Watch on day one.

And so on the day he sent me a text when he was working at home, he sent me a text when he got it. And about two miles from my house we had a little on like on a street that was not his street and not my street um we had a like a meetup and there was an exchange of of uh of cash for goods did you did you did you get the watch out of a brown paper bag tucked inside a trash can uh that like a dead drop i i did not okay um he just handed me the uh the box that it came in the shipping box and uh we chatted for five or ten minutes and then i and then i came home and uh and thus begin my adventure with uh green apple watch sport but uh it was just kind of funny it was completely serendipity i i hadn't i had sort of planned to just not not be part of the

party but in the end i got to be part of the party, but in the end I got to be part of the party. So now I don't know what I'm going to do with the one I ordered. I may cancel that order, even though I do like the space gray look. But anyway, if I do keep that order, then I'll, I'll, Upgradian's going to have first crack at buying my Apple, my other Apple Watch from me. Get the Apple Watch worn by Jason when he wrote that article. But I haven't decided what I want to do about that. But anyway, the other thing I wanted to talk about is the cheese vertical. Yeah. I bought cheese with my Apple Watch. Of course you did. It wasn't manchego. It was mozzarella because I was making pizza on Saturday night and we were

out of mozzarella. So I walked down to the local Whole Foods, which is very close to my house, which is why I can walk there. And so that's why I shop there way more than I should, because it's within walking distance. And I got up to the counter with my little thing of cheese and I double tapped the little friends button and held my wrist up to the little reader and it all went like, you know, and that was it. They let me leave the store with some cheese. So apparently I bought that cheese with my Apple Watch. Again, I don't have much of a story here. It worked. And it's cool that I didn't have to do any thumbprint or anything because I had my watch on my wrist. And so it,

it had validated that I was me. I want to, I just want Apple pay. Like I would like it. It would be nice. I know. Wouldn't that be nice if you had that? It would be a really great day for everyone.

Yeah. Yeah. I hope it's coming. There are lots of like little rumors that fly around and say like q2 or something it's it's you know it's big businesses big business in you know that's what they're doing they're just businessing around each other for a bit and eventually they're gonna yeah they're gonna do it but this is financial institutions which are just slow slow on the last analyst call apple actually likened it to the carrier negotiations.

That it was that difficult. That they really had to go into each market and negotiate with individual banks and individual payment processors and get it to work. I really have my fingers crossed for a more firm announcement on the call today. At least to say, yes, it's going to be coming to these countries in q2 like i want to hear apple say it um and then i'll be happy like i don't care if i have to wait another three months or whatever i just want to know that it is happening rather than like yeah we're working on it like that's not you know that's that's nothing and until it's until there's a confirmation working on it means nothing right because. Because we still don't have iTunes Radio.

You know, so it's kind of the same deal. Yeah, we're going to bring it to other regions. Okay, well, we'll see. I still feel like I have so much more to say about the Apple Watch, but I figure what we should maybe do is start going through some of these questions, because it might unearth a little bit. I did just want to, just before we do move away, because i don't think we're going to talk about this again i do want to just talk about the home screen a little bit more in so much as to say like there it's it's it's weird it's not good it's not good so the app type the app targets the touch targets are way too small i i very, very frequently do not open the app that I want.

I open the app that's next to it. Does that happen to you? No. Okay. Maybe my fingers are bigger than yours. I don't know. Or maybe I've just hit in the wrong places. Trying to arrange apps is a nightmare it's an

absolute nightmare so you know like on the iphone they like when you try and move apps around it pushes all of the apps that are next to it right or around it but the thing is with the apple watch what it seems to do it pushes them in all directions. Yeah. So you move one app and the entire line changes. It's like, oh, just let me put them arbitrarily, or something is a bit, it's nightmarish to arrange apps. But there are some apps that are really, really good. And there are some apps that are not good. And I think it's clear who has had the most time

with a device yeah yeah although i think not not necessarily but it does seem to feel that way that there's an indication we know that developers got to go to labs and use these devices and actually do some hardware testing but i feel like even then it's not the same as living with the device and so that we're going to see a lot of app revisions happen soon from people from developers who are like oh yeah that totally doesn't work let's try this instead um but you're right some apps felt really good and some apps were kind of pointless but like i bet i was using um i had a twitterific notification and i tapped on it and it opened the twitterific app and allowed me to send a reply using text you know speech to text uh that was

a pretty cool experience i have to say that was pretty that was pretty cool every now and then i have one of those experiences that i i am surprised at how well it works yeah yeah but one of the main problems with the third party apps is the is the delays like sometimes you tap something or you try and open an app and you're just waiting spin spin i was trying to demo workflow for federico and i was i was basically making a video for him and i was waiting like two minutes because i was recording it i'm sitting there going i'm so sorry buddy like maybe in a minute and i don't think this And I don't think this is the issue of developers because they don't know a lot of this stuff.

And I'm sure there are things they can do to speed it up, but because they haven't got the devices, there's nothing they can do. But like the workflow app is kind of incredible, the things that it's able to do. I don't know how it does them. It's kind of like the iPhone app. But yeah, there are some real issues

with lag for the third-party apps. Yeah, definitely. It's early. I mean, 1.0, I mean, it's what we said about photos and it's true for this. I think this hardware is pretty good, but the software is, it's new

and they're taking their best shot at it. It doesn't mean like they should have waited. I think at some point you have to get it out there and learn. And the true test is that how will Apple react to this learning process? What comes next? And given that we have WWDC coming up, I'm hoping that what we're going to see is some thoughts about the direction that the Apple Watch is going. And I we're going to see is some thoughts about the direction that the Apple Watch is going. And I hope we get to see some software revisions for Apple Watch now that it's out there and see Apple readjusting and figuring out the right things to do for this product. But it is cool and fun. And although we have criticisms about it, because there's definitely work to be done, I'm enjoying it a lot.

I feel like there's so much to appreciate about it, even though there also is so much potential and there's so many things that can be explored and changed and learned about this product as we go. So it's 1.0 in all those senses, right? It is the excitement of the new, and it truly is new. And I love that feeling. This is weird and different. It's not like what I'm used to. At the same time, 1.0 means what most people know that it means, which is there are bugs, things don't work right, some things are going to have to be rethought. That's totally true. The things that I love about it, I really, really love about it. The things that annoy me really, really annoy me.

That screen. The screen is amazing. Yeah. And the aluminum. Nobody does aluminum like Apple. It's amazing. There's so many things to like about it. Like I said, the hardware I feel like is almost beyond reproach.

It is a beautiful piece of hardware. And then the software. Yeah. It's got some great ideas and some stuff that's like, oh, I see what you did there. I love your ambition. I'm not sure if it works, but I love that you tried it. See, like I could just sit and look at that watch face all day,

which is something that I love. But the problem is it goes off too quickly. Something that annoys me. You know, that's kind of how I am with this device is I really love it and it really annoys me. But I really love it. but it really annoys me. I feel like I keep going through this at the same time, but I do feel like my love is stronger than the things that annoy me.

I love more things about it than there are things that annoy me. Yeah, yeah. And that's the 1.0 experience right there. It reminds me of the iPhone. The original iPhone reminds me of that because the original iPhone frustrated me of that because the original iPhone frustrated me so much

because it was limited. Why can't I copy and paste? Yeah. Why doesn't it do this? Why can't I send picture messages? Like, why can't I send things over Bluetooth? Like, there were all these things

that it didn't do that really annoyed me, but there were all these other things that it did that I can't believe that it could do. Look, we've got questions. Let's get into the questions,

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for supporting Upgrade. Yay! So, first question from Benjamin. This is a crazy one. Is there any way to view a reminders list on the Apple Watch? No. No, there is not.

You can add reminders. All of the things that Apple has with their ecosystem and syncing and apps on all the devices, and there's no reminders app on the Apple Watch. It kind of feels like if you use Reminders, it feels like the perfect device for Reminders. I do use Reminders.

I use Reminders. And I think the answer is, I believe there may be some apps like Things that sync with Reminders and are on the Apple apple watch so i think there may be some other apps that sync with the reminders list that might display it but the official apple approach of the reminders app just isn't there it's dumb the most functional part of reminders on the apple watch does exist which is being able to add them but you cannot view them or check them off. Or check them off, yeah.

Which is crazy. Did you say functionable? That's another word. You know me, Jason. I like to make up words. Functionable is today's word of the day. Okay, good. Ding.

This comes from Lucas. Can I use Apple Pay on my Apple Watch when my iPhone does not support it? I have an iPhone 5. I believe you can. Yes, you can. I thought I'd heard this somewhere. I think they said it on stage.

Yeah, they have the secure element and all of that in the watch. So if you have an iPhone 5, so you don't have the ability to do Apple Pay on your phone, you can do it with the watch. It's true. That is absolutely the case, which is pretty cool.

John has asked, is 42 millimeters a good size or might want an even bigger model to be right about in the future? It's good. I wanted to do this because I like this question because I want to break it down into two parts. Let's talk about the size of the watch. I think the watch for me is the perfect size.

It is the same screen size as my purple effectively um it's it is thick but it's not too thick uh and i don't find it heavy um so it works for me perfectly um i don't have i don't have any problems with it uh size wise what do you think you got a 42 there right i got a 42 um so i i have worn a watch my entire adult life i mean like i take it off sometimes but pretty much uh 90 plus percent of the days i have worn a watch at some point um and so for me i i the amazing thing about it is it just feels like a watch my wife put it on for a little bit and she was like, oh, it's so heavy. I'm like, well, she doesn't wear a watch. But if you're used to wearing a watch, it just, it feels like a watch. It's fine. And it doesn't, it actually, I was worried that it was going to be, feel like super thick, like I was wearing a big, you know,

brick on my wrist and it doesn't feel thick at all. And the screen size, yeah, I mean, it would be nice if the screen was bigger, I suppose, just in the sense that you'd have more screen real estate, but it would not be nice in the sense that it would be a larger thing. And I feel like this is a good size for my wrist. I think it's a good match. And I don't, you know, if I want a larger screen, I've got my iPhone for that. So I feel like it's a good size. What we've learned is everybody's wrist is different. The shape of the wrist, the bone structure, and the size. There's so many different aspects. There's variation in the human body. So that's something that a lot of us geeks haven't really thought about. I was up at Twit and I was talking to somebody about what they were thinking and they showed me their wrist and their wrist is like

this totally different shape than mine. And I thought, you know, I can't tell you what to do here because I don't know how this thing's going to fit on you. And in fact, I put the small sport band on. I'm using the small band, not the big band, which I had no idea, but I'm using the small band, not the big band, which I had no idea. But I'm using the small band instead, and it fits better. So I don't know. I feel like 42 millimeters is very nice. I feel like that's a good contrast. I think the real question is, will Apple try to keep making it smaller and smaller? But 42 seems to fit really well on my wrist.

And generally, the human body doesn't change that fast. It's going to be thousands of years before we can adapt our bodies to technology through evolution. So we're stuck with what we got. And I think the 42 millimeter fits on a lot of wrists. And they'll do a smaller version for smaller wrists. And I think it's good. So I don't think we're going to get a Mike was right moment with the Apple Watch, but I could be wrong.

No, I don't need the physical size of the watch to be bigger. I don't want it to be bigger at the moment. Like I can't think of, it's different to the phone. Like my, I feel like with the phone, you just put it in a pocket for a lot of the time, but I'm not going to put my watch in a pocket. I'm not looking for a pocket watch. I could have the screen get bigger.

That would be nice. Just over time, just inch further and further to the edges of the display. That's true, but I don't want the watch to be bigger. No, don't need that. Don't want it, don't need it. Okie dokie.

Where are we now? Matt matt does activating siri on the watch pulls audio playback on your iphone no it does not and it does not the first time you do it you don't know what the hell is happening i was like uh what well it doesn't because it makes sense really they are independent devices yeah yeah i was listening to a podcast on headphones and needed to say something to my watch, and it was fine. Yeah. Yeah, so, yeah, it kind of makes sense, kind of is also a bit confusing.

This is from... I don't even... I don't even... Oh, yeah, I don't even know. I'm not going to say that. It's a spoiler, actually, for a sitcom. So we don't want to give that away. Robert is also a fake name.

So, from a fake person. I know Apple Pay resets if you take the Apple Watch off. What if it slides up or down on your wrist? You have to keep it snug. So the idea being, you have to put in a pin or something sometimes explain that a little bit because i don't know about that so much uh yes so apple pay so right so well all the concept of the watch being locked and unlocked they want you to put a code into it um i discovered overnight after i wrote my story that actually once you put the watch on your wrist, if you touch ID, unlock your phone, that unlocks.

You don't even have to put the code in on the watch. That unlocks the watch. The whole idea here is as long as it can verify somehow that it's you and then you keep the watch on, then it's unlocked. The watch stays unlocked the entire time you continue to wear it. That's cool. I have loosened it over time. I wore it really snug the first day because I was afraid of like, it's not going to, it's not going to, it's not going to work. It's going to keep coming unpaired. I've loosened it up now and I think it still works fine. I do wonder if the heart rate monitor requires a snug fit, but the actual lock concept doesn't. I mean, I suppose if it was super loose,

it might be a problem, but I've got it at a comfortable tightness. It's not super tight and it slides a little bit, but not a lot and it works fine. So I think there's some slack in it. I think that you could probably over loosen it to the point where it would want little bit, but not a lot, and it works fine. So I think there's some slack in it. I think that you could probably over-loosen it to the point where it would want to lock. But generally, they seem to have been pretty intelligent about making it kind of, you know, do the math about how it knows that it's still the same person wearing it, which I like. I really like that idea that it's a personal device, and as long as it knows that it's still on your person, it knows who you are. It can trust. A phone can't trust, right? A phone can't trust that it's still in the hands of the person who owns it. But this watch can tell when it gets taken off. And until

that moment, it knows that it's on that person who put it on and authenticated. That's pretty cool. I like that. Also, Mike, did you notice that related to both of these last two questions, when you're wearing the watch and you get a notification, it doesn't go to your phone and your watch. It just goes to your watch. The phone doesn't make the notification because the phone knows you're wearing the watch, which I kind of love. I kind of love that idea that it knows that it's redundant to ping

because it's not like you've got the watch in one place and the phone in the other and you happen to be near the phone. It's not like with an iPad and an iPhone

where it needs to let you know in both places because it doesn't know where you are. It knows that you've got the watch on, so it knows it should just notify you

on your wrist. I wish the Mac knew, though. Oh, yeah. Yeah, I do. I do do too yeah i hope that there's some more um proximity stuff coming at some point i would love my mac to know that i'm wearing the watch and to not worry about bugging me about things because i've got my watch on that would be awesome maybe an os 10 death valley Yeah, that would be nice. I would like the Mac to be more aware

of the watch in some way. Because I feel like it works a bit better with the iPhone than the Mac, right? Like if I'm looking at something on my iPhone or I'm looking at something on my Mac, they don't... One doesn't buzz with the others being used. But I don't know. I do not button doesn't buzz like with one the other's being used but i don't know i do not know okay so uh from mark is there a way to get watch notifications only for messages from

a specific person um i don't think there is no it wouldn't that be nice i feel like that's got to be um yeah bring like bringing the concept of the vip the email v VIP to your contacts to have a list of people that you can set. I think granular notifications would be a nice feature. I can see why it wouldn't be there at first because it's kind of a power user feature, but it would be nice to have more of that, you know, more granular settings for things like saying these people are are the ones that i want you to let through it's like i just want to be notified about tweetbot dms i don't want anything else from tweetbot but you can't do that huh interesting you know but well because if i want them on my iphone oh yeah well that's true you know i want to be able to separate the two. I mean, notification management

is just a big thing and I genuinely feel like it's going to be one of the big things of iOS 9. I think it has to be. It just makes sense. It becomes low-hanging fruit now. Yeah. Scheman in the chat room, how's the battery life been? Jason? Great for me. I used it all day

yesterday and at 1 in the morning I still was at like 50% I haven't been that good but it has been really good for me too so for example I woke up at like I yesterday maybe was awake from like 8 in the morning I went to sleep at

about oh no I went to sleep about 3 in the morning so I had a really really long day and it was 10% when I went to bed. Like, that is great for me. That's as long as a day for me can go, and it went the whole day. And I'm playing with it, you know?

I'm playing with it, and I'm using it properly. It's easily getting through any day for me at the moment, so I'm more than happy with it because charging it at night is like whatever. It's totally fine. moment so i'm more than happy with it because charging it at night is like whatever um it's totally fine um we have uh benjamin and jen uh have you used maps for driving directions is there lag the taps for turning left or right tap you soon enough have you used it for driving directions i haven't i've used it for walking directions and the taps are good but i did

find them to not in all cases not to necessarily be soon enough huh so my feeling is i don't it's the same as i never use turn by turn directions i just look at the map and you can see the map at all times on your watch which is perfectly good for what I need you can basically see the route you can zoom in and out of it that's perfect for me, that's all I want I don't need the taps or whatever when I'm walking

sometimes I can see the value in the taps, if I'm in a strange location and walking down the street, just having that little extra note of like you know yeah go that way is a is a i'm looking forward to trying it i've been meaning to try it and i just haven't had a chance to to try it yet so you know soon yeah i'm i'm i just am very happy like maps was one of those things that walking around i just was really looking forward to it you know when you like think you know the device is coming so you think about it

into the future uh that was one of the things like oh i can't wait until i have maps on my wrist and i'm very happy that i do can the uh this from josh can the apple watch display notifications from apps without watch kit extensions yes they can yeah you see all of your notifications that you have on your phone um but if uh an app if there is a watch kit app um or whatever you would call it or a glance or something it's going to be way better um with what it can do but if if a developer has taken into account um notifications on ios and they they use the buttons or whatever. What are they called? You know what I'm talking about.

Like if you get a mailbox one and you can archive it. They're the new actionable notifications on iOS. They translate over to the Apple Watch and that's great. For me, there's no mailbox app, but I don't need it. I just need to say archive or set for tomorrow when an email comes in and i can do that which is great yeah in the apple watch app there's a uh under notifications there's a list of all of your apps and it says mirror iphone alerts from and then you can turn those on and off per app and then those are just the standard iphone notifications getting mirrored to your watch on an app-by-app basis.

So I turn most of those off. Yeah, I have most off and I'm turning more off as we go. From Chris, do you think Apple would ever do a C version of the watch like the iPhone, a lower tiered watch made of colorful plastic? I don't think so. I don't see it. I mean, you can never say for sure, but i think the sport is the low end and maybe in the future the sport might get a bit cheaper and there might be a bigger gap um but this thing has already got color all over

it like it already feels like that line to me yeah i don't know i mean would apple make a plastic watch uh eventually maybe just but i think they they want to make their intentions clear that this is – they want people to view this product as a high-quality product, which is why there's no plastic watch. Because they could have done that, right? They could have said the Sport is a polycarbonate sports watch, and it's $199 or something like that, or $299. And they didn't.

So I think that could happen. But my guess would be that, yeah, it would be the Apple Watch Sport would just get revised downward and maybe become plasticky. But it would, you know, it could happen, but I wouldn't bet on it. And then we have one last question from Tom.

Can you sync or transfer podcasts to your apple watch like you can music i think the answer is no yeah so i use overcast and overcast works so yeah but i i think i think he's saying um like transfer you can load music onto the watch and then like go running with just the watch and Bluetooth headphones. And I think for that, you have to have... It's only going to do music. I think podcasts are not available. The only way you can do it is by going into iTunes and changing the metadata, but it's not going to remember your sync position.

But in theory, you could do it. You could tell iTunes it's a song, right? Yeah, you tell that a podcast is a song and then put it in a sync playlist and do it that way. I did realize that I was looking in Apple Watch under General, About, and it had capacity 6.2 gigabytes, available 5.7 gigabytes. And I laughed because that's like way more than the original iPod. Yeah. So it's a thousand songs on your wrist.

And I don't even want to put songs on it because I don't own a pair of Bluetooth headphones. So I actually, there's kind of no point. But that just is really funny that this is, you know, it is an iPod on top of everything else. It's funny to me that there are settings on the watch of any kind. Yeah, I mean, other than that glance that lets you put it in airplane mode and turn off alarms and do not disturb and find your iPhone,

that's sort of like the little simple settings. But beyond that, your iPhone is for that i guess and we do have um so that's kind of the end of apple watch we're going to be talking about the apple watch a lot oh man i think it's good to keep it there for today but we do have a couple of uh regular ask upgrade questions um so do you want to thank our ask upgrade sponsor for this week yes ask upgrade this week brought to you as usual by our friends at MailRoute. If you imagine a world without spam viruses or bounced email, that world can come to pass if you use MailRoute. MailRoute works by diverting the mail that normally goes to your domain.

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Relay, and everybody's favorite, mailbagging. Mailbagging! One of the first things that you sent to me from an Apple Watch was mailbagging related. You drew a little mailbagging doodle on the little Apple Watch thing. I certainly did. Yeah.

It was a special moment. Why would I want to write anything else? Great moments in mailbagging history. Anyway, MailRoute, everything, all of those things, including mailbagging, all the things you want from people handling your mail. And here's the best part. There's a risk-free trial. You don't need a credit card.

You sign up, change your MX records. That's the record for a domain that says where does email get delivered. It gets delivered to MailRoute and then MailRoute will pass it on to your servers. As soon as you change those records, your mailbox and hardware are completely protected. So you can try this out with no credit card required. Give it a try and see if it works for you. All listeners to Upgrade will receive 10% off for the lifetime of their account, not just for a month or a year, but for the lifetime of that account, 10% off. Go to mailroute.net slash upgrade now to get 10% off.

That's mailroute.net slash upgrade. And thank you so much to MailRoute for sponsoring, upgrade, and supporting Real AFM. I don't think we make enough of a deal of that. 10% off of an account lifetime is awesome. That's really, really, really great. You know, some of the deals we read are very much like, you know, you get a percentage off for your first order. Which are nice. And if you're already a customer,

some of those deals don't work. Other deals work for all customers. This is a lifetime deal. Pretty awesome. Don't get a lot of that. I'm pleased that we have it. So should we take the show out of a couple of our favorites? A couple of our upgrades?

I think so. Eric, glad you were able to bring up the Samantha Cristoforetti tweet on Upgrade. Can you remind people? This is the astronaut who took a picture of herself wearing a Star Trek Voyager costume, talking about how they were delivering the first zero gravity espresso machine to the to the the international space station and she's italian so she especially like federica wants her espresso but upgrading eric points out she's actually quoting quoting that tweet quotes an actual line from uh an actual episode of star trek voyager so it's a high level of star trek

voyager analysis i'm sure somewhere brianna Wu is very excited to hear this because she loves Captain Janeway and she loves Star Trek Voyager. But I just love that there was a Star Trek outfit. Some people will argue that because it's a Star Trek Voyager outfit that has extra meaning to the astronaut. Perhaps it does to the, you know,

what the best Star Trek show is. Perhaps it doesn't. But I think it still is a super cool geek moment, and I appreciate Upgradian Eric for pointing out that even the tweet is a Star Trek Voyager reference, not just the uniform. Yeah, so that's pretty cool. Yeah.

That's lost on me, but I can imagine for people that like that kind of thing. Hooray. Yeah, well, I I mean the idea that there's a real astronaut in real outer space who's wearing a Star Trek uniform that's funny that is pretty funny that's pretty cool yeah there is apparently an episode of Star Trek Voyager where they really get upset

about not having coffee and then from wow an Upgradeetian I thought we were finished with this And then from, wow, an Upgradeetian. Yes, Bobby. I thought we were finished with this. Bobby has decided to decree that he is himself an Upgradeetian.

So, okay, Bobby. Whatever you need, sir. I was wondering for many years why Apple does not provide any method to charge an iOSos device uh from another ios device um like for example maybe your you know as bobby says your wife's phone is at 10 and you want to just provide a bit of extra juice but can't jason what do you think about this uh my guess is that there's something about how uh lightning works that that i mean these phones don't, they can power like very, very low power devices, but I'm not sure that's the same as charging another device, right? You can plug in some USB microphones to them through an adapter and they'll work and others, they won't.

So my guess is that they're just not made to put out the level of power that a battery pack would essentially do. But I think it's a really clever idea. It would be nice. Wouldn't it be nice if you could plug your iPad into your iPhone if you were really desperate to keep your iPhone alive? But I am not an electrical engineer. that the amount of power that's being able to be sent across a lightning cable from an iPhone or an iPad is not big enough for it to be you know, to make a big difference. It's a nice idea

though. So then the last one today Justin asked me to mention this earlier, will there be an upgrade t-shirt? I mean we have a clockwise t-shirt now, will there be an upgrade t-shirt? Will there, Mike? There most certainly can be be there's nothing to stop us doing one um except for a couple of things we need to design but we can do that um and then we just need to decide do we want to give people

more t-shirts right now because it's you know it's one of those things we can decide do we want to do this before um wwdc if we do we have limited time and if we want to do that then there's already a million t-shirts out right now do people want to be spending more on t-shirts i haven't got an answer jason is my feeling on this i don't know uh what to what to think about it yeah i don't either um i would love there will i think definitely be an upgrade t-shirt i think the question is when i i definitely i hear from people who say i have too many t-shirts. I hear that.

There are limited things that we can do. T-shirts are fairly easily shippable and easily makeable. And it is truly in the technology industry tradition to make a t-shirt. We always have stickers. We have stickers in our relay store and you can grab those at any time. I just don't know if, one, if we need to do another t-shirt and two if it needs to be right now i mean i would love i want there to be an upgrade t-shirt um but i don't know i don't know just you get it right it's just like i don't i'm just i'm just not sure if we need to

have if if i don't know if i need another t-shirt right now though i'm buying them all that's the thing i'll buy them all we have a nice symmetric t-shirt right now, though, I'm buying them all. That's the thing. I'll buy them all. We have a nice symmetric t-shirt. I bought that clockwise. I bought that connected. I bought that. And I would like there to be one. I just don't know if people want it. And also like these things,

let me just be completely upfront with it. We want to make as much money as we can when we do something like this. And I personally don't know if it's right to do it now because people want it for WWDC or do it later when it's not T-shirt Armageddon. Yeah. Yeah, plus we have to have a good idea. Yeah. I mean, well, we don't.

We just get Frank to do it, and he'll just make us a great T-shirt because that's what he does. So we don't even need to worry about the idea of it. It's just the timing. That's all it is. So, Justin, this is your answer. We think there will be one sometime. We don't know when it will be. It might not the timing. That's all it is. So, Justin, this is your answer. We think there will be one sometime.

We don't know when it will be. It might not be now. I say there definitely will be one. Yeah. But now it's just a case of timing. Because if we want to do it before WWDC, it needs to be soon. I mean, I've thought about things like hoodies and stuff like that. And I quite like the idea, in case you might hate me for saying this,

I quite like the idea of an analog hoodie. Because I feel like it wrapped up in feelings. Hoodie is my uniform too. I would love an upgrade hoodie. That's a great idea. Maybe we should do that. And people are going to be really angry. They're like, I don't wear hoodies.

Somebody's always, you know, there are people about the clockwise T-shirt who are just saying, I don't want to wear a yellow T-shirt. It's like, well, okay. Some people don't want to wear a gray T-shirt. So, you know, some people don't want to wear a black T-shirt. And other people do. So it's difficult because everybody's got opinions. But we'll work on it. We'll do something.

There'll be something sometime. It may not be before WWDC. I feel like we're at peak t-shirt right now. I was working on that clockwise t-shirt design for ages, and we finally pulled the trigger on that one. I think we'll talk about it. Yeah, maybe we could do trousers. Because everyone takes care of the top half.

No one's looking after the bottom half. I think that should be a Bonanza special. Excellent. Right, I think that about wraps up this week's episode of Upgrade. If you want to catch our show notes this week, don't forget to check in your app of choice or go to relay.fm slash upgrade slash 34. Thanks again to our sponsors this week,

the great people at GoToMeeting from Citrix, also Hover and MailRoute of course you'll find us online, there's a couple of ways you can do that we're at jsnell J-S-N-E-L-L is where you'll find Jason and I am at imyke I-M-Y-K-E and if you want to find Jason's great writing

he's over at sixcolors.com we'll be back next time with another episode of Upgrade. Until then, say goodbye, Jason Snell. Goodbye, Mark Hurley.