Upgrade - 36: Menu Bar at the Top

Episode Date: May 11, 2015

This week Jason and Myke discuss what a new Apple TV remote might look like, the dangers of cloud syncing, Apple Watch intimacy, and Jason’s new TV. And then it’s time for the latest Myke Watches a Movie segment, featuring “Raiders of the Lost Ark."

from relay fm this is upgrade episode number 36 today's show is brought to you by squarespace build it beautiful mail route a secure hosted email service for protection from viruses and spam casper because everyone deserves a great night's sleep and go-to meeting. Make it easy to meet with your team whenever you need to, wherever you are. My name is Mike Hurley, and I am joined as always by the one and only Mr. Jason Snell. Hi, Mike. How's it going? I am dandy, sir. How are you? I'm doing good. Doing good. I'm in a good mood because we have a Mike at the movies today.

We do. We do. It's a big one. And as we'll remind everybody because I think some people miss this, is you don't have to listen to Mike at the Movies. Some people write in and say, oh, it was so long because you had the movie thing at the end. We promise there will be nothing other than, nothing like

of technology value after we start Mike at the Movies. It's a bonus. It's like the ATP post show. It's a bonus it's like the atp post show it's a bonus and you don't have to listen nobody's going to test you on it there won't be a quiz on what happens there stuff before that there will be a quiz check your box but um not the not the mike at the movies part that's just extra big one today as well raiders of the lost ark yes today's mike at the movies i do like mike at theies days because I get to watch a movie for work. It's great.

Yeah, that's true. That's good. That's sort of my incomparable experience sometimes. It's like, oh man, I got to watch this movie. It's fine. It's work. I actually paid for the movie tickets when we saw Age of Ultron last week with the incomparable gang. The corporation paid for the tickets.

It was like, yep, this is a business trip. Yep. Business trip to see a movie. It actually was. Totally legit. Yeah, crazy. We have some follow-up. We do.

So I would like to start off the follow-up this week with a message from Upgradian Eves. He did a warning upon us and the listeners. This is good stuff. I've done some follow-up research as well, but explain what Upgradian Eve is talking about here. This is in regards to some, I think it was an Ask Upgrade that we had last week from Robert about syncing his documents folder

through iCloud. We both said, that seems fine. Like, why not go for that? This is why not. Eve says, I would strongly advise against letting a documents folder sync through iCloud, Dropbox, or anything else, like ChronoSync in my case, at least when there is more than one Mac involved.

Many programs save their preferences and or working files inside the documents folder, and if they are synced between two or more Macs with the same programs, these programs may not be well prepared once these files change without notice. Just a quick side, I like that Ease calls them programs and not apps. There are exceptions like 1Password should have a dedicated folder sync. In cases like this, a sync is welcomed. In all other cases, a user need either to decide on a case-by-case basis if a

sync doesn't distribute problems between macs or should do a selective sync and omit the non-document folders of programs yeah so so i've got a few things here one is i i dispute the concept that many programs save their preferences inside the documents folder that's not that's not true maybe some do i'm sure some do. But most programs on the Mac save their preferences inside your Library folder, which is not the Documents folder. It's a different folder. And so I think there's less of an issue here than that. But it's totally true. There are programs that if you just dump everything in your Doc documents folder into iCloud, you do risk having, or Dropbox or whatever, you risk having some weird behavior if you have two Macs that are running and accessing that information simultaneously.

Things can get weird. And I actually did some research on photos because somebody was asking me about this on Twitter, too. A lot of people have asked about putting photos on a shared library, like on a server or in iCloud or in Dropbox. And the answer is you can't move it to the iCloud drive. It will error out. Unfriendly error, by the way. Not like, I'm sorry, you can't move it there. It's more like, it can't be done. It's just a weird error.

You can move it to a shared volume, and if somebody else tries to open that library while you have it open, it also gives you kind of a weird error. It basically says, I tried to repair this, and I can't. But it won't let you open it if it's open somewhere else. And if you put it on Dropbox, it's really bad, because you can absolutely open that library in both places on Dropbox, and that creates conflicted copies, which the Photos app doesn't see, and that's not good.

So I do think you've got to be really careful when you sync your documents, and you need to be sure that you're syncing stuff that you actually want to sync. And, you know, I just say caution. This is why I actually suggested last week that you start moving things over and see how it goes rather than just sort of like select all of your documents folder and drag it into iCloud or Dropbox. But I think there are lots of cases where it works really well. or Dropbox. But I think there are lots of cases where it works really well. And there are especially, there are also cases like Eve mentions with 1Password where it's made to work really well. They have a sync system that they use. But there are other cases where it gets really weird. And I think Eve's advice is exactly right. If you want to sync something to Dropbox because you want

to use that Dropbox space and have it available in the cloud and have it be kind of a backup for you, definitely consider using the Selective Sync feature and turning it off on all the other Macs so that they don't see it. For photos, that's what I recommend, is if you really want to have your photos library also on Dropbox just as a backup, that's okay, but put it in a folder, turn Selective Sync off on all the other Macs that you have who have access to that Dropbox, because you, you could get in some bad situations if you had multiple Macs trying to

open and read that library file at once. And I, I would like Apple to, it would be nice if Apple wrote something into Photos that, uh, warned you when it tries to open something from something that looks like a Dropbox folder or actually actively writes a file into the package that says, this is open right now, that Photos checks and says, oh, it's got the this is open right now file in there. Maybe I should warn the user that they should not open this. But there are various things that Apple could do.

But I appreciate it. So I dispute some of the details of what Eve's saying here. but um you know there are various things that that apple could do but you know i i appreciate so i i dispute some of the details of what eve's saying here i think it may be a little overblown but in general this is true you should be really careful when you sync because some stuff especially packages can get really weird they've got databases in them and then you've got different conflicted versions of databases and things can get weird really fast um i do have a little bit more follow-up if you remember on last week's episode um i mentioned that my girlfriend had purchased an apple watch the day prior yes and that it was going to be shipping in uh around sort of late may time the 27th was the original shipping date um A couple of days after we recorded, it moved up a week,

so it was going to be shipping by May 14th. And then last Thursday evening, it was out for delivery, which was very surprising to everybody involved. It's the smaller model, right? Yeah, it's the 38mm with the white sport band. Those seem not to be constrained in the same way that the larger models are.

No, not at all. I mean, because it was, you know, originally we're shipping in, like, two to three weeks. But it was just really interesting that, like, it said it would be the end of May. Then it was the middle of May. And then without any warning was on a truck, like, to be delivered. She was only able to pick it up today. Quite unfortunately, we were going away for the weekend. And it was being delivered to her office.

And we had to leave. Like, so she picked it up today um so she's she's kind of been been setting it up i think at work because i started receiving um taps and uh heartbeats and doodles and things like that from uh my girlfriend today now jason just sent me his heartbeat. I did. Now, when I receive... So this is something that I found quite interesting. And I'm not the first person to recognize this, but it's a new thing for me. When I send my heartbeat to Jason

or I send a doodle to Casey or I send some taps to Steven, the majority of the time, we're joking around with each other. A lot of it's ironic and stuff like that. But doing these things with somebody, what the person that I love, like romantically,

because I love you all, you know, it's a very different experience. It feels very different. There is something about it where it's like, this is a different thing. This like receiving her heartbeat is a different like it just holds a different emotional connection uh and i'm and i'm feeling very positive about that i like that

a lot i like that that is something that we now have in our lives now i guess it's my case to make sure that she keeps it because she's i think rightly said she doesn't she doesn't know how it's going to fit in her life um and she wants to make sure that it can fit in her life so she'll be taking advantage of the return window if necessary that's great i i love that she's trying it out and it'll be interesting to see whether she does decide to keep it or not um and how it fits into her life and how it fits in your your life your lives together too um i got mine too the one that I ordered finally showed up. The black, the space gray with the black band showed up. So what are you wearing, then? I'm wearing that one right now.

But I'm still sort of in this position of not being sure which one I want to keep and which one I want to get rid of. I think my wife prefers the black model to the one. She says she didn't like the green band. I'm not so sure. I'm not so sure I like the black model to the to the one she says she didn't like the green band. I'm not so sure. I'm not so sure. I like the black on black. And maybe this is the influence of our friend Matt Alexander. But he's cautioned everybody about looking like too much of a nerd and wearing just this all black item that it doesn't really go with anything. And it's really, you know, it's it's really heavy and i have to admit i kind of feel some of that i feel like you know it i really kind of liked the lighter look of the of the

regular sport not the space gray sport um and i like i like the look of this and i like the black band and yet i'm not i'm not entirely convinced that i like this better if the only band i would ever have for the other one was the Bright Green Sport Band, I would probably feel a little bit differently. But I'm planning on getting at least one other band. So I'm still not sure. But I'm trying it out for a week, basically.

And I'm going to see whether I want to keep the Space Gray one or send it back or instead sell off the one that i got on day one i think that this the more i think about the space gray one like it can you have less options to like add to it because less bounds will go with it i think then well yeah even the even the um like the there is a contrast between the, you know, silver aluminum sport and the stainless steel lugs on those bands. But it's less of one than it is. I mean, the space gray is so dark that there will be much more contrast with every other band that you put on it. I think you could only really use the

leather loops or the sport bands yeah i think i think that's true and i want to use the i want to use the classic buckle so that's another thing that pushes me toward i think the classic buckle would look okay but you know it's going to be dark watch dark face dark band and then bright lugs which is weird so i don't i don't know i'm i'm i'm open to it but you know what a problem to have which apple watch to keep and which one to throw back man but anyway it is i it's fascinating because i was sure that this is the one i wanted and i got the other one just entirely accidentally from a friend and now i'm not i'm i'm not sure that i made the right choice. And I might actually like that green sport.

Like I said, not necessarily the green band, but the lighter colored body. Because luxury. Because luxury. So it turns out that Universal owned the rights to do the standalone Hulk movies. So that's... Turns out.

This was a thing, a few people sent this in to us. Well, it's weird because, yeah, so Universal released those. And I guess Mark Ruffalo in an interview said something about that. Yet I'm unclear on the status because The Incredible Hulk is considered a Marvel Cinematic Universe movie. There was a Tony Stark cameo. And I believe General Ross from that movie is appearing, Thunderbolt Ross,

is appearing. They're going to replace him with USB-C Ross. That's a shame. In the Captain America Civil War thing. So it's, yeah, but it may be, although I'm just unclear. I don't know whether that means Universal says, well, you can use him,

but only for the Avengers movies. I'm a little unclear about why they wouldn't make a deal to move forward with a Hulk movie. Maybe Marvel is saying you can't have Mark Ruffalo. Maybe Universal is saying, you know, we don't want to do this. It seems weird because it would seem like after the reception the Hulk has gotten in these two Avengers movies, you would think it would have rehabbed the reputation of the character from their two kind of lackluster features.

You know, I was thinking, because I really like the interaction between B banner and and black widow and how that that character arc um has been interesting for for for banner that uh that uh without spoiling more about age of ultron um you know maybe that maybe that would be something as if they did do a black widow movie or they did some some other kind of thing i'd like to see more of of mark ruffalo i i i feel like they're just kind of they've got him for four movies or whatever and they're going to use him sparingly. But it is kind of a shame that we can't get a broader canvas from him. Maybe, I don't know,

maybe Marvel thinks that the Hulk is better when he's used sparingly in these Avengers movies instead of the two features that they made that were kind of flops. So I don't know. But yeah, Universal is involved, so it's not as simple as Apple. Marvel. I do that all the time, Marvel and Apple. Damn. I do. I do. It's strange that Apple would not make a Hulk movie. Yeah. See. But but Universal being involved changes the changes the equation there. So that kind of that kind of makes sense that now it's a it's a they seem to have a friendlier relationship than like with the X-Men movies or the Fantastic Four movies, or the Spider-Man movies used to be.

But it's still an issue. So maybe that answers the question. It feels to me like they're probably at stalemate. Marvel want the rights to Lap, so they get all of the control. Right. But Universal don't want to let him go because they're hoping that Marvel will want to collaborate on a movie. Right. But Universal can't get Mark Ruffalo

or something like that, and they don't want to make a movie without Mark Ruffalo. Because it would be a marketing disaster. Disaster, yeah. Like a different Hulk. Can you imagine a different Hulk? That would be like having a Flash TV show and then introducing a totally different actor

to play the Flash in a movie. Oh, wait, they're doing that anyway. But it's not like what marvel uh is uh is has been successful with so i guess we'll see the hulk is cool hulk was cool in avengers it's cool in avengers 2 um yeah and good follow-up the last piece of follow-up uh has come from uh mike on from Mike on Twitter. Mike has actually developed a T9 text input app for the Apple Watch. He currently has it running in the simulator and you'll find a link in the show notes which you can find at relay.fm slash upgrade slash 36

or in your app of choice, which includes a GIF of him showing it working in the simulator. Mike went on to tell me, my current plan is to have an input text and it saves as a note in an iPhone app for sharing later and releases free or open source. That's pretty funny.

It does seem to work. Yeah, it's crazy. Shine on you crazy diamonds. Yeah. It's great. Such amazingness. Yeah, it's crazy. Shine on you crazy diamonds. Yeah. It's great. Such amazingness. Yeah, it's crazy, but that's awesome. So that's an awesome example of ingenuity, we'll say.

Absolutely brilliant. Right. That comes to the end of the follow-up for this week. We have a few topics that we want to get to. So, Mr. Jason Snell, could you please tell the world about casper mattresses oh yeah so our first uh our first sponsor on upgrade this week is casper and i get to talk about why do i get to talk about this mike because i i um i i sleep on one indeed i think that's the reason you want me to talk about this so if people if people don't know casper is an online retailer of premium mattresses, and their prices are great.

A fraction of what you will find for a premium mattress if you go in the store. It's sort of like a high-tech reinvention of the mattress business. You order it on the internet, a box appears at your house. A strangely small box. And in there is a vacuum-packed Casper mattress. there is a vacuum-packed Casper mattress. It can get that small because it's made of latex foam and memory foam in layers, which when you open the seal, do it in the room that you're going to sleep on the mattress in because it expands. It sucks in the air, expands to fill the space, and now it's a mattress. Sized like a mattress, it's a mattress. And I've been sleeping on one

for a few months and it's great they they use the phrase just the right sink just the right bounce and it is really appropriate i i was shocked at how much my old mattress felt like kind of like a trampoline like the cat would be on the other side of the bed and i'd sit on one edge of the bed and the cat would be like and like jump off the bed and it's because the old bed was like way too weird and bouncy and stuff and this one is super soft and luxurious but it also doesn't feel like the weird memory foam feel. And I know there are a lot of people who are really turned off by memory foam, but by putting the latex foam layer on top, you get this really nice combination that works really well. When they talk about

prices, premium mattresses can often cost more than $1,500. Casper's got a range of mattress prices, starting at $500 for twin, $750 for full, $850 for queen, all the way up to $950 for king. They're all made in the USA. Right, Mike? USA. USA, okay. Okay, thank you. I really like the convenience of it, the fact that you can buy this over the internet. It comes in a box, and if you don't like it, you can, you can send it back. There's a hundred day period that where, where you can return the Casper mattress. So if you're afraid to try a mattress that you get over the internet,

cause you don't know how it's going to feel, this is the beauty of the Casper system. You can actually send it back if you don't like it. Um, laying on a bed in the showroom is not going to tell you whether you like it or not. So sleep on it, like literally sleep on it and see what you think. And yeah, so I've been sleeping on my Casper mattress and I like it a lot. And they don't pay me to say whether I like it or not. That's me saying, I like it a lot. you should try it out especially given the 100 day try on so here is where you go you go to casper.com c-a-s-p-e-r.com slash upgrade and use the code upgrade to get 50 off any casper mattress purchase that's casper.com slash upgrade and thank you so much to casper for supporting the show all of relay fm and you know, I sleep on your mattress.

So thanks for that too. For supporting you at night. Yes. Yes. They give me literally, they are supporting me at night. Otherwise I would be on the floor. So earlier, I think it was earlier this week, you published one of your articles that you write for Macworld.

Are they editorial pieces? Like what are they classed as, just out of interest? I think, I don't know if they're classes. I think we're calling it a weekly column. Column, yeah, that works. And so, you know, I have, I don't know. It's a thing I write for them every week. And they, you know, Susie Oaks over at Macworld comes up with some ideas

and shoots them past me and I say yes and I write something and they pay me it's a great system industry column, that was the word I was looking for so in this column you talk a bit about Apple TV remotes because there's been some rumors

which one of the newspapers had the rumors I lose track let's just say Wall Street Journal it was Brian Chen so it's the New York Times papers had the rumors i i don't know like one let's let's just say wall street journal we'll just go with oh no it's brian it was brian chen so it's the new york times no brian chen okay former macworld printing lab testing guy now new york times tech writer brian chen i want to take a very brief aside for just a moment because you mentioned macworld uh if anybody has not yet heard um the welcome to the macintosh episode about macworld oh yeah it's just stupendous it's at

macintosh.fm uh episode number four called page turner which features my lovely co-host miss jade snell john siracusa and serenity caldwell that show is incredible and that episode is extra special it's just brilliant so such good work anyway yeah um so yeah you kind of and then took this rumor and the rumor being that the there could be a touch screen on the apple tv remote right or that it could all be in an in and of itself just a touch pad of some yeah, touch screen is probably not accurate, but yeah, a touch pad. The idea of a, there's this rumor that there's going to be a touch surface in the remote.

The idea that you would, you know, you'd slide your finger along a surface and it would read your, you know, read your movements, and that would be how unclear whether that would be the only way of interacting or a way. There might be physical buttons too it's kind of nebulous about that because it would i think it would be safe to

assume it will probably not be a screen because it would that would feel kind of pointless yeah well and it would be pointless uh it would uh really use the battery so you're now you're docking your remote control every day and at that point you've got an ios device i mean like if you really want that you should use your iphone as a remote and we can get to that because i heard from a lot of people who love using their iphone as a remote i think it's uh fine for some things including text input but uh crazy for other things because i fundamentally I don't want to look down. I especially don't want to get my phone out of my pocket and unlock it and launch an app and then look down and make sure I'm touching the right place on the touch screen when I could just feel for a button and press it.

But I think the nice thing about the idea of a touch pad that might even have some buttons on it at the top, but there's also a place to hold it and just kind of like move your thumb up and down and side to side, is you don't have to look. It's not a screen. All you're really doing is flicking your finger or your thumb. That has appeal.

I can understand that because I do, when you get in that mode with an iPhone, using the remote app, and you're doing that to move around, it feels pretty natural. I could see how that could be could be something. Um, and then there's also speculation about, about, uh, haptic stuff that, that it might also, you know, do some of the vibration stuff that we've seen in the Apple watch and in the force touch track pad. And maybe there's something

there where it's, it's giving you feedback as you move with your, with your finger. I, I, I'm less convinced of whether that would be particularly useful or not, but the idea of a touchpad with maybe some buttons at the top, because I do like physical buttons. I think it really helps because you can orient your hand and your fingers on the remote without looking at it. So when I'm watching TV, I don't really want to look down away from the TV in order to press a button. So I think it's interesting. I think it's an interesting idea that Apple might put a touch area on their remote. The more I hear people talk about this, in my mind, the image that I'm drawing is what people expected the iPhone was

going to look like. Like a touch pad, a touch pad of some description and then a click wheel. Yeah. Yeah, sure. I mean, I, I, I, I'm kind of viewing like a, uh, like a credit card, you know, or a little bit larger kind of thing. Um, that's got a touch area at the bottom and some like a strip of buttons at the top, maybe. So guys, I keep hearing people talking about, um, false touch being like the great savior of the button in this and and i don't know really know how that would work like i feel like people are saying that or believing that false touch could give the impression of buttons and i just don't think it could do that like once you click down on it you might be able to feel something but

it can't give you the impression of a raised button. Like it can't do that, right? You have to be clicking constantly. Yeah, or if it's doing haptics as you move across the, you know, you move. The idea is like as you're moving through menu items might give you a little buzz, but that doesn't really help you if you're watching something. No. watching something. And if you have to move your finger a few times in order to orient, like, are they going to say, well, to pause, what you do is put your thumb on the remote and then go and move it down until you feel the third buzz and then click. It's crazy. It's just,

no, that's not it. So I don't know. I feel like it's going to be something like the Apple remote is now that's got um you know a play a play pause button and a menu button or something and then below it it's going to have a touch area and that's how you're going to do the directional stuff the up down left right and then maybe you you know you squeeze it essentially and there's a force sensor that uh so when you squeeze it it it counts and maybe there's a haptic involved there so you know you're you're not actually moving the the the track pad when you click but you it counts. And maybe there's a haptic involved there. So, you know, you're not actually moving the trackpad when you click, but you feel like a little buzz.

I could see that, but like, that's sort of all I can envision for this. There is this part of me that like, here's an idea like this and wonders, I know what we say it can't be and it can be this, but then I think, could Apple just go ahead and make a full touch device anyway? Like we all think we need buttons,

but they're just like, no, but this is super cool. Look what it does. Well, it could have no buttons. It could totally have no buttons. It could also have no buttons, but different force areas. So that if you, you know, there's just a thing that says play, pause, or menu or whatever that's in the corner.

But it's not actually a physical button. That could be too. There are lots of things they could do. It'll be interesting to see what it is. You know, in the piece, I also throw out some other things that have happened in remotes lately that are kind of interesting. Like the Roku and I guess the ps4 have um headphone jacks yeah because you mentioned you mentioned the roku in there and i think uh basically it has a headphone jack in the remote so you can plug in headphones to watch so you can watch something you can watch something

about disturbing people right so imagine that you're in bed or whatever and someone's sleeping you can watch tv by plugging your headphones into the remote and you mentioned in the article uh that it seems like an obscure feature but i wanted to just point out because i didn't know if you knew this that ps4 controllers have a headphone jack in them which is mainly intended for like headsets for gaming but it is possible in the ps4 settings and i'll put a link in the show show notes in case people need to know how to do this to route all of the audio from the PS4 through to the controller. So you can just plug your headphones into your controller

and you can play that way again in the same ID. You can play a video game without disturbing the other person in the room, which is fantastic. It's a great feature. And I use it quite a lot actually because sometimes i like to play video games with my headphones because they're better than the speakers on my tv no um so i i play that way um so my my son does that with the wii u because the wii u game pad

you can just play on the wii u game pad and it's got a headphone jack exactly exactly um i think i think that's a that's a cool idea i doubt doubt Apple will implement it, but it's kind of a neat idea, the idea that you can not bother everybody else while you're watching something. And then the other thing that's interesting is Amazon added a microphone into their Fire TV remote. And again, I'm not saying full- on Xbox declaring everything that you want to, you know, want to do. Xbox, pause the display, whatever. It's a ahoy console. Pause the movie while I go get some soda.

But instead, the idea for things like voice search, because that was the number one thing that people brought up about using the iPhone as a remote, is that nobody likes using the Ouija board, you know, where you have to move around and pick letter by letter. That's awful. And so what Amazon has done is said, you know, we support voice search. So if you want to watch Daredevil, you press the little button and say Daredevil, and it goes and finds Daredevil for you. That's good. That's a good feature. And I could see Apple doing something like that. Although, you know, I wrote a speculative piece last year about Apple TV, where what I said was, I wonder if Apple TV will either have a Kinect style, like, you know, microphone and camera that you can put on top of your TV, or whether it will be something like that, that you put on top of your TV that has inputs that are intelligent enough that you can just, you know, talk to Siri like you talk to Dan's Amazon Echo, for example. Maybe you could do that. Maybe that, you know, that would be an option for Apple TV. It's all

out there. I mean, this is what's fascinating about what Apple will do with the Apple TV is all of these things were options for them. And it'll be interesting to see what they chose and what they didn't choose and why, because they could totally make something that is a Siri kind of thing that sits and has a FaceTime camera and sits on your TV and listens for your commands and things like that. And if they don't do that, there will be a reason why. And if they don't have a microphone on their remote, there will be a reason why they chose not to do that. But it's interesting to think about all the possibilities, at the very least.

I think one of the reasons they would put it, in my opinion, in the microphone and it being invoked to a button is because Apple would never be able to use Siri in a TV ad anymore. Right? Because every time the TV ad comes on, it activates everybody's Apple TVs.

Microsoft had this exact problem. They'd be ahoy telephoning it. right because every time the tv ad comes on it activates everybody's apple tvs microsoft had this exact problem they'd be ahoy ahoy telephoning it oh they there's something they could do that would be clever but uh but yeah that's it's possible i mean that's the nice thing about the amazon feature is that it's a button you press it then you say something and then it goes off and searches for it it's not something that's just hovering in the room at all times waiting for you to say something that sounds like ahoy Telephone but isn't Ahoy Telephone. So Ahoy Television. We're living in a world with lots of Ahoys, Mike.

There's Ahoy Timepiece, Ahoy Television, Ahoy Telephone, Ahoy Metal Tube. So many Ahoys. I did find it interesting that we didn't get, ISA anyway, one complaint about activating people's... Amazon Echoes? Yeah. There aren't very many out there. Since it's by invitation only, right? There aren't that many.

We were way worse about that than we were about the Ahoy telephone scenario. It was unfortunately just Dan that we affected. Hey, Dan. You're welcome. hey dan you're welcome um in regards to the apple tv um are you expecting that wwdc is going to be when we're going to see some of this stuff like especially presuming that we're probably also going to see a music streaming service at wwdc is that too much yeah i um i feel like the most important question and again tim cook's apple the rules are changing. But the question I always ask when we're looking at WWDC is, is there a developer story? I feel like that's the number one thing.

It's like, is there a developer story? Because you can launch anything at WWDC if you're Apple. You've got a platform. You've got a keynote. Great. But you need to launch things at WWDC where you're expecting the developers to get involved. I feel like that's like the extra push. And so if you ask that question of every rumored announcement for WWDC, I feel like it can be illuminating.

Like I said, maybe things are changing and it doesn't preclude them from making announcements. But generally, they try to have a developer angle. So, for example, music service, I don't see a developer angle there. I see that maybe it's available because the rumor is put it in iOS 8.4 or whatever. It also wouldn't surprise me at all, given that they make lots of entertainment announcements in the fall, that it wait till the fall. And then they announce it then, maybe in iOS 9, maybe in an iOS 8.4 that comes a little bit before iOS 9 comes out to keep compatibility with devices that are not compatible with iOS 9, if there's any change there. The Apple TV thing, it's the same thing. I feel like

if there's a developer story, if they're going to let you do apps, if you're going to, the developers will actually be able to do something with Apple TV as a platform, then it makes sense for that to happen at WWDC. And if not, then they could kind of do it whenever. They can do it later. They can do it in the fall and have it be a big holiday seller. So I'm kind of up in the air on it. I feel like there could be a developer story there. I'm curious about the watch too. Like, will they make watch announcements? Will there be a, you know, watch OS 2.0 announcement as well? I kind of expect there will be, but Apple TV, maybe. I hope so. I've been waiting for, you know, Apple TV, you know, as a platform for, and I know developers have for quite a while that long

time and it just hasn't happened so maybe this will be the time but if they're going to do that and developers can want right uh apple tv apps then yes i think they have to do it at wwdc i think that there is a possibility for some development in the music service but carplay like development small, accepted in. Because there are other types of services that you could integrate into that platform a little bit and also push some information out. Federico had some really good thoughts on this

on Connected last week. There are some, like, you could have lyrics and you could have Sh and you could put you know you could have shazam integrating and stuff like that by the way if you've not yet tried the shazam apple watch app you need to try it i don't understand how they're doing what they're doing it's amazing all right it's one of the most impressive uh apple watch apps i've tried actually um like the lyrics and all that stuff it's's madness. I actually don't know how they're doing what they're doing. But yeah, I see that if you're going to do an Apple TV at any point, right, it's got to have apps now, right?

Because that's expected. Like if you're going to make a serious move, like if you're not just going to continually upgrade the box, like if you're going to make Apple TV what Apple TV should be in 2015 uh apps is a big part of that and if apps is a big part of that then you need to talk about it at WWDC right it just seems logical but I don't know about about I don't know about the watch yet I don't know I don't know if we're

gonna see anything more at WWc like in a in a real big way other than a like stay tuned well they they promised that they will give developers access to more of the operating system so there could be a stay tuned and then they'll roll out more in the fall um they could also do you know watch os 2.0 say, here's a beta of watch OS 2.0. This is going to be out in the fall. You can start developing your apps now. The same sort of story that they do with OS 10 and iOS. That would be interesting.

Likewise, the, you know, the big iPad rumors where there's this talk about like, oh, there could be a big iPad and all of that. That is different in that there are some different developer rules. That could possibly come. Although, again, more likely it'll come in the fall when they traditionally release all the iPads and that developers will have no time to plan for that. But it's not beyond the realm of possibility if that product is ready that they could release that product or announce that product in the summer along with changes that developers could write to.

More likely they'll have lots of mysterious APIs and lots of mysterious changes to how you can build iOS apps that they will say nothing about why, but it's very obvious to observers that something else, an iPad of a different screen size is coming because that's basically what happened with the iPhone the last couple of years is it was very clear that there would be bigger iPhones, because they were starting to talk about different tools

and different ways of laying out apps, and why would you need that unless you were doing a bigger iPhone at some point? So we may see some of that, too, one way or another. That's the fun thing about WWDC. There's the stuff that gets announced, the stuff that doesn't get announced, and then the things that are hinted at in the details but not announced. Considering we're less than a month away, there's going to be a lot more WWDC talk on the way. And I'll ask this question.

Certainly. I don't really think we need to answer it right now, but it's just something that's circulating in my brain as we talk about this stuff. circulating in my brain as we talk about this stuff. OS X, 10.11, iOS 9, Apple TV, Watch 2.0, and maybe HomeKit, and a music streaming service, potentially. Is that too much stuff?

If you just look at the developer platforms in there, if you ignore HomeKit, because I'm just throwing things in to make the list longer, if you look at iOS 9, OS 10.11, assuming it will be that, Watch 2.0 and Apple TV 1.0.

It's a lot. It's a lot, right? But do we not think that they're not building all those things? I think we all think that they're building all those things. Sure. Is it too much for Apple? Is it too much for developers? Is it too much for the event?

Both. I just wonder if it all needs to happen at the same time. I mean, and this goes back to the age-old discussion of do we need to do these every single year? And do they have to happen all at once? Do you really need to use WWDC as the platform to launch all of your developer initiatives? They didn't announce the watch there, and there are 5,000 or whatever watch apps at launch day, right? They didn't need to do that there. in the fall as a beta and say you're going to ship it at the end of the year or in January. And you could totally do that. Will they do that?

Or will they say, oh, but we can announce it now. We got WWDC. We got to do it now. And sometimes I think that there is an actual push and pull within Apple that's like that, which is there are people who are like, this is our time. We should do it now. Give it all to the developers now. And then there are other people who are like, it's too much. Let's just do this later. There's nothing stopping us. Look what happens. The developers are going to love this stuff regardless of when we drop it on them. Why do we need to drop it on them now

when we're doing like eight things at once? It goes back to the age-old software quality discussion too, which is maybe getting these things not all on an announced new version in June, ship it in September schedule might be good, right? Maybe stagger it a little bit. But, you know, the downside of that is if you've got watchOS 2.0 and the features that will take advantage of that would, if they would be better on iOS 9, let's say, which is a good question. Would they require, you know, if you're using iOS 8 and there's a new watch OS update, would they bar you from installing it if you weren't running iOS 9?

I would think not, but it's an interesting question. I don't know. These are all the questions that you're right. We'll be swirling out there that we can talk about more as we get closer because we're, what, a month away now. Yeah, just as my one last point, it's just as someone who has been

like knee deep in iPhone history recently, I do really feel like we're going to get a watch roadmap event like we did with the iPhone SDK sdk no so i think that they'll say we have stuff to say about the apple watch you know it's coming this year we're going to have an event shortly which you'll hear more about where we outlay some of that stuff that that's that's what i think we're going to see but we'll wait and see what happens it could it could just be in the keynote i mean and and it could be that simple of we said that, you know, thank you for making all these WatchKit apps.

We said that by the end of the year, we would let you make full apps. We're on track for that. Stay tuned. Yeah. You know, it could be that simple. And whether they do a special event for that or it's just part of some other event or no event at all, right? Because with a developer message like that, they can do no event at all. Like when the WatchKit stuff came out the first time.

Yeah. It's just here's a bunch of stuff. Boom. Here it is. And everybody absorbed it and wrote thousands of apps without having even touched the hardware or maybe touched it in a lab in a few cases. Right. Talking about TV stuff, you in a few cases. Right. Talking about TV stuff, you bought a new TV. Let's talk about that. But before that, let me thank our second sponsor for this week's episode,

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and you want things to be just easier to manage, or maybe you're looking to start your first ever website, or you want to put a portfolio online or set up a store of your own, I think Squarespace should just be a place that everybody considers now. It is something that I've used for so many years for various projects, simply because, for example, for me, I have a couple of projects at the moment that run on Squarespace.

I have MikeHurley.net, which is just a website which has my name on it, right? Because you just have one of those. And then RelayFM runs the blog and the store, our RelayFM store, they're on Squarespace as well. So I have MikeHurley.net there because it's a very easy way for me to have a very good looking website, right? Squarespace's templates are beautiful, they have responsive web design built right into them, they just look fantastic on all devices I can choose and very easily make customizations, so I can make it look just the way that I want, I can touch it, set it up and just leave it there because that blog or that website gets very little added to it. So it just sits there. It's never a worry for me. And whenever I need it, I can just go

there and add stuff to it. Very simple. And then when we have the relay store, that's like, you know, we have to store on the blog there. It's because we didn't want to build a blogging part into our CMS for podcasts. So we just thought, why don't we have to store on the blog there. It's because we didn't want to build a blogging part into our CMS for podcasts. So we just thought, why don't we just go to the place that we know it's going to work? So we went to Squarespace. Very simple. And also the same thing. Do we really want to build all the infrastructure for a store?

No. We'll just put it on Squarespace. Because they give you all of the features you're going to need. They look after them. They maintain them. They update them. They upgrade them. It's just fantastic.

They have loads of different additional pieces of functionality that you can take advantage of, like the cover page, I've played around with this in the past. It allows you to set up just a single page website or like an intro to your website or something like that, maybe a big announcement you've got. It has all of the power of a full Squarespace site, you can even set it up with a different template and a different design, so it looks different and catches people's attention. They havety images support so you can throw in awesome stock photography at just ten dollars an image and one of the reasons that i always continue to come back to squarespace they have 24 7 support through live chat and email so whatever time you're working on your website if

you have any problems they're there to help you they have teams located in new york dublin and portland who are there to help you they They have rock-solid, fast hosting. They have their dev platform, so you can go in and tinker and add some stuff. I know that Stephen uses that to do some special things to his site, Fire 12 Pixels. That's also on Squarespace. They can give you a free domain name if you sign up for a year and just so much more. I'm confident.

I'm very confident. If you try out Squarespace yourself, you're going to love it. So you can sign up right now with no credit card needed and start building a free trial go to squarespace.com to do that and when you decide to sign up make sure that you use the offer code upgrade to get 10% off your first purchase and show your support for this show thank you to Squarespace for helping us out at RelayFM Squarespace, build it beautiful so indeed. Squarespace, really beautiful. So, indeed, beautiful Squarespace.

No, you don't like that one? I don't think Squarespace would go for that, for our singing the... Well, we'll see. It's extra. We have to charge extra if we sing. Exactly. We couldn't, so we don't. So, right, let's move on.

So you bought a TV. Why did you buy a new TV?'s a big purchase a tv not necessarily in cost it's just you know people don't buy tvs that often so so um while i was traveling my wife was watching tv in our living room and she's just watching a show in the middle of the show suddenly the t our tv that we've had for five years our 42 inch lcd lg tv just says no signal like okay that's not good um you know maybe it's the maybe it's the switcher maybe it's the the tivo she switches to other inputs and it all says no signal yeah that's the problem it could be a million things right at that point and i'm and i gone and, you know, I'm the person who set all this stuff up. So she's like, well, it doesn't work anymore.

I think it's broken. I gave her some things to try. Nothing worked. And she said, all right, well, you know, I hope that when you come home, you find out that it's broken. Because I would hate for this to just be that I pressed some button and didn't understand it. And in fact, she was completely validated. It was busted. And I did some internet searches and found out people saying, well, essentially what's happened here on these kind of models is that something happened like on the logic board, basically. And you might be able to get somebody to fix it for a few hundred

dollars. And I had that moment where it's like, I'm already unhappy with the picture quality of this TV because it's five years old and I bought a TV for a different room last year that was a cheap, you know, it was a cheap TV. It was, I think I got it at Amazon, but it was a cheap TV and the black levels on it, although not at like plasma level, John Syracuse will tell you,

but were so much better. It's like, you could see so much how the technology has evolved in five years. So I was already looking at this TV, like all the blacks look really gray. You know, it just isn't, and I wish it was bigger. And because we bought it to fit a space where a TV used to be. And I think I kind of underbought, I thought, oh, well, you know, 42 inches or whatever is plenty, plenty enough, but there was room for more. And I had been thinking that. So I had that moment of like, you know what? I'm not going to throw more money at this TV

that I already don't like and just broke. Let's look and get a new TV. So we went to Costco. I decided, then I did the whole like, do I want to invest in like a really expensive TV that I'm going to have forever? And I thought, you know, I kind of don't. I kind of want to get something that's reasonably priced.

And if I can find something at Costco that is where you find a cheap or reasonably priced TV that will last a few years. And if it lasts longer, I'll move it to another room. And that room will have a nice years and if it lasts longer it i'll move it to another room um and that room will have a nice big tv on it so we went to costco and uh indeed uh we found a tv that was uh i felt was really reasonably priced and uh what was funny about it is it's a so it's a vizio which is uh an interesting tv manufacturer that proves that advertising can elevate you from being, you know, Sampo to being a brand that people recognize. But Vizio to me means, you know, pretty decent quality, but cheap. And I did some, you know, CNET searches because I know all the TV nerds out there are going to be like, oh, God. Like right now, John Syracuse is polishing his, I don't know, you know, his laser beams to destroy me for making a bad purchase.

But I did some research online and found that this was actually a pretty good quality TV for the price. And compared to some of the other 50-inch TVs that were available. Also, the Wirecutter doesn't have any recommendations right now because they're shifting model years. So there was no consensus for what the best, you know, really high quality TV was anyway. So for a pretty good price, I got a Vizio 50-inch LCD that turns out is a 4K model, or basically the same price as a 1080 model from Samsung. And bought it, brought it home, hooked it up. Looks great. Five years difference from the last one. Doesn't look as good as my mom's giant plasma TVs that she's got, but they don't make those anymore. But it looks so much better than the old one did. And it's bigger, which is really nice. We watched a movie on

Saturday night after we bought it, the whole family family and that was a lot of fun because it was a it was a it was the avengers because we were going to go see avengers 2 the next day and it's rumbly and there's lots of stuff flying around it was really great and uh and then uh after the kids went to bed we watched uh daredevil on netflix in 4k which was also interesting because they have the 4K streaming built into the TV and there's not a lot of 4K content out there, but Netflix does it. And so we watched that and that looked really good. My internet connection is apparently fast enough to support the 4K stream. And it looked really nice because this is essentially a 2160p monitor. 2160p.

That one hasn't crossed my mind. That isn't in my memory yet, like the other dimensions, you know? Yeah. 1080 and 720. 1080. Well, so this is double 1080 is what it is, which is what they're calling, you know, ultra HD kind of display. It's a double 1080. But, you know, that was sort of beside the point i think i don't know whether there's going to be a lot of 4k content out there

or not but um tv looks good it was a good price um hopefully it will last longer than the old one or as long as the old one well one lasted five years and uh the netflix playing with the netflix 4k stuff has been fun i want to do some more before I kind of render a final judgment about whether it's just a gimmick and whether highly compressed 4K video is any better than slightly less compressed 1080 video. But maybe. I mean, I think it's a higher bitrate for sure. So maybe in the end it looks better. But yeah, new TV.

New TV in the house. 50 inches. It's nice. Nice to have a larger tv are you able to switch between um hd and 4k on netflix uh like can you choose which one you want i don't well you uh one one netflix plan supports it and one doesn't. But on the box, I don't think you can force the HD and non-4K version. I guess it would just do what Netflix does, right? And just stream its best quality. Yeah, you press the info button and then you can actually watch

and see what resolution you're getting. And it'll go, you know, 480, 720, 1080, 2180. And then you're all the way up there. After the races. And then your TV takes off and shoots into space, I think. I mean, this is really difficult on a podcast, but are you able to describe what looks better? Is things just crisper?

Do the colors look better? What is so 4K? I don't really... Well, 4K, I mean, there's more lines of resolution is the idea so it's it's like i mean theoretically you could say it's like retina i mean they shoot it in 4k are the effects rendered in 4k i think that our friends in the in the effects uh um in the effects business sometimes they they do the effects at a lower resolution and then scale it up but you know the daredevil stuff look good um It's more resolution. There's always this debate of like, can you tell the

difference between 720 and 1080? Some people can, some people can't. Can you tell the difference between 1080p and 1080i? Some people can, some people can't. Can you tell the difference between 1080 and 2160? You know, it looked better to me, but I don't know whether that's a placebo effect or not. And that's why I want to give's why I want to spend some more time with it. And then I'll see. Because also I'm paying whatever, $2 or $3 more a month for Netflix to have access to it. So I want to decide whether it's even worth doing that. But it's kind of a fun thing to play with.

And yeah, I do think we chase in fact i read an article that said that netflix is working with um some like tv manufacturers and stuff about a high dynamic range uh spec because there's a thought that having more dynamic range in a picture is actually much more noticeable to people than uh more dots at this point so what's the frontier of higher quality images i don't know but um you know like i said the daredevil episode we watched look great and they've got some demo stuff it's very much like the early days of hd where you know most of the content that's available is like demos of you know people in the ocean or like hd net yeah hd net used which was at one point the only HD channel available, used to have a show that was like The Sunrise. And it was literally somebody set up an HD camera at sunrise in a beautiful location somewhere in the jungle or in Hawaii.

And then for half an hour or 15 minutes or whatever, it would just be that one shot of The Sunrise. It's like the the windows in back to the future too right yes yeah you can make it you can tune it in to be anything yeah so that was in the early ages of hd it was like how do we how do we impress people with this oh i know nature photography we'll do nature photography it's a little bit like that like netflix has a show that is essentially that which is nature high definition pictures of nature there's a 4k show that that is all of that but then there's some movies and all of the netflix originals now are being shot in 4k because netflix is pushing this as a as a format it's funny you can't watch 4k on um netflix on the on my retina imac here because they don't

support uh streaming the high res stuff to pcs mostly i think because they're afraid probably rightly that people will intercept that stream and then have this super awesome high definition version of the show to uh to put on bit torrent so it's it's you know only appearing for now at least in locked off devices like this embedded in my TV set. I think there was one thing that made me smile when you were talking about the sunrise thing. When we were in Romania, there was a TV channel. I can't remember the name of it,

but basically it just showed a garden with a lake in it. That was the channel, which is very amusing to me um and joe steel in the chat room mentioned that this could be an interesting way for you to test the apple tv does not support uhd which is 4k ultra hd so you could set up what box were you using just out of interest yeah well i actually these days i've been mostly watching netflix on my tivo because it's integrated

into the tVo interface. So you press it and then it launches the TiVo app. So, yes, I could do that. Although the challenge there is you couldn't really do it simultaneously because I think the 4K stream would degrade if there was yet another video stream on the line at the same time. But I could definitely use that to kind of go back and forth and see with the same episode of something and see if I noticed the difference. Um, I don't know if the sunrise show is available in just HD or, or, or whatever it is,

the, you know, plants and animals that are highly defined. Um, yeah, we'll check it out, but it's a little like the, um,

the fireplace log shows that are on at Christmas time that are just, it's a log in a fireplace. If you don't have a fireplace, turn on time that are just it's a log in a fireplace if you don't have a fireplace turn on your tv pretend it's a fireplace for all the family to gather around yeah it's very exciting when they get when the the log burns out and they put in a new log that's people that's that's riveting television it's like when the the dvd screensaver goes to the corner right that. That thing. You familiar with that? Yeah.

Yeah. Should we move on to Ask Upgrade? Is it that time? I think so. I think it is that time. Great. So we have our sponsor of Ask Upgrade this week, which is our friends over at MailRoute. Jason, would you like to tell the people about the MailRoute?

I would love to tell the people about mail route. Did you say the mail route? Mm-hmm. The mail route. It's a route that the mail takes to get to you. What is the mail route? The mail route goes through mail route. Mail route is a system that intercepts your mail before it gets to your server.

So basically, you sign up, change what's called an MX record, which is a, it's a domain-y thing, but if you're running a mail server, you probably understand what that is. It basically says, where does all my mail go for my domain? And you change that to point at MailRoute. And so MailRoute takes your mail in, it analyzes it, and then passes through only the good mail and leaves the spam and viruses and bounces and stuff like that. They just never get to you. They're kept in a holding bin at MailRoute. This also means that MailRoute servers are taking care of them. They're updating the hardware and the software. You don't have to worry about any of that. They get to see all this spam as it comes in, and I think that improves

their intelligence in figuring out what's good and what's bad. If there is something that is valid that got filtered by MailRoute, and that does happen occasionally, although it's very occasionally, you can get an email sent to you with a list of all the spam that MailRoute filtered out so you know that it's working. And with one click, you can have that mail delivered and even have the person who sent it whitelisted so they're never spam blocked again in the future. spam blocked again in the future. So since you don't have to install and maintain everything, and the servers that you do have now are not getting pummeled by spammers, which is a thing that happens. And my email server that I used to run just got killed by all the spam coming in. I would still be running my own mail server, frankly, if I had MailRoute back then, because having somebody to sit between me and the spammers would have saved me a huge amount of network traffic and burden to the server.

Large organizations use MailRoute, universities and corporations. It's got all of the things that an email administrator or an IT professional would want for mail tools. There's an API for easy account management and it supports LDAP, Active Directory, TLS, outbound relay, and mailbagging. Mailbagging. I went Batman this week. Yeah, that's good. Everything you want from people handling your mail. You can start a risk-free trial.

Don't even have to put a credit card down. You sign up, change those MX records, and that's it. Your mailbox and hardware are completely protected. So there's no reason not to try it because it's a free trial. So all Upgrade listeners will get 10% off, not just for a little for the lifetime of the account here's what you need to do you need to go to mail route.net slash upgrade now mail route.net slash upgrade for the 10 off offer and thank you to mail route for sponsoring upgrade and relay fm and me and filtering out my mail and Batman. I did assume. Thank you, upgrade and mail route. I did assume, right,

that if Batman had an email account of his own, you're like bat at batman.com or something. Or not brucewayne at batman.com. Maybe bat.man. Bat.man. Domains all the time, right? Maybe there's bat.man, super.man, spider.man. Mail at there's bat.man super.man spider.man merlin merlin.man i just assumed that he would get a lot of spam right so he would he would

use mail route to help him um you know like those utility belt companies they send a lot of spam email yeah anyway i'm sure also like uh you know uh service on the on the batmobile like uh get an oil change on your batmobile things like that batman doesn't want to put up with that crap nope that's what alfred's for now it's kind of like alfred yeah anyway um i i want to thank everybody uh because i went into our ask upgrade sheet this morning jason and we only had a couple of of ask upgrades uh from last week's episode so i tweeted about it and i think we now have enough for the next six months so yeah i i think so did you notice by the way that we got um we that spammers found hashtag ask upgrade oh yeah i saw that i

cleared them out from the Google document today, but that was fun to go through. I don't know what was happening. I think we ended up getting inadvertently caught into some sort of Spanish Q&A session. I don't really know what happened, but that was an interesting thing to go through. It was very strange.

Yes, in a language I don't understand and um i couldn't decide whether it was intentional or whether we like got trending somewhere accidentally and then that gets picked up by spammers but but in the end we have this just amazing like chain there's some some of the some of the tweets are just completely like no there's nothing there yeah remember me what um which is oh okay so here it is so these it seems like it's a link to um the twitter account upgrade official which is from the philippines and it looks like it's a boy band yeah i think what happened was people were saying like ask something like it was like a name of one of the people in this boy band and then he tagged ask upgrade so i'm concerned now that this might happen uh but you know we might be okay we'll see uh but our hashtag has been has been coerced by a philippine uh filipino

boy band boy band we it's as long as they make us members mike yep i'm okay with it we did sing a moment ago so that was our our uh audition i don't even know what to do anymore uh derrick um on the no more events label that pops up on the Apple Watch, Derek has suggested, and Jason, I'm interested to see what you think, what about a one-minute daily appointment called blank, just some spaces, for 2359? So it would always say 2359 blank. Would that work until Apple maybe or maybe not issues a fix?

Would you do that? I wouldn't do that. I wouldn't do that. I wouldn't do that either because it's just going to say 2359 and then nothing. Yeah. Just a reminder of it. Midnight will come. Dumb. Yeah.

And then after midnight, it probably will just tell you what your thing is in the morning. But it won't say no more events. But yeah, it's a nice hack, but I wouldn't do it. No, neither would I. I've come to terms with just not having my next calendar event on my watch, and I'm okay with it. I was really excited that it was a possibility. And if I was still in an office and I had like 10 events during the day, I would probably do it. But right now, I just don't have a calendar event on my watch face.

I haven't decided if I'm gonna keep it i it doesn't bother me um no more events doesn't doesn't bother me anymore uh but i and i see something i think i like having my next event there but i'm not 100 sure that i do do you know what i mean like i think that i like it there but i, but I actually don't know how often I use it, but... There. There we go. So let's move on, because that one did not

fly. So we have Chris... Sorry, Derek. With mobile boarding passes on the watch, are there issues with the display sleeping when you turn the watch to scan? Right? So if you're going on a plane, you bring up passbook and you bring up your boarding pass If you'd usually like if you turn the watch away from your face the screen goes off and you see in all the videos and Stuff people turning their watch like away from them face down onto the scanning thing

So one I was gonna ask Jason, do you know and two what happens if Apple pay? Yeah, so I really like this because um apple did something very smart which is when you scroll to the barcode in passbook the watch face stays on if not forever then much longer and it goes to full brightness yeah okay that's what i'd expected because when you go when you're in passbook on the iPhone, and you go to that point, and you open a pass, it ramps the phone up to full brightness anyway. Yeah. All the other UI drops away. It's just the barcode, and it's at full brightness.

And then when you move your hand away, it stays on. So it's a special mode for scanning that happens there. Apple Pay is all NFC, so, you know. Oh, of course. Yeah. So you don't actually need the screen to do anything. You just kind of wave it and it does it. I bought two hot dogs with Apple Pay last week.

Oh, yeah? At the baseball game? Yeah. It worked. It worked, although the scanning the passbook didn't work, but the guy was like, oh, this scanner is bad at devices. You should use her scanner. And I ended up scanning my passbook on my phone instead of the watch because I didn't want to make people wait in line behind me at that point. But it totally worked. Apple Pay totally worked to buy hot dogs. That's like

half of the Apple Pay purchases I've made have been hot dogs at a baseball game but you know hey it works i would be surprised if this is the first time you've had this next question this comes from adam adam has said i'm abandoning picture life for now for the new photos app but i want to keep the memories feature so like many of these photo sharing services picture life will send you like on this day kind of pictures. Do you have any suggestions for this? Has this crossed your path yet? No.

In our little document, you suggested TimeHop, which mines your Twitter and Facebook feeds for pictures. And I would throw in that ThinkUp does that too um think think up does a lot more than that but one of the things that think up does is tell you about things that you did in the past time hop is very good at that that doesn't help um it doesn't mind like your whole photo library only the things you share socially i know there was i can't remember the name of this app but it won't solve the problem anyway but it was a i think it was something that looked at dropbox and did that for you but again that's also not probably going to help in this scenario so it feels like there

isn't anything maybe maybe there's an ios app of some description that can look in your photos library i don't know i don't know. I don't know. And I don't think you can set up a smart album to be, you know, show me everything that happened on today's date. I don't think it works that way. I don't think the smart albums feature lets you select, you know, it wants you to have very specific days,

not like a rolling selection of a year ago today or whatever. It's a good question. I think TimeHop is a great suggestion. If you've got photos that you shared, TimeHop is great. It will tell you what your tweets and Facebook posts of the past on this day are. It's an app, and there's also an email. I like it.

Yeah, but it's unfortunately – It's not all your stuff, though. Yeah, because maybe most of the stuff you want to remember is the stuff you don't share, right? The real personal moments. It not surprises me, but this feels like something Apple could do, and it feels like an Apple-y feature, right? It's bringing the personality into the photos.

If the scripting support were better, and maybe it can get better, because they often will improve the scripting support. There is some at launch, but there could be more. If they made the scripting support better, then you could have an app that, you know, basically poked your photos library and said, you know, look at this date in the past here and then did something and, you know, put together a slideshow or something like that. But right now there's nothing like that. Sorry, Adam. but right now there's nothing like that. Sorry, Adam.

Jonathan has asked, would it be helpful for the watch to have a network connectivity complication? Now, I had to go back and forth with Jonathan a little bit on this to try and understand what he was asking, because I was saying, well, you know, if the watch can't connect to anything, it shows that little red thing with the cross for it, right? But he's saying, well, sometimes, it's right, sometimes the watch is connected to the phone,

but the watch doesn't know that the phone has no service. I've seen this. So I think my feeling on this is, yes, in theory, it would be good to know, but I think the watch just doesn't know. So even having the complication is not going to help because I just think sometimes the watch doesn't know it's not connected to the internet.

It sounds to me like what really should happen here is that the phone should be passing whatever it passes to say, we're not on the internet, we're not connected to the watch for that same notification. Or a different one or a different icon. But I feel like a complication is too much. I feel like they've got the little alert spot in the top of the watch face where you'll see a red dot if there's a notification or you'll see an alert if there's... Or a little airplane if you're in airplane mode. Or the little, like, is it an hourglass or something?

Or a moon when it's do not disturb, right? It's a moon. Yes, a moon. So I could see it there just, you there, or continuing the existing warning note. It seems really fiddly to have something more complicated than that. It would seem to me better that the iPhone is more aware, like, I don't have service right now. I'm not on Wi-Fi. I don't have cellular service, and would just tell the watch, you know, it's one of those times where we're having connectivity problems.

It's a good question, though. I have not experienced this situation, but I think that that would be the right way to do it, right? It's just the phone knows whether it's connected or not. So the phone should share that information as appropriate with the watch and the watch should be able to adjust accordingly. Rob has asked, could we see an option in settings to allow the watch to stay on longer than a few seconds, battery permitting? Is this something that we think we're going to,

that we will see? I don't see it happening because, you know, if you increased it, like if you increased it by a quarter of the amount of time or twice the amount of time, you were probably decreasing the battery life

by a quarter or a half. And they're just not going to do that i mean i have to say right now you know i've had this watch for a couple of weeks now i'm happy to say that i really like it uh and my battery life i mean sometimes i get to the end of my day and my days can be quite long um and i'm at 50 like quite frequently so you know i wonder maybe give me an extra couple of seconds but give me an extra couple of seconds, but I think an extra couple of seconds is not going to make much of a difference. I feel like it would probably need to be like twice the amount of time. And then at that point, you're cutting the battery life in half,

and I don't want to do that. It's a trade-off. And I think looking at what's at hand, I think Apple just made what they consider to be the best trade-off. I think, so my prediction is going to be Apple's going to loosen up a little bit on the battery life moving forward. Because I feel like Apple was terrified of being dinged for not being able to get through a day. Sure, sure. And maybe there are people out there who are using this thing.

Or maybe this is in anticipation of having more native apps come down the road. But right now, I feel like they overshot. And again, other people may have different experiences, but everybody I've talked to, and certainly my personal experience, is I don't run out of battery on the phone or on the watch. It's not even close. And so, yeah, could they, as an option or even as a default, stretch it a little bit? Put a little, you know, let that watch face stay on a little bit longer before it decides to shut off. Because I do get annoyed that it's, you know, oh, it's already off. No, no, no. I don't come back, right? I wanted you to come back. Why did you just turn off right there? They could tweak that a little bit, seeing it out in the world

and realizing that maybe they overshot. Maybe they could tune it a little bit more, either as an option or just as the default. So it wouldn't surprise me because I feel like everybody's basically saying, hey, it lasts through the day, no problem. Then again, they may be saving up all that battery life because they know there's going to be a wave of native watch apps down the road that's going to make it more power use more power use in the device and and drain that battery faster i don't know i wonder right if if the pulling for i mean i don't know i have

no idea but when i open overcast in an overcast like the watch is sending a thing to the to the phone to try and get data and they're exchanging stuff back that seems to me like a battery draining process. It just feels like all that data being passed backwards and forwards every time I open the app. It feels like there's going to be a lot going on there. So, you know, I wonder what's going to happen with the battery life. I mean, I guess different things are going to affect it differently, but it might still be okay.

It might be. But I do feel like it's possible that there'll either be a setting here to keep the screen on a little bit longer, or that they might even tweak it themselves. Because if my impression is correct, watch battery life has not been a problem. And I would definitely set the time out

a little higher than it's set right now in my own personal life because I've never come close to running the battery down. And I have had on several occasions been frustrated that it went to sleep a little bit too fast. Sure. Yeah. No, I agree with that. We'll see. But it would not – honestly, I think it's more likely that Apple would just tweak this than it would be an option in settings, only because Apple likes to avoid adding fiddly options in settings.

But it's possible. So this last Ask Upgrade for this week comes from Lex. Not that Lex. Not that Lex. And Lex wants to know, how do you treat your Mac docs? For example, screen location, what are the apps you're keeping them what are the folders that kind of thing I'll go first

I will talk about like my MacBook Pro which I consider to be my Mac right the Mac Pro is like this dingy over there doing its production stuff so I don't really have it set up the way I would so I have my my menu my dock is on the left um where's your menu

bar is it on the top my menu bar is on the top uh today sometimes i move it to the bottom you know like interesting to mix it up i don't recommend that uh today my dock is on the left um i have it down are those are those pop-up menus drop-up menus when it's on the bottom they are all those menus they are pop-up pop-up menus yep good i have uh naturally finder i have the app store there not 100 sure why looking at that why i have it there but it's there i have chrome system preferences mailbox messages tweet bot lingo which is my irc app slack omni focus clear skype evernote by word and spotify i then have a downloads folder uh which is in the grid configuration and displayed as a stack and then i have naturally the recycle bin

or trash i guess i too have my menu bar at the top oh my yeah that's where i like it traditional it's well it's you know i've been using the mac a long time you know the original mac had the menu bar at the top so You get stuck in your ways. Yeah. I have my doc pinned to the right. I'm one of those people. Finder, BB Edit, Safari, Mailplane, iTunes, Messages, Twitter, Photos, because I'm writing a book about photos. I'm done. I wrote the book.

They're producing it now. It'll be out soon. Reminders. And then below that is stuff that's open. So right now, Skype, Lingo, and Slack. One of these days, I will probably make Slack a permanent. In fact, I'm going to make Slack a permanent resident now. Yeah.

I'm going to put it right next to Twitter there. And then below that, I've got documents, downloads, and Dropbox folders all listed. I have a question of my own, but a really good question in a chat room from Rufola. How does the dock on the right affect Notification Center? What happens? Does it just push everything over? Well, in Yosemite, the notification center doesn't push anything. It just slides over.

So when you activate notification center, it slides over the dock as well as everything else that's over on that side. I was going to ask, Mailplane. Mailplane. Not Mailbox. No, I'm using Mailplane. You know, I, so I wrote the article about like alternatives to Apple Mail. And I said, well, I think Mailbox is my favorite of all of the ones that are sort of like general, of general use. But I use Gmail. And so I use Mailplane.

And I've been sticking with it. Mailplane is a wrapper around Gmail that makes it more Mac-like. You can drag in stuff, and it's got Mac keyboard shortcuts, and it's just a little more Mac-friendly interface on the Gmail web interface. And I'm finding myself just using it all the time. I've sort of not gone back to Apple Mail. And Mailbox, I really like the organizational features of it. I feel like the Mac version of Mailbox is, you know... It's finicky, but it is a beta.

It is a beta. Will it ever be a final? I really like features of it, but I also get frustrated by some of the other features of it. And since I'm using just Gmail at this point on my own domain, but it's still just Gmail, that's what I'm using. I, you know, I go back and forth. I try other stuff, but I find that right now I'm spending more time using Mailplane than

anything else for email. Cool. I mean, you can just use a web browser too, but I like Mailplane because it adds some stuff and runs in its own app and you can set it as the default mail app and so if you click a mail link it opens a new you know gmail mail window that's really nice to to have all that it always interests me when people use mailbox on one device but not on all devices yeah and i am still using mailbox on my on my iphone yeah um and i like it there i like i like the you know swipe to classify that's the thing is that all of the classifications of mailbox are just folders

in gmail labels in gmail so i have access to all that same stuff what i'm not using as much is the you know snooze features yeah because they don't they don't really work i'm also a big fan of the reordering right right i i don't do a lot of that but um big fan of the reordering. Right. Right. I don't do a lot of that, but, um, it's one of those things that I wish,

I wish the mailbox version on the Mac was, was a little more, uh, stable and had a little more, um, attention given to it. Cause I really like it, but you know, it's mail plane for me because I'm in Gmail all the time is,

uh, and I'm, I'm, you time and I'm kind of used to the interface. I do like it. Mailbox on the Mac, it does weird things and whenever they release a new update for the beta, it fixes the weird things but introduces more equally weird things. Like at the moment, I have it in full screen, right? If I open a new email previously, it used to just put that,

the compose window over the top of the full screen window, right? It just kept it within the application. But now it opens a separate full screen window, which is just the worst, it's just the worst possible thing to do. And like, also, if I open the preferences, it opens another full screen window

with black around it and it doesn't have a close button like it's just yeah and i emailed them about it and they were like thanks for the feedback and it's like that was not the response but okay he's like bug report like thank you that's like okay buddies anyway yeah buddies. Anyway. Yeah, it's too bad because I like so many things about it. And then there are things that are just super weird and I feel like, you know, come on. Come on, you're a male client. Wait, what? Come on.

Yeah, wait. What? So, yeah. Come on. Okay. Right. It's time for Mike and the movies. Okay.

So we're releasing you. If you don't want to hear Mike talk about Raiders of the Lost Ark, you can leave now. It's okay. But before you leave, there's something Mike needs to tell you. It's very important before you leave that you stay to listen to me talk about GoToMeeting from Citrix. Because they can do awesome things for you. If you think about all of the time, the money and the hassle it can take to hold a meeting, these things can be atrocious. Like I used to be in a big company and we used to hold lots of meetings. And if I

used to think about, like I went to Scotland for a meeting once, I got on a plane to fly to Scotland for a meeting. It's insanity. And the main reason is because they don't want to do it on a call. They wanted to see me. Well, if we were to just use GoToMeeting, they could have seen me because you can turn on your webcam and you have HD quality. You can talk to each other. Like GoToMeeting, it's not just a money saver. It's also a hassle saver. Like if you think about having to say you've got four meetings in a day, right, rather than traveling from place to place to place, or even from like, different floors in the buildings and, and like disrupting yourself and you forget your notebook on your desk,

and I see that all the time. GoToMeeting can take all of that stuff away from you. It is the best way to meet with clients and co workers online. It's just a smarter way to meet. You can do it from any computer, any tablet, any smartphone. You don't have to worry about travel expenses, like I mentioned. You don't have to worry about traffic. GoToMeeting can take that away from you. You can join a meeting. Anyone on your team can join a meeting by just clicking a link. You don't need any signups. They make it as easy as possible for people to join. You can even share screens to present, review, and get feedback all in real time. Because with GoToMeeting, everyone sees what you're seeing,

so your team can get on the same page and just get going. I want you to sign up for GoToMeeting today. You can try it for free for 30 days with nothing to lose. GoToMeeting.com, so visit GoToMeeting.com and click the Try It Free button. If you do it now you'll have your first meeting up and running in just minutes so that's gotomeeting.com for your free 30-day trial thank you so much to citrix gotomeeting for supporting this week's episode of upgrade and mike at the movies okay so like at the movies we're going to the movies. Okay, so. Mike at the movies. We're going to the movies with Mike.

What did Mike see this time? It's Raiders of the Lost. I can't do it. I can't be Elliot Kalin singing the, it's Indiana Jones and the Raiders of the Lost Ark, which is not its title, but it's how it's marketed now. It's just Raiders of the Lost Ark.

Yeah, so this was one of. Steven Spielberg. This was one of the things that I noticed originally. It was just called Raiders of the Lost Ark and then when I searched on IMDB to find some names for the characters for my notes it took me a moment to find it because

I was looking for Indiana Jones and it wasn't coming up and then realized that oh it was just called Raiders of the Lost Ark because nobody cared about Indiana Jones before the movie came out, right? Indeed. Why would you care?

Oh, Indiana Jones? I haven't heard of that guy before. I'm going to love that movie. Yeah. And they probably, I'm going to assume, didn't know that it was going to be a franchise, right? Well, I mean, I'm sure they hoped, right? I mean, this is Steven Spielberg and George Lucas

at the, you know, I don't know about the height of Steven Spielberg's career because he went on to, you know, I don't know about the height of Steven Spielberg's career because he went on to, you know, have this amazing career after this, but this was like the height of their fame as these young producers and directors who had made these giant blockbuster films, and they decided to collaborate

on Raiders of the Lost Ark and everybody went crazy, like, oh my God, it's the next big thing. So I imagine they thought it would be a big franchise. And starring Han Solo. Exactly right. Who was, I think, reluctant. Harrison Ford was initially reluctant to be in this movie

because he felt it was too similar to Han Solo. But he did it. So before going in. Tom Selleck was going to be Indiana Jones by the way but he couldn't do it because of Magnum P.I. yeah yeah I know what a world there's a parallel universe out there

where Tom Selleck was in Raiders of the Lost Ark I can imagine that like I mean I'll talk about the character in general in a minute like as I go through but I can imagine Tom Selleck also fitting that role like in my mind I get that as I go through, but I can imagine Tom Selleck also fitting that role. In my mind,

I get that. Okay, so before I watched this movie, there were a couple of things that I knew about Indiana Jones. Right? I knew the character. I know

Indiana Jones as a character. Good start. I know about the boulder. I know about the face melting, and I know about sliding under a closing door. You know about what? The face melting. What was the first one? The boulder.

Oh, the boulder. Okay, yes. I almost heard, I know about Ebola. That's not really relevant to this at all. The boulder. The boulder okay yes i i you know i almost heard i know about ebola that's not really relevant at all the boulder the boulder the roll giant rolling bull got it didn't you get the ebola subplot of raiders of the last time i missed the subtext there so i'm gonna go through and as i do and and talk through my notes i I do very much enjoy doing this, but it is very peculiar. I mean, I'm sure you feel sort of time

to watch a movie and take notes on the movie because I don't know how you do this, but I pause the movie and make some notes and start again. Do you do that when you take notes in movies? No, because it's generally, no, I just generally just keep taking the notes. So if something really

amazing happens immediately after something other amazing and noteworthy then i might miss it and in which case i would back it up i suppose yeah because i felt that sometimes i lose i like it's like 20 minutes later and i don't know what's happening it's because i realized i lost 30 seconds but those 30 seconds something really important happened in them like that's happened to me so that's why i pause um so i don't end up with more confusion later um so yeah my first note is i was you know noting indiana jones there is no indiana jones in the title uh and this is my next note that i have here is something that i feel is pretty um pretty a pretty consistent feeling that you're going to hear me mention quite a bit uh but whilst i think a whip is super cool i don't think it's probably the most effective weapon in any instance that he uses it

it's it's it's tool i think it's not his only tool it is a kind of his trademark but it's not his only tool and i don't know archaeologists you're you're getting in and out of scrapes and funny areas and and it obviously it's quite versatile with what he does with it. He's very good at the whip. Yeah, that's my thing, though. It's like I don't think anybody could be that good. Well, this is a little like when you're playing Dungeons & Dragons and somebody says, I'm going to do something with rope, right?

It's like rope doesn't do that. Sure, you could try to do that. What do you think this rope is? Is this magic rope? Because rope is very limited in its utility and i think whips are similarly limited you know it's like any any time a grappling hook is used to cross a cavern in any movie grappling hooks do not do that in the one go like i saw star wars i watched stars this weekend and you know when when luke and leia are going across that cavern you know in the death star

and he like throws up this this grappling hook from his batman utility belt which apparently yeah for the rest of the movie that nobody bothered to mention uh i don't know where it's never explained i need to cross caverns sometimes and you know he uses that and he throws up there and in one it like goes around and hooks on perfectly yeah amazing yeah just what you need for that in case in case you are trapped in a place where people work that has giant bottomless pits these things happen workplace hazards you know anyway but this isn't about star wars No. I found the beginning of this movie to be very mysterious. There's no explanation to what is happening, right?

You're just in the jungle. Right. And also, something that I found really interesting, and I wonder how people took to this when it first came out, because Indy is in this first scene, right, when they're going after the idol. There is no kind of clear uh explanation of what as to whether this character is a good guy or a bad guy well in fact he if you if you uh

if you look you'll see that um he's in shadow at the beginning and his back is turned to the camera and we don't we don't actually see his face for a long time no um it's uh it's he he's mysterious at the beginning because then it's like the people that look like they're up to no good and they have accents right um and and it's like and then he's siding with these people and it's like is this a good person or a bad person i can see how that you know people might have thought that because i was when i was the star of the movie so you know yeah but you didn't necessarily well okay i mean you you if you knew harrison ford right but i mean this is assuming knowledge of it but anyway it doesn't mean he's a good guy uh then you know we go through the whole scene uh who with alfred molina who may be my favorite character in this movie i think he is amazing he's just so great uh

all of his terror everything uh yeah he's just brilliant uh and they go and grab this the idol and so much of what i knew about indiana jones happens in this sequence in that opening sequence yeah which is something that i found really interesting i didn't expect to get both the boulder and the sliding under the door in the same movie let alone in the first 10 minutes um and even like the uh put replacing the idol with a bag of sand that all of these things have been played out so many times but like watching them here it's always difficult when you're watching a movie like like this uh having seen a bunch of movies that like use things that are probably uh unique to this movie like later that become tropes because when you watch them you have less appreciation i think so i i try and leave those things at the door and appreciate the movie what it is but it

is very difficult when you have all this retroactive knowledge about the film before you've even seen it. Although the film is itself a, you know, it's an homage to adventure serials, just as Star Wars is, really, to adventure serials of the 50s, I guess, and before. So it's not, you know, it's a re-spinning of some old tropes

into things that then became so influential that you saw them again afterward because of this. And then again, another consistent theme along with the whip is how gory this movie is. Surprised me. Well, there are, yeah. Zepedo takes the idol and doesn't give back the whip, but he is not careful and gets impaled by the spikes just as Forrestal, not Stratforstal, but Forrestal bought it here earlier

and they find his skeleton. And then as Indiana goes under with his whip and goes under the little dropping down door, which is dropping for a very long time, of the little dropping down door, which is dropping for a very long time. He finds Alfred Molina impaled likewise on the spikes and says adios, Zapito,

and takes the idol and then runs away. That's a pretty gory moment just then, right? Yeah. And then later there's the face melting and things that happen at the end. There's not quite so much in the middle,

but, oh well, other than things involving airplanes, airplane propellers in the desert. Yeah, okay, fair enough. I'll give it to you. I've noted down more gory parts, which I'll get to. It's the gory details is what you're saying.

Indeed. Then, of course, we have the boulder, right? This is such a huge action moment to put at the start of a movie uh because it is so uh insane right it's huge boulder chasing you and you're trying to escape from it lots of danger lots of excitement and and this like real like rise of of action right at the start of the movie reminds me of a james bond film um he's going on this little adventure which sets definitely that's definitely the model here james bond is absolutely one of the models for indiana jones and for this movie you know the the flavor is a little different but it's definitely one of the models and then also

it's that cliffhanger feel of a serial of a movie serial where you're coming in at the end of his adventure and seeing you know how will he escape the rolling boulder and you back up and sort of see the the the the action that came before and now we'll see the resolution and they're trying to give you that feeling too but that's the same thing that james bond does it's the exact same thing you're you're usually in those james bond movies you're catching up on something that isn't related to the movie and it's just sort of like here's what happened in this off-screen adventure that james bond had and now we're getting the resolution of it but it's definitely very bond like uh like indiana jones i'm also scared of snakes right because he has the snake that's in the plane which also made me laugh because

there was a snake on the plane which made me smile uh uh so little did i know at this point that i was not set up for a good ride here. There were going to be a lot more snakes as the movie progresses. Yes, they're setting up his fear of snakes for later payoff. And then we have, in a row here, we have two in a row massive shocks to me about this movie. Shock number one is that Indiana Jones is a professor. Yes. I did not know this and i was

extremely surprised because at first i thought oh like that's a surprise he must have retired right and now he is a professor and he is going to be called back into action but no he is a professor who as part of his professor duties goes on massive adventures right which i love the thought that like there are archaeologists that are teaching archaeologists who are sent by the museum whatever that is the museum uh to go out into the world and steal things i love university museum the university museum that we must protect uh i also really loved uh in as 80s movies will be this is an 80s this is in the 80s yeah it's 1981 i want to say okay great uh in a great 80s movie fashion all of the girls are in love with him uh in the class to the point where i really really enjoyed the love you written on that one on her

eyelids genius but and and the guy puts the um the male student puts the apple on the desk too i love that so everybody loves dr jones but i have to say harrison ford in this movie is an extremely handsome man like there are points in this movie where I'm like, oh my God, look at you. Absolutely. Absolutely. No, actually, it's quite a shock, right? We've seen him all scruffy in the jungle,

and then you cut to him riding on the chalkboard, and you're like, whoa, whoa, whoa. What just happened, right? Cleans up. He cleans up kind of nice, and that's how we how we meet dr jones and his element for the first time and i do you know now i feel having seen these movies that indiana jones is more attractive than han solo oh yeah yeah i agree

so he's just a scruffy looking nerf herder uh-huh yep the next huge surprise for me that i was not expecting was the nazis i didn't know that the nazis were going to be in this movie 1936 did not set off any alarm bells uh i just didn't expect it i was very surprised that my now i know him as an archaeology professor is going to be fighting the Nazis in this movie. And this ties into these two points tying to archaeologists are cool. Archaeologists are... How many archaeology careers were launched

with Raiders of the Lost Ark? I don't know. And it's a nice... I mean, it's not... He ends up fighting the Nazis, right? But it's really about the Nazis and the Nazis are after an archaeological item and the U.S. government says, we, you know, we don't want him to get this item.

And so Indiana Jones is on the case at that point. So it's sort of like, who's going to get the item? Who's going to get the Ark of the Covenant? And then, you know, the globe-trotting adventure begins. And the Nazis, you know, pre-war Nazi Germany are the villains, which is it's interesting. So there are no open hostilities. He can move, you know, around the world. But it's very clear that they're, you know, that the Nazis and Hitler are not it's not going to go well.

Right. So so they're good. They're good villains to have at that point. Hitler is mentioned so much in this movie. I was waiting for him to make an appearance. Yeah, he appears in The Last Crusade. Okay. In a jokey scene that I don't really enjoy,

but it's funny. It's so broad that I don't... One of my criticisms of The Last Crusade, which is a very good movie. It's not at Raiders level, but it's a good movie. It's the other good movie in the series i would say that's gonna make some people sad but um but it the nazis are much more slapstick villains in that whereas they feel really menacing here for the most part yeah

there is a lot of slapstick in this movie yeah hitler hitler signs an autograph for somebody in Last Crusade. It's not. Anyway, yeah. Yeah. Okay, so then we have we discover Marion, right? Marion, yeah. Marion Ravenwood. She's drinking an awful lot of alcohol. She's drinking the other Nepalese

or wherever they are, Tibetans, under the table. She recovers extremely fast from the amount of alcohol that she consumed as Indy arrives. She's really good at holding her liquor. It's the lesson we've learned about Marion. And then, you know, so basically Indy is on his quest now to find the Ark of the Covenant,

which is what the Ten Commandments were expected to be uh stowed into there is a whole you know we set up the idea of there could be magic within here at this point yeah let me pause you just to say and we talked about this on the incomparable episode about raiders i think it's actually kind of a masterful scene the exposition scene that happens where they're like in the auditorium at the college and it's and it's uh Indy and his mentor and the two guys from the government. And they explain all this stuff about the Ark of the Covenant and all that. And that is maybe my favorite exposition scene

in any film, because it's so dramatic and interesting, and yet it really is like a guy at a chalkboard explaining the Bible. But the other thing is, it doesn't feel like, I mean, it is exposition it doesn't have the exposition feeling to it that's why it's so good yeah it is being explained to

these two people because these two people clearly don't understand what they're dealing with and it works it it what i agree with you i i didn't realize until now how well that scene actually worked because it kind of i just took it in as information i needed um so indy has arrived and he has asked for uh it's like an amulet of the headpiece of the staff of raw which is like on a on a a necklace in in in nepal his his old mentor abner is dead but his his daughter and indy's ex-girlfriend, Marion, is running this bar. And she says she knows where it is. Come back tomorrow. And then some evil German accents appear.

Yes. You know, the most evil that you could imagine a German accent to be. Like, it's not just a German accent. There's also, like, a weirdness to the voice. Oh, yeah. Well, it's almost like a Peter Lorre kind of thing. know oh yeah well it's like it's almost like a peter lorry kind of thing where it's uh i think what tote says the the nazian questions she's like gonna get a drink for you and your men when she realizes they're gonna be threatening her and he says we are not thirsty and it's like oh my god your fire is dying he's dying yeah so creepy yeah

he's a bad guy suffice it to say that's a bad guy. Suffice it to say, that's a bad guy. Not only is he wearing all black, and then later in the movie where he gets like the nunchucks coat hanger. Like, what is that thing about? That's a pretty good gag though. Oh my God, what's he going to do with that? Oh, he's just hanging up his coat. So this is another point. Again, whilst it's cool using a whip to grab a hot poker whilst it's in inches from somebody's face i think bad idea i think that that is a poor choice the tools that are available at a time i would say he has a gun because he gets it out next but he wants to pull

the he wants to pull the poker away so it doesn't burn marion i think that there's he could have just usually like just whipped her in the face at that point or whipped it forward into her face that's what I expect the force of the whip hitting the poker would have hit her in the face Indiana Jones is that good it appears so

wouldn't it so this is where a lot of gore is occurring there is a gunfight that happens in the bar, and there is an incredible amount of blood here. There are lots of people on fire, and it's just surprising to me. There's one point where someone gets shot in the head, and it's not like what you usually see in a movie.

The guy gets shot in the head you see a gunshot wound immediately appear on his head it doesn't move he just falls forward which is actually i believe after watching mythbusters what actually does happen like you don't fly across the room when you get shot sure right you just stop where you are and fall down and it's real enough looking that it was uh very surprising to me there's lots of people with blood pouring out of their mouths after they're shot in the back you get you get the thing where indy indy thinks he's been shot by the guy but it turns out that that uh the guy has been shot and his mouth opens and blood pours out and he falls down yeah it was you know it's not a complaint

it was just surprising i was surprised by it i don't know uh what rating this movie was but i in the u.s the u.s rating is pg yeah see that surprises me um i feel like that you couldn't do this now and still it would be a pg it would be a pg-13 now yeah that's what i write in fact the second movie in this series is what essentially created the pg-13 rating because it's even more far more brutal interesting interesting uh james thompson in the chat room says i saw this film when i was eight is what essentially created the PG-13 rating because it's even more, far more brutal. Interesting. Interesting. James Thompson in the chat room says, I saw this film when I was eight

and it did traumatize me a bit. So there you go. I then, my notes jump quite significantly here. So I'm now straight at the point where they're having the chase in the desert town. I can't remember where they are. the chase in the desert town. I can't remember where they are. So what happens is that Toad tries to grab the medallion,

but it's been in a fire, so it's burning hot, and so he screams and jumps out and puts his hand in the snow. I don't know why he jumps out the window. He just ran out the door, man. Yeah, he just runs out the window. He's driven mad. The thing's burning down. Karen Allen picks up the thing with a cloth and says to Indy that she's coming with him because they're partners.

And we follow the little, you know, the airplane on the map montage, which we saw to get to Nepal. Now leaves Nepal and goes to Egypt where they meet up with Sala, who is John Rhys Davies. And he says that the Nazis are digging out in the desert because they think they've found Tanis, the lost city. and goes to Egypt where they meet up with Sala, who is John Rhys Davies. And he says that the Nazis are digging out in the desert because they think they've found Tannis, the lost city out in the desert. And so is it the chase? Which chase are you referring to? Is it the first one where she gets kidnapped?

So the next point on my notes, so Marion at this point is in a basket being taken around by a couple of villains, right? Yeah. And then I just liked the bit where, this is another famous scene. Now that I've seen it, I know people are referencing it.

You've got the huge tour guide who's throwing the sword around, right? Getting ready for the showdown and indy just shoots him yeah which is great the story is that harrison ford was like had the flu or something it was incredibly sick and they got to the end of the day shooting that and and they didn't you know and he was like what if i just shoot him and we don't do a big fight scene and they said all right let's do that that's the the story anyway but it's a it's a it's a it's a really uh it's a funny moment that indy is just he doesn't he doesn't go in for that kind of showbiz stuff he's gonna whatever i can just shoot you unless there's a bullwhip involved unless there's a whip involved yeah he couldn't use the whip in that situation so he whipped him in the

eye or something he was tired well one of the things that happens with indy in this movie and and in general is that he um he gets beat up like i like that about him you root for him in part because he keeps getting beat up he gets he's you know he's punched he's bloody he's tired you get the sense he's really tired and he wants to go lie down but he can't because he's got to fight the nazis instead so you know at this point marion's put into the back of a truck full of explosives i was not expecting her to be blown up yeah it is a surprise when she's blown up and it's very sad I thought she was dead yeah well I mean the way it's edited it's very hard to imagine

how she wasn't put in the truck but we just hear her voice and see the baskets and it turns out she's in another basket and not that basket I guess but it's unclear how she gets out of the truck before it explodes but at that point Indy is essentially suicidal so he basically goes and finds Belloc his tormentor and and he's like

go ahead make my day we'll both go you know we'll both die and uh they save they save him and talk him out of it and uh convince him to go out into the desert and try to uh dig in the right place because we learned that the the Nazis are digging in the right place because we learned that the Nazis are digging in the wrong place because they've copied the headpiece from the burn on evil German totes hand. And the instructions on the backside of it say, take away a couple of cubits. And so they're digging in the wrong place. So they got to go. Jones has got to go to the well of souls and with his little stick and his little and the

little headpiece and uh and uh find where to dig properly to get this artifact so a couple of points that i had leading in between these two um points that we have here uh there's one where you know after marion has died and indy's sitting at a bar and he's drinking and there's a lot of close-up shots of him and it was at that moment that i decided that Chris Pratt should be the new Indiana Jones and they should reboot it um yeah that might happen well they've just announced Indy 5 and by all intents and purposes seems like it will have Harrison Ford in it so because it's Indiana Jones 5 but I feel like they could start again because chris pratt uh is perfect for the role in my opinion and looks enough like harrison ford uh i kind of wish that shia labeouf kind of wasn't

his son because chris pratt kind of is harrison ford's son uh you know they they look very very similar and i would i would quite like to see that because i am a big fan of chris pratt i i like his work i was surprised the monkey died even though the monkey is a traitor um a treacherous treacherous traitor he's a nazi monkey nazi monkey uh even though he is a nazi monkey he eats the dates like a silly nazi monkey and uh and then he dies and we you know and then when we're up to the point that you're at um harrison ford goes down into the the the pit like the map room i think the map room yeah and he does all of his archaeological stuff he points at things on

the floor and he brushes sand away and and he finds out you know where the the correct place needs to be um and then you know there's a hoo-ha-ha but he ends up getting out of there um and that's when marion is alive and i wrote in my notes she's alive because i was very excited about that and also happy um but then he leaves her there he's gonna untie her and then he realizes they'll know that he's there if he if he has her helps her escape so he says i'm gonna leave you here and that infuriates her quite right rightly so and he leaves to go get his prize that's smart though to me yeah you don't see that sort of stuff in movies no it is it is smart but i also love that it infuriates her

and yeah it's it's a that's a i like that i like that moment a lot that she's uh she's infuriated that he's gonna leave her there um and then there's the whole uh basically that they're at the point now they've they know where got to go, and they start digging. And then, you know, I don't know why they thought they wouldn't get caught. They find the Ark of the Covenant, right? It's a big desert. Yeah, but it's not far from the site. Yeah.

No, they can see them up there. They almost get away with it, but they don't get away with it. No, they can see him up there. They almost get away with it, but they don't get away with it. So they toss Indy and Marion into the pit after getting the Ark of the Covenant out. And, of course, it's full of snakes down there. Ah, so it's very dangerous. You go first. Yeah, there's a nice moment where Zala says, yes, you go first.

Yeah, I didn't like all the snakes in this bit. One of my favorite points, again, this enforces the craziness of using a whip. Marion burns Indy's leg thinking that the whip was a snake. Yes. It's like, see? Whip is silly. I do like the whip, by the way. I don't want to seem as anti-whip.

I just think that there are times where the whip works and times where the whip doesn't work. And then they kind of get out. And then there's like this horrific... So basically, Indy climbs up this big statue, knocks it down, creates a hole in the wall, right? And then there's this horrific scene, right? Another really... And this one's out of place. There's like desiccated bodies that have been buried on the other side of the wall. And then there's the snake that comes out of the skull. Why does that happen?

I can't get that image out of my mind. It's meant to be spooky and scary. But then pay no mind to that because even though this thing has been entombed for a thousand or two thousand years, through that wall is where there's people buried. And then through that is like a window and you can just crawl out. And somehow it's remained undiscovered all of this time.

But no time to think about that because it's going on a plane and we need to get to the plane. And so there's another set piece where they try to hijack the plane. need to get to the plane and so there's another set piece where he where they try to hijack the plane and there's a there's like a big nazi who's like a bare knuckle boxer kind of guy big bald nazi who's trying to to fight indy while uh they're kind of like stuck in the in the cockpit and there's a gas leak and an open flame and you you know the all of these things are happening at once where there's a ticking countdown and there's a guy who's trying to kill indy and there's the spinning marion is is mowing people down with a gun attached to the plane yeah a lot a lot going on there and then more blood and then the guy gets uh chopped up in the propeller blade which we don't see but we see

the we see him go ah and then we see like a sound effect. And there's like a stream of a splatter of blood. And of course, when they're fighting, there's blood all over them, right? They get busted open. Sure. Because he's getting beat up, which again is one of his charms is that he gets beat up. He's not one of these heroes who's like, I'm okay. Like in the Avengers, I fell out of a four-story building, but I'll walk

it off. Like Captain America says in that movie, if you die, walk it off. I like that line, by the way. Indiana Jones just gets the crap beat out of him, and you feel bad, because you know it hurts. He's not one of those people who, even though, yes, he does get up and he continues adventuring, you just get the sense that he is taking damage. He is really unhappy with his predicament, and I think think that's charming i think that's one of the things people

like about indy i just said he's not tough he's tough right but he's not invincible he's a professor exactly yeah yeah and he's i mean and that's why we root for him is that although he's tough um he is getting the crap beat out of him and reacting like we would presumably or at least like a human being would and being like really unhappy about it and later in the movie there's that scene where where karen allen asks where it hurt or it doesn't hurt like his elbow and his forehead there's very few parts that don't hurt on indiana jones and his lips and his lips. And his lips. Well, that's his move. That's his big move, yeah. That was a good move.

There's also more blood. They're then... Oh, I forgot one of my favorite lines. Truck chase. Yeah, it's a car chase. One of my favorite lines in the movie. I do not understand the delivery of this line. Right? And I won't be able to effectively deliver it, but I still find it funny.

So they get out of the plane or whatever. And then what's the guy's name? Their helper. What's his name? Sala. Sala. So Sala finds Indy and Marion in a tent. And he's like, oh, they're loading the Ark onto a truck.

And he's like, what truck? Like, I don't know why. He delivers it. Like, there's a truck here? Like, it was very peculiar. Yeah. And he's like, what truck? And I was like, I, there's a truck here? It was very peculiar. Yeah. And he's like, what truck? And I was like, I've never seen a truck before.

Very strange. Again, that's one of those transition moments where what the movie's really doing is propelling you to the next set piece. So he's just like, what truck? I must find it. And so then he does. And it was a great car chase. There is one moment in this where uh indy is in is in the driver's seat of the truck right he finds his way into the truck

and again more blood right he gets shot and like his arm gets shot splatters blood against the window um which again you don't usually see that in movies like they just get their arms i was like ah my arm is shot and you might see blood on the shirt but like splattered blood and then some of the craziest stunts i have ever seen in a movie i i feel like even avengers 2 quotes this um because there there there's a similar kind of thing with a battle on a on a vehicle and captain america keeps he's on like on a truck and he and he's he's moving around because altron is battling him and again no spoilers here but i felt like that movie was even quoting this same truck chase. Because Indy goes out the window. He gets shot.

He goes out the window. He loses purchase on the hood ornament. It's Mercedes, of course, because it's German. He goes under the truck with his whip and is dragged along well i mean there's yeah there's a whole documentary about it but you know they had a stuntman who was kind of attached and so he's dragged along under underneath and he's got his whip and he then he's being dragged behind and he pulls himself back and then he gets into the truck that way and comes back and it's this whole and meanwhile they're like then then then they're slamming against other other trucks and

the trucks are careering off into like giant ravines that shouldn't be there then they're slamming against other other trucks and the trucks are careering off into like giant ravines that shouldn't be there because they're just out in the desert um and uh yeah the whole the whole thing it's very it's a great it's a classic classic set piece action uh truck chase thing where indy is everywhere in that truck before finally um driving it away to the secret location that's been waiting for him that is everybody is ready to be in the open-air market. And so they drive into the little thing, and the doors close, and then everybody's there, and the Nazis go, what? Where did it go?

Yep. Then they're loaded onto a ship. Yes. Which is where Marion and Indy finally get to rest. And something, I do not understand why this happens, and I wonder if you're gonna know where i'm going with this uh marion is wearing a dress and indy tells her it's nice and she looks in the mirror and she flips the mirror over and it hits indy in the face and

then it goes out so he screams but there's a thunder there's thunder at the same time so masks scream and she's like what was that and he's like you say something i don't i don't know why that happened i don't know why that i mean is it just i i can see why they did it right they're like oh he's so beaten up he can't catch a break he's just getting hurt more but all of it was so weird yeah no it's it's it's kind of it's kind of wacky and of course he falls asleep this is their their big romantic moment he points out where she can kiss the parts that are not hurt and he points it at his lips and all that

and then he passes out because he's exhausted then the Nazis find them in the worst submarine of all time, I'll come to why that's my verdict in a moment they come aboard they get the Ark, which at this point has started to burn

out of the blocks right so you know there is evil magic in there or something or is it or is it good magic because it burns the uh burns the nazi symbols off the box oh yeah that's a good point yep god hates the nazis we know this um and uh then they take the box they take marion indy hides in the submarine and then swims across the submarine and gets on the roof of the submarine. The submarine, we then are treated to the submarine going across the globe, right, in a little map,

and then arrives at an island, and Indy's still on top of the submarine. So either Indiana Jones can hold his breath for days, or the submarine never submerged even though they used the periscope this is one of the great well and and they say in their movie german because it's the simplest it's it's like high school german which is dive the u-boat um that uh it's uh either either they don't die very far or like just an inch or i think the implication is that that there's probably a scene that we don't see and i think it might have even been storyboarded and like in the script where he um fights it's his fights his way into the sub and then like

is on the sub in the in that little portion in the conning tower and then and then gets out before but it's just waved away like suffice to say indy was fine and he had great adventures on the submarine and they didn't know he was there and now we're at the island in the mediterranean where this is all going to happen it is that it is a beautiful moment that's completely baffling yeah and then again uh i wasn't expecting Nazis in this movie. And then when there were Nazis, I was still not

expecting how much Nazi I was going to get. Like a giant Nazi base with big banners and stuff. More swastikas than I think I've seen in

any movie. Like, they're everywhere. Yeah. There was a lot of Nazi in this movie. Mm-hmm. And then they kind

of, they go through this thing and they end up bringing uh the ark to this cavern after indy you know tries to to blow it up or like he has an rpg like a rocket launcher and he's and they're like you're not gonna blow it up this is this is an archaeological marvel and he's like yeah you're right yeah and convincing right i i totally ball of that he's not gonna do it like he loves marion but he also loves archaeology um and then they you know they they basically tie them to this stick on top of a hill and then we can kind of get to the point where they open the yeah they do a ritual to open the ark and and belloc is dressed in Jewish ritual garb,

and the Germans don't like this Jewish ritual, but he's like, well, it's Hebrew Bible. This is what we do. And Belak is, you know, they're like, oh, the Fuhrer wants this, and Belak is very much like, yeah, yeah, I'll give it to him when I'm done with it, right, because Belak's always got his own plan. So they open the Ark.

What could go wrong? Everything. And there's sand in it, so it's not a problem. own plan and they so they open they open the ark what could go wrong everything everything sanded it so it's not it's not a problem and then the and this is i think a bold choice for this movie and i really like it which is uh what happens next is the wrath of god like you know if you're going to believe that there is a a covenant of the lost ark or lost ark of the covenant i mean and there's 10 commandments and all that is real then at that point you need to believe that the Hebrew Bible God is real. And in this movie, he is, and he's really pissed off at the Nazis,

and so these angels or demons or whatever they are appear. Shiverholes in everybody. All the Nazis die horribly. Yep. But Indy tells Mary to close her eyes, and so they're unaffected. I don't know why that is what helps, but closing your eyes apparently is all you need to do. Well, looking on the face of God, I think, is the idea. It's like it's too much, and it's going to destroy you.

Plus, all the Nazis are bad, I guess, and so they're going to get wiped out. I wonder if there's one Nazi soldier who really didn't want to be there and hated everything and was thinking of defecting. And, uh, and, uh, he did, he, maybe he got spared. He had something in his eye. I don't know. But yeah, so all the Nazis die and Indy and Marion are, are, uh, are safe. Um, the Ark is sealed again. And then that's it. We cut to Washington, D.C., where the FBI men are told

we're putting it in someplace safe where it's going to be looked after by top men, to which Indy says, who? Because Indy knows all the top men who would be looking at it. And they just say,

top men. And cut to a giant government warehouse where the Ark has been put in a box and is being filed with millions of other boxes just like it in this huge warehouse never to be seen again the end yep uh i like that you know that there's just this this big uh this big box like this big sort of storage facility with a bunch of boxes uh you know i i like that i like that a lot because it's just like oh there's all this stuff that happens that you don't know about james thompson says it's basically costco yeah you are going to come in maybe in costco um there

was a lot of for me of unexpected oh we missed you know face melting and head explosions of course that that happens uh with the the wrath of god um that's what that that happens there uh there were a lot of unexpected things in this movie like that seemed to be like a running thing for me there were just lots of things that happened that i didn't expect to happen they did happen um not no i'm not saying it's a bad thing it's just something and it was interesting to me considering that i felt like i knew this movie, how many things in it surprised me, even just the way it was made. So did you like it? They do not make movies like this anymore, Jason Snell.

That's true. Did you like it? I did like it. Oh, good. So I think of all of the films, so this is like the third, right? So I say all of, but the three films that I've watched the most, this is the one I have liked the most, but also the one that I had the most problems with. But I think that those two things go hand in hand.

And it's like quibbles, because I think, you know, Real Genius and Princess Bride, they were very easy. And Spinal Tap, they were very easy. And Spinal Tap, they're very easygoing movies, and I liked them a lot. But I appreciated them for what they were. I didn't look at them like I did of Indiana Jones,

being like, maybe this is one of the best movies ever made. I didn't think that that wasn't what I was thinking as I was watching the others. So when I put it at that level, when things happen in it that I find are strange, they kind of stick out to me more in my brain as weird things that are happening uh but this is such an incredible movie it's so it's just so good and like I was thinking you know when I thought to myself they don't make movies like this anymore I was thinking what movies can I think of that are like this um and i think

maybe the one that is most like it most recently for me is guardians of the galaxy yeah that's exactly right that's space indiana jones sort of yeah i felt and chris pratt in that is also like this like he's not he's not a super you know superhero kind of guy right he's just a regular guy who's doing super things and has issues and all of that that is sort of like just like how uh indy is you know he gets beat up and he's got problems and all of that you know this is um steven spielberg is considered probably one of the greatest directors in in in history certainly holly directors, right? I don't know whether he's in the top five or the top 20 or whatever. I would argue that this may be his best film. And that I think that just because it's an adventure movie and all of that, I think you

need to take it, you don't have to take it seriously, but I think it is, as a piece of filmmaking, it is staggering. It is the imagery in it the shadows throughout the lighting are are he uses shadows to tell so many parts of the story i've seen this movie like 50 times i think the script is fantastic it's lawrence casden um the the uh the direction is great and this is this is i think what happens when you have a world-class set of talent working on a film and taking it completely seriously even even though it is in this genre, an action-adventure genre. This is when you get a work like this. That is, you know, are there better, more serious movies?

Sure. But in terms of, including ones that Spielberg has made, but in terms of the whole package and the fact that this much attention was brought to bear on a movie like this, yeah, it is absolutely one of my all-time top five maybe top two three something like that films and um you know i think we're really privileged to have a director like steven spielberg make a movie like this because um he

brings his a-game to this one i think more than he did in some of the other um you know big tentpole action adventure spectaculars that he made in the future. I think this one is the, it's just, I think it's a great work of art. I actually also think it's very personal. And that's one of the reasons why it's so great is the reason there are all these Nazis in it is it is the, you know, it's the Jewish kid saying, you know, giving the middle finger to the Nazis. And, you know, later he made a much more serious meditation on the Holocaust with Schindler's list but you know here he's he's uh you know he's he's sticking it to the nazis and that and that that is motivating

spielberg and making the movie too so it's it's yeah it's i think i'm glad you liked it i do think it is um a a spectacular film achievement that just because it's a silly adventure movie you know it can't it can't be discounted as just being an amazing work of art on top of that like i can't remember the exact moment but it was about 20 minutes in and i was like oh this is really special um yeah and and i i look forward to watching it again uh because when i watch it again all of the things that that surprised me and i found peculiar i won't find surprising or peculiar anymore and I think it was just because I felt like I knew the movie going into the movie but

it actually turned out I didn't so when things happened in it that surprised me they were genuine surprises and it kind of shook what I thought the movie was but yeah I mean I want to watch it again and look out and pay more attention to some of the

cinematography and pay more attention to a lot of the scripts and stuff like that. Without just seeing the spectacle and trying to follow the plot and the story. Well, it holds up under a repeated viewing. Like I said, I've seen it maybe 50 times.

I'm always noticing other things. It doesn't get old for me. And I'd recommend at some point you listen to episode eight of The Incomparable, which is me and Dan Morin and John Gruber talking about Raiders of the Lost Ark for an hour. And, you know, it was, you know, we call out a lot of the little details that we appreciate. I would say for your next viewing, one of the things to watch is watch the shadows. Just watch the shadows. Yeah, see, i didn't catch that so it's crazy when you start noticing the shadows you know you just it's crazy like in that first scene uh how the shadows tell the story like indiana jones appears as a shadow that's the first time we see him and and then throughout the the

the way the shadows are used yeah i mean sp mean, Spielberg, it's a beautiful thing. And when I say The Last Crusade is a good movie, it is a good movie. But in my mind, this is on a whole other level from that. This is one of the best, if not the best, action-adventure movie, I think, ever. So, yeah. Yep, you've got a a fan you're doing well on this four for four these are all becoming

not total favorites but favorites you know like all of the three previous really I enjoy those movies I will watch all of them again and I like them a lot but I think Raiders has gone in there now as like a you need to watch this again so it can become one of your favorite movies.

Nice. That's how I feel about it. As I said, I found some things peculiar because it was a different time and maybe I'm used to different types of violence now. And funnily enough, that violence, whilst more brutal, is less gory in these types of movies it's it's uh yes this is this is now we're in the sort of cgi superhero

movie era and the types of effects you can do with that are different and they're not better or worse they're different and those stories that that people are telling today are different and the scale like you look at an avengers movie and so much of the violence in a movie like that is on a massive scale. It speaks to, I think, our fears about terrorism and things like that, where we talk about, you know, cities being destroyed and buildings coming down. And that imagery is just endlessly played in superhero movies. And Raiders of the Lost Ark is not about that. It's about, you know, it's about other stuff. It's about some personal violence and some horror and the wrath of God, right? And things like that, which are supernatural. There's a much bigger supernatural element to Raiders than to a superhero movie.

Yep. All right. Mike and the movie is successful again. Woo-hoo! Very, very. Genuinely, thank you for making me watch this movie. Yeah, I'm glad. Because I may have never seen it, because it gets to a point where it's like, you haven't seen this movie, you maybe will never see it. Do you know what I mean?

Because Indiana Jones, right? I'm 27 years old, and I've not seen Indiana Jones. Yeah. So I may have never seen the movie, so I'm so happy that this exists. That this section exists so I can find out

all about all these great movies. So yeah, I look forward to the next one. Alright. Right, I think that wraps it up for this week's episode of Upgrade. If you'd like to find the show notes for this week you can check online at relay.fm slash upgrade slash 36 if you'd like to find Mr. Jason Snell on the internet

you can find him over at sixcolors.com on Twitter he is at jsnell I am at imike upgrade is part of the fantastic RelayFM family you can find this show and many of our others over at Relay.FM.

Thanks again to our sponsors this week, Squarespace, MailRoute, Casper, and GoToMeeting. And we'll be back next time. Until then, say goodbye, Mr. Snell. Once again, Mike, we discover that there is nothing that you possess that I cannot take away.