Wait Wait... Don't Tell Me! - Del the Funky Homosapien

Episode Date: July 9, 2022

Del the Funky Homo Sapien, rapper and producer, answers three questions about mankind's ancient ancestors, neanderthals.Learn more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

From NPR and WBEZ Chicago, this is Wait, Wait, Don't Tell Me, the NPR News Quiz. Ooh, ah, check out all these fireworks. I'm your grand finale, Bill Curtis. And here is your host, a man who looks more and more like Uncle Sam every year, Peter Sagal. Thank you, Bill. It's that time of year where we celebrate the founding of our country by terrifying every dog in the neighborhood. And this year, we thought we'd celebrate with one of our favorite traditions, letting you enjoy some of our favorite moments from the past few months. As a lifelong fan of guitar solos and big hair, we were delighted to speak with Slash, a legendary guitarist for Guns and Roses, but he joined us in April of this year. Here's an extended version of our conversation.

Hi. Hi, how are you? I'm good. I'm glad to hear it. I got to ask, though, about that thing that we heard. Your first guitar was a one-string flamenco guitar? Yeah, it's sort of a long story. It was an acoustic guitar that was buried in one of the closets in my grandmother's apartment. And I knew absolutely nothing about guitars. So I started learning songs on the one string. And I learned Days of Confused. And then I learned a couple UFO songs and there

was an Aerosmith song I don't know whatever I could learn on one string I started doing so when when did you finally find out the guitars had more than one string well I mean I knew there was more strings I I there was a local music school the teacher over there his name was Robert Wolin still to this day one of the best guitar players i ever heard play but uh anyway so he taught me how to put the other five strings on oh he actually like said oh you know these go here slash yeah i mean you know okay i learned a lot of things about you this week i didn't know for one thing that your your your parents both of them were broadly speaking in show business your your mother was a costume designer, right? And she worked with some really cool people like David Bowie she designed for? My mom was a clothing designer, basically.

And so she did a lot of musicians in the 60s and 70s into the 80s. And then my dad designed album covers. And he worked for Asylum Records, which was David Geffen's first real record company. Wow. So you grew up around these amazing musicians. In Laurel Canyon, no less. So it was a really great, great... So you come home from school

and wave to Joni Mitchell up on your balcony? No, my dad did her album covers and Joni was like a family friend and my mom did her clothes and I went to Joni's sessions and all kinds of stuff did did you ever did your mother ever like design one of your onstage costumes because that would make her very proud no she did make me one of the best pairs of leather pants I ever had um which they were really really cool and there's there's there's a lot of pictures out there from me back in the day wearing them.

I wish I still had them, but I traded them with this guy for stuff. It's ridiculous. You traded away the leather pants your mom made you? Yeah, but you gotta have it.

That's what happens, kids. I've heard stories about hitting bottom, but that's a new one. Just say no to drugs. It's like, hi, I'm Slash, and I knew I was in trouble when I traded away my leather pants that my mom made me. We've got to ask, if we're talking costumes, we've got to ask about the hat, which has become your trademark. I've heard you made that hat, or you designed it. Back in the day,

Guns, I think, was playing at the Whiskey in 1985. I always wore hats. That was always the complete thing, to have a lid of some sort. We were playing the show at the Whiskey, and I didn't have any money or

anything. So I went down to Melrose and, uh, and went into this store and saw that top hat. I thought, oh, that's cool. You know, and it was really crowded in there and I just picked it up and walked out. And then I went next door and I found a concho belt in there, grabbed that. And then I went back to the apartment where Axel and I were staying and I put the concho belt, cut it up and put it around the hat and wore it that night.

And it just became a thing, you know, it became like, like, uh, almost like my alter ego. Like I could hide in that thing. Yeah. I mean, it's fine. It's kind of amazing, but kind of cool that like the single most famous piece of headwear and rock and roll was stolen. Cause of course that's more rock and roll than like, you know it at target i guess yeah well yeah i don't think we had target you know one of the things one of the things i'm curious about is you you and your band became such so iconic i just can't i don't know i can't imagine what it's like like like if you ever

walk into like a music store do you know that some idiot is going to be in the corner just butchering one of your songs? It's funny, though, because I used to work at a music store at one time. And so I do know what that's like for others to have guys come in, sit down on an amp and plug in and play any number of Zeppelin or Van Halen songs. I've been through that. and play any number of Zeppelin or Van Halen songs. I've been through that. But I've never actually seen anybody play a Guns N' Roses song in a music store, myself personally, but I've heard that that happens. I'm sure it does.

Have you ever been in a Whole Foods and realized that the instrumental music is a sweet child of mine? That happens a lot. Really? There's a lot of, yeah, Muzak versions of songs, of our songs. But yeah, I've heard it in different places. And it takes you about five seconds to recognize what it is. Yeah. We understand you have some enthusiasms outside of came out i thought this is the greatest game um and i did i got involved with them i actually recorded some music for them and and i used to go out to finland and hang out angry birds a fun thing that was happening and i'm just

going to assume i don't know much about the rock and roll lifestyle but you can pretty much do anything you want and you're like there's this game in my phone where you throw birds at pigs. And I want to hang out with the guys who do that. Well, I thought the idea and the, the, the graphics were really, really original and great.

And so the fact that they were in Finland, which is where we were playing, I had to go check it out. Sure. Well, if you're in Finland anyway, absolutely. Are there any games, as you say, if you're in Finland anyway, absolutely.

Are there any games, as you say, that was a little while ago, Angry Birds is heyday. Are there any games you're really into now? No, no. It was Angry Birds. And then, and then I sort of, you know, that went away and I just got sick of being addicted to my phone. Sure.

Once you're angry at the birds, that's when it's time to stop yeah hey this is great but we have business to do slash we have invited you here to this time play a game we're calling here she is miss america what do you ask slash about well obviously sashes namely the sashes worn by beauty queens. We're going to ask you three questions about beauty pageants of various kinds. Get two right, you'll win the prize. For one of our listeners, the voice of anyone they may choose from our show on their voicemail, Bill, who is Slash playing for? Pat Herman of Los Angeles, California. All right. Here's your first question. Winners of the Miss South Carolina beauty pageant back in the 50s and 60s, in addition to the sash and the crown, also often won the privilege of doing what? A, serving as governor for any one day of their choosing during their year-long reign.

B, getting to walk on the grass anywhere, even if the sign says stay off the grass. Or C, getting to marry Senator Strom Thurmond. The only one that sounds even realistic is the first one. I mean, I'd feel sorry for the grass. And marrying a senator, that's just not happening. I couldn't be right. Except for South Carolina. So that's probably the right answer.

In fact, it is the right answer. Strom Thurmond married two different Miss South Carolinas in his lengthy career. Oh, so that's a joke. Okay. No, it's, yeah, it's sort of, but it did happen. Strom Thurmond married two different Miss South Carolinas who were both 22 years old at the time. And he did that 20 years apart. He was, he got around old Strom. All right. If, if you're not into miss America, there are other titles. A pageant contestant can vie for including which of these a miss neurotoxin B America's greatest cyber Ninja or C the armpit queen.

And this is a real thing. You're asking real thing. One of these things, only one actually happens every year. I'll have to go with the cyber Ninja, the America's greatest real thing. You're asking. It's a real thing. One of these things, only one, actually happens every year. I'll have to go with the Cyber Ninja. The America's greatest Cyber Ninja? I don't know what the f*** I'm doing. I'm just going.

Slash, neither do we. And yet, here we are. Yeah, so then I have to go for the first one because if it's the armpit thing, I'm just, I'm not playing anymore. Well, Slash, it's been great having you in the show because it is in fact the armpit queen there's a town called battle mountain nevada and it was named the armpit of america by jean weingarten of the washington post officially so they decided to embrace it all right people sometimes criticize pageants beauty pageants for just encouraging women to care about their looks.

Well, in Venezuela, they kind of embrace that. They hold an annual pageant to honor what? A, the best plastic surgery. B, the most attractive Barbie doll. Or C, the blondest blonde. Most attractive Barbie doll. You're right. You nailed it.

Did you do it by reverse psychology, thinking like one can't be? It is true. They have a Miss Barbie Doll contest. People dress up their Barbie dolls. They have a very tiny stage in Caracas, Venezuela every year. Bill, how did Slash do in our quiz? Got two out of three, so he is a winner. Squeezed one in.

Absolutely. That's Bill. He decides. You win. Congratulations. Slash's latest album is Four. Slash, thank you so much for joining us. You thrilled us all by sharing some time.

Thank you, man. It's been really fun and different talking to you guys. Sometimes we record more material than we have time to broadcast. Here's a question from March about an unusual place to get your coffee. Maz, this week we learned about a coffee shop in Bristol, England. It's unique for being one of the few cafes we've ever heard of to open up in an old what? Mortuary.

No. Cemetery No Well, I'll give you You're on this thing about cemeteries And you're right in that this too is a place Where everybody ultimately goes The bathroom

Yes It's built in what is quite a beautiful Decommissioned public restroom There in Bristol, England Yeah And, you know, it's for everybody who's ever walked into

one of those and goes, hmm, what's brewing in here? Sure, converting an old bathroom into a cafe might not sound ideal, but it does mean you never have to ask for the bathroom key again.

Wow. But you do need a four-digit code to get in the front door. Exactly, yeah. When we come back, a never-before-heard bluff the listener game, and Oakland rap legend Del the Funky Homo Sapien

gets quizzed about other hominids. We'll be back in a minute with more Wait, Wait, Don't Tell Me from NPR. From NPR and WBEZ Chicago, this is Wait, Wait, Don't Tell Me, the NPR News Quiz. I'm Bill Curtis, and here is your host who keeps Independence Day in his own fashion and prays you keep it in yours, Peter Sagal. Thank you, Bill.

This week we are revisiting some things you've already enjoyed once, but also some things you've never heard before. When we visited San Francisco in May, we taped a second show with panelists Karen Shee, Tom Papa, and Adam Felber, and special guest, legendary Oakland rapper, Del the Funky Homo Sapien. Here are some of the highlights from that show. Hi, you were on Wait, Wait, Don't Tell Me. Hi, this is Will in Palm Springs, California. Hey, Will, how are you? I'm great in air conditioning. As I understand, you'd have to be. What do you do there in Palm Springs? I'm a personal trainer, but I'm getting ready to start law school in fall at 57 years old. At 57 years old. All right. Right?

A lot of questions. Are you prepared for the difference of reaction you're going to get when you tell people at a party you're a lawyer rather than you're a personal trainer? I am not prepared for that. That's a great question. Yeah, it's not going to be good. You're not going to enjoy it. I'm just telling you. All right, I'm going to ask you great question. Yeah, it's not going to be good. You're not going to enjoy it. I'm just telling you. All right, I'm going to ask you a question.

I have on occasion made use and profitable use of a personal trainer. When you guys say, you're doing great, that was great, are you telling the truth? Absolutely not. Well, all right, well. Welcome to the show. You, of course, are going to play the game in which you have to tell truth from fiction. Bill, what is Will's topic? Visit Iceland. Iceland

has so much to offer visitors like ice and land. Now Iceland is enticing tourists with something new to convince them to come. Our panel is going to tell you about it. Pick the one who's telling the truth, and you will win our prize,

the weight weighter of your choice, on your voicemail. Are you ready to play? I'm so excited, yes. Okay, clearly ready. First, let's hear from Adam Felber. It's no secret that with its tiny population, Icelanders know everybody and their cousin, because everybody is their cousin, because everybody

is their cousin. And that lack of genetic diversity is leading to some very real health concerns. But now there's a solution, a brand new tourist campaign called Iceland, pay your way with DNA. Yes, men, for the low, low price of a donation of a few of your healthy spermatozoas, the government of Iceland will pay your airfare, foot your hotel bill, and offer other perks. Once you arrive, you'll attend a cheekily named harvest festival with free food and drinks and a clever agrarian theme, which I'm sure will delight any dude who hasn't ever seen Midsommar or Wicker Man. Says pay your way with DNA chairwoman Katrin Arnundsson. Promoting a healthy and diverse Icelandic gene pool

doesn't have to be so clinical. We think of it as 23 and yippee! Pay your way with DNA, a program to encourage men to come to Iceland and leave something of theirs behind. Your next story of an Icelandic tourist trap comes from Karen Chee. Visitors to Iceland go there to get off the grid to witness its otherworldly natural landscape and otherworldly natural Björk. So if you're traveling there, you probably don't want to be looking at your email the whole time. And while you could use a traditional out-of-office

message, Iceland is offering tourists the chance to, quote, outhorse their email. Again, that's not outsource. That's literally the word outhorse. Outhorse is a service that has an actual Icelandic horse answer your emails for you. So now if your boss emails you saying, hey, Karen, did you finish that draft I asked you for a week ago? Your horse can reply, nay. You might be wondering, how does this work? As well as, uh, what? So, well, the people who are actually behind OutHorse built a giant computer keyboard that actual horses walk across to type on.

This is true. So the actual messages are more like L-K-D-A-J-A-S-W-J. OutHorsing your email while you're in Iceland, they'll have a horse, an actual horse, answer your email for you. Your last story of a new way to welcome you to Iceland comes from Tom Papa. Iceland has just introduced

their latest tourist attraction, the Icelandic Volcano Experience, a guaranteed visit to an erupting volcano. Iceland has 32 active volcanic systems, like the notorious Ægfjallajökull in 2010, which stopped all air traffic over Europe for several days

by spewing ash in the air, and Fagradalskavall that erupted in 2021. However, when these volcanoes are dormant, they can be as exciting as looking at a pile of cold haddock. Icelandic officials solved this problem by creating guided tours that simulate the harrowing experience of encountering an angry lava-spewing mountain. Tourists are first driven out to the trailhead in speeding ash-covered jeeps inspired by the fun-loving American tourist film Jurassic Park. Dressed in heat-repelling asbestos raincoats, each guest is given a pair of goggles and a metal lava bucket in hopes of

bringing home a volcanic souvenir. For the main attraction, these lava junkies are strapped into a harness and lowered into a giant vat of khodsopa, the classic Icelandic lamb soup. As a parting gift, tourists can even name their own volcano by selecting 50 random letters from the Icelandic alphabet and being forced to pronounce whatever word they make. All right. One of these is a plan to entice you

to give up your comfortable life in Palm Springs and go to Iceland. Is it, from Adam Felber, pay your way with DNA, in which they're inviting men to come over and sort of widen the gene pool. From Karen Chee, outhorse your email while they promise they will have an actual horse on an actual keyboard

answer your email for you so you can enjoy Iceland's natural beauty. Or from Tom Papa, the Icelandic volcano experience where you are going to see a live volcano, whether there's one or not. Which of these is the real story of the Icelandic tourist campaign?

I'm going to go with the outhorse. You're going to go with the outhorse. Karen's story, outhorse your email. Yeah. Alright. Well, to find out the correct answer, let's hear an advertisement for the real story. Outhorse your email. A revolutionary service where Icelandic

horses write real out-of-office replies so you can relax. Yes, you were right. You picked Karen's story. That was the real one. Outer air for email. Real program. Sign up.

Horses will answer your email while you enjoy Iceland. Thank you so much, and good luck to you on your new career. Thank you so much, Peter. Take care. Thanks, everybody. I'm going to write you a letter. here. Thank you so much, Peter. Take care. Thanks, everybody. And now the game where we remind somebody what they missed when they were busy doing something else. If there is a single king of the rap scene in Oakland, it is Del, the funky homo sapien, who's been a part of hieroglyphics and other groups and collectives performed with gorillas. Plus, he has created his own music with

dozens of collaborators for more than 30 years. We are delighted he joins us you. So, first of all, Oakland, Oakland born, Oakland raised, right? Yep. Yeah. East Oakland. Yep. And they, they actually have, I mentioned this earlier, they have a festival for your group hieroglyphics, like higher day, they call it, right? In September every year. Yep. Which must be cool to grow up in a town and then now they have a festival for you every year. You know what? I appreciate it a lot. I do.

That feels good. Growing up in the town, I'm like, oh, okay, I guess I did something for myself. Yeah. That's true. If I'm not mistaken, you got your start in recording, the recording industry. You wrote songs for your cousin who happens to be Ice Cube.

Yeah, but let me just make it clear, though. Please, correct me. I wrote songs for Yo-Yo and I wrote songs for Cube, but they don't need it. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? We did interview Ice Cube in the show a while back, and he didn't mention you, so I guess. Yeah, see?

So there you go. Yeah. Now, what's funny is, so you knew those guys. You were writing for those guys. They were, like, in Southern California. West Coast Rap, they called it. And then I looked at, I went back, and I looked at one of your first records.

And I looked at some of your verses on a song. Get your lazy butt off my couch. It seems nowadays friends step to me bogus and end up on my couch at night without notice. It's cool to have a friend over every now and then, but I got to have my space and I don't want to see their face. Which I want to say, I did not grow up in the mean streets. I grew up in the not very mean suburbs. And finally, to find hip hop I can relate to was really something. Well, you know what? Actually, that song, you know, Gangsta wrote that song, right? So Gangsta was in jail at the time, so he couldn't do the song so DJ

Poole helped produce my first album so he was like yo Dil you should do that song sleeping on my couch. I was like okay okay is it cool yeah yeah yeah glad that you did that so shout out to Gangsta Man because that was really his concept. Right so you're telling me that the guy who wanted the song about getting his lazy friends off their couch couldn't do the song because he was actually in jail. Okay. You've collaborated with a lot of people. You did a record with a chef once who appeared in your record. I mean, who's the strangest person, the most unexpected person you've collaborated with?

The most unexpected person I've collaborated with? That's a good question. I don't know. Gorillaz probably was the most unexpected because nobody really expected that to do nothing. Yeah, so for people who don't know, so Gorillaz is this collective out of England, right? Yeah.

And they're like these guys, and their initial idea was you'd never see us. We'd just see these cartoon characters we created. And you actually do the verse on probably their biggest hit out of the first album, Clint Eastwood, right? And that's like the thing that most people know you for. Yeah, that song was such a huge hit. There was a lot of people that was like,

yo, Del, I heard your new song on the radio. What are you talking about? You know, that song is playing on the radio all the time. What song is you talking about with this something about? gorillas and I'm like They can't be talking about that song So you like did this thing you drop these verses for these guys? I said we want did it and it was done right? I'm just glad to be a part of it

It was you know say I'm glad Dan the Automator produced it pretty much So I'm just glad the damn gave me the chance to do that because really it was his foresight. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? The song was already done. I guess he didn't approve of the lyrics. He had me at the studio. He knew I could whip up something in like 30 minutes.

So he's like, hey, Del, before I take you home, you think you could just come redo this real quick? I'm like, take me home you think you could just come you do this real quick. I'm like take me home No, I'm done with what I'm in here to do so that's like your biggest your biggest popular hit you made because you just wanted The ride home pretty much It's amazing how like incentives make art at what age did the voice kick in like what voice are you talking about this this great you've got a great distinct voice when you were a kid reading spider-man was probably like hey i'm gonna write a hit song you know what i i was really into comic books and really into cartoons i thought wanted to be a cartoonist. I guess I am a cartoonist to an extent.

So, what was your question? Oh, my voice. Cartoons, basically. So you were doing like cartoon voices? Yeah, like doing, like, blow me down. That's amazing. Well, Del, we have asked you here to play a game we're calling...

Gary the Funky Neanderthal. Ah, that's how it works. So you're Del the Funky Homo Sapiens. We've discussed that. We figured we would ask you about mankind's ancient ancestors, Neanderthals and others. Answer two out of three questions about early humans, and you'll win a prize for one of our listeners, the voice of anyone they may choose in their voicemail. Bill, who is Del the funky homo sapiens playing for? Suzanne U of Stanford, California. All right.

Ready to do this? Okay. So, our techniques these days for researching prehistoric humans and other fossils have improved over the years. What was an early method for paleontologists? A, if you find a fossilized skull, put a hat on it. And if it looks nice, it's a human because apes look dumb in hats. B, if you find a fossil, you don't know what it is, lick it. And if it sticks to your tongue, it's a caveman. Or C, give a bone to a dog.

And if the dog doesn't eat it, it's a human because a dog just wouldn't do that. C. You're going to go with C. Like you find a bone in some historic site and you're like, hmm, could this be a human bone? Here, Rover. You toss the bone to the dog.

And if the dog's like, no, I can't do that, it's a human. Right. No, it was actually B, you lick it. Oh, okay. oh okay because you know what i was just about to say that that happened if i if i urged you to stay and give it another try in exchange for a ride home you would have got it all right still got two more chances the image of a caveman as this dumb, unthinking brute is really due to the person who first identified the fossils of an early human species, the Neanderthals. Why did he assume these ancient peoples were dumb? Was it A, the remains were found in a cave with a math problem on the wall and it was

solved incorrectly. He determined the cause of death of the specimen was he was staring up into a rainstorm with his mouth open, or C, he just thought they looked dumb. C, he just thought they looked dumb. They did. The Neanderthals, the famous Brow Ridge, and this 19th century paleontologist who figured out there were another kind of human looked at them and said, well, they must have been dumb. Look at them. And that's why we think cavemen were dumb. All right, your last question. If you get this right, you win for one of our listeners. Another mystery about early humans is why we left our ape cousins up in the trees and came down to live on the ground. Which of these is a leading theory

to explain that? A, the apes just couldn't stand us and threw us out. B, one early human somewhere dropped his lunch, went down to get it, looked around and said, hey, it's pretty nice down here. Or C, they couldn't get a good night's sleep because they kept falling out of the tree branches. they couldn't get a good night's sleep because they kept falling out of the tree branches. Oh, man. B. So you're thinking, like, the paleontologists have decided that, like, one early hominid up in a tree eating an early hominid sandwich.

You're thinking he, like, dropped his sandwich. He's like, ah, damn it. Climbs down out of the tree, picks up his sandwich, looks around and goes, wait a minute. He's giving you every opportunity to get different.

I'm giving you every opportunity to change your mind. And then he'll take you home. Okay, C. It is C. Oh! Yes. It is C. Oh! Yes.

It turns out we humans sleep more deeply but for a briefer time than any other primate or large mammal. And the theory is that we came down out of the trees because we kept falling out and waking up. Oh, my God. There you are. See? It makes sense, doesn't it? Shoof is funnier than real life. There you go, man.

That is what this show is based on. Bill, how did Del do in our quiz? Two out of three. Del, you know your species. You did it well. Del, the funky homo sapiens, everybody. Del, thank you so much for joining us. Thank you.

What a pleasure to have you. You too. Appreciate it. joining us. Thank you. What a pleasure to have you. When we come back, our panelists, as you've never heard them before, and an intrepid explorer who discovered the refuse left behind by another intrepid explorer. We'll be back in a minute with more Wait, Wait, Don't Tell Me from NPR. Wait, wait, don't tell me. From NPR. Support for NPR and the following message comes from GoodRx.

Laughter may be the best medicine, but there's nothing funny about overpaying for prescriptions. GoodRx compares prescription prices at local pharmacies and can save you up to 80%. For simple, smart savings on your prescriptions, visit GoodRx.com. GoodRx is not insurance, but can be used instead of insurance, Medicare, and Medicaid. In 2021, GoodRx users saved 81% on retail prescription prices. From NPR and WBEZ Chicago, this is Wait, Wait, Don't Tell Me, the NPR News Quiz. I'm Bill Curtis, and here's your host, who thinks we should be celebrating our nation's birthday on June 21st, because that's the day the Constitution was ratified. Peter Sagal. Thanks, Bill. While the country celebrates its 246th birthday,

we're celebrating a much narrower band of American history, that is, things we did on this show during the last six months or so. Hey, if it happened in the past, it counts as history. Let's start with some never-before-heard questions for our panelists. Tom, according to AccuWeather.com, an asteroid will pass by Earth this weekend that AccuWeather tells us is the size of what? Rhode Island. No.

The Empire State Building. No. Peter Segal. No. The size of... Well, this caught our eye because it was in a... I mean, we've all, you know, like these metaphorical units of measure. It's as big as the Empire State Building.

This used one we hadn't seen before. We hadn't seen this one before because it's unusual. Right. Because of its size. Because of its size. These things, the units that were used are known for being tall. It's actually more like long, long-necked specifically. Oh, a giraffe.

Yes. This asteroid is the size of 350 giraffes. Oh. 350 giraffes. Oh, 350 giraffes. Yes, yes. It's called Asteroid 7335. It will pass within two and a half million miles of the Earth, which to NASA is dangerous, but not dangerous like put Ben Affleck on a spaceship dangerous.

And this meteorologist telling us about this asteroid tried to put it in like non-threatening terms And they explained that this asteroid is as tall just so we could picture it. Oh, tall! Yeah, as 350 giraffes. Oh, and it's just gonna come by and eat a little the Amazon and keep going. Yes exactly Adorably, yeah But the idea of using a giraffe as a measurement of height Adorably, yeah. But the idea of using a giraffe as a measurement of height stacked on each other. Oh, they're stacked.

What? They're stacked. They're stacked. Head to foot. I was going to say that 350 giraffes are roughly the same size. Oh, stack, not stack. Are the... Right. So it's 350 voluptuous giraffes.

This is a serious science thing, Tom. Try to be dignified. Hey, 350 stacked giraffes is serious science. So the idea is like, okay, how are they stacked? Is one giraffe standing on the head of the other giraffe with tiny little hooves all together? No, he couldn't do it. He'd have to stand on the back,

but then you're talking about half-sized giraffes, so it's like 700 giraffes stacked up. Right, and not to mention, what about the weight on the bottom giraffe? That's true. Right? I mean, they've got skinny legs, so I don't know if the bottom giraffe

is going to be able to hold up the stack. I've never managed to stack more than like three or four giraffes. Well, anyway, the point is astrophysics is hard. Karen, a paleontologist at UC Berkeley may have solved one of the great mysteries pertaining to the Tyrannosaurus rex. What is it? How short its arms were.

Exactly right, Karen. Yes. Wow. Think about it. It's really weird. You've got this terrifying monster with a head the size of a Buick filled with knives, and it's got tiny little toddler arms.

Yeah. Yeah. Why did the T-Rex have to go through life without being able to scroll on a phone? Yeah. Right? Those are the dream proportions. I know. Really?

You think? Yeah, for a nice man. Yeah. You find that you're looking for a guy who's tall, has an enormous head. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. He's kind of a snout. I mean, size doesn't matter. And tiny little arms like this.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Why? Why, Karen? Just for the intimate hugs. If you're lucky, he might be able to just touch your elbows at the same time. See what I mean? Yeah. I don't think that's hugging that's happening.

Don't step on her dreams. Thank you. Thank you. I was't think that's hugging is happening. Don't step on her dreams. Thank you. I was hoping someone would stand up for me. You're going to find that tiny-armed, giant-headed man someday. That sounds weirdly like a threat. This Halloween, Karen is going to see some kid wearing that inflatable T-Rex costume

and you're going to be like, finally. Yeah. I know your mother's in the audience. She's probably thinking, you know, at this point, I'll take it. Yeah, she's like, as long as it's any person, if you'll have her. The hypothesis comes from Dr. Kevin Padian of Berkeley. So the thesis is that now that we know

that Tyrannosaurus is hunted in packs, they had feeding frenzies when they brought down their prey, and the advantage of short arms is they don't get accidentally bitten while they're all trying to eat the same thing at the same time. Sounds really dumb. No, it's... Now, hold on. If you don't like that one, here is another theory, and this, according to Dr. Padian, was actually presented at a serious conference discussing these abstruse topics of paleontology, this is another theory for why their arms are so short.

They're perfect for sneaking up on triceratopses and tipping them over. Whoa! That's right. Triceratops tipping. That's the theory. And the evidence for the theory is all these fossils of adolescent T. rexes found next to fossilized six packs of old Milwaukee beer.

It's so sad that you would tip over a dinosaur with your friends all drunk and then not be able to high-five each other. Adam. Adam. It was only five months ago that Winnie the Pooh entered the public domain, so anybody now can use the characters. And already, filming has wrapped on a new adaptation, remaking the Winnie the Pooh story in what genre?

Horror. Yes, Adam! I have seen a picture. It is disturbing. It is disturbing. It's an upcoming slasher film called Winnie the Pooh, colon, Blood and Honey. And it is now getting fast-tracked for wide release

after the movie stills, one of which Adam saw, were put on the internet. Everybody went nuts for them, especially this really creepy shot of Pooh and Piglet sneaking up on a woman relaxing in a hot tub. Menace in their eyes. This will be either the very worst Winnie the Pooh movie ever, or the best. Menace in their eyes. This will be either the very worst Winnie the Pooh movie ever

or the best. There is no middle ground. Wow. According to the writer-director, I'm sure you're all curious, the movie features Pooh and Piglet going on a bloodthirsty rampage

after Christopher Robin goes off to college and abandons them without food. So if you thought it was freaky when like Winnie the Pooh got his head stuck

in the honey jar, wait till he sticks it into your rib cage. I mean, I will say like, I know Winnie the Pooh is very cute, but like as a woman, if there were a man walking around a forest without any pants on, I would be scared. What if he had tiny little arms? Oh, I'm in, I'm in, I'm in. Sit down next to me. I was going to put on my pants, but I couldn't reach them. Finally, we looked into one of the most exciting discoveries in recent years, how a group of explorers found the wreck of Sir Ernest Shackleton's ship, the Endurance, beneath the Antarctic ice.

We spoke to Dan Snow, a broadcaster and historian who accompanied the expedition. Peter asked him how he got into the explorer business. I grew up watching those amazing TV shows where they, the early days, I guess, of TV history, where they just went, you know what, we're going to go, we're going to recreate the great journey of X, or Cortez, or Alexander the Great. So I've spent my whole career trying to replicate those early pioneers of broadcasting. This is by far the biggest. This was an expedition of 50 crew members and 50 scientists and expedition members. So 100 people all sailing from Cape Town, 10 days through the Southern Ocean, gigantic storms, very exciting. They

delivered. The Southern Ocean delivered nicely. Then we got down to the Weddell Sea, choked with sea ice, Antarctic sea ice, then found this shipwreck 3,000 meters down the seabed below. We got through COVID. We got through geopolitical disharmony. And we actually found the wreck as well, which is unbelievable. That's always nice when that pays off. I don't – just judging from the reaction to the news of the discovery, I just don't think that in America we appreciate how admired – I once read that he was among the ten most admired Britons in history. Ernest Shackleton was. Because in this, despite the fact that he was technically the 10 most admired Britons in history, Ernest Shackleton was. Because in this, despite the fact

that he was technically a failure, right? He went on four expeditions to the Antarctic. He failed absolutely all four of them. He died starting out, which is not really his fault, but starting out on the fourth one. He is, we love heroic failures here in the UK. And he was the ultimate heroic failure. And it's because the point is his heroism shines

when it's because everything goes wrong that you become a hero. It's easy to be a hero when everything's great. It's like, it's not, I don't find it super exciting. Getting super pumped about Tom Brady or Wayne Gretzky. Like you guys are just amazing, right? But Shackleton, he messed up. He screwed up.

Like it all went wrong all the time. And when it went wrong, he messed up. He screwed up. Like it all went wrong all the time. And when it went wrong, he showed greatness. He showed toughness and spirit and he showed compassion. He got everyone. And that's why we love him in the UK. So very briefly, he had the idea of sailing his ship, the Endurance, to Antarctica to eventually get to the South Pole. I assume that's what he wanted to do. And instead, they got stuck in the sea ice, frozen in.

So now more than 100 years later, you guys set out to find the ship. How did you know where it was? Well, there was a very brilliant New Zealand captain of endurance who was Shackleton's kind of number two called Frank Worsley. He was taking like celestial navigation readings every day on the ice. As the ship was crunched in the ice, they were living on a camp beside the ship. And then when it eventually sank through the ice, he was taking readings.

Whenever he saw the sun, which is not very often, he got his sextant out and he did a lat long. He used the stars and the moon, everything he could use. And he was brilliant. And we ended up, so he fixed this position and we found it around four and a half miles away from where he fixed that position. Unbelievable.

And bear in mind. Unbelievably far away or unbelievably close? I think it's unbelievably close, right? All right. You're using kind of Celestia. It's a tough crowd. Jeepers. We don't know anything about this.

Four miles away and you're using the old sextant method. And by the way, it's cloudy. So he's only doing the day after it sank now. But every day the ice is moving. You don't know where it's moving, but it's on a kind of current. It looks like it's static, but it's moving. So you could have moved 12, even 20 miles over 24 hours. So he had to guess where the ship had been when it sank. And he did that so brilliantly that it was within four miles from where we actually found it. Okay, I have a question then. We're talking about brilliance, but didn't they anticipate in advance that the ship would get surrounded by ice? They were not told it was icy, Roxanne. That was a major failing on

the planning part. Roxanne, you raised a very important point here. And this is the thing about Shackleton, is he was completely useless in many respects. And this is why he's a hero for our time. This is why he's a relatable hero. So Shackleton was hopeless at raising money. He was a hopeless husband. He was a hopeless planner. His expeditions were wildly underprepared. The Norwegian whalers on South Georgia, this island down there near the Antarctic, they said, do not go into the Weddell Sea this year because it is full of ice. He said, I'm not listening to you Norwegians who know all about it and have all your local knowledge. I'm going to overrule you and I'm going to go to the Weddell Sea anyway. So he needed to be brilliant because he kept getting his crews in these terrible situations, right?

So his great skill in life was saving other people from his utter lack of skill. There it is. That's exactly right. I'm just going to write that down and steal it. So I have a lot of practical questions. So you said that it was four and a half miles away, and you said it was 3,000 meters down. Translating that into American, that's way deep. Yeah, 10,000 feet. And now that you have found this long-sought ship, which no one ever thought would ever see again, what are we going to do with it? We're going to do absolutely nothing with it. That's the excitement, isn't it? I mean,

we're going to marvel at it. But isn't isn't it amazing you're right your first point is these ships would sink beneath the sea 10 000 feet a hundred years ago you think well that's that that story's over now because of technology that story is that story's beginning it's got another chapter that the ship's being beautifully well preserved we're not allowed to touch anything nor would we wish to we but but the amazing we did take laser scans to within quarter-inch resolution. So we've got a 3D model of that. There are shoes. There are boots.

There is a flare gun on the deck. All of that is going to be brought to life. This ship is going to become alive, I think, like no other shipwreck on the planet. Well, Dan Snow, it is really fascinating to hear about this expedition, which I thought was really cool. But we have, in fact, as we must, we've asked you here to play a game that this time we're calling... I've just

discovered Bucky Ched. So you helped discover the endurance at the bottom of the Antarctic Sea, but we discovered Bucky Ched at the bottom of the just-released lineup of the Lollapalooza Music Festival 2022. So we're going to ask you three questions about Bucky Ched and other acts you can discover at Lolla this summer here in Chicago. Answer two

out of three of them correctly, you will win our prize for one of our listeners, the voice of anyone they might choose on our show for their voicemail. Bill, who is adventurer slash presenter Dan Snow playing for? Emily Hunter of Phoenix, Arizona. All right. You ready for this? Yeah, I love Phoenix. Yeah. Here's your first question.

Very basic question. Who or what, exactly, is Bucky Ched? Is it A, a backup goalie for the Los Angeles Kings hockey team who moonlights as a DJ, B, a classical music ensemble that only plays Sex Pistols covers, or C, a computer running an AI program that generates random folk songs. Random word generator there. I think it is A? A, yes, it is A. Very good.

Oh, my goodness. It's weird. 2022 is my year. I know, yes. But it's also very weird to hear a great Oxbridge accent express uncertainty, right? That's not how it usually works. Listen, overconfident Oxbridge men is what got us all into this mess. It's true.

That's what got Jackal stuck in the ice for nine months. It's what gave us Boris Johnson. Never listen to them. Never listen. If you hear this in the ice for nine months. Exactly. It's what gave us Boris Johnson. Never listen to it. Never listen. If you hear this voice, disregard anything it says. Exactly. Here's your next question. There's another DJ playing Lala this year, a guy named DJ D. Saul, who spins electronica music. What is DJ D. Saul's other job?

A. He's the assistant to Lollapalooza's graphic designer and he stuck his name onto the poster. B. He is the head of investment bank Goldman Sachs. Or C. It's DJ Bucky Ched trying to double up his gigs. Wow. That is a tough one. I've got a feeling. I'm going to go B.

You're going to go B. He's the head of Goldman Sachs. You're right. That's who it is. His real name is David Solomon and he's not spitting electronica. He is the CEO of this very large influential investment bank. That is bonkers. Isn't it, though? Yeah.

Well, you're doing very well. You have one more question. Rapper Joyner Lucas is in the Lala lineup, but he is threatening to drop out this year. Why? A, he's concerned about the lax COVID protocols, which he feels are premature given the progress of the virus. B, he wants to quit in protest of the female performers getting paid less than their male peers at the festival. Or C, because his name on the poster is in smaller type than, quote, that goofy ass Machine Gun

Kelly. On this one, I'm going to have to go see. I feel confident on this. You're exactly right. He's very upset about that. He feels he should have bigger type than Machine Gun Kelly, as I'm sure we all do, ultimately. Bill, how did Dan Snow do in our quiz? He was no Shackleton

because he got them right the first time. There you go. He did not lead his crew into disaster. Dan Snow is a historian and part of the expedition that discovered Shackleton's endurance. You can also see and hear more from him at the Dan Snow History Hit Podcast and TV channel. Dan Snow, thank you so much for joining us on Wait, Wait, Don't Tell Me. Thanks, guys. That was super fun. Thank you so much. It was a joy. Take care.

Bye-bye. That's it for our ambivalently patriotic edition of Wait, Wait, Don't Tell Me. Wait, Wait, Don't Tell Me is a production of NPR and WBEZ Chicago in association with Urgent Haircut Productions' Doug Berman, Benevolent Overlord. Philip Godeka writes our limericks. Our public address announcer is Paul Friedman. Our production assistant is Sophie Hernandez-Semirnevis. B.J. Liederman composed our theme.

Our program is produced by Jennifer Mills, Miles Dernbosch, Lillian King, and Nancy Seichow. Our illegally purchased M-80 is Peter Gwynn. Technical direction is from Lorna White. Our business and ops manager is Colin Miller. Our tour manager is Shana Donald. Our production manager is Robert Newhouse. Our senior producer is Ian Chilock.

And the executive producer, wait, wait, don't tell me, is Mike Danforth. Thanks to everybody you heard on this week's show, all of our panelists, all our special guests, of course, Bill Curtis. And thanks to all of you for listening. I am Peter Sagal, and we will be back with a new show next week. This is NPR.