Walking The Dog with Emily Dean - Adam Kay – Returns!

Episode Date: September 14, 2021

This week Emily went for a walk with Adam Kay and his Airedale, Pip. They discuss Adam’s move to the country, the joys of dog ownership and the books he’s written recently including his upcoming ���Kay’s Marvellous Medicine’. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

There's a big thing about wilding, isn't there, at the moment, where you sort of wild the land and let it be how it should be. We've done the same with Pip. She's been fully wilded. My parents did it with me, and it was fine. This week on Walking the Dog, I went to Oxfordshire to chat with a guest who's appeared before with a borrowed dog. To find out what life was like now, he's become a dog owner himself.

He's a brilliant comet and a publishing phenomenon. His memoir, this is going to hurt, even outside Michelle Obama. It is, of course, the ridiculously talented Adam Kay, who took me for a stroll with his adorable Airdel Pip. Pip had even had a grooming appointment for the day. I mean, I know you're busy, but you could have done the same, Adam. And we had the loveliest time. Adam is that rare thing. He's someone totally unchanged by success. He's so genuine and just a thoroughly decent person. We chatted about his move to the country with his wonderful husband James, the joys of dog ownership,

and the books he's written recently for a younger audience. Kay's Anatomy and the forthcoming Kay's Marvelous Medicine, a gross and gruesome history of the human body, which is utterly hilarious and fascinating. It's that book you wish you'd had as a kid. So do grab a copy when it's out on September 30th or pre-order it right now via Amazon. I loved my day with Adam, although I would like to apologise for the various comfort breaks Ray decided to take on Adam and James's beautiful stone floor. Thanks, Ray. You've just completely ruined our chance of a Cotswold's mini break. I'll shut up now so you can listen to the man himself. Here's Adam and Pip.

Why is Pip eating my car, Adam? She's checking it. Doing her checks. I'm doing her checks? Yeah, Pip. Why has Pip pulled up my microphone, Adam? Because she's a wretch. Should we go? Should we walkies? Yeah, I'm going to decide I've had enough water

because otherwise I've got too many things to hold and you're just going to end up holding my water and that's pathetic. I can hold your water. No, no, no, absolutely not. No, I've done, I'm done. There we go. She's going to walk, Pip?

Good idea. Pip? Do you take her off the lead, Adam? I mean, we have done, but then she makes a run for it and tries to find a better life for herself elsewhere. So we have to be quite careful about that. I mean, we let her off inside. Yeah.

Oh, that's generous. Occasionally, you know. but she's not one of the dogs that just stays by your side. There was a bit of a problem with training her, which was we didn't do it, and now she's not trained. But it was all during lockdown, and it was, you know, and also socialising with people. She didn't, or other dogs, we couldn't do.

We looked it up, and it was like, like if it's like I think you could only she there was you could only socialise the dog at these classes if if you were like I think not just it wasn't a key worker wasn't enough it needs to be like super crucial that you needed to I don't know like run a hospital or something so anyway and so we sort of ignored that side of things and and now now it was a bit too late she knows how to sit Pip sit sit sit sit Good girl. I mean she knows the word.

She's just choosing not to do it. I think she really recognised the word. Yeah. I think it's overrated civilising dogs. Yeah, they weren't meant to be like this, were they? You know, there's a big thing about wilding, isn't there at the moment, where you sort of wild the land and let it be how it should be. We've done the same with Pip. She's been fully wilded.

My parents did it with me and it was fine. I'm going to introduce you because I'm so excited to be here this is the second time that this man has appeared on the podcast run out of guests during the second circuit it's fine can I say there have only been this is very special

because only two other guests have appeared on this podcast twice I think Dyer Morgan she got a dog after appearing on this and Lee Mack Are you saying they got dogs because they went? I'm going to say I didn't get my dog because of going on your podcast. I'm putting that on the record.

But I mean, it was nice to hang out with the dog I knew, but I was always, I'd been petitioning for a dog for a good decade before. Well, I'm very excited to introduce part two with his actual own dog. My own dog. The wonderful Adam Kaye. And since you came on last time, we should talk about your witty. your dog do you want to introduce your dog? Yeah so this is Pippin and she's an Airdale Terrier which is like the largest type of terrier and so she's the so she's like

sort of sort of no like sort of almost Labrador size but with the with the sort of temperament of a of a terrier who's obviously been wilded and she's 17 months old but still quite puppyish. She's absolutely beautiful and she's got sort of David Lee Roth Europe final countdown vibe on the hair front which I love. Yeah I mean she normally looks more sort of scraggily like a like a child's picture of a dog where they've done lots of sort of scribbling to denote the hair but she did go and this is I don't think this was deliberate I think it was just when she was previously booked in to the groomers so she did go yeah

yesterday and so she's she's a bit blow dried and then she'll jump in a stream or something and that'll be that So I've come to meet you because last time which we'll talk about you didn't have your own dog You've now got Pitt which is why you're on again and also because you've moved I have moved and last time we're in West London and now we're in Oxfordshire which is where you're currently residing Yeah, it's very much where I'm residing We suspiciously shortly before the plague hit, we abandoned London and moved to the countryside, which was which is great to be honest. I mean, it's just I've always lived in London. I guess I've sort of associated myself with being a London or whatever that means. And James grew up in the

Scottish borders and sort of the countryside had had less of an appeal to him. And we should say that's your husband? That's my husband, yeah. And which came first as the decision to get the dog. Have a husband or a dog? Dog. I went straight to the dog just so you know, I skip the husband bit. And sort of turned the dog into a strange, unhealthy husband figure. Anyway, that's a whole other story.

Were you the one lobbying for the dog rather than James, your husband? Yes. James was the one saying, oh, but the smell and, and the pissing and the shitting, and it'll be, you know, it'll be me who has to do all the walking. And he was right. She stinks, she pisses, she shits, and he has to do all the walking. So in fairness to him, he was absolutely spot on. But he does love her very much. And why did you go for an Airdale?

They, some of my... Best friends are Airdale. Some of my best friends are Airdale. they're the only breed I knew really so um no so when when I was growing up family friends who we were a cat household and but these family friends we stayed with a lot a lot had an amazing airdale called Meg and they've had airdales ever since current ones called Maisie and I just love them they're very silly they're quite sassy I think their training is in as an otter hound.

You've heard. Yeah. So I think that's what, that's what, that's the profession she would go into if I hadn't pushed her into domesticity. She would just be hounding otters all the time. So they're sort of that, their origin story essentially is that is, that's what they were bred to do. Is that right? Yeah. And then they moved to Yorkshire. Is that where A Dale is?

Air, yeah, anyway, whatever. And now I'm a bit hazy on all of this, but I remember Rotters are involved somehow. She's really beautiful, Adam. I absolutely love her. She is. She's quite, quite unusual. You don't see lots of them around.

It's like, I don't know, like driving a Morris Minor or something. You wave to other ones as you go past. It was weird, though. She's, she's met to, Airdales before and they really, really, really know when it's their own breed. So she, obviously with, you saw with Ray what she, what she tries to do when she meets a new dog generally is try to kill them or push them over, fuck them. But with Airdales, when the two she's met, it's just been much more, all right. So.

has respect for her own. She does. She's got that sort of, it's a bit of a craze attitude, I think she has, which is I look after my own. Yes, no, exactly. Or maybe it's just, maybe it's just confusion and she just sort of suddenly sees another dog that looks. There's a, there's a, there's a, about once every, once every month or so, someone sends me a tweet of this, this sort of meme from the internet. So, and it says, in the, the 1980s you had to carry all of this with you and now it's all on your phone it's a man holding a map and you know an analogue telephone and a ghetto blast and all these things and it's this this old photo and the and the actor the model or whatever in the person looks exactly like me

but is not me and so it's so much so that whenever this does the round I thought people will be like, oh, is that, what's going on here? So I wonder if, I wonder if that's what happens when she meets another, another erdo. Oh, I really like her as. She's so sweet. She likes you too, and you can tell that. She's not constantly woofing. So that was my, that was my concern is that we might have to like do a dummy one where I'm pretending I've got the dog and you'll be, we'll be saying things like,

oh, look at her, and chewing that grass and jumping over the style. We'd have left her at home in disgrace. She'd have go, well, blah, blah, blah. Does she bark at people then? Yes, she does. And what normally sets her off? People, except for me and James, and you, it turns out.

Church bells. Church bells is a big problem. I think it gets quite distressed by them, but that's fine because we live opposite to church, where they're to constant bell practice. So, should have thought of that. It's like when you go around a house, you should check the, you should check what the Wi-Fi is like and what the phone signals like. If we ever move, I think we need to check, there's no bells. And the weird thing is, I get if you've got a church,

you do some, you do your bell practice of whatever, but this church, they've only got one bell, there's only one note, so it's just the practice for an hour at a time is gong, gong, gong, gong, gong. It's not even the ding ding ding ding ding ding whatever. Anyway, so that's so she doesn't like that. She's not very she's not very food oriented which also makes it slightly tricky to for the whole training stuff. But she's very happy here because it's nice to be in the country because you've got so much more space for her. It is yeah and I think James also made the very reasonable point that it's you know, with a big dog in London, it's a bit, it's not great on the, you know, our garden in London was, you know, tiny and now, now it's like near.

And then she can shit where she likes. As can you enjoy it, did you know, exactly, miles from anywhere. So tell me, so we should talk about the first time you came on the podcast. It was a debacle, wasn't it? it went so a lot was edited it's fair to say from what what happened and my report back when i got home about how how my chat went with emily was very different to what went what went out uh actually on air and uh because we i had a i had a rental um a rental dog it wasn't a lovely dog i tell you what i tell you what I can't remember the dog's name. It was golden lurcher. So basically,

dog was being quite naughty and sort of generally woofing and snapping and whatever, but professionals that we are managed to keep the dog under control. I'm going to say him, because I can't remember if it was a boy in there. There's a lot that I blocked out from there from this. And then there was one point when a woman was cycling past. and the dog just went for her. Yeah. Smacked her off the bike, destroyed her clothing. It was like a big rip down her dress or her trousers or whatever else. And it got slightly worse because not only had the dog knocked her off the bike and

destroyed her clothing but she was on the way to an interview. And the trouser leg was ripped. and understandably she was very upset this woman. Yes, she was on her way to an interview. I know. I paid for her to buy a new pair of trousers. Oh, did you? That's nice. And how about the job of her dreams? Well, she sent me in...

Did you employ her? She sent me an email. Marketing executive. And the subject line was the trousers bitten, which I thought was a new Agatha Christie play, someone was telling me that. I worried that might have put you off, but it hasn't. No, but this time we're in rural Oxfordshire,

and I can see no one. We should be safe. Do you like this solitude, as? Do you think you prefer the quiet here? Yeah, I mean, yes and no. I mean, I'm not a million miles from London, so it's possible to go back, you know, when legal. But there's something, I don't know, I think I'm calmer.

So there's something about, in London, everything's sort of on top of you, isn't it? Yeah. It's all a bit crowder, which it definitely isn't. It can, yeah, it's a bit like, I imagine, sort of huge fame is, and you can't turn it off, you know. I mean, I should point out, I don't have huge fame. And so my fame is very easy to turn off because I get, even in London, someone would notice me about once every two months. And mostly that was, are you the guy from the meme with the, with the phone? and the ghetto blaster.

What do people say when they recognise you? I suspect they're quite friendly, aren't they? Yeah, no, I think I've got, it's nice, it's nice, it's nice people. I used to get recognised a bit at university as the singer from Good Charlotte. But I didn't, but... Well, I was telling someone the other day, the worst lookalike I've ever had was,

I got in a cab once and the driver said, Has anyone ever told you really looked like the tin man from the Wizard of Oz? I imagine when people do recognise you, it's quite nice because they're familiar with your work as a writer. You know, you're famous as a writer, so it's not like they've seen you doing something which you're not terribly proud of. Do you know what I mean? It's like actually this is... You're assuming I'm proud of the stuff I'm Richard. Well, I hope you are.

It's yeah, no, it's sort of, yeah, I've never sort of particularly courted fame, so I don't like, I don't generally go on panel shows and stuff. Isn't fame the sort of unfortunate byproduct of success, such as it is, but I've always sort of struggle to understand why you would want the fame bit, which is the stuff that's in. intrusive upon your life, you know, as your primary aim? Damage? You know, I quote sometimes that F. Scott Fitzgerald thing, which you always said, which is that proof of good parenting is that the child has no desire to be famous. And I think what he was specifically referring to in fairness is, you know, the sort of fame for its fame safe.

So he's not saying, oh, you know, if your kid excels, in something and wants to pursue that, that makes absolute sense, you know. But it's more just that and all. And I've never felt that with you. I've always felt that the work is the thing. I mean, it's really difficult to become famous as an author. That's that's a quite good thing about my line of work, I guess. But I mean, it's, also it's a slightly, it's quite a big call to go up to someone and say, are you author X when you're sort of recognising them from the photo taken probably 10 to 15 years ago on the back of a, you know, inside flap of a book cover? Well, I'm glad you brought that book up because I want to discuss, I mean, all of your

books, because there are quite a few of them now. And that book is now, what are we talking now on the millions front? Where are we up to? you stop counting? I remember if someone's counting. I mean, I think it's sort of like three million books of like this is going to hurt and the Christmas one I did. I think that was I think the adult books are about that. So that's phenomenal isn't it? Unless it's just one person who just bought loads of copies. They'd recognise me that level of commitment. Have you had a chance to sit down and kind of pat yourself on the back really? Yeah, I don't know all the time.

Don't have a greater. No, I mean, I sort of, it's, no, it's extraordinary. And I sort of, it's definitely changed my, changed my life, obviously. Are you a monster now? The biggest single thing it's done is it's given me the creative freedom to only pursue the projects. I want to do. And also it means that when I'm having a fight, with James and he says, you know, what they're saying, in some sort of thing, I'll sort of point at

something, you know who paid for all this? So that's quite good. But, you know, I've been, I've been a jobbing writer. Should we go through here? You'll go through the gate. Pip sometimes sits when it gets, when she gets to a gate. She likes going through things. Pip, I know this girl. You're going to sit? You're going to sit? No. Pip, do you want to sit? Sit. Good girl. Good girl. For the for the record it just sat and we and we asked her to what are you getting here oh my god a chew duck fillet yeah we'll love you forever she allowed this one it's called a chewy duck fillet i mean i'm so um you were asking me if she was allowed it uh you unfortunately paused for a second

which gave her time to remove not only the chewy the chewy from a your hand but the microphone from your lapel now we're going to give you another one no no do you want to lay no should we see if we can make you lay let let she didn't lay so we were saying about fame you were saying the good things yeah you're you've got creative freedom i understand that and you're not worrying about so like if you look at any writer so before books i i mostly wrote telly, exclusively very exclusive very telly. And if you look at any

sort of fledgling writers IMDB page or whatever, is this sort of random programme generator. Yeah. And like you sort of, you know, you've written for, you've written an episode of Holby

and now you're writing for, you know, a sports report on, for Sky. And then it's sort of just taking any work that you can get. And because it's very difficult to get any work whatsoever and so and it's a luxury to work so I was I was there for a while I sort of eventually sort of found found some stuff that I was sort of regularly getting booked for but now I can I can work up what I what I really want to do it's

your podcast twice you should say there are This is going to hurt, this is my first book. Then it was the night shift before Christmas, which is, what happened was, when I was sort of pulling all my diaries together from time on the wards, there was sort of, because I worked a disproportionate number of Christmas, it's basically all of them, had loads of diary entries from Christmas, and Marydard was like, quite Christmasy, isn't it, this book? So maybe we cut a lot of those out and then, and then sort of put that together as a Christmas book, which, And then you did the NHS book, which did phenomenally well. Yeah. That must have felt really rewarding. Is that another nice byproduct of this in a way, you know, that you've got a voice and can be heard?

I mean, that is, yeah, thank you. You've given me a way to sound nice here. But no, I mean, that's, that is probably the best byproduct of all this. I do have, you know, I am now someone who can represent the, you know, the voice of my form a profession and and it meant that through lockdown when I had this sort of I guess a feeling of sort of helplessness as a lot of us did yeah what can you know is there anything we can do to help and and came up with together with Orion who published it the idea of this book called dear NHS where we got a

bunch of people a hundred people or 104 because it was like when you're inviting people to a wedding and they're not going to say yes and then too many people said yes no you were just meant to say I'm really sorry I can't make it and send a sort of fifty pounds self-witches voucher anyway so a hundred and four hundred-ish people and the brief was just to say write something about a personal experience of the of the NHS I didn't say make it sad or make it funny or make it poignant or about you or about your mum or about your whatever. And people sent in this extraordinary, I mean, I'm hugely proud of it.

I actually had very little to do with it other than sending out the letters in the first place and writing a couple of words at the front. But it was a very beautiful love letter really to the NHS, which obviously we've never relied on more than we have. in the last year and a half. And it's raised a phenomenal amount for charity. Obviously, all the profits we gave away, which is last time I heard was north of 400 grand, which is proper, proper, proper.

And that was going to NHS charities together and the Lullaby Trust, who are a great charity who I support a lot, who look after families bereaved with babies and young kids. And so, I mean, that was a hugely fulfilling thing to do. during lockdown and sometimes it's just nice to, you know, nice to do something where you think you're somehow helping and that, yeah, that's obviously something that I wouldn't have been able to do

if I was still script editing BBC 3 shows. Paul McCartney might not have opened the email. This is like some kind of gate. Metal, metal gate. I mean if we're relying on me for the country ways, this is going to be interesting. I'm giving it a go. And that one a go and then that one across the top. Oh wait. Wait, I've got a new system, hang on. Let's do that one first. Do you like the one turning, opening a gate into the crystal maze to ask? There we go.

Do you know I feel really proud of myself? Yeah, it's good. And we need to close it because we remember the countryside code. Is that still a thing? That was a thing when I was... It feels quite in 1970s public information. Yeah, the countryside code. It was like, take nothing but animals, kill nothing but animals, whatever.

I want to take nothing but memories, photographs, kill nothing but time. I don't know, it was like, close the fucking gates. There was the Australian drink and drive ad they used to show a lot, which is, you know, we had all these clunk, click, or you might. Whereas in Australia, they just said, if you drink and drive, you're a bloody idiot. That's it? Yeah, that's good. 10 second campaign.

Do me your dog voice, Adam. Like, if you're with Pip and it's just you too, what would you say to her? No, we, I, I speak to it. dogs the same way that I speak to children, the same way that to speak to adults. Because I don't particularly like this sort of infantilisation of infants that people do. Actually, maybe they should be infantilised. Anyway, so anyway, when I'm talking to my nieces and nephews or anything, I just have a conversation with them that they can't understand. Because what's the point? How are you going to learn a language?

You know, if you're learning French or something, they don't do the French women of the kudgy kudgy koo. And so anyway, but that's how I talk to, that's how I talk to Pip. Come on then, let's hear a little burst of you in the pit. So what did you say, Pip, come to Daddy? I don't think I'd call myself that. It would, it's, uh, Pip, can you drop that? Come on, come on, just, just drop everything. Oh, that's the thing.

It's like, every single time we're out and she sort of picks up a thing, a sort of sort of plastic lid from a milk on a pip drop. And then just, I just want to give the sort of, of overall global message to just drop things. What are you doing there? Come on. But you had, just to go back to the success of the NHS book and I felt during lockdown you did become, I think, quite a sort of key figure for the NHS really. I mean, I don't know about that at all. I just felt I found you quite a reassuring presence, I suppose. Okay. I mean, most people who said the opposite, which was that I was a

right at the start, I'm not saying I'm sort of any kind of mega brain genius, but I called it quite loudly as worse than the government were saying it was. And there was a, and there was a, there was a moment, I don't need to remember, it was an awful moment back in February when we were seeing these sort of gurneys being wheeled out of Italian hospitals. And at that point it was something like two, three hundred, people a day dying in Italy. And we were still sort of saying, there's no need to lockdown, there's no need to do anything, there's no need to do anything

other than saying happy birthday and wash your hands. And I said, you know, if we don't do something, if we don't actively do something to stop people transmitting this to each other, this is us in a fortnight because, you know, it was, the virus has just behaved predictably in every single country it's been in and we're somehow pretending that British pluck will stop us getting infected or something and and so and I was you know I said this and and it got quite you know got quite noisy when I said it for

whatever reason and there were sort of responses from the the government and pest and all that sort of stuff basically saying this is nothing like Italy it's absurd to compare the two places and a lot of sort of saying that I was doom-mongering but I was just sort of I don't know that was just that was my vibe and so and I guess you know and at that time a bunch of people started following me um for sort of for my sort of predictions and prognostications about about this sort of thing when they shouldn't have followed me and obviously I just got I got one thing right once but I have always you know followed sort of people who who I trust didn't retweeted anything they said and

but yeah I don't know why you found it reassuring but I'm glad you did maybe well I just found it it's always handy to have you on on the speed aisle because as you know as someone who considers themselves within your friendship group you do get calls from all of us quite a lot yeah it's nice it's like You say it's not. It's like sort of, it's... Oh! Sorry.

What is it, Adam? I'm going to say that's a dead squirrel. What's protocol? I think we leave it and keep walking. Pip, we don't want you having that. And then you decided to write books for a young audience, which I really want to congratulate you on, because I loved the first one.

Kay's Anatomy. Love that you did that pun. Yeah, a pun obviously no single child reading it. No one between the age of seven and twelve is going to go oh my God, Kay's anatomy, presumably in 20 years time they'll be like oh it'll get rerun on whatever, whatever channels replace Dave and they'll go oh oh okay's anato, I see yeah yeah right smile. And talk me through your new one because you it's Kay's Marvelous Medicine. And it's so brilliant ads. I absolutely loved it because you know what struck me when I was reading it

that I thought this is really making me laugh. I mean just I don't know what it says about me that I opened a page and it said true or poo and I was on the floor laughing for about half an hour. And every time I saw it again, I would start laughing at true or poo. I mean, what it says about you is the same thing it says about me is that we have the sense of humour of a 7 to 12 year old. But I loved it. But also, it honestly, what also struck me about this book is that, and it's something that's true of all your writing, is that it's, it's not only funny, but it's, it's rigorous and it's, you can tell that work has gone into it. And I just get the sense that you have a strong work ethic and whatever you're doing, let's leave it. You think, I need to do this to the best of my ability. Is that, is that true of you? Do you? Do you say, you of not agonised but are you quite forensic about detail and getting it right?

I am. I mean you're only as good as your last thing obviously and and if you're an author you're only going to produce a certain number of books and I just need to make sure that they're as good as they they can be and I like getting it really. Right, and also the harder I work on it, the better it'll be, the more people will love me. There's something about doing a kids book. I really, really, really didn't want to dial it in. There are two ways of writing kids books, and I think one involves a bit more work than the other, and I just wanted to make sure I was on the right side of it.

And like we were talking about, about not patronising the dog, it's, you know, I, I, I, I wrote as I would for adults in my first draft, and then I worked out what wasn't going to work and what I wanted to play with, which was, you know, often it was just taking out references to Starsky and Hutch and all the swear words. And then other than that, I think,

and I'm glad that you found bits funny because the idea was that I'm just writing jokes, but there hopefully jokes that kids will, you know, will understand. Interestingly, I also, I would say, I mean, I don't know if you're going to, feel free to test me on it later, but my retention of the facts in there was pretty good. And I find that interesting because that is very much to do with comedy, isn't it? So if something's funny, I think you remember it more. Do you know what I mean?

It's a bit like, if you watch when Harry and that Sally, the line everyone quotes is, I'll have what she's having, less than the sort of emotional stuff, because it's funny. So I kept thinking, God, imagine if I could have had this as a kid, because I was always obsessed by comedy and a lot of kids are, actually if I'd have been taught history or science like that, I would have fucking loved it. I would have loved science.

Yeah, I mean, hopefully it's a bit of a confidence trick, that, you know, it says on the front that it's silly and it's disgusting, it's gruesome and whatever. And it is, hopefully it delivers that. But at the same time, it is also telling kids things that they need to know for their, you know, for their education and their exams and their sort of general betterment. But I think as soon as something is labelled as educational, it's a natural turn off. And, you know, loads of people who do that, that brilliant. Our mutual friend,

Connie Huck, has written some brilliant books about the cookie series. She describes as a stealth learning in there which is which is great and that and I think that's even cleverer because that's that's that's packaged as fiction and then these this is telling telling stories that you know i'm i'm quite open about the fact i'm going to be telling you facts in a in a gross way but i think i think there's there's a move towards towards that kind of thing you coped with the difficult second album because you never had a difficult second album you've just released the sort of beetles back catalogue essentially and everything does well and no I had my successful first album then the Christmas it was a lot shorter so that was like a sort of that was an EP

then I did my charity single so you know it's Christmas yes exactly but he never had I mean do you ever wake up in the middle of the night and think oh God I hope this does all right that's also one of my motivations for for putting the hours in and trying to things right and not so much if it doesn't sell well because both books don't and there's the biggest the biggest single factor is luck about how the how the book sort of how many copies it shifts and there's a lot of books an awful lot better than than mine that have sold an awful lot worse and it's just you know that's just that's just how it goes but I just don't want I don't read

reviews really because that doesn't help but I just just don't want the book that just quite, you can't avoid reviews because people act you in it on social media and whatever and, you know, and reviews from individuals are just as interesting as reviews from newspapers or whatever, but I just don't want the one where people are gone, nah, he's lost it. I, yeah, he just didn't work on this one, did he? So I think that, that, that worries me. Ultimately, if a book doesn't sell well, that's my publisher's problem rather than rather than mine. I remember Neil Gaiman, you know, the writer said that to me.

Oh, Neil Gaiman, the writer? So I know Neil Gaiman, the farmer. See? No, no, no, it's okay, Neil Gaiman the writer, yeah, go on. Neil Gaiman? What does he do, Adam? I believe he's a writer, Emily Din. What Gaiman said to me exactly what you're saying?

He said with any writing with a book, he said, your job's done now. Right, should we go up here, Pip? Should we go up? Countryways. Come on, up. Good girl. There's a BMW coming. Thank you.

I raised my hand. Oh wow, great. I felt really part of the country then. Do you feel like a country squire? No, no. I feel like someone on a day trip, and I'm treated as such by everyone else in the village. The, um, yeah, I mean, I sort of agree and disagree a bit with

with that because actually when you've when you've handed the book in as you know I think you've probably done about a half of it writing is very much a business and but part of that business is is the is the marketing and the and the events and that and that kind of thing I do think with you and I'm honestly not just saying this that you just you do seem very unchanged by your success which is really lovely I mean I've not had huge success, you know, compared to a lot of people. So that makes it easier to remain fairly normal. And also I've got James telling him I'm shit the whole time.

So that really helps bring me down a bit. Is that, that must be nice, though, having that consistency that you're enjoying this together as well. Yeah, no, it is. And we work very, very closely together on all of the stuff. So yeah, also it's good that we get on. It's good that we're able to work together. Because lockdown meant that we were sort of working together, living together. You obviously moved to for a reason, and I think the fact that it's quieter here,

I consider you someone who does an extrovert's job, but is innately quite introvert. Discuss? I certainly, I mean, I've been on a sort of, relatively perpetual tour of this is going to hurt which has been an amazing thing to do oh sorry hello oh fresh fresh fish ads I think the most extroverted thing I do is is going on stage which obviously pretty fucking extraverted but I don't I think I've had to I've had to slightly learn how to enjoy it I don't think I'm one of the people who is you know powered by applause and has this you know absolute desire to

to go on stage and but you're not a lot of comics are sort of show-offs in the room socially as what do you know what to mean they're saying I haven't been funny wow as you are funny she said I wasn't funny I didn't say that she's got we've got it recorded Let's put it this way. If someone else has something funny, you're happy to laugh. Very much. Very much. Yeah, yeah. Cross. Adam, I think you're really good with Pitt. Thanks, Emily. Come on, up, up. There we go.

You've got a lovely relationship. Should we go through the village? Yeah, oh yeah, let's have a quick. We're going to see the Masters Village. Well, I said to you before, I came to Oxford. I like visiting friends in the country because I can be very Jane Austen-Aunt. And that's when I say, Mr. Kay, he's a 300 a year. I wonder if doing, I suppose, a job that required a great deal of discipline beforehand and checking in and... Do you think that's helped in terms of you not getting slightly lost in this?

Yeah, I mean, I think it was very useful doing a real job for a long time before sort of joining the world of entertainment and writing and stuff like that. Because another thing is, once you've worked on Labour Ward, you know, something goes wrong, you know, oh no, the edit's been delayed for this reason or, you know, or, you know, this thing that was meant to happen. and isn't going to happen and Ellen said no, you know, whatever it is. Nothing matters. It's like when you've done a job where the stakes are 100% when everyone's, you know, everyone's working really flat out and hard, and they think it matters and it really does matter, it's sort of moving to a world where everyone sort of acts like it's life or death, but actually it isn't. I mean the arts have absolutely enormous value and I'll defend the arts to my death but it is many steps removed from you know delivering a baby

saving a life or you know whatever doctors nurses midwives you know do it's like it's that is that job has changed me more as a person you know a hundred times more than anything that's happened since. Really? So like emergencies don't worry me, whatever the emergency is. I sort of go somehow into this sort of doctor mode. I was trained in it. It's like, okay, well, the substation is on fire.

So I think at this point, we phone the number on the side. We know, whatever it is. Yes, you are. Do you know, I've noticed that you're incredibly calm, aren't you, in a crisis? Yeah. And we had a lot of crises, probably, yeah. You attract them, I defuse them.

But no, I think, I don't know, and that is definitely not something that is sort of innate to me. But there was, we were, I was with, I'd been with James's family over Christmas up in Scotland. and to sort of detox and sort of, should we cross here? Oh, is it pretty? You're local, we're just in that Adam's local village, which is ever so pretty. So we're coming back from Scotland and we thought, let's get a night in a hotel before we drive all the way back down to London. So we're going to somewhere in Northumberland.

And I don't like to place blame. on it on anyone of course but I was driving and James was navigating and he really really fucked up and we ended up on this at the end of gladiator we have to run up the travelator yes so we ended up on that except it was quite a lot narrower slightly steeper like I might be I might this might be my mind adding extra things but I think on one side there was a sheer drop on the other side sharks maybe and and then it got higher and higher and narrow, narrow and then sort of the ice appeared, and then we were on sheet ice. And at that point, the car was like, no, I'm done, and started just sort of sliding backwards.

And so, in this sort of Scotty, what's worse than a B-road, D-road, bridalway, whatever it was. And we sort of were careering backwards. And I was just like, okay, well, what we have to do here was, and it wasn't helped by James providing a sort of screaming soundtrack next to me. I like to think James is the me in the relationship. What am I, Ray? Sitting there quietly at a bag. You've got beautiful hair.

And you're fully toilet trained. You say that, but I've got a text. Do you want to read out this? Do you want to read out this text? What have you done? Ray has immediately pissed and shut. Oh, no. Ray has immediately pissed and checked on the living room floor.

Am I telling you the problem? Hashtag fully trained? He is trained. But you know what? Do what? You've trained him to do that. He's been in the car for two hours. We should have let him go to the bathroom.

See? Sorry, my apologies. I feel awful. Ray, I mean, he's shamed himself. This is awful. I should have properly let him use the bathroom. He has been in the car for two hours. He's got a very small ladder.

I wouldn't have mentioned that had you not claimed that Ray was toilet. Ray was toilet trains. So I feel you're in a very good place now. I feel you're happy with that. Oxfordshire. Yeah. I agree. It's a lovely bit, but also I feel you're in a good space mentally.

I am, yeah. I mean, there is... Thank you. Did you struggle at all in lockdown, like, mental health rights ads? Are you someone who... Yes, yes, yes and no, but it's... I became any time, you know, I would... was struggling. I became acutely aware of my huge privilege. You know, I'm no one, no one,

no one close to me died and which is not the case for everyone I know and you know I live in a house with a garden and I've got you know friends living in 15th floor flats with no balconies and a toddler and I sort of, you know my you know work obviously sort of, sort of, rate 20 on that but I was able to sort of find other things to do in the absence of and the absence of TV and and theatre and lots of my friends you know really really you know hugely struggle financially obviously in the arts lots of people fell between the cracks of government funding and so I sort of tried not to try not to dwell on my myself too much and it's sort of it wasn't a wasn't a particularly rough period for me because I was in a fairly lucky setup I guess.

And do you think, because you got PIP, was it during lockdown really? It was during lockdown. She was a 40th birthday present. Oh, dear. And also, I'm not easy to buy for because, not that I'm madly profligate. It's just that I spent a long time looking after my. myself and if I want the thing, I just get it. So it's like, anytime someone's like, what do you really need? I'm like, well, nothing, because I'd have bought it. The one thing that I've been saying for years and years and years

and years about what I really, really want is a dog. And then, so James was like, I'm going to have to get him a bloody dog now. But, and here we are. What were you not expecting about dog ownership and what surprised you? How expensive vets are? are and how I should have got pet insurance right at the start rather than once she had once she'd had a vet visit for every possible organ system now rendering her I think I can only

get insurance for like her nose or something also I've sort of so you said before about you know I'm I'm I'm on speed dial for some sort of friends who are happy to get the opinion of a doctor who really hasn't worked for a very very long time time and even at his pump wasn't great. So anyway, so I'm on that list. But and so, you know, lots of people's, you know, I'm quite, doctors are often slightly more laid back than than civilians. It's like, oh my God, what's this rash? Oh my God, my child's vomited. You know, all that sort of stuff. And you sort of as the doctor spent lots of time going, I think it's probably fine. I mean, I think just leave it. Sounds like a virus. You know, that sort of thing. And then as soon as Pippus, you know, as soon as Pippus, you know, appeared, I turned into this anxious parent. And I think, you know, my single biggest source of anxiety is, it's sort of, you know, and she was, she wasn't eating properly and she was tiny and we got her at seven weeks, which I think is quite young for a... Yes. Tennis school, PIP! Oh, wow. See, it was worth coming out.

get a tennis ball. Shall we throw it to her as? Or does she just like to chew them? She likes to chew them. She can't catch. You know some dogs she throw a ball to them and they catch? She's happy for it to just smack her on the side of her head and bounce onto the grand roll.

And when it's reached a complete standstill, she'll catch it. I was surprised how much you love them, to be honest. Oh yes. So you're saying I'm someone who appears incapable of love. And this is the, this is the, final scene of the movie where I get a dog and my icy heart slightly thaws. It's like the scene in the dad who hates dancing in footloose. You just see a little close of them tapping as well. Yeah exactly. No, I'm saying how much one. So I was surprised

how much I loved Ray is what I'm saying. Yeah. If it was so utterly I imagine what's the other thing that people kids that's the that's the thing that people must have with kids isn't it um oh pitt right i think we're going to go in and have some lunch soon do you want another treat do you want a treat then you sit look bloody sat for the for the record sit good girl Girl, Pip. Have you had an Aedale on the podcast before? Do you know, it's my first Airdale?

Pip, it's special, see? They're very, I mean, they're, I just think they're great. I mean, she's a wretch, obviously, but in general they're great. They're very teddy bear looking up. She's so teddy bear. I absolutely love her. Oh, I can see why she makes you so happy, Adam. Before we let Pip go and have a lie down and work out what terrible things Ray has been up to inside with,

your husband James. Well, the house doesn't look like it's on fire. Tell me, what's the single thing you love most about having a dog since you've got a dog? It's companionship, I think, and, no offence, James, but it's just, so I often work quite late at night. That's just, I'm quite distractable,

so that's a good time for me to write. And it's just a sort of nice presence, sitting there. I mean, who can't love someone who gives you unconditional love? Having said that, hers is quite conditional on treats. So if I've got a bag of treats, I'm offered absolutely unconditional love. I think that's why she likes me. The enormous bag of treats and the delicious microphone. Oh my God, she's got paws all over your top.

I'm sorry. Bill me, bill me. That's how it works on this podcast. Some clothing is always destroyed. I really hope you brought disgrace on the family. Jesus. I really hope you enjoyed listening to that and do remember to rate, review and subscribe on iTunes.