Walking The Dog with Emily Dean - Amanda Wakeley (Part One)

Episode Date: November 5, 2024

This week, Emily and Raymond are taking a walk in Battersea Park with the legendary fashion designer Amanda Wakeley and her Labrador Luna (who was sporting a very stylish red bandana!) Amanda tells us about her happy and chaotic childhood with a succession of Labs and Jack Russells and her family in Cheshire. We find out what life was like for Amanda at Cheltenham Ladies’ College and how making clothes in the school holidays led her to creating her own label and pioneering her clean, glam and wearable style.We highly recommend you listen to Amanda’s podcast Style DNA - where she speaks to extraordinary people about their personal styles and the psychology behind the clothes they wear. It's available on all podcast platforms!Follow Amanda on Instagram @amandawakeleyFollow Emily: Instagram - @emilyrebeccadeanX - @divine_miss_emWalking The Dog is produced by Faye LawrenceMusic: Rich Jarman Artwork: Alice LudlamPhotography: Karla Gowlett  Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Unless you're a nudist, clothes affect us all. We all have to get dressed in the morning and make a decision about what we're putting on. This week on Walking the Dog, Ray and I went for a stroll in Battersea Park with legendary fashion designer Amanda Wakely and her adorable Labrador Luna, who, by the way, also didn't disappoint on the style front, as she turned up wearing an incredibly chic red bandana. Amanda started her label back in 1990, and she had a huge impact on British fashion

because she was a very early pioneer of that sort of clean, paired down, wearable glamour which went on to win her a legion of high-profile fans. She's dressed everyone from Princess Diana to Helen Mirren and Kate Winslet. She's had such a fascinating career and has so many brilliant stories so I couldn't wait to find out more.

I was also really interested to hear about her decision to step away from full-time designing not long ago and instead channel her passion for style into her very own podcast called Style DNA, where she chats to well-known names like Trinny Woodall, James Blunt and Elle McPherson about their own personal style journeys and the psychology behind what we wear. It's a really genius idea and it's well worth a listen, so I thoroughly recommend you getting involved. I have to say, I really love spending time with Amanda.

I knew she was going to be interesting and ridiculously elegant, of course. But I think what really struck me was just how warm and genuine she was and I've also become frankly almost unhealthfully obsessed with her dog. I really hope you enjoy my chat with Amanda. I'll stop talking now and hand over to the woman herself. Here's Amanda and Luna and Ray Ray. Yes, you're the most beautiful colour. How old is he?

How dare you, Amanda, very rude. Well, I just wondered if that was his normal colour or he was like we are. Are you suggesting my dog has ombre? He could have ombri. Does he have ombre? Well, he has... Luna's changing colour because she spends so much time outside. If she has the chance, I'll open up the balcony doors and she lies, sunbathes.

So she's going brown now from her black. Well, Raymond, he does use the George... I get my hair down at George Northwood and Raymond uses the George Northwood shampoo. Raymond, you are such an indulged dog. Luna has the river. That's it. Don't you? And actually, let's hope you stay out of the pond today.

Yes. That really wouldn't make my day. Come along, Luna. Where do you want to head? Oh, I'm in your hands, Amanda. Oh, my God. I have such a shite sense of direction. I come to bad to see most mornings,

and I manage to get myself lost, but I'll try and get us lost too. The good news is, I think if you've got a poor sense of direction, you have to agree, you have to commit to being very laid back about getting lost? Completely. Well, I know I'm within Battersea and so, sooner or later, I'll get to a place

I recognise. Come on, Raymond. Look, you're going to see Raymond run now. Raymond. A million miles an hour. Oh, Raymond. Hello. Luna makes friends with everyone, don't you? Hey?

If a child was drawing a picture of a Labrador, do you know what I mean? I think you would draw Luna. She is pretty, I have to say, but she's Diddy. She's a little Labrador. And, you know, I did loads of research on her mother and her father, and I thought they're really beautiful sort of petite field dogs, you know, Labradors that, you know, are used to working and all of that.

And then, oh my God, when I picked her up, it was this little ball of. of fluff. I was in tears taking her away when she said goodbye to her breeder, which was eight weeks old, just this ball of fluff. I knew I was getting her. I knew my brother was terminally ill. I picked her up and that night my brother died. And so she's sort of been this ball of joy that was sent to make us laugh. And I really, really believe that. She reminds me on a daily basis to laugh, to get outside into nature, to get some exercise, move our bodies. Because she's a proper, she needs five kilometres before she'll eat a thing. I'm not joking, she's on hunger strike this morning.

Because we're a bit later than I normally am, I put her food down thinking I'd normally feed her after I've walked her. And I put her food down this morning because I thought, by the time I get back, it's going to be late. No, that food has sat there for two hours. Well, I'm already a little obsessed with Luna. I'm obviously rather obsessed with you as well because I've been a fan of this woman for a long, long time. I am, of course, with a very wonderful Amanda Wakely. We have Luna, Amanda's Labrador, Black Labrador,

and my dog Raymond, who you've just met for the first time. I get there sense, you're not a massive small dog fan, but I think you're going to make an exception for Raymond. I love all dogs. I'm not great with yappy dogs. Because it's just like just when you least expect it, they go off on one. And that's just not good for a heart, is it? But you tell me that Raymond doesn't even bark, let alone yap.

Raymond. It's something of a superpower, his silence. I've been trying to find a man similar to Raymond. He just shuts up on, come on. Come here, please. But you didn't answer me. How old is Raymond? Oh, I'm sorry.

He's seven. Oh, Raymond, that's sort of 50 in dogs years. Oh, Raymond. That's a very, very wise age. We get wiser. Do you know what I've noticed? Luna does something rather adorable is whenever you start talking to Raymond or giving Raymond attention, Luna comes over to me. She gets very jealous.

Does she? Yeah, which is quite sweet. I mean, we all want our dogs to know who their owners are. Although she's got a very short memory. if I go away or we go away. She's, you know, out the door to whoever's looking after her and she doesn't look back. And then I'm sort of put in purder for a couple of days

when I come back. And I'm clutching this. We met this morning and the first thing you did was give me, I mean, there's no delicate way of putting this. You gave me a poo bag. I gave you a poop scoop. Yeah. I think they are just genius.

I've used them forever and it's recycled paper and card. You don't get your hands anywhere near a plastic poo bag. You don't get your hands anywhere near the poo, but you sort of scoop up the poo. It turns into a little carrier bag and you dump it into the closest bin. It's quite good. And it's quite good. Can I say they're not paying, I'll say this either.

And what I love about this, you know those sort of, in New York people carry those very cool brown paper bags. have their luncheon. That's how that's what these look like. So I'm going to put this in my pocket and it's called poopscoops.coops. Yeah. Pooops.com. Right, come on. And we're in Battersea Park, which is this is your local Amanda, isn't it? It is, yeah. It's sort of where I tend to come across for a good walk in the morning and I just love it actually. And it's got more and more beautiful. And if we go down here, I'll show you what I mean. There are,

areas of this park that you can really get lost in. I love walking down the river in the morning to come here and across the bridge. And it's just a very special part of London. You've got the birds, you've got the ducks, the swans, you've got the parakeets, which I know have a mixed review. Raymond is already being carried. Is this normal? Raymond!

Am I going to have to put your lead on you? Are you in the city, Billy? It's those little legs, isn't it? It's just that the park ranger was nearby, and I thought needed to be scoops. I think it must be a great job being a park ranger. I think so. Just the change of seasons.

I love that. And I'm a big believer in there's no such thing as bad weather, just, you know, the wrong clothing. I think you're quite a sort of party outdoors type. We're going to get onto this now, because I want to talk to you about your childhood. Did you grow up with dogs, Amanda? I did.

I mean, that's the joke. I'm the youngest of three. And I think by the time my mother got to me, I would volunteer to have my afternoon kip in the dog's basket. Because I loved our Labrador so much. I would literally spoon with him. And he had this giant basket. And so I think that's where.

it kicked off. But I, yeah, I love dogs. And I love being outside in nature. I think it's really good for us. So how many labs did you have? Did you just have a series of labs? A series of labs. So Bodger was this giant white Labrador that I grew up with from zero to 13. And he was such a character. He was a really naughty boy. He would just go off, take himself off. And it wasn't until he died that people started knocking on the door and saying, is Bodger all right? And my mother would say, why? Yeah, sadly, he died last week.

Oh, that would explain why he didn't come for his fried eggs and bacon. It's like, he took himself off around the village every morning for numerous breakfasts. And then we had, you know, a succession as you do. and generally Jack Russell's too You see, I have some Jack Russell It's a good combo, isn't it? Yeah, but it's quite down to Abbey And I love that for you

Oh God, am I so true to type Anyhow, I love the Jack Russell As much as I love the Labrador I listen, I love all dogs Oh, look, we've got a spat Morning Branker Oh, Looney Tunes, who's that? Who is that? Now you don't know who you're walking with, do you? You do not know who you're walking with.

This is Branca, who is my dog sitter when I go away. Look at this. This is the hairbear bun. So she knows these are all her friends. Hey. Oh, Luna's so excited. Who's that? Oh, you are bonkers. Oh. She loves Angus. My Angus. Oh, is that your Angus? Oh my God. I love. they off now. What kind of dog is Angus? Bearded collie, low turn. Oh, bearded collie, okay. Have you heard a whistle on you, Luna? Branca, I forgot to bring my... Oh, you see, you're a good girl, aren't you? Good girl! So this is your dog walker? I do the walking, but Branca, bless her, does the sitting, so if I'm away,

now I'll lose Luna. Luna's now run off with the dog's system. With her friends. Oh my God, but it's so sweet when she comes to pick her up. She has them belted into the back seat of her car. So they're all on their collars and they're sitting, like little soldiers on the back seat. Or with their collars and leads on, it's the cutest sight. And actually, it's really sensible.

You know, there's only, I think by law, a dog walker can only walk five at a time or something like that, which it makes sense, quite honestly. You are a good girl. I want to hear a bit more about your childhood because it's you and the Labrador's and the occasional Jack Russell and it's your mum and your dad and this is where Amanda that you're growing up

in Cheshire. I thought it was Cheshire yeah yeah in the countryside and your dad was a surgeon is that right? Good research Emily and your mum physiotherapist. She was she gave it all up when she had us three and I have to say she was and still is the most phenomenal mum at 91 she still mothers me and I love that

I'm very very lucky sadly we lost my pa 12 years ago but she is still crack on cracking form she sadly lost her Labrador about six months ago but we'd already got her her a Bengal cat which is the closest cat to a dog she goes for a walk with the cat or the cat goes for a walk with her it's bonkers it's fabulous

and not on a lead she picks up her stick and he comes flying from wherever he is and walks with her and talks to her the whole way round the field and he looks up at her and talks to her it's just the most endearing

sight Do you know, it's so extraordinary that relationship, particularly I think the elderly can have with animals, you know, and honestly, it's extraordinary the difference it makes. It really, really does. I think it's touch, its connection with nature, its connection with an animal. I love it. And that lack of judgment from animals, particularly people with dementia and stuff like that, you know, if you know on some level you're not the person you want to. once were, you know, and your mind's not functioning the way it once did. I think what's so lovely about animals is they're a disjudgment-free zone. Oh, completely. Do you know what I mean?

Completely. They're always happy to see you. I'm going to continue to lose Luna now, aren't I? Because she's trying to keep up with her friends. Luna! I wonder if we're best walking back the other way. Luna, you good girl! You are a crazy beast.

Come on. Has she been for a swim? Luna, did you go for a swim? Are you wet? She is. Oh, you little witch, honestly. How did you get in the water? I don't want to know.

I think we'll go back this way. You are a monkey, though. Come on, Luna. I hope that's not the smelly part of the pond. I don't think it is. I think, you know what? One of the wonderful things about getting a dog is I've sort of stopped caring about dirt and the smells.

You just have to. I also think that they, you can keep a dog clean. A dog doesn't have to smell. All right, Amanda. get the hint. No, he doesn't. I'm sure he doesn't. He looks really clean. Does he smell? He struggles sometimes with over. I'm not going to lie. I know. I see people slightly exchanging looks when he walks. I do have to, I spend a lot of time keeping clean. Is it his breath or his coat? I mean, I've asked that about so many men I've dated over the years.

What was the deal breaker, his breath or his coat? Usually it's the coat. And do you ever have him trimmed? I do sometimes. He gets trimmed in the summer, but do you know what? It was so his personality that coat because he was always a bit strange and not like any of the other dogs.

And I quite like that about him. So I wanted to keep his uniqueness and oddness. Absolutely. But I mean this time of year, he must get, just start dragging along all these dried leaves. Well, do you know, I make sure he keeps a tidy undercarriage. I make sure that...

So take me back to Wakely Manor. It wasn't as grand as that, trust me. Was it? So it was sort of... It was happy and chaotic. Was it? Yes, absolutely. Medical people are obviously...

They have a very distinct type of personality and generally in order to be able to do that. What was the sort of household energy like? Was he quite... organized and reliable and dependable. It was what I would call an old-fashioned marriage, which definitely worked in, I would say, God, mum, I hope you do agree. But I know you do.

They wouldn't have been married for that long. My father was just the most loving man on the planet. And he was a surgeon in the days when surgeons were general, rather than now they're very, very, very, very specialised, which I'm sure is probably better. So if you're, you know, you're an ankle surgeon now, you don't touch a knee or anything else generally. He would be doing everything from, you know,

whatever it was in Chester Royal Infirmary. And he was the senior surgeon there, highly respected, very loved. I mean, talking about dogs, I do remember our Christmas Day ritual was always, we would get up, do our stockings, and then we would take the dogs, generally the Jack Russell's, not the Labrador, and we'd visit Dad's patients in the Royal Infirmary on Christmas morning. the whole all of us all the kids mom would stay at home with the turkey and dad would park his car and walk through the front door of the royal infirmary with one or two jack russells under his arms and plonk them on the patient's beds as he did his ward round they would absolutely i mean he wouldn't get away with it now would you but they would love it you know they were in hospital for christmas and he was there with his family

just checking on their welfare. And when he died, I'm not exaggerating. My mother must have got hundreds of letters from people we didn't know, but talking about how my father had touched their lives, or saved their lives or whatever it was, or save their marriages because he'd given them some really good counsel. In an era when that's just a... what you did.

Yeah. We still have all those letters. It was really, it was very moving to know how far his goodwill had spread. You have two brothers you had and were you quite a tomboyish kid or were you? Yes, absolutely. I mean, oh, Raymond's on strike. He's put the brakes on. What's going on, darling?

Oh Raymond, why have you gone on strike? He says, we're going far too fast. We're this ridiculous Labrador wearing a red bandana. Do you know what it is sometimes? He sees something which frightens him. Oh no, Raymond. It can be, often it's a wheelie bin. What's up?

What did you see, darling? Or did you want to do a poo-poo? Oh, do you need a poo? Oh, no, he's sitting down. You could just probably fit in my pocket, Raymond. You really could. You're very, very sweet. I think he wants to be carried.

Do you think he does? Yes. Oh, you're such a lazy bones. Come on, let me carry you for a bit. Yes, I am not carrying 25 kilos of you, Mrs. No. Can I say Amanda wasn't talking to me just then? Sorry.

I was looking at Luna. That's the trailer. So go on, yeah, I can see you as a tom boy. In the nice way that, particularly girls that grew up with brothers, You know that's not in the country and things that sometimes happens. Yeah, no, I want to play with their cars and go windsurfing and water skiing with them and dolls just and to this day freak me out. So I wasn't one of these sort of girly girls that dresses their dolls. It wasn't until I could actually start dressing myself that I got interested in clothes.

Right. So it wasn't from dolls. Yeah, I was going to ask. So often with fashion designers, that starts very young, doesn't it, that interest? And it's spurned by one person, like, is often a family member. And I know, was your grandmother quite influential in that regard? Both of my grandmothers and my mother were super stylish and they travelled quite a lot. And then we would sort of inherit their cast-offs into the dressing.

up box which was enormous. It was this giant chest on the landing at home. I remember it clearly. And my parents were incredibly tolerant about me slicing up things that were in the dressing up box and sort of remodeling them. And was your mom quite stylish? She was actually. What was her sort of look if you had to describe it? I mean, I remember her in the 70s. She was, you know, wearing flared jeans and platforms and it was in the era when the butcher would come in a van, the milkman would come. And the 70s, there was, you know, women went through a phase, or some women went through a phase.

Maybe it was sort of more in the country than London, but I don't think it was, I think it was sort of fashion, that quite a lot of women wore wigs because it was just to easy. You know, it wasn't the blow-dry era that we're in now. And so my mother, blest her, poor thing. I would think it was the best thing to run out and tell the milkman or the butcher or that Mommy had a wig on. And now I'm mortified that I did that to her. But anyhow, she thought it was the funniest thing.

Luna's met her friend. And Luna is just friends with anyone and everyone. one she can. Come on, Luna, let's go. So yeah, so your mum was quite stylish and I like the idea of you, you see, when you say you told the butcher or the whoever, you know, the milkman or whatever, that thing about, my mom's wearing a wig. She's wearing her wig today. She's wearing her wig today. Just to clarify. Hello. That shows me quite a mischievous little girl as well. Yeah, oh, Definitely. Definitely, definitely, yes. And actually, I still think it's important to have a laugh, not take life too seriously.

And that's what sort of slightly saddens me. I think we've become almost overly woke that we're frightened to make a joke of something because I grew up in, not in a cruel way, absolutely, because I really consider myself to be kind. but just in the way that I grew up in a household that was very much, if you love someone, you tease them. And so we grew up, you know, taking the Mickey out of each other. And it sort of hones a sense of humour in a way. Do you think as well, because I have a lot of friends,

like Adam Kaye, who's a friend of mine, who was a doctor, obviously, and is now, he then became a comedian, he wrote the book, this is going to hurt, you know, all about the NHS and he. What's interesting is you see this a lot in comedy. There is a real connection between medicine and comedy and I wonder if I imagine with your dad's job, you're such of humour must be a real relief. Totally. What you're dealing with every day. Totally. Medics, because I grew up all around them. My grandfather was a very prominent surgeon in fact was knighted for services to medicine you know he was on one of the

he was he he went to war and was on from one of the major hospital ships and still to this day one of my favorite possessions is his silver identity bracelet you know Cecil wakely C of E you know HMS Garth castle and I you know if ever I sort of want a little bit of grandpa with me I pop it on. And it's, and you know, it's valueless, but to me it's probably one of my most pressured possessions. You see, Cecil, wait, too. I bet he had a Jack Russell or two. Oh, they had dachshunds, and he had a giant belly. And he had such a sense of humour.

Oh, my God. And he was the best grandpa in the world. I mean, we would, they, he would work this crazy week, drive up to Cheshire. spend the weekend with us and I am not joking I can remember climbing into bed with him at sort of 5 a.m in the morning God he must have had about four hours sleep and lying on his big belly I mean I must have been four had these thick wincey up pajamas on and I'd say tell me a story grandpa and he would make up these incredible stories about sausage the sausage dog and Susan and it was like Enid Blyton but coming out of my grandfather's mouth just at 5 a.m. in the morning

and when we really should not have been waking up our poor grandpa, but he had this incredible imagination, sense of humour. And I do think when you're dealing with life and death all day every day, it is quite a tonic, isn't it? Or it must be. You went to Cheltenham Ladies College. I did. And Cheltenham Ladies' College has this sort of reputation, doesn't it? Why?

It has this reputation for being highly academic. Yeah. And the thing I would say about it is it is highly academic, but what is brilliant about it is whatever you're good at, they bring that out in you. You know, even if that's, I'm not even, but if it's art, if it's hockey, whatever it is, they focus and make you the,

best possible version of yourself. And I think there's something really delightful about that theory. And I suppose in a way that was what I was trying to do as a designer is make women the best possible versions of themselves. So that inspired me. The other thing I felt very privileged about, oh my God, Luna. Or now she'll go bonkers now. Please don't jump off that wrong. rock though. Come on, let's go. Oh, she's going bonkers. Can I say what's currently happening? Luna is in, it appears to be some sort of steeple chase with about six other dogs. Luna is very much leading the way. She's about three laps ahead. Oh, go on, Luna.

She is trouble with a capital of tea. Children are actually shouting Luna at her. Oh, no. Oh, my God. She's the absolute. pack leader of trouble, isn't she? Now you know her nickname is lunatic, you know why. So when you were at Cheltenham, what were you popular? I imagine you were, because you're very beautiful and I can imagine people would, and you're warm. Do you know what? Which don't take this wrong with me. That's quite an unusual combination because beautiful people don't normally have to be warm. Well, thank you. And I'm, I think, I think we should all be warm. I think it doesn't cost anything to smile at someone.

Sometimes I smile at people in the park and they look at me like, I don't know you. Why are you smiling at me? But I think, you know, I'm a big believer in smiling at everyone. And the thing about Cheltenham that I really, really loved

was that it was so international. There were girls from all around the world. I don't know if it's changed now, It was very uncomplicated. And I don't know whether that was because it was all girls and we were all in a uniform the whole time, apart from at the weekends. But it wasn't that sort of crazy competitiveness.

It was so warm. And when I went back, God, I went back about 15 years after I left to open their new art and technology wing. And I hadn't been back. once because you know boarding school not for everyone I did miss my parents and my pony and my dogs and brothers and god isn't that awful I put my brothers after my pony and dog did you miss your folks or how did you adjust okay to boarding was that a sort of successful experience for you um do you know what it taught

me how much I really loved my family because you know when you're growing up and it's you're all hugger-mugger and you know and as a as you sort of past 10 as a girl you then start to pull away from your mother and want to make your own clothing choices and you know whatever um my my mother will always say to this day, I needed to go away by the time I went to school. Just, oh, hello. You've also been in the river or the pond. Oh, he's very handsome. Hello. What's he? Is he a lab? Yeah. He's a big golden lab. He's slightly different looking. Soaking wet. With labs, they're, there are, yeah, no, all good. all good

so some are more a stockier breeds than the sort of what's known as the field dogs which is what

that's like me I'd be one of those stocky you wouldn't stop it you're petite and refined and what were we saying

so yes I probably I probably needed to have some space to realize that life is actually not full of happy families it's you know you have to work out who you are yourself you have to work out your friendship group and become an individual that's

interesting so you think what it may be taught you was also it gave you the tools in order to sort of individuate yourself from your family. Definitely, definitely. And I'm very grateful for that. And also the confidence that you're fine on your own. You're not on your own. You're in this big school surrounded by incredibly kind sort of house mistresses and teachers and you know, your contemporaries. But you can't go running home. to mummy to say so-and-so said this about me. It's actually, you said this about me, I don't like that, and this is why I don't like it, and that's why I don't think it's very kind. Let's move on. I guess you grow up quicker, perhaps, perhaps, I don't know. By this time that you were at Cheltenham,

this sort of idea of having an interest in fashion and clothes being something you were passionate about, when that really started to become clear to you that that's where your career was headed? No, absolutely not. I knew I loved it. You know, I'd make clothes pretty much the whole school holiday because I just loved it. So I'd go back to school and I'd be wearing my new navy leather pants that I'd made in the in the holiday and friends would say, oh my god, I just love those that try them on and then I'd be having commissions for the next holiday to make something for a friend. So it was early entrepreneurialism,

which actually would then fund my next outfit. But that is entrepreneurialism in there, isn't it? Because not everyone has that. Most people would say, oh, I'm glad you like them. Oh, yeah, I must make those for you. And then it would never happen. Yes.

God, it probably sounds a bit, mean that I didn't just make them. No. No, what I mean is you would say you would do it, but ultimately it would never into your head at that young age that this was a business model. Yeah, it was completely instinctive, I think.

And it was a means to an end. But I think that's interesting because it's not, isn't that a bit mean? What you're doing is you had a sense quite early on of placing a worth on your time. Well, that's exactly it. Holidays were finite.

and if I was going to go off to Manchester to choose the leather by the lining the zips the everything else which I loved I loved the whole process but yes it is you know that that was sort of a day and then the cutting the making the all the rest of it so yes I had it it was a way of me sort of marking my worth you knew your own value you went off, I know you spent some time in America was that after you left school? Yep, I went off there when I was 19. And were you a model?

Yes, but very part-time. Oh, tell me about modelling. It was a means to an end. It was back in the 80s. It was just a way of not having to have a full-time job because I could just do a modelling job and then not worry about it until the money nearly ran out

and I could then go and get another couple of jobs. It was very hand to mouth. Did you enjoy it? I loved it. I loved the freedom. Are you a good model? I'm sure I was crap. Did you have opinions about what you were wearing though?

Do you know what you mean? I wonder, was it showing them? Were you thinking, oh, I don't think this is, this could be cut better? No, no, it wasn't because actually I started off in, I was living in Florida to start with and so it was when the designers sort of started doing trunk shows

so Emmanuel Ongaro's collection would come over or the Leweve leather collection from Spain would come over and would do these little runway shows probably at the breakers or... Were you doing runway? Yeah. See that's the elite though isn't it?

Well no not really because it was you know it was regional it was provincial it was I mean Provincial Louvre, Provincial Angora. You worry about sounding grand and like you're quite self-deprecating, aren't you? Yeah, I am actually. I'm not good at, I'm not good at saying I'm good at this. I've tried to get better at least sort of patting myself on the back every now and then when I've done sort of achieved a milestone or whatever.

It's really interesting that you said, oh well, no, it wasn't proper modelling. You know. No, that is. Yeah. That's, as elite as it gets. It was. It was.

Yeah. It was. And we must have been good. In an era when we actually had to do a one and a half turn at the end of the catwalk. And I don't know if I could still do that, but you had to twist, twist, twist and step out of it. Can I say Amanda's just done it? Yes, she's wearing walking boots and parker. Still, I felt transport.

So the Milanese runways. These were not Milanese. But then I moved up to New York. My modelling actually took me up to New York. And... Did you ever have... Because you're sort of slim, naturally, obviously, you're quite athletic.

And what was the sort of scrutiny like from that point of view? Did you ever feel... Yes. Pressure to lose weight, did you? To be a certain... Or to maintain it? Well, just quite simply because the sample sizes were...

particular size and so yeah you know when I was living and working in Florida I would survive off great fruit half the time because it's a big it's a big mass of food with not many calories and a bit of sugar it wasn't great for my teeth I have to say but you know I didn't have an eating issue I just knew that I had to you know be a certain weight and shape and size to be able to do what I was doing. And it allowed me the privilege of working closely with these beautiful clothes and to see them inside and out and that really opened my eyes to, you know, beautiful garments. Oh, look at this Amanda. What's this? I think it's a fun fair that they're

building. Oh, thank you very much. Well, we'll keep away because we've got dogs that hate them. We hope everyone has a safe, nice bonfire night. But our boys are going to be in, aren't they? Yes. Well, I'm sure this will be responsibly organised. Nice to meet you. Oh, Raymond's running fast from that. I think I nearly wanted to debate.

I think I had to wrap it up because I don't like bonfire night. She was very good to be sure. She was. She knew her stuff. She knew her stuff. And you know what? I would say that was a real example of how, you can disagree with someone agreeably.

Yeah. Two women, this is what happened. Yeah. I'm interested, when you came back from America, it seems like you were very influenced by the style aesthetic over there. I really was. And you couldn't find that look in the UK, which is kind of what inspired you to create your own design.

Yes. Is that right? Completely and utterly. And, you know, I made a couple of pieces. when I came back and I remember being stopped in Browns on South Malton Street by one of the head buyers actually and said where did you get that black suede

floor-length duster coat from because of course we all need one of those don't we and I said I made it and I was about to start a you know a small line of them and she handed me her card and I sold to Brown early days and we should say Browns is a very beautiful you can explain what it is

which was Browns on South Malton Street and it was just the mecca of designer clothes back in the late 80s yeah and so your aesthetic you were known for this clean glam style which is it's very elegant it's a I'm gonna be honest it makes sense to me that you have a Labrador because understated, classic, classy, elegant, soft touch. And I've got a hairy, out-of-control mess. Oh, gorgeous. Look, you've both got long, flowing lots. It was interesting to think, well, that would have been the tail end of the 80s.

You started your label or you decided to start this. It was around 1990. 1990, yep. And we're coming out of the tail end of the 80s when that's the opposite of what we're seeing really in fashion, isn't it? Everything's about detail and excess. Yeah. But you felt, you just believed in this, didn't you? I did.

I did. And I wish I could say to you I had a massive great business plan to grow a brand and all the rest of it. Back in the day, I didn't. I, it was literally. Just instinct. Yeah. And you went to your dad. And did you sort of pitch him a proposal and say...

Yeah, not even as formal as that. You know, back in my father's day, you know, he was a medic. He wasn't a business person. But bless him, he loaned me, or they loaned me back, you know, whatever it was. And then I paid them back once I... So look, a startup loan, really, that you would have gone to the bank for. Yeah. But I wouldn't have known how to.

So that's really interesting though, because how old were you in your early 20s then? A lot of young people, they might have got the loan from the parent, but it might have ended up going on holidays and cocktails. No, I was super focused. And I created a small collection and I sold it literally from samples to friends and friends of friends. And I would only make to order. So it wasn't like I had a massive investment in stock and all the rest of it. I didn't.

And actually, it was a very good little business model that. And, you know, fashion is a really horrendously complex industry and business. And, you know, there's a lot of arguments for people to keep their brands or their labels really small, tight and stick to their knitting. Not everyone has to build a brand that is going to be ultimately scooped up by LVMH. Listen to those parakeets. Look at them. They're beautiful. The Jimmy Hendrix parakeets. Is that an urban myth? I think it's an urban myth but I don't know what the truth is about them. I want to believe it's true that he's responsible for them. They're sort of magical. I know they're a bit naughty.

Apparently, they sort of... But that's why you like them because you're a bit naughty. No, I don't like them terrorising other birds. But look how beautiful that is. Do they terrorise other birds? They do, apparently. You know what it is? Isn't that joyful, that colour?

I love that colour, that lime colour. You know, if I look like that, I terrorise people. Do you know what I mean? I'd be like, look, come on, look at me. Parakeets have so got the look at me, Dean, haven't they? They so have. But when you see a flock of them, flying, low, they're just magic. Oh.

Oh, Amanda, look at the Dalmatian. There's something very magical about Dalmatian. There's something quite thick about them too, generally. Sorry, but there is. I'm going to be hated now by trolled by Dalmatian owners, aren't I? Have a Labrador. I really hope you love part one of this week's Walking the Dog. If you want to hear the second part of our chat, it'll be out on Thursday.

So whatever you do, don't miss it. And remember to subscribe so you. You can join us on our walks every week.