Walking The Dog with Emily Dean - Charlotte Church (Part Two)

Episode Date: December 11, 2025

In part two of Emily and Ray’s walk with the wonderful Charlotte Church, joined by her dogs Selma and Holly, the conversation continues with more reflections on life, music, fame and finding a slower, more grounded way of living.If you haven’t already, make sure to catch part one, and if you’d like to explore Charlotte’s beautiful wellbeing retreat The Dreaming in Wales, or book a stay, you can find all the details at https://thedreaming.co.uk.Follow Emily:Instagram XWalking The Dog is produced by Will NicholsMusic: Rich JarmanArtwork: Alice LudlamPhotography: Karla Gowlett Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome to Part 2 of Walking the Dog with the Wonderful Charlotte Church and had two dogs Selma and Holly. Do go back and listen to Part 1 if you haven't already. And by the way, if you want to find out more about Charlotte's incredible retreat for Dreaming in Wales and book your stay there, go to thedreaming.co.uk. Really hope you enjoy part two of my chat with Charlotte and do give us a like and a follow so you can catch us every week. Here's Charlotte and Ray Ray. You know, my mum had a book when I was younger, and I wasn't old enough to, I used to laugh at her feminist books. Yes.

And she had a book called The Cinderella Complex. Yeah. And it was how women are taught to be picked. Yes. Men are taught to do and all this and to say, I don't know about money, silly me. Yes. But that fairy tale thing is fascinating to me. Yeah, totally.

And so, but also, like, when I think, in all of my learnings, now in this sort of spiritual path that I'm following and the ideas of, you know, archetypal feminine and masculine, and it's much more complicated than that, but often the masculine is quite, can be quite binary and can, yeah, and I think it's the feminine and, you know, in that sort of, in the ways of nature as well, in the ways of Mother Earth, that brings in that complexity and interrelational being between all the ecosystems. And also things which are like the feminine is like the wild,

the unruly, often the dark, the, you know, the womb space. the serpent and often I think particularly within those very hyper patriarchal capitalist places of being and places of life and of business they they often have quite a quite a negative view of other humans as well like people are stupid so so much of like when I've had meetings with TV companies or um with um I mean also all sorts of people in all sorts of industries which which would be considered showbiz yeah they've got a really low opinion of the general public and I'm always like no like that is not the way that people are and anyway you've a duty you hold all this power um then there's a duty to not keep giving people the lowest common denominator i said you know i'm so loved that you said that because frank skinner who i've worked

with a long time he has very similar due to you because you know he'll use a word and someone will say well people won't know what that means he'll see great yeah they've learned something new yeah they'll look it up why would i choose an inferior word that doesn't sum it up when we should constantly be chasing knowledge and experience. Yeah, and intelligence as well. Like nature is enormously intelligent. Nature is enormously complex and really what I believe that we should be doing in every industry and in every area of life is mimicking the systems of nature because nature's had billions of years of evolution in which to perfect its systems and you know the systems are elegant this elegant

yeah do you know what this is honestly we're standing at the top just staring out into the sea with the the sunset setting and I feel so happy oh good crying I'm so happy is that weird why is that it honestly was I felt quite moved is that a bit weird no it's not at all it's moving it's really moving nature isn't it massively moving and especially like you know if you're not used to particularly a horizon like this you know yeah we're deep we're so yearning for this and this is what the dreaming is all about like we're deeply deeply yearning to be interwoven and in deep relationship with our our natural earth our

mother and I think the fact that I've just cried at the sunset means I need to come to the dream I think you too I've got it written all over me I think you do can I find that more about it so this is this beautiful property you bought yes just we say if you want to find out the background behind this story do watch Charlottes Dream build on Discovery Plus on Amazon Prime I watched it but you can any wherever you get your Discovery Plus and you bought this beautiful home for a doll doll doll yes which was the former home of Laura Ashley yes and I get the feeling you weren't thinking oh I'm going to buy this extraordinary house and turn it into a retreat you were

more thinking loki glamping in fields kind of thing yeah and then you fell in love with it didn't you yeah I mean I feel like that land literally lassoed me and I've been its faithful servant ever since and I'm in deep relationship with that place it's deep in massively deep in my relationship with trees and birds and water and with myself with my purpose and what I want to do in the world is made things crystalline clear to me who I am and and what my what my work is here and I just love it it's such an honour and a privilege to create retreats and experiences for people where they feel safe enough to sometimes after a whole lifetime to rest and to let go of some stuff that is weighing them down

that is keeping them in a cycle of addiction or unhappiness or whatever that might be it's just so joyful to be a part of it so to be honest I just feel totally enamoured

and also just in awe in awe and wonder at the whole thing and you know it's not just me I put in the sort of initial life energy and money and such but there's very hands on I mean yeah I was kind of shocked

if I'm on honest, by how hands on you were, that you were every detail. Oh, yes. Every wall collar, this poor cousin of yours is having to re-paint this bloody wall. This is meant to be the womb. It doesn't look like the right color for a womb. It's not fleshy enough.

What about this? No. And you know if you'd like it, because Charlotte walks into a room and she go, oh, that's lush. I was like, OK, she's happy. Well, I wanted to create somewhere that really really felt like you were stepping into a different realm you know and it does it feels like heaven on earth there's something so special about the energy of that

land but also I wanted it to be affordable so that all sorts of people like people like I grew up with could afford to go and stay and have that experience we've also got to pay what you can yeah we've got to pay what you can space on every retreat so even if you can just afford a five or a night you can come But I wanted people to feel precious. Yeah. I wanted to create, yeah, so the rooms are like, and the beds are like little dens.

They're like adult dens and the beds, like the beds are just the best. They're like nest, they're so snugly. But yeah, I just wanted people to remember that they are absolutely precious and unique. And I'm not saying that in any sort of. of like, I hope that doesn't come across as too, like, sickening or cheesy, but, you know, I genuinely marvel at what, at human beings and the shit that people have been through and how resilient people are and how compassionate and tender. And it just blows my mind. and yeah so it really is an honour to be custodian to this beautiful place

and to keep creating these experiences for people I love that you all say you're custodian of the land yes do you know I say that about my animal yeah I say I'm not his owner I'm a custodian of his soul yes do you know what I mean because I feel I don't own him he while he's here I've been blessed to look after him yeah and maybe that's how you feel about the land exactly absolutely yeah and that's all we ever are to anybody you know even

there's a beautiful karl gil bram poem um which is i can't remember what it is but basically saying that your children are not your own that's quite a thing to acknowledge isn't it oh enormous can are you there yet yeah yeah i also set up a um a charity called the owen project which is a free to attend democratic school in the forest. Which is amazing, isn't it? Yeah, and that is all about that. Like, there is another supremacy, apart from white supremacy, which is adult supremacy,

which so many of us are completely unconsciously part of. And what is that, Charlotte? What you mean, like sort of thinking we control kids' lives? Yeah, so when you look at First Nations peoples, over the world and their approaches to parenting and education like it is absolutely understood at the core that whilst we care for and look after like we don't have control like they will all they always have autonomy and they always have their freedom of choice and the idea of like coercing would be like completely frowned upon so

again you know it's all interwoven with the way society is how much you know capitalism dominates everything and everybody's lives and everybody's ways of being but and the industrial revolution you know it's all you can't really talk about how we've got to this place that we're in with the poly crisis of things that are happening whether it's the climates whether it's the rise of fascism, whether it's, you know, the wealth accumulation, it's all so interconnected with everything else, you know, with colonisation, with... But I find it you fascinating because a lot of people, you know, sell 10 million records, make a bit of money. And by the way, I can understand this. They think, well, look, I can afford to look

after my family now. Yeah. Put up some electric gates. Yeah. Keep the riffraff out. Yeah. I sort of feel that's not what you did. I just bloody love the riffraff, don't I?

I do. That's genuinely it. I bloody love the riffraff. That's the next TV. But I suppose, like, I'm just deeply invested in the world. But you've always been like, that haven't you and I think I just think it's quite unusual because I understand there's a part of human nature and I know people but I think

started out with the best intentions probably quite left-wing or probably and then suddenly what happens is the money comes and the success comes and it just erodes away a bit at you and it becomes like oh yeah but it'd be nice if we had a bit more for us yeah but I mean but also I think it's kind of It's complicated, isn't it? Like, I'm trying to get rid of my wealth bias. What do you mean by that? Towards wealthy people. Because, you know, I've been generations and generations of my kin have been paupers.

Right. And... But I think it's possible to be wealthy and have values. Absolutely. What I mean by values is just treating people with kindness. Yeah. That's what it comes down to. But also, we're getting to a point, I would argue, where, like, the world, needs all of us like shit is going down and we we are one we are one and we need to

act together so it's like where what what role do you choose in it is it is do you want to fight for rivers do you want to fight for homeless folk do you want to think about you know planting trees that there are so many um ways to engage in in the world maybe you want to work overseas and work in the global south do you want to be charlotte church and do all of these things absolutely is it education is it there's there's so many ways in which you can you can be of service and and i and i honestly believe that that is where everything and everyone is going anyway. So whether you're doing it now

or whether you'll be doing it in three years or in five years, there will not be a choice, I believe. Summer! Come on, Holly! Oh, do you know, I've got a bit of the church voice then and I've got slight tingles. I still get that when I hear your voice. Sometimes when I, even when I was watching your documentary series, and you'd be doing some exercise with them in the garden or in the forest or something,

and you'd go, oh, this voice, and I'd go, oh my God. How powerful to have that, you know, always, that impact it can have on people. Yeah. I'd like to ask you, what do you think of regular therapy, Charlotte? Would you do it? I do do it, do you? Mine is quite spiritual. Yeah.

So it's quite encompassing of great mystery. Yeah. And yeah, I am really a student of First Nations peoples and the biocultural landscape of Indigenous people. indigenous peoples i really think that but you see you're better than me then because i just go and say i really got an issue with my mother yeah you don't do that in therapy you talk about other people yeah but i think that within so within a uh in often in in first nations cultures like the daguerre um or maybe some communities in um in south america

in the Amazon a lot of what a lot of what I hear people saying is that when this when there's something wrong with somebody in the community whether that's physical health or mental health mm-hmm they believe that it is an opportunity they're happy that that's come to the fore because something's wrong in the whole tribe and it is like the whole tribe's opportunity and responsibility in which to help that person. We all fix it together. Yeah.

We'll fix, but we all talk through this and... And also they would say that the way in which we do it in the West, again, which is in this atomized way, you go and you speak to your therapist, is not optimum. I mean, I do it and I find it, you know, very useful and I've got friends who are amazing, amazing therapists. but I am interested in this sense of the collective and in community because I think the wound at the core of the earth is separation and it is showing up in every which way it possibly can whether it's you know how tech addiction and people's addiction to their phones and stuff is is affecting every different type of relationship well like do you know one of the things that slightly bothered me come here Ray And we need to get in a picture and we can't see you over there. You're useless. Come here. I noticed with my therapist started going on Zoom and for me, that just didn't work.

Yeah. And I felt so old-fashioned. Yeah. An analogue that that bothered me. But I feel part of it is the connection being in a room physically with someone. Of course it is. And being down Zoom, it felt very corporate. I was just like, no.

Come here, Ray. But the other thing you've got to think about is. So, for instance, your nervous system is connected, like our nervous systems are essentially, you know, these amazing sensing tools and your nervous system is regulated by my voice, by my face. By your voice. No, no, no. And mine is regulated by your facial expressions, your voice. so if you if you start coming at me or if you're you know if I'm frowning at you like I am now or if I started you know speaking in a big voice or you know your your nervous system would react and so of course when you're in a room with somebody it makes an enormous difference because we are these like amazing

instruments of sensing and so when you're very calm I can't explain you've got a very I would say you had a hit very healing energy Oh, thanks, honey. Do you know what I mean? I can't explain it. There's a very... Yeah, there's something about you. I don't know what it is, Charlotte Church, but whatever it is.

Can you hold on, please? So I need to ask you my new guru about traitors. We talked about celebrity traitors because Jonathan Ross, who's very important figure in both of our lives for different reasons. He married my best friend and he kind of helped discover you. And you recently did celebrity traitors with him. How did you find that experience? It was far more emotional than I was expecting.

And I would love to see a version of the traitors where they edit. it for because the way they edit it you know it's for um it's for lightness and like entertainment I mean it's this like it's an incredible tally isn't it but I would love to see a version where they add where they edit it for like you know the the the group dynamics like the deep psychological nature of the game which it truly is Holly Selma come up be come on um yeah I would love to see that version. But yeah, it's emotionally intense. What did you discover about yourself that surprised you? I discovered that, um, come here. I, like, as soon as I went in

there, I said, certainty is the enemy. I am going to stay in uncertainty and just like, and I did completely the opposite, immediate. And I was like, it is Nicco, it is Claire, it is Tamika, and it is Celia. And I was absolutely sure. Did you ever suspect Jonathan at all? Towards the end, towards as I was leaving, I did, I was like, hangar, banger. Your outfits suggest that you are a really, you are like a bond villain. hidden plain sight. He definitely did.

Samma! Come up, baby! You know what he did say to me, which is interesting? I'll pass this on to you. Yes, please. I was telling him that I was coming to meet you today and he was so thrilled because he genuinely adores you, Charlotte. Oh, blessing. He does feel, you know,

you've been a big part of his life and he remembers you so fondly from when you're a kid and so I think he did say to me you know, how sort of emotionally intelligent and intuitive you are. knows that he thinks of you is incredibly bright so I wonder if that would have been maybe had you stayed in longer I think you might have rumbled them quite soon I've got to say though

right because on the telebox you know you're you watch two hours of it a week yeah whereas you know we're in there for like 10 to 12 hours a day yeah so I will say in the faithful's defence the three of those folk their ability to lie was extraordinary so that's what I'm so what I'm saying is they're lying their deception their deceit was so well practiced that they were almost impossible to detect and Jonathan has just sent over those jets at that point so that this is unusual what I will say yeah is knowing how much Jonathan adores you. Yes.

I'm sorry, I'm going to throw Alan under the bus here. Yes. I don't think it was Jonathan's idea. I think Alan and Kat will have been the architects. I don't know that. Yes. But I will be finding out. Yes.

But you were, I just think, I think you came out of that show brilliantly. And I think it really showed. I felt quite humbled by it. I'm not going to lie. Yeah, I did feel quite humble. humbled by it because because actually I was I was quite emotionally wrought. Why? Well just because I you know I what my teenagers say I deep it all the time.

Oh yeah, I'm gonna go so deep. I deep everything all the time and so of course I was I was deepening hard. So everything had had immense emotional complexity and meaning and nuance to me. So Alan came in a minute, oh I don't laugh. yeah I'm deeping it yeah I was totally deep in it and so yeah I was all right yeah I was all right getting murdered because I was quite emotionally wrought also you've got your family to come back so I know a lot of people were thinking that we haven't mentioned them but I should say you've got two three wonderful kids now yes yes and your lovely husband who we

met on the show yeah who I love john Yes. I feel like you really can tell you're very twin soul. You know, like you're very aligned, aren't you? Oh my gosh. I absolutely love him. He's exquisite. He's an exceptional musician. He's a beautiful writer. He's really clever. He's really sensitive. What would he say about me? What would you say is the hardest thing to deal with Charlotte? Oh, with me? Yeah. It's the fact that I am, like, I've got such enormous personal capacity that, like, I'm a roller coaster. I'm an absolute rollercoaster of, like, yeah. Which way this way? Summer!

Come here. I can take the other leave. Come here. I've hit this. Which way up here? Yeah. I'm an, oh, we can walk along the beach a little bit more. Yeah, we'll walk you to where you need to.

So is it more that it's kind of, we're doing this, no, we're doing this, or. When you say capacity, do you mean, what do you mean by that? You don't stop or? Yeah, sort of I don't stop. I'm also very agile and so, and fluid. And so I think that, yeah, I think I'm just a bit of a roller coaster to be partner of. and um but he loves it he loves it i think they all they all love it my kids love it as well because it's exciting i bet you're quite evolved in arguments though because you've done a lot of

work on yourself so i can't imagine you being a shout or a screamer um i mean it depends um but not really because also i think that i'm um yeah that i'm what there's a great uh storyteller called Clarissa Pinkola Estes. She's a psychologist and seventh generation Mexican-Hungarian storyteller and she talks about the squinty eye and you know if if we are elder well then the elders should teach you about the squinty eye and to have the squinty eye really means just to see beyond to question you know that actually there is so much going on under the surface of what people say, you know, what people present, what you yourself say in present. And to develop the squinty eye just means that you're always questioning

and you're always curious and you're always, you know, reaching out with empathy and compassion because there's just so much going, so much more going on than meets the eye. And so I think particularly in arguments and such as well, then I give it the squinty eye. I'm like, okay, what's going on here? Well, a friend of mine who was in AA once taught me, first question you should ask is,

what's my part in this? Yeah. And I find that quite helpful. Yes. Because what it means is that as long as I always, that question even when someone hurts me unintentionally or something I think okay I've done some sort of accountability I haven't run away from this yes and then I'll give a fairer assessment and if guess what if I come out the other side and

decide no it was your fault it definitely is yeah but I suppose the thing is as well like when you when you look into the neuroscience of things like this so there's something in neuroscience called memory face bias and so it means that your brain is self-editing to present you in the best light I love my brain for that as a survival mechanism your PR yeah so as a survival mechanism so so when you think about when you when you remember something different to your partner or your sister or whoever and you're both swearing blind no this didn't happen this happened often often you are both

genuinely remembering like what you remember it's gone through your own filtering system and so I think what we need to what we need to remember is that like everything is a field of possibilities like and and like objective truth is so so so so elusive well you know Charlotte don't you think that's why which is much more of a modern take and I like this take that actually what matters is not the intent it's how that person felt so actually if you say something and someone feels a certain way it's valid for them to say well that made me feel i'm not saying you meant to hurt me or what you've said was inherently bad but i can tell you how i felt yeah you know yeah and i think this it's

and equally the person who said it can say well i can tell you i didn't mean it in that way yeah you know both things are valid and if we take it out of the ego like we take it out of the small self and you think about yourself as like basically you are walking water holding up a consciousness you're wandering round as walking water experiencing like stuff as a consciousness so when you get the sort of personality and the ego not out the way because we don't want to like we need ego we needs personality, we need character, but we need to develop it. It's not about like totally getting rid of it and like, you know, siphoning it off somewhere. But when you start to think about, when you sort of like step back and you start to think about interactions and stuff like

that, everything changes. And also you become so much larger, so much more tolerant, so much more curious and then therefore sort of less impacted by other people's shit. Joel, can you be my therapist? You know, honestly, I find it very uplifting being with you. Oh, bless you. You've had this extraordinary life that I'm going to be honest, might have messed up a few people. Yeah. I hope you don't mind me saying that.

Oh, not at all. Absolutely. It is, it is, it was a fucking, whoo, it was a, it was a ride. All the ingredients were there to use to be a complete mess. Totally. And you're not. No. You're an incredibly evolved, kind of warm, generous-hearted person.

And I think that's down to you. And I think, as you say, your family and... But yeah, it's such a lovely experience meeting you. Oh, thank you so much. so much that's so kind oh well I've had a lovely one lovely wonder she smells lovely as do I what is that that's surprising I never smell nice I don't wear any deodorant or anything so I generally generally stink I just not wearing deodorant I'm going to do that I don't shave anymore I don't shave anything um when did I stop I stopped shaving probably about 18 months ago

think forget it maybe even longer than that maybe two years and I stopped wearing deodorant I just started thinking do you know what like this this area this underarm area there's so many receptors there lymph and you know all sorts of stuff going on there I'm just not sure about sticking all of this chemically stuff in these pores because your skin is so you know it's the it's the largest organ in the body. It's everything we put on our skin goes into our bloodstream. I'm definitely never understood that whole like for jazz or than I just think that's weird. Yeah totally. I mean each to their own. Do you know what I mean like I just mean have a lovely time do whatever feels good

diet shave it whatever but for me I'm just like anything you feel pressure to do is a woman that's my thing. So I have friends who love nails and I get that. Yeah. They say see it as a very female space for them to hang out in and i i love that they enjoy that for me it fit i feel slightly oppressed having those long nails and that's me yeah that's not about them because they look great in those nails but for me it feels like there's so much there's already quite a lot of self-araiser involved in being a woman i and nails feel like an extra thing i have to do yeah but you're right i like that you've just made that decision for you and you thought I don't want to wear deodorant I'm not going to say yeah but that's me but I sort of love it

I love the contradiction of it so like I love wearing dresses beautiful dresses with my really hairy legs and heels and nails and just it's so confusing for people and I and I you know I've got my boobs out the majority of the time because I think they're a great litmus test or titmus test as my husband said because it really sort of separates out people who are But yeah, it separates out the perves immediately. Why? Because they don't know where to look. Yeah. So you can immediately go, okay, well, you're, you're really struggling with looking at my face. But it also separates out those who are like maybe deeply conservative or deeply religious and, you know, it's not necessarily that that's a bad thing or I need to mark out those people.

Nothing like that at all. But I... It's handy, though. I it is for me it's like it helps with my discernments to have my cleavage out regular with breastfeeding as well that when women breastfeeding public space that's a good marker as well yes how people react to that yeah totally I'm gonna do the Charlotte Church way forward now yeah do you know what the deodorant and the shaving it's so liberating is it and but also it in a way it makes me feel it's just even more I feel much sexier Charlotte Church, what a wonderful woman you are. We love you. Honestly, this has lifted my spirits, you know. Oh my God, you wait till you come to the dream in. What?

I'm absolutely so. Honestly, you will, your mind, but mostly your heart will be blown. Really? Yeah. It's gorgeous. It's so, it's so full of wonder and play and grief and joy and... Yeah. Look at Ray.

Charlotte. Ray Ray, Ray, Ray, Ray, Ray. Hello, Ray, Ray. Look at you. You're such a cutie pie. We're going to go to the dreaming. I don't think we're allowed dogs. You can stay somewhere, though. Can I, um, I'm going to ask if you have a message for Jonathan Ross. Do you have a message for Jonathan Ross? Post-traitors. Post-traitors. If I speak to him, what shall I say? Tell him that he needs to give the charity I run £100,000 and I'll forgive him. This one's hardcore. That's when I see the girl in the boardroom coming out. Everyone's like, oh, she wears these airy, fairy dresses, she's a mother-earth.

Don't mess with church. Totally. All the things, all the faces. I love him dearly, but he will only be reinstated as my TV dad if he gives £100,000 of my charity. Oh, for God, so he's going to absolutely murder me. What the fuck did you ask him out? I've already told him. I've already asked him to his face.

He was like, all right, mate, ease up. Well, you know what? We've come to the end of our walk. We have. I feel very uplifted. Well, thank you so much for coming to Wales to Camry. Do you know, I think I said to you at the beginning, my family are from here, my mum. I told you about my kleptomaniac grandmother.

It wasn't the best intro. But something very special about this place. I can see why you wouldn't want to leave, Charlotte. The magic is very close, very close to the surface. Yeah. And do you know what? What's interesting here is how, you're very well known, how lovely and respectful everyone is.

Yeah. I wonder if you'd get more bothered in London. Well, I'm always about, see? Yeah. And I have been for years. So pretty much everybody in Cardiff has had some sort of experience, conversation, whatever. So I'm old news around these parts. They're like, oh, it's just Charlotte.

She's not right. She's that eye. She's lovely. Oh, look. See that dog there? That's me when I enter the dreaming. Yeah. This is me when I leave, all calm and serene.

Honestly, you wouldn't believe it. Come here. Rayway. It's an imperial shih Tzu. Oh yeah, he's an imperial shih Tzu who's called Raymond. He's so silly, isn't he? Do you want to see him? Say hello, Raymond.

Good boy, good boy. Oh, thanks so much. It's my pleasure. Thank you for being so kind to him. I'm so glad you guys. Bye-bye. Bye. See bye-bye.

Bye. Ciao for now. Have a lovely warm. Bye bye. That's what I love about dogs, Charlotte. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? You've got his chats and...

I just love that. I think it's that connection we were talking about at the beginning that, that we lose so often. Yeah. And dogs, I think, return us to that place. Yeah. It's not weird to talk to someone. It's a way in, isn't it? That's what I think.

Yeah. Because I would never have talked to that man. He was a really interesting, fun man, who obviously... Yeah. And I wouldn't have, we wouldn't have had a, just because it would be weird to go up. You know, I always would be like, hey, have you ever had a dog? Well, I always think, when you have a dog, you say, what's the name? Where are you from?

If I walked up to you, I mean, excuse me, what's your name and where are you from? Yeah. I mean, everyone knows that in your case. No one was ever going to say that to you. But that is the thing with me, though, is that actually my husband says this to me a lot. It's like I've got a slightly skewed sense of people because... Is everyone quite nice to you? Well, some people are pretty mean, but in the vast majority,

in the vast majority, people have been a very interested. So I've not had a lot of sort of feeling left out or, you know, not seen. And don't be a douchebag, Holly. Oh, what, sorry, she's a bit funny when she's on the lead. Which are you going, we'll walk up with you? I'm going this way, my love. Oh, we'll walk up, Robbie. You were saying, because people, Johnny says this.

Yes. Because people are nice to you. I've seen if they were swimmers, but they're birds. Yeah. Well, yeah, just because it's almost like, I do feel like, People almost treat me because I've been famous for such a long time and because I was famous when I was a kid. Oh, yeah. People almost treat me like I'm a distant relative.

So, but then... Because they'll be like, I'm your mother, babes. That means you see the best of people. Maybe that's a good thing, though. I think so. You know, you see people at their best. But also, I think that if you're expecting people to be shit, then they will be. If you're expecting your teenagers to be untrustworthy, then they will be.

will be. By the way, if you can hear the noise, this is the noise of Fun Harbour. Fun Harbour Snooka Centre. It's an amusement. Loads of two P machines. Come on, Ray. I'm going to, I need to say goodbye to Charlotte, but I don't want to do it outside Fun Harbor because it's noisy. Where are you? Can we walk there? You can walk over here? Well, just walk you here, so it's left. I love you, Fun Harbor, but you're not helping my podcast. Oh, Charlotte Church. We've loved today. It's been such a lovely day. It's been really special. Lovely to meet you, Ray. And what did you think of Ray?

Did you like Ray? Ray's wonderful. Do you like his energy, Charlotte? I do like his energy. I think he's like, I think he's quite a little shy boy. He's got some Dalai Lama qualities as well. Yeah. He's drawn to Charlotte's press.

Sorry, Charlotte. I have told him about this. about this. It's absolutely fun. I get it, Ray. They are amazing. He's a boob man. I do apologize, Charlotte.

I have explained to him about the Me Too movement. We don't do this anymore. He's a bit stuck in the 70s. Oh, darling. Sweet little boy. Well, Charlotte, you are wonderful. And I'm going to see you when I come to the dreaming. Yes.

I can't wait. Hello motorbike. See, having been with Charlotte for the last hour or so, even when the motorbike passes, normally I'd be like, the bloody motorbikes running, and I'm like, hello motorbike. Hey, hey everyone. She's chilled me out. Oh, thank you wonderful Charlotte Church.

Really great to meet you. We love you, Charlotte Church. We love you too. I really hope you enjoyed that episode of walking the dog. And do you join us next time on Walking the Dog wherever you get your podcasts.