Walking The Dog with Emily Dean - Ferne McCann (Part One)

Episode Date: January 14, 2025

This week, we’re in Essex’s Thorndon Country Park with the fabulous Ferne McCann and her cockapoo Clemmie! Clemmie is a bit like her owner - charismatic, charming and incredibly well-groomed. Ferne tells us all about growing up in Essex - and how she started out her working life as a colourist at Vidal Sassoon, but knew that she was destined to do something more! We find out how she became a part of the cast of The Only Way Is Essex, and eventually what led to her making the decision to leave the show. Ferne is currently starring in the 2025 series of Dancing On Ice - you can watch Dancing On Ice on Sundays on ITV1 and ITVX!Follow @fernemccann on InstagramAll episodes of Ferne McCann: My Family and Me are available on ITVX!Follow Emily: Instagram - @emilyrebeccadeanX - @divine_miss_emWalking The Dog is produced by Faye LawrenceMusic: Rich Jarman Artwork: Alice LudlamPhotography: Karla Gowlett  Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

I'm not just saying this, but this has honestly been almost that kooky in the best possible way. I don't mind me saying that. But so much fun. This has been the best podcast I think I've ever recorded. This week on Walking the Dog, Ray and I popped over to the beautiful Thornden Country Park in Essex to go for a stroll with reality TV star presenter and entrepreneur Fern McCann and her adorable cockapoo clemmy. Fern first rose to fame on the show The Only Way is Essex and went on to start in her very own long-running reality series

Fern McCann, My Family and Me on ITV, which showed pretty much everything that was going on in her life from meeting her partner Laurie to raising her two girls, Sunday and Finty, and very excitingly for me, welcoming the adorable Clemmy into the family. Fern has always come across as very honest and unaffected in her TV show, But I think what really blew me away about her in person was just this warmth and positivity she emanates. She's also utterly hilarious. So there was a lot of laughter, mainly at Ray and I, the hopeless urbanites trying to navigate the mud.

But it was also fascinating just to hear the journey she's been on navigating life under this constant gaze of cameras. And how, with the help of therapy, she's finally reached a really good place? She's also someone who clearly loves the challenge. which is why she's currently competing in ITV's brand new series of dancing on ice with Skating Pro Brendan Hatfield. It goes out on Sunday evenings on ITV and Ray and I are not only huge fans of the show. We're also now totally team Fern.

So we'll be hitting those phone lines to vote for her, and I hope you will too. I absolutely love my walk with Fern, and I know you're going to love her as much as we did. I'll stop talking now and hand over to the fabulous woman herself. Here's Fern. And Clemy and Rewe. Can I just say, right, your dog, I was expecting its fur to be really coarse.

How dare you? What a pleasant surprise when I've stroked your dog. That's what Man I've said to me. Emily, oh my goodness, you've heard that before. So when they go to stroke and it's... I didn't expect it to be this sort of podcast. You've set the tone. You set the tone.

But you know what lovely soft fur? Oh, I'm so glad you like him, Fern. What is the breed? He's an imperial shih Tzu. What's the difference between a Shih Tzu and an Imperial Shih Tzu? Well, he's just a bit smaller. So lovely. Do you like him?

So lovely. Clemmy's a very nervous dog. So is Ray, actually. I've made Ray quite frightened of the world, so he never leaves me. Ray's got roots, isn't he? Has he got dry shampoo in? Right, come along, Raymond. Let's go in the can.

I'm actually going to leave Clemy on her leads. Are you why, Fern? Because, well, maybe, I don't know. Should I take her up? You've just made me sound like a, feel like a bad mother. Oh, there's the tree man. Should we get away from the tree men, Fern? Let's get away from the drilling.

Oh, wait, Clemmy's just marking her send. Oh, do you need a poo bag? I've got no I've come on what do you take me for but you're quite organised like are you the person that you know right I've always got poo bags I've got my water bottle I don't lose my keys or are you no I am disorganised

but I've had to learn to be better because especially having children having the dog and juggling so many things you really have to just, you know, if you want to... Sorry, is that a real pain? Oh, it's fine. Do you know what I love about having women on this podcast, everything? But I love the fact that women feel they need to apologise

for the fact there's a random tree cutter in the background. I'm so sorry about really all the way to Thorndon. How lovely is Thorndon, by the way? Oh my God, this is. So actually, Fern, yeah, talk us through where we are now. This is one of my favourite places. to come. It's Thorndon Country Park and I feel so lucky to be on the doorstep of such an amazing place in the world because you just wouldn't think that it's in the heart of Brentwood

and it's amazing because you've got the Gruffalo Trail here so look if you can see through there there's the can you see look come here there's the snake from the Gruffalo I'm actually taking you on the Gruffalo trail right now. I didn't know it was real. So yeah oh yeah it track so amazing. I thought he's a made up man. No, no, it's a real thing. It's a real thing and you're going to see the Gruffalo today. Is that just not that best experience? So yeah, it's just beautiful and do you know what right? Because we don't live in LA and I love that the hills that they all climb every single day. Yes, I watch that on real housewives. They do they go on hikes. Yeah, they go on hikes. It's real part of their culture. So there's right over the other side,

we probably won't make it, but it's almost like a little Essex hills and you can go on hikes. It's just gorgeous. I've done so much over here, like brought my kids here to play. I've trained for SAS here, obviously walk my dog. It's just a great place. So it's a bit of a backdrop to your life this place. Yeah, I just love being outside with all the trees and The sun beaming through. It's gorgeous. Do you know not? Oh, wait, hang on, is Clemy having a poo?

Oh. Do you know what, right near the dog poo bin? So, because I'm not going to walk around with the dog poo. Oh, yeah. Look at her tiny little poos, though. I feed her on a raw dog food diet. So do I. I've switched Ray to raw.

Have you? How are you finding it? Best thing. The only thing she's got really bad breath. Really bad breath. For everything else is just amazing. And do you know what? She gets so excited for her meals now. And that, like, for me, food is my love language.

I love talking about it. I love cooking. I love having people around. I love it when my kids eat my meals. And now that's extended on to Clemy. When she gets so excited, that fills up my cup when I see my dog smash her dinner in. I love me. Right, let's pick this poo up. Hang on. There, there, there. There. Good girl, Clemmy.

Clemmy's coming off the leave, right. How long have you been doing this pod? I've been doing it. Do you know what? Fern. I was very early to the party with podcasts. I got in early. So I started doing it seven or eight years ago.

Wow. Yeah. I got a dog because I went through just some quite sad times. I lost my sister and my parents and they all died. And I just thought, you know what? I need some joy. I'm going to get a dog. And I got Raymond.

Oh. And I started this podcast. as it all came from something sad it's like no a lovely thing now oh don't that's made me really emotional I'm so sorry you had to go through that but you know dogs they just give you so much

so much love my life wasn't complete until I had Clemy and she is just yeah look at how much she's just loving life Clemmy is adorable so Clemmy we should say

do you want to formally introduced Clemy. I feel I know a bit about her because I'm an avid fan of your show it became my family and me, didn't it eventually? Because you weren't a first time mum. That's why they changed it. So it was first time

mum and then the name changed to my family and me after having 15. I think there were 13 seasons. Yeah. I watched every single one. Oh, did you? I had that show. Oh. And we should say very sadly it's ended. It's come to an

and we'll get onto Y. Yes. And you've got something even more exciting happening soon. Yes. But I saw you getting Clemmy. Yeah. And I felt this was quite a bit of pressure from your daughter Sunday, wasn't it? It was desperate for a dog.

She was completely desperate for a dog. And I'd put off the idea for such a long time because I know that they are a huge responsibility. And I was pregnant at the time. So I thought, I don't want to bite off too much than I can chew. And my partner found a litter of cockapoo's, and he's just quite impulsive, and I love that about him. He's like, right, we're getting a puppy today. I was like, what?

I hadn't even let the film crew know, and I know that sounds ridiculous, but a big moment like that, they were not happy when we went to pick up a puppy, and the crew wasn't there. They was like, what? You know, these milestones in our life we had to share with the camera crew, but we had loads of footage on our phones and stuff.

But anyway, so we went, and what I loved is the dog chooses you because there was two girl pups, we knew we wanted a girl, there was this other one who was a gorgeous, like really deep copper red, and I loved her. Every time Sunday went near her, she growled. And Sunday and Clemy just instantly, oh no. See, I haven't got a very good recall. Clemmy here.

Girl, why are you barking or are you trying to make friends? Do you know what? Clemmy's a fabulous sort of sunny extrovert. She's like you find. Clemmy, she's actually quite nervous. Hi. Hello. Oh, these are gorgeous.

Are they longheads? Dowshounds? Yeah, longhead, sausage dog, yeah. Yeah. What are the names? Pablo in this one. Pablo? Pablo, yeah, this is Pablo.

He's a menace. That's Hector. He's another more social. Oh. Hector. Hello. Pablo and Hector? It's gorgeous.

After a couple of minutes but you'll do his best to avoid like any contact with other dogs or stuff. How often do you take your dogs out for walks every day? How often? Yeah. I like coming here and try to do like a bit and I want or something like that. Just do like... Every day?

Yeah. I need to get coming out for more walks. He is a funny wee one here. He is a bit of a funny wee one. This is Raymond. Hey, nice. What kind of breeds that? Um, I mean.

I mean, is he a dog at this point? I don't even know. He's so weird looking. He is an imperial shih Tzu. He's sort of giving like a little mini footstool. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? Like something, he's so perfect that you could just pop one foot on top of the other and watch a really good episode of something.

And I do frequently. Lovely to meet you. Oh, you see, that's interesting fun. Sometimes I've had all sorts on this podcast. And I think it's very interesting how people react to that first. fellow dog owner interaction. And you... I love it. You really like it, don't you?

I'm such a people person. I love socialising. And I guess that is definitely the perks and the beauty of being in the public eyes that people come up to you if they recognise you. I mean, that guy, you know, I love dog

walking chat. I love it. But yeah, I love getting the cut of someone and really getting to know people and I just love hearing about people's stories and yeah definitely a people person so I guess having a dog and going on dog walks you do get stuck into some really good chats and you we were talking about when you first got Plymy so it was Laurie who was your other half who was sort of his idea yeah the mastermind behind all this exactly super impulsive and like

I said, there was one that I loved and I loved the colour of her, but she just did not warm to Sunday whatsoever. Every time Sunday went near her, she growled so much. So I was like, right, okay, Sunday and Clemy were just inseparable. And that was it. She is a cockapoo, although I would argue with Laurie that she's more, I think she's definitely got more poodle. I don't think she look, in fact, I've never met a cockapoo, two cockapoos that look the same, because obviously there a mixed breed they all look different yeah and I just think Klemie looks like a lovely little toy poodle but she's yeah she just completes our family how gorgeous is this let's just bask in the sun oh heaven oh that's so nice so good isn't it yeah so

nice where's Ray oh there he's behind you Raymond do you like fun I think so he's a bit naughty is he really liked pretty women I'm afraid oh do you know what I mean, in that he's a bit of abusey fascist. He likes really good looking women. I can how can you tell? I just know. He just likes to be seen with them. He thinks, oh, this will look good for me. Maybe I'll get in the sidebar of shame. I call it the sidebar of shame. Has Clemy done another pair or have we? Come on, Clemmy. Let's go and check it out. Let's go back, Fern. I want to go back to your childhood growing up not far from here. No. In Essex, unsurprising. Yeah, I'm an Essex girl.

Born and bred. This was with your sister and your mum and dad who were together at that time, weren't they? Yeah. And did you have a dog at the time? I did. I had a Larsalapsu, which kind of looks a little bit, tiny bit, bit, bit bigger than Raymond. But she was like a gorgeous beige colour. She was called Mitzie.

Yeah. And then I went on to get a cat. Are you a cat person? Yeah, love cats. Same. I'm so pleased that you said that because, you know, cats are so misunderstood and they are such a spiritual, gorgeous. They actually draw from a lot of our energy and that's why they're always sleeping. But, you know, when I get into this and people are going to be listening to this, they're going to think, you sound nuts. You sound positively crazy because I'm like, you know, cats, they're sleeping because they attract a lot of negative energy. amazing, the frequency. You know, that frequency that they emit is astonishing. There's something very sort of been here before about cats.

Do you know what I mean? Like Buddhist quality about them. Yes. Because I love dogs, but I think the difference between dogs and cats I've always felt, because I've owned both, we used to have Burmese when I was growing up. And they're beautiful cats. But I felt dogs wanted to put a ring on it within minutes. of meeting you. They're in. They're committed. You've got the proposal.

They love bomb you. They love bomb you. Yeah. And cats, you've got to earn their respect. Yeah. It takes months. Oh, absolutely. They're not going there on the first day. But they're incredibly loyal. So I had Sunday when I had my cat Lulu and loads of people were telling me about cats and you've really got to watch them with newborns and how they can get jealous. and get very close and sit on your newborn baby and it terrified me. But actually Lulu, my cat, who's now died, but she always sat with me when I was pregnant. And then she sat next to Sunday and protected her. Always just sat, just watching, you know, and I just think they're so wise cats, so wise.

But equally the same, dogs are the same. I always thought that I was the chosen one with Clemy in our family because she was like my little shadow when I was pregnant with Finty and then I didn't realise is that because they're hearing their senses is so my second. Then when Finty come, the dog is obsessed with the baby. So it was never me. I was just the shell.

He was the vessel. I was the vessel and then when the baby arrived she's absolutely obsessed. Now I'm going to have to, I'm really sorry Fern, but I'm afraid I'm going to have to carry my boy over this mud because he's not as hardy as, he's not a tomboy like Clemmy. Yeah, no, I don't know what's happened to her. Clemmy's amazing.

She's loving life. Full of energy, isn't she? She has got bundles and she's so smart. She reminds me a few of it. Really? Because when you first meet her or when you see her, you think, oh, she's beautiful looking, very well groomed. And then you see that she's this bundle of charismatic energy. Do you know what I mean?

Thank you. Well, they say that dogs are like their own. don't they? Yeah, I think you are quite like her. So, Fern, just to go back to your childhood... Yeah. Because I read your first, your autobiography when it came up, shortly after you done, I'm a celeb.

Oh, my goodness. Cross my heart. Yeah. And... That's a blast from the past. Yeah, but it was really interesting looking at it because you were very honest about your childhood and it was difficult because your parents split up.

Yeah. a lot of us. I went through that and you were similar age to me because I think you were sort of about 13 were you? Difficult age that, isn't it? I think that when you become a teenager and especially as a girl, hormones and

everything, I think actually in my teenage years I really lacked that male figure to guide me. I think no disrespect to my dad but because my parents split up I definitely went through that rebellious

stage and just probably loved school way too much but being the class clown and all of that but deep down that was that was just a facade almost because I was hurting so much and look this is minor my parents splitting up in in the grand schemes of life and I could never imagine my parents being together now but it really affected me really affected me I get this impression of Your dad is, you know, he's very successful, wasn't he? Yeah. Super sociable and charismatic. And you grew up in it.

It was reasonably comfortable, wasn't it? Yeah. Yeah. Had a lovely childhood. Amazing. My dad was an Essex boy, hard worker, went straight into the city. That city trader lifestyle, just, you know, like you said, super charismatic. We had amazing.

times. I can really imagine him. Did he have a pinstriped shirt? Do you have like a striky blue shirt with white collars? So he was on the trading floor and he traded commodities and he as always said it was such a fantastic time to be in the city, just super fun. Yeah, because he had that job. We had a really nice childhood. Like we weren't super super duper wealthy but definitely comfortable, great holidays. Yeah. Clemmy. Good girl.

And was it one of those, I'm imagining one of those sort of five-bed redwoods. Clemmy? Clemmy. Clemmy's got involved with this dog we saw earlier. Hello.

Yeah. Who seems like a cross between, or I had Leighton Williams from, you know, strictly on this podcast. Oh, did you? And he called Crossbreeds a collabs, which I love.

Oh, I love that. Hello. Hello. Okay, Clemmy. Hello, darling. It's all right. It's all right. Fine. There's a good doggy. And this dog has sort of claimed me.

Oh, hello, darling. She's lovely. What's this dog called again? She's called Gracie. Gracie. And what is she a cross of? Is she part lab? Kimmy.

No, she comes from Romania. Oh, Gracie, Diane. You're ever so sweet, my love. Stop, that's so lovely. You're such a sweet girl. She's got like a little. Dalmatian poor. You're ever so sweet, Gracie.

She sort of looks like a lab, but is she like a border collie or a little bit of a grey hat? Like a real mix. Oh, you should. So I had a book when I was young and it was mine and my sister's favourite thing and it was like a whole Bible

of dog breeds and I used to love just flicking through. Yeah. Yeah. Klimmy? She's nearly 11 there, but she's crazy son of a gun. How lovely that you've given her a lovely home. Oh, I'm lucky to have her. Oh, sweet.

Oh, it's lovely to meet you. Lovely to meet you. Bye, boy, Gracie. What a sweet dog, you are. Come on, Raymond. And here we go. Oh, so what is this fun? So this is the owl from the Gruffalo.

This is the owl from the Gruffalo. Yep. Oh, how much. Amazing. And so this is a real thing Fern McCann is telling me. Yeah, I'm telling you, it's a real thing. The Gruffalo exists.

So your childhood, your mum, I love your mum, and obviously your mum, Jill, who you call Jill, which I love. I know, and it actually really offends people. In fact, I had a DM yesterday. This is quite a common thing when people are like, I'm sorry, why do you call your mum Jill? It's, I don't, I call her mum to her face. Like, mum, mummy.

But Jill, it's more like banter, you know, on Instagram stories or, oh, yeah, my mum, Jill. I mean, that is her name. Yeah. But it is more lighthearted taking the Mick. She loves it. But yeah, my mum is amazing. She is just my best friend. And we have so much fun together.

And when you were growing up, it's an interesting energy because obviously sometimes, you know, your dad, sounds like, as I say, very charismatic, bit Wolf of Wall Street. He was larger than life character. But your mum, sometimes, when you're a kid, it's only as you get older

that you realise the person sort of keeping that everything going is actually the quieter person. Yeah. Your mum. It's such a good point. I think when you're growing up, you look at, you don't see your parents

as people and individuals. You see them. as mum and dad. And then it isn't until you get older that you really get to know your parents on a kind of friendship or what have you. But my mum's great. And she's definitely, she's not as false coming as me,

but she's great. She's the backbone to our family. In fact, when I had Sunday, I turned to my mum and I was like, I'm so sorry. I was such a handful as a teenager. But yeah,

she's the complete backbone to our family. wouldn't be able to raise my children without her. She's like my first daughter's second parent. She's just amazing. And what were you like as a kid, Fern? Because you come across as incredibly on your show and in real life now that I've met you, very extrovert and sunny-natured and full of charisma. Was that you as a kid?

Like I always say if I was one of your friend's mum's, And he was talking about Fern. You said, what's Fern like? What would someone have said? I think they would have said she is, wow, I guess, yeah, just super, I was about to say charismatic. No, I think that I was definitely described as the fun one, someone who always wanted to just have fun and get involved and just always really positive. and just always really positive as a child.

I never forget at the end of my year 6th school play, one of the parents stood up and was like, well, that's it. Fermer McCann's going to be famous. And it never left me. And I wanted to perform. I wanted to be, not in the public eye, because I didn't really know what that was, but I wanted that, I wanted people to sort of...

You wanted to be noticed? Yeah, I wanted to be noticed. Some people might say that's quite common with a parent who leaves. Really? Yeah, I think so. Yeah, when you dig a little deeper. I think if you do anything that's related to performing in any way, you know, being seen or watch or stuff like that,

I think sometimes, it's not always, but sometimes it is linked to notice me, dad or mom or whatever, you know. Yeah, I definitely think I've had that. I've changed over the years I'm definitely more of a calmer fan now I was erratic and impulsive and I think yeah larger than knife type of character

but now I definitely feel the most grounded that I've ever felt and feel very calm I get the sense that you know were you quite bright academically now I'm going to get imposter syndrome because it's something that I would I want to be more intelligent than what I am, right?

No, I know. I really wish that I was like super, super smart. Thing is, I'm not. Okay, however, I'm one of them that does all right. You know, whatever I do, forget what I've done now, but at school I could show up and just get by, even with maybe not doing as much work as I possibly probably should have. Yeah, I think that I was in all the top set.

I do not know how it happened because I sucked at maths, failed it, sucked at science. But now, with life, anything that I do, you know, I'm going to give it my all. That's one thing that I can absolutely back myself is no matter what I do in life, whether it's giving birth, dancing on ice, turning up for your podcast, creating a reality. show. Can I ask you a question? How old were you when you bought your own house? How old was I? 27. And you think that's someone who's not intelligent? Yeah. Well, I guess it's how you measure it. I would say that's a very good way to measure it. I'm just saying... Okay, that's a nice way to... Yeah, that's a bit of an achievement, isn't it? Yeah. You don't get that through being stupid, do you? No. No. You know?

You did that all yourself. Yeah. Every penny of that yourself. Mm. So, I'm not having it, McCann. I'm sorry. Right, I'm going to put this coffee cup in the bin. This is good for my confidence boost.

Oh, look, Fern. What does that say? I'm not testing your reading skills, but I thought. Do not put other waste in this bin. Please take it home. What does that mean? What does that mean? Do you think it's all right?

Is it just a dog poo bin? Oh, no, there is other things. How have you just put your nose in there? There's nothing in there. Emily, you just lift. I have to go, hold my breath. I'm hardy. Yeah, you are.

I've been exposed to some terrible things. Right, come on, Ray. Oh, there's more mud. I have to carry you across. So, you did your A-levels and then you did hairdressing. You had a Saturday job, didn't you? Yeah. Because your mum instill.

Jill in still. you with this real work ethic. Yes, yes. And you became a colourist at Vidal Sussu. And I know this because when you would have an argument on the reality show you did with your partner, Laurie, and he said, no, what do you know about hair, Fern? You don't know. I know.

I was a colourist at Susserun's Laurie. Exactly. And he would really take the Mick. Look, you've got a really love hair. This is no disrespect to hairdressers. right because it's a really cool career path if that's what you want to do you've got to really love it and every single day I would get on that London commute because I'd work on I worked on the seven dolls in Covent Garden and I just take my mind elsewhere and be like where I'd like manifest

my way out of that salon basically because I just did not the only thing that kept me in hairdressing was the staff from banter like I love that camaraderie with people that you know you have banter with and you just have great nights out and great times but apart from that I didn't want to be colouring people's hair I did a full head of highlights why didn't you enjoy it do you think it was because I can't really see yeah I can see do you think you just felt a nine to five wasn't right for you or did I just always knew that I wanted to perform I wanted something else And then my friends joined Taui, the only way is Essex. And I was like, oh, I want to do that.

Like, if not acting, then what? Then how can I get on this reality show? Like, how can I get my foot in the door? Oh, Clems, you call. Oh, bless her. Oh, my goodness, Clemmy. She got twisted up in Ivy. She's got twisted up in, oh, Bubba.

Hang on. Oh, guys. Oh my goodness. There we go. Rescue my dog. So yeah, I just always felt like, oh, this isn't for me. Like, I just felt it in my bones. Like, I can't be doing this for the rest of my life.

I cannot be doing this. Getting on the London commute and colouring people's hair, didn't want to be there. It wasn't until my friend was dating, Joey Essex who... And other sentences I wish I could come up with. I mean... Who was dating my boyfriend at the time

and then they was like, oh, okay, like this sort of works. And then we got an interview and went on the show. And then... But it's interesting because it seems from what you said about it in the past that, and of course I had no idea that it's fascinating that it almost takes over Essex. At that point, everyone was sort of talking about it. There was almost a sense if you were a young, attractive person.

It was like a bit of a sense of failure if you weren't in it or something. But was it, there was a buzz about getting on it in Essex. I felt so lucky to be on that show. I just felt like, yes, because I'd had an interview for it before. And it never materialised into anything. And then I actually joined in series, I remember if it was series nine. I'll tell you exactly when I'm. It was. It was Series 9.

Emily, you know more about me than I do myself. Be very careful. Series 9. So joining Series 9, which was actually quite late. Like I wasn't a Taui OG, but I was just like, I joined in a Mab special. And I just felt so incredibly lucky. I was like, yes, but my mum wouldn't let me give up the hairdress in. So she made me get a little local job in Brentwood.

And I was like, what? I'm on like one of the biggest reality shows still colouring people's hair. So, yeah, I mean, that was the start of everything. And you went on to do that until you did I'm a Celebrity. So it was a good... How long would fun have been in TOWY? I think I left in Series 13. Something like that.

That really rings about. I wasn't on there for very long. But you made a huge impact and we know what was great about it. Suddenly you were famous. You're getting... You don't get paid in... You know, you don't make a fortune from the show itself. No.

It leads to other opportunities, doesn't it? And I know what the good stuff would have been, but I wonder it was tough as well, wasn't it? It was a really hard time, I think, because I had almost not waited so long for that opportunity, but my whole life wanted to be famous. And I know that can make people almost wince and feel uncomfortable, but that's just me. I wanted to perform.

I wanted to be on TV. And then I'd waited so long for that opportunity. Then when it happened, the premise. of the show was to create drama and for people to have arguments and things like that. So I just knew, like, I think that I was almost like a producer's dream. They was like, oh, let's get Fern in. I was never actually the A character. I was just always the B character there playing a role that was not me.

So then lines got very blurred between reality and a reality TV show, because I almost showed up and was playing this controversial bitchy character, which, believe it or not, I don't like arguments. I don't like confrontation. I don't like awkward, uncomfortable conversations. I know they've got to happen sometimes in life, but it was really surreal and a weird time for me to watch myself on TV and be perceived as this bitch and someone that always got herself in the mix of drama.

and I really struggled with that. I really struggled mentally with coping, with falling out with people and then people having this opinion about me online and I just wanted a way out. I was like how, it's almost like, be careful

what you wish for because I was on this show and listen, I've got no regrets with Taoie I think it's a fantastic show what they've created and it's like a cult It's, yeah, it's just so, it's massive part of the reality genre. I think when you're young and you were 22, I think, when you started that show. And we now know, your frontal lobe hasn't developed.

You're a child still at 22. And so impressionable. So impressionable. So impressional. Your emotions are completely unregulated. You make impulsive decisions. And guess what? I get it.

That's why you're good TV. But it's tricky that I think when we're young as well, particularly as women, we lack a sense of making our own boundaries, which other people do respect, but we find it difficult to say no. So someone will say, will you do this? And we'll say, oh yeah, please, like me. It was like the perfect storm because I wanted to be famous. And I would do, you know, what was asked and also wanting to get in the mix.

But then I never really had any boundaries. Boundaries is something that I've really had to work on in therapy. I've had therapy for the best part of seven years now and that is something that I've really had to work on because I'm such an open book, way too trusting, you know, and I've never really had boundaries in place until now. And that's why I think now I feel really grounded, really just like I just feel like I really know myself. I really hope you love part one of this week's Walking the Dog.

If you want to hear the second part of our chat, It'll be out on Thursday, so whatever you do, don't miss it. And remember to subscribe so you can join us on our walks every week.