Walking The Dog with Emily Dean - Hayley Morris (Part One)

Episode Date: July 28, 2025

Join us in London’s beautiful Dulwich Park with the brilliant online comedian Hayley Morris! Hayley’s life changed during the pandemic - when she started posting sketches on social media. She has now amassed a staggering 9 million followers with her hilarious and inspiring sketches - which cover every topic from bras to mental health! Hayley has a young whippet called Donatello - who didn’t join us on our walk, because he’s still learning how to socialise with other dogs on walks. This meant that Raymond was thrilled to have Hayley to himself, and he spent much of this chat asleep on her lap.We spoke to Hayley about how she’s turned her anxiety into comedy, how she handled her dad's dementia diagnosis and her former career as a wench… Hayley’s comedy shorts are available on her YouTube channel. Subscribe to make sure you don’t miss her next release which is coming in August! Follow @hayleymorris3 on InstagramFollow @hayleygeorgiamorris on TikTokBuy your copy of Me vs Brain: An Overthinker’s Guide to Life – the instant Sunday Times bestseller!Follow Emily: Instagram - @emilyrebeccadeanX - @divine_miss_emWalking The Dog is produced by Faye LawrenceMusic: Rich Jarman Artwork: Alice LudlamPhotography: Karla Gowlett  Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Every time he comes in from being outside, we wipe paws, we wipe his willie, we wipe his bum. If you're coming to my bed, everything's getting wiped. This week on Walking the Dog, Ray and I headed over to beautiful Dulwich Park in South London to go for a stroll with online comedian Haley Morris, whose hilarious sketches have earned her a following of over 9 million people. Haley has a whipit called Donatello. I know genius name, but he didn't actually join us today. just because he's still in the early stages of getting used to socialising with dogs on walks. So Ray got to have Haley all to himself, and I won't lie. He's not averse to loving it being all about him.

Haley was one of those people whose career really took off during the pandemic when she started posting her comedy sketches online, and it's fair to say they attracted a huge amount of attention, mainly because they're brilliantly funny, and a huge online fan base, which has allowed her to turn this into a full-time career. Haley has also written a Sunday Times bestselling book called Me versus Brain, which is a very funny but also very insightful journey through her struggles with overthinking and anxiety.

And in it, she also talks very honestly about losing her dad to a rare form of dementia called Picks disease. And the complex process of navigating grief, which is something I've also experienced. And it was very cathartic, I hope, for both of us getting to chat about that. I loved my walk with Haley. she's got a very gentle, sweet-natured energy and Ray has frankly never been cuddled and stroked so much in his life. So I really hope you enjoy our chat. Do, by the way, check out Haley's brilliant sketches on YouTube, TikTok or Instagram.

I'll stop talking now and hand over to the fabulous woman herself. Here's Haley and Ray, Ray. Right, come on, Ray. Are you going to follow Haley? She's going to show us where to go. Oh, my goodness. A little shake-off. Coming in.

Oh my god, I can't cope with how cute he is. What do you think, Haley? Oh, just the cutest. Do you like him? Yeah, I'm really pleased. He's got the nicest face. Oh, that's such a lovely way of talking about him. Oh, honestly, he's so sweet.

So fluffy. You say that, but he just did a massive shit before. That's the thing, isn't it? They do big shits. And then you go, well, you're still cute. I didn't think it at that point. No, that is, yeah. I was ashamed.

In that moment. It is really embarrassing, isn't it? they shit and you're just sort of like you have to stop and it's maybe in the middle of a path where people are trying to get around you're like sorry don't want me just picking up my dog shit well you've got is it a whippet or a whipet yeah you've got a whip it and how can I put this in a delicate fragrant way I think their evacuation is a bit cleaner if you know what I mean because you've seen this right there's no flat he's got no fur really like he's obviously got very you know what's the word short hair hair hair he's got he's got he's got he's got

got lots of hair. I do often find myself neat crouching under my dog's ass with a baby wife. Oh do you know what though? Every time Donnie comes to Donnie's my dog, every time he comes in from being outside we wipe paws, we wipe his willie, we wipe his bum. Because otherwise it would just drip. I've done that with boyfriends if you. We treat him like a boyfriend, you know. But I'm like if you're coming to my bed, everything's getting wiped. You're going to get your bum and you're really hot. I'm going to treat you like a little child. Come on, Raymond. You're already getting hot.

I might have to carry him. Oh, my little tongue out. Is it a bit warm? It's walkable for him today. It's about 20. My rule is over 20. I tend to worry a bit. Same.

Yeah. Especially in the summer, as soon as it starts coming towards 19, I'm like, I look at the weather out before I go to bed and I might not have got to get up at six. Yeah. Might you going out early. I just panic.

I just really wouldn't ever want to be there. You know, it's sunstroke or heat stroke that would terrify me. Well, I've got a whole set up in the car as well with fans and a cooling mat. I love it. It's ridiculous. Well, I'm so thrilled to come and meet you today, Haley. I'm very thrilled to be here. And we should explain.

We're in the lovely, it's Dulwich Park it's called. Yeah, Dulwich Park. Which is so beautiful. It's like something at Bridgeton or something, isn't it? It's very kind of old school. It's beautiful. Beautiful. And you don't have, you were saying you have a lovely greyhound called Donnie. Donatello, yep. Donatello. After the turtle or the artist or both. Do you know what? Neither. Everyone always says the same thing and I'm like, no, neither. It was, we were going to get an Italian greyhound. And so we were like, oh, let's call the Italian greyhound Donatello. And then I kind of always wanted to whip it. And so, I did kind of fall in love.

One of our friends got a whip it, and I was like, no, it's got to be a whip it. Also, Italian greyhounds are just so fragile. Yes, I've got a friend. They're called Iggy's, aren't they? Iggyz. They're just very fragile. Yeah. And that's what scares me.

Like, very skinny little legs, skinnier than Donnie's legs. Yes, they've got tiny little sort of Kara de Levine legs. Yeah, they're little models. Very, very skinny. They're the supermodels. They really, really are, yeah. Yeah, very heroin chic. It's wild.

So yours is a regular greyhound? Just a Whippet. I think he's like between the two sizes. So he's bigger than obviously in Italian greyhound, but smaller than a greyhound. But they kind of all have exactly the same characteristics. And greyhound and whippets. I never really understand the difference between them.

I don't really either. But they do, when you look at them side by side, there is a lot of difference in like their body and their shape. Obviously size is a big difference. Yeah. Greyhounds are huge. Really big yeah. There's quite a lot of greyhounds in this park actually. We're in like a group chat round here with with all the sighthounds. Oh really? Yeah. So you didn't bring Donatello today. I did not. And why was that? So Donatello is going through adolescence at the moment and it is just a very much constant eye on him and it's a lot of checking in. So

We're working with a behaviourist because as soon as he hit adolescence, obviously being a sighthound, he's got like a really high prey drive, impulse control is not really there. So, yeah, as soon as he hit that, which he hit it a bang on a year old. So would he, for example, if he saw Ray today, do you think he might go for Ray? No, he might just get a bit overstimulated and then try and hump Ray, which wouldn't be, you know, wouldn't be very socially acceptable. Ray might quite like it. Although I don't know how much Ray would deliver. Well, Donnie would really give it a good go. But yeah, we work with the behaviourist and it's basically, it's tedious to walk with us

because it's constantly stopping, starting, I'm constantly like playing games with him for his focus and attention. But soon, when he's out of that side of things, I hope it'll mean he's a really well-mannered dog. Oh, how lovely. But no, he's honestly like my pride and joy. Absolutely love him. It is like children, isn't it? Oh, it really is.

Well, you do and we're going to talk about this because I'm a huge fan of your, you're obviously a brilliant content creator. Thank you. Online and you make these brilliant comedy videos. And I want to talk to you all about how you got into that. But one of the videos I especially love of yours is one that you do,

and it's a sort of you talking to your dog essentially and when I looked at it Haley I thought oh no this is me and Haley's doing this as a complete piss take and I'm looking... No but that is literally me I'm nodding at it very sagesly go yeah nothing to see here completely normal behaviour and there's this woman I ask yeah who's what do you want to give us an idea of what she's saying

she's going oh big stretch big stretch, big stretch I would die for you Yeah, lots of very high-pitched, who's a good boy. I love you so much. Yeah, I'm just... She says at one point something that I actually say, which was really nice, which was, what's a distinguished gentleman? Yeah, always.

And it's because he has like a little cross-pour, very distinguished right now. Do you think where's a distinguished gentleman? You're a very distinguished gentleman, aren't you? With the loveliest little face. He's a real snob, I think. Oh, he's so sweet. I think if he was a person, he'd be a sort of person who'd be... I don't like the look of the new neighbours.

Their car's a bit dirty. Yeah, I do always wonder what voice dogs would have. Yes. I don't, yeah, I think that's, that feels pretty accurate for Raymond. I want to go back to when you were growing up because you didn't have dogs. I didn't. Oh, well, I know this because I read your brilliant book, which is... Oh, thank you.

Me versus... Me versus Brain. I'm just going to wait for that lovely man. I'm assuming as a man, it could be a woman. But normally, when things are annoying, it's often the man. You're not wrong. All right. All right, I'm sorry the women won the euros and the men didn't.

Calm down. Absolutely limited. I wonder if there'll be, we're recording this, we should say, the day after the lionesses, won the euros. So it feels very... Like, you know, double win, back-to-back win. Yeah. Unbelievable. It's almost like if women are given the chance,

so they can be even better than men at least. Almost, almost. There were lots of men I was noticing saying, I mean, I just don't like women's football. I'm like, you just don't like women, then. That's it. There was one man, which is brilliant, saying on one of those shows,

and he was going, I mean, I don't want to listen to the women. Yes. Did you hear that? I don't like their voices. And the guy was going, You don't like women's voices. Yeah, and then said, what does your wife think?

She don't like it either. I was like, right, okay, well, we want to know she here. Separate the two of you. Come on. Oh, dear. But what I love about that man is that literally he's going to have the next two. I mean, this is going to be the most hellish few days for him. Yeah.

Yeah, that was the biggest victory, wasn't it? Yeah. So going back to your childhood, you didn't have dogs because your parents were dogged out they were completely dogged out yeah and why was this so my dad was terrified of dogs

when he was growing up so my grandparents their kind of way of dealing with things and dealing with phobias was to put you right in front of it so when they found out that my dad was scared of dogs they were like okay perfect we'll go and get a load of our stations So they had, I think in the end, they had between 11 and 13 Great Danes and Alsatians in their house. And they didn't have like a, they weren't living in a huge house.

13? Yeah, well they bred. Like they obviously had, I think they started with one boy, one girl from different places. And then they ended up having babies and they just kept them. But yeah, my dad and uncle grew up. with several large dogs. I never met any of them. Yeah.

And then my mum and my auntie, they had two dogs that... My auntie had gone to Notting Hill Market. They lived in Tunbridge Wells. And she'd gone to Notting Hill Market, and she came home with a dog. And then my mum, I don't remember how she got her dog, but she got her dog, again, wasn't... didn't ask her parents for the dog.

And it was a border collie. and he was my mum now realises he just didn't have the outlets he hadn't been trained properly so she didn't know how to look after him and he was just a crazy dog

like just had so much energy ran away all the time they'd move to the Al of White at this point and my mum said she'd go on a walk with him in the morning and then lose him on the walk and then he would come home at like 6 o'clock because border collies

because they're the smartest dogs aren't they need like a job they need absolutely do They need constant stimulation. Yeah. And they need, they're very goal driven. They're like CEOs. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

They run the business. It's like how a CEO would be if they didn't have a job. They'd be sort of taking drugs and watching daytime TV go mad. You know, succession to the max. No, it's so they, you know, they had these two dogs. One of them, my aunties, man, I think she was, I don't know, I think she was a mutt, but she was really, really lovely. They really loved her, but they found my mum's dog a bit of a nightmare.

So when it came to me and my brother being like, can we get a dog? They were like, no. No, because we'll have to look after it as well. I remember being like, no, no, I promise I'd look after it. I still think I would have. I don't. I don't know. I like to think I would have, but maybe not.

But yeah, no, so it never happened. But I think once they were really close to saying yes and then I stayed at a friend's house who was looking after three or four different dogs and the dog had slept on my face all night and I hadn't slept and I was like, I don't want a dog, slept on my face all night, I didn't sleep. My mum dad would like, perfect. Yeah. Yeah, away with that one. But now I have a dog.

I was thrilled to discover that you have previous with shih tis because your best mate have a shih Tzu, I think it was a shih Tzu. Was this day? Yes, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Dave, you were jealous of your friend's dog and you got a rabbit. I got a rabbit, yeah. It was not the same. I did train the rabbit, but

it wasn't the same. I did love the rabbit but I did really want a dog. Yeah. And Dave was great. You do have, it's a weird thing. I think some kids I had that feeling when I was growing up. My parents didn't want to a dog. Not because they were dogged out just because they were sort of... Their responsibility? Well, they were sort of, I suppose

performers and artists they would have called themselves so they were moving around and I think it just felt like too much responsibility and commitment and like you'd have to actually look after something yeah it is like bad love having children let alone a fairy animal so this is as you say in the Isle of why you were growing up which I'm fascinated by people that grow up there because it just seems like a sort of permanent holiday resort yeah well I because I was born in Guilford so I lived there for a while and then we moved to the Isle of Wight and that was like the best thing in the world. So I was sad to leave friends but I was like, oh, surrounded by the sea.

You can go, you know, after school, we'd go down to the beach. It was a great. It was like the best place I think to grow up. Loved it, although it's very small. So you do know everyone. That's the downside. I'm like, the plus side is, you know, you've got the beach, gorgeous scenery. The downside is you know everyone.

And then also in the winter there's just nothing to do. But I think that's the same as anywhere you grow up. up, isn't it? In the UK. Yeah. Well, I'm one of those weird people that grew up in London and people are always like, it's not like growing up in Manhattan? I didn't know people actually grew up here. Like, how do you live?

See, I feel like I'm jealous of people that have grown up here. Because I think you grow up with more of a confidence and, like, I think you know yourself quicker. That's so interesting. That had never occurred to me. Do you think that is true? I wonder. I just, I think, maybe

not everyone feels this way, but I think when you grow up in a small place, you're kind of, in a way, not kept small, but you're very used to a very quiet style of life, and everyone's kind of quite chill and, you know, everyone's got a different mindset when it's, it's that way, it feels slower. Yeah. Whereas London feels like... We're all noisy monsters. Yeah, but you're in the best way. It's like you're, you want to be seen, you want to be heard. you want to take up a space, whereas I feel like when you grow up in a small place, it's don't take up much space.

And so when I have friends that, you know, grew up in London, I'm like, ah, you've just got, you've known yourself forever, whereas I feel like only in my later twenties have I started to learn, like, really started to learn who I am and how to be a bit more confident. Wow, that's so interesting. I've never thought of it. Yeah, I find it fascinating. I wonder if it's a bit more like growing up in London.

It's like growing up in one of those, you know, I sometimes, I've had people on this podcast like Rob Beckett and Jonathan. Ross and they always say that the reason they're so I suppose confident and they have these huge incredibly charismatic personalities is because they grew up in these big families where they had to be heard yeah yeah I wonder if London is it's basically like growing up in a family exactly exactly it is and I think you're just competing with everyone in a way to be like yourself whereas on a small place it's everything's quiet and no one's really doing anything it feels like you're kind of not so worried about being heard. I don't know if I'm saying that right, but I definitely

feel a difference and I am so jealous of the people that grew up here because I just think it feels like you had all the tools there for you in a way. I don't know if I'm making any sense though. Yeah, although I think to be honest there's something to be said often when I meet people who migrated here as it were. I kind of think there's a sense. of there's a lack of entitlement because I sort of think with any sort of migration and that is a form of migration if you've made the bloody effort to come over to live in it set up as yourself up in a new environment you're going to make you're going to be driven and determined and ambitious perhaps in a way that someone who's grown up assuming well all this is here for me won't be so I think

there can be a bit more entitlement and possibly more of a failure to launch thing whereas do you know what to mean I think it's yeah it's like it's kind of growing up with privilege in a way growing up in a big city yeah and I just sometimes you don't get that hunger I think that you notice you know I've had friends who've come here from Liverpool and they're like it's expensive to come here yeah he made a lot of effort they're not kind of sit about fucking about on their ass doing nothing after all that effort so oh is that a wolfhound oh yeah I like wolfhounds oh he's lovely they're big but not mean

no they've got such a lovely little face yeah they're really gentle dogs aren't they yeah that little tail as well and so when you were growing up what did your parents do so my mum

before she had us but she will love to say whenever we're you know talking about career she'd be like I used to be a fashion buyer so my mum was a fashion buyer and my dad at that time didn't really know what he was doing

and then as soon as they had my brother my mum moved away from that and became a fitness instructor and my dad moved into advertising. So he ended up being a creative director and my mum, a fitness instructor. So she still is a fitness instructor. And I'm fascinated by that because I'm like, you're so strong. And she's in her sixth season. She's just, yeah, it's amazing.

You've always done it. Really? Yeah. And I've always had such an interest in that. What's going on really? Oh, just climbing a tree. I'm quite relieved. I thought that was a middle-aged man.

It was just a child, yeah. It was a child. I suddenly saw this figure, clampering up this tree. And the way he was dressed in quite a grown-up way, it really did look like a 42-year-old man was climbing a tree. Be careful, please.

Yeah, but I think he's sort of 12 or something, which seems far more. I just can't, yeah, all I can see is his legs. I don't see anything further, so he could still be. Actually, Hayley, that's a good question. Listen, beyond what age is it weird to climb trees for no reason? Do you know what? As long as you can do it safely, I don't think there's a weird age.

I do. You've got to get in touch with your inner child, you know. If I was suddenly started clambering up that oak, you would honestly do. I might be a bit, like, that's strange, but you know, you've got to do what you've got to do. I think you could just about get away with it. Oh, I don't know. You were still in your 20s? No, I'm early 30s, yeah.

I think I would be... I think your tree days of sale now. They'd definitely sales. Yeah, I broke my arm from a tree, so that was it for me really. I really retired it at that age. I don't know. I think that boy's a bit old to me on the tree. Yeah.

I don't want to judge him. No, he's okay. We'll let him go. They're doing a stellar job, though. I will say I'd be... I'd be that's he'd that, going from branch to branch, worrying. Yeah. Yeah.

I really do. Suddenly feel like the responsible adult. This is what happens. So you grew up with parents who weren't, you know, necessarily performers or working in the comedy industry. And that's what you make your living doing now, is making these brilliant videos online, hilariously funny videos online,

which have been so massively successful. Is it something like over 9 million? Yeah, something around there, yeah. Isn't that, that's a good saying. Yeah, it really does play my mind. When you think of the numbers as people, which it sounds really weird to say when you think of the numbers as people,

but your brain switches off to it being people at one point. And I think probably for like a, maybe like protective way. Yeah, because then it does become a bit, well, it becomes a bit overwhelming. Yeah. So, you know, you seem really nice and you don't, and you want to stay that way.

Oh, yeah, 100%. Yeah, so you kind of like just forget, But then there's been times where say, if a video hasn't performed well and I've been in a head space of like, oh, that just didn't do well compared to others. If someone then says that amount of people fills X amount of stadiums or this stadium, you suddenly go, well, that's wild to think those numbers equate to an amount of people in a crowded space that you would consider being a lot of people. We should just say, there are three helicopters going on the head, as you can probably hear, I always get very excited and thinking, because I'm quite excited by army things. It's a bit weird. But it generally, you find out

they're probably picking up Fritz William from Basel or something because he had a few too many last night at the Euros. It's never anything. It's always, there tends to be VIPs and then. Oh, it's gone now. The hellies. Three helis a lot, though.

Three helis. Oh, look at that good boy, though. good boy is that does this good boy belong to the climbers I think so just chilling that's really well behaved is it a golden retriever Haley I think it's a labrador well I think it looks a bit more shaggy than a lab yeah maybe a bit of a mix the most beautiful that is the textbook oh that if you ask a kid think of a dog yeah that's it there you go that's the chat GPT idea of a dog whereas Ray not so much so oh no that you can't compare with two angels so this performing instinct or gene or whatever

you want to call it you've obviously got funny bones where did that come from was it evident when you were a kid so that came from my dad so my dad although he was uh in advertising he was a copywriter he used to write sketches or you know funny things on the side i remember he was part of like a forum where you could write jokes and they'd go into sort of like the eight out of tens eight out of ten cats sort of shows so he used to write a lot on those and forums and see if he could sell jokes or you know just write scripts and he'd written he'd written a few TV shows but never sold them and then he wrote so he was quite sort of creative he was really really creative he just never had you know the opportunity for

some reason as a cis white man. I don't know how that happened, but he didn't, nothing really happened, but he used to write these sketches and then, I just remember my dad was like that OG vlogger. He used to vlog all our family holidays, which sounds weird saying vlogging, because it wasn't really that at the time. And obviously there was no online. No, no, they were just for us to watch back and he used to this thing where he would attach music and scent to all our memories. So like he'd film these videos of us on holiday and then he'd put music over the top that we'd listen to while we were there. So it was for us to kind of look back on

when we were older. But then he would also film us. I think we just used that, me and my brother used to just be obsessed with like pop stars and I always wanted to be a pop stars. And my dad used to film music videos for us. So my brother was always Robbie Williams and I was always Britney Spears

and we'd film these music videos. And then when we got older he started writing these sketches for us. And we used to watch like Slap the Pony, Abfab, like you know, French and Sondon we loved comedy. So he'd write these sketches. Me and my brother would perform them.

We wouldn't always understand the jokes. They might have been like jokes. We were like, you know, it's not a fart joke. It's not funny. We were just kids, you know. But we kind of grew up around that. And my dad being so enthused by comedy. And then my mum's side of the family

are all performers in like dancers. So there was always that element around us. But it was never, I was never the funny one. I was never told I was the funny one. It was always my brother's Jim Carrey. He's going to be the next Jim Carrey. And has he gone into? No.

So I think, I think because I was never told that it would be me that would be doing stuff, I think I just had that fight. Like my cousins were dancers and, you know, everyone was like, they're going to be, you know, the next Darcy Bustle or they're going to be huge performers. So I just never really got that on me. and then I just thought for it. Do you think, I think that's really interesting that you say that because obviously they say now, don't they,

that you should, you know, this whole vogue that used to be, that was as well as saying, you're amazing, you're brilliant, you're going to do this, and now things are moving towards never tell a child they're gifted at something in particular, whether it's football, singing, comedy, never say you've got a natural talent, you're gifted, because then you do think, oh, well, I don't need to try then. Yeah.

Whereas if you say, oh, that was good, you tried really hard, or you're trying hard, you're working hard at that. Yeah. It sounds like their parents probably did you a favour by not sort of overplaying that. Because I think it was, I've never, no disrespect to any of my family, and I think everyone's so amazing. I think it was just more of a the pressure probably wasn't on me

but in a different way I wanted to be heard and I wanted, you know, I had this passion but maybe I was quite shy I don't think I really showed much want for it I think I let my cousins and my brother and everyone be louder than me but I think as I got older I was like oh no actually I really love this

and this is something I'm really passionate about but I knew I had to work really hard to be taken seriously. Yes. So I think it, my mum always said, she thinks it worked massively in my favour, not having anyone tell me that it was kind of going to be handed to me. Yeah, it's your destiny. Yeah.

And you never grew up either with that sense that it was, you were owed it. No. I'm interested in how you got from where you were growing up to suddenly being, in a sense, what you do, you are a sort of entrepreneur, you know, online creators. to build up the kind of following that you have. And you're obviously interested in performing, but I sense lacked a bit of confidence maybe in that area? Yeah.

Yeah, I think I don't know what it is. I think my confidence goes up and down quite a lot. I think there was a phase when I was at uni. I was the most confident I have ever been, and I could have done anything at that point. And I think that's, I think, you know, when you go from school to school, like when on the Out of White,

they do primary middle high they didn't do it how they do it now which is obviously it's it primary to secondary um so you change school three times and you'd usually find that people went to complete different schools so it was remaking friends i think helped and hindered but when i got to like 18 and i'd gone to university and obviously had to make new friends i was so confident then i was like oh this is like great i can just put myself out there make friends i found that really easy and then i worked abroad had the same experience but i think lockdown probably was the thing that took my confidence away from that a bit. Because I suddenly, I'd been working in hospitality for a bit,

that, you know, you're just constantly talking to people. You say I'd been working in hospitality for a bit. It's a bit more exciting than that. Because you were working in Disney World, Florida, as essentially a wench. Yeah, a wench, that's it. A bar wench, yeah. That was it.

And I'm hoping the outfit was polyester. It really was. With the crisscross? Yeah. Oh, the snow white criss cross. It was a lot. It was really heavy as well. For like, Florida is so hot.

Like the summer's there. It's like 100% humidity. It's like 40 degree heat. And you're just wearing this. Do you have to wear a wig? No, but you did, if you worked in the chip shop there, you did have to wear like a bonnet, which was... Bonnet in the chip shop.

Yeah, it was a lot. It was a lot. Really like oldy, England. Well, we should go back. Because after school, you did a degree, didn't you? Yeah, so I went to Brighton University, yeah. And you did your degree in broadcast journalism, because that's what you thought you were going to go into.

Yeah, because I thought I wanted to be a TV presenter. Like, I loved Fern Cotton. And I was like, you know, she's great. But I also wanted to act. And the advice from everyone around me was I really wanted to go to GSA. So I wanted to start auditioning for... What's GSA? GILFITS school of acting.

Okay, yeah. So I wanted to go to an action. college and my cousins were going to dance colleges and so they were doing there or had already done their auditions I think they went at 16 but everyone was saying to me don't go to acting school because if nothing happens from that you don't have a degree and it was at the time when everyone was like you must get a degree degrees everything so I was like okay well what's the closest thing I can do to like presenting or acting and that was broadcast journalism I loved writing but I didn't love the news.

So I don't know why I chose it on that side because it was all just, you know, TV, TV news, radio news and documentary. It was a very, very good course. I really enjoyed it and I felt like a lot. You probably would have been better off doing a performing arts degree. Yeah. But then having said that, and we'll get on to this,

I imagine there were some technical skills that you probably learned from that course, which have become invaluable now. Massively, yeah. And I learned to edit on there. I learned that. They made us start a YouTube channel to get confident in front of the camera. And I probably wouldn't have done that if I'd done acting at college

or just a performing arts degree. It was invaluable, really. Are you having a little shake? You're okay. You're having a shaky. You're right. Do you like having a cuddle with Haley? You can't see.

You're very gentle with him, Haley. Oh, thank you. He senses that. He's got a real instinct about people. Do you find your dog has that? Oh, yeah. Do you know what? I don't know if you ever have this,

but when I'm walking along, sometimes he'll just like jump up at someone, like arms up. He doesn't really do that. So I'm like, what did that person? What energy were they giving? Yeah. Yeah. I think he's got a good instinct.

There's no one he's not liked, which is good. He sent, no, Ray really does sense that. Like sometimes if, and particularly with other dogs, you know, he'll just sort of, dogs that I'm not so keen on he just backs away from and I think no not that I'm not so keen on that sounds mean

but you can sense they're not quite yeah I can sense that maybe they're a bit boisterous or pushy he immediately he can sense that instantly from a dog it's like yeah you're not my kind of person he's the dog's introvert club

aren't you little intro boy so you leave college and then you end up, you realise you don't want to work at a news-based environment, and then you end up working for a beauty company. Yeah. Are we allowed to say which one? Well, I guess so. I've worked for Lizelle.

Oh. Yeah. That's a bit poshant. Yeah, so Lizelle was for, I don't know if she was actually from the Isle of White, but her co-founder Kim Buckland, I think it thinks her name. It was from the Isle of Wight. So they started it on the Isle of Wight. So they had their home base there.

Because she's really skincare and... Yeah. And what was your job there? So I originally, when I first left uni, I went and worked in the call centre there, which was... Oh, come on, let me ring. So fun. I love it. I'm just going to ring.

Like an old fashion ring. A little 70s sitcom ring. Hello. Hello, welcome to Lizelle skincare. How can I help you today? Do you know you're really good at them? It was such a classic, like, cool centre vibe, but like really old school. Did you ever say the Holy Grail trying to connect you?

Maybe, I might have done. But we were advisors, we would advise skin product. So I say to you. I don't know what to do because I'm a bit menopausal and I'm just getting red patches all over my skin. What would you advise? So I think I'd first of all say, what's your current skincare? routine. None of your business. Good go. And then I go, no worries, thanks so much for calling, goodbye. Did you have to learn to be quite patient doing that job? Yes. You might get people

saying, I bought this and blah, blah, blah, or, you know, I found like, generally, like the vibe in that call centre was everyone was very softly spoken and you would really use words like, lovely and it was really, you know, very gentle and very calming. You did, you know, they did, you know, were the occasional people that would call up really angry. And, you know, we had the downstairs was literally where they picked and packed and sent it off. So I could be like, no worries, just hold for one second. Let me look into that for you. And sometimes you just walk downstairs and be like, it's this order gone.

But some people would get really angry. But I think because we were so calm, they would be like calm back. Are you quite calm? I think so. I definitely can be, I can like get angry. think we all can, but you would really have to push my buttons to get me angry. Okay. That's a good quality to have.

Well, yeah, I think anger's a funny one, isn't it? It's, I always think if you're angry, it's because you've never let it out if you're really holding that anger. You've got to let it out. When you're angry, just let yourself be angry and it will go. Do you know, I always think whenever, you know, because we all have those moments and I, and I sometimes have to remind myself, whenever I'm trying to control my anger, or overreacting to something.

I try and imagine how Barack Obama would deal with something as opposed to Donald Trump. That's a good, yeah, that's a good reference point. You know what you mean? You've seen Barack Obama. We never saw him lose his call in all that time. But I think that's probably because he had outlets. Because I think anger gets a really bad rep.

It's just an emotion, do you know what I mean? I think everyone should feel anger, but it's how you handle that anger for then how it kind of displays with people. Like if you feel angry, I think just let yourself be angry. Don't do it at people, but just have the outlet. And then you won't have that repressed anger that's going to come out how Donald Trump does. You know?

Then it comes out in other ways, like very hostile towards people, very hateful. You know, it's funny emotions. Yeah, and I think it's also, I think the one thing that I think you've got to be so careful of. I don't know what you think about this is, I think one of the worst qualities you can have is to be, immediately suspicious of everyone's motives. Just that misanthropy where you think, why did they do that? What are they up to? And we all feel it sometimes, but it's just so liberating when you can say,

or maybe they just, there's no dark agenda. Yeah, exactly. We just couldn't make it. No, it's funny, isn't it? People are very, it's like, not everyone, but there's a lot of people that are very slow to give people the benefit of the doubt or have a bit of empathy. Sometimes I feel like dogs teach a lot of that.

Do you? Yeah, I feel like Donnie's taught me a lot with stuff like that. There's maybe people don't have the same experience with their dog and so they do something that might not be nice for us. They've not done that intentionally. They just don't know that that would upset my dog or be something that would be frustrating for us. So I tend to not be like, how dare they?

I'm just like, they just don't know. They don't get it. Yeah. Otherwise you kind of just go around being really, angry and hate everyone when we're all just doing this at the first time, you know. Yeah, that's so true. After Liz Earle, I could do a whole podcast on you working at Liz Earl, I'm obsessed with it. But I'm presuming you worked out that wasn't what you wanted to do full time.

Well, I then moved from there on the Isle of Wight with Lizell over to London into social media for them. So I did social media and content. I was an intern. Were you good at that? Yeah, I think I wasn't bad it. I was definitely, I was learning a lot. But it was when social media was really, sort of still quite early days. So you kind of just knew what worked at that point. Nothing was really changing.

It was just put up a nice, you know when you used to do those flat lay photos? That's exactly what it was. It was all flat lays. It was so much easier about it. It was like you're buying like, not newspapers like, samples of wallpaper and then putting products against it. With light it, just strategically lit. So silly. So yeah, I did that.

I just didn't, I didn't love it. Yeah, it wasn't like my favourite thing in the world. And I just, I really didn't love London at the time. I think it was like, I was broke, you know, couldn't do anything. London is a bad city to be in when you're broke. Yeah, it really was. And I was like, I didn't know what I was doing. I had no money.

I was trying to have a social life and trying to work. And like, I used to get to the tube before it had gone into. peak so I'd be like getting to work at like seven or eight a.m. in the morning because I just couldn't afford to pay every day like a peak price so I was paying. Isn't that interesting that so such you know that's so and I want you to keep that thing because it just tells you a lot that I said why. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? Like it's like that's that's such a reality. Yeah. You know, and I think it's really important that because we don't think about things like that. No. And it's harder now.

I don't know how I would do that now because I was literally getting in early doors and then I would wait until off-peak started again, which was like, what, like 7pm? So I would either walk from Hammersmith towards Oxford Circus or further, depending how long that took me. But I would be like the first in the office,

the last out, I was paid the least. And I was just like, this is just no life. I was like, I can't do this anymore. And you spend your money? Yeah, on travel and rent. And also just your, You're, when you're not, you're kind of like, oh, you're tired. You don't feel motivated, you know, because all your downtime, you just want to sit there on the sofa.

So you're buying delivery or whatever, or, you know. But yeah, that's no joke living on a budget in London, like that kind of budget. It was a lot. And I was also at that time making YouTube videos weekly, so I was still trying to find one day a week to film and do, you know, come up with something. I, like, no one was really seeing it, but it was something I enjoyed. So. But then after that, you went banana picking in Australia. Yes.

Okay, fine. You know, you're casual. That's what you do. Yeah. But that's it. And then you ended up at Disney World as a wench in a polyester wench suit. Yeah. And it was around that time that you got some upsetting news.

Yes. Yeah. Yes. That was about half. Yeah. Yeah. Yes. So that was about halfway through the year-long program I had.

It was, yeah, December 2016, I found out that my dad got dementia. And so I was in America. Oh, holy. That's so shit. I've got to come home. And my mom was like, don't you dare come home. You know, this is something that you're really enjoying and this is, you know, something you wanted to do. She was like, your dad would be so upset if you came home.

And she was like, there's nothing you can do here. Like, you're just going to witness something sad. So she was like, if this has taught me anything, it's enjoy your life. And there's so much guilt I have for this now. But my mum was like, just you have to live for yourself and do what you want to do. So I stayed and then came home. And it was like, you know, the deterioration because he had Picks disease. So it was a seven year lifespan once you've got that.

And the decline. Which is pretty much what he lived. Yeah, that almost bang on. But the decline is like I've never known anything like it. my grandpa had Alzheimer's and that was not a slow, that was not a quick decline, that was very slow. Whereas I'd seen my dad in the summer of 2016, exactly a year later I came home, a completely different person, couldn't have a conversation, had like the same stories he would tell over and over. He was living in a bit back, so he would be talking about a boyfriend that I'd had like three, four years prior,

as if I was still with him. Yeah, everything was just a bit lagged. Yeah, it was really, really hard, and I kind of ran away from it and went back to London because I couldn't handle it and then ended up going back to Disney again and then lockdown happened. And was it during lockdown

that your social media career really started to take off? Is that right? Yeah, so I'd basically worked again at Disney from 2019 and then And in March 2020, or it was April, I'd been sent back. So our program obviously got cancelled.

We all got deported home. And I was like, well, shit. I was like, what am I going to do now? And so I moved back in with my mum. And my dad was in a care home now. And we weren't able to see him. So I was like, oh God, I've not seen my dad. I'm not allowed to see my dad at this point.

And because it had been a bit of time, you know, I knew that a decline would have happened. and I really worried it wasn't really his memory, it was just personality, so he wouldn't forget me, but I just knew that his communication and everything would be different. But yeah, I came back home, was even with my parents, well, my mum, and I was like, oh my God, I've like thrown my life away. I was like, everything I was doing was a side hustle

because acting in comedy was my goal. So I kept, I'd, you know, put all my effort into making these YouTube videos, making these sketches and then all these other jobs I'd had were treated as side hustles just to like pay the bills and fund that and it got yeah it got to this point where I'd been sent home and I was like I literally have nothing to show for myself at this point I was like what have I done so I was like full of regret and I remember it would have been probably October or November 2020 my auntie had come around so it was when you were allowed someone in your bubble it's like really weird to think about now but she'd come over

and me, my mum and my auntie were sat in the hallway at my mum's house. I was just in tears. I don't know what to do. I was like I had opportunities that I could have taken that I turned down. I was like, I feel so stupid. And my mum was like, look, what's meant for you will not pass you by? But let's see what we can do now. So we were all like, right, what is like a logical thing you can do?

Have you got enough money to move back to London and make things happen? Like audition, try things. And I was like, well, COVID. And then we've kind of all tried to make a plan. And I was like, right, if nothing happens in 2021, by the end of 2021, if nothing has happened, give it up. Just get any old job that I enjoy and I'll just do that. And my friend who worked in TV, she was like, you should just be on TikTok now. She was like, don't worry about YouTube.

She was like, that's where everyone's like finding people and scouting them now. So I was like, what the hell? What have I got to lose? Let's start doing some sketches on TikTok. And then December 28th, 2020, blew up. And I was like, oh, this is like, something's happening here. And then, yeah, it just kind of, it just really, really growed from there. And I couldn't quite believe that that had happened when I'd said, you know, if it doesn't happen in 2021, I'll give up. And it all just suddenly was like, let's do it, let's go.

And it was a series of videos that you did. I mean you have so many you know hilarious themes that you cover but you have this me versus brain which is about well you explain what me versus brain the whole concept of it is yeah so it's like

overthinking intrusive thoughts and yeah just like the general things that your brain comes out with that you probably didn't want to say in front of other people because you thought you might be the only one that had those thoughts so that's where it started was

kind of making videos, trying to, I don't know, there was no, like, outcome for it. It was just I thought it was funny that I had these thoughts, didn't realise other people did. You wrote a brilliant book called Me versus Brain, which is sort of tied into this. And here's an example from this book, which is this idea that you have arguments with people in the shower. So it could be something that someone said to you six years ago. Yeah. You spend your time in the shower.

And when I read that, I sort of punched the air and thought, oh, God, it's not just me. Yeah. And aren't they the best comebacks? But you just don't think of them at the time. But no, I think it's, it's not everyone, because I have met people that have told me they don't even have an internal monologue, which I might. Who are they? You've got no voices in their head whatsoever. So I don't know.

Yeah, I think it's. Are those the same people, but if they're in a, you know, in a work situation, and let's say their boss closes their door, they don't then spend the next 40 minutes thinking they're about to get fired and composing a resignation letter. They have a very peaceful life. Yeah, and there's people I've met that

are they only think in pictures, they don't think in words. I mean, I think we all have, I think I've discovered, there's a lot of us that have this same motherboard and it makes us all have these same insecurity thoughts, feelings. But we don't all like, talk about it with each other so we don't know until, you know, someone says,

hey, I have intrusive thoughts and this is what I'm thinking. And then they're like, oh, wait, me too. Do you think it is a neurodivergency thing? So I think yes and no. I think a lot of it, I think intrusive thoughts, as I've been told, is quite an OCD trait. I've never been, I've never been tested for OCD, but I'm pretty sure I do have OCD. I have a lot of OCD tendencies. but yeah I've never looked into it really but yeah it's I think it's a bit of a mix

because I think everyone over things I think it's just the nature of being a human where we're sort of always second-guessing ourselves I guess but what your content obviously really resonated with people and I think I think one of the reasons for that is that it was at this point particularly during COVID This is my theory anyway, so bear with. That I think COVID, people suddenly did not want, you know, there was a bit of a backlash against the old idea of influencers. People showing us their perfect lives and curating their kitchen,

their sort of, you know, marble kitchen island and their jars full of cookies, which they've never eaten. You know, and just saying how wonderful their life was and opening all their free stuff that they've been sent from brands. And I think during COVID people wanted dogs. They wanted vulnerability and people being honest and human. And I wonder if there was a sort of like humanity to what you were doing. It albeit through a comedic lens that really resonated with people.

I think so. Because I think it was it was that idea of being authentic, which I didn't realise that that's kind of, you know, that was what it was. but it was just, I was just being, I was showing up and being quite vulnerable with the stuff that I was, I was making sketches of. And they were sketches, so they felt removed from me, but they were like actual things that I experienced.

But they then tended to, you know, throughout time, they've moved from being experiences I've had or things I think and feel to just being like, oh, I know that's the thing that I've had before, so I'll write something on it. But I do think there was like, everyone just craved a bit of realness. And I just happened to do it at that time. Because yeah, it was, everyone was quite curated at that time and no one was saying the stuff that people were ashamed of.

Well, it was going through the high guys, Amma talk about era. And then I think it just started to feel like, well, if this is all we have to get us through the next two years, this is our only contact with the outside world, they're going to have to step it up a bit. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? We don't want ads. Yeah. You are an example of someone who, in a really weird way, the pandemic, professionally. Professionally really was great for me. Yeah.

Professionally, it was a fantastic time. Yeah. You know, personally, it wasn't a great time. But professionally, it was a fantastic time for me. And I always find that really funny because people, you know, when you talk about COVID, it was like an awful time. But I'm like, well, I don't know what would have happened if we didn't have that. So I am very grateful for it.

I really hope you love part one of this week's Walking the Dog. If you want to hear the second part of our chat, it'll be out on Thursday, so whatever you do, don't miss it. And remember to subscribe so you can join us on our walks every week.