Walking The Dog with Emily Dean - Jake Humphrey

Episode Date: September 14, 2020

This week Emily went to Norfolk for a country stroll with Jake Humphrey. They chat about Jake’s big break, his moments of self-doubt, and feeling in his element on live TV. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Are you good with this, by the way? Are you all right now? Are we all through? Hars is down! Oh, now you should have filmed that. You should have filmed Emily falling in the mud at a really deep conversation about psychology. This week on Walking the Dog, I went to Norfolk

for a country stroll with sports presenter Jake Humphrey and his beautiful Labrador Bell, along with Labrador Alfie, who belongs to Jake's mum and dad. You'll probably know, Jake, from his coverage of major sporting events from Formula One to the Olympics to sports personality of the year, and of course as the BT Sport Premier League anchor. Jake's created a really idyllic family set up at his Norfolk home. They've got a lake, they've got chickens wandering around.

He gave me eggs to take home. But as perfect as his life seems, it's not been without some mental health challenges in moments of self-doubt, and I was really impressed that he was so open about that. We also talked about his childhood, failing his A-levels, his huge TV break, and why he feels in his absolute element doing live TV every week.

Jake, by the way, hosts a podcast which is called The High Performance Podcast. It's hosted by Jake and a psychologist, Professor Damien Hughes, and it features all sorts of high achievers from Maria Ferdinand to Tom Daly, all sharing the psychology behind their success. I found it incredibly inspiring. I think you'll really like Jake. He's an interesting combination of someone who's obviously very driven and business-minded, who's all so happiest just wandering around the countryside for hours with his dogs.

watching me fall in the mud. Oh yes, that happened. I really hope you enjoy our walk as much as I did. Remember to rate, review and subscribe if you did. I'll hand over to him now. Here's Jake and Belle and Alfie. Is this usual for Jake to do the walk or is this your job normally? No, this is usual actually.

I have to say, he loves it. I don't know where to begin. So what you're doing? Are you going walk around here or walk around? Jake? I think that we can have a little walk around the garden, and then we can go through a fence there. There's a bit of scrub land, and we'll try and get through there,

down the alleyway, then we're onto a lovely little country lane. Then it takes us round into a bit of common land where we can just walk around there. There might be some cattle, so we might have to put the dogs on the lead. But I'll just give you a little flavour of Norfolk in the sun. Did you like me as a townie trying to look cool and unfazed when Jake said, maybe walk through some cattle? Oh, let me just check up. Love you, darling.

Thank you so much, Harriet. Lovely to meet you. Yeah, we're going to take both. We won't be long. Come on, Alfie. So welcome. It's just slightly unnerving when it's not your daughter. I know Alfie, obviously, because he's my mum and dad's,

but it's just different, isn't it? I know the bell will just stick with us all the time, but it might be, we have to put Alfie on the lead at some point. So Jake, let's introduce the dogs before we even introduce you. Yeah. Quite right. have with us. We have Bell, who is our fox red Labrador, at which point you look at her and think she's not a fox red, I know. And then we have Alfie with half a tail. My mum and dad's slightly

older and much bigger Labrador, but they're just great mates. And my mum and dad have gone out for the whole day, and so we're dog sitting Alfie. Immediately she wants to go in the water, look. Is this your lake? Yeah. I mean, it's not often I get to ask that question. Which I know people will listen and think, oh, that's... What is he doing having a lake? But the great thing about living in Norfolk is, like, there's a lot of land here. So you can kind of, you know, you... You live in the country, you know?

He's in the lake already, Alfie is. What's Bell doing? She's crouching over the lake. No, look, she wants a stone thrown in the water for her. Oh, shall I do it? Yeah. Which one, Jake? Go for that one.

And then she'll... She'll then go... You can throw it, give it a good old hole. Where? Where is it? Now, off she goes, looking for something that sunk. But they just love being in the water. Look at those two.

See, I'm now, because I work in television, I'm now wishing this was, like, video, because it just looks so cute, doesn't it? So, yeah, she should be fox red, but when we went to some friends who go to school with our children, they had puppies. Yeah. We were keen to, I grew up in a house, always having dogs,

so I was really keen for our kids to have dogs. and so we thought right let's do it let's get a dog we turned up to look at these fox red pups and hey look at the herons come to steal the fish look straight in he saw us and left again they saw this townie and they thought everything's like what

the townie with the cost of coffee car you thought so farmehouse was the countryside didn't you that's the problem this is the real thing when we sometimes go on holiday the kids are like yeah but dad why are people getting so excited about some chickens and an old tractor Because that's all they see all day long. Chickens and an old tractor.

We'll have to go and see if we've got some eggs actually for you. So I should have actually... Oh, I love some eggs. No, we'll go and see if they've laid anything. I've never been offered eggs on walking. So this has been our little... I'm not a massive camper, right? So the odd night in a tent is in the garden is all that we need to do.

And then back in the house, just one night. We've done it twice over the summer. And the whole family stays in that. Or it's on date night. It's not date. That's how we do romance in Norfolk. Come on love. Out to the tent.

You're a cheap date, aren't you, Jake? I should officially introduce you, Jake, Humphrey, because I'm very excited to be here. I'm with a man who really needs no introduction. Everyone knows who you are, Jake. In fact, I know that everyone knows who you are because when I was driving up here and I got, not lost, but I just wanted to check I was going in the right direction,

I won't say where you live, but I mentioned your address to someone local. Yeah. And they looked a bit blank. And then I thought, I'm going to have to do it. And I said, do you know if Jake Company went, oh, Jake, of course. Well, I do get posts addressed to just my name and the town I live in. And that's it.

And it does get to the door. And actually, the field that we're walking through now, I had a really good fun 40th birthday party in here last year. And put some tents up and had some food trucks and a load of bands and stuff. Is this your field, Jake? Yeah. Wow. You know what? We've tried really hard because when we first came here, this was just thistles and nettles everywhere. And we've seeded it with lovely sort of traditional English

grasses and we've tried to turn it into a wildflower meadow because they're on the decline so much. But it's a lot of work and it's kind of a bit hit and miss really. So I was hoping this year that this whole field will be a riot of crazy colour but sadly it hasn't, it isn't to be. But I'm kind of, I'm quite heavily plugged into that whole environmental thing. And everything we try and do here on a very small scale, you know, if I can just make a small patch of traditional English wildflower meadow, it's a small gesture, but it makes a difference. These two love it. Look at them. Oh, come on, Belle and Alfie. I'm with Belle and Alfie, as we were saying.

And we're in, I won't say exactly where we are, but we're in near Norwich, aren't we? Yep. Sun's out. You mentioned briefly that you'd had dogs when you were growing up. That's right. And where was that? I was born in Peterborough and that's where we had our first dog who was a beautiful mongrel called Sally.

And then we moved to Norfolk in the late 80s, 1987. So my mum and dad are about five miles down the road in the same village as my sister. My brother is still in Norwich in the north of the city. He runs a picture frame in gallery. Norwich my sister and her husband both worked for the NHS and it just felt like we needed to come home when I stopped working on Formula One and we and we had our first child and when you were growing up what what sort of a childhood was it just a really kind of I mean a really happy childhood really happy childhood I thought I kind of I wanted to say

kind of normal but then that almost does it a disservice you know what I mean Like there was nothing outstanding. I went to the sort of local state school. I had a paper round like everyone did. I used to do the garden for a guy that lived around the corner. I then became a waiter. Did we go over the bridge? Yeah, it's over the bridge, yeah. And tell me what your parents, it was you and your, you have a brother and a sister. Yeah, I got an older sister and a younger brother, so I was the classic middle child. What does that mean to you, the classic middle child? Well, a good example, my mum and dad will love me telling this story was that my sister, was the oldest, so she was kind of in charge. And my brother was the youngest, so he was like really well looked after. So one Christmas, and this is not a word of a lie,

my brother got a brand new jacket and a guitar for Christmas. My dad worked for age concern, Norfolk. So we actually lived in an old people's home for a few months when we couldn't find a house. That was an experience. And so I got from one of the old people's homes where he was working a knitted Norwich City monkey. I was about 15.

Honestly. And even now, I say to my dad, remember the knitted monkey when my brother got a guitar. You see, I wonder if that's what spurred you on to your success. It's all down to the knitted monkey, you know. It all goes back to the monkey from Etheltyple Court. Do you genuinely think that does, in some way,

make you crave attention more? Does it make you crave attention? I don't think it made me crave attention. I think I can only sort of talk from my experience. And I'm in no way scarred. from in the middle child, but I do think that you just have to fight a little bit more because your sister is the first one to do everything, or in my case, so that's kind of exciting and brilliant, and then your little brother is the kind of little one that everyone

needs to look after. So you're kind of, you are kind of a little bit in the middle and I think maybe I was a bit in the middle, Emily, my whole upbringing. Like I was the most ordinary child at school. Like, didn't do any, people often think that because I'm on the telly, I must have done like drama or acting at school or anything like that. I did none of that. I wasn't in any of the clubs. I'm a sports presenter who never played any of the school teams. I think I played once for my school team. I was so bad. They never picked me again. My GCSEs were like very ordinary 1A, which was only in word processing, and I only took that just to get an A. He actually did a typing GCSEC.

1A4Bs, 5C, something like that. And then I went and did my A levels and again, just everything was normal. And I suppose then, there was like a C change then when I failed my A levels. What did you get? I got an E, an N and a U. What's an N?

Oh, exactly. I think... They made up the category for you. I was just confused as you when I opened the envelope. Actually, I said to the teacher, I said, excuse me. I've opened this and I've got an N. And do you know what?

I'll never forget how quite sarky response. Oh, what is Alfie doing? Oh, I thought they were in the water. Look at these two exploring. Alki and Bella are on a bridge, a little wooden jet, mini sort of bridge. Look who's the other side of the wooden bridge. Oh, Jake, is that a cow?

It's a cow, yeah. How do the cows react to the dogs in New York? We'll get around that side. They'll come and feed from us. Oh, we'll find out. Yeah. Yeah, again, like with Bell, perfect.

Like for his sake really because I think you might get trampled if he Oh no come on Alfie I've lost a mum and dad's dog How where's he gone? Ohfie Hey Oh there's a rustling in the bushes We found him That's interesting you were saying about your A level yeah you got an N what did you discover what it meant

So yeah so the teacher said to me um An N is for someone who um isn't quite clever enough to get an E, but not so thick they got a U. And I think she thought it was a joke, because I opened, and she didn't know my previous grade was an E, and the next one I opened after the end was a U. And that was for English politics and psychology A and ever. And that was a bad day, man, because my mum, got left down here, my mum was a teacher at the school where I went.

She was a home economics teacher, which is where my sort of love of cooking and all sort of homey things comes from, I think. and I walked into the back door and it was that horrendous thing where my dad was standing holding a bottle of champagne with the smile on his face and he just went well and I remember I just went like this

I just put my sort of fingers to my head and was like my head's gone dad and I went upstairs and my dad is such a brilliant sort of gentle bloke I remember I'm coming up and just basically saying everything would be fine and interestingly how nice Jay what a lovely lovely Yeah, it was great. And they had a friend staying over. And my mum and dad's friend, who, for the life of me, I can't remember her name, but she felt that she had slightly mystic powers or an ability to kind of read what's going to happen. And she said, that minute, she said, you don't know this yet. Failing your A-levels is the best thing that will ever happen to you. And I just looked at him and I obviously thought, you're just trying to make me feel better, which is really nice.

And weirdly it turned out that she was exactly right. Around the back of Jane's house now. That's Bell's dog run for if we go out. She will not stay in it. She leaps over that. See how that fences? She just leaps over. So does Belle...

Alfie obviously lives with your parents. Yeah. Does Belle, does she have the run of the house? Yeah, pretty much, yeah. Is she allowed in the beds? She, right, this is a slightly sore subject because we've always been, she's such a good girl,

and she knows that she's a dog. And I mean that in the nicest possible way. So when we go upstairs and put the kids to bed, she sleeps on the bottom of the stairs and waits for us to come down and put the kids to bed. The last couple of weeks, she started going up to bed with the kids and laying a bed with them.

Let me show you a picture quickly. That is a real life dog daughter. And they were asleep. Look at Bell, she's fast asleep. You see, looking at those pictures of your daughter. I'm not that cool with that, though, by the way. Are you not? Not really.

Like part of the life countryside upbringing is that you know we have some friends whose dogs are just outside only dogs a lot of the farmers that we know I'm definitely a step more towards it's a member of the family and so Bell comes in is in the kitchen is with us all the time but I'm not a dog comes on the bed kind of person why I just partly hygiene reasons I mean you know we do shower and bath most days oh look here's a sparrow hort that we on the lawn today. Look at that isn't that stunning. Sad but stunning. Oh I find it really sad. I know I know I know. It's a dead sparrow hawk. Look at that it's a bird of prey. Look at those claws on that. Oh Jay. You have to get quite used to death in the country. Yeah you do absolutely. Yeah you do. I mean we um look at that one that's in flight. Look at that. She's holding out the wingspan of the dead sparrow hawk. It's not what I

expected from today. We're not sure what happened to it though. We don't think it was an animal attack. It feels like it flew into something because he's got a broken neck. You see the way you handle that a deceased bird. You're now thinking why doesn't he let his dog on the bed if he touches his death? No, I'm thinking I could have seen you being a veterinarian. My daughter, that is her chosen profession. Alfie! Alfie! Good boy. He's got that wet ball again. So your issue with the dogs on the bed is partly hygiene. And partly. And partly I just think that I still think there is boundaries with dogs. I still think that it's important that you eat your dinner and they're not at the table

slobbering and sniffling around and they wait until you've eaten and they eat. I just think it's like, it's not like a control or power thing. I just, I just wouldn't want a dog that just thinks it can just go anywhere it likes. But then sometimes the great thing I would imagine about having kids is that they challenge your beliefs. Because you're thinking this is what I think And then you see how happy that makes your daughter And it made me almost well up that picture So I think maybe that's what kids are there for

Is to teach you to think, well, what? And I think it's also really great for the kids Because the relationship they have with us Is different to their grandparents And which is different to their cousins And it was absolutely different to their dog Like the relationship Bell has With Florence and Sebastian is like nothing else

So Jake's got a lovely people. Giana. Yeah, that's Harriet plays that. Not as often as she should, but she does. I'm going to take you and show you the chickens if they've got any eggs for you. So, you had, and I know this because you've spoken about it, which I think is great that you've spoken about it, but you had, you were bullied, weren't you at school, Jay? That's right, yeah, yeah.

Tell me about that and what that was like. I mean, obviously not great, but how did it manifest itself? Yeah, at the time, it was awful. I mean, we moved, we moved up to Norfolk. when I was still at primary school and that was kind of all okay but it was when I went to a high school in Norwich that it just, come on half,

it just wasn't good really and it was, I was just really sad I had absolutely no friends at that school I was only there for year seven and year eight and I kind of, I'm not a big fan of quitting at anything but I just had to leave basically because it just become a bit toxic

and I think the big issue in those days was that schools struggled to know how to deal with it. So my mum and dad spoke to the school and then it was kind of like it was like made a big deal of in front of all the children. This guy's getting bullied. Can you all please stop doing that to him? And it's like, what's that going to do?

Like in 2020, schools would deal with it very differently and I'm not accusing them of not doing the right thing. They probably did what everyone, what every school would have done at that time. But it was really hard, really hard. But then I suppose I'm I come from a viewpoint now which has only really been something I've cotton on to this by the way is our fox protector talking of getting used to death. We lost a few foxes recently. So we've got this stuff over the top just. What do you mean you lost? Sorry, lost a few chickens. Oh, I see. Not nice for the kids. Florence loves, do you like chickens? Yeah, I do actually. Now the dog's okay with the chickens. Bell will be fine. Alfie might come in and have a sniff so we might shut the gate.

Alfie, you're not allowed into the chickens. chickens. Well, Bell's friends with him really. How many chickens have you got, Jake? We've got, we had four, lost two to the fox, and then got another four. So we have six now. Hello, chicken. Who's in there?

Hello, darling. Hello you. This one is shouting because she's always broody. Let me in first. Here you go. It's okay, sweetheart. That's Coco. Coco.

In here we've got lavender who is broody as well. I think, so you know the broody thing comes from wanting to have a chick basically. Yeah. Not only is she broody but if you try and take her off the nest, she was super-agriss. I love it here, you know, Emily, because this is like the total antithesis of the TV world, basically. Hey, Jake's lock me in here with the chickens. Have you heard of chicken before? No.

So all you want to do is just hold it around there. so that its wings don't sew a bit higher up, like holding its wings in so it's wings in so it's wings because if it's wings flat then you'll get, there you go. There you go, sweetheart. How about that? She's a natural with the chicken. Be honest, how appealing is the country life

when you get a little taste-to-like. Do you know what? I'm giving the chicken a little massage. Yeah, good. These are amazing. Yeah, they don't like great eggs and when they do, they're about this big, they're tiny little things. And what are they called?

Silkeys. Oh, they're Silkeys. You know, they're very North London. Why don't you get a silky on a lead and walk around Highgate? You can be the crazy chicken lady of Highgate. That would go down really well out there. I mean, I like that I'm the crazy chicken lady already. So Jake...

I'm going to give you these eggs. Oh, I love that. I can't take them yet, though. We've still got the podcast to things. Oh, yeah. Let's leave them here and then we'll cut them on the way back. It's a great idea. We'll leave the eggs.

It's so kind of you, though. Pleasure. So tell me, you were saying about your school, And that sounds, what was it like though, Jay? What sort of things would they do? What kind of bullying was it? Like, I suppose partly sort of physical bullying. I mean, the single worst episode was when we were getting changed after swimming one day.

And just as I took off my swimming trunk, I got pushed out the door of the changing room, but it pushed you into like a car park and a load of classrooms. So I was standing there trying to maintain my dignity with my hands while the bigger lads. Because I was a really late developer. Like, I was small. I was... My English teacher, Mr. Pugh, used to say that I was just, like, a bit too sensitive, you know? Like, I think the reason now that I love the job I do,

and particularly the podcast I do, is that empathy with other people. Like, I just want everyone to get on. I want positivity. Life's not very long. We can all do better. But that doesn't really work very well when you're a 15-year-old. How? Why does he do this?

That's not the place to go. is it? It's clearly we're going around the corner to some land that is not mine. He's gone straight into the pond. So we're going, we're navigating some, I mean I say navigating. It's hardly the temple of doom, but. Listen, if you've come from Highgate, this is a big, this is a big hike we're on right now. This is all sorts of challenges. This is, I feel like Captain Odes. So, so you, things didn't go well in terms of academic qualifications, but it sounds like, I mean, do you think the bullying might have contributed to that bit? I think that the bullying, the bullying created something which I think is a huge, hugely

important in anyone's life, which is resilience. And it's something I struggle with all the time with Flo and Seth. How can they be brought up in these beautiful rural surroundings, go to a great school, have loads of wonderful things in their life and still have resilience, how do I create that fight and that struggle in them? Because I think that one of the big issues we have these days is that people don't fail at stuff. For a start, we don't let our kids fail at anything. We just constantly create a world around our children where they're going to be fine and everything's going to work out for them because we've smoothed the path in front of them. And even if they do fail at something, we're very quick to tell them

that they haven't failed. They've done okay and it's just like, you know, you'll do better next time or something like that or just ignore it and brush it under the carpet and feel sorry for them and go and buy them something to kind of ease the pain. And if we do that, if we create children that don't struggle and don't fail, I think they get to 19, 20, 21 and have no proper concept of actually how brutal the world can be and how important it is to fail. Like when I say they fail, I'm not talking about it in a negative sense, but I think failure and having a comfortable relationship and an ability to fail at stuff is the absolute single most important thing you can do because I think that if you don't teach people

young people that failure is an option and it's okay I think that there's a road hit boys girls wait I think that they think when they try something and fail they think oh this isn't for me this is the wrong path because I've failed at it they see failure is the opposite of success and it bloody isn't failure is part of the journey to getting there it's part of the journey to success do you think though because I agree with you intellectually. There's another dead bird of prey there. I wonder if this is some sort of omen or is this just a, is this just a Thursday? This is just an average Thursday in the countryside. I agree with you intellectually about that failure thing. Absolutely. Is it hard as a parent though when you see your

own kids being in situations where they're disappointed or experiencing discomfort to deal with that? Yeah, completely. And that's why I'm totally aware that I haven't managed to conquer that because I've not let Florence or Seb really fail at anything yet. And I'm not... What do you mean by that? I haven't let them... Like we make sure that if they've got a tricky bit of homework, we sit with them and really guide them through it and make sure that by the time they take it to school the next day, the answers are right. Well, maybe sometimes the best thing for them is to realise that they've got the wrong answer. And if they go into school with the wrong answer,

that's okay. You don't have to have all the answers to all the things all the time in this world. And so I'm not sort of coming at it from a point of view that I've conquered it and I'm sort of preaching saying that's what you need to do. I have not, I have not done that. You know, you can call it that in itself could be considered a failure, I suppose, but like a good failure because it's part of learning, isn't it? It's part of living in that now moment. The things that I'm probably most proud of all the things I've done of the, of Whisper, which is our production company and that has just been constant failure constant mistakes constant learning and we've been going for 10 years and and it's it's now oh car coming now there's a car coming now jake right let's see

bell come here will i take bell yeah would you mind i think bell's going to be less pull a better fit for me just because i'd quite like to show off that i do know how to handle a dog on a lead i know you do I've listened to many of your pods In fact, your podcast was the first one I ever listened to I want to talk about when your career started Because for some people it starts young, doesn't it? Often I chat to people for this podcast There's a story of the show when they were five

You know, whatever, the Jake Humphrey show, Mum and Dad Which is the total opposite really, I think Really? Well, yeah, I think so. Going back to the A-Level story And my mum and dad's friend who said, this is the best thing that will ever happen to you That was a tricky period and there was sort of three things that happened at that time

My my granddad who was a farmer you've probably picked up I might have come from a farming background He in the 1960s he was going to a wedding and he went down to the farm to show his brother his new suit for the wedding and it was proper old school Top Hat and tails suit and the they were picking potatoes with the have you seen those potato pickers? They're sort of shaped like that and they rotate like that and they pull the potatoes out the ground, send them over the top and into the back of a truck. And then sometime around the 1940s probably, they invented a machine to do it and he went down to show his brother his top hat and tails and said, look, I'm off to a wedding, how do I look?

The potato picker caught his tail, pulled him into the machine, snapped his back in half and he survived but was a parallel on the waist down. And at that time, they said to him, this is like 10 year lifespan. And he lived until the mid to the late 90s. Amazing guy, Grandad John. And as a young kid, you have no concept that your granddad is disabled. It's just absolutely brilliant fun when he climbs into bed to get on his wheelchair and do a wheelie and wheel around with my cousin Simon. And it's only really later in life that you get an instant.

sight that adulthood gives you of kind of how difficult that must have been. The one thing that I always remember when I think of the sort of trauma you would have gone through on a daily basis without ever complaining once was when we all got dressed up to go to a zoo somewhere. And he used to have a wooden board that he would slide across to get into the car. So he'd ride his wheelchair up to the car, have to take off the side of the wheelchair in front of his two little grass. by the way, put a piece of wood under his bottom, pull himself into the car, across the piece of wood into the driver's seat, close up his wheelchair, and then he had a machine on the top of his car that used to store a bit like, see that thing now on top of that car, which is used

for like going camping. I used to have a really big one which would store a wheelchair, and you'd have a winching, and the winch would come out, you'd tie it into the wheelchair, press a button, and the wheelchair would get lifted up into the roof of the car, and off we'd go and he'd use hand controls to drive us around. On this particular day, as he slid himself across, he pooed himself. And as grandkids, he goes, we can't go out, guys. He has to go back in the house, my grandmaster clean him up.

Look, you know, and I sort of, I'm only really telling you this story because, like, at the time, as a grandson, I was just like, that's cool. We'll just go and play in the garden. Do you know what I mean? It meant nothing. But to him, it must really have been a kind of difficult moment. Do you mean you? Hi Sarge, how are you? I'm well. Yeah, really well. Nice to see you. Lovely day, isn't it?

Bell! Come here you. This brilliant house is lived in by the former head of the British Army, who would be great for your podcast actually. Lord Richard Danet. Is that him? And that's the guy that works really?

Is that Lord Richard Danet? Oh no, that's the man. And that's Sarge, who would have been a sergeant, probably in the army with him and now looks after him. Oh, when you said, hi, Sarge. I didn't know he was an actual serge. Howie? Kelly. Alfie!

So my grandmom, so she was his carer and when he died she did struggle a great deal and sadly she committed suicide just after he died. Oh, that's awful. Yeah, absolutely it was. And that was around the same time that I failed my A levels and then I got, believe it or not, fired from McDonald's, which takes some doing. So you can sort of see that that was a period. period of like quite a few kind of heavy body blows, right? And then the bullying at

school hadn't been great and I was just like, I was, I suppose I would describe myself as being the kid who felt there was kind of nothing special about them. And then the most remarkable thing happened after failing my A-levels, I went back to school to do A-level retakes and on the day that I went in, Mr. Brogan, my politics teacher, would you like a Blackberry. Oh, I'd love a Blackberry. There you go, you better pick it in the current climate. I'm like that.

Mr Brogan had a letter and the letter was from a local TV company called Rapture Television and they were looking for young people to go on their channel and talk about political issues. So they were writing to the local A-level politics class of which I was in because I failed my A-level. So I was redoing my politics at A-level. So I went down there and I just said to them, look, it's not great, I failed my exams. Bearing in mind, you know, like you don't speak to anyone a year below you at school, do you?

I obviously then had to go back and sit in a class with all these younger children. I say younger, only a year younger, but at school you just, it's embarrassing, man. And so I went to a local TV channel and they ended up using me and paying me five pounds cash to work Saturday and Sunday

to move sets around, to operate the auto queue, to work the sound desk and all these things, because they had no money, they couldn't employ presenters. Nor did you at five pounds. No, it's nothing like I used me. But like what I learned was worth so much more than that, you know? And that was my first job in television. Then when I passed my A-levels, I got a job there because they ran while I was working there as a work experience kid, I suppose you'd call me, they ran a competition for viewers to send in a home video.

and the best home video got to go to Paris and present a show. But because they only just started and they had no viewers, they got no videos. So they asked me and the other work experience guys to create videos if we were viewers, and then they picked the winner. Obviously this is in the days where you could lie on the television and no one minded. Yeah. Things had changed somewhat. But I was then sitting in the gallery operating in the auto queue and the presenter went, and the winner is Jake Humphrey from Norwich, and there's me having just filmed this video in my garden with my best mate, Stephen,

Suddenly going to Paris to do some presenting which my parents were dead against because this was the time to focus on Passing my A levels. I went to Paris really enjoyed it There I say found it easy and then they offered me a job and then that was it. I worked at Rapture TV when I passed my a level And then someone said you need to make a show reel created a show reel sent it down to London and ended up being the first presenter on the new children's BBC channel in February 2001. You must have been so thrilled when you... Do you still remember finding out you'd got the job? Yeah.

I've got a few kind of memories like that. The biggest one is that when I walk into my mum and dad's living room, because just before I got offered a job on Children's BBC, I auditioned for Blue Peter, and I didn't get it. But when I go into my mum and dad's lounge, the evening I got back from that audition, the smell of their living room

reminds me of that day. I can go straight back. Because obviously the emotions were so heightened. I was this kid from Norwich ended up in the Blue Peter studio jumping up and down on a trampoline. Like doing a proper audition for a show that was so famous

and we're still in its kind of heyday 20 years ago. And then my memories from getting that job on Children's BBC was just kind of the responsibility really of being a children's BBC presenter. You know, you're following in some amazing footsteps but then I had great fun. I hosted Fame Academy with Holly Willoughby and Caroline

Flack and then I moved on and did news round and hosted news round for a while which was great and then they were looking for a new Formula One presenter but at that point Jay yeah you I would have thought you're young this extraordinary thing has happened yeah I don't like has happened that implies you had no part in it. You've created this extraordinary opportunity for yourself and everything's working out. And then you struggled a bit during that time, didn't you? Yeah, that's right.

Yeah, that was, I think that was just going to London and my parents sort of leave. I remember the panic rising as they drove off. I moved into a flat in East London. But look where I live, right? This is what I came from. And suddenly I'm in Limehouse in a small flat. like scared basically and I think it was just a bit it was just a bit overwhelming and I suppose

that period that I'd gone through a few years before maybe I hadn't really processed that properly but I actually think that and I genuinely believe that we still talk about when people have mental health episodes is this kind of like a big deal right if I'd have if I'd have had a bad knee or you know a stomach problem or something you know we would We wouldn't discuss it in the same terms, almost like it, let's go in here, this nice bit of common. Like it still is a big deal, Emily. And I think that while we talk about it, like you had this period where you had a mental health episode, like it's a big deal. I think that still makes, A, people going through it feel like what they're going through is a big deal, which then stops them talking about it enough.

I think I don't, I struggle to know of anyone who at some time in their life hasn't had. some kind of mental health problem, whether it's just serious self-doubt, you know, all the way to, go on, look at that, a dog's trying to work out how to get through a kissing gate, isn't? Well, you haven't seen me try and do it yet, so let's not laugh at the dog too much, Jay. I think that, oh, hold on, there's cows in here, let's put out here on a leaf. I think it's really important to sort of normalise, if we can, when we have had a mental health. health episode or even if it's an ongoing mental health problem like like we would if it was a physical ailment and I think that we spend so much time thinking about how can we go to the gym

I don't think anyone would have nothing that wouldn't be helped by talking yeah all of us even just a conversation like this between a couple of friends it doesn't need to be a formal counselling session I just think we just have to talk more and how did you deal with it jake yourself because you that I wonder there's a part of me that wonders whether you'd so convinced yourself that you were kind of nothing really at that point. And I think as human beings, we cling to our identity. We think, I like this, I like this film. I don't like Corrianda or I like it.

I'm a failure. I'm successful. So I wonder if it suddenly felt daunting and overwhelming that that was being challenged. It was like, oh my God. Are you good with this, by the way? Are you all right now? Are we all through? Passes down!

Oh, no, you should have filmed that. You should have filmed Emily falling in the mud at a really deep conversation around, about psychology. But you know what? You sort of instinctively reached out to help me. And I thought, oh, I think you'd be good to have on a desert island. Good. I'd do my best for you. Are you quite like that?

Are you quite, in a group situation, are you quite a problem solver? Are you, I'm dealing with it? Yeah, I guess. I mean, I think I'm probably, in my head I think I'm probably more standoffish because, like, the too many cooks spoil the broth type thing. Like, I would probably shrink a little bit and let the louder, let the louder people go to the front, you know. I think there's a misconception that maybe I'm loud because I want to tell you, but I'm really, I don't consider myself to be loud. And I've got a real obsession with quiet leaders. And my boy is very quiet. And should we get these dogs in the water? And too often, I've apologised. for him being quiet and I'm vowing, look at that street, I'm vowing never to do that again.

Because why can't you be quiet and brilliant? Why do we celebrate the loud and not celebrate the quiet? Yeah, that's true actually. I agree with that. I'm embarrassed now when I think back, when I used to say, oh sorry, Sebastian's a bit shy. Would you? Why would I've said that? So what? If my boy wants to be quiet and work you out, let him, you know? Do you think it's also because we, without even realising it, we have a bit of unconscious bias towards what we expect of men and what we expect of women? I definitely think we still live in a world where if you're a woman that is a leader, you're seen as ambitious and you'll walk over anyone to get what you want and you're ruthless. Whereas if you're a man who's a leader, then you know you're powerful. and you're dominant and you're leading.

We have to change that. We definitely have to change that. I want to have a daughter who is allowed to be celebrated for being a leader, which Florence kind of is. This place feels like we were talking about mental health. This feels like it's a really good place for your mental health. Yes, you're absolutely right. And I think that living in London, working in Formula One,

my wife worked on Strictly Come Dancing, and I'm still able to. Oh, did she? Harriet, what was she doing on that? She was a production coordinator. Is that how you guys met? No, we met in a nightclub in Norwich. When did you meet? In 1999, a long time ago. So I've been with Harriet right from that A-level failure period.

She's been there every single step of the way. Oh, my goodness. Now I should explain what's happened. My beautiful Labrador has jumped in the lake, excited to get a piece of stick that Emily has thrown into the water only Emily's throat was so bad the stick actually went behind her and is somewhere in the fields and the dogs are still in the water waiting for the stick I'm so sorry Alfie and look at him wrapped in that week he's wearing the

waltz wearing the weeds like a sort of cloak like Emperor Alfie look at that is brilliant she woke up in Highgate now she's covered in mud she's spilt Costa coffee all over a rural field in the middle of nowhere and she's searching for a the things that this podcast does for her. What were you asking? I feel I'm being urban shamed. Tell me, yeah, so the move into sports. Oh, yeah.

Do you think that was quite brave in a way? Because most people would say, God, you've done brilliantly well. Yeah. I love Deslinem as a kid. And I always wanted, good girl, pal. And I always wanted to be a sports presenter. But it was a difficult thing to convince the BBC, really, because going back to 2007, 2008, I had that first conversation with them, I think they were still very much of the mindset that you're either a qualified journalist so you can be a sports broadcaster,

or you used to play to a high level, and then you can talk about it as well. To take a sort of A-level failure that lost a job at McDonald's and has been on kids TV, I mean, I was hosting a show at the time called Mobster Lobster, where we'd run around in the bluepies that go then. dressed as a giant lobster popping blooms and in the balloons were foam and in the foam was either a big or a small starfish which depended how many points you got. Did you have to say

to the sort of head of sport like Nile Sloan or whoever it was? Yes, if you could check out my work on mobster, lobster please. I met the talent manager and she did actually quite pointedly say yes I saw you doing a mobster lobster this morning and I thought this conversation is not going to go well.

But it's interesting you should mention Nile actually because he is the person that took the chance on me. He's the guy that saw someone on kids' telly and thought, I reckon I can put him on Formula One. He was the head of football at the BBC at the time, and then he was given the job as head of Formula One, and he's now head of ITV sport. And he absolutely, along with Roger Monesy,

who was the head of BBC sport at the time, the two of them, to take a guy from mobster-lobster and give them the job on Formula One is a huge leap of faith, and I'm sort of eternally grateful for them. did? Timing. Because I think that at that time there was a feeling that BBC Sport needed to be a bit younger,

it needed to appeal to a younger audience. I think Formula One leans that way anyway. And I think they were looking for someone at that time that would come and bring a freshness, I think, to that department. Albert, I'm saying, that's interesting, that you went for something quite self-deprecating timing. That's external factors. Yeah.

I think what qualities in you did they see? I think it probably comes back to the empathy thing again. I think people often think if you work in football or Formula One or any sport, you must love the sport itself. And I do love football. I love Formula One. But what I love is the personal story. I love the idea of someone trying to be the very, very best in the world.

And there was a time where I hosted a quiz show for the BBC. And I really struggled with it because I was doing F1 at the time. And I found myself, and you know, this is no slight on people that host quiz shows. Like they'd do it brilliantly and the nation love them. I get that completely. But when you're standing there going, okay, answer this question to win. 25 pounds. Let's have a look.

This before you see my head going, last week you were saying, if Sebastian Beto wins this race, he's the champion of the world. And I just love that, I love the inspiring nature of sport. I love the quest to be the best you can be. I love the struggle. I love the sacrifice. I love the non-negotiable behaviours. I love all of that, a hell of a lot more than I love,

are Man United going to play two up top or play 433, or is Sebastian Vettl going to pit for new tires on the 30 second lap? I like, for me it's about the emotion, and I think maybe they saw a bit of that. But also, I guess it was also a tale of taking my chances, because they gave me a job on, to host the Super Bowl, and I did a bit of hosting on football focus.

And then I went to the Olympics in Beijing in 2008 while I was still on Children's BBC and hosted an Olympic Games. And that was like, I'm sitting there with Sue Barker and Hazel Irvin. But probably the biggest smart stamp of approval from them was asking me to host sports personality of the year, which I did. Did you ever fill imposter syndrome at all?

Yes, and daily. And I think, I actually see that as I see that as a good thing. I think it keeps you on your toes. I think the day that I think I've made it and that I'm great. And that's one of the things that really frustrates me. You know, we touched on it really briefly, social media criticism.

I think people assume that if you're on the telly and you're hosting a sports program and I assume that they think this because I get told it all the time when I go on Twitter that you're arrogant or that you're smug or that you're trying to be best mates with the footballers or that people want to hear your opinion like I can't tell you how far opposite of that I am

and that before we go on air I'm thinking it's the last time I do this because I'm going to mess up today and I'm totally aware that my knowledge of the sport that I'm presenting is not a patch on the people that I'm sitting alongside. I've had Adrian Charles on this podcast and I know he really got so hammered all the time

from people. And what I felt was a really disproportionate level of abuse. Totally. Yeah, absolutely. Do you start, get that sometimes? Yep, yeah, I do. And I think...

Why do you think people seem to target sports presenters? I think it's... I don't know specifically, but maybe I think this just to make myself for better. Hey, we can wash our wellies off here. Do you want to clean your... Because if they're waterproof, you'll be fine to stand in a bit of water. You're not going to fall again, eh? Should I just tell you a really brief story?

My daughter, she's only saying. She's only seven. Obsessed with swimming outside. So every day she likes to swim in that lake of ours with Bell. I'll show you video. She clings on the back of Bell and Bell pulls her along. And we came down here the other day and she swam across here on our own. And I didn't want to go in.

But she was, again, swam. This is your daughter? Yeah, this is the back of the garden here. So we've come down the lane around the back. So this is, you know where that field was that we were in? Oh, yeah. So your kids are going to have, it's almost like a very swallows in Amazon's sort of childhood. I want them, I want to build a little platform.

so they can swim in here. And you know what? I was panicking so badly that this was going to be the conversation of Jake Country's daughter disappears off in the river. You know, that dinner party test. Sorry, he let her just swim across a river

on her own, aged seven. And she got to the middle. I was like, are you okay? Are you okay? And she stood up and she was up to her waist. So I was like, ah, we're all right. Can I step in here? Yeah, come on in.

Jake, you're such a confident country squire. You're a bit like a country. You know what you're like, your country squire? You actually just said you're a bit like a... Can I just point out that's what you just said. I assumed you were going to complete the word country, but we didn't get that far. That's the trailer.

So the sports thing and the reason why they're so critical, and I like to think this, because maybe it makes me feel better about being criticised, I like to think that, like if you're hosting like an entertainment show, for example, I'm not sure. I like to think the reason why they're critical is actually, hey, there's nothing to do with me or anyone else they criticise. I think it's because they're so, so passionate about it. Like, they love their football team so much and they love that sport so much. But if you're sitting on the television having an opinion about it. Yeah, yeah. Then that passion comes through. And you can't. can't say everything about everyone's football team that makes everyone happy all the time. You just can't. And I guess that's what it's about.

But I also think if I saw someone on the television sitting there with Paul Skulls or Frank Lampard or whatever, I'd think, I bet they're smug. I bet they love themselves a little bit. And it's like sometimes I don't think people realise why should they? The struggle you have to go through before you sit down in front of a television camera in front of millions of people and talk. Yeah. It's not normal. It's not a normal way to earn your living.

And actually... Almost everyone will be fighting some sort of battle that we know nothing about. So why don't we all just assume the best of everybody and see where that takes us? Because, you know, from little things

like if someone's being aggressive in their car, well maybe they've had a really bad day, maybe they're on their way home from a bad appointment with a doctor. So don't react. badly to that sort of thing, right to looking at someone and sort of assuming they must be a certain way. Let's just assume everyone's great. And then start from that viewpoint and if they prove otherwise, fine, well, they've proved otherwise. But why don't we start from the good and see where it gets us? Tell me about presenting live sport. Do you quite enjoy that adrenaline?

Yes. I love, I particularly like it when you get that feeling that you're sort of on a runaway train and the whole production are coming with you. You're the person at the front of the train and you are going to hit that wall and you are the only person who can pull the brakes. I love that feeling. You know, I often look at it as a kind of a pyramid like when I'm on the television

because I'm the person who says hello, I'm the person that has to get you on there and off air and hopefully ask the right questions and bring the right feel and tone and emotion to the programme. But beneath me are so many people that are working so hard all the time. And that's not to say the person at the top of the pyramid is more important, but I love the responsibility of everyone sitting there.

And there's probably, right, Alfie, there's a, I think there's a cow near here. Hey Alfie, come here. I love the feeling of all those people sitting there thinking, right, we're going on air. It's a huge game of football, what's going to happen, and I'm there going, you're fine. I love the feeling of, don't worry, I've got this, I'll get this, I'll get a get us on and I felt I really enjoy that and I don't know why you're quite a natural leader in that sense aren't you you would have been probably the sergeant then in an army I think you've got I've got the bravery for that but a lot of people shrink from that kind of responsibility there's all those millions of people watching you there's

all that responsibility is essentially on your shoulders yes there's Lyon called it a high wire act without a safety net and it absolutely does feel like that you know I don't use an auto queue I feel that something that I've written even half an hour before is not necessarily going to be relevant at the moment that we're on air and you have to be and I think if you're obsessed with using an auto queue I think you just become too rigid and you need it there all the time and and it stabilises on what are you doing if you're using an auto queue or like if you're using an auto queue you're

effect I don't know it feels a bit of a cheap to me you're kind of sitting there and reading and I would much rather be sort of reacting to exactly what happens because the great thing about doing live sport and the reason why I really love it is that the story is not written. So we go on air and we know for the hour before the game begins

what we're going to be talking about. We have absolutely no idea what we're going to talk about a half-time, what we're going to talk about a full-time, is there going to be a trauma? We were sadly on air the day that the Leicester City helicopter crashed at Leicester.

I wanted to ask you about that because I watched that and I really, I don't know, kind of haunted me in a way you having to deal with that. I mean, it was awful. But what taught me through what that felt like because you were, you saw the helicopter take off when you were doing your link, weren't you? Yeah, that's right. And that's an eternal regret really is that you have like a, when you do my job, you have a little voice in your head, which is kind of saying, you could talk about this or you could talk about this. And at that point when I saw them getting on the helicopter. And we should say it's the Leicester City owner.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I remember seeing him climb on and I thought, oh, I should talk about what a brilliant owner this guy is and what a great family they are. We were already on our way to an ad break. And so instead of that, I made some stupid and now regretful and annoying Kilib blind about core look at them climbing on their helicopter after watching their Premier League football team

winner game of football. At times like this, you question your life choices or something like that. Obviously, totally unaware of what was going to happen a few moments later. But I do wish that that moment had been about how brilliant they were because they are and were amazing owners in that football club. How did it happen, Jake, that you said that? You suddenly go to a break. Yeah. It must have been pretty much moments after that.

Did you hear a rumble or something? You know, we, because obviously I'm wearing an earpiece and I'm hearing maybe seven or eight voices in my earpiece. And I'm in a studio and I'm live on air. So I don't have an, I would say I don't have an awful lot of spare capacity, right? I'm kind of, I'm pretty much at my limits when we're alive on the telly. And that morning, we'd had the sort of horrendous news that Glenn Hoddle, who we worked with, had a heart attack. So we were live on air and I heard the producer just say, okay, just go straight to the brain. now please, I need to talk to you. Just get to the break as quickly as you can.

And you had no idea what this was. I had no idea what this was, but obviously, as you would, I assume the worst about poor Glenn. I was like, oh my. I don't believe. And he's obviously a friend. And I was like, I was then in my head, I was thinking, right, what do I now say about Glenn, one of the greatest blokes I've ever met in my life, a genuine football legend, but more than that, a legend of a man and a person, what am I about to say? So I'm on a totally different sort of journey at that moment, and it's only then that one of the security guys comes in and says, that helicopter's just gone down. And again, it took a bit of time to sort of process what he was talking about. And even then, I sort of assumed he was talking about like

a bumpy landing in a field next door or something. I had no concept really what was going on. And then the producer said, look, because they were all, our production team are based in the car park of the football grounds. That's where we operate. So we set up what they call the TV compound. And the helicopter crashed in the car park very close to where everyone was working. So they obviously were fully aware because they really would have heard it. So the producer came on and just explained what had happened. And I guess I had a bit of training because I was working in Formula One when Felipe Massa was hitting the head with a spring.

from the car in front and was, I might take Alfie off now, and was badly injured and we were even told at one point that he'd passed away. Now, it was wrong, and Felipe was in a critical condition, and they were, it was touch and go, I think, but obviously we survived. So that was really important for me, that moment on the BBC, to remember that in that situation, it's not my job to break the news to people of who was on. the helicopter what might or might not happen it's not about being salacious

it's not about grabbing headlines it is just about sharing only the facts that we know and we're also not our rolling news channel so hi there so I was I was kind of conscious that we we shouldn't be doing that job and obviously we'd also seen the people climb on the helicopter but again it's not not my job to be saying who was on it it just for all we knew the friends and families of those people were inside the club watching our program we were still alive on air I suppose it's just these sorts of situations are strange I mean I remember doing the Europa League final the weekend of the manchester bombing or the week of the

Manchester Arena bombings and Manchester United were playing with Manchester having just been devastated by that bomb and obviously there was a lot of talk about whether the game would carry on or not so I think that in those moments yeah sport becomes totally unimportant but then also massively symbolic as well. Of course, yeah. Because it's what brings people together, you know. Like what became so important in the weeks after the helicopter crash was the football club. The players, the fans coming together, having a place to mourn.

And then actually where the helicopter crashed is now a beautiful, a beautiful garden of remembrance for all the people that were on the plane, including the crew. And it's like, oh, it's just, it's a good reminder that. that you need to make the most of every minute of every day because it's over too quick, isn't it? For what it's worth, I thought you cope with it really well, actually. And I remember watching at the time, and I just thought you dealt with it like a human being. Yeah.

Which sounds weird to say that as a compliment, but often people on TV stop behaving like human beings because they think it's like the auto-cue thing, and I must say this in a... But I suppose that's my kind of approach to my job, really, is that stats will even be pretty dry. You know, it's like if something incredible happens, I don't need to know that it's a 75th time

in the last hundred years that it's happened. You know, like, it's about that moment. It's about living in the now, I suppose. And as much as we can do that, probably the better. So, you know, I appreciate you saying that. And sport is about emotion, man. What's sport about? It's not about emotion.

I want to talk about your podcast, Jake. Yeah. The high performance podcast, which, if people haven't heard it, they really should because I don't often recommend other people's podcasts but I won't make an exception because I found it fascinating and well you tell

what did you find fascinating? What I liked about it because you've got some brilliant guests it's everyone from Frank Lampard to Rio Ferdinand to Potchitino and I am a huge football fan anywhere and sports fan but I think why I liked it is you hear those people

who are kind of at the top of their game essentially talking about what drives them. Yeah. I like to look at sport as a snapshot of life effectively and the things that these people are doing to get to the top of the tree in their given sport

is absolutely no different to what my kids should be doing to get to the top of their class or the CEO of a business. Well, the recurring themes from the podcast. First of all, the other thing that I try and live by

is this thing of 100% responsibility which means all kinds of things happen that are not your fault, right? I mean, we've talked about your trauma. We talked about my trauma. None of those things are my fault or your fault, right? Sadly, and it is difficult to get your head around it sometimes, it's still our responsibility to deal with that, right?

And I think as soon as we're shifting responsibility to other people, playing the blame game, talking about luck or chance, we've really given up control. And I think living a life of 100, percent responsibility where you are responsible for your good decisions, your bad decisions, decisions that other people take, things that happen to you, being responsible, taking it on yourself and going to, it's my life, it's my story, I'm going to make sure I deal with that.

And that is something that has come through loud and clear, I think, on the podcast, that all of these people take responsibility. They don't pass it off to anybody else. And when I thought it was interesting with Frank Lampard was talking about, there was an incident where there was someone who had been abusing him in the stands. And then he encountered him in a sort of civilian life. And he stopped himself. I thought it was interesting that Frank Lampard was able to display that emotional control. Yeah.

And how that affects him when he's playing and now when he's managing. Do you think that's something you have, you've mastered? I think so. I probably never really considered it really because I still think that a bit how you mentioned at the top about you see what's different about them. I still think I interview these people and I put them on a pedestal and don't consider that I'm necessarily operating at the level that they are. But yeah, I think emotional control is probably something that I have got. Apart from when my family are concerned, like I'm a proper hypochondriac. Are you? Yeah. Oh Jake, I love a hypochondrial. Any slight pain or illness, or my kid, you know, one of my kids is limping because they're called a muscle,

my brain automatically goes right ahead to disaster scenario. And that is about the only time I'm totally out of control. I want to be more in control. And I've learned to say to myself, you know, we were talking earlier about mental health, respect to mental health issues. The thing that helped me the most was when the beautiful lady I met and spoke to you for a long time called Ruth, she said, maybe just give up control over this

little thing and accept that you are going to live a brilliant, fulfilling, passionate, rewarding life. But this little bit of your brain is maybe always going to be there. You just let it be there because it's just a trick. That's all it is, this anxiety that it's creating is just a trick. It's telling you a story which you're choosing to believe. So just don't believe the story. Don't fall for the trick. accept it. That changed everything for me. And I think now when I find myself worrying, like mad, lying awake at night because one of my kids looked ill or Harriet had an issue or something, I say, well look, it might not be brilliant, it might turn out badly, who knows. However, what I do know is I'm this way inclined, it's more than likely going to be a trick. See,

I'm not at the point where I just say, oh, it's a trick. I still can't quite get that far. But by saying, I know myself, I know what my brother. brain is like, let it be there. I presume Ruth was a therapist, for some sort. I think that's what it's helpful for, is that my experience of it is that it doesn't stop you thinking a certain way, but it often can stop you acting on it. Because you think, oh, I'm doing that thing I do. You become your own sort of analysts in a way.

And I suppose in some respects, maybe I would not really thought about it before the high-performance podcast comes from the fact that I spoke with someone and what I really want that podcast to be about is that there are answers everywhere for all kinds of struggles and all kinds of questions and all too often we struggle trying to find the answer ourselves but hey guess what someone's already been there someone's already looked for it someone's already found it and someone's willing to sit down and share it with you I mean one of my one of the bigger reasons why I walked away from the BBC and joined BT and I suppose why

I moved up here as well. It's like never sit in the comfy chair is something that one of my first bosses said to me. I called Adam Stunhock when I worked at Rapture TV and I said I want to go to London. And this was before I got the job on children's BBC. I didn't have a job. I went down there slept on people's floors, created a show reel, went and met people and hoped for the best. Now a lot of people would say, are you mad? And Adam just said, listen, all credit to you. The motto I live by, never sit in the comfy chair. And I try and do that as often as possible. I'm not going to his house, Jake. When you were growing up, Jake, were you the handsome boy who got all the girls?

No, I had no girlfriends. I was a really late developer. I wasn't necessarily ugly, but I wasn't like the cool guy. And I think cool kids are the ones that get the girlfriends. I was never cool. And it was never in the sports teams. Like, I was a really late developer. I remember when I was doing my French oral,

they made us play volleyball outside until it was our turn to go in. and do our exam and I didn't dare put my arms in the air because I had no underarm hair. And all these other lads have got like six packs and pecks and I'm thinking, what the fuck? Why? So I was trying to play volleyball like this. But you see in that case, I'm not saying you're a nerd, but you've done the ultimate revenge of the nerds where you're now presenting the jocks wet dream show. Yeah. Does that ever occur to you? Yeah, I think so. I think it probably does. Maybe it's one of those subconscious drivers.

But I hope I don't do it in a way that is like the Jock's TV show. Do you know what I mean by that? Like, all the criticism that comes my way tends to come from like 18-year-old, very, very like, raw, footbally lads, lads, yeah? And if they send me some criticism, I'll try and ignore it, but sometimes I'll look on their feed. And nine times out of ten, it is the total polar opposite opinions about life that I hold. And then I sort of think to myself, do you know what?

I'm quite glad you find me an annoying TV presenter. I'm really pleased about that. Because I would never, in a million years, go for a drink with you. Yeah. So let's just leave it at that. My view on that is that I think sometimes people who are sensitive and empathetic tend to get targeted by bullies. And I feel the reason for that is that bullies sort of know on some level there's something lacking

and they're kind of jealous of those qualities because those qualities make you likable. I think there's an, I think, yeah, maybe you're right and I suppose that the sort of thing that when you get older, you think, oh, what, you know, like when you meet some people and you're not really sure what's missing, and you can't put your finger on it. And then it's like, it's like a charm thing. It's like a sort of an ability to just be with you in that moment, right? I guess, as you get older, you cherish those sorts of people. But maybe when you're 14 years old, There's no value to that. What is that? That is a fish. Alfie's got a skeleton in his mouth. Oh Jake, this is like nightmare before Christmas. I want to go home.

Might be like an otter or a stout or something, I think. Alfie! But it could be like a big fish, isn't it? It's like a pike or something. You're not very squeamish, are you? Not really. You know? I'll check it up on top of the Blackberries.

You're quite like you had this car accident which looked terrific and your whole car was smashed up and you were going oh a bit of a bit of a bother tonight i mean you're all right is that just a posh country thing or is that just do you think i'm posh i'd say you're doing all right for yourself but does that make you posh though i'm intrigued by this what class would you say you are don't know really middle class i mean i've never struggled but my dad was a charity worker my mum was a teacher we just went to state school it would My mum had to work so that she could pay for us to have stuff and for my sister to go to uni. But, oh my God, my story is most definitely not one of heartache and sorrow.

Well, your parents kind of guardian readers? Yeah, they get the eye now. They used to get the guardian when I was growing up, yeah. Quite socially conscious. Very. Well, my dad, you know, my dad worked for age concerned, Norfolk. He spent his life wanting to sort of help people out. Alfie, come here.

Well, there's a car coming. Come on. That's Mrs H. Mrs H. Oh, do you know what? I've really got a great feeling about Mrs. H. Oh, she's so nice. Tell me when you met her.

Is it real love at first sight? Yeah, it was absolutely love at first sight. Only I told her it was love at first sight, and her response was, I can't say the same thing back. That's what she said when I said, I love you. How many weeks or months in? Don't say it was an hour in.

There was a couple of weeks in, but we met two weeks before she went to uni. And then she went to uni. and we stayed together throughout uni. Then she came to London and we said together, she got a job in TV. She is the person who makes me feel like, no matter what's going on, everything is fine.

She is an absolute earth mother. You think she had the job working on Strictly Come Dancing, looking after celebs and dancers, gave it all up because she thinks that... Bell! Gave it all up, Jake, to do more talent handling. Yeah, me, exactly. But gave it all up because she felt that she should be...

She wants to be with the kids and she wants to, you know, I think she pines for it without really saying how painful it is to not do it anymore. Hello, Mrs H. Hiya. I'm just hearing that Jake said, I love you after a few weeks. What was your response? What did you say? You can't say the same. You can't say the same.

I love this woman. Unbelievable. Hey, hey, hey. She's brilliant. Yeah, a lovely walk. So nice. It really enjoyed it. I fell in the mud.

I mean, it's been eventful. She spoke about Flo's app. outdoor swimming. I love you. Do you know what? I kind of love you Mrs H already. You've got very good energy about you. See in a bit. Drive So nice to meet you. What do you what do you like as a partner? Hi there how are you? Yeah really well thanks. What a lovely day. Is that a little terrier? Little border is it? Not a border? Oh Lakeland. Lovely. Stay there Bell. No. Keen to say hello to you too. We're all going that way.

Have a nice walk. Do you lose your temper, Jake? No, that is the one thing that Harriet wishes happen. You know, sometimes she's like, can we just have a fucking route about something? And I'm like, yeah, but I don't know why. I've got no reason to be... Like, I think I'm probably quite annoying in that respect

that I try... I've tried to get into a headspace where little shitty things don't get me down. I don't compare myself to other people. I genuinely do not care what other people think of me and what I do and how I do it. Not in a sort of arrogant I'm going to bulldoze through kind of way, but just in a like it's unhealthy, I think. And sometimes she's like, God, just get a bit angry about something.

But I have no reason, Emily, to be angry about anything. I just feel massively blessed. If you have a marital route, who's the first to make up? Me. Every time. I can't bear a grudge. I can be, like, I can get obviously annoyed, and I can go to the bed so angry.

It's sort of snappy or something, yeah. And I'm just like, you know, you roll over in bed. We've all been there. God, I'm no saint, but you roll over in bed, you're like, right, I'm going to sleep. Good night. And then the next morning, I'm the one rolling over there. Harriet. And I feel like saying, I know it was definitely your fault.

It was definitely your fault, but I'm sorry. You don't do the, I'm really sorry you felt that way? Try not to. Because those people. How it would say that I can be very annoying, though, I'm sure of it. Would she? Yeah, I think so, yeah. Are you strict that, Jake?

I try to be strict, yeah. My thing, I suppose, and this is probably annoying, and this probably does come from all of the things we've talked about, is I really do get frustrated if things aren't right, you know, like perfect. Like if someone hasn't really put the effort in and really cared about it and realised really that, because it's like I think I think it's quite a healthy thing just to have a sort of a little smattering of OCD like wanting things just to be just so you know do you have that yeah well here I am walking up litter from outside my house of course I do ridiculous are you a

perfectionist I try to be I would say I'm a perfectionist but I'm not perfect you know what I mean like to be perfect I certainly I do like to like to be perfect I certainly I do like to start every day and have a plan for doing a few things really, really well if I can. What a nice walk that one. Oh, do you know, it's been really good for the song. Okay, Bell, you're coming off the lead now, darling. Come on. Come here, please.

Without knowing it, you've basically, um, do you think you've turned this podcast into a little bit of a therapy session as well for the people you chat to? I mean, the stuff that we've spoken about there, I have a prevent, like, I haven't spoken about for. with anyone, I don't think. Certainly not in a public forum like this. How do you do that? How does she get you to do that? Man. You're quite an open book, I think, Jake. I can always tell from the start because

you don't usually think I'm like a spy, but the minute I turned up, you were, honestly, it was the warmest welcome. You were standing here. I felt like downtown Abbey and the staff were greeting me. Like, you look, you were so, and your wife came out and

So I've got very good energy Here's my last question Yeah Two questions I'm going to sneak in Do you cry? Yep Too easily When was the last time?

I When we went back on air after the shutdown And I wrote a bit of script For the football coverage Which was It was There will be You'll be watching this now

It makes me feel a little bit teary. You'll be watching this now and when you last watched a game of football the person you're watching it with is no longer here. And that was kind of my way of saying, look, I think we've all been through an horrendous time but football is back and it's not the answer but maybe it's a bit helpful. And I guess that is the, that maybe sort of sums up my approach to being a sports presenter. Finally, what do you most hope people would say about you when you leave the room. What do you hope I'll say to Sarah, my producer, when we leave here today about you? I wish we were still with him. Because when I, I used to Muratio Pocitino just recently

for my podcast and I left and I just felt like that was, oh, I want to be back with you like the energy from him is so lovely and I think that's the nicest thing you can say about someone. I wish I'll still with them. The good news is Jake, I'm not going anywhere. I'm moving in. Great, come on. Bell, come and say goodbye to Emily. Look, come and say goodbye. Oh, give me a cuddle. Not you, Jake.

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