Walking The Dog with Emily Dean - Lou Sanders (Part One)

Episode Date: June 25, 2024

This week on Walking The Dog, we’re taking a walk in North London with the brilliant comedian Lou Sanders. Lou has appeared on shows such as QI and Would I Lie To You? and she also won the eighth series of Taskmaster. Lou is pretty obsessed with her two cats - she’s even moving house for them, but we think Ray won her over and scored a few points for Team Dog. Lou has a long history with cats - she even had one with showbiz aspirations... She tells us about being an alcoholic at a young age, moving out of her family home at 15 and how the complex relationship she had with her family has healed over time. Lou’s book What’s That Lady Doing? is coming out in paperback on 18th July. You can pre-order your copy here!Lou is on tour next year with her show No Kissing In The Bingo Hall. You can find tickets and dates at https://www.lousanders.com/ Follow Emily: Instagram - @emilyrebeccadeanX - @divine_miss_emWalking The Dog is produced by Faye LawrenceMusic: Rich Jarman Artwork: Alice LudlamPhotography: Karla Gowlett  Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Oh, I had a cat called Crunchy. He phoned America. And no one believed me at school. I mean, I was struggling now, Lou, to be honest. He was in the local paper. This week on Walking the Dog, Ray and I went for a stroll with comedian Lou Sanders. As well as being a hugely popular stand-up, Lou is a much-loaf face on TV, popping up on shows like Live at the Apollo, QI, Would I Lie to You, and 8 out of 10 cats. Talking of cats, Lou is very much a committed camera.

person, but she fell pretty hard for Ray, so I like to think he put up a very persuasive case for Team Dog, even if she did tell him his face look like a triangle. Lou and I had a fascinating chat about everything from her childhood, which saw her moving out of her family home at 15, to her hugely successful comedy career. Lou, I should say, has also written a very honest and very brilliant memoir called What Is That Lady Doing, Full Starts and Happy Endings, which I wholeheartedly recommend and she's also on tour next year with her show no kissing in the bingo hall so do go grab your tickets at lou sanders.com if you want to go and see her live i really enjoyed my chat with lou i'll stop talking now so you can hear from the

great woman herself here's lou and ray you're a good boy right let me compliment your bloody dog on on mike if you don't mind i mean i'm serious he's like quite exceptional Does Ray have to be picked up a lot? Yeah. Yeah, that's okay. You know, he's got his pros and cons. It's also quite nice to have a little snuggle. Come on, Rui.

Do you know what? I never used to be a dog person, and I have got more into dogs. Have you? What is that? I think my softest decided to come out in my old age. I think I'm just more emotional. Really? Yeah, I used to find them too sort of needy,

and I said, I haven't got time for this. And I used to worry about, because some dogs have got a really dog smell, I don't care now. Do you know, I'm not going to lie. Mine certainly, I can't speak for other dogs. Mine can be a bit smelly. I feel it's fine. Because you know, like those quirks of someone,

like when you're in a relationship, other people find those habits annoying and you kind of grow to love them, the partners of quirks and weird things. And then you hate them at the end. Oh no, he's doing a poo. Oh, God. That's a quirk.

Lou Sanders, I am so thrilled to have you on this podcast. Well, thank you for having me. I heard a whisper that you were going to fact me on ages ago and I've been sitting waiting. Looking at pictures of Raymond, maybe one day I'll get to me. No, that was nothing to do with you. That was to do with the podcast having a brief hiatus,

so that was not to do with you. I've been dying to have you on for ages. I'm so thrilled to have you on. You don't have a dog. I don't have a dog. I notice. Never say never. Well, I've got two cats,

so he probably do say never. Well, one of them, I mean, we don't know if he's on the way out. He's got a dodgy eye. If you Google any of your symptoms, Like if your animal's got symptoms, it's so scary, googling them because they're always like getting to vet immediately, they're dying. Really?

That's not Ray. I don't think I'm going to keep Ray off the lead with Mr Police Dog. I mean, he looks very nice that German Shepherd. Yeah. But, I mean, Ray's tiny. He looks a bit like one of those dogs in those police displays when someone wears an arm by hand. Yeah, yeah.

And the dog bites it. And he looks like he could jump to a hoop of fire quite easily. He looks like he could take any of us on. Can I just say, Ray, is absolutely gorgeous and very unique. I've never seen a dog like it. His face slopes like a triangle, and I mean that in a good way. He's saying that, Lou. Imagine if someone said that to you.

Think of that Lou. Her face slopes like a triangle. No, but he's so enigmatic. And I don't use that word a lot about dogs. And also, he looks like something out of Star Wars. And no one's talking about it. And I do like the way he runs. So talk me through your cats, Lou.

You've got two. Oh my God, I'm obsessed with them. I'm actually moving house for my cats. Because they haven't got much of a garden in London. They are technically indoor cats, but I think that's cruel. So I'm moving to Margate. The house I want, it's got a massive garden. I said, I want a garden for my boys.

And the estate agent was like, oh, how old are your boys? I was like, they're two. What's their names, baby and Bobbert? It took us a while to realise we were on different. pages. But yeah I love them so much and one of them's got dodgy eyes so I'm a bit worried but he's really I even if he goes blind in one eye he's still bloody gorgeous I want to go back to your sort of history with pets and your childhood in general did you have pets growing up? Oh I had a cat called Crunchy who phoned America yeah and no and no one believed me at

school I mean I'm struggling now moved to be honest he was in the local paper I've got to find this article because okay so what happened was crunchy normal cat you know I didn't really easily I'd show biz aspirations but so we went to France for a year we gave the cat away to a lady to look after for the year where we were gone I think she kept hold of him actually and in that time he knocked the phone off the handle yeah sat on it the woman picked it up and he'd got through to America so he's in the local paper I mean she may have been lying but she was about 75 so I don't think so not that old people don't lie but you'd ask yourself

why wouldn't you and in those days you'd run up quite a bill wouldn't you do yeah oh my god yeah lucky he didn't get thrown out how brilliant imagine if it was like a pawn line or something and it was a husband and the husband's like yeah the cat did it cats a feather I've all told you it puts a new spin on the door gate my home work yeah look at him lou he is so cute does everything about him is really good actually. Oh, I love that you say that. Yeah. He's very unusual. You're gorgeous, you are. I didn't mean what I said

about your face. It is interesting. And it's absolutely lovely. It's divine. Oh, look at you. I wish I could see that face more. You know, he's the brother of Catherine Ryan's dog. Really? He's the half-brother. Oh, do they see each other a lot? Yeah, they really like each other. That's so nice.

Yeah. Family's important. But this is what does my head in life. The family that shits on the carpet together, stays together. When I got my cats, I didn't want to get one cat because I didn't want to put it away from its mom and then be like, I'm your new family now. It's psychotic if you think about it. And then, so I thought, well, I get two cats and then brothers

and then at least they've got a new mum, but they didn't ask well, but they've got each other. But it still feels a bit weird, doesn't it? Like, oh, I'm just going to take you from your family. I had another cat called a Tuol star in French, so you can imagine. And it was an absolute anti-social little, you know, when you've been sport with a cat like Crunchy, you know who can call America, then you get a twirl and she just does her own thing.

I thought, wow, we didn't really bond. Isn't that? It's funny, isn't it, when you get pets and you're not really for each other. There's been a mistake here. I know. Sometimes that happens. You have to meet your soulmate with an animal. Yeah. Come on, Ray. I want to go back to your childhood, which I've been reading all about in your brilliant book.

Oh, did you read my book? How? Called What's That Lady doing? Full Stats and Happy Endings. And I honestly loved it, Lou. I think you write brilliantly. Oh, thank you. And it obviously gave me quite a bit of an insight, because you wrote really honestly.

Yeah. And sort of from the heart. And I think that's really important when you're writing a... Yeah. That's why I like women's memoirs because they spill their guts on the page and they are not afraid to really get into emotional dynamics and feelings in a way that it's not men's fault but they're not sort of taught to. Yeah, it's vulnerability, isn't it? And I get the sense that I mean in some ways there were elements of chaos in your childhood and weren't there? Yeah, but I'm so close to my mum now she's really great and I was really close to my stepdad before he um

carked it so that was nice you were growing up in sort of not far from margate yeah yeah like broads day ramsgate first then broadstairs they're all sort of quite close together and now yeah going back to margate it was you and your mom and your dad originally wasn't it yeah they divorced quite early when i was like one and a half two or something and then she met my stepdad once about As you write about quite honestly, your stepdad kind of struggled a bit with that relationship, didn't he, taking on you guys as kids? Yeah. You know, when you're a kid, you think adults know what they're doing or they've got it together, but it just never ends really. Everyone's just an insecure mess, you know, trying to make it through.

My friend's mum is in a kind of rast home. She's about 80. there's a bloody bully in there. 80-year-old bully. It never ends. That's terrifying. Yeah. You think that ends?

But my step-dad was a good guy. He was just, you know, a bit autistic. Do you think so now, looking back? Well, I think he just had his struggles and he didn't really know how to... The truth is he was a bit jealous of me and my mom, but he wouldn't have been aware about himself enough to acknowledge in that day and age, people didn't really do a lot of work on themselves,

especially that age and gender and time. And, you know, I guess they're just trying to get by. But yeah, it all worked out in the end. So you're growing up in this sort of Kent, as you say. And it's kind of, you know, there's all sorts of chaos and things going on inside people's families that we rarely know about often. Yeah. But on the outside anyway, does it seem like a typical sort of middle class?

family? Yeah and now I look back I think because we all think oh they didn't do this or they do this and you know a bit anger by resentful but now I look back and I think I was so lucky my god you know I'm reading this book about gratitude so I look back now and I'm like oh my gosh I was so lucky you know this gratitude book is like did they help you with your homework did they put a roof over your head did they feed you you're like yeah they did actually thank you so I do think I'm a little prince, spoilt little princess in the end. Plot twist. But then you were pretty rebellious as well, weren't you? Yeah. Give me, give us an insight into how that manifested itself, that kind of streaking you. Well, I dare say I was an alcoholic from quite young. So had my first little taste at

11. I thought, oh, I'll be back for that. And then 13 started drinking quite a lot, like binge drinking. And then I would just do anything I can to sort of get out, stay out. You know, know, lie and stuff, just to go out drinking, basically. And I had a lovely time. And my mum was quite, I mean, she fostered independence anyway, but obviously if she knew what I was doing, she wouldn't have fostered that much independence. Like I had money for guitar lessons every week,

and I went and spent it on pills. I cancelled the lesson every week and bought pills instead. What kind of pills? That's just being a kid, isn't it? It's just drugs, you're born. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But that's just being a kid. expressing yourself.

I don't know, that's quite early. Did you not do that? I think it's really interesting with addiction, which I know you've been really honest about that, and how you sort of came to the conclusion that you did have an issue with it, you know, when you were older. And I get very irritated when people talk about,

oh, self-control, you just have to think, no, I genuinely believe some people have, have that gene in them. Yeah. Or it's a generational thing, but it's, I never got addicted, really. I never had an issue with it. that and so that's why I can see friends of mine that did struggle with it.

I understand those differences that are so fundamental. I think if you get to the reasons behind it, you're less late to have the addicted. But I think everyone's addicted to do something, right? I mean, I don't even see it as a thing because everyone's going to have, everyone's going to have this shit to work on. I think that's the, it might be the Park Ranger, Lou. Ooh! They're obsessed with us. Hello, Ranger.

Hi. They're absolutely. Yes. Well, the rain is. Yeah, without us. But everyone's got something. So I hate that victim thing of like, oh, it's like, yeah, no shit you've got stuff to get over.

Everyone has. But I do think I was very lucky as well. I mean, not in all ways. You know, I didn't put everything in the book because even the stuff I did do put in there caused a bit of controversy. But I think I was very nice about everyone. I think I was quite compassionate. I do actually.

And I think... Should have seen the first draft. My dad wasn't speaking to me for a bit after it. I thought, do you know how much stuff I didn't put in there? You, hi. And your dad, your biological dad, he sounds like... He'd be described as a colourful character. He's a colourful character, yeah.

You don't want boring parents. But that's the whole point of the book is that everyone's fallible. No one hurts you on purpose. No one has a perfect upbringing. No one's the perfect parents. And they had even worse parents. But it's like I discuss all the horrific things I've done and I sort of say, oh, well, you know, I said, sorry I've moved on. I'm not that person anymore.

And so when I then say, oh, my, you know, my dad did this or my mom did this, not in a pointing fingers way, but like trying to highlight why I went off the tracks kind of thing, I guess, and then give some sort of indication for it. and not blaming them because, you know, but then saying, well, their parents were way worse. Like, I had it lucky. But everyone wants to be written about in the way that they want to write about and everyone wants to kind of whitewash history. And you're like, well, how is any change going to happen then? That's like cancer culture where you're not allowed to make mistakes or you're not allowed to be anything other than perfect.

And of course, no one is. And if you had to sort of, I suppose, sum up the themes in terms of the energy that you grew up around, How would you sum that out? What was the energy like in your childhood home when you were growing up? Well, I sort of got on with it and could do what I wanted. So it was a lot of freedom, which is great. I would say neither of my dads were particularly interested. So that led to an interesting thing about like men, like an addiction towards men

and just being like, I must get my validation through some asshole in the park. But that's also just growing up as well, isn't it? You know, that's most people. It was very hard to have independent self-esteem as a young woman and just be like, oh, I'll get my like self-esteem for myself because of the way the world is as well. But I had some lovely experiences. My first two boyfriends, as I say, I picked really well and they were lovely, like really nice.

I thought I was going to lose my virginity to someone that really loved me. I forgot to put in the mix if I loved them. But anyway, and he sort of, you know, wrote me poetry and, you know, he was an absolute massive sap, which is perfect. And then the next one was really cool and fun. But then I went off the rails and picked loads of Gemini's. I mean, you tell me. When you were younger, were you still turning up to school

and were you quite a good student and stuff? Yeah, like I was really good and really interested. I just wanted to please. I was a real little people pleaser. And my brother was quite naughty, so I thought, well, I can't be naughty because I'll give my mama a heart attack. So in school, I was quite good. I didn't really want to miss school because I don't want to miss out.

but I went off the rails, you know, at the weekend or in the evenings drinking, but I still got myself into school. I've always had like a really strong work ethic. Like I had four jobs when I was 13 and stuff. You did all sorts of jobs, didn't you? Yeah. Pet shop, relevant. Cleaning out the cages before work or before school.

I'm sorry, I've called school work. And let the rabbit loose and they had a dog, so I did get fired. but he didn't tell me and I was 13 and he was phoned my stepdad to tell him I thought just tell me to my face you know I really felt like

I was like how dare you not tell me I want to give this book as much of a platform as I can because I really think everyone should read it and I loved it and it was very lightening for me so I tried to make it so that

it's a sort of book you'd by your goddaughter if she's 1415 to try and get her to not make the same mistakes and if she did make mistakes not to kind of beat herself up over it, you know. And actually, loads of women my age have contacted me saying that I help them get rid of loads of shame. And then some of them say it's help them stop drinking and stuff.

And so don't not read the book because you think you don't want to stop drinking. It doesn't have those powers. You left home at 15. Yeah. Which is pretty young, isn't it? Yeah. And why was that? Oh, you know, just probably he's at home and felt absolutely.

mad and stuff. I mean, it's really hard to say stuff without, like, because nothing's black and white. You could, I'm sort of obsessed with the fact that, like, if I told you key points about someone's life, you'd be like, oh my God, they've had a terrible time. But if I told you other key points about someone's life, you've been, oh my God, they're the most blessed person ever. Yeah. So it's just what we choose to focus on.

So my stepdad was a wonderful person, but in the beginning, it was a nightmare. And maybe it was me as well. I was quite a strong sort of flavour as well. But, I mean, I was four when I met him. And so it was just too hard to live at home. And then when I moved out, I felt so peaceful. But then it made it even more special that we had a really good relationship as I got older and stuff.

And he was an absolute cutie pie. And he really got mellow as he got older. That must have been quite stressful living on your own, though. That shows... I loved it. Did you? Joking me. I loved it.

I had those past. and sauce things every night. I just had milk. And where did she live, Lou? I lived by a railway station. I did only live around the corner just by the railway. And this other girl from school, she'd done the same thing a bit later when she was 16, because you can't sign on when you're 15, but I got a charity to help bridge the graphs I could sign on early.

Which I think benefits are a lifeline for people to give them a chance to kind of, you know, get themselves together and stuff, you know. Was your mum reluctant I get the sense to move out? She said, you're not moving out, I said I am because I'm going mad. And then, yeah, we had a bit of a row and I moved out anyway. Went and bought a duve for 10 pounds and a saucepan for about six and I thought, well, I think I'm set up. I was going out with my nice boyfriend at the time and then, you know, about six months later, we moved in together so that was nice. nice. But yeah, I felt very sort of free mentally and very like, a weight had been lifted.

And I didn't really do it for the freedom because I had that anyway. So I did it for like the mental, mental space and stuff. Just because you were aware there was this, this sort of tension at the time. Well, yeah, he was sort of like, I mean, it sounds like, I feel very protective towards him because he, you know, he did stuff at Amnesty International. He was a loving man but they just just didn't work us living together he used to like lie about me and stuff to my mom and that did my nutting because I never used to lie and I just couldn't understand why an adult would lie about a you know a child really to their mom just to get them in trouble it's like what are you doing so I just couldn't handle I was like what is going on here like bare-faced

making stuff up like a psycho I was like what and that really does your head in when you're a kid because you sort of think, well, what is true and what's not, and, like, why am I here and stuff? You confronted him, though, which I thought was really brave at one point. I had to. I was like, what? This is, like... Did you just say, look, why are you lying?

Yeah, because we'd been getting on. And, like, he just went into my mum and told these awful lies, and I was like, we've just been having a laugh. I don't understand. It's so confusing. And in all other ways, he was, you know, a decent man. Like he didn't he didn't gamble, he didn't womanise. Like it was like what?

Like, you know, I think it was just fear. Like people act funny out of fear and he just didn't want to lose my mum, I think. And so I guess he was bringing them closer together by making me the enemy. People do mad stuff, don't they? And then, yeah, I was like, what are you doing? Because I just couldn't. I was like, what is going on? And then he just sort of went harder into.

the lie I guess or just insults or something but we did like I wanted to get on with him I was always like trying to you know I just wanted everyone to sort of have a laugh and be happy but there is this lovely redemption art as you say where and I think that really shows that it is possible you know you I feel you and your stepdad because he died didn't he and I feel you really reach this kind of very peaceful harmonious place yeah Yeah, and he really did love me, you know. And he had a thing about bloodlines, so he was, like, obsessed with his two children that were his,

and he had a thing. He was autistic, you know. If you factor in all the staff, he's like, he was heavily autistic and never diagnosed, but it's pretty obvious. Did he ever do a test or anything like that? Yeah, because he said, I used to have stand-up about it. He said, do you know, I did one of those Asperger's tests once? And do you know, I was very bloody good at it?

He was a laugh. He was really funny. I ace that test. He was obsessed with, like, education. He didn't think I was going to get any GCSEs. So he was, like, he was worried about that. And, you know, and then when I did get my GCSEs, and they weren't exactly amazing,

but he was blown away. Like, he absolutely couldn't believe he was delighted. And then I think that was the first, that wasn't even that long after. And that was the first kind of time he saw me as, like, a potential, even though it's awful because it was in a, academic terms but you know that is just the way that he thought and stuff and as he get older obviously he he sort of you know he idolised his um real son the younger son my half

brother and you know through and then he did like loads of terrible stuff like do it to pay him back money did and then through the years I think he sort of realized that I was the one that would come and help and I was the one that sort of would give them love and cook dinner for them and be there and then his real son was the one that just always constantly let him down and I think through the years he kind of realized, oh, okay, like there's more to anything than bloodlines. But he was a historian, so, yeah. And not everyone's family can be wonderful, come on. No one's is.

No one's is, yeah. But I think we are, I think we choose our family. I know that sounds baffling, but from a spiritual point of view, I do think we choose our family for the lessons we need, so, which might sound really harsh when people have been abused and stuff. But my mum is like lush and she's had quite a hard life. And yet she astounds me sometimes with her sort of compassion and her understanding of stuff. Like I was thinking the other day, the first time I did QI, I was quite rude.

Like, well, my step up so it was a vulgar humour. But my mum was like ashamed. She told the gardening club that I was going to be on QI and then she was ashamed. She didn't talk to me for like a week or two. But then I said to her, look, women should be over. to talk about what they want. You know, you're a feminist. Like, it's not fair that the boys talk about their body parts all the time, and then women have to be a thing to be preserved or looked at or delicate.

You know, it doesn't serve us. And I explained that we shouldn't have shame about talking about bodies or, you know, if it's not, you know, I'm not just going, oh, comorata. It's not just like one-dimensional humor. It's, you know, I talk about having a plus-sized labia or whatever, you know, that's positive. And stuff, it's never just. We had a really interesting chat and then she sort of came on board and then now if there's a slight thing where I'm like,

oh, sorry you didn't like that. She's like, no, you don't do your comedy for me. Like, it would be mad if you're doing it for a 75 year of woman. You go and do you and like don't listen to me and she's so progressive in lots of ways. Yeah, isn't that lovely? Yeah, she's really cool. I really hope you love part one of this week's Walking the Dog. If you want to hear the second part of our chat, it'll be out on Thursday. So whatever you do, don't miss it.

and remember to subscribe so you can join us on our walks every week.