Walking The Dog with Emily Dean - Stephen Mangan (Part Two)

Episode Date: December 4, 2025

In part two of Emily and Ray’s walk with the wonderful Stephen Mangan, the conversation continues with more stories from his life, career and comic imagination.If you haven’t already, catch up on part one, and don’t forget to treat any young people in your life to Stephen’s brilliant new children’s book Barrie Saves Christmas, a heartwarming and hilarious festive tale about a St Bernard who becomes an unlikely Christmas hero.Pick up your copy of Barrie Saves Christmas hereFollow Emily:InstagramXWalking The Dog is produced by Will NicholsMusic: Rich JarmanArtwork: Alice LudlamPhotography: Karla Gowlett Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome to Part 2 of Walking the Dog with the wonderful Stephen Mangon. Do go back and listen to Part 1 if you haven't already. And do treat any young people in your life to a copy of his brilliant new children's book, Barry saves Christmas, about a St Bernard, who ends up becoming a total festive hero. I absolutely loved it. Really hope you enjoy part two of my chat with Stephen. And do give us a like and a follow so you can catch us every week. Here's Stephen and Ray Ray. So we've got our coffees now.

Yeah. None for you, Ray. Well, when you went to Rada, I know it feels like part of that, if I'm right in thinking this, was prompted by your mum getting sick, wasn't it? Yeah, I came back from university, managed to scrape a degree, didn't know what I was going to do. I knew I wasn't going to be a lawyer.

I kind of would have loved to have been an actor, but it just still didn't know what the root was and how to make it work. and also, I don't know, I was just confused. And in September that year, my mum got ill. It turned out she had colon cancer and she died in the following March. And so that's sort of six-month period when she was ill,

I was at home anyway. So it was an easy decision just to say, well, I'm going to help out and look after her. Because, you know, there's all sorts of appointments, radiotherapy and chemo and all that kind of stuff needed doing. We didn't obviously know at the beginning. what the story was going to be. We were hoping that she would be okay. But eventually it became clear she wasn't. So she died age 45. Her mother, as I said earlier, my grandmother had been

47. So you're suddenly looking at it and thinking, wow, here I am in my early 20s. My mom and my grandmother have both died in their mid-40s. Is that going to be my story? And if it is going to be my story, I don't want to waste my life doing a job I don't love. So sod it gave me the kind of the courage to put aside the law degree because you feel a sort of responsibility you think am I throwing away something that people would kill for this kind of education but I thought sort of I'm going to try and do what I want so I applied to get into Rada I think my audition my final audition was 10 days after mom died so I really didn't really didn't care couldn't care less about it which is I've you know just

discovered since a really great way to go into an audition you know because they can read they can read desperation of people they're like dogs yeah you know there's nothing more attractive in a way than someone who kind of feels like they could take it or leave it I don't know anyway whatever happened I got in and it gave me that courage just to launch myself in a whole different direction and of course looking back now I'm it feels like it was a very positive thing that came out of a really unpleasant, upsetting, devastating experience. I think that's very common. Is it weird, actually?

My sister died of colon cancer when she was 43. Did she? And so I suppose what I can relate to, and she has two kids. I always have to say that, you know, when I say had, I'm like, no, there'll always be her children. Yes. You know, like you're always your mum's kids.

And, you know, I really relate to that sense of carpe diem. Yeah. that i think you only really understand that when you experience grief particularly with life interrupted i think you know it's different when with grandparents sometimes and but it's that sense of time running out isn't it oh listen to those lovely birds very loud are they the jimmy hendricks ones yes they're the uh what are they the green ones the parakeet green parakeets are quite noisy the urban myth parakeets all right you're trying to tell us something Yeah, I think I was talking earlier about my mum having a younger brother and a younger sister and her sister came to live with us.

Well, Alan, her brother, he died in a car crash when he was 27. A few years, five years before mum died. I sat in the room when my grandfather died, admittedly he was 92. But, you know, to be there in the room when someone dies is quite something, especially when you're 14, watching that. and then watching my mum die. I think from a really pretty early age, I got quite a sense of the fact that this ends. It doesn't go on forever.

And there's no guarantee about how long you're going to be around for. Yeah. So get on with it. And I think that's probably why I'm driven to do so much and kind of try and pack so much into my life because I've had that sense of urgency instilled in me from those experiences, I think. I see it as the gift they give to you.

Yeah, I mean, certainly it's probably more useful to discover that when you're younger rather than on your deathbed to suddenly go, oh, hang on a minute. I mean, it's a very hard thing to get your head around, isn't it? The fact that we're not going to be here forever. But I don't think a bit of a bit of sense of that. Obviously, you don't want to spend your whole life in fear of it or weighed down by it or depressed by it. But I think a little bit of like the party doesn't last forever, is it?

It's a useful thing to know and to feel. Oh, I guess if I'm really honest, I don't know if you feel like this, but certainly since losing my sister and my parents, I think I definitely am less frightened of dying than I was. Because I think, well, oh, what's this dog? Hello. I love your dog, what is it? She's a Bernese.

Bernese, mountain dog. They're similar to St. Bernard's. They are. They are kind of like on the same route. My friend likes St. Bernard's. I love St. Bernard's. I love them. Yeah.

Yeah. Gorgeous. I like the white tip on the end of the tail. So cute. Yeah. What's the name? Coco. Coco.

She's having a fight with a branch. Coco. Look at Co. Coco. So you went on after you left Rada. Yeah. And I feel like you became a really, you had a lot of theatre experience, didn't you? Yeah.

to do any film or television. I just decided that I wanted to be a theatre. I wanted to be a good actor. That was the main goal. And I figured the way to do that was to play all the great classical parts. So I was going to, the plan was to do theatre, not do any film or television and go to wherever I could play leading roles. So I spent five years in Manchester, Birmingham, Salisbury, Norwich, did a world tour

of much ado. And I did Shakespeare and Shore and Moliere and Coward. And my agent would ring me up occasionally and say, there's a merchant ivory film being made. And I'd be like, nope, don't want to do that. I have to say, you are quite merchant ivory. Don't think that's what a nice thing, though? Well, I mean, looking back, who knows what...

You've got something like, the Bounder. He's arrived again, but he was on 300 a year. There you go. You've got that in you, Stephen. But I fell in, you know, theatre is what... You don't, you know, at school, you don't do a six-part series for the BBC. You do a play. and that's what I've that's to me that's what was exciting an audience so yeah I stuck to that for five

years and then slowly dawned on me that it's not just the parts you're playing it's the people you're working with and there were obviously talented people working in film and television so I got off my high horse and from playing sort of heroic leads juvenile leads in the theatre ended up doing a lot of comedy so I fell in with Chris Morris and Armando Inucci and Well, we know you did because this still gets shouted at you today because you, of course, were Dan in Alan Partridge. Yeah, I had it about an hour ago, was my last one. It's over 20 years ago, but it's still people love it.

Do people say it a lot to you still? I mean, several times a week. Several times a week. The worst, it wouldn't be started, because the whole point of that scene, I mean, for people who don't know, Alan Partridge is in the car park, and I'm playing Dan, and he's shouting. Dan, Dan, Dan, Dan, Dan, Dan. And it goes on forever. So when the show first came out, I would be standing in R Price Records or wherever. And the guy on the till would just start shouting Dan at me, right there next to me. But obviously, to make the joke work, he would have to do it for about a minute. I mean, I remember going into a student union refinery. They were having lunch. There was about 400 students, and all of them started shouting it. I got a season ticket at Spurs.

I went to a Spurs game. Sorry for you lost. And half the crowd was shouting Dan at me. I mean, it's been a huge part of my life. I've had Dan in my life longer than I've had my children. Even a bird sound like they're shouting it. It's just, but you know, I always say there are a lot worse things people can shout at me. And there are a lot worse things to be known for.

So I'm very happy. It's an iconic TV moment, so I'm very happy to be part of it. It is, this is true. And also, like you say, what a brilliant show to be involved in. One of the greatest comedy shows ever made. Amazing, amazing. So that and I played Adrian Mole, and so, you know, was doing, that was... And apparently Sue Townsend, I heard you tell us through, which really made me laugh,

that she was kind of losing her sight a bit, wasn't she? Losing her sight, she eventually went pretty blind, but at the time I auditioned for Adrian Moll, her sight. it was going so she sat down i read a bit and she explained that adrian is a geek and pretentious poet and the actor playing him just cannot be good looking um so she said would would i mind if she had a good look at my face i said of course not she pulled out a huge magnifying glass came to within about three inches of my face scanned me from top to bottom backwards and forwards, backs of forwards, and then said, yeah, you're perfect.

Although not in many ways. I mean, she was one of my heroes. I loved that woman, and we obviously got to know her well doing the show. And was Green Wing immediately after that? Green Wing was not long after that. Green Room was 2002. I think we did a pilot in 2001. I probably did Adrian Mole a year before.

Green Wing was really your sort of breakthrough role in some ways, would you say? Because, I mean, Adrian Mole was a six-part series. It wasn't particularly good, if I'm honest. Yeah. Even though the cast was amazing, you know, Zoe Wanamaker and Alison Stedman and all sorts of great actors in it. But Green Wing did take off and was a huge hit and was nominated for all the awards. So it was my first taste of being in something.

Oh, yeah. Really. Oh, look. Oh, look. Hello. Hiya. Hello. Do you know, Steve?

do you do this I always really suck up to the police when I see them because I'm worried I just get that fear and paranoia it's like if they're driving behind me I drive do that I drive really slowly even though I don't even drink I've got no reason you've got anything to hide just got a guilty soul in the car I just think they might say in 1982 you stole an eyeliner we know what you did okay I confess I'll come quietly well you were you surprised when Greenwing took off, presumably you were being recognised more. I was being recognised more. I got asked my autograph in the Camden Sainsbury's, where I shopped.

Oh, how was that? And I signed it and gave it back to the woman, and she looked at my name and said, who? I said, Stephen Mangon. She went, oh, sorry, I thought you were Lawrence Llewellyn Bowen. So it wasn't all upside. I said, I've... Stephen, I'm so sorry. I said, I've got short hair.

She goes, yeah, I thought you'd had a haircut. I said, I'm not him. Anyway, I've told him that story since, Lawrence. Did he find it amusing? He said you should be so lucky, darling. So, yeah, so Green Wing got you that recognition. And presumably, once you get a role like that, other offers start coming in, do they, a bit more regular? Yeah, I think it's obviously, you know, it's a crowded marketplace being an actor, and there are a lot of us.

So if you're in something that's successful like that and you play a part that people remember, then yeah, I think it definitely helps. And I got all sorts of work, and I'm probably still getting work today because of Green Wing, to be honest. You still bump into people who love it. I can't go into a hospital without being attacked by doctors, so especially it needs to tell me that my character was a hero to them, which is really worrying for the rest of us because my wife Louise was in No Angels so she played a nurse so the two of us do get quite a lot of attention in hospitals from the staff we've got a little school trip here yeah so when my sister was sick and she was in the Marsden and no this sounds like there were sort of light moments

Stephen. Yeah. And a good friend of my mum's, is an actor. He's called Hugh Quashi and he... Yes, I saw him the other day in the play of the Old Vic. He's a play Shakespeare actor as well, yeah. I saw him with Susan Sarandon. Yeah, he's so brilliant. And he was really great friend to us and he was coming in and it was very weird. As he was in Holby, I could see the doctors, sort of almost walking towards him quite purposefully and then realizing they'd made a mistake. We filmed Greenwing in Northwick Park, mostly. Yeah. And I was obviously wearing a doctor's coat

and sometimes going from set to the common room where we were sort of housed when we weren't acting. You did worry someone was going to collapse in front of you and their family were going to beg you to save their child. And you just had to say, I couldn't, I can tell him an anecdote. I can make them laugh. I don't know about actual medical stuff. Well, you've got your law training because, well, Mortimer was famously called upon for his law training, but I think he was actually a solicitor for a while.

He was a bona fide solicitor. Whereas you wouldn't be much good to me if I was interested. Didn't he get Jarvis Cocker out of problems when he showed his bum to Michael Jackson? I think so. Yeah, I mean, as you do. It's not a situation I encountered, but, yeah. So how nice to be finally thinking, and you mentioned Louise, did you meet her when you were doing good? Green Wing then and she was doing...

There was a party that filmed four through, I can't remember what four, in Leicester Square, some building in Leicester Square, and they invited the cast of No Angels because that was their big nurses hit and the cast of Green Wing because that was their big doctor's hit. And she's a bit of a stoner. Did she walk in and you thought, oh, okay.

Yeah, absolutely. I was just bowled over. Michelle Gomez introduced us. Oh, how lovely. So Michelle Gomez, who plays the sort of Mad Scottish Sue White in Green Wing. So she's, Michelle is our Silla, black. And yeah, that was 20 years ago.

And you had to get numbers in those days because you couldn't, there wasn't sort of, you know, Instagram and you had to be a bit more direct about your interest. Exactly. And I didn't get her number that first time. So I had to sort of track it down. Because I was shy.

Oh, were you shy? That's adorable. But I realised that we'd actually been in the same film together, even though we hadn't acted in the film. So I got hold of the director and pleaded with him to give me her number. And then that's it. And here we are now, 20 years later, three kids. Yeah.

Were you nervous when you called her? Of course. Yeah. And gold, she said yes. I mean, funnily enough, we were out last night on a table with Knit and Soreny, the musician. And our very first date was to go and see him do a gig in Shepherds Bush. So we told him that story last night. And I thought he'd be really, he just said, was I good?

And he was. I mean, it's almost as if he's a performer. I know. I mean, what are we like? But yeah, but it was, I told him that obviously it was a cool thing to take someone to on a first date. So he should take that compliment. Yes, I think that's a good. Tremendous compliment.

Yeah. Well, we need to talk about your wonderful book. Barry saves Christmas, which I've read, and I absolutely loved it. And I told you something, which is I read it to Ray. Yes, I'm so pleased about that. I do read stories to Ray because it calms him down. We already listen to Classic FM, which is Sunday afternoons. To calm Ray down on fireworks night.

It appears to be every night of the year these days. I know. It does go on. So he loved the book. I'm so happy. Well, there are a lot of dogs in it. It's dog after dog. I did all the voices of the various dogs.

Did you? And it's such a brilliant book, Stephen. I think you write so brilliantly for children. And I just think it's such a fantastic blend of, it's kind of touching, but it's so funny. It was even making me laugh at points as well. Excellent. Did Ray laugh? He raises a wry smile.

Okay, I'll take it. Okay. I'll take it. But it's centred around this St. Bernard. Barry. Yeah. Barry spelled with an I.E. Yes.

Because J.M. Barry, who wrote Peter Pan, had a St Bernard. A St Bernard called Porthos. And it was watching his St Bernard playing with children that gave him the inspiration to write Peter Pan. In the books, the St Bernard becomes a newfoundland. Nana, the dog Nana, is based on... I wonder why that was? I don't know. If I was at St Bernard, I'd be annoyed, but there we go.

So, St Bernard, because I wanted to write a Christmas book, but so many of the angles have been done to death, Santa, elves, all the rest of it. I thought, well, St Bernard's are out there rescuing people in the snow, snow, Christmas-y. We could make a story, I could make a story out of that. So, yeah, my hero is a St Bernard, and he's... And what a hero.

And he's also, because doing exactly what we're doing today, he's out obviously, look at this thing coming towards us. What? This could be... Can I tell you what this is? This is love at first sight. I think we need to have the... We need to take a picture of this. This is incredible.

I think this is a papillon. Oh, look at those in years. I don't know, but I'm going to check if it's a papillon because... There's two of them. There's two papillon's if I'm right, but I'll I may be totally wrong. Let's find out what it is. What a stunning little dog. But do you know what's happening here? It's like Love Island when two bombshells come in.

Yeah. A little bit threatened. Can you see? They're like 10 yards apart but they're just looking at each other. Yeah. Come on Ray. You can get closer. We're just admiring your beautiful dogs. Are they papillon? I got it right, Stephen. You know what you're doing. They're very cute dogs, aren't they? I love a beautiful. They're not as cute as Ray, but they're cute.

No, but they're incredible dogs. So, yeah, so there's some Bernard, as we say, in this book, the star of this book. Yeah. Well, Barry is the star, but what I like about it is that it's written from the point of view of the children as well. It kind of switches perspective, doesn't it? Yes, yes. So it's quite effective that, because you can see Barry sort of going into situations as the unreliable narrator, saying, and then I did this, and I was such a hero.

And then you get the kids version. And it's like you didn't actually do that. Yeah, each chapter you're inside the head of a different, you're either Lawrence, Carrie or Barry. Yeah. Because the parents said it would be funny or the dad to call them Larry, Carrie and Barry. Yeah, that's something, because I think that's dad joke central, isn't it? That kind of thing.

So, yeah, it is absolutely right for comedy because the first chapter is Barry describing how he comes from a long line of noble dogs who rescue people in the Alps and how brave and, you know, honourable he is. And then you see the second chapter through the eyes of Carrie and realise that Barry basically spends his whole time lying in front of the fire and farting. So yeah, that lovely juxtaposition, which a lot of comedy is based on between how you, you know, you see yourself and how the rest of the world sees you. And I think that's been basically the basis for my entire career. I mean, Guy Secretan in Green Wing thought he was a sort of ladies man sex god and everyone else

thought he was a posh pratt and there's that that that you know the divergence between how you see yourself and how the rest of the world sees you that stephen well it's the david brent principle david brent thinks he's a great boss and we all look at him and go no you're not alan partridge thinks he's a brilliant you know tv presenter yes it's that sort of lack of self-awareness isn't it is maybe where the comedy lies and i really what i also love about this book is that it's that It's so many twists and turns. It took me on a lot of journeys. I was going, oh, it's actually quite gripping.

Yeah, I mean, we haven't discussed the squirrels. The squirrels play quite a big part. I'm obsessed with the squirrels, because Ray's quite obsessed with squirrels, but they're the sort of nemesis of Barry's life, really. They start off like that, yeah. There's a squirrel called Dorothea, who just winds him up, no end. Well, there's not just one squirrel. Well, they all do, yeah.

There's a thousand. And my sister illustrates the books. I did I do throw her a lot of curveballs I mean there's one scene where they open a small door in a underground passage you'd have to read the book to work out what's going on yes we don't spoil it but they open the door and there are 300 squirrels in this little chamber

so it's like go on Anita draw that but she loves that sort of thing she loves it I mean she spent days just drawing squirrel after squirrel after squirrel and you know her illustrations make the book I think I love her illustrations yeah they're really one talented isn't she because and what I love about it I know this sounds weird but you can

tell that she sort of is able to get inside your head yeah in the way only siblings really can we just know we have the same sense of humour we were brought up because they're funny books they're funny illustrations they're fun they add to the comedy yeah um and they're just a joy it's the best part of my year when i start getting the illustrations email to me from her because they're always fantastic and I'm always trying to I mean I'm her older brother it's my job to be annoying

I mean she told me once that horses were difficult to draw so I wrote a whole book about reindeer you did write a book about reindeer what a bastard I know you've written is this your eighth book it's my eighth book I'm in the middle of my ninth I'm halfway through the ninth

I can't believe I've written that many books I'm so proud of it though I really am because books are really hard they take so much time You sound like that character, you know, near the stripe the comic strip presents. Yeah. Al Pacino says, writing's hard. Yeah, that's me.

No, but you know what? I can believe it having chatted to you, only for this brief period of time, because you do strike me as someone who really does apply yourself and has a work ethic, which I think probably comes from you, because it's always down to you, really. but I also really get this sense of that being instilled in you from childhood really. I think so. I think you just absorb that stuff without really noticing it. My parents did both work really hard and, you know, had a good time as well. They weren't slaves to their work. In fact, Dad didn't particularly enjoy his job, but... But there was less of a sense of that being a prerequisite for a career back then.

Yeah. I think that's a very modern concept. I think so. do what you love. I think back then it was like you look after your family. It doesn't matter what you do. My grandmother could not understand me being an actor at all. Really?

It was just so weird. Well, why would you, why would you do that? Why would you give up a law degree and do something like that? Yeah. It just seemed daft. And I think dad was slightly wary of it as well. He was only getting into Rada and the kind of approval that, that stamp of approval from an august body.

Yeah. You know, he thought, well, if they think you've got a chance, then maybe you do. but I mean you just you want your children to be okay don't you you don't want them to toil you know fruitlessly in a career that doesn't want them so I think I can understand why he was anxious but nowadays I think this generation that's coming up doesn't think like that at all everyone's the gig economy is everywhere everyone's got jobs that have limited contracts and you know and everyone's hustling doing this that and the other so the world has changed so much even the idea of you having one job seems quite often passion now. I mean, who does it? Nobody does it anymore. Well, I mean, some people do, obviously, but it's becoming increasingly rare. But yeah, I mean, I think, I mean, I'm constantly going, oh God, I've got to finish this book, I've got to write, you know, because I think I put myself in a situation where I have to do it. I sign a contract. I get in advance.

I have a deadline. I just have to do it. And I'm constantly thinking, why is my life so busy why do I have so many things going on but I'm the one who's making that happen yeah and I'm slowly realizing that it's my fault because you constantly feel like some outside agency is making you do all this work and actually no I kind of like it but it's just anything well as Miley Cyrus told us it's the climb though isn't it it's the climb and it's doing that you know I was saying to you earlier that when we're waiting for our coffees that my best friend Jane is a screenwriter.

Yeah. And when I wrote a book and she said to me, I said, I hate it. I don't like writing. And she said, no one likes writing and everyone likes having written. And having written is one of the greatest things in the world. It's so true. Getting a box arriving at home with 15 copies of my book is about as exciting as it gets. I mean, or somebody tweeting or Instagramming you saying,

I've got a 10-year-old, they weren't particularly into reading. you know, tried your book and they, you know, they're not coming down to dinner because they want to finish your book. That to me is, it doesn't get any better than that, you know, that's the best review I'll get for anything I've ever done. And do you find, because obviously acting in some ways is more of a sort of team sport, isn't it? Completely. And writing's quite solitary. Yeah. Do you think you're more suited to one or the other? Is there one you prefer? Or do you think you're, maybe it appeals to two different sides of you? I think, you know, you write, especially if you write for the screen,

there are so many people involved, so many people who have an opinion. It's wonderful being part of a big team, but at the same time, it's a relief then to go away and just be the master of the book and really write whatever you want. I do a play, act with other people. I just like bouncing between the two. After you've been writing for a while, you're desperate for the company of other people and to be working as part of a gang and a team.

Are you? Yeah, I see that. And if you're in a play for six months, eventually you think, well, I quite like to just lock myself in a room for a few weeks and just... So you get both? Yeah, I get both. And when you're doing something like The Split, or episodes, two of my faves, that must be really lovely when that gets recommissioned. And you've built up all these... They're really close bonds, aren't they on shows like that? Yeah, they are.

If you're lucky, I mean, sometimes you hear horror stories where actors just don't get on and it's a poisonous atmosphere. on set, but the work somehow produced is really good and keeps getting recommissioned. That must be hell to be stuck in a job like that. The bad news is it's been recommissioned, the good news is. But episodes, I work with Tams and Greg, who's an old friend and with Matt LeBlanc, who turned out to be just fantastic, took himself, didn't take himself seriously, took the work really seriously. Yeah, he seems so, do you know what, it was through seeing him in episodes that I just thought,

God, he seems like he's got a very British sensibility in terms of his humour. He's brilliant. He's just great. You became quite Pally with him. We were really Pally, still friends and yeah, absolute bonus. And then all the other people involved in that show. I mean, the only downside of that show was it was set in L.A. We filmed most of it in Wimbledon. Freezing, which is not really kind of what I was hoping.

But other than that, it was a treat. And the writing on the show was fantastic. So, yeah, and the splits, again, we were like genuine family. Nicola Walker, I'd known since I was... Wasn't she at Cambridge? Yeah, she was at Cambridge at the same time as me, so I've known her since she was 18. In fact, when you put set dressing up on a set,

you normally have to get a picture of you when you were younger and a picture of them, and they photoshop them together. But we actually had pictures of us when we were teenagers to hang on the wall. And it's lovely to be married, fake married to someone that you actually know, rather than Steve and meet Susan, right, you'd be married for 15 years' action, you know, trying to manufacture that kind of chemistry.

And you've got to be a lawyer. again anyway. Yeah, here's what I could have won. I got to be a barrister. You are, I don't know how you feel, I'm going to ask you in fact, how are you with compliments? Not good. Really? Yeah, I mean, it's not that I don't enjoy them, I just don't know how to respond.

That's quite British, isn't it? I mean, it is, yeah. And I think also very Irish, like, don't get too big-headed, don't, I think there's an Irish have a very keen sense of when someone's getting too big for their boo. I don't know how to deal with it and I don't you know people often say I think people who aren't actors watch us in the theatre and think that we do it for the applause at the end you know that bit when you stand on stage and everyone's clapping that's the that's a really an really embarrassing bit of the job

not embarrassing but it's just it's kind of something you feel has to happen but it's that's no I don't think any actor does it for that moment we don't we just, I think most of the people I know who are good at their job are good actors just are interested in the doing of it. Yeah. And the other stuff that comes with it, whether it's being recognised or, you know, is a kind of weird byproduct. You don't set out, I don't, I didn't set out on this journey so people could shout

Dan at me on the street. But here we are. But that's what's happened. I used to get really embarrassed because my, my mum's in the thing. and my dad was a he worked for the BBC so they were very and all our friends were actors so we'd go to all sorts of things and we had this thing where obviously they'd always stand up and you know standing ovations which is like you always do that for friends and my sister and our entire childhood we were

like oh it's just so fucking embarrassing and my dad would go bravo oh bravo honestly Steve and now but old habits die hard because I cannot if I go and see something I mean obviously it's terrible but I would always stand Will you? To show my appreciation. Whereas I've noticed, again, it's quite a British thing not to do that. Yeah. It's more American that, isn't it?

I think so. I think so. When you're known as being, oh, Stephen Mangon's so nice, he's so lovely, that there must be times when you don't feel nice and lovely. How does your frustration and anger or whatever that we all experience as human beings, how does that manifest itself? Do you sort of withdraw into yourself? Oh, I can get, I can get Christ.

Yeah. And I can get angry and I can vent it. But I also have a job that requires you to be emotional. And it's quite handy that. But yeah, of course. I go running. I can, you know, I mean, we all, you know, I'd be weird if I didn't. But I don't know. I've always thought that we just need to make a bit of an effort with each other because, I mean, I was invited back to Rada to hand. handouts and graduations, those parakeets are back. I was a much harder to hand out some... They're like noisy, have I got news for you panelists? Yeah, they really. Don't know when to give it a rest.

Yeah. And they asked me, you know, do I have any advice for the students? And advice is always dangerous because everyone's coming at it from a different point of view. But I sat and thought about it long and hard and thought, what advice? And it came down to nine words. Work hard, be on time. don't be a dick I think that's basically the kind of the beginning and the end of my

advice for anyone in any job work hard beyond time don't be a dick so that's why I try and do I like that advice because I also think it's also that thing of remembering when you're doing particularly what you do you know how many people would want to be in that position. Yeah, and how I would want to be in that position if I wasn't in this position. Yeah, yeah. I'm really lucky, really lucky to do what I do. It's a great way to earn a living. It's, I can't think of a better one. So, and also, you don't have much in this business. You have your body of work and you have your reputation. And I think if you're going to be trouble

you need to be a better actor than I am to get away with it so if people think he's fun to work with he's a laugh and he's not going to be a pain in the ass

I think that's yeah it's interesting that it's sort of like if you're going to be sort of tempestuous and a bit you can do that if you're Richard Burton maybe you've got to be amazing for people to still want to work with you if you're an almighty pain in the back. But you are a brilliant actor, you see, there you go again.

I think what's interesting about you is that you built up effectively your 10,000 hours on stage, which most actors will tell you, you know, in some ways it is like the Marines because it's live, it's relentless, it's every night. Yeah. And I wonder if that gave you a really firm grounding when you went into TV. Massively. I've done dozens and dozens of productions on the stage, hundreds, thousands of nights in the theatre. I was obsessed when I was growing up with reading autobiographies of, you know, I would read Ellen Terry's autobiography, these actors from the, from the Edwardian era, from the, you know, Victorian era. In fact, I'm reading at the moment I'm reading Moss Hart's autobiography, American playwright from the, I don't know, 1920.

He's writing eight books and he's reading. I mean I'm obsessed with how people got going and of course the way you became a great actor. Until very recently all the great actors in this country and got their reputation in the theatre. Everybody you can think of until recently. And they all went to rep and they all got that training and I wanted to do that. I wanted to play dozens of different parts and I wanted to do like you say the 10,000 hours. I just wanted to work and work and work.

So Stephen, I have another question. What do you like at... Because nice people sometimes struggle with confrontation and they have to watch people pleasing. Right. Is that something that applies to you? A little bit. I mean, I think like a lot of people,

I find it easier to get annoyed on other people's behalf. Right. So... But I... Yeah. But I know, I mean, I... I can get quite confrontational. I've got certainly more as I've got older.

Really? Yeah, I think so. But I do recognise that people-pleasing thing. I definitely had that when I was younger. But I think the older you get, the more just experience teaches you when actually you should put your foot down and go, I'm not having it.

Do you know what I'm learning as I get older is that when you say no, people will always respect it more if you don't give a whole list of reasons why. Because I used to do that. justify it. Yeah. Yeah. And I think actually people smell that there's either it's inauthentic or it's not, whereas I'm really practicing the hard no now. Yeah. And it's working. Yeah. I just, someone invites me to something and there's no, you know, I just don't fancy it. So I'll say, no, I'm not coming. Yeah. And I say, I can't, I've got to take the dog to the vet and then I've got this. Yeah. And then it opens up a conversation where as I started saying, absolutely not. Yeah. Yeah, great. That's what you've got to do, Stephen. I think you'd probably, I You strike me as someone who wouldn't have a problem with saying absolutely not. No, and I have no problem with saying no to jobs that I don't want to do.

Really? Yeah, absolutely. Would you ever do anything like the jungle or? I can't see you on reality to me. I don't think so. I've been asked to do, you know, those sort of things and strictly and those kind of things. I mean, strictly, I just, I just those trousers. It's the trousers and the chest waxing. You're fit.

You look good, you work out, and you go running. I mean, they asked me again the year after Bill Bailey won, and my wife said, is that because they want more old, funny people? Which was rude. I kind of love Louise, I've got to be honest. Louise is very funny. Can you tell me, before I let you go, I've already told you one of my favourite shows is Fortune Hotel.

Is that coming back, please? I don't know at this moment, because it was on in August. It's so brilliant. They do all sorts of market research. It's just endless kind of crunching of numbers. I hope so. I mean, who doesn't want another month away? So we'll see. Watch this space. It's fun. Well, Stephen, we've come to the end of our walk and I have to say I've loved getting to chat to you. Have you enjoyed meeting Ray?

I've loved meeting you both. Look at Ray. Does he, you trim his eyebrows? Could you do mine? Do you know, I spend more money on his hair than my own. His grooming bills. Extraordinary. You'd have to let me know where he goes.

Yeah, they can fit you in. They've got 11.15 on a Saturday. I'm just going there, so I'll have a ray, please. It's like the Rachel. Yeah. Well, thank you so much, Stephen. It's been an absolute pleasure. Thank you.

I mean, I love St Bernard's anywhere and I adore you. So why wasn't I going to love Barry saves Christmas? Ray, are you going to say goodbye to Stephen? Bye, Ray. See you later, sunshine. It's just too cool for school, though. I really hope you enjoyed that episode of Walking the Dog. We'd love it if you subscribed and do join us next time on Walking the Dog wherever you get your podcasts.