Walking The Dog with Emily Dean - Tammy Beaumont (Part One)

Episode Date: June 2, 2025

Today we’re in beautiful Epping Forest with the internationally recognised, record-breaking cricketer Tammy Beaumont!Tammy currently plays for England and she was part of the winning 2017 Women’s Cricket World Cup team - she was named the player of the tournament and was awarded an MBE for services to cricket! We were joined by Tammy’s beautiful black Labrador Indy, who was named after Indiana Jones… and absolutely lives up to his namesake! Tammy tells us all about coming from a cricket-loving family, what it was like to be the only girl on the team and how she’s driven by the desire to prove everyone wrong. It’s an incredibly exciting time for women’s cricket - and Tammy tells us all about how cricket is becoming more inclusive and what that means for women in sport and beyond.If you want to catch Tammy in action this summer you can get tickets to see her play here - or you can watch all the action on Sky Sports!IT20 & ODI India SeriesThe HundredFollow @tammybeau on Instagram Follow Emily: Instagram - @emilyrebeccadeanX - @divine_miss_emWalking The Dog is produced by Faye LawrenceMusic: Rich Jarman Artwork: Alice LudlamPhotography: Karla Gowlett  Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Yeah, a lot of the times we'd turn up and the opposition say like, oh, they've got a girl playing, they must be rubbish. And then the next year I'd come back and be like, oh no, that's girls playing again. We're in trouble. So, yeah, for me, it was always, if you said you can't do that, I would go watch me. This week on Walking the Dog, Ray and I went for an Essex stroll with England cricketer Tammy Beaumont and her beautiful Black Lab, Indy. Named, by the way, after Indiana Jones. Indy completely lived up to his name and did a ton of exploring on our walk. Ray, not so much. Tammy has been playing cricket since she was eight years old and she's gone on to become one of the country's most celebrated female cricketers.

If I tried to list all of her achievements, we'd be here all night. But to give you an idea, she's been named Wisden, Cricketer of the year. She holds the record for the highest ever score by an English woman in Test cricket. And she's also the owner of an MBE. Now, full disclosure, I'm not exactly the world's leading expert on cricket, but I am aware just how much. much more high profile the women's game is now becoming. And it turns out Tammy has played such a huge part in the increased visibility of women's cricket, so I couldn't wait to find out a little bit more about her life journey. Not only did Tammy turn out to be incredibly easy to chat to and a real laugh. She also exudes this very calm, composed kind of elite athlete energy. She strikes me as the first person you'd call during any kind of crisis, and frankly, I plan to when you're

she likes it or not. I really hope you enjoy my chat with Tammy and if you want to catch her in action the good news is there's a very exciting summer of cricket ahead with the England women's team taking on the West Indies and India in two international series and you can watch all the action on Sky Sports plus the 100 will also be kicking off in August. If you want to buy tickets to any of these events we've put all the links in the podcast description for you. I'm going to stop talking now and hand over to the brilliant woman herself. Here's Tammy and And Indy and Ray Ray. Come on Ray.

I'm going to put him down, Tammy. All good. He's awfully slow. Raymond trying to keep up with Indy, your fabulous black lab, is a bit like me trying to keep up with you. Oh, he'll wander off and come back. Oh, look. Go on, Indy.

He pretty much lives up to his name, Indiana Jones adventurer. He is absolutely beautiful, Tammy. So we're in, we should say, Chinkford. I think it's the bottom of Epping Forest. Oh, okay. So yeah, just big nature area in London, I guess. Do you know, they always used to take you to Epping Forest in, when I went to school in London and you'd always go for outings. I would have paid attention if I'd known how stunning it was.

So we've got the wonderful Indiana. Yeah. Who's a black lab. And India's how old? Four and a half. He's four and a half. All his brothers and sisters from his litter work for a living, you know,

on shoots and things, and he's scared of shotguns. So he's a pet. Oh, I love that he's quite a sensitive type. He is actually. He hates fireworks. He likes chasing ducks, though, as you'll see. We've got lots to discuss. You are obviously an internationally

famous cricketer, women's cricketer and I'm horribly ignorant about cricket, but I'm really, you're inspiring me to know more about it. So you can think of this as you having to speak to an idiot. My dad was obsessed with cricket. I mean, to a sort of very manic degree and it was all he would do. And I remember my mum once saying, you need to do more with the girls, you need to take them out and he took me and my sister to Lords. He didn't tell my mum. And we were children, Tammy. So we basically ended up, I remember we played with the rubbish. And then when I got to, I became a teenager, I was like, I thought, he has this on all the time. I'm going to have to find someone to have a crush on. It was desperate back then. Who did you choose? It was slim

picking, Sammy. What, what are we talking? Well, I chose a man called Derek Pringle. I think I've heard of him. I mean, he's a really good cricketer, but he's not someone you'd have a crush on. No. No, I think within cricket people do develop some quite random crushes. It's more about, I guess, how they play than what they look like. Well, as it should be. I'm really interested to know how this passion and talent for this sport all started.

And you grew up. Was it in Kent that you grew up? Yeah, right on the coast, a place called Sandwich, which everyone finds hilarious. So does the Earl of Sandwich living here there? I wonder if he does. I think so. And I think he was the one that developed the sandwich years ago, apparently. Or at least the town likes to claim that.

But yeah, I fell in love with the game, mainly my older brother and my dad both played. And my dad was very heavily involved volunteering at the local club, Sandwich Town. And your dad was Kevin and your mum was Julie? Yeah. Oh, you've done your research. I know, my. Oh, I'm a bit obsessed for Julie and Kevin. You have a brother

Yeah, Michael And I'm interested in the sort of family atmosphere Because I know your dad was a research scientist So was it quite a sort of sciencey household Yeah, it was Yeah, so dad Worked for Pfizer down in Sandwich You worked for Pfizer

Yeah, and now he's moved to the rival AstraZeneca So we know about them Yeah I was the beneficiary of one of their vaccines There we go, like so many My brother actually has a PhD in chemistry as well. And what's it growing up in that sort of household? I always think of sciencey people as quite organised and disciplined

and they've got their shit together. Was that the energy in your house? I think we kind of had the best of both worlds. My mum was a teaching assistant and we just kind of call her a child whisperer. It's like, you know, if you've got a crying baby, she's the one that... So she's so nurturing. I joke that she'll mother anyone. And then dad's very analytical, very logically minded, very level.

So kind of had the best of both in dad trying to push standards. And I think when I was about 13, he came up with a plan of how I was going to get to play for England and when I was going to try and be the best in the world. And I was only 13 and mum was like, calm down, Kevin. She just wants to enjoy it. So it was a very good mix. Do you want to say what's happened here? My producer has had to pick my dog up because he is so lazy,

he's decided I don't fancy walking. Come on, Raymond. You're very lazy boy. Look at Indy. Be more Indy. Whereas Indy's charging off around the corner, chasing Ducks and trying to find things to explore. This is what proper dogs do, Raymond. So, yeah, that's interesting.

So it feels like a kind of structured household. but you knew where you stood do you know what I mean? Potentially I think we were quite chaotic at times as well I mean because I started off doing gymnastics and then my brother did football and cricket and dad did cricket sort of three days a week so we're always off in different directions

packing different cars driving up and down the motorway and what were you like as a kid Tammy because I mean I'm really interested in where how sports people start off in life You know, like if I'd have been, let's say, one of your parents' friends, and they say, oh, what's Tammy like? What would they have said? I'd probably say stubborn, strong-willed, strong-minded.

No, I actually was quite a sickly child. Had a lot of food allergies. Milk being one of them, so even from an early age, lots of kind of food intolerances and days off school and things like that. Were you popular? I think I got on with everyone, but maybe wasn't, you know, the it girl as such. I kind of, I think I, I almost always saw maybe the person that was left out of a group, and then I'd make friends with them.

And kind of, yeah, I remember I was always very short because of my allergies, didn't really grow properly. I remember standing up for one of my friends who was, like, you know, the big girl, the one that bloomed a bit early in primary school. and she used to get bullied and I'd be the one standing up to the bullies even though they're about a foot taller than me. That's interesting though because to me that's a very captainy thing to do as well.

That's the sort of... Do you want to mean like that sense of fair play? Yeah, I think you know, when you're an athlete you tend to work out probably your personal values at times and I'd say one of mine is fairness. And whenever I'm in some see something that's kind of unfair or, you know, well sport at times is unfair, you know, different coaches favour different people or, you know, they just want to play a certain way and see things differently.

And that's certainly things at times that gets to me that it doesn't feel fair. But yeah, I guess that's one of my values. One of the things that kind of elite sports people like yourself all tend to have in common is the ability to keep a cool head. And I know some sports people I've spoken to have said for them that was almost more important that question. quality than talent than natural talent. Was that something you felt you had from a young age? No, I think that's something something I've developed. I think we do a lot of personality testing in cricket.

Do you? Yeah, yeah. What was yours like? Well, I've actually changed three times as I've got older. I think I've mellowed out a bit. I think for me in cricket, it's even more mental side of things is, you know, There's people that have come along in the women's game that have had a better technique than me. But I was so mentally stubborn and determined and a bit ruthless at times, I guess,

that that kind of overcomes that technical flaws at times. It's interesting you use the word stubborn and determined, because I think often women are described as stubborn and men are described as driven. Yeah, I would probably call it driven, but I just... I'm going to rebrand you as driven. Yeah. Hey Tammy look at that swan oh wow really beautiful isn't it yeah it's like posturing they're beautiful birds but they have a very bad

PR don't they do you I always think it was quite bad tempered and although one next to it I think is that called a Canada goose the like black and grey one and there's some near us where we live and they've had a standoff with Indy I mean quite rightly you've got a gigantic black Labrador barking at you you are going to hiss back but Indy He's being well behaved now Because I've got treats in my pocket

Oh he's seen the swans though Tammy Look It's all going to kick off Yeah he doesn't actually like swimming though So I think we'll be fine Doesn't he? No he's scared of swimming as well That's quite unusual for a lab

Yeah he'll paddle up to his shoulders But I think when he was young Well when he was young he did fall in a river He got himself out But he just doesn't quite nail the swimming technique Oh do you know I really like Indy's personality You know what he reminds me of? That girl at your school who needed a bit of protecting.

And I think you've chosen a dog who needs a little bit of protecting. Probably a little bit. He's full of character. He's very energetic. He is quite a lot like me, actually. He's very energetic. He wants everyone to love him. And my dog, as you can see, is very like me because he likes to be carried everywhere.

There's a little bit superior. No, I'm not superior. I'm not superior. to Tammy Jr. And you're growing up in Kent and you're already, as you say, showing an interest and ability with regards to cricket.

He used to practice a lot, didn't you, in the garden, and occasionally inside the house? Yeah. How did that land with your mum? I think mum just gave in in the end. She knew once three of us were involved. There was no chance for her. actually played a couple of club games with me a couple of times actually when our women's team

was short but yeah I think she just eventually moved all of her nice ornaments that she didn't want breaking into the place that we weren't playing my brother he chose his schoolmates he obviously went to school three years before me and his best friend at school had two brothers so I had no choice but to join in with the the boys sports as opposed to sit in the living room with the two mums talking about mum things Well, your brother played for an under-eleven's team which your dad's coached. Yeah, proper family affair. And then it suddenly occurred to you one day that you should be in that team, didn't it?

What did you say? Yeah, I think this is my mum's favourite story, to be honest. So my dad was trying to ring around to get an 11 out, and we were a little bit short. And he'd got down the list, and eventually he was calling these boys. And I was saying, well, Dad, I can bat better than that one. I can bowl better than that one. Why can't I play? And I mean, if I can bowl better than that one, that one must have been terrible.

Because I can't bowl. Like, why can't I play? And my mum just went, well, she's right, Kevin. Why can't she? And the next thing, you know, I turned out and played. And borrowed my brother's whites that were about four sizes too big and never looked back. And so was this a mixed team then? Presumably it was more unusual then, was it?

with a... Yeah, I was the only girl. Yeah. So girls were allowed to play. Really, how did that feel to be the only girl? I think to me it didn't ever feel strange. I think you can see why people would be put off with that. But yeah, to me, it was, why can't I?

Why can't girls do the same thing as boys? I think we never got treated any differently, my brother and I. So, you know, why should I have been going to ballet or gymnastics when Michael's going to football and cricket? And, yeah, a lot of the times we'd turn up and the opposite... opposition and say like, oh, they've got a girl playing, they must be rubbish. And then the next year I'd come back and be like, oh no, that's girls playing again. We're in trouble. So for me, it was always trying to prove people wrong. And, and, yeah, you know, that was a good motivation

for me. But that in itself is really interesting, because one thing I do remember picking up, and my dad would tell me about cricket, he would say, well, what a good team captain does is that they understand that different players need different psychology. And I always remember him saying, You see, Ian Botham, how you'd speak to him is you played like absolute shit. And then Ian Botham, he said, his response to that would be, I'm going to show you. He said there are certain players that wouldn't respond well to that and would need more gentle encouragement. Which were you then, Tammy? It sounds like you were actually quite driven on by the girls are rubbish.

Oh, yeah. I think, for me... You're a bit of an Ian Botham is what I'm saying. wish. Don't quite party as hard as he did when he played. But no, I think, yeah, for me, it was always, if you said you can't do that, I would go watch me. And that was very much my attitude for a very long time. And even at England at times. And there was a couple of coaches that cottoned onto it and they'd almost try and wind me up and say, like, you know, oh, this, this person said this about you or, oh, I don't think you can do that. And then I cottoned

onto it, so it didn't work anymore. What would they say? I would be mortified. What they would just So it's basically like saying, do you see what this troll said about you on Twitter? Pretty much, yeah, pretty much. Some people crumble if they hear negative feedback, though. Most people do. How come you're not like that? I think at times, like, the trolls and negative stuff on social media started to get to me as it's gone on.

But I don't know. I guess I've always had that. I wanted to be the best. I wanted to play for England and show everyone what I could do. I don't know, I guess probably being labelled a failure to thrive child at the age of three. Yes. It puts in you a bit of a, well, no, actually. And I used to hate the fuss of, like, going to birthday parties and I couldn't have the cake

because it obviously had eggs and flouring. And it being such a fuss, and I hated it. And I was just like, no, I'm fine, it's fine. Give me the cake. I'll take it home for my brother, like just at four. So that was just... And the food allergies meant that you... There were a lot of food groups that you couldn't.

eat? Yeah, it was like milk, wheat, eggs. Then I got put on this diet that was supposed to, this elimination diet, and it was like five foods. I was allergic to three of them. I basically just lived off oven chips for about four years. I've got to say, you look great on it. Well, luckily I grew out of it when I was about 10.

Otherwise, I think we won't tell McCains. They'll be signing you up as a brand number. I need a sponsorship. Your clear ability and talent continued to kind of flourish, didn't it? And was it clear, for example, when you were playing, was your school, were you having to take time off? And was it starting to become clear that, because when you were selected for Kemp, were you 16? Yeah, yeah. And by that stage, how was it, how are you juggling that with GCSEs?

And was it, were your school aware that, look, come on, I think we know what's going to happen here? I don't know how aware they would have been at maybe the extent. We didn't really have a girls team, so I was playing in the boys' team. Were you the only girl again? I was, but a couple of girls ended up coming through after me. I think I almost set a bit of a precedent of, I basically demanded to be in the cricket team. I demanded to go to trials. And at first, we had two heads of PE while I was there,

and the first one was an old school Welshman and wasn't so keen, but because he had made my brother the captain of the age group he was in, he was like, all right, well, we'll give you a go because I think he asked my brother, is she any good? So they let me go to the trials.

It's always a good idea to ask a man, I think, if a woman's any good. Oh, it does my head in that. Oh, Indy. Indy's met some friends. Oh, that's a little puppy. Little puppy. Indy, you were that big ones.

Indy, look at the little puppy. little Labrador puppy ever so sweet and you used to jump up like that before as well oh it's so sweet though come on Rui I'm just going to put her on the lead while we go past these geese yes actually I'm going to do the same with Raymond oh oh my god Tammy will you look up ahead stay I wasn't telling you to stay Tammy I wouldn't dare

Tammy have you ever said you want us to describe what we're seeing so there's two ducks with five little ducklings and then another two ducks with another four just walking up what waddling up the path towards us the little family outing they look like they're at centre parks don't they the mum the dad and the five kids or two moms or two dads can i just say well yeah whichever way around they want yeah they're all jumping in the water now there's three different families actually there's already this one in the water we've just seen a lovely black labrador puppy it's so cute what's the what's the puppy there

Desperate to meet you. Pip, how old is Pip? Four months old. Oh, and I think Pip almost seems to sense that Indy is her kind. Yeah. Labradors have a thing for Labradors and Golden Retrievers. They essentially have to say hello to every Labrador they ever see. Oh, hey, Pip. Come on Ray. Hey you. Turn your little puppy, come on. It's okay, Indy still jumps up and he's four.

Tammy Beaumont has just picked up her giant Labrador I have to say Greg James who has interviewed you because he's a massive fan of yours and cricket in general he picked his dog Barney up his Labrador up you're the second person to pick up your Labrador and you're both connected with cricket I'm just saying I don't want to make any assumptions but I think Barney might be a tiny bit heavier than Indy

only because I've seen him on Instagram but sorry if that's not true Greg Greg just so you know just F-Wi Tammy Beaumont just body shamed your dog no your dog is great Barney is great he's a legend he's so sweet look at the little ducklings look at that indy don't look too closely and think that it's dinner it's not dindins he uh actually is very clever at finding like pheasants and fishing that like he's never caught one but he can get on the scent and get them to go running this is honestly so beautiful oh indy just made a bit of a i'm going to say he lunged There wasn't too much aggression in it, but you get them a scare.

I love it when ducks do that. And they stick their bottoms in the air and sort of twerk. I think when you were taught, I think that's a great, what's the word? Like story for what you were saying earlier about athletes being really calm, but underneath the water, the legs are going. I think quite often I try to have a bit of a game face and, you know, all calm on the surface. But inside, it could be going. Really?

Yeah. So maybe that fake it till you make it thing, there is some truth in that, Tammy. Oh, I think that's the first half of my career entirely. That would be, yeah, the whole imposter syndrome of, you know, should you be here? Should you be, are you good enough to play the game? Pretty much until 2016, I was in and out the team questioning whether I was even good enough to play for England. And then after that, I managed to fake it till I made it. Well, you were selected when you were 18 to play internationally, weren't you?

Yeah, yeah. Playing for your country at 18, I know that's very normal for sports people. You're at your physical peak, all that. It makes sense. But to the rest of us, normies, 18 feels so young to be carrying that weight of responsibility. How, I mean, that must have been an amazing feeling. It was, it was, definitely. It came quite out of the blue, actually.

Back then, we were completely amateur. All there was was county cricket. You did it on a weekend. Right. And we trained through the winter. What's down here? Yeah, should we go try another path? So then, yeah, I basically got picked for England under 21s.

Did all right. And they said at the end of that, oh, you're going to come to the West Indies. Wow. The current wicket keeper, she's having a bit of a rest. And you're, I want to get this right, Because you're an opening batsman, you're a batsman, a batsman nearly said, man, can I say that again?

Because that is disgusting. Yeah, it's changed to batter, so it did used to just be blanket batsmen. Isn't that awful that I said that without thinking? I mean, I would still say it without thinking. Played 20 years with it. But it's good that it's changing now. So it's batter? Batter, yeah.

But why wasn't it always batter? That's crazy, isn't it? Because women didn't write the rules? The laws, the laws. It's that normal that you say, well, these are. these are my two things. I'm a wicket keeper and a batter. Because it seems like did you discover that you were better at one ultimately? Do you get to pick? I think if you're lucky, so if you're someone like lucky in both

and Andrew Flintoff, Nat Siverbrunt, you're good at both and you're good enough to almost play as both, which is an all-rounder. I think when you start out as a kid, you just try everything and naturally you end up being better maybe at one or yeah and then obviously a wicket-keeper's very specialist but for me well my older brother did it so obviously I copied everything he did is this Michael yeah although he's left-handed and I'm right-handed and dad's left-handed so and what's the relevance of that in cricket is it good to be left-handed or is it better to be right-handed do you have an advantage if you're left-handed it's more unique I think in the men's game it's not so

much it's very common now but in the women's games game in England in particular, there's not many left-handers at all. So actually, all of our bowlers learn to bowl at right-handers and sometimes might struggle against left-handers just because you haven't practised it as much. But yeah, I don't know. I just naturally always pick the bat up right-handed. We joke that it must have been mum holding the bat with me in the garden, not dad, and maybe that was an error.

In between all this, where you're, you know, as I say, showing all this extraordinary cricketing prowess and about to go on international duty for your country, you, managed to fit in a degree. You went to Loughborough and you did, was it chemistry in sports science? Yeah, so obviously you said earlier, scientist household, just naturally good at chemistry,

but I didn't actually really want to be a mad scientist. That's what we always called Dad, just a mad scientist. Oh, I love Kevin a mad scientist. Yeah, he's great in his white coat. Actually, when he used to work at Pfizer, there was a odd time you could take your kid in. And he just played Minesweeper with us

and sent emails to the guy in the next cubicle. So that's all we thought Dad did for years. Well, we don't have it on any good authority. That's not what he does. No, well, he actually turns out when you actually Google him, he's pretty big time in what he's done. Yeah, he's got loads of, like, you know, like sighted papers and things. He's actually done very well, but he never tells us about it

because all he wants to talk about is cricket. But, yeah, I think, so I did chemistry and sports science, but again, it was just a different era. in that I went to Loughborough University because they had a really good cricket program and there was nowhere else to sort of practice or train professionally. I always do associate Loughborough with very sporty.

It's a very sporty university, isn't it? Oh, I remember moving into halls on my first day and they have like fresher helpers that helped me carry my kit bag in. They're like, oh, do you play cricket? I was like, yeah, yeah. And I just got the call that I was going on England tour. So they were like, who'd you play for it?

I was like, oh, England. And they were like, oh, that's cool. And then I met the person two doors down. And they were like, oh, I'm an under 21's GB triathlete. Three door down was like England under 21 netball. I was like, oh, okay, so it's not actually that important if you play for England. Like quite literally everyone you meet. Do you know, I'm really disappointed.

I would have been so excited to have dropped that on people. So, yeah, England. And so yeah, me too. Yeah, pretty much. Pretty much was like, oh, no, yeah, I'm this. I'm that. But that's good because you're with like-minded people and you did your degree. Did you enjoy university? Was there a part of you thinking, well, and do you think your parents thought she's obviously got this talent? We believe in her. She hopefully believes in herself that she can

excel in this sport, but always good to have a backup plan. Yeah, well at the time there was no money in playing cricket for England. If you're a woman. If you're a woman. If you're a woman. yeah you got well I ended up getting lottery funding did you yes when I when I played for England I got put on Sport England lottery funding but because I was a very fringe player it wasn't that much so my luckily I had my my student staff and mum and dad helped a lot but it was only after I finished university about a year afterwards that we became professional and even then had to work two days a week for a charity called Chance to shine who go into schools and try and get cricket

back into state schools and things like that. Yeah, he's having a little paddle and a drink. Oh, Indy. Are you having a paddle? Don't shake on everyone. There we go. Raymond, Indy's just been in for a little paddle and Raymond is looking at Indy like what sort of a weird how are you getting yourself wet? Raymond, did Indy go and have a little paddle? Yeah, you've shaked for him. Oh Raymond, you're adorable. So yeah, you were, you left university and then after that, as you say, you were developing your cricket full time and you were, but it wasn't, you're not able financially.

It's not like with a, you know, a young footballer where it's like right, you're signed. That's it. It wasn't like that at all. There was 18 of us received the first profession. contracts and that's just over a decade ago and yeah like I said those of us that were on the the lower contracts were still working part-time or yeah it's a different world to probably the women's cricket game now you know people are earning that haven't played for England or international cricket are earning more in the

hundred competition than I did in the entire year as my salary but it's amazing to see that trajectory across the course of just my playing career. It's really interesting cricket because I always think of it. It's viewed, isn't it? Is this quite... Another Labrador. Oh, another Lab. Oh, this is what every labs do, the little turn, the little... Oh, it's so sweet. They become friends. Indies meeting so many lovely labs today. Yes, I'm interested in how cricket is perceived as this, has traditionally always been quite a sort of refined genteel sport. And it's only as I've got older, and they've worked. And they've

obviously quite sensibly introduced safety gear, that you realise it's not gentle and refined at all, is it? Not at all. I think it's really changed, even in the last 20, 20 odd years. How has it changed? Well, I think the invention of T20 cricket has just brought in a new, which is the shortest format, so it's just 20 overs. About a three-hour game as opposed to a five-day test match. And do you think that's got more people interested in the sport, because it almost felt a bit overwhelming, getting involved in that commitment, if you're not familiar with it, you know. Yeah, I think it's a much more bite-sized version, but I also think it's more exciting in that it's brought in more skill, more power. You know, everyone wants to go to a T20 match and try and take a

crowd catch and see sixes and wickets and things like that. And I think that the development of that has brought in a completely new audience. And there's almost nothing better than going to a T20 on a Thursday or Friday night at the Oval, whether it's Surrey playing or somebody else, you know, because you maybe hit up the bars in the ground and then go into town after that. I remember you first coming on my radar. Must have been in 2017, which was a big year for you, wasn't it?

Yeah, that was... It was a big year for women's cricket in general. You helped the England women's cricket team when they were on the World Cup, and you won the player of the tournament. You, after that, I think you got an MBE. Yeah. So this feels like your career was at an all-time high,

but I was really interested to discover that you almost, there was a point prior to that, a few years prior to that, where you almost packed it all in. Why was that? Yeah, it was just the up and down nature of the start of my career. So like I said, I remember Dave is a wicket-keeper, batting down the order at number.

nine, then kind of got dropped, got picked again, pretty much batted in every position from one to 11 over that time and just kind of would work really hard, improve a bit, get back into the squad, then not do very well, and then find myself back out the squad and have to do it all again. And yeah, I had a bit of a moment in, I think it was the 2013 Ashes where I remember were playing a game and while I was batting I basically thought to myself if I don't win this game for us I'm going to get dropped again and lo and behold I got out and we didn't win the game is that a horrible feeling to me oh yeah it was horrible is it the longest walk of your life I mean Lord's is a long walk anyway but yeah it was and after the game when we did lose

you can get out onto the balcony of the members pavilion at Lords and there's these benches and sat on this bench and had a little cry to myself because back then I was very like stoic I guess like stiff up a little but then in private I'd probably cry and didn't like to show any vulnerability at all but our assistant coach at the time Carl Crowe who now works in the IPL he came out and found me and we had quite good relate well we still have a great relationship

he's like a mentor to me still now but he was like right come on it's all right like let's sort this out and a few months later we sat down and it was like right how what do you want from cricket do you want to play cricket firstly and then what do you want and then how are you going to get there and what is it that's stopping you at the moment and what was it a few things i think it was like almost trying to protect yourself and maybe not being completely honest with you know needing to get fitter or needing to be better mentally or um i what happened often was i'd get out there and i'd be so nervous that I'd do something that I hadn't been doing in the preparation to get there.

Yeah. And even, like, my nerves would just get the better of me. So it was almost trying to find a way to settle at the crease, come up with some routines that maybe calm you down a bit and then make you think logically and use that side of the brain. It's that play the game not the occasion thing as well, isn't it? Yeah, absolutely. Where your mental discipline is always able to overrun. just that cortisol and those nerves running through your body.

Yeah, absolutely. I learn you almost have two brains and when you're stressed, only your animal brain will work. You can only tap into that and it's only like I feel stressed or survive. Oh no. Indeed. Leave it. I find that's so interesting, Tammy, that chimp, they call it as well.

Yeah, it's literally that chimp mind. where you have to always try and access your hard drive, which is at the back of your brain essentially and not your frontal lobe, don't you? When you're making important decisions and especially those split-second decisions that you get all the time in sport. Yeah, absolutely.

I think once I learnt that, it made a lot of sense as to what had been happening for me. Did you work at all with sports psychologists or therapists in that area? Yeah, I did. We didn't have a full-time one at that time. but I did ask to speak to one and luckily they put me on to one who was working with the the men's lions team which like the men's second team yeah um so I remember meeting up with him and he did end up being our first full-time sports like so that was nice to have some continuity but was that helpful yeah I honestly don't think I'd have become the player I'm today without doing it

um what was the biggest lesson you learned I think the one for me is like try to project so maybe I'd be quite hard on myself, I'd make a mistake and you'd almost see me beating myself up and actually sometimes thinking about what you're projecting to other people. You know, you don't want them to know you've made a mistake. Do you really want your opposition to know how you feel? And in then doing that has made me feel better because of it, because maybe I'm trying to project calm and then I feel calmer. A little bit of that fake it to you make it thing, but a bit of a bit.

I totally get it now and you've explained it really well. I'm likening it to whenever I was younger and I was at the bar and let's say a guy who was messing me about a bit or an ex or something had walked in. You know, you do that thing, you turn around to your female friends and say, just pretend I've said something really hilarious. Yeah. It's sort of, I imagine that's how you deal with the opposing team in cricket. You're like putting this game face on, aren't you?

I certainly do. I've always enjoyed that. that's probably something I had to learn to deal with a little bit more in that when back in the back in the day it was pretty much you only play against people when it was England versus Australia so you could actually imagine that that bowler hate I hate hate her and she hates me and we're going to go to battle and it's rah all of that kind of thing and then you start playing franchise cricket which come into the game where I might go as an overseas player to play in the women's big bash in Australia

and you end up in the same dressing room as them or they come to to England and playing the hundred and you realise they're the nicest people you've ever met and then you're going out there and you're playing against your friends so it's so much harder to have that I always think that because I watch football a lot and I always think yeah when you see people on international duty getting so riled up with people they play with every week yeah I think I think everyone's starting to get their head around the fact that you know yeah you play hard on the pitch play fair on the pitch but off the pitch you can still get on and you know hang out as friends really turn things around for yourself and there was a huge achievement you had in

twenty twenty three and i know about this achievement because gregg james speaks of nothing else he's obsessed with it yeah basically you surpassed you broke a record of big record didn't you yeah i had no idea about it double centurion is that right double century yes i scored a double hundred in an ashes test match um at trent bridge and were you the first woman to first english woman So the previous record had been Betty Snowball. Betty Snowball in like 1930 something, I think. So tell me, excuse my ignorance, but women were playing cricket back then, but just kind of slightly erased from the history books.

I think the history books are there if you look hard enough, but it's just that it wasn't particularly advertised. It was in the small print. Yeah, it took place, but people weren't necessarily interested and wasn't too accessible. I love. I think they used to get a boat for four weeks to Australia, practice on the boat, play some games of cricket,

and then get back on the boat. So it was a proper expedition. The best part about our, well, not the best part, but the moment that hit me in the fields of our World Cup final at Lords in 2017 was that before the start of the game, you go out for the anthems. But they made a really big deal of kind of the legacy

of women's cricketts. and particularly in England. So England women's cricket team had won the World Cup in 1973 which was the first ever cricket world cup men's or women's. And then they won it in 1993 and 2009. But for 1973 and 1993 they never got a medal. So they presented them with medals that they obviously never got. They got to be put up in hospitality at Lords. The founder of the women's cricket World Cup an absolute pioneer, Rachel Hayho Flint. You basically organised.

Well, I don't know her, but even I've heard of her. Yeah, I met her when I was 10 actually playing for Kent under 11s. And she told my mum she thought I was good, so that meant a lot. So we've just got to a tree and this is a 19th century tree. I think it's 350 years old. Our producer was just telling us this. And what I did is I've edited. that out so it sounds like I knew this but in fact it was my producer who's far smarter

and more diligent on the research front than me but this is named after a cricketer this tree and it's the cricketer is called Robert Grimstone i haven't heard of Robert Grimstone but then no surprise there have you heard of Robert Grimstone we're honest i haven't but it is a glorious tree isn't that lovely come on indy indy's got great recall When I've got treats he has. I bet as an elite sports person, you are very good on the discipline front, training indie. I actually think we're a bit soft.

We've been very soft. He does a lot of things that I reckon certain people wouldn't like their dog to do, but we almost know it's our own fault. Like he gets on the sofa, he gives you proper cuddles. I mean, he's 34 kilos and he'll lie on top of you, but we enjoy that.

It reminds me of an old boyfriend. I'm her joking. Indy, come on, what's this? But all the things you've mentioned, I think, are lovely. Like, you let Indy in the beds? Yeah, he used to sleep in the crate and then, yeah, we just got a bit soft. And we're moving house at the moment, so everything's in boxes and whatnot and there's not a lot of space. Indy, you've got a big grass.

Indy's chewing a bit of grass like someone from Oklahoma. Come on. Not another one. Oh. So when we're in London, at my in-laws, there's a park where we're walking him every day. And there's like a little sort of brick shed that does coffee, really nice pastries and stuff as well. And they do dog treats and Indy quite literally goes and point, like, starts sniffing the shelf. And it's like he expects his morning treat.

And as Indy named after, Indy Emma Jones, and your other half Callum, Yeah, so we couldn't quite come up with a name. We actually were going to get a golden retriever, but that didn't work out. And my husband wanted to call that Thor. We felt black Labrador can't be Thor. So we went round the houses, but yeah, Indy people think he's a girl quite often, but he is Indiana, but he only gets called that when he's naughty. But yeah, Indiana Jones.

Callum did archaeology at university, so he wanted to go to, well, he told him. me he wanted to be like Indiana Jones adventuring around the world but archaeology is not like that anymore is it not apparently not most of the best things have been found oh that's so depressing I know but Indy lives up to his name he's very much an adventurer and we're actually on about getting getting our dog a dog we're that kind of dog people so we're probably going to get another one over the winter another Labrador but maybe a girl oh that would be nice be so nice for Indy to have a friend what have you got any name ideas well this is the thing

So you'll see where I'm going with it. So my nan was called Dora. Unfortunately, she's no longer with us. But Dora the Explorer. Yes. Yeah. It's a thing. It's going to happen.

Oh, the intrepid Labrador pair. I know. Well, he loves Labrador. So one of my teammates, and former teammates, Nat and Catherine Siverbrunt, have got two Fox Red Girl Labrador's. And he absolutely loves it. We go and walks with them quite often. And he loves having a little pack of girls with him.

and he's like Danny Zooko in Greece. Yeah, he is a little bit. He is. I really hope you love part one of this week's Walking the Dog. If you want to hear the second part of our chat, it'll be out on Thursday, so whatever you do, don't miss it. And remember to subscribe so you can join us on our walks every week.