Walking The Dog with Emily Dean - Tom Rosenthal (Part One)

Episode Date: June 30, 2025

Joining us today on Walking The Dog is the fabulous actor, comedian and writer Tom Rosenthal. Tom shot to fame for playing Johnny Goodman in Friday Night Dinner and Marcus Gallo in Plebs - and he is also a critically acclaimed stand up comedian!Tom has a gorgeous Romanian rescue dog called Kiki, who he absolutely adores. She was at home in Bristol with Tom’s girlfriend Gigi and his daughter Simi when we met - but Tom’s affection and connection with her is clear, and we’re already planning a trip to go and see her in person. We met on a blisteringly hot day in June - so we decided to have Raymond sit this one out because his fur and hot weather don’t go well together! Tom told us all about how Kiki helped him through a very tough time and how she’s opened him up emotionally. We find out what impact having a famous dad had on his childhood - and also the most outrageous prank that he ever played…Follow @rosengrams on Instagram Tom will be performing his brand new show, ‘Whatever People Say I Am, That’s What I Am’, at the Edinburgh Festival Fringe from 30th July – 24th August (18:15) at Assembly Roxy, Upstairs and then touring across the UK and Ireland – tickets on sale now at www.tomrosenthal.netFollow Emily: Instagram - @emilyrebeccadeanX - @divine_miss_emWalking The Dog is produced by Faye LawrenceMusic: Rich Jarman Artwork: Alice LudlamPhotography: Karla Gowlett  Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

We're like doggers, literally. We're doggers. That's the new name for the podcast. This week on Doggers with Tom Rosenthal. This week on Walking the Dog, I went for a stroll with a very wonderful comedian and actor Tom Rosenthal. Now, we'd arranged to meet Tom in London's Finsbury Park. He'd come down from his home in Bristol where his dog Kiki is based, but it started out as a pretty scorching day. So I decided to play safe and leave Ray at home in the

cool for this one. And by the way, if ever in doubt, do avoid walking your dog in the heat. I personally don't take Ray out once it gets above 20 degrees, so that's a good guideline to bear in mind. The good news was, even though Tom wasn't walking the dogs, he was very keen to do a lot of talking about the dogs. And by the time, Tom and I eventually met up very late afternoon, it had actually cooled down enough for some dogs to take brief shady walks. So we also got to meet a few new friends, including one with the best name ever, Harabo. Tom started out as a comic, but became best known as an actor after getting cast in two TV shows that became huge, the brilliant Friday night dinner and the equally brilliant plebs.

He's since gone on to receive critical acclaim for his stand-up shows, and thankfully for fans of his comedy, he's returning to the Edinburgh Fringe in August this year, with a brand-new live show, whatever people say I am, that's what I am. And yes, well spotted, that is a reference to the Arctic Monkeys album. Tom is such an interesting person to chat to. His dad, as you may know, is the sports presenter Jim Rosenthal. So I was keen to find out what his experience was like growing up with a very well-known parent and also discover when his talent for comedy and performing first began to emerge. Tom is such a genuine, likable person. I mean, I knew he was going to make me laugh a lot because hilarious is what he does. But there's just something so authentic

and decent and kind of good-hearted about him. He also could not stop talking about his dog Kiki and seem to adore Ray. So frankly, I'm calling it. The man is an official gem. If you're planning a trip to Edinburgh this summer, do catch Tom's show. Whatever people say I am, that's what I am. It's on every day from now until the 24th of August at 6.15pm.

Or you can catch it in the autumn at the Soho Theatre in London. Either way, book your tickets now before they sell out at tom Rosenthal.net. And do, by the way, remember to keep your dog-o safe in the summer heat. I really hope you enjoy our chat. Here's Tom, with lots of chat about Ray Ray and Kiki. I'll just get away from the... The coconut man? He is an absolute dreamboat, that guy.

Who is the coconut man? Well, he's a man who stands there with his very muscular torso and machete's coconuts at any passing woman in order to get their number. I don't wish to objectify him. If they're going to object to anyone, It is him, isn't it to be fair? He's impressive from the back. He's 10 out of 10 and the front.

I've been checking out the front before you got it. Lovely coconuts on the man. I mean, he's got a lovely bunch. Come on, Tom Rosenthal. Oh, how lovely to see you. What a lovely sporty site you are. You're talking about my backwards cap and I pulled up socks. Yeah, I've not sanctioned this outfit with my girlfriend.

My girlfriend used to work in fashion, and she's She essentially now dresses me and I get a lot of compliments on my clothes. But today, she's had no input in this, which is why I looks like a sort of a teenage American skateboarder from the 90s. I'm really loving it. Thanks. Well, it's an audio podcast after all. I did actually ask my agent, like, is it filmed? Can I turn up looking like Bart Simpson?

Because I'm not sure whether the teenage dirtbag vibe is what I want. No, I actually like this look on you, Rosenthal. Thank you. Well, you look very nice as well. Oh, I'm so kind. I mean, I thought there was going to be a dog. Right. This is an absolute first, I have to say.

I've been doing this podcast for a long time. And it's called what? Walking the dog. I don't have a dog with me today. My producer has insisted this will be fine. I was like, he's sure we can do this. So we'll blame her if it's a disaster. Okay.

But I'll tell you what happened. I woke up this morning and discovered it was going to be 28 to 30 degrees at the time we were doing this. and I love my boy so much and I just feel I didn't want to bring him out in this heat. I think that's responsible dog ownership. He's a little furry thing.

He has a lot of fur. He pants and he really overheats easily. And I thought if anyone's going to understand, it's Tom. I am pretty gutted, to be honest, just because, like, I wanted to do this podcast so I could talk about dogs because I have a dog and I'm obsessed with my dog love my dog and I'm really worried that now the dog's on here you're going to ask me lots

questions about myself and I really don't want to talk about myself very much. Look we'll cover you... I just thought I could do an hour about how great my dog is, maybe a minute about my childhood. There you go home. We'll cover some basic wiregraphical info out of politeness. Okay. But feel free. I'm going to rename this podcast, Talking.

Talking the dog. Okay, fine. The first ever podcast to be talking. Wow. Your dog is in Bristol, is that right? Yes. Which is where I sort of live, but I've been doing so many shows, recently. to prepare for Edinburgh Festival that I haven't really been home and I was trying to get Kiki to

Finsbury Park to walk her but then she would have had to live in a nasty London flat for five days and it wouldn't have been good so both of us have basically looked after our dogs you know made sure our dogs have a slightly nicer life and neither appeared on this podcast making the lie a complete name a complete lie I think the listeners will respect how responsible we are that we're putting we're not shilling our dogs exactly for the podcast just whoring them out hawkingham on the podcast for a dog that lovers likes I think Kiki would have been a bit hot today

yeah Kiki will be panting sure but she's only like three she could have taken it yes raise an old man you see yeah and I would hate you to be on the episode where your dog ceased to exist that would have been absolutely grim so thank you for we don't want to end it with Ray being blue

lit to the vets and you know I love your look but the backwoods baseball cap is not a dignified final sight being to see. What a rubbish lost human to see. I mean, do you know what? I don't want that in his mind when he's crossing Rainbow Bridge. Yeah. Yeah. So wonderful Tom Rosenthal, who I'm is such a huge fan of. In fact, I was on the phone. She's always the judge, my niece, who's 23, and she went, have you doing today? She's always really bored.

She's like, oh, okay, bye. And then when I said Tom Rosenthal, Oh my God, oh my God, why didn't you say? I said, oh my God, this Johnny? Oh, they love them the Friday night dinner? Wow, she's part of that. They all love them a Johnny, don't they? Well, did you have a bit of, when you did Friday night dinner, Tom? Yes.

Did you have a bit of a female fan, basically? I mean, you still got one, I think. Yeah, I mean, it's that sort of TikTok generation, sort of girls between sort of 12 and 17. Sort of imagined that, I mean, I sort of... Well, I would they? Why would they want to invite Johnny into their lives? I honestly, I just think it's like I looked, I could sort of be their boyfriend. I'd sort of look like a man, but I'd also look like a boy.

You know, I'm not a non-threatening sort of love interest. I honestly assume that's what it was. But yeah, so I have a sort of menagerie of now slightly older girls to come to my gigs and watch me do stand-up. It's their first stand-up gig and they're sort of confused by the entire thing. Yes. But yeah, there was a few strange years when I was sort of a TikTok trend. a sort of a weird crush.

I kept described as a weird crush. You know what I mean? Not attractive enough to be a natural crush, but not ugly enough not to be a crush, you know what I mean, in that nice little window. Who's the weirdest crush you've ever had? Oh, goodness gracious me.

I'll tell you mine. Yeah, please do. Vince Cable. Okay. And Henry VIII. Okay, why are you into a Henry the 8th? I'm curious about that. Because whatever you say...

It's a risky crush. Yeah? But whatever you say about it, and he always put a ring on it. Guy committed. Well, is it commitment if you cut their head off after a few years? I don't know. Then is the brakes.

Then is the brakes with Henry the 8th. Oh, man. Weird crushes. I'm loath to answer. I really don't know, to be honest. I think it's always disrespectful when men, you know, have a partner they love. And then they start saying, oh, a really lot more go, Robbie or something. That's really what I should have said.

And honestly, what I feel, intuitively. time when it would not be offensive to anyone. Oh, so from history. Oh, just when you were younger, maybe. Oh, my first crush, I think, was Cameron Diaz, but that's not weird at all. That's a pretty standard crush. Yes.

Oh, I mean, you know, no, again, I liked sort of baby spice from the spice cards. I think that's the first person I was attracted to. But again, not weird. I think both of them are sort of classically attractive, so. There's no castron of arrogance in your closet. Budica. Oh, man.

What a pair. So listen, we should talk about the wonderful Kiki, your dog, who can't be with us today because she's in Bristol. Yeah. Avoiding the heat, I hope. And tell me about Kiki and how she came into your life. Wow. Kiki is a rescue dog from Romania.

As far as I understand it, there's quite a lot of rescue dogs from Romania. And I do, occasionally I'm sort of concerned that we're part of a kind of pipeline, you know, to sort of... Well, I had Sophie from Romania on this podcast. Have you come across Sophie from Romania? No, no. It's a BBC correspondent called Rory Keflin Jones. Right. And his dog became quite famous on social media,

and she's called Sophie from Romania. She's very shy, and she wouldn't come out from the sofa for months. How did you get Kiki, and what was the process like? There's a charity called Freedom Angels Romania, and my girlfriend was just sort of surfing the internet, looking at sad dogs, and we very sadly sort of went through a miscarriage basically Oh, Tom, I'm really sorry, that's really tough, isn't it?

Gigi was sort of like, can we get a dark? And I just thought, well, yeah, we should do that because that's a nice thing. And Gigi went to visit this charity and Kiki, you know, was pretty scared, but just sort of like when she's sat down on the floor, like pour on her, even though she's got an anxious dog, and she's immediately sort of fed in love with her. So we purchased Kiki for £500.

And she's been a sort of really magical presence in our life, and she's like really helped us to heal from that whole thing. And yeah, for like a week when we first got her, like Gigi would sleep it down in the kitchen with her. next to her bed and she was so timid and so scared of everyone basically but has sort of gradually come out of her shell and now she's a actually genuinely really social dog who only really gets scared of like loud like a motorbike or a coffee machine or something you know that's the only time that she'll freak out she actually runs up to people she runs up to dog she introduced to

herself she's like a completely didn't thing and whenever i see her making friends with like a new dog or a new person i get i sort of get quite emotional in a way that i'm just not ever in the rest of my life, you know, it's really touching to see such a change from this this scared little thing who, I mean, when we first got her, any man, she was just terrified of, basically. Really? Yeah, she just, she was always a slightly more amenable with women, but, I mean, she clearly, like, some men have been really mean to her.

But now she runs up to men, you know, and she's like, she doesn't just like any man, she has to judge you a little bit, but the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, well, none of us, really. Precisely, I think you've got to have a healthy suspicion for most strange men, right? But she has the completely correct amount of suspicion for strange men. And yeah, I mean, I wasn't a dog person before we got Kiki. But now, she's changed our life. And she has sort of kept us together at times.

And I sleep with her in my bed every night that I can. She's just sort of a really special presence in our lives. And that's why I wanted to talk about her on this podcast. Because I think whenever I talk about her, I sound like a much more emotionally and chew human being than I actually am, you know. She's really opened the window into me, which could go, oh, he is a human being, you know, whereas sometimes they think I'm a robot. Yes, it's so true. I find it, so, you know how you worry about how you come across sometimes? And whenever I'm talking about my dog,

I just don't care. Isn't it weird, Tom? And other dog people, and you're just like, wow, your dog's great. Wow, your dog's great. Oh, this dog's so good. And yeah, it's so connecting. And there's something just like, I mean, I'm a sort of increasingly spiritual person. And I think these little things are sort of tuned into a higher frequency than we can understand. And some people look at them and go, oh, stupid dogs, don't know, but I just, I just think that they are actually above us in some way and that they have access to kind of like a plane of existence that we don't really understand. I think, I trust my dog's intuition over mine, 100%. And sometimes my intuition about people is quite poor. So I like, I like, I like

a little thing, like, oh, no, that's a wrong person, you know. Because if she barked to someone, I'm like, I'm not buying anything of you. I don't trust you just because my dog's reacting a bit negative with you. They're like our little Philip Pullman demons, aren't they? No, 100%. Yeah, that's what I was just thinking of. And I miss her. Like, I'm less of a person when I don't have her on my team, you know.

So yeah, I just love talking about it. I find, Tom, I find it's really interesting because sometimes, if I'm walking through the park, we're in Frinsbury Park we should say today, which was easy for me, because I'm North London, and may not have been as easy for you, because we're both Arsenal fans, I felt it was fair enough. Yes, it's nice. Yes, it's nice to trade home territory.

Yeah, this is our manner really spiritually. And I guess I feel if I was walking through this park, let's say you weren't here and I was on my own, I would feel like really weird, like a weird old woman if I went up to someone and started talking to them. Whereas when I've got Ray, people gravitate to you and it's like I can have a conversation with that, people thinking I'm a lunatic.

I say this to Gigi all the time. Like when we're with Kiki in the park, Kiki always runs up to like these. incredibly attractive girls and I was just like why the hell didn't I have a dog when I was single? It's so what an amazing way to start a conversation before you want to talk to. Oh I'm so sorry oh my dogs oh god what are they like anyway what are you doing now you know I mean I could have been using that for years I've just been using my own terrible human conversation skills it's true it's the classic rom-com meet cute is yeah

Tom we're at the ice cream shop do you want a drink or an eye I mean the only thing is we don't want our eating she gets annoyed me. What about a fruit pastel lolly? Is that going to be okay? No, let's get an ice cream actually. But if it sounds annoying, we'll just be careful. It's only when you get to the cone that it gets tricky. Let's have an ice cream. Should we treat ourselves? Am I not allowed to have a fruit pasta lolly? Is that being my band?

Oh, yes, you are. No. I would select that if it doesn't affect the sound too badly. I would love that for you. Thank you very much. I keep those in my freezer. Well, why didn't you bring any for me? Now we have to pay £2.60. The budget on this podcast has gone through the roof. roof. Could my friend Tom Rosenthal have a fruit pastele ice lolly please and I keep them in

my freezer hence they don't feel a special to me. Do you understand? Yeah, of course. Maybe I have caramel. Caramel, just one scoop. Cone please. I'll do that. I'd have a water please. He's got a whole bottle. I came. You're so prepared. You've got your bottle of water with you. Are you quite organised no no I just I'm not really a walker if I'm honest so like I thought no dog no water yeah I obviously now I have a dog I have to become a walker but like walking yeah without a dog is I play golf right so I walk then but honestly I just didn't know how much walking would be doing so I thought I might need two liters of water to get through it because I feel like I don't know I probably

walk as far as like you know your average 80 year old or whatever I just don't sure to choose to do it so I love the sound of Kiki and I'd really love to meet her I might have to do a special visit to Bristol so I can we can get Ray and Kiki together that would be very special I and tell me about the dogs you were saying did you not really have dogs when you were growing up no not a dog person at all really I had a few cats growing up Which I liked, you know, but I felt like my parents looked after them and I didn't really have a huge sort of relationship with them And yeah, my sort of the dog world has really opened up to me

And this was we should say this was in Was it Barksha that you? I grew up in Barksha, yes, yeah A little village called Cucumdean Oh, that's where Ulrika's rock lived. Who? Alrica Johnson is there Yes, yes, or Rika does live down the road or did And this was with your dad, who we obviously all know who your dad is. A fabulous Jim Rosenthal.

He is fabulous. And your mum, she was pretty high-powered as well, wasn't she? She a producer? Yeah, she produced news night for a bit. And then stopped her high-flying career to just mother me. Oh, how lovely, though. It was very nice if her to do so. Uh, feel a bit bad.

Do you really? Well, you know, I just feel like, you know, it's basically there to pick, like, who was earning the most money. And Dad was just doing a bit better then, even though Mum was doing quite well. And I feel like Mum would sort of like to have kept doing that to some extent. So she directed all of her energy that she was, you know, putting into getting the first interview with Yo Corona after John Lennon's death, just to sort of like doing my art home work. work and it's like a bit of a set down in it yeah but look how brilliantly you've turned out and what an interesting successful life you had that must give her a lot of pleasure i think they're

extremely proud are they um yes yes and uh i am very grateful that they allowed me to you know express myself and at times be extremely obnoxious Why are you? Yeah, you know, I think I was just a bit sort of precocious and I think the best gift that you can give kids is confidence, you know. I agree with that, Tom. And they definitely gave me that. But sometimes a confident kid is quite annoying, right? How did they give you that?

I couldn't tell you. I mean, I just know that a lot of my friends and a lot of what I understand about other people's experiences, they have this internal voice. and they're like a piece of shit or, you know, like people get depressed because they think they're worthless and as far as I understand it, that's just you kind of internalising the things that you were told when you were a very small person. And I didn't get told that stuff. You know, I don't know what I got told, but it wasn't that. And so I feel very fortunate to have an internal monologue, which isn't sort of too self-flagellatory and I have to credit them entirely with that, you know, I think. And you weren't an only child. What's that like being an only child?

sibling and I'm always interested what that... No, I was thinking about this today actually. I don't... It's very hard. I don't know. I mean, I think you obviously get a lot of the attention. And I always thought growing up, it was the best situation because all of my friends would just moan about their siblings, right?

But I wonder as you kind of age and as I'm going, you know, my age now, there's almost sort of more of a burden on you when you have to become the one who's sort of responsible for the family and looking after them because it is only you, really. So if my parents, you know, need nursing or whatever, like, that's all on me. And it's not a strength of my, you know, so I'm going to have to really learn compassion. Maybe it's a bit late to do that.

I don't know. That's what Kiki's helped me with, though. Oh, my God. Like, actually having to look after something and think about when she has to eat and when she's got a walk and if she's done a poo. And, like, it's just, it's, it's really growing me as a person being responsible for a dog. because I have now been responsible for a little human as well for about four months. Congratulations! So like if I hadn't had the dog first then, I don't know how I would have been with the baby.

But yes. Congratulations, Tom. I heard that you'd had a little baby. I'm utterly blessed right now in this part of my life. How lovely. I thought I missed my dog. And now when I'm not with my baby, oh my God, my heart aches. This isn't a life athletics track.

Oh, yes. Have you walked past this before? No, but I brought it. you here because I thought your dad would approve. Do you want to do a quick 400 metres? No, but I think you could handle yourself around that track. A few years ago, absolutely. But I've had many knee injuries.

You're a bit Lecoq Sporty. Yeah. Nice. Yeah, that's interesting what you're saying about. Just going back to what you're saying about, you know, being the sole child in your house. because I always find I think I'm quite drawn to only children.

My best friend is an only child and I really, I think what I like about them in some ways, particularly when only kids are growing up, because they spend more time having adult conversation, I think they're quite sophisticated and wise beyond their years in a strange sense. I mean, all I know is a sort of stereotype that we're kind of,

weird and selfish. And I think I probably do fit that criteria. I don't. It's definitely like quite often when there's like a jug of water and there's like, you know, you and your friend have got glasses, I'll just fill my glass up and people look stare at me like, are you a psychopath? And I'm just like, oh, do you want so? Because I'm in my brain, I'm like, well, if you want it to me, you just pour some yourself. Like, well, I've got to pour you, yours. And that's how my brain works, right? But it comes across very badly sometimes. I think there is probably a case to be argued that because you have less sort of social pressure around you to be a certain way and you don't have like a big sister like being like or big brother being like, no, we do it like this, you kind of grow into

yourself slightly more authentically, I suppose, which might be why we're sort of perceived as slightly we're sort of rub against the grain a little bit. But I honestly haven't sort of looked into this enough. I think I might start thinking of it more because it seems to be a question from people with siblings a lot. But I mean, I don't think only children really care what it's like to have siblings in my experience. Because we've always just observed them and just seem that like, I don't know, it seems like, uh, less fun when you're a child to have a sibling from my perspective. But then again, I'm quite a sort of isolated individual. Are you? Yeah. I definitely. sort of prefer being by myself. No, I think that's quite healthy though. Isn't that the ideal

state in some ways? Not to be by yourself, but to be comfortable by yourself is that's the sign of an absence of neurosis, isn't it? It's not panicking, not feeling the need to constantly be surrounded by people. Yes, I wouldn't say that I have an absence of neurosis. But I think the neurosis of needing to be around other people is quite quiet in me yeah yeah i understand that though that sometimes it's just i feel like sometimes i just need to i love seeing people and then i feel oh okay i've done that and now and now i really just need to be on my own for a bit yeah yeah yeah um and you just have to pick sort of friends and in loved ones who get that oh yeah yeah yeah the ones who don't get quickly filtered out and they're like well isn't he's need to

texting me. Like, it's not because I don't like you, I just don't want to be around you. Is that mean? Yeah. Yeah. So growing up, you must get asked a lot about your dad and I'm interested when you've sort of talked about him because obviously there's a sense of, I suppose, slight otherness that comes with having a famous dad. And your dad is pretty well known. And I wonder, how do you think there are different ways of dealing with that, Tom, aren't there? How do you think you dealt with it? Well, yeah, they asked me to maybe write an article about this and I'm actually quite excited to do so because it's again never something that I've actually consciously engaged in the sort of the question that you just asked. I think the whole sort of battle, if it was a battle,

to this point has to be kind of ignore that reality and just sort of like try and get on as if it hasn't been particularly unique or strange right but i think if i was to sort of therapies myself and think about it on a psychological level i do wonder whether seeing that's a cute little dog sorry tom is it a russles griffin hello i love russles we're supposed to have a dog on this right in the heat. I haven't taken my dog out because she was getting hot, but yours is okay. I got some licks. Little Brussels. Do you like Brussels Griffin, Tom? I mean, I don't really know the types of dogs. They're beautiful. I think they were like little rat catchers in Brussels or something.

Absolutely dream. They're the most beautiful dogs. Yeah, so Kiki's a street dog. Look, what's it called this Brussels? Can we take a picture? Would you mind if my, I've took a picture with him? Tom, you're going to have to pose with Mojo. Come on then, Mojo. Jo. This is a good idea. We can use other people's dogs. Tom, you hold the treat and look and you need to look at the camera Tom.

Mojo, come here. It was lovely to meet you. We're meant to be recording a podcast with my dog and because it was too hot because he's a Shih Tzu and he's very furry and I didn't want to bring him out. So you've saved the day. Oh, that's so sweet. Thank you Mojo for helping us. It's not a bit better. It's lovely. Mojo, you're very cute. We love you. Thank you. Bye-bye. You too. Oh, what a nice woman, a lovely dog. I just realised that. I fed Mojo the treat and then I got ice wobbly on my hand and I just licked.

I just basically put my hand in Mojo's mouth and then licked it. Oh, Tom. That's rookie dog ownership, isn't it, that is? What do you mean? Are you quite funny about hygiene? I need to get wormed. I don't know whether that's being funny about hygiene, putting my finger directly in the dog's mouth and into my nose. That's quite reasonable about hygiene, I would say.

It could have been worse. I mean, how? I could just kiss the dog on the lip straight away. I don't think she would have appreciated that very much. Do you let your Kiki lick you? Yeah, I mean, she can lick wherever she wants because that's how they give kisses, right? But it's not like on the mouth, you know.

I do sort of like rub my head into her and stuff. But I think there has to be some sort of limit. Well, I've tried with Ray, but there's no, there's no letting up. He doesn't understand about boundaries and me too. Kiki literally like, my baby, Simi's got like, nappies, right, and we'll put the nappy in the bin and Kiki will go try and lick the poo out of the nappy. Like that's what Kiki's doing in their mouth. So obviously I'm not letting that mouth near me if I can try.

But I do love her so much. I've had worst dates. Tom, can you please? I was really interested. I know. Well, thankfully, the beautiful dog interrupted my. No, I'm fascinated. Go on.

Nonsense. But I do wonder whether seeing everyone around my dad and the sort of love that my dad received when we went to football or most places and knowing that that came because of the sort of the magical box in our living room whether it then kind of programmed into me that I needed to get on that box in order to get the same kind of validation that he did and that whether the rest of my life has been a sort of step a series of steps in order to achieve that

and I don't really know the answer to that did you ever feel people wanted to be your friend at school because of your dad? There's definitely one or two people who that applied to, yes. Yeah. But that's fine, you know, it's like, it's, I always say that he was pretty universally sort of beloved. So it's, it's not like you're walking around and you're sort of, I don't know, Nigel Farage's kid or whatever, who's presumably a lot of Nigel Farage's kid is going to be getting sort of, you know, your dad did this.

or like basically no one would ever be having to go at my dad just be like oh cool there was a Grand Prix and the dad was at it

you know what I mean so I think I really did sort of luck out with the kind of famous dad lottery um it sounds like he was a lot

he is and was a lovely dad as well absolutely and a great sort of example for how to be successful in an industry like I you know

he he worked so hard he's a real like sort of professional and to have that in your house to have someone putting in sort of hard graph and showing that that does basically get results.

I remember reading, I think it was of relative values or something with the two of you. And I found it really touching, though, that he said, I just remember one time. He said, you know, I was always so committed. And then it was one birthday that Tom had. And he said, I said, oh, daddy's got to work today. It was a, obviously, it was a Saturday or something. And he said, I just saw his little eyes well enough. And I thought, I'm not doing this.

And he's called the producer and said, no, I can't do it. And that really made me cry. I thought that's so sweet. Yeah, he has, he frequently apologises for sort of like not being there as much as he could have been. But from my perspective, you know, he absolutely was. I don't consider myself to have had an absent father. And it's, I mean, that's a sort of a conversation I'm having with myself right now. I don't really know how present I should be or what the optimum amount of time I'm spending with my daughter is.

I definitely feel right now that it's not enough. I've been going around the country doing shows to get rid of Reddingburgh. and I miss her desperately. I don't know whether she actually notices that I'm not there. But then, you know, of course she has to on some level because I am not there, right? So I basically worry, I mean, I think I'm going to carry the same guilt than my dad has, regardless of how much time I spend with her because there's a part of me who just wants to be with her 24-7. And that's sort of impossible and unfeasible.

And I don't even think would be that good because I think that, you know, there's definitely times where me being apart from my girlfriend makes our relationship better. You know, you need some breathing space, right? I think quite seriously, I think there is something to be said for that. Because I think there's a thing Frank, Skinner always quotes, which is a real thing, which is you need to be guardians of each other's soul. The idea being that implicit in that is there has to be some space given because you're respecting the fact that that's an individual soul, you know,

And I think we're getting so into this idea of, oh God, Tom, this one looks a bit, like a big, big bastards. Huge. What is that, Tom? I'm glad you look like you can handle yourself. Again, I don't know the types of dog. I would just call that big scary dog. Like, is that one of the dogs that's been made illegal? I don't know.

Big scary dog. That sounds like a new celebrity children. That looks like a close protection dog. Yeah, I don't want to put a treat in that dog's mouth. I think it might be having my fingers. I just... Is this what we are now as a podcast, by the way?

We're just like hunting the park for dogs that we can do with. Yeah, we're just hunting there's a slightly predatory element to this now. We're a bit creepy. It's like we've gone to a children's park without children.

Have you ever seen those like pawns where like men just like they drive up and they're like, hey, what are you doing? You know, it's like what I feel like. We're doggers. Literally. We're doggers.

That's the new name for the podcast. This week on Doggers with Tom Rosenberg. The podcast is rebranded as a direct result of Tom Rosenthal's appearance. Tell me about, is it Christine your mum? Yeah, she's called Chrissy, yeah. Oh, I love Chrissy. Yeah.

I think I'd like Chrissy. Yeah, I'm sure you'd have a lot to talk about. Mm. And was your, I imagine, you were very funny as a kid. Was that a sort of general atmosphere of humor and comedy in your house? I have absolutely no idea. These are the sort of questions which I sort of, I kind of worry about, because I just don't remember much.

Like, I, I feel like if I was funny, it was always in a kind of controlled setting. I don't think I'd have people like laughing 24-7, but I would sometimes put on, like, shows at Christmas, like I'd get all of my friends and I'd do like parodies of adverts or whatever. And then when I went to school, I would do like public speaking competitions whereby you had to write a sort of funny speech. So I don't think I was like actually a funny person all the time, but I would definitely always have an interest in sort of devoting some time to prepare a sort of comedic thing and then sort of present it to people for validation. Yes. So yeah, honestly I don't know how to answer that question. Were you well behaved or were you naughty?

Yeah, very well behaved. Oh, were you? I see that. Very well behaved. As far as, again, as far as I know and remember, I did a few pranks to be fair. There was a bit of Johnny Goodman in me. Was there? Yeah, like the best bank I did, I think, was when I got my A-level results. But the night before, I'd like Photoshopped up some fake ones.

So, like, I didn't get into uni. That's so elaborate. But I was so good at Photoshop. I took myself Photoshop at 14, which back then it was like you were a magician. Who was this for for Jim and Chris? For my mum, yeah. And my dad, yeah. Why?

That's so interesting that you were willing... Well, I said, I mean, I was precocious, right? So I was so confident that I was going to actually get the grades that I wanted, that I took this once in a lifetime opportunity to mock up some fake results. I think once in a lifetime. Well, it is. You only say you a level is once. That's literally the rest of your life. According to these people, when they're very systemised and they think, if you don't get into uni, your life's over, right?

And my parents would spend all this time and money getting me into this nice school so I can get to the nice university. and yeah I said that I got like a you in history of art and like an F in English or whatever. What did they say? Well not much for half an hour because I just gave them the results and I just walked off because I knew that I wasn't a good enough actor to pretend for any length of time that this was real. So I literally just put it in the car and walked off and just hang up with my mates and then my mum was in tears and my dad was like screaming in the house. He's like screaming at like the history of art teacher like why in the hell do we go this to your? And he like rag and all he's afraid of all he won't believe it. he's not going to uni and then they came up to me like half an hour like they were still crying they gave me a little cuddle me like Tom it's all right and they go of course they got into

uni you know what I was like you know I gave them the results that's a prick right that's a really obnoxious thing to do but uh I'm still glad with it you know I love it I mean it's borderline psychopath do you know what I mean yeah but I love it it's uh I don't know whether I was the best child to have at all times you know no because You know what? You remind me of Frank because Frank Skinner says he does pranks. Like he ran up the producer once

and he said, I can't remember it's some really important thing we were doing. It was a recording. He said, oh, just it was a new thing and he went, just so you know I'm ill so I won't be coming in today. And I think it was her birthday and she went, oh my God. And he went, not really. He said, but I hadn't got you a gift so I thought I'd give you the gift

of that not happening. I think you'll be That's really good. No, no, but that's, I think the feeling of relief, right, is, is better than just the first feeling of like, if I was like, oh, I got on duty, they'd be like, great, right? When you've gone on that journey of like, oh, you've reached the depths, then when you get back, it's like, that's such an amazing elevation. You've given someone a gift of like an emotional journey, right?

That's the perfect prank. And they still don't see it like that. They haven't forgiven me for it. But for me, you know, I think that was a special moment. It was a special moment in my life. Lil Steve Pank. Not least because the Photoshop was just exemplary guilty. You did well academically and you went to...

Was it King's College London? King's College London was my university. Philosophy. I did philosophy, yes. I love everything about that. Oh, really? Why? I like people that have studied philosophy.

I think they're interesting people generally. Lazy people, man. No, I think it's a brilliant... brilliant degree to study because I think it's sort of oddly, I think it kind of covers so many areas. Well, yeah. And I think that's sort of what you should be doing at university is learning to question things, you know. Yes. Yes, it's sort of studying everything and nothing.

The Greeks, yeah, they kind of thought that that was the only subject, really, because you were just sort of studying how to live, you know. You're studying wisdom itself. Oh Tom, I'm going to be a bit creepy. We've got another dog, are we? Yeah. Come on. There's another dog. The man who owns this dog has got a lime green raincoat and a green visor on.

So I'm pretty sure he's the exact kind of extrovert we need. Yes. He's got a bit of a Leighton-Williams vibe. Yep. I'm feeling. He's got a Louis Vuitton backpack. Let's hang out with him. Sox and sliders.

A Christian Dior. And a French boulder. This man is fashionable. I'm going to say hello. Oh, look. He's so cute. Is it she? Is she so cute?

Can we say hello to your dog? Oh, shut up. Hello. She's the... Oh my goodness. What's her name? Haribou. Hello, Haribou.

Hello, Haribo. That is the best name for a dog. Haribo! Oh, hello, my angel. She's a very special type of French, isn't she? She's, um, she's small, not the big, not the big type, but she's a small, like, teacup size one. Hello.

Oh. Oh. Oh. I've got a shit. Oh my God, your water. My dog is called Raymond. And what do you want? You can smell treats, can you, my love?

Let me put some water in your bowl. It's the least we can do after we've interrupted you. No, let me put some more. Harribo, you spilled your water. Here you go. There you go, my love. Don't spill this one again. Right, we should leave you in peace now. I love meeting you. Nice to meet you. Have a nice day. Love you to meet you. Bye-bye, Harrowow. Do you know what it is? It's because I keep loose treats in my bag sometimes. You can smell careful of your water, darling.

Oh, bye Harrow-bye. Bye Harrow-bye. Oh, I really love Harrow-bo, Tom. Yeah. Well, isn't she cute? Look at her. She's still looking at us. Maybe this should just be your podcast, to be fair. Well, just meeting other people's dogs. I feel like this is...

It's starting to make me think this is a better idea. Because I'm making... You're changing my life. I'm meeting and interacting with more dogs. Yeah. Do you know about the other Tom Rosenthal? You come across the musician Tom Rosenzat. Well, there's a Tom, musician,

and there's a guy who does the talking to people on park benches. Well, that's the same guy. Is that the same guy? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I didn't know that. This is what I mean. So Tom Rosenthal does strange on the bench, but we could do like dogs in a park.

Oh, suddenly inserting yourself into it. I don't know. I feel like the copyright of this idea is half might. You know, I was here when we come up with it. I'm sorry. Do you know, I'm happily do it with you? You can't just take the creepy dog predator podcast off my hands completely. I was here in the exception.

It was partially my idea. We got it on tape. I think hunting around finding people to talk to about dogs is actually much better. This is what I wanted. Because I, you know, all the same. with you. We're sort of like questions about my life and stuff. I feel like, ah, I get neurotic, but that's why I love having a dog. You literally can just look at another dog and just like, we've got a dog, you've got a dog. And you just have that amazing interaction that we just had,

which we wouldn't have been able to have if there was no dog there. We couldn't just go up to me and go, oh, you've got a nice green visor. He'd be like, go away. It's London. What do you want? You know what I mean? I think it's a much better idea. I'm going to sack the guests off and just go up to people and talk. Yeah, thanks, Tom. You're quite close to a crazy person then, I think. Just no guess, no recording equipment. Just going up to them and just going like, you've got a dog. Yes.

Please go away. Oh, God. You're the only guest that's allowed on because I love you. Fantastic. Fantastic. So you went to university and then after you graduated, did you sort of know you were going to go into acting and comedy? I know that I printed off some headshots and sent them to loads of agents

after buying some kind of directory of acting things. So I must have had some ambition to be an actor. I did stand-up comedy at university, and I think I sort of saw that people who did comedy acting could get to work. And I'd seen spaced when I was like 14, and I was very sort of inspired by it. I thought it was a really cool TV show.

And I thought I wanted to be in something like that. So I think it had a really vague idea that I wanted to work in that industry to some extent and doing stand-up comedy would be quite a cool way to get into it but let's sit on the log but you know that I didn't really have a concrete idea of what I was doing I just knew that stand-up comedy was quite a good way of sort of exhibiting my precocious cockiness and my propensity for sort of preparing humorous material for an audience's consumption and did you get nervous and do you start nervous and do you get nervous doing stand-up yeah yeah yeah I was yeah I was sort of known to

being quite an uncomfortable person to be around before gigs like I would get really really stressed and I would just sort of pace up and down saying my lines to myself when everyone else sort of hanging out and chilling yeah and yeah I've always put like loads of pressure on myself before shows and I took a bit of a break through stand-up to kind of like my last tour drove me a bit mad and I wasn't really enjoying it and now I've come back to it I'm trying to be a lot more chill. Was that manhood or was that... Yeah, yeah, yeah. That was very critically acclaimed though that tool, wasn't it?

Yes, I mean, I was very, very, very proud of it. But I think I put a lot of pressure on myself when I was doing it that didn't make it as enjoyable experience as it could be. And also isn't necessarily conducive to being on the best show. And so what I've tried to do is, yeah, see it a bit more as like a privilege and not be so worried about it and not think that it's all in my control. Like, it's actually something that we're all kind of doing together. and it's like a privilege to do it, as opposed to what I used to think where it was all on me

and if I was bad, then no one would have a good time. And, you know, it's like, I think being able to kind of embrace it as something that you're all doing together and that you just have the sort of privilege of being the conduit for the kind of common consciousness is a much more holistic way of thinking about it and something, it means that it's not all on me, basically.

Yes, I see that. If it doesn't go well, then it's, again, it's not all on me. It's like we're doing it together, If it doesn't work, then, nah, do it again. See what happens then, you know? Yeah. So, yeah, it's something that I've tried to get away from being too nervous, because it doesn't really help.

And I suppose when you were doing that show manhood, you know, the nature of the theme of it was inevitably deeply personal. It doesn't get more personal than that. Yeah. Because you were talking about being circumcised. Yeah. I think it was really interesting, I think, the premise, behind that because I suppose I'd never really questioned it really and I thought yeah that is

something that's again just from a philosophical point of you it's worth thinking about that and it did change my opinion of it well I'm glad to hear that it's it's because the premise of it isn't it really what you had got thinking about is that actually it is a form of quite extreme body modification and it's just something that maybe that's something you should decide as an adult yeah that's all. That's very much what I think and feel about it and that was very much my sort of aim with doing the show because I mean I

know it's a heavy work but I do feel like it's the only thing in my life that has sort of traumatised me to some extent. When I sort of realised what had happened to me when I was six days old I saw it as just like a real like profound sort of injustice and I

was desperately seeking for ways to make sense of it and every avenue there was no good reason, you know, I was desperate to find a good reason that's happened to me, and there wasn't. And then when I sort of, you know, think about it, and I ask people about it, and again, most people will sort of react like you,

this is not something they think twice about. A lot of men, it's happened to. They don't think twice about, and I just had a very, very different experience. I thought a lot more than twice about it. And, you know, there's a whole community of men on the internet who were similarly kind of aggrieved about it, And I do think that when you think about it, it's an invasion of human rights, you know, and it shouldn't happen.

So I really wanted to make a comedy show which communicated this, but in the most palatable way possible. And so, you know, I was really proud to do that and I think I achieved it. But, yeah, you're right, touring that show, which was quite personal. And again, obviously I was putting pressure on myself because what I wanted to do was change people's minds about this thing that I think is really important, which is a lot. Because it's already stressful enough doing a stand-up show without it having to change people's minds on a, you know, quite deep taboo and potentially sort of blasphemous subject. Well, you're worried about your parents' reaction as well.

Because you don't want them to take it to personally. That's always the balancing aspect of the point of it, isn't it? Yeah, like, you know, again, I don't want to go into it. I don't know how much is in the public domain already, but like it wasn't something that they responded that well to initially the idea that I was going to do a show about it. We'd obviously had a lot of private discussions about it, and it was something that they've, you know,

you know, regret, but again, they didn't really think too much about because, because, you know, they were recommended to do it by doctors and it's such a sort of standard practice. Right. And, you know, if they'd done it to, if they had a different son, it would have literally not been in a conversation. It just so happened. They had this sort of neurotic, overthinking philosopher type who's gone, well, why did you do that? You know, I don't know.

What do you mean why? You don't know. You know, give me a reason. There wasn't, and the doctor said, well, that's not good enough. You know, so we had sort of arguments about it, and I think they thought that it was something that would get over, but it's obviously isn't. and I suppose I'm as over it as I ever will be because I have created this sort of piece of work

that hopefully will try and fix the problem to some extent. But they know that it's something that, you know, is something that's bothered me basically. But they came to see the show like seven times and there were some catharsis in it, I think. After they saw it for the first time, Lindenborough, like we all had a big family hug and I cried a lot and I think we've all cried about it

to some extent and it's like, I do think it's something that our family has moved past, which a lot of, A lot of people who have the similar kind of trauma to me don't have that privilege. They basically, some of their parents would never even acknowledge any kind of fault. Or their parents would die before they had a chance to raise it with them. And, you know, it's, I don't know, man. It's not something that I've thought about for a few years because I'm now thinking about my new show.

But I do want to perform that show again. And I do think it's sort of the thing that I'm proudest of. And in a way, I think it's the sort of thing that I was put on this earth to actually do. I think, like, this is an important message. And people don't really want to talk about it quite a lot because it's, you know, grim and it's about genitals and I think that comedy is actually a very good vehicle to raise these kind of serious subjects because if you're making someone laugh then they might actually listen to your perspective yeah I heard someone the other day so documentary maker Adam Curtis who I do

really like and respect yeah amazing yeah have you seen Shifty the new one no I've really really watched hyper normalisation recently that's just unbelievable man he's so interesting and but I heard him talking the other another day about comedy and he was someone was chatting about you know comedy with him on a podcast and he was saying you know because you have to ask he was saying people say all comedy change as well when is it actually changed anything and when is it and you know when you're listening to a podcast and you find yourself talking out loud getting irate thinking no no no adam I like you but you're really wrong here because I'm like you can't really say that because if you look at how Richard prior

and even Chris Rock what they've done in terms of race and opening up conversations about that. And I think actually, no, comedy is how you get messages through stealthily. I do think that is a strange thing for someone who I consider to be so entitled to say because if it doesn't do anything, then why do dictatorships put comedians in jail? What about Lenny Bruce? It's almost the scariest thing to them being mocked because then it shows the ridiculousness of their perspective.

Yeah, I mean, I mean, watching his documentaries, he is quite a serious guy. There's not many punch stunts in there. So maybe he's just like not very. funny and he has a bias against funny people. Like... Well, still watch your documentary. He's very much the coin. I think your documentaries are amazing mate, but I don't want to have a point with you.

You sound dull. Do you know what? I really certainly turned you against him. I really hope you loved part one of this week's Walking the Dog. If you want to hear the second part of our chat, it'll be out on Thursday, so whatever you do, don't miss it. And remember to subscribe so you can join us on our walks every week.