Walking The Dog with Emily Dean - Victoria Pendleton (Part Two)

Episode Date: May 21, 2026

In part two of Emily and Ray’s walk with the wonderful Victoria Pendleton, the conversation turns to fear, resilience and the mindset shifts that helped Victoria navigate life after elite sport.Emily and Victoria also talk more about her brilliant new book The Fear Opportunity, which explores how doing things that scare us, even in small ways, can lead to a richer and more fulfilling life. Emily found it hugely inspiring, and highly recommends giving it a read.If you haven’t already, do catch up on part one. And be sure to order your copy of The Fear Opportunity, out now.Follow Emily:Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/emilyrebeccadeanX: https://twitter.com/divine_miss_emWalking The Dog is produced by Will NicholsMusic: Rich JarmanArtwork: Alice LudlamPhotography: Karla Gowlett Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome to part two of Walking the Dog with the wonderful Victoria Pendleton. Victoria's just written a brilliant new book called The Fear Opportunity about harnessing fear to help you lead a better, more enriched life, which I absolutely loved. So do order your copy now. Really hope you enjoy part two of our walk and do give us a like and a follow so you can catch us every week. Here's Victoria and Rewe. Actually, we should just mention, because I didn't mention earlier, because I was so excited about all the stuff. all the stuff your extraordinary life. Okay.

Did you have dogs when you were growing up? No, I didn't have dogs and I was growing up. Would have loved to have animals. I drew a picture of myself age. I think it was like at lower school or I think about 11 and my ambitions and I wanted to have a horse called lightning, a black horse, two cats and two rabbits. Yep, that was it.

Just wanted to have loads of animals and be like a little old lady sat at home with all loads of trophies. Then I was in the background. I drew this picture of a lady by herself, sat in an armchair with a blanket and a grey bun and a fireplace and some trophies. That's what I wanted. I wanted to be a crazy cat rabbit horse lady.

That's what I want to be ultimately. You know, that's me minus the trophy. Is it? Love that. Get rid. Edit out the trophies and you've got me. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's it.

That was the dream. So let's get back to fear. Yep. And which is something I know quite a bit about because I'm quite a fearful. person. Okay. And I fear failure a lot, so I think I won't do it because then I won't have failed. And as I've got older, I am starting to try and challenge that a bit. And I feel as an Olympian, this is something you'll relate to you, I feel it's like a muscle that you build. A hundred percent. You know, a lot of people assume as an Olympic, if you're an Olympic champion or a

world champion, that you just must only win. You must only know the feeling of winning, but you lose thousands and thousands of races for the few that you win. Thousands. And actually, I quite like learning new things. Like I like developing skills and starting from the beginning. And I don't mind being novice and I don't mind looking silly. Actually, when I started horse racing, I was in a press conference and a male journalist pipe-tab and was,

so, Victoria, you've been world champion, the top of your sports internationally. And now you're going to become an absolute novice. How does that make you feel? And I was like, oh, chuckled, because I was like, never really thought about that. Yeah. Yeah, fine. Got to start from somewhere.

Something I've never done before, so I assume that's the bottom. I hope they'll work my way up a little bit. You know, it was, it was. And wasn't there a steward who said to you was you're about to go into the race, something like. Oh yeah, you can pull up if you want to. Meaning it's not too late to back out.

Yeah. And you were just about to race. Yeah. So just before the race. Yeah, two different people came up and said, you can pull up. if you want to and I was like thanks for letting me know if the horse feels lame of course I will animal welfare comes first but how do you go from the

point and that's an interesting thing where you don't believe in someone else's version of you so do you know what you mean yes I wonder when you were starting out in cycling I think I had so much of the other version of me I think I was conditioned to hear people say oh no not you you you don't have what it takes to do that or you're a bit small and puny or you don't have the right mentality Or maybe you should pull up. Maybe you should, don't do anything too dangerous. Maybe you should just be quiet.

Maybe you should just be smaller. Maybe she should be less glamorous and all these things. I always people less, asking less of me or assuming less of me. And I had to come to a point where I stood my ground and goes, actually, you know, I've worked really hard for this and putting everything possible to come to this moment. And actually, I'm going to give it my best shot because I know deep down, that's you I am as a person.

and I will always give 100%. And what will be will be. So that's it. That's my decision and I'm going to stick with that. You have to be steadfast in your own, in what you've put in, and what you kind of want to get out. You have to be steadfast because it's so easy to be cynical, isn't it?

It's so easy to step up and go, well, I bet she can't do that, or she won't be able to do this or she's not this. It's so much harder to be like, like, do you know what? I back you 100% and I'm in your corner and I want to be one of those people because I miss that. That's the one thing I really appreciate. So when I meet you someone who's about to undertake a challenge or do something, I wouldn't dream of being the cynic. I was like, yeah, I'm going to be like ferociously in your corner. You have so

got this. Like if you need to, if you need a pep talk, give me a shout. I'm there for you because I feel like there's not enough of that about. And this whole book is almost like giving a pep talk. It's like, do you do know if you want to be courageous today, you can be courageous. Like, when Yogi Brysner, the horse riding coach, called me courageous for the first time, I was like, oh, that is

a big word for a little old me and... Had you not been called that before? Never been called courageous before. What about your coach is inside? No. I needed to be more like the men. I wasn't courageous. And he gave me that word and I thought, oh my God, that feels really good.

Like, I'm courageous. And then it got me thinking, you know, you don't have to earn it, you don't have to deserve it, you don't have to be born with it. If you want to be courageous, you just make the decision and commit to it. And I love that. And I really want people to sort of believe that, that if you just commit, like wholeheartedly go, I'm going to give this a go. Whatever will be will be. But don't hold back and do not miss out because our opportunities in life are so limited and we don't have much time. I just want to make the most of everything that you can.

Yeah. And I think going back to this thing, it's a brilliant thing where you say why zebras don't get ulcers. And it is to do with the fact, isn't it, that what you're saying essentially is that zebra's like us are hardwired to perceive threats. Yeah. But unlike us, they save that stress up. When they need it. Which is literally when their life is done with threats. Yes. Yes. Whereas we worry if we sent a text and we put. to thumbs up on it and thought, oh, that's a bit passive-aggressive.

Yeah, yeah. But we, what you're saying is we would probably utilize that same level of stress over something so insignificant, 50 times a day. That's it. So we live in this continual state of threat, which isn't really proportional to the actual threat that we have. And what does that do to us? Like, is it harmful to our bodies and our physiology?

Absolutely. Yeah. I mean, it's, it's, being in that. state that the energy it takes it's aging it's like oh you've put me off it on it sorry don't do it don't do it just to chill out but no like it takes such a toll is what I mean on our bodies it takes such a toll on our bodies to be in that state and it's been proven that stress and anxiety causes all kinds of different conditions and is linked to so many up so many sort of disorders and diseases and but we're so

caught up to be comfort, like I guess what it comes down to is in some ways because we strive so hard to seek comfort and to be comfortable and to be, you know, masters of our own domain that so much can throw us off balance and so easily and that it doesn't need to be that way And if we just maybe reframe how we think and how we feel and how introspective we are towards the physical sensations that we have through our experiences, it can change the way it physically affects us. And a lot of this starts in Charlottet, doesn't it? Yes. You do see people now with their kids where, and I'm not just, you know, saying this as is a parental thing,

but I think just basically as a society, we have moved towards kind of pathosophobic. apologising risk for kids. It's this idea that kids can't be exposed to anything at all that's risky. Yeah. And that's interesting, isn't it? Because I suppose what happens then is that is that you don't develop resilience. Yeah, you don't develop resilience. And you know, the argument to the fact is that we live in such a comfortable and protected society and that we don't necessarily have the same community around us that support us in. our, so we say, mistakes or failures, that we fear so much, that we actually, there is a real concern that the future generations are going to be so timid and so sort of riddled with anxiety that they're going to struggle to sort of exist in happy kind of... Well, when you see those things, sometimes you laugh at them online, but it's things like

people were brought up in the 80s or the 90s are built different. And it is that thing where you think, no, it was insane compared to now. We would say to my mother, we're just going to go and play in the cemetery. Yes. Literally this is at 8 o'clock at night. Climbing over the gate. Yes, yeah. And she was like, I'll have a nice time, darling.

Yeah. You know, it's so weird now to think about. And knowing our limits and knowing what we're capable of. Yeah. They're very transferable skills. Like knowing, I can do that. So therefore I might be able to do this. that didn't hurt you know I can totally manage that so maybe I can try this sport and I

could be able to go here so it's very transferable to feel that resilience and although it might seem crazy for example kids playing climbing trees and stuff and falling but it's a really important part of learning and learning our own boundaries and actually I spoke to a couple of researchers as one guy Martin who I'm going to pronounce his name I'm going to say Rijen is his second name sorry if I pronounced that wrong. Yes. And he talks about like this risky play or he calls a thing called loose parts where you take very normal pieces. Can I say don't Google Whiskey play? No no no no no no because I can't be responsible for what comes up.

Don't do that. But it's basically like having objects like office chair or a barrel or ladders and letting kids almost play you use their imagination to create play using objects that do, you could, if you use the wrong way, cause, you know, to trip over or balance, need to balance or need to monitor and regulate yourself and how important that is for learning and development of your physical capability. So it's teaching you risk assessment as well. It is. It's teaching you risk assessment. And if you're always sheltered from that, then you've, there's a very real chance that you could become incredibly fearful moving forward and self-limiting. And also when something traumatic or tragic happens, completely unable to regulate how you respond to it. So it can, you know, as human beings are all going to experience moments in our life that we want to feel resilient and prepared for. And actually how we play and how we, you know, our development as kids can play a big part in there.

Well, you had, you know, you've had a tragic thing because your twin brother Alex, you lost him. Yeah. And I'm so sorry. Oh, you know, I've had 42 amazing years with you. him like I'm grateful for that time I had with him and he died of cancer didn't yeah head of brain tumour yeah yeah but I I like how you look at it and I was saying to you before we started I I lost my sister and she's pretty much the same age stage four cancer yes and you know I think it is it's the difference

listen it's awful losing a parent and I've lost both my parents but it felt like the circle of life quite honestly. Yes, yeah. And it doesn't, I realize now that I'll sort of think about my sister, even if it was just for a second, probably every day. Yeah, I know. I definitely think about my brother every single day. Yeah, yeah, he definitely crosses my mind.

All right. Tell him I miss him or. Do you ever see things that he would laugh at and think, oh, that's really annoying? Yeah, yeah, of course. Things he would laugh at or things that he would appreciate, things he would like. I like, he's constantly in my thoughts. in my mind and you know I keep a picture of him at home like right near my my bedside table and I always tell you know say good night or like miss you or

something I speak out loud to him because I still want him to feel like part part of my existence and also I don't know like maintain that connection yeah well I think because you're such a superstar he really was yeah you know It's really, someone said something to me once and I love what you say about seeing it as a gift that you had time with him. Yes. Rather than a theft that death took him. Yeah. And someone said something to me. It was actually my best friend Jane and she sent this thing to my mum. Because, you know, it's like for your parents, it's devastating. Yes. Yes. Yes. She sent this really helpful thing and it was a thing about bereavement and someone said they'd had useful advice. in a similar situation which was try not to think of it as a life interrupted it is a I'll say it again try not to think of it as a life interrupted instead a wonderful

life completed and that actually makes me cry thinking about it because it's like oh no you're not so it's just reframing how you view it a bit yeah it's like what a life yeah and I know in many ways like Alex made me cry no I'm a real cry yeah come here So silly. I'm a real cry to. Are you? Yeah. It's because I think whenever I meet someone who's lost a sibling, it's a hard thing to explain, but I think it's a unique, unique loss, particularly when you're close. Yeah. You don't get closer than twins in your case. And sometimes I find it hard to explain to people what it feels like. I kind of, I guess, for me, the biggest thing is like, imagine something really exciting happened in your life. And some, like, you want to do.

share it with somebody but we don't have that person anymore like I would be the first person I called and be like oh my gosh Alex you wouldn't believe this and the same as if I was really struggling I can't seem to get my head around this and and he would give me the advice like and he always had my best interest at heart but not having that person to share my life experiences with and I was like who do I speak to now who do I ring and left a massive hole yeah and I have other people in my life who I love and trust and obviously would speak to but If I had something brilliant happen, I just want to share it with him.

Yeah, I get, I totally get that. I just get frustrated. I even got angry in lockdown because Arnold Schwarzenegger was sharing pictures of his mental house with his donkey. Yes, in the kitchen. And I went, oh my God, why did my sister not live to see this? Yes, she would love this. At the kitchen, this dining table with his donkey and everyone's eating off the table.

Totally normal about it. And it's little things like that, funnily enough. But you know what's lovely about that? is I sort of think now the fact that we're talking about Alex and Rach now I think how lovely that they're still getting talked about you know they're still in our minds and in our hearts and in our conversations you know what I can imagine and I can say this to you yeah I'm a woman and it won't sound creepy yep but when you were starting to make a name yes yourself in cycling yet that much because you're very very

beautiful and you know I suppose like you say didn't probably look like a lot of what people expected women at your level in sport to look like so you're getting offers and you're getting you know you're it's a brand's dream isn't it having someone like you to endorse a product but I wonder if in some ways do you think there was a part of you as well that we were living in different times then but almost got slightly punished for that Oh, 100%. Like, why are you talking about your vulnerabilities? You're giving your opponents an advantage.

And I was like, I'm being honest. And you know what? I can be a little bit emotional and a little bit up and down and still win everything. So it doesn't matter. And if one person can relate to it and go, do you know what, actually, sometimes I just go home and cry after a bad day. But it doesn't mean that I can't still be a champion at the same time. Like they don't have to be separate parts, like two separate parts.

You can be both. And that's okay. So I got ridiculed for my honesty in interviews and I think a lot of journalists kind of prayed on that vulnerable damsel in distress, diminutive female. Do you think I wonder as well that you were early to the party with vulnerability. Oh, I was. And then, you know, it's totally okay now. Now athletes would be fine. Yeah, absolutely. They like athletes crying. And if we talked about like mental health, people wouldn't automatically like, almost demonise it. They're like, no, that's okay. That's normal.

And I'm glad that more athletes have been open about it. But I was very much warned off being honest and open about those things. As it showed weakness, it's not something athletes should do. You've also been very open about this guy Steve who's helped you. Oh, Uncle Steve. We all need an Uncle Steve. Yeah, I mean, look, if everyone has... Therapist or sports psychiatrist. So he's a psychiatrist. He's also a surgeon. He's also like a dean at the university medical school in Sheffield. Like he's an absolute leg end of a human being, legend.

And one of the kindest, most generous people. He also has loads of rescue animals at his house. He's just like honestly, he, if there were people like Steve in everyone's life, the world would be a much better place and a much happier place. He's helped a very special individual who, really helped me sort of succeed and achieve my goals and my potential because without him I think I would have been like you know what this is all a bit too much and did he come in when you were struggling yeah he was lucky enough he got an appointment with the team when I had just sort of

joined the professional ranks and he said you know you don't have to feel this way and we can work through it if you want to put the work in there is another way and I was like yes please please alleviate my suffering, mostly self-induced, but yeah. And he really helped me kind of construct ways to cope with, the way I felt and manage the relationships in my life. He was a godsend, an absolute, he's like an angel in human form. Yeah. I'm really lucky.

And I sometimes ring him up just to catch up these days because I love and appreciate him so much. Yeah, he's a really special character. do you think what do you think if you could look back at young Queen Vic on her bike you know all those years ago I'm talking about even pre the Athens Olympics when you were pretty green in terms of experience yes yes what would you say to her now gosh I'd be like stop worrying girlfriend like seriously take some time out don't put so much pressure on yourself and Don't let other people judge what you're capable of, first of all, and be confident in that.

But I would never have believed, if you had told me in my early days in sport that that was what I was going to achieve ultimately, I would never have believed you. I wouldn't have believed you. I would have believed that I would win a gold medal at the Olympics, let alone too. Never, ever, ever did I believe it. So I'm very lucky to say that I have succeeded and achieved. far more than I ever dreamed was possible in my life. I'm very, very lucky. I'm a very lucky individual. Well, you've achieved far more than most people on the planet I've ever achieved.

But I am very, yeah, I'm very grateful. And actually going back to what you were saying there about being offered. You did it. Don't be grateful. No, you did it. Thank you. No one else, you did it. There were people that help me. Uncle Steve helped me along my way. Yeah. I, I guess like a bit, like you, Just going back to what you're saying about these sponsorship deals and being ahead of my time and all that lot and making the choices that I made along the way. And I can't remember where I was going with that point, but there was a point I was going to make. Oh, I changed the bloody subject. I got obsessed by Steve.

Yeah. No, you were talking about how other people would sort of say, like, criticise you slightly for taking those deals. Yes, criticised me. Whereas, you know, I was just trying to earn a living and make the most of what I was. I had to offer. And also, again, it's so interesting that no one would ever dream of saying to Marcus Ratchel. You know, no one would say to a Premier League footballer, I can't believe you're advertising those boots. Yeah. I know. No one would ever dream of saying that to Harry Kane. No. What, you're taking money from Nike. And they get paid loads as well, footballers.

Yeah. I didn't get paid that much. You don't get money for winning gold medals at the Olympics, unless you're sponsored. So it was, I always found it hard. I had to tread a slightly different path to make success from the sport than perhaps some of my male colleagues and it was I think difficult for people to get their head round to start with but thankfully it's a little bit more normal now. Is your head in a much better place you think than it was? Oh my gosh. Yes. Sometimes when I watch elite sport I think to myself wow I'm glad that's not me. that now yeah you know like I watch you I think because it was just so like there was so much stress and pressure and I wasn't saving lives I was just riding around in circles really really fast that's all I was doing in a ridiculous outfit quite frankly you know yeah but at least

you were doing something I'm sorry to go on about him but that man on the motorbike he actually contributes nothing people who are paid to do that you know what I mean he's the most annoying man at school um yeah but I am really you know like I really do feel very lucky to have all of the hardship and the difficulty that I went through in my cycling career seems ultimately so entirely worth it for what I have now and the opportunities that have come off the back of my success have been so varied and so kind of interesting and I feel very grateful that I've managed to exist so long without getting a proper job which is what I haven't done but you know I'm

I'm very lucky I'm very very fortunate in that Yeah, but the work you're getting now, it's a lifetime's experience, isn't it? That's why you've written this book because I genuinely, if I'm really honest, it's an interesting subject, but you know, you've done it. So when you're talking to me about fear, I will listen to you, you know, whereas if the bloke in the pub said it, I'd say, yeah, all right, I really got time. Whereas in your case, I'm like, no, no, no, you really know what that feels like. Thank you. Thank you. I appreciate that.

So, and it's a brilliant book. I thoroughly enjoyed writing it. Like I had such a blast. I spoke to so many interesting experts and professors. Who the hell is that? That's Connie Huck. Oh my God. Do you know her?

She used to be able to be talking about me. Con, I'm interviewing Victoria Pendleton at the moment. She's really lovely, by the way. You'd love her. Oh, guess what Connie? Listen, I'm going to put you on speaker. Say what you said. She said, I told you she would be.

I knew it. Hello. Can you say hello to Victoria? Hello there, Connie. Hello. I said that. I said I think she's going to be a good one. I feel the same about you.

I can always tell you were absolutely lovely. Yeah, love that. Everyone loves the huckster. I love you. We're just finished. I'm going to call you when we finished. Yeah, yeah, go, go, go. Love you, baby.

Bye. Love the huck. Wouldn't do that for many people. But you know, everyone loves a bit of huck. luck time. No, it's only because the only reason I did that is I said, I've got a little parent and she went, I know she's going to be really nice. I get a very good energy about her. She's never wrong about people even. She said she's one of us. Love her even more now. So we should end, before we end, we should talk about the dog house. Yep,

because you're on and it's my favourite show. Oh, I love it. It's so brilliant. And you were on an episode of it. I was with your lovely mom. With my mummy. Yes. And you got a dog for your mum. Oh, Lilo. Lilo, the Rhodesian Ridgeback. She's so gorgeous. She's so licky and lovely. It was so funny watching that show, though,

because the receptionist was kind of like, it was very telling about you that she was going, oh, yeah, so what do you do? And you said, oh, I'm an athlete. And I'm thinking, oh, my God, this is so cringe. I can't bear this. And you're going, I'm an athlete. Yeah, I did a lot of sport.

And you go, what do you do? Well, I'm retired. And she went, oh, my God. Victoria Penelton. Yeah, yeah, yeah. The penny dropped. I do you feel like when people say that, because you must get recognised a lot. No, do you know what? I'm not very recognisable.

First of all, I'm a lot smaller in real life, apparently, than I look on the television. Really? Yeah, a lot smaller. And yeah, and I think I don't, I'm not particularly recognisable. Like my vibe is, like, I think quite low-key. How did you find it during, let's call it, 2012 gate? You know, when...

Oh, yeah, there was a bit of paparazzi. a bit scary around there. How did you find that fame? I didn't really like it and thankfully it didn't last and I'm not I think yeah I'm not just super recognisable I don't think I really stand out that much so I've quite honestly I missed all that which was a good thing I can't imagine what it would be like to not be able to go anywhere without people recognising you or well that's what Ray has yeah I can get that I can see that I'm actually just holding him in the hope that someone might recognise me that's what I hope it is But we're kind of merging, we've got the urge to merge, haven't we, dressed in black?

I also want to say one of my favourite things you've ever done, I mean apart from the gold, was you appeared on SAS, Who Does Wins. Oh yes. There was something you did in that, which I've never forgotten. It was a stand-up to cancer one and it was years ago. And it stayed with me to this day, because I remember it so vividly, it's when I started to really think, oh, she's a bit of me as a person that, you know, not in a love Island Wye. And I can remember they were trying to psych you out

With like videos from home or something And I remember them showing all these video And all these men like Wayne Bridge and all these guys And just crying and collapsing And I never forgot this You walked into the room The little woman in inverted hollards You walked into the room

And they must have had videos you were on something You looked at the laptop and you went Oh fuck that I'm not doing that And you slammed the laptop show Yeah I did And I thought oh okay that's a different class because you wouldn't you knew but the self-control that took well the thing is I wouldn't do a show without doing my research and I was like I'm going to watch

every single episode of this show before I go on I was like you don't watch the laptop you don't watch the videos you know you've got to stay focused you've got to stay in the moment you're we're physically depleted mentally depleted emotionally depleted at this stage this is not what we do that's what that so I you know I was like I'm ready for this moment no prepared Bosch they still made me watch it actually it was fine it was really sweet but yeah you did really well in that though thank you I did a lot better than I expected and actually thoroughly enjoyed the experience because it helped me feel a bit more confident about myself again and my physical ability and also I met a fella out the back of that as well

I'm a bit obsessed with your yeah yeah so that was you know meeting someone who's special forces and yeah dreamy dreamy's a bit of me is ex-special forces yeah so he was he he left in 2016 medically discharged and yeah he's just literally brilliant Louis brilliant we love Louie yeah so does Louie because the dog you've got is the Belgian Belgian yeah Belgian Shepherd Malinois I bet Louie likes the Belgian oh it's his choice obviously I didn't Of course it is. I mean, I was like, it's the first dog he's ever had really. And I was like, are you sure you want one of those?

That's like, oh, that is a lot. They are a lot to handle. We can start with something a little bit easier, like a Labrador. Or Ray. Oh, Ray. Can you imagine if you brought Ray home to Louis? Yeah. Louis, I've got to dog.

Ray. How do you feel this works with the SAA? Yes. Yeah. Well, what I'm interested, just as a person and his experience, what's, have you learned from him in terms of. of, I'm just thinking about the book and all the lessons you teach and that and the messages. What, because I'm fascinated by ex-special forces people in terms of those skills like resilience and grit.

And actually working in a group and as a collective, what have you learned from him in terms of life lessons, would you say? How he approaches life. Yeah, I mean, he is incredibly calm and self-confident, but in a very quiet way. He's like totally under the radar. He doesn't, he's someone that doesn't draw attention. to himself he wouldn't want that he hates that in fact hates hates hates hates that but just really calmly confident in his ability and calm under pressure and you ask him to do anything and he'll just handle it and I'm just like oh that's such

self-control amazing like in any problem strength whispers it doesn't yeah exactly okay manosphere that is it does it like you can't even hear it you may not even see it but yeah it's a real calm quiet humble kind of of demeanour. He's really humble. I think I'd like Louie. And he loves animals too. He really does. He would honestly give Raymond a cuddle. Would he? He would. You wouldn't shy away from this. Look. How could you? Would you like to meet the Belgian Malinanon? What do you think the Belgian Malinan would make of Ray? What's it called again Valah? Vala, yeah, Valor. I think

should be okay because I don't think he's not really... Okay, worries me. Okay, no, I think okay. yeah I don't she eat him no she would probably she would probably I think our dogs those type of dogs what I would say is that they're quite instinctively intelligent so I think they know he's not a threat yeah I don't think she would see I don't think Valor would perceive Raymond as a threat and therefore I think they'd probably get on quite nicely they probably just ignore each other that's what happened that's the ideal date yeah yeah yeah get older yeah just quietly get on with their own things. Oh, honestly.

They independently check their email, I think, P-mail, that's what they would do, independently, yeah. You'll have to come up in some as you live in the country, don't you now? I do you, I live in Dorset, yes. You live in Dorset. It's lovely. Do you know what?

I've loved this. Oh. Have you enjoyed it? Yeah, I have. Look, I've got to cudder Raymond. Can you still hear her? Oh, yeah, sorry, yeah. So I'm trying to, oh, we've all merged into one mass,

haven't we, of black here. You've gotten so well. And I haven't had a chance, because there's been so much. to talk to you about but I haven't even had a chance to ask you about Everest because you also come into a bit of Mount Deering to climb Mount Everest along with the taking part in making up professional horse racing okay but I think that's a really nice thing for people to read about in your book because it's actually something which I think maybe the thing you almost learnt the most from yes would you agree with

that in terms of... Gosh, it's dangerous here, isn't it? With all the cyclists? Oh my God. They don't know like they're going, to be honest. You know what? Victoria Pendleton, you do realise you've just complained about cyclists. No, no, no, no.

They're just coming around. Some of them aren't really looking where they're going, are they? They've got their heads down looking at their computers rather than the road. Have you noticed that? They do a bit. I bet you don't approve of that. I don't approve of that. You've got to be aware of what's going on around you.

And they shouldn't have earphones in either, I'm just saying. You know when you see those cyclists? Can you look at them and see them and see them? think, oh they're good, they know what they're doing. Just from seeing them go past. Can you? Yeah. Is it the body language?

The position, the body, the way they move, they're suplex. Yeah. I don't know. Yeah, you can usually tell. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean. Do you still enjoy cycling? I don't really do much of it, to be honest. I think the thing is, no cycling wasn't allowed to do any other sports, definitely not ride horses. and I wasn't allowed to run either. So I tend to do things that I wasn't allowed to do now.

Look at him. Is he serious about it? Yeah. Is he moving too much, Vic? Yeah. He's wobbling his bum around. Oh, he's got no hope. Yeah, that's interesting.

I can see why it would seem, cycling would seem... I took the shine off it a little bit, doing it for so long with such intensity. And I also really love, like, running, and I really enjoy being at the yard with the horses, I really do. I love that and that takes up a lot of my time. I'd rather be like nose to nose with the big velvety chestnut mare, to be honest. Honestly, this has been an absolute pleasure and a joy.

Oh, thank you. I have enjoyed it. Did Raymond enjoy it? Raymond has had the best time ever. He loves you. Are you a combat? Are we going to watch? We're going to get into the cycling now? No, he's going to go into archery. yeah he's got calm he's controlled yeah um and listen thank you so much it's been such a pleasure to meet you i genuinely mean that oh thank you and i love your book and i found it really inspiring it's called the fear opportunity and it's out on may the 21st so i urge everyone to order their copy um and yeah it's a brilliant book and what a wonderful human being you are thank you

I've just realised that both my nose and Raymond's nose are both running. What a look. What a strong look. We are. We're twinning. Okay, bye. Bye. I really hope you enjoyed that episode of Walking the Dog. We'd love it if you subscribed and do join us next time on Walking the Dog wherever you get your podcasts.