Was I In A Cult? - Mormonism w/David Archuleta-PT1: "America's Mormon Idol"

Episode Date: February 17, 2026

David Archuleta was seventeen years old, Mormon to his core, and singing in front of thirty million people on American Idol. America saw the golden boy - the angel voice, the humble smile, the kid who made grown adults cry on national television. What they didn't see was the father who controlled every note, every decision, every version of David he was allowed to be. "I basically was his puppet." Behind the fame was the sweetest kid grappling with his own sexuality because his church told him who he was allowed to love, and who he wanted to love wasn't on their yes list. David believed that if he just prayed hard enough, God would "fix" the one thing about himself he'd been taught to hate. Spoiler: God had other plans.Today is Part 1 of his story... it wrecked us in the best way. Part 2 is available NOW exclusively for PATREON members. DAVID'S NEW MEMOIR DEVOUT  is now available. FOLLOW US For more culty content — follow us on Instagram & TikTok → @wasiinacultFOLLOW DAVID@Davidarchie GET THE BOOK DEVOUT by David Archuleta - available everywhere books are sold. Audiobook includes a bonus EP of original songs. (Squeal!)SUPPORT THE SHOWGet PART 2 of David's story RIGHT NOW a week EARLY by joining our Patreon! Get ad-free episodes, bonus content, and behind-the-scenes conversations.HAVE A CULTY STORY?Email us → [e-mail] Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Hey Ontario, come on down to BetMGM Casino and check out our newest exclusive. The Price is Right Fortune Pick. Don't miss out. Play exciting casino games based on the iconic game show. Only at BetMGM. Access to the Price is right fortune pick is only available at BetMGM Casino. BetMGM and GameSense remind you to play responsibly. 19 plus to wager, Ontario only. Please play responsibly. If you have questions or concerns about your gambling or someone close to you,

please contact Connix Ontario at 1866-531-2600 to speak to an advisor free of charge. BetMGM operates pursuant to an operating agreement with Eye Gaming Ontario. The views, information, or opinions expressed by the guest appearing in this episode solely belong to the guest and do not represent or reflect the views or positions of the hosts, the show, podcast one, this network, or any of their respective affiliates. I was on my Christmas tour, and it was like my dad's vision, his dream coming true. It was supposed to honor God and Christ the Savior. And we had a stop in San Francisco, and,

there were a couple of men near the front of the audience and they had been kind of trying to like talk to me a little bit during the show as well and I could tell that they were that they were gay and as I was

high-fiving everyone at the end of my show I skipped them in my head I was kind of showing you're not supposed to you're not supposed to be gay and you know I don't want to show that I support that lifestyle when it goes a

what I was told to believe, and I thought it would be right of me to not give them high-fives. And that moment has haunted me, you know, now years later, because after everything that I went through trying to come to terms with my sexuality and eventually embracing that part of me, I was just like, I hated myself so much, and I thought that was okay. I thought I was doing the right thing to hate who I was. Welcome to Was I in a cult? I'm Liz Iyakuzi. And over here I'm Tyler Meesam.

And today, okay, I need to say this on front. He sang for me, Tyler, I mean the voice of an angel. A real angel. I know this. I was there. I heard it as well. It was also a very special interview for me personally. We were talking about today's guest, David Archel.

And for those who don't know, and if you don't, you must have been in a cult. But David was a contestant on American Idol, season 7, 2008. His story kind of hit close to home in ways I wasn't expecting. Why? Because you both were 17-year-olds with a voice that made grown adults weep on national television. I mean, more because we both grew up Mormon. It was one or the other. You had a 50-50 chance, Liz. You went down one road.

No, David was famously Mormon at the time and from Utah. And so, yes, I myself and all of Utah were aware of David Archeletta at the time. David was famously Mormon. You were just more locally Mormon. I mean, I was regionally Mormon at best. But by 2008, I had left the church. I was no longer in the Mormon cult. But David, well, he was an Uber Mormon.

He was more Mormon. He was more and more and more and more Mormon. And what nobody knows is that behind the instant stardom was a father who controlled every note he sang, a church who told him who he was allowed to love, and a kid who spent years believing that if he just prayed hard enough, well, you know how the rest of that goes. And if you don't know, well, David has come out since then.

It's true. And his new book, which dropped today, actually, February 17th, is called Devout. And the title is very clever because the out in devout is in a different color. Devout. Yes. Now, I love music biographies. I read a lot of them. My favorites for those who care.

They don't. Springsteen's book obviously is a good one. Bono is insufferable, but his book is fantastic. I think Bono's starting. a cult, by the way. I would join Bono's cult. I would join Bono's cult. But my favorite, for those who care, is Patty Smith's just kids.

It's a really great book. However, David's book is fantastic. It's emotional. It's smart. It's funny. And as you soon will learn, it kind of came at a particularly meaningful time for me. Because it brought back the memory of when you, too, made 30 million Americans. Weep.

I remember it fondly. on national television. That was me. That was me. This interview is so good that we made it a two-parter. However, our lucky Patreon paid supporters, well, both episodes are available right now. Ooh, you heard that?

You heard? All you got to do is join the Patreon. You get two for the press of one. That's a bargain. All right, enough of us yapping. Let's get to somebody singing to Liz eventually. Please do. Let's get into.

to it. Welcome to the show, Sir David. David, Archiletta, it's a absolute pleasure to meet you. Having been raised in Utah, you were a household name within the 801, which is the area code for Utah. So thank you for joining us. Tyler, thank you so much for having me. Where in Utah were you raised? I was raised in Pleasant Grove, a big Mormon family, five sisters, one brother. I feel like that's as Mormon as you get. I don't know, David, I don't want to out Mormon you because your story's pretty Mormon too, man.

Pretty Mormon. I mean, unless our name was Jensen or Smith, it would be more Mormon. But Misa and Archeletta, not really Mormon names. No, not really. Now, I was raised in a big Mormon family, and I had a very nice childhood, of course. I had a father who was wonderful.

I had a mother who was not. She was cold, and she was judgmental, and she was shameful, and she never really fully. accepted my trans daughter or my gay little brother and would tell them as such. She was the personification of Mormonism for me. Now, I got your book during the Christmas holiday, and the story of your father really resonated with me in relation to my family and my mother. On opposite sides, my mother never supported my art, whereas your father pushed you into it. Now, the reason I'm telling you the story is because your book really, really affected me at a time.

when my mother, and literally, as I was finishing the last chapter of your book, my mother died. She was 79 and she was getting old and she had Parkinson's and whatever, but... I'm still sorry to hear. That was just recent. I just got back from the funeral last week. My God. My condolences to you. Thank you. But your book was this weird kismit that I read while I was dealing with all of the emotions that come up when you've lost a parent, especially a parent that was a part of your Mormonism. So for that alone, I appreciate your book, and I appreciate getting able to tell you that in person. So I am just sending you lots of love because I know that's heavy, especially explaining the background with your mom. But I'm so glad that

you enjoyed the book and hopefully found some connections to feel a little seen through your own journey, even though I know it's not the same story, but similar backgrounds, both being Mormon. I'm sorry about your mom again, Tyler. Thanks, Liz. You know, death and funerals are strange. They make you really look at the world differently,

take stock of yourself, take stock of your past, your future, your family, your loved ones. It was a weird holiday season for me. Yeah, and I know you had accomplished. relationship with her, so I'm sure that makes it extra complicated. Like I said, my mother, for me, was the personification of Mormonism. So, yes, it was complicated.

But I had a wonderful mother. I had a good upbringing, and I'm glad I had that. But I didn't mean to make the first part of this wonderful interview about me. But it was germane to the story. Yes, as I'm prone to say. As my co-host tells me often, it's. stays only if it's germane. Unfortunately, it was.

No, but genuinely, I am really sorry. I know that was really tough. Thanks. Let's get back to our American Idol, shall we? Tell me a little bit about your childhood and your background, David. So I was born in Miami, Florida. My parents met there at a church dance, the cultural hall in one of the meeting houses. My dad was there for summer sales.

from Utah. Utah's, they know how to send off their salesmen, you know, selling security, pest control, just whatever it is, because we're used to going around knocking on doors from our mission. My mom was there with her sisters, and my parents met and started talking about music. I think that really clicked for them that they had a love of music in common. my dad decided to stay in Florida after watching the movie Big. It was like this thing, should I stay or go back to my old former life? But he decided to stay and try it out with my mom. Five kids were born in Florida.

And then we moved to Utah when I was seven years old in Bountiful. And my last sibling was born there. And we moved around a lot in Utah, but we, you know, we were pretty Mormon, pretty faithful. for the most part. We're pretty sheltered, pretty squeaky clean. No swearing, no inappropriate jokes, no rated our movies, because it's not of the spirit. And we were homeschooled a lot of time. So we weren't always exposed to a lot of the trends and topics and jokes anyway. And I think that kind of made me more sheltered than even the average Utah Mormon. When I was a kid, I didn't question my beliefs. I trusted my parents. And I,

I trusted that they were going to take me somewhere safe. And if they told me it was true, then it must be true. And so I just adopted the belief. Went to church, Sunday school, and loved the music, loved getting to sing the songs there. Music is a big part of Mormonism. It is singing, playing piano, not letting your light, what is it, not hiding your light under a bushel? Is that hermit? Yeah.

Let not your hide under a bushel, yeah. But like, shine it your light forth. so that men may see your good works. Like, I don't know if I'm remembering it properly, but... Yes, he's remembering it correctly. Now, this is a phrase we both heard constantly growing up Mormon. It comes from Matthew, chapter 5, verses 15 and 16, quote, Neither do men light a candle and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick.

And it giveth light unto all that are in the house. Let your light so shine before men that they may see your good works and glorify your father, which is in heaven. What as viable verses are famously known to do? This, of course, can be interpreted in many a ways. Yes, but in the Mormon world, and this is something I actually kind of still agree with, the interpretation was pretty clear. Don't hide your talents.

If you've been given a gift, you're expected to use it and use it publicly if you can. Which I'm guessing David heard about a million times. Tell me a little bit about being introduced to music. My mom would sing us lullabies to put us to sleep, and my mom has a beautiful voice. And so I saw how music could be soothing in that sense. And then my dad would play me Kansas on his record player. He had an old record player. I didn't like the rest of my dad's music, but I loved Kansas.

I loved Point of No Return, specifically. I loved the fiddle that was in there. Oh, boy, he does not know the layup he just gave you. Oh, he's about to learn. The band Kansas! became one of the defining rock bands of the 1970s by combining hard rock, progressive structures, and violin, which for some reason worked. Progressive structures? What is a progressive structure?

You know, Liz, I could explain it to you, but you'd never get it. If you don't know, tell you what, put on the point of no return album. Smoke a J, a 1976 J. And you'll know. And I will feel the progressive structure. In my bones. It does make sense that David liked Kansas. You see, they were one of the bands that kind of felt safe in religious homes.

They had songs like Dust in the Wind or Carry On My Wayward Sun. Great progressive structure. Yes, now you're getting it. I mean, these songs sounded philosophical, even spiritual. Now, Kansas, of course, the band, they were formed in Topeka, Kansas in 1973. Now, in the 70s, the bands kind of liked geography. See, Chicago, the band Chicago, they were from Chicago. Boston was from Boston.

And guess what band is from L.A., but is also a European city? I don't know who. No, they're from England. Who? The who. Oh, the band. No, the band's from Toronto. What?

No, come on, guess. Guess who? No, the guess who are from Winnipeg, Liz. I see, yes. No, yes is from England. London? No, London's from Los Angeles. In America.

No, America's from London. Just like Japan and Asia. Asia is from Europe? Actually, Europe is from Sweden. The same continent is Berlin. Berlin, Germany. No, Berlin is from Los Angeles. Just like Paris.

Okay. This joke is officially dead. The dead are from San Francisco. Oh my God, enough. This is madness. Also from London. Who is from London? Yeah, exactly.

The who's from London? Geez, you finally got it. Okay, so back to David's dad. He liked rock, but he preferred jazz. Oh, sports teams, sure, the jazz from Utah. He loved jazz music, and I just couldn't connect with it. And he'd always be playing his trumpet, and it was so loud. We'd literally be covering our ears and be like, Dad, when are you going to stop?

And my mom would sing and play like Selena Quintanilla, and she would play, what else would she play, La India? She would play a lot of like these Latin salsa-esque artists. Mexican pop artists and then salsa artists like Mark Anthony. She would learn the song. She would sing them. She would dance to them as well. I always remember her wearing red. She would always take these dance classes.

So she would learn flamenco and she would take salsa classes. And she loved dancing and she loved music. And that's how her whole family was. Extended family. Classic Latino culture of just celebrating life, celebrating being together with your family and making it a party. When you're younger, sleep feels kind of like a nuisance, right? It's the thing that interrupts fun.

You fight it, you brag about surviving on four hours of sleep like at some personality trait. And your body's like, cool story, bro. Enjoy your future back pain. I feel like I'm now in the area of like, oh, I'm sorry, I can't do that because I will be sleeping. Yeah, so what you sleep on suddenly matters a whole lot more than it used to. I mean, futons and throw blankets were good, for your 20s, but you're a freaking adult now, Stephen. Get some nice sheets to sleep on, for God's sakes.

Like bowl and branch. Bull and branch sheets are breathable, incredibly soft, and designed to get better over time, which is exactly how I want my relationship with my sheets to go. Yeah, but no other relationship. You really don't want your husband to get more soft. Maybe more breathable would be. Possibly more breathable. These sheets, Bowling Branch, are the I care about myself now.

And if you really care about yourself, you will also get, you'll also get the Bowlin Branch's waffle blanket. Yeah, instead of just rolling out of your futon and going to the Waffle House like you used to, Tracy. We know your past. Stephen, Tracy, get your shit together. Do what we very adult types have done and get yourself some awesome bowling branch sheets and blanket. I mean, look, you don't need to act like an adult, but at least sleep like one. Sleep soundly with Bowling Branch. Get 15% off your first order plus free shipping. At bullenbranch.com slash cult, don't forget our code cult.

That's B-O-L-L-A-N-D branch.com slash cult. Code Cult to unlock 15% off. Exclusions apply. Okay, a quick note on terminology. We've been using the word Mormon, which is what most people, no, but as any listener of this show knows, the church has been moving away from that term. They now prefer the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. No, I'm just going to say Mormon. I don't have the time or the lung capacity for the entire title. I don't get it.

It's like if Hellman's mayonnaise got mad that you called it just mayo, or Velvita started making you call it pasteurized prepared cheese products to respect the accuracy. The accuracy would be not real cheese. True. Because that's the thing. The church claims that it's about accuracy. But accuracy about what? I pray, ask you, Tyler, ex-Morman, Tyler. If you were to ask a Mormon, they'd say, well, because the term Mormon doesn't use Christ. And we believe even Jesus Christ. It's important that his name be revealed in the title. But correct me if I'm wrong, in 2010, the church launched a massive campaign called I'm a Mormon,

billboards, buses, television spots, a website even, Mormon.org millions of dollars spent screaming at the world, hello, we're Mormon and proud. Yeah, they did that. I remember that. They did that. And then, oh man, oh man, just one year later,

2011. The darn little old guys from South Park, along with Robert Lopez, had to come and ran on their little parade, didn't they? Book a Mormon. debuts on Broadway. Oh, yes. And it wins a solid nine Tonys. Deserved.

Oh, it does, Tyler. And it becomes one of the most successful comedies in Broadway history. And then it had to go and be popular in London's West End. And suddenly Mormon internationally equals satire. Am I correct? That also happened, Liz, yes. Then all of a sudden in 2018, a new prophet, sir Mr. Russell Nelson comes to town. and all of a sudden, Mormon bad.

Mormon, no good. He said every time someone used the word Mormon, it was a victory for Satan. What is a victory for Satan? That's such a weird thing. He's like, cheering. Hey, we're going to say. He's like, I'm doing an eight ball right now.

I don't care about your terminology. Yeah, but so why the ship? Why the ship for Mormonism, right? I mean, it probably goes back to our dear friend Mitt Romney. He, Mormon, ran for president in 2008, and millions of people, for the first time in modern history, were Googling Mormon. And what did they find, everybody?

Polygamy! And South Park episodes from 2003. A classic. A classic. Play this for us, Rob. Just give us some yumminess. All right, kids. Now how about we do some scripture readings from the Book of Mormon? All right!

The Book of Mormon? What's that? You know, the book that Joseph Smith found. Who's Joseph Smith? Only the most important person in the world. You never heard of him? No. Tell us the story of Joseph Smith again, Dad.

Yeah, yeah, Dad. So what do you do? If you're the Mormons and people are realizing that, I don't know, maybe you're not just a nice group of blonde people with excellent cast rolls, but instead an incredibly bigoted cult, well, you do what every horrible cover up this country has ever done and flood the Internet with new propaganda and fix things. The search engine.

Mm-hmm. But apparently, though, the media, the wicked media. Well, they missed the memo because there has been of late an explosion of shows and headlines with the term Mormon right there in the title. Like the secret lives of Mormon wives. Yes, a popular one. There's Mormon no more. Surviving Mormonism and the worst of all of them. Murder among the Mormons.

Oh, my God, whoever created that straight to Satan. The Netflix smash hit that critics called expertly crafted. Seriously, the New York Times said it was a taught, unsettling, true crime series with real emotional. Wait, are you really making me read this? I just happened to find some quotes about that show list. Yes, dear listeners, for those who live under a rock are Tyler directed. I did. The Mormon's on Netflix.

And yes, you should all go watch it. It's quite good. Yes. Correct? Thanks. It is. It's a good one. I co-directed it with Jared Hess, who directed Napoleon Dynamite and Minecraft. And the next Minecraft movie he's doing in two weeks with Jack Black, apparently. And yet here you sit with me doing a little podcast. I'm sorry for that. I would be pissed, too, if it were me, you were forced to hang out with over Jack Black. Can't always get what you want, Liz. Get what you need.

I still use the term Mormon and I always will. I've been grandfathered in, but our sweet David Archiletta, well, he told us he wanted to be respectful and he prefers to use the term the Church of Jesus Christ of Latterney Saints. So that's what he'll use. Yeah, so when did you start performing your own music? That started because my dad introduced me to musicals. His mom was a prominent Utah theater performer and apparently she, She had an amazing singing voice as well, but my dad showed me lame as a rob.

It was something that captivated me. And I kept rewining it and played again at VHS tape. I had no idea what the story was about. I just saw the performers' expressions. I saw the intensity that they would put into it, the dynamics of peace and then anger, and just betrayal. And as a kid, just by feeling it in the music, was so powerful to me. And my dad got a couple of other CDs.

So he's like, hey, listen to this. It's Evita. And listen to this Technicolor Dreamcoat. And I did. I would listen to them and learn the songs I liked. And that's when my parents first were like, oh, like, David is musical. And this is quite entertaining that he's so into it. My mom would teach me certain songs and my dad would teach me other ones.

And as I got older, I guess age 10 into age 12, that's when I became my dad's project. He was determined to get me famous. And here's where I want to pause quickly because there's a difference between nurturing your child and helping them find their voice and deciding that their voice is your retirement plan. He would have me practice. He would have me learn new rifts. He would teach me the power of dynamics. Like make sure that you really fluctuate, like give a full experience, like singing loud in these moments and quiet in here.

But my dad wanted to get technical and be like, this, and then do it right here. And he would have me like basically memorize how he wanted the song to flow and where it would peak, where it would have its moments. And so for me, I think it took away from the fun because I wasn't just able to express myself, like how I was. I think my dad was like using me as an instrument. Like I want to sing like that. I can't. So I'm going to have you learn how I would want it sung. And it got to the point where he was so fixated on him,

just being like I'm going to make him famous and I know how to. And I know, I know his talent better than anyone else. I'm his dad. He interpreted it as a divine calling. Because he was like, I know my son's skill. I know what he can do with it. And I know how to make the most of it. And it's because God has called me to do that.

And so it was confusing because for me, I'm like, will I ever get to sing things how I want to? And my dad would always be like, you don't understand. I've researched and I've listened to you and I know what you're capable of. And you don't. And so if I'm like, I want to, instead of singing it, I would want to be like, ah, ah. And he's like, no, no, no, no. You've got to sing it this way because it's, he's like, I've got it all in my head.

And that becomes kind of a theme all throughout the book that, and in my family as well, it always had to be done his way, dad's way. I basically was his puppet because if I said something, he would always express his disappointment that I didn't express myself the way I could have. I didn't do my hair the way it could have been. And it's not like there was a right way or wrong way of doing it. but in my dad's mind, he always knew the right way. Now, we're not saying that David's father is a cult leader.

No, of course we're not saying that because we haven't said it. We're just saying that the dynamics he's describing sound familiar to us. Control, isolation, divine authority, breaking someone down to the point of submission. So we're not calling him a cult leader. But if you were to replace the word dad with, I don't know, say prophet, what would you call it? And that's what was really difficult is you couldn't really argue with him. It's like trying to argue with someone who is extremely devout in their religion or their politics. You can talk to them and try to give them a different perspective,

but anything you say is a threat to what they believe. And I feel like my dad took that approach to anything he was so just no. I'm not going to let this go until you not only see it my way, but you need to be convinced and agree that I'm right. Because there's something I'm like, no, I don't want to disagree with him.

I don't want to have to just say yes, whatever you say is the truth, the light the way, Dad. But he wouldn't back down. And he would just wear people out. And so you just eventually, he's like, okay, yeah, you're right. Okay, yeah, whatever you say. Was there something he needed

to fulfill his life by pushing you? The way I look at, it and as I was writing the book, it just became clear to me on the timeline because my dad wasn't like that when I was little. He loved how I would ask him questions all the time. I would always be like, Dad, why is the sky blue? Like, you know, those kinds of questions. Oh yes, parents, we've all been asked this one before. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, I got this one. Why is the sky blue? You're welcome, parents. The sky is blue sun because the sun sends white light to earth and white light is made of lots of colors. And when that light hits the air around us, the air breaks it up and spreads the color

blue everywhere. So when you look up, you're seeing blue light spread all across the sky. Or you could just say the sky is blue because it's the sky's favorite color. And it brings out its eyes. You could say that. Or you could give the literal definition as Tyler has done. Or you could say, shut up, kid. I don't know. Google it. and he would always say, that's such a good question, son. And so I think he appreciated that I had my own curiosity and wonders, and he welcomed it. There was a shift when there was family drama that happened. And when I was 10 years old, that's when I was told that my dad was a bad man and needed to be sent away by a family friend who was close to my family.

And I was staying at this person's house. and I wasn't given any specifics, so I was really confused. And we were there for like a couple weeks, and this person wouldn't back down. I was young, but I also felt like this doesn't make sense. You're not giving me any clear reasons why my dad is a bad person. And then this person said, I didn't want to have to tell you this, but I'm going to have to. And that's when they said that my dad had been molesting my sisters. I was also told, you can't tell anyone this.

This is our secret. and you can't even tell your mom. They didn't say molesting. They said, touch. They're like, he touched your sisters. And that threw me off, because I was just like, what's wrong with touch? Like, what's wrong with touching? Like, yeah, we hug.

They said, no, he touched them here. And I was like, I was still really skeptical. But the person would come over and just hug me and say, they're there. It's okay. It's okay. I know that's hard to hear. I was like, I don't get what the, I don't get what the hell you're saying. Like, I don't get why it's bad.

But then I was like, I guess I'm supposed to. to be worried. I guess I'm supposed to feel upset because their energy. And I was just like, I don't understand why I'm supposed to be upset, but you want me to be upset. And eventually I did. I was just like, I guess I'm upset and I'm supposed to be afraid of my dad for some reason. And I held that secret for like a year or so. I started becoming afraid of my dad. Eventually my parents found out what was said. And it spread through my mom's circle eventually. And, um, Everyone was kind of like, yeah, if it's happened, then we've got to send Jeff away. He's a bad person.

I finally tell my sister, and it turns out, she was like, no. She's like, what? She's like, no. Dad's never touched me that way, but if we're talking about that, my mom's stepdad has been touching me that way. And it completely foiled this plan that was supposed to come forth against my dad. and once my sister spoke out for herself, suddenly it didn't matter. Like it was all about like your poor sister and she's just like a little girl and we need to protect her. When it was my step-grandpa, suddenly, oh, he would never do that.

And they were just like, they started calling my sister a liar. I was so confused. And my mom was in the middle of this and my mom was like, I don't want to talk about this. Because I think her family was saying, you need to leave that man. And she was so confused. She's like, I don't know who to believe. She's like, let's just not talk about this. Like, let's just forgive and forget and move on.

I don't want to think about anything that happened. And that was her coping mechanism. Eventually, my mom was like, I need my family with me. That's when my parents, we just, we stopped hugging. We stopped saying, I love you. We stopped saying family prayer because we didn't want to be around each other anymore. And this was around when I was like 11 years old. And that's when my dad became fixated on my singing.

and I feel like it was his escape from the problems. Okay, I shouldn't say it was the only way. I think he genuinely was interested, like it was a hobby of his. But once all that family stuff started happening, my dad started putting me into singing competitions. And that's when he would try and prepare me for them. Sing this song, and I want you to do this. I want to try this riff and sing it this way.

And every little detail was planned out. And, I mean, I was just 10 years old, so I was just like, okay, you know, I'd just do it. But just also this thing where it's like I was learning how to do things I didn't want to do. And always having to do it someone else's way. I think those are the things I was starting to, over time would grow into a lot of resentment and bitterness over. Because even when I got older, I was just like, why am I always doing things I don't want to do just to make someone else happy? But I got good at denying myself, you know, and that's praised in the latter.

Saint culture. You know, to lay your life on the altar and to sacrifice what you want for something greater, like you get a pat on the back for that. So it doesn't matter how I feel. It's about pleasing my authority figure, whether it's my dad, my bishop, state president, prophet, this producer on American Idol. I think I just learned how to completely just block out what I thought about things. But I think that's when I started getting really obsessed with religion myself. we'll be right back. When you're younger, you know, dinner is vibes, you know, just getting through it so you can go have fun. I'm sensing a theme in this week's ads.

But now you're an adult, Todd, and dinner is much different. It's more about logistics. It's more about what can I realistically pull off between work, life, and just kind of being tired for no reason. Some nights you cook, some nights you reheat, some nights you just need. dinner to exist quickly and quietly, thank you. And that is why Marley Spoon works so well. They actually evolve with you. There's ready to cook.

There's ready to eat options, depending upon how ambitious you're feeling, Margaret, or not feeling. I love Marley Spoon. I think I'm in, I don't know, like six weeks. I don't know. We just keep getting it, and I'm loving it. You get a nice box on your door, and I've been doing the ready to cook stuff, but the ready to heat stuff is great. too.

Yeah, everything's chef designed. They're made with quality ingredients and balanced enough that you feel good afterwards. True. I'm eating healthy and, you know, it's good because adult food regret is very real. You know I'm right, Jennifer. Don't. Listen up, Jennifer. There's over 100 recipes to choose from each week.

And they're all yummy, especially because you can curate them to your flavor preferences, et cetera. We just had their sheep pan, you know, easy-cooked chicken and veggies. It's delicious. It was really delicious. Marley Spoon, we love them. They love us. This podcast is sponsored by Marley Spoon, and it's honestly made eating well feel doable again.

I can't say enough this year. Fast track your way to eating well with Marley Spoon. Head to marlyspoon.com slash offer slash cult for 45% of your first order plus free delivery. That's a solid number. 45% for Roger. Not bad. Are you listening? Are you tuning in, Roger?

You're taking notes? Penelope. Roger. 45% off your first order and free delivery. And don't forget, it's marly spoon.com slash offer slash cult. Don't forget there's a slash offer in there. Marley spoon.com slash offer slash cult. Now go get to good eat.

Go get some mean. Margo. My dad had me. I was meeting with record labels because people were. impressed by my singing. They just didn't know what, okay, a kid can sing, but what's his image? What's his brand? How are we going to sell him as a product? And so a lot of people would say, you know, have him come back when he's older. But there was a place where a kid with a voice and a controlling stage dad could get a shot. Star Search. Yes, Star Search. It launched in

1983. It was hosted by Ed McMahon, Johnny Carson's Sidekick, who turned, Here's Your Next Star, into a real second career. The show was a mega launchpad. Beyonce was on Star Search. Justin Timberlake, Christina Aguilera, Britney Spears, even Dave Chappelle. The show has been rebooted a few times since then, most recently just a few weeks ago, live on Netflix, because apparently we are all addicted to finding those diamonds in the rock. But the reboot that matters here is the early 2000s reboot, hosted by Arsenio Hall. Our next junior singer proved that soul is alive and well in Utah.

Tonight singing in Alicia Keys hit falling with no G. Please welcome David Archimela. I went on that, won the kids' division. To win, I sing, you're all I need to get by. Marvin Gay and Aretha Franklin remake And now singing the R&B Classic

You're all I need to get by from Sandy Utah Can we get a little of it? Hold on, we'll get there Liz wants to be wooed again Hey I don't know when I last sang that song Okay, all right

So here's what happens listeners Liz, during this interview, was just basically on her side, listening on mute. But then she chimes in. I'm sorry, that song, that song. No, no, look, I mean, having interviewed a few musicians

and rock stars here and there, the general rule is you don't fawn and you don't ask them to sing. So all the things that I did. I think David is a little bit different. He's unlike most artists. He's humble. He's kind, and he has a genuine gift for singing.

And I think he didn't mind singing. He actually, we actually moved on. And then he came back later and he said, would Liz like me to sing for her? And it was amazing. Did Liz want me to sing her all I need? Because if you did, I don't mind singing it. I just don't know.

I haven't sung her to my favorite. It's one of your favorites, Liz? Yes. Oh, my God. Yeah, it's such a good song. It's very moving. It's very moving. I took one look at you.

And it was plain to see you were my destiny. That's a little Ritha. With my arms open wide. I threw away my pride. I threw away my pride. Dedicate my life to you. I will go where you need. Be right there anytime.

I'm a need. And when I lose my will, you won't be there to push me up the hill. There's no. No, look at us. There we go. He just made Liz's day. That was amazing and beautiful.

Thank you. Thank you for doing that. Appreciate you. It's fun to do. It's fun to sing songs you don't normally sing. Unless you're being told exactly how to sing them. Or your father. Yeah.

Okay, guys, I'm playing Tyler for a moment, but this is my music moment. So that song was originally recorded in 1968 by Marvin Gaye and Tammy Terrell. Aretha Franklin smashed the cover in 1971. Give him a taste wrong. Like the sweet morning do, do one look at you. And it was plain to see that you were my destiny with my arms open wide. But the 1995 version that I grew up on is the iconic remix of Method Man's. I'll be there for you.

You're all I need to get by featuring The Queen, Mary J. Blyde. It's so good. Rob, give him a little taste. Like sweet morning due, I took one look at you, and it was plain to see. You are my destiny. Oh, it's so good. It is all versions are great songs. All versions are amazing.

So thank you again, David. Thank you for that moment. And back to Tyler. So your father then, did he amp it up after Star Search? He tried. We moved to California, and he just tried to pursue any way through, like taking meetings, recording demos, and just trying to network here in L.A. We made some progress, but at the same time, there wasn't enough happening that it made it worthwhile to stay down there.

And Star Search called back, and they were having another season. Okay, let's do this. We're doing Star Search again. It was a longer process. We were down in L.A. for a longer time period, and I started getting vocal problems. I was 13 years old at that time and found out that I had a vocal cord paralysis. And so we went home and I would sing here and there at different things in Utah. But I really didn't want to pursue something because I think I could also sense how obsessed my dad got with me. And I didn't want to be around him.

It made me feel really uncomfortable. It just felt like I was constantly under a microscope. I was just like, okay, he never tires of this. and I don't want to be around him. So I would go rollerblaying around. I would try and spend as much time outside, so I didn't have to be around my dad. But I think also, I was the one person of my siblings and parents

who believed that my dad did something bad. And I didn't fully understand what it was, but it's just my faulty way of thinking. I just associated, okay, touch is bad. And I would think if my dad touched me, like, even just like on the shoulder, I thought he was doing something bad to me. I thought it was like a sexual undertone that he was transmitting to me and I needed to stay away from him.

I don't know why I did for so long. Like literally into my 20s, I held on to this belief that touch was bad and I wouldn't touch people. Like when I did, would be in school, my friends knew not to touch me. Listen up, campers. It's time to buckle up, pitch a tent and take a hike. This is Camp Counselor's Podcast with Zachariah Porter and Jonathan Carson. Consider this podcast your new favorite variety show.

Where the badges mean nothing. And the drama means everything. Is this podcast even about camping? No, but it is camp. We cover everything. I have a theory that a chicken finger is the perfect chaser for a tequila shot. No, because at the end of the day, I was a child actor who fell victim to an audition scam. I'm going to be vulnerable for a second.

Have you ever had to shop in a husky section at a department store? Then I don't want to hear it. Honestly, I can't talk about this anymore. I'm overstimulated and I'm bloated. From weird news and our current obsessions to hot gossip and listeners submitted confessions. Nothing is off limits at this camp. New episodes of camp counselors drop every Monday and Wednesday. Listen wherever you get your podcast.

Lights out campers. So David, he's on American Idol, 17 years old, 30 million eyes on him. It looks like everything is working. But there was something David couldn't talk about. Not to his dad, not to the church, not to anyone. It was also around that same time in my adolescence, you know, I was having feelings for girls and boys. And I was really confused why I was feeling things for the boys because I was never, it didn't make sense to me. Like, I had heard about gay people, but I thought gay people were, I don't know, as a very specific type of person.

And being Mormon, like, you're not supposed to be gay. And I believe what I believe in. The things I'd heard about being gay was that it was a certain personality type that was very flamboyant. and very witty and very quick and like to dress up and wears bold patterns. Like the idea I had from like TV shows where I saw a gay character or something, you know. But I guess I didn't even think of how people liked men. I just thought it was like a personality. So I didn't really know what I was dealing with.

And then I was like, if I have these feelings, what does that mean I am? And then when I learned like understood better what gay men, I was like, oh my God, like, I don't know what to do about that. Like, what do I do? Because I was just a kid, you know, I was a kid when you start getting feelings, having crushes and stuff. And it's okay, it's normal if you have a crush on a girl and you're a guy, but what happens when you have a crush on a boy and you're a boy?

And it's like, it's foreign. No one's talked to you about that, even being an option. And so you just keep it to yourself and try not to think too much about it. And then you, you know, start going to church every week and they start talking about. marriage. That's like all you're talking, like from an early age, you're talking about, that's your goal is to get married and have a family. And that's going to bring you happiness in your life and for eternity. In my adolescence, they started talking about homosexuality being a sin and evil. I remember just being at firesides after church, like in the evening at the church

house where they have a speaker come and talk or they try to talk about things to like the youth and saying like, hey, like, beware of this. The world will try to teach you this, but this is God's way. And I think that's when I really started solidifying my stance on gay people in the LGBT plus community, because that's bad. Yes, the Mormon church has a long and frankly awful relationship with homosexuality. In 1969, the book The Miracle of Forgiveness written by Spencer W. Kimball, who later became a Mormon prophet, and a very, very popular book growing up as a Mormon. He stated that, quote,

homosexuality is a gross, grievous, abominable and detestable sin. And this was a phrase that was repeated often when I grew up in the Mormon church. And look, I could read more quotes. I could read more speeches and I don't really want to. Suffice to say, Mormons just don't like gay people. And I know that's an oversimplification, and I know that I'll get a Mormon apologist sending me emails. But it's true. And I know it's true because I was raised to believe that.

And fortunately, I no longer believe that. But I can only imagine the deep pain that David was in being told that who you are is worthy of Satan, just for being you. But then you can't talk to someone about it because it's like, okay, what if I'm having those feelings? You're too embarrassed to say that because you're not supposed to have them. So I'm like, there's something wrong with me. I must be bad. Did I slip and Satan's got a hold of my heart? That's how you look at it.

And I think also just like my dad always was correcting me. So I was like, there's always something wrong with me. I always need to be corrected. And my dad would say a lot of times, like as I got older, oddly enough, that I couldn't function without him. And I think it's a power thing. Like you strip someone's power away from themselves. and you have control over them. And I think when you infantize your child,

even as they get into teenage years, you can still have control over them because they don't know who they are without you. And so I think my dad a lot of times would be like, this is why you need me. Like, see, like you're too dumb on your own to do things and function. And so I think I was just used to always having something wrong with me

and being corrected. Also, as a latter-day saint, it's cultural to feel shame. Yeah. Like to feel inferior, to feel less than, and to know that you're nothing without God. And it's only thanks to God that you're something. So I think it was like you were praised and rewarded in a sense for feeling shameful and feeling like you need to beat your chest and say, I'm a sinner and I'm not perfect and I'm nothing without Jesus, which I think is common in religion in general to be like, I am inferior to God, you know? Now, this is quite a common theme in Mormonism, and I can speak from experience here.

You're told that you're exceptional. You're told that you have been chosen by God to be on the earth at this specific, very important time, that collectively and individually you're part of a very special people. But it's not a cult. And at the same time, you're told to shine your light, to use your talents, but also not too much. Don't be too great. Don't be too worldly.

Don't be too boastful. Don't be too proud. So you grow up believing wholeheartedly. You're exceptional while you're constantly kind of shrinking yourself. Well, welcome to being a woman. Tyler, you just described every woman's internal struggle ever. Be pretty, but not too pretty. Be ambitious, but not like run a company ambitious.

Be confident. But apologize immediately after. funny, but wait, actually never be funny. Okay, I'm seeing it. What cult can we blame? Damn it. Patriarchy. But I think I just got used to that feeling like, oh, I'm supposed to feel like I'm not good

enough. I'm supposed to feel like I'm inferior. And so it's like the church taught that, but my dad, it became extreme because of the dynamic I had with my dad. So here I am feeling horrible about myself in church. And people like that about me in church. They like that I am insecure. They liked me singing and they felt such emotions when I sang.

They would say they felt the spirit when I sang. So it's like, oh, but David is so talented, but he's so humble and down to earth. Wow, that is a man of God right there. And for me, I was like, I hate myself. Like, I think I suck. I'm like, singing's not going to fix what I'm feeling inside. But everyone thinks that I'm close to God because they're like, listen to him sing. That's the voice of an angel. And I was like, I was just like, well, maybe if I keep

trying and being more obedient and singing for God, he'll forgive me. And I thought the only evidence of him actually forgiving me was for him to make me straight. So I was like, I'm still not straight. Like, no matter how much I do, no matter how much I read my scriptures and pray and fast and go to church and read the manuals and read the lessons, maybe if I do enough, he'll change. He'll change. And of course, you get to a point where you realize you can eat, sleep, breathe, church, and it's still not enough to change your sexuality. And I was distraught because I thought that was clear evidence that no matter what I did, I would never be enough for God.

So in the midst of all this, you go on to American Idol. Tell me about American Idol, how big it was, and what happened your first season you got on there? So American Idol was on a whole other thing. level at that time. It was before we had apps on our phones, so we didn't have Instagram. So the way that people connected with each other was mainly through television and movies and like a major artist's album or something. But American Idol was people's social connection to each other, to their family members, to like everyone would get home and sit around the TV together and watch American Idol. And I was on the seventh season in 2008. There was like 30 million.

people watching every week. In the U.S. alone, it was a cultural phenomenon, really. It was what you talked about at work, with your friends, around the dinner table. Oh, to be in 2008 again, when the largest fight this country had was who was going to win American Idol. And the biggest jerk on television was Simon Cowell. I went to audition for American Idol. I would have been curious to audition anyway, but I would say it was mostly my dad who wanted me to go on audition and he made it happen. You know, I was in high school. I was really embarrassed to tell any of my friends that I was going on. We went down, waited in the line for two days. A year old David Archiletta, it's been an emotional road just getting here. A few years ago,

I had this vocal paralysis. All right, so let's do it. What you go sing, man? I'm going to sing waiting on the world to change by John Mayer. Go for it. Persistent, when we're standing at a distance, we keep waiting. Waiting. Waiting on the world to change. Thank you. Randy, yes or no? 100 million percent yes, dude.

I love you. Oh, thanks, thanks. I'm going to squish you. Alright, that's a no from Paula. It's a yes for me, two yes, and you're through. Welcome to Hollywood, David. Thank you. San Diego's one out for you, dog.

And went for like the Hollywood week and top 50 week. You are back. This is Idol. We are down to our final performance of the night. The singer tonight. Tonight, David Archiletta. Yeah! You were born to do exactly what you're doing there.

That was brilliant. Right now, you're the one to be. It's never going to go down on you because you bring out so much sunshine and everyone throughout the whole world through your singing. Yes, David tore through the competition round after round after round and at one point he gets vocal coaching from Mariah Carrie and fun fact, no shame. My first CD ever purchased was Music Box. So what a sweet, sweet fantasy that must have been. Reading her I carry was really scary just because I thought I'm not worthy to be in her presence.

The advice she gave was really helpful, actually. Don't be afraid because whatever you do is going to be real and authentic. Every week on American Idol, my dad was so excited. He was just eating it up. He was on a mission. He was like, my son is going to win this. He was convinced. And a lot of times he would say, like, David, you don't understand how talented you are.

You don't get it. Like, what you do, other people can't do. My dad had this very much us against the world mindset. He felt like everyone was out to get us. And so he was just like, it's you and me against them. We can't trust anyone. We've got to have each other's backs. He's like, I need you to be there for me the way I'm here for you.

You can't trust anyone. And I feel like my dad may have had a little bit of that stem from the churches be in the world but not of the world teaching that you hear so many times and especially because you're taught that the entertainment industry is so evil and it's of the devil so it's like oh my gosh all these people are they're going to drag us down with the devil if we get too close to them so we've got to keep an arm's length with these people when they were starting to narrow us down i didn't expect to make it as far as i did there's four of you left at least there's one guy that hits the stage every time he hits the stage.

Tonight's performance was arguably the best you've done so far. I was there until the finale with David Cook, so it was the Battle of the Davids. People were really invested in that. You're watching American Idol. We are live with the results. Ladies and gentlemen, David and David. The winner by 12 million votes of American Idol 2008 is David Cook. And David Cook ended up winning?

No, America, you picked the wrong, David. Yes, David Cook, the crooner from Blue Springs, Missouri, was crowned the winner of American Idol season seven. were there. It was a battle. It was intense. But no love was lost because according to a people exclusive, Tyler, two Davids. Breaking people exclusive. Those two Davids remained friends during and after the show. Yes, and after the finale, the top 10 performers, well, they went on the road, the American Idol concert tour. After that, like, it just didn't stop. That same night that American adult ended, I was signed to a record deal. They had us going on the American Idol tour. And I felt so unworthy. Like, it was just, it was ingrained in my head. I'm like, I do not

deserve to be here. But I tried my best because I'm like, God must want me here. And that, that is where we leave it for part one. I know. I hate us too. Because the story is just getting started. We had such a great. great time with David. And we are so happy that he was able to join us. And sing for us. And next week, he sings for us again.

Yes, he does. And we go deep. It's a very beautiful and emotional story. We talk about David's two-year Mormon mission to Chile, how the church wrapped itself around his fame, how a letter from his father breaks him open. And we hear what it's like to spend your entire life praying to be different until you finally realize that maybe you are not the problem.

It's a great episode. You can wait for next week. But I wouldn't. I wouldn't if I were the. Or you can join Patreon and hear Part 2 right now. It's available for all our mid-level Patreon members. So do it. And speaking of out right now, David's fantastic and heartfelt and deeply vulnerable memoir called Devout is a available for purchase today. I do assure you there's so much more in the book than we can ever fit into these episodes. The link for it is in our show notes. And if you're an audio person like I am, I highly recommend that because there is bonus

music connected to the book that he wrote as an accompaniment to his story. I think he wrote it as he was writing the book, right? Yeah. So he can sing for you, listeners, as you listen to his story. I mean, come on. That's pretty rad. David is also going on a book tour starting February 17th today in New York. And then he's in Boston on the 18th.

Shytown on the 19th. St. Louis on the 20th. Austin on the 23rd. Salt Lake on the 24th. And he will be here at the Grove right around the corner in Los Angeles on the 25th guys with moderator Dan Reynolds was the lead singer of Imagine Dragons. Him also being a former Mormon, oddly enough. So the conversation should be great. The information is out there somewhere on the internet.

You could probably find it. A special thanks to Ken Phillips, Dave's publicist who set this up. And today we leave you all with the glittery words of Mariah Carey. Don't be afraid because whatever you do is going to be real and authentic. Was I an occult? is blah blah blah blah blah by who? More morons

Liz Ayakuzzi I mean more morons Lesmon I thought that said less mom I was like fucking harsh Les mom Mesaum harsh

too soon Oh God that's horrible It says Tyler less mom as in more mon less mon but i read it as tyler less mom not even europe at cruel to have written that comedy is tragedy plus time tyler sound mix and design by rob japan from europe para of course of course see you next week everyone 50 first dates.

This is awesome. And TV shows like Survivor, SpongeBob SquarePants, the fairly odd parents and ghosts. Pluto TV is always free. Hazzal. Pluto TV, stream now, pay never. You're welcome.