Was I In A Cult? - "The Fleetwood Mac Star Who Vanished Into a Cult"

Episode Date: July 20, 2026

Before Stevie Nicks. Before Lindsey Buckingham. Before Rumours. There was another Fleetwood Mac. And one of its lead singers was a young guitarist named Jeremy Spencer. This week, we goes deep into a strange, dark, and almost unbelievable chapter of rock-and-roll history involving early Fleetwood Mac, Los Angeles in the '70s…  And, of course, a cult. Oh, and F-you, Uncle Jerry.  ——————————————————   FOLLOW US Instagram → @wasiinacult TikTok → @wasiinacult SUPPORT THE SHOW Join our Patreon! Ad-free episodes, bonus content, behind-the-scenes conversations, and our forever gratitude. HAVE A CULTY STORY? Email us → [e-mail]

The views and opinions expressed on this podcast are those of the hosts and guests, and do not necessarily reflect the views of Libson or its affiliates. Guest accounts or personal recollections shared from their own perspectives. References to specific individuals, organizations, or groups are presented as commentary, opinion, and personal experience and should not be interpreted as definitive statement of fact. This podcast is intended for informational and entertainment purposes only. This is called a tease. Mick Fleetwood was slightly agitated.

His band Fleetwood Mac was slated to play a gig that night at the famed Whiskey a Go-Go in Los Angeles. But their guitarist and lead singer Jeremy Spencer was nowhere to be found. The last time anyone saw him was when he left the hotel that morning to go buy a magazine. Mick Fleetwood canceled the gig that night. And the next night. And the next night. Five days later, the phone finally rang. Jeremy had shaped his head, changed his name, and was living on a farm outside of town.

With his new family. The children of God. A cult, obviously. Welcome back to Was I in a cult once again with your hosts and spiritual guides. Oh. Your spiritual guide, Liz Iacuz. And over there, Tyler Meesam. And occasionally, Rob Parra, who chimes down.

Who is the ultimate lord. The ultimate lord of this show. Yes, the ultimate lord. I like that. Now in more than 120 episodes, what? We've done that many episodes. We've done that many episodes, Liz. Have you listened to them all?

Yes. Now, in more than 120 episodes, we have almost always had a badass guest sitting across from us, telling us the story of a cult that they, got in and got out of. But today, by goodness, we're doing something just a little bit different. Still Colts, don't worry, we're not pivoting into some chat show about reclaiming the female orgasm. Yeah, or re-examining masculinity through radical vulnerability. I am starting that show. Rob and I are doing that

because we're the most masculine men we know. But Tyler, I'm actually implementing a mandatory testosterone checks for all hosts on this show. So get to that doc. I will take the injections. For all hosts? No, we're not doing those shows. Probably more testosterone in the two of you combined. No, but there is, you guys should get your testosterone checked.

No, I'm just kidding. But no, we're not doing those shows because there are plenty of microphones doing that already. Today, we're telling the story ourselves. It is a story involving the beloved band Fleetwood Mac. Fleetwood Mac, because what many listeners may not know, one of the strangest and ultimately darkest stories surrounding Fleetwood Mac is about a cult. A cult.

And, well, you know, we just so happen to have some professional experience in that area. So Tyler put on his documentary hat and went in, guys. I did. It's a well-worn hat. Too far in. I did. I went. I think it was February when I was like, Liz, I think I want to do a show on Fleetwood Mac. It's August, by the way, or very close to August. So it took me that long to keep researching. I went way far in. I watched grainy videos. I listened to good music. I listen to bad music. I comb through photos. I even enlisted my dear friend, Jim Berkenstad. He is an author. He is known as the rock and roll detective. and he helped me dig deeper. We tried to track down the person at the center of today's story. Were you successful? I did not find him, no. And we'll get into that later.

We didn't find him. So basically, Tyler found a loophole that allowed him to make a music documentary inside of our cult podcast. So congratulations. I prefer to think of it as combining two of my loves, Liz. Like, you can have pizza and wine at the same time, and I can have cults, and I can have music. So, and you know who else loves music? Well, cult leaders. Many, many cold leaders.

Yeah, because they crave the power and the adoration that rock stars have. So, yes, this story has everything. It's got rock and roll, it's got religion, it's got disappearance, it's got drama, it's got Fleetwood Mac, one of the best bands of all time, and it's got one of the most destructive cults in modern history. All because one morning, a singer and guitar. car player, walked out of his hotel to buy a magazine. So let's tell a story, shall we?

Rob, have you got any lead us in story music? Doodleoo, doodoo. Give us some good, like, 70s vibe right here, Rob. Second time. Shut your mouth. Thanks, Rob. First off, Fleetwood Mac. Fleetwood Mac.

I know you know who they are. Everyone knows who they are. my generation, you know who they are. If you are of the most recent generation, you know who they are because they have seen a resurgence. For good reason, they're immortal. They are immortal. Somehow every Apple playlist, SUV commercial, and TikTok montage eventually lands on Fleetwood Mac. Every longboarder drinking juice out of the bottle.

Totally. Would it be fair to say that they are everywhere? Nicely done. I personally, I do love Fleetwood Mac. Who doesn't love Fleetwood Mac? Actually, no one. I did a dive, and I tried to find some written testimonials of Fleetwood Mac haters. Couldn't find anybody famous who put it on record that they weren't fans,

but there are definitely some Reddit forums dedicated and an entire episode of, Your Favorite Band Sucks, which I'm assuming is a podcast. There's not many podcasts, so that probably is one. Yeah. they apparently don't like it. Other than that, they are widely, widely loved. They are loved and they're great. And I do get sometimes tired because they do get overplayed of late.

But I could listen to Landslide over and over and over. Sometimes it's not enough to listen to that song. You want to eat it. You know what I mean? You want to hug it. You want to feel it. You want to rub it on your chest. Did I say too much?

Did I say? I probably did. Most people hear Fleetwood Mac and they think, Stevie Nix, Lindsay Buckingham, and Rumors, of course. Yeah, they think about the affairs, the breakups, the cocaine, some of the greatest songs ever written by people actively destroying one another, in front of one another. But before Stevie Nix, before Lindsay Buckingham, and before rumors,

there was another Fleetwood Mac. And one of its lead singers was a gentleman named Jeremy Spencer. Dumb, dump, dum! Fleetwood Mac was founded in 1967 in London by Peter Green, Mick Fleetwood, and John McVee. Now, after playing a few gigs, they added a young blues guitarist named Jeremy Spencer. Jeremy was born in Hartlepool, England, in 1948. I'm sorry, I have to briefly discuss Hartlepool. Briefly.

It's worth it, trust me. So according to the local legend during the Napoleonic Wars, a French ship wrecked off the coast. of England, right near Hartlepool. Now, the only survivor was the ship's mascot, a monkey dressed in a tiny French military uniform. Wars used to be so fun. Like, battleships had mascots? Now, the townspeople had never apparently seen a monkey nor a Frenchman before, so they suspected the monkey was a French spy. There on the beach, they put it on trial, What? Yeah.

And they hanged it. What? Yes. Yes. They hanged a monkey? They hanged the monkey in the tiny French military uniform for being a French spy. God. It's horrible.

Come on. Somebody spent all the time making that uniform and then it just goes to waste. And the legend lives on. Today, the town's local football mascot is a monkey named, wait for it. hangus. That's Angus with an H. This story is not true. I don't know if it's true or not.

It may be apocryphal. But there's more. In 2002, the man who was inside the hangus costume was elected mayor. Okay, enough. No, there's more, Liz. Come on. The townspeople still refer to themselves as the monkey hangers. In fact, it's the name of their rugby team.

Books and plays have been written about the monkey, including a song from 1850. Oh, my God. Now you're going to play it, aren't you? Of course we're going to play it. The Lord Merivale was walking on the shore. When it came across a funny sight he'd never seen before, there was this little fellow sitting on the sand holding a banana in his tiny area. Oh, folks, young folks, everyone and each, come and see the Frenchie that's landed on the sun. on the beach. His great long arms,

a great long tail, he's covered all in air. We think that he's a spy, so we'll hang him in the square. Well, there you have it, everyone. It's a worthy tangent. It's a worthy tangent. Jeremy Spencer was born in a town

once governed by a monkey, apparently. Supposedly the story is true. It's very funny. I'm going to say there's always some true in legend. Regardless, back to Jeremy. So Jeremy,

spent much of his childhood near Oxford. He started playing piano when he was very young, and as a teenager, he became obsessed with slide guitar and the blues of guitar legend, Elmore James. Now, at this time, American Blues was exploding in England. Britain took muddy waters, Elmore James, and Howling Wolf. They ran them through London and shipped them back to America as the Stones, Cream, Led Zeppelin, and the Yardbergs, amongst others.

And the original Fleetwin Mac was very much a blues band. Here they are performing live. Jeremy is the guitarist and singer. See, Jeremy was a strange contradiction. You know, he had the curls and the guitar. You know, he looked like a rock star. But he was short, boyish, almost innocent looking. Until he got on stage.

Well, right. See, Jeremy was notorious for crude and sexual performances. Sometimes he would walk on stage with a dildo, sticking out of his fly, or he would fill condoms with milk. and he would toss them into the audience. What a dream boy. I've always wanted a man to do that.

Oh, he gets better, I assure you. He gets right in the eye with the splooge milk. Oh, thank you. I do, I do, I will follow you anywhere. That's amongst the safest things that Jeremy Spencer has done, I assure you. But apparently much of it was an act because after the show, while the rest of the band was partying, Jeremy would sit alone in his dressing room reading the Bible. Hmm, it is unclear whether the dildo was still in his fly whilst he read the Bible.

He was just sucking on the leftover milk condoms. Mommy. Gross. Why are they drinking beer? I'm drinking my milk condom. I don't like this story. Sorry. Fleetwood Mac released their self-titled debut album in 1968.

It climbed to number four in the UK and remained on the charts for months. Jeremy and Peter Green both shared vocal duties. The band continued releasing records. They appeared on television and had major hits with songs like Albatross and Man of the World. So Jeremy is young, he's successful, he's performing all over the world. And privately, he is becoming increasingly religious, increasingly uncomfortable, and increasingly desperate for something else. And the cult?

It's coming, Liz, because while Jeremy and Fleetwood Mac were riding high, somewhere in Los Angeles, someone was already waiting for him. Jeremy just didn't know it yet. And that's a cliffhanger. By 1970, Fleetwood Mac was already beginning to fracture. Peter Green was struggling. He was taking large amounts of LSD, becoming increasingly religious and consumed with guilt over the band's wealth. sort of like the guilt you and I are consumed with here. It's a heavy burden.

Then came a now infamous night at a commune outside Munich. It was an acid-fueled gathering his bandmates would later describe as the moment Peter was never quite the same. Although Peter himself rejected that version, he remembered the knight as spiritual, creatively thrilling, and said he took the acid willingly. Been there. So whatever happened to Munich, Peter had become deeply disillusioned with the life Fleetwood Mac was giving him. And a few months later, well, he left the band. Yeah, it's just another chapter in the drama that is Fleetwood Mac. I'll tell you, so much of it.

So much of it. And with the band's founder and Creative Center basically gone, Jeremy Spencer was then pushed much closer to the front. Good old Jeremy Spencer. our protagonist and our antagonist, all in one fell swoop. Christine McVee then joins on Keys, and the began, moving beyond the blues into more rock songs. They released more albums, and while having a nice following in the UK, Fleetwood Mac started to get a stronger foothold in America,

which brings us to 1971. God, that was so long ago. It's a great year. It's a great year for music and a great year for the birth of great podcast hosts. With flowing, blonde, curly locks. I don't know who I'm talking about, but that was a great year. Back when podcasts were weekly radio shows and the family would gather around the old wooden radio to tune into the podcast, sponsored by Chesterfield cigarettes. More doctors smoke Chesterfields than any other cigarette.

I see what you're doing there. I see what you're doing there. It's a backhanded, I'm old joke. No, it's just, that's what commercials were like. That's what commercials were like in 1971. Not really, but okay, I'll take it. Maybe, maybe 1946. Yeah, either way, it's close enough.

1971 is this close to 1946? As it is today. Is that weird to think about? That's true. It's actually closer, my darling. It is much closer. 46 is much closer to 71 than today is to 70. Look, 1971, a great year, but also a phenomenal year for music.

It gave us what's going on. It gave us Imagine by John Lennon, American Pie. It gave us me and Bobby McGee. You've got a friend, Maggie May, one of my favorite songs. And Star We to Heven, Starway to He, stairway to Heaven. I'm going to listen to that. Stairway to Heaven, you say. Similar to what 2025 gave you.

of us some music. Similar. Just, just classics, like ordinary and messy and anxiety. These are all real hits from last year, Tyler. Seriously? Truth. Those are the names of the songs. Ordinary, messy, and anxiety?

Correct. Your theme song. People just name songs after national mood. How they feel. fucking exhausted. That's what it would... Exactly. Must I get out of bed?

Don't look at the news. So after weeks of touring, Fleetwood Mac in February of 1971, found themselves in Los Angeles. They had a three-night gig at the famed Whiskey go-go on Sunset Strip. Oh, speaking of the Sunset Strip, Liz, funny you bring that up. And speaking of rock and roll hotels, and less than a month. Month, my film, of which I've been working on for years, it's about the famed Sunset Strip Hotel, the Sunset Marquis. It drops on August 14th.

It's called If These Walls Could Rock, it's got a shit ton of rock stars. And yes, listeners, for you, I will get you a discount. That is a promise. And you need to watch it. Because it's good. Because it's good. You've seen it. You were at the premiere.

I was there. You got drunk at the premiere. I saw you. Wasted. No, I didn't. I wish. Did I? You were having a good time.

We were all having a good time. Regardless. Yes, we will keep you posted on that. August 14th. Obviously, we'll let you know. But from what I could piece together, Fleetwood Mac was staying at the Tropicana, which is kind of a cheap,

legendary haven for rock musicians just off the sunset strip. The night before their first show at the whiskey, the band gathered in McFleetwood's hotel room to listen to a live album that they had just recently released. Jeremy hated what he did. heard. And later he said, and this is a quote, when my stranger blues Elmore James thing came on,

I just blurted out. This sounds like shit. But it wasn't only the record. Jeremy was also becoming increasingly uncomfortable with the life surrounding the band. He continues. I went to my room and I just prayed to God to somehow get me out of this. Also, they were getting into cocaine. To me, that was a stone's type drug and the feeling of invincibility that it gave you just seemed wrong to me. Ironic foreshadowing right there. Yeah, right. According to Meg, Jeremy was also still shaken from a terrible mescaline trip earlier in the tour. And just six days before they arrived, Los Angeles had been hit by a massive earthquake.

So by the time Jeremy went to bed that night, he was spiritually desperate, alienated from the band, rattled by drugs, and literally standing on shaky ground. Which is about as vulnerable a person can get without wearing a big sign on their head that says, please approach me about your commune. Which, the very next morning, someone did. Hold. Hold. Pause for dramatic effect. Hold.

Put in some drama here. Continue to the next morning. Monday, February 15th, 1971, Jeremy left the Tropicana Hotel on foot. He told the band he was going to a bookstore down the street to simply buy a magazine. He walks out. into that warm California sun. West Hollywood is half awake, people who never went to bed,

sharing the sidewalk with people who are just starting their day. And as he nears the newsstand, Jeremy is approached by a friendly young man named Apollos. So friendly, and so certainly not the name his mother gave him.

No, but as cult names go, A-plus, Apollos. Apollos is very strong. It turns out Apollos belonged to a then little-known religious group called the Children of God. Children of God, one of those names that sounds incredibly wholesome until you learn what's happening within its walls. Yeah, the God part was misleading, sadly, the children part. Not so much.

Not so much. Now, Children of God members were trained to look approachable. Young, calm, and friendly, they were often carrying guitars. They spent hours around record stores and bookstores, parks, and newsstands, just waiting for the right person to stop and have a conversation. And musicians were especially attractive targets for the children of God. I mean, musicians already traveled together, they lived communally, they questioned conventional society, and often believe that music could transform people. So Apollos and Jeremy began talking about God, about music, about purpose. And then came the moment that matters the most in nearly every single recruitment story.

The invitation. Apollos invites Jeremy to a nearby commune, where the other members are staying. It was probably something simple like, oh yeah, you like God, I like God. Got some friends over here. We like to talk about how cool God is. You want to come hang?

Yeah, I mean, it's just outside L.A., a farm in the hills, young people, music. You like music, right? And like, I mean, God is cool, totally misunderstood. He's not the boring Lord that makes you stay quiet in church. I mean, God's all about freedom, man, and love. Free love. But of course, Jeremy didn't know that part yet, so he went.

And there were probably snacks. There were always snacks. I'm sure in that moment he felt like he'd found his people, you know, who understood him. Not people who wanted to do blow off the back of a roadie named Cliff. Speaking of back of the Tropicana, Fleawood Mac was still waiting for their friends. front man to come back. Yeah, they had no idea where Jeremy was.

They thought he was still out getting a magazine. Of course, this was 1971, so if you didn't know where someone was, well, you just didn't fucking know. You just had to wait. Yeah, or you called hospitals, which is what my mom did. I'd come home a little late, and she'd like, I called every hospital. I called every hospital asking for you, asking if you've been in. aren't you glad that I wasn't there?

No, no. She had to call every hospital. And meanwhile, I was just riding my bike with Chad up the street. So the band just waited. And waited. And waited. But Jeremy never came back. And that very important gig at the whiskey that night had to be canceled.

But who replaced them that night? You ask, nobody really asks, but I don't care. I'm going to tell you. I'm going to tell you you can skip ahead. Well, I dug through old concert listings and found out who replaced them that night, an L.A. soul funk band called Pollution, fronted by a guy named Doby Gray. Do you know Dobie Gray? Do you remember the song Drift Away? Oh, give me the beat boys and free my soul.

I want to get lost in your rock and roll and drift away. So the next morning at the Tropicana Hotel? Nothing. No Jeremy. So McFleetwood contacted the FBI. Highway Patrol and state police joined in the search. Appeals went out on rock radio and television. Fleetwood Mac canceled a second night. Their lead singer had vanished. According to Mick Fleetwood, quote, we were genuinely worried for days we didn't know what had happened to him.

We thought he might have been hurt or lost. Next day. No Jeremy. That night, whiskey, pollution played again. Pollution is still playing here at L.A. Tonight they're actually opening for smog. Tomorrow. Fire. Fire. So Mick Fleetwood then called Peter Green, who had left the band the year before,

and convinced him to fly over from England to fill in while they continued to search for Jeremy. One day becomes two days. Two days became three days. Then the phone rang. But it wasn't Jeremy. The caller said that Jeremy had joined a religious group. that he had renounced rock music, changed his name to Jonathan,

terrible call name, and that he didn't want to see the band. And he wasn't coming back. Mick Fleetwood later said, quote, we eventually found out he joined a religious group. At the time, we didn't understand what that meant. Years later, Jeremy has said, quote, I know people call it a cult.

I understand why. But at the time, it felt like the most honest, spiritual life I'd ever known. And after much searching, the band did track down Jeremy, living on the commune, and according to Mick Fleetwood, Jeremy had shaved his head and was speaking almost entirely in religious language, repeating phrases about Jesus. Jeremy later disputed that account.

He said, quote, People say I disappear. I didn't disappear. I made a decision. I didn't leave Fleetwood Mac because of the band. I left because I felt called to do something else entirely. Jeremy thought that he'd found God. But what he'd actually found

was one of the most destructive cults in modern history. What's Anna Colt is brought to you by Chesterfield Cigarettes. The number one cigarette company trusted by doctors. Chesterfield Always the top tobacco's great grade A of top tobacco in the USA.

Sun-wrenched top-tobacco is going to mean that you're smoking smoother and you're smoking clean. Chesterfield. Okay, so we're back. Now, to understand what happened to Jeremy Spencer, we have to understand God, or God's children. Or wait, no, neither of those. In order to understand what happened to Jeremy Spencer,

we have to understand the most heinous cult to ever live, the children of God, which, if you didn't guess, already has absolutely nothing to do with God or God's children. Now we have covered the children of God a few times on this show, and every single time this cult somehow manages to get worse. Founded in 1968, just three years before Jeremy joined by one David Berg, who, as I recall from a previous episode, had a pretty fucked up childhood. He was caught masturbating in church and his father, the preacher. Well, he caught him in made him finish, and also he had some inappropriate sexual relations as a child, according to him.

And good old Dave, he brought every bit of his trauma into his cult. This group began in Southern California, initially as an outreach to disaffected hippies and runaway youth. Early on, it was loosely organized and idealistic. And at the time Jeremy joined, there were only about 800 members or so, but it grew very quickly, spurred on by the Jesus People Movement. Oh, the old Jesus people movement. The group preached communal living, rejection of materialism, sexual openness, and absolute devotion to God. David Berg positioned himself not as a pastor, but as a prophet.

Obedience to Berg became obedience to God. The group trained members to distrust their own instincts and see submission as enlightenment. But the defining feature of the fact of the group trained members to distrust their own instincts and see submission as enlightenment. the children of God, the thing that would eventually make it infamous, was, of course, its sexual doctrine. Within Children of God, quote, free love began as a vague idea, tied to the counterculture movement, the belief that love should have no boundaries. Well, early on, this mostly meant consensual sexual relationships at first among adults. But as the group consolidated around David Berg, sexual ideology became more explicit, more coercive, and more authoritarian. And

And this is where the movement stopped looking like a hippie commune, and it became something much darker. Berg began promoting and justifying sexual abuse of children, framing it as love and education or spiritually beneficial. Many of our past Children of God episodes were filled with stories of horrific abuse. It's also important to understand this. Jeremy wasn't drawn in by the cult's later sexual doctrines. They weren't fully there yet.

And that doesn't make Jeremy an innocent man, however. Because, yeah, sure, Jeremy seems to have been genuinely searching for something. God, purpose, a better life. But there's another side to Jeremy's story. Jeremy was just a horrible person who liked little girls and happened to find the perfect cult to fit his profile. Yeah, you see, Jeremy was an... Let's see, I'm trying to find the right phrase for this.

Jeremy was... I'll help you out. A piece of shit. Thank you, Liz. You see, in 1966, five years prior to joining the cult, when Jeremy was but 18 years old, he was married to a young lady named Fiona. And I stress the word young, because Fiona was 14 years old. And by 1971, Jeremy and Fiona had two children already.

And by the time Jeremy disappears into children of God, while he brings Fiona and his two children with him. Now, Jeremy, fully into the children of God and fully out of Fleetwood Mac. Meanwhile, Fleetwood Mac stumbled through various members. And then in 1974, producer Keith Olson played Mick Fleetwood a track by a little-known duo called Buckingham Knicks. Mick was immediately struck by the guitarist, Lindsay, Lindsay Buckingham. And then Fleetwood Mac had a guitarist named Bob Welch who left the band later that year. ignore that he had sex with Mick Fleetwood's wife. That's another chapter of the Mick Fleetwood, Fleetwood Mac story.

So Mick called Lindsay Buckingham and asked him to take the place of Bob. And Lindsay agreed, but on one condition. He wanted Stevie Nix to come with him. And with Lindsay and Stevie joining Mick Fleetwood, John McVee, and Christine McVey, the version of Fleetwood Mac the most of the world knows, was finally in place. Their first album together was a huge success. Then, two years later, in 1977, after breakups and secret affairs, they use all of that relationship band drama to write the album, Rumors. One of the biggest selling albums of all time.

Millions. It sold 10 million albums in a month. It sold 40 million albums all together and is still a top selling album. And because of this, Jeremy benefited. Flewwood Mac's success sent sales of the earlier album soaring. And because Jeremy, of course, had written songs and played on those records, the royalty checks kept arriving. Royalty checks. Mailbox money, musicians call them. And, of course, every one of those royalty checks, well, guess where they went, Liz, guess. Go ahead and guess.

Starving Children in Africa. Next guess. Yes. Solving the homeless problem in Los Angeles. Again, maybe you forgot. He's in a cult. David Berg. He went to the cold leader.

It went straight to the Children of God, millions of dollars, going to a cult. And Berg quickly realized he had something incredibly valuable, not just Jeremy's money, but Jeremy himself. The Children of God,

see, they always used music. Members played guitars on street corners, and they sang in parks. They performed concerts to attract new recruits, but now they had something they never had before. Millions of dollars and a bona fide rock star. So who do you think Berg put in charge of the group's music? Well, you guessed it, the former lead singer of Fleetwood Mac.

Jeremy later said, quote, music was still important to me, but not fame, not touring, not that lifestyle. So Berg put Jeremy to work. Now here he is on a Children of God show, which was called Music with Meaning. I dug it up. It's a grainy VHS, and the opening, though, I got to say the opening is, it's quite catchy. He used to play with one of the most famous pop groups of recent times, the Fleetwood Mac. And we're going to be finding out what he's doing musically at the moment. The show features a number of musical artists.

And here's one called Love Lights, which is basically 12-year-old girls in revealing costumes, including one in a very skippy bikini. It is super cringe. It's super cringe. We can play it for you, but it doesn't do the justice that the video does. A banana with you.

It's that irresistible, undeniable, power of love. And here's one with a woman, singing with a flower in her hair. So nice. Here's a dude with a guitar. Oh, I long for the music that sing. And I wait for the songs that live.

And then there's Jeremy, who has zero charisma. Which is kind of not what you'd expect. Not what you'd expect, but he's pretty flat. He's kind of a boring guy. Now let me introduce you to our guests on the show today, Jeremy Spencer. Jeremy, well, you, I know that music's meant something very special to you because you must have grown up with it ever since you were very young. Yes, that's true.

I started playing the piano when I was nine, ten years old. And then, after that, the tape just cuts. He's about to talk about Fleawood Mac, and it's obvious. It's a legal edit. And then he comes back with this. Jeremy, you... A little bit of responsibility to all the attention. I couldn't quite

I didn't feel I could cope with it responsibility because of the fact that so many people were looking to me to me for something and it stopped short

at me and so I was really at a loss of very much enjoy watching Jeremy perform his perennial favorite prodigal son Hasn't everyone

been a prodigal son Jeremy also signed a record deal with CBS Records which was then part of Columbia Records to record an album it was called Jeremy Spencer and the children Ugh

I know When you find out more about him you'll just know that that's there It's there It's there It was a

collection of blues songs with evangelical lyrics. I guess you can play it if you have to. I'll play it. The album did not do well, Tyler. No, it did not. It doesn't need to be said. The album sold poorly. Spencer was dropped from his record deal and I did find a few of these albums for sale online, relatively priced. I did strongly consider buying one, but I didn't, Liz, because, well, because I'm fucking sane, Liz, I'm a sane human being and I don't know. You're going to buy it to burn it, but it wasn't even worth that. No.

But Jeremy started something that lasted for decades. Music became central to the children of God's identity, not just as entertainment, but as one of its most effective recruiting tools. Berg understood that people lower their defenses when they're singing, so he encouraged members to write songs and form bands. And soon the movement had bands all over the world, recording folk and rink and redsing. rock and pop and children's albums and worship music. In France, actually, one group even performed under the name Les Infants de dures. You can probably say that since you're fluent in French. Les Enfants de du.

Yeah, which literally means... Children of God. They didn't even try to hide it. No, children of God. The band actually scored a number one hit with this song, My Love is Love. I look this up people are all of them dressed basically the same All happy smiling

Kumbaya clapping together The album cover has them in like a field All spread out It's just It's a cult like, however, the song itself is... But God damn it, it's a catchy song.

It's a catchy song. Damn it. I can understand why it went to number one in France. I can kind of understand. I hate it when cults make good music. Here's another one. Here's a banger from their album. This one's called Love Light.

And Lord, it took me by surprise. When I saw the Love Light, love. Because the movement attracted artists and former professionals. The quality of the music could be surprisingly high. That's part of what made it effective. This wasn't church music. It was cool, folk, rock, soft rock. Singer-songwriters, right, which made Jeremy Spencer's story even sadder. I mean, he thought he was walking away from music for God. Instead, he just found himself making music for an organization that used God to justify pedophilia.

All of a sudden, that late-night cocaine off the back of cliff after a show isn't looking so bad, is it, Jeremy? Yeah, he kind of left one of the biggest bands of all time, Jeremy, so that you could play shit music for an asshole pedophelian cult leader in small communes. And here's another thing. Jeremy wasn't just trapped inside the children of God. No. He became one of the people that.

others needed to escape from. Oh, this is another cliffhanger. You just dropped a cliffhanger lead. Yeah, I did. Commercials. The Chesterfield you smoke today is the best cigarette ever made. Nose, throat, and accessory organs

not adversely affected by smoking Chesterfields. First such report ever published about any cigarettes, and it applies only to Chesterfield. A responsible consulting organization reports this study by a competent medical specialist and his staff on the effects of smoking Chesterfields. Remember this report, and by Chesterfields, regular or king size. What a buy, they're best for you.

Once Jeremy Spencer joined the Children of God, he largely disappeared from public life. For decades, very little was known about what happened to him inside of the group. And then Daniela Young published a memoir called, uncultured, which is also an excellent title, by the way, about growing up inside the children of God. And guess what, listeners, we are going to have Danielle on the show in the not too distant future, actually. Throughout her book, she repeatedly refers to a powerful figure known only as Uncle Jerry. Uncle Jerry. Now, Danielle never really says who Uncle Jerry is, but she doesn't have to, former members and pretty much anyone who is familiar with the children of God landed on the same answer.

long time ago. Uncle Jerry is, of course, Jeremy Spencer. And what she describes is horrifying. Here is a passage from that book. In a society that has no rank, no class, and no money, Uncle Jerry wielded the power of a general, a duke, and a billionaire. Before he found Jesus and joined the children of God, he'd been one of the founding members of an evil rock band, which had made him a very famous and very rich systemite. A systemite, by the way, is what they call individuals who are not in the children of God, part of the system, supposedly. She continues. He was one of the very few people in our world who still had a regular income from outside because he received royalty checks. He gave all his money to the family, and the money brought him security and impunity. I tried hard to

see what everybody loved so much about him. They called him playful, handsome and funny. But to me, he was short, old, and bald, his goofy British accent and unfunny jokes, a cover-up for how dangerous he really was. Okay, now we have gone over the awful nature of the children of God cult before, as we've mentioned, but for those who wish to be sick to their stomachs this afternoon, it's a good time to rehash those facts. So like many high control groups at the time, the children of God live communally, often crammed into run down houses and apartments

all around the world. Adults and children all live together. David Berg deliberately tried to dismantle the traditional family. Parents were taught that their first loyalty belonged to the movement, not to the children. In many communes, children were effectively raised by the group.

And physical punishment wasn't just accepted, it was encouraged. According to Danielle Young, one of the adults who frequently carried out these punishments was the man she called Uncle Jerry. This is from the book. He loved giving group spankings, seemed to feed off the crying and screams. As bad as his spankings were when he was performing for the crowd, it was always worse when he would take you alone into his room and close the door. But the abuse didn't stop at physical punishment. David Berg taught that God's love should be expressed.

sexually and that there should be virtually no limits on who could express that love, not even age, or family relationships became obstacles. Daniela remembers it this way. We entered the second building. A poolhouse converted to the recording studio and art rooms where the talented adults created the shows and comics spreading the prophet's words. It was what made our commune special. We moved quickly towards the same.

stairs, leading to the sound-proofed basement that housed several small rooms with recording equipment and spare beds. When we got to his punishment room, Uncle Jerry told me to take off my dress and underwear and stand next to the bed. I wanted to kick and punch and bite him. I wanted to draw blood. I knew there was absolutely nothing I could do to stop him. My body was a tool given for the glorification of God. She goes on to discuss more about Uncle Jerry, including... I understood that girls were supposed to sleep without underwear because we had to, quote, air out the smelly and disgusting parts of ourselves.

But I still burned with rage every night when the uncles, especially Uncle Jerry, came into our dorms, to do panty checks. Nice guy. Fuck him. Fuck him. And fuck David Berg. And fuck David Berg's dumb fucking dad.

And fuck, fuck cults. Yeah, I know, right? And also fuck Jeremy Spencer. Sorry, Jeremy. Yeah, you're gross. Fuck Uncle Jerry. And all the other uncles that did this shit.

But Daniela obviously isn't alone. In 1982, Spencer's first wife, Fiona, publicly accused him of statutory rape. She also alleged that she and Spencer had recruited adults to engage in sexual acts with their older children. Harper Collins later published, Not Without My Sister, in which one of the authors describes children's sexual abuse by Spencer in disturbing detail. We are not going to be. to read those passages because, frankly, it's just too difficult to read this shit, and I don't want to. Yeah, I don't want to either.

And where, you ask, was law enforcement and all of this? Well, in 2005, multiple former members submitted sworn affidavits to the FBI in San Diego, alleging child sexual abuse by Uncle Shithead Jeremy Spencer. The investigation ended the following year when federal president, prosecutors declined to file charges because the alleged crimes fell outside of the statute of limitations. So Jeremy has never been convicted. Just another old, white, dude who's done horrible things and continues to get away with it. Cults are very good at hiding crimes and hiding him apparently. He's currently outside of the United States supposedly in Ireland. Now, in 2009, Jeremy responded to the allegations by writing,

quote, I could go about trying to refute at it or even erase where possible what is written about me, although that in itself could be construed as covering up and it could be fruitless, considering that anyone can say anything about anyone on the internet or in books these days, virtually with impunity. Instead, I prefer to go on with my life and, for those interested, Let my music speak for itself. Uh-huh. Well, I wrote a song, Tyler. Yeah, you did, Liz.

About Uncle Jerry. I did. Oh. I actually did. And I had my good friend Suno created in the style of Fleetwood Mac. Oh. And this is for you, Uncle Jerry. We got a request.

Going out to the listeners of Was I and a Cult. This is Liz Iyakuzi. with Fuck You Uncle Jerry. I too will just let the music speak for itself. I'm sorry, The children have spoken. You're a goddamn monster and terribly broken.

You left the evil rock and roll and troll. Fuck you, Uncle Jerry. Twist the game. Who's to blame left behind. Rotten hell, you pathetic car. Amazing. I'm both I'm both

and terrified of what creating music and art in the future will be but regardless I still had to curing it and I had to write the lyrics Of course you did You still have to

But there was some creative talent involved But you know It's not just the cults Not just the cults That can make good music So thank you Liz Hopefully that will be number one

In France too But Jeremy He spoke about letting the music speak for himself. So what is he exactly talking about? Well, apparently Uncle Jerry announced plans to tour the United States back in February of 2014. And he even launched a Kickstarter to raise funds for the production of a new album titled Coventry Blues. Terrible title. However, former members, well, they weren't having it.

No, they weren't. The Safe Passage Foundation launched a petition urging, venues and supporters to cancel the tour to, quote, take a stand against child abuse. And guess what? Four days later, Spencer's publicist announced that the tour had been canceled due to unspecified health reasons. Unspecified health reasons.

Unspecified. Would you like me to specify it? Yes, doctor. The creator is a sick bastard. And he's permanently unwell. There is no cure except to just go away. Going away. Permanently go away.

Live eternity in hell having to listen to Liz's song on repeat. Exactly. Over. Uncle Jerry, we know. Now, here is one final twist to the story. Three of Jeremy's children who eventually left the children of God while they formed their own band named Jynxt. It's a strange name is J-Y-N-T. Jeremy devoted his musical talent to the children of God for decades and his children used music to escape it.

This is one of their songs. Jeremy Spencer is now 78 years old. His legacy isn't just the music he made, it's the lives that he helped permanently damage. All because one morning in 1971, Jeremy Spencer went out to buy a magazine. And history has its strange trade-offs because had Jeremy Spencer stayed in Fleetwood Mac and not joined Children of God, well, Lindsay Buckingham and Stevie Nix may never have joined, and we may never have such great songs as one of my favorites, Sofer Springs. Now, since we always like to end on a hopeful note, one final passage from Daniela Young and her. her book, Uncultured.

We packed up two Volkswagen vans with our new family of nine. I tearfully said a silent goodbye to my family within the family, and then a realization hit me, a sudden ray of light breaking through my sorrow and grief. We were going so far away that I would probably never, ever have to deal with Uncle Jerry again. Now, most of us won't have an Uncle Jerry again. but almost all of us have something that we might need to leave behind. Sometimes it is a person, sometimes it is a belief.

Sometimes it's just a fear or whatever it is. I hope you, listener, find your Volkswagen fan. And drive. And go with the windows down so everyone can hear you singing loudly. The Uncle Jerry song, play it again. again, Rob. And don't stop for magazines. We will be back next week with a guest sharing a riveting story of her time on a UFO sex cult boat.

Yeah, what? That's not a typo. It's a UFO. Don't say we don't try to continue to surprise you guys because we do. He would always call us little pussy cats. His women were pussy cats. So his pussy cats, he would have them all in his meeting, and then he would do the energetic treatment.

So basically him fingering everyone until they would climax, and the women would look me in the eyes when they climaxed, and I was very embarrassed by it. And then he would say to me, you see, Laurine, we are like one body here. We are all connected. We're fluid in the energy. Thank you for listening everyone to this very unique episode.

I hope it paid off in the long run and that you got to listen to some crazy music and some of it is stuck in your head. Well, this episode was written by you, Tyler. Kudos. I mean, again, I mean, I tossed it off in 10 months. It was no big deal. Just spent way too much bloody time on this episode.

I had too much fun. And didn't have much fun. at the same time. Hosted, written, produced by Tyler. Meesam. Oh, we basically do the same shit on this show. We share the same shovels of dirt. It goes from one to another.

Yes, you collect those millions of dollars of royalties on the Uncle Jerry song. That mailbox money, Liz. Oh, I can't wait. Keep it coming. Keep it coming. And Rob Pera, who spent too much time probably on this as well. Oh, we just got an email. I was in an ice cream cult.

I was in an ice cream cult. It's not a very interesting story because I was thrown out after six months when I didn't give the leader the level of devotion she wanted. Oh my God. We got our ice cream cult story. She's that can be real. That can't be real.

Thanks everyone for listening. Thank you all. Never go back again. Chesterfield King Size at the new low price, Chesterfield Regular. And what a pair this is! Hollywood Starlets, Gene, and Joan Corbett. It's easy to see why we picked them for Chesterfield's poster of the month. Let's see what size Chesterfield Gene likes.

I go for regulars. They're best for me because they have the taste and mildness I want. I agree with what Jean says about Chesterfields, except for the size. I've smoked king-sized Chesterfields. ever since they came out. Buy a carton at the new low price. Chesterfield King size. Chesterfield regular.

They satisfy millions. You know, Chesterfield is the only cigarette I can speak for because it's the only cigarette I smoke. I've smoked Chesterfields for 22 years, and I recommend you try them. They satisfy and how. There you are, friends. Chesterfield is best for Ed Sullivan.

Chesterfield is best for you. People smoke Chesterfields and we tell you what happens. Scientifically, but simply. A medical specialist is making regular bimonthly examinations of a group of people from various walks of life. Forty-five percent of this group have been smoking Chesterfields for an average of over 10 years. After eight months, the medical specialist reports he observed no adverse effects on the nose, throat, or sinuses of this group from smoking Chesterfields. And remember, friends, Chesterfield is the only cigarette to give you this scientific evidence on the effects of smoking. So try them, won't you?

Prove what we say. Chesterfield is best for you much milder to give you all the smoking pleasure the modern cigarette can give.