Was I In A Cult? - WISE (aka Scientology): “Stop Interbulating Me!” [RE-RELEASE]

Episode Date: June 2, 2025

**This episode originally aired in May 2023**Fresh to the workforce, Amber answered a job posting for a dental assitant: “No experience needed!” Looking for something reliable to support her new life as a single mother, she was thrilled when she got hired. Little did she know, her new job would be more than just dental work…Follow Us for More Culty Content:Instagram & TikTok: @wasiinacultSupport the Show:Was I In A Cult? is listener-powered. If the show has moved you, made you laugh, or made you question your group chat - please rate, review, and share.Want ad-free episodes + bonus content? Join our Patreon!Share Your Story:Have a cultic experience to share? We’re listening.Email us at [e-mail] Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Welcome everyone to Was I in a Cult? I'm Liz Iacuzzi. And I'm Tyler Meesom. And this week we're doing something, well, a little bit different. Yep, we're giving you a rerun, a re-release as they say. A re-broadcast. A throwback. An encore. Straight from the vault. Unearthed from the warm whispering crevice

of the back catalog, pulled from the cavernous depths of our echo chamber that is our collective podcast pelvis. This just keeps getting weirder. It did, it got weird. Now before you throw your phone across the room in protest, please let us explain. Yes, because we are doing this for you,, and for us, because very soon we're dropping the first of a jaw-dropping two-part saga about a guest who was born into Scientology.

And it's not just a compelling episode, it exposes a whole other side of Scientology that many listeners may have never known to exist. So, while we put the finishing touches on that episode, and by finishing touches we mean writing it, recording it, editing it, crying, re-recording, yelling at each other, making me cry, Liz making me question everything I've ever done. We are going to give you one of our most bonkers episodes from my vault.

Official bonkers. This is from the vault. Not my vault? And this is a favorite. No, it is not your vault. It is a collective vault. It's not the deep cavernous area of my vault. Okay, continue. And this one is a favorite. It's sneaky, it's weird, it has marbles, graphs, org charts, a shrine to a woman named Doctor, who may or may not be licensed to drill. You just did that. You did it. No regrets. It also happens to have deep, deep ties to, yes, Scientology.

So think of this rerun as a primer, a little warm it up. A little foreplay. It's like stretching before sprint through the trenches of religious manipulation. Or flossing before the dental cult cavity filling. So here it is, guys. We bring you the unforgettable story of Amber, a woman who answered a Craigslist ad for a dental receptionist job and accidentally found herself being recruited into a cult. That's that can't that doesn't sound true. You know, Scientology will never cease to amaze you, Tyler.

They're on Craigslist and they're on sides of buildings and they have ads during the World Cup. They're everywhere. So with that, enjoy. cup. They're everywhere. So with that, enjoy. Most people that I tell the story to either think I'm wildly exaggerating or they're just so thrown by the whole thing that they're kind of speechless. There are some groups that you can say, oh, I was in this group and people are like, oh, you were in a cult. Not a lot of people are going to react that way when you tell them you worked at a dental

office. But as far as the actual Scientology side of things went, you didn't know what they didn't want you to know. Welcome to Was I in a Cult? I'm your host, Liz Iacuzzi. You sure are, but I'm also your host, Tyler Meeson. And you guys, before we get to today's story, we have to share. We don't have to, Liz. We are going to.

We, no, we have to share an incredible shit story. Literally, that we got after last week's episode. Yeah, if you didn't listen to last week's episode, there was a moment where we discussed defecating into your garden. My garden or just a garden? Any garden because the cult leader of that group used to fertilize his crops that way. Yeah so we joked to send us your human feces fertilization stories and well you flushed them right to us. And this, ladies and gentlemen, this is from Bridget Blake. Hi guys, after listening to this week's story,

I had to write in about my experience with fertilizing with poop. I used to work at a wastewater treatment plant. In the plant, we had screens that would catch any solids that you didn't want going into the plant process. So basically anything your body didn't break down as well as all kinds of stuff people liked to flush. Underwear, T-shirts, even money.

Did you know people flush T-shirts on the toilet toilet? I've never done it. The things that got caught by the screens were eventually moved into a dumpster that was super gross. One summer, tomato plants started growing in the cracks of the concrete in front of the dumpster room. The old man I worked with would eat the damn tomatoes. These plants came from seeds that were processed in someone else's body.

Yuck. Direct quote. That's her yuck. It's also our yuck. Anyway, hope you enjoyed my story. And don't eat fruits and veggies grown from someone's shit. Love, Bridget. Oh boy.

Thank you, Bridget. That really made our day. This is why podcasts were invented. That story alone, Liz, is the reason people have ears. There is also another incredible one or two, but we'll save it after the credits. Because really we really must get to today's story. Yeah and I apologize I still have a sort of cold thing going on so I'm still going to sound like a good old Midwest mom today. On the show, if you haven't noticed, we feature cults that run the gamut.

And the way this guest came to us was fantastic. We opened up our email one day and we got this in the subject line. Oh my god guys, was I in a cult? Question mark exclamation point. And when I read her email, I was speechless. It takes a lot to make Liz speechless. That is true. Yeah, we won't go into too much of what the email said as to not give anything away, but eventually we got to the line, I was in a cult and it was my job. And when I talked to her and she told me her story, I was like, wow, yes, 100% we were

having her on our show. Plus, she's wonderful, funny, and very personable. Her name is Amber. She was a pleasure to talk to. So because her cult was her job, let's start Amber's story when she first entered the workforce. So I did mostly retail work. However, those jobs only ever pay minimum wage. And then when I was 20, I had my first kid, my daughter. So I started looking for something that I could do to make more money. I found this ad on Craigslist that said no experience needed. Hiring dental assistants starting at $10 an hour. And they were having open interviews. I didn't even have to submit a resume or an application.

I didn't even know what a dental assistant did, but I figured they'd tell me. It was a pretty standard dental office. The building was between an orthodontist and a dance studio or something like that. was between an orthodontist and a dance studio or something like that. The first thing that they did was they handed you a packet of paper on a clipboard. The very top piece of paper was an agreement that said, this office uses technology from WISE, which is the World Institute of Scientology Enterprises. It's not affiliated with the Church of Scientology and only borrows different technologies from books by L. Ron Hubbard. So essentially it was just saying like, we use this training material in this office and if you are okay

with this, sign your name. Okay, I personally had never heard of WISE and I was quite intrigued. So clearly the first thing I did was check out the website, which I found to be wildly misleading. It's WISE.org and the photo on the front page is of a mama lion and her two cubs. And at first glance, you may think that you stumbled

upon some sort of charitable wildlife situation. Yeah, and in the top left is the Wise logo, also a lion and two cubs, and under that it says Publisher of Prosperity Magazine. Whatever the fuck that means. And then the main text on the page says, Join Wise, the membership for everyone using the Hubbard administrative technology in business today. They couldn't be more covert if they were Jason Bourne. You love Jason Bourne, don't you?

I mean, he's hot, he's a spy, he kicks things and jumps and yeah, of course. Every guy likes Jason Bourne. I don't care who you are, every guy would like to be Jason Bourne just for a couple of days. Would you rather be Jason Bourne or James Bond? Very important question.

Amy lost her answer. Instagram poll coming up. Jason Bourne, James Bond. I think I'd take James Bond. I'd rather be Oprah. Boring. Oprah's never shot two guns whilst jumping in the air. As far as we know. I had really no idea what Scientology was. I think everybody knew Tom Cruise was a Scientologist,

but it was just a silly, quirky thing. It wasn't something nefarious at all. This was 2009. I probably would have agreed to just about anything for $10 an hour back then. So I just signed it and moved on. A girl came out and addressed the entire group and did this whole like spiel about how they were founded, who the owner of the office is, who their mascot is. They have a mascot. It was the giant costume of a tooth and his name was Herbie and he was named after the little elf in Rudolph that wanted to be a dentist. He doesn't like to make toys. Do you mind telling me what you do want to do?

Well sir, someday I'd like to be a dentist. A dentist? A man came out and introduced himself and he was just like, hi, I'm Jo. I own this dental office with my wife. I'm not a dentist. She's a dentist. Dentist. Dentist.

So I got called back by Joe and he did my interview and he was so cool. It was just like we were chit chatting and he was like super laid back. He's like, I really like you, I think that you're gonna be really good for this office. We'd like to offer you the position. I was like, yes. Remember to take note of the process

and how she experienced Joe right from the start. He was warm, laid back, like two old friends, just having a nice chat. Mr. Cool Man Joe, Joe Cool. Also note, it seems she was probably hired mostly due to her outgoing personality. I really wanted this job to work, but I had no idea if I was going to be able to do it.

When I came in, I was basically just seated next to this front office receptionist, Amanda. She told me that her task is to train me to operate just like she does so that she can take a higher position. So Amanda gave me a tour of the office, you know, pretty standard stuff. There was 35 employees. She introduced me to some of the staff and managers, Christine and Doug. Those are fake. All of them so far have been fake. The names, that is.

But not the mascot name. That was real. So Doug did a lot of the back stuff. So his job was ostensibly to keep everything on schedule. Christine was like the front office manager. So far pretty normal I'd say. One thing I noticed is anytime they referred to the owner of the practice they only called her doctor. You didn't say the rest of her name. There was also a giant portrait of Doctor hanging on the wall. It was off-putting. It was huge. And if the oversized portrait wasn't enough, there was a little shrine with other framed

photos of Doctor enjoying life with the people she loves. Super creepy. And if the shrine wasn't enough, Amanda then shows her the weirdest thing of all. She was like, this is a picture of Doctor and that is a box where you can send her a message and there was like this wooden box with a lock on it with cards and you could write whether you're an employee or a patient anything to doctor that you want to. It's really important to her that everybody has a direct line of communication to her that can't be intercepted by anybody else.

She will always open the box and she will always read the messages. You could ask her anything. It's weird. Yeah. That's like most dental office, right? And then the next stop on the tour. She showed me the wall in the break room, which was the org chart, and it had every job title, and it was separated into divisions. I have a cheat sheet. Hold on. And while she gets that cheat sheet, let's learn a little about

Scientology, shall we? Of course, I'm sure most of you listening know a bit about this behemoth of a cult, but here is a 30-second description, courtesy of ChapGPT. Scientology is a controversial religious movement founded by science fiction writer L. Ron Hubbard in the 1950s. It's based on the belief that humans are immortal spiritual beings called Thetans. Traumatic experiences in past lives affect our present existence. Scientology offers counseling called auditing and courses to help individuals rid themselves of these negative influences.

Critics argue that it is a cult-like organization that manipulates and exploits its followers, while the Church of Scientology claims to be a legitimate religion promoting self-improvement. The movement has faced legal challenges and controversies over the years. Oh, to say the least, Mr. Robot. Now, back to this org chart. Alright, so there's Division 1, that was my division, that's communication. Division 2, which is the dissemination division. Division 3, treasury. Division 4, that was my division, that's communication. Division 2, which is the dissemination division. Division 3, treasury. Division 4, technical division. Division 6, public division. Their main job was deleting bad reviews online. I

don't know how else to say that. And then Division 7 was the executive division. So that was basically my very first interaction with the org division. So that was basically my very first interaction with the org chart. And I was like, well, yes, that's a thing that they do in offices. I wish the org chart was the weirdest thing, but it wasn't. Next, Amanda continues the tour of the office and? She brought me into the room off of the break room.

And there was like a couple of long tables and this big shelf just loaded with these blue books. And she said, this is the course room. And she said, well, Joe runs the course room and he will bring you back into the course room for about an hour to learn business courses. Business classes at a dental office? But the way it was presented was free business school, essentially. Wow, these people really care about their

employees' vertical career growth. And I thought if I can take these business courses while I'm working and maybe later put them on my resume. Like, that's amazing. So aside from a few small oddities, the life-size portrait of Doctor, who goes by no other name, the divisions of labor and the free business classes, the first day of work training is going fairly normal for Amber. Although this is her first office job,

so she has nothing really to compare it to. But it wouldn't stay normal for long. That's your total, like, things are about to get it to. But it wouldn't stay normal for long. That's your total, like, things are about to get worse read. Stop, beat, finish the line. Well, give me a better line then. Give me a better line. I'm just going to have chat GPT do this for you.

Give me a better line. No, it's a great line. It's a great line and a great read. I'm just saying it's very, we cut and paste it from every episode. We should get Chachi BT to learn it and then just do it in my voice. Clone your voice. But it wouldn't stay normal. It wouldn't stay normal for long.

During my tour of the office, Doctor came into the building and everybody's complete demeanor changed. We're like holding this woman in reverence and it was very weird because she's just some regular lady but she wasn't, she was doctor. Dentist. Dentist! When she came in, Christine and Doug, they were right there by her side. It reminded me kind of, you remember the West Wing, how they were always walking? It was always like a huge group of people. That's what it was like. It was like, Dr. walked in and these three people would just be together and everywhere

she went, they were with her. They introduced her to me like I was being lest to meet her. They said, Dr, this is Amber. She's doing her working interview today for Front Desk. And she went, oh, good. And that was that. It was just like a pretty pleasant interaction. It was fine.

It wasn't a big deal. But she had the craziest smile and not in a good way. She smiled with every tooth in her mouth and I don't know that any of them were natural teeth. It was creepy and her eyes were kind of fixed. And that was the picture in the shrine. That's what I had to walk past every day was this photo of this creepy smile, these creepy eyes. So next, Amanda gives Amber a package to take to the post office. Does that fall under communication? Is that under her line of?

It's part of her division, yes. It's part of her division. Yes, apparently. Well then Amanda, you get a pass. And the woman working the counter at the post office took everything out of the envelope and she was like, it has to go in this other flat rate envelope. And I came back into the office and I went to walk over to Amanda and doctor was standing right there.

And she turns and speaks directly to doctor. And I was like, they said that if you need to mail that out again. And she looked at me like I spit on her shoe and said, thanks for the information. And then just walked away. And I was like, that was weird. I later learned I did not go through the proper lines.

I was not supposed to give doctor that information. It's not in her hat. That's how I learned what a hat is. I mean, that's easy. Who doesn't know what a hat is? I know what a hat is, Liz. What is a hat? Thing that you put on your head.

Wrong. Yeah, it wasn't a hat that you put on your head. Wrong. Yeah, it wasn't a hat that you put on your head. A hat is a detailed, ongoing job description. A binder filled with documents, instructions, policy, anything that applies to the job that you are doing and you study it and you memorize it. And it was like the Bible, basically. It was just like the metaphor

of you know she wears many hats. You may not wear more than one hat and if you're going to wear a different hat it cannot be until you have mastered your current hat. So the training was me sitting next to Amanda and watching her do the job while I had the hat on my lap. And she's answering phone call after phone call after phone call. And she tells me that there is a very specific phone greeting. Good morning. Thank you for calling Gentle Dentistry of L.A.

My name is Amanda. How can I help you today? There was a lot of pressure on Amanda to make sure that I was not put on the phone until I had it perfect. And if you don't say it perfectly, this is an issue with Dr. So we have Joe, the friendly, personable, cool Joe, husband of Dr. Amanda, who was the current receptionist looking to move up in divisions. And then there were the managers,

Christine and Doug. And Christine, she took a special interest in Amber. And it was a priority of hers to really get to know me. She would ask me about my life and, you know, she asked me all these questions about my daughter and she was like, oh my gosh, I have two kids. So it was very, very immediate that she wanted me to really like her and open up to her.

I just felt immediately welcomed into the fold and I loved that. It felt really good. Two words. What are they? Rhymes with Dovepalming. Love bombing. There you go. I'm so smart! Mm-hmm. But then they dropped another type of bomb. When Christine told me that her and Doug were Scientologists, I was just like, that's cool. And she's like, doctor is really active in the church as well. You know, she told me, I was genuinely curious. So I would ask Christine questions. And she was like, give me a call when you get home after you get your daughter settles

and we'll talk. And I did. I called her and she was like, so me a call when you get home after you get your daughter settles and we'll talk and I did I called her and she was like, so what questions do you have? And I was like, well, I just I kind of had the same questions that I would have about any religion what is Scientology's answer to where we go when we die and her response was That's entirely up to you. It's less about where you go when you die and more about what you do while you're here." I was like, okay, fair enough I guess. And I asked her about what's his name? Xenu? The alien warlord that supposedly all

Scientologists believe in. Yeah, I mean just the same questions about any religion. What's up with Xenu? We had the same question, so here's a 30-second definition of Xenu, courtesy of ChatGPT. Xenu is a central figure in the cosmology of Scientology. According to the religion's teachings, Xenu was an alien ruler who brought billions of his people to Earth, stacked them around volcanoes, and destroyed them with hydrogen bombs. old would come up with. I put him all around the volcanoes because of the lava. What's this drawing of, Timmy? These are the Theatons. This is a bomb and it blows him up in the volcano. And a volcano?

It's very nice. And he wants to kill all of his people. It continues. The souls of these beings, known as Theatons, are said to attach themselves to humans, causing spiritual and psychological issues. This story is revealed only to those who have reached the advanced levels of Scientology, and it is regarded as highly confidential. Critics view the Xenu story as evidence of Scientology's alleged cult-like nature and fantastical beliefs.

No idea where they would get a crazy idea like that, Tyler. I don't know. I just had to reread that and maybe Chad GPT is wrong, but volcanoes, hydrogen bombs, alien ruler, souls, thetons, this is lunacy. I'm sorry, it is just madness. It seems like something only a science fiction writer could come up with. Yeah, a terrible science fiction writer.

It's just ridiculous that people buy this. I'm sorry. You should be sorry. Should be really sorry. I'm not, because I'm not in it, thank God. It is. It's absolutely preposterously insane, but aren't so many things in cults or religion. Don't get me started on the Bible.

So Amber questions Christine about this, and Christine, well, she kind of plays dumb. I mean, I would. Why does she play dumb? Cause she believes the shit. It's not hard to play dumb when you're fucking dumb. And she was just like, I've been a Scientologist since I was born. And I promise you never once have I ever heard of anything like that. And I was just like, yeah, that's what I figured.

Cause that sounds nuts. And that was it. It was just the normal conversation about religion. So by this point, Amber is working as the office receptionist, and she's getting pretty good at it. And in line with other oddities, there is a specific protocol for every incoming phone call. When we got a phone call or a letter, it had to go directly to the person it was meant for. If you get a phone call and the person says, I'd like to schedule a new patient appointment, I would say, okay, I'll get you right over to our new patient coordinator. There was a notebook.

You had to write down every single call that came in. The average number of phone calls I answered in a day was like 90, which is a lot of phone calls. In the beginning, she would answer all of these calls with Amanda looking over her shoulder. I also noticed that when people were coming up to her, they were giving her this graph paper. She would collect it all. And I found out that was everybody's stats. So everybody had a stat to track. For me, it was phone calls coming in. And you had to count that every day and plot it on a graph. And then you would draw the line on the graph and based on the direction your line is going

in you would be assigned a condition. If it was going straight up you were in affluent condition. And then if the line is just like steadily going up but not as steep that's normal condition. That's kind of where you want to be, because affluence can't last forever. The line was going slightly down, that's emergency. And that's when you answer questions about how are you going to head this off before it gets any steeper? And then if it's steeply down, you're in danger.

Hold on, I was just getting the hang of everything. There's the weird doctor lady with the larger than life photo who thinks she's Madonna and only goes by doctor. Then there's the org chart with all the various divisions, the proper lines of communication. Hats, there's don't forget hats. And hats, everybody has their hat. But now she just threw in stats and affluent conditions. I swear to God, I'm going to need a glossary of terms by the time this episode is over.

We have only scratched the surface. So everyone had their stat put on a graph. And you would take those stats, deliver them to Christine or Doug, and every morning there was a meeting and everybody had to hold up their graphs one at a time and say, this is my stat, this is my condition in front of everybody every day, every day. Those questions that were kind of shaming you for not doing your job the right way, for not meeting your stat, you had to answer those in front of all of your co-workers. They take the graphs and they hang them along a wall. It doesn't matter how hard you work, it doesn't matter how correctly you do everything. What matters is that line on

the graph and if yours isn't going up then you're just not good at your job. And my stat was incoming phone calls. So when you have a decline in incoming phone calls, how do you take responsibility for that? I was very confused by it and I did talk to Doug and I said, if I am quantifying my job by incoming phone calls, I should have some control over something that impacts how many people call in. Shouldn't I have something to say about the advertising?

And he said, you're looking at this through the wrong lens. If you're not getting calls into the office, it's because you don't have enough intention on your lines. Basically what he was saying is if calls weren't coming in, it's because I didn't want them to. You heard that ladies and gentlemen, that person ghosts you. It's your fault clearly because you didn't have enough intention on your line. They would use words in weird ways like intention. It's your fault, clearly, person who didn't have enough intention.

One day, Amber approached Christine to simply tell her something. And she just looked at me and walked away. And she walked into Kim's office. She was standing there with Kim. Kim was another woman who worked at the office. She was like looking at mail or something. And I walked in behind her, and I tried to continue the office. She was like looking at mail or something. And I walked in behind her and I tried to continue

the conversation and she says, stop interpolating me. And I was a little shocked. I guess I was just kind of standing there like quiet and I was like, am I supposed to know this word? I don't know what that means. That's gonna be the title of our episode, by the way, stop and Turbulent Me. Do you know I looked it up and it is a word invented by L. Ron Hubbard. What is it? What does it mean?

It just means like, according to him causing turbulence. So like stressing you out or like making you feel negative. Tyler's going to have to stop and interrelating me for the rest of the season. You've just created a monster over here. I'm sure Christine had a perfectly cromulent reason to be annoyed with her. It was probably more of an acidumbuckery reason. I ultimately found out that the org board was not the only thing that was modeled after the church. Every aspect of the company was

run like the Church of Scientology. Yeah, remember those free business courses? Joe, doctor's husband, would tell us we were having course time that day and we would go into the course room and we would learn the courses. And Joe had to be there. You couldn't just go in the course room by yourself. He had to be there to guide your learning. So the first course, it's basically telling you the right way to learn. One thing was called a misunderstood. According to them, if you're reading and you don't know the definition of a word, you have

to stop in a dictionary, look it up and you cannot keep reading until you fully comprehend the meaning of that word. You can't absorb anything else that you read. Another was gradients. If you come across something that you can't understand, that means it's too steep a gradient. You got to go back. Okay Tyler, I can't even keep track anymore. I'm definitely gonna need that glossary. Yeah, you don't want to disfactorily make a mistake, now would you? No, I could never confunctionally do that without feeling blastophic about the whole thing. Yeah, it's completely desmorical, in my opinion, Liz. Desmorical.

Oh, did I say it incorrectly? There's workbooks and then they have those little clear flat marbles and you would have to take those little marbles on the table and show Joe with these marbles that you understood what you just read. And then he would tell you if you can move on to the next chapter. If he did it wrong, he would do it for you and he would show you like, this is the idea. So like it literally made no sense. It was used for everything, but this is that I have to learn this stuff so that I can be successful in this job.

Eventually he took another course about the tone scale. So the tone scale is basically just a chart and at the bottom is apathy. And then you would go up to grief, fear, hostility, anger, antagonism, boredom, conservatism, strong interest and then enthusiasm. We had to memorize the tone scale. There was also this thing called ARC. It was a triangle and each side of the triangle had a label. Affinity, reality, and communication. Affinity is you have to basically be somebody that other people want to be around. Reality is the way you

relate to them and then the other corner is communication. You have to have all three of those things in order to have effective communication with somebody and you have to move them up the tone scale. That one was manipulative. The financing girls were taught the tone scale over and over and they beat it into their head. And the reason why this tone scale was drilled into the finance girls' head was because it was to be used on the customers,

which we will get to very shortly. But first, it's important to note the types of clientele that this dentist office was targeting. They were very focused on attracting people who were afraid of the dentist. And then they see these advertisements that say, come in for a free visit. Go ahead, remind them, Tyler.

Ahem, nothing is free. They would call, they would say, I haven't been to the dentist since I was seven years old and had a terrible experience. And you can sit them down and you can shame them for how long it's been since they've been to the dentist and that is why they targeted people who were scared of the dentist. At their first visit, they would come in for an exam and x-rays. That was the free part. And then the exam would lead to the treatment plan. And that's where the supreme con artistry would come in.

They would present this massive treatment plan with thousands of dollars of work that needed to be done. When the truth is, usually none of that work actually needed to be done. If you came in for just the one toothache, we are going to treat your whole mouth, the entire mouth. The rule was you can't start your treatment until the entire plan is paid for. So these financing girls had people walking into their office with these treatment plans, 10, 15, 20 thousand dollars worth of on it, and they would set these people down in the office,

and they would have to move them up the tone scale. Okay, so this is why the finance girls were so well-versed on the tone scale. And pay attention, because this manipulative sales tactic could be used on you at some point. They're trained to covertly pick up on where they are. They're angry, so they're meeting them right there at anger. Like, how long has it been since you've been to the dentist? The tone has to seem angry. You're supposed to be angry with them, but you're also pressuring them.

And then immediately the person gets defensive, right? You're also trying to move them up and up and up to the point where they are enthusiastic about paying for that treatment and getting it started. And that is their training. That is what they're trained to do. So like the next one up is boredom. So now the finance girl is like easing her tone into just like, yeah, whatever. They don't care either way what you do.

And that's when you kind of get the person going, wait, wait a minute. I know I need this work done. Like you can't, we can't disengage yet. I need to talk about this. I need to know what to do. I need to know what my options are. That's how we get them to say, yeah, no, I definitely need this work done, but I just don't have that kind of money.

And that's when they would start with, what about like your 401k? Do you have like a vacation fund somewhere? How about a cry card with a high limit? And then they would start with, what about like your 401k? Do you have like a vacation fund somewhere? How about a credit card with a high limit? Maybe a family member or a friend can loan it to you. There was no taking no for an answer. So that's why people were calling grandma from the office asking to borrow 15 grand.

So they would go tens of thousands of dollars into debt. That is massively fucked up. That was probably the worst part of the job was watching that happen. Wazaynokult is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Hey, you like playing games, Liz? Is the Pope from Chicago, Tyler? Yeah, apparently he is. Do you ever find yourself playing the budgeting game?

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When I would walk into that office, I would breathe a sigh of relief. I would walk in and I would think to myself, I'm around people that understand me. I was thrilled to go to work. I felt really good every time I walked in. And that was by design. You know, there was a big effort to make me feel that way. I was in the inner circle. Christine especially really, really wanted to sink her claws into me. And she started really pushing.

She was like, you know what you should do? You should go to the church and get some auditing done. I think you would really benefit from it. It's been like a huge help for me and my stress levels. And I was just like, Christine, it's cool that you are so passionate about it. I'm glad that you found something that helps you. Not my thing. But Christine also didn't like hearing no. There was a time I was upset about this guy that I had dated and we broke up and he was

like sending me nasty text messages, you know, because we were in our early 20s and that's what you do. And it was annoying me. And she just like said something like, yeah, if only there was something that you could do to help you with your emotional mind and your reactive mind. I was just like, man, she's not going to let this go. That one sounds like what man, she's not gonna let this go. That one sounds like what, Tyler? Thrive-o-polation. Is that another Elrond word?

What does that one mean? Definition, adjective, to thrive, with intention. Huh, which oddly is what Amber started to do. Is that an adjective or a verb? I don't know, you said it, you made up the fucking word. I worked one-on-one with Amanda until management felt like I could be left alone. Amanda went to learn some of her new duties as moving up in the division, and it became my job to collect everybody's graphs and stats, which gave me permission to go up into the private

executive office once a day. Jo had a desk up there, this like beautiful mahogany desk. It was gorgeous. It had to be just thousands of dollars. When every once in a while I would go up and Christine would be there dusting the desk, moving things around on the desk, setting out like a bottle of water. And I asked her one day, I was like, whose desk is that? And she's like, this is for doctor. We make sure that every day it's exactly the way she wants it just in case she comes in. But there were times where she was doing it and like knowing full well doctor was in Africa for two or three weeks and she would still do this. Every single day, just faithfully organized the desk. Well, that's fucking creepy. It gets creepier at every

church of Scientology. There is an office that's roped off, cleaned and organized every single day for when Elron Hubbard is reincarnated and comes back. And it's set up exactly the way he preferred his desk to be set up. So she was basically treating Doctor like Elron. Whether she was there or not, she was there. And it was always, what does Doctor want? What should we do for doctor? Doctor doesn't want us to do it this way. Was doctor ever being a doctor?

No. I think she saw a patient once while I worked there. She was teaching seminars, pitching lies to other offices, dentists, chiropractors, things like that. But there were a number of people who actually did perform dentistry in this office. One day we were onboarding a new dentist, Dr. Dano. Dentist.

A dentist! And they had him fill out his new hire paperwork in the course room. And I happened to be doing course room time at that time. And after Joe walked out of the room, Dr. Dano said, you know they're having you read those books because they're trying to recruit you into the church. And I was like, what makes you say that? Then he said, they hired you because you're weak minded

and they know that they can recruit you. I went to Amanda. I told her everything. She walked away and comes back with Joe, and they bring me into an office. I'm telling you, I'm shaking. And he sat me down, he was like, tell me everything. And I told him, it was a very short conversation. I said, that's not true. That's not what's happening here. And he looked at me and he said, so what do you think right now? And I looked at him for a second

and we kind of like locked eyes and I said, Joe, are you asking me if I think that you're recruiting me into the church of Scientology? And he said, do you? And I said, no, I don't think that. And he said, okay, go back to work. And then Dr. Danno was fired immediately. Yeah, I hate that story.

I hate myself in that story. I really do. It's just not one of my proudest moments, I guess. But her reaction was understandable. Little did she know this entire time she was being slowly indoctrinated with the learned language, the nonsensical protocols. I don't know Liz, I think the protocols are perfectly senticannuous. And that's why they had to

fire Dr. Dano. He was a threat to their operation. After that happened, that's when shit got really crazy because now they trusted me and now they felt like I had their back. So they were a little bit more open about talking about the church. As far as the actual Scientology side of things went, you didn't know what they didn't want you to know. And what they did want you to know, you knew it when they wanted you to know it. But when you got to the point where they think, okay, she's going to believe this, she's going to find this plausible, that's when they tell you. And that's where the gradient comes in. That's what it actually is. It's not that, you know,

you struggle to learn something. It's that you weren't brainwashed enough to hear it. You weren't brainwashed enough to believe it. I wasn't scared of joining a cult because I was already in one. I was already there. I was already using the same words. The system was already in place. I was like, you know, I could do it. I could join the church. They were always talking about their outreach, their philanthropy, the wonderful things they do for the community. And it doesn't feel like a religion. It feels like a self-improvement thing. I considered it for a minute.

The office, which for years had been thriving, for some reason went into a decline. Pure patients, less people calling in, and the managers, they were worried. They were more than worried, Tyler. They went completely horrible-atic over the entire situation. Good word. That's when they started looking at graphs. They started looking at stacks. They started looking at everything and saying, where are the suppressives?

So, okay. Now, what is a suppressive? Well, Amber was taught that a suppressive is basically a lower level human. A person who is negative a lower level human, a person who is negative, antisocial, who doesn't have enough intention, anyone who speaks poorly about the office, etc. These are all suppressives.

And it was demonizing to be labeled one. And for Scientologists, it's really just anyone who leaves the church or speaks out against it, like us right now. We're suppressives. Christine pulled every dental assistant into the course room and said, the reason that your schedules are empty and it's the reason that your doctors aren't making any money because somebody here doesn't want it to happen.

Christine demanded to know which one of them was a suppressive. And this was turning into a pretty consistent thing thing searching for the suppressives in the office and Over time Christine became really intense and scary. She raised her voice pretty frequently if somebody was doing something Suppressive somebody didn't have enough intention. She had every right to come at them. You're not doing it the right way crying was have enough intention. She had every right to come at them. You're not doing it the right way. Crying was super common at that office. And then Joe would come, because he was the comfort, the father of the office. And he would always say that crying is a good thing. It means you're learning. And that's when they throw it at you. Like, you should go to the church. You should get some auditing done. This isn't you. You're not meant to react this way.

Knock you down then build you up. Constantly keeping you in a state of confusion. One time I was having a phone conversation. It was a really intense conversation and I took my phone out to my car because I didn't want anybody to hear what was going on. And the conversation ended and I just started crying. I was so emotional and I'm just like staring at my steering wheel, just sobbing. And I hear it tap at my window. I look at it's Christine and I rolled the window down and she just very intensely said, this is your reactive mind.

Do you want to live like this forever? You need to go to the church. You need to go today. And I was upset and I couldn't drive away because she was standing like on top of my car basically like leaning into my window and would not move until I said I would go. And I was so broken down and I was just like fine I'll go. I'll go. I'm gonna go. And that was so broken down and I was just like, fine, I'll go. I'll go. I'm going to go. And that was the day that I went to the church and had the most bizarre conversation and

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Quince has you covered. Go to quince.com slash colt for free shipping, 365 day returns. That's q-u-i-n-c-e dot com slash colt to get free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince dot com slash colt. So here is Amber. She is post breakdown in a vulnerable state and she arrives at the Church of Scientology. I went and she had somebody there waiting for me. She knew who I was as soon as I walked in the door

and the first thing she did was sit me down and do a personality test. I was just like, oh my God, like what did I get myself into? And she did the personality test and they give you like this printout of all of your results, which of course were horrible. That's terrible.

I needed so much help. You're not going to take a personality test from the Church of Scientology and get good news. They're not going to tell you you're great and you're doing awesome and you're super confident. No, they're going to tell you that you have too much stress and you're too sad and things are too messy and you're super confident, no, they're gonna tell you that you have too much stress, and you're too sad, and things are too messy, and you need them. She was like, I want you to read this. And she handed me this like, stapled document.

I started reading it, and then she hands me a cup of clear, flat marbles and tells me to show her that I understand what I just read. Yeah. Yeah. I showed her that I understood what I read and she was impressed with how good I was at it because it's something I did at work all the time. And she was like, I want to show you the first course you would take if you signed up for it. And she handed me the book and I remember looking at it and looking at her and saying, I've taken this course already, I know this course.

It was the exact same thing. Yeah, remember those free business classes she'd been taking at work to better her career? Yeah, that was just Scientology 101. And I was so beside myself when I left there. I was just on another planet. I was like, something weird is going on. Like this isn't what I thought it was.

That is when I started to notice the things that had been going on forever were not okay. So what happens? How does that lead to you getting out? The first way was I started Googling and I just went down a rabbit hole and I was on my computer at work, which felt very rebellious at the time, like, oh, I'm going to use your equipment to find out what you're up to. And at this time, there wasn't information about the church like there is now.

There wasn't documentaries, there wasn't TV shows, but I did stumble upon a man's blog who was an ex-scientologist and specifically was talking about wise world Institute of Scientology enterprises and Called it a Scientologist factory the man claimed that wise will pay Scientologists that own businesses and use the tech anytime One of the employees bridges to the church the owner of of the business gets a kickback. So Doctor and Joe Cool, well maybe he's not as cool as he presents.

And it wasn't too long after that, I opened a piece of mail from Wise and it was a check to Doctor for $3,000 and there was a stub attached to it that was itemized with employees names on it. She was raking it in from Wise, but that's when I knew for sure I was like, dude, this is true. Everything I read is true. This is crazy. And now that feeling that I would get when I walked into the office was complete opposite. Now I was

walking in, I just felt gross. And I'm like, God, half of these people have no idea what's going on and the other half are just pushing this god-awful agenda. People are just trying to make a living. We're just trying to support our families. They just took advantage of that. And one day I pulled into work and I got in my car and I dragged myself halfway to the door. I looked at the building and I could see the door was just like a glass door and I could see everybody lining up with their graphs to present their stats from the day before.

And I just saw for what it was, Little Scientologists in Training. And I turned around and I walked back to my car and I never went back. Let's go Amber! That's my girl. And her research didn't end there. Doctor was the weirdest piece of the puzzle. And I wanted to know absolutely everything. So I was looking into her and I found that she had had her license revoked. She had had it revoked well before I started working there.

Hmm, that's interesting. Makes sense why she was always in Africa or wherever the fuck she was. So this shrine, these private letters to doctor, a life-size portrait, a daily dusted desk, that was the replica of L. Ron Hubbard's office, all for a doctor who wasn't even a licensed doctor anymore? Oh, and there was a reason why this dentist had her license revoked. And it's a fucked up one. A patient passed away due to negligence.

So like I said, the office practiced what doctor called comprehensive dentistry. They hired up a full treatment plan and you can't get any of it done until it's paid in full. All of this is unethical. And a man came in with an abscess tooth and he wasn't treated because he couldn't pay for the whole thing at one time. He left the office, ended up being rushed to the hospital,

and died of an infection that went from his tooth to his brain. All she had to do was give him an antibiotic. If he just had had an antibiotic in his body, there's a really good chance he would still be alive. The family of the man spoke to the local newspaper, and the doctor started to be looked at. And that's when they found the insurance fraud,

and the weird financial sayings, the pressure to talk people into getting loans, and all of this was documented. And that's why she ended up losing her license. And what ever happened to that wonderful manager who kept hounding her to go to church? Who, Christine? She got fucking fired. Christine, she was fired because I didn't pay for any courses and that was her real job. She didn't really serve any other function other than to, you know, encourage us to go to the church.

And I think I was the third or fourth person that went to the church and didn't buy anything. It's the little Victorios sometimes, right Tyler? Absolutely. And so after Amber left the office, it fortunately didn't sway her entirely away from the industry as a whole. My first interview at the next office, the manager that was interviewing me was like, so tell me about that office. I heard their Scientologists tell me everything. And I'm like, they were really pushy with their religion. And that's kind of how I wanted to leave it. And she's like, everybody knows that about them. We all know. Eventually, I left the office and I found a wonderful job where I can work from home.

It's a way healthier and better place for me. I'm much happier. And looking back on the entire ordeal, Amber reflects. They manipulated me and they were working me into somebody that they could control. And they made me the perfect follower. So I walked out of that job and into a marriage with a narcissist. And he just took the place of the office,

of the people that were trying to do this to me. And it took six years for me to say fuck this and get out for good and really start healing. I got my ass into therapy. I think that therapy was probably the main reason that I can sit here and talk about this in a way that doesn't hurt anymore. It doesn't make me emotional. You know, I've worked really hard to come back from that and I'm kind of grateful for it in a way, because if that didn't happen, I never would have pushed myself to grow.

And I've grown to be somebody that I can be proud of being. And for that particular dental office today, we are happy to say it's closed. True. However, that doesn't mean that there aren't other offices just like them out there using the exact same system. How many wise organizations are there? They'll say, you know, thousands of offices having so much success, but you don't ever get a solid number. So like you could go to your dentist and it could be wise. Yep, absolutely.

They are 100% created by, run by, funded by the Church of Scientology. Dentists. Dentists! And we asked Chad Cheepey T. DENTIST! And we asked ChatGPT one final question. Is Scientology a cult? And here is what the AI bot said. Scientology. Devisive. Accused of being a cult due to control, secrecy, and controversial practices. And then just for fun we asked chat GPT if it was a cult in the voice of Cookie Monster

and it said, hmm, Scientology. No, that sounds like Yoda. Hmm, some say Scientology, some say cult. It's controversial with control, secrecy, and maybe cookies. He's not wrong there. every cult has cookies or snacks. And then we asked it is Scientology a cult in the voice of Forrest Gump? And they said Scientology some folks say it's a cult but controlling ways and lots of secrets just like a box of chocolates sometimes cults like a block of chocolates Jenny oh sorry it's a cult Jenny and then we asked it is Scientology a cult in the voice of Yoda and it said, hmm, Scientology, Colt or not, Controversial it is,

with secretive ways and control over followers. Hmm. Why does Yoda and Cookie Monster sound vaguely similar? I know they do actually sound very similar, don't they? They pull from your same register. This new AI technology, if it doesn't all put us out of work, it is fun. Even though it's going to kill our society, it is just really a joy to fuck around with. And then, because we were having way too much fun, we asked ChatGPT to give us a Shakespearean

sonnet about the show, Was I an Occult? In somber tones, this podcast doth unfold, Was I an Occult? Its haunting title cries. Where shadows dance and hidden truths take hold, through whispered tales where darkness oft lies. The host, a virtuoso of spoken word. You notice how they didn't give you two hosts, Tyler? Just me.

Or it's just you. The host, a virtuoso of spoken word, provokes reflections, questions piercing deep. And souls recount the webs they once were lured in search of answers, memories piercing deep. In souls where count the webs they once were lured, in search of answers, memories they keep. Like tragedies, their stories find their stage, revealing fates entwined, past sins revealed. Yet through their trials wisdom doth engage,

a journey fraught, but hearts now keenly healed. So listen close, thy ears two voices true, in this podcast's realm enlightenment ensues. Wow, that Shakespeare was something, wasn't he? Thank you, Amber. You are amazing. You were an incredible storyteller and a joy to talk to. We really enjoyed you coming on the show and enlightening us with a cult we had never really heard of in this way. Yep. Great story. Crazy story. I will be very careful when I go to my dentist next time. And stick around after the credits, guys.

We've got some more shit stories for you. Yay. The stories aren't really shit. They're fantastic. But they do involve pooping outdoors. Was I in a Cult is created, written and produced by Dr. Ayakuzee. And Dentist Mee-Sum Audio edit, design and mix by the Division 5 leader Rob Para That's our show and this is the last episode of Season 2 you guys

Thank you so much for all returning listeners We really appreciate you sticking around and being right there with us when we came back. And also appreciate all the new listeners. Take this break to go back and listen to more of Season 1 if you can. And tell your friends. And also, you know, Liz and I love the notes and messages and emails you send. They're really fun. We have a great time.

We try to respond to every single one. So please, info at wasinacult.com. We love hearing it. Yeah, and if you have a cult story of your own and you wanna be on this show, email us, info at wasinacult.com, and we'll be back in a few weeks, guys. Stick around after the credits

if you wanna hear some more shit stories. Stick around after the credits if you want to hear craptastic stories. This is called Poop Story by Marty Pierce. I grew up in Oklahoma in the 80s, so having toy firearms was normal. I had a pretty common World War I-era replica, the bolt-action rifle, that was mistakenly left at a neighbor's house. This was before your guns had an orange tip on the barrel or was painted odd colors because it was all about authenticity. Anyway, my friend decided to spray paint my gun with red and silver paint and really messed up that authentic look. When I found it in his yard, it made me really mad. They weren't

home, but back in those days it wasn't uncommon for kids to be outside and unsupervised for hours and hours. In their backyard, they had a playhouse, a real one, not like the little tykes plastic. Think like a shed. And there was a small Igloo brand ice chest on the floor. I was so mad, I decided to poop in the ice chest. Here's the crazy part.

Their mom figured out it was me and took the ice chest to my house and left it on the porch with a note from my parents telling them we owed them a new ice chest because I crapped in theirs. My dad was super thrifty slash cheap and cleaned, disinfected the ice chest and took it back to their house and told them there was no way that he was going to purchase a new one for them. She obviously refused. My dad took it back home and used it for years

as his lunchbox. He also never bought a replacement. Thank you, Marty. Marty. Art. Fantastic. We also never bought a replacement. This one is called Doo Doo and that is spelled D-O dash D-O. I will leave the author anonymous for his own sake. I have on numerous occasions combined running and shitting in strange places. Having made the mistake of drinking too much coffee before going for a long run, I have found myself in the middle of nowhere with only a bush as cover and my underpants as

toilet roll just needed to share. Well, thank you for sharing. Thank you for sharing that story. We've all kind of been there. As runners, we've all kind of pooped in places we shouldn't. And please continue to share your shit stories with us as we're on this break. No, we don't have to.

We're gonna come back and we're gonna share a shit story at the end of every episode, just for fun. Actually, maybe we won't. Actually, I don't think we will. Maybe we will. No, I don't think we will. But maybe we will. No, I don't think we will.

No, I don't think we will. But we might. But we will be back in a few weeks with more fantastic poop stories. Cult stories. I shit you not. They are good. Maybe we'll start off with your story, season three, Tyler.

Probably not. Maybe. Thanks, guys. We love you. Thanks, everyone. This time, I'm getting the last shit word. And if the portrait wasn't enough, it was like a little shyer. And if the portrait wasn't enough, it was like a little shire.

And if the portrait wasn't enough, it was like a little shire. I was wondering what a shire is. Which a shire is like a little hobbit home. Oh, it's a shire. It's a little shire. Just, I'll read anything you put in the teleprompter. I'm dying. It's really not that funny. It really was. It really wasn't.

You were so committed. You were so committed. From the waters of Lake Erie. It was raising flags. He said, there's no way that that fish should weigh 7.9 pounds. It's just not big enough. To a nondescript office building in Richmond, Virginia, home to a $700 million fund for children with special needs.

If there was a cliche list of how to blow money that you just stole very quickly, this guy did all of them. To the ski slopes of Salt Lake City, where a former Olympic snowboarder landed on the FBI's most wanted list. Ryan James Wedding is one of those interesting narcos who have had two very successful careers, one legal and one illegal. We're pulling back the curtain on a fresh lineup of opportunists who stopped at nothing to get ahead.

These are the stories of people who saw a loophole, a moment of weakness, a chance to get ahead, and took it. I'm host Sarah James McLaughlin. Join me for a new season of The Opportunist on May 19th. Follow now wherever you get your podcasts. ["The Opportunist"] This summer, Pluto TV is exploding with thousands of free movies. Summer of Cinema is here. Feel the explosive action all summer long with movies like Gladiator, Mission Impossible, Beverly Hills Cop, Good Burger and Transformers Dark of the Moon. Bring the action with you and stream for free

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