Waveform: The MKBHD Podcast - Broken iPhones and Meta Quest 3

Episode Date: September 29, 2023

This week was a long one! Not only did Marques, Andrew, and David discuss the killing of Google Podcasts (shocker), Spotify using AI to translate podcasts, and iPhone 15 overheating issues, but they also go over everything from last weeks Microsoft event and the Meta event. Techtember is ending with a bang and the busy season rolls right through into Techtober with no break! The gadgets just keeping coming. Hope you enjoy! Links: Google kills Google Podcasts: https://bit.ly/ripgooglepodcasts iPhone 15 Review: https://bit.ly/iphone15reviewmkbhd Spotify AI Translations: https://bit.ly/spotifyAIpodcasts 9to5Google Pixel Leak: https://bit.ly/pixel8leakagain iPhoneDo Overheating Video: https://bit.ly/iphonedoiphone15 JerryRigEverything iPhone15 Pro Max video: https://bit.ly/Jerryrigeverythingiphone15promax AppleTrack Drop Test: https://bit.ly/iphone15droptest Microsoft Event Coverage: https://bit.ly/microsofteventroundup Shop products mentioned:  Apple iPhone 15 Pro Max https://geni.us/7LuO6 Apple iPhone 15 Pro https://geni.us/qihGc Shop the merch: https://shop.mkbhd.com Instagram/Threads/Twitter: Waveform: https://twitter.com/WVFRM Waveform: https://www.threads.net/@waveformpodcast Marques: https://www.threads.net/@mkbhd Andrew: https://www.threads.net/@andrew_manganelli David Imel: https://www.threads.net/@davidimel Adam: https:https://www.threads.net/@parmesanpapi17 Ellis: https://twitter.com/EllisRovin TikTok:  https://www.tiktok.com/@waveformpodcast Join the Discord: https://discord.gg/mkbhd Music by 20syl: https://bit.ly/2S53xlC Waveform is part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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you'll be filling your kitchen with the cozy aromas of a homemade meal in no time. Visit HelloFresh.ca and use code SPOTIFY for your exclusive offer. This episode is brought to you by RBC Student Banking. Here's an RBC student offer that turns a feel-good moment into a feel-great moment. Students, get $100 when you open a no-monthly fee RBC Advantage Banking account and we'll give another $100 to a charity of your choice.

This great perk and more only at RBC. Visit rbc.com slash get 100 give 100. Conditions apply. Ends January 31st, 2025. Complete offer eligibility criteria by March 31st, 2025. Choose one of five eligible charities, up to $500,000 in total contributions. What is up people of the internet? Welcome back to another episode of the Waveform Podcast. We're your hosts. I'm Marques. I'm Andrew.

And I'm David. This week, we've got a bunch of random... I say that every week, but a bunch of random stuff. Too big events. It's a little focused. Yeah, I mean, it's still TechTember. So we had some events this week. We also want to talk about some iPhone stuff because there's more.

The review should be out by the time you see this, or iPhone 15 Pro review is out. But it's had some weird bugs and issues we've got to talk about. We also have Google face swapping in photos, potentially, as a rumor, and then we're going to go over Microsoft and Meta's events. But first, Google's Try Not to

Kill a New Service Challenge. Impossible mode. They killed another thing. killed google just one month give us one month where they don't kill something yeah yeah so uh google podcasts was uh terminated not yet passed away 2024 it's going to pass you have the rest of the year okay so if you listen to podcasts which if you're here you know i'm I'm making an assumption, but I feel like you may listen to podcasts. Take a look at the player that you're using. Google has an app called Google Podcast.

There's also Pocket Cast, Apple Podcast, Spotify, blah, blah, blah. Google's decided it's not worth keeping Google Podcasts around. They're going to kill it. Who knows what their criteria is? Google seems to kill a lot of things. Probably start moving out of Google Podcasts if you use it. The thing is, this one kill a lot of things probably start moving out of google podcasts if you use it the thing is this one makes a little bit of sense makes the most sense because of how much they're trying to integrate podcasts into youtube music yeah so what do they do

officially they just putting podcasts in youtube music that's that's what they're doing yeah they're just integrating it in because the ability eventually the end goal is to be able to be listening and then switch to video and that's is that what they're doing now right yeah so right now in youtube music if you go to a youtube podcast it'll play like we're there now yeah and then you can toggle between audio version and video version at the same point yeah my question is what happens to people that don't have a video version of their podcast like you can't subscribe to rss feed yet so i'm assuming at some point in the future in youtube music you'll be able to subscribe to rss

that'll probably happen before the end of the year but then what about their they don't have a video portion what's gonna play like a moving waveform yeah i mean it's youtube music just like audio player right it's what they're trying to make to like be competitive with spotify and be able to like listen to music so obviously podcasts audio only as well i think it's what they're trying to make to like be competitive with spotify and be able to like listen to music so obviously podcasts audio only as well i think it's just like trying to make it all together and that is a benefit that it can connect to youtube it's disappointing to me because i really like dedicated apps like i don't use spotify for podcasts because i don't i really don't like when i just starts recommending me random episodes of shows intertwined with my music.

Someone who tweeted, I think David Pierce might have put this on threads the other day. He said he doesn't use Spotify podcast because the other day he was listening to his new for you music playlist and it was playing some jams and he was enjoying it. And then it started playing chapter two of an audio book he had never listened to that should be completely right like i know spotify wants to be like the audio app but she that can't happen

that's got to be treated i just want a separate tab for those things i like things being separate so that's why i really enjoy pocketcast because you can you can really like tailor the ux ui to like the specific thing you're doing yeah um Makes sense because Google kills a lot of stuff. But I think the thing that makes it sad is that it didn't come out that long ago. It was like only a couple of years ago. I did. I briefly used it because I don't I'm not subscribed to that many podcasts. So it's really easy for me to migrate.

I have like less than a dozen podcasts I subscribe to. So I'm using Pocket Casts now, but i have used spotify for them and i got annoyed by like popping up episodes within playlists so i stopped and i went back and i've used google podcasts but this is just like one less option now yeah oh well that's how it goes sorry if you only listen to three bands ever you never have to listen to the for you stuff and then it'll never happen true case closed gotta expand your case closed are you saying that's what you do yes exactly expand those horizons i know it's not a band too everyone is just making moves to become the like all-in-one audio app yeah yeah i don't know i feel like in america people don't really like having all-in-one apps maybe that's just me

i mean they're forcing it i was a different. We have apps with like overlapping functionalities. Like remember when, what's it called? Clubhouse. Remember when Clubhouse was like popping off? Yeah. And then there were suddenly nine Clubhouses everywhere. Yeah. And real people would use more than one of these.

Yeah. Don't ask me how I know. I just know. I mean, that's basically X and threads. You have to post the same content to the same type of platform. I'm trying so hard not to. I don't want to. Yeah, I know. I'm trying not to. It's annoying, but it feels like you have to post the same content to the same type of platform i don't want to yeah i know it's annoying but it feels like you have to yeah it's strange another podcast news spotify is partnering with open ai to be able to take a podcaster's voice and turn episodes

into different languages which i thought was pretty cool. That's pretty dope. Okay. That works. That's dope. What? See? See? You can see how much Spanish I know. See? I think this is like a cool example of AI. I know we talk a lot about like some things that are more scary and some things that are really useful and this being able to like broaden the horizon of shows reaching broader audiences, I think is really neat. They're doing it with a couple test podcasts right now. We are not one of them, Spotify. Come on. You know you love us. But right now they're doing it into Spanish

and then there will be German and French pretty soon. So that's interesting. Have you guys seen the audio dubs for YouTube channels? If you do multi-language dubbing for a single video. So there are, there are a couple of YouTube channels. Ours is one of them where we have a feature within YouTube that lets us upload a separate audio track for a different language. So what happens is you can get a voice actor or yourself even to dub over the video in a different language that people who speak a different language don't have to rely on subtitles. And that's a pretty laborious thing to do for a creator. So one of the newest,

most interesting tools that started to pop up is AI generated dubs. So you leave your audio track as is and whatever your language is, but then the AI will create 10, 20 different languages of audio tracks for people to hear your video in their native language seems pretty awesome if it works well but there are a lot of questions about if it doesn't work well like what things go wrong what little words in our enunciations don't really work another one for us was like when we do shorts we're like cramming it into 60 seconds and for a lot of languages it's like impossible to say that much stuff in 60 seconds so there's a lot of questions around it but it is pretty interesting i'm also interested in podcasting when you have three to four people like at the same time yeah like look at us yeah and that's fun sometimes i know some people like say quit talking over each other but we're having a good time here and we're

all joking around i would love to see a translator try and figure out voices and then be able to dub all of them. It's hard too because David and Marques sound the same apparently. It's actually a two person podcast and Mar David just talks a lot in it. Yes.

It's um... I did that on purpose. I was like yeah it's cool to see like I know I want it to work well but that's it seems like podcast is a perfect place to start because it's just like it's mostly just voices with ours we have to upload the music in the background and the sound effects as a separate track yeah so that you can have just the voice and then the sound effects still say the same which is like okay now I have to export like five files per video but you know

it works so that's cool yeah i like it there's a lot of strange stuff going on with this i mean imagine with multiple movies that are like made overseas and then get shipped to united states or vice versa they always have to hire different voice actors to yeah host the different or be the different characters and a lot of the times you have two options you can either like re like if it's a animated movie you can reanimate it to make it more natural with the voice or you can you know uh just let it dub over and it just seems not natural and i think people have become really used to that um but my main question is like a lot of different languages have a lot of different parts that they enunciate

and kind of like talk louder the dynamics of like different languages are crazy variable yeah and i just don't know if that's going to be like a direct translation or how that enunciation and that kind of stuff is going to move over yeah and i think it's going to listen to it and even when we're enunciating something that yet wouldn't be enunciated is it going going to still bring those levels up? There's even some YouTube channels of, it's like an English to English dub where it's one singer singing a song from a different artist. And in that, you'll listen to it, and there'll be times where you can tell

the AI doesn't quite get it right, and you'll hear the background of the other person singing. So I'm just wondering if this goes in here and it's Spanish, and then it's just a word it just gives up on, and there's just like English word that makes no sense in the middle of it. I'm trying to remember this example. I think it was on Colin's Mirror podcast. They tried some dubbing and they realized they start a lot of sentences with either like some word that has a literal translation in other languages, but you normally wouldn't start a sentence. Like when you say bro and like start a sentence like that,

it would say, oh, it's man. So if you start a sentence like, man, this thing is really cool. It will start the sentence saying hombre, but like that's not how you would normally start a sentence. So you have to actually think about those things in the dub. Yeah, and I imagine because this is like building an AI model based on your voice, it's going to like, it will probably get the enunciations correctly for that language to make the sentences sound normal. But it's not exactly how you spoke it in the episode.

Yeah. So this type of thing would probably work well for like audio books where you're just reading a transcript. But something that's really free flowing where you want to like your personality is semi-defined by the way that you sort of like push words out yeah so i don't know i mean it's interesting if nothing yeah i think audiobooks is another place that could be cool i'm listening to an audiobook right now and it says it's narrated by a person but i'm listening to it and it sounds like it. Really? Some professional audiobook narrators, though, are just extremely precise about words. Which makes sense because it's an accessibility thing.

You want it to be easy, yeah. But this one, he's had a couple moments where he said something that was supposed to be an exclamation, but it was way too monotonous and I was like, this can't be a person. Maybe he's like, man, gotta get through chapter three. I'm like 25 yeah yeah it's a lot yeah okay well let's talk about the iphone for a little bit there's some new stuff i mean every week there's something new with the iphone yes and uh what you might have forgotten is every year there's some gate

with the iphone i feel drama it has to. I feel like this one happens every year, though. It has to be. Yeah. Last year, there was more... Wasn't it build quality stuff? I don't even remember, but it shows you how important they were.

This is build quality. Okay, so the one that's sort of at the top of mind for most people right now is overheating. I've seen like five posts in a row about this today.

Yeah. And a lot of them are like sarcastic and a lot of them are actually people with issues. So just to get it out in front, the issue that a lot of people seem to be, well, a lot of people that some amount of people seem to be having is the iPhone 15s and 15 pros are overheating. And it's been attributed to a couple of possible things. Maybe it's software

bugs, maybe it's the A17 pro or just the new phones in general. Either way, lots of people having overheating issues with their phones and going to Twitter, sorry, X, to talk about them. This is one of the reasons actually that my iPhone review was, I would say, a little bit late. It's because the last thing I've been testing after all the other new stuff with the phones and all the camera stuff and all the screen stuff and all the other stuff we've tested is the battery life. And you and I, you've had the pro max. Yeah. I've had the 15 pro spent the most time with it, trying to compare it to the old phone. And I'm just not getting a good read on if it's any better or any worse at all.

Yeah. But the way I've described it is with any phone, I typically have a bunch of average days and then a couple light days that are really good and a couple heavy days that are really bad. And that'll let me get my I'm not doing like benchmarks and like laying them out and side by side stuff. I'm just I'm going by feel. And with this phone, I've had plenty of those average days, but I haven't had any really good days. I haven't had any sort of light days where I get eight hours of screen time and I'm like, man, this thing's got great standby time. I haven't had that day yet where I normally would have had it by now. Yeah.

And I have had some weird instances of the phone getting hot in my hands in the middle of something random. There's no rhyme or reason for it for like five minutes or ten minutes at a time. I was just, and this is the last anecdote, I was just at a golf event in Florida. It was like 90 something degrees. The real field was like 105. I was outside, full brightness, GPS on for the golf thing, like lots going on.

Phone did not overheat, no problem. But then on the airplane on the way home, phone is in airplane mode. I'm playing Spotify, and it's getting hot in my hands and drops like 4% in five minutes. Wow. In like five minutes. And then it was fine,

and it went back to normal. I was like, what is actually happening to this phone? So it's going in the review. I have to mention it. I don't know what's causing these issues. The best guess I have is it's some type of software bug,

whether it's iOS 17 or some apps or some combination of things that all of these people have in common. But that's been my findings. I'm curious if you have any heat issues with the phone you've been testing. I haven't noticed a lot of heat issues that I didn't also have with the 14 Pro. That's sort of what I have. It gets hot sometimes um fairly randomly like especially for so i've noticed if i charge it on a wireless charger even for just two minutes it'll heat up a lot um which that's kind of natural but it heats up like a decent amount i wouldn't say it's like significantly more than the the 14 pro i mean we've been talking about how our battery

life has been like either super average or kind of below average in general on the max. I've gotten less than I got on the 14 pro max and especially the 13 pro max because I'm getting like 24 hours instead of like three days. I did have on like Saturday. I noticed that I had a really good day where it was like 73 percent by the end of the day but it was like two hours of screen on time so i wasn't really using my phone that much but that's a good day because if you like extrapolate it out two hours at 73 is like eight hours that's pretty great yeah pretty good so i like to see those days yeah that's that's interesting i yeah i don't know why it randomly decides to like just turn the cpu on full load It would just crank through. What am I at right now? 68.

That's reasonable. This is, I really wonder if like the new GPU cores and the new, um, like AI cores and ML cores or whatever, if those are like spinning up at instances where they don't need to, or. So I,

my thinking behind that is those should all be lower power cores than the main big powerful ones. Yeah. And if you just go by like people's benchmark results it seems that these newest phones have done the best on benchmark i've seen a couple different benchmark results where the newest phones score the highest yeah that's why i think it has to be a software thing there has to be some app or combo of apps or something in ios 17 where if you're doing something it just like flips it to 100 and just has a really bad five minutes so i don't know what that is but that's

the only thing i can think of that's weird andrew you're gonna say something all right farouk iphone though do you know who he is he did a video saying he thinks and he was doing some testing that instagram for some reason was doing it and that also it was an ios 17 thing because he got his 14 pro to do it as well and he shows an example of just like loading up instagram putting a like temperature reader on it and within like five minutes it goes up 15 degrees it goes from 80 to 95 wow um wow i don't know and at that point, he said he was losing about a percent a minute in terms of battery life. Jesus. That's pretty bad.

One percent every minute. Yeah. So he lost like 10 percent in the 10 minutes that he's like filming the video. It was just interesting. I'm sure it sounds like it's more random than that. Although the fact that he was able to. The funny thing also is he compared it to opening threads first, checking the temperature for a few minutes. No change. And then opens instagram so same company software but both totally different things um

i i just i thought that was funny it was an interesting video it seems like he he thinks it's ios 17 not necessarily just the new iphone but okay i don't know there could be something to it yeah no yeah i use instagram i have the app my phone. I've definitely used it in the past couple days, but I haven't been able to pinpoint it. I feel like it's one of those things where it's going to be very hard to find the exact thing. It's super hard to lock this down. Then they'll fix it without saying there was ever a problem,

and then we'll all forget about it, and we'll never know. Yeah, this is what I am guessing is going to happen. We're already on 17.0.2. I think we're going to get some more software updates. I think people are going to push updates to their apps iOS is going to continue to get updated and eventually it's going to even out at basically the same battery life

as last year I think that's what's going to happen yeah pretty what's a boring solution to like an exciting gate and everyone wants to be freaking out but like it's probably not going to be that insane yeah that would explain why I'm not getting as good battery life on the Max though,

especially if that's happening like in my pocket and I'm just not noticing or something. Because sometimes what I did notice is when I did notice the phone was hot is when I reached into my pocket to grab it and it was already really hot. No, yeah. And I was like-

It's just so funny to be like not using it and pick it up and it's like really hot. And I had assumed like, oh, did I like turn on the flashlight by accident and it was on for a while or something, but it was never on. So I don't know. As a two phone person,

I'll like check both pockets and like one phone is cool and the other phone's hot. I'm like, what's going on here? What's happening? The Pixel gets warm sometimes too, just randomly. Yeah.

Hot leg, cold leg. It's the way it is. In terms of the other thing that kind of obviously JerryRigEverything's video of him just crushing the uh the iphone 15 pro max in his hands was really fantastic yeah um are you guys seeing any durability issues uh no i have a story oh i have a story oh i have um my review unit iphone this happens every year i have my review unit but i also will buy one of them for my own.

And I was at an Ultimate Frisbee tournament. Didn't this happen last year? Yeah. I was at an Ultimate Frisbee tournament, and I went to sit down to put my cleats on, and it slipped out of my pocket. So I'm already sitting down. On the ground. On the concrete. But the ground, not in like a chair.

Right. Yeah. I want to sit down on the ground and two inches out of my pocket the review unit falls out of my pocket and i literally it's one of those drops where like yeah it's fine and i put it back in my pocket and i looked at it like a minute or two later and it's got a crack across the back i was like what how i didn't there's no other opportunity for it to get that crack that's when it happened but that's the glass and so i don't feel like that's that crazy because glass breaks and the

titanium is totally fine as i as expected i've dropped phones on the edges before this is the thing is like when you drop a phone it's really just luck about what part of the phone lands on the ground that's wherever all the energy gets absorbed, physically speaking, that's what's going to have the biggest chance of breaking. The next day, I go to the random mall in Marlboro, Massachusetts,

wherever I was, and I picked up my natural titanium one, and that one has not had any problems. I haven't dropped it, but yeah, that's my story. I have actually cracked a phone for the first time in years. I feel like the last time a phone slipped out of your pocket was, wasn't it like getting into some low car with a pixel and it got that pink line across the front of the screen?

Do you remember that? Was that mine? I think so. But that was also with a, I believe a pixel that was having screen issues where like one of the connectors got loose very easily. And it's not that that it broke the screen it's that a pink line came up across the display yeah I mean a while ago my theory on why the like Apple went square with the iPhone was because if they lower the amount they lower the chance that a piece of the glass is going to touch the impact point and it just hits the rim,

the chances of it breaking are way lower. So remember when the 12 came out and they called it like, what was their branding for the screen that year? Ceramic Shield. Ceramic Shield. It's like, yeah, it's square, so you probably won't hit the glass anymore. It's probably just gonna- But they have like infused ceramic

in the glass or something. Yeah. Something like that. But I would bet that's probably just gonna but they have like infused ceramic in the glass or something yeah something like that but i would bet that's probably true but they're like durability testing probably got better because it just didn't impact the glasses as often right zach does say that the he thinks the ceramic shield glass is like doing better for the scratch test yeah he said it looks really good um he also everyone should watch that video he also cuts it up to see how much of this grade 5 titanium there is because that shit ain't cheap and like that was really interesting yeah but the fact that on the pro max he could bend it with his thumbs and just absolutely splinter the back of the phone was kind of crazy wow oh the only other thing i wanted to say here is there's a picture going around in terms of this durability gate of like an iphone with a cracked back glass and the camera like being

completely popped out oh you showed me this yeah i was like wow that does seem really bad and then i found the testing from it and it's sam cole who does a lot of iphone stuff and he was doing drop tests it was the 14th drop he did and it was from the second story of like a thing of stairs onto concrete okay so like listen there might be some durability issues with this whatever but like stop using that picture he dropped it onto concrete there's some crazy memes i mean and zach always does the crazy stuff he does with his phones like a blow torch or whatever and it's like wow i wonder why it broke it did good the lighter didn't affect the front screen at all that was pretty good i usually light my phone on fire so i'm glad i'm glad it doesn't affect it yeah it's like the least likely thing to happen yeah i'm glad it's i'm glad it's

durable um i'll keep an eye on it if anything else gets scratched or whatever happens you'll be the first to know on x he did tear it apart with two hands though didn't he didn't he try to do the test and it just exploded? And it just like the backlash is like shattered with both his thumbs in it. I just want to try it. You didn't see that? No, I didn't watch that one.

Wait, really? I watched the one where he was like carving up the stainless. Cause he had the blue one. He made a couple of videos about it. Live reaction. I thought you saw it. I wanted to know if there is a light color stainless steel underneath the blue coated or dark coated titanium.

So I got to the part where he scratches the titanium and it's immediately just bright silver under it. No, but that's still the grade five titanium. Right, but it's a coating that he cut through. It's a coating he cuts through, which is just color. It's just like however you do that. That was my concern. Like if I drop my phone and it's a dark colored phone, it's going to look crazy. Yeah.

So that's confirmed from Zach's video. Wait, hold on. I need to show you this clip though. Okay. One eternity later. Jesus. I mean like, obviously you're not really going to be doing that, but he mentions right after this, like iPhones don't do this in any of my testing.

Every time I do this and it's only the pro max. So I'm assuming the leverage of it is helping with that. He could not do it on the regular Pro. Okay, so that's really interesting. Because remember BendGate? And it was just a 6 Plus because that was a thinner, longer piece of uninterrupted aluminum, and it was easier to bend.

That's fascinating. Another year, another gate. What can you do? Leave it to them to find it um okay last thing i want to talk about is you guys seen this uh it's a it's a pixel 8 feature leak i don't know if you've seen any of these pixel 8 leaks floating around the internet there's a couple of them google's always surprising they can still leak things when we think we've seen literally every millimeter of it and now we're getting into software yeah so what do you think of this one the face swap yeah is what we're talking about how would you describe it so yeah

so effectively they're like they're showing that they take a picture of a family and all the kids are being demons and they just tap on their faces and they become happy and they like i'm assuming the way they're doing this is when the uh when the camera is open it's constantly sampling frames so it's just grabbing ones where they're smiling and then when you take the photo if it's not ideal you can just tap on their faces and merge it in yeah it's like a live photo i'm guessing right and it has the like previous and prior sort of video file i doubt it's that because that usually only takes like eight frames before you hit the shutter button moment of capture and like eight frames after you hit the shutter button. I would assume that it's just looking for faces all the time.

And if it sees someone smiling, it's grabbing one of those. That's my guess. My other guess was usually in an action photo, you're just taking multiple frames. So like if you're doing it, then your gallery probably has five or six photos next to each other yeah it's possible too but the ui of it was really neat where it's like they're on a merry-go-round carousel and yeah like one person the kid's not looking at the camera and they like click her face and on the bottom this little ui comes up that shows like four other options of that kid's face and then they just click on the option you can see it just swipes the kid's face away yeah yeah it's all what is a photo energy exactly what is a photo energy yeah this is my uh god where do we would you use this would

you hell yeah i would use this okay also because they had this magic editor feature before where they just showed like oh there's a kid with balloons on a park bench and you just want to move them over. So you just like click them and drag them over. No issues at all with that? No. I mean, this seems like super reasonable if you're taking pictures of both. How many times do you take a group photo and like there's not one single one where everybody is perfect?

That's true. And at least I'm at least happy this is taking other photos of the person and not generating their smile. Like the Photoshop, like, make them older, make them smile. Like, open their eyes. My baby was missing from the photo. Add him. Yeah. I think this is cool.

But it's not a photo. Exactly. That's true. It's like you can just Photoshop this, and then you're going to put that in your photo album? It's taking from another photo, though. But it's not the one that you went to. It's like you can just Photoshop this and then you're going to put that in your photo album? It's taking from another photo, though. But it's not the one that... It's not fake.

I think this is the least creepy out of maybe all of the things that people are trying to do. Just imagine that you look through your photo gallery and they're all different scenarios when you're at the beach, when you're on the ski slopes, and in all of them you have the exact same face. I think it's pulling, though, from recent data. Probably. I'm guessing. Almost definitely. In the like thing, it shows multiple different photos on the carousel

and then it's like showing it, swapping the face from a different photo. Yeah. So I think it's going to be at least from like, it's not like, hey, swap this picture of my kid on the carousel, except you're taking a photo from their second birthday three years ago.

I know what this kid looks like. I can just, oh, by the way, I know what green grass looks like too. Did three years ago. I can just, Oh, by the way, I know what green grass looks like too. Did you want that grass to be green? Oh, by the way,

I know what a blue sky looks like too. Just keeps going. Yeah. When we go to the Google event on the fourth, I will definitely be grilling them about how this works. I'm very curious. I think this is less creepy than the IO stuff where it was like literally change every single piece of the photo.

Yeah. They're probably, they're probably announced some of that stuff too. Yeah. They try to make it look like literally change every single piece of the photo yeah they're probably they're probably announced some of that stuff too yeah they try to make it look like really friendly like because i think it's like the barrier to entry to photoshop like you're right it is photoshop it's it's not exactly photoshop but it's the it's the same thing you would do with photoshop which is i have a picture i want it to look a little different to make it look better and it's not the same as the original picture but but this is what I wanted. And I think that's the same philosophy here. It's like, I got this capture and it's of my kid and he's really happy,

but also I wanted him in the middle and that person in the background, I don't want them there. So I'm gonna just do that real quick. And it's super, you just poke it and it goes away. So that's what I feel like regular people actually want. I could be wrong, but- No, no, no, that is- Seems like it's what they want. I think so. I just feel like their tools actually want. Yeah. I could be wrong, but... No, no, that is...

Seems like it's what they want. I think so. I just feel like their tools have gone from being helpful to now being, like, a lie. Where's the line? Exactly. Yeah. Where's the line? Before was like, oh, you know, there's someone in the background.

Remove them. Okay. That one's okay? That one's fine. Okay. Then there's... What's your problem with face swap? It's a face swap. I don't... Man, I don't know. I think Then there's the one you mentioned. What's your problem with face swap? It's a face swap.

I don't, man, I don't know. I think I disagree with everyone on this one. If it's a swap from like three seconds before when they're just looking at the camera. How far is too far? A minute before? If it's like not in the same action, I guess. It's such a different like thought process because you're, it's like, are you trying to capture exactly as

that moment happened and then you can look at it later or are you just trying to make a piece of art that includes your entire family yeah because like film basically what you're doing that's film has been because you shoot film it's that's the capture of the moment yeah fundamentally anyway yeah and slowly digital photography has gotten farther and farther and farther from that to like even just a regular iphone photo of a tree you're technically merging several moments together one a split second before the other was a capture of the sky with a lower exposure and the other was a capture of the tree with a higher exposure and then it's merging those moments together it's not it's not really a photo yeah but we're cool with that one we're cool with that one okay what if there's a kit like just the picture of the tree we're cool with those three moments because they're a millisecond apart and nothing changed yeah i mean are do you ever do

like uh it's a fine any sort of um like why can't i think of the the like auto correcting brush in like a photo if there's like a spec on your like sensor so yeah content aware fill like do you do any of that in photos is that too much that's fine unless it's what line are we drawing here then i'm i'm saying i'm actually fine with all i think you're saying tap the shutter post zippo that's not a saying we're approaching it's been years we're approaching the trolley problem but with photos I think my issue is more just the time space between them. So like the tree example, that's like milliseconds. It's not on a human perception level that crazy, but like different faces in a scene

that's like spanning what, 30 seconds of everyone joking around for the picture and everything? It could be, it's like two seconds. Okay, two seconds. That's like perceptible time oh man i i disagree i don't get what's so weird about this it's like a video then take a video yeah i guess you can't put a video on your wall at home not yet okay andrew have you heard of nfts is this too far here's my question you have a stock image of you that's your profile picture from years ago and you take a picture of you i already yes it's weird because you're on agar

falls yeah you get your face is blurry but it just like superimposes details from what your nose your face should be like i think that's creating something new though okay yeah so it is but so is the other thing. No, it's not. It's just taking two pictures and it's like... It's two pictures for their part. Here's an example. Here's an example. Remember the photo we took for like Mac's birthday party here?

And we had everybody including Boris and Astro in one photo? Yeah. That photo that's posted is two photos split straight down the middle because Boris and Mac weren't looking at the camera at the same time. And that one was maybe 30 seconds apart? Not even. Between those two shots, 10 seconds apart? Yeah.

That's exactly what this face swap's doing, though. It's just doing the face and not cutting down the middle of it. So it's weird when it's way too much time between the photos. I agree. Okay. Yeah, that makes sense. I think in all these, assuming's within like like click click click click click and then it's like in those five photos it's like okay find the ones where they're

actually looking at the camera it's gonna be hard to define what's too far yeah because everyone's gonna have a different line everyone's gonna have a line and they're not gonna understand why that line exists yeah like oh this is from a photo that i took the day before i'm gonna start the same gps location so it's probably the same light so it's fine yeah i think that's yeah yeah like if you go back to the spot to like take another picture to then blend in then it's like bro you cared way too much about this what is the photo yeah but see that's just your opinion man you're right you're not wrong i can't wait to see you guys editing photos and be like what are you doing that's just not the real moment yeah no there's like this is actually

a big thing in the film photography community there's people who are like if you edit your film then you're not actually like posting the real photo like you suck but at the same time it's like when you scan a piece of film, which is just a plastic emulsion, different scanners will show the colors differently. There's not really a one true color unless you take positive film. I screenshot my eyeballs. Yeah. What is it? I couldn't say that was straight face.

Yeah. But it's like you're technically editing your film by choosing a scanner. It it's i don't know it's all semantics yeah yeah people people will everything too far don't don't scan the film at all yeah i mean people might say that because you could do like lab prints directly off of the film negative and then that's literally the truest no edits but hashtag no filter hashtag no filter that's the only way you can do it fair no filter well we we sent that one off the deep end so anyway pixel leaks they happen sometimes uh we should take a quick break though because we got some more there's like a microsoft event there was a what there's a amazon what there's other events that happened yeah oh there's a

meta event yeah there's a bunch of stuff we should talk about. But before we get to all of that stuff, we should take a quick break. Trivia. And do trivia. Did somebody say trivia? We didn't. Perfect. Trivia. I said it is trivia. All right.

You guys are in different seats and it's really confusing. It's been a little weird for me too sitting on this side. Okay. Slept on the other side of the bed. I did. Yeah. Driving on the wrong side of the road. That's more dangerous. That's podcast is going away next year rip google

podcast fun fact it was actually released for android in 2018 yeah when did apple first released the apple podcast app on mobile a bazillion years ago. Ancient history. Yeah. I remember every podcast I would listen to ever would just be like, make sure you rate us on, oh, it was iTunes for a while. It was iTunes for a while. So that's what I thought too. And I thought you were about to give away some good information, but now I don't think you know your stuff. It is ancient history, bro.

That podcast app. It's like the first big, big. Apple Podcasts was, yeah. All the podcasts would always say, please rate us on Apple Podcasts after they said, please rate us on iTunes. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, man.

Interesting. I'm shot in the dark on this one, I think. We'll see. Either way, we'll be right back. As a Fizz member, you can look forward to free data, big savings on plans, and having your unused data roll over to the following month, every month. At Fizz, you always get more for your money. Terms and conditions for our different programs and policies apply.

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Buy from DysonCanada.ca. With ANC on, performance may vary based on environmental conditions and usage. Accessories sold separately. All right, welcome back. We are hopping into the first event of this episode. We're doing two events this episode. This one actually technically happened before our last episode went out, but we had recorded already. So that's why we're covering it this week instead and it's the microsoft surface event that happens every year but it's not happening with panos this year because he is gone yeah it is pretty sad officially is at amazon as is he officially today today the news came out cool amazon alexa right something with no oh okay that was the first rumor i had read something else something else okay well since then he was the chief product officer at microsoft for like 19 years he's

actually been on the podcast before great episode noisy episode yeah that was a long one to edit i was editing back pre adam and alice episode yes i wish they were here for that but um it was it was a great episode he's always like seems super passionate we've met him a couple times and i i have to admire how much he like he was a super nice guy seemed very into the products for as much as we talk about presenters of products because there's a huge variety of presenters of products like that's one guy who uh can really get into the weeds of like i like product people and he you can tell he uses the product and really appreciates and understands the nuance of how other people are going to use that product. I'm not sure.

I think he lives in that world. Do you go on hikes and use the Surface Pen in Excel to track your altitude? I think Panos does. I think he did. I think he got into the flow all over the place with all Microsoft products. But okay, so we got an event what happened at this event ai ai

ai ai a lot of ai ai ai so bing stuff ai um not as much they're clearly flexing their open ai partnership yeah yeah like this is one i didn't so i didn't get to watch it apparently it was like a private event but at least they had an event and then they sort of announced the things from the event after something like that people were like live blogging about it and then they had like a testing area where you could try stuff i think it was like amazon did the same thing right it's like event but it's not really live but it's also not really that private so you can everyone's tweeting from it it was confusing i don't know why they didn't just stream it on youtube like someone made this point the other day and i thought about it i was

like that makes sense. It was like, nobody knew that this Windows event even happened because they didn't stream it on YouTube. Yeah. And it would have created a ton of hype from a ton of random people, and people would still be talking about it. But they didn't stream it on YouTube, so it ended up in some random blogs. And they've done it in the past, like, have streamed it in the past. Like, we've watched it before. Yeah.

So I don't know why they decided not to this year, but. I don't know why they decided not to this year but i don't know um in terms of what they announced they like we said like a lot of ai stuff seemingly um co-pilot was kind of the main for sure thing and co-pilot they announced before so it did sort of seem like they were re-announcing a lot of stuff but with enterprise focus uh which you know maybe this is why they didn't live stream it but i think it was like because they announced it and how it is into the new like windows 11 update and it feels very similar to how like the iphone event this year was so much of what they announced at wwdc but now like here's the actual product that you're seeing it in yeah which i guess for us when we

watch everything feels redundant but prop well no one watched this event. So I guess it's not. I was going to say, then it makes it a little easier for the people watching specific device or software stuff. Yeah. Then they're seeing it for the first time, but it wasn't streamed. Yeah. I don't know. Yeah. One thing that was kind of a core point that was exactly what we talked about with the Amazon event, actually,

was the fact that they're allowing you to now communicate with your chatbot with voice. It's multimodal now. Well, multimodal in terms of it can also create images, but like because they announced Dolly 4, and now Bing chat has the ability to create images. You can put in images and ask for things and that kind of stuff. And Dolly 3, right?

Oh, I wasn't supposed to talk about that yet. We are Dolly 4. Dolly 3. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's kind of the funny thing is like opening oh i wasn't supposed to talk about that yet we are dolly for uh dolly three yeah yeah just check that's kind of the funny thing is like opening i announced dolly three they announced and they have chat gpt4 and all of this is like 20 a month but you can also just do it for free in bing that's i think the dolly thing is really what made this seem like microsoft like flexing its partnership here it's like they announced this a week ago and like look we're already announcing it as part of inside the windows they'll always be the the first one to integrate something with it because of that

partnership they had like inside how it's developed they know what's gonna be capable of they get to just make that stuff first yeah pretty cool but a big thing is that the assistant that you're talking to has access to like all of your windows 11 stuff all your files and all that stuff first yeah pretty cool but a big thing is that the assistant that you're talking to has access to like all of your windows 11 stuff all your files and all that stuff so it can actually do stuff to the things on your desktop right yeah it's it's like a part of all obviously the microsoft 365 apps um in edge and bing chat it has all that i think i also saw something cross-device support where if you're asking about information, it could also access your phone,

which I'm assuming would need some sort of app. But an example I use is like phone link. Yeah, so Microsoft has this like phone link thing built in that links to your Android phone. It has access to all your photos and files and text messages and stuff. Yeah, it used an example of like asking for flight information that you probably have

on like an app on your phone instead of probably like right on your computer and that it could gather information through that through voice as well i mean like this again bringing back to the amazon event and like the fire stick this feels like all of us listening to this podcast and in this room right now are one step closer to not having to be the family tech support like the fact that it can see stuff you can ask and it can help help you with things that are happening on the computer yeah i'm very excited for yeah also it's just advanced clippy yeah it is it's clippy we talked about this months ago but they missed

such a big opportunity to just bring back clippy like people would love that dude it's not it's like anthropomorphized but it's a it's a freaking paper clip i want to know why they're not it's perfect we'll get this we'll get to this later but like meta like an like used real human likeness to make these chat bots yeah and and microsoft had the opportunity to have a paper clip talk to you yeah which is come on dude people are way more okay with that yeah like kids these days don't know what a save button floppy disk is people don't like it's fine it'll be it's yeah people barely know what a paperclip is imagine yeah imagine they see a paperclip paperclip kids are gonna be seeing paperclip while they won't what's paper

and why did you clip it together? It's a computer. But anyways, it should have been Clippy. It should have been Clippy. It should have been Clippy. Yeah, so you can now communicate with, basically Copilot's going to be more deeply integrated across Microsoft's entire ecosystem. Yeah, bringing it from like we were used to in Edge, now it's in full-blown Windows.

That's what I was going to say. The two places on my computer where i personally think i would get the most value out of an ai co-pilot is one in my browser so it can be alongside my browser and help me either summarize or find or make the most out of what i'm looking at on the web page yeah and two is alongside my computer and it's trained on and knows everything on my computer. And I can just ask it for a file. Where's my W9 from 2018? Just like pull it up.

I don't want to find it. Like, you know where it is. Like that sort of thing. Like it can summarize things that I've written, things that I've read, my inbox, like all that stuff should just be like known by the AI. I trade all of my privacy to this ai for it to help me out i will trade all of my privacy to co-pilot if it can figure out windows audio drivers and which thing like music is playing out of around my computer out of the 50 options that it decides to show so i was listening

to hard fork which is this podcast with casey newton and kevin ruse it's very good very funny and very to the point. Casey's very funny. And they were talking about how they were, basically Google recently announced sort of a version of Copilot that only plugs into all your Google apps. So it was BARD extensions, which we did not cover yet. I think that came out last week or late last week.

It's called BARD extensions. And it's basically the same as this, where it plugs into all your Google apps. And then you can talk to Bard about things that might appear in your email, appear in your this. And Kevin was asking Bard, like, how do you think my emotional state is based on some of my emails? And it was like, it seems like you're kind of depressed. And he was like, can you pull up like an email where it says I was depressed like that? And it generated a fake email that he sent that he never sent. And this happened multiple times.

This guy is an AI god. Isn't he the one that got like... He's the one that got Bing to tell him to leave his wife. Yeah. But I'm just like like if you're asking for like your flight information how can you trust it how do you trust it yeah that's my thing like it doesn't seem ready yet like even google's is not ready it's really good at gaslighting you yeah it's just like it realizes you noticed it's wrong and it's like i don't want to be wrong

i'm gonna make you think you're wrong this is one of those things where like i think busy enough people all at some point just go like what if i had an assistant what would they do and i think when google assistant came out that felt like the dream because it's like this thing is gonna know my calendar know my inbox know where i commute to every day know what i'm gonna do the next day what i'm gonna like that's gonna be basically everything i want from an assistant and it's free and it's built into my phone. I just ask it, what time do I got to leave for the airport for my flight? Like, is my flight on time? I just ask it things and it helps me out.

The one thing I need that to be is dependable and accurate and reliable. And if it's going to gaslight me about things I never even wrote in my inbox, that's kind of broken. Yeah. No, it's not good. It's not good. So it's, I don't know. I mean, we'll see how Microsoft says says hopefully it's a little more controlled considering it's

more enterprise focused and they have a lot more to lose um but the bard extensions thing is is kind of wild i mean all of these i enjoy because the people who go and break them for the first week so like when this is really rolling out the new windows update i can't wait to see all the press and i really how they mess with it. I miss when Bing was going totally off the rails. That was a sweet week. It was a fun week. They had to limit it to five chats because it was going way too existential.

I remember we were working on the video, and I had all these examples of things it would do, and one by one they started nuking features, and it would just start. You were like, talk to me naughty about the Cybertruck event, and it started generating and then just disappeared. Just deleted it, yeah and then just disappeared like you would like to go to this event wouldn't you delete what was that what was that weird yeah it's like turn it off unplug it um anyway besides this ai stuff that they're announcing they also announced some hardware uh one more windows update oh which we did cover last week but I'm just reiterating layers and paint

banger update biggest thing of the year how could I forget how do you not live stream layers and paint that would have been a hard retention spike would have been huge standing ovation I think introducing layers

pops out with like a 10 second graphic with sick narration. Yeah, 37 years in the making. Okay, anyway, they also announced hardware. Pretty boring updates, I gotta say. And this has been the case for Surface for a very long time. We got a Surface... Which one was the boring one?

The Go? Yeah, everyone's favorite 2-in-1. You know we love 2-in-1s here. The Go is not the 2-in-1, though. No, the Surface Laptop Go 3 is a 2-in-1. They didn't release, I mean, I wrote this later in here, but there was no just Surface Laptop 6. There's no just regular Surface Laptop.

It's still the 5 from 2022. That is not something that they announced. Which is, obviously, I've been using this for a very long time. I dig it. I love the form factor and the size and like nice hinge. Everything about this is fantastic so I was kind of looking forward to a new one. That's the thing.

Sorry to interrupt. That's the thing about like even working on this iPhone review and some pieces of tech, I always think like this piece of tech is really really great i wouldn't change a thing about it that's why i was bummed that there wasn't a new one yeah but what yeah what do you yeah i think it's more like people really enjoy getting told that has a new feature that they didn't even realize they wanted yet you know. That's why people still want like tech events to not get totally leaked before it happens. Or when there's like an oh wow moment during like a during a tech event of some kind. It's like very exciting to have no idea what you're going to see.

I think it's that. And it's also like when you see a new piece of tech, you kind of picture it in your life and you're like the last version of it like made all the right choices for my life so the newest version will probably also make all the right choices for my life and i'll just like better somehow but it'll be better in every direction hopefully yeah but you never know to be fair this is a surface laptop three so the six is like would have been a significant jump up and like when you're kind of looking for something new you probably want to get it from the same year. The last Surface laptop was from 2022 at this point, almost a year ago.

Yeah. Silver lining is maybe if they didn't announce it now, that means it's going to be a bigger update that they're going to announce at a separate event. But it would have been just as big, oh, at a separate event? Yeah. A separate non-livestreamed event that nobody knows about? Yeah.

But yeah, Surface Laptop Go 3 is a two-in-one laptop um i mean yeah kind of boring under two and a half pounds 15 hours battery life fast charging 12 inch touchscreen fingerprint read power button 720p webcam uh core i5 integrated graphics 8 or 16 gigabytes of ram and i mean this is just like 900 it's like when you said it's a 22 webcam you know that kevin hart clip where he's getting interviewed and the guy says like i'm like 47 years old and he just goes damn that's i had the same when you said 720p webcam my brain was just put that in damn wow okay to be fair like all webcams are 720p until fairly recently 2023 i know just one of those ones i feel like just

skip over that stuff yeah yeah um i think the most exciting laptop they announced was the surface laptop studio 2 horrible name they should have just given it a new name um but it's an upgraded version of the laptop studio which we covered last year which is quite fun it's sort of a not true successor but kind of like spiritual successor to the surface uh what was it called just called the studio right yeah no no the studio is the desktop oh i'm talking about the surface book surface book service book with it no just called surface book it had over the surface it was a tablet that docked into this really awesome aluminum chassis oh yeah and had. And you would rip it out.

That really bendy hinge on it. That was their apex of Microsoft hinges. Right. I loved that. Not visually. I liked it. I don't know. It looked like a snake spine.

It reminded me of the Royal Flex spine. Do snakes have spines? Aren't they only spines? They're just spines. They're not just all muscle? Huge spine. they do have a spine gigantic spine okay that's good to know yeah um anyway so they made it a lot faster but the thing that is actually fairly interesting to me is that they put a dedicated ai uh accelerator

chip in it oh yeah they kind of glossed over that um and a lot of the articles also glossed over it. But they put an MPU separate from the main Intel chipset in there, or Ryzen chipset, whichever they're using. Probably because they were too busy trying to talk about the 4050 or 4060 options that promise up to two times better graphics performance than Apple's M2 Max chip. Yeah, they said that, and I was like, mm-mm-mm. max chip yeah they said that and i was like listen i and it's graphics performance from a 40 60 like i'm sure there's some sort of gaming scenario or even just like rendering scenario where maybe it is better performance than that but it's just like a very specific thing they did show a blender render test and they did it on stage and they started the macbook pro at the exact same time and as they started the laptop studio and the macbook pro like took too long so they kept they just moved on to the next section while it

was still rendering but the laptop studio had finished really fast but it's optimized specifically for that kind of stuff yeah and i mean a 40 60 is a nutty card like that's a great card it's gonna do really awesome yeah but the npu is interesting because it's kind of like you don't really fully understand how AI is going to be like a wrapped part of Windows, like a really important part of Windows. But the NPU is specifically designed for those tasks. So once we actually get this version of Windows in people's hands and this laptop comes out, then maybe you'll see how it's like really accelerating all the AI ai tasks that it's supposed to do i think that says a lot yeah i think that's a lot about how much they actually plan on having this stuff like work its way into windows because if you're gonna put dedicated silicon in the computer for it that means they're gonna do enough of it that they want a separate chip to take that action off of the main cpu and so it'll be able to do it faster

and ideally save you battery life. More efficiently, yeah. So, pretty dope. It says a lot, yeah. Yeah, it does. It's actually kind of insane how quickly Windows went from, like, having nothing to do with AI to this is the entire new direction for our company.

When you spend that much money. Yeah. On a partnership, I'm sure. But it's crazy, because before ChatGPT came out, Microsoft was just Microsoft. That Cortana, man. That was less than a year ago. That is wild.

Do you realize that? I mean, they made that investment way before that, but it was only when ChatGPT came out that Microsoft was like, we're a different company now. That's us. You made this? I made this.

I made this. Yeah, exactly. I also think just the laptop studio in general is like interesting interesting it's a fun laptop like it's fun because it's totally different i do appreciate it it is like bulky it's bulky the way the screen hinges so it can come forward like an easel and just like how the pen we did we did yeah i thought it was really cool then too and this is just an updated version of it um yeah i think i'd love to give it a try it's definitely a lot more to like throw in your bag for traveling yeah there was one other thing they

didn't announce it's funny that it was announced outside the event but the event itself was kind of outside of the event yeah but there's a surface go 4 which is like a tablet for yes super cheap yeah it's like a cheap well like frontline worker like go beat it up not great processor and everything like that so they announced that as well um but i was yeah i was bummed like i said before no surface laptop 6 would as i assume what it would be um that's usually i think kind of their like flagship i agree it's like it's sort of like how google has the pixel as being like this this is what Android could be, could look like. Here's all the crazy features that we could have on Android.

Yeah. That's what the Nexus devices used to be. Was that one of the questions that I asked? I didn't ask Panos that. I think I asked the CEO that. Satya, are you competing with other OEMs or are you like trying to lead the way? I'm trying to remember what he said.

He probably just said we're trying to lead the way because the companies that own the platform don't care about the hardware. Right. It's why Google just got like, just kept not trying with the Pixel for years and years. But they want to have a piece of hardware to be able to flex like,

here's how well you can integrate with stuff. And it's basically like a test device. When they make new software features, they can test it on the thing that is made to run their software features. So, no Surface 6 means either A, mission accomplished, B, we're just late and it'll come out later. I think they're just late. Or C, no, that's it. uh we're just late and it'll come out later i think they're just late or c no that's it just say i mean the surface laptop studio is still like a it's beefy machine that can like handle all this really well and you would almost like say is the like if this the

surface laptop six would have been the pixel eight then that's the laptop studios like the fold or something like that maybe like a step different way more niche and everything like that with all the different that's a good analogy yeah thanks yeah thanks i like that analogy well thanks there was a reason we kept you around yeah thanks y'all um but yeah so that's why we keep you in the middle so both of you can nod at my presence shower me with praise. Please, please. But yeah, that's the Microsoft event.

Yeah. I was the best part of it. There's even more events we've got to talk about, but we do have some time to get there, which means we should have a little bit of a break. All right. So let's do another trivia question. Trivia. Where's Ellis?

I'm back. Trivia. Where's Ellis? I'm back. Trivia time. Oh. Ba-da-bo. iPhone 15 Pro intro, audio, done. It's a banger. Nice.

Get ready for that. Oh, I'm so pumped for that. You've already watched it, haven't you? Yeah, it's been out for two days by the time you're listening to this. Two days? Yeah, people,

hopefully. Same day, right? Hopefully. I'm giving myself a little buffer. It'll be out by the time you watch this. It's been out for beep days. Yeah. Wow.

Were you about to say something more? You can just beep that. I was going to say, you teleport back in for trivia because trivia is very important and we need to have good trivia questions. Very important. Did you guys get my weird question during the break? I got it first. Wait, which one?

For all the viewers out there. Mita? If you rearrange the letters and metaA it spells what important food group? I wrote it out. It's M-E-T-A. It's like mom, what's your E-T-A? Anyway, my real question is also about META.

Oh. Yes. META is no newcomer to the hardware game. As early as 2011 they had a Facebook not branded, but oriented phone on the market. It was called the HTC Status.

It had this little Facebook button at the bottom. The HTC Status is actually what they renamed the phone to. Horrible first name. Do you remember the first name? It's terrible. I do remember it, but I don't remember it. That's the problem. I do remember it, but I don't remember it. That's the problem.

Like, I remember that happening, but I don't. I don't remember it. I remember how bad it was. Wasn't Facebook going to make a watch at one point, too? Yes. Right? And it had a camera on it, and everyone's like, I don't want it. Yes.

Do you remember that? That was, like, last year. They're like, you guys wouldn't want, like, a microphone. No, there was an older one. Oh, an older one. And a microphone in your house. Wouldn't that be cool? HTC Status.

I remember it having a worse name. It did have a worse name. When AT&T made it an exclusive of theirs, I think they made HTC change the name. Or at least that's when the name got changed. They were like, guys, come on. Come on, really? Oh, yeah, I know it.

Good. Cool. I won. With you. That's just me. You You and me It was last year That one says last year Because I'm a god Incredible

I know things Sometimes Alright well we'll all ponder that Andrew will I've got no chance He's got no chance We'll be right back Dig deep

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The guide is free to you at netsuite.com slash waveform. netsuite.com slash waveform. All right, welcome back to the Metaverse section of the podcast where we just pretend to have legs. You guys don't know. You can't prove you can't see it. You've never seen our legs on this podcast. It's because we don't have any. But we're going to pretend to have legs for this segment.

So just picture us with legs. Or we just... Actually, wait. Yeah. Also, Adam and I confirmed legs from Family Feud episode where he stood up. Y'all have legs. So yeah, producers confirmed have legs. Producers have legs.

There is definitely an episode with me having my leg right here in the air. David has one leg. That's true. Red jacket people legs, question mark. Question mark. Anyway. Anyway. There was a meta event.

We had a big long keynote with, I guess, Mark Zuckerberg gave most of the keynote, but there was a bunch of other stuff. But we got some announcements. 30 minutes late, too. It was late. It was live stream, though. So shout out to that, at least happening. And we got some new, it was basically three new things that they announced.

It was the Quest 3. It was the, I guess it's called, would you call them glasses? They're glasses. They're Ray-Ban Stories Mark 2. Ray-Ban's glasses with camera we'll talk about. I think it just said smart glasses on the screen. Yeah, smart glasses. And also an AI thing.

Yeah. So. More llamas. I'm just going to like use that umbrella term for now so okay let's start with the quest 3 so we knew the quest 3 was coming this is the big thing where i don't know honestly if you're just talking like most accessible most popular vr headsets in the world it's the quest and that's the one that you know what 300 bucks it's the one i think it's 400 now right oh is it there was a big jacked up the price okay that's why it was insanely accessible right now it's a little less okay so it did sort of graduate as well so i'll just give you the details so we have the quest 2 which was a vr headset didn't

have it i think it had maybe one pass-through camera yeah this is the quest 3 it is a fully what they're calling it and this is very wording, is the first mainstream headset built for mixed reality. And what they mean by that is when they say first, they mean we're coming to market before the Vision Pro. When they say mainstream, they mean we will cost less than any of the others, including our other one. And when they say mixed reality, they are referring to the fact that you can use pass-through all the time and it is how it's meant to be used so you can put things in your daily environment you see your environment around you but there are virtual items overlaid inside that environment so that's the mixed reality thing the reason it costs more $4.99 when it comes out in October is because it's got to have a bunch now it's got cameras on the outside

more sensors to do better pass-through which is understandable it's also to have a bunch now it's got cameras on the outside more sensors to do better pass through which is understandable it's also got a new snapdragon xr2 with double the graphics performance i think i said it's going to have 90 hertz but we'll do 120 hertz with a beta or something yeah yeah so it's got a bunch of new stuff it looks pretty cool it looks different on the outside yeah and uh it's coming later this year this This is definitely their reaction to Apple. Although they announced it technically before the Vision Pro even got announced. But I think that they knew that people were starting to move to mixed reality stuff or spatial computing stuff. But it is such a huge divergence from their previous quests. Because the previous quests have been all VR.

Yes, you technically have pass-through, but it's black and white. It's really low frame rate. It's safety. It's a safety thing. It was like to set up your room and if you get past the barrier, you set up so you don't immediately run into something. When you saw pass-through in the old quests, you were like, oh no, something's wrong.

And most of this keynote was talking about mixed reality, which is so funny because every other time they're like, guys, we're gonna make the metaverse happen we're gonna make the metaverse happen and then every game they would release is just vr just vr and they have the exact same thing where like apple had the thing has the thing where they you can dial in how much of mixed reality you want versus virtual reality and now you double tap and you are fully immersed in the vr world you double tap and then you've got mixed

reality back yeah so it's also funny because i remember we were talking about this a few weeks ago and you were like oh the new meta quest is probably gonna have like this and this and mixed reality i was like why would it have mixed reality this is not the oculus quest pro is their mixed reality thing why on earth would this have it that makes no sense it's jeopardizing the oculus quest pro the the massive success of the oculus pro um they sold them all to assurion but but here it is and it's there and i can't help but think this looks pretty awesome and makes the oculus i've said it so many times i've messed it up but the quest pro seems bad no yeah there's almost no reason anyone should ever get the quest pro i, it was sort of made for businesses

in the first place, so it was a couple thousand dollars or whatever. Yeah. You know what it reminds me of? It reminds me of the Mustang Mach-E, where you're like, okay, it's not the same as the other Mustangs, but I could see why you'd want to use the Mustang name to get people to pay attention to it. Because if they tried a new name with this

that didn't say Oculus Quest, I don't think it would be received quite the same way. So it's sort of graduating to mixed reality and we're just like, this is part of the family now. So this is just the way it is now. Quest 3, mixed reality. Great. Yeah. Some other updates on that. You can now use

the hand tracking is apparently significantly improved. I was hoping for this. Zuck said through some AI stuff. Okay. significantly improved um hoping for this zuck said through some ai stuff okay very generic uh probably training on more hands or something uh and he also said like you can use the new controllers which by the way do not have the rings anymore so now there's they're significantly improved controllers he was like you can use the new controllers or you can use your hands so it seems like they're probably wanting to move towards just being able to use your hands for everything.

I mean, if it's like the Quest Pro, they said there was way better tracking and some sort of things in the new controllers. And these controllers look exactly like the Quest Pro controllers. So again, it feels like jeopardizing that. For games, you want to use guns and stuff. It makes sense to have a controller that has haptic feedback, etc. But for a lot of things, using your hands is probably gonna be useful yeah i wonder if it's the

same pinch gesture type stuff yeah i don't know i bet it is i still think because like the um vive does pinch gesture things and i remember shen one time telling us a big reason of that is because when you tap on your finger you're getting feedback from yourself so like you still want that feedback yeah and it's all built out already. Like you can use your hands as controllers, but it's like this interesting like pointer mechanism where you put your fingers together and then it draws a line at the thing that you're pointing at.

So it's different from the Vision Pro, which in Apple's demo, you just look at the button and tap your fingers anywhere. And it just selects what you're looking at, which was very different. It's a much more complex thing. That a three thousand dollar headset etc we know it's different yeah that's just that's the difference in controls yeah it really feels like they're trying to pivot towards being an apple competitor like i previously i kind of felt like there were

different use cases like apple is like this is all productivity and work and you can i guess kind of do games but you're going to be movies you're gonna be watching courtside they had the same thing yeah they had like the same demos that apple used to like show off the vision pro stuff watch all the nba games or like have one nba game but then also kind of the other ones on the side and scores and standards and stuff like that yeah exactly the same as apple did it yeah i can't believe this is coming into the thing that feels like the quest pro or sorry the vision pro competitor because i thought the quest lineup of these like cheaper ones were really going to be based on vr and gaming and let's be real the best things you're still going to be able to do in this are vr and gaming and like that's what i actually like about

the quest 2 and what this will be but like yeah cool it's got more uh it's got mixed reality and depending on how well they can do the productivity stuff that apple is targeting the vision pro to be they could have a leg up because apple doesn't really see the vision pro as a gaming device i mean it's heavy it's expensive you don't want to sweat in it. Whereas this is like, you've got swappable headbands. You've got all these things. They're washable, they're machine washable. It's cheap, it's made of plastic. And so like, they've already gone super far

into making this a good gaming device. So if they're able to nail a lot of the productivity stuff that Apple is doing with the Vision Pro, then they were kind of ahead in a lot of ways. It feels like this is an area where they they've got to be ahead because they've been making these headsets and they actually know how people really use them so apple's never made i'm sure they have market research and they know how people they think they're going to use the headsets but i think mark said on stage like it

turns out people love fitness in these things and like seems crazy but it's the most popular thing people do in these headsets is like turn games into like fitness experience eat things and like seems crazy but it's the most popular thing people do in these headsets is like turn games into like fitness experience eat saber is like yeah the number one thing i play on these a thousand times over and there's a bunch of things just like beat saber that people love supernatural i think it's that and it's also the quest pro is three thousand five hundred or sorry the vision pro is thirty,500. And I think if I'm just forecasting in like basic Apple language, remove the word pro,

they're gonna have a cheaper version at some point. Just the Vision, whatever. If I can just go out there, there was just a rumor that 9to5Mac posted from Ming-Chi Kuo that that cheaper version is potentially canceled. Just throw that out there you know in the middle of the podcast that's all there is there's like no more information about it but there's a rumor

that that might be canceled that is fascinating i mean i just go by like apple's like they do in the future what they did in the past so okay this has the word pro on it what does that mean it's the higher end expensive one which probably means they're going to make a lower end not as expensive one that probably has less features sure and it'll probably be in the same price bracket, not the same price maybe, but the same bracket as this. So they will have a leg up in both adoption because it's a lower price and knowing what people actually do with it,

having a plastic build, having interchangeable headsets, like being more fitness focused. I think it'll have a bunch of legs up in that way. The main thing that are behind on in the productivity space though is ecosystem because like Vision Pro is basically a MacBook that has all of your apple stuff yeah like mirrors it's connected to your iCloud but it also will literally mirror your macbook yeah where with this I think they showed some software and they had some Microsoft compatibilities I'm trying to

remember exactly what they said it would do but it would do some stuff like teams yeah i mean i do all my business in whatsapp so i think i've got this directly plugged in yeah we do your business this is uh you know it's a it's a new headset we will we'll see when it comes out in october there is actually one thing they showed that i have a little bit of a gripe with go ahead they were showing kind of like the mixed reality and how you can use different i forgot what they called them um but basically like different apps and programs that would be able to be kind of pinned around your world similar to what apple was talking about yeah one of them

was instagram they're making a new instagram basically app inside the metaverse that can that works in your space and everything but they're still too lean of a team to make an iPad app you can't use that excuse anymore you put it in the metaverse and it's not on the iPad I would bet you the real excuse why they haven't made an iPad app is because they compress photos too much

and because they compress them so much if they have to stretch them up to a bigger scale they're just gonna look awful yeah that's the best theory I've heard that's hilarious yeah i just want to say as as the person in the office who embarrassingly has probably spent the most hours in the quest pro i know not something i'm proud of i'd like to apologize to my girlfriend for making that public um i i i don't see the difference between the quest 3 and the quest pro i see a difference this looks way more comfortable this is way better i think this looks way better than it looks a little bit more powerful and people say the color on the pass

through cameras is better but other than that it's like like what what what is it actually like that's what i'm saying i think this cannibalizes the quest pro yeah well except for when you like sell it overpriced to enterprise businesses by saying it's the pro version saying. I think this cannibalizes the Quest Pro. Well, except for when you sell it overpriced to enterprise businesses by saying it's the Pro version. I think the cheaper plastic and lightness of this will make it way more comfortable because the Quest Pro was not exactly a comfortable headset.

Your forehead gets wet. You get sweaty in this, but I'm usually playing Beat Saber on Expert, Expert Plus. I'm going to use it. When we get it, i'm doing the same thing i'm spending full work days in this floor until i start puking this is like a dream yes yeah spend more time in it i'm interested they have a 90 hertz with the 120 hertz beta whatever that means um but i'm interested in the uh latency because one thing that the vision pro did

exceedingly well in the demo that we had was like such little latency that you could stand up, walk around, run around, and it felt like you were doing it normally. You're talking about the mixed reality latency aspect of it, right? Yeah, feeding the image into the camera and into your eyeball. And that's crazy important.

Yeah, it's super important. The pass-through demo with the Vision Pro is the only one where I feel confident I could win points of ping pong with the headset on. Yeah. only one where i feel confident i could win points of ping pong with the headset on yeah real ping we got to make a challenge i don't every other one you would like swing and you'd see the pass through and you'd think you're connecting but there's enough latency that you're not connecting yeah and the pass through on the vision pro is that good yeah yeah we'll see about this one one other thing this has or i should say

doesn't have is those creepy eyes on the outside of it and that is a huge win it does have a little bit of a new design it does look a bit different it's not like three it looks kind of like alien yeah but uh no not your own eyes plastered on the front yeah staring at you yeah Yeah. So that's Quest 3. It's coming October 10th. He said August 10th by accident and it showed October 10th on the screen. All of us had to have a minute of like what day is it?

Did September not start yet? When he said August I was like I swear to God it's September. I know it's September but yeah. You're right. It's October. He opened the next part of the keynote with alright this is kind of a really hard pivot because it's September, but yeah, you're right. It's October. He opened the next part of the keynote with, all right, this is kind of a really hard pivot because it's completely different, but I'm just going to go for it.

Let's talk about AI. And I was like, oh. And then four people in the front row were like, uh, golf club. Every tech keynote ever is just like, it's AI time, guys. It's chatbot time. We're going to talk about it they really ring

the ai dinner bell yeah so the main thing they announced was meta ai which is going to be populating basically all of their meta apps um you're going to be able to talk to this llm in whatsapp messenger and instagram uh i don't know about facebook probably facebook but maybe they don't want you to do that. I don't know. I guess Messenger is built into Facebook as well, so it would be the same thing, sort of? Yeah, question mark.

But it's basically based on their Llama 2 model, which they are populating throughout all of their applications. For those that don't know, Llama was their large language model. These are all different names of animals, mostly because some animals have two Ls in their name, large language. And they also announced EMU, which is their photo-generating AI. And there wasn't an acronym for it. I don't remember what it was, but they literally said sticking to the animal theme.

One thing they were trying to do to undercut Open open ai was that they are announcing like both the chat bot which they want to compete with gpt4 and their image generation bot which they were specifically like it doesn't take minutes this takes literally five seconds and everything is free so with open ai right now you have to pay the twenty dollars if you want to use gpt4 and you have to pay the $20 if you want to use GPT-4 and you have to pay that money if you want to use DALI 3 that is built into GPT-4 now. So the images they showed looked pretty good. They all kind of had a sort of a cartoonish like drawing to them where I would be curious if they could do other styles. But like anytime you see a keynote like that, you know, they're hand selecting the absolute best of the best versions. So I'm just going by that and saying, all right, these are pretty good.

Yeah. I'm curious if I can test it and see what they actually look like if I test more. Yeah. One neat thing I think they did with it was bringing it into like stickers and WhatsApp and Messenger where like you, if there was a sticker you didn't have, like if you wanted a frog on a skateboard, you could type in and it would create one through emu and make a sticker for you i was like that's the kind of little thing that i actually think is kind of yeah i would like that that's kind of like um in ios 17 how you can like turn anything into a sticker and use it throughout your different apps yeah but this you could just like type in some totally unhinged thing that maybe you're talking about and then it would make a sticker and then

put it in yeah that's kind of i think that's kind of weird i think that's cool it i don't know maybe i'm old i don't know i just every time every time i see a tech keynote get to the stickers section i just my eyes glaze over and i just like wait for the next thing to start like i don't i don't any group chats are you in work i'm I'm not in any that use stickers. I'm in group chats. Nobody uses the stickers. And, but you know, clearly people do because there's a long section in every keynote.

What's the Google thing called? Where if you like put two emojis together and it makes it- Emoji kitchen. Emoji kitchen with the hot dog is like the best thing ever. This is like a way cooler version of that. I need to react with a frog with laser eyes. So let just go on the thing the other crypto frog yeah i i kind of

love that i love that that's like you're bringing your imagination to life and just putting it into the chat it's one of those use cases that i can imagine perfectly i just never ever use yeah so emoji or limit emoji or limit they're very. Our Slack is going to be full of those. When we move all our work chats to WhatsApp. But by far, the weirdest part about this Meta AI thing was that they were announcing these chatbots that you can interact with use the likeness of a bunch of celebrities with different names. And we were having this really weird existential question about like conversation about this when we were in the other room even

just the way they announced it was strange because it showed they just they were like these new people you can chat with that are like videos of people talking to you but there's a bunch of pictures of people we recognize but different names and they like didn't explain it for a while so the way they said it was like you can talk to i don't know i'm making this up victor played by duane wade and it would be duane wade's face and you're using you're having a chat conversation with victor but also duane wade and you're just supposed to not say it's duane wade it's like it's victor but it's duane wade's personality and likeness. Right. And so they had Snoop Dogg. They had Mr. Beast, Tom Brady, a bunch of people in there.

And it was like, you can have a conversation with Tom Brady, but it's Bob or whatever it's said. I think his name was Brew. And you're like, okay, so am I supposed to feel like, am I talking to Tom Brady? Or is it like, why are these likenesses involved at all? The way I see it it's like if one of these chatbots goes nuts and tells me to jump off a bridge I can't

say Tom Brady told me to jump off a bridge so I'll have to say Brew told me to jump off a bridge that's the difference so Meta gets sued instead of Tom Brady and then Tom Brady won't be in two lawsuits because if any company think about it if any company... Think about it.

If any company approached you and they were like, David, we want anyone to be able to have a conversation with you through an AI chatbot that we trained to know everything about you. Your fans can just talk to you all day. I don't like that at all. That would be super cool, right? No. And the one objection I would have is like,

what if that chatbot says something crazy that i would never say yeah like no trust me it knows everything about you and it would never say anything crazy and i'd be like but that's what you said about bing and it went nuts for a week yeah so just to protect me a little bit you can use my likeness if you pay me a lot and also call it something else yeah and that And now it's just a weird, confusing combo. I'm surprised that this many big name celebrities agreed to this. They're all big names. They're all huge celebrities.

Money, money, money. Meta must have made so much money. Like, oh my God, it's crazy. They said it's coming for regular creators sometime in the future, like next year. It sounds like it's coming for you. That's how that sounds. He did have this three or four minute spiel where he was like, look, we know that creators

really value their brand and we don't want to have this go. We're going to roll this out slowly and patiently and be careful about this because we know you wouldn't want it to just represent you without you knowing exactly how it'll behave. So that's why we're using it with these first. I'm going to turn my action button into your AI.

Let me talk to Marquez. marquez just like yes adam we we talked before about how people like break these things the week of people breaking these with celebrity like this is gonna be brutal it's gonna be so funny it's gonna be weird i can't wait for the screenshots i'm still a little confused is it really using like their personality or are they just, they're like putting people into, there's like a chef that you can ask cooking questions and there's like, Chris Paul was golfing. The golf expert. Yeah, yeah.

And so I don't know if it's really them or more just like they have a category they talk about. It's probably just the category that they represent. So the one that's like, is just to get it to feel friendly it's just i wouldn't talk to bob the funny guy but if mr beast's face is on it maybe i will i need to tease the funny guy i need to talk to one of these people asap and ask what the terms and conditions of this were like did they scrape all of their text messages

in terms of like finding their personality yeah that's why i don't think there is actual personality in it i think you're right but then why even pay for the celebrities at all i guess it's a marketing familiar face but even that it just looks like it's a single photo and then like what's that face app where that people always take your face and make you say like crazy things or like sing. That's all it feels like. It doesn't even feel like a video. It's very obviously like, it's like Snoop Dogg,

the dungeon master, like animoting in the corner. There's not even smoke. How realistic could it be? Yeah, that's proof there's no personality. Yeah, there's zero personality. That's why the iPhone's been overheating is because Snoop Dogg

just smoking in your phone too much. Snoop Dogg, the AI, dungeon master. New sentence. It's weird, man. Snoop Dogg the AI dungeon master. We got to wait. It's like a random dolly generation. Yeah.

We'll wait for this to come out. I think that was the weirdest tech event demo I've ever seen. I was genuinely baffled the entire time yeah me too yeah at no point did you feel like you wanted to try it no yeah i do gotta say like all of the celebrities that they had on stage to like or not on stage but in the app to be like hi i'm mr beast and i do this they all seem like they didn't want to be there but soup jog like showed up in this full costume. He was all in it, dude. Snoop goes 110%, man. He did even 110%.

You gotta love that about Snoop, man. You're getting all Snoop Dogg. They labeled Mr. Beast as the funny guy. Yeah, what? Also, Chris Paul's a basketball player, not a golfer. What is going on? Don't win a championship, you're golfing a lot. Yeah, maybe that's a subtle dig, actually.

That was not subtle. I hearles barkley's a golfer too yeah we heard you a lot spent a lot of time in the bahamas so we're gonna train this one on someone who vacations a lot um the vacationer yeah yeah i don't know i i think that they took the idea of these personalized aisIs because this is a whole conversation in the AI space right now. It's like they're going to have a sub AI to help you with every single little task that you want to do versus one omniscient AI that happens to know everything. That's sort of the competing conversation. It seems like they just took that and they ran with it. That's interesting.

Yeah. What do you do with Mr. Beast, the funny guy? Especially if it's not his personality. Tell me a joke, funny man. Yeah. Like, what do you do with Mr. Beast, the funny guy? Especially if it's not his personality. Tell me a joke, funny man. Hit the joke button over and over again. Yeah. And then the bigger question in all of this is there's another conversation about people owning their digital twin. Have you heard of this conversation at all? Fleeting over the past couple of months. It's basically like, if I can go on the internet and ask Abraham Lincoln and ask to talk to Abraham Lincoln, and there's an AI that's trained on everything he's ever written, and

then I'm basically talking to Abraham Lincoln, it's like, that's eventually going to happen for everyone. Whether you like it or not, someone's going to scrape all of your videos, they're going to turn it into a bunch of text, all of your tweets.'s gonna make ai marquez and be like what phone should i buy and they'll just like ask the ai version of me yeah yeah and so the question is like should you own that since it's technically your likeness versus can someone just randomly make it because someone will make it against your will it will happen it going to take some sort of a redefining of what likeness is. Yeah.

But yeah, you should own that. Yeah, for sure. We'll find out when Meta releases this version of that in like six months. This shit started in October. It wasn't that long ago. It's been less than a year and we live in a completely different world now. I just feel like Google probably thought about this and said, we shouldn't do that. Remember when they had like, you can have a conversation with Pluto.

Because we know everything about Pluto. Literally everything humanity ever knows about Pluto, Google knows that too. So it's like you can have a conversation with, insert subject here, like, oh, what's it like being 900 million miles away from the sun? Oh, it seems like it's pretty cold. What's the closest thing to you? How bright is the sun? And it'll know everything. It'll have a conversation can you hold on one

second did you think the disney character ellis no the planet the planet the planet which is over there super confused why is pluto 900 million miles okay yeah yeah like clued you back in no pluto so they they had that moment, and then I think it was sort of a Google I.O. demo that that happened, and I don't know that it ever became a real tool that people would use, but I guarantee somebody was like...

It was Lambda 2. Well, we also have a bunch of info about people. What if you could just have a conversation with Barack Obama? And someone was like, eh, we shouldn't do that. Yeah, that person was a lawyer. Yeah, exactly. And that could have a bunch of weird implications.

I mean, the Transformer was invented in 2017 at Google. So I would bet you that Google has had basically this level of technology for a while. They just knew that it was freaking ridiculously reckless and dangerous to just release it. And Meta was like, hold my beer. Well, OpenAI was like, we're just a random foundation. I don't know. And they just went with it, and now everything's... Google was like, I'm too busy killing off services to release this.

Sorry, that thing that's going to change the world, I was focusing on Google Podcasts. Well, anyway, the last thing that they announced, we had the AI, we had the Quest 3, the last thing they announced was the Ray-Ban glasses, the new ones, version 2. Ray-Ban Stories 2. And they show all these demos where, like, this

chat comes up, and you can do this cool thing where you're streaming on Instagram from the glasses, and you have video calls from the glasses, and they see through your camera, and all that is super cool for first- person view, but there's no screen. So if you're streaming on Instagram, you can't read any of the comments. You have to have your phone out. If you're on a video call, you can't see who you're calling. They just see what your camera sees. Like there's a whole bunch of weird missing things that I would like to have a screen for. It was like actively

confusing in that because everything they showed they felt like you were reading things online like when you when charlotte claire best part of the entire by the way is that the f1 driver that's like in it um he's like live streaming a go kart race and it shows like the chat going up but like you can't see that yeah and then like later when it's showing how it uses ai so you can a new feature that's coming out next year so if you're asking hey meta i can say that and i don't think i'm going to set anyone to but one's devices on the podcast yeah it is the trigger but um no way so you can ask you can ask it things and it can like a chat bot but it's audio only but in all of the, it's showing the question asked and showing the answers from it,

which feels like if I were watching that and not paying enough attention, I would be able to see that in the glasses, but you can't. Yeah, you hear it in the speakers. So that's, yeah, it's interesting. I don't know how useful it will be. This is why I tweeted like Google Glass,

hear me out, could come out tomorrow and it would still feel ahead of its time. Yeah, yeah. Because Google Glass was the same idea. It was actually it didn't even have glasses attached to it. You could attach the frame. But it was just the frame. Yeah. And it had the bone conduction speaker so you could hear stuff but it also would show

like navigation instructions incoming notifications. Yeah. Like all that stuff on the little prism. Yeah. That was. None of these smart glasses that we're seeing have, like, video support to, like, actually see something in a screen. Everything is just, like, it records video. It does this, but you can't, like, watch anything in that. What if your screen could be projected onto something in front of you?

That sounds like a very humane technology. And also, like like something from uh 2004 but yeah like but it has ai so it's okay true true true but yeah like i don't know all that whole thing and even just like saying we're announcing three things today and showing smart glasses at the end when you're talking about all this ai and mixed reality and everything and then just to be like oh yeah they're just glasses with a camera that feels like a privacy nightmare and also which there's no video on the screen at all the big update in them was that next year you're going to be able to talk to your personalized ai well i don't know about personalized you'll be able to talk to an ai in the glasses well so that's no that's already

that'll be out when it comes out the thing next year is that it will reference what you're seeing so the camera will be able to like you can look at i don't know a bottle of milk did they make i was trying to yeah not here bottles what oh it's cartons here right there's bottles of milk are there not really a bottle maybe it's somewhereons here. Right. There's bottles of milk. Are there? Not really. A bottle? Maybe it's somewhere else. Maybe like, when you get like an individual,

what do you call it? Like Wawa when you get chocolate milk. Oh, chocolate milk comes in a bottle. But regular milk doesn't really come in a bottle. You can get a regular milk thing like that. What about the lunchroom when you were like a kid? That was a carton.

That was a carton. Oh, I had ones that had like that pull-off tab on the top. Oh, I see. It was in plastic. Okay, yeah, I've seen that. Wait, really? It's a bottle, yeah. Yeah, but it's like a little mini like yeah it's a bottle i guess we don't have that on the

golden coast that no get out of here canadian slap that's not here sorry sorry we didn't have any bag full of milk every time i picture a bag of milk i just picture it that's a bottle yeah that's like european i've never seen that in the united states we just went this this this this this this is what i had in um wow loading internet nice anyway so if you looked at your bottle of milk yeah then the ai could theoretically be like hey andrew in your ears that no one else can hear this has got 1400 calories that in your example it showed on screen yeah that's a bucket that's a bottle this is the most dystopian i have ever seen dude i like the example where it

was looking at a leaky faucet and it said hey meta what is this and the response how do i fix this how do i fix this and it said this is a leaky faucet you start by disassembling it and that's what it said to the person oh my god what do you what do you say now like how and then it it has to talk you through with zero visuals look there's a world where this works amazingly well we're just so far from it like if i can look at my tool chest and be like which tool and it's like third from the left hex wrench and you grab it and it starts directing you that's what google glass that would be sick but i just just no way it works that well yeah like you reach your hand out and it's like two over to the right and then you grab it that sounds if it was that good without a screen because it's got to do all

audio for that yeah yeah that sounds that's why the google glass one would just show you a picture of it you'd be like oh it's that one so we're far we're far from this working well i can't wait somebody doing this in the wild of like talking to their glasses and like moving their hand based on the questions they're asking it. This now convinces me that you know how the AirPods Pro have the new audio mode that's like it's like adaptive. I bet you they only made that because they want people to be wearing the vision pro and feel more immersed 100 with the noise cancellation but then when they actually need to talk to people and just not get hit by a car oh that's a great point yeah it's like pass through

on the headset yeah what whoa it's audio pass through wait a whoa wow yeah apple's got the best pass-through audio already in headphones yeah ready to pair with the best pass-through video in a headset that's why i never even put that together i just thought of that right now can i can i hot take real quick it would be 30 seconds apple i don't know if anyone else feels this way when they released the adaptive mode they made transparency mode worse because transparency mode used to reduce noise by more than it does now it feels like to do adaptive mode they like had to make room by pushing it and i like the old transparency mode was just golden and i was using it all weekend and just like this hurts i wonder if they know i don like it. I haven't noticed it that much.

See, Hayato does this too. We both used the AirPods Pro as our earplugs because they're the best in transparency mode. 100% because it cuts out the high frequency. They are no longer the best concert earplugs. In transparency, it's loud enough that it hurts your ears and in adaptive, you lose the high end. And I was just like,

that's unfortunate. Give it back. i wonder if the people felt disoriented when it would just go from full transparency to like cutting noise like in and out really quickly so they had to like lower that gap so that's the shift transparency mode now still will cut like the high frequency abrupt loud noise yeah so it's not perfectly transparent yeah interesting but it's it's it's less attenuating than it once was that sucks because i've definitely been to concerts where i'm like my ears hurt so bad and i need something to cut those frequencies huh yeah who needs hearing you do because you're listening to this podcast trick question yeah so yeah so google glass coming soon yeah google glass was way ahead of its time before it gets killed again yeah also ray-ban stories

like you can adapt you could put regular frames in them but then you have to wear like ray-ban style regular glasses all the time which is not everybody's style and then otherwise you buy them as sunglasses and then you only wear them outside when it's sunny. So to solve it, you just need like a visor with interchangeable. To solve it, you just need a wire that has a little display on the corner and, you know, Google Glass. We'll get there sometime in the future. Or you get an implant in your eye. Replace your eye?

Y'all, they're testing Neuralink on humans pretty soon, okay? You don't need any of this stuff if you got Neuralink. This podcast just went full circle. That's how we started this whole thing. We've gone full circle, which probably means it's a good time to end it. We just complete the loop perfectly right there. Yeah, I still don't think they make bottles of milk in the United States. No, there's just bags everywhere.

Thanks for watching. Bags. Thanks for listening. Trivia. This is the last step. I wrote down one of the answers, so I cover it up uh trivia time trivia okay so quick update on the score because last time no one scored so i had to double check yeah marquez with nine andrew with one, two, five. Every year. I mean, every week. David with nine.

First question. Yeah. Google Podcasts is going away next year, which was released for Android in 2018. When did Apple first release the Apple Podcast app on mobile? Hmm. Hmm. Mobile. Yeah yeah that part is confusing me

or just makes it seem like there's an extra part on mobile on mobile wait was it on an iPod first it's just why I think he said mobile they still sell iPods I don't know actually I think so

No, they're called the last iPod iPod. There's an iPod touch in like 2018 the classic was the last one living they killed the I think it was a classic They they read remember they brought the touch out again. That's yeah, there was around when I started working Yeah, and I reviewed it was like, why does this exist? Flip them and read. Okay. I said 2016. I also said 2016.

Marques, what'd you say? 2004. What? You're all wrong. Okay. Who's closer? Because we're very off. It was 2012.

Oh, wow. That's much earlier. Dang. Yeah. Apple Podcasts? Yeah, the podcast app on ios i remember everyone saying reviews on itunes for so long well no it was on itunes since it came out but for mobile specifically it wasn't until 2012 that they had an app because the app didn't come to mac os till later i'm

guessing no itunes you would sync your podcast in it. Yeah. On your iPod. They would show up in the music app. Yeah. What? Yeah, it was like playlists, podcasts. Wait, so Apple Podcasts, though,

came in 2012 as a separate app? Indeed. How would you get the podcasts on Apple Podcasts? They would show up through iTunes? Through iTunes

and they'd show up in your music library. Wow, 4G really changed the world. You don't get a point for that. No point, no point. All right, Alice's question. Facebook had a phone at one point. It was called the HTC Status,

but before it was called the HTC Status, it was called what? The Sony Xperia 5.5. Can we know what year it was? 2011. Interesting question. the Sony Xperia 5 5 can we know what year it was 2011 interesting question I remember the keynote that they announced this at do you know what event it was at because I have that information

in front of me as well no I remember watching it though it was at mobile world congress oh it was MWC 2011 no I'm wrong. I just guessed one around that time. Flip them and read. Oh, you two have different ones.

I must be wrong. You have different ones. I must be wrong. I said Eris and I know I'm wrong. Oh, I gotta be wrong. That is wrong. Wow. I said HTC First.

That is also wrong. Really? Oh, wow. I said HTC ChaCha. It is the HTC Chacha released in certain markets as the htc cha-cha-cha because no way htc was correct are you kidding me and then it was cha-cha it was cha-cha-cha it's just a horrible name horrible name cha-cha wait like you're saying no you're saying it's like htc if you were to try and say that out loud, it would be like...

Oh, that's HTC. Just like in a different market, try to pronounce that. And you're just like, oh, it's the Cha-Cha-Cha. HTC to Cha-Cha. Bless you. That's terrible. Thank you, yes. That's a terrible name.

HTC Cha-Cha-Cha. I'm glad my knowledge of that paid off. And with that, Marques takes the lead. First double digits. Ten points. Ten. I'm coming for you. Ten clubcha I'm glad my knowledge of that paid off And with that Marques takes the lead First double digits Ten points Ten I'm coming for you Ten club I'm coming back

Hey Double digit club Ten club This was a long podcast I'm sure This was a long episode So we will wrap it up now To let the editing commence Definitely stay tuned to the other channels

Because there's videos like we talked about In the works for those There should be a new studio video soon which is really awesome we're working on there's a new main channel video new autofocus video on the Polestar there's a lot of stuff going on so subscribe everywhere if you haven't already and TechTember rolls on

although by the time you hear this yeah it's still TechTember next week though we will be talking about the Pixel event because Pixel event next week is on Wednesday so record the podcast afterwards and you'll get our information. And that'll be techtober. That's true. Either way.

Talk to you guys in techtober. Peace. Bye. Waveform is produced by Adam Molina and Ellis Roven. We're partnered with Vox Media Podcast Network and our intro outro music is created by Ving Silver. because i'm using the sn7b so say something that i would say say something that i would say okay that was close whoa wait really i didn't hear that at all wait really i didn't hear yeah i don't sound like you i sound like you do it Well, I think I sound like me.

Well, I think I sound like me. That was pretty good. It's closer than anyone else. You had the cadence perfect on that one for sure. Thanks. And I'm not even Jono. Jono. I was waiting for it.

You were going for the same pun though. I was going for the same joke. We are the same person.