Waveform: The MKBHD Podcast - CES 2025: the Good, the Bad, the Ugly

Episode Date: January 10, 2025

We're back! After a nice break for the holiday Marques, Andrew, and David waste no time getting right back into the newest gadgets and announcements. With Ellis and Adam both out sick, Mariah is in control of the producer table so you know it's going to be a good one. First, everyone gives a quick update on what they did over the break before venting about Qi2 wireless charging in upcoming Android phones. Then it's all about CES where they talk about everything from weird vacuum robots to the new Nvidia announcements and even some new wonky screens from LG! After that, it's all about the cars of CES including Afeela, Faraday Future, and even Honda. Of course, we wrap everything up with some trivia. Enjoy! Links: MKBHD - OnePlus 13 Review CNET - Nvidia CES in 12 Minutes Verge - Nvidia Digits Verge - Nvidia RTX 5090 9to5Google - Qi2 article Linus Tech Tips - Nvidia RTX 5090 demo Verge - Tracking Microsoft tricks Tony Statovci - Bing Short Tom’s Guide - Microsoft copies Google Tom’s Guide - StanByME 2 Hands-On Verge - Dell Kills XPS Verge - New Bird Buddy Cameras Motor Authority - Faraday Future Prototypes Electrive - Faraday Future sold 10 cars Car and Driver - Afeela Verge - New LG lamps PC Gamer - Ducky keyboard Verge - AutoKeybo Short Verge - Honda Zero Music provided by Epidemic Sound  Shop the merch: https://shop.mkbhd.com Socials: Waveform: https://twitter.com/WVFRM Waveform: https://www.threads.net/@waveformpodcast Marques: https://www.threads.net/@mkbhd Andrew: https://www.threads.net/@andrew_manganelli David Imel: https://www.threads.net/@davidimel Adam: https://www.threads.net/@parmesanpapi17 Ellis: https://twitter.com/EllisRovin TikTok:  https://www.tiktok.com/@waveformpodcast Join the Discord: https://discord.gg/mkbhd Music by 20syl: https://bit.ly/2S53xlC Waveform is part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

From the director of The Greatest Showman comes the most original musical ever. I want to prove I can make it. Prove to who? Everyone. So the story starts. Better Man now playing in select theaters. Cold and flu season are upon us, which means it's especially important to keep those hands clean.

And when soap is involved, the conversation can slip out of control pretty quickly. I hope you can't hear me rubbing my hands together in front of a mic. No, we love ASMR. ASMR episode. Gross. This week on Explain It To Me, the dirty truth about clean hands. You can find new episodes every Wednesday wherever you get your podcasts.

It's 2025, we are back. I wrote feeling fresh after our first break, but two of our five people are missing. So how fresh could we really be? We're feeling fresh. We are halfway back. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. What is going on people of the internet? Welcome back to another episode of the waveform podcast. It's 2025. We're your hosts. I'm Marques. I'm Andrew. And I'm David.

And okay, so we're mostly back. Ellis and Adam are both a little sick, taking a little bit of time to get better, rightfully. So at the desk today, Mariah producing. She has all of the buttons, she has all the trivia questions. It's gonna be a good time. Ah! They're already on.

I'm ready, I'm ready. Thank you, Mariah. Yeah, wow, we have kind of a mix of things because we took a little bit of time off, so there's been stuff piling up that we want to talk about, a little bit of CES stuff, I should say, a lot of CES. It's mostly CES stuff. That's happening now and that's a lot of,

it's a lot of stuff, but it's like a lot of empty calories. It's like just headline after headline after headline, new stuff, new stuff, new stuff. We'll talk about some of it. But what'd you guys get into over break? Did you have any fun? Anything, any stories you want to tell? I have a New Year's Day story that is tech related.

And if you follow me on Blue Sky, I might have physically or digitally seen me pulling my hair out. Oh, I know. Okay, so I spent my entire. Not now. I'm pretty sure you do. I probably do. I spent pretty sure you do. I probably do. I spent my entire New Year's Day

because over break, Claire and I noticed that our Google Home, when you asked it the time or the weather, would not respond. And it wasn't like the, I can't help you with that now, it would just spin. Like spin or light up and just like play the animation and nothing would happen. So at first I was like, I'm way too busy, whatever.

New Year's Day, when you have a one year old, you're in bed way before midnight the night before. So New Year's Day isn't, is just another day. Not even remotely close. If I made it to 10 PM, I'd be surprised. So New Year's Day, I'm like, I'm gonna fix this. I have a pretty chill day. It can't be that hard.

Long story short, it was very hard. And I wound up flipping the breaker on my entire house. I reset every Google Home I had. I disconnected every single smart home device from my network and re-added them all in nothing. Why was it so important to get your Google Home working? Because the weather is like one of the things I ask my Google Home the most.

I need to know the weather. It's so nice. Can you just look at your phone? It is, yeah. I can, but like when I'm getting changed in the morning, like after the shower, it's way easier to say, what's the weather, do I need it? It's part of the routine.

Yeah, it's part of the routine, for sure. You know, I flip the breaker of my house every morning when I get up too, just to make sure I what's the weather? Do I need it? It's part of the routine. Yeah, it's part of the routine, for sure. I flip the breaker of my house every morning when I get up too, just to make sure I can check the weather. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, that was the one time thing to try and fix everything. Yeah. And tech support.

But long story short, and the moral of this story is, in tech, when something is wrong, always check the simplest version of the problem. And what I did after doing all of these stupid things for hours and hours is I went on my phone and I disconnected it from the wifi and I asked it the weather and it did the same thing, which meant it had nothing to do with my devices or my internet, which meant that it was a Google issue. So then I spent the rest of the day adding

all of my smart home devices back onto my account. And then the next day I get tagged in like 30 different times from different articles that's like Google's having some sort of issue, only doing the weather and the time. It was only those specific things. So yeah, there's a million things that went through my head of what could have been wrong. It was Google's fault.

This is the reason every support person is like, sir, is your computer on? 100%, is the monitor plugged in? Is it lying on the ground right now? That probably is the issue like 60% of the time. It is, I did very little tech support and it's almost always the like, turn it back on. Yeah, turn it off, turn it back on. Yeah. Turn it off. Turn it back on. Yeah. It works.

Most of the time. Wow. I'm sorry for you. And I hope you can now ask the weather to your robot. I can. And they tell me that it is very cold. So your back is very cold. It's cold. It just says it's cold. It's definitely cold. It's cold. Yeah. That's how you started your year. That's how I started my year. I can't wait. What happens the rest of the year for you. Any more days? If it happens again, I'll be throwing all of my Google stuff

out of the window. I can guarantee that. Just Google it first, make sure it's not. Yeah, yeah. A server-side issue. Dang. Yeah, I had a fun, I had a weird story that was, it wasn't supposed to be a story,

but it turned out to be a story, which was I sold my Cybertruck. I don't know if you saw the headlines. Yes. Now I- Why are there headlines? Yeah, this is the thing. So I've, you guys knew, and a lot of people

who follow the channels know, I had both a Cybertruck and a Rivian R1T, and we got them, we ordered them around the same time, not knowing which would show up first, and we were gonna use them for our car videos, for the tow hitch rig, for the stuff that we set up and get rollers of cars for, and we still use them for that. And I mean, they're kind of the same thing.

They're both a big, expensive electric truck. So I don't need both of them. So I was trying to decide which one we were gonna keep. And at one point I realized that the Cybertruck had been sitting in the garage for like a month and I was just using the Rivian for all the things I was normally using it for and for the tow hitch stuff and for any like picking up stuff.

I was like, okay, I think we've made our choice. It's the Rivian that I prefer. And so started the process of selling a Cybertruck, found a private seller, sold it. So I posted an Instagram story, sold a Cybertruck. Just for the people who knew that we were still picking and now you know which one I picked. Within 12 hours of that, there were like CBS News headlines that this influencer had picked over Elon Musk's precious Cybertruck and there

were all these reactions from Tesla fans. And I only posted the Instagram story. There wasn't really any context, so I eventually updated people on why I picked the Rivian. They're very similar trucks. I like a lot of things about each of them, but I picked the Rivian. The funny part about that was one of the headlines was that, oh, Marquez and Elon unfollowed each other on Twitter. The way I saw it was our subreddit said Marques unfollowed Elon.

And then I think on a blue sky I saw, which then I went onto Twitter to see, was Elon unfollowed Marques. Yeah. And so I think I came in the morning and be like, saw that unfollowing thing, sorry, that's like blowing up. Yeah, and the funny thing is I didn't unfollow Elon at all. I woke up to find that my account had unfollowed Elon. What?

What I assume happened was, you know how you can like, if someone's like going a little nuts, you can like, or you can like block and unblock, sort of soft unfollow, so they don't know that they unfollowed you. Does that force them to unfollow you? Yeah, if you block someone, they can't follow you anymore. So if you block them and unblock them,

they'll stop seeing your stuff. Because there's no notification that you got blocked. Wait, so did he block you? So I was following you. He tweets a ton. And I don't really have any political follows. I tweet, I follow people who I want to see their stuff, and I don't follow people who I don't want to see their stuff.

So Elon is tweeting a lot. I don't know if you noticed. And it was getting closer. I was like, do I mute him? I still wanna see like the important stuff but there's just too much stuff now. And then when I saw that, I was like, wait, yeah. I just realized I haven't seen any Elon's time

in like a couple of days. So I assume he like did something, either block and unblocked or like. Well, so now they changed the block, how the block thing works so that you can still see their content if you go to their profile, you just can't engage with it.

So maybe he's still blocking you? My theory is, no, he didn't block me. Well, I'm not blocked now. My theory is he just went block, unblock, so that I'm no longer following the account. Does it say that you're blocked? Only if you catch it in the time that it's happening. So like if I go to you right now.

Can you block him real quick? I block you. Oh, shit. All right, so now if you go to my page. It doesn't say anything. No, it says, no, it says Andrew McAnally has blocked you. So now if I unblock you. That I won't be following you anymore.

Refresh the page. But you're not following me anymore. Yeah. Cool, cool, cool. So look. No confirmation that's what happened. No confirmation. I'm just saying I just noticed that I had not, I wasn't seeing this stuff anymore.

I don't know how personally that guy is taking me selling my Cybertruck, but long story short, yeah, the Rivian is pretty good at all the things we use it for. I miss things about the Cybertruck, don't get it wrong. I miss the larger second row, the larger bed, the way better speakers, the four wheel steering. There's a lot of things that are better about the Cybertruck, but there are also things

that are better about the Rivian, including being smaller and more nimble, parking in New York City with that thing. I like the design better, I like the gear tunnel better, I like a lot of the materials and the build and finish better. So there's things on each side, but I picked one, and that was that.

But that was what happened over break for me. Everyone dramatizes everything now. That's a fact. You don't want to read about that? It's a fact. You think it's not a story. I wish. Well the story was like, once the Twitter drama happened,

then it's a story for them The funny thing is it wasn't even Twitter drama because you didn't even do anything. Yep. Yeah, it's Twitter drama that happened to you Manufactured Wow, I would say but here we are. Well, my break was much less dramatic than both of yours Nice, I just went to California and I went to my rattlesnake den that I grew up in Not a literal rattlesnake den. What is a rattlesnake den? So, I told you guys how Chuck Yeager like ruined my childhood, right? The guy that broke the sound barrier.

I vaguely remember some of, and like the street has changed names. Yeah, like my mom named it and then he bought my road and then he renamed it to Chuck Yeager Road Yeah, yeah Anyway that road at the top of the road on the top of the mountain is a rattlesnake den that my parents did not know It was a rattlesnake time when they built the house on top of it an actual an actual rattlesnake den Oh, okay. So like we just had tons of rattlesnakes all the time

regardless, I went back there, haven't been there since I was like 15, and I was really afraid of getting shot because there was lots of signs that were like, do not come here, like back off, like all this stuff, because it's in the middle of nowhere. But I went up to the house and I knocked on the door and a very nice lady let me in.

She's like, yeah, this lot was just sitting here for like four years. We bought it from the bank for like nothing and then they remodeled it and it was cute and it was weird Yeah, yeah, so you went back to the house that you that I grew up in. Yeah, I've thought about doing that It was crazy because I haven't been there since I was like 14, which means more than half my life I have not been associated with that area. So it feels like I watched, it feels like a long time ago I watched a movie that was my childhood.

You know, I might've told you guys this already, but a very high percentage of the dreams that I have take place in the house I grew up. Really? 90 plus percent. My take place in my elementary school. In the school? 90.

Just like wandering the halls and I wanna go back to my old school so bad, I just like walk the halls and see what it's like, but I'm gonna get arrested if I do, so. Yeah, don't do that. Without being announced, probably don't do that. Don't do that, please. I did go to my high school,

because I brought a friend with me and I wanted to show her like everything about my childhood, so I showed her my high school, but it was not open when we went, it was on a weekend. But you could still get in. But you went inside. Well, there's no inside really, it's like an outdoor, went, it was on a weekend. But you could still get in. But you went inside. Well, there's no inside really, it's like an outdoor California.

Oh yeah, Florida has that too. It's like living in a movie. Yeah, so I don't know if visiting the house would solve that or what, but I've driven past it a few times. Does that still happen to you, the dreams? To this day, 90 something percent of the dreams that I have are either in my bedroom,

on the stairs between the bedroom and the kitchen, or just around that house. That's wild. You should keep a dream journal where you wake up and you write it all down. Yeah. And then we analyze it on the podcast next week. Yeah.

One of them recently was on the block of the house. It wasn't in the house, but it was like, I rode my bike down that block a lot. Dang. Yeah, anyway. Yeah, so yeah, mine was fairly undramatic. I sailed around San Francisco, around the Bay, on a sailboat, it was really cool.

I couldn't go to Lake Tahoe because the pass was snowed over, but, and I told you guys this before the podcast started, I started the screen time thing on my phone to see how much time I was gonna use my phone every day, and it was like 24 minutes a day. That's crazy. Which was incredible.

It was just, my brain was healed. Mine was the opposite. Yeah. I had to get those 45 wins in Pokemon the card game and that took a lot of screen time. And I did do it though. I was speaking of phones. So I did review the OnePlus 13.

I really liked that phone a lot. There's a lot of good things about it. The main pillars of the review are that there are three things about that phone that are really, really good, but are trends and that are going to be really, really good about a lot of phones in 2025. The Snapdragon 8 Elite is amazing. Great battery, great high-end performance, great gaming, great efficiency.

Was it overheating at all? Never. No? No issues at all. So I mark that as a win for that chip. The 6,000 milliamp hour battery, the carbon, what are we calling it? Silicon carbon battery. Again, awesome.

Like the battery in that phone, obviously having a lot of capacity is great, but it also managed the battery great. Could not kill it in a day. Not even if I tried. I had like a day where I drove back and forth home and then picked my parents up from the airport and came back and like high brightness,

Waze navigation the whole time, streaming Bluetooth, like high brightness, Waze navigation, the whole time streaming Bluetooth, like five hours of Waze navigation for the day. So that's 40%. Waze navigation with not plugging in feels that feels like you're trying to kill your phone. Illegal. Yeah, it feels. Cause I was, I was like, I will not plug this phone in.

And I got to the end of the day, it was like, yeah, no problem, 44%, ready to go. So battery amazing, chip amazing. And then the screen, like we've seen this for like the past year or so, but it's going to keep happening. You're gonna get phones with like 4,000 nits peak brightness and HDR and like 1500 nits of full screen brightness and high brightness mode Great screen I could I could see it all the time outside no matter what I tried to do

So I love that phone and it's also like nailed the other fundamentals. There's some weird quirks in oxygen OS I don't love, but the thing that's keeping me from using it as a daily is it doesn't have WiFi calling on AT&T. And so I can't, there's not good enough signal in this studio. And so I can't keep using it. I'm missing important calls.

This is something I found out with my Zen phone is that, and I think I remember pleading to people, is like the phone, it has WiFi calling, right? The feature is available, it just has to be approved. That's really annoying that carriers apparently have to whitelist it. I think that's what I originally found out with T-Mobile after hours of talking to them.

And they probably won't really do any phone that they don't sell. Yep, it's basically the ones they sell are the ones that get approved. So the Pixel, the iPhone, the other Samsung, the major ones, they all work. And OnePlus phones for years on AT&T have not had Wi-Fi. T-Mobile, do they still sell OnePlus phones?

Cause they had that deal with OnePlus when the OnePlus 6T first came out where they started selling OnePlus phones. For some reason I thought Verizon was the OnePlus people. No, they always like, it always sort of worked on Verizon, but not officially. Oh yeah, I get what you're saying. Yeah, they had like unofficial support for Verizon

Yeah, there's like years of forum posts from like years and years of one plus phones for people on AT&T being like hey Does Wi-Fi calling not work? It's been true for a long time. I remember I had this with the one plus seven I wanted to use Wi-Fi calling and it didn't ever show up mobile has a couple Do they looking at an old page because I went to their website and I went to smartphones and then I went to brands and there was a OnePlus like filter, but when you click it, it has no results. So they at one point sold some OnePlus phones.

Yeah. Either way, I liked that phone enough that I would daily it. The camera as a weakness being a B plus camera is totally fine. So yeah, that was a good phone. That was the first review of the year. Go watch that video if you haven't already. We'll link it below.

I have kind of a segue from that. Yes. So one thing with the OnePlus phone is it has their first party cases, which is something OnePlus does very good all the time. Actually, I brought some in. And they have these magnets for like MagSafe. One question we've had a lot of

that we kind of got the answer to this week at CES. Unfortunately. Unfortunately is, so the WPC, the Wireless Power Consortium lists Qi2 as needing the magnets and we are Qi2 purists here. That's right. Well, a fellow Qi2 purist, Ben Shoon, wrote two articles at CES so far.

One about Samsung having Chi-Tu. Because they announced that they would. Exactly. In Galaxy devices. And then like a day later, the WPC announcing that Chi-Tu will have a subdivision of Chi-Tus. Extensions to Chi-Tu. One of them being something called Cheetu Ready.

I hate everything. Which, I know, from them says, the growth of the Cheetu ecosystem will continue with the introduction of Cheetu Ready certified devices. These devices, smartphones, and accessories such as cases deliver the full Cheetu user experience when paired together in approved combinations. Well, okay, but you have to have two things.

So it's full experience, but if you also buy the accessories. Can I just point out, it was like three weeks ago that the guy from the Wireless Power Consortium was like, I need to make something very clear. For something to be Chi-Tu, it must have magnets. Technically, that is still true. For something to be Chi-Tu ready, which is like the official naming of it. Not just that it is ready for ChiTu,

it is called ChiTu ready. Symmetics ruin the world. So yeah, if the wireless coil inside of the phone meets the ChiTu specifications minus the magnets, it is not ChiTu, but if it has an approved case, no, no, no, no, as long as it has an approved case from Chi-Tu with the magnets that line up correctly, it can then be Chi-Tu ready.

Yeah, yeah. My take. No, don't do that. Mariah is on, she must have been practicing yesterday. She's ready. My take is, so I was using the phones and I was happily enjoying that I could slap a case on and then drop it on any MagSafe accessory.

But Marquez. And so the way I phrased it in the video was like, okay, I'm a no case person. Cause there's two sides of this. I'm a no case person and I literally in the Rivian, I have one of these cases so that when I go drive, I sit down, I put the case on and I pop it in the dash. So that I can use waves.

Doesn't need to be this way. And when I get out the car, I take the case off and I pop it in the dash. So that I can use waves. Doesn't need to be this way. And when I get out the car, I take the case off and I go inside. But the other side of that is, let's be honest, most people use a case. And so if you just spend $30 or whatever it is, yes, it's an upcharge, but it's as good, for most people, it's as good as having.

But then also in order to be like officially Qi2, it's going to have, it's going to need a Qi2 ready certified case and that certification is going to cost money. So the case won't be cheap. So it's either the case won't be cheap or the random case that you buy on Amazon will say it's ready but won't actually

be officially Qi2 ready and then it won't really work quite as well or I don't even, there's probably, I don't think that they have a microcontroller that says this is a Qi2 case. Because you know how Apple, when you put an official MagSafe case on it, that's a little special animation because it knows.

I think there might be. So there's the magnet here. Well, is this phone have Qi2? I don't, it's Qi2 ready. The phone? Was this? Or is it just a MagSafe 13 set? Oh, maybe it's not Qi2.

I think they just have a magnet in the case. Yeah, because OnePlus never used the words Chi-2, but they literally, maybe I shouldn't say this, but in the press briefing, they said, this works with MagSafe. They told me this works with MagSafe. So they're like, use MagSafe accessories. And I was like, great.

They won't market it that way. They're not gonna publicly say that. But they also have this little thing up here by the NFC chip, so maybe that has something to do with telling the phone the case is on. I don't know. They each have that. Either way, it worked with everything MagSafe,

so mission accomplished as far as I'm concerned. Yeah, I mean the main thing with Qi2 is they want the magnets to align perfectly so you can get the highest rate of charging possible, because Qi2 standard is going to evolve over time to allow you to pump more power into your phone. And they need to make sure that the coils are perfectly aligned.

Because otherwise it's meh. It is nice that there's some sort of standard that these cases have to be to get that, which means we're getting the best possible way for it. Yeah. And honestly, like you said, there's two people, there's case people. I mean, I want it in the phone.

I know. Let's be clear. I think the difference is, everyone outside of listening to's two people, there's case people. I mean, I want it in the phone. I know. Let's be clear. I think the difference is everyone outside of listening to this podcast. Uses a case. Uses a case, and if they get the first party one, it's perfect.

For people in this room and or listening to this podcast, I think that's where we have the people that might be like, please. But just intense irony of all these companies being like, we etched a special S pattern into the back of the device and the emerald green reflects our heart. Something like that, you know, it's like, it's like stuff like that.

And then they're like, but you're gonna put a case on it, right? Yeah. I will be giving points, I will be giving phones extra credit this year for building in the magnets, put it that way. Thank you. I will be appreciating those extra.

If you're gonna build in these special silicon carbon batteries or whatever that have more density, then you have more room to put a Magnet true, but they're putting some big batteries in these phones. That's true. The numbers of the one plus 13 battery 6,000 milliamp hours Yeah compared directly with the one plus 12. The phone is thinner Yeah lighter and has 600 more milliamp hours of battery. Finally. That's amazing I remember being like 12 years old and seeing all these articles and Wired being like,

the battery of the future has just been invented and it will be in your stuff really soon and then it never came. It's graphene. So it's just, well graphene was the main one, but it's always like, this professor just discovered a new way to have unlimited power density. Even the silicon carbon one,

it's not just silicon carbon because silicon carbon swells so badly that it's like a composite yeah like salt yeah but it works these phones are lasting forever so i'm happy about that yeah i'm glad we're gonna see that a lot more we have a lot more to talk about with uh ces etc so we'll get to that in a second but before we do that let's take a quick break and do some trivia So we'll get to that in a second, but before we do that, let's take a quick break and do some trivia. ["Trivia Dude"] Trivia dude.

I think that's the longest I've gone without hearing that jingle. Two weeks. You mean you didn't play it on every day? Just to hear it once in a while? When I arrive at my destination in my car. Wow, wake up in a cold sweat to that sound. Well, as you know, CES 2025 is here

and we've already seen some bangers come out, but it wouldn't be CES without some absolutely heinous products. I did not make this list, I want you to know that. And so the question for you is, which of the following is not a real product from CES? These are always the best. Could be anything.

Okay, so we have a couple options for you. These are always the best. It could be anything. Okay, so we have a couple options for you. Option A is a razor heated and cooled gaming chair. Option B is a 3D printer that prints cake batter and bakes it with a laser. That sounds like a lot. That sounds dope as hell.

That's crazy. I want that. Option C, Samsung stretchable display that just sort of bulges out sometimes. Like bubbles? Unclear. In what direction? This is an Ellis and an Adam writing. I got 4D. Option D, Mirumi? I don't know. A furry little companion bot that imitates a shy infant that imitates a shy infant, and stealing glances nearby people while clinging to a bag strap.

That is, that's a title from The Verge. That's real. That's gotta be real. That's crazy. Allegedly. I have no question. I've seen that. I've definitely seen that before.

That's in your dreams. And then option E. Wait, there's five questions? Option E is just, they're all real. Oh. So I'll let you simmer on that, think about that, and we'll come back. Man, this is a trick question.

Is it a trick question that it's a trick question? That's the- I wanted to, yeah. Well, okay, we'll think about that. Answers will be at the end like usual. We'll be right back. Support for waveform comes from Coda. Picture this, you're starting a new project at work and your vision is clear. You know exactly who's doing what and where to find the data you need to do your part. In fact, you don't have to waste any time searching for anything because everything your team needs from project trackers

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That's C-O-D-A dot I-O slash wave to get started for free. Coda.io slash wave. So we'll be the first to tell you that not everything goes to plan. Life comes with its own set of curve balls for you to handle, especially when it comes to protecting your family. So while you can't full proof your life with the Life360, you can family proof your family.

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Guide to AI and Machine Learning at netsuite.com slash waveform. So the guide is free to you at netsuite.com slash waveform. It's netsuite.com slash waveform. All right, welcome back. So CES is a thing that's happening. You know what's crazy? I haven't been to CES in four years. Since 2020.

This will be the fourth one you missed, right? Cause we went to 2020. I went to 2020, the original super spreader event. Yeah. And I haven't gone since. So 21, I didn't go, 22, I didn't go, 23, I didn't't go, 22 I didn't go, 23 I didn't go, 24 I didn't go, and now it's 25. So this is the fifth one.

I didn't go to one, two, three, four, or five. I don't hate that. I actually kinda like that we can see all the stuff that's happening at CES and if there's a couple things that are standing out like diamonds in the rough, then we can pursue those right after CES. So shout out to everyone who's making the sacrifice, who is in the thick of it in Vegas,

who is finding the stuff, right? And now we get to sit here in the cozy podcast studio and go, oh, that seems cool. Oh, that seems kinda neat. So yeah, shout out to the frontline workers at CES. One of the biggest headlines, of course, is NVIDIA sort of delivers their keynote. They have the RTX 5000 series cards.

There are new prices, new capabilities, new AI stuff. Andrew being a resident gamer, do you wanna walk us through? David and I are gonna tackle this together. Okay. Because we both play games. This is, do you know how Tim and Miles did it once and they were really ripped?

This was the like the light version of that. A discount version. A discount version, but we're gonna cover this together. We're not gaming channels. No. There are gaming channels, you all know LTT and Gamers Nexus will do the insane coverage of this stuff. I've watched some of them.

I watched Linus's first one. Yeah, I watched some of the highlight stuff. So let's start one. Yeah, I watched some of the highlight stuff, yeah. So let's start with the graphics card. Okay. Because the 50 series, I'm sure you're gonna get some shit for calling it the 5000 series. My bad, 50 series.

But it's RTX 5070, 5070 Ti, 5080, 5090. That's what got released, correct? That's what got shown on stage. And they had the price tags. And there was a big screenshot of like, this one's cheap, it's a good deal. This one's expensive, that's crazy. Let's start there.

Prices, 5070, 549, 5070 Ti, 749, 5080, 999, 5090, $1,999. So the thing that strikes right there is that I believe the 5070, 5070 Ti and 5080, if you take their 40 series counterparts are all cheaper than they were when the 40 series originally came out. While the 5090 is $400 more than when the, did I say 50, the 5090 is $400 more than the original $1,600 base of the 4090 when it first came out.

Okay. $2,000 is a crazy number. Was the 4090 the first one to have a 90? I thought there was a 3090. Was there a 3090? Okay, yeah, I don't know. Was there a 20? I know the 4090 was present. Us asking that is where you should gauge

how much you take our information. I used to be really into this stuff a long time ago. Yeah. The 3090, I believe, is the one that we got in the main year. I thought that was a 4090. I'm pretty sure it's a 3090. The 8K gaming one, so the 3090. The 3090 was like,

I've always find gaming so interesting, graphics cards specifically, because tech just gets so small, and gaming does get smaller, but it costs so much money to make your computer smaller that just like PC gaming computers are still gigantic. And we're still spending so much money.

Wow, look at how empty the studio was back then. Oh my God. So that was four years ago, we did a RTX 3090 with gaming in 8K and it handled it and we uploaded the video in 8K and we nearly broke YouTube processing, but. It took like a week to process I think. It literally took a week to process.

Okay, yeah. Wow. So I think what I always find interesting with graphic cards, especially from Nvidia being released is there's always like two groups. It's what's like the cheapest one that I can compare to a previous series. And then what's the most expensive one. Yeah. Here we have the $2,000, 50, 90. And one thing they said on stage was that the 5070 at five hundred and fifty dollars is

Comparable performance to the 4090. This is the one I saw the most chatter about for sure. I think that initially Initially the reaction of oh my god, the 5070 is cheaper than the 4090 and delivers the same performance This is amazing a great universally positive. That's the first reaction. And then the second wave reaction that I saw was, wait a second, really? And I think a lot of what Jensen, the CEO of Nvidia said on stage about AI frame interpolation, X percentage of these pixels are rendered,

but the rest of them are AI generated. That being not exactly the same as a 4090 is what most of the conversation I've seen has been about. I still think it's gonna be a good card. It's 550, it's gonna give you great performance, seems like it. Linus did a video of being the first one to game on one of these cards.

It looks like it's gonna be a good card, but I think that line was what got said. In Linus' video, he got to try cyberpunk on two computers right next to each other. One had a 4090 and one had a 5090 in it. And from the frames he was getting, he was getting double the frames in Cyberpunk at like full settings.

Now there's a lot of questions to how it was set up in the like full settings. He went through it quickly. They're obviously gonna pick things that work really well. And there were some things that weren't quite perfect. I think one of them specifically was if you were moving really fast, the text in the UI or floating text was blurry

and some things weren't quite doing as well. So I'm interested to see what their real findings are when they're outside of the Nvidia booth that they got captured into after the event. People are gonna find ways to expose the AI part. I think the biggest question is like what you said, is if we're focusing so much on AI because they introduced black,

a Blackwell chipset or something in it, that there's so much AI and they even said the reason the 5070 can be comparable to the 4090 would be impossible without the AI enhancements that they made. So clearly there's a lot of AI helping in here and whether those frames are comparable is what we will find out from all of these different

gaming channels that dive really deep into it. But I think people listening to us that right now aren't calling us morons because there's a lot of them and I understand why you're doing it. The other type of people who are like, oh cool, a 5070 might be somewhat comparable to a 4090 and for $550.

Those people probably will be like, cool, I'm getting some frames and things generally do look pretty good for this price tag. I think that's probably, I think the 5070 looks like the more interesting lineup right now. The architecture of the chip is obviously going to be focused on AI because that's what Nvidia is focusing everything on right now and something that is good at is upscaling. So I would imagine that a lot of the frames that they're quoting is with their enhanced

upscaling capabilities. You can just interpolate frames and have them be a higher quality and also interpolate resolution. So I imagine the discourse when these cards come out is gonna be like, well, what's the true performance? And then like, oh, the upscaling kind of messed up here and it doesn't look perfect. And there's gonna be a lot of discourse. Yeah, I almost wanna make a graph of like,

the 4090 got here and this new card is gonna get slightly higher, but then plus AI. Plus AI. And then you set double, you're like, yeah, okay. And I think a lot of that will also depend on how optimized games are for specific things like that as well. So there could be some optimizations where some games

are gonna run way better on this new AI chip, or the AI power from these new cards. So it's like every piece of tech, it's going to be super subjective to like what you're doing. And but either way, it's like, I think this is hands down the most chatter from CES. Yeah, it's funny. So the the 5070 549, I've not followed this stuff super closely for a long time. But in, I don't know, 2015 or something, 2014, when the 970 came out, I remember that being a big deal because that's four gigabytes of video memory

except only three and a half of those gigabyte, by the way, $349. So just saying, it was like $200 cheaper and that was like considered a great deal. But I had three and a half gigs of super fast video memory and then half a gig of super slow video memory They got sued over it. I got a $35 check in the mail of our lawsuit Everyone's got that $30 check mine was from AMD

Yeah, also Jensen were this alligator Like yeah, we're saying his jacket to be an alligator leather. You were saying it was the RTX jacket? The RTX On jacket? He usually wears this jacket. It's just a regular leather jacket that he wears at every single trade show. But he upgraded it. But he upgraded it to, let me see if I can find a photo.

I'm sure if you generate a trillion dollars in shareholder value, you can just grab a new jacket. I think that's sort of what the vibe is. All the billionaires recently have been flexing. Crazy jackets. Zuck has his chains, you know. Should we get new jackets? We're not billionaires. We're not billionaires.

I don't think we get to do that. My favorite comment on one of the videos covering this was after he announced the pricing, he pulled out this cardboard cutout of the chip so that he could show what all the different things were physically. What was holding in front of him was a big circle and someone's like, he had to pull the shield out

after he announced prices to the crowd that apparently just went kind of silent when the 50.90 price got put out there. I watched one of the super cuts of them showing the prices and them showing the 5070 got a lot of people riled up and then they revealed the entire price spectrum everyone went Oh, I will say 50 80 999 to 50 90 1,999 is not sad. That's great. There's got to be a 50 80 TI coming out at some probably or maybe at Maybe at Computex something 50, 60, 50.

I have a question that might not be able to be answered if you haven't been in the thick of this for a while, but I'll throw it out there anyway. Are GPUs in the same kind of category as smartphones where when the new one comes out, the last generation ones drop in price where they might be a better deal? They don't really sell them much anymore after that.

Generally it's like you have to get them secondhand, but they drop in price by a lot. Right, because nobody wants a 4070 anymore. Yeah, even though it was probably just fine as a card literally a year ago. So I kind of want to. If they're available, I'm sure they get grabbed pretty quickly when they drop,

and secondary market of GPUs is like the worst thing you could go into because they'll all be like lightly used and lightly used means like. For crypto mining. Two straight years of mining. They've been mining for two and a half years. Like literally never turned off. They'll probably just stop working soon, yeah.

I have a question. Is this one of the first GPUs to quote, to use AI to enhance performance? No, sure not. They've been using the DLSS thing for a while. Is it just like a rebrand of like, now we're calling this? I think they're dedicating more compute specifically

to drive that more. I think that, I mean, this is the whole theme of CES in general is how can we lean into AI and making our stuff better? And if you're Nvidia, it's let's make as many improvements to this specific technology in these GPUs as possible, even though it's existed for a while. So that's how you get these numbers.

Lots of flops going on, that's how I know. Terror flops, baby. I have no idea what's going on, and we're just all AI videos now. Don't fall for the trap. So yeah, that was the headlining event was Nvidia's announcements. They also did a couple quick things

that David might be able to do better on, which was their like personal AI Supercomputer. Yeah, this like robotic chip. Yeah, I tuned out for those Yeah, just being honest. They they announced their own your own personal Supercomputer which to be clear they also announced a like lighter way cheaper version of this in December Which was two hundred and fifty dollars and could do 8 billion parameters, but they announced one at CES that can do 200 billion parameters and is $3,000. It was like the size of a Mac Mini.

It was like a gold Mac Mini. It looks like, it sort of looks like a Mac Mini if it was 3D printed. A current Mac Mini? Yeah, a current Mac Mini. It's tiny. It's called Nvidia Digits. It has 128 gigabytes of unified memory and four terabytes of NVMe storage, so definitely fast.

You can link two of them together to handle 405 billion parameters. And for context, I think Meta's top tier Lama model is exactly 405 billion parameters, so it's like you could run your own top tier llama model on it for $6,000. Yeah, I guess my primary question was gonna be what do you do with one of these that you wouldn't do?

So it's mostly for startups and people that wanna develop AI applications. Okay. So, yeah. But it is crazy because most, you used to have to rent out cloud processing for a lot of money to be able to do this kind of stuff from different companies, and now you can have one locally.

The value proposition is it runs dramatically faster and probably more efficiently if you have all this locally and you can do way more development on that machine rather than depending on paying someone for cloud processing. You own it in person instead of doing it in the cloud. Got it. And also you have access to all of NVIDIA's models and software libraries and development kits and stuff.

Which have great names by the way. Yeah. They just all have great names. They do. Lots of llamas and stuff, it's just, it's great. Yeah. So it runs on a Linux based DGX OS and supports all these different frameworks.

It's pretty cool for startups, I would say. Like, I think the $250 one is probably for like, the hobbyist or high school student or college student. Which is becoming a thing. It is. Yeah, becoming a thing. But if you're a startup, like $6,000 to run two of these in parallel and run like, some of the top tier models

is pretty good value proposition Yeah, I did not pay much attention to the robotics thing. Did you I didn't okay? Here are the two things that I remember from it and they're going to be extremely vague Okay, and one is just more funny. So the one thing I saw is that they were developing some sort of like I Don't know if like digital teaching for humanoid robots. So like the reason we can do all this automation in cars is because we can attach cameras to cars and figure that out. Whereas we can't just send like test humanoid robots

out all over the place. So they have a lot of video that they're taking from to teach robots digitally and do all of these different like tasks and stuff in a digital world, so it's not creating massive wear and tear on robots and chaos, I guess, which I thought was kind of cool, but I didn't fully understand. Nvidia has also done that to train its car systems. It's like car visual learning systems.

It trains them in a virtual world, so it can do it way faster and without actually hurting anybody. If we kept all of it in that digital world, I'd be okay with it. Yeah. The other funny thing I just saw is, I'm pretty sure it was on a screen and not physically,

but he like talked about this robotic chip and how like this new chip could power a robotic brain or like a function something of it. And they brought up all these different potential like humanoid robots in the back and Tesla bot just wasn't one of them, which I thought was funny. This is gonna be the-

No Optimus? Atlas was there. Atlas was there. Oh, so Optimus was not there. Atlas was there, Optimus was not there. This is gonna be the EV week at the White House moment, except for robotics, huh? Tesla makes their own chip, right?

Or do they use Nvidia chips? So they make their own chips. Maybe Nvidia is just trying to show things that use their own chips. Does the Boston Dynamics one use an Nvidia chip? Probably. I wouldn't be shocked. I have no clue.

I don't know, to be clear. But yeah, I would assume that that's what they're doing. Yeah. So speaking of robots, let's move to something far more important. Okay. So I went through and just kind of picked out a bunch of fun CES picks, lots of weird stuff, lots of fun stuff. The first one,

because Andrew said we're speaking of robots, there are many new robot vacuums, like many new ones. And the fun thing about CES this year is that there are so many different robot vacuum companies now that they all have to differentiate themselves somehow. So they're all doing the robot vacuum thing, but also doing really weird other stuff. So I listed some of the most fun ones. There is the Switchbot K20 Plus Pro, horrible name,

which is also an air purifier, security camera and iPad holder. Wow, Astro could never. It sounds like DJ Roomba from Parks and Rec. It kind of is. There's the EufyClean E20, which allows the suction part to detach, and then you can attach a stick vacuum to the suction part,

so that it's like multi-stage corners. You can do the corners better. Or so I guess like it can do one room, but then you can attach it and pull it up to another room and manually. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's kind of cool. It's kind of cool.

It might be one of those things for like something that tries to do multiple things, just does both of them worse, but. I 100% believe that. There were multiple robots that have little like side things that come out to clean corners that are better than they used to be. The dream me x 50 ultra can go up short stairs. Okay, I was just going to say that I need the one where like the legs pop out and like tiptoe. Yeah stairs. It's kind of, it has these like, these like weird,

I don't even know what to call them. They're wheels, but they're like triangular wheels that kind of like, like pulling up the stairs like this. But it can't be, it can't be big stairs. It has to be like really short steps. Oh, I was gonna say, cause I'm in a ranch, but I do have two stairs between my living room front hallway and the rest of my house.

So I need something that can just do two stairs. They're normal size stairs. Oh, dang. You could drop a ramp down for the little robot. Yeah. Kind of like- Make it ADA accessible. I would have to make a 15 foot ramp

to go up two stairs just- And it's always dirty under the ramp, but the robot always goes up the ramp. Yeah. But I think the weirdest and most fun one is the Robobox Saros Z70, which has a little mechanical arm that pops out of the top and it can pick up things like your socks and underwear from around your house.

That's what I'm talking about. And you can set designated locations for it to just collect the laundry and put it in certain areas. Oh my God. This is why, because you know how we were just talking about this? There's a bunch of humanoid robots and everyone's like,

yeah, it could do your chores. It could vacuum your house. Guys, the vacuum is the robot. It has a little arm, comes out and does stuff and vacuums it. That's what it is. Can I stress test this? Because having a toddler means my living room

every single day is just, I don't think you understand how many toys get on the ground from one day of playing. My night, every night, is putting all the toys back. I could watch, it would have to pick up a hundred different things, and I would love to see. How much time do you have? I would, I'll stress test it.

It also has, I mean, the pincher claws are not like they're not thick They're very kind of like they're mostly small toys. Yeah I saw I saw a couple videos of this and there were a couple socks that it would like it was kind of like a Claw machine or like some it would get it most of the time But sometimes it would like kind of get it and it would dangle for a second then fall But they're actually releasing this in May or June. It says it can hold 300 grams. That's like barely half a pound.

That's like less than the amount of like- It's like a phone. Isn't a phone like 300 grams? Those videos are picking up shoes. Okay. Not high top Jordans. When I say videos, I mean renders on their website. But it shows on some muscle.

That's like a Birkenstock. It's like an Ugg boot. It is funny because previously you had to keep your house really clean for these robots to work, or at least with nothing on the ground. And like, if it could pick a wire up and just go underneath it, that would be the main thing. That's the number one killer of robot factories.

The nuts be seething. Especially in this studio, because we've had plenty and we've tried a bunch, the number one killer of like walking in the next day and it's just like strangling itself with wires. Like it's just the wires. What if we give it a pair of scissors? It cuts through the wires.

And then behind it, it like sews it back together. Yeah. Oh my God. It solders it back together on the back end. Yeah, so that was actually coming out in May or June of this year, which is hilarious. Never stop CESing. So yeah, I'm here for all the weird robot vacuums.

There was one that could, like it had a mop on it, but it would pick itself up like a short amount when it did carpet so that the mop didn't touch the carpet and the vacuum part would still vacuum. Oh, so it was both, because you would previously need a mop one and a vacuum one. Yeah. It was one that like, yeah, it would lift itself up after it mopped to do the

carpet and it would keep going. So it is very fun seeing all these companies go crazy with this. Man. Uh, okay. Second headline for CES. Yeah. You guys have heard of the LG Stand By Me Go, of course Which we bought last year because it was a thousand dollars. That is the suitcase

TV I guess yeah, it's a TV. Yeah, and we joked about bringing on an airplane and stuff like that Well LG has announced the Stand By Me Go 2 Which is even more portable in some senses of the word. Because a suitcase TV, you couldn't actually take it out of the suitcase. It had these mechanisms that kept it in the suitcase, but it could be angled. This one is a fully, it's just a display, but it comes with a strap, so you can carry it around on your shoulder if you want. It has a clamshell case that looks just like

the iPad clamshell case that closes on the front to protect it and is also a folio so it can stand up on its own. And now the remote magnetizes to the top of it as well. So yeah, their booth at CES had them basically just having the strap and just hanging it on the wall. It's like, yeah, hang your TV on the wall Would you get but like hanging on the wall means it's just battery powered?

Yes, it's battery powered and the bat and the plug is on the side So like it won't be as clean hanging on the wall. Yeah, but there is something really funny just thinking about somebody Shoulders slinging their standby me go and like I mean walking around we got with it. You got the dancing pizza guys outside of pizza places, spinning the signs and stuff. Now you can spin a TV. Have a guy with a TV. It kind of reminds me of like a fast food drive through signs.

You can put up like the menu on it, but in your house. They last four hours. So it lasts four hours pretty good. USB-C charging. It's actually longer than I thought you would say. It's up to 14. And still not anywhere near long enough. Yeah,'s four hours pretty good. USB-C charging. It's actually longer than I thought you would say. It's up to 14. And still not anywhere near long enough. Yeah I know, I know. But it's up to 1440p instead of 1080 from last time. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. I mean. This is the perfect place to unveil that. CES. Yeah. That's the perfect place. LG does some weird stuff. Evergreen. I'm gonna jump to another LG one

real quick. Just this is a personal favorite from C, and I know some people might not find this that interesting, but I think it's cool as hell. This is a lamp slash speaker slash garden slash garden water. The more slashes at CES, the better. I think it's quite attractive. It's like an accent lamp, and then that lamp shines down directly on a garden that you can grow things in that is auto watered from a reservoir in the lamp.

And also it is a 120 watt, 4.1 channel Bluetooth speaker. So there also is a like side table version of this. Life is good, baby. Life is good, baby. Life is good. Wow. Yeah. I like the end table version of this. There's two versions.

There's a very tall one and then there's like a shorter end table version. Yeah. I think they're both cool as hell. Before we leave the LG train, I just want to play to you the first five seconds of a reel from The Verge. They went to CES and they found another LG creation.

So I just want to let you guys hear this real quick. What was it? Does it say in the reel? Have you ever wanted to use your microwave as a selfie camera? Nice. LG is there for you. Let me tell you. Are they the ones that put the camera inside of the microwave, too? Because someone put a camera inside the microwave so you can watch her.

That's old news, though. What if you want to stand outside the microwave too? Cause someone put a camera inside the microwave so you can watch your phone. That's old news though. What if you want to stand outside the microwave while it cooks your food and do a TikTok dance on the camera? Oh. Now you can. LG has made this possible. I'm just, they're thinking of everything.

Life's good, dude. They got out of smartphones, which is a stressful industry and they just decided to do whatever the heck they wanted. Side quest. Do you think that the plant combo light speaker, when you're blasting the speaker, will your plants be upset by the volume? Depends. No, that'll be good for them. What are you blasting? Probably good for them. Well, see, that's what I'm saying.

If you're playing like metal music, are you playing like orchestral music? When you're pregnant, you play Mozart to your baby. It's the same thing, right? There's for sure been studies about people who, not people, but if you talk to the plants, they grow better, no? I believe that. This is a science podcast. No, I promise there's been AB testing of like, and I'm just spewing misinformation now,

but I've also read that and I've looked into specifically money trees, cause I have one, and if you, every once in a while just shake it. Because it just sits there, but it shakes it as if it experiences wind and gets stronger. I've heard that for Fiddly Fig. So that's like, you have to pay attention to the plant a little bit, and I think if you play

the right music, that speaker will help it grow better. So do you come home and shake your plant? Maybe. Yeah, just Google task, shake money tree. Just a little, yeah. I like it. Well, LG has unfortunately not announced pricing or availability of these combination fricazoids.

I want both of them, but they're probably gonna be really expensive. I want it with rosemary in it, so it just smells like rosemary in my room. I was thinking you could grow mint or something, and then you just always have fresh mint for your tea and stuff. Oh my God.

Also, I just Googled should you shake your money tree, and the AI told me no. But if it's working for you. But it's flourishing, it's doing so well. Then keep it in the house. And I also talked to it, so. Yeah. It's one of those two things.

Something's working. Something's working, for sure. Yeah. Cool. Okay, LG's out there. LG's out there to it, so. It's one of those two things. It's helping it for sure, yeah. Yeah. Okay, LG's out there. LG's out there, okay. Next, do you guys remember Bird Buddy? Yeah, so we talked about this on the podcast previously, and I believe that they sent us a Bird Buddy to use after we called them out on the podcast.

That was a camera that you would put, it's like a smart bird feeder, basically, and it would take pictures and analyze birds that showed up to your Bird feeder and be like, oh you've got a mockingjay today and it would be a funny photo of the bird they have Expanded or I should I say shrunk. This is such a good like shark tank story. Yes So now they are doing plants and bugs with a new bird feeder be your bird buddy feeder They re-branded or like put themselves under an umbrella of wonder now. So there's all these like wonder devices

But yeah now they have these special cameras that you put on your plants and some of them have their own Solar panels and you can sort of contort the camera solar panels and you can sort of contort the camera around different things. So there's some that you can basically use as a vine to go around. Like Gorillapod style. Yeah, it's like the Gorillapod camera. To be able to point at certain things in a special way.

They look really good and they're cute and they kinda go all over your garden, but they also will recognize different bugs and they'll say, this butterfly is this. And then one of the few actually good uses of a chatbot It will tell you about all of the bugs and stuff and summarize all of the bugs that came to your garden And you can ask them about the bugs that came to your garden Which is very adorable $300 on this to be like that's the invasive blank beetle. So

Enjoy the tree service where you have to cut down eight trees for $1,500. It's just like 200 lantern flies. Yeah. That's what you get in New Jersey. You should be like, you got nothing, you got nothing, you got one spider, you got 150 lantern flies. Yeah.

Oh. Yeah. So they also created these new things called Wonder Blocks, which are these modular systems that you can put around to attract different types of bugs and butterflies and stuff. And they sell things like a plant base, a butterfly feeder. It basically looks like a little honeycomb nest, but you can grow plants in them. It's cool. Like they really, they really took a phenomenon and ran with it, which I think they're doing a great job.

The last line in the Verge article is Petal and Wonderblocks will be available on Kickstarter in the spring of this year with no details on price. So it's an announcement of a Kickstarter. Kickstarters are weird now though, where like these companies that are established already do it and it just feels like a different way of pre-ordering. Yeah.

I imagine they're using it to try to find how much demand there is before they start ordering and shipping and all that production Stuff, but that's your your asterisk bird buddy is already a company that sure delivers a product So how much how much could they be making? Seats me. Yeah, that's pretty good. I like my buddy Kickstarter. Yeah. Oh, yeah, you have the bird buddy I do has it still still operational I need to get a new post for it so I can bring it closer to my house

because my wifi signal was having a little issue with it and it was just dying a bit faster because of it. So yes, I'm in the process of creating a stake. It is so cold outside though that it is not a priority. It's not a lot of birds. They also said that they're going to be selling a optional solar panel that goes on your roof They can power the cameras and stuff. So that's pretty cool

Yeah I do feel like the downfall of a lot of these outdoor things is you need a really good router for your signal They'll reach into your yard and mine is not good enough No, that's a really good point because we wanted to get one for my father-in-law But their internet and router is terrible, but he's a big bird fan But I don't I literally don't think I could set one up at his house I got birds boy we got birds do we got bugs at the end of the CES stuff and we'll go through all the other stuff first yeah let's do cars and the two keyboard things

after the break and we'll rip the rest of this up now okay you've heard of Dell Okay, you've heard of Dell. Dude, you're getting at Dell. Dell seems to have taken a lot of tech YouTubers' advice in a certain direction. There are many companies that create bad naming schemes for their stuff. Sony actually did the same thing last week. They named a pair of headphones

like Sony Ultra Max or something. And they went like self-aware. That's not what they're called but. And made. They made a self-aware meme about it. Which was funny. But Dell did basically the same thing. So you remember the XPS brand. Dell XPS has been a tried and true beloved. One of the more established brands in the VCS. Quite like people that are in detect know about this brand Yeah, it would be shame if something happened to it. Well that did so Unfortunately, the shame was shamed. We no longer have in spron XPS or latitude now. We have Dell Dell Pro and you guessed it Dell Pro Max. Well, this is not a joke

When I told mark has that on like Monday You guessed it, Dell Pro Max. This is not a joke, unfortunately. When I told Marques that on like Monday, there's some things that just get Marques to do the perfect, just like head down disappointment. And that was one that I haven't seen in a while. I saw something on Blue Sky where someone was like, now that all the companies are naming things Pro and Pro Max, Apple should just change it to something else.

You know what's actually worse about this is they still subdivide each tier by premium, plus, and base. So you can get the Dell base or the Dell plus or the Dell premium. Or the Dell pro base, the Dell pro plus, the Dell pro premium, or the Dell Pro Max Base, the Dell Pro Max Plus, or the Dell Pro Max Premium. Nice.

Yeah. I think like online, this is not gonna be as big of a deal because the options will be right in front of you and you can see the changes, but someone trying to sell this in a Best Buy store is gonna have the worst time. Here's an interesting counterpoint. Was it always clear to the average person

who was walking into a Best Buy and about to buy a laptop which one they should buy, XPS, Inspiron, or Latitude? No. I feel like looking at the specs. This potentially puts it in order better. It just makes it more annoying. It's not worse necessarily. It's just cringy. It's just cringe It's only cuz it's pro max if it was like yeah

Like it was pro plus it would be not like not as bad. Honestly It's just yeah, or if they just said like if they didn't have these sub tiers and they just said it's configurable. I Think that would be fine. I do think that's where you lose like I think that would be fine. I do think that's where you lose, like somebody who doesn't know much about laptops wants a very distinct naming of like base, middle of the ground, best. Yeah, but I think they could have done Dell,

which it's just called the Dell. Well, the Dell base or the Dell Plus or the Dell premium. Yeah. The Dell base. Yeah. Give me the, what? Give me the base Dell. Geez, I mean the Plus Yeah, give me that what even the base Dell. Geez. Okay plus I don't know. I don't but you could have walked into a store and you could have said Oh, I like the way that one looks

What are the specs like best buy could carry like three skews of each without naming them something different? You know what I mean? Yeah. Anyway, I'm not like against this. I just think it's a little cringe, but that's okay. Yeah, you're allowed to be a little cringe You're allowed to be crunch. Yeah, you're allowed to kill your best most successful brand Which should be fair like XPS was the only like we knew in spron But we also knew them as like the really cheap like school laptops that were bulky and not that good Did anyone here have Dell attitude? That was an absolute unit Those things are bricks. I had one from like 2005 or something,

it was my first laptop ever and it was insanely thick. Indestructible. Indestructible. I miss Sony VIO. Well, they split, VIO got split off. Yeah, I'm just saying I miss it. There's no rhyme or reason for it. That was my like old, my eighth grade home computer. Big old Sony bio.

It was awesome. They were cool. Okay. I think that's everything except for keys and cars. Keyboards. You can do keys and cars after the break. We can do that after the break, I think. Okay.

Keys and cars after the break. You heard it here first. But that does mean we have one more break to do some trivia Scooby-doo-ba-doo Trivia, dude. All right. Our second question for you today is Bing is clearly trying to do everything in its power to stay relevant and Including tricking users, but they have to hold on onto that number two search engine spot by US market share.

Who holds number three spot in the US market share for search? I'm also going to say, this is based on something we had written in the script that we haven't talked about yet. So we will talk about that. Bing tricking people after the break as well. We'll get there.

True, see you soon. So, we'll see you soon. Support for Waveform comes from Shopify. Here's something small business owners say every single January. It's a new year and I'm gonna make that change to help grow my business. They said it in 2024, 2023, 2022, and so on and so on.

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Four years ago, you may recall Congress was meant to do the same But the certification was delayed when thousands of Trump supporters marched on the Capitol The president-elect has said repeatedly, and he told NBC again last month, that he's gonna pardon at least some of the insurrectionists. Those people have suffered long and hard and there may be some exceptions to it, I have to look, but you know if somebody was radical, crazy, there might be some people from Antifa there. I don't know, you know, because those people seem to be in good shape. Whatever happened to scaffold man?

You had to be there. And Tifa was actually not there four years ago, but members of several extremist groups were at the Capitol on Jan six. And today on explained, we're going to ask with her American extremism on the eve of a second Trump administration. Today Explained, every weekday wherever you get your podcasts. All right, welcome back. CES, CES is a fun show because obviously there's lots of like robot vacuums and consumer gadgets and drones and stuff like that.

But there's also this whole like section that's just cars every year. There's just, it's like car stuff. There's also like boats section that's just cars every year. There's just car stuff. There's also boats and tractors and stuff. Vehicles in general, totally. And the meta with CES is it always feels like it's a vibe check on what's the theme with tech this year. Sometimes it's 3D, sometimes it's curved displays,

sometimes it's 2025 and it's just AI in everything. And so if you ever go to the car section of CES, what you will find is a mixture of like regular cars and then future concept prototype, not real cars that may never ship, but more like a concept of mobility, like super vague stuff like that. And those are interesting, I would say,

but usually not ever gonna come out. Some of the stuff we have here are right in between, I would say. First one, CES car headline. So remember the Afila? Yes. The Sony car. Sony and Honda collaborating on making a car. This was like two CES's ago we first saw this and we've seen it.

Might have been three. It was 2022 I think. Either way. I remember seeing a Sony car. 2023 I think they showed it off for the first time. 2022 is when they announced it. Well then they were going to do something. Yeah it was a car in the Sony booth

and we were all like, whoa Sony? Well I guess Sony does make screens and Sony does make displays. when they announced it. Because it was like, it was a car. Well then they were going to do something. Yeah, it was a car in the Sony booth and we were all like, whoa, Sony? Well, I guess Sony does make screens and Sony does make display, like motors. Maybe they can make a whole car. So there was a, just cause I remember physically seeing it, there was the Vision S01, which was in 2020. Concept vehicle.

Yeah, that was concept vehicle. It was just like a car that was just sitting there at the CES show floor. And then Vision S02 was 2022. And then Vision OS was 2024. So here we are in 2025 and Sony and Honda are officially collaborating and announcing a price that you will be able to buy this car.

Maybe, what is the price? The price is it will start as $89,900. So it will not be cheap. It's called the Afila One Origin. There also will be a higher end $103,000 signature version of this car. People who have been looking at this car, I mean, it looks like a regular Honda.

I think it's reasonable to say. It's kind of lucid almost. Yeah, I mean, it's an EV. It's a brand new look. Obviously Sony's got a little injection of design. There's also a subscription associated with the car. You get the first three years free, but that includes a Fila Intelligent Drive,

level two ADAS apparently, immersive entertainment selection, customizable themes, and a Fila personal agent. This is, like I said, it's right in the middle of CES cars. Because everything hardware wise about this car looks super reasonable for CES. Like, it has some screens and stuff, it has a sleek, minimalistic design.

But nothing on the inside is like, no mirrors or no steering wheel or like that. It seems normal. This looks like an Accord from 2025. It looks like a normal looking car on the outside with some nice screens. But being Sony, not sure. Being a new brand, not sure.

It's collaborating with Honda, but it's 90 grand. Who buys a $90,000 Honda? Like there's a bunch of questions still about this thing. I have two things to say about this. Okay. One, Mr. Stark, I'm not a Fila so good. Oh my God. Two, for this price, they should really be putting

a PS5 in the car. Hey, wait a minute. Well, hold on, hang on. You might be out of something. That's the difference between the Origin and the Fila signature. One's a PS5, one's a PS5 Pro. For like another $12,000.

Those have big screens in the back. I think only the Signature has the big screens, right? Oh, okay. Oh, is it? That checks, I believe so. I mean, for a hundred grand, yeah, Jesus. That's an expensive car. Like a Lucid is like that price, right?

You can get a Lucid for that price, yeah. A new one. There's something so funny about having the big screens in the back, but also under the seat, still having like the cigarette lighter power port. Yeah. You can pre-order it right now, but only in California.

Oh, that's very CES. Like only in California. Wow. So if I'm in New Jersey and I want one. CES is in Vegas actually. Well, I'm just saying. I know, isn't that funny? They're so not sure about shipping this

that they're like, how about just California? I think we can ship this in California. The people that have a lot of money and are willing to buy an EV. Yeah. Yeah. They said a global launch is coming later, but no details on that. I like how it's like, there's two options,

California only, global launch. Yeah. Not even nationwide launch. We can make it anywhere, baby. Yeah. It's a $200 down payment. So, or you know. Or down payment. So, or you know. Or down payment or yeah, pre-order. Interest-free loan.

Yeah. Okay, CES car story number two. Do y'all remember Faraday Future? When I say that name, does that ring any bells? That's a word I haven't heard in a long time. Oh yeah. 2017, I made a video showing the Faraday Future FF91. I don't know if you remember this. I do. 2017, I made a video showing the Faraday Future FF91.

I don't know if you remember this. I do. They actually had a separate engineering development car that was near final, and then they had a aesthetically finished car. So they would give me a ride in the engineering car. And I remember the guy like floored it, and he was like, that's better than a Model S, right? And I was like, yeah, it's pretty quick.

And then they had the aesthetically finished car, which was mostly kind of a clay model that you can maybe roll on the stage, but like point your camera at it, it looks pretty cool. Yeah. That was 2017. It's 2025 now. And they are showing some new prototypes at CES.

Here we go again. They've been at CES, I'm pretty sure every year since 2017. The FF91, they still want to ship and they still claim that they're going to produce and it will be $300,000. But I found some new cars. I found a funny thing in this before we get into the new ones.

In one of these articles, I found a quote that says, the announcement of the new brand comes just months after Faraday Future disclosed to the US Securities and Exchange Commission that it only delivered 10 cars by the end of 2023. And I would put an asterisk on those 10 cars too. So like 10 sounds like not that much,

but to me, someone who's been hearing about Faraday Future, I'm like, 10? They deliver it too? Really? Yeah, so yeah, they're coming with some new prototypes that they want to target 20 to 30 to $50,000 in price, which is very noble. It's what you probably would like to get to at some point.

But yeah, this is also, I would say, very Faraday future in that they have continued to attempt to get funding and to try to sell this idea of a new brand. The only startups that have really hooked our Rivian lucid Tesla, right? As far as EVs, I mean, that's it, as far as here. So it's a challenge getting a company like that off the ground, but Faraday Futures still at it.

CES. The thing I'm most confused about is, I saw all this stuff that they're announcing it at CES. I have not seen any coverage of these announcing it at CES. I have not seen any coverage of these new vehicles at CES at all. Like I can find something about Faraday Future to host exclusive private showcase and experience in Las Vegas of prototype mules.

But like I've seen, when I search it, nothing's coming up and CES has been going on for like three days now. We literally, we were both, we were all at that in 2017. So I wasn't, it was, that was the CES where Marques texted me and was like, I think I need help. So that was pretty much as I started.

So I've been, since I have been working at MKBHD, that's how long we've been waiting for the FF91. Dang. When they actually release their car, you might get fired. You gotta be careful. have been working at MKBHD. That's how long we've been waiting for the FF91. Dang. When they actually release their car, you might get fired. You gotta be careful. I have a lot of job security. I feel like it.

So yeah, Faraday Futures still doing their thing. Okay, the last headline I've pulled from CES cars that I thought was interesting is another Honda one, Honda Zero. It's another concept, but more futuristic, Honda Zero. It's another concept, but more futuristic looking Honda cars. And these have torn people apart purely on aesthetics. So I have this link here,

if you guys click and look at the top image in this, and you see this SUV in the sedan. Before you answer, I suspect that you either think these are sick, or you think these are horrible looking. Jaguar, I think they're sick. You think they're sick? I think they're sick.

Really? Yeah. Okay, so there's two, I will try and describe them. One looks like a, kind of like that new Prius redesign, but larger and longer. The one on the left, yeah. And then the right looks kind of like CRV mixed with the Hyundai N75, was that what it was called?

N74? Yeah. The headlights, because of the headlights, the very futuristic, but the future is now trying to be retro future with the dot lighting and stuff. Yeah. The first one looks like if a Lamborghini was in Halo 1. So it has the face of a Lamborghini,

Murcielago, Countach, it has the old Lamborghini face. Like they, I think they copied the old Lamborghini face. From the front. And then it's got this big sloping crazy thing. And it's a concept car, there's no rear view mirrors, no door handles, that whole thing, but still. Silhouette goes hard. Then the right one, I think, yeah, you're right. It's like CRV plus like, pole star,

cause there's no rear visibility plus Ionic. Back of the like, the first one you're talking about has kind of like, do you know those like infinity mirrors where it's like, only like one set of lights, but the mirror make it look like it goes forever. That's what that has on the back. I think that's illegal. I think there are lots of things about concept cars.

Well, yeah, there's no door handles. Yes, there are many things about these concept cars that will not make it to any sort of production car, but this is Honda's Zero concept, and it's named after their, they have an in-house OS they're developing, named after Asimo, their humanoid robot from the 2000s. Is that the tiny little guy over here?

ASIMO, ASIMO, I don't know if I'm saying it right. These are all also only renders, right? Yes. Like there is not anything as CES about this? Correct, it's just announced as CES stuff. Cool. Yeah, so. Good to know.

CES, concepts. It's just a vibe. It's all vibes. The concept electronic show. Yeah. So, you know. CES. Concepts. It's just a vibe. It's all vibes. The concept electronic show. The conceptual electronic show. Yeah. So that's the cars of CES.

That's fun. Thank you for joining my Ted Talk. Thank you. Now welcome to my Ted Talk about two keyboards at CES. I'll go pretty quick about this. Let's go. Ducky released a new inductive switch for mechanical keyboards, which is kind of cool.

And I will try and get through it as fast as possible. So it's actually Cherry who developed a new switch they're calling multiple point switches. We've talked previously about how Hall Effect switches are the new fad in gaming, because of all the different rapid trigger and features you can add to it. Ducky One X is launching with these cherry multi-point

switches that they're calling inductive switches. And the cool thing about this is they're far more energy efficient than the magnetic Hall effect switches. The switches are more energy efficient. Yes, and the reason for that is because you need all these different sensors inside the PCB for Hall effect switches. And because this is, this is where I'm trying to get it from. I could not fully figure out how these worked, but it's some sort of metal device inside of

the switch and then coils on the actual PCBA, which I learned the difference between a PCB and a PCBA is a PCB is an unfinished circuit board and the PCBA is a circuit board with all of its modules attached to it. So that makes me think that this is a, all the switches are attached and there's not much you can do. So I wonder what the modding category on this is for the nerds like me that like to do different things to their switches and keyboards. But anyways, what's really cool about this is we haven't seen any wireless or

some, but not many wireless hall effect keyboards because of the inefficiencies of each switch. As they take more power. So this, this new Ducky one X does have Bluetooth and 2.4 gigahertz because they're saying it's former energy efficient and it has pretty solid battery life. Interesting. I think this is something that's going to be very popular because Ducky is already a popular brand

in the gaming category. This will be popular for people who want those features play games and want a slightly better keyboard, but don't really care about the stupid stuff I do where you're like spending hours looping switches. So does this improve like latency? It's not latency, it's the benefits of Hall Effect and what these inductive switches are

is there's not one actuation point. Anywhere in the keystroke, it can calculate and you can change per key where those actuation and deactuation points are. And there's a lot of cool things in gaming for, it's not physical latency, but it's more like how fast things react because you can do 0.1 millimeters,

like the actuation point for each key and stuff like that. My God. Exactly. The other thing I want you guys to click on this, I saw this, keep seeing this auto retracting keyboard. So it's essentially, imagine like this big pad that you have in front of you. And then there are like a split keyboard

where you're typing. But if you want to use your number pad or your track pad, they are underneath the split keyboards. And you like, if your right hand, you type, type, type, you lift your hand up and a camera sees it and it pulls away the keyboard and a track pack pops up. And then you can use the track pad and then you can lift your hand

and then the keyboard swipes back in and you type, type, type. And then on the left, you lift your left hand up, numpad pops up. I like how we just went from the most energy efficient kind of keyboard to the thing that probably needs its own power supply. It has like a sound.

We're finally looking for equity. This is good. Oh, okay. That was a piece of foam falling off the equity. This is good. Oh, okay. That was a piece of foam falling off the wall. It is cold. Luckily that's not, that part's not on camera, so we don't have to fix it right now. Wow.

Yeah. Well, it wasn't near your body at all, so. I did fall in the background. It hit my shot though. Yeah. I just saw Mariah's face, her eyes light up. It's the lights again. I know, she looked like what I looked like

when the light fell on Adam's head. So I got very scared for a minute there. Well, you're wearing a hat, you're okay. Yeah, yeah, that's, we're all good. One more thing to know on these keyboards. I feel like we are just trying to recreate the things from Wall-E, where you just get like wheeled around and you just don't move at all

and you just kinda do this to exist. I think there's potentially at best here like some accessibility benefits. I don't think this is a mainstream thing. It's also- Paralyzed and you can't do this kind of movement. Yeah, like you have very specific hands movement and can't go that far left to right.

This might be super useful. The thing is, is like, look how large, I mean, the, what I'm assuming power supply for this thing is underneath is like a foot and a half tall in front of it. So where I put my keyboard on my desk, I literally wouldn't be able to fit the rest of it on there. We need something to go on that plate in the front nearest to you, maybe some kind of like food apparatus. So you don't have to move your head or neck as well. It needs the little arm from the robot vacuum to just feed me Doritos.

There's a tiny microwave in there. They're cooking. They're making something. They're cooking. Wow. I think that wraps up CES for us. Mostly. Yeah, I think that does. There is one thing we did not mention before, but since the trivia question is based on it, I want to go over it. Mark, it's about Bing.

Wait, can we play this before we do the Bing segment? Hi, I hope you're having a Bingtastic day. What can I help you with? Oh, never been here before. Well, that's just the thing. You can find all things with the Bing. We are more than a search engine. We are an engine that searches-

Google Yeah, Google is deleting search engine in the world and it was found in- Hey, you know what I mean. Take me to Google. Give me a bow to him and take me to Google now. Right through that door. Yeah. Yeah.

Can you do me a favor Marques? Can you go to Bing.com right now? Yes I can. Do they not get rid of this yet? It worked for me yesterday. Can you type in Google and tell me what it does? Oh, let's do it. And not hit enter?

It's not doing it. It doesn't do it anymore. We'll try it on his. Enter. No, they changed it. This worked yesterday. All right. What did it do before?

This is what it looked like when you would do it before. No way. And funnier. Okay, so for audio listeners, essentially when you would type in Google and hit enter, this like, it wouldn't say Google, but what do they call it? Google doodles?

So there would be this Google doodle-esque picture of a bunch of different people and then a search bar underneath it and then under it a bunch of the results for Google. The best part about this is if you were in this, if you scrolled up, it revealed where the Bing search bar was so it wasn't just making this page. It was auto scrolling down.

So you didn't see the Bing bar above to tell that you were still on Bing. It was so funny. Imagine working for Bing and being like, I got it. I got it. This is what's gonna happen. People are gonna come to Bing, they're gonna type in Google and then we got them.

I'm so mad it doesn't work for you. Do it. Oh my God. Wow. Oh my gosh, they're gonna type in Google, and then we got them. You just have to trick people into using this. Do it. Oh my God. Wow. Oh my gosh, they really changed it. That's so funny. Well, like one of the,

someone who worked for Google that works on Google search tweeted, like, Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. And then just wrote, New Year New Lobe at Microsoft. It says, Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, but Microsoft spoofing the Google homepage is another tactic in its long history of tricks

to confuse users and limit choice. New Year New Lobe, Microsoft. New Year New Lobe. Was this for like a special occasion or they just felt like doing it? I mean. It went on for like a week. I have a feeling it was just.

Yeah, so I saw this as a Reddit post on r slash Google, like a week and a half ago, and then it got picked up by news organizations like a couple days ago. Yeah. So, yeah. I think. You tried.

They really thought that the AIification of Bing was going to be their moment, and it just wasn't. So. Yeah, they did have a moment there, but now. They thought. Yeah, they thought. That's brutal. Well. Yeah. CES, by the way, so we're recording this on Wednesday.

CES will continue to happen for the next few days. So there's probably gonna be even more crazy stuff that we don't even know about between now and when you see this on Friday. So send it to us if you think we should check it out next week, but either way, that's it. That's all we've seen. We do wanna say one thing.

There's some crazy fires going around in Los Angeles So if you're a listener from over there Please be safe. We wish you the best sending out good vibes to all of you and Yes, stay safe out there, but I think it's time Olivia thank you. Sorry, was that too soon? No, I almost was like I was waiting for the pause I didn't want to be it's always you who throws it. So it felt wrong for me to do it. So I was going to let you throw.

As long as you do the pause, it's great. All right. Okay. Hit it Mariah. Amazing. All right. Would we like to know the current standings or? Yes.

No. So the current standing for season five that we just started is Marquez has two points, Andrew has zero points, and David has four points. That's wild. But yeah, I've still never won a trivia extravaganza. There's still time. There's still time.

Okay. Quick refresh. Our question number one for you today is about CES. So in CES 2025, we've already seen some crazy cool stuff. And I want to know which of these is not a real product from this year's CES. So we have option A is the Razer heated and cooled gaming chair. Option B is a 3D printer that makes cake batter and then cooks it with a laser. Option C is the Samsung stretchable display

that just kind of bulges a little bit. Don't know why. And option D is that fun little critter that hangs on your bag. I need to see a photo. And then E is all of the above. Okay. So which is not real.

Okay. Okay. And then. So which is not real. Okay. Boom. It's getting cold in here. It's so cold in here. It's very cold in here. I can't feel my fingers. For those of you who don't know, we turn the AC slash heat off every time we do the pod

because it makes noise right onto our microphones. And so whatever the temperature is outside, the temperature in here as we record slowly goes towards whatever the temperature is outside. The room is 50% windows. And it's like 23 degrees. During the summer it heats up, during the winter, it gets cold.

For the Europeans out there, that's like negative five. Oh, okay. It's chilly. All right, gamers, what do we got? All right, David said option B. I said B. What did you say, Andrew? I said all real.

All real. And I said option A, the razor. I know Marcus is wrong,. I said B. What did you say, Andrew? I said all real. All real. And I said option A, the razor. I know Marcus is wrong, because I saw that. Dang it. I thought I would have seen it. The furry creature is also real. I saw that too. Andrew is correct.

Dang. All of these are real things. I saw they would probably all be real, but I thought they would have. Okay, I don't need to explain. Y'all gotta see this crazy little guy. I need to see the creature. Can you put it in our slide?

Dude, it's weird. Yeah, take a little look at him. It's weird. I've seen it. I knew it was real. It just kind of hangs there and then just kind of like turns its head and stares at you. Same.

He's a silly little guy. It's a waveform. It's like a pink sloth that just kind of like turns its head around. It's a little cuter than like a Furby, I would say. That's low bar. Question two. Okay.

Okay. So Andrew got one point. Oh, who's the caring one? Give you that one. All right. So question two today is, Bing is obviously trying to trick people into using a search engine.

No surprise. So they are the number two search engine by US Market Share. Who is the number three spot holding the market share for search in the US? I have three guesses. I feel like... There's only so many companies. Man, you guys are really thinking about this.

I have two options that I've ruled out, but I. That you ruled out? Yeah. Well, yeah. Kind of a guess though. Okay, wait, before you say it. Yeah. Can I say what my three guesses are? Yeah.

Not that which one I put down. Yeah. Okay. Duck, duck, duck, go. Right. Okay. Yahoo. Right. Ask Jeeves. Interesting. I feel like we've talked about Ask Jeeves not that long. It's just called Ask.com now.

Oh, it's just Ask.com? Oh, Ask, yeah, yeah, yeah. Is it just Ask.com now? Although... All right, I'm gonna show you my board. Okay, show me what you got. I put Yahoo and I ruled out MSN and Chad GPT. Oh, MSN.

Because I think people might be using Chad GPT that much. God, I hope not. Link aggregation? Well, they do have the search engine. But it's still kind much. God, I hope not. For link aggregation? Well, they do have the search engine. But it's still kind of in private, it's not like, it's not like, I also put Yahoo.

I put DuckDuckGo. All right, well David is incorrect, unfortunately for him, but both of you are correct. Okay, let's go. Wow. I was between Yahoo and DuckDuckGo. Probably my dad. I would guess, I would guess. I mean, Yahoo's a big news aggregator website,

and so people who just go to yahoo.com, that's just where they... That was my guess. I think DuckDuckGo is the non-tracking version, right? Yeah, it's privacy focused. Yeah, privacy focused, but I just... I think they got in trouble for that. Hot for tracking or something.

Dang. Yeah, nothing is good anymore. I'm happy I got a point, though. Well, David's still in the lead by one point. Let's go. Andrew, you have a chance now. I, that changed the dynamic of that completely. It was four. It's two, three, four now.

Two, three, four now. Yeah. Do you like my duck? Oh. Duck is like the only. Enhance. I don't really know how to draw it. Adam, zoom into that. Look at this little guy. It's out of focus now.

Oh yeah. Well, hey, that's our show for this week. Lots more CS stuff coming. So like I said, send it to us. Tag at Waveform. We'll find it. And of course, thanks for watching and listening as always. And we'll catch you guys next week.

Peace. Big year. Bye. Waveform was produced by Adam, Alina, Ellis, Ruben, and Verizon. and we'll catch you guys next week. Peace. Big year. Bye. Waveform was produced by Adam Alina, Ellis Riven, and Mariah Zink. We are partnered with Vox Media Podcast Network and our intro outro music was created by Vane Sill.

Bingo. Nvidia's queen.