Waveform: The MKBHD Podcast - Creative AI: Should we be Worried?

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Starting point is 00:00:26 you know, has concerns about gambling, visit connexontario.ca T's and Z's apply. This episode is brought to you by RBC student banking. Here's an RBC student offer that turns a feel good moment into a feel great moment. Students get $100 when you open a no monthly fee RBC advantage banking account,

Starting point is 00:00:42 and we'll give another $100 to a charity of your choice this great perk and more only at rbc visit rbc.com slash get 100 give 100 conditions apply ends january 31st 2025 complete offer eligibility criteria by march 31st 2025 choose one of five eligible charities up to another episode of the waveform podcast we're really back this time uh we're your hosts i'm marquez and i'm andrew and today we've got kind of a mixed bag but it's a fun one um a bunch of the strangest in my opinion dumbest ev features we've seen in a long time um also possibly some of the strangest dumbest smartwatch features we've seen in a long time and then a whole bunch of the ai stuff that we've seen over the past couple weeks and months sort of building up one of those things

Starting point is 00:01:36 were like i think we're gonna end up making a video on the main channel about this and this is one of those times where we kind of use the podcast to have the conversation that turns into the video we sort of figure it out as we go so we're doing it live we're doing it live but first we just want to say uh thanks for sticking with us we're all good we're back we're in the studio and we're also if you're watching the video version wearing some pieces that you probably are going to want to get if you're if you're interested for the holiday season you're probably going to want to check out shop.mcbhd.com. I'm wearing the holiday sweater that is no doubt by the time you see this almost sold out, just a warning. This is a limited edition thing. I think it's only like bigger sizes left and it's baggy too. So, uh, so check it out if you're interested. Andrew's got the Chevron sweater.

Starting point is 00:02:16 The OG. I'm being Marquez for today. Personal favorite. Yeah. We just wanted to throw them on real quick because if you want them by holiday season, probably should order them quick. We don't shout out merch too often here, so please give us a quick minute to do it. But yeah, thank you so much for all the kind words last week. We all feel great now. And just big shout out to Adam who, while we were sick, we really thought we would get back in on time and we didn't. So last minute, threw an idea at Adam and he made a two hour long podcast episode. I didn't know we had such a streak going until we checked 100 i think that was our 144th episode that's

Starting point is 00:02:50 almost three years in a row pretty crazy and the funniest thing is the closest we've ever come to missing an episode was episode one because we got messed up on when we were supposed to release it and you were in california you flew back flew back from California, recorded an episode on Thursday, and then flew back to California for what I needed to be there for. Yeah, a good time. So, yeah, Streak is alive, episode 145 today. Yeah. Keep it going.

Starting point is 00:03:16 Let's keep it going. We'll see how it goes. This is the longest relationship I have with anything in my life. Same. Marques has been through like 14 different project apps how many phones have we used the first phone we were using was probably very different when we started the podcast you want to talk about these ear what is this earbuds or watch which would you call it let's do earbuds or yeah that's a good point is it a smart i think it's a smart watch

Starting point is 00:03:40 smart watch okay so huawei i don't know if this was a leak or Huawei posted it. I saw it on The Verge, but essentially it's a new Huawei smartwatch that then pops open and has two Huawei earbuds inside it. And when I first saw this, my immediate thought was, cool, the two things I want in a smartwatch are for it to be thicker and for it to have worse battery life. So I don't understand this at all. And surprisingly, when I said that on Twitter, a lot of people disagreed with me and thought this was really cool. And I'm just baffled by that aspect.

Starting point is 00:04:16 It's, uh, I'll tell you what it is, which is an interesting gadget. And we don't get that many interesting gadgets. Aren't all the smartwatches kind of the same looking at this point? You can get the square one. I don't think this looks any different. I think this just looks worse than other ones because it's thicker.

Starting point is 00:04:33 Right, but how many of them also let you hold and charge your earbuds? Like functionally, okay. Functionally, that's kind of cool. I would love to hear this argument. No, I just mean like, okay, in the future someday when battery life isn't dramatically compromised in this tiny amount of space wouldn't it be cool to also be able to have your earbuds just like in your smartwatch just as one of those as a hypothetical yeah a hypothetical hypothetical i

Starting point is 00:05:00 sure the thing here is is like wireless truly wireless earbuds like this are the absolute easiest thing to carry out of anything else in the tech world like these are the smallest carrying cases possible they're super easy to bring with you literally anywhere even like i know a lot of women say that they don't have pockets like they have enough of a pocket to fit an earbud case in generally like this i think this is uh one of the things that's underrated about some wireless earbuds that actually have a small case because a lot of them have an a surprisingly unwieldy case there and i think the the smart watch would be the smallest case possible you know why they're unwieldy because they have good battery life and they put it yeah they put a big battery in them and then they need like the

Starting point is 00:05:43 shape around them and they need a nice clamp and some magnets and the clasp and they put it all together but like the beats are like a giant case for no reason like they don't need it to be that big i don't think yeah airpods are like literally one of the smallest cases for wireless earbuds they do yeah airpods are weird when you look at them next other ones they look about the same size but because of the shape and the thinness of it it's usually much easier like i've found them to be some of the easier ones to carry around um new galaxy buds are pretty good but this just to me i mean like it's one of the arguments i saw was no now your watch has more batteries because the earbuds have batteries in it and it can take from the earbuds and i was like oh but then your earbuds have no batteries yeah that's weird that's

Starting point is 00:06:23 you're just saying that there's space in there that could have just been a battery. So one of these things has to have a terrible battery life. I mean, with today's technology. I would argue both of them have a terrible battery life. Probably, yeah. But you know, the idea, the future possibility. The thing is, I'm wearing the Galaxy Watch 5 right now. Do you think a pair of wireless earbuds could fit in this?

Starting point is 00:06:44 No. How much bigger do you think this would have to earbuds could fit in this no how much bigger do you think this would have to be i also i'm using the 40 millimeter also so like this is the smaller one yeah i mean i have the watch ultra and there's no way anything there's no way earbuds would fit in that and that is gigantic like there are a lot of people saying the watch ultra is really cool but they could never wear it every day because it's way too big this thing is going to be gigantic look at how small the the leather band on it looks yeah it's minuscule i guess on the other hand and adam can probably back me up there's a lot

Starting point is 00:07:11 of people who wear much bigger watches than the smart watches that we're wearing right now i don't know if those are the same people that want earbuds in their watch but i'm just saying it's out there do you know what's funny is out there in that situation the company that i would probably believe this to be better i think wouldn't make good earbuds which is like garmin like garmin are big watches insane battery life so i don't think that's an issue already that's exactly what i was gonna say yeah like the new epics just came out and has like a 16 day battery life or something and i actually believe that it has a 16 day battery life so cut it in half and throw some you still have eight days of battery but i don't think garmin earbuds would be good maybe if they collabed i mean i'm sure harman kardon would love to throw their name on literally anything so they could probably

Starting point is 00:07:52 collab with garmin but maybe in that scenario i could see it i just can't imagine how many times this is going to get knocked into a wall because it's like it's so big there's a thing like in watches when you're wearing them it's how many's so big there's a thing like in watches when you're wearing them it's how many times you could just knock them into like the door frame as you're walking through it and you're not paying attention and then every other watch survive or and every time you do that two earbuds fall down on the floor and roll across open and things are just yeah just like imagine being at the mall or something and just like uh you now all of a sudden your earbuds are rolling away in a group of crowded people because you accidentally knocked into like a mannequin or a clothes rack or something like

Starting point is 00:08:28 that it all seems there's so crazy there's just i agree i agree with all of this it's just that there's something about consolidating two things that you'd have to charge and carry separately into one thing and that general idea i like i don't know if you'd put like your earbuds in your phone there's probably a phone case earbuds in there i think there has been there's at least been concepts of that i almost feel like that makes more sense because phones at this point are already almost unwieldy to put in pockets so what's another 100 million powers yeah for earbuds yeah i don't know like i i don't know how regular huawei watches are have tested one? I never have. I have not. I would assume they're similar to a Galaxy Watch, a Pixel Watch, just kind of like the standard.

Starting point is 00:09:10 You have about a day, a little more than a day. So putting this in there, even if it's using the battery from the headphones on a day that you don't use it, there's still gaps of where it all has to fit and extra connectors that have to pair to it. Like you're losing battery space no matter what. Dude, if Apple did this, the world would be on fire. Everyone would go nuts.

Starting point is 00:09:28 Someone said that. I don't think I agree with that. I think they love this. I don't think. One, I don't think Apple would ever do this. No, no, no, of course. But, well, maybe not ever. But if you tried to fit current earbuds,

Starting point is 00:09:41 Apple AirPods or whatever, inside of an Apple Watch, it wouldn't work. But tiny, tiny earbuds inside of an apple watch it wouldn't work but tiny tiny earbuds inside of a watch people would go oh that's genius that's beautiful i still think people think it's stupid well what's funny it needs an amazing i think the people who think this is cool would hate the apple version of it and i think the people who hate this would think the apple version is cool or the sane people like me because i'm perfect would think this is stupid all around and i disapprove of whoever did that we're gonna

Starting point is 00:10:11 have a talk after work i'm gonna try to get my hands on this watch okay i'm gonna try good luck i'm gonna try speaking of watches really quick a lot of people liked this last time but do you see my um my alpine loop for my galaxy watch isn't that weird isn't this an apple band no did you say somebody was like nice watch before you showed them the watch i went to a taco bell my natural uh habitat um and the guy at the drive-thru was like yo sick watch because i would kind of have my arm like resting on my window and then i like turned it over and went wait what because it was a galaxy watch and not an apple watch ultra and that's amazing I was like that was amazing but dude there are so many

Starting point is 00:10:50 good knockoff watch bands on amazon I have a trail loop knockoff and an alpine watch knockoff and they were ten dollars each so and they're probably very close in actual material and quality to the real like I would call them seven to eight out of ten in comparison when you're a tenth of the price yeah i think that's pretty awesome that's pretty good um all right another kind of ridiculous thing i want that i know you want to talk about i want to talk about maybe one of the this might not even be a hot take one of the dumbest things i've ever seen this is funny because i get to play devil's advocate for this time and you get to be mad at me. Okay. So Lexus, there's a video on Evo Magazine's Twitter of Lexus developing a manual transmission for electric cars in the form of like the, you know, a stick shift. Like a full blown stick shift.

Starting point is 00:11:36 Full blown stick shift. And there's a video of this guy driving around for 45 seconds, shifting like a normal stick shift car, but it's like adding noise adding all this extra oh i didn't notice the noise yeah there's noise it's terrible we'll play a little clip of the video for you guys but yeah this this seems uh this seems like the one of the dumbest things i've ever seen does it have a boost gauge it seems like it's got like an rpm counter and yeah i don't know what that maybe that's a just a way of knowing when to shift but like i i quote tweeted this with an older tweet of mine and i think we've probably talked about this on the show at some point

Starting point is 00:12:19 which is like we're gonna look back at the transition period where you're trying to convince people to get an electric car and look at all the weird things they do to imitate gas cars as hilarious. Because, look, electric cars are just fundamentally easier to use. And to add back all of the clunky and inefficient and engaging of a manual gas car is just a waste of time get over it ignore the like just just drive just drive you'll be fine i'm going to play devil's advocate but i also don't know why because i i truly don't think there's many people that would argue for this because if you like manual you probably hate evs and if you like evs you probably don't care about manual that much i think there's a very small small niche place that might find this interesting and we have talked about it a little bit before in the sense of there is still

Starting point is 00:13:14 driving scenarios that require that skill based is more fun and like maybe you're racing or something like that where if you're just putting pedal to the floor, you're you're losing a lot of different variables that way. Gas car. I mean, eventually we would like to go everything to EV, right? Yeah. I mean, the enthusiast fun car, I imagine that will stay the gas car the longest. There is no sense in making the electric. That's my that's my thing. It's like 90 percent of the comments are like agreeing with me like this is dumb. And then 10 percent are like, wait, I like manual cars. This is cool.

Starting point is 00:13:48 But that person's still not buying this. They're just going to buy an older gas car to do this. I think there's potentially an area in where we get to the point where EV is, the performance you're getting out of an EV is so much cheaper than the performance you would get out of like a gas car. Like let's like, it already is at that point. So let's go even cheaper now. Like now you're racing something that's $30,000, but has a zero to 60 that's equivalent to something

Starting point is 00:14:16 that is like 70 to $80,000. That's very normal right now. Yeah. And then, but now you can add the skill-based aspect of it. So if you're doing a track day to get slower to add variable like the thing is is if now you're racing on track day and the only aspect is pressing the pedal forward like you're losing out on so much i still yeah i agree actual i just think there's still a part of it there's so many other things that are still skill related with driving like even when you just play when you go-kart race which is just like oh you just hit the pedal and go there's all the driving lines acceleration braking handling the weight of the cart like all those things still

Starting point is 00:14:54 matter you just don't have to shit like there's lots of arguments in the gas car world now about like oh man porsche's pdk is so fast but i still want the manual version because it's more engaging and i'll just be slower and there's lots of cars that are literally too fast for a manual gearbox and it's like we don't do manual gearboxes anymore because that's not safe i mean the biggest argument to this is f1 f1 still has shifting f1 is shifting and is there it's part it's part of the sport like there is a skill gap between of people who are shifting better and i think cars that are built that are shifting differently and yeah i think for the sport like there is a skill gap between of people who are shifting better and i think cars that are built that are shifting differently and yeah i think for the sport of professional yeah

Starting point is 00:15:29 that's what i'm talking about the sport yeah but there's still a hobbyist sport aspect of things i yeah it's niche and you're going to be paying a lot extra for this um i think the other thing is people i saw a lot of comments that were saying why would i want this why would i want to drive every day like this manual Manual sucks in everyday driving. Like if it's electric, it's not going to be stuck in manual. It's going to be a mode. I guarantee you, you can drive this car with just a pedal and not having to shift.

Starting point is 00:15:55 There's a lot of cars out there that have, even gas cars that have this like fake shifting or stuff like, like my Forester is a CVT, which doesn't have gears and still has fake shifting on it for i think it's really stupid but so what happens when it fake shifts you fake shift and it just creates what it would be similar to a gear i think the only real scenario is like if you wanted lower gear and like snow or mud or something like that um but if you even in that scenario if you fuck it up it'll just be like nope you're wrong and

Starting point is 00:16:25 then go past it yeah yeah this is like i there's i think this is extremely small yeah percentage of the population i feel like f1 is a thing but we've been driving cars for a hundred something years and we still have horse races yeah it's like there will always be like the people that take that older thing and continue doing it no matter what. I think when you reach a moment of peak performance, you need to add more variables into things to create larger skill gaps of stuff like that. So in the sport-obvious aspect of this,

Starting point is 00:16:58 shifting is still going to be one of those variables that will make the difference between drivers. On a track? Yeah. I'm only talking about track. If you do this on the road regular lexus i don't even know maybe a car maybe an suv and it's like you're adding inefficiency you're adding distraction you're adding engagement sure but for what if you want that feeling just get a car. They're also driving on the wrong side of the road. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:17:26 Morons. Who would ever do that? Driver on the right side of the car. Geez, we can't take them seriously. Wild. Anyway. See, I want to say I've enjoyed both of us playing devil's advocate because I saw moments where both of us legitimately got mad at the other person.

Starting point is 00:17:40 I was so mad. And I love it. Can I throw one more wrench in here do it formula e cars have transmissions of course they do i actually didn't know that also no one cares about formula well that at the highest level they also have speed boosts it's i still think there's so many variables i think with formula e there are way more regulations so all the cars are more similar so the gearbox is an actual variable. I've always heard that it's an efficiency thing, like you can actually pull more efficiency

Starting point is 00:18:11 out of the electric motors by running them through a transmission. Yes. But I don't know. So most electric cars today have one gear, and that's because they can run at an extremely high range of RPMsms from zero having all their torque up to say 20 000 rpm or whatever tesla model s is one of those lots of electric cars do that there's a couple that have two gears and they'll say they do that because they have a high performance lower gear for like getting off the line quick acceleration and then a lower rpm higher gear

Starting point is 00:18:46 for efficiency so when you're cruising along the highway when you're going at higher speeds you use that higher gear uh that's why gas cars have so many gears is because they're extremely inefficient outside of their like peak power band which is a several hundred rpm uh so yes adding more gears can make you more efficient theoretically it's just a matter of whether you want that complexity in a gearbox and do you want to add all those parts to your car when you can probably get away with having one gear and doing great things with several motors instead of several gears yeah i think we're both in agreeance that everyday driving yeah everyday driving i hate this with all my heart. I think there's a sport hobbyist aspect of it that is kind of...

Starting point is 00:19:29 I'll admit that. Yeah, if someone were to buy this for everyday driving, I bet they would use it for like a week and then probably never touch it again. Like you would just drive the car normally. They'd be so annoyed. All right, let's take a break. We got to come back and talk about all this AI stuff that's been on Twitter lately. BRB.

Starting point is 00:19:49 Oh, wait. back and talk about all this ai stuff that's been on twitter lately brb oh wait i saw ellis go for the microphone yeah it's been so long we had the hassan interview we had the week off we completely fell out of our rhythm we have to do trivia we have to do trivia oh yeah and i think there's going to be a pretty trivia tastic episode coming up pretty soon i knew about that okay i knew about that so you know we're making up for it. But yes, trivia. Yes, of course. How could I forget? Alright, so across the Atlantic, far, far away, there's a magical realm

Starting point is 00:20:14 called Europe. And in Europe... I've heard of that. Crazy, right? In Europe, there's a science center. And at this science center, both the Higgs boson particle was discovered and the World Wide Web was invented. Do you know the name of the science center? Oh, man.

Starting point is 00:20:37 I thought I was going to be able to guess the country at least. And then you're like, no, let's be more specific. I know the name of the facility that the Higgs boson thing is. Honestly, I'll take the country. Oh, well, now it's going to be bad when I get this wrong. I also half know that. That's a good one. Okay.

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Starting point is 00:21:51 this is for you the canadian armed forces a message from the government of canada all right welcome back to the ai podcast i'm your ai host marquez oh no he's real he's real don't worry no what am i one of my biggest pet peeves though low-key is when companies say that they're using ai to do something and they clearly not this morning i really get annoyed by this like there are companies who say they have AI autofocus. And the difference between that and eye recognition is very faint. I don't know why they feel any. Actually, I know why. AI is very futuristic. It's in the news a lot. It seems like this black box of mystery and wonder that kicks out amazing results. And so people like to lean into AI whenever they have anything smart in their product. It's AI. But I want to talk about actual

Starting point is 00:22:51 AI for a little bit because it has actually made the rounds on, you've seen it on Twitter, right? Yeah. Chat GTP conversations. It's just nice to have Twitter about something else blowing up besides just Twitter. I'm tired of reading about Twitter for the last month. Yeah, this is why I like Twitter. Moments like this, where we all get this little taste of the future

Starting point is 00:23:10 through a open AI research project that is basically a chat bot, but that draws from a gigantic catalog of the world's information and is able to do amazing things. And it's kind of terrifying some of the things it's been able to do. It is fun to collectively gawk

Starting point is 00:23:28 and be terrified together. Yeah. This is, so like I said earlier, this is one of those things where I want to make a video about this because I have some thoughts about all of the AI stuff, how it's used,

Starting point is 00:23:41 what we can use it for, how it might evolve into the future and this is you know just me like thinking out loud on some of that stuff uh but you have a so i want to talk about two of them the two big ones we're talking about chat gpt which is like a chat and then we're also seeing a bunch of like avatar ai so we're going to talk about both of them quickly like you said we haven't discussed this too far we're going to use the podcast as kind of our first dive into this. And I think we've toyed around with it a little bit. So I have a couple examples here.

Starting point is 00:24:12 ChatGPT, though, is like people are online. We're already getting people sending to us, like creating full MKBHD videos through ChatGPT. And it does a pretty dang good job. So basically what it is, is it's a text box. You can type in any chat and just have a conversation with it. You can ask it questions. You can give it lines of code

Starting point is 00:24:34 and ask for it to find what's wrong with the code for you. You can ask it to write a poem for you. You can have a conversation back and forth about something you learned and it will further educate you on the topic. Like it has all this information to have realistic, meaningful thought and response conversations. Like we talked about when Google AI, Google IO came around and Google assistant got more conversational. It would remember context. What was that one project? They had like a conversation bot project. They did. And that was like more research project like this. But even in the consumer product we

Starting point is 00:25:08 use now, Google Assistant, when you ask, how tall is Barack Obama? It'll tell you. And then your next question can be, ah, when's his birthday? And you don't have to say, when is Barack Obama's birthday? You're in a conversation flow. This is like the ultimate highest end ai version of that in research form and we've been asking it for all kinds of things hey give me a a script for an mkbhd video about you know art and ai and it will actually give me a script for an mkbhd video like it it's pretty good and the best part about is like what i really loved about that i don't want to spoil too much because we have some fun examples saved for the video later. But like when you talk about when you say write it for a YouTube video, it ends with

Starting point is 00:25:52 like, don't forget to subscribe and hit that like button. Or like if you ask it to write you a tweet, it'll put hashtags at the end of it. Like it understands the context of even the social media. I get that it can do poems and stuff. understands the context of even the social media i get that it can do poems and stuff but seeing that it's doing this like new age uh ways of posting almost and finding that context is really switching really cool um i i made a couple examples for waveform though today um the first one i did i'd like for you to read it it's i asked it to write an intro for the waveform podcast hosted by marquez and andrew okay and i'm gonna have Marquez read this like a regular intro and maybe we'll switch

Starting point is 00:26:29 ours up. This is what it came up with. Welcome to the waveform podcast where hosts Marquez and Andrew explore the latest in technology and science. Join us as we dial delve into the fascinating world of cutting edge innovation and discover how it's shaping our future from the latest advancements in artificial intelligence to the frontiers of space exploration, we cover it all. Tune in every week for engaging discussions and thought-provoking insights. So like right off the bat, that seems kind of simple, but if you really think that all I put in there was Waveform Podcast and both of our names, it hits stuff like technology, science, of our names, it hits stuff like technology, science, AI, space exploration, that it's weekly and we're doing a discussion. That's pretty impressive. Okay. So I got to admit something.

Starting point is 00:27:13 Okay. When I first started seeing these, I was very unimpressed. Okay. Because I felt like it was basically taking a few keywords and then just copying and pasting examples of popular versions of that often from maybe just wikipedia articles so i had people send me like what is an armadillo or what is ultimate frisbee yeah and then it would just tell me what ultimate frisbee is and it would read exactly like the like the wikipedia article and i like, that's not impressive at all. Like I could ask Google that and it would tell me the same thing. So it really became much more impressive when the prompts got more creative, I think.

Starting point is 00:27:54 It's similar to Dolly where like Dolly was impressive, but clearly kind of messed up. But the more intense you got with the prompts and how it still was continued to be messed up, like errors here and there but it still could contextually figure out this two to three sentence long prompt yeah and still create something that made sense it's really good point it's the more so so there's a a normal accepted error rate let's just call it like 10 and when you just ask dolly give me a cat and it gives you a cat but

Starting point is 00:28:28 10 of the things look kind of weird you're like not impressed but when you ask dolly give me a cat with 12 legs in the style of monet on like canvas with like robots fighting in the background. And it actually does 90% of that. It's really impressive. So I feel like it's kind of along the same lines here. Chat GTP, I've had a number of conversations with it. I've asked it lots of things. I even tweeted what I asked for, you know, iOS versus Android essay.

Starting point is 00:28:59 I love Android versus iOS essay. And I, previous versions of that, it got some things wrong. Like it was telling me some things that weren't actually true. But the fact that I was that detailed with my prompt and I was like, give me the style of the YouTube video. Give me Android better than iOS. Give me these things. I was like pretty impressed that it was actually able to generate that much.

Starting point is 00:29:17 Even though a lot of it still kind of does read like it's taking from the top line of an article it found or the second paragraph of the Wikipedia about Android. It's sort of throwing together a structure based on things that I asked for, which is cool. It's blending them very well. I mean, it pretty much is doing that. I guess the argument would be, how much is it just copy and pasting from the exact things it finds,

Starting point is 00:29:38 or how much is it analyzing X amount of data and then just through all of that data, creating something. Because if you search your name, Wikipedia is not going to be the only one. There's going to be 400 pages that say like Marquez is an American tech YouTuber with 16 million followers. And then it's going to be like, oh, 500 articles have said that. That's got to be important. I want to take that and put that in there, some form of that in there.

Starting point is 00:30:02 But yeah, the way it contextualizes different things and actually make sure that it's using them all correctly in like a story for the most part you're right there is still an error there is still an error rate yeah for sure and some of them you read and you're like that's awesome and then i think david was saying something about fastest sea mammal it's like oh that's so cool and then looked it up it's like wait it's not that like that's not what it is oh yeah yeah and i also have like uh and this will also i think be in the video there are some errors that are more common than others like when you ask for these like ai paintings or portraits or dolly yeah hands we're gonna get into the the paintings in a minute the art i guess can i do i i wrote i got it made a story in chat, GPT, that can I read this,

Starting point is 00:30:49 and then we'll get into the more art version of it. All right. In the holiday spirit, I asked ChatGPT to write a story about how tech YouTuber Marques Brownlee had to take over the role of Santa Claus. Would you like to hear? I would love to hear what it came up with. All right. It was the night before Christmas,

Starting point is 00:31:13 and Marques Brownlee, better known as MKBHD on YouTube, was feeling more than a little stressed. As a tech YouTuber, he's used to filming and editing videos, not delivering presents to children all over the world. But that's exactly what he had to do. Thanks to a mix-up at the North Pole, apparently Santa Claus had come down with a terrible cold and was able to make the rounds. And since Marques has been so good this year, the elves had chosen him to take over the job. Marques was a bit hesitant at first, but he knew that it was his duty to help out. So

Starting point is 00:31:39 he quickly put on the red suit and hopped into Santa's sleigh, which was powered by the latest and greatest technology. The sleigh was equipped with a GPS system that showed Marquez exactly where children lived, and it even had built-in cameras so that he could capture all the reactions as he delivered the presents. As Marquez flew from house to house, he couldn't help but smile. He loved seeing the excitement on the faces of the children as they opened their gifts, and he even got to try out some of the new tech toys that he had helped design before he knew it it was time to return to the north pole marquez was exhausted but he felt a sense of satisfaction knowing that he helped to make christmas special for so many kids as he handed the reins back to santa marquez couldn't help but joke i think i might have to

Starting point is 00:32:17 retire from tech and become a full-time santa santa just chuckled and replied i think we might have to make you an elf. Whoa. You got burned at the end of it. That was so good. That was really good. It wasn't really good. What was the prompt again? Give me that one more time.

Starting point is 00:32:32 It was, write a story about how tech YouTuber Marques Brownlee had to take over the role of Santa Claus. That was... I kind of missed the music already. Yeah, that was really good. It had a punchline at the end. It really... So... Whoa. Yeah. the music already yeah that was really good it had a punchline at the end so whoa yeah it's a it's a lot of fun to play with i'm very interested to see where this goes i can't wait for like

Starting point is 00:32:53 in five years you just called this before this is kind of like the highest form of like conversational ai that we're we're seeing and in five years when we look back on this and think about how terrible it was, it's going to be really impressive to see where we go. Yeah, for real. Okay. Now we should talk a little bit about the visual versions. The visuals, yes.

Starting point is 00:33:13 There has been, we did a whole video about DALI. We've talked about DALI. It's using, you know, obviously diffusion and creating images from scratch using a natural language text prompt which is sick uh there's another one uh that's generating ai avatars of people there's a couple yeah and i think with this one basically you feed it several images is that right so you give it some images of yourself yeah and it can spit out some cartoon version of you with different situations it's very dolly

Starting point is 00:33:44 like except this time focusing on humans, although humans that are consenting by giving you their pictures. Prisma Labs did one for you and you have a million photos of yourself online. And it did a very, very good job. Like yours are insanely impressive. And I think what it's doing is similar to Dolly

Starting point is 00:34:02 where it knows what a general person looks like but the really cool thing is that it confines the stylization of other things and make you into it like this is you it looks like you're in a chevron hoodie astronaut suit um and like cool more like miami vice here's you in a purple suit which is really awesome yeah um a lot of it is really cool and yours are super impressive you're pretty good uh one thing i've noticed that it never really does well just like dolly uh hands and text so anytime there's supposed to be text in it like the one with the astronaut suit supposed to have some text on it right there doesn't really make a real word if you ask dolly to make a stop

Starting point is 00:34:45 sign seven out of ten times it just says some says bad yeah some weird word and then uh i think if you there's some other so other youtube friends that have done this with hands but even look at the one of me in a purple suit like that those hands don't quite match up there's like a floating thumb on the top of my hands there that isn't connected to either hand that just happens when you have hands and photos with ai um so hands are tough other than that pretty good yeah yours yours is very good sarah dichi did one with avatar ai that was incredible i mean but again then there's like justine who did one on i forget if it was prisma or avatar. Hers was bad. Yeah. And she has a lot of really good pictures out there. And her face looks nothing like her in some. Some of them, her eye is almost off the side of her head.

Starting point is 00:35:33 It seems to really like some people and really dislike some people. Myself, who doesn't have a lot of good photos online, tried Avatar AI. It is rough. I'm going to show you some. I disagree. These are fantastic are fantastic sir wanna see these so I think these are really bad to be fair the photos I fed into it were not great although it still took about 30 photos and if you would like oh yeah I love my your are they yours as well there's a

Starting point is 00:36:02 link in the doc oh it's. I'm clicking on it now. Some of these... These are so good. Some of these are very good. Some of these are very bad. I also totally don't approve of all the categories it put me in. It shows Dominatrix as the first category. There's also like

Starting point is 00:36:20 Jim and for whatever reason, Sunflowerfield. None of them look like me. I look like Dr. House and some of them, which I'm not opposed to. Like it's funny. So Andrew,

Starting point is 00:36:31 you did not tell me that you starred in a whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa,

Starting point is 00:36:34 whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa,

Starting point is 00:36:44 whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, I don't think we can show the gym one. The gym ones are incredible. So there's a varying amount of resemblance to your face because you can tell it's picking which photo it's going to use and trying to make it look like you. The Picasso one looks less like a photorealistic version. I would argue the ones that look the most like me are just the most standard ones that felt like it's pretty much just pasting the photo that I put in there.

Starting point is 00:37:04 The race car driver. It just kind of looks... The race car driver one, you can just tell in specific ones that felt like it's pretty much just pasting the photo that I put in there onto it. It just kind of looks... The race car driver one, you can just tell in specific ones, it is just my face on Michael Schumacher's face. The fashion model one of you in a turtleneck is very good. This is just a young Michael Schumacher with kind of my facial details. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:37:22 So you can tell where it's pulling from on some of these things and um I don't um this might be one of those things where you should watch the clip later if you can't see all of it because it's a little hard to explain I think I think the thing is is it's it's nailing very normal photos of me the fashion model one the one of just like in a business suit or the passport versions of these are all just kind of normal where photos i fed into this a lot of them were from weddings which i had a suit on so it's basically just making kind of a drawing version this side profile of me as a fashion model is like i posted a side profile picture that was exactly like this and it just feels like the photo of me okay so that's a good this is a really good transition point because there's

Starting point is 00:38:05 a tough question behind all of these which is how do you credit what it's taking inspiration from yes and so for the for the ones that you gave it the pictures of it's it's fairly straightforward you gave it a certain set of pictures so you know what it's drawing inspiration from and if you ever see any similarities it's pretty obvious where it got that stuff i think my whole thing is actually pretty obvious in a lot of theirs as where the ones that nailed it it's mostly taking it from the pictures i fed it the ones that didn't nail it you can kind of tell the photos it's grabbing from yeah and that's like you said it's a it's a discussion that I think we need to have because it's a discussion on Twitter now, is what part of where it's scraping from is okay, I guess. And that is a tough question.

Starting point is 00:38:52 So you mentioned that other one is clearly a picture of young Michael Schumacher. It's definitely just Michael Schumacher. That photo, where did that come from? Exactly. And we don't know the artist or the photographer or any of that behind that image. And I think that comes back to even like, so Dolly from OpenAI is taking from an unknown giant database of like all of the information that they've fed into it.

Starting point is 00:39:14 And then if I ask it for a picture of a cat in space or whatever, it'll give me a picture of a cat in space. And maybe it's taken some photos from artists about cats and some photos from NASA about space. But if I ask it for a photo of a cat in space in the style of an MKBHD video, it might be taking frames from an MKBHD video that it has in its database. And should it be able to do that? Yes.

Starting point is 00:39:43 And that is a tougher question. I think that is a very tough question and I'm going to preface this by saying we're just going to say our opinions very quickly on this and we're looking at it. So I don't want anyone to... Yeah, I'm not a copyright lawyer. I just want to preface this.

Starting point is 00:39:54 We're not copyright lawyers. But there's also just like... I don't know. It's a tough, tough subject. Yeah. And I think there's a lot of conversation to be had about it. But there are a lot of artists out there who seem to be seeing this and saying that a lot of things look far, far too similar to art that is not consenting into being part of these AI databases.

Starting point is 00:40:18 And we just don't know how much is a coincidence versus how much is it literally drawing inspiration. It's very, very hard. So the way, here, the way dolly works is really interesting and i you can sort of go back and watch the video again and hear the explanations and there's other explainers of this but it's like it has all this information it has all this database it uses diffusion it has an image of you can you can listen to david explain this on a previous episode but it has just like a static image of just like black and white grain and then it has a final image and it tries to use diffusion to like add structure to this static image on its way to the thing that you described to learn what you're making so if you ask it for a picture i'm just going to go with a cat again it knows because

Starting point is 00:41:04 it's learned from its database what a picture of a cat looks like. And then it tries to create a picture of a cat from nothing, essentially. And so it's not just like taking a piece of someone else's art and pasting it into this new creation and calling it a new creation. That would be a lot more obvious. What it's more doing is learning from all these different sources what it thinks you are trying to ask it for, and then creating a new version of that from scratch. And sometimes the level of variation from that new thing is pretty tough.

Starting point is 00:41:37 Like there's probably not that many pictures, let's say of a cat with a purple sky behind it or something. So if you're an artist that made a picture of a cat with a purple sky behind it or something. So if you're an artist that made a picture of a cat with a purple sky behind it, and then I ask Dolly for a picture of a cat with a purple sky behind it, it'll probably resemble a little bit more of that artist's photo because it doesn't have as many examples to draw from,

Starting point is 00:41:59 if that makes any sense. So it's like, if I i make more specific more nuanced art i am more likely to find issue with my art being drawn from rather than if i just made like general pictures of cats you know it's tough i also think depending on which ai you're using there's probably ones that are doing a better job because i have seen people post that like some of these avatars they're getting have old artists signatures on them which means it's definitely taking a little more than just completely learning and it's more melding things together which feels yeah if it literally has a signature then it's definitely not it's using diffusion i think the the hardest aspect

Starting point is 00:42:42 of this is is you've mentioned we were talking about this a little bit before the show and you mentioned how like in in humanity we take inspiration from people yeah and there's no fine line of like what is pure copying and what is inspiration and i think it's very hard to to compare that to a machine and ai learning and like i don't know where that line is at all and i think the more we try and find a line the the more is the harder it gets honest fuzzy it's fuzzy because basically you could argue that ai if we're trying to make it as close to a human experience as possible is literally doing what humans do it's taking inspiration from things and then making its own thing and so when you think about like copyright and uh stealing yeah you're like all right well if you make the conscious decision to try to make your own

Starting point is 00:43:34 version of that thing you're gonna find yourself copying parts of that thing but if you sort of subconsciously might not remember where you remember it from but you kind of have this idea of what you want something to look like and then then you create it, you were inspired by all of your previous life's experiences. Everything in your life up to that point has led you to what you are painting. How do you give credit to all those parts of your life? And maybe some pieces of art you might have seen along the way that might have inspired you. pieces of art you might have seen along the way that might have inspired you that to me is just as complicated as as the ai creating something new from all the sources it has to draw from my one pushback on that would be and again this is super hard to define if you can't tell like

Starting point is 00:44:16 we want to be very specific with how we say how we talk about this because i think we both understand that we are we are not artists making physical like paintings and stuff like this so we maybe don't understand well i the other thing was like when chat gpt makes a script in the style of an mkbhd video how much is it actually drawing from things that i have actually said and i asked it for like script in the style of a Mr. Beast YouTube video. And I think it's just like has a general thing where for a YouTube video, it adds an intro and the style of a YouTuber and an outro. It didn't say peace at the end of mine.

Starting point is 00:44:55 It didn't have an alliteration. It didn't say what's up MKBHD here. It just did like the general YouTube thing. So I don't know how specific or what it's actually drawing from there, but it didn't seem incredibly so derivative not to get all conspiratorial but when andrew was like i'm pretty sure that's just mick schumacher i was like oh i bet i could find that photo of mick schumacher so i've been digging around is it mick or michael because he's wearing a red suit so i'm assuming it's a ferrari michael

Starting point is 00:45:21 schumacher the i've found closer photos of Mick than Michael. But the thing that I wanted to throw out there is that when I run a bunch of the other photos in that race car driver bunch through it, through Google Lens specifically, it brings me a ton of pictures of Haas NASCAR drivers. Interesting. And the suit you're wearing is almost identical to the Haas NASCAR suit. And I'm wondering, that's what I'm wondering, if somewhere in the metadata of the world, there's like a tweet that's like,

Starting point is 00:45:54 Andrew loves, and you have the Haas shirt that you wear, and people tweet at you about Haas. I don't like this anymore. Is that a coincidence? Or did it get scraped? I do want to go into that really quick. And what I was going to say before is the comparison, I think, is a gray area of I,

Starting point is 00:46:14 as a human, take inspiration from this. And I, as an AI, have a set database with a physically pointing to a thing on the internet that belongs to somebody and where that ownership and copyright part stands. You can choose to add things or remove things from the source. There's a physical link to a specific thing. I think ultimately, in a perfect world where the AI would suck on this,

Starting point is 00:46:38 is that the database is voluntary or paid for. But I think that database is a fraction, fraction, fraction of the size of what the database potentially is i also don't know what these databases are pulling from this is we're all speculating but i would just i'm going to go off the assumption of it's just the internet everything it's some collection that they put together because they've taken a lot of things out because obviously dolly doesn't want it to create certain things so it's taken a lot of

Starting point is 00:47:04 things out of the inspiration and it's taken a lot of things out of things that will hopefully create so they have some curation or control over the sources they just don't like tell us what that is yeah it's all it's it's a weird area i i think my ultimate do you have anything else more you want to say i kind of have like a closing thought on my... Yeah, I guess I just think, I think as I like to draw the line towards the future and see how far forward I can look at it. And it feels like as AI gets more and more complicated and nuanced and impressive,

Starting point is 00:47:35 it will become more and more feeling like human brain type of thing. Oh, that scares the shit out of me. And then you really kind of do compare it to like how humans draw inspiration from things there will be more explicit inspiration where it's like oh i want to if i'm going to draw a picture of andrew with a nascar jersey on i'm going to give him the haas one because that seems like it would work but i think there will be more subtle inspiration like what fabrics you use or

Starting point is 00:48:00 what colors that are just like i kind of like this color because I grew up liking red like that. How do you even examine what to give credit to? That will always be, I think, a fuzzy line. Yeah, I definitely agree. I would say my final thought maybe is a bit different than yours. And I want to go back to something Hassan said, which is just in this AI world, one thing we're losing is the human aspect of it, which is just kind of more of a passion and a feeling behind things. And I think all this AI stuff is really, really cool. And I see it as a tool for the future. A lot of things, there are people who aren't as artistically talented and still want to

Starting point is 00:48:39 be able to get a vision out there sometimes. And I think that could help with this to then pass off to the designers and artists that are good at stuff like that that's what I see it and and ultimately when I see these I think they're cool and then I forget about them whereas like I love buying prints and stuff from artists that I find all over the place because I think they're super talented and really beautiful and there's just something behind it that gives me a much more interested feeling and i enjoy looking at it over and over again i would never buy anything from any of these ai things and hang them on my wall because there's no journey behind it yeah whereas i know that it came from a

Starting point is 00:49:16 human exactly like there's so much more to that in just the overall enjoyment of a piece so that's why i see this as a tool and i don't know if i hope that i think that feeling is for a lot of people but i i don't know if that's good enough for art like i think artists still rightfully should be worried about this and how it's handling things but yeah that's why i don't see it as as big of a threat to art in general okay two things on that yeah one i do agree with a lot of that and whenever i have a feeling that is like i don't think humans will want x i always have to think is that a generational thing i always just run i always just run it through that filter because i

Starting point is 00:49:59 always think like do humans want to spend all day in vr no but my nine-year-old cousin doesn't really care sometimes i do like there's there's like always a generational question so i always just toss that in there like well well younger generations like buy air and think it's totally cool maybe but the other thing is yeah it is a tool and i think that's kind of where i want to go with the video which is like as far as us as creators using AI to do things and make things, it's always a great beginning for brainstorming and coming up with the base of an idea. And then you edit it to create what you want. So every example I have of useful AI is using AI as a tool just like that, whether it's like running a picture through the ai sharpening filter in in pixel mater and

Starting point is 00:50:46 then it's not perfect but then you finish it up to look just the way you want or you use the magic eraser tool in the pixel which uses ai to like fill in the background and then there's a couple extra things you want you finish to edit on your on your own all the way up to like i don't know i just have chat gtp and i just say give me a bunch of video ideas. And I look through that list and I go, Oh, here's some good ideas. And then I pick on my own what I think makes a good idea. I could see like a perfect example would be, we want to step up smartphone awards set and you want to show Brandon something cool. You can then quickly create some sort of visual that's 90% accurate. then brandon can actually do it whereas

Starting point is 00:51:25 yeah trying to sometimes explain what you picture in your mind is very hard and i am not talented to be able to show that at all yeah so like something like that is how i i see this folding out at least in my what i would plan to so one of my favorite examples is the combo where someone wanted some inspiration for something so they asked chat gpt for some descriptions of interesting sets and then they took what the chat spit out and put it into dolly and had dolly mock up those sets so out of completely nowhere this person just wanted some feelings for some inspirations for some sets. And they got like a bunch of high resolution images of some sets just completely come up with from AI. Technically inspired by humans, but like that person will go on to create their own set using the tools of AI as the baseline for their inspiration. That's the basic thing that I think I find most useful with all these AI tools isn't that kind

Starting point is 00:52:26 of limiting though like you're limiting yourself to what the AI can picture I don't think so I think I think it's more of a beginning to the rest especially when I'm asking for help like that I'm already like pulling for my own and not really finding something so I'm like all right I want to I want a couple inspirations for like modern sets i've seen some modern sets but let's see some modern sets with quasar tubes and i just type that into dolly and then i get oh what if we put all the lights like horizontal let me just like giving us ideas and then we take it from there and i think that's like a legitimate use for it so i think that's probably what i'm gonna use it for yeah i can see i think this is a complicated topic that i'm excited to see the video on and if anyone else would like to chime in here,

Starting point is 00:53:07 I would love to hear what other people think. Our Discord channel or comments on YouTube, both of them, great places to chat about this. And we'd love to read that before we dive into this video, I think. Yeah, yeah. So we'd appreciate that. Before we take a quick break,

Starting point is 00:53:21 we do have to do another trivia question. All right. So Adam has bestowed me with the enormous privilege of doing two trivia questions today. So let's kick it off. In 2017, Dara Khosrowshahi became Uber's second CEO. What was he the CEO of before? All right, into the break. Miami Metro catches killers, and they say it takes a village to race one. Anyone knows how powerful urges can be?

Starting point is 00:54:08 It's me. Catch Dexter Morgan in a new serial killer origin story. Hunger inside of you. It needs a master. Featuring Patrick Gibson, Christian Slater, special guest star, Sarah Michelle Gellar with Patrick Denzi and Michael C.

Starting point is 00:54:21 Hall as Dexter's inner voice. I wasn't born a killer. I was made. Dexter's inner voice. I wasn't born a killer. I was made. Dexter, Original Sin, new series now streaming, exclusively on Paramount+, a mountain of entertainment. Support for the show today comes from NetSuite. Anxious about where the economy is headed? You're not alone. If you ask nine experts, you're likely to get ten different answers.

Starting point is 00:54:40 So unless you're a fortune teller and it's perfectly okay that you're not, nobody can say for certain. So that makes it tricky to future- proof your business in times like these. That's why over 38,000 businesses are already setting their future plans with NetSuite by Oracle. This top rated cloud ERP brings accounting, financial management, inventory, HR, and more onto one unified platform, letting you streamline operations and cut down on costs. With NetSuite's real time insights and forecasting tools, you're not just managing your business, you're anticipating its next move. You can close the books in days, not weeks, and keep your focus forward on what's coming next. Plus, NetSuite has compiled insights about how AI and machine learning may affect your business

Starting point is 00:55:17 and how to best seize this new opportunity. So you can download the CFO's Guide to AI and Machine Learning at netsuite.com slash waveform. The guide is free to you at netsuite.com slash waveform. netsuite.com slash waveform. All right, we're back. I got one last little quick thing I want to do, which is the last video that I put up, which was my tech hot takes video. I inevitably knew I would be ruffling some feathers with my different levels of hot takes.

Starting point is 00:55:43 What I wanted to do was rank how hot it turns out my takes were based on the reactions I saw. I had four. You had four? Okay. Four hot takes. I'll give them a ranking after you. Is that, you're ranking them one through four or you're just going to give it like a zero to a hundred, a Scoville score. Let's do that. Yeah. Scoville score. Zero to a hundred. I'll agree. Okay. So my first take was that TikTok and YouTube hundred i'll agree okay so my first take was uh that tiktok and youtube will coexist this is not my first take this is my least hot take tiktok and youtube will coexist because there's such different use cases that people will just spend their time on each platform and it's fine uh this met a tiny bit of pushback because people said that they're spending a little bit less time on YouTube and more on TikTok,

Starting point is 00:56:25 but I generally still stand by the fact that they will coexist. I'm giving this a ranking of 35 out of 100. This is a cold take, I think. I think this is, yeah, I think that's totally reasonable. I would argue shorts almost feel different than TikTok while still being short form content. TikTok to me feels more meme-y

Starting point is 00:56:46 and quick hits where youtube shorts feels a little more like a good discoverability platform for main channels main channels are still the focus on short cycles yeah tiktok you don't have that other extra thing behind like what people are trying to help you find on tiktok uh yeah i'm giving it a 35 not that hot 10 30 10 scov 35 Scovilles? 35 out of 100 Scovilles possible. All right. That puts us, you know, in between a bell pepper and a banana pepper. So let's turn up the heat here. Okay.

Starting point is 00:57:12 If we want to use a real Scoville scale, let's go zero to 100,000. I have the Scovilles whole chart in front of me. I mean, it gets to like absurd, like million plus Scoville. A hundred is less than a jalapeno, right? Like a hundred's nothing. Yes. A hundred thousand, I mean. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Starting point is 00:57:28 Sorry. I was good. Yeah. A hundred thousand's a pretty good. A hundred thousand? That's pretty hot. That's scotch bonnet. Exactly scotch bonnet.

Starting point is 00:57:36 Well played. Thank you, Sean Evans. So let's go zero to a hundred thousand. Okay. That was a 35. Cool. That was a 35. Okay.

Starting point is 00:57:43 Bell pepper. Yeah. That was a piece of paper. Yeah. Not that 35. Cool. That was a 35. Okay, bell pepper. Yeah, that was a piece of paper. Yeah, not that hot. Okay, my next hottest take was that 5G sucks, mostly because most people agreed with me. 5G is just not good. I think there was like one use case that I saw it in,

Starting point is 00:57:58 and I believe New York has pretty decent 5G apparently. So if you live in a developed city near a tower, It's not millimeter wave though. It's C-band? Yeah, mid-band. Yeah, mid-band is like pretty solid. And that is so niche. And yeah, I guess if you're in a city, that's awesome.

Starting point is 00:58:19 So if you are a podcast listener in one of the like hundred countries that's not New Yorkork city you probably would agree that 5g is pretty bad would you argue that if i change that sentence to um if your parents ask you if they should upgrade to 5g you should say no is that just not is that the coldest take ever now yes it's just a fact it's just a fact. It's just a fact. Okay, cool. If your parents are like, hi, I'm choosing between these two phones

Starting point is 00:58:49 and I'm deciding if I should pick the one with 5G or not, you could just say, yeah, save your money, mom and dad. Not worth it right now. Ellis looks mad at me saying that. Do any phones not have 5G? Thanks to carriers, that's actually a really good point. Thanks to carriers, most phones have 5G. And they're all more expensive and all the plans are more expensive and all the battery lives are all worse

Starting point is 00:59:08 and they get hotter and they get hotter and and it's like for what for what yeah i can't you might be right there was a moment though where i know like verizon was trying to upgrade people into the 5g plan and like whether they had a 5g phone or not i know my mom texted me asking if she should do that. I was like, no. Yeah, don't do it. So on the Scoville scale, I'm putting 5G sucks only because there are people in New York who would disagree. I'm putting this at 1,000.

Starting point is 00:59:34 Yeah, I'll go like, sure. I will go there because I know there are people who disagree. No point of me is excited about 5G for another five years at least. Same. Every time I see a new 5G for another five years, at least. Same. Every time I see a new 5G denomination in my status bar, I do a speed test and it's like 600 kilobits per second. And I'm like, what is happening? And you've lost 5% battery in that time?

Starting point is 00:59:54 No, no, this is good. All right. So that puts us at a Poblano. Poblano. So a tiny little bit of spice. That's a good, I like that number. Okay. I had two more.

Starting point is 01:00:04 Second to highest, nobody cares about panel gaps real people don't care about panel gaps customers who are buying teslas are not actually asking or caring about panel gap this is something we've talked about a hundred times on this episode this one got real pushback i think the wording of it makes sense. I think it makes it seem just like people don't notice it or that they can't be like... It feels like you're telling them they're not allowed to be upset. I know that's not what you're saying,

Starting point is 01:00:37 but that's what it sounds like when you put that. Therefore, I think the take is hot. Interesting. I do agree with you that it is on a bottom of the list aspect of things. And I think that happens in a lot of things. And I just, when I hear that sentence, it makes it feel like we can just forget about panel gaps. And I think it's still something that Tesla needs to severely improve on. Yeah. I had to break that down in the video, of course, after the title of the hot take, I'm like, here's what I'm actually saying.

Starting point is 01:01:09 But I did sort of end it with like, all right could you could have a car dropped in your driveway tomorrow a tesla model y or a what a mustang mach-e and you can trade the panel gaps on the model y for something from the mach-e what do you pick what do you want from the mach-e anything the software the performance the tires the sunroof anything the ceo and like it's it's pretty far down the list so i'm like yeah most people who are buying a model y or a model 3 or model s it's pretty low on the list but there are plenty of people whose pushback was simply i care about panel gaps i mean we individually care and a lot of people who work actually for tesla did chime in say a surprising amount of people actually refuse delivery or at least bring up the panel gap i think the thing that also is is they're variable the funny thing about it the

Starting point is 01:01:55 worst panel gap i've ever seen on a tesla was the model y that they lent us for a video as a review unit was in terrible shape it was the hood felt like half an inch underneath the gap to the front bumper it looked like it had an underbite and you could see it from every single angle and i and the spoiler was half falling off the spoiler was yeah i don't even know if that's a panel gap or just like a glue issue but well there was also parts inside the car that were like the the headliner was kind of peeling off it was just a poorly early model y so yeah yeah that was one where like i kept thinking to myself if i wanted to buy a nice car the best part about a nice car is that like parking it taking 10 steps and turning around and being like oh i own that that's really cool i will i will i will only

Starting point is 01:02:40 adjust your statement a little bit buying anying an expensive car. Yeah, sorry. Like, well, you know, my impresa, I wasn't doing that very often. The number one piece of feedback I heard was if I spent that much money on a car, I would care about panel caps. That's the main argument. I think that's a solid argument. And I still think your argument rings true to it, as in there's so many other things in

Starting point is 01:03:05 it that are better than other cars in comparison but like if you were to buy an eighty thousand dollar mercedes and saw that you'd be much more upset for whatever reason the stigma behind it on why you're buying that car if i'm buying an eighty thousand dollar mercedes i'm probably looking for certain luxury things, certain comfort things, and I don't care about performance as much. So I'm not mad when it's the slowest one. How about this? Then all of the people though, who like to as well say like, well, Tesla is just as nice as a Mercedes or Tesla is just as nice to that. They need to wake up and realize that in the quality control aspect of things, they are dead wrong.

Starting point is 01:03:44 It's worse. It's just worse. I'm just saying like- Make your argument realistically. Yeah. If you line up a bunch of cars for the same price, I might decide to buy a Land Rover because I want to off-road. I'm not mad that it's slow.

Starting point is 01:03:57 And people are like, well, for $80,000, it should be fast. Well, that's your opinion on what you want in a car. So again, you line up your priorities. I'm giving my take. Tesla customers don't care about panel gaps i'm giving that a 24 000 not even i'll go i'll go 40 000 okay i think it's a bit hotter just because of the fact that we had to explain it that much in turn means it was hotter the hotness of the not yeah trying not to get dumped on by everybody can i just say ellis has like 1500 tabs open just now so as you guys are wrapping up he's like frantically switching tabs looking for this

Starting point is 01:04:37 have you found the scoville scale i did yeah yeah you know i'm constantly like researching and googling and fact-checking and stuff while we're doing this, but it gets a little out of hand. What was the Scoville number? It was between like 25 and 40. 25 to 40,000. Like habanero? No, no, no, no.

Starting point is 01:04:54 We're nowhere close. Really? That puts us sort of in the cayenne pepper, Thai pepper range. Or if you have enough of it, it's hot. No, no, no. I take that back. Tabasco cayenne is where that puts us. The real aspect might be what makes that hot as well

Starting point is 01:05:08 because then people who do care about it feel like... They don't buy it. It feels like the truth about or the contrarian take of like, well, everyone else is lying to you and I'm going to tell you the real deal about it. So I think that's what also creates the hotness. Yeah, I guess the longer and more detailed take is people who choose to buy Teslas

Starting point is 01:05:31 aren't buying it for the build quality. That's the longer version of it. It doesn't quite ring a blow quite as well. Yeah, not as hot, not as spicy for sure. The number one hottest take is that crypto is just gambling. I agree 100%. A shocking amount of people found massive offense to this. Now, I wouldn't say it's a majority. I still think most people would agree, and especially in the wake of what happened with FTX and what happens with Bitcoin every couple of months.

Starting point is 01:05:59 We kind of are on the same page that most of the time when people are talking about crypto they're talking about investing to try to make money and that's to me mostly gambling because the difference between investing in a company that is public that has value that makes products who you can who you can assess based on those products like Like if I see Apple comes out with a new product and then I go, that's a good product. They're offering more value to the world. They're more valuable. I will buy their stock. Their stock price goes up because of it. That makes sense. That is not gambling to me. It makes sense. When someone buys crypto, especially when it's not Bitcoin, and there's just like a rampant speculation about

Starting point is 01:06:46 the price might go up because who knows. And it doesn't really ever present any utility other than it's a new crypto and it maybe has some new fringe feature, but no one's ever going to adopt it. And then the price goes up or down. Hey, you should put your money in. To me, that is just a slot machine. And I have no problems leaning on that take pretty heavily because it just keeps getting proved true um but a lot of people uh in the crypto space i think generally take issue with any negative sentiment about crypto because they want it to be the future i will all talk like listen i don't i do not know i don't want to get this one i'll be honest i a lot of times i feel like the stock market is gambling as well i don't even but

Starting point is 01:07:32 but i don't know i don't whatever yeah um i mean i have a 401k i guess but like other than that i don't invest really in anything which i'm sure a lot of people will tell me i'm a moron for but whatever um i think my only dogecoin i do i do think crypto and we've talked about this with nfts also is like the gambling aspect of it is the the most headline grabbing because somebody's people selling an nft for 69 million dollars is it a headline like people making tons of money when they invested 30 in bitcoin in 2007 and now they're multi-millionaires because of what it's done yeah is a headline there is stuff on the blockchain

Starting point is 01:08:12 that's actually interesting and we've talked about it before and just like fully there is some technology there that's really cool but i would argue the majority of crypto stuff that gets flooded into my twitter that i still haven't muted somehow is probably more gambling aspect stuff so like listen there there's some stuff back there but i i most of the stuff i see feels like gambling for sure it feels similar to the 5g take in some ways because there is a subset of people who are like i pay for things with. I use crypto all the time. It has real application. Well, I'm sure. I mean, there are some companies who accept Bitcoin,

Starting point is 01:08:51 and there are some bodegas in New York City that accept Bitcoin. I am not one of those people who has ever bought anything with Bitcoin ever. I think that's most people, and I think most people who do buy Bitcoin never intend to buy anything with the Bitcoin. Most people who buy crypto, Ethereum, Dogecoin, any other random coins or tokens that seem to have some random spur of the moment flash in the pan value are not intending to use it for anything other than to sell it later to some sucker and make some money off of it gambling it's and it's insanely more prevalent right now with just all the rug pull schemes that happen and i don't want to like discredit maybe some of them the better ones but like there are so many things staining the atmosphere and yeah and crypto in general is just has a permanent stain on it that i don't think i'll ever be able to shake whether that's

Starting point is 01:09:39 it's the creator's fault of that or not it's happened even nfts like get looped into crypto because of obviously what they're based on but like i love artists being able to be properly credited for their work long after they make the piece of art that also makes a lot of sense i also think it would be cool if the deed of my house one day was actually an nft and after i made that video i got a company that reached out and said you can actually do that now and i was like cool but i'm not gonna do it no i'm not gonna do it no like i agree i i was thinking this morning like i don't know where my birth certificate is if it was on the blockchain that would be way easier and that's the boring stuff in there somewhere in the future will happen future generations maybe yeah so cool thanks for

Starting point is 01:10:19 listening to the cancel the waveform post episode the comments are going to be spicy I have to give this one closer to like an 80 80,000 on the hot take on the spice scale because of your veracity that I was disagreed with if we're judging by veracity I think you've broken the scale I'll go yeah yeah 90 90

Starting point is 01:10:39 K yeah that's pretty good we're firmly in Thai pepper range nice spicy spicy cool like it sweet what is the ghost pepper out of curiosity like 300 000 or something uh 800 900 000 it can go up to a million damn yeah i didn't have any takes that spicy it's hard to make a taste that yannis yannis is the best power forward of all time. I think that isn't... I've said more insane things about basketball in this room. We'll figure it out.

Starting point is 01:11:10 Yeah, I think that's true. It might be true. My hottest take is Google Chrome is going to be gone soon. Soon? Yep, I say five years. You said five years, right? Five years. That I have a hard time seeing.

Starting point is 01:11:21 That's my hottest. What's taking over, Internet Explorer? It's not out yet. Whatever's taking over internet explorer it's not out yet whatever it's taking over is not something is going to kill chrome in five years and will kill chrome that is a spicy take someone's investing in something over there there's a lot of moms and dads who just fire up whatever their kids tell them which is just gonna take forever to kill there's also a lot of moms and dads who don't have any available RAM. That's fair. That's fair. And with that, we'll move on to trivia.

Starting point is 01:11:49 Oh, do you want to be red? Trivia time. Look at my camera. Usually I'm the Chevron. Oh. So now we swapped. Boom. All right.

Starting point is 01:11:59 What's the question? I forgot. Oh, right. That's my job. Yeah. So question number one, what is the name of the European Science Center where both the Higgs boson was discovered and the World Wide Web was invented? And I'll accept the name of the center or the country it's in. And if you want to go for both, I'll give you a little two pointer.

Starting point is 01:12:19 You'll get two. Okay. Just to make David even more behind you guys. Oh, man. Who wants to reveal first? too okay just to make David even more behind you guys oh man I'm this was very gut feeling I just wrote down what I felt in my gut I think I might have overcooked the questions this week a little bit so I'll that second one is tough all right yeah I got an answer. You got an answer? Oh, I think you're right. I think you're right on... I think you're right on Switzerland. I think I'm right on Switzerland. I just wrote Large Hadron Collider.

Starting point is 01:12:53 Same. But I don't think that's the name of the science center. Same. Yeah. And I wrote CERN because I think it's at or around CERN. And I don't remember what CERN stands for. That name sounds correct. Is that it? CERN. And I don't remember what CERN stands for. That name sounds correct. Is that it?

Starting point is 01:13:06 So, okay. So it's called CERN, not the Large Hadron Cluster. Sorry, Andrew. I was pretty sure. That's fine. It is on the border of France and Switzerland. I'll give you that.

Starting point is 01:13:16 Each of you guys get one point. Okay, that's fair. Together, we are scientists. Together, we overcome David. All right, on the border. That's solid. CERN, good job with that. The minute you turned that, I was like, yeah, that sounds familiar.

Starting point is 01:13:32 I saw Switzerland. I was like, yeah. Do you know what CERN stands for? No. I was trying to think. I don't remember. It's in French. There's no reason you would know.

Starting point is 01:13:38 Oh, is E for European at all? Yeah, but the French word for European, which is still kind of European. Yeah, yeah. What does it stand for? I'm trying to do that. You're really asking a lot of me today. It's French. It's more French.

Starting point is 01:13:51 There we go. Not even. Nope, not even. Go for it. I'll Google it. I'll try it. I'll try to cancel myself live on it. My girlfriend speaks pretty fluent French, so if she ever listens to this, I would never

Starting point is 01:14:02 live it down. So I'm just going to pass it on to you. CERN. Conseil Européen pour la recherche nucléaire. That is the weirdest translation. The Center for European Research

Starting point is 01:14:18 of Nuclear, basically. That makes sense. I'm glad this video is so scary. Comments will be spicy. All right. The second one, I don't think I know the answer to. All right. Question number two. In 2017, Dara Khosrowshahi became Uber's second CEO. What was he the CEO of before? He? He. Does that change your answer i remember the first the first guy really messed up yeah i do remember listening to that uber pod that podcast about like the start of uber but i don't think they got into the secondary aspects of it yeah this is like the founder that made it all the way to the point where he became the villain yeah all right ready yeah turn lift felt like the obvious one but it like i don't know i

Starting point is 01:15:13 wrote hotels.com weirdly hotels.com is kind of close he was the ceo of expedia if you were gonna say i was thinking airbnb first because it just felt similar. And then Expedia Travel, I was in the hospitality range. But I didn't want to go straight to Lyft. I'm just like Uber just poaching the CEO of Lyft and him swapping over feels like it would have been a bigger story. And I would have known that. Yeah. Wow. All right.

Starting point is 01:15:38 I'm proud of Hotels.com. Pretty close. No points. No points. But pretty close. But a final score. Respectable. Marquez Andrews, Hyde No points. But pretty close. So final score. Respectable. Marquez Andrews tied at 15.

Starting point is 01:15:47 David has nine. Let's give him eight. Okay, David has eight. David's very competitive, so we like to mess with him. Well, we went over for sure, but that's a long, excellent episode of Wave Forum. Welcoming everyone back by just talking our faces off. thanks for sticking with us thanks for listening thanks for watching thanks for subscribing thanks for watching the clips thanks for hanging around catch you guys very soon in the next one waveform is produced by ellis rovan and adam molina we are partnered

Starting point is 01:16:20 with vox media podcast network and our intro outro music was created by Vane Sill. That outro may have been AI. Take care.

Waveform: The MKBHD Podcast - Creative AI: Should we be Worried?

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