Waveform: The MKBHD Podcast - Galaxy Tab S8 Ultra Impressions and OnePlus' First Folding Phone!

Episode Date: February 25, 2022

Marques and Andrew give some first impressions on the new Samsung Galaxy Tab S8 Ultra before talking about a JerryRigEverything video where Zack cracks a OnePlus 10 Pro in half. They wrap up with a discussion about YouTube subscribers and whether or not they even matter in the age of algorithms. This is a quirky one with some good insights sprinkled throughout! Links: JerryRigEverything OnePlus 10 Pro video: https://bit.ly/3veysx7 JerryRigEverything Humvee video: https://bit.ly/3HjqWnd Twitters: https://twitter.com/wvfrm https://twitter.com/mkbhd https://twitter.com/andymanganelli https://twitter.com/adamlukas17 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/wvfrmpodcast/ Shop the merch: shop.mkbhd.com Join the Discord: https://discord.gg/mkbhd Music by 20syl: https://bit.ly/2S53xlC Waveform is part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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or concerns about your gambling or someone close to you, please contact Connex Ontario at 1-866-531-2600 to speak to an advisor free of charge. BetMGM operates pursuant to an operating agreement with iGaming Ontario. All right, what's going on, everybody? Welcome back to another episode of the Wayform Podcast. We're your hosts. I'm Marques. And I'm'm andrew and in today's episode we've got a bunch to talk about we've got samsung's beefy new tablet over here the s8 ultra we're going to talk about this we also want to talk about youtube subscribers and

if they're still worth anything and also we'll get into zach jerry everything snapping a phone in half but first we interrupt the regular programming to talk about daft punk we just like daft punk interrupt our regular programming at the studio really messed and had us all glued to our screens um i it was kind of funny actually this unfolded a little bit before the announcement because i remember it was maybe like three or four days ago madian on his instagram story had a picture of a Daft Punk frisbee. And I just replied like fire emoji and just like a random piece of merch that he had or whatever. Yeah.

And then last night or the night before, I guess, this launched, Austin just randomly tweeted, I miss Daft Punk. Exactly. And so this was all sort of just happening in the background. I'm just thinking about Daft Punk. And then out of nowhere a daft punk twitter account is born and tweets yeah some album art from uh the homework album yeah from 1997 and we're all kind of like what this is and it was like it was a brand new account

and it doesn't follow anybody it wasn't even verified when it first tweeted and so we're trying to figure out is this just honestly what i thought was i thought daft punk finally retired the twitter account and some lucky person just got it yeah and started tweeting and trolling everybody but immediately it's trending there's an official daft punk.com website the instagram account lights up it starts sharing images it's giving us throwback vibes um and then they tweeted twitch link well they tweeted another picture first that was just like the i don't know if it was the poster or something from some concert in 97 it was like the tour poster yeah um and people started freaking out about that yeah and i think there was like i mean internally we saw that and then we saw maddie on posting and

all of us were like imagine if maddie opened for right we thought maddie was in on it we thought he knew that daft punk was coming back and he was gonna like be part of it with them how great would that french duo or trio end up on stage that would be amazing but that's not what happened we got our hopes up at least that high that's not what happened uh We got our hopes up at least that high. That's not what happened. They tweeted Twitch link, which was a countdown timer. And when the timer went up, it was uninterrupted footage of a 1997 concert, actually before they started wearing helmets. Yeah, I thought it was interesting.

So a super OG original performance from Daft Punk. And they ended up re-releasing a sort of remastered version of the Homework album from 1997. 25th anniversary edition. I thought that was pretty cool. I wish they were touring again, but that's a whole nother story. At least it's not an NFT.

A lot of people thought it was going to be an NFT and it wasn't. That was a relief. I was, I, there was a brief thought for a minute in my head that we were going to see a Daft Punk NFT and I would not know how to feel about that. Would you buy an NFT of the, it was the silver robot that exploded, right?

Yeah. You know, the closest I ever got to wanting to buy an NFT was a piece of Daft Punk art, actually. It was Justin Mahler, right? It was Justin Mahler. Yeah. But I haven't actually bought any NFTs or really gotten involved very much. But obviously I have my eye on them. They're on Twitter all the time.

I was like, if Daft Punk gets into it, that's gonna be crazy but it wasn't it was just a little innocent little remaster of an old album so that was cool and you've been listening to it i you know it's funny so i listened to it on the way home that day in my car and i i'm very familiar with pretty much daft punk's entire body of work and so I'm listening to it in the car and I'm like, oh, this does sound different. This does sound really good. Like this got this new spatial mix or whatever. I'm feeling like, oh, the bass is a little bit less distorted. It's a little tighter.

I'm very into the difference here. But then I pulled it up on Spotify today, this morning at work, and I was going to play for you the difference between the two. And I played them, and I couldn't hear a difference. You looked like you were having a mental breakdown. And I'm freaking out because I'm like, I know I heard a difference last night. It sounded very different.

And now I'm playing the original homework album back-to-back with the remastered homework album, and they sound exactly the same to me. And I'm listening on the Yamaha speakers and the hd 650s and it turned out basically my car is introducing like the stereo mix this is just what tesla does they just have like a standard amount of stereo separation they just create among their speakers and uh so it was on by default i had to swipe it down to off to have it sound a little more like I expected. Okay.

But I was the victim of the placebo effect for sure last night because I was jamming. I thought this was all brand new stuff. But it's good. I still enjoyed, you know, I got a little throwback out of it. You'll have to listen. I'm sure there's some things

that sound a little different. I bet. You hear remastered songs every once in a while and just because you're so used to something, even if it does sound better or a little more full, it sounds off because you've just been used to something for so long. Yeah, usually remasters, you get a little more out of it. You get a little more highlighting some things

you might not have heard before, pulling up obviously higher resolution stuff. It would be like if I remastered an old YouTube video. You'd be like, oh, this new dynamic range or it's a little more better resolution. I can't actually do that because I don't have the original footage. But anyway, that's the idea. So 25th anniversary of homework. It's in the show notes as if Daft Punk needs a shout out from me.

I will put the helmet on. I think they're doing a. Oh, we forgot to do that. I was going to do that. We'll do our clips out or something. That's a great idea. That's a great idea. I think they're doing a vinyl release also of it true i believe yeah so if you're into the vinyls definitely definitely grab that i also have i think everyone in the

tech world kind of saw this video but jerry rig everything has been massive lately but like it's when one of his when a phone fails spectacularly his video is like the only thing on everyone's twitter timeline in that that sense and um we had one of those happen recently he did the the one plus 10 pro yeah and he snapped that thing in half like a candy bar it was really funny because he in uh zach's intro he was talking about how it's like he was skeptical because it's a China release only phone when OnePlus never does that and he was kind of like let's see what goes wrong

and I know he does voiceovers but that was in the intro part and I was like oh man when he looked back to edit that I bet he's so happy that he said that it was ominous yeah but watching through it it just kind of does everything a normal phone does and his breakdowns.

It was like scratches at six, deeper grooves at seven, clockwork, like everything else. But then the bend test. And I also have to say, there's a lot of comments every time this happens, which isn't very often, of who's going to ever bend like this. Right. No one. No one's saying anyone's going to bend it like this. You could put it in your back pocket. You could sit on it. There are ways, though anyone's going to bend it like this. You could put it in your back pocket. You could sit on it.

There are ways, though, where a phone could break like this. And because he does it to all of his phones, when only how many have snapped in half? Three, maybe? I can think of three things that snapped in half. Three things, though. How are all of them phones? One was an iPad. One was the Legion phone.

The Legion phone was recent and snap yeah but we all thought the legion phone was going to look at that that was a weird one it was also like not built in two spots because of that yeah yeah you know the the the bend testing is funny i remember like the original the genesis of the bend test which was like the iphone 6 plus when lou you know actually it started because there were articles about people who sat on the phone and in their back pocket it bent. And that was like, oh, that's kind of funny.

Like it's a brand new phone. It's just coming out. It's bending in people's back pockets. And then Lou was smart enough to do a video where he just tested like, well, I'll try to bend this phone. I don't know if he even tried to bend any other phones, but on camera, it's got the iconic top down shot. The just bends right in half and that was like a moment of like well

that's that seems bad yeah and so we got you know bend gate apple had to fix it 6s has these reinforced pieces inside the phone um zach's been doing bend tests since around then. And I think that's the thing people point to is most phones don't bend in half when you try that. And the proof is Zach is very strong and tries really hard to bend all of these phones. So, yeah, when one of them does fail that spectacularly, you're like, well, I wasn't putting my phone in my back pocket, but it does seem kind of bad that this phone so easily failed the test they all passed. Yeah, durability-wise, it is clearly weaker than the majority of other phones that he does, and that doesn't happen to. Is that a deal breaker? If you were going to buy a phone and you saw that it failed the bend test,

would that be a deal breaker for you? I mean, if it's compared to another phone that I consider equal footing, that might just be the straw that makes a chain i i really like the one plus 10 pro in a lot of ways and i feel like if it had the right software or maybe the international version comes out and i really like it i would still use it i'd still be fine with it yeah i don't think it should severely affect and i don't use a case i just have it in my pocket true i loved when he tried to put it in the case at the end to make sure the plug was still in there. But it seems like there's a very specific reason it did it because under that giant camera bump is basically there the space for the battery.

And it's just like a clear space of nothing, a clear line across of nothing. And then it happens to be on one side, there's an antenna band. and then it happens to be on one side there's an antenna band and on the other side there's the volume rocker which is both of those things are making the rails which he also mentioned are super super thin yeah not as stable yeah so there you go i mean it's basically the same problem apple had and they had to in the next year's phone specifically add reinforcements to have thicker pieces right around those parts of the rail i think even if the the antenna band volume rocker is probably in a spot it's always going to be but antenna band and even thicker rails if you make the antenna band closer to like where the camera module is or where the

battery is so you're getting a little extra support of the internals in it yeah on something like that but yeah we all know zach strong but he it did not look hard to break that. I mean, first little bend and the whole back was splintered and shattered. And then just like he flipped it around and it was barely anything and it just folded like a- Also, the crazy thing is like he does this with his bare hands, right? So it's a glass phone. He breaks it in half. He's literally pulling glass out of his thumb as in on camera.

I've held up devices where i'm like i wonder if i could bend this in half but the second i like start to and i see the bend going i'm like no i don't want to shatter glass everywhere and get it in my hands like that doesn't seem fun this tablet which we're going to talk about in a second guarantees i could snap this in half guarantee he could snap it it's so big so at a certain point it's much taller than an ipad pro and it's thinner and he snapped the ipad pro in half. It's so big, so at a certain point, you're... It's much taller than an iPad Pro, and it's thinner, and he snapped the iPad Pro in half. I don't see what they could do structurally to make this thing survive.

But you never put it in your back pocket. Exactly. So it doesn't actually matter that much. But, yeah, that's what I'm... There's lots of phones out there that would be fascinating to try to bend in half, but I just leave it to the professionals. Maybe we should do a Studio Olympics of who can snap the most bend in half, but I just leave it to the professionals. Maybe we should do a studio Olympics of who can snap the most phones in half.

Did you snap the model phone in half and it shattered everywhere? Well, that was more dangerous because of how much less safe that crappy glass is on like a model. That was glass everywhere. It was glass? Oh, yeah.

Oh, I thought it was plastic. No, the front of it was glass. It was shattered everywhere. If you go back and watch that studio video of the phone guessing game yeah um but yeah and just real quick why we're uh top of the show and still talking about zach he's doing this like evie hummer build out yeah i've seen some of this i didn't really there's 17 videos at this point and they're insanely detailed incredibly interesting so what is he

doing because i've seen the final result videos and like sort of he's not totally it's not totally done but what is the explain what the concept is and what he's trying to accomplish here it's kind of funny when he explains the concept because he's essentially taking one of the least fuel efficient cars possible and turning it into an electric vehicle a green He called it the green machine. So it's a Humvee, so not exactly like a regular Hummer. And he explains in there that kind of the difference between a Humvee and a Hummer is like Humvee is a military vehicle that doesn't have the standard luxuries of like a regular everyday car,

like air conditioning and pretty normal stuff. I mean, it's like almost straight metal interior and there's a bunch of quirky little things going on with this is like a 5 000 pound truck is like armor truck yeah and what i also right in the beginning the way he moves into this garage is this like little armored tank roomba looking thing that he like puts his jack on and it pushes it can push like 3 000 pounds or something what a great invention but it pushes the whole hummer so it's it was really really impressive yeah um but he's been doing everything from stripping the humvee with of all the the regular like the engine and the transmission and all that stuff and then

he's replacing it with the motor from one of those vehicles that pulls airplanes essentially and then he has a bunch of batteries that i believe were from like a model 3 or something like that i'm almost positive as a tesla i don't remember the exact one wow but he's building everything um i haven't watched every single video but he gets super detailed and it's really really fascinating and i'm also really impressed by how he just like takes the camera underneath the car to like take apart all these different things it's a lot of work it's funny in the car community it is fairly common to like take a built engine and can and use like built parts and do all sorts of

custom stuff yeah that doesn't really exist in the ev world like we have i don't know if you've ever seen rich rebuilds i know of him but i don't watch him it's kind of along the same lines where it's like you realize that these car companies don't want you taking apart their cars because there's so much complexity. You have to be an electrical engineer to make a lot of this stuff work safely, whereas you had to be a mechanical engineer to do a lot of the previous generation of car stuff safely. Now, you could get good enough as an enthusiast to do the car tinkering with gas cars. Zach's demonstrating how hard it is to do it with an electric car. Rich Rebuilds did a version in reverse, actually. He took

a Tesla and has started gutting it and put a V8 in it, which is really funny. Half of it is trolling because this guy is an incredible troll, but that's the type of stuff that you realize is very rare. I think it's cool that zach's doing it it's not going to be like some like street legal production card type thing he's just doing a project yeah i'm not totally sure what the legalities of it are um yeah i wouldn't i don't think it's supposed to be street legal or

anything i mean i'm not totally sure i don't know what you would have to do to get it to be street legal um and i'm sure he talks about it in know what you would have to do to get it to be street legal um and i'm sure he talks about in one of the episodes but i've watched i watched like maybe the first five and then the last two um but highly highly suggest watching it especially now if you haven't watched it and there you want to like binge something he's getting really close to the end of it the end of it i don't want to spoil anything would be complete just complete you can drive it park it charge it i mean not just like straight like a short drive i think he wants it to be a certain i think he wants it to be like a regular daily driver i'd be curious what happens when you plug that into like an electrify america charger does it just i think it's i don't know i don't know if that's possible

yeah i'm sure he's also covered that like i said lots of episodes all of them are about 20 or 30 minutes um okay and i now that i know about all of them because he's he's been posting more recently and then i found out there were that he's been doing it since last july i believe yeah so i wish him luck zach good luck also come on the podcast yeah when you're done yeah yeah watching this i was just like zach needs to come on the podcast yeah soon sick all right let's take a quick break we'll come back we'll talk about this tablet i could snap in half With Uber Reserve, good things come to those who plan ahead. Family vacay? Reserve your ride as soon as you book your flights.

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Having someone to talk to is truly a gift, especially during the holidays. Visit BetterHelp.com to learn more and save 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp, H-E-L-P dot com. Alright, welcome back. I'm holding in my hands, for the video viewers you can see this, but for audio viewers, a Galaxy Tab S8 Ultra. I love that Samsung makes these. So, we've had Samsung tablets in the past. I've made videos about a couple of them

and they've had the Galaxy Tab S7. We've had a couple of them in the studio and made videos, but this is an Ultra for the first time. So they have a Tab S8 and they have a Tab S8 Plus. This is the Tab S8 Ultra. It is a 14 and a half, almost 15 inch screen. I'm just gonna hold up my Surface laptop next to it. It's smaller. Basically imagine a laptop screen i'm just gonna hold up my surface laptop next to it it's basically smaller basically imagine a laptop screen but just a screen so 15 inch laptop um it's about a

two and a half 2.9k by 1.8k so it's a decently high resolution but there is a lot going on here that i'm i'm curious what your thoughts are because the gold standard in the tablet world is still the ipad right yeah and this is a eleven hundred dollar tablet so it's competing with the highest end ipad the ipad pro if you were to compare it to another tablet this does a lot of things the ipad would never do so i i think it's worth at least pointing at some of those things yeah for talking about them number one uh it's huge and it's 16 by 10 which is interesting uh the ipad has always been a little closer to a square not quite a square um but it is very obvious when you're holding it that this is meant to be in landscape it doesn't really make sense to

use it like this you're holding like a clipboard yeah that's probably about the same aspect ratio i mean you could read a webpage like this, but the way things are oriented, the way the notch at the top is in the top middle, and we'll talk about the notch, and also the fingerprint reader is over here where your thumb would be. Boom.

Oh, okay. So in display fingerprint reader. Yeah, it's optical. It's not ultrasonic, but it's just made to be horizontal. For sure. So that's an interesting note. Although the power and volume rocker

feel like what it would be like if you were using it portrait. That is true, but then they're all the way at the top, which is interesting. I mean, if you were just blowing a phone up, this is about where they would be. True.

They would just be a lot bigger. Yeah. And then the port is down where the bottom would be too. So that's interesting. Yeah. But think this is this is a horizontal experience i agree because this huge screen you're what are you doing watching movies gaming i mean watching any videos really yeah uh potentially i mean multitasking on it as well yeah so that's number one uh number two is it's an oled and this is something i haven't seen an ipad yet so the ipad you know mini led we hear about all these dimming zones and that's all great

i think this looks better even though it's a slightly lower pixel density and i can kind of see a little bit of if i go i mean it's a big enough screen that's your best chance at being but if you're again if you're doing this if you're like squinting an inch away look at the text doesn't that look kind of soft it's it's a little bit to do with the resolution and a little bit of the uh yeah i see what you're talking about the pixel layout i don't know if it's pentile or what this matrix is but it does look a little soft if you but you look how close you are to it to see yeah exactly like if you're just looking at the same thing you're like that's a beautiful screen so it's a it's a huge oled and that's this is the biggest touchscreen oled i think i want to confirm that but i think it's the biggest touchscreen oled i've ever used because

we get the oled tvs but then we have lots of like mini led laptops mini led ipads this is a 15 inch oled and it looks great gets up to about 400its, a little bit dimmer than the max brightness I would have liked to have seen, but that's the downside of OLED is it doesn't get super bright, but great looking screen. So I definitely want to point that out. Expandable storage. That's great. That's nice.

Micro SD card right at the top there. That's cool. And then this pen is included for free. So it's, it's a So it's an S pen. Free, free, free, free. For free. Definitely not something Apple's doing right now with the $130 pencil. But here's the interesting thing.

It attaches two ways. One, you can attach it by a magnet to the top right there. Okay. That is like... It's reasonable. It doesn't charge there. So this is like it's reasonable it doesn't charge there so this is like you're this is like the the take the tablet off or like i was using the pen for a little bit and then i just want to leave it there for a second while i see how hard it is okay i just want to leave it

there for a second while i do one or two other things and then grab it again so that's like a short-term storage or if it's like laying down flat and you're just sliding it right on top yeah to keep it there so i gotta it's got that flat edge like the apple pencil i gotta snap it into place but the only place it actually charges it's on the back like that and this is the same as the last year uh where it's super easy to just yeah scrape it off or if you put it in a bag if you don't have a case can i see yeah why is the place it goes on specifically glossy that's just supposed to show you where it goes or oh because it's glass and can wireless is charged yeah it can't be metal so that's it's they just decided to do plastic or whatever it feels weird to have like a glossy place where the thing that's gonna like touch

on it all the time and potentially scratch it up it's gonna just constantly keep going the ipad does like a plastic matte plastic cutout you can only do it facing one way it kind of does it but you can tell it doesn't but it doesn't charge yeah oh it doesn't charge not very well you have to line it up pretty well specific spot that yeah yeah because when you do that i've seen animation it's nice click it's nice click so that's one thing i don't know if you know the ipad kind of has the same problem where like you slap you slap the Apple Pencil on the side and it can just fall off at any point. Here's Samsung's solution.

This is half of their book keyboard case. There's an attachable keyboard. The other half is just, like, imagine a magnetic folio that slaps to the back that has a dent in it that just holds the pencil to the back of the tablet. And essentially, like, has its own little flap a dent in it that just holds the uh the pencil to the back of the tablet and essentially like has its own little um flap so that you can open up for the pencil without taking the whole thing off of it's like a little hidden compartment except it's not hidden because it looks really

obvious from the back yeah it's just a a little bulge holding the pen in there do you know who i think has done this the best microsoft they have the the keyboard that goes in the bottom that's the front cover for it and at the top of the keyboard it just basically folds onto itself and creates its own little hinge and hides the pencil in there right and then it doesn't feel like this huge bump on the back it's just kind of like well you almost don't notice it because when the keyboard's up it just props it up a little tiny bit and then the pencil's hidden i do like that a lot the problem with that is you can't use that without the keyboard thing yeah if you well i guess they're assuming you're using the keyboard

as like you're just playing cover but if you don't want to bring your keyboard then yeah you've lost yeah i like that this accessory you can use half of it true and you can use this little kickstand right here and dave made a video about this tablet already. We're working on our full video right now. But something he said in the video, which I thought was really interesting and very true, is a tablet this big, you aren't using it, holding it most of the time. Like it's got this split keyboard that I keep using because I'm typing while holding it. But I actually found most of the time I use it, I've set it down somewhere. And I'm either watching something or I have a website

pulled up. I've got whatever, Amazon, whatever videos. And so I just use the regular keyboard. And so I've got this little kickstand here and it just pops up like that. And then that's how I use it most of the time. I don't think I've taken my iPad out of the folio in years. Like I just, just sits constantly in that folio case. No, I do like this little, this little kickstand is nice cause it's not adding a lot of bulk to the back of it. Yeah. But yeah, being able to-

It's also the thinnest tablet I've ever seen. So you can add like a thick case and it's totally fine. It's a good hinge on this too for how thin it is. Yeah. Now- Oh man, I keep slamming it on the desk. It still has the optional keyboard accessory that I'll hold up for our video viewers here.

It's got a trackpad. It's got some pins and some magnets and it slaps on. This has the same problem that the Surface and the iPad Pro have, which is that the top is heavier than the bottom. So when you try to use it like a laptop, it's all flopping around because all of the weight, it's like top heavy basically. So you have to use the bottom. So when you try to use it like a laptop, it's all flopping around because all of the weight, it's like top heavy basically.

So you have to use the back. Yeah, so. Oh, you have to use the stand you're saying? You have to use the stand. So if I were to use this kind of like a regular laptop like this, there's no strength to this hinge at all. You're just holding it. You're almost, so like,

because now you're putting it up a little higher and the way the kickstand on the back of the folio works is it's only as long as the actual tablet is when you bring it up you almost have to be using this at like 120 degrees you almost can't get it up at like 90 yeah because now the the tab or the kickstand isn't tall enough and it's messing it up yeah and it falls over exactly so i you know it's kind of cool you can have yeah the laptop setup is like a nice option it's got dex built in there's a quick keyboard shortcut switches in a dex mode it looks great but yeah biggest problem with this that i think a tablet needs to solve and kind of the ipad magic did it

was it the magic folio or whatever? What do they call it? With the keyboard? That like floated and was supposed to feel more. You can't put this on your lap. When this is on your lap, it can't stand up because it needs a hard surface behind it for the kickstands to support.

Yeah. So because of this, which is how I use my laptop so often is it can't just use it right in my lap which is a pain and i don't know how you use your laptop in your lap a lot when i'm using a laptop yeah i'm i guess it depends on the size of the machine uh i hardly use my laptop in my actual lap anymore i usually just carry it between tables and put it on a table i think there's times where i'll take it and i'd like to like be watching tv and doing something quick on my laptop or or something like that and

then i'd like to sit on my couch yeah lean back rather than like or like put it on the couch next to you yeah yeah i don't think this would do great on a couch next to you either it'd be real floppy yeah yeah that's the downside but i guess we should talk about the notch i'll just i'll just bring up the notch real quick i think this notch is the easiest non-issue of any notch it's a tiny notch smaller than the iphone's notch on a huge screen yeah 15 inch screen and it's holding two cameras right now the standard 4k webcam and an ultra wide 4k webcam i really like these these are really good qualityk webcam and an ultra wide 4k webcam. I really like these. These are really good quality webcams. The ultra wide has this follow feature that works.

Okay. It's not very responsive, but it works. Um, so I like that it has an ultra wide webcam. They're both too big to fit in these super thin bezels. So it's got a little tiny notch. I think it doesn't matter at all. Totally fine. I'm curious what you think, looking at it.

My biggest issue and it wouldn't be solved by putting the notch on the top in portrait mode, was just like at one point in one orientation when you're holding this, it's wrong. So like I kind of think back to the what was it? The was it the second me mix ultra that had the cut out camera in the bottom corner? Oh, yeah. Like I almost wonder what this would look like if there's just a little black space in this corner to have an extra camera in the bottom corner. Oh yeah. Like I almost wonder what this would look like if there's just a little black space in this corner to have an extra camera or the two cameras.

And then when you're holding it in portrait, it's just like in a corner based on portrait and landscape. I guess the only thing about a corner webcam is that no matter what orientation you're in, the webcam is off center and you're not really looking at it. So like if you're on a video call and it's like this, this is the best place for a camera for it to be up here yeah but if i put it over to

the side like on the ipad you're constantly looking over to the side of the webcam and it never really looks like you're looking at the camera that's like kind of annoying and i guess that's why i want the ipads to shift to this spot a corner would just always be off so i think i think that they did i i mean that's like very very nitpicky i don't think it's that bad one thing that i find really interesting with samsung as a tablet and just samsung phones in general and and it makes more sense to me on a tablet is their dex features like getting closer to this where like this does feel pretty close to a laptop in all of this and like how chromebooks are so much more i don't know what you're oh you're trying to turn dex on okay um like chromebooks are becoming so much popular because we're realizing

as people so many average users are just using for websites and emails and stuff and youtube and whatever like this probably is more powerful than a chromebook and if you can just dock it into a station this feels it's android but a chromebook is chrome os so like both of them are kind of losing so powerful you mean uh software wise i mean suffer for what you're doing yeah like both of these a Chromebook and this can handle web browsing YouTube yeah emails absolutely no problem yeah uh yeah that's a good point I mean the the base I don't know I'm thinking like you know similar price range if you got a thousand dollar Chromebook you'd have more you'd have more power Chromebook is ridiculous but you're still doing the same stuff it's just a web browser right you know, I'm using this tablet and it to me still feels like a big tablet.

So like the Instagram experience isn't great. The SoundCloud app isn't really good. Like the columns in Gmail are pretty decent, but like my to-do list app doesn't take advantage of the space. Like it's not great, but it's fine. You get your windowed apps in Dex mode, which is cool. But yeah, i guess it does

have a similar level of productivity to a chromebook plus any extras that happen to work well with android on a tablet yeah like if you're a journalist or you know a writer or something like that and then this is really easy for you to lug around and take down some quick notes or draw some stuff up like in an uber ride and then when you go home and you're ready to really bang out an article and you need to uh like use your normal keyboard because typing a whole article on this keyboard would probably be pretty brutal then you can plug in your mouse and keyboard and have a monitor that maybe is a little more oriented for correct posture something like that a little more ergonomically correct and that seems kind of neat yeah i'm not an artist but i can you can scribble i can scribble for

i can scribble for days i'm also just like not a tablet person oh so it's like hard for me to really see who like who's fully taking control of this but the more and more i look at tablets the more and more i'm realizing they're at this part where there are people who don't do as many things on the computer and that probably could super benefit from this. And someone who travels, like this would be awesome. That's the one time I consistently see myself being like, I wish I had a tablet, is watching movies like on the plane.

Yeah, that's a good question of like, I don't know if I should, maybe we can put some of this in the plane. Yeah, that's a good question of like, I don't know if I should, maybe we can put some of this in the review, but what is the ideal workflow and like set of devices to have? Because I think there's a lot of people who have a really good computer and a decent phone and that's all they need. A tablet in the middle wouldn't make sense.

There's also a group of people who has a really good phone and that's all they need. A tablet in the middle wouldn't make sense. There's also a group of people who has a really good phone and like an okay computer because the phone can do so much and it's got a big screen and it can do all kinds of tablet stuff that you don't really need a tablet there. And so there's a bunch of people who have like a phone they don't like as much or a tablet or a computer they don't like as much, but if they got a tablet that they really liked,

it could do kind of both in a way. It could have the app experience. You could do the email, social media, watching videos, but also you could put a keyboard on it and start answering emails in like a long form type of way and like really do some serious productivity stuff. But I don't think anybody needs a good phone, a good tablet and a good computer.

So there's always like a balancing. I would always, which one do you want i would say if this is your main thing a computer is probably not something you're taking everywhere with you and the person in that i would say that happens is someone who travels a lot and is still taking phone calls so no matter how good their phone is yes you can multitask on phone but no one likes to really do that much work on their you know like the triple window action on the galaxy no and i don't like hearing people like tapping on the phone when they're like obviously doing stuff so like this then to me seems like that kind of person i don't know if that's like a trader or something like that who's traveling a lot or like again a journalist who

might have to take notes in a in a rough place and is also calling people pretty often for interviews or something like that. If you are somebody that this feels like would be your main. If you're in the target demographic. Yeah, I want to know. I kind of want to know the target demographic. Like we've we've heard people respond to us on why people do like the S Pen and phones. And there's been some really interesting that totally makes sense.

Yeah. I would like to know how somebody would incorporate this into their everyday workflow or just everyday yeah and not mobile gaming i yes i totally understand that mobile gaming on tablets is far more fun than on a phone um but i find it hard to buy a thousand dollar yeah for like every single day yeah if all you do is mobile yeah fair yeah no i'm curious about that but yeah full review full reviews in the works obviously i've been using it for a little bit i don't have a full sense of battery life yet but it seems pretty good i want to put in a heavy day today and tomorrow and see what happens but seems pretty good oh man putting the pen on blind

is not easy but i got it um that's the tab s8 ultra also people always people have been asking on twitter about it it's like i didn't realize every time this comes up i always get a bunch of people asking about the new galaxy tab and what i think of it and how good it is so this ultra last time we covered a tab was in a video that had a sponsored bit and people were mad that we didn't talk more about the sponsored bit so like it was kind of here and there but like no matter what samsung's products seem to get a lot of lot of hype and i think a lot of it is how close they are comparatively to apple and and forming a similar ecosystem and i think people want choice and this I mean, like even without using this so much,

it seems like one of the obvious competitors against the iPad and people want that competition. Yeah, it's that and it's the willingness to do things Apple won't do. You won't see a micro SD card slot in the iPad. You won't see, you know, Android, obviously. You won't see an OLED as of right now. So yeah, keep your eyes peeled for that video. Before we stop talking about this,

I kind of want to, and these won't count towards the scores, or maybe it can count towards the scores with an asterisk. Let's do the alphabet typing test on this. On this? Yeah. Oh my God. On the screen? Okay, so I got to use it.

Yeah, do the screen. Let's make this tough. I just think this sounds fun. This is going to be bad. This does not have anything to do with how good or bad this tablet is but i'm just here's another question do you want to try the split keyboard which is probably the right way to do it but really well i'll give you the split you can here i'll pull it up i guess are you gonna hold it or are you gonna type with it like on the ground i'd be faster putting it on the table and poking you do one i'll do the other which one are you gonna hold it or are you gonna type with it like on the ground i'd be faster

putting it on the table and poking you do one i'll do the other which one are you doing i'll do full keyboard you can just play the keyboard yeah damn it here you go okay good luck i'm i'm gonna go with i'm gonna predict can i screen record this i can screen record oh yeah yeah if i get sub 10 within three tries i'll be really proud of myself i was just predicting that you would get over 10 i was gonna say over 10 so if you get under 10 with a split keyboard oh my god and i have to hold this yeah this is yeah you know what this seemed big and now like it's a looking at it this feels like i'm about to like go bungee jumping it's a looking at it there's a lot of space feels like I'm about to like go bungee jumping it's like yeah that looks

so cool on YouTube and then you like look over the edge and you're like I don't think I want to do this yeah okay oh I don't see the number. Hold on. I need to make sure I put the keyboard down without losing it. Yeah. 7.6. 7.6?

Did you see how much my head? Yeah, you were looking back and forth between the right and the left side. For the audio listeners, this tablet is so big and with split keyboard to type the alphabet, I literally had to turn my head like left to right constantly to now i feel like i need there's pressure for me to beat that that's first try too wow and the the suspense is really there because you uh can't see the time because the keyboard comes up over it on the website standard standard keyboard here we go ready wait wait i want to record this i want to get the the lack of asmr and uh not gonna stop this you messed up like three times i did i was that was pretty bad 10.2 i messed up at what letter like two or three

i took two seconds to find the s button well it's because you missed it and i had to come back and kept going and then came back should i do one more yeah do one more okay that's much better 6.91 i was told that's pretty close to each other that's impressive man well done well done on the split keyboard all right let's take a quick break we'll come back and we'll talk about youtube You know what's great about ambition? You can't see it. Some things look ambitious, but looks can be deceiving. For example, a runner could be training for a marathon, or they could be late for the bus.

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slash waveform. The guide is free to you at netsuite.com slash waveform netsuite.com slash waveform. All right, welcome back. I have, confusingly enough, a tweet about a LinkedIn post, but it kind of made a little wave on Twitter, especially in our group of creators. And I just wanted to talk about it because I think it's really interesting and I wanted to see your opinion on it. Sure. So Colin and Samir tweeted a post

from someone named Ezra Cooperstein, I believe. So the post by Ezra says, the YouTube subscriber has long been the currency of the platform. It will be gone in the next two years or at least deprioritized. The algorithm is better at knowing your interests and knowing what you want to watch and consequently a sub will mean less and less this is already the case on tiktok it's time to

think less about this number and more about metrics that do matter and then colin and samir just said like if this happened we'd be bummed getting to a million subscribers is something they've been actively shooting for for a long time right um i have a few thoughts on it but i'd like to to hear what you have to say about it so the youtube subscriber count yes is a what they call a vanity metric yeah which is basically that it doesn't really mean that much anymore, although it is a nice looking thing to have on your front door. So I think that will always be true. I think there will always be a bunch.

Like when you arrive at a YouTube channel and you see that it has a bunch of videos, kind of the first thing you look at is, well, how popular is it? How many views are the videos getting? How many subscribers does the channel have? It gives it a sense of legitimacy to varying degrees. It's not like I see 3 million and think, oh, that's not as good as 5 million. But generally, if it has a lot, I think it's pretty legit. If it doesn't, then it's not, or maybe it's fake or whatever. So that's, that's what like the vanity metric thing is to me. But I've also, you know, he brings up TikTok,

which is a really interesting example. YouTube subscribers are very different from TikTok followers. I think they're worth vastly different amounts as far as the way they kickstart you into the algorithmic boost. At least this is the way I view it, right? So I started a TikTok from zero. And one of the first things I posted when I had, you know, probably a five digit number of followers had like a million views. And so it was very clear that those people were not coming from my audience. They were coming from the algorithmic

boost. It just got sucked up into, you know, people wanting to see this type of thing. That doesn't happen nearly as dramatically on YouTube. If you want to see a video get to a million views, you need it to have some sort of an initial kick to get it into that algorithmic feed to get it to people. And that comes from subscribers. That comes from the initial audience

of when you first serve up the video, all those people serve as data points for YouTube to know, ah, turns out people like this video. Yeah. Cause YouTube doesn't really want to take the risk. This is the difference between their algorithms. You know, YouTube doesn't really want to take the huge risk of going, let's serve this 15 minute video to 5 million impressions and see how many people click and watch it. But if you serve that to your subscribers and they click it voluntarily people click and watch it. But if you serve it to your subscribers and they click it voluntarily and they do like it, then YouTube already knows, oh, I can serve this up.

So I think TikTok has a really- It's like their control group. Exactly. So TikTok doesn't need that control group as much. They've got an amazing algorithm and they can figure out what's good about a video and what audience to serve it to, and they crush that. But I think YouTube specifically,

I agree that subscribers are less important than they have been in the past, but I don't think they will ever be completely meaningless. I think you bring a really interesting point in the fact that like both, ultimately we know that both of these platforms are trying to keep a user on the site as long as possible. Yep. So in that, in trying to keep somebody on the platform, TikTok, while its algorithm is insane, we've talked about it all the time, but if it serves you a video you're not interested in, it's taken away three seconds of your time because within a couple seconds, you

know, you don't like this and it's a quick swipe. If YouTube, so many more of those videos are eight minutes nine minutes 10 plus minutes like you said 15 minutes if it serves you that and you don't like it it's not just a swipe away then you're going to make some like choices around based on that you're going to go search something else and you have way more of a chance of getting served a 15 minute video and being like yeah i think i'm done with youtube for today and closing the browser where tiktok get served a bad video. You just swept not, even if on TikTok, you swipe backwards to leave thinking you're going to close the app. It brings another one in and it has a chance to snag you. That's really true. So the mechanism for selecting

a new piece of content is different. Yeah. And this is just disregarding YouTube shorts right now. This is just like a standard YouTube video. If I don't like a TikTok, basically I swipe, it's no effort. It's two seconds and it's already on to trying to give me the next best piece of content on all of TikTok to possibly give to me. On YouTube, I log onto YouTube and there's a bunch of videos to pick from and there's some titles and some thumbnails and it's a selection process and maybe i click one and i get a little bored and i'm like never mind it's not that good the amount of effort required is a little bit higher to search through titles and thumbnails again yeah maybe related videos maybe other videos in your subscriber box to find one you want to spend time on and that subtle difference is enough to mean the experience shifts between these two

platforms. Yeah. TikTok. It's so easy. It's so easy. So yeah, you know, I don't think Colin Samir should stop towards trying to get to their million subscriber goal, mainly because number one, I, you know, I talked about vanity metrics before. It's like when they go to do an ad for a jelly smack or something like that, the number one thing that those companies seem to look at is how many subscribers are we going to reach? This is kind of what I wanted to talk about in here because while I don't disagree with this person, subscriber count is going to be popular

for more than two years because I still don't fully think ad agencies have figured out social media marketing quite yet slow and subscriber count is such a big thing for them to like decide whether they want to do it whether it's the right thing no right but it is a thing that they are still actively actively looking at it's always the first thing i saw a lot more of this in early earlier days of youtube but there's no doubt a bunch of advertisers that are still doing this where they look towards all right i want to do a tech ad so i want to work with a couple tech creators and we want to just reach you know a lot of them their goal is just to reach as many people as possible just generally in tech and the first thing they do is go to the

tech channels with the largest subscriber number yep and that's the only thing they do is go to the tech channels with the largest subscriber number. And that's the only thing they look at. Now that's, it might work. It's fine if you get to work with those certain select group of creators, but the more nuanced approach is to work with those with the most engaged audiences. There's a bunch more metrics you want to look at. And obviously this makes much more sense now in 2022 when there's a much more advanced study of the creator economy but the point is um the

subscriber number isn't meaningless anymore but it's it's a little bit less than the whole picture yeah so if you're going to look at like i wanted i want to run um samsung i want to run an ad for this this phone on as many of these tech channels as possible um i want to talk work with creators on something like this i would want to find the ones who at this very moment are speaking to their audiences the best. And that might be a channel with 300,000 subscribers that gets 300,000 views on every video and not the one with a million subscribers that gets 100,000 views on every video. So I guess the point is, yeah, it's, it's less important than it has been in the past, but it's just one of a constellation of data points to consider.

Yeah, and if you are still a marketing agency who sees subscribers, that still is always while the algorithm is so great and while somebody watching MKBHD might not look in their sub box and still get served MKBHD videos, that sub box is like a second chance for them to not miss that video.

So that is double the chance now that this ad ultimately ad gets seen because that's what you're paying for so you want to hit the bigger subscribers um i actually think google team pixel does a really really good job at looking outside the box in terms of content creators because they do exactly what you said they'll find a smaller creator that's got 5 000 even 10 000 subscribers um and but they'll see that that person is getting 100 comments or like 8 000 views out of their 10 000 subscribers and that's awesome that's like that's a really really loyal community base and a lot of times when you're you're an advertiser that's who you want to hit so it is really important um the but those people because they're not getting the big views and from the the subscriber kickoff like you're saying are very rarely getting into the algorithm of reaching the outside right world of that yeah exactly also another thing i noticed

this is sort of on a tangent with shorts and TikTok. We started the shorts channel. Yeah. And I've just been fascinated looking at the graphs of what these shorts are doing. And basically what I found is we had a couple of shorts on the channel to start. Then we gave it a big shout out. So this is before it had many subscribers at all. It probably had less than 15,000 subscribers.

And those shorts, all of them, I think there's six of them now, all of them have a graph that looks like flat for about four days and then it slowly starts to increase where it's basically not hitting the shorts shelf and getting recommended for 96 hours and then it does and then it starts going up. So typically when you have

a lot of subscribers on a channel that graph looks like a spike at the beginning and then it flattens out so basically the the best combination for a short would be a lot of subscribers and then hitting the short shelf quickly where you get an initial spike from subscribers to quickly get it into people's feeds and then the short shelf takes it off so yeah it's a combo it's it's the one-two punch of like having an initial audience who likes what you make and is willing to take that risk and hey an investment of 45 seconds of my time i'll check this one out real quick and then that data proving to youtube that it's worth it it wanting to serve it to more people to get more people satisfied and spending more time on youtube and serving it up in the short shelf and then it

blowing up the channel has 160 000 subscribers all the shorts have at least half a million views so they're coming from people who are not subscribed to the channel that's the that's the interesting thing there so yeah that's what ticked off some good i guess the the last thing kind of also is like a subscriber is kind of anytime you enter a like let's say like Pinterest or um maybe like a backgrounds like wallpaper app or just like a lot of social media when you're first joining it doesn't have any information on you so a lot of times you'll get that prompt it's like what are you interested in tech hiking cars so a subscriber subscribing to channels kind of helps youtube get your personalized uh algorithm kind of figured out a little easier and i'm sure they're

always going to be interested in that now that doesn't mean the number of it's that important but youtube's not going to get rid of subscribers or anything like that because it's helping them so much be able to serve you that information yeah i you know what i that just reminded me of something when i you remember google plus vaguely google plus was another long ago attempt at a google social network and uh i was one of the earliest people to start using google plus i gave it a shout out on my channel i talked about it a little bit And I eventually ended up in the suggestions for who to follow when you first sign up for Google Plus. It was like me, Guy Kawasaki, like some CEOs, like it was a small list and I was in there. And so I had a couple million followers on Google+, which was great.

You were like the Beyonce of Google+. I was one of the top 10 most followed people on all of Google+. But my engagement ratio was very low because most of those people who just signed up and didn't really use Google+, were just following me and never engaged with anything. So if you were looking to do a brand deal on Google Plus and you stumbled across the top 10 most followed accounts,

you'd be making a horrible mistake because that would not be a very good use of your money unless you specifically wanted those people's audiences. So if you wanted tech, you should go to the people with the most engaged tech audiences. But yeah, I think I have pretty sure I had like five or six million followers on Google Plus, which was not a big social network and not a lot of people use i wish they sent you a plaque because that would be a piece of history that would have been really funny but yeah you know it died as quickly as it came up but i i do remember being in the suggested list that's kind of awesome and so if you if you think youtube's going to go that way you know where they suggest automatically channels to follow i think what they do now is they suggest topics to follow and if you follow a topic then there's a bunch of creators

oh yeah they do do that thing and so you can subscribe to that so whenever you open the beauty topic there's videos from 12 beauty creators i remember when pewdiepie had like more subscribers than like the music topic yeah youtube yeah right so right. So yeah. Yeah, so this LinkedIn post, I wish I had more context of exactly where it was. If he's specifically talking to marketing agencies, then I like completely agree with this. There are like so many other metrics you need to look at and see what kind of engagement pieces are getting.

But in terms of just like the average person or even the content creator on here, like subscribers are still super important. And you know showing the numbers and everything is kind of like a bragging point or like vanity number yeah it's still pretty important yeah i think the the hottest take in this is that it will be gone in the next two years yeah that i disagree like youtube's gotten rid of a lot of things that we thought were important like the dislike button counter I get it but every social media site needs a way to follow and show how many have done so yeah uh and it does it on TikTok and it still is a fairly important yeah TikTok shows followers exactly so I don't think that's going anywhere yeah okay I think

that's about it thanks for this surfacing this info and for everybody who's been tweeting at us thanks for doing that too we got a lot of our topic suggestions and things to talk about from Twitter so keep sending stuff our way and we appreciate the Discord people but that's been it for this week stay tuned we've got a really fun

one coming up I know I keep saying that but obviously it's true it's true we got a lot of good stuff coming up so thanks for listening keep saying that, but obviously it's true. It's true. We've got a lot of good stuff coming up. So, thanks for listening. Thanks for watching. Catch you guys next week. Peace. Waveformer is produced by Adam Molina.

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