Waveform: The MKBHD Podcast - iPhone 16E: What Does the “E” Mean?

Episode Date: February 21, 2025

This week is a classic gadget week on Waveform! Marques, Andrew, and David discuss the new iPhone 16E, HP buying Humane, the Nothing Phone 3A, the Rivian announcement we were all waiting, and a few other stories. Of course, we wrap it all up with trivia. P.S: we're headed to Austin! If you're going to be at SXSW in March we'll be doing a live show so come say hi! Links: HP buys Humame: https://www.theverge.com/news/614883/humane-ai-hp-acquisition-pin-shutdown Nothing Phone 3A video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_D_btmdrP9M Rivian announcement: https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a63833444/rivian-r1t-r1s-california-dune-edition-details/ Paid subreddits coming soon: https://www.fox9.com/news/reddit-paid-subreddits-paywall-feature-coming-2025 Amazon shuts down Kindle downloads to computer: https://www.theverge.com/news/612898/amazon-removing-kindle-book-download-transfer-usb Music provided by Epidemic Sound  Shop the merch: https://shop.mkbhd.com Socials: Waveform: https://www.threads.net/@waveformpodcast Marques: https://www.threads.net/@mkbhd Andrew: https://www.threads.net/@andrew_manganelli David Imel: https://www.threads.net/@davidimel Adam: https://www.threads.net/@parmesanpapi17 Ellis: https://twitter.com/EllisRovin TikTok:  https://www.tiktok.com/@waveformpodcast Join the Discord: https://discord.gg/mkbhd Music by 20syl: https://bit.ly/2S53xlC Waveform is part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Just go to indeed.com slash Vox CA right now and support the show by saying you heard about Indeed on this podcast. Indeed.com slash Vox CA. Terms and conditions apply. Hiring Indeed is all you need. This week on The Gray Area, why are we so afraid of our own ignorance?

If someone refutes our argument, it feels like something quite intimate. This week on The Gray Area, why are we so afraid of our own ignorance? If someone refutes our argument, it feels like something quite intimate has been touched. That is an incentive to build up all sorts of defenses to remain convinced of your own rational capacities and your independence. Listen to The Gray Area with me, Sean Elly. New episodes every Monday, available everywhere. Ooh, Apple polishing cloth is officially compatible with the iPhone 16. Yes! They did it.

They did it. They did it. Another successful launch, folks. Engineering. R&D doesn't just happen. Okay. Do you think there's a singular job that's just update the Apple polishing club? Yeah.

I'm a project manager on the polishing club. Ha ha ha ha. Ha ha ha ha. What is up, people of the internet? Welcome back to another episode of the Waveform Podcast. We're your hosts. I'm Marques. I'm Andrew.

And I'm David. This week we have some real announcements that happened before we recorded, which is very exciting. As a matter of fact, we just jumped in here directly after watching a 12 minute video that Apple put out with the iPhone 16e. So that came out. We also have a new Rivian announcement. Hint, someone was right last week.

And we also have a couple of other small things like Humane was sold, Redis charging for some stuff, and a first look at the Nothing 3A. But first, Andrew has written that Google Tasks now has a web app. What might be the shortest story in the history of Waveform ever,

you can now go to a dedicated webpage with your Google Tasks. Are we sure this is new? Yeah. Because I feel like I've been doing this for weeks. So what you can do is you can, like previously it would be on the sidebar of your Gmail. Yeah.

It would look exactly like that, but now it can just be in its own dedicated webpage. I could have said I've been using this webpage for the last like month and a half. Pre-alpha. No, that just means someone at Google remember that it exists, and that's very encouraging. Like Google Tasks is, it's on the radar.

So there's two things I was excited for. It was I can float my own window on the side of my desktop, which has just my tasks in vertical, which is nice. And the second thing, which is like, tasks and like vertical, which is nice. And the second thing, which is like, wait, they remembered this is one step to maybe new features, if anything not a step backwards to oblivion. Yeah, maybe they'll add some stuff.

Yeah, that's good. That's it. I tried to check the way back machine, but it's not, it's down. So I have no way to know whether or not, maybe I had early access to this. I guess we'll never know. This week also HP spent $116 million,

which actually was the most shocking part to me. I didn't know HP was out here spending money like that. And they used it to buy Humane. Humane finally got their wish and was acquired. Maybe not the way they originally drew it up, but it happened. They shut down the pin., it is going offline, the servers will go down,

they're shutting down the team that developed it, it's not gonna be a thing anymore, RIP humane PIN. But yeah, HP is acquiring the talent and the engineers and the team. The technology behind it. The patents. Yeah, the patents.

There was like 300 patents from the company and like Cosmos, Cosmo S. Great name. It's actually a pretty solid name. No, it's Cosmo S. Cosmo S. Cosmo S. Yeah, it's like, okay, the pin's gonna stop working,

so everyone who said it was bad is justified in saying it was bad, because it doesn't exist anymore. But it's also like, what does HP see in that? I don't know. Apparently, Emron and Bethany are going to work at HP to upgrade their AI systems and their conference room software. This comes back to HP.

What does HP do? I kind of, the first thing I ever reviewed was an HP product, so I'm not like a HP hater. I kind of to HP. What does HP do? I kinda, the first thing I ever reviewed was an HP product. So I'm not like a HP hater. I kinda like HP. No, we were just looking back at HP market cap and right after you made that video, they skyrocketed. Yeah, I believe that. 2009 was probably peak of HP's powers.

I bought an HP Pavilion DV7T. It was very competitive. It's the one I picked over all my other options and that was not a cheap laptop. They had a thing back in the day, but today. They're launching a Zoom competitor. HP? No, I have no idea.

No, what are they? Did I tell you guys when I thought that I may have uncovered a money laundering scheme at Intel? At Intel, yeah. But retell the story. You should retell it. Because I was in Pittsburgh. Okay, allegedly. Okay.

Allegedly. Okay. This is probably not what is happening. I want to start. However. However. Okay. When I worked at Intel, I wrote software that would check, basically there was these giant

sleds of computers, right? Because they used these Xeons, which have two Xeons per sled. There's tons of sleds in a rack. Intel buys those racks from HP, Compaq, Lenovo, Dell. All these companies where I'm like, they technically sell laptops, but there's no way that's how they make most of their money, right?

So Intel would buy these giant racks for like a ton of money with like 15 year warranties. Because they're running these computers at such like high wattage and so much power that like parts break a lot, right? So the money laundering scheme that I thought I uncovered, this is probably not happening, is that the software, when I wrote the software, it would basically every morning check every single part in every single sled. So it checked the RAM, the CPU, like everything on the computer.

The things that would break the most often were the Intel Xeons and the Intel developed RAM chips. And the reason I thought it was a money laundering scheme was because I it seemed like Intel was putting the their like B list zions in these computers that HP was then selling to Intel as a rack. when they would break because my software basically would say like every single day there was Xeons breaking, there was RAM sticks breaking, and it was always Intel developed parts. So it seemed like HP then had to go back to Intel and buy new parts from Intel to put in the thing that they sold to Intel,

and it just sort of felt like they were cycling money like this. I feel like this feels like the McDonald's allegedly ice cream machine where it's like it's broken and they also kind of run the place Compact what else does compact do this is the thing his? Well now well, I mean at the time still it was like 2016 compact was not Commercials and sold laptop wasn't around 2016 compact got a lot of

HP and 2000 way each merged yeah HP compact thing yeah easy answer here is they all do a lot of enterprise stuff that we just don't quite know of it they yeah okay so what did they do they were selling giant racks of sleds to companies like Intel, and that is probably how they make most of their money.

That's the answer to your question. Wait, you think people aren't buying the pavilion? More like pavilion, okay. Got him, got him. So that's probably how they make most of their money. Yeah, so yeah, they figured they've got 116 million to spend on acquiring Humane. Humane gets kind of their wish.

Not exactly the way they drew it up, but at least it's something. Yeah. I just canceled my Humane subscription today. Wait, I was paying every month in hopes of seeing it improve. It didn't. It did a little, but not enough to, you know, make another video or anything. I canceled it today. Did you really just did you actually just forget? No. Yes Yes, but I was giving it a chance We still have it. It's yeah, I know exactly where it is Yes, so, you know, they raised about 230 million. They sold it for a hundred and sixteen million

It was more a few months ago, they were reportedly trying to sell it between like 700 to 1 billion, I believe. So this is quite a bit lower. This is actually approximately one seventh of Juan Soto's MLB contract that they just got sold for. Yeah. Wow. And I can't help but think,

I think we all know Humane is that company that hyped themselves without a public facing product for a very long time and it feels kind of like they did that for longer than they had an actual public facing product. That's probably true. Yeah, because it came out a year ago. Less than a year ago.

And they were hyping it for a while. They're in stealth mode. Yeah, they've been around since 2018 and I know like every startup company has a product they're working on before they but like they were out there Hyping up humane Publicly without their public product for a long time for far longer than we actually had the pin So if you are a humane a fellow humane pin owner like myself expect it to be a brick by the end of the month

It will still be able to tell you if it's overheating or what your battery is. Yeah, I was gonna say, it's not just a brick, it could also catch on fire. It could tell you if it's about to, and it can tell you how much battery life is left, because that was the things that it was doing offline, and it continued, yeah, it could continue doing things. You know what's also kind of crazy?

So they will give people refunds only if you bought it within the last 90 days, which is the normal refund period, but they're not giving anybody else refunds and this product only existed for like less than a year. Amen. That's the risk. It's a $700 pin. That's the early adopter risk.

That's a lot of money for something that last 10 months. The humane Reddit and- If only there was like people who told you not to buy it. We did our job. And we got yelled at for it. They all should have bought a rabbit. What were you saying? I was just gonna say the subreddit

is not happy about this, obviously. It's one thing when they launched the email saying we're winding down, and then at the end, it's like, end everything will be offline. February 28th, which is like a week and a half from right now. So, and then that also means somebody asked them and somebody responded, no, there are some offline things that can do like tell you your battery level.

Can it tell me the time? I would just say no, it's literally brick. How? How? It's gotta. Does the projector still work? Yeah. It should show you your battery level. So maybe it's just like a life hell

Yeah clock clock. Yeah, that's kind of dope I'll know what I want for free But I don't know if I'd charge that remember when the Spotify car thing went out and I came on this podcast and we spoke About do you open sourcing it? Yeah, and how great of a community that has turned into yeah, I hope they open source They will in probably not they're shedding it, but I was that would be so sick great of a community that has turned into. I hope they open source the Kuwaiti Pin. Probably not. But that would be so sick. That's what the subreddit is asking to open source it

so people can tinker with it. I think there's way more complicated parts in this. I mean, we did get to see the inside of it and that thing is complicated. I don't think they can open source it because all the patents got sold to HP. Yeah, that would probably be my thought on why they're not gonna let a lot happen to this.

Well in six years, just like Pebble, we'll go back and ask HP to open source all this. So hold onto it. Yeah. I guess. Because you never know. Hold onto your brick that might catch on fire. I have a hot take.

What? We're gonna think back on this the way that people think about Google glass Eventually, this is the future right do you mean form factor wise? No, I mean just an AI assistant thing that you wear They're not if you want to go super broad and say a standalone AI device was ahead of its time, sure. That is where I'm going. But that's about as generous as you can be. I think we'll all look back at the humane pin

as being like, oh, that wasn't ready. Why did they ship that? That was bad. Just like we looked at it while it was out. And Google Glass had some real, some strong fans. Google Glass was fire as heck. It could come out today and be looked at kinda the same as back in the day.

I would still like Google Glass currently. Cause you're a glass hole. I was. Speaking of glass, do you know what sand is made of? Well, glass is made of sand. I got it backwards. Yeah. I almost nailed that.

Fire segue note. I knew where you were going. Almost nailed that. I knew where you were going. Almost nailed that. I knew where you were going. Sand is actually the remnants of ancient window factories that they used to only put on the beach. For dinosaurs. Yeah, for dinosaurs.

But when you made a window, you needed to test it. So you're like, oh, we should look at the beach because it's really pretty. Yeah. Anyway. Well, speaking of sand, since we're on the topic, Rivian made an announcement this week. You remember last week on the podcast, we saw a bunch of we're on the topic, Rivian made an announcement this week. You remember last week on the podcast,

we saw a bunch of pictures of sand dunes from Rivian and they were teasing something to be announced on the 19th or recording this on the 19th and we know what it was. Let's just revisit what we thought might be coming. They're probably gonna announce a sand colored Rivian. A khaki Rivian would be pretty sweet. I'd be into that. I want it to be R2D. I want it to be the maver colored Rivian. A khaki Rivian would be pretty sweet. I'd be into that. I want it to be R2D.

I want it to be the maverick Rivian. We should place bets, but there's just no way. Sand color. I'm going with either special event or sand mode. So you're saying sand mode. David, you're saying sand color. Yeah. Andrew, what are you saying?

Rivian, what is it called? Rivian Adventure Network. Yeah, what are you saying? Rivian. What is it called? Rivian Adventure Network? Yeah. So David was right. It is a close. You're close. You're the closest. It's a new trim package for the Rivian R1T and R1S, and it's a limited edition trim, but it's called the California Dune Edition. It is, in fact, sand colored. So you get the paint very much. You'll get the point for that.

There's a couple other things as well. From what I can see from these pictures, there are new 20 inch all terrain wheels. It'll come with a spare tire, a reinforced underbody shield, a couple other sand colored things. Available accessories. One of them is Max Trax recovery boards,

which are those like boards where you're stuck in deep snow or sand. Some of these you can already get it'll just come With these accessories like the dark I've thought about getting the dark crossbars for forever because mine came with light crossbars And I was like oh, I want the black ones, but I haven't bought them come with them I just saw it just a new range of accessories, so I wasn't a hundred percent sure if that oh well beam with it or just like That's a good question. But I would believe it comes with these

because they've existed already. The revised power tonneau cover, they've had to re sort of engineer that over time and I also have had mine replaced. So all of these things will be included, I believe. And then there's no release date yet, but it seems like we'll get to see one at South by Southwest in March. Is anybody gonna go to that? I don't have a release date yet, but it seems like we'll get to see one at South by Southwest in March.

Is anybody gonna go to that? I don't know. South by Southwest? I heard that Waveform might be doing a live episode there though. Oh, I saw that too. Oh, I would go to that. Oh, do you wanna go?

We can all go together. We can just all go together. Is this the invite right now? Yeah. I thought I'd get it on Partyful, but. No, we've used Apple Invites. Oh, that's why. Okay, bet. Yeah, I thought I get it. I'm party full but no Okay bet so How about we all go to South by Southwest? We'll do a live waveform show while we're there sounds good, and we'll go check out the sand colored Rivian

I'm just gonna throw let's try Saturday 11 a.m. March 8th 10 a.m. Does that work for y'all? I thought was 10 a.m I'm down, but only if it's at the Vox Media Showcase. Oh. I could do that. Game? I think we can find a way to get there. All right, sweet. Should we invite anyone else or no?

How about the audience? Yeah, no, they should come. True. They should come. Okay, yeah, so y'all, so if you're watching this, you're invited too. Yeah, see you there. Bingo. Sick. Let's go.

That was so good at transitions. Wow. That was rough. The most natural transition you've ever heard. Use your AI assistant to distill what we just said. Guys, please come. Yeah, we are gonna, it's our first live waveform event. Yeah.

It's gonna be on the Vox stage. It's gonna be, I think the first, we're the first program on the Vox stage. It's Saturday, March 8th at 11 a.m. We will be there, we will be recording it and releasing it as a bonus pod episode. It won't be broadcast live, but it will be live there. And we're still trying to figure some ways out

to involve the audience as much as possible because we've never had that chance. Maybe comment section. Yes, please. Let us know if you have cool ideas for what we should do at South by Southwest as we record live with an audience next to us who couldn't interact with the podcast. I have a question for you guys.

You know in school when there was like a group project and the teacher would be like, okay, who wants to go first? Did you guys always volunteer to go first or were you hoping to go last? I always went first. I always went first too. I was always hoping to go last. You were hoping to go last? Yeah. Interesting. Ellis is the tiebreaker. Ellis. Wait, well the question is,

everyone in the class has a little poster board. We're all going to do a presentation. Who wants to go first? You? How good is my presentation? You. That's a great question. Very mid.

First. Yeah. Can I ask why? Actually first no matter what. Because you get forgotten about by the time the worst ones come mid. First. Yeah! Can I ask why? Actually first no matter what. Because you get forgotten about by the time the worst ones come along. Okay, also you get to set the tone. Yeah, exactly.

If it's bad, there's not a good one before you to make you look bad. Exactly. But it's possible that you do the bad first one and then the second one is way better. Yeah, but everyone will forget. Exactly. Okay.

They'll remember the new one, they'll forget the bad one. My theory was always, it's a presentation, so it'll probably take longer than that period. So if I pray for last, I might be able to fix all the things I didn't actually do and then go the next day. That didn't happen before to me. I've done that, yeah. Good call.

Yeah. Also just getting it over with is nice. We are going first at South by, so. Okay. So yeah, we'll have to bring the heat, set the tone. We're setting the tone. Set the tone. And you guys should bring the heat too, it'll be fun.

And if you're sitting in the first three rows, you will get whipped. Wear a poncho. You will get whipped. You're gonna wear a poncho? Oh gosh. Yeah, it's like Sea World. We're setting the bar as high as we can.

As high as we can. Expect fireworks. You know what, Shamu like Sea World. We're setting the bar as high as we can. As high as we can. Expect fireworks. You know what? Shamu will be there. Can I just say this Rivian looks sick. Wait, yeah, I did want to go back to it. It looks sick. Really?

Wait, it's a good, we didn't say how good the color was. This is like my favorite trend in vehicle colors they've been doing lately. Sand in general? Like khaki-ish kind of the, I don't want to call it dull because it's very clearly still like you did I need it like right up Rivian's alley like with the other colors They've done cross the Subaru cross-check was doing it for a little bit and with the like black

Wheel wells the accents on it, so I think this looks really good. I hope they do this color on the R to Yeah, so I guess this is limited. I don't know how limited yet. Yeah, but I think that would be cool as well. And then R3X. Everyone loves the R3, but it's so far away. We're just waiting. I want it so bad. I love the R3. That's what I'm waiting for. I think we universally all really like the R3. We're just waiting. The R3 is one of those cars that like you aspire to drive and I feel like the R1 and the R2 are the cars that you actually end up driving. Yeah, well,. The R3 is one of those cars that you aspire to drive, and I feel like the R1 and the R2 are the cars that you actually end up driving.

Yeah, well, so allegedly R3 is gonna be cheaper though. So it should have reasonable accessibility. I remember when they announced it, it was like the R1 and R1S were out, and they announced the R2, and everyone goes, oh yes, this is nice, this is nice. It's smaller, this is more attainable. And then they go, by the way, one more thing, R3. And everyone went, forget the R2, this is nice, this is nice. It's smaller, this is more attainable. And then they go, by the way, one more thing, R3.

And everyone went, forget the R2, this is sick, I want that. So yeah, it'll be someday. And it looks more like a Subaru. Did you say this is my Roadster, is that what you said earlier? Yeah, this is the R3X is my Roadster. R3X is our Roadster. But that means it'll never come out.

Yeah. It's not out yet. It's years away, years away. Well speaking of things that are coming out we should talk about the iPhone SE but before we get to that we should take a quick break which means we got time for a trivia question. Also the Roadster is light years away now because it got shot into space. Well that's the first gen Roadster but then the new Roadster got announced, and that was, what year do you think that was? Eight years ago. 2017. 27. Yeah.

Eight years ago. 27. It was like right when I started. I still remember that text. I barely graduated from college. Came out, got announced. Right, 2017. I think it was 2017. Doesn't Tesla, are you like three of those things right now?

That's a common misconception. They only owe me one and a half of them. Allegedly. Allegedly. That text message when you decided not to go to the semi-event and then I was at home and I just like got this message of Marques being like, turn the event on. And I was like, why? And then there's road surges on the stage. But it all worked out because you went to the iRobot event.

The one that is also real. everything is for sure coming out. Yeah. Yeah. Anyway, trivia, guys, I the cyber taxi is sand colored. I just realized what's yellow. No, it's Mountain Dew. It's gold. It's gold colored. Mountain Dew Mountain Dew. It's not green. What?

Mountain Dew is green. Mountain Dew. Trivia, dude. All right, it took every fiber of my being to not ask you guys a Dune question today, because I knew no one would get it right. Thank you. So instead we're doing a truck question. Oh no. Big truck day.

So, talked about the Rivian. One of the things that I saw mentioned in this Rivian press release is they're redoing the way the electric tonneau cover works. So I figured I'd make you guys search the inside of your brains for the origin of the word tonneau. It's an English word technically, but we're borrowing it from French.

And we're borrowing it for the French word for what? And I have four choices. The first one is barrel. The second one is tunnel. C is mattress. And I don't know why I switched from numbers to letters there, but we're just rolling with it. Barrel, tunnel, mattress, or ton,

like the unit of measurement. Tonneo. I hate that one feels very obvious. Which one? Yeah. To me, they all feel kind of obvious. Don't say it. Mattress?

Yeah, cause it's a truck bed. Well, we'll think about it. We don't, I don't think any of us know the answer, but we're gonna make a guess later. Answers will be at the end like usual. We'll be right back. So, so

so so so so so so so so

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your first month free. And don't worry about the move, they'll handle the whole transition for you, no tech expertise required. Just visit kenstay.com slash waveform to get started. That's K-I-N-S-T-A dot com slash waveform. All right, welcome back. We've got some exciting, thrilling new breaking news this week. The most innovative and unique and exciting, I can't even do this. There's a new iPhone.

It's the 16E. So it's actually not the SE anymore. Yeah. Big change. 16E. I think that actually not the SE anymore. Big change. 16E, I think that makes sense. Didn't SE stand for special edition at one point? But then it was just the budget iPhone. So now it's just the 16E. Cool.

This completes the iPhone 16 family as Tim Cook put it. It is about what we expected. I mean, we saw some of the leaks and now we have the official specs and everything that's new. Here is a quick overview before I get reactions from everyone. It is in fact the newest chip, the A18.

It does have enough RAM to run Apple intelligence. Great, that's baseline stuff. It has a 6.1 inch screen. It's an OLED. It has a notch with face ID. So the home button is gone. It's just face ID, touch ID it does have black or white matte colors it is it does have an action button no camera control 48

megapixel single camera on the back and one less GPU core than the standard iPhone 16 so it is the same a 18 neural engine, but one less GPU core for the budget phone. No MagSafe. Okay, so it does have wireless charging up to seven and a half watts, but no MagSafe magnets. And the phone has Apple's first in-house design cellular modem that they're calling the C1, which apparently has been in development for a really long time. It's supposed to be super efficient. I would love to test this. They're touting a 26 hour video playback battery life, which is on par with the latest generations of iPhones.

And it's $599 for 128 gigs. It starts at 599. Yikes. So initial thoughts on this. I think a lot of people, including myself, immediately reacted to the price. Whoa, $599. That's a big jump from the last two.

I don't know if you remember the last two iPhones were, the last two SE iPhones were $399 and $429. So this goes beyond $499, all the way up to $599 starting. And it does obviously improve a lot of things from the last cheap SE. It's not Lightning anymore, it's USB-C. It's a face ID, it's an OLED, there's all these things that are updated. But it is still, I mean you could frame it as this is still $599 for a 60Hz like base

iPhone that has a single camera and doesn't do anything special, like why is it $599? Tariffs, of course, are gonna come into play here. This is the first, I guess, new iPhone where we have to consider that. Yeah, I'm curious what the biggest surprises were. To me, honestly, MagSafe missing seems like the biggest miss. I think a lot of people associate the iPhone with having MagSafe, and I guess that's pretty classic Apple

to go, yeah, not the cheap one. Everyone else gets it, not the cheap one. But that is wild. But yeah, like the MagSafe thing, it still has wireless charging, you just can't line up magnets. But it's also 7.5 watts instead of 15 because there's no MagSafe. Every iPhone says the iPhone 12 has had MagSafe.

Except the SE. Yeah. Yeah. So the SE still doesn't have it. Alice's... MagSafe. 12 mini. 12 mini even. Yeah. Yeah. So the SE still doesn't have it. Alice's. MagSafe. MagSafe. 12 mini.

12 mini even. Yeah, MagSafe, but not on the SE. So that is, I think probably the biggest miss. That's wild. I think the biggest X factor question mark is clearly the C1 chip. We don't know if that's going to be some incredible improvement.

They'd been using Qualcomm modems in the past for context. Is this gonna be some huge battery life improvement that we see continue on future iPhones? Are they gonna make a bigger deal about this in future iPhone keynotes? Is there some signal improvement that I should expect? Like what, we just have to test it. I don't know what to expect from the C1.

The C1 is like a lot of the 5G modem, but it does not include millimeter wave. So not that really anyone was using millimeter wave that frequently, but you can't use millimeter wave. Which the question then becomes, do they use millimeter wave for like precision finding with the air tags? Or is that something else? That might be...

I actually don't think that's through the cellular modem though. That's not through the cellular modem. So it might not matter. Okay. But they might start using the C1 to do that where they weren't before. That's the thing is, I don't know. I have to test and figure out like what things work better,

what things are more efficient. TBD, so that's the X factor. The things that we know are gonna be good are it's the cheap iPhone with the newest chip, the A18. It's gonna be probably the most powerful on paper, $599 phone. It's probably gonna be a solid camera for a $599 phone.

Usually is. The cheap in there is relative and so much more relative now because it's just so much harder calling this the cheap iPhone at $600, especially when the iPhone 16's at $799, $200 more. That's a crazy jump. especially when the iPhone 16's at $799, $200 more. That's like, that's a crazy jump. That just feels.

Just a big jump from where we came from. Does it make any of you guys scared for Pixel 9a? Like it'll go way up in price. Like that'll take a jump like this? I don't think so. 429 was super reasonable. Right, 429 was way more obviously the budget iPhone one is half the price of the the nice iPhone And that was cheaper than I came out a few years ago. Yeah. Yeah, so

It is $25 a month financing for two years Where I most people in the US are gonna see how most people in the US see this the iPhone 16 base is $33 a month for two years. So it's literally the difference of $8. And for that you are now missing the Dynamic Island, MagSafe, ultra wide camera. And I think that's it. A GPU core. A GPU core.

No telephoto on the base. There's no telephoto. Yeah. I, $8 a month. So $8 a month. I guess you could get a cheap streaming service for that price. Yeah.

Phoebe. Phoebe or, or DDo or something. I don't know. But this is, it's an interesting phone. I kind of, I'm already starting to form my opinions because at a software level, we kind of already know what the iPhone is. Like we're not expecting some new crazy features

to come with this. We know what Apple intelligence is already. We know what iOS 18 is already. We know what that looks like on an A18. We know what that looks like on a 6.1 inch OLED. It's just strip out some of these features. Is this phone still for you? I think there's obviously a group, especially people who watch waveform and who are really into tech, It's just strip out some of these features. Is this phone still for you?

I think there's obviously a group, especially people who watch waveform and who are really into tech, there's a group of people who are going, are you telling me $600 for a phone with a 60 Hertz display in 2025? Is that a joke? Are you making fun of us?

Of course that's a terrible deal. And people like that, this phone's not for you. But there's a whole separate group of people who are like, what's the cheapest, smallest iPhone I can get that's brand new, that's gonna have five, six, seven years of software support? Give me that one. This is the phone for you, even if it's not $400,

it's $600 this time, but this is still the correct answer to that question. So whether or not this is the phone for you kind of depends on who you are. And yeah, we just now know what the phone is. I'm curious because the iPhone SEs traditionally have not sold that well. So I'm wondering if making a more expensive phone

is making them more likely to sell well. I don't, I mean, it probably shouldn't, but. I have a question that kind of can piggyback on that. Yeah. Do you think part of the reason it doesn't sell well is because of the inconsistency of when it releases? Because we don't get them every year. I think it's because of carrier plans.

Okay. I think it's because people don't care about the difference between a few bucks a month and they just get the better one. Yeah. The Pro Max for the past year or two has been the best selling version, at least in the US. That says a lot.

Yeah. Yeah. So. The reason I ask that is because, first of all, I think iPhone 16E is the better naming scheme. Even if we've gotten used to SE. I agree with you. And that's what we did. My question about that is, if we've now introduced this

into the same number of the current lineup of phones, is this an every year release now? That's a great question. If that was true and they were also releasing an Air for the 17, they would have a lot of models. I agree. Even in the grand scheme of things, it's a lot for the iPhone, but it's still not that much.

Like look at Samsung. Like if iPhones next year are 17, 17 plus, 17 Pro, 17 Pro Max, 17 Air, and 17 E. That sounds like a lot. But then you look over at Samsung and they're like, we have a phone at every price from $90 to $1,700 at increments of 10. And they all have different names.

They're A series, they're Z series, they're Galaxy S series. So I could see it. The one market that they're not really hitting right now where they could really dominate if they wanted to is the pay as you go market because that's where Samsung really, really tracks. The reason that the A series Samsung phones

are so insanely popular is because they're sold at Boost Mobile as pay as you go phones. Yeah, they are much cheaper though. Way cheaper, yeah, really cheap. Really cheap. Like they'll go plastic, they'll go like yeah, 229 I don't think Apple wants to really compete in that market because you have to make pretty low quality stuff Hmm. So question for you guys. This is something Harper asked me and I was stumped

Should you get this phone or an iPhone 15? 15 Apple would say and then I'll tell you what I would say. Regular 15? Do I got base 15? Yeah, base 15, not pro. Regular 15. Apple would say, you don't get Apple Intelligence with a base 15. That's what Apple would say.

You don't get Apple Intelligence with this one either. No, you do, you do. I thought it was still rolling out. No, you'd- 16E. That's what I'm saying. Two different things, two different things. Yeah, 15 is never getting Apple Intelligence.

16E has enough RAM, it has it has Apple intelligence has an action button what I would say is I Get this how much do you care about the two things that are like meaningfully different to the experience the ultra-wide camera and One extra year of software updates like those are the the things that are maybe Meaningfully different magsafe how much do you care about those things? Oh, I love MagSafe, oh. I know. And I think if you do care about those things, you should get the 15,

because you can get it for as cheap, but probably less. Right now if you bought it straight from Apple, it's 699 versus 599. Yeah, it's $100 more for a 15. For a brand new 15 today? Yeah. Because they just continued,

they discontinued the 14, so the cheapest. Okay, so a 15 is 699. But it has. And that gets you an ultra wide. The dynamic island, ultra wide, MagSafe. One less year of software, no Apple intelligence, which could be a plus. But, and it has the action button.

Wait, does it? No, 15 doesn't. Wait, did they really just announce the action button? The 16. Oh no, sorry, that 15 did have it did they really just announce the action button? The 16. Oh no, sorry, that 15 did have it. The 15 Pro had the action button. Oh, only the Pro had it. Oh.

Is that true? Let me look it up. Oh, the 15 Pro had the action button. Yeah, I don't think the 15 did not have it. Yeah, so if you want an action button, you gotta get the 16E. I do like the action button. Are you a, yeah, I guess you won't know

unless you start using a phone if you actually care about the action button. $100 plus. Apple needs one of those, what Marvel character are you quizzes for the very specifics of which thing you need. And that's like, find the perfect person for the iPhone 16E.

That wouldn't rather have an iPhone 15, wouldn't rather just go to the iPhone 16e that wouldn't rather have an iPhone 15, wouldn't rather just go to the iPhone 16 regular. Yeah. Or buy a used iPhone 15 for way less money. If you need, yeah. If you're not paying on the monthly dollar amount. You know who this is for? When I worked at Best Buy Mobile,

there were people that would come in with like a really old six-year-old phone and just be like, give me the cheapest newest one. 100%. And that's who it's for. The cheapest newest one. I could also see this being for the company that wants to buy everyone work phones

and at $200 cheaper for every single phone and you're buying XMIS. E is for enterprise. There we go. Oh no, isn't it always for enterprise? Or education. Wow. I think it's very expensive. It's for eggs, that't it always for enterprise? Or education. Wow. Oh.

I think it's very expensive. It's for eggs, that's why it's overpriced. I thought it was for Ellis. Yeah. Ellis. We will get our hands on this phone, we will test it, we will review it, stay tuned of course for those thoughts. But yeah, iPhone 16e, that is out.

Another phone that also has a small letter at the end of its name, he is not out yet. God, I'm crushing the segues. You really are, that's pretty good. There was a comment last week that said, y'all are really getting lazy on the segues, and you just brought it back to this episode. Welcome back.

I liked the glass one, that was good. Nothing Phone 3A. It's not really unveiled. We're getting the classic dribble of information. I think last week, Nothing said, it'll have a Qualcomm chip. And that was it, cool. This week on our YouTube channel,

they did a very, very objective smartphone camera comparison. So they didn't show the design of the phone, but they showed that they were taking photos alongside an iPhone 16 Pro Max in a couple random different scenarios, compared them back to back, and then concluded that they were very impressed with their own product. Marques, was it deceptive at all?

Look, if you're nothing, you're incentivized to make your device look as good as possible. You don't make that video if you don't think it'll work well. So if there are instances where you can give the NothingPhone an edge, you'll do it. I think one instance was the video stabilization section where they compared the ultra-wide of the iPhone to the regular camera on the NothingPhone 3A. The quality is so much worse on the ultra-wide camera. It's a fact. It's pretty bad.

So look, I look forward to the Phone 3A coming out. I have no doubt that they're trying to hype that it'll be a better camera because the spec by itself convinces no one. It's an interesting YouTube video. It's also an interesting case study in a company reviewing its own products. I don't know how people feel about that.

Me personally, I want to believe that they can do an objective job, but like, it just doesn't work. They're not going to do an objective job. I can't watch that video and then have them at the end go, I'm very impressed by our product. Well, yeah, obviously. But if you're super curious about this phone coming up,

there's a glimpse at some stuff that it'll be capable of. That's the Nothing Phone 3A. Can I just say I love this rollout that they're doing? Because- The tease of- I don't think they're trying to be objective. I think this is them being like, instead of sending it to influencers, let's just do our own videos. We'll influence ourselves.

I think that's essentially what the like mood board is for their YouTube channel. Yeah. I think they went, wow, people really seem to like the trustworthy voices in this sort of casual style where we talk about phones. So how about we just do that for our own phones and we have unlimited exclusive access to everything we make. And you don't even have to pretend to be ethical

because you are the company. Yeah. I think that is like important is we know they're not going to be objective because it physically says it's from nothing. So we know they're the ones doing it. And I give them credit. They're, they're good at knowing their audience and being kind of, it's more personal seeing them doing stuff like this.

And I went into it like, cool, they're doing a great job. And then when I saw the comments, we're all saying like, that's definitely the ultra wide camera. They did the video on and they didn't. It's not only that they didn't mention that, it's that right before it they said, we're recording both of these in like 4K 30. Just so you know, the iPhone can go higher frame rate, but we're trying to make it fair.

So it like, they gave the iPhone credit while also, like by that giving credit makes it feel more trustworthy to then not mention the biggest issue. Cause that whole idea. I want to, I feel like I want to give them credit more trustworthy to then not mention the biggest issue. Is that a whole drive? I feel like I want to give them credit because they are doing something unique. You don't see this type of stuff from Samsung. Yeah, imagine if Samsung did this.

Yeah, it would feel crazy. So it is very fun and startup-y and competitive and interesting and we pay attention to it. But I don't think we should be going there for purely objective information. So. We joke around about nothing and Carl Pay a lot, you know? But I do think if Samsung attempted to do this,

it would be the most cringe thing. It would be so cringe. And Samsung, we love you. Do it. But don't do this. Do it. Like it would be, it would be, oh my God. It would make. Stop it! It, oh my God, it would make,

it would make all the hairs on your arms stand up and just be like, oh. Yeah, yeah. It kind of gives the old moment YouTube channel vibes, if you remember that moment, is this like camera accessories company that used to review their own lenses and stuff. Although they didn't really say they were reviews.

They would be like testing. They would showcase what it was capable of. Yeah. Which felt more ethical than this. Yeah, I think it's when you bring in a competitor's product and compare it directly to it, you're like, now I don't know if I can listen to anything they're saying. I definitely don't know,

I don't think I can listen to anything they're saying. Yeah. They're very good at doing the like, compliment sandwich of, let's say one nice thing about our competitor, which therefore makes it feel closer, and then for the next 20 minutes, talk about everything in your phone.

One of their most popular videos was Carl Pei reviewing the new iPhone, which they did exactly that. He's like, actually, their engineering is very good on this. I'm very impressed. And then 20 minutes of good things about the nothing phone. I remember when Zuck reviewed the Vision Pro

and he just was like, I used the Vision Pro and then I used our MetaQuest Pro and I was just shocked at how much better our product is. Do you remember the best part of that video? It was filmed on a MetaQuest 3 and he turns around and there's the guy just standing like this. I forgot about that. I forgot about that too.

Yeah, and it makes it hard because sometimes what they're saying can actually be true. It's just we have to hear it from an unbiased third party to actually take it seriously. Yeah, like our podcast is super well produced and it's the greatest podcast in the world. Especially when compared to other tech podcasts. Sometimes I watch those and I'm just so amazed

at how much better ours looks and sounds and it's just produced. Yeah. It's a fact. But don't take it from me. Yeah. Well, do take it. But don't listen to any other podcasts.

Yeah, do take it from me. Yeah. That's why it looks so bad. Definitely get your news from a variety of sources. This is pretty classic media literacy 101. But yeah, you know, we got a little peek at the 3A. That was cool. Okay, well it'll come out eventually.

Eventually. I don't think, so Carl Pei had said that the Nothing Phone 3 was going to be their first AI phone. So usually, like the Nothing Phone 2A came out after the Nothing Phone 2. So now they're releasing the 3a before the 3. And the a is the cheaper, the regular is the flagship. So the 3 I believe is slated for like,

I think they said later this year, summer or something. And that's their first a iPhone, which will be interesting and weird. Before we go to, before we leave Nothing, I did want to, I think we've got an interesting opportunity for a little future wager prediction. Uh oh. Which is, when the inevitable nothing AI assistant

comes out, what are they going to name it? And I will not accept little Carl as an answer. Oh God, I wanted to be little Carl so bad now. Carl? So you know how Samsung did that weird thing where they combined Bixby and Gemini and it was just kind of like Gemini with plugins in the S25 lineup?

Yeah. It could be along those lines. And what was interesting was I was talking to them about it and they said there's no name for it for the assistant The assistant but you can still say I mean it is called nothing Google or Gemini But for nothing, this is for Samsung for nothing though You you still just say Google or Gemini to pull it up. So I think that will still be true I don't think they're gonna name it at all. Do say hey Gemini now you still say hey G. Yeah, Google

But does German can can you say hey Gemini? I don't I've never actually tried. I don't think I've tried that Let's try Gemini attached to my action button. So that's how I put it. Yeah, I thought you had to launch Gemini All right, meet me real quick. Hey Okay, that worked. Hey Gemini Hey Gemini Okay, that worked. Hey Gemini. Hey Gemini. Okay, Gemini. Nah, it doesn't work. Brilliant branding, Google.

Yeah. Rename everything and then not allow you to call it. Okay, nice. I think they're gonna name it after the bird. Do you remember the bird from all the Nothing Phone 1 advertisements? The parrot? Oh.

The parrot, I think it's gonna be called like Parrot or Bird Guy or something like that. Something bird related. Yeah. Do you think they're gonna be called like, parrot or bird guy or something like that. Something bird related. Yeah. Do you think they're gonna- You're gonna have to squawk. Squawk. Yeah.

Quack! Anyway, trivia! Wait, did everyone say their predictions? I wasn't creative enough. I don't know, man. All right. I'll go with little Carl. No name.

Little Carl. God, I really hope it's little Carl. Trivia, dude. So we just finished talking about nothing, but they also sell, like usual, welcome to waveform. They also sell other things, you know, like headphones. And under their sub brand, CMF, they also sell like the watch, you know.

But did you know that they also sell a 5.1% beer named what? What? They sell beer? They sell beer. Is it rebranded? There's nothing beer, 5.1% alcohol. How much is that?

Is that a lot? Sir, what have you been drinking? Nothing. Nothing. Hey. Loopholes. But what is the name of that beer? Huh. This is another the name of that beer? Huh.

This is another trivia question that I won. Little Carl. Little Carl. I wasn't built for this question. One of you may get it, but not me. We'll think about it. We'll think about it. We'll be right back. Support for Waveform comes from Coda.

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One, I hold very near and dear to my heart, not really. But Reddit. I didn't realize you cared that much about Kindle. You could talk about that. Reddit will be launching paid subreddits. Okay, I'm going to, okay, there was a comment last week that said Andrew really bums me out, so I'm gonna be optimistic about this.

Wait, this is not the time. You don't have to be optimistic about this. You know that asteroid that might hit Earth in a few years? I don't wanna bum anybody, but like, the percentage of it hitting Earth, why not? I saw an article that did go up. All right. Okay, so Steve Huffman, the CEO of it hitting Earth went up? It did go up. I saw an article that it did go up. All right. Okay, so Steve Huffman, the CEO of Reddit

and one of the founders of Reddit did a video AMA because he's too much of a coward to do a regular AMA. A video AMA is where you just answer questions in video form? I don't know where he grabbed the questions. I'm sure there might've been one, but it means you can't obviously be skipping the number one upvoted one.

Like, you know when you've done your AMAs, it's kind of hard to skip the one that's like at the top with thousands of upvotes. And the questions were definitely written from real people and people on the Reddit team. Yeah, totally. He did mention that there's plans, he's said this before,

plans for some sort of paywall content on Reddit. He said, there's one coming, we're working on it as we speak. So I tried to take the optimistic approach here and thought of a way that might be beneficial for a paywall subreddit. What'd you come up with? And I'll pitch it to you guys. Patreon. I was just going to say that. I think a creator or person focused community, like paywall community, could be the perfect in between of like Patreon, which is fairly slow, and Discord Premium, which is fairly quick

in terms of chatting. I think that could be beneficial. It could be pretty cool. As long as that payments is partially going to the creator of it, then I don't know though who creates the subreddit who would get payment because how would someone else not just create the MKBHD subreddit, right now our subreddit, who would get payment because how would someone else not just create the MKBHD subreddit, right now our subreddit,

we don't even control, we have no control over. So that was my idea here. Judging by how Reddit's gone lately, it's probably just a money grab and will be total garbage. Very unhappy with what Reddit has been doing in the last couple of years. However, optimistic approach, I do think that putting a paid,

I will see something that I pay for in my feed that I'm already scrolling approach is a good way to do it. Because the problem with Patreon is that you either have to check your email a lot and read everything in your email, which is a bad experience, or you have to go to the Patreon website in order to consume the content. And nobody just frequents the patreon

website right but if you're already scrolling reddit and it just like a subreddit that you subscribe to just shows up in your reddit feed passively it's like I have access to content that I didn't have before and is now part of my stream of content so I think that that is a good way to consume paid content is just to have it appear with your other content. I don't love that it's like isolated to Reddit and you have to probably use the official Reddit app and all this stuff.

So this is exactly how Twitter does it right now. You just described. Right. So if you subscribe to someone on Twitter, their paid content shows up inside the feed along with the rest of the free content. And if you aren't subscribed, it actually shows you a tiny one line preview encouraging you

to then go subscribe and pay to see the whole thing to unlock the posting or feed. So it makes sense. It makes sense because also people just scroll Reddit. That's the thing. People just are around and so it acts as a platform to surface people exploring and finding new things. So I could see that working out.

Yeah, I'm not shocked by it. I bet Reddit takes a cut. And it's a competitive, like they're a platform, so they're gonna take a cut because they're servicing things to people, but then hopefully people who wouldn't have found as much of an audience on Patreon without that active people scrolling

will have a bigger audience because Reddit just surfaces it to people. Also, over under on Reddit forcing you to subscribe to the subreddits on desktop because Apple would take a cut of whatever that cut I was thinking. Very good point. Yeah, so if you're in the Reddit app, there's another 30% gone.

Yeah. Damn. Yeah, that's probably gonna happen. This is based on very little information. Like, I don't know if that's what they're doing. That's my my best take. And I think that seems the most reasonable way to do it. Right. Is like to have a community. Communities like to communities are more fun when they're small. Right. Because it actually feels like you're participating.

Yes. So by having a premium community where there is a paywall to get in guarantees a closer knit and especially when they can get brigaded by something else, that does seem beneficial. And I could totally see it working. I hate to give Reddit credit. It'll still be on the worst app in all of history. And I still hate Steve Huffman. So there used to be a feature on the Reddit app where you could like go to the next comment

by hitting this little bubble and I no longer have it on my app. I don't remember that. Is it there for you? You're talking about collapsing a thread and the next thread comes out? It like just jumps to the next thread. I thought they changed kind of how threading works

in Reddit recently. I still use Relay. Or sorry, in the comments. Yeah, I'm trying to get to something with a good comment. It's actually an incredible app. Yeah, see, there's no thing anymore. I don't remember where. There used to be a little bubble

in the bottom right corner that would jump to the next head. Oh, wait. What are you doing? Oh, that does. There's a little arrow down here. Oh, yeah, I don't. Whoa. That's not on the iOS app anymore. I mean, this app sucks.

Yeah, it's really bad, yeah. It's quite bad. That's actually good to know. Damn. They did put it in a nice feature. See, it's just not in the iOS app anymore. Hmm. Damn. Yeah. You should iPhone users. I will say if you like, I've had a continuously pretty good Reddit experience using relay on Android.

Yeah. So if you want a good Reddit experience, How much is it a month? It's not cheap. It's like eight bucks, right? It has to be that cheap because of how much, how much it costs the developer for this. It's not cheap. That's true.

Okay, that might actually be worth it though. If you use Reddit, yeah. Concert three things easily, subscription. If I just cancel my Tubu subscription, I could probably pay for that. Shows him my API usage. Wow. The breakdown, loading comments,

loading feed profiles, wow. Dang. Yeah, but paid subreddits, actually kind of a good idea. Worst person you know. Worst person you know, that's a great point. The best part is he hasn't even made the point. We've developed the point for him.

Yeah, so question. They have an in reddit video player and photo image viewer now, right? Maybe that's why they were doing that. Instead of just having a YouTube in bed where they can't like host the content, now it's like also better than Patreon and that you can like host it locally just on the subreddit as well. So you have to go on reddit.com

in order to view the like subscriber only content. That could be interesting. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It all checks out. It all checks out. We'll keep an eye on it. Well, speaking of... Speaking of checking out. Speaking of eyes.

Eyes? You use them to read. Oh, your sandwiches, sandwiches, book that you don't own anymore. Yeah, that was pretty good. I said speaking of checking out and then I was going to go to Amazon. Yeah, that's Amazon exists. That was a good cycle cycle. Oh, I see. Checking out.

I was my head went to like libraries, like checking out books. Well, Amazon exists. Yeah. I was my head went to like libraries like checking out books. Wait, wait, wait Amazon exists Yeah, since when? You didn't hear? Speaking of checking out. No, no one called me. They sell books. I hope you haven't checked out of this podcast yet But what is happening with Amazon and books though? Adam. Amazon is Removing a feature that will let you download your purchased ebook to your computer first. Cool, cool, cool.

So not a huge deal because most people probably don't interact with their ebooks that way. Like personally when I buy an ebook on Kindle, I just download it straight to the device, like straight through wifi, whatever. But there is a way to download it to the computer first and then transfer it via USB cable to your device if you wanted to do that for whatever reason. One of the reasons is that that basically allows you to strip it of DRM content and then you can put

it on any other e-reader that you have because if you don't have a Kindle you could just put it on a regular e-reader or whatever. Also that allows you to basically own the e-book that you purchased. Yeah, well yeah, because you bought it. Yeah, well we can't have that. That's not gonna happen anymore. Amazon can't have this. Because now when you down, because you can't download it anymore, it's basically like streaming. Like you know how... That is horrible. Yeah, like how PlayStation if you buy the digital version, technically you don't like own the game. You know, it's the same situation now with books. So if it if for whatever reason Amazon decides to stop

hosting a book or if they change the covers of books, that's one thing people have been complaining about, or they update the versions of the books, your ebook will change because it's reflecting the changes that Amazon is doing on their end, even though you purchased it. So what do you really own anymore? So you're basically purchasing an indefinite license.

Yeah, you're licensing the right to stream this book. I hate the future. Yep. iTunes too. Yeah. And not that this is something that affects any of us, but I'm pretty sure back in the day, if you died, Apple took all your iTunes files back

and you couldn't pass them down to your kids. They just put them up to the cloud. Damn. With you. Bless out. So basically, if you have a big ebook library in Kindle, you have until February 26th to download all of your ebooks, because after that you will no longer be able to. I think Meta just downloaded like 82 terabytes of it. Allegedly. Allegedly. I heard. Out of curiosity, will you still be able able to side load ebooks onto a Kindle? Yeah, yeah, there's like Kindle to cloud app that you can use they haven't updated since 2006 But it's okay. Okay. This is more so how this is more so how You get books from Amazon like Amazon's changing it on their end how you do this. Let's go to borders instead

Yeah, do that. But what is like purchasing anything anymore in this digital age? Like do we actually own anything? Yeah. Nope, I don't think so. When I buy a hoagie, I eat it, and then it just disappears from my stomach when they decide to discontinue it.

You're just licensing them. Licensing the nutrients. What percentage of our audience knows what a hoagie is? Oh, it's a sandwich. It's a hero. It's pretty regional, right? It's a hero. Oh.

We've gone off the deep end. I think it's time to wrap up the pod with trivia. ["Tonno Cover"] ["Tonno Cover"] All right, question number one, fellas. Tonno cover, we get it from French, but specifically, we get it from the French word for what? Hit it.

A, barrel. B, tunnel. C, mattress. Or D, ton, like the unit of measurement. And this question took a lot of research. So please don't mess it up. Are you sure that the research was correct? Why would you say that in front of our audience?

Be like, I don't know, Ellis. Maybe they shouldn't trust you 100%. Just make sure you ask Jet Chibi-T first. Oh yeah, sure, that'll get me the right answer. All right, Flip em and read. Who wants to go first? I just went with Ton. Ton is correct.

Nice. So I also did that. So you also got it. David, you put? Mattress. Mattress, I made up. But in a rare, in fact, for the very first time in waveform multiple choice history,

there were two correct answers amongst this four. Because ton, ton, tonneau actually comes, is the French word for barrel, more specifically like a cask, like a large barrel. And the English word ton comes also from that word because this was the part that was really complicated to make sure I had to get right. But essentially you started off by measuring most of,

like how much stuff you could carry on a boat in how many barrels you could fit on it. And then over time through some complicated language stuff, we extrapolated the word ton from that French word Barrel anyway, thank you for coming to my TED talk all that to say David. You did actually have a 50-50 shot Do you know I know it wasn't mattress Ellis was so eager to say his like like like the bed of a truck Come on. I was like, that's not it. He's too proud of making that up Yeah, I should have known that

The French would have not Said mattress. They probably have another word for mattress. I know like sleeper Something like that. This has been linguistics with waveform. I really wanted to say damn. There was a 50% chance How'd you come up with that? Sorry, I shouldn't that's really mean. Quick update on the score. I apologize. Marques with six.

Okay. Andrew with four. After those two correct points. One point. Good job, guys. David, still in the lead with 10. If you combine Andrew and Marques' points, It is now a tie.

It is a tie. Oh, it's tied, man. Yeah, you both have Should have okay next question. Hmm. Nothing makes a beer. What is it called? It's five point one percent it definitely has a name. Oh Oh sorry, it appears you cannot buy this beer everywhere yet Oh really? But there is a mailing list How many points does David have? 10

Oh he has 10, I thought he said 12 for some reason Oh no no, 10 The math ain't math What is it called? Flip him and read, what do you got? Oh good guesses. David, what do you have? Oh, that's so really good.

I put not beer. No, but I wish it was. I put dot. No, Marques. I put nothing. No. It's called beer. Dang, I thought about that.

You were the closest. You literally put not beer. I was second to the officer. But it is beer. So what kind of beer is it? It is a light lager Of course, it is the easiest beer to manufacture It was like a Japanese style lager maybe I would be into that Anyway guys, I think that has been our show, unless anyone else has something. Oh, to that dude who posted in the not our MKBHD subreddit

saying like, oh, I found your thing. That's the same problem I keep having. That's just a thermometer. It's just you put a thermometer in your house and it tells you. I used to have one of those. That just rang a bell. I used to have one of those.

Yeah, they're fine. But to me, it's like, no, no, I want forecast. I want high. I'm talking about last week about the Brookstone weather cast. Okay, thank you for coming. But I used to have the thing that that guy posted where you'd put a little thermometer in your window. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

That's great, but it's not, it's not, it's not the same. I wanna know if he's got the stories. Someone deleted it and just said, didn't it say like, here you go, Alice? Yeah, which is a deep cut reference to the Wayform podcast. But- Well, I think that about does it for our show.

Right? Yeah, that's for sure. No more news. No more news. No more news, we covered all the news. For sure nothing will happen between now and Friday. Thanks for watching. Thanks for listening.

And again, let us know at South by Southwest what we should do to involve slash incorporate you guys who will also be at South by Southwest. Let us know in a comment. We'll definitely do the most upvoted thing. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Maybe cut that part. Anyway, that's it.

Catch you guys next week. Peace. Wayfarer was produced by Adam Malina and Ellis Rubin, we're partners with the Vox Media Podcast Network, and our intro to our music was created by Vainsil. Bingo. Let's go. ["Bingo"] You said, which one seems obvious, and I don't want to say that out loud if Well if it's so obvious then your boys are probably thinking it too

Not these morons Not these people with eight times the amount of points that I have Mattress cut