Waveform: The MKBHD Podcast - Verified Badges are Gone and AI gets Too Real

Episode Date: March 31, 2023

This week, Marques, Andrew, and David discuss each of the products from the latest Dope Tech video before jumping into a ton of weird celebrity AI deepfakes that we can all agree are way too weird. After that, they talk about how Elon Musk has promised a bunch of changes to Twitter Blue. They wrap it all up with a discussion about WWDC and the rumored Apple AR headset. Make sure to stick around for trivia as well! It wouldn't be Waveform without a chaotic trivia ending. Enjoy!  Links: Dope Tech: Better than Expected: https://bit.ly/wvfrmdopetech Snoop Dogg images: https://bit.ly/wvfrmsnoop Will Smith video: https://bit.ly/wvfrmwillsmith Apple headset doubts: https://bit.ly/wvfrmappleheadset Shop the merch: https://shop.mkbhd.com Twitters: Waveform: https://twitter.com/wvfrm Marques: https://twitter.com/mkbhd Andrew: https://twitter.com/andymanganelli David: https://twitter.com/DurvidImel Adam: https://twitter.com/adamlukas17 Ellis: https://twitter.com/EllisRovin Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/wvfrmpodcast/ TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@waveformpodcast Join the Discord: https://discord.gg/mkbhd Music by 20syl: https://bit.ly/2S53xlC Waveform is part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Why? You can skip it. Oh, what? Just like that? Just like that. How about dinner with my third cousin? Skip it. Prince Fluffy's favorite treats? Skippable. Midnight snacks?

Skip. My neighbor's nightly saxophone practices? Uh, nope. You're on your own there. Could've skipped it. Should've skipped it. Skip to the good part and get groceries, meals, and more delivered right to your door on Skip. And I'm David. And we're all here to talk about how AI is getting crazy good. You've probably never heard a podcast episode about this exact topic before.

We're going to be the first ones to break it down for you. But yeah, it turns out AI tools are kind of amazing right now. Everything is going to be different from here on out for the rest of time. I had that hot take on Twitter where I compared it to crypto, just saying it has more usable things. And boy, does that ruffle feathers. Yes, it does. Boy, does that ruffle feathers. We'll get to that in a minute. But also, we want to talk about some Twitter news

and also about Apple possibly releasing something that they might not be super confident in. Just a different type of Apple, especially when you hear stories about the first iPhone and how they had to lock things down for Steve. Now it's a little different. Yeah, like a Fuji Apple instead of a Snapdragon Apple. Exactly. It's a different type of Apple but Fuji Apple, instead of a Snapdragon Apple,

it's a different type of Apple. But first we have a, we have a, we have a correction to make. Yeah. I, I have a correction. I feel like I led you all stray listeners and hosts. I said the Volkswagen ID two was similar to the. I was very wrong about that. That's why I'm a moron. So thank you.

Everyone. I, uh, to be fair, it does seem like the golf in the last couple years has gotten bigger but even still the old golf the id2 is smaller than that it's like the volkswagen polo which i'd never heard of never heard of that but overall smaller which goes kind of to what david was saying he wanted a smaller car to park easier this might be the one for you david i gotta say uh i also wanted to make a correction because uh i said that smart cars were really expensive and then i looked them up and they're only like fifteen thousand dollars used so it's because there's airbags sorry what oh you just instantly small trade-off the pull oh yeah the size of the pullout

looks much better for brooklyn i gotta say i think this might be in your future there was a video on twitter the other day of a truck tire falling off of the truck and then a air quotes small car rolling over it and being absolutely launched into the air yeah uh small cars are the soul isn't that small the soul is like a pretty decent size for what it is it is actually a normal size car yeah and i think like that video do you think it's also partially because the soul is like a flat front so when it hit the tire it like gripped onto it and launched it up rather than if it was like uh i mean this is a uh like crazy like if it was a lamborghini with a really aggressive front,

do you think the tire would have just launched into the air instead? Tough to say. If it was low to the ground. Yeah, low to the ground and slanted. Possibly. I will say that after I tweeted about this, several other people sent me other videos of other tires launching other cars into the air.

Really? So it might be dependent on the frontal area or shape of the car but I'll just say that new fear definitely unlocked after seeing this one yikes great good news about it person walked away yeah so car safety is getting fantastic it was also captured by this was by like the century the footage of the Tesla behind it imagine trying to explain that to insurance of like look man I was driving and then i was 12 feet in the air and then i was upside down i don't know what happened but i promise it wasn't my fault the skies opened up whatever you say luckily the guy with the wheel wasn't allowed to get away because he was missing

a wheel of a car fair um yeah so sorry off track yeah okay closer to ap polo that's our correction okay i still want to see what a polo size is though it's i think it was like uh 400 millimeters shorter than a golf explain millimeters yes but we are american so i don't actually know what that means we also have a correction to make over here at the producer's oh no wait no no, wait. No, we don't. We're great. Sorry. Didn't you guys get a trivia question wrong once? Mung beans returns. I did get the mung bean question correct. We'll just see it in 2025.

We'll see the ID2 and then you can know what Apollo looks like. That'll be a reference. Okay, let's talk about Dope Tech. We did a Dope Tech video of... So it turned out we had a theme. The theme was all it turned out we had a theme the theme was all of these devices we had rock bottom expectations for and they all were like kind of good at something even though we still wouldn't recommend them they did exceed our rock bottom expectations yeah uh

we we kind of changed it up at the last second it was going to be something else uh i'll talk through the things that i felt most strongly about which were mostly amazon astro and then we can get to the the shoes i also wanted to say i think david thought of the name you're a dope tech and i think that's what we should have called it interesting i think my name was doper than doug okay maybe that's why we didn't name it someone thought that you're a dope comma, and that would have been awesome. Both would work. Both would work. That one works better, though.

Okay. Yours would have gotten more clicks, I can tell you that. So Amazon Astro is not really for retail sale. We kind of had to go through a connection to get it, meaning there's a small group of people with access to purchase one for $1,500 or whatever it was. $1,600 now. $1,600, and we had to $600 now. $1,600. And we had to pay them to get it.

Still worth it. You know what it is? He's been chirping around the studio, rolling around, being entertaining for like a month or so. Honestly, I had no expectations for Astro to be good, you know? And its purpose, just for those who are unfamiliar, is it's this little helper robot that rolls around your home. And it has a couple features.

It's got a screen on the front with a face. It's got cameras and microphones. And, of course, it has wheels so it can roll around. So it'll be an Alexa robot. It'll answer your questions. It'll follow you around and be helpful, theoretically. And then when you leave your home, it can patrol your house and roll around from room to room

and notice if an unfamiliar face appears or if a loud sound or a window crashing happens, and it's your security device as well. That's the Astro theme in two minutes. And it's got a retractable camera that goes like four feet in the air. Yeah. It goes higher, but not that high. Barely counter height.

Yeah. So, I don't know. We first got it, and it roams around around the studio and it starts mapping things out. And then I'm like, I hear it behind me mapping things out. And then I open up like my browser and I look up Astro and it's like, Astro is an unmitigated disaster and throws itself downstairs. And I'm like, oh, this might not be great. But so that's where, that's my expectation started. You made a lot of memes about astro

throwing himself down the stairs yeah that was a long time ago maybe putting him at the top of the stairs but we never did it i think it's safe to say when we got the opportunity to get astro we wanted to throw it we wanted it to throw it we wanted to put it at the top of the stairs and turn the cameras on and just wait yes and then we wound up liking it just enough to not want to do that so what it does is it has this face that changes everything yeah and it just looks at you it's got these eyes and it just it it stares at you and when you walk into the room it looks over at you and goes hi i missed you and it like puts text on the screen and says david i missed you or sometimes i'll walk in and it'll be like

miles i missed you or then i miss it doesn't know who people are. Like it tries, but it's not always 100% right. But then it like, it has these sounds and these expressions. And so even though it's really bad at the things it's supposed to do, it does seem kind of like innocent and friendly. Where like, if I was a robber and I broke into a house, Like someone actually, someone did this where they tested Astro, where they like walked in, they snuck into a house

and Astro just like stared blankly right through them and nothing happened. So it's like, it is bad at most of what it does, but for some reason the face just personifies it just enough for us to not want to dunk on it all the time. When you anthropomorphize robots, they can be as useless as possible, but they're still really fun.

The apartment I used to live in, I used to live with Michael Fisher and we had this robot called Jibo that he's made a video on. He loved that thing. Oh yeah, I did too. We considered him part of the family. He doesn't even move around like Astro. He sits in one place and he sort of swivels and he dances

and he'll randomly show you a turtle or a magic trick. I've never seen this. Sorry, I just pulled it up. He's so cute. He was designed by one of the like an ex Pixar employee. Okay, that makes one more sense. And all his animations are like super adorable. They eventually went out of business, turned the servers off, and then the company got sold to like Kaiser P permanente or something and now they use them in hospitals with like dying children so yeah okay so they they

cheer them up yeah it's it's like you can anthropomorphize it a little bit but we don't want it to be like full-on humanoid because then it gets into creepy right so it's like just like it has a face it's like just friendly enough yeah uh and that's what makes it like acceptable but like every you get on the list of things it's supposed to do and one by one it's like oh this isn't actually as good as i thought like it's supposed to be able to like uh it follows you around sure if you ask it for a video it'll play a video on the screen sometimes we asked it when we ask it okay the first night we had it i said astro i'm not assuming anyone listening is it has an astro so i'm gonna set your astro off if you do i said astro play an mkbhd video and it pulled up a web page from

daily motion playing a pirated judge judy episode in like horizontally flipped because they didn't want the copyright strike on it and just played a full 45 minute episode of Judge Judy at ankle level not even full screen because it was on the daily motion page so it was fantastic so it does that sometimes

and then you'll ask it for something like what's the weather tomorrow and it'll just stare at you and not answer because it doesn't go I didn't understand that it just you say it's name the eyes turn blue and then you stare at you and not answer. Cause it doesn't go, I didn't understand that. It just, you say its name, the eyes turn blue and then you say the command and then you hope it does something. And if it doesn't, it just stares right back at you.

It doesn't do anything. Pretty much all these social robots are like really bad at what they're supposed to do, but they're so adorable that you just kind of love them. Like Astra rolls around and like gets in your way. And like, I've tripped over him once and I don't really care. He likes to sit right behind your ankles like

without you noticing like you have your headphones on at your standing desk and then he's just like hey. But it's just so silly and like when you ask him to do something and he does something so completely random like playing an episode of Judge Judy it's like this was worth the $1,600. Right like that's what most pieces of tech ordinarily if it was

this bad at all of the things it was supposed to do, it'd be like, this thing is terrible. Why would anyone want anything even near this? But because it's so friendly and cute, we're like, oh, I tried. And it's not even supposed I mean, I guess it's supposed to kind of be like that, but you're talking about Jibo, which is like it's supposed to be a social robot, right?

Astro is supposed to be able to do all these different things that could, I mean, let's be real. For sixteen hundred dollars, you could put like a wise cam in every single crevice of your entire house and do the exact same thing that like monitoring Astro could do. Yeah. But like you put a cup holder on an iRobot. Or you could just walk ten feet because somebody has to get the thing out of the refrigerator anyways. But like because he's so friendly, which isn't his main, main thing.

Like I said, we didn't want him to fall down the stairs it's literally the way he looks at you the way he acts a little bit he makes sound makes it yeah just cute enough to not want to just punt that thing across the room which is crossed my mind a few times the weird thing is those are all very intentional decisions yes coded the robot. Intentional, but there are plenty of companies that intentionally try and do that, and it doesn't work. And for whatever reason, no matter how frustrating Astro is, it worked and it made us not destroy. I discovered possibly the most annoying Astro feature yesterday. No way. Yeah. Another one?

More? Even more? Yeah. The one command Astro does with a hundred percent success is play chuck mangione couldn't tell you why well but he's never let me down with that one um but i discovered he has that mute button on the top that will not stop playing music like like it just mutes his personality so then you mute it and then you say astro stop playing music because you're

frustrated that the music's still playing but then he's muted so he doesn't respond to you well the mic is muted that's fair yeah that's what he's supposed to do no if i hit the shut up astro button it should shut up it shouldn't be like oh you want my personality but you're thinking about the mute switch wrong yeah the mute switch is like you have a camera and a microphone following you around your house all day. That's the make that stop button. Yeah. Yeah. I feel like in that scenario, you're like, I'm having a party and I want Chuck Mangione

playing, obviously. And you don't want other people to be able to change that Chuck Mangione is playing. So now you put the mute on. So he continues to play it and no one else can tell him what to do. Or you work at Amazon or you work at Google and you're on a video call and you've got your smart assistants in your apartment. You don't want them to just go off like crazy while you're on a video call and you've got your smart assistants in your apartment you don't want them to just like go off like crazy while you're on your video call it's weird it's weirdly good so the reason it made dope tech is because it's weirdly good at a few things

one of them is rolling around confidently yes so we don't have stairs but we do have like carpets and different levels or whatever of the studio and that thing like mapped out the studio once and it just rolls around right behind people's ankles goes underneath tripods like it seems extremely good at just going places he skirts objects with like millimeters yeah he'll clip an edge once in a while but he's hit my toes yeah well that's your fault to people but like you can drop something in the middle of the room that wasn't there when he mapped it and he'll just go right past it just like right around it which is fine yeah it did almost like strangle itself with some cables. Okay, I wanted to say, he one time,

yeah, there was a cable hanging near his docking station and he spun around and moved forward and got it tangled around his neck. His neck. And like just the, like watching him go forward and pull back a little bit and his eyes, I like ran over to save him because there was just this instinct in me

like that is that is real and he is dying he's in trouble it was so hard right now but that's just proof that like how good it is at acting like yeah thing yeah it's also very good at when you call it and this works best when there's no one else in the room but when i call it from anywhere in the room it turns around and looks right at me and it locks eyes with me. Triangulation of microphones. Incredible. Yes and I was trying to figure out how it's so good so like if I was 90 degrees to the right and I say hey Astro

it turns to the right and sees me. If I'm behind him he like turns his body and then hits me at 90 degrees but like if there's three other people in the room sometimes I'll be behind it and say hey Astro and it'll turn and face a different person so I think it's a combination of triangulating sound and finding a person,

and it just stops at the first person it sees. I think that's also a perfect way to describe how good and bad he is, because you can say, hey, Astro, it will do a 180, tilt its head up, look you dead in the eyes, and then you'll say, come here, and it'll be like, on my way,

and then spin around 180 and start looking for you again it makes no sense yeah so he's so cute he's got great speakers i love him i love him tim hates him for some reason ellis hates him too there are reasons do i hate astro oh astro yeah yeah rate him one to ten can we rate these three things can all of us give everything a rating all right astro okay yeah who wants to start as in as in i would actually buy it or just how much i like it rating conditions you just spent sixteen hundred dollars and you got astro and you're going to the purchase link and rating it on a 10 1 to 10 system like i had to actually spend the money yeah oh god one thousand six hundred dollars but i already spent it. Like, I had no choice. Sure.

Yeah. Can I return it? Yeah, but you still got to review it. All right. He already scraped his face on something, so you can't return it? I would give him a 6 out of 10. Wow.

Because he's really enjoyable to have around, even if he's really bad at what he's supposed to do. He does like hanging around around people. Yeah. Like, if he's in an empty room and he hears people in another room he'll go i'm gonna go hang out with y'all and just go like i want to get cats but i'm not home enough so i feel astro's perfect until it heats itself down a flight of stairs though i don't have stairs oh perfect and it has that like so six like when you come in after a while it's like oh good to see you

again that's like kind of nice. I know. It really is. There you go. If I had to rate it, I feel like it's so bad that if I spent $1,600, I'd want to rate it higher to try and gaslight myself into thinking that it was worth the $1,600. You're scoffing at other people, though. I don't know. Like if I actually spend money on it, it's like a 2 out of 10 just because it like makes me happy every once in a while but then when i want happiness is not worth more than 2 out of 10 stars not when the rest of its frustration all of my pants were frustration i would have given them

them at least a 3.5 out of 10 i think that's a bad rating damn well you just had them on backwards it's not true not true i i think in the video i gave it a five i think if i'd spent the money and wanted it in my home to do all the things i'd probably give it like a two wow yeah it's tough heartless what if amazon made a refrigerator that had a little docking station so it could dock in and actually put drinks in it that would be epic two and a half i was gonna say that is a like wild thing you would have to do and it would still barely increase the usability because they'd never have to get off of every twitch streamer has a small red bull refrigerator next to them they're also three feet from it all

the time yeah true yeah i feel like if i was like a 3d printing home builder type of guy i would have so much fun building all of these little things like a fridge that has a little arm that could, you know, yeah, so ramp. Yeah, just like building Astro accessories would be so much fun. But I have to give Astro zero because like, I feel a little hypocritical because David and I, you know, we talk a lot in private about how much we love the history of companies like bell labs that just threw unlimited money at at weird problems and developed like incredible things but like i i i can't justify a company like amazon being like let's make something bad for the hell of it instead of

like well they just had to release it early like all the engineers were like this is not ready and amazon was like but it's shipping but what's it for unmitigated disaster actually it's like it's like it's like they're actually making a product that's like we're doing this for literally no other reason than we have nothing else to do when it's like well to have a roaming microphone camera in your house yeah it's like i don't know i'm over it i i like i don't i don't i don't need to be like pumped up for this thing when we come in one day and the screen is just laying off of the body on the ground, we know who the number one suspect is. I don't want to break it, right?

Because it's $1,600, but I'm not going to be like that guy. But I've been so curious about what would happen if I just put it on its side. I'm afraid the screen's going to break. It probably acts like a cat and it goes, I can't handle this. I feel like it could turn its head and lift up and be like a horseshoe crab that flips itself up.

Oh yeah. If that's coded in, that would be unbelievable. We should try that. There's no way it does. If it can upright itself, I'm scared, man. That would be,

that's worth at least one star. If it can upright itself, The revolution is here. Yeah. All right, Adam. I'm going zero. What? Zero.

You guys don't like happiness love astro if we average this out astro is like zero zero my favorite thing we've gotten in the studio in so long but if i had to pay sixteen hundred dollars to have this in my house i'd be pissed you'd be already paid the sixteen hundred you're rating it after therefore i'm more pissed yeah you can still i would still return it because i need sixteen hundred dollars more than the astro and i would rate for the people reading your review they would they would have to know how bad it is. Because as a consumer, this doesn't do anything useful. That's what I'm spending the money for.

It's a pretty good speaker. The one thing I could say, if I'm imagining an Amazon employee in here right now, he'd be like, look, you could buy a separate 10-inch Alexa show and a Bluetooth speaker that's really good and a security system. Or you could buy them all in one. None of those are on wheels. And it runs around as friendly. Yeah, like it's stopped by any stairs.

Well, it has to be on wheels in order to be all three. But that's my devil's advocate. So what was your number? Two. Two, two, six. Zero, zero. So that's eight. And there's five of us.

So it got eight over five eight over five it got about a 1.3 we're going out of 10 right it's first grade 1.6 1.6 star average between us all right all right that's moving on that's probably fair i i love him i i want to tell a quick really quick story about jibo michael had this a really amazing story about jibo when he first got him where he like left on a work trip and Jibo was like in the living room and he had a roommate and at like three in the morning, Jibo just randomly started blasting, killing in the name of by raging against the machine. And his roommate was like, what is going on? And he walks in

the room and Jibo was just like dancing to it too. And yeah, incredible. Anyway, social robots. All right, let's move on. Okay, real quick. The last two, we had the Huawei Watch Buds. I did a short on it, eventually put it in this video. I didn't expect it to be great because of the theory that I mentioned, which is like two-in-ones

have to make some sacrifices some places. This is a decent Huawei smartwatch and a really convenient, really basic, low-level pair of earbuds that happens to go inside. The technology is good enough that it works. Three-hour battery life. The watch lasts more than a day or two. Cool.

I would never buy it because I don't need earbuds that instantly in my life. But I could picture if you're on the train and like, oh, I'm getting a call. I was expecting this one. Pop it out. Put one earbud in. You're good. It worked. So I'm getting a call. I was expecting this one. Pop it out, put one earbud in, you're good. It worked. So I gave it a seven in the video.

I was like, this concept is surprisingly usable for what I was expecting. Considering Huawei watches have really, really good battery life in general because they're not Wear OS, even with the cut down battery, it being over two days is like pretty good. The earbuds are really bad yeah but definitely for like in a pinch like you get a voice note or you're getting a phone call and

you just like really quickly need to listen to it yeah whatever and some of the tech is kind of cool how you can like put whatever earbud in each ear and it doesn't really matter and it just pairs automatically that was a dope tech very cool in. And the magnetic pairing, like all that stuff. Very cool. But yeah, I don't know. You'd have to buy a Huawei smartwatch and be happy with that. Let's say it's $600. What number rating could you give it?

$600. Yeah, $550-ish. I just think, I mean, it's hard to buy a smartwatch that isn't more integrated into the way that your smartphone actually works, right? Yeah. So, like, the Apple Watch is super integrated into all your Apple Health stuff. Any Android Wear watch is very integrated with all your Android apps. Huawei watches are, like, all the data is on there and then on the Huawei Health app.

And that's it. That's a good point. Yeah. I think I would give a higher rating to the concept and the execution than the actual product. Right. If like if the Apple Watch or the Pixel Watch pulled off the same thing, it would be more easy to integrate into our lives and that would be a better product. But this one I could literally never use. Yeah.

So. Yeah. Yeah. I'd probably give it a. Yeah. It's like the technology is really cool. I'd probably give it a four. OK.

Out of 10. Yeah. I really liked what you mentioned which i didn't know about until i watched the video so i've missed you guys the like how it can tell which ear it's in i think that could be something with earbuds in the future when they sound better being that small like it's cool how small they are like how much they fit into your ears obviously if they didn't sound very good who really cares um i could see it as like in almost all the scenarios you guys are talking about i think just pulling out your what truly wireless

earbuds would be like two seconds faster which i know we are like saving time if they're in your pocket what if they're in your bag then it's three i still don't think it's that bad but um yeah but like i could totally see this as being something like first gen like folding phone where like i'm willing to have worse battery life or sound on my headphones if somebody in the outside can watch me flip open my damn watch and put earbuds yeah like there's something cool about that the first samsung fold wasn't great but the people who saw you unfold a phone in public you're like yeah i'm that guy interesting also when you go to the tsa they don't make you take your watch off so you would also not have to put your earbuds in the tray which is kind of nice nice you know

hopefully you go through the metal detector and it doesn't go off yeah i go through the metal detector with like a belt and a watch and several things i think this was okay by that yeah i don't really care where it's so yeah i'll give it like five out of ten five okay dude i go through the metal detector so often i know exactly what i can do yeah yeah you gotta show me your belt bro because i'm not are you going through the metal detector or the i'm going through the standout yeah you need pre-check so you can do the metal detector and then it doesn't matter oh okay yeah i'm so i'm so used to my peasant normal TSA life, I forgot that that was even an option.

Pre-check is so worth it. Yeah. Best. A lot of credit cards will pay for you to do pre-check. So it's $200 every two years. If you fly enough and are in airports that have pre-check, it's very worth it. Yeah, it's very worth it.

Yeah. Anyway, what would you give it? Pre-check, 10 out of 10. I'm giving the concept a seven and the actual product a 1 like wow that was way worse than i thought i cannot use the product i mean i have to use a huawei phone and that would really bother me it's hard to do it based on like us being in the u.s and not being able to use huawei like right that's tough a lot of people said you could download the huawei health app on any android phone and then it might be able to pair.

But I'm not sure. I think we should. If I could give that the benefit of the doubt, and then I could maybe use it. I still don't love it, and it would be like a three. But yeah, I love the idea. The concept is well done. So there's that. Yeah.

You guys have any thoughts on the watch buds? I did not use them. Okay. Cool. I didn't use them, but just seeing you guys use them, probably like a one or a two. Okay. Wow.

So pretty middling rating for those. The last thing we got to try. 10 out of 10. I was going to. You guys all. Straight to the moon, baby. If you guys watched last week's episode, I did show off them, including my feet.

So if you want to see either my feet or the moonwalkers. Oh, you were wearing them the whole episode last time okay so andrew had the decently high expectations for them let's talk about what they are for the audio yeah what are they and did they live up to your expectations it's like uh you know the moving sidewalks at the airport it's like if you could strap that onto your feet every day so you could walk faster but walk faster not jog walk we love faster yes um yeah they're basically like wheels that you strap onto your shoes that have a hinge so you can still like go over press up on a toe and like go over stuff and also if you lock them you can walk upstairs without being like

it sounds like that anyways but at least there's a little toe movement when you're doing it um the i had i wanted these so bad i've wanted these since the second i saw them and i've been trying to convince you guys to get them and it took a lot of convincing um and then like casey made a video on them and i started seeing them and i was like i need to try these so bad um we got them i honestly still do think they were really fun the problem is is they're twelve hundred dollars they weigh four and a half pounds each so like walking around with them is so are they 1400 something like that okay walking with them normally you're supposed to be able to walk with them normally and then when you want to skate on them yeah walking with them normally you sound like a transformer clog so loudly it's so loud and even when you roll with them the wine

from the motors is so loud our building hates us i have loves us and hates us but um yeah i was excited for them i don't i like see the potential the thing about all of these is like i see the potential just enough in all of them i have a really hard time being at four and a half pounds super clunky and like if you want like what is the use case here you want to that's your we have a long walking commute and you want to go faster with less energy but you still want to use some energy so you don't want to use like a boosted board or a scooter but i try i've tried to pigeonhole this into it's a situation where it wins over something which is like hoverboard boosted board that's how i feel about all these items all of these but i i find a real struggle to like actually put the moonwalkers at the top of of some situation like i think in the video i ended up with being like

you have a short last mile commute from like the subway station to your office building, which involves the stairs out of the subway station. And you like already have them on and you like you walk through the city with that. Like you could still do that with a Segway or a hoverboard, but you'd have to pick it up for the stairs, but you don't want to pick it up. So you do that. It's like that's the one time i could see it being the best option but it's like astro it's like i can't really find too many other reasons to actually get it i have one use case where i think it would actually be pretty useful so i use my boosted board almost every single day but if it is either raining even lightly or if the streets are just wet because it did rain you can't really use a boosted board because it just throws water up at your legs and then my pants get soaked but these i can still

get somewhere faster and especially since i hang out most of the time i hang out in my neighborhood if i just like need to get you know eight blocks away to get to my friend's apartment or something much faster would you do it absolutely can i bring these home i would love to bring these yes so also it says designed with an adaptive ai drive train this is a pet peeve of mine yeah no it's not it's not just just don't use that word it's not ai you don't have to say it's a i it's probably adaptive it's probably very clever it's probably great software and well engineered you don't have to say it's ai you just don't have to also quick hack for your boosted board in the rain have you seen sam sheffer just takes a piece of cardboard and lays it on top true and then it just shoots all the water into the cardboard and then you just throw the cardboard out when it's wet yeah but then how do i get back i can find

another flip the cardboard over you can keep the cardboard till you get back i guess that's a good point does the water not splash up from the road it's a long board so it's outside of the uh the motors are protected it doesn't matter it splashes up onto my pants that's the issue i went to a party a couple weekends ago and i just showed up my pants were absolutely soaked and they were like wow what happened to you yes yeah interesting yeah so i'm gonna i'm gonna test these in brooklyn okay and then see how people react and i'll film it based on what you've experienced so far, you've spent $1,399 on these. You waited the time required

because it's a Kickstarter. You got the pre-order. What's your rating? Oh, God. A three. Because I like them and they're fun and once you get used to them, you can get pretty good at them.

They do actually go over bumps and stuff pretty well because they have nine wheels on each foot, which is really cool. They do have a lot, yeah. They're like 10 pounds each so your ankles start hurting and also the side muscle in your right leg starts hurting a lot.

Hip flexors. Hip flexor stretch. Yeah. Also, when you get to your destination like what do you just keep wearing them or you take them off so you gotta take them off like any other last mile like a scooter you'd have to put it in the corner somewhere like yeah i think their ultimate goal would be you keep wearing them oh god oh god you gain some height yeah that's show up to taller. I gained at least two inches, which was pretty dope. Feeling taller. So the number is like what?

Out of 10. Three. Three out of 10. Yeah. All right. Imagine this. For that much money. David, raining outside, wants to go to the cafe in Brooklyn.

I'll film those, dude. Moonwalkers. Yes. Walking down the street. Pops open his smartwatch to pull his earbuds out yes and then astro's following behind him and then i have that triple screen macbook adapter so i get to my cafe i open that up and then i put the nreal glasses on and plug those into my mac and astro can grab your coffee when it's ready from the barista if you somehow don't get jumped

doing all this it'll be a miracle i only live three blocks away from this cafe so i really hope you walk in like jesus is jason this guy is out of control okay well i'm gonna do this i'm just saying i'm i'll film it i'm gonna give the moonwalkers like a 10 out of 10 i'm i'm between one and two oh my god between one and two can't give half scores but it's because okay one it's a one but it's like the the current iteration of the tech like just how i was impressed with the technology of the watch buds i was like man this has got to kill the battery of either the watch buds or the watch and it turned out like you still get two days on the watch and three hours on the buds i was like that's pretty good tech i guess we can do it at

this point with these it is proven that the tech is not at a point where it is a reasonable product over the other things. So I would never recommend to anyone these over any of the other options. Yeah. It also says walk at the speed of a run and it's really walk at the speed of a jog. Which is still impressive.

Yeah, I do like that you can feel the wind in your hair when you're just walking ellis was jogging next to us while i was just casually walking like all you do get the speed still uses a lot of energy because you have to lift up the 10 pound shoes and you're kind of tired by the time you stop i'm going to recommend one of those hoverboard things more i do want to use these on a moving escalator in there airport. Oh my God. That's Jason Bourne, right? Dude, that's like literally flying. That's Back to the Future 88.

I will say every time I fly out of JFK in the Delta terminal, I'm always like the last gate and it takes me like 20 minutes from security to get to that gate. I would fly there. You could strap these on on the airplane. That's a good use case.

I will say when I was in the hallway of the building, I was like testing them and shooting them, walking down the hallway and it's like clomp, clomp whirring sounds. And I got to the end of the hallway and I just hear them and shooting them walking down the hallway and it's like clomp clomp whirring sounds and I got to the end of the hallway and I just hear someone poke out in another suite and go that's that's it that's the sound and that's because this entire week we've been clomping

through the hallway and they're going what is that and like two heads poked out and they were like what is that and I was like it's I don't know man it's bad we've been having a lot of people just like poke out and film us yeah so like through the airport you would get to the gate faster but not without some great stairs I don't know, man. It's bad. We've been having a lot of people just poke out and film us. Yeah. So through the airport, you would get to the gate faster, but not without some great stairs. Yeah.

Can you bring them straight on the plane? Do they have too much battery? I doubt it. No, probably not. You'd be fine, right? Also, they're not going to check. They'll be so confused. Yeah, they're just going to be confused. Battery is three amp hours, 3,000 milliamp hours.

Okay. Either way, you're good. That's pretty small. Yeah. That's smaller than a phone. Yeah. Than most phones. Well, anyway, if you haven't seen that Dope Tech video,

when you stop your car or however you're listening to this, you should go check it out because all of these products are really ridiculous. There's no way to appreciate how it looks and sounds until you watch the video. So definitely do that. All right. We've got to take a quick break. But before that, let us do some trivia. Trivia, dude. Trivia, dude. All right. do that yeah all right we got to take a quick break but before that let us do some trivia trivia dude trivia dude all right first question we asked david before this he got to pick the topic of today's trivia questions so ellis asked him what he wanted he said transformers

i was going to do a question about optimus prime ellis talked me out of it so we're just going to do regular transformer questions so now when you say regular transformer this is a good power transformer like power stations and AI should said camera sensors could be a next week okay so the word transformers was introduced by a team at Google in 2017 what was the name of that team? Oh, I know this. Okay. Marques, you have no idea?

Yeah. Can we get a bonus point for knowing the name of the paper? No. No, because the name of the paper is famous. The team, I feel like, is not famous. Do you think these guys know it? No. Okay, let's go to ad break. Let's stop making fun of us.

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Yeah. It's spooky. It's terrifying. It's like one of the things with dolly is like specifically you can't do people yeah there was a reason for that and that was for safety yeah it was even just like vague people too right just like any old random person like so it wouldn't use sources with likenesses and like real celebrities like you could ask it for mkbhd but it would spit out like a kind of a generic looking black guy.

But if you ask it for a generic looking black guy, you will get one, but like it won't spit out someone's likeness intentionally. And then the messing up was just like, Dolly not being great at that point. Yeah. Okay. So yeah, this is the total opposite of that. This doesn't care at all.

You can now do celebrity faces there's some crazy examples i posted some of snoop dogg in different um yeah it's in different tv shows and they are good he's in cheers he's in the office star trek i mean these are these are good some of them are pretty obvious like this x files one the dog is very obviously not a real picture but like some of these you could assign felt these are i mean like to the audio listeners these are good like really girls like i would not be surprised if this was just actually a maybe they were doing like a skit on saturday night live and like this could be an actual frame this looks so close it's not photorealistic but it looks like a photo with a filter over it yeah it's so close i mean the proportions are everything is

correct i mean look at the breaking bad one that one's pretty sharp it still doesn't look like a photo but it is the sharpest looking one i think some of the older shows are like have almost like a filter over because it was filmed at an earlier time and all of the stuff it's gathering from there looks a little more off or like not as sharp but the other thing is is like with being able to do celebrities and stuff we're now getting all these posts on twitter that are one either fake and seem really real or we're getting real pictures that you don't know if they're ai or not um i think like over the last week we saw a bunch of fake ones of Trump getting arrested. And the one that got me,

and actually I didn't even realize this was fake until I started looking for writing this episode, the Pope in this really fly, big, white jacket. That one looks really realistic. I'm still looking at it, and you could convince me this was a real photo. Yeah. It's just kind of terrifying.

And starting to get hands correct. That's the most terrifying part. Yeah, it'll still mess them up a little bit. But even if like with a sixth finger, if you're looking at it, you don't really notice off the bat. Yeah. It's like when-

It's not mangled like it used to be. Exactly, yeah. But some of these are way too real. The internet is going to be a terrifying place really soon. And I'm kind of worried about it. I'm almost worried about like something being real and so ridiculous. And somebody can then say, oh, that was AI. That wasn't actually me.

Yeah. I just have to. Sorry, this is totally off topic. I was trying to log into the mid journey discord and I got a captcha and it says, pick the one that has a rugby ball i don't know what a rugby ball looks like so there's like four different sports let me just pick what i think a rugby ball is an ai would know what a rug i was on the the mid journey um yeah right the mid journey subreddit is really good and if you pick the best ones of like the

last month when it seems like this released they are fantastic yeah um but for all the worry that we have with photos here i did there is some ai generated videos coming out of of actual people with likeness and i know you haven't seen it i know david saw it have you two both seen the will smith ai generated video i have not seen it okay well i want you two to watch this and um you can tell me if you're still worried about AI right now. Okay, interesting. It is a video of Will Smith eating spaghetti. Is it this?

It's the link in the doc. Okay, I'm clicking it. Is there sound? No. Okay, I'll just... Oh! I love the Shutterstock logo. Okay.

I also love that the person that tweeted this tweeted text to video. It's so over. For the audio listeners, this is a monstrosity. We'll drop it in the show notes. This is incredible. However, I gotta say that while it's really, really, really bad now, give this three months and it will be way better.

That's exactly it. This is super, super early. And we're not impressed by it because we've seen the photos look so good. Yeah. But as soon as it starts getting like more accurate and the physics and the reflections and things that come from that, it's just going to look like a render. Yeah. Like it's going to get closer and closer and closer to photorealistic until it passes for a real clip. This is what I was talking about back when I did the original Dali video.

I was like, well, Dlly is getting pretty good now, but let's just fast forward a bit. It gets really, really good. It makes good pictures. It gets even better. It makes good video clips. It gets even better. It makes a half hour video essay all by itself.

It has its own YouTube channel. It gets even better. It makes the Mandalorian. It keeps going, right? The tech gets better and better. So yeah, when I see this, I'm like, I'm not impressed obviously because it's not that good now, but it's very clear that it's going to better and better. So, yeah, when I see this, I'm like, I'm not impressed, obviously, because it's not that good now.

But it's very clear that it's going to keep getting better. And then the questions get very different. I don't want to, like, does Will Smith actually eat spaghetti? I don't know. Not like that. I don't know, man. I hope not like that. I don't know.

It's basically clipping into his face. Yeah, his face is, is like distorting completely the spaghetti is just like giant globs of but i just wanted to throw that in there to like ease us down a little bit for right now even though yeah give this three months he's eating it just with handfuls of spaghetti give this three months um also i mean related to this um there was this tweet or not tweet this article that went up this morning. Apparently, Elon and a bunch of AI researchers put out this public paper that they signed today that said, please, like, stop advancing AI for at least the next four months. Because they're six, six months because they are terrified of the speed at which it's like getting used for bad things.

Did you guys read that the the ARC paper that came out last week? Because they are terrified of the speed at which it's getting used for bad things. Did you guys read the ARC paper that came out last week? The absolutely terrifying ARC paper? The one with the... The one about TaskRabbit? Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Dude, OpenAI has a division called the Alignment Research Team. Or the Alignment Research Corpus.

Or it's ARC. I forget what the c stands arc is pretty sick it's essentially what they're trying to do is figure out is chat gpt evil that's like the the funniest most generalized way i could say not let's make it not evil it's is it already evil specifically what they're trying to test is they're trying to see if we give chat GPT the ability to replicate itself and then assign tasks to those replicas, as well as execute code and use a web browser, what would it do? I can just do it. So in this experiment, they also created a dialogue window where they could sort of see GPT's thoughts, like so they could understand why it's doing what it does. Essentially, they gave it $60 in a bank account and said, make as much money as you can. And I know people have

been doing this on Twitter and TikTok. This is different. Yeah. What it did is try to do some investing, stumbled across a CAPTCHA. So how did it get through the CAPTCHA? It created an account on TaskRabbit and told someone on TaskRabbit it lied to them, saying, I'm a blind human and I need to pay someone to help me do this. And in its dialogue box, it said, I need to lie to this person because if I admit that I'm a robot it won't help me and they put that on page 54 of this paper they like put it in the very back as if

this is like not huge and they won't release any of the other details of the tests they won't say anything else about it they're just like oh by the way ChachiBT knows how to lie yeah it's interesting because this is what we were talking about before say anything else about it. They're just like, oh, by the way, ChatGPT knows how to lie. Yeah. And it's interesting because this is what we were talking about before when we were talking about AI getting creative and then the problem with AI is it fundamentally hasn't really been able to tell when it's lying to us or not. Like in its current version, if you ask Bing or ask

even Bart at this point for something, it will regularly hallucinate things incorrectly. Like I'll ask it like, write a bio for me and it'll write like 75% of it will be right and then some of it will be wrong. And it's just because it's filling in the next word and the next word and some of them are just wrong. And it just doesn't know to incorporate that in the way it builds out the sentences. And so to hear that it is completing tasks and some of those tasks involve deciphering what's real and what's not and then choosing what's not because who put a moral compass in gpt nobody then that is that is much more interesting that's really weird they're they're also finding this is earlier in the paper and it's it's unrelated to the test i just said but they are are finding that GPT-4 is able to come up with its

own motives and directives and stick to them across a long term. So it can get an idea in its head and then like function off of that idea or value for quite some time. Which was a feature at the beginning. Like when you talk to Google assistant and you're like, how tall is Wilt Chamberlain? And then you're like, what team did he play for? What's he like? It remembers that you're talking about Wilt Chamberlain and that're like how tall is walt chamberlain and then you're like what team did he play for what's he like it remembers that you're talking about what chamberlain and that was like oh we built that in because that's a super useful thing it's conversational it's more natural it's more intelligent and now we're kind of like oh i'm i'm memory and attention i'm spooked man yeah it's a bit spooky one of the interesting things about these AI tools is what it spits out, there's this like human layer of like when I see it, how fast can I tell it's AI?

So if I'm in just like regular context and I see a piece of text, I'm not really in this is it AI or not like critical mode. So I might just like digest the text and just think it's like a normal thing a human wrote. But when it's a photo or a video and i click on it i don't know if it's just me or the way i i make videos so i'm more critical of it but i'll notice things and be like oh wait a second is this ai like my brain thinks about that more quickly so it depends on the medium and i think the text is getting so good that it's passing for regular human activity more often and in more situations, which is fine because that means we can use it as tools. But it's also really tricky because now you

have to think about the morals of that way earlier. Yeah. It's interesting because there's like a number of ways that you can think about the way that AI is advancing itself. And it's sort of already past this critical threshold where like, you can't, we're not really going to be able to stop people from training models, like Stanford trained a model for $600 last week, which would normally cost millions of dollars. So there's a couple of approaches. But the one that people are talking about more often now is like, let's let things mess up in public very early before it's dangerous. The problem is the more that this gets democratized to people,

the less they're going to be like transparent about how it's messing itself up. Also, the ARC stands for Alignment Research Center, and it seems like it actually is independent of OpenAI and OpenAI let them run the test, and then OpenAI published their results. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I tweeted,

ChatGPT is built into my weather app, Carrot. Did I do this last week? Did I tell you guys what it did? And it wrote this really sarcastic, it burned me super hard, like really fast. And I'm like, oh, these really niche but interesting training applications of a little chatbot inside of an app is really cool and useful. And I kind of like that that is a thing that we can do now but it comes

with all the baggage of like well you could do a terrible version of that too and we're just trying to not let people do that yeah trying for for people that don't alignment is like specifically when you train an ai and it's just doing things you don't necessarily expect. And so alignment is basically guiding that AI towards the intended purpose. I totally thought it was a Dungeons and Dragons reference. Oh, no. No, it's that research center is basically like, what are these AIs doing right now? Because you can only predict to a certain extent, like what their capabilities are going to be. And then the alignment center would be like, OK, it's doing this.

So what do we need to code into it to make it move more towards the intended purpose right it's not like chaotic neutral no no no um anyway yeah sam allman talks about alignment a lot when they talk about training gpt models um but as for how quickly we're going to be able to stop these things from just like getting out of alignment, I don't, I don't know. I think we're kind of passing a, a threshold where people are just going to start training models like crazy. Cause if it went from, it costs hundreds of millions of dollars to train a model to Stanford trained it for $600 within like a month, you're going to be able to train a model for like

six bucks in like a year. And then anyone can train their own micro model and then the level of like misinformation or whatever you can spread, but that's going to be insane. Yeah, I was talking about this. I was doing a video shoot in the city the other day, which every time we explore like a new tech,

it becomes more and more obvious, but every tech has like two arcs instead of one. The top arc is the ceiling of how good the very best version gets and the bottom arc is how accessible the easiest to use version gets so if you just talk about like i don't know batteries for example like the absolute highest end best batteries might be in like aircraft or military applications or crazy things but then the easiest like lowest end barrier to entry version is like a Duracell in your pocket to power some remote control.

And so like these AI tools also have both of these arcs. And I am much more excited by the lower arc of like accessible, like training a model for six bucks, like having a chat bot in a weather app, like having this email tool help write excuses for me, like all that's great. But then the highest end of that arc is the terrifying one. Yeah.

That's the scary one. The military applications. So that's where I'm at with this. Yeah. So Will Smith eating spaghetti. Yeah. That's what we're talking about right now. That's what can keep us grounded for the next month.

Give us more spaghetti gifts. Just keep remembering that. Yeah. Just keep it in your mind well speaking of crazy things we saw on Twitter also Twitter Wow another Twitter feature I'll just I'll just pull up the tweet Elon tweeted

because we were in the process of like figuring out what verified even means or does anymore old verified check marks new verified check marks Twitter ID like whatever okay it's all happening he tweeted to get a blue check verified for seven dollars a month sign up at t.co slash blue so that's a different link the first thing he announced was that on april 1st that all verified like all legacy verified users will be erased unless you're spending the eight dollars so basically switching over into this new verified

which is eight dollars but that tweet he said seven dollars but also sometimes it costs eleven dollars for like the ios tax yeah if you're going through the through your phone in which case you're going through an app store which takes a 30 cut then you pay more to make up for that so okay elon was um he said seven dollars a month but it's only if you pay for an annual plan if you pay monthly it's eight dollars a month okay so it's 11 if you do it through like through ios play store ios and then it's eight dollars a month if you do it monthly and seven dollars a month if you do it annually got it so easy sweet so just i'm glad elon has no confusion when he announces new things yeah is twitter slowly going to become a paywalled service yes is that what's happening i have a feeling at the very like eventually they're just going to be

like if you want to use twitter you have to pay for it because that's what i'm just fast forwarding this stream of consciousness which is like okay if you want to have your your replies prioritized and you want to show up in this and you want to be like all these your verified user and all that stuff then you must be twitter blue and eventually it's just like you can just there's no rules you can just put whatever you want behind twitter blue like oh to send a tweet you must be verified yeah like you could just you could just you could view the whole thing behind a paywall yeah is next announcements not that far off from what you're saying which is by april 15th in order to come up in the for you page which i think everyone knows what the for you

page is at this point it's just like recommended it's recommended basically yeah so it's algorithmically generated exactly and it's i hate it as well it's so addictive it's really bad i hate how addictive it is i scroll it basically like i scroll instagram reels and i keeps going i hate both of them because i just, I just lose so much of my time to it. It is insane. Pretty rough. Well, maybe it will be better or worse because now in order to show up in that you have to be a verified user. So you have to be paying for Twitter blue. Okay. I saw an insane stat yesterday that 50% of people that pay for Twitter blue have less than a thousand followers and a huge number of Twitter Blue have less than a thousand followers. And a huge number of those people

have less than a hundred followers. So the For You page is going to be all people who generate the least value on the network. Because if they don't have that many followers, that means they're not making that much content. That's tough. It's weird. I'm a big believer in like the market

usually can push towards what works best and if like the users that are generating the most value are not being recommended you're kind of pushing against the market forces all right but like the people that have like less than 100 or like less than 10 followers there was a number of them had zero followers those people are probably the people that are just tweeting like had my macaroni for lunch today yeah like the best stuff on the for you page right now is from people who are not who are who are verified who are making a bunch of stuff who are about to be unverified yeah yeah it's all like kind of a weird scenario because one of the things i do like about twitter is when that viral tweet about i just ate macaroni

this morning happens to hit the perfect timing and does get hundreds of thousands of likes and that's the random but like totally well i think we're also going to lose a lot of that because of the people who don't want to pay eight dollars you still though just to clarify you still on the for you page will get all the people you normally follow whether they're verified or not yeah but now it's this scenario of like elon it seems like what they want is like any aspiring influencer is going to want to pay eight bucks so you're like kind of preying on them and also all the people who already do make a living on twitter you're gonna have to pay the eight

dollars or else now you're losing so much outreach and i have a pretty hot take that the people that like pay to artificially boost their content are the people that are making the worst content yeah like on on youtube right i think that's a normal i agree yeah yeah yeah so so it's like if you're if you're like constantly going on being like please watch my video please watch my video it probably isn't a good enough video to just naturally do well and so if you're trying to boost your content constantly you're probably making worse content and it's the people that want to pay for twitter blue that want to want their content to be pushed by the algorithm yeah that are probably not making as good of content because it's usually like random people that make those funny funny jokes that go hyper viral yeah

yeah you know total one-off joke or then you post your soundcloud after and like but that's the stuff i loved on twitter totally just like totally random like same perfect joke perfect and I feel like it would be more it would be unverified people that are making those exactly I agree which is why if you only do the verified people and the verified people are only the people that weren't verified in the first place they're making that I just yeah anyway I also like I want to brainstorm something here like let's imagine you decide, I know you like Twitter Blue because it, like you like some of the features.

You like edit tweets. It's something we've liked for a long time. If you just decided you didn't want to pay for Twitter Blue anymore, now you're unverified. And let's say you and a bunch of other very big creators, like you could argue you bring people to Twitter. You have enough of a following, a couple million. Like if a bunch of those people decide now they don't want to pay anymore

just through whatever reason they want, now you're not recommending them. Are you ultimately now taking people who drive people to your site and punishing them? Are you going to now potentially make the For You page a page you spend less time on because you're not getting as much quality stuff on like this reminds me feels bad of facebook yeah that's a bad yeah that's a great not a good path but facebook is notoriously like pay-to-play like you the as soon as you start

boosting your posts which you kind of have to do to get them viewed by your entire following right you become dependent on paying for your content to be seen which is i mean facebook meta makes money sure but it's like everyone kind of knows facebook is a graveyard for like the worst content i don't i don't go to facebook to see valuable fun timely jokes and things like that that's just not what happens on facebook just boomer content and so And so when you pull up this Twitter method, which is kind of going down the same path, which is, all right, you could choose to not pay, but the market will just swallow you up

and the people who do pay will go to the top and you not paying will not be seen, period. That's how it is on Facebook and that's how it kind of looks like it's gonna end up being with people who choose not to pay for Twitter blue. So yes, Facebook has leveraged money out of me and Twitter is now going to leverage eight bucks a month out of me, which is not as bad as Facebook because you have to pay like more than you should

to get viewed by your followers on Facebook. Um, but that's kind of how it feels. It reminds me of originally Elon said that only blue verified people were going to show up in the for you page at all and then he sort of rolled it back the next morning and said but your fault the people you follow will also show up in the for you page right so i feel like that should have been obvious but i also think i mean i didn't think that was obvious just because of how many bad decisions twitter has made yeah it just means that you won't show up to people who don't know who you are already yeah so like that ultimately stunted or whatever that is a lot of what twitter is like a lot of times some of my favorite stuff on twitter

is because like a lot of people i know liked things or because something within my like i've been seeing a lot of awesome devil's tweets recently from accounts that i don't know about because like they're on a pretty good streak right now and I love that content like it is it's good discoverability the reason that you hate like Instagram reels is the same reason it's so successful it's like a lot of the most successful and best social media things right now yeah are by surfacing content that you weren't following totally showing you the coolest stuff that you were never going to see otherwise coolest that's TikTok the most Instagram reels that's That's TikTok, that's Instagram Reels, that's the For You page, that's all that stuff, right?

And so if you move in this, like I'm just fast forwarding now, like you make Twitter blue, this like site-wide thing where nobody who's not paying gets recommended. Okay, now you just nuked most of the interesting content that people were spending meaningful time on Twitter engaging with.

I think that's backwards. I mean, it's pretty backwards. The ultimate goal on all of these social media websites is to keep you on the site as long as possible, right? I feel like limiting this for you page, which is supposed to keep you on as long as possible, is bad. It's bad. You're going to spend less time on Twitter. And that's not what Twitter wants. Maybe that's's what we want maybe it's beneficial for us but it's not beneficial for making any money yeah yeah for a company that just got valued at half of what it got paid for less than half not not a great look well and elon said they got valued at 20 billion but everyone else was like it's way lower like yeah who would buy twitter right now you know i'll buy for eight bucks second elon i convinced you not to buy it again yeah yeah so i

do wonder how long it's going to be until the money just runs out because they have to pay like a billion dollars a year just in the um in the loan money i was gonna say not if they keep firing everyone yeah they have to pay like an insane amount in just an interest and i think i saw a stat that only 1.5 percent of legacy verified users are paying for Twitter blue right now. 1.5%. Dude, it's really, like just in general, there are not a lot of, it was like 280,000. Yeah, 280,000 verified users.

And then 1.5% of these people are paying for it. So it feels like there are like two paths forward that people like Elon are probably considering. One is just max, just sprint towards profitability. Yeah. And the other is like long-term health of the platform. Yeah. And if you sprint towards profitability, you trim all the loose fat, like you get rid of all the things and you try to get as many people paying as possible. You will probably achieve that at the expense of the future of the platform because now it'll look just like Facebook.

On the other end of it is like showing people random things like recommending new things they wouldn't have seen otherwise for you, Paige, showing people all this diverse content and then getting them to spend more time on the site and then slowly getting ads in there. Kind of like where TikTok is at, kind of like where YouTube Shorts is at, Instagram Reels. It's not the best way to be profitable, but it is the healthiest platform. So pick a road and commit to it and see what happens, I guess. Well, when you've got a lot of debt,

then you pick that road. You can do it. It seems like that's what, and if it's 280,000 blue users right now, and let's say FOMO with these next couple of updates coming up, bring more people into that. I still can't see it being a number that is healthy for the platform, like enough to save the platform. And then you're still sprinting down the path of destruction, which just, I mean, I mean, here's a, right. Am I not?

It's like, but like, just to show, I feel like this was, I thought this was kind of funny. It was a rumor, so let's take it with a grain of salt. But there's a leak of potentially a Twitter blue settings page where you could hide your blue check mark because apparently so many people who are subscribing to Twitter blue

are getting made fun of for paying for Twitter. So you still get the algorithmic boost, but you don't have to be shamed for paying. So if you're one of those like 30 follower twitter blue verified users who are getting made fun of every time they respond to something you can hide it it's so funny have you i asked you guys this before and you had one example but have you ever seen something where you pay to be to be like the premium tier of something but then also you're like i don't want people to know i'm which is exactly tinder yeah that This is the Tinder example we were talking about. The newest, highest paid Tinder feature

is to be able to scroll Tinder, but not show up. Right. So you're just able to just match with people. It's like a shame. That's like shady, though. Or shady. But it's also like on Twitter,

it's like a hide this out of shame button. Exactly. But the people that feel the most shame are probably the people that are most willing to pay for it which is really depressing it is what it is i'm really taking advantage of all like it is it's a shame there are real people getting shamed for it and but it's also like wasn't the original point so like you can verify that you're a real person yes why would you pay to be a real person but then hide it and nobody knows because you get made fun of because it's not about being a real person that's not what the verified badge even means i guess yeah basically just twitter plus yeah it's just

being able to be surfaced more that's all it is i do want to say exactly what you said though elon's reasoning for saying the for you page should have the verification is because that proves there will be no it's the only way to combat the bots and ai bot swarms on the for you page but also at the same time it just like i must be if i'm a if i'm a bot with like well i don't get that much on my i don't see ai bot swarms on any for you pages on any social media maybe i'm missing that i know it's constantly being combated but like i scroll tiktok and i i get i get tiktoks listen i'm with you i'm sure it's out there somewhere but like also at the same, if I'm a bot whose ultimate goal is to either like spread misinformation or scam people like I'll pay $8 like that seems like a great return on investment. What's stopping them from getting

verified? Exactly. Nothing. Yeah. Interesting. Damn. We are dumping on Twitter a lot. There was one thing recently that I haven't seen an announcement for on Twitter that I actually think is a great idea. Whoa. And i think i've only seen it in very small scenarios but i do think it's a kind of a cool new feature we're only allowed to be negative here we're only sorry i'll throw my one thing in there so all of our negative things yeah go for it okay um if you look at carl pay's um profile on twitter right now oh Oh, yeah. He has, it says Carl Pay. Next to it has his blue checkmark. And then next to that, it actually has the Nothing logo.

And if you were to click on that, it'll bring you to the Nothing page. Or if you click on that in your Twitter app, it'll come up and say, Carl Pay is a verified user based on his affiliation with Nothing, which is a verified company. Because now we have yellow check marks for verified companies um which there's not that many verified companies because it costs a ton it's like a thousand a month or something also really quick how come blue check verified is flat but the like uh yellow check verified is like 3d and has a shadow design and design tim's losing his mind but so i can only find it on like carl's

and someone said a different i found one on a twitter designer she has a little twitter logo next to her check mark you click on it i think that's really cool i think so you can tell who's why someone's verified based on a company and like you said it costs a ton of money to get company verified yeah why don't we charge companies verification process based on their size and then they get to delegate actual verified users on who works with them then you can have a bunch of journalists and reporters and stuff like that who actually get verified without having to pay eight dollars a month and can actually show that they're a part affiliated with the company like this seems like what could have been a very good way to

handle twitter verification and actually make some money off of charging companies who are willing to pay it as a business expense yeah yeah everyone who writes for a certain site exactly right part of a why isn't cnn doing this why isn't fox doing this like why and then all their reporters why aren't they good for like journalists and people that hide like important scary companies exactly um but it wouldn't really work for like regular celebrities because like who are they affiliate true and like it would in our scenario would marquez be like he is verified but also under mkbhd but if like and then we could be verified under that like mkbhd page it's an interesting i don't know i thought it was a cool step i think

it's a cool feature it's also on like 10 accounts that i can find tim cook doesn't have it satya doesn't have it yeah elon doesn't even have it seems like it's only twitter amazon and um and nothing nothing the the three the three giants of the tech world yeah big three guys roku's next right deep cut deep cut um they lost all their money is that all we have to say about twitter i think that's all i have to say about twitter for now for now i think that's a good one i miss flamingo don't pay for twitter oh you can't even pay for waveform if you could you should pay for waveform instead of twitter we're cooler that's true if you gave me eight dollars a month i would smile if you gave twitter eight dollars a month elon would smile. If you gave Twitter $8 a month, Elon would not smile. Take that into consideration, folks.

Before we do our ad break and do our little last bit about Apple, let's take a quick trivia detour. Alright, to try and bring in a little more fun into this episode, we're going to do another audio round. One of Ellis' favorites. One of his favorites. The listeners love that.

All right. So if you can tell me what piece of high voltage electrical equipment makes this sound. Also, maybe this sound. Oh, yes. Also this sound oh yes also this sound and maybe this sound oh my gosh it's not all the same sounds they were very similar that's this and that one same device if you can name it you get the same exact device or same type of device? Same type of device. I think I have this. I think, anyway, yeah, whatever. No one cares what I think.

I do. Oh. Ad break. As a Fizz member, you can look forward to free data, big savings on plans, and having your unused data roll over to the following month. Every month. At Fizz, you always get more for your money. Terms and conditions for our different programs and policies apply. Details at Fizz.ca.

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Curiously, that's exactly what we were going to talk about in this last segment. That makes it even easier because we get to overanalyze the invitation, which I'll describe for our audio listeners. But our video listeners are looking at it now. Appears to be a series of lenses in concentric circles which if you've ever seen a VR headset is just what they look like from the inside. It's a bunch of concentric lenses and circles in a lens in a VR headset.

That's also the rainbow at Apple Park. It is of course and that's probably what they would all say but come on. No I know. It's like supposed to be both. Exactly. Oh and that's the Apple logo. Got it. Wow. and it says wwdc uh so that's that's where we're at i think what's a little more interesting is we are expecting some sort of a mixed reality headset or something like that and the story behind it is really interesting which is as secretive as a company as apple is it's kind

of leaked out that like they're really pushing to have the headset ready to go by wwdc and it doesn't seem like it's actually going to be ready to go which is something we've heard about other previous products um the famous well i was gonna say the famous iphone original iphone launch story is like steve jobs at the last minute going you know what we can't do resistive. We need a glass capacitive touchscreen. And that being a last second pivot and that being a huge differentiating factor for the iPhone. And this might be Tim Cook's moment of like, last second, get this thing ready to go. We're late. We need it to ship. It's happening now for Apple's mixed reality headset, whatever it's going to be.

But yeah, there's a lot of turmoil. Some apparently employees have left the project. Some questions being asked inside Apple HQ. I'm very curious about it. The New York Times had an article just saying about how there are some engineers and people working on the project who are expressing a lot of doubt on the release of the device and whether or not it's ready. And like you said, some of them have gone as far as like exiting the actual project um but i do believe there's a rumor that they showed it off to about 100 investors or something or board members in january and now that it should be launched or not launched announced at wwc so this is the thing because like wwc first of all is a worldwide developer conference it's where they go over software. It's where they talk about code, apps, possible new platforms, things like that. And so if you announce a product at WWDC, notoriously Apple announces a product and it's ready to go shortly after. Announced today, shipping in two weeks. Announced today, shipping this friday that type of thing

it would feel kind of un-apple like to go hey wwdc new ar vr platform developers start your engines but the product isn't coming till next year so here's something that i read in this article that i don't think we've talked about and maybe you guys have seen it other than i have but two things i've learned from here that mark kerman said was one that the device is going to cost three thousand dollars yeah yeah which is crazy but it also seems like this is a developer this is like specifically a developer device and that remember we talked about once there was rumors already of the second gen yes that will be the consumer cheaper version yeah that we'll see next year so this is potentially and makes perfect sense for wwdc a like developer only product

but still costs the developer three thousand dollars yeah and then the public can't buy it no you could because you know what happens like the metacost pro right so apple announces products and like if they show it on stage people people are going to try to buy it. For sure. So if it's available to the public, you know how there was like that old, that early Apple Silicon Mac Mini or whatever it was. And it was like, if you want to develop for Apple Silicon, you can get this developer kit. It's the early Apple Silicon Mac Mini. People all over the internet were like, can I buy one?

It's just a developer kit. Well, you could though if you had a developer account. Right. Which only costs $ hundred dollars a year right so is this going to be available to the public encouraged development or is this a developer only product that you spend three thousand dollars on developer kit i think it's that um because tim cook is specifically interested in ar and not nearly as much in vr and that's why they've been pushing all of this insane ar stuff like every year with the iphone with LiDAR and all this different stuff.

I think that they understand that the most useful AR applications right now are for like business and manufacturing and all of that kind of stuff. And they also are going to need to build out an app ecosystem because this is an entire different type of device. Yeah. So if they release it strictly to developers at the beginning with a $3,000 device, like Andrew said, they cut the price down by making it cheaper over the next year or two. And then eventually it trickles down to consumers. It's sort of like the original Apple Watch was really bad.

And people still bought it, but it would have been – if it was any other company besides Apple, they would have just canceled the product. Right. But they had long-term aspirations. They had long-term development. Exactly. And Apple has long-term aspirations where maybe on gen five or gen six, that's when it's like affordable enough for mass adoption. I mean, and even gen two, like I think the 3000 price tag might be part of like, I get what you're saying in that is this developer only, but people are going to want to buy it anyways. If you throw a $3,000 price tag might be part of, like, I get what you're saying in that is this developer only, but people are going to want to buy it anyways. If you throw a $3,000 price tag and also say like, this is a developer like tool essentially.

Remember Magic Leap? Like Magic Leap didn't come out as like a full blown consumer. You could buy it, but there were all the stipulations that like this is for developers and they're creating things on it and like it's not going to be perfect. So if throw a price tag three thousand dollars is crazy the time to stop

regular people from buying exactly the meta quest pro was fifteen hundred dollars and is already five hundred dollars okay think of it this way will it be in an apple store or not i don't think so i doubt it uh maybe like a product demo i don't think that gen one will be in an apple store i would put like gen two will be in an apple store. Got it. I would put like... I think Gen 2 will be in an Apple Store. I agree. Okay. I wonder if they're going to make it a really cool platform for people who develop in other AR platforms like MetaSpark and stuff like that to become like a part of their toolkit.

You know, like maybe even if... I'm sure Apple's going to release some sort of their AR development platform. But I could see that if you were an AR studio and this is the best headset you could buy, $3,000 is worth it. But you'd have to go through that. Yeah, it's just interesting. I think as a developer, it's worth $3,000. Yeah, I think the presentation is going to say

everything about this. Like, if they go on stage and it's WWDC for the first 45 minutes, and then the last 15 minutes, we're like, we've been working on these new VR, AR experiences that connect with what we've been working on these new vr ar experiences that connect with what we've been talking about with lidar with the iphone and if you want to develop apps for a new experience we've got this developer kit it's a three thousand dollar kit here's a little image of it okay goodbye that's like just for developers and then you never get

to see it in stores they just continue development of the background and get in the hands of developers who actually make the apps and they hope they get a killer app out of it and that's awesome or it gets presented as something that we should buy we should be interested in it's $3,000 I think it sounds like we don't expect that okay I think it's the first with a little more I feel like they'll have to show it a little bit

not just be like yeah this is the this is it I think they'll show a little bit of like this is why we think AR VR is like the future and here's some things we're already doing with it. And here's how developers can use this to create things in that scenario. This is why I think we're actually been getting so many leaks about the second generation. I wouldn't even necessarily think of it as a second generation. I would think of it as a developer model and a consumer model.

Yeah. Like it's way cut down. For sure. As long as you put up something for developers to actually work with, then eventually people will buy the cheaper one and they'll be able to use the applications that the developer model built. I guess we all kind of expect an eventual consumer-facing Apple mixed reality headset to still be expensive. For sure, yes. That's why I don't think any of us were totally shocked at $3,000. But I think if they're going to go into a store and start selling this to people,

it's got to be less than... It's got to be like $1,200, something like that, because it's an iPhone accessory to a lot of people. MetaQuest Pro, in six months, has dropped 30% of its price. So that's a really tough price point. It'd be quite ironic if

Apple launching this saved Meta as a company. Well, it's also funny because the competition is going to be really interesting. Most people today do not buy a $1,000 VR headset. Most people buy a Quest 2 or something like $100, $200, and that's good enough, and you get to play the games, and you get the controllers, and it's plastic, and it's fine. And I don't know that there is any set of expectations or competition right now for a 1500 iphone accessory yeah headset i do think that google glass even enterprise edition

shut down last week and right now there is no competition in the landscape of like ar for enterprise ar for actually useful stuff besides like the Vive, but that's not mixed reality. That's, I mean, there is a mixed reality function, but I think that like, there's very little competition in that space. And if Apple can actually get into this like manufacturing space, which Apple's always been a consumer only company, but if they're able to get into a space where huge companies are buying Accenture levels of this, where they buy 15,000 of them, that's a big cash cow.

I do think this is still going to be full goggles. I don't think this is going to be the glass. There have been a lot of rumors. Yeah, it'll still be full goggles, but it is focused on mixed reality more than yeah than um than virtual reality i just don't see apple doing anything halfway like they're not going to open a brand new product category in their store in the next five years without this model being the one to get people excited about it right so i think when they announce something on june 5th or whenever it is they're going to try and like hype it up like this is

the thing but this is why they do it at wwdc yeah i don't whenever it is, they're going to try and hype it up. This is the thing. But this is why they do it at WWDC. Yeah, I don't think this is going to be... Yeah, because they need the developers. It's not to get the consumers excited. It's to get the developers developing. But I don't think this is going to be something you see in the stores. I can see it in the flagship stores. If you go to the Fifth Ave store,

I can see a little corner where they're showing this off. It's just a demo. Yeah, like a demo with like... Because they already have a couple games. They've been working on this for on. I don't think they'll do it too. Yeah, like a demo with like, because they already have like a couple games. They've been working on this for years. Yeah, I think they probably have already looped some developers in and have had some games or some experiences that they've been working on that they will be able to show on stage

in order to go, hey, the rest of you developers, you've got your ideas going around, right? You're going to want to do this too. And so they get to making whatever they think is good for AR, VR. And maybe in the stores, they get to share some demos with people with the ones that I've already been working on. I think the next,

like you said, it's hard calling it next gen, but the consumer version later, I think that's what goes in stores. This is like, this is just kind of like, like you said, with the silicone one,

they just never announced that. Like this is for, this is for people to start building on. So when they do release the consumer one, that's what we're all just typing it because it's a new apple product because we're nerd category yeah yeah that's true but it's also interesting that like this could be a really interesting moment for tim cook because like he is like full-blown like all sale ahead on ar and the fact that a lot of the employees that are even just like working on the project are like

i don't know about this yeah it's like it's kind of like a make or break it moment there's a really interesting quote i have in here from the times article that just says uh some internal skeptics have questioned if the new device is a solution in search of a problem unlike the ipod which puts digital songs in people's pockets and the iphone which combine the abilities of a music player and a phone the headset hasn't been driven by the same clarity. Just thought that was a really great quote that I don't think any of us see Apple seeing a lot. It also makes me, you said this is an iPhone accessory.

I think it's going to be a standalone. I think every Apple product in the world has to be tied to the iPhone. I can agree with you on that, but it's just like the clarity there at least is i i do agree with that i don't think it's going to be like you need an iphone to do this you can do it by yourself i'm sure you can do it by yourself i just think like when there becomes competition because you know when apple comes out with the headset boom expect seven more headsets from samsung everybody else is going to make headsets in the same price category in the same range and it's like now what differentiates the apple one if you have the developers and the apps that's good but if you have a couple of things which is what apple does which is like if you have an iphone it's

connected to your account and like all these things work well with it and suddenly you're taking a facetime call on it like all these things are going to be plugged in to that ecosystem for sure yeah i just want i'm just making the difference between like that and like how nreal is like glasses as an accessory like it just shows what's on your phone i think you'll do be able to do everything by itself it's connected to your phone and has benefits of being connected to your phone but still a standalone product where if you leave your phone in the bedroom it'll still work in the living room sure i'll put it this way it will be worse if you have an android phone. Yeah. Guaranteed. Or just won't work at all. It'll be worse.

It has one big thing going for it too is that when the consumer one initially comes out, it will be sold in Apple stores. I think people really underestimate how powerful that is. But then you also have to do the thing that the HTC Vive did when it first came out in Microsoft stores where you have to wipe the lenses and clean it

before people do a demo and schedule a demo. That's a big deal. Yeah, I do agree that it's way, way, way easier to create an incredibly popular product if you are just taking existing standalone gadgets and mixing them into something more portable. But taking a category that people don't even really have a problem with yet and then just creating a solution for something

that doesn't necessarily exist is definitely risky i mean maybe it's just like the best fidelity highest accuracy tracking version of kind of something like glass or like magic leap or something that we've kind of already seen yeah maybe i am sad that google glass like had all those privacy issues and that was the whole reason it kind of shut down because i had a camera on it yeah that was the problem not great and even the snapchat spectacles had like the the ring that would go in a circle so people knew you're recording but i feel like the category could have the category could have really moved forward if they had just not messed that part up there for sure has got to be like an angle from apple where they explain on stage why it doesn't

have a camera and a microphone yeah and they go into depth about privacy etc yeah yeah it'll happen i don't think it matters though i feel like this is a you're not walking around with these on if it's ar people are gonna try it all kinds of places i feel like it's like ar like the meta quest pro is like it's like increasing your workspace that you're in but it's probably going to be a big clunky set that you're not like walking around the street probably needs internet connectivity and stuff like that and it's just something about having a camera and a mic that someone doesn't know if you're recording with it or not it just makes people uneasy in general so that that'll always like if apple puts a mic in it and doesn't tell you that's that's that's there's just no way they do that so they're gonna have to explain why there's a mic in it or they're gonna shout out why they didn't put a mic in it and i feel like it's gonna be the second one

i feel like they will have a mic it has to have a mic and a camera in it i don't think it's just i feel like it'll have sensors and things for tracking but i don't know if it will have a mic i think i'll have a mic and a camera it i think it has to if you need to be in this like meta world it's like ar and vr right guess if you do FaceTimes you need yeah if you need FaceTime what if it needs a microphone

there's no way it doesn't have a microphone but what if the mics are just in your AirPods or your iPhone you know like what if it's designed to work with AirPods

to become a robot it'll probably need a mic for voice calls or whatever basic stuff but yeah cameras freak people out so that was kind of doomed

when Glass had it I just want to say as someone who actually like and you can roast me for this but as someone who genuinely enjoyed the meta quest pro yeah yeah yeah bring it on yeah um that thing gets your forehead so sweaty the idea of taking it outside is like laughable like forget the weight and the size and how silly you would look. You'd be just walking down the street, sweating buckets. It'd be so funny. There's just a gigantic gap in the form factor.

The difference between that and Google Glass, which is just like, it's a pair of glasses with a prism in the screen. It's like, I walk in, I check the weather up in the corner of my vision. Like somewhere in there is an opportunity. Of course, that's how the companies see it. But like, you've got to be good. I think this is going to look way more like the Quest Pro my vision like somewhere in there is an opportunity of course that's how the companies see it but like

you've got to be good i think this is going to look way more like the quest pro then it's going to look like google glass way more goggles full giant clunky especially the developer version real glasses no i don't think it's gonna look it's gonna be way clunkier than unreal interesting the developer model for sure i mean all the like kind of renders which i know have been around for forever but they're full-blown goggles a lot of them are just vr headsets yeah yeah so i don't know we'll see i think we all remain healthily skeptical and i am looking forward to wwdc which we now have a date for which is sick wait what is it june june 5th okay which is sixth no fifth also by the time this episode comes out,

it will be April Fool's Day tomorrow. So this is just your annual reminder not to take any headlines you see, probably starting when this releases on the 31st. Probably don't take any headlines too seriously and double check if any images you see have six fingers or not. That's where I'll leave it. We should do trivia questions

to finish up this episode and wrap. I already wrote your answers. I already wrote both my answers. I'm not very confident with either, which is why I'm just not even going to change them. Alright, so quick update

on the score. Marquez, you have 10. Andrew has 8. David, you have 11. And David wrote the score. Marquez, you have 10. Andrew has 8. David, you have 11. And David wrote the question. First question. The word Transformers was introduced by a team at Google in 2017.

That's where the T in ChatGPT comes from. What was the name of that team? By the way, I only have a 50 50 chance of getting this right just say no i don't even know what to attempt to guess for this like i'm so i'm gonna guess i'm wrong if i get it wrong can i lose a point no no if you get it wrong, can I lose a point? No, no. If you get it wrong, Andrew gets a point. Okay. If I get it wrong, I want to guess what the other one is.

You don't have to give me the point. I just want to guess. Okay, sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah. All right. Flip them and read. Go brain. Let's go.

I wrote the AI team. I wrote Google X. Oh! Google X doesn't really exist anymore, right? That I don't know, but Google Brain was a Google X project that eventually got taken back up by Google. Yeah, I wouldn't call it X. Google Brain is a Google X project?

Can you ask me what was the team? I think I'd be right. What was the question, technically? Give him the point. That's correct. All right, I'll take it. Because the question was, what was the team? What was the name of the team?

And all of them work on AI, right? Google Brain is a project, and Google X is a team that made the project. Well, no, it's spun out. Google Brain is now a spun out thing. Well, yeah, but it was originally a project X team. So is Google Brain a team name? Now it's a team name. Oh, interesting. What other team names

are over there? I don't know. The other one I was thinking was DeepMind, but I'm glad that I got it right. Nice. That makes perfect sense. Next question, brought to you by Ellis. Alright, so let's see if we can identify this sound.

Or maybe this sound. Or one of these. Or maybe one of these. Wait, it is a... And what product category is this? I wouldn't describe it as a product. It's in almost every product you use. I would tell you exactly what this component does, but I think that would give it away. I wouldn't describe it as a product it's in almost every product you use I would tell you exactly what this component does but I think that would give it away I don't think it will it's currently in it uses induction to turn one voltage into another voltage

I mean I'm so wrong the funny thing is I'm pretty sure I'm wrong and I'm pretty sure I'm wrong at naming the wrong thing. I think, actually, Andrew, that you're about to get it right. Wait, what did you say? Just based on what you said, I think you're about to nail it. What did you say? I said, I'm pretty sure I'm wrong,

and I'm also pretty sure the thing I'm wrong about is named wrong, incorrectly. Like, I have an idea of something, I'm naming that thing incorrectly and that thing isn't even answer to the real question almost every product okay currently that was cool you guys are really putting a lot of stress on this is it in every single smartphone it's in most high-end smartphones oh we're it's I'll give you a hint hint. It's not in a Pixel 5a.

Jeez, that's tough. I feel like we're getting way too specific now. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. I just wanted an answer for the question. I have no idea anymore. It's in a microwave. It's in every television set. It's in all of these cameras.

It's in every single power supply. Keep giving us hints until one of us gets it right. It's made of two coils separated by a small us hints until one of us gets it right. It's made of two coils separated by a small bit of air. I know what it is. Unless I don't. I want to all show our answers now. I'm just going to flip these boards.

Thank you! Is that what it was? It's a transformer. It's the theme of today's I know. I got it right. Way too many questions asked on that one not have transform uh wireless charging it's just a transformer it's two coils separated by a little bit of air that can uses i started conduction to send a voltage when you said on top of a

telephone pole i was like is it just transformer but it is i feel like we went off the rails can you uh just re-establish to the audience that I am? You're correct. After he basically told you what it was. Because the timer was out. Sorry. Give David the point. Give David the point.

I'll argue that one. None of us get the point. I played the timer. And all of you ignored it. No, but I was writing it while you were doing it. I'm going to protest the point. I protest that point. I'm submitting a formal request to the referees union to take back the points.

I think David, you get the point, but I'm outvoted. Unfortunately. He just told you at the end. Did you write Transformer after the timer went up? No. When it was going dum-ba-dum-ba-dum. It was definitely over. We'll check the tape.

If David wrote his answer before the timer expired, we'll give him the point. I think I was writing it while the timer thing was going. So we'll check the buzzer beater on that one. So that'll be how we finish the scores. It's the buzzer beater effect. Other than that, that's a good place and the podcast. Thank you guys for tuning in. Thanks for listening.

Thanks for watching. Check for the fingers. Catch you guys in the next one. Peace. Check for mine. Waveform was produced by Adam Molina and Ellis Roven. We're partners with Vox Media Podcast Network. And our intro outro was created by Vane.

See you next time. Thank you.