We Can Do Hard Things with Glennon Doyle - First Ever Live Q & A with the Pod Squad!

Episode Date: December 9, 2021

1. Why embracing that it’s not possible to do everything brings freedom. 2. One change that Amanda made to get back into her body and reclaim her fire. 3. How to navigate our anxieties about the impending “return to normal” and how to hold onto the rhythm many of us have found comforting during the pandemic. 4. How Glennon’s been rethinking her popular Untamed quote “The braver I am, the luckier I get.” 5. How inviting more life into your life gives your people permission to live more fully.  To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Whether you're doing a dance to your favorite artist in the office parking lot, or being guided into Warrior I in the break room before your shift, whether you're running on your Peloton tread at your mom's house while she watches the baby, or counting your breaths on the subway. Peloton is for all of us, wherever we are whenever we need it, download the free Peloton app today. Peloton app available through free tier, or pay subscription starting at 12.99 per month. Welcome back to We Can Do Hard Things. That was a different octave, babe.

I know I was trying out something new, did you hate it? No, I just wanted to, like, it was up there. Yeah, it was up there. I'm up there. OK, so here's the deal with today. I'm very excited because today's the day that we all get to hear more directly from our Get Untamed event and directly

from our pod squad. So this is the time that the voicemails that you all sent came to life because in the live event when 13,000 of you were listening to us record the podcast, watching us record the podcast, your little faces came up on the screen and I got to see your little perfect faces ask us the question. So you're going to hear that today on this podcast. You're going to hear your own fellow pod waters ask their own perfect questions. Okay. But first before we jump into this, I want to talk to my sweet sister But first before we jump into this, I want to talk to my sweet sister about a recent experience that she had with Adele. And I will tell you that you weren't actually. I don't know this story.

What is going on? Do you not know this story? No. Oh, my God. Please, please let there have been an actual experience with Adele, but there was not. There was my experience with myself listening to Adele, which is, okay. I think 99.9% of people's experiences with Adele, right? To be fair, that's how we experience Adele, right? Right, right. Well, that's Adele experienced you. Remember when she read, untamed, and then she posted on her Instagrams and saying how it like split her open. It made her feel alive. And then I died 1000 deaths of joy. Yeah. I woke up in the I woke up early one morning because England is earlier than us. Right. And check to my phone.

So many ways I say that I keep my phone outside of my bedroom so that I can be zen, but I never do not one time not in my life. So I woke up, open my phone and saw 49,000 trillion gazillion notifications because Adele had posted the not just a little bit like the crap out of untamed. She said it like shook her soul and all of these things. And it was wild because Abby and I when we were falling in love, Adele was like one of the soundtracks to our I mean, Abby tells you that her great love is me but tell them who you What can I do?

Okay Adele has gotten me through I feel like I'm very similar in age so all of her her albums, you know 1921 if she helped me grow and and age well and I went through like some hardcore breakups Yeah, and she was she was maybe She helped me grow and age well. And I went through like some hardcore breakups before we met. And she was, she was maybe better than all of my therapist combined. I don't know. I just have a, her voice is something completely otherworldly. And I know that even the other day when she just released 30 Glennon came up to me, she said, you don't love Adele more than you love me. Oh, you know, and I said, of course not, but like, I love

her voice. Yeah, for sure. I don't know Adele. Adele, I would love to meet you in person one day. The truth is her, her posting that, you know, she's a national treasure. Pretty much. Worldwide. She's an international treasure, but in her home country of England, when they saw her tweet, every woman in England went out and bought untamed. It was unbelievable. And then all the British tabloids started writing about us,

which was real wild for a week. Holy cow. Okay, so I want to... But babe, to be clear, I love you. Holy cow. Okay. So I. But babe, to be clear, I love you. Yes. Okay. You're the only one for me. You're the one that I'm still on the fence. I'm still in the fences. But we tell us about your situation. Yeah, tell us. Okay. Sorry. So I was going, I was redoing my second pass of the journal and filling it out because I some people might only need to do this once I think I'm gonna have to do it semi-annually, but the the part

The feel it all section where you list all the songs and you have this model where it's like blank reminds me of blank and makes me feel blank And you're supposed to be like getting into your emotions with the songs It was a really cool section and I was listening to 30 when it came out and I had this crazy moment where I was listening to Easy On Me which is such a beautiful song for like the 1,000th time but I listened to it for some reason as if it was me singing to myself. And I'm telling you that I really think that everyone should relisten to that song to yourself, because I was like a puddle. And it, you know, the, I just had a different reaction to every single stands of it. But, you know, the, if you haven't heard the song yet, first of all, great news for you because the best is ahead for you.

But the chorus is, go easy on me, baby. I was still a child, didn't get the chance to feel the world around me. I had no time to choose what I chose to do. So go easy on me. And it was just such a release. Like, you know, you're really, I think, in some cases, what we want the most is for our own selves

to go easy on us. And, I mean, the, the Aino Golden, this river that I've been washing my hands in forever, I mean, that, it's like that for me is the story. I mean, we talked about in the last episode, the loop in your head, the stories you tell yourself. It's like, I've just been washing myself in this forever. And there's like, there's no gold here, you know?

There's just, and then the part, oh my God, the line, I had good intentions and the highest hopes, but I know right now it probably doesn't even show. It's like just like all of the dreams we have, we were little all of the like stuff we swore, we were going to get right and we, and we haven't exactly figured out. And maybe we're never gonna figure it out and maybe like we still deserve to go easy on ourselves. Beautiful. Freaking cool.

Anyway, I think everyone should give the gift of that, not asking for forgiveness or grace from other people, but maybe asking and giving yourself grace. Well, now Adele is my favorite person on earth because anybody who gives my sissy the gift of going easy, I'm obsessed with Adele now. I worship Adele. I can't believe she did that for you.

Also, I'd like to point out, sister, that allowing art into your life, carving out some time. And I know you only did it because it was your homework because it was my journal. It was my journal, page 235. Listen to some music and feel things.

Yeah. And if you're getting a suspicion, if you're listening and you haven't gotten the journal that it's not actually a journal, it's like an intense experiment. They wouldn't let me call it that because maybe people don't want to buy intense experiments, but it's not just a journal. That's so beautiful. Thank you Ad Adele, for giving my sister that gift. And just the gift of your voice to the rest of us too. It's just, oh my goodness. And so that's what I want for you more than anything in the world for you to go easy on you.

Yes. Peace. And everybody listening, you sweet pod squadder, I'm talking to you. You think I'm not, but it's you. You're the one I'm talking to. Go easy on you. The younger you, the you from 20 years ago, the you from 50 years ago, the you from yesterday, every single version of yourself, using what exactly you had in the moment to do the best you could. With what you knew and who you were. And then that's what you're still doing. That's what we're doing. And, Dr. Maya and Sulu said when we know better, we do better. But we forgive every thing and not even just forgive, embrace and love it.

Door, a door, every single version of ourselves that survived. All of those little scars are part of what makes us up. And I think that Glenn and I learned that so much from you in terms of the shamelessness that you take into your everyday life. The only way I would have believed it was possible is by witnessing it every single day for five straight years. That you can actually live a shame-free life.

And you do that. And you just make it possible for me to actually start doing that one day. So thank you. Well, I think I'm a good example of like, if I can forgive myself, I fucked up a lot. I've heard a lot of people, I was an addict for a long time. I sometimes have, sometimes like flashes of things come back

to me are things that I did. And I actually have to shake my head. Yeah, I shake my head until it's gone. Like I just can't even, because when you are, we're drunk for a very long time, or you know, I was a food addict since I was 10. So I just think it messes with your memories a lot. But every once in a while,

something will come on the periphery that I actually don't know if it's real or not, but I think it is. And I just shake it, shake it off. Shake it off means something different to me. Thank you is. And I just shake it, shake it off. Shake it off means something different to me. Thank you, Taylor Swift. So this is a whole episode on singing full circle, full circle and Taylor. Yeah.

Yeah. But I do fiercely, fiercely forgive all of the previous versions of myself who did the best as she could. Oh, I can't wait for that day. And I think just as important, it's the current version. Like because we can all look back and it's like, before and after, oh, I was jacked up and I'm okay. The hardest thing for me is the current version. Like, I'm not, I have plenty of former ones that I'm like, RIP, good, nice try.

But then even just now, like the today version of me, when you're like, it's good. I had the highest hopes and no right now, it probably doesn't even show. Like, I'm still trying and I still have to forgive the five minutes ago me. Yeah, me right now. Or how about even better?

This is like, if you wanna get to level. Are we going meta? Level A. No. Highest level is forgiving this self in 20 hours. Like listen, I know I'm about to fuck up. Like I'm gonna wish I had this like perfect family dinner tonight and I'm sweet, but know I'm about to fuck up. Like I'm gonna wish I had this like perfect family dinner tonight and I'm sweet, but actually I'm gonna snap at you, I'm gonna

whatever, and guess what? I forgive myself for that. In advance. That's amazing. In advance. Okay. Let's jump back into our get untamed conversation and here and see and love on our just amazing pod squad. We love the pod squad. Oh my gosh. Go easy on you. So I have an idea. I think that we should take some amazing questions from our amazing pod squad. What do you think sister?

Do you think that's a good idea? I love that idea. I love that idea. Let's do it. We're gonna hear from I think live like we're gonna actually hear from one of the people. I think so I hope so. Oh my gosh It's like actual real and happening and alive and here So this is so cool. It's been so many years since I've seen you guys actually in person. So Amanda, so I really admire what you said in the podcast about overwhelm and recently identifying as creative.

And what do I do with that? And am I allowed? And can I put the fuel and heat and oxygen and all together and do all these things that I feel like are inside me and I should be things that I feel like, you know, are inside me and I should be doing that, right? So my question is like, one, are you? Are you doing those things? So that would be cool. And that was cool. I guess. Yeah. Like, it was happening. Like, are, you know, are you feeling supported in that? And, you know, if not, what do you do about that? And how do go in and Abby help you?

And how do you house your own family? You know, like, you know, your husband and kids and your parents and all that help you. And like, how do you live in the boss? Right? Like, how do you live in both places? Oh my gosh. Okay. God love Erica. It would be cool if I were doing that. So I think that I regret to inform Erica that the honest answers that I have not figured that completely out and by completely out, I mean, like not even close to figuring that out. But I do think that, I mean, in the journal, you have this idea of like, not this, that period of time where you, you know that the place that you are isn't it, but you don't necessarily know exactly what is it yet. And I think that that's important to just acknowledge the value of that place too, because I think often we don't let ourselves even accept

a truth when we don't know if we cannot or we will not, or we don't know how we're gonna act on that truth. And so I think then not this is a powerful place and I spent a lot of time there. So I think that I'll just say that I don't have it figured out yet. I'm trying really hard to figure it out. I've added a few things to my life, even though I know intellectually probably subtracting things for my life is the better way.

But I have started therapy, which is very good. And the really remarkable thing about that is I'm telling the truth to my therapist. Oh, wow. Yeah, the therapist. Are you serious? Yeah, like all the terrible things. And I don't know how many years of therapy

that I spent Acting like it was a coffee date same Pretty good How are you doing And to like I was trying to kind of like game ace Therapy like they were grating me on like my general decency as a human or something. I'm like nail that. She's not damn thing out of it in 24 months, but she thinks I'm also paying for it. At least I'm also paying for this. So I am not actually doing that anymore. I am saying all the things as if no one is judging me on my health or decency as a human.

So I'm being very indecent and it's very, I think it's making a difference. Also, and I feel a little weird about saying this, but I'm just going to say it because I think that we should. I looked at my family budget and I realized that of the four of us in the household, one of them goes golfing when they feel like it. One of them has signed up for 1500 baseball tournaments. One of them takes piano lessons and attends every slime activity within 60 miles of us. And I just thought to myself, like, what would this budget look like if hypothetically, I also had needs or preferences. Like, would it be a little different? And so I decided to make some adjustments and I did. And so now I have added

And so now I have added this girl as a line item on the budget and I am getting a massage once a month. Oh! I am. I'm doing it. And it seems crazy, but I have to tell you that there is something so spiritually healing to me about laying there when it was actually someone else's job to make me feel better. And there is literally nothing I can do to help anyone at all. And all I have to do is accept take and know about trying to just make out with it's all about taking no Yes, no, but doing it. And they have an ulterior motive has nothing to do with giving. It's just all about receiving. Yeah, and I'm telling you that it is something that there is like a shift in my body. And I just, um, and so I feel really, really good about it. I also as like an efficiency junkie also. I'm like, that basically counts as like a month at the gym because I know

Body works important so it's done. So I just think that that's really I think body stuff is good and I also think anything if you're in that place anything that requires Some adjustment of people around you whether it's time or budget or whatever, there's some value in that. It feels different than whether you're stealing the side on the side that no one's ever gonna notice. So I just think that's good. And to Erica about the cost of other people,

I just feel like, let's be honest, they're not not paying for it now. Like anytime we're not taking care of ourselves, the people around us are not not paying for it. Exactly. They're just paying for it in a very different way. And so I think I think that the people in my life would rather pay their current price than the alternative that they were paying. So good. Can I just follow up real quick? I know we need to get onto the next question, but I just want to ask one thing because Erica also asked you how Can people support you or how are or how are not and I just

personally want to know I'm taking notes Because I feel like I'm always like Damn it take better care of yourself, and then I'm like also can you just like fix these six problems for me? Yeah, I can I can make the the reservation or whatever for more massages. I think we should keep that up to like once a week. I'll call. No, no.

The line item is very specific. No, I think that I am in a very, in some ways, the very most privileged position where I think that people in my life really want what is good for me. And in some ways, the most difficult position in that I have the hardest time making that okay with myself. I think that challenges are not necessarily with me asking for adjustments, but it's like actually being vulnerable enough to be like, I can't handle all of this. And that makes me feel like I am not,

that makes me feel, not good enough. So you are trying to get to the, ugh. Yeah. Well, I think it's liberating. I think I'm really, I think the, it's liberating. There's freedom in embracing that it is not possible

to do everything. Yeah. Because it's not, like, it's just not possible to do everything. So once you just step into that freedom where you're like, oh, good news, bad news, it's not possible to do everything. Then I think that that's helpful.

I have a sign on my desk that says, it's okay if you don't do everything. Yeah, that's good, that's good. I love it, it's okay if you don't do everything. Yeah, that's good. I love it. It's okay. It is okay. It is okay. Nobody can do everything.

I'm Jonathan and hevar. I'm a podcast producer and someone who likes fancy things. But I grew up working class. My parents were immigrants with factory jobs. And because of that, I think about class a lot. And I want to talk about it. That's what we're doing on my new podcast, Classy. And what did you all eat?

You know, trailer food. I was like, girl, why not doing that anymore? You'll hear from people who told me awkward, embarrassing, and strangely intimate things about what class means to them. She said, you know, for the house cleaner, I hide the tag on the $6 bread. And I just thought, don't you think she knows that you're wealthy? You're hiding the tags from yourself.

Classy. A new podcast from Pineapple Street Studios. Available now. Wherever you get your podcasts. I think we have to go to the next question. Okay. Leah, where is Leah? Leah! Hi, Leah! Hi, I'm super nervous, so I apologize.

I usually avoid public speaking at all. You're already doing a great job, Leah. Really good. Thank you. My question is, how do you deal with the prospect and anxiety of having to be retained as the world goes back to normal and you are being forced back into the world? As an introvert and empath with so much anxiety and ADD, I have personally thrived with the world being shut down. I have had the most growth during these past two years that I have ever in my life and I have found my untamedness. Now that we are being told we have to go back into the world to the office and back to

the normal, I am so anxious about the prospect of having to go back to how things used to be. And I am afraid I will fail and regress back to being the tamed me that I never really liked. Beautiful. Lea, well, first of all, I feel I'm excited about Lea. I feel like Leah really gets what untamed means. I think sometimes people, because of the goddamn cheetah thing that's taken over, I think sometimes people think that being what our idea of untamed is is something that's like fierce and out there and loud and bold and all of those things, which is not all what I meant by untamed. What I meant by untamed was that there's a self that we were born having, that there's

a self that has certain ways of being that has a certain, you know, neurological way that has a certain sensitivity way that has a way of being in the world that is right for us. And over time, what our conditioning does is it pushes us out of that self. So it pressures us into being different than who we really, really are. And so untaming is going back to that truest in herself, which for many of us, for Leah, for me, probably, is not loud and fierce and out there. And some of our most, what we have discovered during this COVID time is some of us found our peace for the first time.

I feel just like we had us. I have never been more comfortable in my own skin. I have never been at a rhythm that makes sense to me. For me, the constant going out in front of human beings, the constant like being out in all of these social situations, the constant having to navigate this and that, and that, and that, and that, the constant weird vulnerability, like that was constantly jarring to me. And so, Leah, I understand completely what you are saying. I have found a rhythm that makes sense to me.

I've even found like a social life that makes sense to me, which is like, I also like you. Did you want to come to my house for 48 minutes? Come it to, leave it to 45. We got to be weird. We got to be specific and weird. We got to stop being crazily over-scheduled. We got to say no. I mean, there's a study done that a lot of people,

a lot of women keep having children just because babies can be a shield. I can't go, I can't because I have this baby. So I can't do all the things you want me to do. Like we actually can say what we want to do and what we won't do. And we can keep saying no. And we can decide we didn't want to have those 27 friends anyway. We only wanted these three friends. Everybody has to go to work though. How does she manage that?

Yeah. I mean, work is a whole nother thing. I hope. I keep seeing and I keep reading. I do hope that people are going to be brave enough to actually say what's working for them in terms of work. I hope people are walking in and saying, you know, actually I was more productive and More myself from home. Mm-hmm. Or I mean, I I hope that people who run things are open to a new order of things That meets more people's needs because the world out there often only meets the needs of like the most extroverted Bold. Yes out there and those aren't always the best leaders at all. One of the things I'm thinking about so much lately is this default we've had of the loudest person in the room, the most certain, the most what is the leader.

We do that even when I was a teacher, it was like they're loud they're the leader. And that's never true. It's often like the quiet one, the best listener, the one who's a curator of a conversation and not a dominator of conversation. So, Leah, I just, I know what you mean. It's like, we found ourselves during this time and we found a rhythm in a life that works for us

and we don't want to lose it. I think that what I'm hearing and what I've experienced over the last couple of years is I have gotten a sense of personal power that I've never had before. And I think it is scary to go out in the world and test that personal power that we think we've had because we've been doing it in the confines of our own homes or in the privacy of our own selves, right?

We haven't really had as much experience to go out there and practice, but what I know about practice is, you're not gonna be perfect at it at first. And what I know about discipline is that if you can practice something over, repetitively, over and over again, you're just going to get better at it, right? So give yourself a lot of like space to

not be perfect and give yourself a lot of love and and and not needing to be perfect at it yet. This is a life experiment. This is yours and you get to figure it out. So I don't know, I just think that that anxiety of trying to make it perfect at first, let that go because it's not going to be. And maybe it's a commitment of bringing our real selves wherever we are, just a little bit more. Like Leah said those things. Yeah. And made me feel like so yes, that. Yeah. And it's like in all of these spaces, like work where we are is or wherever that we hide ourselves if we feel like we don't like what's going on or we don't, we think there's something

wrong with us. But if maybe we could commit to just like telling the truth a little bit more in those spaces, that's how those spaces change. Yes. Right? Then other people get to say, I actually don't feel comfortable with this either. I would prefer this. I would, but it's going to take some brave people to bring their full selves to these

spaces and tell the truth so that the order can rearrange itself. I love that. That's true. And she said she has had the most progress, had the most peace had the and how beautiful is that? Yeah. That if all of life had been pre-COVID and it never was a fit, right? And then she had this time and she's like, oh, wait, it's not me. It's all you have. It's all you have.

Like this whole system doesn't make any damn sense. It's really nice to be able to step back and be like, oh, it's not me. It's that this system is incompatible with me, but I am very compatible with myself. I know how I work. I know what I need. And you know.

So lean into that. All right, we love you, Leah. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited.

I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. great passengers in my car, you clean up after yourself. It's not going to be awesome. I'm terrible. I'm terrible. But I do have a question that's become actually even more poignant to me over the past couple of weeks.

So I was going to ask you what, when the three of you, when your spirits seem like they're saying are really low, what do you do to find your way through hard things? Like for me, I just want to put my rhyme comes on and listen to the same and to go girl song over and over and over again and then I want to scroll puppy videos until I want to scroll puppy videos until I can't put my eyes open. Right? And I think sometimes that's what I need. And it's hard for me to hear and think about and do the hard things. But I think I'm wired for hard. I go there all the time. I do the hard things, I say the hard things, I think the hard things, I believe the hard things,

but especially lately, what do you do when that hard is just too much? I hear you, I feel all of that. So I had a major mental health crisis and I was in high school. And then again later, when I sober, and what happens during those times is that you actually get to learn what people need. You get to learn how to be a human. You know, you have, if you're lucky enough to have some resources, you have a recovery group, you have maybe some therapy,

you have programs, you have these things that people who don't have mental health crises don't get, which is like, here's how to human a little bit. It's unbelievable that everybody doesn't get this sort of thing. This is what people need. You know, we all know how to take care of our plants. But we don't know how to take care of ourselves. Nobody's ever taught us.

I learned that my only real job, and I think since you would agree with both of you, you'd probably agree with how I live my life, which is that my only real job is to just like not lose my shit completely. Like, I don't wake up every day and they're like, how do I heal the world today? How do I do all the hard things? Like, I am literally like, what do I have to do today? To not completely lose my shit. And then I do all the hard things. Like I am literally like, what do I have to do today? To not completely lose my shit. And then I do all of those things, right? And for me, I have to tell you that, Stacy, if there's a different way to do it

than you're doing it, I don't know what it is. Because, yeah, right? Like I feel scared. That's taking me back. She's like, I do really, really hard things. And then I watch puppy videos. I'm like, nail it! thing. She's like, I do really, really hard things and then I watch puppy videos. I'm like, nailed it. Nailed it.

Nailed it. Is there, I believe in Stacy's way. Like, that's what I do. I do, I try to Joan of Arc some shit. Like, I do. I've learned that there's just like a way of being that whatever is like the hard thing, whatever is the hard conversation,

whatever is the icky relationship, whatever is like the hardest job of the day. Like, go towards thing, Joan of Arcate, straight towards the battle, right? And squish the time between the knowing and the doing when you know what you have to do and doing the thing you have to do. That's all the most you can smush it. The better your life is. I believe that. It's true. Yeah, it's like smush it real good. Smush it real good.

Yes. Smush it, Stacy. I can offer you that. But, but I have to tell you, I believe in quitting. I believe so much in the power of quitting. Every time anybody says to me, like, how do you do this work without quitting? I'm like, I quit every day. Quitting is my favorite thing on earth. Quitting is a spiritual practice. I wake up in the

morning and I look forward to quitting and I quit every single day. She does. I do. I care the most amount for a lot of hours and then I care, not at all. And then I check out. And then I'm like, whatever it is for the day, whether it's just trash TV and carbs or whatever it is. I just, if I didn't stop caring, if I didn't quit every single day, I wouldn't, wouldn't start again. It's just a serious rhythm to me. It's, it's, and then, and then I always think about like the bigger my thinking gets, because Stacey feels like to me, somebody who might be like, and then things are big, and then things are hard, and then everything sucks, and this is how my brain works.

Like a couple of times a day, I just, the bigger the problem is, the smaller the solution is for me. The bigger the more I hate my life, the more I hate my house, the more I hate my job, the more I hate my, I need a new, I really usually need a glass of water. Right. I usually need so true. I keep a lit, this is in the journal.

I keep a list of like little things that I need to do to fix myself, like with Stacy saying, when I can't do it, when I'm overwhelmed, there are things that we do when things get hard that are ways of abandoning ourselves. Okay, for me that's the booze, that's the, was the drugs, that's the binging and purging, that's sometimes for me it's the shopping, there's a lot of things. Okay, and then there are things that help me stay with myself. And those are always so simple, they're like a glass of water, a walk outside, some fresh air, right? They're like, play with your dogs, put your phone away. And I keep this little list of things

close to me because once it's things have gotten too hard, it's too late. You can't be creative when you're overwhelmed. I also think that having a partner in close proximity or somebody that knows you really well that can have like a safe word if like they are seeing you experiencing life. Extra hard is helpful. Like sometimes I'll say to Glenin. Hey Glenin, have you had any water today? Have you done the self-care things that usually bring you a little relief? Yeah, when one of the kids says, so mom, have you been about some yoga? That's when I know.

That's when I know. Thank you, Stacey. We think you're doing it all right. Basically, we think you're nailing it. Let's hear from Aisha. Hi, Aisha. Hi Aisha. Hi Aisha. Hi Aisha. How are you guys? The internet over here is a little bit slow. I'm really far from you guys. It's like 8am here right now. Oh my God. Please. You're

perfect. You're doing great. Awesome. This is really exciting for me. So before, you know, like I get carried away and talk a lot about myself. I want to put my question in here, guys. So I, a little background about myself, I'm originally from Pakistan, and that is where I am right now. I'm sitting family, but I live in the US. I've been there for like, about 11, 12 years now. So I identify myself as a feminist,

and I do relate to a lot of beliefs that you talk about and things you say, but you're living in this society and culture that I'm part of. Oh no, I should. I'm going to pull up her question. I don't want to miss her question. She says, I am a feminist and I'm always calling out things I don't agree with, but no one respects that because being a feminist is not applicable to our culture and practices that I am stuck in. How do I unbind myself from such life? How do I bring change and help other women?

Oh, Aisha. First of all, I hope Aisha is still on. Well, I mean, first of all, the only appropriate answer to that question from me is I don't know. I don't know. We all have different cultural conditioning. Every single one of us has a different group of rules that we're trying to break free from.

And mine as a white woman are very different for my issues. So I can tell you that, you know, since Untamed has been out in the world, I've been thinking a lot and learning a lot about what feminism looks like as a white woman. Always reading the feminism. Right. Always reading. And I just think this is interesting.

There's this quote from Untamed that people circulate a whole lot. And it says, the braver I am, the luckier I get. Okay. And that quote within the context of the story that I wrote, I still believe in, but, but. It also makes me a little bit cringy and let me explain why. The problem with print. Right. It goes out as you can't amend it.

Yeah, it's just, and you shouldn't. It's a record of where we are when we are print. Right. So that it goes out as you can't amend it. Yeah, it's just, and you shouldn't. It's a record of where we are when we are there. Yeah. And then if we're still growing, if we're still paying attention, if we're still learning, if we're still open-hearted, open-minded, we shouldn't be in the same place we were four years ago. That's right. That's, no, that's not even, that's not the way any of this is supposed to work.

That's right. We are supposed to be continuously wrestling and stretching ourselves and growing. So anyway, one of our dear friends, her name is Dr. Yaba Bale. She's an unbelievable educator and human being. And it's so interesting because the closer we've got, the more I started watching her work in the world, and she speaks very strongly and openly and beautifully

about white supremacy. The more I watch her doing her work in the world, I realized, huh? Often the braver Dr. Bleyas, the unlucky or she gets in terms of the next opportunity, the next opening, The more Yaba tells the truth, the more often her next opportunity is limited, where mine seems to open. And so it's just, it is also true that the luckier I am, the braver I get. So, you know, what I would say to Aisha is that, you know, my job, I used to think white feminism just meant like, I'm a feminist and I'm white. So that's white feminism. No, it's like a whole idea that what we're doing

as white women is just trying to get higher and higher up in a system that is corrupt, just getting a few of us through. As opposed to, no, no, no, no, no, no, we just don't even believe in any of the system. We're aligning ourselves with other groups of women, or other groups, not even women, just all different marginalized groups to

change the system completely so that more people are served, right? So that's my job as a feminist who's white. I don't have a freaking clue what Ayesha's job is because I don't know what she's dealing with, right? I mean, I know that the people that I learn from, the black women and the women of color, I would ask Ayesha to look at, you know, Brittany C that I learned from, the black women and the women of color, I would ask Ie should look at, Brittany Cunningham's work to look at Brittany Cooper's work, to look at Dr. Yaba Blay, Toronto Burke,

Austin Channing Brown. Kalida Brohee is a Pakistani woman that we spoke with on the together tour, who was completely amazing, all it's spoken feminist, and I think that there are many people from Iasia to learn from and maybe in that particular way, I'm not her. Yeah, the lucky I am, the brave where I get.

Love it. Aisha. Thank you, Aisha. Okay, we're gonna go to Jessica. Hi, Jessica. Hi, Jessica! So great to be with you all. You too. Yeah, I just love listening to the three of you

because you bring such different perspectives and I identify with each one of you at different points the insights that you share on many of the different episodes of the podcast Really come from being able to make space enough to find your knowing and that's just so hard How can we all do that in our crazy lives when we're called upon to be responsive to children, partners, family, co-workers? It's really hard. Yeah. It's so interesting because, first of all, thank you Jessica for that question.

So many of us are asking that exact question right now. I mean, I think that one of the funny things that I've, whenever I hear women especially say, you know, I want to take care of myself. I want to take care of myself. I want to find myself. I want to, I want to live my life. But how can I do that when I'm worried about my kids? I'm worried about my co-workers.

I'm worried about my parents. I'm worried about it. I mean, one of the ways that I have learned to speak to women especially is like, okay, we're gonna worry anyway. Like, whenever someone says don't worry, I'm like, great, that's great advice, that's super helpful. We're gonna worry anyway. So it's like, let's worry about something different.

Like, what if we worried about setting an example for those kids that meant they didn't get to live either because they were copying what we're doing? What if we worried about not modeling a full human joyful life that they one day will be able to recreate. Like what if we just took the worry and switched it in a way that gave us permission to live as well as other people permission to live? Because I'm just telling you, like I, I just know from my own life that there is this thing that happens when you stop believing that a good woman or a good mother or a good wife or a good daughter or a good just buries herself just doesn't live just refuses to have desires just refuses to have dreams

refuses to have feelings refuses to have humanity when you stop believing that and you instead decide no like a woman does get to have have to have Dream ambition desire feeling intuition juiciness all of it a First there's a shit show There is because the whole world revolves around the idea that women will not meet their own needs. Right? So when we do start, everybody has to reassemble for a while. Balls drop.

People get pissed. If you can wait out that storm, what I found is that then you start to see your people around you, watch you, and also give themselves permission to live. You just like invite more life in. When you demand more life from yourself, you eventually invite more life from your kids. I remember having this conversation with our friend Dr. Bernay Brown and her on her podcast a long time ago and us talking about this and her saying that she had this day where she came home and she was supposed to go to her son's event to basketball game or something and she was so freaking tired that she just couldn't do it. And so she just did not show up for her son's thing,

that her son really wanted her to be at her whatever and it was heartbreaking for her and she just didn't show up. And then the next day her son came in and she said to him, I'm, I just, I was so tired and I just couldn't be around people anymore. I just needed to not be around people. And she thought that her son was going to be sad and then said, her son said, I often, I don't want to be around people sometimes. We can do that. He goes, we can do that. He said, I'm not, sometimes I'm just so,

I don't wanna be around people, I wanna be home. But I don't know, we could just do that. She, in her refusing to just martyr herself for her child. She gave her child permission to be her child self. Yep. Funny how that works. So what we're gonna do right now,

because we have, just keep keeping you for literally, an extra 35 minutes, and I would keep you for eight more hours if I could, but here's what I wanna say to you. I am so deeply grateful from my family to yours for walking this, doing this life with us. Thank you for loving us,

thank you for loving us, even when things got really weird and hard, and thank you for showing up for us over and over again. Thank you for loving my sister who we just, you know, she's loveable. She's magic. Thank you for loving her so much. Thank you. We love you. We love you and your families and your dogs and your plants and your lives. We just love you and we love you so much that before we say goodbye, we are going to offer you one of the three best things that we have, which is our Tish Melton is here. And she has something to perform to you because this is how we end things together. When life gets hard this week folks. Don't forget,

we can do hard things. We love you. I walk through fire, I came out the other side. I chased desire, I made sure I got what's mine. to believe that I'm the one for me. And because I'm mine, I walk the line. Cause we're adventures and heartbreak some map of final destination We're like, we're stopped asking directions To places they've never been And to be loved we need to be known We'll finally find our way back home

And through the joy and pain That our lives bring We can do hard things I hit rock bottom it felt like a brand new star I'm not the problem sometimes things fall apart And I continue to believe The best people are free And it took some time, but I'm finally fine. Cause we're adventurous and heartbreak so bad, a final destination we lack, we've stopped asking directions to places they've never been, and to be loved we need to be known

We'll finally find our way back home And through the joy and pain That our lives bring We can do hard things. This word ventures and heart breaks on map. We might get lost but we're okay with that. We've stopped asking directions To places they've never been And to be loved we need to be known

We'll finally find a way back home And through the joy and pain That our lives bring We can do hard ways Yeah, we can do hard things. Yeah, we can do hard things. Oh! Ah!

Bye, everybody! Thank you! Thank you! To Sister Thank You to Alison and Dina and Paige. Thank you to PRH, the whole team. Thank you to Kate and 13. Thank you to Lauren and Adam. Thank you to Alison and Dina and Paige. Thank you to PRH, the whole team. Thank you to Kate and 13. Thank you to Lauren and Adam. Thank you to all of you.

Thank you to Tish. Thank you. All of you. We love you so much. Let's keep doing life together. We can do hard things, is produced in partnership with Kate and 13 Studios. Be sure to rate, review, and follow the show on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Odyssey, or

wherever you get your podcasts, especially be sure to rate and review the podcast if you really liked it. If you didn't, don't worry about it. It's fine. you