We Can Do Hard Things with Glennon Doyle - Free Birds, Empty Nests & Sexy Sue

Episode Date: July 14, 2026

What happens when life suddenly gets quieter? Glennon, Abby, and Amanda check in on the big transitions happening in their own lives—from the emotions of becoming empty nesters to the unexpected opportunities that come with a brand new season. Plus, they're answering Pod Squad questions you won't want to miss—including one unforgettable call from Sexy Sue that sparks a hilarious and thoughtful conversation about dating, relationships, and when (and if) we need to DTR.  We talk about what it means to let go of old roles, embrace uncertainty, and ask the question many of us are facing: Who do I get to become next? - The grief—and unexpected freedom—of becoming an empty nester. - Why midlife can be the perfect time to reinvent yourself, your friendships, and your relationships. - Abby's advice for navigating competition in a blended family without losing sight of what matters most. - A challenge to stop obeying unfair rules in advance—and the power of everyday acts of resistance. Follow We Can Do Hard Things on:  Instagram — ⁠https://www.instagram.com/wecandohardthings⁠

Welcome to We Can Do Hard Things. I actually kind of sat down nervous and excited. It's been a while since we've sat down together and talked. Because of that, I would just like to check in. First, I want to ask Amanda, how are you? Set the scene. Okay, we are in my favorite place. We're in Connecticut.

This is a place where John grew up coming in the summertime. And we hunker down here for several weeks of the summer. And his mom and his sister are often here. And the kids are always reunite with their buddies here. And it's really fun. Actually, one of our listeners painted when I said that about favorite places, one of the listeners painted this gorgeous painting of the Connecticut coast. And I have it hanging here.

And I love it. Yeah. Yeah. It's the same person who did the Thousand Islands. That's behind your set of Welcome to the Party, Abby. You know, I was thinking about this the other day, Amanda. Why haven't you ever invited us there? First of all, we have this place here that it's when we got it was like, you've purchased a shed.

It's literally like if you hang something on the wall of the exterior, this is the outside wall, and you like put a nail in the wall, it goes through from the inside of your living room to the outside of the house. It is. That's awesome. A literal, like, piece of wood. These are, like, old school sheds on the water, which is why I love it, because it's so simple. Like, it's so simple. Obviously, it's so weird to have a whole part of my life that y'all have never been to.

And obviously, it's open season, please, but it's in the middle of nowhere. So it would, like, require you to really, my God. I want to come. I was thinking about this the other day that I feel. that we've never been there. It just looks so sweet. It's like the kids just leave on their little bikes and then they spend all day outside and they're smoking cigarettes. Smoking cigarettes. I'm joking. They don't do that. Well, I don't think they do that. Yeah. Yeah. But yeah, they're gone. They'll be like, like, Bobby comes home to use the restroom and he runs and he's like, hi, goes the

by the bye. And he's gone again. And it's just like I'll see you at 10.30. So what? do you do all day then? I do my research for my podcasts. I sit on the porch and do that because people would be embarrassed about how much research I do for my. I think they know for my podcast. And then I like to take Seamus on walks and there's always like something going on like it'll be like, you know, the sand castle contest on the beach or like the crabbing contest at night. You know, these kind of like big events that that the community has to gather for. So it's just a very simple little situation which I like. It's slow. Slow. Nothing to plan. I think this is why I love it. I realize that I think the whole mental load of planning and logistics is absent because there's

nothing to do. And so that I think is the key distinction between a revving engine of logistics all during the year where it's like, okay, practices at this time and then we're doing this. And then we got to pick up from this. And then we got to, there's nothing to pick up from or to go to. So there isn't logistics. So it is a nice, renewing, very lucky thing to have. Do you feel closer to your family when you're there? I mean, I'm literally closer because if someone sneezes in any part of the shed, you're like,

God bless you. If someone's taking a shower in our one bathroom. if you feel like it's raining on the house because and sometimes literally water coming through to the rest of the house. But we're like on top of each other like a little puppy pile. So that's yes, I do. That's beautiful. How have you been? We are in an interesting time.

If you're in the puppy pile, we are in the puppy leaving time. We over the next 30 days, all three of our children will leave our home. So in a few days, we drop our youngest at college because she's going early because she is going to play soccer. So we're a few days away from that, the whole family. That's happening next week. Like this coming week Sunday. Sunday, yeah. Oh, my God.

So including her siblings, everyone's going to drop her. That's in three days. I know. Holy shit. So that is happening. and it feels different than the other two. I'm doing this thing right now where I'm trying to stay utterly frozen inside. It's so interesting to feel, like to try not to cry, to like feel the like trying to stay frozen.

You're trying to consciously stay frozen so that like you don't unravel at this. In this particular moment. Okay. I'm just saying. Okay. Right now. Okay. On this podcast recording when I said three days, you're like, I freeze, freeze Elsa.

Right. Okay. Yes. It feels different because she's the youngest also because she's just going to do something so hard. Going to play D1 soccer is like, you know, for the other two, the things I worried about, like, making friends or finding your classes or all of that. That just feels like the least of Emma's problems. So I think it's going to be something that is challenging in a different way. Thank God she has Abby to like know, to just even understand. I know, but that's almost worse because you, like, know how hard it is.

You know, it might be like blissfully ignorant might be more helpful at this point. Yeah, but it's not like she hasn't been training for this moment for her whole little life. You know, like she's prepared. She's ready. She's been working her butt off her ass off all summer. It's just an interesting time for sure for our family that we're coming into our empty nest stage and era. Yeah. Yeah, because two weeks after she leaves, then Chase moves out.

He, you know, he came home after he graduated and lived with us for a year, which was the biggest gift. It was just incredible. We just actually really got to know each other. Like if you're a parent out there, you feel stressed out because you feel like maybe you don't know your kid as well as you should or something. Like there are some kids who just take so much longer to reveal themselves. And this year is what that has happened. and he was 22 when that happened. So it's been such a gift, but he's moving out with friends.

Two weeks after Emma leaves, and then two weeks after that, Tish goes back to Berkeley. Three to zero over the next month. Five to two. What's, oh, five to two. Oh, that's better. Yeah. There were five people, and now they're still two. They're not going three to zero.

We will continue to exist. If a tree falls in the forest If the children are not in the house Is anyone in the house? Exactly. That's a good point, babe. I'm going to think about that. I mean, I talked about it in my therapy session yesterday

And I know that this probably annoys the hell out of you. But I am choosing to look at it From like the most positive light-filled lens ever That I'm like, What are the things that I haven't been able to like focus my energy? and attention on, what are the things that I want to do that I haven't had the space of the time to be able to do? Like, I'm so excited for Tish and Emma and Chase. And that excitement for me is allowing me to have also excitement for myself and for you. There's so much opportunity.

We're coming into a new era of ourselves. And yeah, there's going to be a lot of stuff that's like sad. I'm going to miss them. But I'm looking at things that I'm not going to miss. You want to know what I'm not going to miss? What? Kitchen sink. The sink. Yeah, I knew it. I knew it was going to be the sink.

The sink, the socks, and the sunglasses. Triple S. Yeah. That's true. There'll be less people to steal your stuff. Yes. And more obvious who to blame when they do. Exactly.

Exactly. Yeah, it's a bad situation for you, Glennon. That is true. Also, in this economy, I mean, they'll be back. It's the good news and bad news about the state of affairs of this nation. And everyone will eventually be back in the house. Exactly. If Chase...

And they're all artists, so for sure they will. And if Chase is any indication, he came back after graduating college. And it was a wonderful experience to, like, get to know him as an adult, not as a child. Yeah. You know? No, I hear all this. I just, you know, every time I talk to someone about this, they're like, this is, I swear to you that someone must have said this on a podcast somewhere because all anyone says to me now is like, You know, what I've heard is that we don't call it empty nesting now.

We call it being a free bird. Oh, geez. Okay. And I'm like, okay. Sorry, then it's better. Yeah, seven. Wow, that really transformed something in my heart. Right.

And then the other thing they say is, I swear to you, maybe seven people have said this to me. You could play mahjong. Well, I want to learn how to play mahjong. Holy shit. Alice and I have been learning mahjong this summer. But like, why is that everyone's answer to your kids leaving forever? Because women don't have hobbies. And so when we are facing the epidemic of an entire population of females who has never been taught to look inward and discover what really lights them up and delights them, we hand them something like, oh, you don't know?

We have an answer to that. It's mahjong. I think that is the answer. If my polling is correct, everyone is saying that. So I guess we'll try that. And that's if you aren't sporty enough to pickleball. Which I'm definitely not going to do. I'm not going to do that.

But here's the thing that I've been thinking a lot about too. We identify so much as mother that we feel that this moment in transition in our life means that we're no longer going to be parents or something. That is equivocally what we know about Tish and Chase. We know that we have had to be very, very involved in their lives since they went off to college. There's no circumstance where we're not going to be involved and doing stuff. There's just going to be a geographical change. Yeah, it's just like logistically interesting.

The only way I can describe it is, and then I'll stop after this. But I was in the pantry the other day and I was looking at, you know how during COVID, like a bunch of people convinced some of us that if we bought like plastic containers for like our cereal and snacks that we would have some level of like control over. the world or something. I don't know. I just got tricked into buying a lot of plastic containers. Organization. That already had containers like cereal boxes. Let me take this out of this container. If only the banana came with a container. Yeah. And I did that. I thought, yeah, that sounds right. But we didn't go as so as far to write to get the things that say live,

live, laugh, love. No, no. Oh, God, babe, I did that before you were here. I know. Every room in my house had directions. Eat, live, remember, go to the bathroom here. Every room. It was Christian white lady aesthetic. Every wall was labeled with directions. That's what I'm saying. The plastic bins in the pantry are like the next level. It's the new level of that. Yeah, how to contain yourself, how to control. The point is, I was, I keep these full because the children eat this so much, like locusts, and then they bring their friends, and so they're always filled up with unhealthy food and, et cetera. And I went into the pantry the other day, and they were at very low levels. And my immediate thought was, okay, I have to like reorder the things. And then I just

stood in the pantry and realized, I do not refill these containers. Abby and I are not going to eat 17 pounds of Doritos. My point is, I just stood there and stared at these containers that will now remain empty. And of course, my heart turned it into a metaphor of emptiness and like how everything is empty. Like, what do I do? I guess I just get rid of the containers. So I don't stare at empty containers. And then I just cried in the pantry for 20 straight minutes. about not ordering Doritos. And like that is okay, like empty, free bird or whatever, but still, it's emotional. Right.

And you want to know what you can fill it with? What? Me. Jesus. We can fill it with each other. Oh, my God. It's too much. As a resident heterosexual here, come on.

I'm so excited. Like we get to like re get to know each other again. I know we're giggling, but I actually really do think that that's true. I know. I know you're lucky that you guys like each other. I know. Can you imagine the trepidation for people who are facing this? And it's like five to two.

And yikes. You don't like those odds because in fairness to people, it's very, very hard to keep a really, about a relationship when you're raising kids for 20 years. So I think there's probably a lot of fear in a lot of folks that is like the emptiness plus the oh my gosh, I'm going to have to face this thing that I've been able to skillfully avoid for a long time because my focus was over here. And so maybe I don't even know if this thing is going to work or maybe I know it's not. Yeah, and you've been avoiding it for the last five to ten years because you just had something else in the way. So, I mean, you're lucky in that respect.

Yeah. I mean, the empty container is like that. What's left is your relationship with your partner if you have one, your relationship with yourself if you have one. And if not, there's Majong. And it's not, there's Majong. Your relationship with friends, if you've built them. Like, I had this very cool experience over the last few weeks, which is that building friendships over my lifetime has been a recurring theme. like, I know I've been talking about this forever.

Am I doing it? Am I doing it right? Do I have friends? Do I know what I'm doing? But I have felt like I wasn't the kind of parent who was like in it with other parents at school. I just wasn't. I had people that I liked and I know that I had people that liked me, but I didn't do the

thing where I was like at all the meetings and like creating bonds like that. And I felt kind of sad about that during the graduation stuff. stuff. I felt like I could sense the kind of difference in like camaraderie that some of these women and of course the women had and who had been like showing up a lot and doing it together and as opposed to how I felt, which was, I don't know, I just sensed the difference. And then I thought, oh, it's too late. Like I didn't do it and it's too late. And then this really cool thing happened, which is that three of those women who I actually sensed that about at the ceremonies, like, oh, I should have done more work to like bond with these people. And they texted me a week

after graduation. And they said, two of them were together. And they said, we just were talking. And we've decided that now that we have the time, we want to be intentional about creating a friendship with the four of us. Whoa. And I just had this feeling of like, oh my God, it's not too late. That is so exciting. And maybe like that's another beautiful thing about being a fucking free bird or whatever we are. Like maybe it's not that I didn't do it when I should have, but like now there's time. So we like got together and had coffee and now we're on like one of those text chains that I think like that love he's always talking about that love he's always talking about that people who like have so many friends are on all the text chains and we're like

texting each other. And one of them. Like, you know how the type A school moms? There's usually like a type B school mom that gloms on to them that like I never know what's going on at school. So I have this one friend who I, Louisa, who I just, God, I would die for her because every day she's like, you do understand that tomorrow you have to do this. Right. That's very sweet.

I know I asked her if she could go to Emma's college orientation so that she could continue to tell me. but her, alas, her kid is going to a different college, so that wasn't appropriate. But shout out to all those parents who do the work for the type B parents. They really keep us. Tomorrow's a short day. Really? God.

From whence do you gather this knowledge? Is there a separate text threat? Like, I feel like the school systems might identify these people early. And, like, you think it's like an old school phone tree where they're like the only the 12 of you can be trusted. So you are responsible for disseminating this news because even if we send it to Doyle, she's not going to read it. It is a great mystery to me. It is amazing to me.

It's a service. It's a patriotic duty. It is. And I'm really grateful to all the Louisa's out there. God bless you and keep you. We thank you for your service. Recently I've been working on my skin, but I've been doing it from the inside out. Okay, stay with me.

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slash hard things for $50 off your first purchase of $100 or more. That's where we are today. Thank you for that check-in. I think we're going to hear from our incredible pod squad now. And what I'm really excited about you guys is that the idea for these Q&As was that we were going to just hear them and respond in real time and not prepare and just be our little selves. and I have never done that, not one time. I always read them ahead of time so I can sound smart.

Did you do it today? No. Oh, good for you. This is the first time I have ever actually come. Watch the free bird fly. Will she fly? Will she fly? We'll see. She could crash and burn. You'll hear it here first. That's right. This is the real me, unprepared. Okay, let's hear from see. Hi, I'm Chelsea, she, her, and my question is for Abby. I am a nearly 40-year-old, and my wife came out later in life, and we now co-parent our 14-year-old son, who is a top-ranked X racer in Florida, and my wife and I also started racing about six months ago. The challenge is that I now raised her ex-husband, my stepson's father, and we're very amicable, but also very competitive and I haven't beat him yet, though I'm quite close. And he often says one thing and does another kind of downplaying his effort, but clearly

training hard and competing hard, which feels somewhat manipulative. And while I understand this may be a subconscious thing on his part and come from his own path and communication patterns, my question is, how can I handle racing him and communication? him and communicating with him given this dynamic, which is kind of weird sometimes. Thank you guys so much for all you do. Cheers. Oh, I love this. Okay, Dave. Let's hear. First of all, BMX, is that just regular bicycles? Are these dirt bikes, mountain bikes? It's called a BMX bike. So it's like, it's not as big or tall as like a mountain bike or as like sleek and aerodynamic as a road bike. It's almost looks like a kid's bike, but they do all these tricks on them. I know this is not

essential to the answer, but I just want to picture this guy pretending not to try, but really trying. And then the boy, okay, so are they going up and down in dirt probably? Is there dirt involved, like hills usually in a BMX? And are they running in, are they going in circles? No. So there's probably a BMX track where, you know, they're racing around and there's like lots of like twists and turns and ups and downs that you've got to like plan how to go over the bumps in the hills and whatever. Jesus. But I think it's on concrete. Thank you.

I just need to picture Chelsea in her element. Thank you for that. Well, if Mahjong doesn't work for us, we could try dirt biking. Yeah. I think Pickle-a-ball, this is a level. Okay, this is a theme of this episode. Okay. You can play Gin Rummy.

That's for the, that's for if you're really starting, okay? Can we do that? Then if you really want to level up, because it's a level up and it's very hard, Mahjong. If you have a body that will move and you don't need to play mahjong or gin rummy, you can do pickleball. If you're a complete badass like Chelsea, you don't play pickleball, you BMX bike. And if you have a real death wish, you BMX bike, your wife's excess bike. That's right.

Well, I have so many things to say. First of all, amazing that at nearly 40 years old, you've picked up BMX racing first and foremost. Second of all, I have a unique experience kind of similar to you in that early days I started playing on a team with Craig. A soccer team. A soccer team, our kid's dad. So this is like a year and a half after I retired and I hadn't played soccer before and I was not fit. And so I played a couple of games and realized like it wasn't going to be for me anymore because I wasn't as good as I used to be and I don't like that. I also really, like, wanted to honor Craig and his talent because here is the thing. This may be very snarky with me. I don't know.

I won out in the deal. Like, I won Glennon in a way. There's always been a part of me that is, like, really wanted to give Craig a little bit more in some of these other areas. Yeah, nice little consolation prize of being good at soccer. like maybe the BMX win for him. Like, yeah, his ego and I understand that communicate. But like, whether you win or not, I just don't think that the real competition is about the BMXing. I think it's about all this other stuff that's like underneath it.

And I get it. But I just wasn't going to have the competitiveness with Craig. That is the thing that I was not going to do because I didn't want that to challenge or compromise our co-parenting relationship together. And so I just like, oh, okay, let him have the soccer. Great. I mean, also, it's hard to say because I also, like, won the soccer when I played. There wasn't, like, a real question of who was better at soccer.

Yeah, this is not an apples to orange and apples to apples conversation. But also, Craig is excellent at soccer. He's so good at soccer. He's so good at soccer. And he still plays. And the kids go, and he's so dedicated to it. And it's his community. Yeah.

And the kids go watch him. Yeah. So I'm just to say, like, he is actually excellent. great soccer player, but I wasn't going to play the competitive game with him about this because I wanted to prioritize our co-parenting relationship. In some ways, I kind of bowed out. And this is not to say that, like, you can't BMX race. But like, is there a way to not, like, be in competition with the stepfather, Chelsea? Well, yeah, but this is what this question is about, right? To me, the question isn't really about competition. The question is about this

sticky, weird thing that, and it seems like we're just talking about BMX biking, but I feel like there's something else here. Like the problem with his approach, if they're just like, we're coming, we're competing, we want to beat each other. That would be one thing. But he's coming in pretending like he doesn't give a shit about competing. He's pretending like he's not caring while he is actually super training on the side and working hard, but coming in like he's like, yeah, whatever, it doesn't really matter to me. And that's the part that's bothering her. I think what I hear Chelsea saying is, if we both came to fight, right, and one of us won,

and we were like, damn, good run, you beat me, that would be one thing. But he's kind of trying to have his kick and eat it too. He's trying to win, but he's trying not to pretend like he's trying to win. And that feels gross. So he's like a competitive mullet. He's like nonchalant in the front and chelon in the back. He's like he's like the Stanford. You know the idea of the Stanford thing where what's so stressful about being at those high level schools is like you have to be a duck that looks like it's just floating on the top.

But underneath you have to you have to look like you're not trying. Yes. But underneath you have to like kick like hell. So what Chelsea can't stand, Abby. I see. What Chelsea can't stand is the fact that he's acting like he's not trying. But clearly he's like training and competing. Okay.

But why do you think that's bothering her so much? Okay, well, here's a reframe of this. I'm now understanding. What I think is happening is he's scared. Yeah. Yeah. And his insecurity and his lack of wanting to, like, quote unquote, lose to you is really showing itself. But you know what's sweet is that I just noticed that what we can't forget is that the little one, the 14-year-old son, is a top ranked BMX biker.

So what all these parents are trying to do is identify the most with him. Be like, this is a thing that I gave you, that I am connected with you for, right? Is it like all about not just a competition between the parents, but sort of an effort to be like of the thing their kid is good at? Yeah. Oh. Yeah. Now I'm just thinking of it as like just the dude being the dude. right? Because I feel like we can be like, oh my God, this guy like he's trying and pretending like he's not trying. But we all do this. I know there's like 17,000 books available and podcasts and whatever in the world on vulnerability. But really like to me, vulnerability is just caring publicly and openly. There is nothing as vulnerable as caring. I really care. You know. And when you claim that, it's so scary.

and when you don't claim it, when you pretend like, oh, I don't care, you can avoid all that vulnerability. It's like why kids decide that they don't like a sport before they suck at the sport, or why someone decides they just don't like a person before the other person reveals that they don't like them, or why you'll go out with someone who would be lucky to have you, but never go after the person you'd feel lucky to be with. It's like all of this stuff is like, I really care, I really want this thing. And, And it's just everywhere. It's why we joke about like, oh, I didn't even take a shower.

Oh, I didn't. Because like to show that you really tried and you really care and you really want something to be a certain way is to just reveal like that you failed. Or like, is there anything more icky than like you really did your best and worked hard at it and came up short? It is the ultimate vulnerability. So I think like it's just the layer of. that is one thing, but then the layer under it is like, do we even know the thing we really want?

Is it so scary to say it out loud? And then it's so scary to tell ourselves. Like, if you really admitted your desire or your dream or what you wish your marriage would be, that is the ultimate like exposure of this deep care. I think it's a little thing in the BMX deal. But if we're being honest, we all do that. Totally. And I'll just, I'll say one last. I had to compete against people that I really loved my whole life. And it is not an easy thing to learn how to do to be in sincere competition for my job, making money, paying my bills with people I actually was in community with that I loved and it cared about.

And being able to balance those two things are very, very difficult. and if you can just keep doing it and keep showing up, like, don't let him win. That's not what I'm saying. What I'm saying is there's some things that you can't control. You can't control what he's going to do, whether he trains hard and plays it like he's not when he does beat you. All you can do is like train as hard as you can and also work on continuing to communicate with him and not let your competitive ego get in the way of being able to have

those conversations off the BMX track. Like you can do both. It's just compartmentalizing is a little bit about it. And it's possible because I was able to do it. I was able to compete taking people's positions and being the starter was not easy because there were a lot of people that were fighting for my job, but also then maintaining those relationships off the field. Like it is really hard, but it is possible.

There's something also that I am just going to know. as relating to whoever Chelsea's invisible partner is in this question, which is that there's something, and maybe this is problematic, but that I've noticed that where the one that comes in and the dad compete in traditionally masculine areas. I'm just saying if there's something that needs to be drilled or screwed or some job that is assigned heteronormatively to the male in the relationship. Like, I don't know, maybe a little bit like BMX biking, there seems to be an underlying

competitiveness between the Abby and the Craig or the Chelsea and the new person. But what I do know just from this question is that Chelsea's family is going to be okay. That this kid, this 14-year-old kid, has three different parents. parents who are so obsessed with him and his passion. That they're all BMX racing. Exactly. That because he rides a bike, they're like, I wish he did cross country. It would be so much easier.

All three of them have learned how to ride bikes and are showing up for this kid so much that they're becoming him and compete. Like, this kid is loved and going to be okay. And that's the most important thing, I think. about Chelsea's question. Yeah, Chelsea, play mahjong. Plus, also, can we just talk about, I just, the word amicable in that? I know.

Like, amicable to me is the biggest tell of any word. Anytime someone insists that they're amicable, our relationship is amicable. It's a code word meaning we are desperately trying to be kind and respectful to one another, and no one could be. say otherwise. Because if you don't say amicable, you would be like, we're buddies, we're friends. I like them. But when you say, like, it's an amicable divorce, is it? Because amicable.

And Glenn, and to your point. Yeah, it means you're murderous. Amicable means you're murderous, except for the law. You are exerting such restraint. It should be applauded. But I think that there's probably a group of people listening to this who one person left a marriage that they had children and then they started dating somebody of the same sex. There is something very interesting around being the me, the Abby in this situation, coming in with an ex-husband to get into relationship with. There's a very interesting dynamic there. There's some sort of male competitiveness that.

I think is a really interesting dynamic. They're all going like Chelsea and the guy and they're like, Who's your daddy? And then they're just BMXing around in circles to answer. Chelsea, your family's awesome. That's what I want to end with. Your family's awesome. I kid you not when I say I used to take about a dozen different supplements.

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reported having more energy after 12 weeks. Go to IM8health.com slash hard things right now or click on the link in the description and use code hard things for a free welcome kit, five free travel sachets, plus 10% off your order. That's code hard things at IM8health.com slash hard things. Code hard things at IM8health.com slash hard things. These statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease. I try to be intentional about the products that I buy for my family. So when it comes to laundry, I choose all free clear detergent. You all know this about me. I'm always thinking about the

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detergent for your next laundry day. This episode is brought to you with the support of our sponsor, Midi Health. As we all might know by now, menopause. isn't an overnight process. It can take years. And for some of these symptoms, you might not even recognize them as menopause or perimenopause. So you just go from doctor to doctor describing brain fog and fatigue and random anxiety, never connecting the dots. Midi Health exists specifically for this stage of life. Midi Health is the only virtual care clinic for women navigating midlife hormonal changes from perimenopause through menopause. It was created by women for women. And midi clinicians are menopause experts and hormone-trained specialists who actually listen and understand

what's happening in your body. They'll help build a treatment plan around your specific symptoms with safe, effective FDA-approved hormonal and non-hormonal options. Best of all, the visits are covered by insurance. Book your first virtual visit today at join midi.com. That's join midei.com. Sexy Sue. Oh, hell yeah. Pod Squad to hear from sexy Sue. Here we go. Hey there. I'm not going to give you my name. You can just call me sexy Sue. My pronoun for She-Her. This is for Solicited Advice, Glennon. I am 53 years old. I was widowed 13 years ago. I have enjoyed being single. I'm not trying to fix that. However, a year and a half ago, I started with a 31-year-old. That is lovely, and I enjoy that very much. And then in the last

month or so, I have also acquired a suitor my age, who is very kind and lovely, and headed toward my six-gate with him. now. My question is, Glennon, when slash if, tell them about each other. All right, have fun with that one, Glennon. We love you. Bye-bye. Sexy Sue. Wow. I will have just written down and we'll start using, I'm not trying to fix that. Just anything that someone else would think was a problem that you're actually not seeing as a real problem. It's good. I have been enjoying being single.

I'm not trying to fix that. I am curious what you all say about this. Oh, I wanted to hear from you first. Okay, I'll tell you what I think. I want to hear it because I actually, I'm, okay, yeah, I just want to hear what you think. Okay. So she's taken a lover, which I would just like to, I like to use that phrase as much as possible. The lover, you mean the 31 year old or,

the one that's her age? Well, you will note that she called this the one her age a suitor. Maybe that's a more suitable name for someone her age. But it sounds to me like the young book. As a lover. So I think she said, when slash if, which is funny too. When slash if do I need to tell them about each other? This may be a libertarian of me. But I think that you tell people about the status of the relationship when they ask you. I don't really understand. Like, why is she feel the need? Just like she has gone out on six dates with this gentleman,

that gentleman has also gone out on six dates with her. If that gentleman says, I would like to know if we are exclusive, or I would like to know if you're seeing any other people, then sexy Sue should answer honestly. But if that man doesn't ask, that man might not want to know or might not want to answer the question himself. So why should we be like patronizingly protecting people in advance of them

even asking for our protection? Like, I don't understand. I mean, if you're sexually active, yes, that was my only caveat. This feels like a different thing, especially if you're sexually active without protection, then it becomes a matter of health, right? You are now, now we're all in relationship together. But, like, if people want to know things, they ask.

And if you're scared to ask, then you may not have the security and the relationship that you deserve. Because if you're like, I don't want to. be that annoying person that ask whether we're exclusive, then you're probably not exclusive because you don't even feel enough standing in the relationship to ask for it. But sexy Sue's out there doing her thing. And if her suitor, who has been on the same number of dates with her as she has been on with him, hasn't inquired, then why does she need to volunteer that information? Yeah, I guess that, I mean, we used it in my day. I don't know if they still do. Which day was that 25 years ago?

Yeah, kind of. I think it was like when Jersey Shore was on is what I'm thinking. Jim Tan Laundry. When I learned these words. GTL. Yeah, with GTL, Jim Tan Laundry, I feel like we also learned DTR, that there was like define the relationship conversation. Oh, people are still doing that, by the way.

Oh, they are? DTR still thinking, okay. Yeah, but that doesn't happen until much later now with the kids. Okay. Well, I think I understand what you're saying, Amanda, and it makes sense that if there is to be a relationship defining conversation, it needs to be initiated. That's the first, like, yeah, that conversation has to be initiated. And the reason that would be initiated is if one person had the desire to know or to be exclusive.

It doesn't sound to me like sexy Sue is interested or had the desire. She's not trying to fix that. No, no. Neither, I suppose, has the person she's the 31-year-old that she's been. dating for a year and a half because if you've been dating for someone a year and a half and that other person has not instigated the DTR, then there's a reason for that is exactly what you're saying. So if sexy Sue doesn't want the DTR and nobody else she's dating has instigated the DTR, then she can only assume that the others don't want the DTR either and she doesn't have to

fix a problem that has not yet been presented. Who has presented the problem? Only her, only her conscience. That's what I'm saying. She is, what she is probably under this, what I'm capturing, is that there's something about potentially dating two people that might not feel totally aligned for her. And that is, I think, the problem that we're probably dealing with. It's like, number one, she has to ask herself, is she the kind of person that is okay dating two people? people, period. And because there's at the start of this, that she's like, I'm not trying to fix that being single. There's absolutely nothing wrong with dating multiple suitors or lover boys or lover women. Like there's nothing wrong with that. I think that this is a conversation

she just has to figure out with herself that if she actually feels like that there's something wrong with it in her body, because we can't tell her what's right or wrong, like what you think. And of course, like if you're sexually active, that's a whole different question and a different conversation. But it sounds like you don't, you love being single. Sounds like you are actually having a good time. And it sounds like unless somebody asks for it, keep going and having the greatest time. I mean, I guess the thing is she must have an underlying, unless it's just like the female

guilt complex that exists. And the whole like, oh, you must be a slut if you're having something. with one person, much less too. I guess it's like, because I can also see from the other perspective, like if this was someone writing in being like, we dated for a year and a half, and then I found out there dating someone else who'd be like, what a dick. But at the same time, I feel like it's like, it's always assumed that the woman is the one who's trying to do the DTR because she's, she really wants an R, you know, like they're always trying to define the relationship because they're always trying to trick you into being in a relationship. And so it's a weird thing. It's a weird

posture because she's the one trying to avoid the R and avoid the conversation and no one else is giving her any complications with that because they're not asking. So I guess it would be the only thing that would maybe present sexy Sue with a little bit of a kind of moral dilemma is if she found out that 31 year old was hanging out with other people, sleeping with other people had another person in his life, would she feel like she had been duped? If presented with that, if she's like, oh, no, I'm just assuming that he is, then she has her answer. There is some kind of tacit agreement there, which is solidified by the fact that no one

has ever had the conversation to say that their status quo is A-okay. And I assume if Souter on the sixth date is serious about trying to fix the problem that she doesn't have and trying to make her exclusive, then he will make that ask. And she will have to decline it. Yeah. And I guess the only other issue. Assuming these are men, right? Right. The only other. Oh, interesting. Was there any gender? I think she said he's, but I don't know. I could have just been making that. No. No, there's a him. Okay. Good. I guess the only last thing that that I have a thought about is that I only care about sexy sale because I'm only thinking about sexy sue right now. I'm not thinking about the other two because sexy sue wrote into us and sexy

Sue is our person. She's our constituent. Yes. The only thing that matters to me is if this keeps bothering sexy Sue. If it wasn't bothering sexy Sue at all, sexy Sue would not have written this question. If for some reason, this is making sexy Sue feel an ick when she falls asleep at night or a little nagging or a nudging or like a discomfort, an inner conflict, then that is when I would want sexy sue, not because of what she should do, not because of should, but because of her actual self-feeling uncomfortable. And if she's really not trying to like, you know, nail down one of these two, if it still bothers her, then why the hell not for her own self to free her own self from the bother? Be like, hey, dude, you are, you just want to be clear, I'm seeing these other people.

I'm seeing these other people. Then that's why to do it, to make herself. least from whatever discomfort led her to even ask this question in the first place. Yeah. Great. Okay. I hope that's all right. Sexy Sue. Mostly we just think you're really cool. I love it. Okay. We are going to go to our Pod Squader of the Week. And this one came in a little while ago, but it's so precious and wonderful and juicy that just here we go. Hi, Glennon, Abby, Amanda. My name is Liz. She-Her. I'm listening to the podcast. and you mentioned the tour, and I just recalled this memory from seeing you on tour that I wanted to share with you, I thought you'd like it. By the way, that tour, if you don't know, we went to a bunch of cities. We met with sold out huge, massive, beautiful dancing crowds of you all over the country,

and then gave every penny that we made on that tour to immigration justice groups in each city. and so the whole thing was just an incredibly beautiful love fest from our perspective. That's what she's talking about. So I took my husband to the tour. It was like our first date, night in years. We have little kids. And we went to the Seattle one, which was amazing. And first time I was like literally mind-blown in a positive way and so long.

But afterwards, we went to go use the restrooms downstairs in the theater. and the women's line was like out the door super long. So my husband, thinking he was going to be quick, goes to the men's room. And then later when I saw him when we met back up, he said that the women had overtaken the men's room and that he and another guy had to poke their heads in and then they asked the women in the men's room if it was okay if they went and used the urinal.

So I just want to say that, you know, we're not worldwide yet, but we, you know, as a group, in that little theater that night, you know, we took that patriarchy that fucked down. They had to ask us if they could use a urinal. And, you know, I just feel like that's a sign of things to come. And that's a sign of the work you're doing and the power in that room. And, yeah, it was great. So thanks for doing what you're doing.

And let's, you know, keep it up. We'll get there. Oh, Liz. Oh, that's so good. Okay, I love this because Alice and I had a very similar experience for her Christmas present. We planned a trip to go see. She had read Ragtime the play and loved it. And my friend from college, Lear de Bessene, who is this extraordinary woman, she basically puts on half of the shows on Broadway. She's a brilliant, brilliant, amazing human and always has been. She made Ragtime, directed it

on Broadway. And so we were dying to see that. And of course, Also, we needed to see Wicked because that was totally obsessed with that for like five years. Okay, so we're in the Wicked intermission. It is like our huge trip of the year. We have like invested a lot in this trip and this show. And you get like a seven second. Is it called intermission in theater? Yeah, I think intermission.

So we're going out and the women's restroom is literally like 300 people long. and the men's room is three people. And all of us are waiting in this line. We have paid cash money to be here. And for the purposes of watching the show, which is about, they're blinking the lights, about to go back on. And all of these officials from these theater

are standing around like this is acceptable that all of these women for needing to use the bathroom are going to miss what they paid for while they're literally sized. by side. It makes no sense. I'm like, this is an injustice. This is bullshit. This is impact. These things bother me even when it's not impacting my actual bottom line and my dollars and my trip that I have planned meticulously for my daughter for her entire Christmas present. And I was like, guess what we're not going to do? Miss a second of that play. And I looked around to the women that were in front and

back of me. And first I checked with Alice, I was like, Alice, what we're going to do is we're going to go over and use that bathroom. And I'm going to invite some people to come with us because this is absolute horseshit. Like, never obey in advance. No one's even telling us not to do that. We're just standing in this line, obeying in advance for the awkwardness of someone looking a skew at us. And I dare someone to look askew at me in this moment. And so I'm like, do you want to come? I'm bringing a contingent over there. And if you would like to come, you're more than welcome. And so this little group of like 20 of us just moves out of line and runs into the thing

and gets in line and just without like no words, no whatever. There's like an official standing at the door. And I'm like, I'm going in there. And she's like, okay. And we just all go in the bathroom. And then like half the line comes and joins half the bathroom. but it was like this idea that like what are we afraid of what are we afraid's going to happen that someone's going to say no in which case we could be like why do they have a right to see a show

that we don't have a right to see this is crazy it felt like a little jolt of like excitement and fun and we should just do things more rather than elect to do the thing that is expected that we don't like like i was like i don't like that i don't like this moment. And this should be different. And wait, why can't I make it different? I literally can. All it's going to take is walking over there. I want to hear just that you're saying that. I just want to hear so many other ideas like that. Like, I want to hear from, if you're listening right now and you're, you just heard that story and it made you think of another thing that you did in a regular situation outside in our regular culture, in our regular society that was like a

micro action of equality that we might not think of, but that we could do in our everyday lives. Would you just call it in and tell it to us? I don't know if that's going to work, but I just, I'm listening to you thinking, I need 50 more of those, especially right now when like the big things are so corrupt. Like, I need things that we can do now in our like grocery stores in our post offices in theaters that mean we're not obeying these ancient, oppressive standards in advance. So if you have any other ideas. Like micro-resistances. Yes. Yes. We need micro-resistance ideas. Okay. Call us and tell us your micro-resistant resistant ideas. 747-2005307. 747-2005307. Or just your questions too, because that was fun,

especially if we have a sexy one like Sue. We love y'all. Thanks so much for doing life with us. We'll see you next time. Bye-bye. We are proud to say that We Can Do Hard Things is an independent production brought to you by us. Treat Media. Treat Media makes art for humans who want to stay human.

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