We Can Do Hard Things with Glennon Doyle - How to Parent While You Heal: Live on Tour

Episode Date: July 31, 2025

433. How to Parent While You Heal: Live on Tour In today’s episode, we share more from our first-ever live tour where we gathered with thousands of you to celebrate our Indie and New York Times Bestselling book, We Can Do Hard Things. We talk about internalized sexism, what to do when you don’t have a village, how to parent while you’re still healing, how to stay rooted in love in the face of fear–and why friendship might be the most important survival tool we have.

Welcome back Pod Squad. Today, after receiving so much love for our live episode that we shared with you a couple weeks ago, we are taking you back into this sacred, joyful space of our We Can Do Our Things tour. It is something that you all and we created together during this time in which so many of us are at home and feeling isolated with fear and anxiety. and feeling a little bit desperate and a little bit hopeless. And the beauty of being together is that we found hope and joy and togetherness and community. And those are the things that are going to get us through this. Every one of these nights reminded us of that connection and the power of being together

and of feeling alive. And a bunch of people feeling alive together. is how we're going to change things. So it's also what makes life worth living. So thank you for showing up with us in those rooms. Thank you for showing up for yourselves and for spending this time with us. We were in all sorts of places. Thousands of you we saw in New York, in Boston and Philly, and Washington, D.C., in Minneapolis, and Denver and Portland, Sanford, and Seattle. And then we ended the tour with an unforgettable night in Nashville, Tennessee during Pride weekend at the Ryman Auditorium. And I will never forget the end of that show with the lights of people's cell phones while Tish

was singing. It was just as close to magic as I felt. In today's episode, you're really going to want to listen to this. It is good. We are bringing you the live moments from a collection of those shows. we're talking about internalized sexism, what to do when you don't have a village, how to stay rooted in love, when all your feeling is fear, why friendship might be the most important survival tool we have right now. And I talk a little bit about letting go of perfection, which I'm not yet perfect at. Let us jump in. Hi, squad. The question is, what's going on with the Sarah Paul?

Paulson playing Glennon and all that. Wow, you are the first person to ask me that on this tour. I have to figure out how much of the truth I want to tell right now. Okay, I'll just tell the whole truth. When does that ever get in me in trouble? So, I believe that that project will happen at some point. I stopped it completely. I could not find any peace or confidence.

with my family in any way being on a screen. Like when I write my stories about them, I get to completely, I want to use a better word than control, but I think that's the right word. Shepherd. This story, you know, it's for me. And so every word that I write about them and Craig

or anybody else is truthful but done with like great, great love. And we kept getting to parts where I just felt like, I don't think I have the right to do this. I can't explain it other than I could never get to a place where I felt like it needed to be done or that I had the right to make my kids like symbols of anything or I just couldn't get comfortable with it. And so I canceled the whole thing. And I know. It's kind of a bummer because Sarah Paulson is one of the most beautiful, wonderful people in the entire world and one of my dearest friends now. And we both believe that we will figure out how it can be done eventually. And when it comes around and it's the right idea, it'll be

perfect. It'll happen. But it just, I could not. I feel like more and more, I'm just not doing anything that doesn't feel like. And I feel like we also have like the most amazing level of like A list, B list were like W were like so low on the fame list and it's perfect. And I don't want it to get higher. Like I think it's not, we're just in a good zone right now, you know? Yes. So there wasn't enough in the plus column to keep it going, but there was so much risk that I just felt like it's not needed. Maybe one day.

I'm sorry. Maybe one day. Okay, let's go up top now. Oh my God. I feel like I could throw up. I'm talking. Sorry. Actually, I do have a question. So when you were talking about how do we make peace with our bodies, it was making me think about my spouse, my spouse is trans, and my spouse has so much respect for their trans ancestors,

and they care so much about fighting and staying here in the U.S. and fighting. And I have so much love that has turned into deep, deep fear and I want to run. I want to take my spouse and run away so fast. So how do I reconcile deep love

that has turned into such deep fear? Yeah. Well, what is your name? Yeah. Maggie. Maggie, you're wonderful. Susie, do you have a response to Maggie about love and fear right now? It's a good question.

It's a beautiful question. First of all, it's beautiful that your spouse is exactly who they are. It's beautiful that you love them exactly who they are. It's beautiful that you can connect your love and your fear because I think that is probably 90% of the ballgame. I think so much of love shows up as fear, and the fact you can connect that is a really beautiful thing. I think the fact that your spouse wants to stay is wonderful because what is happening right now is this intentional strategy of erasure.

I mean, that is what is happening with so many trailblazing, so many existences, so many beautiful ways to show up in the world are being literally erased. That's why they're trying to get rid of critical race theory. That's why they're trying to get rid of the celebratory days that mark these heroic people. That's why they're trying to erase trans people from history. Trans people have been around for thousands and thousands of years. And by putting them up as if they are new, that is an effort to isolate. That is an effort to say you are new and strange. and there is no precedent for you.

And that could not be more just intellectually, factually wrong. So this is why that's happening. And I think that the refusal to be erased from any marginalized group, if we are not marginalized, the refusal to aid and abet and allow erasure is one of the most important things we can be doing right now, because it's just, it's so necessary. It isn't about, it's about recognizing our history.

It's about recognizing reality. And that's why they're trying to replace reality with a counter-reality. So that the people who come up behind have to relearn that they are not alone. They have to relearn, they have to discover that they're part of a beautiful, long-standing lineage on their own, which is bullshit. It shouldn't be the case. So, I mean, I think kudos to y'all for showing up and for refusing to be erased. And also, of course, love is the opposite of fear.

It always has been. And you know how much you love them. And you're going to keep showing up because of that love. They're the opposite sides of the same coin. And your fear is when it's going to keep you loving. And your love is what's going to keep you afraid of the eraser. So just you're doing everything right. And we're going to fight for you and with you.

We're going to fight like hell. Yeah. You are not alone. Yep. Okay, so I think that it's really interesting. First of all, Tish kind of when she went on earlier and she was talking about love and fear and how close they are on the spectrum, like I've been thinking a lot about that. and I think that for you and your spouse,

the fact that you're even in the conversation of these two things, to me, like in my body, like when you said that, I was like, oh, you're going to be okay. And I know it because there's thousands of us in this room right now. It's a big reason why we wanted to do this book tour right now because we needed to be around other people that could help us get through these bizarre times, these horrific times,

that real people are suffering and real people are scared. And I think that if the love can live in coexistence with the fear, and we accept both of those for, like, really what they are, and when fear shows up, Glennon has always said, like, when it knocks on your door, let it come in and tell it, and let it teach you what you need to know. And I think that we will get through this with love, but also the fear is important.

I don't think that we should just try to ignore it. I think that we have to listen to it. What is this fear trying to teach us? That's it. Also, I want to say something else. Because the fear thing is huge. The fear, it's like, we are afraid, but you wonder who's more afraid? They are afraid.

That's the whole reason for this entire bullshit. I think it was Paul Mason who said that fascism is fear of freedom triggered by a taste of freedom by those who fascists don't want to be free. Okay? So it is the very fact that freedom is coming and inevitable and we are pushing it forward. no matter what, that they are so afraid that they need to do this. So it's not, let's just remember we are afraid, but they are way more afraid and they should be because we are going to keep going.

Okay, I mean, I just have to do it, woman in the white shirt that's standing up. The one going like this. Yeah. Hi, hi guys, my name's Abby also. Great name. That's her name too. So I promise there's a question at the end of this, but just a little bit of background. I grew up as an Orthodox Jew, and for anybody who grew up in any devout religion, it's kind of the same story.

I was expected to grow up, marry the Jewish man, make the Jewish babies, and live happily enough ever after. And that's what I did. I went to college. I found the Jewish boy. We got married. We had the babies. And then within the first six months of the pandemic, I had the gay awakening. Yeah.

Thank God. I was like, that's where this is going. We needed to queer this shit up a little bit more. I had two little babies at the time and was pregnant with the third. And I thought, well, fuck. And at the time, I had started opening up to a few close friends that I worked with, and one of them said, you know, I just read this book that I think you might find relatable. And I said, okay, well, I don't know anything right now, and I'm very scared, so absolutely.

and she bought me a copy of Untamed and the takeaway that I got from the book was that we all will die for the people that we love, we'll die for our kids, we'll die. And I knew then that instead of dying for them, I had to get up and live for them. Yeah. I was very scared.

Glennon had seen Abby and then at least she had that. I didn't have an Abby. I'm sorry. I know. Me too. I thought, okay, this is what we're doing. We're going to blow up our marriage.

It's going to be terrible, but I hope at the end of it, I will not only be able to live for my kids, but maybe I will find the glenon or the abbey to my glenon. And I did. Don't tell me her name's Glenn. Because that would be so weird. Yeah, it would be very, very weird. This is my wife.

Hi, Lauren. Together we have blended our families. Together we have five beautiful children. Wow. All under the ages of eight. Wow. So I guess my question throughout. Parent your kids.

the way that you wish you had been parented, but also at the exact same time, parent yourself the way that you wish you had been parented. Because the only thing I know right now is that I don't know anything. Yeah. You know more than most people then. Yeah.

Yeah. The not knowing. Yeah. Thank you. That's beautiful. Thank you. Abby. too because you did the thing before you the Lauren showed up.

People ask me all the time, would you have been brave enough to leave had you not had Abby there? And I hope so, like I think I, but I don't know that answer. So awesome. You're awesome. Like you did it. And like you made the leap. And then just in faith and belief and truth to yourself.

before you had another person there to go to you. That's amazing. Very cool. Yeah, I mean, I went through my hoe phase. Lots of dating out. Well, listen. Oh, I didn't have a hoe phase. Yeah.

Yes, you did. It was just well before. Oh, that's true. Now, listen, one of the things that you mentioned that I think is important about parenting that is, like, makes me know that you're very wise, is that no parent knows what the fuck they're doing. Like, you're just making it up as you go along. And the more I parent, the more I realize that my ability to self-regulate prior to going

into any parenting interaction will either make or break that parenting interaction. Yeah. And that is the only thing that I think about now. Like, it doesn't even matter what I'm saying with my words. It is literally the energy in which I'm walking into a situation. And if I'm bringing my five-year-old self, which I do quite often, or my 10-year-old self, or my 18-year-old self, I am a different parent. And so I have to check myself in those ways. So good on you.

God bless you for taking care of five children under the age of eight. I do not know how you're here, why you're here. That's why she's here. That's why she's here. She'd be anywhere else. I'd be sleeping in a hotel by myself somewhere. I think that we do both of those at the same time. Yeah.

Like, I can tell you for me, it's always happening at the exact same time. Like, when a kid comes to me and I can, one of my, our kids, and I know what they need in that moment, and I'm regulated enough to give them that, whether it's like a listening ear or a gentleness or forgiveness or whatever it is, I always have this wave of gratitude that I was able to do this, but then there's this second wave that's like great sadness for my little girl self who didn't get that in that moment. That's how that happens for me every time. It is not like I heal myself as I'm mothering myself and then I mother them.

It's like I mother them and then I think, oh, and then I just have to have like some moments with myself. And for me, it's backwards. I have a good instinct for what they need. Then I remember, oh, now I give that to myself. Yes. That gentleness, that forgiveness, that caring, that is what I need right now.

And then I find a way to mother myself in that way. Yeah. But I always have to get it first through what I can instinctually do with the kids. Does that make sense? I sometimes do this weird thing where when you're, because you are so good. I'm a little bit less regulated with the kids than you are. Like, when the kids bring us some sort of drama,

because there's drama every day, you are like, oh, wow, tell me more about that. And I'm somewhere, I go somewhere else. And so I then pretend that Glennon is like sweetly, lovingly talking to me and that little part of myself. and then I can get back into my situation. So you can maybe even help each other. Not that you're my mother, but I don't want that.

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your book Untamed to me when I was 12. We skipped the blowjob chapter. Skipping the blowjobs. I had a really big impact on my life then and I listened to your podcast now. And I just wanted to ask, I feel like I'm having such a hard time

because I feel like I have to be sexist to like survive in the world and in my relationships. And I just feel like it's having a really negative effect on me as a woman. And I'm just wondering if you have any advice

about how to not internalize all that. Okay, first of all, what's your name? I'm Olivia. Olivia, you're so great. That was funny and touching in all the things. You should have a podcast, really, Olivia. Can you just repeat for me

what you're having a hard time not being, did you say sexist? Like internalized sexism? Like internalized. Like toward myself. Yeah. Oh. You go.

Well, so does everyone who has been socialized and brought up in as a female person. Yes. All of us. That isn't that there is something wrong with you. That is because from birth, you've been receiving the messages over and over. that you're not supposed to trust yourself, that you are supposed to be a certain way to be received, be a certain way to be loved,

be a certain way to be palatable. Like, it doesn't go from an entire growing up in a culture in which you're stued in that to an intellectual understanding and desire and switch overnight. Like, that just isn't, you should stop shaming yourself for having that because we all do. And it's something that, I mean, the most shame I have felt in myself recently, I didn't even tell you guys this because I was so, so humiliated by it. But I was traveling with my family and we stopped at this restaurant and this older gentleman came up and was talking with us.

I was there with my daughter. My daughter's 10. And he was chatting. And there was this moment where he was like, like, can I have a hug? And I did it. Oh, yeah, I get that moment. I really do.

I did it. And my daughter was there. It was uncomfortable for her. It was uncomfortable for me. This was a man in a restaurant, in a state I didn't live in, a person I didn't know would never see again, and there would be zero consequences.

if I told him no or fuck off or anything. And instead, what my reaction is, as a women's studies major, a feminist, an attorney, and a generally person who's not afraid to tell anyone to fuck off, I said, sure, weird old man who's making my 10-year-old daughter and me uncomfortable, I'm going to give you a hug. like it was so upsetting to me for hours because I realized that my internalized need

my internalization of my job to no matter what the hell else is going on no matter what the cost to placate and make comfortable any man in my presence is so deeply embedded in me that I was willing to even model it for my daughter when I know better It is a poison and it is in us and we need to not be ashamed that it's in us. We need to be ashamed that this world keeps pouring it in us. And so don't beat yourself up. It's just you will get... That's so good.

It's not you. And the more, the fact that you've noticed it, the fact that you see it there is the first step because when it's in you, you can't see it when you take it out of it. you, you can look at it. And that's what you're doing and you're on your way. And don't question yourself and make your comfort and your piece on your spreadsheet. Yes. Let's go up top. That was so good. Yeah, that was really good.

And Olivia, read the blowjobs chapter also. It will help. Okay. Okay. Let's go up top. Hi. First of all, I just want to say thank you. It is the biggest privilege to be alive at a time where you guys are on a podcast and we get to listen to you. We need more of you guys in the world. The question I have, I've been working a lot on vulnerability and changing my definition of bravery. I think, as you guys probably all understand, the definition needs to change and change and change as our work changes before. It's like, come at your stuff. and work on yourself. And then it's like, how do I embody? So I'm just interested in how has your definition of bravery changed and anything you've kind of learned from that evolving definition

that we might be able to take. Thank you so, so, so much for existing. Wow. Great question. I've been thinking a lot about, like, who's driving the car for me. So the last relapse I had happened right at November. right in November, and what happens to me in relapse is that I get really scared. That's how it starts.

I get scared somehow. Whether it's something that's a macro in the world or micro in my life, I somehow get scared. And if I'm not really careful and if I don't stay really conscious, what happens is, and what happens to a lot of us is when we feel threatened, what takes over is a very young. young version of ourselves. Okay, so all of us were children in homes, and in many of these homes, we did not feel safe, and we learned ways to respond to the feeling of not being safe, to make ourselves safe, right? So in my particular home, there was unpredictability and a lot of control, and it was not safe in my house to be free or to have big feelings, or to grow, or to have an

appetite or to take up space in any way. It was a lot of eggshells, right? So I learned when things get scary, shut it down, become hypervigilant. Do not eat, do not rest, do not sleep, do not. It's like when you're, if you're an animal in a plane and the way that, when you start to feel threatened, right, you just absolutely stay hypervigilant. And so what happened is that little self came back up and I went completely unconscious. It took me four months. I was on a plane on the way home from New York and I couldn't even sit in my seat. Like my ass hurts so bad. And it was because my tailbone, I didn't even know what was going on until my tailbone was sticking out of my body again. Like I was so thin. And so here's what I did. This is what brave is to me now.

All that happened and all that happens to any of us when we go unconscious like that is that we just forgot that we are adults now and that we don't have to use those old broken tools that our little girl self had because we have new tools, right? We can set boundaries. We can say no. We can refuse to be in spaces with people who do not make us feel safe. We have a whole new toolbox. So when I remembered that, I realized that my little girl self was driving the car. She just was like, oh, we're scared. I know what to do.

I know how we stay safe. She told me all the things that we used to do in my family of origin to stay safe. Right? And I ended up starving, paranoid, not sleeping, the results of all those things. So what brave now is to me is, first of all, not beating myself up for that. waking up, saying, oh, I know what's going on. My little girl's at the wheel. The thing about responsible adults

is that they just don't let children drive. Truth. Right? Like even if a kid really wants to, even if a kid thinks they have really good ideas, like a responsible adult's like, you know what? Like I think you belong in the backseat where you can rest and put on your little seatbelt

because that's all that little girl wants anyway, right? Right? So I just pulled over, took a minute, said, thanks, sweetheart. I know that you think that this is how we stay safe, but I have some bigger, more beautiful ideas for us now. The good news is maybe there wasn't the adult that you needed in the room when you were little, and so you had to do all those things. But there is an adult in the room now, and it's me.

I've got us. Right? So I just put her in the back seat, and I got in the front seat, and I ran. remembered all of my strategies and now I'm driving again and that's my definition of brave today. For your child, as the school year continues, patterns start to emerge. You can see what's clicking and where a little extra reinforcement could help. That's where I-Exel steps in, giving kids targeted practice so they can strengthen those areas early and keep moving forward with confidence. I-XL is an award-winning online learning platform that supports math, language arts,

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And then up top, who wants it next? Yeah, two hands. Who wants it? Like second to last row. And then you went like that, it's you. That's the key to her heart. Because of the shimmy. Yeah.

Okay, go ahead down here. Hi. I'm going to pass out. Oh, my goodness. So, long time listener, first time caller. Been loved listening to you guys out on tour, and it's really exciting. What I want to know is Amanda, what is it like for you to, to be out there doing your own deal. And Glennon, what's it like to watch her? I would love to hear about that.

Yes, because this is the first time Amanda has been on stage. It's crushing it. What is it like, Sissy? I mean, to be honest, a couple of things about it. I'm usually like a hyper-preparer person, but I started this new philosophy of holding things more loosely. Just, but it was right before this, which I felt like I was like a person training for the Olympics my whole life and doing it the exact same way. And then right before the Olympics, I was like, I don't know, I might just fuck around and try something else. And that's what this feels like. But it feels like maybe a universe spirit thing because it's kind of like, well, that doesn't make any sense

just to go up and have faith in yourself in this context when you wouldn't even be. You even like have faith in yourself when you're like at midnight writing a report that no one's going to read. Right. You know? So I feel like it's kind of been an act of faith to try this. But what I think is even more so than that maybe feels really beautiful to me because it feels like an indicia, like a proof that I really do believe that I want and deserve to change the way I live. and that feels good to me. Because I feel like if she can make it there, she'll make it anywhere.

Yeah, that's what I feel like. And it's been on a more global way, as opposed to my microwave, it's been just such a damn joy and comfort for me to be in the presence of a community of people that cares so deeply and is so smart and is so engaged. And it's really invigorating me and it's making me feel hopeful. And it's making me feel really excited about what's next. Because we exist. We are here.

It's kind of like the Chavez. I have seen the future and it is ours. That is how I feel when I'm out here. I'm like, I see us and I know. that we are stronger than what's coming against us. And it makes me feel really excited. I mean, how it feels to me, like, I can you, it's mind blowing.

It's like I'm back there. I'm like holding my sister, who I've been doing life with since I was three. How did I survive those first years? holding her hand, holding Abby's hand, watching Tish sing, watching you all receive Tish and my sister and us like you always have. It's a freaking miracle to me. I will never get over it. I will never get over that you have, for some reason, agreed to do life with us. I know it blows my mind.

I think about it all the time. I am terrified of any sort of like promise or commitment, but I know that I will keep showing up for you until I die. And I will take breaks because I will lose my mind every five years. That's what I do. But then you write a book about it and that'll please you. Right. So it's either a good day or it's a good story, right?

Either way it's good. And I just, well, one thing that I think is weird is how good she is at it right away. Like I just thought, I don't know, it took me, when I first started speaking on stages, I was so terrified that I would make my sister sit in a chair behind me on stage. I don't know if any of you. No. I still, this is worth pausing with. It's a true story. I would just be speaking at like a convention.

And I would be. can't understand how awkward this was. Only thought of that the other day because someone said, because you said on the podcast, this is your first time on the stage. And I saw someone who was at that event and they said, actually, this isn't your first time in the stage because the first time I saw Glennon speak, you were on the stage. But literally, okay, so this is, she's speaking right here, but she tells the people, my sister needs to be there. And they're like, cool, your sister can be there. And she's like, no, no, no. My sister needs to be there. So there was a chair that I was sitting in. And Glennon is giving a keynote for like 35 minutes.

It's true. It's true. While I'm sitting in the chair with no explanation to anyone. And then she's finished. and then I get up fall around times yeah remember the lady who was like I've seen you you were doing some weird panel where you didn't let the other person talk

embarrassing I can't let us do that there's a lesson in it which is that's true right like fine my sister's coming like right we can do

that my sister's been through a lot that's what the point is also y'all like When I'm the only one talking, a lot of the shits for my sister anyway. Like, you know that, right? And I can just be me, and you can, it's like we're all individuating, I think. That's the good idea. What's out there?

This is like a codependence decoupling, a conscious uncoupling. It's beautiful. I'm so happy and proud of her. I think that she is like a healer in the world. I think she's a leader that we need right now, and I'm so excited. excited to support her. Okay, we're gonna go up top. First, I just wanna say thank you.

This must be really emotionally draining for you to do this tour. So I just wanna say thank you for the work that you're doing and we see it and we feel you and we appreciate what you're doing for us. Thank you. I am a lawyer. I'm a dean at a law school, actually Santa Clara.

Be a captain in the save higher ed and the rule of law boat. And I have two kids who are neurodivergent. They're seven and ten years old. And I'm the primary caregiver of my dad who has terminal leukemia. And I am learning that I have collected really, really beautiful deep friendships in my life. But we are spread across the globe. And because I'm not a PTA mom and I'm not a church mom, I don't have a village that shows up with casserole. when I need it.

And so I know that this is maybe something that Glennon struggles with a little bit and you've talked to Michelle Obama about it. But until we fix it... As you do. I feel like Michelle Obama would like her. Yeah. She would. Until we fix things,

what do the rest of us do in the meantime when we don't have a village around us to help support us while we're doing the hard things? Thank you so much. That's a good question. And it's also not... It's like the people, like her, who are trying to, like, save the legal system,

which is the last bulwark we have against what's going on, who are taking care of kids who need it, taking care of parents you need. Those are the people who, we all need support, but those people need support. But they're, by definition, not plugged into the daily community because they're doing all the other stuff. So how the hell do we fix that? I'm just hoping Abby knows because I know I don't know. You have friends.

I feel like you're... Yeah, I mean, I think that I'm feeling in this moment of my life in my mid-40s, my parents are aging, my kids are still in a place where they need us. And so it's this weird time of life that you feel pulled in every direction. And then you have this other thing that you're trying to protect the same. sanctity of our legal system and we're so grateful, I don't have answers. I have a thought. I have a thought. Go. I have a thought. Oh, oh, no, I thought you were saying I don't have an answer. I'm done. No, no, go, go, go, go, go, go. I was. I did. I said, I don't have an answer. Was that like a period or

comma after that? Was it like, I don't have an answer, but I'm going with this. Please go. Okay. What I'm wondering, because I was like, that's a real situation you're talking about. And I don't have an answer, but then I thought to myself, wait a second, you're saying you're doing all of these hard things and you need a friend and a community so they'll show up for you and the hard things. And it made me think of myself because, okay, so I have this, I had these good friends from college, but I don't keep in touch with anyone because it's, I'm really bad at it. The only people that are still in my life are the people who wouldn't let me live. leave. Literally. Those are the friends I have, the ones who just kept, were like, we're not letting you escape us. And we were going through this situation, and she was really upset with me. She's one of my dearest friends in the world, and she was like, you're not in my life.

And if you want to have people in your life, you need to be in their life. And I realized that, like, the way I thought about friendships was like, okay, I'm a really, good foxhole friend. Like if you need something, if you call me in the middle of night, I'm going to show up. But I'm not going to like go to dinner night or coffee or whatever the hell people do. But when you need me, if you call me, and if you call me, it better be a problem. But if you call me, I will fix your problem. And that was my whole view of friendship. Is that like in those crisis moments, that's why we have friendship so that in the unbearable moments, people will show up for us.

And like over the last couple years, I have, because of the come to Jesus my friend had with me and she's a little scary, so it worked. But like, I realized that I had it all wrong, that I thought you just pay the price to have a friend so that when things are unbearable, they'll show up. And I realize now that having friends is what makes life bearable. It's not that they show up when it is. It's some kind of magic magnifier. It's like you don't have the energy to have friends.

So how the hell do you have a friend? But then you have a friend and somehow you have energy. Even though they took your time and energy, you have more of it. It's magic. I don't, I can't explain it. But it works, I swear. And when I hear you talking about all the hard things that you're doing, I'm like, you deserve.

that kind of magic in your life. You deserve friends not just to bring a casserole, but to make your life feel lighter and better. And so I think you might need to trust the magic. And use time you don't have to get those friends because it won't just be castles. It'll be a lighterness in your life. Thank you, Pod Squad.

Thank you for showing up and for helping us stay human with your brave and beautiful questions. I will never forget those moments with you on the road. We cherished every single moment being together with you in person. God, we love doing life with you. We're closing this episode the same way we ended each unforgettable night with Tish singing, We Can Do Hard Things. Until next time, I give you Tish Milton and Brandy Carly. I got my continued

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