We Can Do Hard Things with Glennon Doyle - Let Our Sundance-Winning Film Remind You What Love Is with Megan Falley

Episode Date: February 6, 2025

383. Let Our Sundance-Winning Film Remind You What Love Is with Megan Falley Glennon, Abby and Amanda sit down with poet and friend, Megan Falley, to discuss the magic that is their Sundance Award-Winning documentary film, Come See Me in The Good Light. The documentary follows Meg and her partner, Andrea Gibson, as they navigate a year of life, love, and living through an incurable cancer diagnosis.  -How to make a gift of your suffering -Why seeing yourself through the loving eyes of another can be life-changing -Why frat guys are finally relating to queer poets -What this movie has to do with body image and loving yourself On Megan Falley: Megan is a nationally-ranked slam poet and the author of three full-length collections of poetry – most recently her book “Drive Here and Devastate Me”. Since transitioning to writing prose, excerpts from her memoir-in-progress have won several first- and second-place national prizes. She runs an online writing workshop called “Poems That Don’t Suck” which has been heralded as “a degree’s worth of education in 5 short weeks.” On Andrea Gibson: Andrea is one of the most celebrated and influential spoken word artists of our time. Best known for their live performances, Andrea has changed the landscape of what it means to attend a “poetry show”. Andrea’s poems center around LGBTQ issues, spirituality, feminism, mental health, and social justice. Andrea is the author of seven books, most recently “You Better Be Lightning”.  Previous appearances on the pod:  215. The Bravest Conversation We’ve Had: Andrea Gibson 245. An Unforgettable Double Date with Andrea Gibson & Megan Falley 265. Megan Falley Knows What Love Is To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

One of my favorite parts about the holiday this year was our recent stay when we went to go visit Glenn and Abby's family in LA, but we stayed in our own Airbnb a few blocks away. It was the best of both worlds because look you've got your privacy, you've got your own refrigerator, you've got your own beds, multiple beds by the way, and your own bathroom. And you know what? Then you can have your own bedtimes. It was just so nice to wake up in our own cozy place and have our own family time and then rejoin the larger family for the Christmas festivities and then retreat when everyone

needed a little breather. So here's the deal, whether you're traveling with family or friends, those extra rooms, the fully stocked kitchen, not only saves you a bunch of money, but it also makes a huge difference. If you're flying solo, you can make your stay your own little sanctuary.

If you're planning a winter getaway this year, I highly recommend giving Airbnb a try. Trust me, it's an experience you won't regret. If you're not killing these people, then who is? That's what I want to know. Starring Kaylee Cuoco and Chris Messina. The only investigating I'm doing these days is who shit their pants. Killer messaged you yesterday? This is so dangerous. I got to get out of this. Based on a true story. New season Mondays at 9 Eastern and Pacific.

Only on W. Stream on Stack TV. Megan Fowley is a nationally ranked slam poet and the author of three full-length collections of poetry. Most recently her book, Drive Here and Devastate Me. Since transitioning to writing prose, excerpts from her memoir in progress have won several first and second place national prizes. She runs an online writing workshop called Poems That Don't Suck, which has been heralded as a degree's worth of education in five short weeks. Andrea Gibson is one of the most celebrated and influential spoken word artists of our time. Best known for their live performances, Andrea has changed the landscape of what it means to attend a poetry show. Andrea's poems center around LGBTQ issues, spirituality, feminism, mental health, and social justice. Andrea is the author of seven books, most recently, Better Be Lightning.

Megan Fowley and Andrea Gibson are the subjects of the most beautiful doc we have seen, which hopefully you will see soon, called Come See Me in the Good Light, which just won the Festival Favorite Award at the 2025 Sundance Film Festival that we were all at. Welcome Meg Phaly. Yeah, buddy! Phaly, Phally, Fally!

Hi, hi Amanda. How are you? It's so nice to see your beautiful face, Megan. It's so good to see you, all of you. Okay, Pod Squad. How do we describe what's happening right now? Okay. Today's episode

is going to be a conversation between us and our dearest love Meg Fally, who you might know from so many previous episodes. I just really like to be here. I live here now. Oh, God. That's my dream. So what we have to tell you Pod Squad is I think the most beautiful creative story, one of the most beautiful creative stories we have ever been a part of as a team, which is a story of friendship and also a beautiful piece of art that was made called Come See Me in the Good Light, which is a documentary about Andrea Gibson and Megan Fowley. And I would say, no, no, you say what it is. Yeah, Meg.

And then we're going to tell you, Pod Squad, how this magical situation came into the world. And the story of how we all ended up in a six-bedroom house in Park City at Sundance, full of lesbians plus Sara Bareilles, because Sara Bareilles is always an honorary lesbian. I don't know how she's pulled this off, but she is. I mean, she wrote the gay anthem many years ago. Right. And days of what we will tell you was a snuggle down and then premieres of this documentary

and how it has been received in the world, which has been a miraculous thing. So, Megan, how do you describing or thinking about Come See Me in the Good Light in your miraculous octopoidal brain. So Come See Me in the Good Light is a documentary and it focuses on the last year of Andrea, my partner's cancer journey. And what has been incredible is that that sounds like just a pretty sad log line for sure. But when you watch the movie, TIG has compared it to a Will Ferrell movie,

because there is so much laughter. And of course, there's tears. Of course, there's hardship. It follows us through doctor's appointments and scans and good news and bad news and radiation. But also it's followed us through our everyday life which includes a lot of tiny dogs, a lot of working together as artists and a lot of love and a lot of troubles with our mailbox and just the everyday parts of life. And I do think that it's sort of impossible to write the synopsis of it. You

know, a poet with incurable cancer, that it just doesn't sound like what it is. We've noticed that a surprising community that's really responding it seems to be the bros. Like frat brother feeling people. And I was trying to figure out why. And I think it has a really sort of YOLO message. And I think frat boys tend to gravitate in this direction. And rather than get it from, like, a free solo or a surfing movie or something, they're seeing it in two queer poets' lives in there every day.

Wow. OK, Glennon, you have to tell the kind of the origin story of like how this kind of happened. Like what from your perspective, because I think I want to give the listener like a kind of a timeline of like when the center, I know you're not great with numbers, so I'll help. Right. And also because it feels like a love, the story for me is a love story. The movie is a love story, and it has all of the beauty and brutality of all of it. And then the making of the project feels like, it's like a parallel love story at the same time. That's why I think it's so pure and beautiful because it was made just by people who love y'all

and love each other. So tell that love story too, Glennon. Okay, I'm gonna tell it from how it happened from my perspective, and then I wanna hear from Meg's perspective how it intersected differently. Also, I would say, before I start this, that if Ticket called us and said, this story needs to be made about Andrea and Meg

and Andrea's love of life and Meg's love of Andrea and Meg and Andrea's love of life and Meg's love of life and Andrea and Meg's love of each other and there were no cancer involved. I would have said that is a hell yes. Like it's not the cancer. That's right. Right. It's the way that you two live individually and together that is the YOLO message. And I'm not saying that like I'm serious. I would have been like, yep, the whole world just needs to see a year of those two and then that will fix the world. Okay, here's what happened in a nutshell.

This is a long time ago. I am in my hellacious part of my last round of anorexia treatment. I am at a moment with the best doctors on the planet where I'm looking at one saying, I can't do this anymore. Nobody, all I can say to you is, I don't think it's gonna work. There's no, I kept saying, I was crying on the phone,

the Zoom with her and I kept saying, nothing is true enough. This is two years ago, this part of the story. Yeah, and I don't know what that meant, okay? But it felt like a serious proclamation at the moment. Like I met nobody in therapy, nobody's being true enough, so I can't recover. Okay, my long suffering doctor looks at me

and says the following, the only thing I can think of for you right now is Andrea Gibson's poetry. I'm like, who's Andrea Gibson? I laid in the fetal position in bed that night with Abby and said, the best doctor on the planet just told me that the only treatment she has left for me is poetry. I am so fucked. That was my first thing. Next day I order all Andrea's books. Abby and I leave for a vacation.

I start reading Andrea's poetry and I... During our breakfasts while we're at like a romantic getaway, Glennon's nose is just in a book. I'm like, this is fun. Something about the body thing, something about the life in it, something about it. I just am like, oh, okay, this is true enough. Then I find through Andrew's books, Megan, then I order Megan's work. Then I'm like, oh my God, I can't do anything except ingest these two human beings.

Okay. I completely ignore my marriage. One day, Abby takes a picture of me at breakfast. We're by ourselves at a table of two at a restaurant and I'm just reading your books. And Abby's by herself. Yeah, I've had enough. I mean.

So Abby takes a picture, DMs it to Andrea, right? That day, we end up in a conversation where Andrea says that they have to figure out how to tell the community that they had just found out that the cancer was incurable. Because of course, Andrea is thinking, how are they going to handle this? How are my people going to handle this? I'm worried about them. The three of us end up on an episode of We Can Do Hard Things, where Andrea is discussing their incurable diagnosis

on the podcast. We all somehow become friends. That moment, I guess, is when we become friends. One night, Abby and I are in bed at 7 30 p.m. This is like many months later. TIG calls us. TIG is our dear friend and Andrea and Meg's dear friend. TIG calls us and says, I think that there needs to be a documentary about Meg and Andrea. And I think you guys should be involved. So tell me if you want to meet sometime. So we send Tig a link immediately to get on Zoom from bed. Tig says, pitches the idea and we say very responsibly, because

we've heard this is what grown-ups do, we say, we hear you, we would like to think this over and we'll get back to you. We hang up the Zoom link, and 30 seconds later, we text Hagen and said, we've thought it through. We've consulted our bodies and brains. We believe it's a good idea we're all in. Throughout, just fast forward,

and then I'm going to turn it over to you Meg. During this, TIG contacts these two people from Tripod Media, Ryan White and Jessica Hargrave who are unfreaking believable artists and directors and producers. They are all in. There is a moment where, and you'll see it in the doc, where Andrea is doing a performance, a show. Chase and Abby and I are sitting there and I get a text from Sarah Bareilles. And she's like, turn around. And I'm like, what? Because we're in this theater. Andrea was performing a live show.

Right. Right. And Sarah, Sarah has flown to the show to secretly be there because she's so obsessed with Andrea and Meg. OK, I go into the back room with Andrea and there's a huge set of flowers, set of flowers, OK, flowers from Brandi and Kath, because Kath and Brandi are so obsessed with Andrew and Meg

that they have said, so. Brandy Carlisle and Catherine Carlisle. I'm like, oh my God, it's just like this moment. So then we pull Sarah and Brandy into executive producing the doc. So then the doc becomes Andrew and Meg are the people who it's about. Subjects.

The subjects. Tig Notaro and Steph Willen and Ryan and Jessica are making it. The executive producers are me and Abby, Brandi and Cass, Sara Bareilles. Sara Bareilles. Just this, and then we become this little family, and then it's the most beautiful thing that's ever happened.

And then it gets in descendants. And then we all have a house that we call the snuggle down where all of us just stay in this house for all the premieres. Okay, Meg, now you go. I mean, I think you summed it up. No, from our perspective, our friend Steph Willen approached us

about wanting to do a documentary and Steph, we're so close to Steph and apparently she had withheld approaching us for a year. She'd had this idea for a very long time and didn't know how we would respond. I have no idea why. She thought she didn't know if we'd be upset or offended or just not want that kind of attention,

but her partner convinced her. She was like, no, just ask, it's a good idea. And she brought it to our attention. And like you all, I think it took about 30 seconds for us to think, do we want to do this? Do we want to invite cameras into our homes, into doctor's offices with us, into all of these ups and downs of moments

that we were experiencing mostly alone? And it was such a clear yes so quickly, I think for a few reasons. I think we'd already done two years of cancer treatment just as us. So that so far hadn't been working. I mean, it worked for us emotionally, but why not add another element? And the other thing was that it was so important to us during that time, there's this quote, don't waste the suffering.

We wanted to not waste the suffering. We wanted to be making a gift or a lesson or learning of this time for ourselves and the introduction of the camera and knowing that we would be in an active process of turning this into art just felt like such a natural yes for us. And so they gave us a list of directors and Ryan White and Jess Hargrave were on that list. We had months earlier watched Pamela, a love story, which was their documentary about Pamela Anderson, which is one of those films where it's my favorite kind of film. You have a preconceived notion of somebody and then you learn the story of their life, and then you fall in love with them,

and you reflect what the hell is wrong with me, that I had those thoughts, but that was my perspective. It was my favorite kind of film. And so when we saw they were on the list, we're like, them, we want them, we want them. Oh, wow. Yeah, and they came, they flew into our driveway and we met them there. They didn't fly into our driveway.

I wouldn't be surprised. I was like, wow, they're high rollers more than I thought. They flew into the god-awful Denver International Airport and then found themselves here. Into your mailbox. In their Uber. found themselves here in their Ubers. But we met them out there and just gave them hugs. Andrea said, I guess you all are going to be here when I die. Welcome to my home. And I think that, I mean, speaks to how who and how Andrea is, which is immediately vulnerable. Skip right past the small talk.

Just go for it. Small talk, allergic probably. And they said to us, we'll shoot forever and one percent gets used. So just, you know, don't think too much about it. One thing that was really funny is we took a walk and they were filming us on a walk and we went with Steph as well. And she had sort of forgot that Andrea and I were mic'd and she came up to us and she goes, Oh, thank God I really like them. I was worried. And then we would just start laughing

because we can see them in the distance laughing. But it felt so immediately connective. And by the time that they left, like the second day, they came with us, I think, to Andrea's first radiation session ever. And then they left from there and we were crying and telling them we love them and it couldn't have been more true.

So even that whole process was just like you said, Amanda, it was like a double love story happening at all at the times. And they would fly in every three weeks and stay with us for three days at a time. And which is actually really interesting because Andrea's chemo cycle is also every three weeks. And we'd kind of been in a habitual pattern

of a little bit of dread with, you know, finding out in those three weeks, the status of the cancer. But then our new friends were coming that were making this project with together. And it was like the joy of having them come was eclipsing that other sort of dreaded cycle. and I'll see you can become a better investor. It's time to get the financial future you deserve. Get yours. Questrade. $25 in PC optimum points. Visit superstore.ca to get started. ["Sundance"] When the documentary was premiered at Sundance,

afterwards we were all in the theater together and afterwards this large kind of like big, I mean big bro guy guy big straight looking white guy stood up to speak as soon as the standing ovation was over. Well and just so the folks know there was a Q&A right after the film and then the Q&A this is what the moment that this gentleman stood up. And he was choked up and he said, I have never, the whole theater went silent and he said, I have never enjoyed crying for an hour and a half as much as I enjoyed that.

And then he said, please, please, when this gets bought, please make sure that it's in every theater so that people can experience this in community. He was stunned. He could just tell, he was stunned by his own love for this, for you too. And I just, that's gonna be the experience everywhere.

And I can't, I think one of the reasons I feel so grateful for it is just the way the universe put it in this moment in this country. It's such an undeniable piece. You just can't watch it and not have your heart explode with love for life and for your love. And I just wonder, what do you think is so special about you

and Andrea? Because actually what's discussed behind the scenes is that there's a stakes, right? In the doc because of the cancer, but it couldn't be less about cancer. I truly believe in my whole heart that if it were just following you two for a year without the cancer,

that it would also crack hearts open because there's something about you two individually and together that is so epitomizes love. So what the hell is it? What is going on with you two and you individually? But for real, like what do you think in your in your hardest of hearts and your mindest of minds? You know, I was telling Ryan in the green room the other day, it was after our third time we had seen the movie and it was the first time that I felt like I was objectively able to be like, okay, this is good. Because the first time you watch it, you're just like, what? You're just watching yourself and it's not like you're acting. It's, and you don't know what lines you're

going to say because they've only taken 1% of your life and you just have no idea. And it was the most surreal experience to watch it the first time. I just had no concept, but by the third time I'm like, that is a beautiful film. And I said to Ryan backstage, you know, I've never really considered myself to be an interesting subject before I saw this. And the way I view Andrea is like, Andrea is so dynamic. They are mercurial and they have every feeling in the whole spectrum. And they're funny and they're weird. And so I was always sort of able to see Andrea's like, you would be great in a documentary, but I didn't feel that in myself necessarily until I, necessarily until I, you know, witnessed myself through another person's eye. And yeah, so I don't think I could have pitched it myself and been like, here's why I'm interesting and you should film me.

I didn't inherently have that. And I do probably think that there is a slice of everyone in their life that could make a beautiful film with the right eye and attention and knowing what to notice. But what I will say that perhaps... I know documentaries don't typically happen in a year. And Ryan had told us that usually the first day is a total wash. And it was so awkward that first day. I, yeah, I just, I wasn't used to it. I didn't know what to do. I was, we were eating dinner and I was like, so aware, like, chew with your mouth closed, make sure this is really

important. And it was just an awkward, you know, sort of an awkward silence. We were having dinner with our friend Steph and what they actually ended up capturing that night ends up being in the film. It's one of the funniest scenes in the film, but it quickly pivots to tears. And I think that their team was in no way expecting that we would immediately go as like vulnerable, real, deep, exposed as we did the first day. And so maybe there's something about approaching poets who are more predisposed, I guess, to vulnerability that made us good subjects in this way. There wasn't pretense. We weren't rehearsing what we were going to say. It's all incredibly

authentic. And Brandon, our cinematographer, our director of photography, who we absolutely fell in love with, he was so… It never felt like there was this big camera in our face. He just… He was always doing something handheld and he was just like close and intimate. He said in an interview that he wanted the camera to feel like a fourth dog, which I thought was so brilliant. But there was just such an ease around them. I mean, I think the first night Andrea invited them into the sauna and Andrea is like weightlifting with no shirt in the, like there was just instant vulnerability.

And I think that you can feel that through the film. I think it's important for the folks that are listening. One of the things that not only shocked me, because you and Andrea are like rock stars in the poetry community and you're beacons of the queer community, like we look to you. And what I found so fascinating about this film was that there was so much around this cancer diagnosis, around this story, it was just like a beautiful example,

an elegant and classy example of like how, when given difficult news and over and over again throughout this film at times, how love was the center of you all. And yeah, fear can creep in at times, but I just felt so incredibly odd by how normal you two felt and how aspirational. Like you're abnormal in the aspiration of dealing with something like this cancer diagnosis and letting folks into your home, but how real and true you you

showed up on screen that even if you are a frat bro, you will find yourself in Andrea. Because this is like, I don't know, I don't know how else to say it, but it was to me, it was just like this beautiful documentary of us all watching ourselves in certain ways and in moments. And I know you guys are not us and you're different than everybody, but I just felt like it was so universal and so gorgeous. And I'm so grateful that you said yes. I have retroactive fear that like,

what if this never happened? You know? Cause it's so good and it needs to get out into the world. Anyways, that's my little. It's so generous. Meg, you know, the reason that they did it abnormally and did it all in a year is because none of us know how much time we have, but you especially acutely are aware that that time is

limited. The generosity of letting us in to be part of that time is really amazing to me. Did you ever have moments throughout where you felt protective or territorial about your time like you don't get to be here, this is mine, this is Andrea's, this is ours. Did you have that sensation at all? And if so, like when and what did you do with it? I wonder if maybe with a different crew of people, I might have had that sensation, but I can honestly say I didn't have that sensation one second. Wow. Yeah, I felt, well, they were so instantly our friends

that we just felt like, why haven't we been doing this with our friends here? And since then, our friend Heather is in the film. She's an ex-girlfriend of Andrea's. She's also Andrea's manager. And since the making of the documentary, Heather's come with us now to every single chemo and she comes to most of our appointments with us because their presence helped us realize the importance of roping in more community to it for sure.

Oh, so it wasn't just being a subject that is being observed, it changed having someone having another presence there, having community there actually helped you. How? Why? I mean, Brandon is the one, the DP who, director of photography, who came into most of the more intimate appointments with us because we couldn't really bring everybody in. So he was there with his camera. And Brandon and I would have a lot of conversations

throughout like about he reads novels and we would talk about books. And we would just, I think to have a third person present whose experience wasn't only Andrea cancer, opened up our peripheral vision, which was so important during times like this, to not just be inward, to have somebody else there to ask questions about their life and get their perspective

and learn something new. And I think it just took us in some ways out of ourselves. And as soon as a third person is in, I can't help it. I want to make that person laugh. And so when Heather's there too now, but Andrew is constantly having to like shush us because they're like, remember this is a serious place. And there's just so much laughter

when we invite another person in. Yeah, so I didn't feel territorial. It felt only like a gift to us. Does it help you? Sometimes I think that I don't understand what's going on in myself and my life until Abby tells me what she sees. Like good or bad, when Abby tells me this is what I'm seeing in me, this is what I'm seeing in you, this is what I'm seeing, then I'm like,

oh, I'm amazing, or oh, I'm fucked, or oh, I'm whatever. But like, was there something about having a witness to your story who is also going to project that story out to the world that made you understand the epicness of your lives. You know, Ulysses is nothing until somebody writes the story. Your story is epic and you even know what you say in some parts of the doc,

like this is like biblical allegorical shit. Did it help you to take your place in that story as epic to have a witness? I think mostly I felt that not so much when they were here and doing the filming because we were just living our lives, but through the editing and our editor is Berenice Chavez and I don't know how somebody does that job

who sits with hours and hours and hours of footage, some of it's monotonous and mundane and connects it all together to tell a story in 90 minutes. I cannot fathom it. So I don't know if I felt anything epic in the day to day, but when I saw it all collected, what I mostly felt was, thank God I have something that I can show people so that they understand what it's been. Because you can tell people what the ups and downs feel like, you can try to put it into words, but it's really just an approximation of the thing. And you can say, no, we've actually don't worry too much about us. We've been really joyful. We've been dancing in

our kitchen. We've been like loving and laughing. But when you actually, You see us, you know, have a difficult day and then dance or however it is. It felt like, oh my God, I get to, people get to understand now. And I'm a writer, you know? My whole life I'm trying to write my experience in a way that people will understand and like what you said Glenn and like it find something true enough but to see it to have the actual images and like really invite people into our home in that way without having to constantly have people in our home I cannot wait to share it it with more people, but especially people close to me. Sometimes Meg, when someone asks you a question, I don't know if you know that you do this, but if someone asks you a serious question like, how are you?

You'll go, language, language. And it makes my heart swell when you do that, because to me it's like this moment where you are wanting to answer with your whole self and truth and body, and you know you only have this one tool, which is language, which is never gonna be enough. And you're just, to me it's like your signal, like, okay, you'll never be able to know,

just from the words I pick, but I'm going to try. Yeah, but that's why this film is so fucking incredible. Because you can, your whole body and the feeling, it made me appreciate embodiment and movie so much because you had more than language to tell and show. And I wonder, what do you think when you watch it that makes you an interesting subject? Like when you are finally able to admit, oh, I'm an interesting subject, you described why Andrea is. Why are you an interesting subject?

I think that there's a tension in our differences there's a tension in our differences that in a good way, but there's a juxtaposition of like Andrea says in the film, I am not a big worrier. I really try to just be with the moment in front of me and my head is very rarely on the future outcome. So that's not to say if the moment in front of me is really hard, I'll have a hard time in that moment, but I tend not to be having a hard time in a future that doesn't exist yet, which I think is probably healthy. But that it's also extremely uncommon.

And so I think there's just this push and pull of experience. So Andrea is really good at like feeling all of the feelings through in real time, like every one. And it's fast and they're, you know, just it's a whirlwind. And I am more, a bit more level, I think, and steady. And there's something about, I guess, the relationship as its own wholeness or its own person and then pulled apart.

I think there's something in that too. And of course I've had my own journey with my body through Andrea's diagnosis as well that I've spoken about, but how having someone face, you know, an incurable cancer diagnosis and the threat of potentially not having a body anymore soon, through cold water on the face of me having body image issues and how I don't wanna say that small because it's not, because it's lifelong and something I've held and carried since I was a kid and somebody told me to and a culture reinforced it,

but it made the discrepancy of not that this thing is small, but that this thing should be small. And I think I was glad that they weaved my story about that into it side by side in case other folks, and I'm sure all of us have our whatever insecurities, and I hope that the telling of that could illuminate something for other people watching who weren't necessarily facing a health scare but some other issue and we all have them of living in the bodies

we're living in. I think about it once a day from the film. Like that piece of it. I mean I don't think it's a little parallel track. I think it's the whole main track too. Like I want to live. And if I'm suspending my ability to live to my fullest until X, until something looks like or feels like or I achieve X, whether it's body or job or whatever, then I'm actually not living. I'm not taking the life and living it now.

And so I think it feels like all exactly the same thing to me when I watch it. And it's that part of your journey, I think about once a day in my life. And to love the body that I have and live in it right now today. So that was incredibly powerful. And I also think that the way that you describe your experience of not future tripping. And in some ways I feel like you think you're having a, maybe a more limited experience because so many people

are future tripping and you're not, or you say like, I don't do that. But it is so rare that to me, that's like, you are having the full experience. Because when I am in a moment and I think this moment may be sort of okay or maybe there's some good things happening, but I know it's just all going to be really bad, I am actually never, I am not having the full experience. I am only living in the future potentially horrible outcome all the time. Which isn't even real.

It isn't real. Right, you are actually experiencing the real thing that is actually happening in that moment every time it's happening. Instead of having this future filter on every experience that doesn't actually allow you to engage with it, which I feel like is what I do. So I can never be here.

What do you think about that, Meg? I have never thought about it that way. I love how you just phrased it that way. And thank you. Well, first of all, even you saying that you think about any part of the movie once a day, it's so validating and affirming and just heart opening that we could have turned this into something that is helping or changing things for other people. But yeah, I think you're right.

There was part of me that was like, am I having a limited experience because I'm not in constant turmoil? If that makes sense. That sounds so weird when I say it back to you now. But yeah, like on days when Andrea is like in a lot of pain, it's very painful for me. But on days when they're not, I am not being like,

well, this is, it's gonna be something or other in the future because I don't and can't know that. And you're right, that is why would I have thought that being present with it is somehow less. So thank you for that. Sister, why did you decide to come on as an executive producer? Because actually, Sara Bareilles is not the only non-lesbian bonus as executive producer.

Oh yeah, that's right. That's right. Sara and Amanda. Yeah. I also get my medal of honor. Oh my gosh. It just wasn't a question of being invited into something so beautiful. What a gift in this time to this time of a very long shadow over a lot of beauty to be able to be a small part of putting a light on the beauty just felt very like a gift. A gift to be able to do that, you know, for myself. Very selfish gifts. And I think what I love a lot about what this film will do is like, yes, the subject matter, yes, the communities,

yes, all of the people who have struggled with a lot of this particular hard thing, but also for people to see knowing that if someone had a camera on your life, you would be a hero too. Yes. Everybody has in their life something like, if your childhood had been documented and you had the director and the editor that you deserved, you would see yourself and you would cry

because of how you survived. And if there was one on your divorce, you would see those cuts of what you said to your kids. You would see those cuts of the days you woke up and pushed through and you would be like, I am a goddamn hero. And so when we see you two living the way you are with just such a ferocious will to live, I think that we can see some of those moments in ourselves to be like, we're doing it. Like if we could actually see the story of each of our lives and the story of each of our lives and the story of each other's

lives, we would be like, everyone is out here trying so hard to survive and to live and to do their best for each other. And that's really, if we could do that for each other, we would live in a very different world for ourselves and for each other, you know? Yeah. We only have a few minutes left, so I wanna talk about two things. Damn it!

Number one, I wanna talk about what you're doing creatively right now. Cause like, what have you done for us lately, is my question. Pfft! It's been a week since Sundance, so I wanna know what we're going to get next. And then also, we have to tell the pod squad what happened.

So we were home for two days after Sundance. And then I was in the basement and Abby was upstairs and I hear Abby yelling. And she's running down the stairs with the phone. And she says, Megan and Andrea and Jess and Ryan are on the phone and they have to tell us something. And then Meg, what do they tell us? They told us that our film won festival favorite at Sundance, which means that of all of the films that premiered there, viewers voted it their favorite one. Now we called Abby immediately because we

were tapped into Abby's competitive edge and the fact that she loves winning and is great at it. And I will say, Abby said something that Andrew and I still quote to each other, which was the sweetest, most earnest thing. And she said, this is better than any Olympic gold medal I've ever won cause this is about love. Yeah.

It is. And it was, and it's true. And like, PS, the very first meeting that we had with Ryan and Jess the director and producer of this film I was like okay so what awards can we win if winning was I couldn't believe it Meg. What does being a champion look like in your film context? I just need to know. We're making a winning? I just needed to know. And Ryan, he's like, we won't be up for any of the awards for various like Sundance rules reasons.

And I was like, oh, this is terrible news for me. I'm out. So now I'm just gonna like enjoy the process, which was actually a good lesson. But then when you guys called, Ryan said, this award is so beyond what I even could potentially dream of that I didn't even want to tell you that this is a possibility. This is like the award they give for the favorite. We're favorites.

And also like, Hot Squad, just listen, the only, you know, it's something like 30,000 films are submitted to Sundance. And then like 39 get in, I'm making these numbers up. Just, it's like that though. And then, Andrew and Meg's doc won of those 39. Andrew and Meg's doc of the people who voted. Yeah. Of all the movies, not the docs, all the movies.

The favorite. It's so exciting. I think it's 17,000 submissions and then 88 films shown. Wow. Yeah. Wow. That's so redonkulous of you all.

And Meg, Abby said when Ryan said, there's no, we're not going to be eligible for anything. At dinner that night, Abby goes, I know that Ryan said that, but I know, I know there's said that, but I know, I know there's competitions and I know we're gonna win it. I don't know what it is, I just know we're gonna win.

I know, I knew it. I said that. I'm like, no. Like I know we're gonna win something and there has to be something we can win there. Can't be art for art's sake, what the fuck? Oh my God. And it's just because I, look,

I believed in this project so much and I believed in the way that this project came together because it was just like everybody who participated and said yes was like a full body yes. It was like not like, oh, like, let me talk to my agent. Let me talk to the so and so. I mean, look, one of Andrea's greatest dreams and you can speak to this was to write a song with Brandi Carlile. And in the movie, tell the story.

This is an important part of the story too. Yeah, Andrea's poems are woven throughout, but the film ends with lyrics Andrea wrote that Sarah and Brandi turned into a gorgeous song, and Sarah's singing it. I don't know if, I think Brandi might end up singing on it as well later in the process, but the credits roll and it's this, another collaboration really,

another beautiful collaboration. It's been so incredible to make something. I mean, as writers, it can feel like such a solo process. And if you win something, you win it, but you're up there alone. And so Abby, you probably, you have a different experience winning something as a team. And winning as a team just feels so, it's so much better. Yes. Yes. All of it as a team is so much better. I don't know how I'll write anything alone again.

I'm just going to invite everyone over. Sorry, fine, Meg, I'll do it with you. I could have asked. Meg sent us a video. It's important. Yes, Sara Bareilles and Brandi and Andrea and this big song and it's on the credits and it's on the credits and it's huge but a couple days later after Sundance Meg sent us a video of Andrea in the doctor's office at chemo with Heather sitting

next to them and Andrea's feet are just bopping in the bed to the song that they're listening to during chemo. It's just it's all very it's it's not just what's shown. It's, it's really real. The project is fueling all of us in our lives, not just out there. Okay. What's next? What are you working on right now, Megan Fowley? I'm working on completing my memoir. I feel like I'm in the home stretch here and, you know, I had started writing a book about my body many

years ago and I didn't know the plot twist of my partner getting cancer would happen and how it impacted me physically and emotionally and spiritually would happen. So yeah, that has ended up being a big, big part of the story as well. And yeah, I'm still working on that. And my hope is that the film just, we keep going to festivals honestly, so we can keep all being together. No. And keep, you know, laughing and crying and community.

And yeah. Yeah. We love you Meg Fowley. I love each and every one of you for individual and specific cherished reasons. Language, language, language. So we'll see if this most beautiful film in the entire world that Olive Sundance decided was the best film,

if in this moment there is a network or streamer that will be brave enough to go against the tide of this moment in the world and put this film in living rooms all over the country and world, which is where it should be. Yeah, because we went into the Sundance Film Festival as an independent, not attached to a network or a distribution network. So the hope is somebody buys it up so we can put it in theaters slash get it into every television. Because this is this movie people need to see right now. And I'm not just saying that because we're part of it. If I had nothing to do with this movie, I would also be saying this.

Hi, Apple. Hi Apple, hi HBO. Is there anything the good people of America can do? Like I wanna be able to send this to people. Is it, it's not like calling your Congress person. You can't like call Netflix. Call your local streaming service. I feel like this is a good question. I think they're gonna know what to do, right?

I mean, do you know anything specific they can do? Cause I don't, I just think they're gonna know what to do, right? I mean, do you know anything specific they can do? Because I don't. I just think they're gonna know what to do. Well, one thing I want to say it just about all of this is we had somebody say, similar to what you're saying, I hope that someone will be brave enough in this current administration to put this out. But this, it's not in any way a political film. That's right. But this, it's not in any way a political film. It's a love story. We happen to be queer. Andrea happens to be non-binary,

but the focus isn't on that. It's such a human story and such a love story. And I think anyone could watch it and see that they have way more in common with us than they have differences. And I think that's sort of something that's most important because you can invite these two people into your home via a streaming service

that you probably wouldn't necessarily maybe invite into your home, if you're on the other side of things and realize the commonality and the shared humanity. And I actually think for that reason, it's so important that it gets to a larger streaming service or to more people, because I think it can bridge what we imagine as our differences and show that this,

and show that this, you know, mortality, cancer, death, that it's not a two-party system. It will happen to us all and we all have love. And yeah, I think that this is the time for a movie like this to come out. Damn. That's the way to end it. That was some good language, Megan. Good language.

We love you, Pod Squad. Reach out to your local. Senators. Your local streaming president. I don't know, just, you'll know what to do. Yeah. We did our part, okay? Call your people.

You'll know what to do. Reach into your soul and ask your soul not what the movie can do for you, We did our part. Okay? Call your people. Reach into your soul and ask your soul not what the movie can do for you, but what you can do for the movie. Exactly. Does somebody have an Aunt Carol that works at HBO or Apple or just call Aunt Carol. Carol. We love you, Pod Squad. Bye. Bye. you, Pod Squad. Bye. Bye. subscribe to We Can Do Hard Things. Following the pod helps you because you'll never miss an episode and it helps us because you'll never miss an episode. To do this just go to the We Can Do Hard

Things show page on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Odyssey or wherever you listen to podcasts and then just tap the plus sign in the upper right hand corner or click on follow. This is the most important thing for the pod. While you're there, if you'd be willing to give us a five-star rating and review and share an episode you loved with a friend, we would be so grateful. We appreciate you very much. We Can Do Hard Things is created and hosted

by Glennon Doyle, Abby Wambach, and Amanda Doyle in partnership with Odyssey. Our executive producer is Jenna Wise-Burman, and the show is produced by Lauren Legrasso, Alison Schott, Dina Kleiner, and Bill Schultz.