We Fixed It, You're Welcome - Advertising Week 2027: Imagining What's Possible

Starting point is 00:00:00 Welcome to We Fix It. You're welcome. The show where we take over companies, you come along for the ride, and we try to put them back better than we found them. Welcome back to We Fix It, you're welcome. This is not our typical episode. I am live in New York with our guests today. Erica Boki, we just got off an event, which is a great event, and we're tired. Can't wait to tell you about it.

Starting point is 00:00:26 Erica is the founder of XT Land. She's an experiential person. She's got a lot of experience under her bill too. Let's let her tell you about it. Erica, tell us a little bit more about yourself. Well, first of all, I'm one floor up from you. So we are in the same location, but you wouldn't know that. And a little bit about me.

Starting point is 00:00:47 I am thrilled to be here with all of you, first of all. Second of all, I started my career in media as a journalist, but then ended up on the brand side and really creating a lot of experiences for brands. like GQ, Team Vogue, Wired, Fast Company, but then ended up also telling the story of some of our partners through that lens. So, you know, experiential to me,

Starting point is 00:01:13 a lot of people act like it's a new phenomenon, a new medium, and I'm like, oh, we've been doing this. We've been gathering since the beginning of time. But it's great to see this industry kind of finally having its moment. And I have a lot of thoughts about why we're here now. But I will just say thank you for having me. Great. Thanks, Erica.

Starting point is 00:01:33 I can't wait to get into it. So we had the event today, your event. We'll talk a little bit more about that because it's very pertinent to our discussion today. The event is time that are coincidentally around advertising week by the time this air is that will be over. But we can tell you more about it in retrospect. but it was for a community that wanted a reason to gather, wanted a reason to be together, and a bunch of experiential heads of brand got together

Starting point is 00:02:06 in a room, had an experience together, not advertising week, near advertising week, and why don't we talk a little bit more about that? Usually I do a little bit of prep about our topic. We got to fix something. What we want to fix today, is that advertising week is not what advertising week could be, at least from our perspective. It's had some glory days. It's had some great moments. It's kind of not at that point right now

Starting point is 00:02:38 from our perspective. And from a lot of people's perspective, including, like I said, a really active, vibrant, happy community. And it wasn't at advertising week. It was down the block. So, Erica, this is usually my part, but let me let you in on it. Give us a little bit of background. Give us a little context from your perspective about advertising week where it's been, where it's gone. And what is it like? I saw some sizzle reeled and I liked last year. I got a good sense of it.

Starting point is 00:03:08 I'm guessing it's more of the same. But what's it like now? You know, in the heart of New York City, except it's not, it's in Harold Square in the old mall that was below the train station in, like, like the last time I spoke there, I was in the JCPenney, you know, boys department and the signage was still on the wall. So it's, and really, I think why this sticks in my cross so much and why I was so intrigued about like, yeah, let's have this conversation about fixing it, is that the brand itself is an experience. Advertising week. It is an experience. So why is

Starting point is 00:03:46 the experience so bad? And I'm not the only one to say this. Like I think obviously, they gather everyone in the industry. It's New York City. It's a hub, Madison Avenue. We all know that a lot of our clients are here. A lot of partners are here. So getting people to come to New York in October is not difficult. But delivering them a good, positive experience when that's literally your product should be maybe question number one. I think in years past, it was owned by, you know, different company. It was definitely acquired and you feel a bit of a difference now. So, but it used to be, it would take over Broadway theaters during the day when no, the theaters were obviously dark. So it was kind of this whole thing like, hey, New York,

Starting point is 00:04:38 let's, we do want to have these big presentations and conversations. Let's go hang out at the theaters during the day. It's really cheap. They'll give us a deal. And then let's kind of take over the city. So that was like phase one. One year, they went and did it at the Sony 68 theaters over on 68th in Broadway. And that was kind of funny that you're all in this movie theater and like, you know, but you're in, you know, watching these panels. But again, upper west side wasn't exactly the right neighborhood. And then I think they did try to go downtown when a lot of the agencies and like Condé Nast moved to one world trade. A lot of the agencies were moving downtown to FIDI. they tried to ever remember they did something in the Oculus, but I think it was just cost prohibitive.

Starting point is 00:05:23 So look, they now are in this Manhattan mall for three years. It's, you know, I said to Aaron, I hope it's free. Like, and maybe it is. Maybe that's why they're doing it. Is it, are they getting free space? But I think aside from these kind of small conference rooms, low ceilings, it's just not a neighborhood that feels like a campus or that you want to hang out in. So it wasn't that difficult for us to say, you don't give a lot of air time to this medium that we call experiential. You don't really talk about it on stage, even though it is your

Starting point is 00:05:59 product. So last year, we ended up, we took people to Rock Center. We had a beautiful, you know, content plus experience. We took people up on the roof and met C.J. Hendry, like, you know, that's a great combo that we love to do. A little bit of content, a little bit of like seeing actually where you are. So this year, Edge invited us, that gorgeous building. I will just note that Beyonce and Jay-Z just posted that they did an event up here. So we all have that. We have similar taste, you know.

Starting point is 00:06:32 But it was, we truly were, you know, elevating this conversation to the highest point that it could be. So while most of these folks are underground over at Ani, we were above, you know, 100 floors up. talking about the craft, the medium, the artistry of gathering people and the power that it holds, you know, as a as a marketing tactic, but also as an art form. Well, I think what you bring up, though, is something that's really interesting because it's not just advertising week. It's also conferences in general and like big time conferences in general. And, you know, it does feel like there is a recovery in terms of in-person participation. but I love what you said about the experience.

Starting point is 00:07:19 And when you have such a iconic location, like New York City, you want that experience to bleed into everything that you do. And honestly, to your point, sitting in an abandoned mall, you could be in Indianapolis, like, right? And so, like, you're having to curate that experience. And, like, the one thing about New York City, cities, the boroughs, and all of the different neighborhoods and all the diversity and all of the activities. And so, like, yes, being on Broadway, how fun is that, right? You know, and it allows for

Starting point is 00:08:00 there to be more additive to, like, wanting to go to a conference and not just sit in a really highly air-conditioned room with really crappy snacks. and $8 waters, you know, and sitting there listening to people, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, and I don't really, I'm not getting anything out of that. So I love what you shared, Erica, because I do think that's the evolution of these in-person events. And I think in all of our different industries, we're seeing that there has to be a transformation of these conferences. And it's amazing that, like, there are conferences that are in jeopardy, you know, even. bigger conferences that like South by Southwest, right? They had to cut down to two days. They had to cancel their South by Southwest in Sydney because the participation isn't there and you have to be

Starting point is 00:08:58 able to continually evolve. And I do think that understanding that a big, a big portion of why people choose to go somewhere is because they want to go to that location. Yeah. I actually want to add to that too because if we actually pull this back, right? And again, this is not an ad week exclusive. This is literally every conference. My partner right now is at a conference and is messaging me and like, oh, this is not great. And I want to roll back because Erica, you said something really important that experiential is not a new thing. And I think people kind of forgot about that. In COVID, obviously, in person died. And what has, what we've seen happen is people failing to pick that back up again. When you look at why you get to a conference, right?

Starting point is 00:09:42 Right? There's one of two things. You're either a salesperson looking to network. You're looking to network as just a, hey, I'm looking to learn and grow. I'm looking for a new job. Or, you know, you're speaking at something or you're going for the networking things afterwards. But all of those four things is all about network. And, you know, to do that, it's that experience is really important. You know, when you're coming together, right? We've been meeting since the beginning of time as you shared, And if we forget that and if it is just about someone talking about, you know, to talking head about whatever the topic is, it's very hard to learn from that. And I do courses on how to like help develop training and things. And if you're trying to teach people something, not having it immersive doesn't work.

Starting point is 00:10:35 And I think we lost the art of bringing the experience back into these learning things because it's not even just about the location. Right. Utilizing the location is huge in terms of that experience. Like New York, come on. It's one of the best cities in the entire world. Leverage that. A lot of people are traveling here who've never been here. If you can create an experience, you're not only walking away from learning, but your network is a lot stronger when you're able to build in these experiences. And I think there's a lapse in any conference now. As someone who works within different agencies, the amount of employees, not. putting their hands up anymore saying, hey, let's use this budget to do this. Because like, I would rather not. I'd rather not go over there for a weekend to sit in front of something. Like, what isn't it for me? The lack of experience. And so I think, Aaron, I would love for you to just kind of share too as a resident marketer. Like, why maybe that has changed? And how can other conferences, including AdW, really lean back into what this is all about, the experience? Yeah, and on the company side too, you have companies questioning.

Starting point is 00:11:44 Should we send another pool of people to the same conference they went to for the past three years? What we know, they're just going to be sitting in a room hearing an iteration on last year's talks. What's the value? What are they going to bring back? Because if they don't come back inspired and ready to take on a full year of work and projects and activations and campaigns, then what's the point? And you just, you know, like you said, networking too. That's critical for a lot of people, whether they're in a official BD capacity or not. Like, you're there to make contacts and build community and all those things.

Starting point is 00:12:22 So if you're not getting that out of where you're going and you're just going out of obligation, it's a dying art. Especially in a city that you said, New York. I'm looking out the window as we speak. It's a beautiful day. And it sounds almost like a joke to take some of the most creative. creative and influential brand leaders on the planet and stick them in a, we'll call it a dilapidated mall building. Now, they might come out of it with a sense of community

Starting point is 00:12:49 that we all went through that together. We all survived it. Wasn't that stuff thing. Or, you know, you could use that very same environment and the city that you're in. And they could come out of it saying, we had a real moment together. And, you know, there's ways of doing that

Starting point is 00:13:07 that aren't necessarily a scrap and rebuild. You can take things that people like about it. But it's, from everything that I've hearing and I've heard, it could be, like you said, a real estate conference in Sandusky. Today's episode is brought to you by Quince. My favorite new button-down shirts from Quince, and I've got to tell you, it's sharp. The material feels great,

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Starting point is 00:15:33 large conferences that have really leaned into the locale and the ability to not be like at the Moscone Center in San Francisco only and really kind of going into different locations adjacent to where the conference is really headquartered to provide more authentic, more kind of creative and innovative time that isn't as tightly scheduled either. that they are like meetups, right? And like, I mean, Erica and Aaron, part of the best part of going to ad week is like the ability to meet with other professionals in your space and talk about things. And oh, my God, did you hear about that agency? Did you hear about this new campaign and how it went viral, right? You know, all those kinds of conversations and connections that are

Starting point is 00:16:26 super, super important. And so like when you think about it, like, it's amazing that, you know, conferences haven't really thought about that more intentionally, I guess, would be the right word, to really kind of grow outside of just the meeting space, but really kind of into those other arenas. I know that some of the bigger conferences I've gone to also are now looking to do outreach in the community so you can sign up to do service projects. You can do all kinds of things. But all of those are really actually points of connection, right, where you can be next to somebody that you really don't know and they're from Austin, Texas, right? And so you're like, oh, wow, let's talk about this. And we have something in common. But I really think that that's one of the things that, you know, how to measure success of a conference now, you've got to kind of look at it holistically and you really need to think about how do you grow it and like, as I said, transform it from. the state kind of what it used to be where you get a couple tickets, you go to the sponsorship show where you get all the Chatskis and the bag full of lip balm and squishy balls and all that stuff,

Starting point is 00:17:41 right? You know, and again, you know, do those sponsors feel like they're getting what they put into it, right? And you guys are marketers. So, you know, you have to figure out how to budget your your budget. And so, you know, marketing spends a lot on these events. And so are you actually delivering results from these events? Are you gaining any business, right? And so I was very interested because, you know, I'm in from the insurance world, Erica, and they just had their big insured tech conference in Vegas. And when I looked at the sponsorship list, it was probably, half of what it's been from three years ago. For sure. I think people are getting, you know, more demanding. And it's interesting, Aaron, you know, at the event earlier today, Canva gave their

Starting point is 00:18:36 upfront and their first ever experiential upfront, which is really exciting. They, you know, digital platform, but they really do experiential well. But one of the things, Aaron, they said is they're like, you know, we don't offer packages. Like, who's buying a package right now that's a It's like a logo on a step and repeat and a napkin. Like it's like, I think, you know, these conferences are following by an old playbook that has, you know, I think we had this weird shift. You brought up COVID. COVID was this moment that gathering was essential to the human experience, right?

Starting point is 00:19:12 We're like, okay. And also during COVID, the technology didn't really meet the moment of like, hey, we have this other alternative. Like, we all know, we did it. We were online for eight hours and, like, this is terrible. But instead of, like, coming out of that with a hybrid approach, which actually, Aaron, we live streamed the event today. So it's kind of like, you know, if you can't make it in the room, go watch it. And, you know, our program was two hours.

Starting point is 00:19:40 But I don't, you know, and we tried to keep the formats kind of moving because you're, you know, what I love to look at is the people who are making content for a broadcast audience. but then they're also making sure it's great for the people in the room. And you know who's great at that? Sports. Sports is great at that. So it's almost like looking at an approach of how can we make the, you know, the IRL is always going to be the best. But can we create another stream for people that is as compelling? And I think, you know, we came out of COVID and everyone just kind of went back to this old behavior.

Starting point is 00:20:20 So all these conferences are like, oh, hey, we're back. and now there's 40 of us, right? And I think brands are more discerning about what kind of packages, for lack of a better word, what partnerships they want. And even Canva is like, we want a partner. And this was always our approach at Condi Nast. Yes, I worked at GQ and Wired and Teen Vogue,

Starting point is 00:20:42 but we were like, hey, here's a great example. Hey, here's Samsung. I was an Arc Digest for this one. Samsung wants to debut some new technology at the Oscars. Okay, we were doing the Oscar Green Room. So I was working with David Rockwell designer. And sure, we could put like four TVs up, show some great content. David Rockwell is like, I want 86 devices for the 86th annual Oscars.

Starting point is 00:21:09 And I was like, do you know how difficult it will be to work with Samsung to get like 15 phones, 14, you know, whatever tablets? And I'm like, but I found this like junior person at the agency who was like, let's make this happen. And we're like, go. So we totally did this and we created this moment. But that was a story right there. And that was not like, hey, you got a step and repeat and a logo on a napkin and write me a check for $250,000. So I think this idea of working together with these partners, making these experiences feel really special and thinking really, really hard about. about your end user, your attendee, what do they want to get out of this?

Starting point is 00:21:54 How can we deliver magic again and again and have them come back year after year? And last thing I'll say, both of you, you brought up South by and we brought up the ANI, both of them were acquired. South by Southwest was acquired and then they started expanding before they actually improve their home product. And then advertising week, they've been acquired. So it's like you have people looking to optimize, spend as little as possible, maximize. You know, they don't, I think the probably people at the top don't really care about the user experience.

Starting point is 00:22:32 They don't have the same passion, right? That's the passion that started it, you know, the founding group that started it. But, I mean, you brought up so many good points. I know that Chino will jump in here because you just said Playbook and that's her favorite word. No, I just, again, you also, even going back, to COVID. So you talk about Erica, like, you know, it used to be done one way. There was passion, right? Adweek used to be a huge deal. I remember when I first started in the industry, I was like, please, I would love to go to Ad Week one day. And I still would like to do that. The problem is, is again, it's the lack of the

Starting point is 00:23:07 focus on experiences and like what people want. So if it is networking, if it is learning something, If it's coming away and helping share, if it's new business, whatever it is, which literally replace AdWeed with any other conference, it is the same thing. People are having to spend money, spend $1,000 on tickets often just to be there. And so if it is just a talking head in a space and you're not creating that experience, why bother? I will just catch the live version. I will not spend the money, you know, lower.

Starting point is 00:23:44 sponsoring sponsorship, all of the things. But if we can go back and kind of do that hybrid and think, okay, great, if that's the people want, people yearn at the end of the day, it's even with Zoom and you can see people going back into the office, right? People yearn for in person, that connection and that community. And I think they can go back to basics like literally any other conference, that is number one on the playbook of figuring out ways. Erica, you've done it so brilliantly. Again, you talked about your event today, the fact that Beyonce and Jay-Z hosted something there.

Starting point is 00:24:21 So you're elevating it from that experience. Being able to walk away and just say I got to experience, that is great. I am sure, Aaron, being there too and just seeing that connection. And again, not feeling tight. And it's not just about what the content in. It's about how people feel the content. And if we can go back to that and I'm actually not going to talk about the playbook, Erica. Maybe we can take some, you know, little tips from you.

Starting point is 00:24:47 What would be your playback to, like, bring some of that experience back into conferences? Because you obviously are doing something right. Well, that's so kind. Aaron, did you want to weigh in on anything you saw this morning before I kind of jump into my new playbook? Yeah, well, I'll say it. You could wring your hands if you're the new owner of Advertising Week and watch the numbers dwindle. Say, I guess people just starting into the conferences like this anymore. But the irony is there's a roomful of people first thing at the seams that want to be engaged,

Starting point is 00:25:20 that know the difference between what an experience is and what a lack of experience is. And that's really everyone across advertising and marketing, you know, you say, what's important in your campaigns and your activations and your approaches? Storytelling, experiences, you know, clarity, community. Like people, that's, you learn that in your first year. of that advertising school, right? So people, it's not a, you don't have to connect the dots too much to say,

Starting point is 00:25:53 wait a minute, people are getting, not only people are staying home and not going to conferences, which is happening. It's a post-COVID phenomenon. Maybe they're not going to come back to the same degree. It's unfair to compare Africa as a week 2026 to what it was, you know, free COVID numbers. But people aren't staying home.

Starting point is 00:26:13 People got on planes, myself included, to come to this incredible event, to be in a room with one another, to have an experience that could have easily had things shifted just a little bit, been an official advertising week experience. Instead, it was an Erica experience. We're all happy to be there and got probably exponentially more out of it. I won't say probably. Got exponentially more out of it than we would have sitting in a dingy confidence space. Well, and you're bringing up the dirty little secret. We've talked about South by, we've talked about Ani, we've talked about Cannes. I have not bought a badge for either of those three in years, meaning we all go and do the fringe events. And I think there's a number of reasons for that. First of all, I'm a control freak. I told you, I grew up at Condonast. I want things to look my way. So I'm not going to your basement of the mall. You know, Can Lion, you've become so cost prohibitive to bring your team out. there to do anything. You have this lockdown on the hotels. You cannot even book a hotel for less than a week. You're flying a whole group of junior people out there. And travel is not

Starting point is 00:27:23 wonderful either. But even South by, like, I can't tell you the last time I actually bought the badge. And that is a big problem for these organizers. That means people are riding on the coattails of all the marketing work you're doing. And you're gathering the people. You're taking over the city. and yet people are organizing around you. And so to me, that means like blow it up and rebuild it. And you have to create value. You have to create value for buying that badge and for actually going and seeing the work, right?

Starting point is 00:27:53 Then that means you're not showing the work in a way that is compelling. If you're going to South Buy and you're not even going to the main stage because every single brand now has a insert name here, house, where they're just, you know, and I actually would love to ask you guys, there's been a shift in marketing too. When I was at Kande and granted this is years ago, brands love to ride alongside of us. They're like, you guys are editorial, you know how to put on a great show, you can get the star power. And now brands are like, not only can I get my own star power, I have my own audience that is obsess with me. You know, I'm thinking of Sappora and Canva,

Starting point is 00:28:32 but they're like, you know, we don't really, we don't really need to ride off anyone's coattails. And if we're going to spend that much money, we want to tell our story. story, right? So we're in, you know, I'd love to hear your thoughts on kind of the shifting of, um, like, like Target used to be a underwriter of public art, right? Like, and now they have an art exhibit at the Museum of Art and Design that is devoted to Target. Like, Target is the exhibit. So to me, that's just such an interesting shit. Today's episode is brought to you by Whatnot. I recently started shopping on What Not and I'm telling you it's fun. Even though, even though, I ordered from different sellers, everything shipped really fast. I was practically waiting at the

Starting point is 00:29:14 door to see what I scored. One thing was a watch, and I keep getting compliments on it. I wouldn't have even known it existed if I hadn't discovered it on whatnot. Plus, I got a great deal, and if you're buying on whatnot, you'll be having a good time too. If you're like me, you'll be discovering products, interacting with actual people, and finding things you love without paying full retail prices. If you've got something to sell, you should check it out too. Now when I walk into shops, I find myself thinking they could be selling on What-Nought. They would be connecting directly with buyers, showing off their products, and building a community of customers who keep coming back. And you can too. I'd absolutely recommend checking it out, whether you're shopping or selling. And speaking of

Starting point is 00:29:54 selling, search What-N-O-T in the App Store, download, and you can start selling right away. Today's episode is brought to you by Quince. My favorite new button-down shirts from Quince, and I've got to tell you, it's sharp. The material feels great and it fits exactly the way you hope a shirt will fit, which for some reason is harder to find than it should be, but not at quince. They've got everyday essentials figured out, and they do it in style. The prices are 50 to 80% less than similar brands so you can't go wrong, and their materials are ethically sourced, so you can feel good shopping there for a lot of reasons. And they don't just elevate your wardrobe. You can shop quince for your kitchen. They've got furniture that

Starting point is 00:30:35 matches my aesthetic. There's a lot to discover. Whether you're bundling up for winter with the cashmere sweater, redesigning your home or some of everything, I recommend checking them out. Find the fall pieces you'll reach for most at Quince. Download the Quince app for app exclusive offers or go to Quince.com. Get free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. Now available in Canada and the UK too. And when Quince asked where you heard about them, let them know it was we fixed it, you're welcome. It's the best way to support the show. I think you're right though. I think that that's muddied the waters of like why these conferences have come to existence because things have changed so much. And that's where I'm talking about the transformation of these types of

Starting point is 00:31:18 conferences. And definitely I was laughing when Erica, when you were talking about South by Southwest, because my personal example, the same thing. I saw how much the past was. And we were sponsoring certain events. And so we did our own viral moment. Like we'll give out five passes, but it's a scavenger hunt throughout Austin. And you have to find our logo branded thing. And it was like, one was at an ice cream truck. One was at like, you know, da da da da da. And so people did that because nobody wanted to pay $1,500 to get in, right? But I love the idea of really focusing, again, tightly on the client, right? Like, who is it that you want to bring it? And who should be paying and investing in time? Because we all know that like, you know, Airbnb's,

Starting point is 00:32:14 hotel rooms, travel, all of these things are very expensive. And when you think about things, I mean, God, think about Dreamforce in San Francisco just happened a couple weeks ago. It just takes over the entire city, takes over all transportation, takes over everything. And they've curated that, right? So they've made it. I mean, I just wonder how do we like really make that something that everybody is willing to invest in and sees like what is that result that we're getting out of it, right? Because I do think part of what we want from this experience is that connection, but it's also learning and being able to show results. Because if I'm going to expense this to my boss that they've got to see that like there was something out of it besides the fact that you were maybe at the blackjack table for three hours, right? You know? So what did you really gain? I mean, you know, cons are not a cheap trip, right? Right. You know, New York City is not cheap. San Francisco's not cheap. You know, like, you know, London, like all of these places that people go, that it's not cheap.

Starting point is 00:33:28 And so the feeling of like, I'm spending this to get there and then I'm not going to be wanting to sit in an abandoned mall. talked about kind of the shift from like, you know, it used to be that the brands were kind of buying in. They were the ones that were sponsoring things just to get the attention of the creatives to say, hey, take our creative and like run with it. That was like what app was all about. And, you know, creators to say, hey, this is how we took this campaign and blew it up and here's why it's gone so successful. I have to shed out to like Hulu Disney and Courage's campaign about the who this, which is incredible.

Starting point is 00:34:07 Shout out to my Canadians for doing that. You know, I'm sure that was talked about a lot. But it's no longer that the brands are trying to touch the people. It's the opposite. And what I think in part of that to answer your question is because in light of social media, you know, in light of all of this, viral moments, you can create your own audiences. And as you said with Sephora, there's like a loyal Sephora is self included. people who use Canva

Starting point is 00:34:37 and we can talk that length at all the different brands and so I think the conversation needs to be a murder of the both, right? We can't go with the old way and think, okay, great, we're going to actually help direct this brand. This brand now has a voice. So how can you merge that together?

Starting point is 00:34:54 How can you take some of that knowledge and learning and the people that are there in-house because they have a fully different experience in those as an agency? How do we bring them together to elevate, right? And it goes back to question, Melissa, on, you know, what do the people want? And I don't know if it's like a survey. We do like a root of entry. Like, hey, why are you here? Which I'm sure they do post-mortem. Like, everybody does something. There's an email list of people. But I think right now for AdWeek

Starting point is 00:35:21 or any other conference to survive is really pulling that data and understanding like why. What do the people want? How do we bring that to them next time? And then curating an experience that, again, things that people can talk about, things people can learn, it hits all of those marks, but it also felt worth it being there where it's like also you could only really experience it in the room because if I can take away the same message or I can do things virtually, great, but I'm not going to then spend the like thousands and thousands of dollars and the work that takes actually to fly myself and or my team there, right? So there needs to be somewhat of like what the exclusive is of being in the room.

Starting point is 00:36:05 And that is where these fringe events like yours, Erica, have really succeeded because you said, hey, listen, we know that this is the market, but we know this is what people are craving. And we're going to give it to them at an elevated stance and why you continue to be so successful. So I think for any conference ad we concluded, you need to merge the two and ask your people what want. Yes. Yes. And it always starts with that. So it's being ruthlessly thoughtful about your end user, your guest, your attendee, whatever it is. It's as simple as that and it's as impossible as that. But all they have to do is say, why are people coming here? What do they want to get out of this? And how can we provide it? And Aaron and I brought him schmoozing around town. We're going to

Starting point is 00:36:52 take you guys on some field trips with us. But even just like if New York is the decision, because it is the heart of the advertising world, you know, then make this whole city a campus. I mean, we, Aaron, we even had someone at the NBA talking about how the NBA is doing these city takeovers and they're doing, you know, travel, experiential travel based on sports. But like, make the city a playground and make that your, you know, you can because look, the tricky, the thing about can is like, look, everyone's in South of France. You're, you're in. You're in. in a different place. So you're kind of more focused on that. In New York, you're dipping in and out. You've got a meeting here. You're going to run down. There's a lot. It's more difficult to create that like closed campus vibe. But I still think that there are places. And this is kind of an interesting thing about New York City. I think cities are seeing the need for people to have more downtime like this and not just, you know, for business conferences. But like Erin, as we're walking. around Hudson Yards and we're walking around a place like Spring Studios. It's like it's an adaptable

Starting point is 00:38:04 like here's a big space. Here's a small space. Here's some public art. Here's some outdoor views. You know, it kind of can be adaptable. And because that's the other thing. Your audience is not one size fits all. You are going to have some people who are the extroverts and they're going to be up all night at the after parties. You're going to be some people who are like, I want to do yoga at 6 a.m. with my, you know, So it's kind of like you have to meet your audiences where they are. And if you look at like, especially for ANI, all these brands are doing this with their own audience. We just talked about Sephora and Canva. They're being like, we know our people so well.

Starting point is 00:38:41 We know exactly what they want. These conferences are not doing that. They're like, we're playing by the same rules. We're just going to do the same crap post-COVID and expect. And you're right. They're going to see the dwindling dollars. And they are seeing it. And then you have these little indie kind of things popping up.

Starting point is 00:38:57 and hopefully we're in indie, but Aaron, even on the B to C side, you guys, you know, we had people talking about Olympics and spectacles, but then we had this guy, Mikey Friedman from Page Break, who's like, I gather people together at like Brownstone, a Brownstone in Brooklyn, and we come together the whole weekend and we read a book. It's like a book club that they get together and they all read the same book. And it's called Page Break and he's now working with brands, right? So, like, you know, I think the answer is that we need to, we need, need disruptors. And hopefully that's what XPeland is trying to do. But like in each of these industries, and Melissa, you mentioned insurance. And there's a company like health, HLTH and Money

Starting point is 00:39:41 2020, they kind of went in with that saying, hey, these people are used to these boring conferences. Let's go in and let's show them they can go to a, you know, bad bunny concert or, you know, show them the kind of life that we've all seen in the advertising world, right? And that was such an interesting and an easy thing to apply, right? So going back to our question, and Aaron, I know you're dying to ask this, like, you know, what is, what would the solution be here? You know, and I think, you know, if we're going to stick with Ani, it's like, it's like, and New York is the assignment, because they do have different onis, but, or they have different advertising weeks, but, ony, you know, if we're going to stick with the assignment, what, how could we

Starting point is 00:40:25 fix it in in New York City, right? Am I? Well, I think you brought up, I mean, the first one you brought up, which is really, you know, my love language, because I'm a CX person too, is an audit, right? Like a friction audit and design the attendee and client journey. Map every touch point. Map every, you know, way session choices, networking, score that with a more customer-centric metric, not just like did they attend or didn't they attend and really look at that. And then also, I love what both you and Chino said about merging. So I think one of the things you fixed as well was the idea of merging, merging brand and partner, right? Like, wouldn't it be cool to have Sephora and Canva up there together talking about who really came up with the idea for this campaign and like this is like the most

Starting point is 00:41:24 successful Sephora campaign ever. And let's talk about it and let's, you know, and then let's have a structured fun time where like they give them something, you know, some makeup, whatever it might be and say, okay, what would you create? Right. You know, like what like create a space where discovery and innovation and they're really talking about the merging of that so that it's not like, oh, these are the people that are our partners and sponsors, Canva, you sit over here and have a little booth, right? And you can have a little session that maybe some people come to. Maybe they don't, right? You might even get to be on the big stage. But like, if we really wanted to talk about, like, let's look at the outcomes and the impact that they've had and the partners they've had. And,

Starting point is 00:42:12 like, again, like some of the largest campaigns of the year that have really, you know, fixated the entire universe in terms of ads. I mean, we've talked about Super Bowl ads before. You know it's not just the agency. It's not just, you know, the brand. It's not just Nike. You know, so let's talk about how does that actually play? And in this new world of AI and technology and that, you know, the social media is taking over.

Starting point is 00:42:43 So you can be virtually a nobody. And all of a sudden, now you have a million followers, right? and you can make a difference in a small business's life, right, by posting about them. So all of those kinds of things, I think, are actually, Erica, you've just brought up are, like, ways in which to kind of move things forward. And also recognize that, like, you know, people want to see, you know, some kind of outcome, right? and whatever that might be. And you have to ask to understand truly what is it that you're benefiting from joining us here this week. Here's something I've done for work that I'll never volunteer for again, writing a step-by-step

Starting point is 00:43:28 process document. It's tedious. It's time-consuming. And after all that effort, it just kind of sits there, which is why I really like what today's sponsor, Scribe, has built for companies. Scribe is a workflow AI platform trusted by 94% of the Fortune 500. And I've had had a chance to see it in action. Instead of stopping what you're doing to document a process, Scribe captures the process as you work, including clicks, steps, and screenshots, and automatically turns it into a clear step-by-step guide that's ready to review and share. Scribes AI can even look at that workflow and suggest where steps can be simplified or automated. And with the Guide Me feature, anyone you choose can follow that same process with real-time on-screen instructions

Starting point is 00:44:09 showing them exactly where to click. And don't worry, it can automatically redact sensitive information like names, emails, and account numbers so you can share with confidence. Look, don't just document your process. Why not find ways to make it better? To see what Scribe could look like for your organization, head to Scribe.com slash fixed it and mention we fixed it for your first month of Scribe Capture Free on Select Plans. That's S-C-R-I-B-E-H-H-H-S-I-E-D-I-T. Today's episode is brought to you by What Not. I recently started. I started shopping on What Not, and I'm telling you it's fun. Even though I ordered from different sellers, everything shipped really fast.

Starting point is 00:44:50 I was practically waiting at the door to see what I scored. One thing was a watch, and I keep getting compliments on it. I wouldn't have even known it existed if I hadn't discovered it on Whatnot. Plus, I got a great deal, and if you're buying on Whatnot, you'll be having a good time too. If you're like me, you'll be discovering products, interacting with actual people, and finding things you love without paying full retail prices. If you've got something to sell, you should check it out too. Now when I walk into shops, I find myself thinking they could be selling on whatnot.

Starting point is 00:45:19 They would be connecting directly with buyers, showing off their products and building a community of customers who keep coming back. And you can too. I'd absolutely recommend checking it out, whether you're shopping or selling. And speaking of selling, search What Not, W-H-A-T-N-O-T in the app store. Download, and you can start selling right away. week. So you're building us to our fix Melissa, so let's just, let's roll with that. Let's fix it.

Starting point is 00:45:46 We have ways of doing this. So the conference itself, we've got a year, right, to turn advertising week 2027 into what we want it to be. And we can put it all on the table. But let's, by fixing it, let's number one, let's invite the experiential people at least back, if not to take the lead. because if you're owning this company,

Starting point is 00:46:11 it's very profit-driven, it's down to the margins, you've got all the frills, and everything seems like a line-in-at-m expense to the point where it's very obvious from the participants who would otherwise participate that it's not going to be the experience that I want. You know, maybe don't overspend on the first time out,

Starting point is 00:46:30 this least experimentation, but you've got within an arm's reach an entire community of, gifted, talented, experienced people that have expertise that know how to pack a room full of people. Start by saying, what would you want? Because if we, let's talk today.

Starting point is 00:46:49 You know, we got a year until 2027. If you were going to come back to advertising week, what would you want for yourself? Then we'll broaden that out to other people too. Pressure tested and make sure it works, but let's not lock the experiential people out of the room. I think that's mistake, number one. Number two, we talked about

Starting point is 00:47:07 Canva and Salesforce and brands that are powerful enough to fill up their own cities and how people fly out to them. The power dynamic should be when you're a brand of that caliber where people are coming to you and you're the main exhibit. You're the center of attention. You don't need the conference as much as they need you at that point. So a brand like Canada can be choosy. It doesn't mean they won't participate in outside community. outside of their own conference because there's networking benefits,

Starting point is 00:47:40 there's client benefits, there's FaceTime with the discipline and others that you can immerse yourself with and learn from. So don't just say goodbye, you know, keep yourself under a locked room, but they get to be choosy about which conferences they attend. And if it's the same old, same old with diminishing results,

Starting point is 00:48:02 chances are they're going to stay away. So those are all part of the fixes. And when we, Erica, we've been doing a little bit of running around today. Let's expand it on a little bit more. We've got some potential. Let's get out of the mall. That's another one. Get out of the JC Penny torn down half standing mall and into another place.

Starting point is 00:48:30 Give us a little, just a little rundown of some of the other places. we're throwing out there. We'd love to see advertising big take over. So we always say the venue is a character in the play. But I think that's even further in that the neighborhood you choose. I mean, I think we all want this kind of more festival or campus-like vibe where, yes, there's some core experiences, but we're still kind of all like in the same vicinity. And we can have those moments where we need to duck out and have downtime.

Starting point is 00:49:02 Fun fact, we did a survey at Fast Company after the Innovation Festival and we were like, what were, what's your feedback? And some of the most, like, the best feedback came on like the networking time on the shuttle buses, like the downtime, program, more downtime. I just saw someone went to a Vodh-Clico event in Santa Monica and they were like, nobody was trying to sell me anything. It was beautiful weather, sunny, warm, nice, music like I think we're also just like also freaking overstimulated that sometimes just give people a beautiful place to just freaking be even in a work environment you know it's like give people a place to sit and have that serendipitous moment where you know so many stories who who here is like sat on a plane on the way home from a conference and ended up having them that was probably the most valuable time was just like that person that you actually had that great conversation with so I would try to kind of hone in on what is a neighborhood or what is an area. And New York City has a lot of them. And like I said, these cities are getting more and more sophisticated. So, Erin, we walked around Hudson Yards. We were up at edge. We saw the beautiful shed, which had a large-scale space, beautiful restaurants. There's a, you know, great outdoor backyard. That's certainly, and, you know, it's walkable to Penn Station. That's why we chose to do our event here, because I knew all. I knew all. You know, the people would be over at Ani and I'm like just take a jaunt over here but um there's some other really

Starting point is 00:50:37 you know we right now are at spring studios which is a gorgeous studio I happen to have done the wall street journal future of everything we did the glamour women of the year awards here it's big enough to have like maybe a 750 to a thousand person event it's not it's probably too small for Ani but if you were doing a you know that that's another little thing does it get smaller and do you specialize? Do you say, you know, this is for the experiential people. This is for the social media people. Do you create tracks? And then maybe there's a centralized like free for all. But like it can felt very unruly this year too. It's just when everyone's just zipping around and everyone's talking about everything, you miss that like kind of core discipline. So I think

Starting point is 00:51:26 maybe having different tracks that people could choose. Chino, what do you think? Or Erin, what do you think? At the end of the day, it's about allowing people to be curious about what this is about. And to do that, it's actually creating a little bit of FOMO. And I think, yeah, the location being a backdrop and a character in the story, the experience that you're doing, building in downtime. Because, again, what is it in an office?

Starting point is 00:51:53 We talk about the water cooler. All of the important conversations that happen at a water cooler. So where's the water cooler in the conference? And I think understanding why that is so valuable. And again, we talk about it and like a, you know, employee perspective where it's like this can help you get your promotion or blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Where is that water cooler here? And I think that's a really big piece too. So, you know, I want to see advertising me get back to it.

Starting point is 00:52:20 I also love the idea of the indies, the fringe, you know, events, which is like what I actually look to. because that's where people really are there to like kind of let their hair down and really build that connection. I feel like I've always walked away with a stronger connection in those events than the actual event I'm actually paying a pass for and often I'll skip some of those events. I don't know how many among us. I'm like skipped portions of your past to go to the fringe event because that was, you know, more important.

Starting point is 00:52:54 So, you know, listen, I think there's a way. for Adweek and others to improve. I feel like we've had a few fixes here, Aaron. And Erica, thank you for, you know, all of your tidbits. I think, please, hire Erica Adweak and do that. And it'll make you life a lot easier. You're so sweet. And, Chino, wait, one last thing, and I know we're trying to wrap,

Starting point is 00:53:18 but you mentioned the watercroller moments. There's also one word I want you all to hang on to, and it's a word called awe. And I think that there is this expectation now. We all are really getting familiar with good experiences now and our expectations are higher. But to be able to create a moment of awe. And to me, awe is when you want to grab the person next to you, whether you know them or not, and say, did you see that? That is just this shared moment that sometimes you do have those moments in Cann.

Starting point is 00:53:50 Can allows for that awe. It's also just like, it's so freaking gorgeous here. Like, you know, New York City can have those magical. Like, Aaron, we had a, we had a drag queen today. And, you know, we had a, you know, Jimmy had some confetti cannons. And we had some just moments of like, you know, I think walking into that space felt like a moment of awe, right? That we were there. But I would encourage, you know, anyone that's planning either an indie or, you know, going to our advertising week folks.

Starting point is 00:54:20 And we're planning our first experiential upfront next year. And I announced it on stage. We're super excited. And where I'm looking, and I'm taking Erin there next, is the seaport, which we're creating an actual experiential district in our city. There's the Balloon Museum. Meow Wolf is coming. It's in the cobblestones.

Starting point is 00:54:42 It feels like you're on a movie set, you know? And to me, like bringing people there and taking them out of that, like, work environment. is another trick that you can use to really pull people out of it, you know, and experience that moment of like the water cooler, like the breath, the connection and the awe. So I'm sorry, that was long, but I just couldn't help myself. That was perfect. That was literally exactly it. That was the moment right there.

Starting point is 00:55:09 That was great. No, and it wouldn't be our show if I didn't ask if we fixed it. So I'm going to ask. We threw a lot out there. If we, it might, you know, I said at the beginning, it might not be a strong. and rebuild. I'm going to walk that back. We might be in a scratch and rebuild moment. So if we say in time for 2027, we've got a full year, hop on board, get hip to what Eric is doing, come join us. We're going to rebuild advertising week the way that we see it. And we've proven

Starting point is 00:55:39 people who will come. And where they're going to leave with an experience, not one where they say, oh, I'm so happy to be home. Can you believe we went to that again? Or where they say, oh, my get like my life just changed in some way. I'm fueled up and inspired for a year. I got people that are just like me that feel the same way as me. We're all energized. Come do what we're doing. If we get to do what we do, what we want to do for Adweek 2027,

Starting point is 00:56:11 Chino, did we fix it? I think we did. I think if they can take, you know, listen to this, hear what we see, watch the success of Erica's event. you know, there's a lot to learn from there, but it's not something that people don't crave. And as a result, you can build it. Thanks, Gina. Melissa, did we fix it?

Starting point is 00:56:30 Do we get people to hop on a plane again with enthusiasm? I think so. And I think it's really important, like Erica said, that we really focus on the attendee as the customer and really design the experience around them. I don't think necessarily bigger is better. I think it's more curated. It needs to be easier to love. And I really feel like it needs to be, you know,

Starting point is 00:56:54 the proof will be that people walk away from ad week 2027 and they say, wow, that was great. And I can't wait for next year. And I learned so much and then so many great people. Thanks, Melissa. Erica, last word, if we get to rebuild advertising week, 2027. In your aim is, you want the job? Did we fix it?

Starting point is 00:57:16 Yes. We will fix it. We are going to create some collective awe, and it's going to be magical. And, you know, listen, the Knicks winning in five, the city is feeling vibey people. You got that going for you. But anyway, it would be really fun for all of you to come back next year, and we could do this live here. Wouldn't that be great? Yes.

Starting point is 00:57:38 Love it. We love an experience, Erica. So we are day. We don't have to ask us twice. Well, guess what? That means we have to. fix one more thing, which is rough, air travel, because that is the problem that sometimes you have all these great intentions and then you're like, I mean, anyway, we'll fix that next guys, right?

Starting point is 00:57:57 Yeah. We will create a live experience for everyone involved. Don't worry about that. Well, that's going to wrap our episode. Thank you so much to our guest, Erica Boki. Erica, how can people find you with XP land and how do people keep up with everything is ramping up? Yes, just come find us XP. Land. It's really easy. Find me on LinkedIn. Shoot me an email, Erica at XP.com. And we'll see you. We'll see you there. It's a pretty great place. Come on over and visit us.

Starting point is 00:58:30 Excellent. Thank you so much, Erica. Thank you, Melissa. Thank you, Chino. We're going to go and enjoy this sunshine. So we will see you next time. We hope you enjoyed this episode. If we fixed it, you're welcome. We go into every episode somewhat cold, and nothing we say should be construed as legal advice, financial advice, or anything that would get us in trouble. All trademarks, IP, and brand elements remain property of their respective owners.

We Fixed It, You're Welcome - Advertising Week 2027: Imagining What's Possible

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