We Fixed It, You're Welcome - The Reese’s Controversy with Brad Reese

Episode Date: March 3, 2026

For generations, a bite of a Reese’s Peanut Butter Cup meant one thing: Milk chocolate. Real peanut butter. That unmistakable taste. Now, many loyal fans say something is different. In this episode, we sit down with Brad Reese, grandson of H. B. Reese and self-appointed “Protector of Reese’s Brand Integrity,” to unpack a controversy that has caught the world’s attention. Brad and others are upset about the current quality of Reese’s products under Hershey’s control, pointing to a shift in taste and either proven or alleged ingredient swaps.  Emotions are high - people love Reese’s. They want real answers. This isn’t just about candy. It’s about trust, heritage, and a beloved company at a cultural tension point with its best customers. What Sparked the Controversy? Brad published an open letter to Hershey’s on LinkedIn calling out what he and many consumers observed: Certain varieties no longer list milk chocolate Some now use “chocolate candy,” “chocolatey coating,” or compound coating Peanut butter replaced in some products with “peanut butter creme” Ingredient changes implemented quietly, without announcement While The Hershey Company has publicly stated that core ingredients have not changed, consumers began comparing labels and conducting side-by-side taste tests online. The consumer pushback and Hershey’s response quickly went viral, drawing attention from major media outlets and even commentary from MrBeast while promoting his own line of Feastibles. A Powerful Quote from Brad “They’re stooping for pennies and passing up dollars.” Subscribe for more deep dives where we fix big business problems with fresh perspectives. Brad Reese https://www.linkedin.com/in/bradreesecom/ • Website – www.wefixeditpod.com • Follow us on: Instagram – https://www.instagram.com/wefixeditpod LinkedIn – https://www.linkedin.com/company/wefixeditpod YouTube – https://www.youtube.com/@WeFixedItPod If you liked this episode, don’t forget to subscribe, leave a review, and share it with your friends! Keep listening to find out how we fix companies and put them back better than we found them. Disclaimer A quick disclaimer. We are going into this somewhat cold and nothing we say should be construed as legal advice, financial advice or anything that would get us in trouble. These are our views and opinions. We're here to ask the kinds of questions everyone's thinking. Have an engaging conversation and maybe come to some conclusions that we feel are worth exploring. By the end, if we fixed it, you're welcome. All trademarks, IP and brand elements discussed are property of their respective owners. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

It's something else here now. Something new. From exclusively on Paramount Plus. It's the series Stephen King calls Scarious Hell. Everything here is impossible, but it's also real. Sci-fi vision calls it the best show streaming right now. We're running out of time and we still don't know the rules. Don't miss what the movie blog calls something you need to watch.

Saving those children is how we all go home. From binge all episodes exclusively on Paramount Plus. There are two things that are indisputably true. One, for a very long time, Rees has been delicious. And two, there are some very real questions being raised about what Rees is now. Because for many people, when you bite into a Reeses, not all varieties, but some of them, the taste is different. People love their Rees, myself included, so naturally they've been talking about it.

One of these people is our guest today. And he's not simply a fan like the rest of us. Please join me in welcoming Brad Rees to the conversation. Brad's the grandson of H.B. Reese, the inventor of Reese's peanut butter cups, and you may have seen Brad on LinkedIn under the name of the protector of Reese's brand integrity. What kicked us all off is that he wrote an open letter to the Hershey's company calling out that he and others were experiencing a shift in the company's ingredients that were impacting the product's quality. The story blew up. It's been in the New York Times, NBC News, the Today Show,

and now Brad's here with us, Melissa and me, to talk about this himself. Thank you so much for being. being here, Brad, and tell everyone just a little bit more about yourself. Well, my dad, Charles Richard Rees, was the youngest of the 16 children of H.B. Reese who invented Rees. And so I'm 70 years old right now. I live in West Palm Beach, Florida, which is where my grandfather, H.B. Reese died. He died at St. Mary's Hospital. I've got cancer. I will most likely die at the VA hospital here in West Palm Beach. So I moved here. here to die here where my grandfather died. So that's kind of closure for me. Well, thank you,

thank you for spending some time with us, Brad. We really appreciate having you here. Well, let's dig into what has the world's attention right now, right? Well, let's factually, for anyone who says Reese's isn't what it used to be. I mean, that's true. Rees isn't one product anymore. It's dozens. So you have miniatures, big cups, thins, fast break, nut rage. There's holiday shapes, white chocolate, dark chocolate, organic, sugar-free, plant-based variations, international varieties. Depending on how you count, there's well over 60s Rhesa varieties variations on the market at any given time. What started this firestorm is that there's been this interesting phenomenon across TikTok and all X and all the socials. People who love Rieces began posting ingredient comparisons and taste tests and packaging breakdowns.

And some social media users, and there's been this undercurrent of growing dissent, I've been claiming that certain variations have been using alternative fats instead of cocoa butter, texture shifts, less definable ingredients such as peanut butter cream, cream, instead of actual peanut butter, and the debate even drew commentary for Mr. Beast when promoting feastables, which is his own line of chocolate bars, because, of course, Mr. Beast had to weigh in here, too. Meanwhile, Hershey's has publicly stated that the core Reese's ingredients have not changed, that their labeling complies with regulations, and all is good in the candy factory. So don't worry about it.

But here's what we're trying to fix with you, Brad. When customers of a legacy brand as beloved as Reese's sense that something's different and not for the better, how should the company be responding? Because for those of us who honestly think the experience is a little less sweet, we'd like some explanations. If something really is different, what should the company be doing in this situation? it's up to us to put together the advice and tell, you know, this is our open forum. So, um, first off, Brad, how, how did Hershey's respond?

Zero, nothing. I haven't heard of peep. And so that, because they put together some statements, there was, there's a video showing a factory tour and the ingredients of the same. Have they said anything to you? No, yeah. So I'm referring to me. The only time Hershey will communicate with me is that they want something. Mm-hmm.

and usually want something means take would you please take down that LinkedIn post that you just published and they know that if anything is not accurate if I will correct it but so I would say well is there anything in my LinkedIn post that's not accurate oh no it's accurate we just don't want you to have it published there it'll be a big favor of you take it down I go okay I'll take it down I'll take it down I try and I try and but there's no reciprocal there's no they don't give me any information there's no knowledge that they pass my way. It's total silence. So everything I come up with on my LinkedIn posts, that's all my research, all my doing. Hershey does not participate at all. And so, yeah, so I've had no response zero from them. Now what's interesting is they're

trying to change the narrative. And it was interesting how they did that. They, then members of the Reese family that are local in Hershey, they tried to separate cause turmoil within the Reese family. And they actually published a letter from the Reese family. And I addressed that in a LinkedIn post. Okay.

They didn't say which Reese family members. And what's really interesting, so they're saying that those Reese family members are fine with replacing milk chocolate with compound coating. That's what that letter is basically saying. And I understand that they're concerned about the price of the stock. And so that makes sense. But the Hershey company doing that, I mean, that's their PR people. And what's really interesting, there's only one person out of hundreds of descendants of H.B. Reese. There's only one individual, and that's my younger brother, Andrew Reeves, who is the sole legal owner of the rights of publicity to the name, image, and likeness of H.B. Reefs.

And he's for my bringing to the attention of the ingredients swapping out milk chalk of compound coating. He's for that. But he's the only single Reese relative that actually has the sole legal rights to the name, image, likeness, and whites of the rights of publicity to H.B. Reese. And so that letter didn't mention that. But anyway, so they're trying to change the narrative. One other way of narrative is they're changing it for the shapes and sizes. Well, if you go to any grocery store check checkout lane or any convenience store, you see the king size Reese's. And we're talking about the king size fast break. No longer mulchomom. Compom coating. If you look at the Reese, the

King-sized Reese Stinks. The crisp you can't resist, that's been out since 1998. Milk chocolate is no longer used on Reese's sticks. It's compound coating. Probably one of the most recent big successes for Reese's was the Reese's Take 5, which was the subject of the first Super Bowl ad that the Hershey Company ever had. And that was in February 2020. When they rebranded the Hershey's Take 5 as Rees Take 5,

that product, Reesis Take 5, was covered in milk chocolate. The king-sized bars are no longer covered in milk chocolate compound coating. And they've done that to Hershey products as well, for example, Mr. Goodbar. Mr. Goodbar has always been milk chocolate and peanuts. Now it's chocolate candy and peanuts. They've done that to the Heath Bar. There's no longer milk chocolate. They've done that to Rollo's no longer milk chocolate.

So it's not just perceptual shifts. there are actual ingredient to. Because you said, yeah, what kicked this off for you was the miniature hearts, right? Yes. Aaron, I don't, I mean, they're doing it so quietly.

That if you're not really looking closely, you're not going to catch it. I mean, everything else looks the same. The graphics, the reasons. It's just milk chocolate is no longer there. It's chocolate candy. Or in other words, sometimes they use chockety. or chocolate cupboard or made with chocolate.

So there's code words that they're using. And they're doing it quietly. Hershey is not going out there and saying, hey, we're innovating. We've taken the king size, fast break, and we've gotten rid of milk chocolate. And at your request, we're now using compound coding.

Please rush because it's not going to last if you don't get there in bio. They're not doing it. Yeah. You know, one of the things that I see from a CX perspective is these quiet swaps really erode the emotional anchor of what Reese's has always been, you know, and that nostalgic milk chocolate and peanut butter, what is the comfort candy for so many millions and millions of people all over, not this, to your point,

Brad, this waxy imitation is really something that really needs to be addressed. And, you know, what's interesting is because they've done this very subtly, they've done it through these quiet swaps, which people don't know, because the branding all looks the same, the packaging looks the same. It kind of makes, I saw some interesting comments online on social media where people were like, thank you, Brad, for bringing this up because I thought I was going crazy that my, like, I'm old and maybe my taster, my taste of a different. And so I was just like, this doesn't really taste like. that my favorite candy of all time, right? And so that's really something that I feel like, you know, Hershey's has been doing to all of these beloved candies, you know, by doing this

quiet swap. And it actually makes the consumer question themselves, right? Because like, you used to, you know, crave that. And now you're like, what is this really? Is this, this, this is so processed that it doesn't even seem the same. Yeah, I had a similar experience. That's sweet. I had not the little heart, but the big, like, the five-ounce heart. And I take a bite of it, you know, around Valentine's Day. And I just thought there's, like, maybe not enough and too much of everything all at the same time.

And it just doesn't have, like, it didn't. You know, you come to expect what Reese's taste like. And that's why you keep going back. And it just, it, and I don't know the ingredients. I didn't do a chemical compound test or anything. But I, as a discerning, you know, lover. of the Reese's brand, I took a bite and said, what is this? And then I had a second thing that week, Reese's product. And it just wasn't what I would want or expect from the company. So then realizing

it's become like Melissa, I'm not just crazy. Like, wait, maybe there's something to this. And then, Brad, you said it for everybody. Like, there's a moment here. Right. Right. And I think it's also a moment for competitors, right? Because, you know, you know, competitors can come in and be like, I mean, I used to complain at my office because we had this organic recess. It wasn't a recess cup, but it was organic, dark chocolate almond butter cup. And I mean, same shape. They use the same shape as Reese. And I was like, this is not a Reese's cup. Like, why are we buying this? But it was real chocolate. So there you go. That's why you're buying it because now this is the taste is what matters. And it's really, you know, it's an unfortunate thing because, you know, for you,

Brad, this is your family legacy and this brand is beloved. It's beloved and it's, you know, you're kind of positioning, you know, it's a flagship trust symbol, Reese's is. And so to have these ingredients that just invite scrutiny, I mean, it's slander to your family, right? You know, because that's not what, oh my God, your grandfather would be, you know, just horrified by this. So. Yes. They've also, I have to point out also, I love the Almond Joy. I also love mounds. And both those products no longer have milk chocolate. It's compound coating. Chocolate candy, they're calling it. So, so these are very important candy brands that are famous that are getting the same treatment as Reese's. And it is, it was so devastating to me

that I mean, my website and my LinkedIn profile was Brad Reese growing Reese's worldwide one peanut butter cup at a time. And I was really successful using LinkedIn to contact distributors in Poland, Germany, France, England, Australia, New Zealand. And it, it's It was fascinating for me and promoting Reese's. And when they did this, when I realized what has happened, the ship from real milk chocolate to compound coating, I can't promote my family heritage brand. I can no longer promote it because I don't believe in it anymore. I mean, it's devastating. It really just destroyed my whole.

And for two days, I sulked and didn't realize what do I do now because I can no, longer go forward the way I was promoting Reese's. And that's when I changed my website and my LinkedIn profile to Brad Reese protecting the Reese's brand integrity. So I pivoted. Mm-hmm. And that's a crucial pivot when you go from ambassador and champion to defender. Not defender, uh, protector. A prosecutor, basically. I mean, pretty much, right? And the labels don't lie. Every national news media outlet has verified, gone out and checked the labels, so forth. So it's been verified. And as you say, all the Risa's lovers always thought there was something with their taste buds or getting old, something, because they have, in this country, we have

generations of tasting what the Risa's peanut butter cup tasted like. Yeah. So we have that background, that knowledge that taste sensory history. And so we are noticing the differences. And it's amazing because everybody thought it was just them. Now everybody else is saying, yeah, it's me too. And you're not the only one. So yeah, it's a breakthrough moment. So why, at least the response that I saw from Hershey's was to do the PR play of saying,

no, no, it's you. It's not us. We're the same. but why why do you think that was their gut reaction? Like to get on top of the story, do you think that there's something verifiable about the ingredients not being the same? I think they maybe were concentrating on one formulation

or one ingredient, but not looking at the ones that are being questioned. Like it was just a very confusing moment because everyone knew that there's been changes. So they come out and say, no, nothing to see here. That seemed very just tonally off for the moment, at least to me. Well, what do you think, Melissa?

Why do you think they did what they did? Or worded it the way they did? Well, I mean, obviously it's like you've already brought up. It's the cocoa shock and input costs, the prices, the pricing. You know, they're trying to kind of mask it in innovation. I don't know if it's innovation, but it's taking advantage of seasonal activity. So having Rieces in the shape of hearts and different line extension. that's really great. But it's all about profit. Brad, you've talked about it. It's all about profit at the end. And it's disregarding the family legacy. It's disregarding the consumers and what they want. And, you know, I think sometimes consumers are okay with changes and shifts in certain processes and operations and can understand the cost impacts. But at the same time, this is about,

taste. This has always been about taste. It hasn't, it's not, you know, this isn't like, I'm not talking about the operations in general. I'm talking about what is the fundamental component of Rises. And so to me, this is really a real challenge about how you use, you know, transparency because the Hershey company is just saying we care most about profit, which is what every company cares about unless they're a nonprofit. And we know Hershey's is not a nonprofit. So they really care about, you know, how are they, you know, and you've mentioned this before. How are they with their share prize? How are they answering to the board? All of those kinds of things around their portfolio. So, you know, from a business strategy lens, you know, they're going from being the best,

you know, in this component, Rieces being the best. And they're okay with that because they're engineering a margin that's better for them. So really, this is going to be, you know, it'll be interesting because in today's world, Brad, you know, there's a lot of canceled culture. There's a lot of that going on viral. And I think there have been viral moments and you've really raised attention to this issue. So the problem really to me is that the lack and Aaron, you know more about this from a brand perspective, but just the real lack of transparency. And then, I mean, you know, they're not saying to you, Brad, that they haven't done this. They're just saying, we'd like you to stop being so adamant about your position and take down your posts.

So, but they're not defending their position and saying, oh, but we really do have, you know, milk chocolate in there. You know, they're not saying that at all. So let me interject. This was not, this was when I was in the promotion mode. Okay. And I'm talking about class action law. suits and so forth. This was not, this was not the ingredients. They didn't tell me to take, they didn't request or ask me to take down my, my LinkedIn post about the ingredients. This was

prior to this happening when, when I would touch a nerve or something, it wasn't what I posted was inaccurate. It was accurate. They just didn't want it to be seen. And, and so I obliged them because I thought, why not, create goodwill and so forth. But anyway, so Rises no longer tastes like Rises. So they've hollowed out the most famous chocolate brand in the world, basically. And what's interesting is the opportunity. Rees is the only Hershey's product that could use the most part. popular chocolate brand in any country or any region of the world as our chocolate coating. Just here in the United States, we could be using Godiva chocolate as Reese's chocolate coating.

Girogeli, you name it, a guitar chocolate covering. And even Dub, I've even proposed to the president of Mars at Rickley to that Reese's should come out with a limited edition, Reese is covered with dove chocolate. And also a, and that's Mars, and then also Reese's filled with M&Ms. Now, they all laughed and thought I was joking, but I'm serious. You can you imagine a Reese's Big Cup stuff with M&Ms, the two most famous brands in America, sales-wise, that's number one, number two. And so, but what's really interesting is now I'm hearing from Hershey employees. And they're validating everything I'm saying.

what's really interesting is the equipment at the Reese plant at 925 Reese Avenue, which was the plant my father and my uncle's built. My father, my grandfather started it, but he died before it opened. Well, that plant is built for milk chocolate, and the compound coatings are gumming up the machinery.

Oh, my goodness. So the production lines are closing down, and when you've got a production line down, you're costing you millions of dollars. So they're stooping for the pennies. I mean, they're stooping for the pennies and passing up the dollars. So here they're using this cheap compound ingredient, okay, to save a buck, but it's causing their equipment to crash because that equipment is designed for milk chocolate.

It's not designed for the vegetable fats and all the compound ingredients they're using. So, I mean, this is not, this is true. Now, can I confirm it? No, nobody at Hershey is going to confirm that. But there's people at Hershey that have for years been working. And by the way, I'm not criticizing employees at Hershey. They're doing what they're told. But there's employees at Hershey that have been trying to keep the standard identity of racist products intact.

And they're constantly fighting the engineers who are squeezing out every last penny a profit. and they won. So the engineers squeezing out every last penny of profit have won over the food scientists who have been trying to protect Reese's historical milk chocolate and peanut butter sensory feel, taste. So yeah.

Well, what's interesting, Brad, it's such a, if this is happening, which sounds like it probably is, it's, we'll speculate, but it's such a cannibalization because of Hershey's chocolate is the ingredient, you know, part of the ingredient, brand that goes into Reese's, then the experience is the Hershey's Chocolate, too.

It's a showcase for the entire line, right? If, you know, if consumers can connect it and say I not only enjoy the Reese's experience but the Hershey's Chocolate experience, why don't I go investigate other products or revisit them? But if you have the opposite reaction, it's, you know, again, if you connect the two brands together, which is a portfolio brand family, but it's, they go together. earth by this point in consumers' minds, then you're going to say Hershey's is less, less than they used to be. From this one experience, you can change your purchasing habit pretty quick.

Yeah, and I think Hershey's going to find that out. Yeah. I'm the grandson of A.S.B. Reese, and I have no interest in buying another Reese's product. Yeah. I mean, that's, you know how devastating that is? Yeah. I mean, I used to do it every day. Every day I need, I mean, I wouldn't buy one every day I'd keep in my freezer or fridge. But every day I would have one, just to remind me, because Reese's is lightning in a bottle. Everybody from the four-year-old up to the 104-year-old loves Reese's. And my grandfather used to say,

if you can make a product that both young and old can enjoy, your potential customers only limited by the number of people on Earth. So I was on a mission growing Reese's worldwide, like one peanut butter cup at a time. I was on a mission to go bring Reese's worldwide because it truly is disruptive to all the other candy products out there. So, Aaron, I mean, what do you think Hershey should be doing

as far as PR and responding to their ingredient issue? I have an idea. Sorry to jump in there, Aaron, before you start. Hold on to it. Yeah, I mean, go for it. Brad, you don't even realize maybe, but you kind of brought it up. So I love this idea of having a new H.B. Reese legacy brand, okay, that is a spin-off and it's a premium brand because we're back to chocolate wax, which is not chocolate.

With verified original ingredients, you can mark it up because it's premium. Anybody knows you say premium and say exclusive. you know, exclusive legacy brand. And then really, I think it would be wonderful if, you know, utilizing the right ingredients, you know, original recipes that you guys could share, you know, that kind of thing. Also, the partnerships that you just mentioned, Brad, like those are wonderful ideas, innovative ideas of like, hey, HB.

Reese legacy brand is in partnership with gear delis. celebrating, you know, I'm making this up. I used to live in San Francisco. I should do this, but 200 years of Gear Daily chocolate, right? And you come up with some really great, you know, trolley car on the packaging, whatever it might be. But that would be a fantastic way to preserve the legacy. And then also for Hershey to see what do people and consumers really want? because honestly, I'm willing to pay more for real chocolate. I don't want to keep putting wax in my mouth because, you know what, that's not the rush I was getting from the Rees Cup that I usually have. And I seriously, my husband is addicted to them.

And so they're sitting in our, in our foyer in a candy jar. But that's interesting, you know, because it hasn't, they really haven't been the same. So, and it's been years and years that he's been doing it. So anyway, I just feel like that's actually a possibility there, a fix, Aaron. And I don't know what you think from a brand perspective that could be. Oh, no. Actually, so with the current ingredients compound coding, you have to understand, Melissa, that people will still buy the Reese's products that have the compound coating.

There's no doubt people will still buy it. Yeah. I'm not discounting that at all. But it's interesting you brought that up, Melissa, about H.B. Reese and his name, image and likeness. We offered that my brother is a sole legal owner. And I, through me, I offered that to, I contacted way over 100 Hershey executives on LinkedIn

and heard back from four saying that that wasn't their department or whatever. But zero, I got, I got no reply, nothing. Okay. So, I mean, I proposed that. I mean, I've proposed that the H.B. Reese and use the old family recipes, okay, which family members have. Okay. And so that's a proposal.

And you might be seeing something shortly. I did meet with Jimmy Donaldson, Mr. Beast. Yeah. Okay. That would be awesome. Well, I love that, the H.B. Reese signature line. What I wouldn't love is if that you pay a premium for a premium

product, which obviously it would be, it would be. I wouldn't love paying that for what Eresa's peanut buttercup used to be until recently, you know. Oh, I see what you're saying. Yeah. I would do it. And I'd probably train myself into it with overtime, but I wouldn't, I wouldn't love paying, you know, for a premium product when the original, like the shelf product should be what,

it should be the standard, you know. I'll pay more for premium, but let's return the standard to what it was first. That would be my pushback. Yeah. You're putting a very good point in that the current REACH products out there in the shelves right now are in the shelves where the historical Riesis products have been. And you're no longer getting the Reese taste. But guess what? The prices are rising.

Right. They're actually raising the price for this compound coating. Right. I mean, so, so they're actually paying more for a genuine imitation. I mean, well, it's, it's laughable. I mean, you're paying more for a product that's inferior. And you said, you're paying a little bit more for real. I mean, actually probably you'd be paying now.

Yeah, at least we'd be getting the real thing. Yes. Part of the part of what they could, what I haven't seen is, you know, we, we know, we know there was a cocoa shortage and we know there were rising prices. And, you know, part of the narrative, if there's a story to tell on their side could be, look, we've had these supply chain escalations, everything costs more. We all know as consumers, everything costs more. Here's how we're approaching that.

You know, we're going to do the original line and it's going to cost more. It's we're going to do these mass market products and there's going to be some quality compromises for the moment. Bear with us. There's been a shorter, you know, and whether or not that's true to the actual market conditions, I don't know. But it's not, it doesn't seem like there's been this dialogue of let's pull you into this situation and what's been happening. Since you love our products so much, let's tell you what's what's going on here. So I think that's part of people are just guessing.

Yeah, you bring up a good point, Aaron. And I ask, I'd like to ask you, Aaron and Melissa, this. So they're blaming the cocoa bean volatility. Okay. but you do realize they're not only replacing milk chocolate with compound plenty, they're replacing the peanut butter with peanut butter cream. So, Aaron, what have you been reading? Is there a peanut shortage?

Not that I've heard. Why are they going to grill peanut butter with peanut butter cream? So if they're using the argument that the cocoa beans are a reason why we've done away with milk chocolate. And so what's the reason with doing away with grilled peanut butter? Because is there a peanut shortage? says have the price of sword. I ask him both that. What's your...

Not that I've heard. Mr. Peanut died a few years ago on a Super Bowl commercial, but he came back, so as far as I know, peanuts are alive and well. No shortage. So why is Hershey

substituting real peanut butter for fake peanut butter? That's a fair question. And if they were doing it, let's just say they were doing it behind, you know, behind closed doors,

let's try this out, let's try this formulation, see if it flies, if people say nothing, and we pocket a little more, good for us. But people said, wait a second, what's happening? So where's the

response to that? That's where, and I'm not, you know, I'm not part of the family. I'm just sitting on the outside as someone who, you know, this was like my best, my favorite treat growing up forever. You know, I didn't have your whole light

destroyed like I did. Exactly. Yeah. And I still take it personally. Yeah. Well, what if you, you know, you've had, this is not the first, I guess, coming to heads moment with the Hershey company. What has been, there's been other things over the years. Yes. And I'd like to say that this current cocoa bean volatility price wise and so forth, it's down 70%

from what it was. But, I mean, we're talking, Reese is a 100 year old brand. We've been dealing with cocoa spikes pricing forever. Okay. So this is nothing new. and also you might ask yourself, why is it so volatile? See, there's things going on that Hershey has not done. If you're operating your company strictly quarter by quarter,

the Coco, the Coco situation is a decade. You've got to be thinking a decade ahead. So the executives at Hershey are not, they're kicking the can down the road. So rather than tackle it head on right now, let's get this straightened out. They're kicking it down the road. They're not, they're doing PR.

So we bought 100. We built 18 schools and we bought a thousand iPads. Like that's, you know, solving the cocoa of, you know, the farmer situation. And it's interesting. Also in 2020, there's the African cocoa bean living wage. And rather than Hershey paying that, they went to the cocoa exchange and bought the cocoa beans for much, much less on the exchange. So, and that was in 2020.

I'm not accusing Hershey of doing anything criminal, but they have not addressed the COCO volatility. You just need to grab it and take charge in 10-year, decade, how many, you know, work your way through it. You can't do it, quarter by, you know, they're not doing anything. So that's why you're developing. volatility. Well, Brad, what do you think about the product diversification that there's just one reason is that product after another? Do you think that that part of contributed to part of the,

we'll call it like a dilution because you just can't keep the quality standard across that many that many individual skews? Or is it, you know, like, is that part of the friction point? I love it. Yeah. I love the extent. I absolutely am just, it's not enough. Yeah. Okay. It's not enough. I came out with the Reese's credit card, orange credit card with the Reese's logo? Yeah. Well, I would be whipping that out and paying for everything to show my love of Reese's,

and I know Reese's fans would, okay? But that was, again, before the ingredient issue. Line extensions, what's interesting is that, for example, General Mills, since 1994, has made Reese's puffed cereal. Have you ever had that? Yeah. Okay.

So there's a very successful cereal, over 200 million in sales every year. Now, Reese's puffs cereal, big, huge success. Try and find it on ReesS.com. If you go to Rees.com, it's nowhere to be found. And it has ReesS.com lists all the Reesis product

manufactured by Hershey, but none of the extensions. And what's interesting, Hershey itself has done studies that a shopper that buys a, for example, Reis Puff Seru, during the shopping trip, during that same shopping trip,

they will four times more likely buying a Reese's product manufactured by Hershey. So right there, their own study says, if they consumer buys a Reese's license product, they will four times more likely buy a Reese's product manufactured by Urschi during the same Hershey during the same shopping trip. Yet, Rhesus puffs or any of the extantions,

we're talking Chips for Hoyer Reese's, we're talking the ice creams. none of that is featured on reesos.com, not even a peep. So what I run into, especially when I'm wearing reesas swag, is people are not aware of all the different products. Most people are aware of Reese's pus, but they forget about that. But they don't, they're not aware of the ice cream, the cakes, the cookies. They're just not aware of it and cupcakes.

And so it's interesting that none of that is featured, none of these extensions. And by the way, we're over a billion dollars and global retail sales of licensed RISA products. Wow. So there's a tightly controlled narrative around the, yeah. But what's interesting from Hershey's standpoint, when they're dealing with somebody that wants to license the Risa's name, the Riesis brand is so successful that it can't be a small. small mom and pop shop, it has to be a substantial corporation that has the means to manufacture at scale because this is what's going to happen. You're going to need a bigger, what do you call it in shark, jaws, a bigger boat? You're going to need a bigger plant. So it's interesting that the

licensed products, as long as they keep the signature Reese's taste, I'm all for that. But if you're the products are made by Hershey are no longer keeping the taste, then you can imagine what's going to happen to the extensions and it's just going to become, yeah, a mess. Well, it might run into a situation where some of the extensions are actually upholding some of the original recipes or the integrity or things like that, and then Hershey's is going to find themselves behind the eight ball on it.

Yeah, yeah. Well, operationally, you know, And you would think when you bring on the extensions and you have to, you know, you run through a checklist or quality standards or things like, like you're going to hold your licensees to a certain degree or you cut them off. So we'll hold them to a stricter standard than you do yourself. Right. With your own. I can say you manufacture. Well, you know, there's no standards now.

There's no standards that. That's that's one of the fixes that I would think of, you know, if we're going to get to that point, I'm sure we are. I would say one fix is really important is to putting some governance around the RISA's recipes and setting up like a RISA's heritage review great. So any ingredient changes on Risa's branded products triggers a cross-functional check, legal CX brand, the family on whether the name packaging and marketing still match reality. And then publish, you know, I think, Brad, you've kind of already done this in your own way, but like a short, like,

Reese's manifesto on the site that will, that these are the things that will never change, what might change, and how they'll tell you when it does. It's clear and there's transparency there. It's just not a PR line, but it's a standard operating procedure and rule. And telling the truth, I mean, I think you can do that by like standardizing the language on anything using the compound, right, using chocolatey candy. with peanut butter cream, right? Not just Reese's, not just using your name,

and then having the consumer assume that that's real chocolate and it's real peanut butter. And also maybe, you know, this is the age of QR codes, Aaron, we've talked about that a little bit. But, you know, having a comparison QR code on the back that would say, this is what was in the original recipe, this is what is in now, turning that into like an informed choice to your point, Brad, people are still going to buy it, regardless of whether it's waxy or not. But let's be clear that's what you're doing. And then I think, you know, one of the things about, Brad, you were asking about the peanut

butter versus peanut butter cream. And I think that one of the things they've said is that the cream is a little more pliable because it's not deep clutter. So it allows for like different forms and the different shapes that people love. you know, at different times a year. But really maybe thinking about, again, going back to like the heritage or legacy or signature brand, Aaron, that you were talking about, you know, branding it in a way that you can roll back to a couple of those fan favorite shapes with the original ingredients.

And to keep the price competitive, you might have to do what companies are doing across the board when you go to the grocery store. You know, you buy a box of cereal. It's half full now, right? So maybe it's a little smaller, but it's got the original ingredients, right? And you can't maybe do all the little cutesy our hearts and things like that

because the peanut buyer is hard to shape it. But, you know, I mean, who knows? Let the consumer have a clear choice and let them pick from that Reese's original versus the new Reese's. Yeah. Yeah, I believe Hershey is misdirecting you with it's more pliable, okay. The peanut butter, it's all about profit, okay?

This thing about, oh, with the peanut butter cream is more, oh, we can use it in more shapes and so forth. It's all bunk. That is total bunk. I'm telling you right now, it's total bunk. It's gumming up their machines, okay, in their factory, which used to work with real peanut butter, okay? So this, this that is more pliable.

No, it's causing them production headaches. They're doing it strictly to squeeze every pen. Again, they're stooping for the pennies and passing up the dollars because they're using all these code words as more plausible and we can make better shapes. But it's all they're just making more money and cheapening the ingredients. And so it's a good way to explain it that our fans are demanding innovation. And by the way, Aaron and Melissa, I'm totally for innovation. Yeah.

But I'm for quality, quality innovation. Yeah. Innovation that erodes the ingredient structure of Rises. That's not innovation. That's cost engineering. Yeah. It's what it is. Completely.

It's not innovative. Yeah. Well, and I love what, I don't know if you've been following the Burger King's been doing, but they've done studies and people if the Woppers haven't been what they used to and they've been listening and they're about to relaunch the Wopper, like their signature ingredient. And I'm excited about like just, again, on the sidelines, I'm like, good for you.

I love Wopper. I love Jute Woppers. Woppers. I love them. Yeah. And it feels very like we're with you on this as opposed to this moment with Rises where, you know, we haven't had that open dialogue moment of, look, you're right. You know, you called it out.

taste buds called it out. Let's get real. And number one, let's, let's, you know, call it for what it is. Yes, cocoa prices, shortages, changing consumer trends, over extending product, whatever it was. Like, you know, there's a perceivable shift in quality. Here's what we're doing about it. You know, and it's a moment where they could say, like Burger King, you're going to come with us. you're going to be, you're going to taste test three variations. You're going to taste, you know what I mean? Like, it could be a little bit of Pandora's box because the consumer starts saying, well, I don't like that one or that doesn't taste right either.

Then what do you do about that? Yeah. So there's quality. Back in the 60s, we came out with Reese's Scotchies. And Reese's Scotchies was rather than using milk chocolate as a coating, we used a butterscotch coating. And so it was delicious. Sounds great.

You know what I had the Scotch, the Scottish colors on the wrapper, Risa Scotches. It was delicious. So, you know, it's like, well, this, and Aaron, if you guys were out on a sailboat, you venture off course. Yeah. The wind was blowing and it took you off course. So now you got, you need to turn around the sailboat. You need to start tacking and doing your maneuvers to get back on course.

Well, Hershey has the opportunity. to, okay, we got off course. We ventured, you know, we ventured into uncharted territory. We didn't really know. We made a mistake. And now we're tacking the ship back to get back to the course that we were on and admit that now we're taking corrective action. So that would be excellent. I mean, Melissa, do you think that that would help?

I do. I think that, I think whenever someone is. off course. It's important to map out where you need to go. I think that like it's it's been such a, it's been such a really interesting conversation that we've had today. I mean, Brad,

you've been able to bring such a like strong perspective of what's going on. And I think that we've talked many times, Aaron, about profit and what it means and how it kind of blindsides companies.

And I don't even say Blind sides companies. That makes it sound like you're not prepared for it. Blinds companies. They don't, they can't see anything else. And so I really love the fact that, you know, you've been able to kind of bring that to the table for us, Brad, and really kind of talk about like where Reese's has really come from and how, you know, your protection of the legacy and, and also your understanding. I mean, I feel like it's not like you don't understand that things need to change. and things need to grow, but there's ways to do it

that can protect that legacy. And I think that's the thing that's so frustrating is that it feels like the Hershey's company in general has just been trying to pull a fast one on everybody. And that doesn't feel great.

And so that's one of the things that, you know, I think they have hundreds of people who work in marketing and communications and brand. Yes. brand loyalty and and customer experience. How is.

Right. And so like those folks like, you know, instead of hiding under the blanket, like what are they doing about this? And I think you're opening up this whole dialogue. You're opening up, you know, questions. People are finally, like I said to you, I'm like, oh, so I'm not crazy that the taste is different, you know. And I just really like, again, thank you for that perspective. also think from an operational perspective from where I'm sitting, I look at this as not very different than a lot of companies who have kind of gone through this. And to Aaron's point, you're seeing

a shift with certain brands who are saying, oh my gosh, you know, this is what we have to do to kind of regain that customer loyalty. And when customers go, when companies go against the grain so violent, you know, so like crazy, I mean. this. Outrageous. It's about taste. It's like it just feels really, you know, like that can't be a good business decision. But obviously they've looked at the data. They've decided. I mean, you know, we've talked about a lot of different companies on this podcast. And they've all done things that have really fundamentally driven them away from what their core mission and value set has always been. And yet, they somehow survive and to your point, Brett, people will still buy it. And that's what's kind of, you know, kind of a frustrating juxtaposition of the entirety. Yeah. Yeah.

And my police so that Hershey believes that their products are still going to sell. I mean, that's what they, you know, they've got all the data and so forth. And they're a very smart organization. And so that's what's so, you know, remarkable about this, decision is, I mean, they're, like you said, they have thousands of people. They're, their food scientists are par none. I mean, they're really, so there are people in Hershey fighting to keep the standards of chocolate, okay, using real milk chocolate and using real peanut butter. There are employees that are there, but they're being overwhelmed and they're not

winning against the cost engineers who do nothing but, but refine and refine and refine and squeeze every, and of course, those go to the CEO and, and, you know, and that's going to push up their earnings per share. And he gets paid tens of millions of dollars by hitting those EPS. You know, it's the short-term incentive for this, to think, leadership of the Hershey company that's led to these decisions. Yeah. This is not long-term. And this, and you could make so much money just keeping the taste, this, the taste, the taste

historical taste of Reese's, it's so much money to be made. It's, it's mind-boggling. And if they just would concentrate on the quality and bringing back the, the taste, historical taste, sensory taste of Reese's, they would make so much money. Again, they're stooping for pennies and passing up the dollars. And you guys nailed it. There have lots of opportunity to turn the ship around. Yeah. It's an aircraft carrier, so it's not going to turn on a dime. Yeah. But to start, and one of those is becoming transparent and admitting that the customers didn't demand innovation of the innovation of removing milk chocolate and putting compound

coding is an innovation that was demanded by the consumer. That's, I mean, you believe that? I mean, Sir Herschy's basically applying that. No, because everyone's telling them the opposite. They're saying we don't. We don't like this. And the voices are just going to keep getting louder and louder. And the company can keep do, you know, profit squeezing and doing what they want.

But if you get to the point where you cut into arreases and there's one peanut sitting there where a puff of air comes out, like, you know, no one's going to like that. So is that the almond soy? Yeah. In almond, you'll have a peanut butter cup with a single peanut. One peanut. The rest is cream, the peanut butter cream. Oh. Act special.

Yeah. All right. We're fixing this. So here's what we're going to do. First of all, listen to Brad. I mean, thank you, Brad, for telling us all we're not crazy and being a champion for everyone who loves this brand and saying, just, you know, just bring it back. Like, it's not that hard.

There's ingredients we all like. Put them back where they came from and we'll all just say thanks. There's a moment of the company to have that, that really, just a heartfelt moment to say maybe we lost our way, maybe that, you know, we agree with you. We love this product too. We love it as much as you do. We're bringing it back. Why can't we all, they could do that pretty quickly, operationally.

So let's do that. And then make that the new baseline standard. Maybe it costs a little more because everything costs more, but what are you going to do? I love the HB. Reese, the signature line or the original line as a premium. or an experimentation type of product or opens, unlocks the Reese's brand up to unexpected brand partnerships and non-Hershey's ingredients. And I think that's genius.

I would love to see that come to market. So I'm all on board on that. And even if it's not the answers we want to hear tomorrow, you know, but there are, there's admission of mistakes or there's admission of, look, here's the market factors that we want to let you in on. or here's our 18-month roadmap toward, you know, quality preservation, whatever, like just have those conversations. But having all of it behind non-transparently where we don't know what's even happening

and getting brought into this discussion behind a carefully guarded response that's not even addressing, Brad, what you've brought to the table, that's not going to cut it. We're not happy. What is the Rees family turmoil. Yeah. Some Rees family members support what we do. And so Brad Rees is just his opinion. Sure.

And he's reported by the words. Well, it's not my opinion. It's labels. It's verifiable labels. It's not opinion. Right. But it's, you know, they're trying to make it, they're trying to switch the narrative that this is a personal, this is a family dispute.

And yes, there is a family dispute. Yeah. But that doesn't, that's not the subject. It's not the issue. It has nothing to do with what they've done to the ingredients. Right. Okay. We reach family members that agree with the Hershey Company and say, yeah, squeeze every last penny out of the product.

Okay. And they're rich family members. And I still love, they're my family. And there's others like me who believe that, you know, the taste is the key. Yeah. And, you know, I'm not trying. I mean, they're saying they're speaking, my grandfather, we'd be very, H.B. Reese, we'd be very happy no longer having milk chocolate and real peanut butter in the air.

And that's their belief. And I'm like, great, you know. But I think that also what Aaron and Melissa, you guys have kind of touched on is what is the competition going to do? This, Hershey, I think, has opened up a huge, I mean, like, I mean, they might have had a dam with a few cracks. Yeah. You know, companies. One example, the vice president of Hershey, who ran all 20 of the global plants of Hershey,

has bolted to Justin's peanut butter cups. What does that tell you? He's starting in a week or two at Johns. Which is owned by Hormel in Austin, Minnesota. But still, Justin is an up-and-coming competitor. and the guy who ran all the plants for the Hershey company, all 20 plants is now their vice president's supply chain at just peanut butter cups.

Yeah, you just don't know. Right. The poppy, the soda brand, they just had a Super Bowl commercial because they kept out it and they kept investing and now they have a seat at the table where maybe they didn't have to, if the soda companies innovated

and didn't open themselves up to a market opportunity. I think, Feastable's peanut butter cups. I think feastable's peanut butter cups. I met with Mr. Bees on Sunday in person up in North Carolina. And I think what they're doing with the opening they've been given, with their feastable's peanut butter cups, which, by the way, are very good.

I mean, it's a worthy competitor. Definitely very good. But they're going to make hay. They are going to take big, take this opening because it's a once-a-lifetime opening for other peanut butter cup competitors to address the Reese's ingredient issue.

So, yeah, Hershey's opened up their competition to, they're on the firing line or what do you call it? Everybody's going to be after going after them. Yeah. And all these with their peanut butter, Buttercups and Trader Joe's. Right. Well, that's what I heard this past week when I've been talking with people about this, you know, this situation.

They've been saying, well, have you tried this other one? It's actually pretty good. So along with the undercurrent of dissent, there's this undercurrent of new loyalty. Yeah. It's betrayal. Yeah. Reese has betrayed its loyal fans. And when you betray, I mean, I'm betrayed, everybody's betrayed.

So you're going to look for replacement. Yeah. So again, Hershey's done it to themselves. It's mind-woggling. Yeah. With thousands of executives who do nothing but marketing and panels, tastes and all the, all the, and AI and all the stuff they use, how can they have done this? Yeah. It's like, what broke there?

Is that pursuit of the dollar? overtaken common sense, it looks like it. Well, Melissa, I'll ask you first. If, you know, if they switch, get very open and transparent about the narrative, admit wherever mistakes were made that they were made, wherever swapouts were made that people, consumers pointed out and said, we don't like this about you. We used to like this about you.

The fix is simple. Bring it back. If they bring it back and they do it in a way that, like similar to Burger King's doing, where they say we hear you. We're going to absorb some costs on it. We want to make this right. We're going to do it as quick as possible in a responsible way. And let's return the original line to, you know, to the standard you used to, you're, you've come to expect from us for years, decades.

And then we come, you know, we do like a signature line and we watch for the extensions and make sure they're all representative. and they all carry out the quality. And each one, like I agree, Brad, there's the, there can never be enough. If they're good, bring it on, you know. Right. If we follow those, you know, that kind of process or do we fix this? Do we make it better? Melissa, I'll ask you first.

I think we've provided some fixes. I think even going further is the idea I had based on some of the conversations that we've had today. but like putting governance around the recipes, setting up like a Reese's heritage committee. I don't even know what we want to call that, but a review. So any ingredient changes can be very clearly communicated if that's going to be what's happened and agreed upon.

I love the idea of the signature or the original line because I do know that Hershey's is about profit. I get it. And there are a lot of people. who might not care, right? Customers that don't care. But I do think that they have that ability because there's so many people

that have the nostalgia for the original. You see a lot of different brands going back to that, like, oh, this is the original, you know, Levi's, you know, this is the original, all the kind of original types of things. And I really feel like Reese's has that opportunity. And I do also think that there is a need to keep your eye

on the competitors to see how they're kind of flooding the market. Because I think to Brad's point, like, you have to look to the future and know that now you've opened the floodgates. And so you really have to kind of make a stance. You know, you really have to make a stance. And I do love the idea of like, you know, going back to the original, but also being innovative about that and finding really great partners who stand with what Reese's really. is all about and the heritage of Riesisys. So I hope that Hershey's and some of those 400 executives, Brad, that you were speaking of thousands of executives. Yeah. Listen to our podcast and listen to what we have to say because I don't think it's just us raising the flag. It's about, you know,

how do you make it work? And as a lover of Rises for a very long, all my life, I hope that they will listen. Yeah. Same. Brad. If, you know, I know there's a lot of history here, but if tomorrow, if Hershey said, Brad, you're right, we hear you, we're doing everything you're asking us to do starting now. Does that help? Does it diffuse the situation? Are we on a better truck? Yeah, then I can go from protecting Reese's brand integrity to growing Reese's worldwide one peanut butter cup at a time. So I'd pivot immediately. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah, I would be right there. But as it is, is right now, I can't, I can't go along with the, of swapping out the ingredients that they've done.

Yeah. And, and Ely's pointed out that the opportunity is still there. And I'm really not, have any expectations that they will address it. I really don't expect them to. Yeah. Unfortunately. But as, it was Glenn Beck, we had me on the radio, on his radio, he said, he said, he said, Rhesus represents the United States.

It's a heritage brand. And if Rhesus is no longer Rhesus, what else is no longer in our country? It's becoming almost a patriotic thing. Like, it's Americana. I mean, if Rhes can no longer be Rhesus, then what else in our society is no longer sacred? I mean, a taste of Rhesus is actually sacred to Riesis fans. It is. It is.

It is. Well, maybe we can do some good here. You never know. We're putting it out there in the world that, you know, Hershey's would do a lot better with you as the, you know, global ambassador and spreader of goodwill and opening these doors than as a detractor that's just saying what we're all thinking. So we'll push things in the right direction.

I mean, I could switch horses real quickly. Oh, that's true, too. resources real quickly. So I'm not bound why, you know, but it really is disappointing, so disappointing. And I just, you know, I think, thank you very much, Melissa, Aaron, for your encouragement and support.

Yeah. This is, well, it's so important to me that you guys are doing this. Because unless, unless the Reese's fans speak up, right. The grocery company, all is, I think they're listening. I mean, they have to now, don't they? I mean, I would assume so.

And so if you just read the comments to my, to my LinkedIn posts. Yeah. It is funny. It is. It is. Yeah. The amount of upset people are. The comments are just, it's, the frustration is so unbelievable.

Yeah. And they all thought it was just them. You know, my taste button changing. And my wife used to love them. She no longer has them. No one eats them. We couldn't figure out why. And some people are actually saying they get sick now when they eat Rises for whatever reason.

So, I mean, who knows? But, you know, the point I'm trying to say is that the comments, there's nobody saying, yes, I'm so relieved they got rid of milk chocolate. Right. And they use it. Right. Yeah. Oh, Cody. No one's saying that.

There's no controversial counterpoint. They taste better now, actually, guys. Yeah. What are you talking about? On the other side, say, hey, you're in Greece. Right on. Not what I've seen. Yeah.

Well, this is an evolving story, of course. Before we go, I'd like to give a ton of appreciation to Brad Reese for joining us during this very busy time. We're going to keep watching the story unfold. Before you go, Brad, give everyone your website and let's, you know, your LinkedIn. How can we track along with you? Well, just, you know, just go to Google type in Brad, Reese. Yeah. I'm not the rancher.

I'm not the guy that was on Survivor. Okay. I'm, but yeah, Bradrease.com, but if you just go to or any search, then you type in Brad Reese. I'm not the rancher on the survivor.

I'm the other Brad Reese in Florida at the beach. You're the guy wearing the Reese's swag. Yeah, yeah, I'm the one wearing the Hawaiian Reesha shirt. But, yeah, so I really truly appreciate everything that you guys are doing to bring tension to.

the ingredient shift. And hopefully Hershey will pay attention. Hopefully Hershey will address it where if I'm not satisfied, hopefully most of the Rhesus fans will be satisfied.

I mean, I'm 70. I'm on my way out. So it's the future generations that need to be a good with this. And so hopefully Hershey will make it appealing for Riesis fans going forward the younger generations to enjoy it.

And what's interesting, though, is Hershey is really pushing what they call better for you. And better for you is like with their skinny pop popcorn and dots pretzels and lesser evil. But it's interesting that they're saying they're building a better for you portfolio. Yet the flagship brand, Reese, is they're doing worse for you. So they're making the better for you when they're snacking. But in races, it's worse for you by degrees.

creating the ingredients. I mean, it's just, your brain just go, it's a big. Well, we're here for their side of the story, too. If they want to come on with us, who we'll mediate, you know, we'll create some good in real time, too. So they, like I said, this is going to be out there. They can, they can respond and listen and do what they're going to do next. And like, you know, between all of us, Brad, you've got the, you've got the most influence. Well, the ball's in their court. Yeah. I mean, why not play?

I mean, they're Hershey, for Christ's sakes. Yeah. Come on. Yeah. I mean, you're an American institution. Yeah. The Clark, Hershey PA. Come on, Hershey.

Yeah. It's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, run with it. And, and deal with it. Yeah. So I wouldn't be shy if I were then. I would definitely be on your show. Don't be shy. No, come on, Hershey.

me. Well, thank you, Brad. Thanks, Melissa. All of you listeners can catch our past episodes at We FixedItpod.com. That's we fixeditpod.com. We'll have a new one for you next week. Maybe with Hershey. We'll see. Until then, stay original. And we will see you next time.