We Hate Movies - S12 Ep582: Spider-Man

Episode Date: December 14, 2021

This week's WLM episode takes the gang into Comic Book Movie territory as they chat about one of the ultimate achievements in the genre, Sam Raimi's 2002 classic, Spider-Man!  How hilarious is the teacher on the field trip with his threatening whisper? Would Aunt May ever wind up dating Bone Saw? And how absolutely terrific is Dafoe in this movie? PLUS: Did Uncle Ben's life insurance policy have a "No Dying in Front of the Library" clause?  Spider-Man stars Tobey Maguire, Willem Dafoe, Kirsten Dunst, James Franco, J.K. Simmons, Rosemary Harris, Cliff Robertson, Joe Manganiello, Bill Nunn, Ted Raimi, Elizabeth Banks, and "Macho Man" Randy Savage as Bone Saw McGraw; directed by Sam Raimi. Check out the WHM Merch Store - Just in time for the holidaze! Advertise on We Hate Movies via Gumball.fm Unlock Exclusive Content!: http://www.patreon.com/wehatemovies See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This week on the program, one of the most uncomfortably course-corrected ad campaigns in recent memory. It's Spider-Man. I'm Andrew Jupin. SADAC is ready. Eric Siska. Steve stole my thing, Chris Cab. You were really going to do it? Yeah. I love it.

And we love movies. Hello, 2002 spider man fucking still banging after nearly 20 years unbelievable movie and what like you mentioned at the top there

the original ad campaign that first trailer I think had that that robbery that was you know there's the net the web between the world trade teaser trailer and poster

yeah can we get like it's been enough time can I maybe see the footage it's on YouTube the full footage yeah oh okay should we do a thing where we stop

watch it really? No, I've seen the teaser trailer. I thought there was part of the movie. It's not part of them. It was never part of the movie. The World Trade Center does appear in the film, though. It is reflected in Spider-Man's eye once he finally, I guess, suits up and jumps around. He doesn't fly.

Yeah, he does not fly. Man, you say the wrong thing about a superhero. You'll get a fucking eviscerated out. Everybody walk on your fucking, tighten your assholes real quick. He fucking comes out of his arms and glides a bit. Yeah, a little bit of gliding. Gliding. Well, gliding is the big a hot oh no hobgoblin i was going to say hoggob green goblin holy fuck folks jesus dude you're gonna be

drawn and quartered i know what was it on i think it was in a melro episode i walked you guys through that there was the there's the green goblin right that's norman osborne there's another green goblin that's uh that's harry osborne he takes up the mantle from his father then you got the hobgoblin running around and what's his deal hot dog vendor no i think he's just a guy that's kind of like a fan of the green i i i'm not that super to spread it, Laura. I know what he looks like, but I don't know his whole deal. And then, heaven forbid, you run into the Demo Goblin,

who's a demonic. A great God. An actual demonic god. He's an actual. From like the Bowls of Hell. Yes, from the bowels of hell. So yeah, you got the Demo Gobble. So when 9-11 happened and all that crash and fumble on the ground, it opened up a port, like a portal. Exactly. You know? I mean, I like

the hot dog vendor stream, just because I like to think that's what happened to the guy in sleepers when they crashed to car. That big fat guy? They ruined his life. Yeah, that's how he turned a villainy. I will say, because I rewatched that the teaser trailer on YouTube last night after the movie. What's kind of great about it is like it's clearly not directed by Sam Ramey.

And it actually looks like it was somehow directed by whoever put together the, you wouldn't steal a car, would you commercial? It looks, it has the exact same aesthetic. And it's just like, dudes rob a bank. And they're like, yeah, now we're getting away with it in this helicopter. and they're flying along and then it's like, whoops, like the helicopter gets stuck in midair and starts getting dragged backwards. And then you see Spider-Man has made a massive web

in between the two twin towers. Yep. And the helicopter's like hanging. And look at that. He could stop the helicopter. He could have maybe stopped the plane. At least he should try it. He should have tried.

He made a trampoline on a web at the bomb. Dr. Connor needed him. Exactly. I got science class. And MJ wants to go to the park with them. me. I don't have time for this 9-11. How they didn't miss high schools when it happened. You just had to sit there or they

hit it from you until they told you to an assembly or something. That's what that's, that was my whole thing. Yeah. Here's a place to start. That's not 9-11. That's a good idea. Yeah, exactly right. Watch this course correction. Fucking banging Danny Elfman's score.

Yes. And here's the thing. Here's how much I love it. I don't even have a problem with the fact that at the the final fight scene on Roosevelt Island when Goblin gets killed it gets so Batman-y I'm totally fine with it

It's, I mean it's very Batman From the very beginning I was like it just sounds like a remixed Batman Which is fine because It's rocking But Elfman has the characteristics Of a superhero theme I like His music sounds like what I

And just the mix of it It's perfect No but I mean what I think What I like about this movie And I mean, we could have also done two. I think we'll probably do two at some point down the line. Oh, hell yeah. Because she's amazing and two is probably better.

It's like the one that... I don't know. I think I might prefer this one. Exactly. It's a lot closer than you think because this movie really holds up. But what I like about this movie is it appreciates the pageantry of being a fucking superhero movie. You know what I mean?

It's not like the 15th superhero movie you've seen this year. It's like, no, no, no. Stop what you're doing. Sit down. Here's a very long insane credit secret. I'm like capital I It could first I'm like oh I kind of like this with the web And then like the green goblin shows up in it

I'm like well this kind of sucks it's so funny I made these like the exact notation because it starts out It's very simple and it's just like some names and a little web And you're like oh that's cute Yes and by the end of it it is some of the like Worst not holding up CGI animation Like New York skyline goblin's face like it looks awful

it gets very messy go big or go home is what I say with these fucking superhero movies I don't want to hear oh my god Captain America listens to Nirvana now but at the same time like parts of this that don't go big and go home like I love

the fact that this like the whole thing in this movie is the green goblin being like man fucking Ozcor is getting bought out from under me I'm getting fired. I'm so mad about this and I'm going to kidnap Spider-Man's girlfriend. The world isn't on the line.

We're not doing alternate dimension stuff. It's such a grounded nothing problem. And he's the green goblin because he's motivated by money. That's the greenest goblin of them all. I mean, I do love the idea of goblin running for

mayor and just getting on that platform. Did they ever do a thing where like Norman Osborne gets into politics? Yes, he does. He runs Shield for a while. Is that right? He's like an evil Like there was a time When like

He tricked everybody And the thing he was good And it's like It's fucking Norman Osborne Clearly he's yeah But like Guys guys Have you been reading this thing

For the last 20 years Clearly It was a good idea To keep all the nursing homes Open during COVID It was a very good idea Norman Oswald's Victory lap novel

Or a fucking memoir So he wasn't He wasn't running shield He was the governor Of New York State It's a governor Look at it Look

I can't help it. I'm Italian. That's just how we say hello. Listen, I just grab people. That's what I do. I grab lady butts. I grab guy butts doing a little guy butt pat. I know Osborne doesn't sound Italian, but it's from the old country, Sicily. Osborne Gino.

And then you go to your shitty brother on fucking CNN and go, avenge me! That would be hairy You know I think he's a good Peter Parker I realized though I truly hate his voice It starts with a narration The voiceover is actually kind of weak here

Honestly I feel like We should have had another take Yep It's always hard to start Again this movie is big and operatic It is hard to start We should just start Because we know what we're doing

I bought a ticket to a movie called Spider-Man. I'm at least more than likely Khan a little bit aware of what this dude's up to. I know what's going on. I saw that redacted teaser trailer. Like, yeah, like, see, like, who am I? And I know who you are.

I fucking know it. I mean, I like Toby in this. Not as a person at all. But I like him in this because Spider-Man, Peter Parker, should be kind of a jerk. That's kind of like his, like. Isn't he, though?

Yeah, no, he is. That's what I mean. Like, he should be kind of a jerk. Oh, you're saying. Tom Holland doesn't play him as a jerk. Yes. Well, Tom Holland has, I feel like that Spider-Man has nothing to reflect. Like, I feel like it's just him and Tony Stark.

Yes. And running around in outer space or whatever. He does no time to actually interact with human beings. This movie actually deals with human beings, which is cool. Well, that's, I mean, the current, as the MCU currently stands, all characters have to be nice. Yes. Kind of.

You have, you can't really say anything to, that irks me a bit I'm gonna spend 17 days on the computer talking about how I don't like what they said there I'm very sane but it's true though I mean like I do think that like he's a bit complicated

in this movie and I think it comes from the writing comes from Toby's performance where he's like he's kind of shitty a little bit like you know what I mean and I think that again like Peter Parker if you read through the things he's like juggling girls he's like you know fucking shirk and responsibility By the way, that is a terrible way to use your powers.

You just grab a lady, huckering the air. He's a fucking. But that's what a cocky teenager should be like. It should be a little annoying, a little hard to take. Also, watch, give a nerd any power. Watch them turn on a fucking die. They'll be killing animals. They'll be doing all kinds of reprehensible shit.

Like Steve, look at Steve. Look what happened to Steve. He's a menace to society. I used to be a nice guy now, oh, dude, no way. Can't look, can't look at Steve in the eye anymore. The three of us have to look at each other. And Steve, we can't look at us. Oh, yeah, because he's got so much power now.

You finally paid you your utility bills. All this gold on you. I don't like it. Barely paid my utility. All these rings and necklaces you have on. It's raped in velvet. I do not like it. But like your Zuckerbergs and what have you. You know what I'm getting.

Eisenberg would have been actually an interesting, Peter Parker. He was probably a little too young here in 2002. No, actually. I mean, it'd probably be actually more accurate because he probably read. Toby was what, 25, I think when they were making this movie. Yeah. He certainly would have been a better than better Spider-Man than Lex Luthor, right?

Oh, yes. Oh, for sure. My Lord. Thanks. I kind of forgot that that happened and now it's all. Little baby billions over there. So the opening is he's running after the bus. And I do think he plays like the dopey

dinky fucking nerd pretty well. Yeah. To me though, anyway, to my and Chelsea and I disagreed on this last night to see where you guys stand on it. I think he, even at 25, he's looking way too old to be a high school kid. He is, but they all are, which I guess helps the reality.

It's a 902 and O rule, you know what I mean? I think Franco and Dunst are more believable as high school kids than he is. Yeah, that's true. They're much younger than he. But what about Flash? Oh, dude, Joe Mangelo. My Lord. Shaving his neck between takes, dude.

You can see the 5 o'clock shadow on him. He was like 26. I think or something like that or 27 maybe. Love Joe Mangonello by the way. A story he told, I think on the Pete Holmes show or something I was reading about it was some stuntman was like, dude, give you a hundred bucks to punch McGuire

in the face of this shot. And he was like, he like considered it. Then he's like, no, I'll probably ruin my career. I'm probably not going to do that. Yep. Did he get, I mean, he's big in this movie. But like, do you think he took this fight a little too personally because

he's humongous now? he was bitten by a radioactive fucking dumbbell and it's just becoming enormous. A radioactive bowflex. He is super jacked now, is he not?

For that like movie that he's never going to get. The dead shot. Death stroke. Yeah. I mean, I would like to see it. Of course,

it would be awesome and worth watching, which means they won't make it. Deathstroke is the guy that does like autoerotic affixiation. Yes. That's what that's about.

Yeah, he spends a lot of time in Thailand. And you say you don't know much about comic books. That one I did read. I saw there was an issue online. It was very interesting. I bet you Joey Banks comes back out for this third magic mic they're doing. Oh, I'm sure.

So what's the deal? The McConaughey is a no-go, huh? I don't know. Did he give up the governor's race, I guess? Yeah, so now he'll take his shit off again. I guess that's true. But it was just Channing Tatum was like, I am ready to do this with Steven Soderberg. And I was like, man, I hope McConaughey's there.

Oh, yeah. I hope all of them come back. What's is it? A bomber. I like, where's Kevin Nash? Get Kevin Nash back? Big guy. I love, so he's like doing the thing. He's like, you wouldn't want to be me. And there's this big fat kid eating the donut. He's like, you'd rather be him than me. I'm like, no, I would not. Like, you know what I mean? Coming, speaking as a very fat man that's lived his life is a very fat man, I would kill to be the nerdy little guy. Oh, yeah, totally. Because I'm not as self-important to it. Maybe I'd be able to use it. But this voiceover, too, if he did a different read of it, it'd be so creepy as fuck because he's like, I always wanted MJ. I would want to be any of these people,

even this guy. I'd like to be her shoe. He's going to start wearing the skins of these kids. You see, MJ's jacket? I'd love to be that jacket. I want her arm inside me. Oh, Bruce. she touched Bruce on the arm

I must have that arm I love him when he's running after the bus and like even the bus drivers laughing about it it's fucking great the guy that little fucking weiner kid I do appreciate that we got actual Queens here right this looks like near Queens Boulevard maybe sunny side or Woodside

they're right out like that already I saw Vinny Chase right on the sidewall they do a pretty good job of mixing it even though most of this movie was filmed in LA there is some New York stuff that I really like Yeah, totally. A lot of it's filmed on. So they are going on a field trip to Columbia.

We're also filming on campus outside, inside. It is the Los Angeles Natural History Museum. But it's pretty cool because outside here, this is the same outside quad from Ghostbusters. Nice to see it once again. Just to show you the juice that Norman Osborne has, he goes fucking dry. It's not easy to drive onto the campus of Columbia.

Let me tell you, unless they open the fucking gates. Not a lot of cars at that part. Absolutely right. He just fucking him and Harry come up driving up and like he not only did he do this. He sits there to have a conversation of heart to heart with Harry while he's doing this. And he's like, you can all wait. I'm talking to my shat. I'm not going to buy a Jeddah just because you're terrible at school, Harry.

Oh, dude. Yeah. You slam on Jeddah. Take that Volkswagen. This movie does exposition really well. Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah.

It just, yeah, again, without the clumsy. voiceover, which is absolutely clumsy, but like, yeah, you get the Norman and Harry dynamic immediately, and it's really good. And I think, I mean, I'm not the world's biggest Franco fan in general, but like, I think. Wasn't he like a sex criminal? Yeah. I think he's good in this. Of course he is. Yeah. And then, and then the second one, the third one's a disaster when they, when, you know, they try and do whatever the fuck they do with that third. He should have been excised at the end of the second movie. The second movie, he should have been killed because that, it is way too much going on.

that third movie to care about any goblin related residuals. But his relationship with DeFoe those scenes are really good. You know what I mean? It's also great casting. Yes. It's really, really great casting. And also what helps this too is like they run immediately into Peter

and DeFoe is just like, oh yeah, you're so smart with all your science stuff. And then you have you know, Harry, Franco having to be like, man, he really loves you. He like wants to fucking adopt your ass. He couldn't care less about me. I think Peter's playing the long

game here. He's like, oh, who's the new kid just transferred in? Oh, that's Harry Osborne. His dad's a billionaire. And he's like, say. You know what I mean? Just like, sidle right up. Yep. I, maybe he and I'll get an apartment after high school and I could pay $300. He can pay $2,000. No, that's, dude, neither of those kids

are paying anything for that apartment. Exactly. Pete's fucking Scott Free. Harry says to him it, like, high school graduation like my dad got the apartment all set for us downtown and it's like yep free room and board you've got enough on your mind don't worry about the rent

this week and it's just like oh maybe maybe he'll offer me a job I like science he likes science hey Harry what what are we doing tonight big guy yep the biggest science corporation in the world just happened to be friends with the guy just happened to bump into him

is what happened there it's interesting that Harry Osborne is like outside the social circle to the point where his friend, his only friend, I guess, is Peter Parker. I guess because he transferred in or whatever after being kicked out of all those boarding schools. But you'd think like he would run in the more popular

circle as a billionaire child. Well, that's what's kind of funny. He's easy on the eyes. I think it's even on this field trip. Like he's also kind of getting bullied by Flash Thompson and all the other like gap model jocks that are in the background.

I think they say something like, oh yeah, what are you doing, billionaire boy or something like that? Oh, yeah, what are you going to do about it? Well, his father will fire your father. That's what it is. That's what it is. Yeah, totally. So they're going around this science lab

and this woman's showing them all these like spider-related science experiments. This lab with humongous columns in it. It's just so silly. I mean, it's almost as if it was a museum. I mean, no, it's a museum, but I'm just looking, I'm like, why? Why? This spider does, you know, it's kind of interesting.

trying to like, it's not just one spider. It's like, or, you know, it's, it's a merge of all these spiders. It could, it could jump. It could do this. It could spin web. Is it a special name for like a group of spiders? You know how there's like a murder of crows? Yeah. It'd be great if there was something for spiders.

I would call it a creep. A creep of spiders. I like that. A vomit gasp of spiders. But that's, it's kind of great though. Like, to what end science experiment? Great question. What are we doing here?

Get all these spiders that got all these little abilities making one big super terrifying spider. And they have 13 of them and one goes missing and there's not a red alarm. Yes, where is the claxon for this? Instead, the, like, because the woman is like, oh, there's 15 spiders or something. And MJ's like, oh,

there's only 14 here. And this woman goes, huh, that's weird. She says they must be working on one of them. Like they're giving it a tune up in the bag. You've got to sign those spiders out. I want a spider's side out. How else am I supposed to create my spider?

army. You just happen to get loose. But seriously, what are they planning on doing? Like dropping this thing in

Nicaragua? Probably. I need that lady at the start of this to be like, this is why we're doing this. And it has to be

like something, something medical breakthrough. Last fall, America was caught with her pants down. That will not happen again. My army of spiders

will destroy the Taliban. Hey, Poppy, what do you think about setting an army of spiders? Can we get a venom going? maybe Shandem a carnage.

Now, Jr., you got to be careful with all them symbiote why I just start small boy. How about an army of spiders? I need to talk about the teacher in this scene. The student whisperer. This guy,

it's like he's very loudly whispering every line. But that's what he wants to do, right? Because you're trying to discipline these kids while also respecting. the goddamn exhibit. But you don't, you never hear it break. Like, even beforehand, he's always like, even coming and he's like,

now keep in line. You sure you don't ask questions. They're stupid. You do. We're talking during that woman's entire presentation. Let's go talk about how we listen. The next person who talks will fail this course. I kid you not.

That is the best one. Yeah, kid you not. I kid you not. Dude you not. Dude, like, it is, that is such a high school teacher, puffing himself up, you know what I mean? It's like ASMR, right? Oh, dude, absolutely.

Yeah, like, if you don't take off your pants right now, you're going to fail, I get you not. A late night, like, R and B station made just for fucking, next on Cup, WKPR, the storm. We're going to be playing. We're going to be playing cool in the gang. I kid you not.

Shia day all night. I get you not. It's just. It's like, I don't, this is, it's puzzled me for years. I mean, I remember being in the theater, watching this movie for the first time and going, why is that guy doing that? There are no, so awesome. There are no small parts, Andrew.

There are no small parts. That's true. That's very true. Although, Tobo would say, you know, this guy doesn't have a name. We know he's a teacher. He's got a profession, obviously. No name to be found, though, unfortunately. Yeah, you got to stop acting.

I looked him up. This guy's great. Why is he in everything? He could have been. like a goon in a bunch of like, you know, like maybe like Seagal level action movies. Could you stop whispering? No, I cannot.

It's a medical condition. I get you not. I just, oh, vet, you talked through that woman's whole presentation. I mean, he does, like, those are such science teacher lines, though, like, get out. It's just like, I just, he just rules.

But you do understand. This is a disaster movie. We need people to be. no, I'm screaming. It's coming right for us. Aliens have taken over the White House. I get you not. Are you going to need more than that?

Go bigger there. We're going to have to send nukes to the asteroid to blow it up. I kid you not. We imagine that this is during what I, like, so Peter is going to try to talk to MJ, he wusses out or whatever. So now Harry goes over there and uses his line, his science facts. Oh, right.

charm the lady, right? And this is when you were talking to the Yeah, because Peter's like, oh wow, you know, you know spiders could lift blah, blah, blah, and Harry's like, why would I give a fucking shit about that Peter? The funny thing is like, the answer to that is like, I don't know, Harry, because it's healthy to be curious, dude. You should always keep your mind going, man.

This reminds me something that happened to me in seventh grade. I would turn to a buddy of mine or what I thought was a friend of mine. Oh, shit. And I would make a little like, you know, aside about this stupid science experiment blah blah blah blah like a little joke and he'd laugh and then he would say it loud

and he would get the credit that's yeah I was like I was like his I was like his Gary I was like his Judd Apatow I was Judd Apatown his Gary Shandling but writing his material honestly that should have that he should have taught you Steve just I can have some confidence yeah exactly

that's all it takes man so that's what that's what Harry does here he takes Pete's fucking material goes in for the kill with his James Franco looks and MJ's like wow what an interesting spider fact I want to give you a hand job in the bathroom

we should take Kristen Dunson's in this movie she's great she's great I still have not seen Power of the Dog yet but it's I'm holding a slot in my top five she kicks fucking ass because I love her I love Flemens I like her new I mean her career's always been good

I mean like she's never really had a downtime like she was a little kid She took a break literally what she did interview the vampire, she comes out, fucking Dora, she doesn't want an Oscar, but I think she gets nominated for best supporting in that performance and then just kind of

fucks around. There's been like interesting like landmarks things. Like any of you, the vampire was like one kind of thing. Jumanji was another kind of thing. Bring it on was another kind of thing. Virgin suicides was another car. Yeah, that whole that Indian run she had. Yep, exactly.

Exactly. And then yeah, she's just so fucking great in power of the dog. And then through all of this, you have her playing MJ three times. And she's really great in these movies. The moon is coming to destroy the earth. I kid you not. Oh, right. And then of course Melancholia. She's fantastic.

It's been a while for that movie. I remember loving it. But it was a moon thing, right? No, no. It was a different planet. Different planet. Okay. I thought maybe it was a moonfall. You're thinking of moonfall. You're just getting excited about for moonfall. We're all being moonfall-pilled and we're excited about it. I'm going to kill myself in a horse

table. I kid you not. I'm gonna fuck a random stranger on a golf course I kid you now yeah I don't know why we have you reading for the dunst character but yeah that wasn't very good I guess I'll just retire from acting

I kid you and he wasn't kidding but yeah so she's great I mean like you know and like Pete you know McGuire is being really creepy here's like hey can I need someone else to be in the photo

with this spider mind if I take your pick Dude, it's two awkward asks for photography in a row. Because right before that, he says to the scientist who's giving them the tour, he just holds up a camera and goes,

For this goal paper? And she goes, uh-huh. He should have made a hat trick and make the lesson, hey, MJ, why don't you get rid of those sandals? Let those babies fly. Yeah, but just like, oh, MJ, I need a person

in this one. click Shutterbug pornography is expensive on the internet she says don't make me look ugly and he's like

I could never impossible later when we find that his bedroom is two feet from her bedroom that's when things get really fucking creepy

yeah he's been doing that for years he's been sleeping webs before he got bit by that spider that's for sure you better believe it he's watching her sleep

guaranteed totally. His lights are off to and he's got binoculars looking in that window. See if the moon, he does it at a full moon. When the moon is at its brightest and he hopes that some of that beautiful moonlight will fall into her darkened

room. So his binoculars pick up some stuff. Pitch blackness listening to every breath you take thinking it's romantic. But this fucking criminal spider is on the loose and Toby gets bit. And I mean like, I don't know, dude, spider bites are most often.

and really dangerous. They're fucking bad. You go to the hospital almost all the time. You got to tell somebody. And I was actually thinking about this last night. Imagine the turn that his life would have taken

if he was like, excuse me, I just got bit by the spider. And then he'd be like under surveillance. The change would occur. Not even that. Norman Osborne has him in a cell somewhere. No, they're dissecting him. It's like what they want to do to E.T.

He's all gray at the end of it. It's just Willem Defoe, like, those big see-through plastic suits. Plus, of the matter, Uncle Ben's probably fine. That's true. Then Uncle Ben would live. Yeah, and he would live to continue to not work. Yeah. And just sit around the house, feeling more useless by the day.

After the Spider-Bite, we do have Cliff Robertson, the great Cliff Robertson, of course, as Uncle Ben. And Rosemary Harris, of course, as Aunt May. This is still back when Uncle Ben and Aunt May were old people. You need a smoke show. I don't need to be J.O. into Aunt May. Hey, you know what, though? I'm totally fine with that decision.

The Marissa tomeying of it all. Yeah. Even the Sally Fielding of it all. I was kind of all right with me. But yeah, so Cliff Robertson's talking about it. He got laid off from the electric plant or the plant where he was an electrician.

Oh, yeah. The electrician's top plant got laid off after 35 years. Let's see what's in the paper. What are people hire people for today? Oh, computer this. Computer that. It reminded me of that Seinfeld where it's fucking for no reason Frank Costanza's selling computers. I saw that one recently.

Totally. It may get lucky here, dude. A, this dude croaks, it gets shot, life insurance definitely takes care of everything. Totally. And you don't need this bitter old fuck because it's going to be every day with the computers. That's her retirement is listening to Well, I can't do it, man. These guys' damn computers. happy he gets killed. Even the computers

have analysts. The therapy may, it's out of control. Yep. Yep. Oh, yeah. You got to watch it with that now. He's also kind of got like a born again vibe to him a little bit. Like when he's talking to Peter, it's like this like, I've been there, I did it all, did it worse than you'll ever do it. I was hooked on drugs once. Exactly. Just like he's got that. I don't know why

his performance is very much. For Uncle Ben? I got like a like a Norman Rockwell very clean cut. Like, this is a hard working American. This is what it used to be like. You know what I think it might be, Steve? The fact that he has the worst piece in any Marvel movie has ever been made. And I feel that like he kind of looks like Southern Huckster

religious dude, maybe like a super church guy. I never minded on the older guys because I'm like, well, most your body's fake at this point, right? I mean, come on. That's fine. He got bit by a radioactive televangelist. Now, Peter, I know what you're going through. I've been through it, man. I was addicted to spider blood for decades. I would shoot this stuff anywhere I could.

Got hooked on it in Korea. I was put it between my toes. I would just inject it into my toes. That way your aunt couldn't see the marks on my hand. Now I'm just picturing a guy like grabbing a GI in the Korean War, grabbing some weird exotic spider and jamming it to his toes. stripping in his mouth. Or encouraging it to bite him, dude.

Oh, yeah. Like a bite fetishist. Like the guy on MASH who was always trying to get sent home. Oh, yeah. Jamie, whatever is Carrie's name. Yeah. It's the actor. Now you do that, right? It's kind of like dudes like shooting themselves in the foot and whatnot. Yeah, people would love to do that.

Peter, at my very always, I juiced a tarantula. And I just shot that son of a bitch down my gullet. Like in World War I, you know, they used to do this thing, right? If you take the rifle and you could, shoot you shoot it with your toe you kill yourself by shooting you with your toe

no I'm just trying about trying to get sent home due to an injury both send you send you home one's in a box Peter barges in he's got this big honkin pulsating spot and that's what I love about Ramee here as a director is

all of his sensibilities are here you got the body he gets the body harness of it absolutely which rules I honestly like the biological webs just because it's like it's one less thing to like it makes

Peter Parker like a regular guy versus like I'm a science wizard you know it makes him gross like he's a teenager he should be a little gross the whole thing of fucking Tom Holland I'm the smartest boy that ever was I'm shooting

yeah but that's more in line with the actual character right he's it's just one extra part of Peter he's also a super science genius and these movies kind of the next one does that a little bit more I think you're right but I like that I don't like I'm already suspending

disbelief for a lot of this and that's just another suspension of disbelief and then you line them all up and it's like one too many so I'm glad that was excised personally yeah I mean the problem with making him the like smartest boy in the entire world is that like he knows the answer to everything essentially yeah

like it doesn't sometimes it takes a little longer than usual but he always knows what do, and that is boring for a character. The other thing that it removes, and the others have, both of the Garfield and the Holland ones have this, when it goes back to him having to have like little packets

instead, there's always a thing about, now I'm out of it, you know, as a device of some kind and this just removes that. And it adds it, it trades it, it's a trade up in my book also because it's a trade up to body horror. Yes. Yeah, but you know, the ultimate body horror was, is if they give him a big juicy ass,

You know, because when you think of spiders, you think of that big, juicy ass. They always have such big bottoms. Just a big old plum on the back of there. He should at least have like a little thick ass. I mean, I guess. Maybe not a full balloon, but a little thicker. Maybe, Eric, but I think it's a fine, it's a fine compromise to have wrist come. Risk come is awesome.

I think that's a fantastic way to do it. And he's coming up the room and Rosemary Harris is like, what are you doing in there? Aunt May, my booty is delicious. Aunt May, my booty has become delicious. Oh, and he could like twerk on YouTube and shit. God, Peter, did you get a BBL? What are you doing with the money that you make? But it's kind of cool.

They shot this first. So he's like, it's really skinny, like emaciated Toby McGuire. Yeah. He passes out. We get like, you know, weird. some bad CGI about what's happening to his cells

well because we we saw X-Men a few years before this so we're going inside the bloodstream there yeah it's not great it's not fantastic but you know

he wakes up the next day he doesn't eat his glasses he's like and again like he's reasonably jacked you know what I mean like he's yep I mean you know

Spider-man's supposed to be skinny jacked anyway but he's not it's not like really like it's not hulking there's not a lot of bulk there there's just definition it's sensible yeah

While this is all going on the same evening. Oh, that's right. Norman Osborne is doing his own experiment because we have learned while the field trip is happening that the military is going to pull funding from OzCore in favor of this other company. And if Oscourt loses that contract, like Norman will be finished. Yeah, well, they're in the middle of the conference to decide that. Like he's just the military is like, we want an update. We want to see what and him and this fucking weenie assistant. Dr. Strom, right? Dr. Strom. And he comes next

to him and he's like, it's my it's my idea that we should go back to formula. And like, it's like the Lisa needs braces, back to formula. It's so good. Back to formula. It's so good. Yeah. Because some of the side effects are

anger and insanity. Totally. We've accidentally invented like super PCP. We were trying to do something that was not that. I mean, also like, what is the military application For Super PCP, a lot. For Super PCP, absolutely a lot.

But for a dude precariously dangling on a hang glider, like... Well, I mean, at the time, right? Like, I never thought, you know, we'd have drones flying by your apartment at night, you know? So it's like... It's its proto drone, I guess. And then the other, I'm just going to put a person on it. Which is the weird part. The drone part, I understand.

The person surfing on it, I don't get. You'll be shot in five seconds. Well, you know, in fact, it's an antiquated notion. to have pilots now, but I think you know, it's a stepping stool. We have to have these weird experimental sciences in order to get the one that sticks. They don't care what the super soldier

looks like. They just want the super soldier, whatever it happens to be. Talk about not caring what the super soldier looks like. I'm sorry. I think this movie's great. The goblin helmet is fucking dumb. It looks cheap as hell. It looks insane to think that like

a scientist and military would be like, yeah, no, no, make it look more little evil. How about some fangs? I think he modifies it when he becomes the green goblet. Yeah, yeah, a little bit. But like, the footage

of scare our opponents. Exactly. The footage of the other effect that they were going to use is amazing. What is this? They had an actual face, like, you have to look it up online.

It's an animatronic. So it would be also body horror. It would look more like the actual mask in from the comics. It would look like the Wishmaster. something. It actually looks scary. Like when it makes the big evil grin at the end of it, it's a little scary.

You will look at that. You got scared a little bit. I pissed my little pants. A little peepie down there. Pissed the pants. I looked at all this footage and I saw it on line. He got a little peepie there. I think the other thing. A little peepie. That's a lot of piss. If the two of you were pissing on that couch over there, there's going to be trouble. You're going to want to get a new one of these.

No, just I think what made, I never was crazy about it, but I think the problem is what made it worse for me is just the absolute horrendousness of everything about that turn off the dark musical including the costume

with the green goblin and that which is very similar to it and I just I can't separate the two in my brain now that was just what a wretched undertaking that whole thing was. Did you go see it?

No, Steve did though. I did. I was the only one. It was terrible. It was awful. There's a long... Because it's like you two now or something. Bono and theage dude. How many people died in your production? Zero, but the guy

came out, I'd probably tell the story. He was like, welcome. It was just some stage hand comes down. I was like, this is a preview. This is not the actual, you're welcome to be here. We're happy to have you, but it's a preview. So if we have to stop, it's not

a mistake. It just means it's a preview. Like the march in front of the treehouse of horror. It really was. And you may get wet with blood, okay? But I remember being, you know, this, it's funny, I don't remember seeing this in theaters. I know I absolutely did.

I remember, like, reacting to it. I don't remember the moment because it was the summer between high school and college and I was probably stoned out of my mind. It was September? No, it was in May of 2002. Got it. Okay. Oh, your school graduated in May.

Yeah. Yeah, we always just finishing. Yeah, yeah. I distinctly remember seeing this. I went to Friendlies beforehand. Oh, nice. Yeah. We were in the throes of our multiplex days.

This was one of the like Thursday night put it on before an open thing. But I remember then I remember then being like, oh, the costume sucks. And it's it's grown on me over the years because obviously being a comic book fan, I'm like, oh, it should look like this and it looks like that. But it has, like, especially last night, I was just like, oh, there's a lot of movement there. It is kind of like aerodynamic and kind of cool. What would have saved it? It's not great.

What would have saved it for me is if they. made the mesh on the mouthpiece a little more transparent. Because the part... You can see through it. No, but barely. If you, if his mouth was way more visible the whole time, it would be better. Because when the camera is far away from it and he's talking, it just looks stupid to me. It just looks fucking dumb. It looks way better when you can see his mouth. You can just have the stuntman and Willem can just do, you know, some booth recording. But let's, it's Willem in the costume. Really? Yes. The whole time?

no every shot the whole time they said something that he did like 90% of his own stuff well that's cool but like the parts where i think the costume are most effective are like the fight at the end when he's got the the eyes are open you can see it's defoe yeah and you can see that those defoe teeth in there yes that's what it's most effective i think now that it's been like 20 years and nonstop superhero costumes yeah i'm totally fine with this one well i guess that is my the fact that it is just a costume and he's not a cg i thing yes it's such a big thing thing for me that I'm just like, fine, whatever it is. They couldn't even, they couldn't

even do Mysterio. I mean, there's a fishball head. That's pretty easy, but no, it's got to be fucking Yeah. I mean, I again, light hitting things. People, real light hitting real things. It's true. So fucking easy. And Defoe is a super inspired choice and terrific in this movie. Yep. He is full. I love

so he goes to take the thing. He's like, you know, I'm gonna I'm gonna experiment on myself. The other guy's not so ready to it. I've always always love this shot of him taking the shot that's slamming the glass down. Totally. It's a power move, dude. Chugging this poison.

It lets you know that this Green Goblin fucks. He doesn't fuck in the movie, but he would fuck. Oh, well, that's also, I mean, just the mere casting of Willem Defoe. Every, even his weird old lighthouse guy, every character Willem Defoe has played fucks. There's no doubt about it. That's the primary thing about Defoe as a person. He fucks.

Even when he voices cartoon character, those cartoons, characters. Fuck. Even if it's like talking dogs or like fucking daisies or whatever the hell. Yeah, I'm a talking dog that fucks. Yeah. I'm a woof-woof. I'm a daisy. I want to fuck you. I'm a daisy. Come over here, bumbo.

Be pollinating. Hey, other flower. Film this. Take it up. Take it off. Now I want this movie. Pixar is Daisy. Story Willam Defoe.

DeFoe should have done something in that. horrendous emoji movie. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I'm the egg plant. Yeah. I was going to send me to a work colleague. Maybe you shouldn't do that.

I should send back a little squirts. I'm going to get you in trouble at work. Or maybe I'm a peachy ass today. I would be remiss. This beginning is a little... It feels a little Batman Forever. like the... By the way, there's an exterior shot

of OzCorp or whatever and it looks very Tim Burton, Batman. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, which is cool as hell. It's like a mat painting or something. Man, it's just... We got to go back. We got to go back to tradition.

Yeah. I mean, the thing about the effects in this movie, the computer effects, is that they are mostly used as dollops. Yes. To connect things and bring them together as the effects should be used. Yeah. So you're also seeing this time where we're beautifully not overboard with it.

It's not the whole movie. You're just seeing it used as it should be used. Yeah. But wait, so what part were you saying was very? No, just him like, they're showing the formula to the guy, to the general, and he rejects it. It's very Edward Nigma-y. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know what I mean?

And then that night, he does it himself. See, that's, I love a good, like, the bad guy does a thing under the cover of night. You know what I mean? And you're right. It does have that same feel of it. after hours we shouldn't be doing this and the guy definitely doesn't want to do Dr. Strum or whatever

which I was I guess I think I clicked on that character's name on Wikipedia that guy becomes somebody It's like Strom front or something It's called like the living computer Something like that it was like kind of dumb sounding

Now Connor's the lizard He's the bug Yeah just a bug I love this shot of Defoe with White dies. It's so evil dead. It's so fucking cool. Yep. It totally rules, man. And, like, they didn't need to do that, but they

did. And it's just, it's another little thing that adds to it. Also, just letting, like, Defoe go wild with the physicality and, like, really, like, see him jumping up after the thing, like, explodes or whatever. And he jumps up, like, on the ledge as he jumps out of the whole thing. Like a gargoyle

or something. It's cool that he actually dies, right? We see any comes back to life. You know, Strom kind of resuscitates. He does. Yeah. This is all Strom's fault. It is.

As always. Yeah, fucked up, buddy. And then he just goes back to formula. This guy gets super murdered. It's awesome. It rules. And then, like, you know, Peter now go to school. Here's a question.

Because I, you always got to try to smoke these out wherever you can. When he wakes up the next morning, Peter, and you see it's the, you know, he's looking in the. mirror. He's all like jacked and whatnot. And then like Aunt May is like, you're going to be late for school. And then something about like, do you need to change? And he goes like change. Oh yeah. Big change. Is his penis larger? His penis is absolutely larger. It's probably maybe that's instead of the ass getting bulbous. Maybe the penis got like a big head on it or something. And May, I got a real horse cock now. It's all head. It's like no shaft. I'm somehow immediately getting emails from some guy named Mr. Hands. Oh, no, it's too big at me.

No one will want me. I can't walk. It's weighted down. Everybody wants this until they get it. And then they know it's a curse. Yeah. I was, what would he have to fuck? Like a whale or something?

Or at least another horse. Yeah, I guess a horse would do. But, yeah. and then, you know, he goes to school and he, you know, he realized he has sticky hands. Oh, yeah. These little, again, body horror. These little fibers at the edge of his fingers are so gross. The close up on that shit?

Oh, my God. What are you going to do when you're, you know, fondling a lady? It's a great question. He's like rip off pieces. Here's the thing, right? It's like they never really establish if those things are going away like cat claws or what. And yeah, dude, it's like when he finally gets. with MJ. Like, you go to fucking grab

a titty, man. Cups a breast. Look, what's going on there? I got a nipple in my palm. Oh, boy. But, you know, there's a scene where Mary Jane almost falls over. He catches her and, like, he grabs all over lunch. It's kind of fun. It's like, wow, good reflexes. And, like, she does

this thing, like, oh, you have blue eyes. I've never noticed because you had glasses. And he's like, what? Yeah, he's, I don't know. What was it? What's the word sunglasses, lady? What the fucking talk? Seriously. I like the Spidey sense. Like how they slow down the time. And especially with the fight with Flash Thompson, seeing like, him

moving normally. It's interesting. Dude, I love this, this big Joe Manganollo getting hit with a tray of food. And there's like big beans all over his neck. Oh, it's awesome. He does the web thing. And like, he's dragging the fucking tray. And that just seems disgusting. It seems disgusting. But it's

also like Spider-Man's equivalent of getting toilet paper stuck on his shoe. Well, because I, we don't ever see, like, he clearly had to learn how to cut them off somehow. Yeah. You don't get that scene, but, like, just the image is incredible. Like, I love that.

And there's the, there's a great, just like, actual physical gag of the, the cafeteria door closes. Yes. And the tray gets stuck. And then the tray's, like, getting pulled, and you can just, you don't see Peter trying to pull it off, but, like, just this bouncing lunch tray is all the special effect you need. I mean, I think this movie's

appropriately corny where it needs to, but it's also, it is funny. Like, the joke is, because Sam Rame And Sam Remy loves Corny's shit also, by the way. But he does also can make jokes that hit. You know what I mean? Here's the thing, though. You punch someone down a hallway. Someone's calling the cops.

You know, someone's going to be like, I don't know what's going on here. I don't know if this dude like practices some like secret fighting art or whatever, but he literally just punched a guy down a hallway. This guy over here is calling an ambulance because his chest is probably caved in at that point. Totally. his his ribs inverted and stabbed his own heart

because later you're like lifted up Roosevelt Island trams and stuff so if you're that strong and you don't even know you're that strong yet and you're like I'm gonna wind up and really knock this dude he should have punched right through his body

oh boy oh oh oh oh oh oh I'm holding this heart in my hand I'm holding this heart in my hand better start wearing a mask because I definitely killed this kid fake your death Peter and then just become Spider-Man full-time.

I am going to jail. Oh, that's right. Just going to jail. My name is Ben Riley, actually. How about that? Walk down the street. I love, like, how just, like, because the whole, the hallway is full of kids and they're all, like, totally shocked, except for MJ who's, like, disgusted.

Yeah. Well, can it remind me of a history of violence a little bit? Oh, yes. You think I'm funny, you piece of shit. Like, I just kind of wanted that to have it. Come here. come here you beast it's so awesome but yeah

but they almost have similar conversations they don't say because it's a comic movie it's not like you put flash at the hospital but you definitely would have yeah

he's like twitching on the ground totally he would not be pulling up to MJ's house a couple nights later in this movie in his new sports car the only thing yeah so MJ the next day

is like you know she's getting yelled at at home by it. We see this a little earlier. This is now there's a bit much. There's nothing funny about living under that scenario but it's hysterical on this movie because one of the lines

I had the captions on the dad is screaming around the house, give me some beer I need some beer. Well, this is all over, you hear it eventually, it's about the dishes and I'm like maybe go dishes and beer, but maybe four degrees lower for the dishes.

Get back in here, Missy, do those dishes. Maybe not destroying half your house over the dishes. Well, he's a drunken maniac, you see. Because Peter is just like, say, and she like runs out crying to like, you know, just escape this horrible situation. And Peter's like, so I couldn't help it over here. You're being emotionally

abused. Wanna Soda. Were you listening to that? No. No, I was just taking out the trash. See the garbage bag. She suggests that like, she's like, well, it's nothing new. You've probably been hearing it for years. And you've never called the cops on these people? Yeah, totally.

Everyone shouts. Sure, sure. Every day yelling over the dishes and beer. Your aunt and uncle don't shout. Well, they scream pretty loud sometimes. Yeah, when they're getting it on. Yeah, fucking grampy fucking slop. Oh, Ben, give it to me.

Oh, yeah, dude, knocking all sorts of little ceramic cherubs off the shelf. Knock it down out there. I can hear you fucking you, 80. year olds. Oh, you've been laid off from your job, but you've not been laid off from the bedroom. Your animals.

Keep it down. We should say we do, there's the first like him checking out his powers montage after the school fight. I love this wall. The first wall crawling scene is incredible. Wall crawl, great. Yes.

Overhead shot little cartoon running on the roof. Not nothing. great at all. No, yeah. But the the CGI in this, yeah, certain certain shots don't really live up. But honestly, I think they are way better than a lot of the CGII

that are what's contemporary to this. I rewatch those Matrix sequels. Oh, yeah. Holy fuck, dude, PS1 graphics for entire people. See, that's what this movie gets right is so much of the effect shots are at least based around actual like

landscape shots and then they're putting other stuff in. And it's not this whole, like everything you're looking at is fake, just part of it is fake. And the benefit is also, what you recall it, for the most part, it's the Green Goblin and Spider-Man

who are completely clothed so you don't need to see skin tone or any kind of human humanity. That's what's weird in these roof-running scenes because they have the parts where he jumps up and when he jumps up

and comes closer to the camera, you have like a cartoon Toby face. Yeah. And it's kind of weird. It really doesn't look. But the wall thing is really cool. I mean, and they do it a couple times

and it's really great. Like, it seems very simple. It's like, yeah, we move the camera so he's actually just walking but it looks like he's walking up a wall but the way the the angles that Ramey plays with in that scene to just kind of draw

you in is incredible well that's Rami I think does I mean I've come around I actually kind of really like the Angley Hulk now dude I rewatch that that has to be re-appraised by people I think that movie's a ton of fucking fun it's really strong but I think

what he does a little too like he puts a little too much effort into it. Ramey gets the thing of comic books of like just try everything. Like angles everywhere. That's why I don't even mind the voiceover because it's another thing that I know gives

that energy of actually reading a comic book. Whereas like Angley is like try like too hard. It's like doing it every shot. I think it's just nuts. That movie is way more nuts than you remember. I had so much fun with it. It's a phenomenal nulte too. Oh my. Oh top

tier nulte. No doubt about it. Oh, but so the only thing I was going to say is that all leads to, like, the crumbling of Peter's relationship with Uncle Ben is he ghosts him on painting the kitchen. Oh, hey, Michelangelo, be here at 5 o'clock. Can't wait and paint with you? And he's like, yeah, fuck off, old man. Michelangelo, meatloaf and veggies in the oven. We now see that bright orange wall of the kitchen is now like a more toned down green. but the phone, yellow, doesn't really go with either, in my opinion.

It's interesting to see like the 70s chic that they had going on here, you know? Oh, yeah. When Aunt May brings out like a big pot of food earlier in this brown pot with flowers on it, very seven-d-old-old-old. It's very watching too much house hunters talking like that. I just, I notice what's in. I appreciate production design. Sure, sure. I appreciate art direction.

Have you heard of these things? They're in the credits of the film. I think this is why Peter is so unpopular at school. It's like, that's the kid with old parents. Oh, yeah. His parents are old. They're still smoking in the house. There's ashtrays everywhere.

His uncle asked if I wanted to lude. I looked in the window one time and they're skeleton people. They're that old. They have vinyl records. It's like his aunt's on like social security and shit, dude. The phone has a. court. No, no, no, vinyl records. It hasn't been become cool again. Not yet. You're still about three years off.

They had a work processor in their house. Not a computer. A word processor. Part of that backyard conversation is they also say to each other, like, that they're both planning on moving to the city after graduation. She wants to be an actress. And he's like, oh, you could rule all of Broadway. Oh, dude, yeah. Toby. But then Flash shows up.

Look what my dad got me, a car. Yeah, another car in Queens. Get a lot of cars riding around Queens, baby. What's so funny about it. Like, I guess to an extent, you could drive to Long Island or something. And especially more rural parts of Queens. You're in, like,

always own park area or whatever. But for Peter, who wants to move into Manhattan anyway, why is he suddenly wanting to get a car? Yeah. You get these weird little transitional shots of him going through like the automotive section and some leaflet and we

see a car superimposed over MJ and it's amazing because it's like car equals women. Yes. This is kind of like when the movie feels very comic booky structurally because you could picture that being like

a Peter Parker thought class. Yeah. I think it's it's silly but it's also totally works. Yeah I'm not saying it doesn't work. I just think it's silly. I just think it's silly, like to take a photo of it out of context. Hey, MJ, yeah, my dad gave me a brand new car because my chest caved in it. I'm going to die today. So we got a new car for a good. I'm going to die. It was spending the park of settlement money early, baby. I'll never play

football again and I got to pee through a bag. That would be amazing if like in the settlement for that schoolyard fight, they get the house. Oh, dude. Like it. Mays have thrown in this fucking street. Oh, I will be flashes made now. You're going to wear the outfit too, May. But yeah, so he sees right under all of those car ads, an ad for $3,000 wrestling prize. Dude, do not.

You see it in a newspaper advertising, you got to go to Midtown and you get three grand, no questions ask, you do not go to that address. Definitely not. It's stunning that that was printed in this newspaper. So Uncle Ben, insists on giving him a ride and he lies and says he's going

to the downtown library location which is again speaking of Ghostbusters the 42nd and the Fifth Avenue there Cliff Robertson pulling up right outside right on Fifth Avenue I don't think so. Move it old man

You needed like horn honking like no Peter I got to talk to you about this. Great power comes great move your fucking ass. It's a busy street park before you get your job Chamba juice. Bus lane motherfucker. Totally.

It should have been a thing where Uncle Ben doesn't get shot. He gets fucking railed by a bus. He gets shot by the NYPD while they're towed his car. By the way, love the car. Love the Sam Ramey tradition

of putting this car and everything. Yeah. Oh, that's cool. It's an evil dead car. Yeah. That's dope. And yeah, and I like this scene.

And I think, again, I think Toby does well here. Like he's just, he doesn't want to fucking hear this old man's bullshit, but obviously the old man's giving him good advice.

Yeah. By the way, that car needs to be in that Dr. Strange movie. And if Disney cuts out that car, I'm cutting something. Totally. Anyway, go on. Peter, Peter, you know, one day you'll get this car.

Well, there's a demonic curse on it. But, you know, you'll deal with that then. Don't listen to this tape that I put in the tape deck because it will summon the evil day. You know the tape that says, Professor Nobby's greatest hits, do not play that tape.

I do. I mean, I think that's what's sort of interesting about this is the problem is they've told this store and I get, I actually think far from, no, no, no, Homecoming is the best of those MCU Spider-Man movies by a country fucking mile with all I haven't seen.

I agree. Far from home yet because it didn't come out yet by the time this was recorded. And I like that they kind of don't do the Spider-Man origin because we've seen it twice already, but at the same time, like there is something, I think kind of missing from that character because of it.

It's kind of a weird gamble in a weird way. They're right in not showing it, but they're wrong in not acknowledging it more. Yes. Because I feel if I'm remembering homecoming correctly, like it's barely, I think there's like a single line mention. We mentioned like Uncle Ben is dead. We don't know why or how or any of that. I want to know if he was a fucking haughty too, you know? Oh, dude. Patrick Wilson. Yeah, exactly.

I was going to say John Stamos. Either or, dude, or both, dude. Like two Uncle Ben. I mean, in Civil War, it's just literally, like, he's already there. He's like, oh, yeah, I'm Spider-Man. Yep. Hi, Tony. Yes.

And that's it. And again, like, we've seen this story twice already. We don't need to see it a third time in 20 fucking years. However, it just, I do think you're missing the emotional core of the character. Your math is off there, right? Because we also had the Amazing Spider-Man, right? Oh, you two times for those origins. Yes.

Okay. I think about two movies. Oh, yeah, yeah. Martin Sheen plays him in The Amazing Spider-Man. Oh, that's right. I forgot previous episodes, by the way. I don't know if this is a hot take or anything, but I always think the origin story should be in the movie.

It's just how much time you dedicate it to it and how you show it to people. I kind of agree with that. I do think it should be there. It's just like everybody does it in the same way that takes 35 fucking minutes. Honestly, I mean, because we got the Robert Pattinson Batman coming up.

I kind of, I know we've seen it to death, but I kind of want to see what they're going to do with it, this go versus me just assuming. Yeah, right. that we know how Bruce Wayne gets started. I mean, because again, like, it's because that it's a movie, right? I mean, it's this weird tradeoff where, like, you know the audience knows.

I mean, like, the audience knew the Spider-Man story from this movie, but again, like, this was the first. And that's what's so great about this movie is, is the pageantry of, like, now you get to see it. Right. Yeah, exactly. I mean, to your point about the emotional core, that's what is totally confusing about the Tom Holland's Peter Parker character. because like clearly especially in these Toby ones and I guess the Garfield ones enough but that is all

there's a lot of weight given to like him with his parents and the mystery of all that but in these Ramey movies his guilt over being responsible more or less for Uncle Ben's demise fuels that character especially like what happens immediately after the death right in this movie where he fucking literally kills a man

But, like, with Tom Holland, you don't know, like, did he just have cancer and died? Or did he, like, was there a similar Peter thing? And Peter, you know, caused him to be killed or whatever. The Tom Holland thing, that's one of the biggest issues with that character that he's playing to me is that the character in this movie is a person who wants to be Uncle Ben but has these super powers to do. Like, an ordinary good citizen, but has these powers to help more people. the person that fucking Tom Holland wants to be is Tony Stark a billionaire and like you don't get any of the heart about that's

also the you know the the decay of our United States society you know at this point kids want to be billionaires or Instagram influencers they don't want to be you know the they don't want to be good people I get I get the reflection which is fine I guess kids fucking do evil I don't mean you're going to do it anyway

you know it I get how it's it's reflective of the culture to a certain extent, but it's also a movie. I don't want to see a movie just be like, I want to be a billionaire too. It's fucking boring. 20 years apart, though, and that shows you where we're going. It's all going downhill from here. And this is a fucking, it is a heartbreaking

moment right here when he's just like, now Peter, I'm not trying to be your father. And he cuts him off and just says, then stop pretending to be. Fuck, dude. And this is credit to Cliff Robertson. man like you can see that little old man's heart shatter into a thousand pieces where i just wish i was shot dead right now what do you think he's doing in between this because he's staying in the city probably crying so weird too he's like i'll be back here to pick you up at 10 10 o'clock at night

oof again this is a seedy shit like oh you're gonna be in the library for seven hours see you later big pete also i mean it is kind you know people get shot everywhere in the city but i just love They sort of play this as like... 42nd and 5th Avenue. 40 second and 5th Avenue is some fucking war zone. You know, whatever. If people don't know it, it's just where all business guys commute. Like, there's nothing going on.

The train station is a block away from it. There's a whole deployment of fucking soldiers in that Brian Park fucking plane station. The right wing media talk about like, oh, someone got shot by a stray bullet in Times Square this past year or whatever. was like, okay. Yep. It happens. See what all the people that didn't get shot.

I agree. So he goes to do wrestling here. He goes to do it, man. Octavia Spencer, a little fun cameo from her, not a cameo. This is like, you know,

a great role for her at the time. Totally. You're in a big Spider-Man movie. And she's funny. She's like a check-in counter person with the wrestling match. Yeah, just like a good line.

Yeah, just like whatever. Besides in this twirpubble is like, you're going to die. And you get fucking the king himself, macho man, Randy Savage. Oh, God. Dude. You know, Bonesaw was ready? I didn't know that I was ready for Bonesaw.

And here it is. It's so great. He just like, he was one of the all-time greats, man. Total showman. And like, here he is playing Bonesaw. And it was obviously an affected voice, but no one has ever sounded like that. No one will ever sound like that again. I don't know what he does. I don't know how he did it. Nope. And there's tons of rasslers. It definitely shortened his life by talking like that, I'm sure. I'm sure there's some other things he did. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Totally. He had that heart attack behind the wheel and crash the car. That's a fucking

formal way to go. Too many slim jim heart disease. Tons of rasslers have come and gone doing like angry, grisly voices. Nothing has come close to macho man Randy Savage. It's just, yeah, he's so good in this movie. Sam, you're going to have to wait. I just got I got to snort these

very thin lines of cocaine. I call him Slim gyms. Snort into a slim gym. So we're making Spider-Man. Let's do it. Oh, yeah, we're snorting some meat. Ooh, this meat tube's going up my nose. Some ground beef up in my nose.

I just snap that slim, Jim. Oh, yeah, it's practically cat food. Yeah, snap into it. I'm going to vomit. Oh, yeah. Hope the FDA doesn't look too closely. Grade L. meat baby oh yeah this meat is cut with fentanyl just when you thought slim jims couldn't get any more

disgusting they were like how about if it was like a two-pack with a slim jim and then some kind of orange cheese stick my favorite uh macho man underneath seven you think of all time is him this little kids in a library trying to read and fucking uh macho man burst in he goes art now boy I will say aren't thou bored For the rest of my life Oh, that's awesome The answer is yes The cool thing is

On top of matriman Randy Savage Of course, it's a fucking Sam Ramey movie You got Bruce Campbell Himself as the ring announcer Yeah, this is the cameo That's fucking great man It's great

He's also good in part two too And he's right Snooty Usher It's I love this The leather jacket The sunglasses And he's doing this Michael Buffer impersonation

He really gets there The Flying Dutchman. And like who will, the ideas you have to last three minutes in the ring with this guy. And he comes out. Everyone's laughing at him. And the macho man's bonesaw McGraw has this cavalcade of dominatrixes with him. It's amazing. I can't like these women just yelling at him.

You got to pay $3,000. You don't make $3,000 for that. Absolutely. Dude, yeah. Oh, I want to walk around in public and have to. These women spit on me. It's a pretty fucking great deal. You get like six ladies yelling and berating at you and spitting on you.

I think you've got a big guy to beat you up. I'm like, yeah, I would pay money for this. Octavis Pitzer's like, now do you want the mean ladies to yell at you to get your confidence up as you go into the ring? That's an extra $20. We're going to take it from your end. Yeah. And any small penis humiliation, that's going to be an extra 50 bucks.

Yeah. If you want them to mash your nuts before you walk down to the ring, that's another 20. And I cannot stress enough. That is a backstage thing. We cannot do that on the way into the ring. That doesn't work. While they're yelling at him, like towards the end of it, this got a huge belly laugh for me this time. They're taking out another wrestler. Maybe it's the flying Dutchman. Oh my God. I can't feel my legs. I am laughing hysterically in my house last night. I want to see whatever Bonesaw did did that guy. I am paralyzed a man tonight.

And now, like, I, there's, I wish, and, like, he was obviously, like, way older. They're filming this movie around, like, 2000. Like, I wish we just had a little more of matriman get, do some, some wrestling. Like, you get a little bit of it. No flying elbow, you want that. I mean, that's the problem with the, I mean, like, the logic of C makes no sense because like, oh, well, I guess Spider-Sense has happened sometimes. Yeah, yeah, it doesn't happen while I'm just fighting this guy, I guess.

Yeah, right? Because he doesn't do the elbow drop, right? No, he does not. I don't know. Yeah, that kind of sucks. And, like, yeah, it turns into a cage match. Peter gets scared. I didn't ask for a cage match.

Unlock the thing. And then the groaner of a homophobic. Did your husband buy that for you and your dad's laughing at the audience? Oh, yeah. That's a cute outfit. Yeah. See, that's the thing is the hero of the movie is bonesaw. Absolutely.

And I agree with everything he has to say. Like, when after, you know, that is a terrible line from Spider-Man. Fuck you, Spider-Man. But, like, yeah. Hey, freak show. It's such a good thing to yell at Spider-Man. Hey, freak show, no need to punch down. So what if I'm gay freak show?

Me and my husband have a loving relationship. Yeah, it's beautiful. At least I get laid. Just yelling at the 17-year-old kid. At the end of the day, Spider-Man, one of us is getting our dick sucks. the craziest thing and I feel again this is like Peter Parker

still does not know like the limits of his own strength and whatever he's kicking Bonesaw across the ring and he falls into the cage like that dude's intestines Yes exactly

Like Bonesaw is deady Yes Absolutely Bonesaw is ready for the grave He wins and obviously it's a Spider-Man thing He goes up to the wrestling promoter He wants us to be grand

He gets a hundred bucks he gives him some bullshit like well it's supposed to be for three minutes and I was like get the fuck out of here kid yeah you pinned him in two so you're getting 100 and you're lucky I'm giving you that yeah so and then

he's got all this cash in front of him and this guy robs him I love the other guy because this like CD office for like the fight promoter it's the guy that Peter's having an argument with but then there's other guy definitely has that green

like I'm handling money Pfizer and he like barely turns around like I'm counting other money behind you. Look, a kid, I can't pay you. I got to go do an opening spot for Jim Brewer. So just, you know, get out of here.

You're paying to me too. Come on. And, you know, he winds up grabbing all this cash and the guy steals it and like, the idea that, I think I've said this on every episode, the idea that Peter Parker, any human being is supposed to stop a dude with a gun for somebody else's money.

Like, no way. Nope, of course not. No, not at all. Absolutely not. And that's what's, you know, great because he throws the line back in the guy's face because the guy says you know that's not my problem and so then he's like well my god you could have

stopped him he took all my money and then you have Toby being like I fail to see how that's my problem well yeah he's going to get it in a minute but I mean honestly if I was in his shoes I did the same thing I'd be like oh no actually you know what dude close the closed door button just hit that that'll

help that's a lot of times Spider-Man should have done in this scenario would it be to knock out the thief take the money and run And suddenly, you know, your uncle's alive and you're a lot richer. You're a criminal now, but that's fine. Yeah, you didn't give your real name. You're criminal anyway. Yeah, exactly.

Quick question. Everything you do is criminal. Do you think Randy Savage ever hung out with a pussy posse? Like, maybe he's like trying to like, well, you got a magician. Maybe you need a wrestler. Me and Leo doing drinks with the ladies. Here it is, dude. I think it was a real fucking wake up call for the pussy posse because I think they were like,

oh, hey, macho man. You know, Randy, you want to come like hang out. with this. We have a magician. We have a bunch of actors. Now we need a cool wrestler. It would be great for you. And it was just like, uh, I don't think so, little kids. What do you think this is? In my free time, I wrestle gators in my Florida backyard. I like meat. We have nothing in common. These actresses need some meat on their bones. Oh, yeah. All right. I guess we should just maybe for a rest of them. Maybe we'll just ask John Sina.

Maybe, what is he, like 13 now? Yeah, much younger John Sine. I haven't done Coke since 1986 and I'd like to keep it that way. Oh, yeah. It's still all in the bloodstream. These kids got problems. Hey, Toby, you should probably go to sleep. Leo, call your mother.

Here's some notes on your movie, Don's Plum. Oh, yeah, that Jenny Lewis, she's going places. Oh, wait. The guy from Madman is in the Pussy Pussy. Nice to meet you. If only, man. That's, there's your Marvel. What if?

Oh, yeah. Oh, Rachoman Randy Savage joined the Pussy Pussy. The Pussy should be entered into, you know. Marvel in general. We start the movies and it's just Toby McGuire and then it's like Leo at the end of the movie is like we'd like to invite you to do

something. You want to come smoke at this diner? We'll tell you all about it. Now you know if they're younger listeners, you know, that are going to do evil later are checking us out for the first time. The Pussy Posse was this famous gang and entourage. I guess a gang maybe is more accurate.

Yeah. That were famous actors. Or would be famous actors. It was Leo, Toby. Kevin Connolly, David Blaine, Lucas Haas, and some others in various configurations. And they did a terrible movie called Don's Plum, which we did a satirer of sleaze on on our Patreon. Easily the sleaziest of the bunch. Oh, yeah. Totally.

Oh, yeah. But, yeah, Uncle Ben has gunned down a little after his prime here, but he is gun down for sure. By the way, that reminds me, though, I'm pretty sure Cliff Robertson says in this movie that Uncle Ben is 65 years old. Okay.

whatever you say. Did he like smoke in his sleep too? Sleep in cigarette. Oh, Ben, you really need to cut out to sleep in the cigarettes. Man, yeah, no smoking in bed kids. Definitely not. That's a recipe for disaster. He's shot.

I forget what he, like he has a touching last moment. No, he did. I mean, there's no line, but it just says, Peter. Yeah. Like, it's one of those like, oh my. You know, like Kirk dying, you know. He really gets. it then Peter puts his mask back on

chases this dude fun spider manning around here you know spinning some webs I bet he had some you know I know he lost his job but I bet they had some life insurance on this guy I bet everything's fucking great oh yeah Aunt May's sitting pretty dude oh yeah not this useless mouth she was feeding gone

now she got some side piece from Flash Thompson oh fuck yeah oh but except oh no there was a stipulation in the life insurance policy you get everything Aunt May unless he is shot to death outside of a library Oh, what an obnoxious clause

You gotta read it all before you saw him Peter, Peter, I just heard You have to move the body Up the street to the gap If he is shot in front of the gap We get paid double You know, just for good measure Take him to Grand Central

Just for good measure Oh God And May I threw him on the tracks Oh, excellent. Now we're getting that city money as well. Oh, you know what? I'm just going to fill this house with computers. I'm going to shove it in his stupid old face.

And I'm going to sue the city, the Metro North, and, uh, yeah, we're in the money. We're in the money. You lying about going to that wrestling event was the best thing you ever did for this family. My husband's dead and I'm really. Now, you idiots. I'm going to have a new suitor come over and we're going to, guess what? We're going to marry him and then we're going to off him too. Oh, hello.

I'm going on a date with who's this, Mr. Tony Star. You're the Spider-Man and I'm the Black Widow. Yes, Aunt May is the Black Widow. So, you know, he chased this dude to an abandoned warehouse like you do. Sure. At first he doesn't know because they say he's a carjacker. He realizes, oh, my God, that's the guy. from the wrestling events.

And here's like points off for making this movie for the lowest common denominator. Because like it's this fucking guy with hilarious like out of the bottle Clorox bleach hair. Very noticeable. Very memorable this man. Yeah.

And when Peter sees him in the warehouse, we have to cut back to slow motion this guy running by him back at the wrestling room. thanks him. Like that's kind of like that's what the salt in the woods. Thanks. But it's just like this I fucking got it man. I understand it's the same guy. This actor by the way, he's been around a lot, even lately just small parts. He was a cop in unhinged the 2020. Oh. Was he the guy that gets run over like the oh like appears and dies immediately? That could I don't know. I mean, he's got some. Is the name Michael Popajon, I think? Yeah, that's right. He was playing a cop in one

episode of True Detective? No, sadly, I'm not the owner of Papa Johns. It's not me. It's another guy. That would have been nice, but catch me at the Laugh Factory. The last name I fool you, but yes. I like the, because it

subverts the need for a lot of, like, probably not greatly delivered melodramatic lines from Toby McGuire, because he's not great. I love what, he just comes home, after the death

Aunt May and him embrace Aunt May is clearly devastating and Ramey does a great job of just like you shot in such a way that everything's telegraphed you don't need a single line of dialogue for this. Oh my God I heard an elderly man

was shot outside of my batch I gotta go visit the widow I'm paying for the funeral my condolages apologies Jesus, I always talk like this, but I am sorry for your loss. It's a medical condition. Aren't thou bored?

He's talking to the body or something. By the way, one last Papa John report, because we talked about it earlier, he's an Angley's Hulk as technician. Oh, me. So just small-ass rolls. I'm telling you guys, go back and give it a shot with open eyes. It's a lot of fun. It's quite worth.

I have the 4K. It's beautiful. Oh, nice. It's, yeah, it's a lot of fun. Peter graduates and,

you know, Harry graduates. Everyone graduates. That's how that works. We get a secret, not really ever discussed again Goblin attack. Oh,

where he murders one of America's military here in like this test thing. This would immediately get you on the international watchness. Absolutely. Yeah, definitely. I mean, I guess it wouldn't be on the news because it was like a secret thing. It's a secret thing, but, like, you would be hunted by the CIA.

It's, it's the competing company that's now going to take over Oz Corp's contract, government contracts, and they're in, like, the test bunker and Green Goblin flies by, bombs it, awesome transition of the fiery flames to the graduation hats being tossed into this guy. And if you want to talk about brilliant, I mean, like, this tells you something like, like, the idea of, like, now the Green Goblin, Norman Osborne is the Green Goblin now. he has turned into that right when Peter Parker is graduating. I mean, it's just such a perfect little moment

to have. They do. And the original script had Doc Gock as a secondary. I mean, there's a trillion scripts for this. Obviously, it's like in development forever. But really, like, right before they went into development, it was Norman Osborne and Doc Gok. And the smart move, Ramey, it was like

it should just be one villain and we can play up the surrogate father stuff. I wish he'd listen to himself for the third movie. Yes. Because, yeah, oh, because that, yeah, was Venom, Sandman, and still Harry Osborne, gobbling around, and Rhino. No, that's Garfield. Oh, that's Garfield. Yeah, but Sandman, what are we doing here?

What do we do it? But it's so smart here. It's just like, they do, they're, they parallel path it, and they both have enough screen time and you feel enough for both characters. You really understand the both. I mean, like, I also think that for, again, that first, uh, uh, no homecoming. The vault, the vulture makes a lot of sense in Keaton's fantastic. And that's yes. Yeah.

He's probably the best, like a top two MCU villain. Yeah. It's awesome. Those movies always have a villain problem because they don't go big with the casting. And that's what this does. It's like fucking defoe. Get defoe in there. Let him defoe.

When you say like MCU current like villains, Keaton and a killmonger. you know. Yeah, and Hiddleston, too. Yeah. I think Hiddleston is good. Yeah, Kilmonger, very good. Michael B. Jordan. I mean, a lot of a, I mean, even movies, I like the Guardians movies, never have a good villain. You don't get enough of him. A Russell's good, but yeah. You don't get enough of him, but I liked Corey Staller in Ant Man. I thought he was good, yellow jacket. That's a total waste of Corey Stahl in that movie, though, because he's tremendous. And that, that movie, I like that movie, but the villain is an afterthought in favor of how cool is all.

all the Ant-Man stuff, which is, I guess, okay, but, like, feels like a total, total because, I mean, like, the MCU had a smart idea, which is, I mean, also Bridges as, oh, but I stay in the counts. Oh, yes, yes, very much. Yeah, he's great in that. But, like, they always, like, because the Batman movies, and really, like, it's all about the villains. So it's like, oh, let's, let's dial that back and make it more about the hero, which

this movie does really well as well. I, like, they equalize it. And then the other ones, they make it way too much about only the hero and the good guys, the villain is kind of an after. More often than not an afterthought. That's an interesting thing to say about that second rainy one though, because Doc Ack is again like a surrogate father situation and it's like, okay, I saw you do that already. I mean, you know, he's still awesome in that movie, Molina. It's still great. And you know, whatever. We'll see about this new one. Sure. He's wearing a bad wig,

but I think it's cool that he's playing the character again. I don't know. Right. Yeah. I'm excited for maybe DeFoe is back, right? It seems like you might be. Maybe. They're keeping, I just watch like, because again, we got all these trailers. We have to have a thousand fucking trailers. There's like a new one out just this week. And they're still keeping them out of it, which is, I think, smart.

So you don't really know which way the wind's blowing. But hopefully it's not Dane to Hahn. Don't. Please don't say that. But so like he graduates. And like, yeah, Harry's like, hey, Pete, you hit the lottery. I'm your rich friend. I'm going to take care of it.

He's like, you don't say. Oh, look at all this falling into my lap accidentally. Wow, my plan is coming to fruition. I mean, thanks so much for your generous support. Oh, and my uncle died. Did you hear my uncle died? I have this huge empty sack with a dollar sign on it. I'm just to pour a little orphan.

All right, Peter. I'm going to buy you new uncle. We get... New uncle. And here he is. Hi, Pete. Ooh, your head can fuck. Let's talk about puberty.

After you put me in the wheelchair, I need a new work, and I'm going to be your uncle. Let's paint the kitchen, Michael Angelo. Norman Osborne's paying me a ton of money to be here. Computer analyst. I heard a special little boy lost his uncle recently. I'm your surrogate Uncle Bonesaw. Man, Uncle Bonesaw. That's a cartoon I could have watched.

Oh, you came home too late last night, so I got to smack you around. Any teeth loose? Put them under the pillow. I'll give you a dollar. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Put it in Randolph Bonesaw $2,000 a week. Randolph Bonesaw. Terrific.

Yeah, it was like Bones Saskinowski or something. It was a hatchet job at Ellis Island. Failed your size. science exam. Time for a choke slam. Love it. Yeah, so we get a nice montage of him spider manning around, saving people, getting some, like, reactions from New Yorkers. These movies love talking to New Yorkers. We get Jim Norton as like an angry truck driver. I don't like him. Yeah. And Lucy Lawless is a quick little, she's the one's like, ooh, we go out with eight Haynes sounds pretty hot. That's Lucy Lawless? Best buds with Sam Ramey.

I had no idea either. That's awesome, right? Because they were involved in the Zina series. Yes, he did that. Oh, I forgot that, Ramey was involved with that. And the Ted is like all over that show. That's right. We should, yeah, Ted Ramey will see soon enough in this movie as like a number two to Jay Jonah James.

And they take this montage right up to, this is how we meet J.K. Simmons as J. Jonah Jameson. Fucking fire sale, dude, this guy rules. Absolutely. Born to play this part. And like, he burned the roll down, really, because, like, Like, they couldn't recast it in the amazing movies. They never thought to do it because, like, what are we going to do? And then, like, they're like, I guess maybe we'll have to bend reality to get fucking J.K. Simmons back in the role for MCU, because that's the only thing that makes sense.

Because at the end of that second Holland one, you see him, but he's like fucking Q ball. I mean, just looks more like J.K. Simmons, but. I totally forgot that. It's at the very, because the end of that second Holland movie, J. Jonah Jameson out, out Peter Parker has been. right? Yes. Yeah. That's like because like it's like that two seconds of like my life's great and I'm fucking Zendaya and it's awesome. And then it's like

Peter Parker is Spider-Man and like all of Times Square finds out. It's amazing that I watched that movie like two months ago for the first time. Yeah. I don't remember. One of the worst. It is a thousand percent one of the worst of the MCU I think. Yeah. So I'm holding out hope for this next one

because again I did like homecoming. But Simmons is fantastic and like they do. I mean to talk about the trailer of the new one, there's this, like, silly joke which really bugged me when, like, uh, Alfa Milina goes to Tom Holland. They're like, oh, what's your name? He's like, I'm Dr. Otto

Octavius. And they sort of like snicker, like, but what's your real name? That's the MCU comedy tone that I do not care for. Exactly. Because in this world with, because that's, in this world, hey, just go with it. Exactly. It's a comic book, dude. It's a fucking comic book. It's a cartoon.

And that's what Ramey gets. And that's what J.K. Simmons gets. like he's a big old cigar chomping joke and it fucking works. You know what I mean? Like it only works because he's committed to it. Exactly. And you can't be committed if someone's going like, your name's Dr. Otto Octavius.

What are you, I prefer these Spider-Man's that look like, you know, Apple products essentially. That's the thing. It's all so mannered. It's all so tight and neat. Ah, fuck I hate him. But he's just swinging for the fences here.

I love him berating A. The Great Bill Nunn. Rest in peace. And Ted Ramey, Ted Ramey keeps coming in about some advertising issue and like, and Elizabeth Bangs. Dude, I love her whole thing in this movie is to call in because like his wife is calling about like home remodeling issues. It's all so fucking funny. And watching Simmons like yelling at three different people about three different things at the same time. Like you want to talk about juggling. Dude, he's juggling this scene.

It's so rad-a-tat-tat. You know, let's do like a his girl Friday. the cadence going back and forth I fucking love him in this movie You buy him as an old timey newspaper Yeah there is actually like a vaudeville type Look to these scenes Like when Ted Ramsey coming in and coming out

Yes It's all pretty it's amazing And we're also I mean a little bit of a nod At least to the 79 Superman movie 78 Superman movie like you know That whole like newspaper world I mean obviously It owes a little to it

But it is so its own thing And it's kind of cool too because Simmons, the way that they gussy him up here, I mean, you look at J. Jonah Jameson in the comics, and that is a cartoon character. And they make him look like that. It's not a more grounded interpretation of what that would look like.

He looks like a cartoon character with the fucking hair, and they even make the... This is how you make jokes about these characters where he has some line about his barber. The only man I trust is my barber. Yes, and it's like, that's great because it's a shitty haircut, but he loves it. and that's what the joke is, you know?

And again, like, you have this world where this character can exist and should exist. You know what I mean? Like, as opposed to trying to make it so hyper-realistic and gray and nothing. Nobody would hire an editor that looks like that. No, no, no. It's unbelievable, this Spider-Man movie.

I usually do appreciate stuff to be a little grounded, but when you're dealing with this material, you've got to, like, let go a little bit. Exactly. And have fucking fun with it, and that's what they're doing. should be fun, period. So Peter realizes he can get money by taking photos for Spider-Man.

You know, he comes back to Jonah's office and he's got these incredible photographs and he looks and he's like, crap, crap, crap, crap. It's just such a fucking funny. What I love here too, it's a great moment of like, yeah, he does the crap, crap, crap, and he'll be $100 for him. And then Peter's like, all right, well, I'll take my photos somewhere else and he goes to leave.

Bill Nunn has a great, like, he grabs him kind of like a, just stay here. This is all part of the things. Sit back down. And, yeah, he winds up giving him 300 bucks instead. He's like, yeah, you're not going to be in staff. He'll be freelance. And, you know, he's, they all these, like, spider menace, blah, blah, blah.

And it's a great, like, and that is something that I love about this movie is like the, you know, the yellow journalism of it all. Like, you know, it plays pretty well. And also, like, you know, for New York. Like, this is kind of like a New York Post type of thing. Absolutely. Yep, totally. By the way, you know who demand, like when it was going to be a canon movie. And all throughout, the idea always was, you know, who would be great for Jay Jonah Jameson?

Stanley. Oh. And like he was even like, and it was always something he was always talking about. I was like, whenever the Spider-Man movie comes out, I'm going to be Jay Jonah Jameson. Fucking Simmons comes out. He's like, well, he was fantastic. Wasn't he folks? I shaved that little girl under the balcony.

Do you see that? It's coming up in a scene in a minute. yeah kind of push a little girl I push her down and I run away Goblin take her not me Go goblin I know what to die I have so much left to give goblin I live through Vietnam

Meanwhile while all this is going on Norman is forced out of his own company influenced by these stakeholders and like the US military or whatever The idea is they're making so much money now. They can sell the company without it. I'm sorry. Oh, yeah. They just, they don't yeah. Well, part of it was

to make the sale go through they said that Norman has to be out. Oh, that's right. So it's like, we really want this money, man. We're going to do what these folks say and sell it off and you're out, whatever. And I love the fucking, one of these old bastards is just like, you're

out, Norman, and gleefully and evilly sips this cup of coffee without breaking eye contact with Defoe. It's very funny. And it's in DeFoe loses the shit. He's like, I build this fucking company. And it's, the idea of the goblin is he doesn't know that he's the green goblin. Norman doesn't know that he's, he just kind of goes back and forth and the schizo stuff.

And again, that's DeFoe all over. Like, duality is just something he can do. Like, no, you can't, you can't do this to me. Do you know how much I sacrificed? The sacrifice line is so good. It's so awesome. And then the guy is like, oh, well, it's too late, Norman. It's already going through.

We're announcing the sale after the. you all know it kids world unity festival featuring macy grazee yes how about how about everybody we take a lunch break and do a real quick back to the drawing board on the world unity festival oscorp world well it didn't work because of the green goblin yeah that's what would have failed through by the way i think right before we get to the unity festival there is a scene of peter parker running into mj on the street Oh, right. She fakes like, oh, I'm going to auditions or whatever. Working at the world famous, now out of business, Moondance Diner. Right. And this is a great fucking line of dialogue up there with, you know, how much I sacrificed.

Hello, Miss Watson. I'm talking to you. Oh, yeah. It is great. I get you Enrique. I love you. I get you. All right. Like, yeah, it's just like a real fucking. Yeah. And it's just an embarrassing, like, her drawer was short by six bucks and this dude's taking it out of her ass. And it's like, dude, I don't know, like, and she's like pretending. she's like, oh, I have all these auditions, Peter, I'm going to be on Broadway. It's like, I don't know, dude, you're 19. Of course you'd be working

at a diner. Like, yeah, that's what you do. I'm working at this diner and auditioning and that's reality. Oh, Peter, I'm so embarrassed. I don't know three homes and five cars already. And I'm only 23. I can't see. Don't look at me.

I keep losing all my auditions to this Rooney Mara person. I keep waking up really late because I would work in my ass off. And she goes to the interviews fresh as a fucking daisy. Bullseying it, my friend. That's the thing. It's like, if you want a career in the arts, well, I hope you're born rich with a silver spoon up your ass and mouth and wherever you hold. That's been the nepotism report from Eric's sister. Dude, it's everywhere. It's everywhere. I'm going to get a special theme for you on that one. So this Unity Festival,

here's a weird thing about it that I was paying attention to closely this time is part of it is Times Square, but it's fake geography, because it's like, it's supposed to be in the heart of Times Square, but then, like, if you turn like 90 degrees, there's this incredibly fake building right there that doesn't exist. And that's like the, I guess it's the base of the Oscore building. I guess so. Because they're all out on this balcony. It's like the Oscar board members.

And then, like, MJ and Harry are there. And he's like, where's my dad? And like, this guy's not telling him that they fired his father, which is kind of great. And we get some good Harry Osborne being a fucking scuzz ass here. He's like, I told you to wear the black dress. My dad likes black. You got to look hot for my dad. Look, I should be erect and he should be erect.

That's how it goes here with the Osbournes. Maybe he's got a point because I think the black dress would have been nice versus this. She's a hostess at a restaurant in 1998. Yeah, totally. She looks like the woman that George Costanza breaks up with. And she's like, tell me, I want to know the truth. And he's like, you're pretentious. You wear the chopsticks in your hair.

Like, it's that exact costume. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Which is weird. And Peter's taken photos at the Unity Festival. And he, like, he already knows that he finds out in the moon dance scene that, like, that Harry is dating her. He's been keeping that. And he's like, oh, man. And like, but that can't stop me from taking some pictures.

Oh, yeah. He's like, oh, I'm just here for Jay, Jonah Jameson, but also some pictures. Dude. And then, like, I'm all the way down here. She's all the way up there. Hello. Upskir. You'll never see me do this. People just think I'm taking

a picture of this singular sign in Times Square. What the hell, Parker? Got no pictures of Macy Gray, only this white lady. What the hell, Parker? You really like her thighs, I guess. Jesus Christ. Told him to get there for Macy Gray. And Harry spies him from there.

He's like, hey, you, stop that. Stop that. Stop Peter. Stop doing that. Here's a question, though, because Harry does try to kiss her right here. Is that before after he notices Peter because if it's after man that's a no it's before because he actually does feel bad because again they have a good relationship listen why fucking

date the girl that your friend your best friend and roommate has been pining for since childhood you are a child billionaire like go find another lady you can find a girl that looks just like that 10 seconds I might ruin a friendship for Kristen Dunst yeah that's a good point I might just do it well then here's the thing fucking do it then yeah don't fucking keep them around

and do puppy dog. Absolutely. With the move is you just go in. Hey Pete, how's it going, dude? You enjoy it this free rent? Oh, yeah, enjoy it the free rent. Enjoying the fact that you're probably going to get a job with my dad one day. Yep, definitely enjoying that.

So here's the deal, pal. You don't have to pay rent and I'm going to fuck your high school crush. Sorry, buddy. Them is the breaks. I think it's a perfectly fair trade on. I think so too, dude. Absolutely. Save it like $1,200 a month.

But then it needs to be addressed. Exactly. You got to get it out on paper and then like that she finds. is that literally, you have a contract? I was just a stupid contract. Now, now, Peter, I am going to tell you what it's like the fucker, but only once.

So you don't, you just get ready for that, okay? Oh, I can't wait for that day. Oh, it's going to be so great. Don't worry. You're going to tell me right here in my rent-free apartment. Oh, boy.

Oh, yeah, Christmas is coming soon there, buddy. I totally kind of forget the sequels to this movie. Does Peter ever get to bust inside of her? What's going on? They get together. They get together. So he's busting inside. I think there's implied sex.

They're in a web and they're like kind of rolling around. Oh, they're putting some webs in there, got it. Like they get together at the end of the second movie. What's all this is her running with the wedding dresses in that movie, right? I forget. That's a third one. Oh, right. Yeah, the planet's coming in and Peter Kidd stop the planet, I think.

That's when you get fucking Dr. Strange involved, by the way. There's a planet coming and is going to bump into our land. Collia, Peter, better move it. All right, Peter, quick, let's get to this golf course. Keep moving past the stables. I don't know what Keeper Sutherland is doing. Forget him. I can't say that she's responsible for the pandemic, but the Saturday before everything

shut down, we recorded here, I visited my wife, and a buddy, we watched Invisible Man, went out for drinks, and on the walk back, me and my wife spotted, walking the other away, Charlotte Gainsburg. And I'm like, she was the last horseman of the apocalypse for the pandemic for me. And it kind of fits with the melancholia. It's just sort of like, I just said it was like, oh,

Charlotte Gainsburg. Oh, wait, the world is ending. Yeah. I don't know. The evidence is mounting. So in comes the goblin attack and he bombs this fucking building. He turns some people into skeletons. Dude, the whole board of Ozcourt gets turned into skeletons. And like,

while this skeleton effect does not hold up in any way, man is it's still great. I kind of like it. We are the skeleton. Oh, we're dead. The one thing that was... You never expected to be hit by my skeleton, Ray. I didn't notice this. Does the guy in the wheelchair, do you see the wheelchair just still sitting there? It turns into bone.

No, I don't know. Cool to have a bone skeleton actually. I think they're all standing up. Well, there's no one guy is in a wheelchair. One of the Oscoors guys. When they turn into skeletons, I think they're all like... They all stand up. The skeleton stands up? Yeah, yeah, I think so.

Interesting. and this is like your first big like Spider-Man Goblin fight and you know the balcony is falling he wants to save it save Mary Jane yeah one moment I like is there's a child that's about to be hit by the stage and even Spider-Man's like come on kid could you fucking move

do anything because you save yourself at all nope this kid has accepted his imminent demise dude he's just staring at this like sign or something's gonna fall on him just take me now God well mom and dad told me they're divorce in this morning. Might as well go out this way. I got the math test tomorrow.

Didn't study for that. Let it happen, Spider-Man. Well, you know, statistically, that kid won't amount to anything. No, for sure. Statistically, I could probably get shot at school, dude. Yeah, probably, yeah. I love how the way that Spider-Man sort of fends off the goblin at the end of this fight is by fisting the underside and just ripping a bunch of shit out, making it go haywire.

And again, in an incredibly corny line of dialogue. again, it's DeFoe and it's this movie. It's like, well, meet again, Spider-Man. Totally. After he's also been webbed right in the face, which is awesome. It's like, and again, I do that cornyness works. I do. I agree. I think the cornyness is what it needs. Absolutely. Making it serious is what's the problem. Like, Batman Returns, I guess you could from the outside say it's a serious movie,

but like, there's a lot corny things about that movie. There's some goofy shit in that movie. That's what makes it work. Yeah. Because I'd rather have, like, corny stuff than like, so that happened, humor, you know. Yep, exactly. The eye rollers. So he saves MJ. He swings up to this, like, beautiful rooftop where, like, I think there's this couple

that gets interrupted when they land on the roof. And I think, like, this guy's trying to angle for, like, a hey, Jay. Or, like, maybe, like, a rooftop beech or something. Oh, fuck, that's awesome. Because they sort of separate, because they're clearly making out. And they're both like, wow, what? Oh, Spider-Man. Well, because they're, like, they're getting down to some Macy Gray.

I got a free Macy Gray concert, too. Oh, I got a blowjohn. I try to glide over time square I'm exploded A nut in her mouth That's more Macy Gray That's the cadence That's the cadence for sure And this is she's like

You know who are you and he's like You know who I am I'm your friendly neighbor at Spider-Man And he flies away She's so fucking horny for Spider-Man now though Oh yeah I will say I like the costume a lot It works. Yeah, I dig it.

His Spider-Wan costume looks. We haven't talked about it. Oh, yeah. No, the Spider-Rank costume looks totally awesome. Like the white webs are a little flashy, but I like it. You know what I mean? They could have gone like black, obviously. Like we always do or something stupid. The shots where they first show it off, like the full costume after the city talks them up or whatever. That's the shots we get the 9-11. World Trade Center reflected in his eyes. Right, right, right.

Which honestly, I thought they would have C-G-Ied out. I think it's better not to. I'm fine with it. Yes. Yeah, but you're right. We were doing that a lot back. Well, that was the thing was movies that were coming out, like, in the subsequent years from that, most of them pretended like it didn't happen. Exactly. And you either didn't show Lower Manhattan or if you did, they were left in like this.

It wasn't until Spike Lee was like, no, I'm going to make a movie and part of it is at ground zero. Yeah. Spike was the first one that, like, acknowledged that it happened. Most people don't know this, but Man on Wire was actually finished in 1999 and they've had to put it back. for all these years just because people got sensitive. I'm just saying look into that guy. He had blueprints. He knew stuff. He was going around those towers a little too much in my life. Case in the joint.

Philip Petit did it. Oh, yeah, you're a fucking mime or whatever. You go to fucking jail. Yeah. Alexander Jones just screaming about Philip Petit. You call him Alexander? I know. I like that. That's what the fucking court's going to call. He's sentenced to life in prison.

Oh, yeah, that'd be cool. Oh, Defoe in the mirror is kind of around here And this is, you know, him talking to himself The split personality shit right here It's just all so great He's like, who do you think

We did this together? And apparently the really weird IMDB trivia thing was apparently Defoe's got famously like Kind of not amazing teeth Like you know, but it like very defoe teeth Apparently for Norman Osborne The studio is like

Well, it wouldn't make sense for him to have like You have to cap them So he's a billionaire You can have your trash teeth if you're playing a Richmond. They're not even bad, but you know, but for this scene, when he's Norman Osborne, he's got the cap teeth, but when he's the green goblin, he doesn't. So they're doing a lot of weird stuff with his hair too.

Like he's like, eh, you know what I mean? He's doing it. And there's a great, there's a great moment where, because they are more or less doing like a cut between, but there's one where the shot is, the camera is still behind Defoe. But you're seeing the face of like the goblin in the mirror and it ends on like a big smile and Defoe turns around back toward the camera and as you start to see his face you see the smile go away

so it's like you're it goes from looking at quote unquote two people to acknowledging that it's the same person making the facial expressions in the mirror. It's great and Defoe is a fucking amazing in this movie just he really is and it's kind of what's kind of great is like once this unity thing happens the the green goblin attacks just amp up because right after this immediately is J. Jonah Jameson being like

and another thing about Spider-Man and the fucking wall explodes to his office. There's the goblin again. I love the line he has like he names him the green goblin. It's like every all these posals need a name with the green goblin. He goes to Ted Ravis like whenever somebody says a green goblin, I want a quarter.

How about the green meaning? Oh right, because he says the Ted Ravit called the patent office. I love he throws a cigar out the window and then flies back. That's so cool. I really don't want to just keep on fucking hammering on why the MCU fucking sucks and just rules. But like honestly, the fact like all the action scenes in MTV is just like a bunch of guys of guns. We're going to make it. We're going to team seven. Let's go. And then it's just

a fucking bomb goes up in fucking Aunt May's house. Yes. And fucking Jay Jonas's office. It's a big fucking act. It gets your attention. It does. And what's a big act we come to find is Jay Jono Jameson has a little bit of a heart of gold. He will, like, hide the, you know, the photographer's name from the Green Goblin. He's protecting Peter in this scene, which is, it's pretty rad. He believes in protecting sources. You could also argue that he's protecting the flow of Spider-Man photos that are making him money. I'd rather die than have circulation go down.

It does make him a three-dimensional character, even though he's so cartoonish. You know what I mean? To be able to. Yeah, it's still, yeah, you are surprised. Yeah, I mean, this green demon has him by his throat. I'd give, I'd give up any one of them. Oh, absolutely. I'd give you guys up.

Alimony anymore. Be like, kill Steve. It's not me, you want. It's him. But, yeah, so Spider-Man shows up right here, of course. And is this the slave? Yeah, gas is like so fucking 1960s Batman. And he wakes up.

And this is. And it's not a huge problem with the movie because there needs to be something to do. But he's like, we can rule the world together. You and I, Spider-Man, me with all my goblin shit, you, I don't know, walking on walls. What I love about this scene, though, is the nonchalance of like him walking over there in that. And this is where the suit works in a way because it's like so huge and opposing. You don't expect him to like walk to Spider-Man and just like hit him on the shoulder and lean on the building and be like, so here's the thing. Yeah, yeah. No, it worked for me here, but what's weird is, like, because Spider-Man tells him to go fuck himself, like, I'm not going to join you, whatever. And then, like, the goblin is going to just, like, fly away. And they have him, like, jump onto the glider and go. And it's a real, like, person jumping and turning into a cartoon. Like, that transition doesn't super hold up anymore. But I do like the cockiness here, even that, like, not killing him and stuff like that. I mean, I would feel this way because I, I would feel this way because I,

I just, what, two of the biggest terrorist fucking attacks of the last decade are now under my belt in one week. I would be like, yeah, fucking Peter Parker going to do me. And the Green Goblin has, you know, a good point here. Like, eventually people will hate you, despite all you do for them, which I feel every day reading the comments about these episodes. But all I do for you. Really? You're going to write that? This is a comment book episode.

You're going to hear a lot of those. The next is the Thanksgiving sequence This is kind of this movie And what we're actually going to do Oh you're missing over You're passing up the best part of the movie Oh am I For me in 2002

Dude the fucking upside down kissing in the rain Yes The hooters scene Dude these things It's outrageous With the 4K transfers I'm like holy shit And you know what

You'll never see that In MCU movie Because they're sexless Yeah And it's also like you know the 2000s were very like, let's see some hooters. That's true. Yeah. Yeah. It's a little bit about

I mean, look, sometimes you want to see hooters, sometimes you want to see dicks and buns and balls. Wouldn't it be great if they full fucking dong in some superhero movies? Totally. There's Andrew Garfield's fucking strong just wagging around. Like, oh my God, look at this thing. You can't do that with Shazam, though, dude, that's a little kid.

Wait, I got a man dick. Holy shit. Look at my hammer. They have to have done that in that movie, right? I didn't see it. I slept through most of that movie. we saw it together and I completely forget it Yeah Yeah

And we were in a stage Fuchs at home Is there a hog Comment in Shazam Either way You had your chance Here and now Who has the best dick

In Hollywood Willem Defoe It's humongest That's true Gabbling dick It's true by the way There are pictures Oh really

Yeah No Godzilla's tail I believe even like Madonna was like Dude that guy's got a huge Really I want to see like him

And Liam Yeah It's gonna be like a Light saber Sith versus Jedi. Dual of the dix. Yeah. Quigon, Jen.

Man, William Defoe should be in a Star Wars thing already. Oh, shit, dude. That's something. He would be too good as a Sith. Like, he would be too good. Like, it'd be unbelievable. Maybe he could finally play Darth Plagis. That would be nice. Sure.

Why not? I love, but, but to your, so, like, you know, it's, it's Mary Jane in the rain. I forget, like, I think she's talking to Peter. And this is when he's like, oh, I just went, I took two buses and five things to see you. Yeah. And he's really, I mean, like, at the same time, like, Peter, now this, she's established your buddy's girlfriend. You never made a move. You kind of need to step back as the friend, I think. Or step forward in a big way. That's what happens here, though, dude, because what she's coming from an audition. He's like, she beefs him. I was in the neighborhood and I wanted to see how your audition went or whatever. And then, like, it becomes this thing where the flirting is on and she knows what's going on. And she's like, are you sure you don't want to come to dinner with us? She might be doing an E2 Mama Spider-Man situation. Oh, totally, man. Let's start doing that.

The more webs the merrier. I think they have good chemistry, too, to be honest. They absolutely do. And I think, you know, so she's about to get sexually assaulted. He beats them up as Spider-Man. And I mean, like, another thing these, I love, it's an iconic shot. Like, literally, it's a- The rain on the looters.

The upside-down kiss. It's a thing that's been done to death in parody form, which sucks. But that's how you know it's an iconic shot. Because it, like, what are you going to parody from MCU aside from the costumes? You know what I mean? Like, again, not to be the MCU guy. I do like a lot of those movies. But, like, there's no like, holy shit that shot really captured the nation's America.

There's some Twitter accounts that it'll tell you. Like, the sea of CGI is like, that's the most beautiful thing in cinema, man. But like, this is like, holy shit. It's an upside. And like, you know, it takes its time. It's got an, it's an iconography. It's romantic. It's romantic, Chris.

You're right. It's crazy. And I know this is just like superhero things or whatever, but like you literally, seconds before you were mugged were talking to Peter Parker. Yes. And then seconds after you were mugged, you're talking to Spider-Man and you're not recalling the same voice in under five minutes. But you know, they weirdly try to lay the groundwork for that when she's walking away from the diner and he's like, MJ, MJ. And she's like, fuck off, you lose her. Fuck off. Oh, that's right. And she's like, I'm like, you didn't have to tell me that. I would have bought that she can't hear.

And to be quite honest, there are like five dudes at any given time, like walking around this later. Like, you want to get coffee? This is a sextacular kiss, though. Buzz off, Jake Gill at home. There is no kiss like this in the MCU. Yes, no, it's not. Find me one. I'll gladly look at it.

But this is a sexy impassioned smooch here, man. So much so that I read this on Amazon, it was like, you know, rated PG-13, for, you know, intense images, and sexuality. I'm like, oh, that's nice. That S word is cool. But now it's Thanksgiving and this is a Thanksgiving movie. It's planes and automobiles American movie

and Spider-Man are Thanksgiving movies. Before we get to Thanksgiving dinner, we have the burning building. Oh, right, right. Sure, the goblin sets of building on fire, which I didn't, I never, I've seen this movie a bunch. I'm so stupid.

I didn't put together that like clearly the goblins set this fire in the first place. I always was just like, oh, and then the goblin's there, I guess. I don't know. But yes, of course, it's to lure Spider-Man. He saves a baby. The fire department is just like, you know what, ma'am? That baby's going to have to boin. That's right, Spider-Man. I also blew a Palm Freetz on 2nd Avenue. Oh, man, that was a fucking weird day when that happened. Turn out the villain there was Con Edison. Totally. I don't know what to tell you, lady. I hope you like your son extra crispy. But then these cops come up to like arrest Spider-Man right in that moment

Because going on in the movie is Jane Jonah Jameson has convinced the world that Spider-Man and Goblet are in it together. Yeah. So this cop's like, all right, you're coming downtown with us. And he's like, actually, I'm going to go save more people in the building. Like you hear some old lady screaming. And he's like, all right, I'll arrest you when you get back then. And he's like, I'm not coming back, you dumb pig. Bye.

ACAB, motherfuck webs out. I mean, I do think it's kind of interesting to make, especially in 2002. I mean, obviously, this part was filmed. It's not so cop deferential to, you know what I mean? The cost are kind of like, you know. They're there.

They're there, yeah. But they're also kind of antagonists for poor old Spider-Man, which fits with a comic. So he goes into the building. There's a little like babushka hiding in the flames. And then, ah, dude, that goblin reveal, it is still just laugh out. laugh out loud hilarious. It's so good.

And he's got some voice modulator for a woman's scream, I guess. It's terrified. I think DeFoe could get there. It's a screen they've used before. It's in movies. I've heard it before. It's like the Wilhelm. So then basically he's like, I'm turning down your all for a green goblin

and they get into a big fight. This is a good fight. It is. This looks good. Not only the fighting stuff, but like the fire all around them and everything. And the slow jumps and turns while these what do they call these little bombs with the pumpkin bombs

oh no no no the knives are the flying things they look like fucking quidditch thing Harry Potter we also do this is a phantom balls

yeah Sam Ramey saw the matrix because we're doing the full back and like you know things are going over him so this is Thanksgiving but he gets cut in the arm

and he just Willam Defoe shows up to Harry and Peter's amazing apartment the size of this thing Defoe just like sweating in that elevator like I guess

sort of transitioning between Goblin and Norman. Yes, it's great. Well, you didn't get to grab a shower after he did all that. Work was murder. Oh, it's such a great line, man. So fucking good. And it's amazing because he finally meets MJ

because he didn't meet her in the balcony and he's just like and she's so uncomfortable. Like, oh, it's a gross dad situation. Hey, dad, what did you mean by work is murder? Wouldn't you fucking fire? Aren't you like doing nothing? You're just like, hanging at home or something?

It is an awesome, like, when MJ catches him in that, like, get a good look, because Dan's a moment, his fucking mouth is open. Just like, ah. It's so amazing. And, like, you know,

they're waiting for Peter. Peter's late, obviously. And he flies under the window. And, like, oh, Peter's upstairs. They all go upstairs. And, like, Defoe's like, this kid's a fucking slob.

Oh, my God. I can't believe I've actually thought I was going to hire this young man. Most geniuses aren't. I do like the sort of domestic part of this. This is very, very old school Spider-Man comic

which is just like, this is my friend, this is my enemy. How do I hide everything? All at the same time and all this stuff. And like juggling all those balls. I like, I like this girl. It's like your boss is coming over for dinner. Exactly. Yeah, it's a big deal thing. And he wants to swig out coming through the front

door makes up some fake story and I had to what does he say he's like I had to fight this old lady for the last can of cranberry sauce I had to beat her with a stick or something. She's dead now oh I'm just waiting for my boyfriend to show up

hello bone saw bone saw is hungry this is Randy Savage with a fork and a knife in his hands I bought the candy jam zah store but I don't cook that doesn't happen

but no it's a I also love Norman she's about to say Gracie grabs the fucking thing she slaps his hand and he's like I'm gonna kill you dude and this is disgusting because she yells at him and then he starts licking his fingers

and you realize what he's doing there Norman Osborne barehanded just taking a big old scoop of stuffing what the fuck but it's like I'm gonna eat before grace because it's sacrilegious. This is the boy's first Thanksgiving in this apartment and we're going to do things right.

Now I'm your Lord God. You know I wasn't going to blow up your house before. But now. Yeah, I was just going to kidnap you, but now I'm going to blow up your house. I just wanted some sweet potatoes and marshmallows and you had to ruin it. He notices Peter's bleeding.

He realizes, oh shit, he's Spider-Man. And he excuses himself because I've got to plan this in my evil layer. And this great fucking scene with him and Franco here is like, she's beautiful. Your mother was beautiful. They're all beautiful. Do what you got to do with her and then broomer. Oh, dude, do what you've got to do with her.

Yikes. And of course, this is all within earshot. MJ's like, oh, thanks for standing up for me, you asshole. This is a disastrous Thanksgiving dinner. Your dad just told you to rail me in front of Aunt May. Thanksgiving is now officially ruined. Rail me and then get rid of me as soon as humanly

possible. It's a great line though because Oh he's going to hit it and quit it Izzy. I've been there sweetheart you better dump him first. I'm used to the old fucking run Franco is like oh you heard that and she's like everybody

heard that creep that creep is my father I'm a dumb meathead. It's so good, though, because he's a little fucking, he's just a little, oh, I'm Norman Osborne's little son. Yeah. And even Aunt May, like, scolds like, oh, Harry Osborne, don't you talk like that? Like, this is a Cassavetes-esque Thanksgiving, man.

And that's, because Franco read for Spite, wanted to be Spider-Man, obviously, and then they were like, oh, you'd be good for Harry Osborne. Because they, I mean, they get it. Like, he's unlikable. Like, that's the point. You know what I mean? Like, he's kind of likable, but he's also, like, you're not going to root for that guy. Like, if you use Spider-Man, you're like, that guy's

kind of a scumbag. You know what I mean? Like, yeah. And we keep rolling on Aunt May hilariously on her knees in front of her bed saying her prayers. Kaboom, another explosion kidnapped. Finish it.

Deliver us from evil. And this is all because of his stupid fucking excuse. Like, oh, bike messenger clip me. Yeah. Definitely not a goblin gash. Sorry, it may have got Goblin gas. Okay, yeah, it's Peter Parker.

So, you know, now he's going to fuck with Peter Parker ruined his life. At May is taken to the hospital for Goblin-related trauma. For being dead? I don't think. After this.

They fixed her, though. They fixed her. It's a fucking pretty gnarly Class 3 goblin bite, dude. So she's in the hospital, like, indefinitely. And she's like, you know, Peter, I was almost murdered today. You should really go for it with your friend Mary Jane. Before I leave this mortal

coil, I'd like you to get it wet. Please lose your virginity before I die. Don't make me tell St. Peter that I let a virgin live in my house to the day I died. Don't do that to me, Peter. Because Aunt May has overheard a prior hospital conversation where Peter and MJ are like kind of holding hands, Harry blows that up by walking into the room sees them holding hands and it's like we weren't doing anything

there are plenty of just you know little offices in this hospital here that you could just take her into and have sex with her A lot of empty break rooms around here just so I could die happy Peter

fuck her on a cat scan machine before you watch off first send that booty look for infections Haven't you? I mean, God damn it. Have you seen any pornography? Hospitals are natural settings. Man,

Harry Osborne goes home and does like, oh man, fucking Peter. And like he tells Norman that like MJ's, he loves her more than anyone. So now put a fucking target on your girlfriend's back. Okay.

Totally. And that's what happens here. It's, you know, Peter is like, you know what, Aunt May, you're totally right. I'm going to give her a call right now. He calls MJ's apartment and it's like, Mary Jane Watson's house, Green Goblins. I love that the

Green Goblin picks up the phone at this apartment. It's so great. And this, it leads us into the... How do I open? How do I use your Nokia cell phone? I don't have one of these. Is it a flip? It slides. I can't figure it out. Now it's chirping at me.

Believe it or not, MJ isn't at home. Please leave a message. You know, Peter, you're the only one that called this number. It was no auditions, no callbacks whatsoever. Absolutely none. This girl's going nowhere. Voice mail was bone dry.

She's off, off, off, broadway. She isn't on it or even off it. She's in the river. That's how far off Broadway she is. Yeah, but this leads into the final scenes of the movie. The Goblin kidnaps her, drops her on top of the 59th Street Bridge, in order to lure Spider-Man, and this is the great choice.

We're sort of, of course, these movies, and it looks like this new one's doing it too. We cannot help referencing the Gwen Stacy thing. In the Garfield series, we do it. Yes. But this is sort of that, right? We're on the Queensboro Bridge,

and it's like, I'm going to drop MJ simultaneously with the Roosevelt Island tramway car with a bunch of, like, Boy Scouts in it, a kid's group or something, which, like, what are we doing, taking kids out to Roosevelt Island, by the way. There's nothing out there. Creep Tower. To sell them, of course. There are

baseball fields there. I don't know if they're being demolished now. What's funny is like one of the buildings they eventually throw Spider-Man in, I think, is one of those derelict structures that is now being destroyed because they're building like a Cornell. Those are, it's already built, dude. Oh, it's already built there? Yeah, I was looking at it because, yeah, where

the big fight takes place and it's all these like rundown, whatever, that is now there's a gorgeous building that's been built over that. Interesting. You know, I would actually recommend if people do like tourist shit in New York,

go to 59th Street, take this tram. The tram is super fun. It's just like a subway swipe. Yeah. Go there and just come back. Yeah. But it's very cool because you're on

this like gondola cable car. Yeah, it's pretty neat. Good views of the city and everything. Nothing to do on. Yeah. When you get to Roosevelt Island, there's nothing there. Just come right back.

It's just mainly residential. You may be able to get a coffee. Yes. Maybe. Dude, we went there once. Everyone was at the village of the dam.

Everyone was looking at it. They look at you. What are you doing? They know, dude, Outlander. Outland. I always kind of liked walking around Roosevelt Island because it does feel like

some weird like Soviet satellites. Yeah, and everyone definitely does. Pink skin and pale blue eyes. That's why I felt at home. Are you here for the Wicker furniture? We specialize in Wicker furniture.

You come to Roosevelt Island of your own accord. I mean, it's a cool place where like they don't even allow you really to drive a car on the island full time. There's like, if you drive onto it, there's a parking lot or you have to like leave your car and then

walk into it. Yeah, and you can only get there from the queen's side. There's like a small bridge. That's right. Oh, a bike, eh? No, that won't do at all. Add it to the bike fire. There's a good moment here. What I do like about the Ramee movies do this with

Spider-Man. And I get it's also partially because you can't see his mouth at all. but when he's looking and seeing like the tramway situation and an MJ he just has a oh because the goblin throws a bunch of goblin bombs into the tramways like main building or whatever and blows it up and it's a shot of spider man looking down at it and he just says like goblin what have you done but because you can't see his face you can envision the comic book thought bubble yes yeah you know in in place of like spoken dialogue it works either way which is cool And like this is when, I mean, he's holding up the tram, he's holding up MJ, he's like trying to bounce around. And of course we get the post-9-11. You mess with one of us. You mess with all of us. Yeah, totally.

I mean, here's the thing. New Yorkers in many ways were a lot like the Bundy family unmarried with children. We can be terrible to each other. But the second an outsider tries to be terrible to us, we all gathers. gather around each other and fight back against that person. Because we're competitive. We don't like anybody being better at it than we are. We're going to hate you.

We're going to be the best thing. My big question is like, where are they getting all these sticks and bricks on the bridge? I mean, it's great that they're throwing like garbage out of him. I think he's getting hit with a soda can. It would be great. Oh, yeah. And just fucking mose them down. That would be amazing.

Yeah, unseen until this moment, goblin weapon, flame thrower on his wrist. Or maybe make some skeletons again. And we only saw that once. Yes, it's true. I guess I'm fine dealing with all of you. Gonna be a bunch of skeletons wearing Yankee caps. So he, you know, of course, Peter Parker saves both the tram car and Mary Jane.

Thankfully because a barge is coming down the river and they are able to land the car and Mary Jane on that. We go to fight on Roosevelt Island here. one of the only probably action sequences in history to take place on Roosevelt Island. And this fight's great. It's a really good fight. It's brutal. Like you really like the movie doesn't have a lot of fights in it

and this one really kind of makes up for it. And they do remind you that like when Norman is originally breathing all the gas or whatever, it's kind of funny because they did a Steve you already mentioned it like pre and post Toby working out thing. They didn't do it with Defoe but there's a

computer thing in that experiment room that definitely says like his muscle mass will get bigger. There's no change in defoe, but he's doing like jump kicks and flips and shit. He's beating the shit out of Spider-Man. It's pretty great. Totally brutal. Because he can't improve on perfection. No, that's true.

But yeah, so then he has to, like, Spider-Man kind of gets the upper hand and this is a lot of like, oh, no, Peter, it's me. It's Norman. Oh, Peter, you got to help me. Oh, I'm so thankful for you now. I think it's like a hit with a brick wall and then punched in the face a bunch. It's nice. Yeah, that's what he does.

Spider-Man drops a whole brick fucking structure on him like an action figure commercial. You can help me. And all he's doing is like and shit go glider to kill here. Oh, Peter. I've been like a father to you. And he's got

the great line that, you know, I had a father his name was Ben Parker. That's the uncle. To which Willem Defoe just replies, Godspeed, Spider-Man. And like, I love that though, The glider has, like, silent mode, like an electric car.

Yeah, it's just like... Yeah, and there's knives come out. It's a good emotional ending for this character. It ties it up. And there's another scene we didn't talk about. I love the scene with him and Aunt May on the bed after graduation where he's just like... What are they soaking or? They were not soaking.

But no, just like he's like, really like that I couldn't save him, you know, blah, blah, blah. Oh, he would have been proud of you. I mean, it's good Toby McGuire acting. He has a really good chemistry with, uh, bro. Rosemary. Harris. Yeah, yeah, totally. But yeah, but yeah, he's like, all right, and reintroduce Spider-Man. And this dude, Spider-Man jumps out of the way, thanks to the spider senses. This spiky goblin glider hits this man in the garage. We get a fucking brief moment of, oh, instead of like mother. Yes. I love injecting that. It's a great Sam Remy. It's a cut

and he's, oh. And it just he's dead. And he. So yeah, his dick is a blitter and you're saying. I mean, because when you look at it, there's like the glider and then right above the glider is like his abs. So like there ain't much more real estate, man. Oh, man. That's a super circumcision right there. Because I think that also I'm done by my own horse cock, Spider-Man.

You could say in the one hand his line of, don't tell Harry is for like, don't tell Harry I was the Green Goblin, but I think also maybe it could be, please don't tell Harry his father died by getting stabbed in the cock. It works both ways, for sure. I'll tell him how big it is.

He won't be able to live up to it. It will haunt him. He brings the body of Norman Osborne home and briefly Harry Franco sees him and it's just like, now he's forever traumatized with the idea that Spider-Man was like chopping his dick up. No, yeah, at that point,

you should have paid a bone saw to fucking bring this body back up there. Totally. Just to evade this whole thing. You know, you could- me to what? Wow, what'd you do with his dick? Look, I beat you in combat.

You should do this for me. I didn't do that. I'm just dropping bodies off. What are you going to do about it, James Franco? And from then on, I always swore I'd kill bones. My mortal enemy is

boats off across. And that his vengeance is done in what, two days? That's nothing. God, that would be just spike his fucking pills. But also apparently there is like end tables all around the Osborne estate with fucking handguns in them. Because he's just like part. He pulls out a gun. He sees, he just pulls out like just a random end table gun.

Dude, well, that's the thing, man. When you're in like that, dude, like you get it wherever you reach. I have to be within arm's reach of a gun at all times. Yeah, for sure. That's the idea. So yeah, he vows revenge on Spider-Man. He tells Spider-Man as such at his father's funeral. roll. He says it to Peter. He's like, I'm going to get that fucking Spider-Man dude one way or

another. I'm going to kill this guy. And it's cool though, but you're all, Peter, you're my only family now. And it's like, it's it. You get, like, again, that's that very spider manny thing that the tension between the two things. Yeah, it's, it's really great here. It, like, it winds up being run out of gas by the time you get to the third one. But like, for now, it's totally fine. This is also a great MJ's like, when I was, you know, going to lose my life. My thoughts all went to you, Peter. And he's like, that's cool. but knowing that, you know, danger will come for whoever's important to Spider-Man, you know.

I feel like there needs to be like a forced ghost of like Uncle Ben being like, I didn't tell you to be sexless. Go with the girl. What do you do it? Figure it out later, Peter. Do what you want with her and broom her. Why is everyone always saying that about me? What does that mean?

Everyone wants to broom this girl. Now, everyone's ghosts are telling people to hit it and quit it. What the fuck, man? No, no, Peter. I'm a person. Peter, just tell her you're not into anything serious. It's very easy. And, you know, she's just like only a friend. And he goes, that's all I have to give, which I think is a great line.

She does kiss him and she does do the thing where like, wait a second, you know. Totally. And then, yeah, you know. Well, who am I? I'm Spider-Man. And I love Lady America, baby. Oh, dude. Yeah, you're hanging your little spider cell.

on that flagpole right by the right by the red, white, and blue. And they say that a hero to save us I'm not going to stand here and wait. Now, did I read the credits wrong there? Is this a solo Chad Kroger's song?

It's a solo Chad Kroger, but he brings in the guy from saliva, ladies and gentlemen. What saliva? It was another one of those bands. That's awful. I was misremembering because the second movie's credits, has, if you're into that stuff, a real

bangor dashboard confessional song, but then also the Ramones doing the Spider-Man theme song, which is cool. This movie is Chad Kroger and then just the television theme song. No, you're missing the Some 41 song. Oh, yes. I forgot about that one. That was asshole clenching.

It's like all bad, but everything's bad and always has and always will be. And music now is awful too. I bought a couple of Some 41 albums. I will admit it. I definitely had the one with the fat lip. I definitely had that one. The second sequel,

it has like an original spoon song. It's a weird soundtrack. Yeah. Well, the strokes are on this soundtrack too. So are the hives. In two, though. No, in the first one. The strokes are in the first one?

The strokes were, I did see them in the credits. I did where it was. When I something, fuck. I'll pull it up right now. I was listening to it on the way here. Get in the mood for Spider-Man.

There's also an aerospace cover of the Spider-Man song, which sucks and did not make the credits. Yeah, that's really. terrible. Where did where was that ever released? Because I've heard it before. When it started is the Stroke song and then Hey. Oh, when it started.

Okay. Told you so. There's a Pete Yoran on here. Macy Gray and Todd Morello, obviously. And theme for Spider-Man, Aerosmith. I don't know. Oh, weird. All right. Well, whatever. But yeah, that, you know, so this movie, man, I got to say, holds up. We'll start with you, Steve, final thoughts. Yeah, I love this movie. Yeah. Again, there's, it's a warts in all situation, but I think that that's okay because it is emblematic of its time.

You know what I mean? Obviously, like being so post 9-11, like by minutes practically. Yeah. And sitting in New York, you know, it's got a lot of weight on its shoulders. But I think McGuire's fantastic. I think he hits the nail just right. I think Defoe, it's an amazing villain performance up there without any of them. And the whole cast is great.

And Ramey fucking gets it, man. Ramey really has a lot of fun with this, and he elevates the material while respecting it as opposed to just, I don't know, like, just it feels like a Spider-Man movie, and I will always love it for that. And I love the second movie as well. Chris Cabin. And it feels like a movie, which is nice, isn't it? Nice that we're not going to the theater to see a television program worth a billion dollars. Yeah, I love this movie. It is probably among my top three favorite superhero movies. It's way up there. I think DeFoe is one of the best villains we've ever had for a superhero movie. That just might be because I'm a huge DeFoe guy. But yeah, the direction's perfect. And it's so well edited.

And it's so fast. Like it usually, you know, another thing with these MCU is like everything's so stayed. Everything is at this very perfect pace. We've all thought this all through. Right. This is like, kinetic. And it really excites you. And that's what a movie like this should do.

So, yeah, I love it. Two hours in one minute, but... Oh, nice. Yeah. Well, I'm not going to repeat my esteemed colleagues, but I agree with every single thing they said. I mean, I think this is up there with the Burton Batman's for me. It's, and it's very distinct. It's directed by a director, which is amazing, which is fantastic.

Yeah, I just... I had something else to say. I might be losing the thread here, but I love this movie. I will say Defoe, DeFoe is up there with my I don't know like what the order would be but he is in the top four of my favorite comic book movie villains

that also rope in Nicholson's Joker DeVito's Penguin and Pfeiffer's Catwoman and then also I guess we'll roped into that top five you also have Hackman as Alexis Luther for me but like that's like how much I think of this Defoe performance I remember what I was going to say

if people haven't checked it out listening check out Darkman the Sam Ramey movie fucking great movie that is very proto I want to direct a superhero movie Yeah He was a huge comic book fan Like that was one of the reasons

That got him the job Right and wouldn't you know it Like sometimes being a huge comic book fan Can work in your favor Of bringing a movie to life I just think about like That last like TNG movie Where they hired that dude

And he was like I didn't watch any Star Trek Like familiarity with the product should be up there. And there's no brand consciousness here. Again, I do like a lot of MCU movies that I will repeat again. Homecoming is a great Spider-Man movie with a lot of Iron Man shitnet that I don't care for. But it's a great Spider-Man movie. But there's no brand consciousness here.

It's like, let's take whatever the Spider-Man thing is and blow it the fuck up. Yep. Yep. And it's also not like looking ahead to the next thing. Nope. It's a movie that is concerning itself with the story that it's telling and not the next 15 stories. Spider-Man, like, I don't, you could put him in the

MCU. Friends could stop by from time to time, but I would love to see him in New York City helping average regular people. Fantastic point. No, I mean, you say that, but I mean, there was that, but Jim Norton does become Doc Ock in the second one. Thank God that didn't happen. That is going to do it for this episode on Spider-Man from 2002

directed by the great Sam Ramey, catch him, I guess, entering the MCU with his Doctor Strange, too. We'll see his name even fucking stays on it. As always, though, you can find more We Hate Movies over on Patreon. Patreon.com slash We Hate Movies. There's another We Love Movies episode on there this month. Talking about Ridley Scott's Alien, which is really great.

We got a once-in-a-lifetime episode on Mary In-Laws, starring George Wendt and Shelley Long as the clauses, which is great. The horniest clauses of all. Big time, big time. Yes, we're talking about Obi-Wan Kenobi on the Gleap Glossary. And, of course, on the Nexus level, our Star Trek plays. podcast. We're talking about, we're doing a full episode, big, big bad boy episode on Star Trek

generations. Hell yeah. And we're doing a big bad boy episode on animation damnation on Toy Story. We might be putting out too much content on. That's true. Patreon this month. Maybe we have to look redact. If you sign up, by the way, you don't just get that. You get everything we've ever done. You get the past December's episodes. You know, all the years episodes. We've been doing

WLMs all year all years long. We've been doing this for our entire Lives. Star Wars Empire Strikes Back. Like so much shit on there than you. Just peruse it. Go to WHM Podcast.com. Go to click on the shows under the WHM Prime. Scroll down. Look at what's marked patron only. You might be surprised. And for you MCU heads, an Iron Man episode. F. FYI. Which we like. Which we like. Solid stuff. But here

of course on the main feed, we love movies month. We'll continue next week as well. Steve, what are we talking about then? We are talking about a man that almost directed this movie, Chris Columbus. It's one of his best, if not his absolute best, home alone. Oh, yeah. That's going to be... We're going to devote some time to that motion picture. Oh, my God.

Bangor fucking score. So, yeah. Bangor lots of stuff. Next week, another little kid in trouble. That's right. So until then, I'm Andrew Jupin. Stephen Sadek. Eric Siska.

Chris Gavin is ready. Take it easy. That worked that time. That was a hate gum podcast.