We Study Billionaires - The Investor’s Podcast Network - BTC251 : Tech Abundance w/ Jeff Booth

Starting point is 00:00:00 You're listening to TIP. Hey, everybody, welcome to this Wednesday's release of the Bitcoin Fundamentals podcast. On this week's show, I have back, author, entrepreneur, and technology expert Jeff Booth on the show. And the reason Jeff is here is because I have a big announcement. And he's the perfect person for me to present this additional direction and scope of the show with. I don't want to give away too much. So we're just going to jump right into the show. I hope you guys enjoy.

Starting point is 00:00:28 Celebrating 10 years. You are listening to Bitcoin Fundamentals by the Investors Podcast Network. Now for your host, Preston Pish. Hey, everyone. Welcome to the show. I'm here with the one and only Jeff Booth. Welcome back. It's so great to see you, buddy.

Starting point is 00:00:57 Hey, so the impetus for this discussion kind of percolated out of you and I just having a candid conversation on where I wanted to go with the show. and what I'm trying to do and what we quickly realized is that a discussion between the two of us might be warranted to kind of bridge in where I plan on going with all of this. So I appreciate you making time

Starting point is 00:01:20 and just, you know, I mean, you're obviously a good friend, but I also look at you as a mentor as well, Jeff. So thank you for coming on and having this conversation with me. No problem. Do you want to drop the bomb right away? I think we should.

Starting point is 00:01:32 I think, you know, like, why are we doing this? What is this all about? So I guess I'll start off and obviously chime in where you feel it's pertinent. But I really want to cover more things on the show. Like I cover Bitcoin every single week. And as an engineer and as somebody who's just deeply curious in general, I'm looking at everything that's what I think is going to play out in the coming 10 years.

Starting point is 00:01:56 And I think that this coming decade is going to be completely nuts. I think there's going to be so much change. and I kind of want to cover a lot of this and I want to cover it from different angles. And first and foremost, your thesis, Jeff, of the price of tomorrow was a massive change in just and shift in how I think about everything. Like this idea of deflation in technology is something that just changed how I was looking at economics, how I was looking at Bitcoin. I was already a Bitcoiner, but it just entrenched everything that I thought I knew. in a much deeper way because I wasn't looking at technology as a thing that was compounding with time in the opposite direction of what the Fiat was compounding in the other direction.

Starting point is 00:02:46 And when you kind of combine those things together, it was just like my mind exploded. And so this is what I'm trying to say in a lot of words, I guess. I want to start covering robotics. I want to start covering AI. I want to start covering nuclear. and the whole gambit of all of these technologies that seem to be each their own vector, kind of all pointing to this idea of a monetary revolution. I think that they all intersect and they have all interrelated,

Starting point is 00:03:16 and I want to start covering all of that. So go ahead, Jeff, tell the audience what you told me when we were talking on the phone. I just thought it made perfect sense. I've known you now for quite a while, but we've always known you to be super curious. or where the world's going and actually not afraid to change your mind on something if new information makes sense. And that's a math and strength. It's actually, I think it's why your podcast is so successful because that's what you've done and people have followed your journey the entire time. And so now take what you know and you've chased Bitcoin to the ground, every hole, every

Starting point is 00:03:50 spot. And I don't think, you're not saying you're giving up on Bitcoin. You're just saying this is a base layer, forced aside, have chased it to the ground. It is Bitcoin. It reinforces that the pre-market is depletion, and we've never lived in one. If Bitcoin stays decentralized and secure, it is inevitable that we are living in one. Let's explore the other technologies that are allowing that to accelerate. And so exploring some of those other technologies, when we say technologies, when I hear you describe that, they're not other things.

Starting point is 00:04:25 They're us inventing new things to be able to solve problems. are ideas that are the basis of technology. And that's what now we have a base layer that allows all of that abundance to flow to all of us, where the free market is, it's massively competitive. Everyone has to compete to provide value to you. And if you're holding Bitcoin, if you're part of the Bitcoin ecosystem, all of that abundance is flowing to you. So you're looking at all of that.

Starting point is 00:04:51 If you're part of the system, all of that abundance is being extracted from you and centralized against you. And so you already understand Bitcoin. and you understand it to the sand. So I'm sure you're going to weave it in for time to time because it's important that people understand that phenomenon, what's happening. But I love that you're going to go and explore your mind,

Starting point is 00:05:13 your curiosity to explore some of these other turtles. I'm still going to cover Bitcoin. I just, you know, it might not be every week, but I'm still going to bring on guests and talk about Bitcoin and whatever new is developing. But I guess from my vantage point,

Starting point is 00:05:27 I'm looking at other nations, States that are adopting and I'm looking at the number of corporations that are adopting it. I'm looking at it from just a pure technical standpoint, which we've covered at nauseam on the show. And I'm saying, I just don't see what's going to supplant it or what's going to outpace it long term. But I'm looking at all these other things and I'm saying the deflation that's happening, like this optimist robot, humanoid robot. We'll talk about that, I guess, a little bit more. But when I'm looking at things like that, I'm looking at AI, and I'm looking at the,

Starting point is 00:05:59 these virtual worlds that they're using to train the potentially trained humanoid robots and all this kind of stuff. And I'm thinking, this is going to be absolutely insane in the coming decade. And I'm combining that with what I'm seeing in Bitcoin. And I'm saying, how in the world can any of these sovereign entities that are just printing pieces of paper at a breakneck pace, possibly compete with Bitcoin or where this is all going from an abundance standpoint. And I just think the story is so much bigger, like so much bigger. And I just want to kind of, I want to cover each one of these topics, but I also want to cover how they get stitched together and how they're all interrelated from a much bigger picture

Starting point is 00:06:46 to kind of maybe understand where we think a lot of this is going. So yeah. Yeah. So let's just keep on it. We'll just have a conversation and pull on these threads. And these threats are important to pull on because Ventures say most Bitcoin are still today, are not understanding that the natural state of the free market is depletion and prices should fall.

Starting point is 00:07:08 And if you're measuring in Bitcoin, prices are falling at the same rate since that technology is growing. So if you measure things from Bitcoin instead of convert Bitcoin to your piece of paper, then you'll see exactly precisely what I'm saying. Your model of the world should match, if it's correct, should match exactly what's happening. So the model I laid out in the world and is Bitcoin is free market's deflation, technologies can accelerate. It's not accelerating. It's moving exponentially. And we didn't, we couldn't understand exponentials. And that meant all of these technologies. They're going to coincide at the same time as

Starting point is 00:07:44 this rate. We can't even understand it. It's going to seem crazy. But if you were in Bitcoin, then all prices are falling by that rate. If you're not in Bitcoin, all of that has to be consolidated at that rate. And it would look like coercion control. Most people are giving the system of coercion and control more energy by leaning into it, by their fear in it because they're not pricing in Bitcoin. They're not sending in Bitcoin.

Starting point is 00:08:11 They're using a derivative instrument of Bitcoin thinking prices going out. That system is still inflationary. A system has to still be inflationary. And it's the opposite of what I'm saying. The opposite of the pre-market questions go down, meaning we've never lived in a global free market. Nobody has a basis to understand that. And it takes lots of time to understand what's happening.

Starting point is 00:08:35 At the same time, all of these technologies are moving exponentially, hitting chaos in our brain from our previous models. We'll just use some examples of if that model of reality was correct. And in my mind, it certainly is because it's explaining everything, not one thing, everything. What would it feel like? Let's use some examples. And let's use some examples of why it would gain more fear in the minds of most of the population. Let's use some simpler examples first.

Starting point is 00:09:04 I'm going to lose my job. And prices are going up. Prices are going up. I'm going to lose my job to AI. What do I do? I turn to the government. I'm spending in the fee of dollar and say, what does the government do? I'll save you because I'll get votes.

Starting point is 00:09:17 How do I save you? I print more money to stray and make it worse for you. Accelerate. Accelerates at the same pace as technology is moving the other way. It's how it's centralized the structure. What are laws look like in that system? They get changed and all your freedoms go away from that centralization because they have to, and you're voting for what does technology look like over you?

Starting point is 00:09:40 It looks like a control system owned by three or four or two. giant monopolies of AI companies that all of your information is going through and you're feeding it, making it stronger, where they could turn you off at any moment, not just money, but everything, or potentially worse, because you're feeding it in that system. Your mind is being warped to what that system wants you to believe, but you have no idea because you're inside that system through fear, making it stronger, which, how do I survive? That would happen. What would happen as it got worse and worse and worse. And I'm going down the fear track at first because that's majority of the population

Starting point is 00:10:22 is living in that fear without realizing they're living in that fear. What they are saying is it's someone else. It's not me. Somebody else is responsible for my happiness and they're stuck in that fear. But it has more and more coercion and control. And as the free market gives us tools to essentially create our own AI's bioengineering And what will people do that want to burn it all down? But the same technology that could free all of us,

Starting point is 00:10:51 they will use those technologies to create massive problems for the world, right? Because they're so stuck. And what will the system do in reaction? Try to stop it. How will it stop it? It will drive more printing amite, more coercion, more control. What most people in the system do? Yes, stop them.

Starting point is 00:11:11 What will those people do? Because they're so hurt. From that, they will want to burn it down. It'll divide society and it'll get worse and worse. And I know that's a really dystopian, our view, but I just want to make sure why I use that as an example, because these technologies are inevitable anyways. They're coming no matter what. When you think robot or robot dogs or you're furious what that will look like,

Starting point is 00:11:35 you're seeing a tiny, tiny section of what will happen. There'll be nanorobots. They'll be every robot of different uses, not just in our lights, but for, built robots to be able to do all of this. There'll be swarms robots. We say that are there already drones today? It'll be everywhere. And AI will be driver of all those things.

Starting point is 00:11:54 This is coming no matter what. The free market demands that all of the prices, the abundance from that. Those that flows to you because an entrepreneur cannot create more value without you using more value and are flowing to you. You're a part of the free market. In the world I described from Bitcoin, There would be no reason to fight with everybody, to divide everybody, because your life would be getting better and better and better and better and better and better from all of the same thing. The only way as an entrepreneur instead of it looking like three or two or three big food monopolies, drug monopolies, robot monopolies, AI monopolies that are going to merge and all interact with the government with your money together to control you, but money has been stolen from you.

Starting point is 00:12:42 there will be thousands of companies by individuals trying to deliver value to you. And there can't be a monopoly in the world that I'm describing. I think that's the thing also that I want to make sure is covered, is this idea of open source technology as it relates to AI, as it relates to robotics, as it relates to all of these different things. because if the money like you're describing Bitcoin is there providing value and allowing cooper, incentivizing cooperation, as opposed to the opposite, which is what Fiat's doing, the incentive for open source technologies is going to proliferate with time.

Starting point is 00:13:27 And somebody needs to cover. Somebody needs to be talking about some of this stuff. And we're seeing it already. Like we just, you and I had a conversation last week about an OS that was open source. It's through a web browser, things like that. I find that stuff so fascinating and so important for the world to see. I think I just saw last week. One employee took the entire weights of XAI's current model and took it to OpenAI.

Starting point is 00:13:56 And so I think another part with this existing system and the way that all these technologies are being built is I think they're very precarious to protection. And I think that with time, the models, like some of these very advanced models are going to be leaked. And I think you're going to have this movement from an open source standpoint that is somewhat unstoppable in the same direction that you just kind of described the proliferation of these fiat-based and centralized technologies. It's the classic, you know, you're watching a movie and there's the villain and, you know, some positive cooperative force entities. entity, individual or whatever, almost has to be able to be stood up to counter it. And I think that we're seeing this literally play out in real time with the world and the way that it's shaped and the technology and all this stuff that's happening. And I guess I want to cover all of it.

Starting point is 00:14:53 I want to be there covering all of it. But you're going to be super important in that, like super important in that because everyone that I see covering it right now, everyone I see covering it right now. They have a bias within the theater world. meaning it all get centralized at a faster rate. And that's why you just keep on coming down to the first principle. The natural state of the free market is deflation. Prices fall to the marginal cost of production.

Starting point is 00:15:19 What would you expect to happen in that natural state of the world? You would expect as technology exploded, prices defaults marginal cost of production every year. What's happening in the world? Not that unless you're bidding in billion. Unless you're in Bitcoin. Yeah. Unless you're in Bitcoin. And so even when you say open source, open source is fantastic and I'm a huge proponent,

Starting point is 00:15:41 but it won't need to be open source because they're everywhere, because entrepreneurs are going to compete. And if what they're giving you does, if it provides value for a while, then somebody else, because of the margin they're making, will compete with them. That's right. And prices will fall. And so today, where does the money for open source come from? Money from open source comes from somebody wanting to donate.

Starting point is 00:16:05 that they're making this money over here to this other system. So it's money for open source, not that that's bad or good or anything else. I love that. The money is still coming from somebody who has made the money from a broken system. It is that is donating. And if money dries up, and then there is no open source. The free market has to win.

Starting point is 00:16:26 We are a part of the free market. The more you do in the free market, the more you do in Bitcoin, the faster it wins. Every one of us, every single person on the planet, as agency in that discussion. If you're not in that discussion, so now you take what you know about Bitcoin, what you know about your own agency,

Starting point is 00:16:44 operating in a system that needs to remain decentralized and secure for this global abundance to flow to all of us, and you've married out with all of these technologies, and you will stitch together a show like no one else's show because all of those other shows are through a Fiat lens. Let's take a quick break and hear from today's sponsors. All right, I want you guys to imagine spending three days in Oslo at the height of the summer. You've got long days of daylight, incredible food, floating saunas on the Oslo Fjord, and every conversation you have is with people who are actually shaping the future.

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Starting point is 00:21:18 Elon Musk replies to this whole Mars catalog. They were asking a question about, you know, scaling and becoming multi-planetary and all this. And this was Elon's response, which I think is just mind. blowing. Check this out, Jeff. There's their question and his response and down in here says 80% of Tesla's value will be optimist. That is totally nuts for him to come out and say that based on what we know about Tesla today and the cars and like where all of that's at and just, you can just see where he thinks all of this is going. Like very quickly for a product that hasn't even launched yet.

Starting point is 00:21:59 He's, and I know Elon can be very, he can say things way ahead of time that that's their value. Now, what he's not saying is, is that value, because what you're describing even in that tweet or he's describing in that tweet. He's describing, I'm going to have the largest company in the world, and it's going to be a giant monopoly because it's a fake one. That's what he's describing or what people are reading. What he's not describing is he's being regraced by Bitcoin right now.

Starting point is 00:22:25 His company is being where you've raised by Bitcoin right now. Now, and over Bitcoin's term, that 80% can be a really small company with thousands of competitors. And it still might be true. Oh, yeah, I see what true. I see what I see what I see what you got. Do you see what I see what I want to say? And I know because I'm pretty close to the robotics sector and very close to AI. He is.

Starting point is 00:22:47 That's why about X or trust. Yeah. Yeah. To digest the information, your information to be able to train models, add those models to the test, But the vision of tests has and all of the vision models to be able to build this. You've got a fantastic engineering team. And he is one of the leaders. But those leaders are coming out of China as well.

Starting point is 00:23:09 Yeah. Leaders are at a crazy rate. Look at, is it B.YD? Look at the cars swinging out of China in comparison to the cars coming out of Chessler. And you'll see, wow, that competition is real. Yeah. That competition. He is not the only one.

Starting point is 00:23:27 doing this and he's not winning everywhere. He's winning where he has a regulatory boat. You know what's interesting about the car thing? So we were over in Dubai and we were talking to some of the people that the Uber drivers that were driving us around and some of the cars, I'd never seen some of these cars before that were on the road. And I started talking the one guy about it and he said, oh yeah, a lot of these are Chinese car manufacturers. And what was weird was some of them looked like a range rover or some of them look like brands in the U.S., like almost identical, but then you get inside and the bells and whistles that they have inside and the intelligence in the car was off the charts. And I'm there

Starting point is 00:24:10 thinking to myself, well, this was the other point was the price was so much cheaper than what you would pay for one of these Western car brands. And then it dawned on me. It's like they are eating the data out of these cars where they're driving, what they're saying. And, inside all of it at a discount or maybe even cost so that they can collect to all that information. And so to your point, which I think is very salient, is the competition isn't just like what we're seeing here in the U.S. or what we're being fed through our social media feed. So much of this brace of deflation, technological deflation, is happening on an international scale. and I think way more profound and way more competitive than many of us realize.

Starting point is 00:24:56 Way more. So those cars are a third of the press. Wow. And so they're marked that they're just losing money on them for the AI. They might not be losing money. Their labor is cheaper. These are dark robotics factories that are AI being becoming AI built. They don't have any lights off.

Starting point is 00:25:14 They don't have any humans. So first, the human labor was a lot cheaper. The human labor was cheaper because China was using the currency as an advantage to keep their exports up to have the human labor cheaper. So their labor was cheaper. What did the pre-market do? All of the U.S. companies that were trying to compete for your dollars funneled all their production to China because the U.S. labor was cheaper. What did that do? China needed to be competitive at a price that was lower and lower and lower.

Starting point is 00:25:46 So they automated, automated, automated. They created some of these first dark factories that didn't have humans in them, so that they could reach price flight. As the U.S. regulatory mode on their cars protected Tesla and GM and other cars, what did China market do? They sold those cars to anyone else who wanted by it. And that's why they're lower costs, not because they're giving them away. How far out to you, and I have, for people that are looking at the video,

Starting point is 00:26:12 I have the optimist robot pulled up here and just showing like all the different tasks that it's being trained on and like what this impact might be moving forward. When you look at stuff like this, Jeff, I mean, this is your thesis from five, six years ago when you wrote the book. What kind of world is this going to be? And from what I read, this is going to be in households, call it three years from now. You're going to be able to have something like this in your house, maybe four. And then at scale, you're probably seven, eight years out where these things are everywhere. And it's not just, like you said, just not just this robot. It's going to be all sorts that are maybe more specialized for the factory.

Starting point is 00:26:54 I think the humanoid ones are going to be the ones that go into the homes. But when you think about how much labor is going to be eaten away at with things like this, I can't even wrap my head around it. Yeah. So when you're showing this, what now some of the stuff that's happening behind the scenes to do that first in that video you saw a whole bunch humans. Five years it won't look like that. Yeah. But to do the hand articulation, how much pressure do I put on this object to be able to pick this up to cups to sweep, to do all of these things that you're talking about, hide into

Starting point is 00:27:30 everything else to walk to, these are complex tasks. They're being tackled at a rate. It's hard to comprehend. I saw a robot skin investment that I didn't actually make. But it was most of this is done by cameras today. It takes tons of camera dimensions and everything else, tons of data to be able to train this. Sensored skin is the same feel touch as we do.

Starting point is 00:27:55 And then all of that data is collected into the models because it has all of these sensors. Think about what it would look like in gaming. If you have haptic sensors everywhere and what that gaming would look like, Now cover a robot in the same public sensors everywhere. And now it picks up more information for the AI to learn at a greater pace and can do all these things. So this, the influence of all of these things is happening at a rate that if you're outside of it. And it's a really interesting. I'm interested in all your journey and your new show too, because you're going to be able to weave together this plus this, plus this, plus this, and all of what's happening on Bitcoin to show, wow.

Starting point is 00:28:36 the rate of that's what this means, where so many people are in a silo, one of these silos, and not understanding how the greater picture all unfolds together. So on that topic, I want to talk about how AI, just in general, is augmenting the learning of some of these humanoid, or has the potential to augment the learning. So check this out, Jeff. So here is a, what appears to be like a video footage, right? You're looking at a person walking through a museum right now, first person view. They're looking at just some rocks.

Starting point is 00:29:11 They're looking at a dinosaur there. They're kind of moving around. Here they are on a market walking. There's flowers on the street. And all of this is being generated real time with AI. This is Jeannie 3, which is just ad hoc making things up as it goes through and ingested a bunch of video footage from YouTube, evidently, is how this was generated. I believe this is a Google model.

Starting point is 00:29:38 And so you're looking at it and you're saying, well, how in the world would this ever be used? And you just got done talking about how on the robotic side, how it has to be trained on like all of this information, right? It has to be in this real environment. But one of the fastest things that we're finding on the robotic side for training purposes is simulated training. So you put the robot in this synthetic environment, you tell it to learn how to dance or you learn how to pick up this ball or whatever it is and they go over and over again. But if you have this simulated environment where they can run a million iterations of it, they can learn you went away, you went back to bed and you slept for the night.

Starting point is 00:30:19 You come back in the morning and now the robot's perfect at picking up the ball as opposed before where it had to do it in the real environment. It might have taken five days. So I'm looking at this synthetic environment that's being ad hoc built on the fly. My understanding is that it can remember up to like 90 seconds of what it showed before in the environment, like as it's just spontaneously generating all of this on the fly. And it's almost like we're building a dream environment for robots to learn. And I'm just looking at this stuff. It is blowing my mind.

Starting point is 00:30:52 Like what in the world? Like the speed, I think that's the thing, is the speed at which this is all taking place is beyond words. It's beyond comprehension. Yeah, and that can do one of two things. You could get excited about that, be part of it, or you could get fearful of it. And how does this impact me right now? And these technologies are impacting all of us. We see these things.

Starting point is 00:31:16 We say, well, how dare those companies take our jobs? Well, what are we going to do about it? Well, we live in a T.S system making sure those companies take our jobs. And prices rise that whole time. And now to take your synthetic data and take it to it to its natural. conclusion or let's live in that centralized world, not true Bitcoin. Then all of the information inside the system, more and more of it would be synthetic.

Starting point is 00:31:42 It would be what we were told. We wouldn't know the difference. It would be stuck. We'd be stuck in that world. Yeah, right? That's what it would look like. I don't think it ever goes like this. By the way, this is also the same deletion between what's happening in the world, what you

Starting point is 00:31:57 can feel it's happening in the world. And then you can take your own actions. within that collision. And you could say, what world, what future am I making stronger with my actions? Am I making the one where I live in this emphasize world, but stronger where somebody is controlling me and everything I do? Or can I make the free market stronger with my actions?

Starting point is 00:32:19 And every single person is going to play that in these. We are the super computer in my mind. The new information, what was there before, not that it can't come from the computer, but the new information order there is always from our mind outside of the information the system holds. And we are the thing that says, wait, what about this? What about this?

Starting point is 00:32:42 What about this? And so we're bringing that new information to a system that the output is the prices. The open is the prices of all. Like if you trained garbage in, you'd get garbage out. If it was all synthetic information, look at what's some of the algorithms did, if he used Google as an example, when now we've destroyed a whole bunch of the woke, but look at what the algorithms did and some of what that looked like, right? When you asked it a question and the reason that looked so egregious to you is because

Starting point is 00:33:13 your brain said, that's not right. Yeah. Right. And so you can just now imagine if you didn't know to say that that's not right, right, that your brain said, oh yeah, that's okay, that's okay, That's what that other system looks like. If I was going to push back on whether, you know, where this is all going could start generating its own unique, useful data and more importantly, creative thoughts on how to advance things forward from a robot's perspective, I think that leading experts in the space would make the argument that this is why we need humanoid robots. We need the AI to be able to nest itself into a.

Starting point is 00:33:56 vehicle that allows it to go out into the environment and have its own unique experiences. And when it can go out and there and do that and retain its own unique experiences, then it's going to have a more compartmentalized experience that isn't, you know, in training in AI, if you train it on a massive data set, it's hard for it to be an expert in one specific thing. But if it goes out and it learns in that specific domain, Let's say that it's trying to be a doctor, right? And it's shadowing a doctor and it's being fed with tons of real information for years in that specific domain. And it's not compressing other information that would cloud its judgment, right, that you might start getting very unique insights.

Starting point is 00:34:44 And you might start getting advancements from that compartmentalized robot or humanoid robot that's going out there and living a unique life. Would you agree with that, Jeff, or would you disagree with something like that? like that. Yeah. So I don't see, and I'm going to be interested to watch some of your shows and that point of view. So my mind is open. But if he said, what do I believe? I don't believe it at all. I believe what you're hearing is through centralized AI companies telling you what they want you to hear to be able to drive centralized structure. And then they're not doing it on purpose. They're doing it to try to get in the free market. And they're getting bigger and bigger to extract most of the gains from that in three or four companies and all their employees in

Starting point is 00:35:29 that. So they're just trying to compete, provide I'm going to win the row race. But all these models, all the models that most people are using are these centralized models, right? So what would change that? Now, you and I have also seen what's changing that to where you're able to watch all of things or I'm able to watch. You're able to watch all of this unfold is based on Bitcoin and based on Noster and other things. You're seeing. People take these models, compress them, have an agent that's on a pub key that is the division of labor narrowly defined, but the agent doesn't have to be coerced by other centralized models. It can't be. It's an agent that's very, very narrow. Now you string together a whole bunch of these agents and they build up your brain

Starting point is 00:36:16 of a robot, that would look very different because it couldn't be controlled. Couldn't be controlled by this. it would get better, better and better. And just like we, just like you and I are two different fractals of value-creating people that have very different strengths and weaknesses that we add to the world with all eight other big billion people adding their strengths and weaknesses to the world. If you had these looking like this and these individual strengths

Starting point is 00:36:44 and a coalescing that couldn't be controlled, then I see a very different path. That's the path I think it's going to happen. And we're very early on that path. And that path isn't guaranteed because there's so much control from the centralized guy. And that bigger game in the centralized AI is a government game too. Because you have a geopolitical game between U.S., Russia, China,

Starting point is 00:37:09 India, wanting to control AI. When it's virtually going to be impossible to control AI, there's going to be like in that world, you would have a couple of companies controlling AI on each side and all the war games underneath it, what you're thinking in that state for control would be really confusing. Let's take a quick break and hear from today's sponsors. No, it's not your imagination. Risk and regulation are ramping up and customers now expect proof of security just to do business. That's why VANTA is a game changer. VANTA

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Starting point is 00:40:52 I think you're already seeing somewhat of that bifurcation playing out where China is the centralized government AI. I would like to think that in the U.S. It's open and that the government's not nearly as involved as China, but I think the government is involved. It's not. Yeah. It's just like you believe.

Starting point is 00:41:11 natural beliefs you have as China is selling those cars of the lost because those people are bad. Right. It's just a belief that you have in your own system of control. And so remember, deep seek came out of China. Mm-hmm. And it was open source. And it was open source.

Starting point is 00:41:28 And so there's tons of these models coming out of China. Why? Because they can download the same info. They can reverse engineer these models. Yeah. But it compressed them, but I'm out as open source and send a shockwave through a rest of of a control structure that is doing something different.

Starting point is 00:41:44 Now, what about the very front edge for these models? What does that look like, the stuff that we can't see yet? Mm-hmm. Yeah, mind-blowing stuff. I just can't even imagine where this is going. Let's talk about demographics really fast. So you see all of these declining populations in developed nations, and it only adds more fuel to the fire of everything we're talking about

Starting point is 00:42:08 and help people understand why. first of all. And then I guess some of your thoughts on that trend. And I guess what you see that being important, whether you see that trend changing and just your overall thoughts in general on demographics. I think primarily demographics is I'm not a demographics expert at all. But let's say you see a general move all over the world is when standard of living rises, people have less children. What would that mean? We want our genes to survive and thrive.

Starting point is 00:42:43 And when there's infant mortality, we have more children, make sure what that happens. That's probably the biological reason. And then standard delivering rises we have less children. Now you add to that, most people are delaying having children because they can't afford, they don't think they can afford children. And you get a massive decline because people are waiting and waiting and waiting or saying, I don't need to have this. We're so stuck in their fear of what their kids are going to grow up in in the future world.

Starting point is 00:43:12 They're scared to have children. And so what are all these? It's just one more kind of giant thing that people are in their bubble and worried about from their bubble or in the field world that is contributing to the fear. Like name one problem, any global problem that you care about. I'm about talking to your audience, not you, Preston, that you care about that could be solved. by just that by debasing money. The problem that you're worried about is we're from the debate spent to money,

Starting point is 00:43:43 from the control of money, every single problem. Yeah. But where the opposite system would provide opposite results. So what does that mean? Well, I would think, and even then Bitcoin, when I say 90% of Bitcoin are reserved measuring it from a fee of instrument, what does that mean? They're giving more strength to a world that's centralizing us. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:44:04 Right. And so what I expect those people to do, sell their Bitcoin back to the Fiat paper, and then the Fiat papers be devalued again and again and again. So they might look rich for a while in that. But what does that mean? Like when I say that, it means we are so early in this transition. What does that mean? This transition is flying to be chaotic.

Starting point is 00:44:27 It is flying to be, and where you're putting your energy in the transition, it will be less chaotic for you. Right. But these things are tied because they're all the demographics is tied to it. The cap and labor, they're just for where capital labor is treated fairly. So what you have is nations around the world and this is happening in Bitcoin too, right? And you have this base layer that if it saves decentralized and secure, which you were part of making sure if you run a node, you contribute your time to a system that is for you, right? If you're spending in that currency, you're contributing to a Google

Starting point is 00:45:06 a free market that is for you. And I could say the same things, the ops. If you're not, you're contributing to a world that's extracting from you at a rate. And I'm not making any judgment what people should do or shouldn't do. But they can ask themselves, do I have agency in the world that I'm creating, or do I not? What you'll see, and we see this in Bitcoin, because we're still into it, and we're seeing all of these things emerge.

Starting point is 00:45:32 But when people move more of their time to pick like, their lives get better. They see that they want to have children. It would be just a mere reflection of their beliefs of playing back, which would be true in the natural state of the free market and everything would be just playing out and the more people there. But if very few people understand what we're talking about right now, they're still stuck in this other system. Then it's going to be chaotic.

Starting point is 00:45:57 Yeah. If you could, so looking back at your book, The Price of Tomorrow, but did you you read it in 2019, Jeff, or did it get released in 2019? I'd be released in 2019. In January 2020, I was on Amazon. Yeah. Wow. Okay. So we're already a half a decade in on the book. If you had the rewrite or add chapters, what would you, looking at the assessment of what was in it versus what you wish maybe could be added or should have also been in it. What would you put? I would have gone deeper on energy, I would have gone deeper on nuclear. And I think in that time, I probably had a bias

Starting point is 00:46:36 too on that specific technology because it was one of those ones that was excluded from my dataset intentionally. I think potentially in that you start to learn more of how you thought when you look and what different changes. That would be one I would for sure go deeper on. And then I don't think I would have written any more on Bitcoin at the time. is I would now because I'm so much deeper on what that looks like. At that time, at that time, when I said this on many podcasts,

Starting point is 00:47:08 I had a 5% probability in my mind if I think I would fail in time. And aim with that 5% probability is understanding that we've never lived in a global free market. And we had to be part of the problem because we use things that provide us for value each day. But we lived in this other system that was extracting that value, but that meant for four or five thousand years, we were in a zero sum game that we must have been part of the zero sum game. And I figured there's no way Bitcoin could resolve that paradox because it's us. Not somebody else.

Starting point is 00:47:46 It's not it's us that won't let that. And so if you figure it's us and there's all of this history that shows that you're not going to get out of this trout. Yeah. Then you have to have a really high bar on finance remaining decentralized and secure. And it was through that high bar trying to break Bitcoin. My actions changed. I contributed more of my time. I started running and I started spending in our dog. We started the venture capital company together to invest in others that we're building onto it together. It was that I understood. I had agency in the world I wanted to see and nobody could take my agency because that agency was with tens of thousands of other notes that also had agency that were protecting

Starting point is 00:48:32 this. And no matter what this system did or anything else, I had agency. And that changed because I realized by doing that I had agency, and now I wanted to protect that. I wanted to spend more time. I spent a lot of time teaching others or helping others to see that they have agency too. And now that I wouldn't have changed the book at that time, but I sure have learned a lot from that time. And if I were to write something more, I would write on this piece because I think there's so many, many people still tracked in the Uthia World. They don't realize that the jail cell door is open so they can walk over having it. Yeah. They have a state agency in the world that they want to create.

Starting point is 00:49:12 And it doesn't have to be one of fear and coercion and control. It can be one of hope, truth, and abundance. What a powerful statement. I don't even want to ask another question because I want to end it on that. That is such a powerful statement. Jeff, thank you so much mostly for just being a close friend and somebody that's always providing just keen insights and things like that. I just feel super blessed to be able to call you a friend and somebody that I can always call on and get just really sound advice from.

Starting point is 00:49:42 So thanks for coming back at you. And I can't wait for this new part of their journey. It's going to be fun. I'm excited. I'm going to have a listener. I'm excited to cover it. I'm just really excited about all these things. And the thing that I've learned from doing this show for a decade is if you do have an

Starting point is 00:50:00 interest in something and you just kind of reach out to experts and bring them on for conversations, you can just share in this learning experience. I'm learning every show I do. I'm learning right along with the audience and the guests that come on. And it's just a really, really fun experience. And so I'm looking forward to covering some of the stuff. And I want to emphasize this. I'm still going to cover Bitcoin.

Starting point is 00:50:22 I'm still going to be bringing on guests to talk about Bitcoin as well. But it's going to be in addition to all these other things. And hopefully I'm able to kind of stitch it all together and provide the holistic picture is what I'm really trying to do of where we're going, man. Where are we going to go in this coming decade? It's going to be nuts. It's going to be fun. It's going to be fun. And it's going to be, I believe it's going to be a very abundant world for those that are moving.

Starting point is 00:50:47 moving away from that fear of the legacy fiat entrapment prison cell. And like Jeff said, the door is wide open for those that want to choose the walk out of it. So very exciting stuff. We're going to have a link to Jeff's book in the show notes. Anything else? You're not really active on X. You're more active on Noster these days from what I understand, Jeff, right? Any other highlights that you want to put out there or things that you want to promote?

Starting point is 00:51:12 No. No. Yeah. Just, I'm just looking forward to following you and you're learning it very much. on this. It's going to be fun to watch. Thanks, Jeff. Thank you so much for making time. Thank you. Thank you for listening to TIP.

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We Study Billionaires - The Investor’s Podcast Network - BTC251 : Tech Abundance w/ Jeff Booth

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