WEAPONIZED with Jeremy Corbell & George Knapp - The Battle for UFO Truth - The Michael Corleone Edition

Episode Date: April 30, 2024

WEAPONIZED is supposed be on hiatus, but recent bursts of gaseous emissions from the folks at AARO have made it difficult to lounge by the pool and sip frozen concoctions. The recent release of documents related to a proposed UAP-related program within Department of Homeland Security (DHS) was hardly a gesture toward transparency by AARO. In this unscheduled, unexpected episode of WEAPONIZED, Jeremy and George review the true history of the proposed Kona Blue program, what it could have accomplished, and how AARO's former boss has blatantly misled the public about whistleblower testimony allegedly related to Kona Blue. And what about those continuing drone incursions over sensitive U.S. military air space, the whitewashing of a UFO incident under investigation by members of Congress, and other assorted tidbits? It's a surprise episode inspired by Don Corleone. ••• Watch the three-part UFO docuseries titled UFO REVOLUTION on TUBI here : https://tubitv.com/series/300002259 ••• GOT A TIP? Reach out to us at [e-mail] For breaking news, follow Corbell & Knapp on all social media. Extras and bonuses from the episode can be found at https://WeaponizedPodcast.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Not more. One witness came to them and told them, I saw UFOs stashed in a hangar run by a program called Kona Blue because the program never existed. It was a prospective special access program, and we know some of the people involved with that. It never got off the ground. I did know about Jay Sands. You know, I've talked to him many times back in the day.

It's not something I could personally report on because there's, you know, what is the difference between verifiable information and not verifiable information? Secrets, cover-ups, and strange phenomena. UFOs and ideas that challenge reality itself. All these mysteries, all this time. Are we ever going to get to the bottom of these? My name is George Knapp. I dig into news stories that others can't or won't.

I'm Jeremy Corbell, and for some reason people tell me things they probably shouldn't. And this is weaponized. How many times it will be when I made this trip, do you think? It's got to be over-suffer-sendize. Over 60 at least. It might be closing in on 100, though. And this, our vehicle, the white steed known as Shadowfax, it knows the way without any help, right? Yeah, I don't even pay attention. The box itself is gone. And what do we have here?

Wait a second. I've seen that before. Hey, everyone, this is weaponized. Jeremy, I'm going to call this the Michael Corleone edition. Just when I think I'm out, they pull me back in. You know, we've been crying for a while. Why are we doing this? You know, man, I missed you. You know, there's so much going on in the UFO world. And, you know, sometimes I like to just step back and kind of look at it.

But you and I have these talks on like weekends where we're just going over everything, what we think about it. I figured let's record it, man. Let's just put out another weaponized. We're not in season two yet. But let's talk about it. You know, I haven't engaged a lot on social media on UFO topic. Other things may be things that I'm interested in.

but I've noticed it's sort of a downward spiral. People are in kind of bummed out since that Arrow report came out since Sean Kirkpatrick took a big dump on all things UFO related. And people are a little bit demoralized and they've lost their will to go on. And so of them say they're dropping out. And some have said that they think it's hopeless. And, you know, we've seen this before. You and I've talked about this before.

There are always peaks and valleys in this topic. We've been on a role, you know, the UFO community in general, the topic in general has been on a role since 2017, since that New York Times story, kicked things off and all the other things that have come out as a result of that. It's been mostly a peak. But, you know, this was going to come. It was going to happen that the Dark Empire strikes back and tries to dissuade the public, the media, and Congress from taking this seriously.

And they did a really good job. I mean, as we talked about, I think in our last episode, the last one of weaponized, this was a body blow and it was serious, but it's not a death blow. It's not the end of everything. It happens. So to people who are demoralized and a little bit out of sorts

because of what the government has done in response to all this interest, don't give up. You know, you and I, we were kind of in the same mind frame for a little while and needed to take a break. It's good to take a break from this once in a while and recharge the batteries, don't you agree?

Yeah, man, look, there's ebbs and flows with this topic. And I understand people's frustration. You know, everybody wants everything right now. The truth is, and you've seen this over the decades, there's always these highs and lows of what you can sink your teeth into and kind of dismantle and try to understand. But ultimately, as people say, this is a marathon. It's not a race.

It takes time. People need to be patient. They need to have grit. They need to stick with it. And be very methodical. about kind of how they analyze stuff. It's very clear that the programs that are going on to make people try to drop this subject are strong.

You see that with people that come forward and how they're kind of just roasted. So look, man, I think ultimately, we have to respond to what we know. We need to be able to verify stuff and respond to it. And sometimes there's more info, sometimes there's less. But I suspect, like always, there will be more coming.

Yeah, I mean, even now, which a lot of people out there in the UFO universe think is a down period, there's no, there's not much going on. There's a hell of a lot going on. Even in what is perceived as a lull, there's a hell of a lot going on that's important. And, you know, don't give up. There's a lot to talk about. There is progress being made. Not all of it is obvious.

But we're going to go over some of those items today. Yeah, well, I want to, you know, one of the big things that I saw, you know, drop. you've had prior knowledge to this. And, you know, this is kind of frustrating, but the Kona Blue UFO program is what people are calling it. I'll just start like this. You know, Kona Blue was a proposed program. And we got imagery of that proposal.

The first image was of a Hawaiian beach, right? It was really cool. Well, I got this text from a buddy of mine named Kirk. And he sent me an image from the North Shore of Hawaii. And it was right. that same image. And he was so stoked. He's like, Kona Blue is my backyard, baby. And so that image is from the North Shore of Hawaii. I don't know why they named it Kona Blue. I don't know that anybody we know knows why they named it Kona Blue. But that was a proposed special access program

that was supposed to really go forward into studying the UFO phenomenon and associated phenomena. Can you tell us a little bit about that? Because in your book, that proposal is everything but the name is in your last book with Dr. James Lackatsky and Dr. Column Calder. Before we go there, your buddy Kirk, who lives on Kona? Who is this? This is, okay, you're outing him as a UFO guy. This is Kirk Hammett from Metallica. Metallica.

I think we need to go visit your friend, Kirk, on Kona, and talk some UFOs, don't you? Maybe stay in his house for a week. He's got great, great music and great choice and subject matters. He's interested in UFO. Sorry to out your Kirk. I don't know if that's bad. Well, that's great.

That's a funny, you've shared that with me. That's a funny message to get. Kona Blue was just a codename for what would have been a successor to Osset. You recall that Robert Bigelow and his company Bass, a subsidiary of his Bigelow Aerospace Company, got a contract in 2008 from the Defense Intelligence Agency, the DIA. Dr. James Lekatsky, rocket scientists who had worked for DIA as an intelligence analyst for many years, highly respected, had taken a trip out to see Bigelow, went to Skinwalker Ranch, had an experience there, went back to D.C., engaged with Senator Harry Reid to get support for a UFO investigation, and he got it. They spent, they authorized $22 million. That's how much the budget was over a period of 27 months. And it was, in my estimation, the best, most honest, forest-reaching UFO program that we know of in the history of the U.S. government. They had 50 full-te investigators, they were really putting it together. And it was not only collecting something like 260,000 UFO cases from all over the world, from government databases, etc., put into this

data warehouse and analyze, but they had teams with boots on the ground. They'd send them to places like Skinwalker or places where really strange activities had happened. They created more than 100 highly detailed papers, analysis of all aspects of the UFO mystery, including the medical effects, consequences of people who got too close to these things, and suffered as a result. It was ambitious, it was successful, which is why it had to go. When, as we've reported before, when there was a letter that was sent to the Department of Defense, the Undersecretary, by Senator Harry Reid, the primary sponsor of the OSAP program, in which he asked for DOD to create a special access program, a SAP, turn ASAP into a SAP so that it was protected

from prying eyes so that people couldn't rate its budget, so he could do its work in private without a lot of fanfare and get to the bottom of this mystery or these mysteries, plural. It was great. It was a great proposal. It would have worked. But as soon as that word filtered out, the knives came out. People realized, holy crap, what's going on over there at DIA? We've got to put a stop to this.

Now, we haven't said a whole lot about this other than the interviews that we did on Weaponize with Jim Lackackackackenzie and Colin. him, Kelleher, but, you know, there was interest by some of these aerospace companies or one in particular in sharing the goodies. It's astonishing to me. We like to think of those big companies as the bad guys, but there were conversations between Bass and one or more of these major aerospace companies in which there was an agreement. They were going to give them some of that stuff. People with good memories might recall that as Bigelow was awaiting the completion of the contract with DIA, he did retrofitting a Bigelow Aerospace. He spent more than a million dollars of his own money

to prepare that plan to get ready to accept some of the good stuff materials. We all know what we're talking about. He anticipated getting it because he'd been told about it. He and his team had been told, it's real. You're going to get some because we've had it for a long time and we can't figure it out. That was the premise. Now, they never got the stuff. They never got the goodies. There's been a lot of confusion about that, but they found out it is real. It's out there. Not much progress has been made, and we'd like to take a crack at it. Never happened.

Once the plug was pulling that program, it was over. And it's sad because it was originally going to be a five-year program, and then they could have extended it. But if it had been allowed to continue, we might have some answers by now, because those are some really smart people. And they weren't limited to just military cases, not just UFOs. It's all the other mysteries that are related. very ambitious scope. Well, once that plug was pulled, Dr. Lekatsky, Dr. Colum Kelleher, and others started looking for a new home. DIA was not opposed to allowing that to find someplace else, taken off our plate. If somebody else wants it, great. So they figured out

that Department of Homeland Security, which is a relatively new organization back in that time frame, might be the place to go. So Cota Blue documents are now out. We'll talk about the reason I think it was released and made public by error. but the documents are now out. But this is a program that we described in great detail in our book Skin Walkers at the Pentagon. I mean, we explained how they were trying to sell it to DHS, what the response from DHS was, what they were going to do with that program. And then in that same book, there's an appendix in the back, Appendance 2,

that outlines exactly what it was going to do. And if you compare note for note what's been now made publicly available about Kona Blue, this code name program, you see that. that they are one and the same. Now, we put that out in the book and people ignored it. You know, they just largely, yeah, you know, yeah, that's really interesting. But I think because we did not have the name attached, they just kind of blew it off. Now that the name is attached, people are realizing, holy crap, that sounds a heck of a lot like that program that was described in this book. It is. It's the same thing. We were not allowed to publish the name Kona Blue.

That was one of the things that Dobser would not allow to go forward. But they allowed us to tell the story about what that program would have been, what it would have been, because it never happened. In Skinwalkers at the Pentagon, I think it's Chapter 17, Dr. Lekatsky, Keller, Howe put off, went to DHS. They had a briefing with Dr. Tara O'Toole, brilliant scientist, one of the head of hachos there, head of a division within DHS, and it was supposed to be a briefing about what this program could be, and it was a limited time frame. She's a busy, busy person, of course, but it went on and on for hours. And after they finished the formal briefing, then they kind of closed their books and their notes and really told her what was going on. The experiences at the ranch, the hitchhiker effect,

they were blown away. She and her aides were blown away, and it was basically, look, we think this sounds really promising. Let's go. So some of the same people who are working with Lakatski and Kelleher started going around to see if they could get materials. Will someone share with us the stuff that we know exists, but we've never been able to access before. And everywhere they went, and they knocked on the doors of the people they thought knew about it and had it. And everywhere they went, the doors, not only were they told no, but the doors were slammed in their face. And then the word starts filtering out. These guys are on the trail of the goodies. They're trying to get this stuff. We need to put a stop to it. And that's when opposition to Kona Blue really metastasized

and suddenly the plug was pulled on that before a program was ever created. The reason all this is really interesting is Arrow, I'm sure Sean Kirkpatrick, Dr. Kirkpatrick, the former director of Arrow, had a role in this because he's been crawling about it a little bit ever since. Arrow finagled the release of the Kona Blue documents. Even we didn't, we had reported in the book what it was and what it would be, what it could do, but we didn't report the name or any of the specific documents because we weren't authorized to do it. He somehow gets DHS to declassified it and release. it and tries to use it as a propaganda tool to discredit the witnesses who came forward to Arrow.

You know, there's a couple of dozen of people who came to Arrow in good faith, told them their stories, and now we now know that Arrow didn't believe any of them, that they just cut off their knees, discredited all of them, gave us a propaganda bullshit answer that says all UFOs are explainable, and if we only had more data, we'd explain everything by now every single case, which is a bunch of crap. What they said about Kona Blue is, these witnesses who came to Arrow, quite a few of them are confused. They're telling us about seeing crash retrievals, reverse engineering programs, and what they're really mentioning is Kona Blue. That is total bullshit.

Not one witness came to them and told them, I saw UFOs stashed in a hanger run by a program called Kona Blue, because the program never existed. They had no budget. They had no hangers. They had no buildings. They had no staff. it never existed. So there's no way in hell a witness came forward and told Arrow, yeah, I got all this information from Kona Blue.

It's bullshit. Yeah, there's a great article. We were recently talking with our friend Chris Sharp from Liberation Times, and he did a great article about Kona Blue that really breaks things down. And he put some quotes in there. Like Dr. Kropatrick said, this is what you're talking about. He said, we had several interviewees come in who named Kona Blue as the program that was housing the reverse.

engineering and non-human intelligence bodies of these craft. And that is absolutely not the case. Understood. So what you're saying is, and we've talked to people that have gone to Kirkpatrick, two Arrow, none of them ever claimed to us that Kona Blue was what they witnessed or they were part of. So what you're saying is this is a shell game and it's bullshit. You said this place was steps from the water.

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Hi. I, uh, let's get you a basket. Yeah, I mean, Arrow is not exactly real transparent. they're not exactly forthcoming in sharing files and information, especially stuff that was once classified with the public. They pretend to be, but they don't. They just release something for the sole purpose of using it as a propaganda tool. Now, as a student of propaganda, not a purveyor of it, I admire, in a sense, what they did because it was, it's effective.

It worked. It was a ruse that worked with mainstream media. Oh, yeah, that must be it. They were confused about this program, Kona Blue, that never went anywhere. it's just flat out untrue. And I think it really crystallizes what the public's opinion of Kirkpatrick should be is that he used that information

with a kernel of truth, made a broad generalization that was absolutely untrue and used it to discredit the subject. It's dishonest. It's just not on the level. It is highly, well, I'd like to say it's a regular, but it's part for the course for the Department of Defense on this topic.

It's really a crummy thing to do. And it was really crummy thing to do to those witnesses, all of whom came forward with different stories. People like Robert Salas, you've talked to him about, he was with the Minuteman missiles and the UFO nuke incidents. Dr. Bob Jacobs, I got to spend some time with him recently. He was involved with an incredible case where UFOs disabled what would have been the test flight of a nuclear missile. And it was on video and was recorded on film. Highly credible guy. There's backup material for his case. And they just wipe that out with a broad stroke of their hand like a magic wand. You know, I think there's some

confusion, Jeremy. Maybe you can help our audience understand. You know, you hear about David Grush, whose job it was to investigate these reverse engineering programs to find out where the stuff is, to talk to witnesses firsthand and to bring that information altogether. So he's been talking about like 40 people that he interviewed. We have heard there are something like 40 witnesses who went to Arrow. and I think a lot of people assume those 40 and those 40 are the same people. Are they? No, they're not. I mean, less than a handful of people that were part of the ICIG investigation.

I mean, we're talking less than a handful of people that David Grush interviewed or the ICIG went to Arrow. And there's major distrust of Arrow. And we actually saw that. Did you see those leaked or not leaked? Did you see those outed signal texts between Dr. Corpatrick and our friend Christopher Mellon? Yeah, that's scary. I mean, it's scary. Right.

So in those signal texts that kind of came out public, it shows the absolute distrust of firsthand whistleblowers of Kirkpatrick and Arrow. I mean, it's right there. You see that where there's some unnamed staffer who's corresponding with Kirkpatrick. And he's like, what is really? Rubio talking about because Rubio was talking about highly credentialed individuals with direct knowledge in these crash retrieval programs. And Kirkpatrick's like, who is he talking about? He was like texting this to the staffer.

And the staffer's like, he's talking about direct firsthand witnesses that don't trust you to come forward. And basically that's the essence of it. So it shows that there are people with this direct knowledge who decided not to go to Arrow. So when you talk about who went to Arrow, as far as the people that went to David Gras or David was able to go to and the people that went to the ICIG, I can confirm less than a handful of those people went forward to Arrow. So it's kind of like sad in some way because you want it all to go

forward. But I think for good reason, they know that Arrow is just a counterintelligence operation to look for leaks and plug them. These people who talk to Dave Grush and whose testimony has been shared with Congress, back closed doors with Congress and a few colleagues of ours, those people are savvy intelligence officers, people have worked at different places in government and for contractors, they know what the game is, and they did not go to Arrow. They knew they suspected from the get-go that this was not what it purported to be. It was not an honest investigation, and they were right. I did not begrudge the people who did talk to Arrow.

They went in in good faith. They hoped for the best. They gave their information. They worried that maybe it was not going to be taken. and seriously, and now those worries have been confirmed. This was a counterintelligence program. Some of our friends that we've talked to who've worked in intelligence circles on UFO matters have said this was a master's stroke by Kirkpatrick.

It is a counterintelligence program. He gets people to come forward. They come out of the woodwork. He gets to find out what they know, where stuff is, according to them. And then he not only undercuts them, but I'm sure it alerted the keepers of the secrets of where their weaknesses are. They now know what the UFO community knows, and I'm sure it allows them to plug a lot of leaks. And further, they used the information they did get. They distorted the conclusions. They used it as a bludgeon with mainstream media.

Mainstream media does not want to cover this topic. You know, that's the way it's been for 60, 70 years. They would use any, you'll get an occasional story here and there, but really they're not comfortable with it. And now they have a whole new reason to walk away from it, which is what they've done New York Times, Washington Post. There might be some stories down the road or something, but in general, there's a serious investigative story. They're done with it, which is what they've always felt like doing. I think Kirkpatrick, also his primary goal, as we talked about in our last weaponized,

is to get Congress off their ass, to make Congress less interested in it. You know, they've always got higher priorities. There's Ukraine. There's a battle over the who's going to be the Speaker of the House. There's aid to Israel and Gaza mess and all kinds of high priorities that are more pressing than UFOs. This gives them a reason to move on. You know, there's a cadre of people that we know there who are not going to move on. They're still interested, and we can get in that. But the other ones who generally don't consider it a priority now have a good reason to go on. It's an

election year, for gosh sakes. So I do have to take my hat off to Kirkpatrick in that it was a master's stroke of propaganda and political intrigue. And he did a number on the UFO community. but it wasn't a knockout blow and we're not done. Right. And so I want to back up one second just to be really clear to everybody because I think there was some confusion. So Kona Blue was never an active UFO program. It was a prospective special access program. And we know some of the people involved with that. It never got off the ground. But it was where we needed to aim if we were going to have a really great program. Now, when it was being proposed, and this is said in your book, but also, So we know independently this to be true is that Department of Homeland Security staff that they were convinced after those meetings with those contractors that advanced technology was sequestered under government supervision facilities.

And I want to be very specific here because there's evidence to back this up. But you and I know that it was Lockheed was one of the main companies that wanted to divest their UAP materials or craft into, let's say, Kona Blue, would have been a. a good home for it. And one of the things that David Gresh said on the Rogan podcast, and I have his exact words, he says, Lockheed Martin wanted to divest itself from this material at a specific facility that's known to me that I provided to the inspector general like street address. So you've got a guy who did the investigation, provided that to the inspector general and said, here is the street address of where this UFO material is being held. So we have to wonder what specifically is the morphology or the look of this UFO material? It leads me back to, and again, Chris Sharp wrote a great article about this and everybody should read it in Liberation Times.

It reminds me of what James, Dr. James Lekatsky said to us on weaponized for the first time. I mean, he admitted verbally that they had a craft of unknown origin, a UAP, but he describes a little bit of detail of what it looked like. Can we assume that this craft that, Dr. Lakatsky has direct first-hand knowledge of is exactly what Lockheed has. I don't know, but let's hear what he said. This is a quote from Dr. Lakatsky. This craft had a streamlined configuration suitable for aerodynamic flight, but no intakes,

no exhaust, no wings or control surfaces. In fact, it appeared not to have an engine, fuel tanks, or fuel. You know, is this what they were hoping to get to study from Lockheed? Do you know? Yeah. Yes. In a word, yes. You know, I know that people like to look at Lockheed as part of the evil empire and then the bad guys who've been hiding this stuff for a long time.

You know, that's a great company. They've done some amazing things. I live in the shadow of a lot of their handiwork, Area 51, you know. That's the place they've used to keep our country safe, to preserve order in the world, in a sense, with these amazing platforms they've developed. that is where I would send the goodies if I had them. Send to Lockheed, see what they can do. I don't think they've made a lot of progress with trying to figure this technology out or with reverse engineering, the specific craft.

But, you know, they recognized, I think, that they needed some help. And when Bass comes along in the DIA and says, we'd like to take this on, Lockheed was willing to give them the stuff. They deserve a pat on the back for that, not our hatred and discord. But it didn't happen because higher-ups, the people who are the agencies that have overseen this stuff, stepped in and said, no, no, no, you're out of your mind. Stop that right in its tracks. What about this conspiracy theory from the FOIA stuff about Lakatsky's AOSAP emails being deleted? You know, all of a sudden intentionally deleted, all of Dr. Lekatsky's UFO ASAP emails from government.

Do you think that's a big conspiracy? or what do you think? No, I don't. And I haven't asked him directly. He has not given me a response to it, but I got a sort of a general sense. He's my co-author and friend for several years. But I think this is just a routine purging of emails

for somebody who's been gone for 10 years. The DOD, like other government agencies, they don't save everything forever. I know that Lou Elizondo, who has been there, he was with the DOD much more recently, then Lekatsky, his emails are already gone. And there might be something a little on a sinister side about that. But Lekatsky's stuff is gone because he's been gone for all these years. So I think probably if they'd thought about it, they would have dumped all that stuff anyway just so people couldn't get it by FOIA,

that those are records they'd want to get rid of. But I don't see a sinister hand here. I think it's just gone because he's been gone. I want to mention Lou Alexander real quick. So I've been, excited to see, I mean, I've really, I stay away from social media, but people have been, you know, sending me, he's been tweeting more. And I love that. I love to hear what Lou Elizondo has to say. I'm glad that he's kind of, you know, unleashed now a little bit and he can be on, I don't know what's going on, but he can be on Twitter more. Look, Lou has a big story to tell. I think that it's important, the position that he did have that we get to hear what he has to say. I know he's got some projects like a book or coming out soon or something. That's awesome.

So I was really glad to see that he was tweeting more and kind of putting information out. I did notice I watched the John Oliver special on UFOs. Let me just tell you. People were pissed, right? The available I thought it wasn't great. Look, it's a social commentary show that uses comedy. It's not like as deep dive they could get. I was like, he talks about everything.

Why isn't he talking about UFOs? Finally, we got a John Oliver UFO special. And I don't think it was as negative as people think. I did see, I didn't, somebody said they didn't portray Lou well and all this stuff. Look, it's a comedy show. I was glad that they covered it. It's not just a comedy show. It's got social narrative.

It's a cool show. It's a thoughtful show, whether you agree with it or not. So when they covered UFOs, I just thought it was interesting that they were basically saying, we need more of both sides. We need more scientific analysis and not going two, four. on one side or the other. So I didn't agree with everything he said. I mean, they kind of made some joke about, you know, the drones,

drawn, arms, and that kind of thing. But at least they covered it. And it's being talked about in pop media. Did you see it? I haven't seen it. I've been told about it. I saw they were teasing it. People on UFOX, UFO Twitter were saying, oh,

here it comes. It's going to be bad. And then people who watched it sent me some notes saying, you're in it. Oh, no. But I like John Oliver. I like that show. It's funny.

It's thoughtful. When I heard that they spent like a year working on a UFO special, I thought, well, that's great. But a year isn't really enough time to get your head around it. You know, no matter who you are, it takes a lot longer to figure this stuff out than just working randomly here and there for a year. It's complicated, as you know. But I want to watch it. I'll watch it this weekend and see what he says. I have no problem with people having four.

fun with the UFO topic. It has been fodder for comedians forever, making fun of the crazy UFO people. It's like fish in a barrel. It's pretty easy. Getting into the heart of the matter, into the real beef of the matter and the mystery is a lot harder and takes a lot of time. So if they're giving a platform that says both sides, we need more information, that's great. I have no problem with that. I mean, that was my takeaway. Sometimes I hear what I want to hear with that kind of said, but that was my takeaway. I did talk with Commander Fravor because they called him and they said, oh, they wanted to make sure that they weren't misrepresenting him. And I thought that was great.

Like, when does a show call somebody when they put their image up and ask if they're misrepresenting them? So, uh, Fravor said, look, you know, it's the best we can expect from a format like that. And I get it. But I'm just glad we're having the conversation. But one thing I want to focus on, it was kind of for a comedic element, but towards the end of the show, he's talking about the USS Russell.

We call it the green footage where, you know, triangle, an angle of observation. quote pyramid and classified documents of people we've spoken with. It's an ongoing debate. You know, what are the shapes of this USS Russell thing? And he plays a clip from the one of the hearings, right, where they had Bray and Moultrie up and basically uses it as a comedic vehicle to say sometimes it's really simple stuff. And they talk about the shape of the object in it, you know, is it bouquet or what? And, you know, it dawned on me at that.

moment that we all got kind of sucked into that bullshit. By saying, taking one piece of footage and trying to use the lowest hanging fruit, you're trying to dismiss the entirety of what we reported on. We didn't just put out one video, man. Look, ultimately, I don't know that shape is the most important thing. The most important thing is that there were hundreds or over, over a hundred unknown units that were swarming 10 Navy warships in 2019 off the West Coast of California. We provided thermal footage. We provided IR. We provided radar.

We provided deck footage. We provided witnesses that were firsthand testimony of active military that were there. We did all of this, I think, in episode two of weaponized, and everybody should go back to episode two of weaponized and watch that. And look, also, we're reporting when we said those, you know, by angle by angle of observation, pyramid in shape, people thought we made that up until we released documents. And those documents were what we were reporting off of. All we can do is report on what we have obtained, right? So we obtained those documents and we reported on it. And then even further so, we did an interview with the guy who had the investigation, your friend,

Jay Stratton. And he came on camera and he even after that congressional hearing said, look, I've had optical physicists, look at this. We believe that the image, what you're seeing was the shape of the object. But again, we're getting caught in the shape thing. And I'm so at the point where I don't give a fuck anymore. What I care about is don't lose sight of the entirety of the event. We're talking about drone swarms. And again, the word drone, right?

That just means unmanned is the idea of remote control, but whose units were they? And I'm not making a claim that they're from Zeta reticulae. What I'm saying is these are true UAP because we don't know who operated them. We don't know where they came from. We don't know where they went. And they were pretty damn big. I mean, the estimate was about 12 to 14 feet in diameter at least. So look, I just want to bring people back in because it kind of sparked me after watching the John Oliver thing, which is this swarm thing about UAP is really important.

And that brings us to a couple of things. One is the Langley Air Force Base UAP swarms that just recently. Langeley Air Force space has been penetrated. The airspace has been penetrated by unknowns. And of course, they're blinking lights. This is not a new phenomenon, the white, green, and red. Merrick, he's a guy on, that works for the Hill. He's a great thinker on this.

He wrote a great article in the Hill, bringing people into this kind of drone or UFO, alarming incursions demand answers. That's the title of his article in the Hill. And what I found so interesting about his article was he talks about the Langley incursions. And this is important. You've got a military area being penetrated by these unknowns and they can't find them. But he also brought us back in history. And he talks about how some of these were transmedium, the footage you and I obtained in release in 2019.

But also he goes all the way back to, I think, 1965 when there were these encouraging. of UAP that we're moving in the same way as what we're seeing now that people are calling drones, right? And they're described by witnesses as having these lights. So the same characteristics in 1965 over near nuclear facilities is what we're seeing with all these incursions. Now, we didn't have the same tech in 1965. So it's so fascinating to me that we can label everything drone and like the drive is great at that. They always label. everything a drone. It's amazing. But they're missing the point again. What does drone mean? It just means unmanned. It doesn't resolve who these are, what the intent is, how they can

operate the way that they operate all the way back from 1965 or beyond or further up to date. So I encourage people to read that article by Merrick in the Hill because it was really illuminating. Yeah, he does some really good work. I'm impressed by the stuff that he's done. And he's, he stayed on it. We're going to have to, if we do a future version of weaponized our podcast. We're going to have to get him on the show and pick his brain a little bit. You mentioned that we do not claim that these drones are from Zeta reticuli. That's true. Well, we're also sort of giving you a pretty strong indication that they're not from Walmart or Radio Shack either. You didn't just go buy a hobby kid and make these

and send them out 100 miles off the Pacific Coast and buzz all these warships over many, many hours. and then you come out of nowhere and you disappear, ho-hum. It's just drones, don't worry about it. And it's not just the 2019 instance, you said, as Langley. These incursions have been gone all a long time. We have no idea where they are from, and they are flying into our most sensitive airspace. That's a big deal.

It's a really big deal that we don't know where they're from, what they're doing, and we can't seem to do anything about it. You recall also, was it 2019, 2020, these mystery drones flying in formation in Colorado and in those surrounding states. Again, you know, hundreds of people, maybe thousands of people saw them. There are videos. Not one of those cases was ever resolved. Aren't you just a little bit curious, Department of Defense, who's flying this stuff around? The idea of like, you know, don't worry about it. It's just drones. You know, that's pretty darn serious when they're making these incursions unimpeded at places like Langley Air Force Base.

Yeah. And you bring up the Nebraska. swarms of these drones. And this is covered in Merrick's article. And I think that's really important because he actually pulled quotes from FAA officials, you know, saying, you know, things like that he says there,

there are several reports that indicate the drones are operating in coordination with a big drone. So this is an FAA emails. So what's interesting is they also called it like a mothership. So with, when they were doing the, when they were, Nebraska was seeing these 30 to 50, the swarm of unidentified, there seemed to be another object

that these things were being deployed from. It really reminds me of Commander David Fravor and the Tic Tac, a series of events that went on for weeks. I mean, this is not a Tick-Tac. This is dozens and dozens dropping down from 80,000 feet to sea level like that. So the thing is, his report was that something was under the water. The water was churning. It was as if these things we're docking. So it makes you wonder if there is a source of these, are these mobile sources, you know, rather than just being a ship or something like that, is this weird? If we have something under the water, these things are docking with. And then also, if we had something in the air when it comes to Nebraska, these things are coming out of. I mean, that relates to

the UFO history that we've heard all along, that these smaller objects are deployed by bigger objects. Look, I don't know. I just know that this has been going on a long time. So I guess when we look at this whole idea of unknown objects, flying with impunity and a restricted airspace, we need to continue to ask the questions of what is going on. And I just don't know the next path forward for that. I just don't know. When you need to build up your team to handle the growing chaos at work,

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At First Citizens Bank, we roll with your goals because we're built for what you're building. Fit for your ambition for Citizens Bank. Well, I know what one path should have been. It should have been the path that Kona Blue was trying to take us on. If that plug had not been pulled, if that had gone forward, that would have been amazing. I mean, we would have some answers or at least have more information by now. You know, in Chris Sharp's article and in Skinwalkers at the Pentagon, it's sort of laid out

what this program would have done. And again, as with OSAP, they don't say it's UFOs. They don't use the term UAP. fly and saucers from Zeta Reticuli, they're using very generic language because they don't want to draw attention to what it is, and they don't want to scare off

their potential client of saying, we're studying little green men and they're flying saucers. So they were going to identify emerging technology and to evaluate potentially disruptive changes in technology.

Technologies that are more advanced than what we know exists. I mean, identifying that technology and calling it potentially disruptive is a better way to speak about this issue than to just call them UFOs in official government documents. DHS was a little leery about getting involved in UFOs. So in what Lekatsky and Kelleher presented to them is, here's the legitimate reason why DHS should be involved. There are threats to homeland security from these technologies.

Plus, and they make the point in the Kona documents that were released and made public, look, if we can figure this stuff out, we get a leg up on all of our opponents. So it's not just getting answers to a scientific mystery. It is in trying to duplicate and expand that technology to give us a competitive edge against China, Russia, and all of our adversaries. That was a really good thing. So in addition, you got, you had a data collection program, a division in Kota Blue. You had an experimental division that presumably they would have worked on these meta materials and craft, try to figure out how they worked. There was a medical division that would have continued to evaluate harmful effects, how people are harmed by these

close encounters. And of course, we know that Bass created a pretty big report on those with more than 100 instances where they did medical follow-up. And then I think in the appendix, in Skinwalkers are depending on, I don't want to make this just a plug for the book, but in that appendix, they describe what they really like to do, which was to have a consciousness division. You know, a UFO world, we're always hearing people talks around that buzzword, consciousness. I think that's the way of the future research is going to be. And nobody really understands how that fits together. But people like Robert Bigelow, Colin Keller, James Lekatsky, do understand it.

And that's where they wanted to take OSAP. And when ASAP was killed, that's where they wanted to take Kona Blue. Robert Bigelow walked away from the UFO mystery. I think he's still interested. But he's putting his money into consciousness research because he thinks, that's where the goodies are. That's where we're really going to get an understanding of this mystery and related mystery. So that's why he sort of moved on. But that's what Kona Blue would have done. If that had been allowed to go forward, it would have been an amazing program. It's still possible to do this. And if you, I know it's been a while since you read that book, Jeremy, but in that appendix, too, after they described how the program would work and what they would hope to accomplish, Colum and Jim Lackatsky came up with the opinion that it has to be privately funded. that it's just not going to work government funding because there's always going to be this kind of sneaky maneuvering

to try to pull the plug, to put a cap on it, to put limits on where they can go and the kind of investigations they can conduct, and then to hide whatever papers are produced. I mentioned at the beginning of our conversation today, OSAP produced more than 100 of these highly technical reports. The public has not seen one page that stuff. You can probe about FOIA

and how everything is transparent all you want, but more than, there's thousands and thousands of pages and these more than 100 reports, and we have not seen one bit of it. The public is always crying for more data. We need more hard data. We wrote an entire book filled with hard data called Initial Revelations, the follow-up to Skinwalkers of the Pentagon, and it goes case by case, pulls these incident reports from the data warehouse,

a lot of them from the 50s and 60s, long before drones were available. to the general public. These are not drones, but these cases were significant. They were well documented. They are inexplicable. In some cases, they have severe national security implications. In some cases, the witnesses had severe medical effects, harmful effects, good cases, pre-dron era, all kinds of technical and engineering data, and the world largely ignored it. I mean, there it is. You're always crowing about wanting more data. There it is, and people aren't paying attention to it. Yeah, man. And it's, you know, we do it to ourselves in a lot of ways. I mean, we have these, these, you know, alien mummies that come out. We got that Las Vegas, you know, shadow creatures. And when it's just like the light, you know, that the guy's holding on the fence, we do, you know, there's a sensational aspect to a lot of this that really captures people's imaginations, but ends up being, you know, kind of harmful to the discussion, I guess, of what we're talking about. So it's just kind of like, it's really hard to separate sometimes the good information

from the bad, especially when you're being targeted like we are with a bunch of BS and we have to really sift through because we get these stuff sent to us all the time. There is a case, though, that I think is so interesting. It's the Eggland Air Force Base UAP analysis by Arrow. Like they put out an analysis. This is a great example of a solid case that was just dismissed like swamp gas and, you know, hot air balloons by Arrow. Did you see Arrow's report on that? And I should tell people what the Eglin Air Force Base UAP is. Yeah, I did see it. It was it was preposterous and laughable of what they wrote and tried to just slough this off. But it was very typical of what Arrow has done in its short history. Right. So Egland Air Force Base or near Eglin Air Force Base,

there was a pilot. He observed four objects. He captured one on his thermal cameras. He described the shape as as what I'm calling like an upside down ice cream cone like it was a ball on the bottom and then kind of like a I don't want to say it like a pyramid on top right so like a like a cone and kind of like one of the the lunar reentry vehicles or something like that so he's describing this and I guess he got some some Congress involved and kind of told about it showed the images he talked about there being like blurry air at the bottom like a heat differential the color was gray with like paneled surface and an orange or red coloring in the center in like a strip. His radar, he said malfunctioned, all this stuff.

So Arrow came out, wrote a report saying nothing to see here, move on. It was probably a commercial lighting balloon and, you know, made these ridiculous statements. If you actually read through, it's just like, well, it could have looked like this. If the balloons hemisphere had seems, it could have appeared. to the observer as like paneling. I mean, come on. It was just like a total dismissal of this pilot. And then it was funny because our buddy Merrick,

we've been talking about, he wrote that it was like total nonsense because he actually called the Florida-based company that makes those high-end industrial products. And they told them that it was certainly not one of their items that those things don't come untethered randomly. Remember, there were four of them. They said in like a diamond shape.

It's just one of those things that you get, get a case like that that should be looked at and you have an organization like Arrow that is completely swamp gassing the public and dismissing it. Yeah, I mean, let's go back. I don't know a lot of the details. You know four more than I do on the instance, but we remember when it first came to the public's attention, it's because of Representative Matt Gates and Representative Luna. Yeah.

They, along with our friend Tim Burchett, they're ultra-conservative members of Congress. and, you know, we don't have to necessarily agree with them on every issue, but they're deeply interested in the UFO mystery, and they've been pressing forward on it and demanding some answers. And they got wind of this instance, and they went down to Florida, and they wanted a briefing, right? They said, hey, let us see this stuff. We want to talk to the pilot, and the Air Force just kind of like this to them,

which really ticked them off. Am I correct? Yeah, I mean, that is correct. and it was, you know, essentially they were not going to let them talk to them or anything. And yeah, of course you piss them off. When you're told you're not allowed to hear or know about something and there's just cloak of secrecy around it, you want to know. It did piss them off.

And to this day, this is the same thing. It's just like cover up about this stuff, man. Yeah. Okay, this is a balloon. And balloon is one of the favorites. Balloons, swamp gas, you know, seagulls, all that stuff. They roll out the golden oldies to explain these things away. But this balloon has four elements to it.

they're supposedly untethered. They're traveling together in a formation. They're untethered and they're there where they're stationary. That's what the pilot supposedly said. They were stationary for a while. It doesn't sound like a balloon. I mean, I joked on X. I said, well, maybe it's the mogul balloon that's been flying around up there since

1947, you know, because, I mean, that it's preposterous. So Matt Gates, I don't know. I know you're staying off social media. Matt Gates, I think last night that we're recording this on Saturday, responded to this. that this is, you know, he was pretty outraged all over again about what a bullshit response this was, and it does not fit the facts that he knows exist in this case. So I think we should also talk about a lot of people have been asking you or me, you know,

what about this Jay Sands guy? Have you heard about this J. Sans guy? You know, I saw some headlines like whistleblower comes out on a Twitter spaces or something like that. And, you know, a lot of people are just asking, what do you think about this guy? And so I think it's important that we at least touch upon this. Like, look, man, I did know about Jay Sands. You know, I've talked to him many times back in the day. It's not something I can personally report on because there's, you know, what is the difference between verifiable information and not verifiable information, you know, to my satisfaction. And I think to yours as well, that it is verified that Jay Sands worked in the positions that he says that he worked in, that he was part of the intelligence community.

I'm not sure what has been said publicly, but, you know, absolutely, he worked in the intelligence community and currently does. So the guy has security clearances and has worked in the capacity as he said. In specifically, specifically, he worked as a red hat, which is like a counterintelligence at Area 51. He was intercepting communications. So this is a guy that would have heard the internal chatter from some of the most secretive programs that are, that our country has. And that is validated that that was his job. I can validate that for you.

That is that is correct information. I can also validate that he's testified to Senate Select Committee on Intelligence to the Senate Armed Services Committee and the and the House Armed Services Committee. So he did come forward with information. And I've talked to some people in those capacities and they're like, yeah, with what we could verify, he did have some knowledge of the, um, legacy UFO programs. And I thought that was interesting because some of his other claims, you know, they're very hard to digest for the average person. He made some really astounding

personal claims of encounters, none of which I could ever validate or verify. So for me, there's nothing I can do with them. You know, he could come forward with that story, but just like any other credible person can come forward with a story, a firsthand direct contact with a ET or non-human intelligence. There's just nothing much I can personally do. with it. It wasn't a story that I felt I could run with. So it's a complex situation. I'm not sure what to make of it. How about you, George? Well, you know, you had told me about him that you'd been having these conversations with him and you wanted to bring me in. That was more than a year ago. Maybe it's a year and a half or so. Yeah. And we finally had a real long,

uh, detailed talk with him where he laid out his story for me as well as to you. And so I was able to ask him some questions. And so much of the key, our incidents that he talked about, were here in Nevada. Yeah. So I know a lot about that base where he worked. And, you know, there were questions I could ask that gave me a sense of, did he really work there? And the answer is yeah.

I know that Jay has been, well, Jason is how ever, everyone else uses the name, but Jay to us, that he has been dismayed in that he's really been ripped apart on UFO, Twitter, and acts in social media, which happens to anybody who come forward. That's part of the, that's part of the whole shebang. he's upset, I think, what I was told, because people like you and I have not come forward to defend him. Well, you know, the agreement we had with him was that we're not going to talk about it. He shared his story with us with the understanding that we weren't going to go forward.

We're not going to do an issue of weaponized on his story, that he had already made agreements to keep buttoned down for a while. You know, people don't know that there's tremendous competition for UFO whistleblowers and witnesses in the journalism world. The people who are considered credible who investigate this stuff, when they hear about a witness, they want to wrap them up. I want him to be my witness for my film or my book. And there's a lot of competition there. So by the time you and I were getting into the nitty gritty with him, he'd already made some agreements about where his story was going to break. That's fine. It's fine with us.

We weren't going to spill it. You know, I think that I'm not surprised that Jay's story is now out. I am surprised that it took this long to come out. Because I think you have the same feeling. He wanted to tell the world about what he had seen and what he had done. He was anxious back then, right? Yeah, I mean, the first thing I tell people when they come to me is, look, you know, I trust but need to verify.

And I'm not making movies on this stuff. I'm not going to, like, you know, put you in something. So I always kill that right away. Like if you're looking for somebody to like back you up, I'm not the guy, right? So I just like, but if you want to tell me what you said or what happened, I'll listen to it. But again, George, I just so much of it for me, I'm not passing judgment on it. It just I couldn't verify it. So I couldn't verify the specifics of the encounter that he says he had at every 21.

So how am I to know better than anybody else if that is an actual event or not? So I can't get up and defend somebody when I can't verify anything. anything. What I can say is I've talked to people within government that he's testified to, not about his personal experience, but about his knowledge of legacy UFO program. And that stuff, everything that could be verified was checked out. So he had some type of exposure to the legacy UFO stuff, even if it's just overhearing it on the radio by name, doing his counterintel. He had some accurate information. So again, look, this subject is never, easy. It's complicated. And I'm not standing here saying, I everything somebody says, I'm behind what they

said, big thumbs. I can't do that. I can tell you what I've verified, what I haven't verified. And that's all that I verified is that he had some knowledge. Not even, to be honest, not even a lot. Like there are people with direct firsthand hands-on experience who won't go to Kirkpatrick and to Arrow. And those individuals, if they ever come forward, I mean, that is verifiable, awesome information about UFO programs. But look, it takes kind of like, it's like a prism. If you can get verified information from a huge panel of people on what's going on, it's going to paint a much clearer picture. So, yeah, man, that's all I get to say about it.

There's nothing more I can say because I can't verify anything. So look, this brings me back to those text messages or whatever from our pal, Christopher Mellon. One of the things that was written, he has this inside guy who's basically like, infiltrate in the crash retrieval program, it sounds like, and he's reported back to Chris, and it says, right now, we haven't gone that far back. We're dealing with the recovered UAP that landed in Kingman, Arizona in the 50s. We're vacuuming up info as gets, as so-and-so gets read in. We now know the management structure and security control system and ownership of the

crash retrieval. We also know who recovers landed or crashed UAPs, And under what authorities? We also know that a still highly classified memo by a secretary of the U.S. Air Force in the 1950s is still in effect to maintain the cover on UAPs. I just thought this was like the coolest because they're talking about direct knowledge of UAP crash retrieval programs. I mean, that's a bombshell, that text that came out, right? Absolutely.

And of course, it's something near and dear to my heart. They're talking about the Kingman incident that I've reported on over the, the years, you know, I think people, if they're interested in the topic, you have to learn the history. And there is a lot of subterfuge and there's some misinformation in that whole Kingman scenario and witnesses who are not really trustworthy. But in essence, there is a core story there. There were hundreds of UFOs in that general area seen within the days of that incident. There were these giant special radar installations in Kingman that presumably could have had some effect on the navigational capabilities of these craft wherever they're from.

There were three objects that crashed around Kingman, according to the witnesses. There was a guy, the late Harry Drew, put together a book that I think fewer than 10 people in the world have even seen it. But he did really the heavy lifting on Kingman, and he convinced me that this was legit, that there really was a program there, that military units were out there in the desert. He dug up the military rations that have been thrown away where they camped. They were there to recover. these materials and presumably took that stuff to a certain little location in Nevada,

not that far from my home, I think that case is legit. And I think that could be exactly what's being discussed in those signal messages that went back and forth with Chris Mellon. Well, look, I mean, I'm hoping that more and more of these direct firsthand whistleblowers will come forward. But we see their hesitation to come forward to Arrow. So it's like easy way or hard way. If they're not going to go the easy way, are they going to push into the public realm, you know, through journalists, through media, through leaks?

I don't know. I mean, I've seen people fluctuate a lot of like what it means to them to come forward. Like, crack the egg is what I'm told. I don't want to be the one to crack the egg. So it's really undetermined how these people that are known to some journalists now that are not publicly known yet, right? Are they going to come forward? And it seems undetermined. I guess it depends on protections.

But I do want to ask you, you just did a news report. And the report was retouching upon a friend of yours, who you've known for a long time, who was raided by OSI and FBI. And we don't know exactly why. Can you tell us about that real quick? Sure. No one goes to Hank's for his spreadsheets. They go for a darn good pizza.

Lately, though, the shop's been quiet. So Hank decides to bring back the $1 slice. He asks co-pilot in Microsoft Excel to look at his sales and costs. To help him see if he can afford it. Co-pilot shows Hank where the money's going and which little extras make the dollar slice work. Now, Hanks has a line out the door. Hank makes the pizza. Co-Pilot handles the spreadsheets.

Learn more at M365 copilot.com slash work. Your Garnu, so people are wondering what you and I have been up to. You know, we do have lives other than weaponized. and one of my alter egos is a reporter for KLS TV. I'm still the chief investigative reporter there, and I like to dip my toes into the waters once in a while and get back to work as a journalist for KLAS. And this is a story I've been wanting to update for a long time.

In November of 2022, two homes owned by Yorg Arnau and naturalized American citizen were raided by FBI and OSI agents. early in the morning, they surround his home up in Rachel, which is just outside of Area 51. They kick in the doors. They have guns drawn. They put him in handcuffs, hauling him out the car, go through everything in his house. They took every computer, every hard drive, every phone, every photograph, all kinds of digital data, anything they could find. And they took it away. And then they put him under an intense interrogation for several hours, asking him about what was on his site, how images are put on Dreamlandresorts.com. That's the website he's had for

the last 20 years. It's a digital clearinghouse to discuss all things UFO, area that do unrelated. It's not a UFO site, and York is not a UFO guy. I think he's more on the skeptical side about whether this alien tech was ever out there than about a desert, but still he's open to hearing about it. And his members all share information about what might be flying around in the skies over Airy 51 and throughout the Nellus test range. Something that appeared on his site seems to have irked OSI, Office of Special Investigations. He doesn't know what it is. But when they kicked in the door, that's where their questions were about.

Now, there is a search warrant, a federal search warrant for that location and another one for the location in Las Vegas that we'll talk about in second. And the first 39 pages of that search warrant were not released. they're not accessible even to York, Arnou, who is the target of the search warrant and the target of the investigation. He does not know how he crossed the line. He does not know if there was an image

or a video that really ticked them off where he is showing something that he shouldn't. But here's what he's always said to me. If I've got something on there, there shouldn't be there. I'll take it down. Just let me know. You don't have to kick in the door and hold a gun to my head. He said the agents were there. It was OSI that sort of led the charge on the

interrogation, and the agents were there were asking him, is this place booby-trapped? Are we going to have an explosion in here? It's booby-trap. I'm not a terrorist. I'm a retiree. I'm living out here in Rachel, in a sense, to get away from the world. I like to share information and talk about Area 51 and what's going on out there. Though I'm not a spy. I'm not a terrorist. I wouldn't cross a line. I'm not sending my drone over the line into Area 51. Anything I have is recorded it from public lands. And if I can see it on public lands, then sure as hell, the Russians or Chinese or Israelis or wherever else has spies out there, they can certainly see it. In fact, as he put it to me, if you want images of what goes on out at Area 51 or S4, Google Earth does a much

better job than we do. We climb up on Tikaboo Peak, 26 miles away, look through binoculars and take these photos the best we can do. But Google looks right down on it. They can see it a lot better the weekend. So, you know, the idea that he has somehow endangered national security by putting stuff on his website seems a little far-fetched, but these agents were pretty pissed off. They came in in force. They weren't sure what they were going to encounter, and I probably, they looked at him like a foreign-born spy or something. And as he learns after hours of these people going through his place, at the same time that that search warrant happened, was carried out by the FBI and OSI. His home in Las Vegas, he has a second home where his girlfriend, Karen

Hello, lives. They kicked in the door there. They came in and took everything again. He figures they took about $20,000 worth of equipment, computers, hard drives, things of that sort, cameras. It included his medical records. It included photos of his dead family, his mom and dad were gone. It included all the information and data that he's used to create Dreamlandresorts.com, and it took them all away. And he's probably never going to get it back. His lawyer has said, look, we don't know what we did wrong.

They have five years to consider whether they will press charges or not. But the chances are, it's highly likely that there's not going to be any charges. It seemed to them, and maybe seems to me, that the intimidation was the point, that they wanted to say,

loud and clear, to the Area 51 community, you can't do this stuff that you've been doing, and if you go a step too far, we'll come for you. You better be careful about it. Now, you recall, Jeremy, a couple of years ago for Mystery Wire, we had this guy somehow got permission to fly over Area 51 and take a camera alone, or at least he was able to, you got permission to fly over it, whether he had permission to do the camera or not, but we put all this stuff on Mystery Wire. It also went up on

on Dreamlandresorts.com, and it was amazing video and images of Area 51, Papus Lake. I think maybe it's possible that something in those images, they saw something they shouldn't have seen. And then when Yorg puts it up on his site, he doesn't know what it might be. That is at least one possible suspect of what really ticked them on. I would just add this further. So they had about a dozen agents there in Rachel. They had about a dozen more in Las Vegas, guns drawn, handcuffs, interrogations, you know, FBI is really good at this stuff. And I hate being on the side where you're bashing the FBI.

I don't like that because I work with them so many times over the years on really important things and investigations and good work that the Bureau has done. I think this was an OSI program. I think that the impetus came from them, that OSI reached out to the FBI and said, we need some help. You guys are good at this stuff. Can you come along? OSI is the father of this intimidation effort.

York is likely never going to know what it was that put him in jeopardy. It's possible he could still be prosecuted, but highly unlikely. You'll recall that about 20 years ago, the same thing had happened to Chuck Clark. He'd been the UFO Area 51 watchdog before York got there. He lived up in Rachel. He'd take people out on tours. He'd take pictures. He had an Area 51 visitors guy that he published, a very knowledgeable guy.

He had called me up one day and said, look, I've got these scanners that I've developed where they can pick up sensor systems that are out on public land. Not something inside Area 51, miles and miles away on public land, BLM land. They put these sensors by the road that will alert Area 51 security when somebody is going to be driving down there. This is public land. You can drive anywhere you want. It's legal. You can take photos all you want. You can hike.

You can camp. So this idea that they can put sensors on public land is a little bit outrageous. So he showed me how it worked. We went up and Matt Adams and I went up, took a camera along, and we're driving along these dirt road and suddenly his scanner makes a beep, aha, we're near what. So we get out of the car. He looks around for it. You see a little antenna sticking up out of the dirt.

He gets a brush and very delicately brushes this off. And there it is. There's the center in the ground. They're using it to spy on people out on public land. They said, this is outrageous. I thought you should know about it. I get in a car where we go right by the camo dudes. They're taking out a license plate number.

Okay, this is going to be trouble. And on the way home, I get a call from a friend of mine who worked for the FBI, and he says, what are you doing out there? Whatever you're doing, don't do that again. You know, you did something. You went too far. So I didn't touch anything. I was just recording something for a news story.

And then a couple days later, the joint terrorism, Task Force comes to Chuck's trailer in Rachel, kicks in the door, took all his computers, every camera, every photo, every hard drive. Chuck was in Colorado, I think at the time, took it all away. And for the next three or four or five years, they held over his head the possibility that he would be prosecuted for a felony for destruction of government property, that by uncovering those sensors on public land, he'd committed a crime. So he was scared. I mean, he remained. He remained scared for years. He moved away from Rachel. He's only been back a couple of times. Storm 51. He was back there. But he moved away. He got away from all that stuff. Doesn't deal with it anymore.

And he was really worried that he was going to go to prison. It turns out it was just a propaganda exercise. It was meant to intimidate. And it worked. And it sure looks like the same thing is happening to York right now. So we did two stories for KOS. One is an update on his case, which is there is no update because nothing is. happened and they're not answering any questions. And it turns out Nellus didn't even know what was going on. They weren't even included in the, they didn't know what was happening until after it already happened and they're being peppered with questions by the media. And the second story we did, well, I ask York, well, what the heck is going on out there now? Other, you know, I'm not going to

ask him about UFO stuff. He doesn't want to go there. Well, what are they flying? What are they doing? What are they working on? And he gave me sort of a pretty good rundown on what they suspect is happening. And again, his information is from public sources, seen from public lands, things that people put together, all this Area 51 community kind of pieced together. And he told me about what he thinks they're doing. It's drones and satellite and jamming technology. And he had told me something I really hadn't thought about before, is that Area 51 now has its own Area 51. There's a place that this secret base has developed that is more secret than Area 51 itself. It's a, it's north of Grove Lake.

There's a, you know, that big mountain range. It's ringed by mountains. The public can't access it. It's off limits. You can't hike out there. But they fly in that area, drones and other technologies, and nobody can see it. No one has any idea what they're flying. Unless you have a satellite, you can't see it.

So that's the story we did. Always like to keep a hand and try to figure out what's going on at Area 51. It is near and dear to my heart. I'm glad you're covering it. I mean, it sounds like an egregious. abuse of power when you're you have somebody like yorg who's raided by federal agencies and you know it's important you shine a light on it so it was cool to see those stories come out well look man i just wanted to to catch up with you on a lot of i mean this is like alison wonderland right now with the ufo thing

you got people you know just trying to demolish you know this guy jans that came forward you've got you know all this stuff you know with the shadow beings out of las vegas you got all these leaked or not leaked but you get all these like memos out of arrow and you get all these text messages. And it's just, I'm kind of watching it at a distance right now and just seeing how people are starving for information on this. The interest of the public is still at this peak level, but you're just seeing the pushback. You really are seeing people try to discredit, try to demean people, try to make people lose interest.

But I don't think it's going to work, man. People are really know that this. phenomenon is real and they're just trying to find out, you know, what, what are the edges of it? So I don't know. I guess the thing I would say is, you know, for those of you that have called me and they're a little disappointed with where we are right now, have some grit, man. Keep throwing punches. Yeah. Don't be disheartened because of the tactics, these heavy-handed tactics used by Sean Kirkpatrick and the organization he's put together Arrow. It was always going to be this. And not to say, I told you so, but I told you so. I mean, how many times we were,

we said it on weaponized, the closer the public gets to the goodies, the harder the pushback is going to be. We're seeing it now in real time. They are pushing back hard. It's taken them a while to get up to speed, but they've cut the legs off of this and thwarted the momentum that was building over the past five and a half, almost six years. But it's not done. There are others that are investigating this stuff.

A lot of information has been given to Congress and congressional staff. there have been private efforts, scientists starting their own investigations outside of government. There's a lot of good things that are happening here. Don't give up, folks. Yeah, and I think the destigmatization of it has really worn a lot of fruit because where we are right now is, I mean, oh my gosh, how many commercial airline pilots that are not under the same restrictions as military pilots have been reaching out to you and me with videos, with their testimony, it's pretty incredible. So right now, what I'm seeing is a lot of collection from the civilian world of this data and information. So I'm really eager to see where that goes. I'm just looking at some of the footage now talking and interviewing a lot of the pilots that have seen an increase

of UAP in their airspace. So it'll be interesting to see where this goes. But I'm glad we touched base again and kind of had a little update. We let the audience kind of hear what we would normally talk about, you know, so that's pretty cool. And I don't know, I'll give you a little break, but then I'm going to drag you back on here again. I hope people will check out the stories that we did on KALAS about York and Area 51. I hope people will, if you haven't read Skinwalkers of the Pentagon and then, you know, initial revelations, the follow-up book, I'm giving a shameless plug to those. But if you want to know about Cottle Blue and related materials or what that program could have been, that's how you can find out. And then last

I think we should probably talk to our audience about weaponize. We, you know, initially I thought we were going to do one episode a month and then it became more a week and, you know, it was a lot of fun. Those episodes with Column Keller, with James Lackatsky, Jay Stratton, Travis Taylor, people who didn't see them, you might want to go back and check those out because there are a lot of information directly related to the stories that are unfolding right now. we're kind of kicking around some ideas about how this could move forward in kind of different and exciting venues and possibilities.

I don't know how far you want to go on that, but we're not done with it. We're done with season one. This is the, yeah, this is the Michael Cordione episode. I don't know if we do we give it a number or not, but we are going to be doing something else in the future.

We just don't know what that is going to be. Yeah, or when it's going to be. I'm pretty sure. We know exactly what we're doing. It's just a matter like when we're doing it. So anyway, yeah, man, leave everybody there. Good to see you. We can do these any time.

This is episode number 53, and I just wanted to have an update with you, man. We'll go from there. All right. Good dog, good. Take care. Never has so few, had so much to tell,

but could say so little. Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile. I don't know if you knew this, but anyone can get the same premium wireless for $15 a month plan that I've been enjoying. It's not just for celebrities, so do like I did. and have one of your assistance assistants assistants switch you to MintMobile today.

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