Weekly Skews - Good Skews: Folk music during times of struggle with Lizzie No

Episode Date: September 20, 2025

In times of struggle, people have always turned to folk music. From labor anthems to civil rights ballads, these songs remind us who we are and what we’re fighting for. Today, as the world feels increasingly chaotic, folk music is once again rising up to meet the moment.On this episode of Good Skews, Matt Hildreth sits down with singer, songwriter, and podcaster Lizzie No to talk about the folk revival happening right now. Lizzie shares her journey from New Jersey to Nashville, her vision of folk as a living practice rather than a museum piece, and why contemporary voices matter if the genre is going to stay politically sharp. You can listen to a playlist of all of the music mentioned in this episode here: https://weeklyskews.substack.com/p/good-skews-folk-music-during-timesSupport the show

Hello and welcome to another episode of Goodskews. I'm Matt Hildreth. If you look back in history in moments of struggle, when politics get messy and when communities feel under pressure, people have always turned to folk music. The songs that spring up from the people themselves have always focused on topics like truth, resilience, and hope. And given how turbulent things feel right now, it shouldn't surprise us that folk music is once again re-emerging in powerful new ways. That's what today's conversation is all about. I'm joined by Lizzie No, a singer, songwriter, and podcaster who's helping lead this new wave of folk music. We talk about why folk music isn't a genre frozen in the 1960s, but a living,

breathing, cultural organism that's shaping our lives today. Lizzie shares what's happening in Nashville's folks seeing how technology like Spotify is reshaping the industry and why insisting on contemporary voices is essential if folk music is going to stay courageous. And because Lizzie dropped by with so many great artists recommendations, I've pulled them all together into a Spotify playlist. You can find a link to that playlist with all of the artists mentioned in today's show in the description of the show or by searching for weekly skews on substack. There you can join our free newsletter. I have a list of all of the songs there as well. And with that, here's Lizzie now. Well, Lizzie, thanks so much for joining us today. We're really excited for

you to chat with us. But before we get into the state of folk music and all the craziness that's happening in the world, maybe just start by talking a little bit about where people can find more information about you. If you want to know about my catalog as a musician and where I'll be on tour and whether I'm coming to your area soon to perform music, you should go to lizzie know.com. That's L-I-Z-Z-I-E-N-O.com. If you want to see me serve a look on, like, anywhere on the mask-to-fem spectrum, like if you want to see my fashions, if you want to see me be whimsical, if you want to see like the most up-to-date announcements about what I'm up to and what I'm doing, you should follow lizzie. know on Instagram.

If you want to hear intimate late-night musings and maybe see spicier photos of me and hear my uncensored political and spiritual opinions, you should get out your credit card and subscribe to handsome Lizzie on OnlyFans. That's handsome Lizzie at Onlyfans.com, I guess. If you want to hear what music I'm interested in and what ideas I'm chasing in folk music, you should follow Basic Folk Pod on Instagram and download the many, like, a couple hundred episodes that we have. And if you want to get involved in my latest unhinged left wing roots music podcast, organizing space, homies hangout opportunities, and, like, most notably my hot takes on country and folk music, you need to be following y'alladarity social club on all platforms. I am just curious before we get into kind of a conversation about the bigger picture on what's happening in folk music, especially in this crazy political moment that we're living in.

If you could talk just a little bit on your background and how you got to where you are right now. Oh man. I'm going to try to keep this like somewhat short, but I feel like what I'm doing right now as an artist and an observer of music comes very directly from like my deepest, most ancient roots. I am a black American, Irish American, loudmouth woman from New Jersey. I'm currently living in Tennessee, kind of retracing my ancestral steps back to the south. And that move inspired so much, like, personal and political growth. But I'm sure we're going to get more into that. Basically, I'm a folk singer who's, like, documenting what it's like to be a queer, black, literate woman in America right now. For a lot of people, I think maybe they think of folk music as, you know, stuck in the 60s and 70s. Maybe some of the diehard fans have been following it over the years. But one of the things that has stood out to me over the last, I don't know, a couple of decades, I guess at this point, or at least a decade at this point, especially in my work more in the kind of advocacy organizing space, is people would say, where are the folk musicians? And it seems like maybe during the first Trump administration, there wasn't a lot, but it seems like today we are in the middle of a new kind of folk renaissance. I don't know if that's your perspective on it.

I am interested to get your perspective because I'm kind of watching as somebody that is an outside observer who enjoys that music and kind of was raised on folk music. But I'm curious, especially within your role with basic folk, where I feel like you've just talked to anybody and everybody. in the folk scene. I'm just curious where you see folk music right now today. It's such a big and exciting question. Like, I feel like I live and breathe this folk music thing. And yes, we're going through a boom of it being visible on a more mainstream scale, if that makes sense. But I first started to feel like I was part of a revival of something, maybe around, I don't know, 2009, 2010, for people that are interested in this type of music, it's kind of always there. And I would say that if my work with basic folk as a podcaster has

taught me anything, it's that folk is not a genre in the sense of a certain set of aesthetic markers. Some people think about folk music as, a set of technological limitations, like we're not going to have a ton of electronic instruments, the classic thing of showing up to the Folk Fest and people not wanting to have a full drum kit. Like, that's an understanding of folk music that basically says your folk if you don't use technology past X-Date. You know, some people think of folk as like, it sounds a certain way. For me, folk music is a way of doing things, which is, be true but not fancy, speak the truth about what's going on. You know, there's a value to truth

and authenticity over polish and perfection. There's a sense of shared authorship and the audience being on the same level as the singer. It's a mode of storytelling. It's a way of describing the way certain independent musicians fund, finance, and promote their work. Like, folk is a way of describing, like, the network of house shows that most of us earn some of our bread and butter from, right? Like, there's so many ways to think about folk music that don't have to do with the acoustic guitar and having a certain type of raspy voice or whatever, which I think we are, like, astute enough to know is just code for white maleness. And, like, what got me into folk music was Peter Paul and Mary, you know, people singing in harmony for the benefit of

children, like the artists that were involved in Lilith Fair, like, Jewel, Tracy Chapman, like pop folk, that was like by women for women. Like, for me, folk is so many different things that the revival now is exciting, but it's disappointing to see the attention still going to a certain type of folk artist who looks like Bob Dylan or Woody Guthrie. It's such a narrow view of folk that I think people have. And for me, what's exciting about folk is that it's just what springs up from the people. Yeah. And I think that's maybe something that I've seen a little bit is, like I said, maybe more on the organizing side of things is, and I think this happens, you know, in politics too, where there were certain moments in time that, that, like, defined a community.

And it's hard for that community to get past that definition. So a lot of, like, what happens in my world with, with more organizing and politics is everybody sort of looks back to the 60s or the 70s. And it's like, well, this worked then. We should just keep doing that. And they don't realize that at that point, people were just kind of. organically responding to a moment the best way they knew how to do it and maybe our goal shouldn't be to just recreate things that happened 50, 60 years ago at this point, but maybe we should come up with like new and interesting ways to do it that respond to folks today.

And I think like I've seen, like I said, as a fan, it seems like the people who are really not just, you know, getting popular attention to their music, but really moving the conversation for it. I think that's what they're doing is they're kind of digging deep into their own roots and expressing things in new and interesting ways. It's true. I think an insistence on remaining contemporary is a controversial point of view in the folk world, but I think it's really essential. And I argue for that. Like, there is old time music for a reason. You know, if you're concerned with things being a part of a tradition and remaining true to, like, very specific. markers of that tradition. That's a beautiful and amazing thing. But that's only one part of what

folk music is. Like I think about an artist like Joya Latakun, who I think is one of our most important folk music voices. And she's been on basic folk, brag. The instrumentation, the production, the songwriting, the phrasing, it's all very contemporary and like relatable for audiences of all ages. And what makes her a folk artist is her courageousness in speaking the truth, like the relationship she has with guitar playing, you know, her voice as a songwriter. There's so many things about her that are classically folk. But the sound is contemporary and like that's what makes her dangerous. I love old time music because I like group dynamics and group politics. And if you've been to an old time jam, you know, where everybody's kind of sitting around playing their

guitars and fiddles and banjos it's like the music's interesting gets a little boring sometimes but the group power dynamics are very fun because how the group decides what to play and who gets to decide what's in and what's out is like a very political decision for the you know eight or ten people or whatever in in the old time circle um but it is interesting for me to see how many people in that community struggle with um translating things into more you know contemporary times and they sort of hear the way something was recorded in the early 1900s and just sort of decided that that's the way to play it now and that they want to try and sound exactly like the record, not realizing that that person that was recorded was probably just one person, probably

somebody that's a white man that sort of was approached by a recording company and they captured the song in that moment, but that song was probably never played the same way, you know, two times in a row. So that's been interesting to see. And I think the artists like you said that are able to sort of capture that that free flowingness to the music, I think is really interesting. And I think that's what audiences want. Like I don't know that audiences want to just listen to 1960 style folk music. Some might. But I think people are more responding to things that feel authentic to their experience. Yes. And I feel like I need to state on the record that I love and enjoy all types of folk, including, you know, the old time traditionalists. But I think it's important

that we make the distinction that that's just one part of a bigger spectrum and we actually need all of it. It reminds me of the people who do great work, like colorizing black and white photos from the 50s, 60s and 70s, that is a point. political act. Like, updating the technology so it looks and feels contemporary actually makes us uncomfortable, but because we would like to put a distance between ourselves and the times in which, you know, these historic injustices were happening. I think when something feels and looks and sounds contemporary, we're forced to reckon with it more up close. And so it's really like politically insidious to have this insistence that folk music be defined by the aesthetics

of the 60s. You know what I'm saying? Like it kind of takes the teeth out of a genre that has the potential to really ruffle feathers politically today. And it's very convenient and neat if we kind of keep it as a nostalgia machine rather than updating it to today's terms and conditions. and forcing people to like deal with these contemporary ideas of resistance in contemporary formats. That's part of why I'm on only fans as a folk musician. Like I want to be in the ring in contemporary formats. And like having online platforms is something that is kind of frowned upon in the folk music community. And I've lost respect of some of my peers for like being on that platform. Not only because of the like a potential for adult content, but also just because it's so internety and people think of it as cheap. Like I want to reclaim the cheap contemporary new now materials for ancient purposes. And I think that goes for folk music as well. So talk a little bit about being in Nashville. I mean, or I've learned recently, I've been saying it wrong, Nashville. And I say it like I'm from

South Dakota. Talk a little bit about the folk scene in Nashville, because I think a lot of people think country, and they probably think oftentimes the, frankly, worst part of country music, the sort of music role, high-rise country music. But I'm wondering, what's your perspective on folk music in Nashville? Because I was just there at the event you put on for the Yolidarity Social Club podcast and gathering, and I was just really surprised with the, like, authentic music. scene that many people might not be exposed to in Nashville?

I think I'm still figuring it out. So I moved to Nashville at the end of 2023, coming from like a very robust alt-folk scene in Brooklyn. And there are so many great songwriters here that a great chunk of them are really good folk songwriters. That's the good thing about Nashville. there's just a great musician doing just about any genre you can think of. I think country gets so much shine and gets so many resources that a lot of artists here can kind of do it all,

like might not consider themselves strictly a folk songwriter. But like, for example, someone like Caroline Spence is like a great country and folk songwriter, who I would think of as a folk artist. because I think what ties her catalog together is the songwriting and her, like, classic vocal technique. But she can also play in the country playground. There are a lot of artists that are kind of doing it all, but the songwriting is what makes them folk, and that's what interests me about the Nashville folk scene. And I had never been to a performance that was like the songwriters in the round. Can you talk a little bit about that? Because that felt very authentic to Nashville,

but not the Nashville that I think gets represented on CMT and, you know, pop culture. Yeah, I love the Writers Round. I love the format of that, kind of like you were talking about with old time music. Like, there's something particular about setting some parameters for how we are going to make the music together. And the Songwriters Round is such a classic Nashville format where you get, you know, three to five songwriters playing their original material, basically just sitting on a, a stool, yourself and a guitar, and having people primed to listen to the stories and appreciate the craft. So it's not to say that there isn't performance involved, but I feel like a songwriter's round is an invitation to, like, get together and really appreciate the

words, like appreciate the storytelling. So it was kind of a perfect fit for what we wanted to do for our first Yolidarity Social, like, get some people whose brains I would want to pick about songwriting and who are really about something politically and culturally, like give everyone a chance to kind of popcorn style one by one, get up and share what's on their mind and what they've been playing and what they're thinking about. I think it's a great way to, like, take the temperature of your songwriter community. And I think it was a great event because it did kind of center around country folk music, alt country, Americana, however you describe it, but it also was not a stale lineup. I mean, I think that sometimes, like you said, people have sort of one

view on things, but you, I think, put together, you and Nathan Evans-Fox, who has been on good skews, put together in an event that was, I think, just a fantastic lineup of like really good music from many different perspectives. Thank you. And I'm just, I just want to mention the artists that we had so folks can look up their work. It was Nate Bergman, Riley Downing, Nick Shoulders, Rebecca Porter, Olivia Ellen Lloyd. That's six people, right? Kapali? Kapali, oh my gosh. Don't let me forget Kapali because he also played with me. Kapali long is so multifaceted. Kapali, don't think I forgot you. I just think of you as part of the crew. Yeah, what I think I can say that I do differently than, you know, some of the other people that are putting shows together and writers' rounds together is I am not particularly fussed about people's identity or, like, having sonic unity.

Like, that doesn't bother me. I don't categorize artists that way. Like, Kapali and Nate kind of come from this hardcore background. Rebecca Porter is like a classic country singer, like Olivia Ellen Lloyd and Nick shoulders kind of bring like the Appalachian twang to it. And then Nathan and I are each kind of on different ends of the country spectrum. So like to me, that's all folk music. And that's what makes an event interesting. Like I don't know why you would want eight people that all like sing classic country. Like it would be so much it's so much more exciting to me when people have different shades of a similar ethos. And I think that's where I'm at right now in my music, just in terms of how I listen to it. And I think a lot of people do. Like, I grew up small town, you know, listening to Tupac.

And then I actually grew up hating country music because I was living in a small, you know, I was like living on a small farm on the edge of a small town. And it was just so expected for me to like country music that, like, I had to prove to my friends who from, who grew up in town that, you know, I wasn't country. and then I would sort of secretly sneak country music with my cousins. But I think that that's how I think people listen to music, especially in the Spotify ecosystem where you can kind of bounce around genres very quickly. You're not just listening to one station with one type of music where it all sounds the same. But you talk a lot about Spotify on the podcast that you do with Nathan Evans-Fox. And you're going through a book right now.

Do you want to talk a little bit about that podcast because I think there's a lot of people who listen to this podcast that would be very interested in that podcast. Yes, please. The podcast is called Y'all Adarity Social Club. And our first three episodes are out now. Season one of the podcast is loosely a book club about Liz Pelley's mood machine, the rise of Spotify, and the cost of the perfect playlist. It's an incredibly well-documented and argued book about how Spotify came to go from being a startup, like in the age of downloading and piracy, all the way to where it is today, which is this major corporation that influences the way most of us listen to music, the way music is marketed, the way artists work day to day. the way genres are defined, the way success in the industry is defined. Like, they have so come to financially dominate that even the major labels kind of follow Spotify's lead when it comes to how to do business. And that has huge implications for art and culture and the possibility for music to be a force for social change like we've seen it be in generations past. Like, my interest in this is that my role models in art are people like Paul Robeson, Tony Morrison,

earth a kit, artists who had very specific political aims and used their art to advance the cause of human freedom and black liberation. When a company like Spotify enters the scene like eats up market share of streaming and dictates from the top down, how artists all over the world are going to make music, I take that personally because I'm a black artist, and I believe that it's my duty and my right to write songs that speak to the times, perform them in front of audiences who are ready to listen, and distribute that music to people who need to hear it. And for me, Spotify's been getting in the way for a minute, and I'm ready to talk shit. And it's a great podcast. I mean, just on this last episode, you were talking about capitalism being the lower-rise gene of economic models.

Do you want to talk a little bit about that? I thought that was pretty funny. I think it's also a good example of the conversations you have on the show. Yes. So here is my argument. Capitalism is the low-rise genes of economic systems because it only fits about 1% of people. And yet it is marketed to all of us as if it's the cutest, hip-est. thing around and like the best way to organize our human bodies. It's wrong. We are all uncomfortable

and it's time to just admit that we don't want it. Like that one skinny person with a very long torso and a lot of money to like buy the correct fit of low-rise jeans, they're fine. They don't need my support. But like for the rest of us, we need to find and put into place a better way just so we can like start being a society like when you have a pair of pants that fit correctly not it doesn't solve all of your problems but it does put your body in a position to even begin the process of tackling the problems yes we should be building our clothes around our bodies not our bodies around our clothes I love that correct and our economies around our communities and our needs rather than the other way around it's a great podcast I'd recommend anybody check it out

I am curious as we get into such a crazy place, I will say, when it comes to, you know, American life and politics. What is it that's giving you hope as an artist and as an activist? What is it where you're really kind of staying plugged into that, to that hope? I will say the most inspiring experience I've had over the past two years was attending the Southern gathering of abortion funds last summer in Atlanta. And I can say that now on the podcast. But at the time, I was not allowed to disclose where I was because abortion providers and allies receive so many death threats that none of us were allowed to say where we were going. So, like, that's the context. Picture you're going to a conference to work on a health care issue and you're not allowed to tell people where you are. Okay, so we get there and it's like a couple hundred organizers, abortion fund. workers, like people that work in tech who work on digital defense for abortion funds, everyone from direct health care providers to people who work on the hotlines for abortion funds that connect people to services, people that work in fundraising, like workers from

across the spectrum who understand that the ability to access an abortion, like that you can afford is central to having even a chance at human freedom. And that it's not a wedge issue that like we can all come together, no matter our background, no matter our religion, no matter our race, ethnicity, gender. Like there were people, there were older church ladies, there were young queer people, all with the goal of how do we spread the message that abortion is important and should be freely available to anyone who needs it. And also how do we practically make sure this care is available in spite of all of these roadblocks that politicians and like the wealthy keep putting into place. So seeing people who were like skilled in, you know,

fundraising to make sure, okay, they've made it illegal, but we're going to provide people with the funding to get their health care in another state. Like these are some of the toughest people I've ever met in my life. And we had a great time. Because on the last night, we had a pool party. There were drag queens. There was a DJ. We were shaking ass at the pool. Like, getting to spend time with people who are so fucking serious and unafraid and who know how to have fun and are a great hang. Like, those people are all over the South doing great work every single day, and it's fun. So that's kind of what inspires me, people who are really in there in the trenches, fighting for reproductive justice. Yeah, and that's what I love about working

with folks in the South through the work that I do is I think a lot of times the South is given a bad rap, but a lot of the best freedom fighters come from the South. And a lot of people that put up with some of the craziest stuff and are just fearless are in the South. I had lunch with my grandma two days ago. She grew up in rural North Carolina and then moved to New York City, raised her family there, and ended up moving back south after my pop-pop died. And I don't know how the topic of Donald Trump came up. But my grandma said something to the effect of, we've seen these cycles of white supremacist ideas many times before and we've survived them. And also, Like, I'm not afraid of Donald Trump. His day is set. And that's on, like, Southern Baptist faith. Like, God knows the day where we put an X over that man's name. And, like, what can he do to us that hasn't been done before? Which is not to trivialize the immense amount of suffering and hatred and harm that he's causing. But folks in the South who've been around the block a few times have seen these, have

seen these seasons of bluster come and go and it's heartbreaking and I wish we didn't have to keep seeing the cycles repeat, but like there's deep wisdom in people who have survived it over and over. Absolutely. All right. Well, as we kind of come to close here, I'm wondering, especially because you have such an amazing perspective from the basic folk podcast, who are the artists out there that we should be listening to that are going to get us through the next couple of years? I know, as you're saying, I think it's good to remember that we are resilient and we will get through this. But I think the, you know, good music helps, especially good folk music. So who should we be listening to?

Kaya Kater, Adia Victoria, Kashana, Shamir, Evil, Jobi Riccio, Jess Nolan, Kapali Long has new music coming soon. Margo Price. Brian Dunn has a great new album. Those are the people I spend the most often. And Kelsey Walden put out a version of Mississippi Goddamn that features the Dia Victoria and Kashana a few years ago. Give that a listen if you've been concerned about the news lately. Absolutely. Well, we'll put maybe a playlist together based on those recommendations. and put it in the liner notes. Is there anything else that you think we should be paying attention to in the folk music world as we head in the next couple of months? My mantra for myself, I don't have time to get into the 4B politics of removing men from the center of our sight lines when it comes to, like, social life and moral discourse, see my TikTok for more of that.

But I do think it's a really useful exercise to de-center whiteness and maleness when it comes to who we think of as an authority on folk music. So if you can get into the practice of making sure there are two women and at least a person of color for every white man you listen to when you think about folk music, that's a great place to start. And if you can't find women and people of color in the places where you look for folk music, you need to start demanding it. You need to start demanding it at your record store. You need to start updating your playlists, start calling your radio station, because if you're not hearing the voices of the people, there's a reason for that. Absolutely. All right. Well, thank you so much for taking a few minutes here and chatting with us. And I think you gave at the beginning of the episode places for people to check you out. But do you want to just give those again so people can follow up and make sure they're plugged into your work and where they can stay involved?

Okay, let me try to get all these handles right. My website is lizzie know.com. That's Lizzie with an I-E, no as in no thank you. My Instagram is lizzie. that's lizzie dot no on instagram my tic-toc is ask me about imagine dragons ask me about imagine dragons on ticot um and i'm handsome lizzie on only fans uh the podcast that i co-host on the bluegrass situation is called basic folk and the new podcast with nathan evans fox is called yollahdarity social club all right well lizzie no thank you so much for joining us thank you