Weights and Plates Podcast - #25 - The Restaurant Trap: Secrets from the Commercial Kitchen with Chef Drea Wild

Episode Date: April 8, 2022

Today Robert and Trent welcome the first guest to Weights & Plates -- Chef Andrea Wild. Drea is a professional chef with a passion for bridging the knowledge gap between professional cooking and good nutrition. She explains the difference between how chefs in a commercial kitchen approach preparing and seasoning food and how the average person at home prepares meals.   Turns out, the restaurant is a great place for having an incredibly flavorful experience but a terrible place to get good nutrition!   Weights & Plates: https://weightsandplates.com Robert Santana on Instagram: @the_robert_santana   Trent Jones: @marmalade_cream https://www.marmaladecream.com Email: [e-mail]  

Welcome to the Waste and Plates podcast. I am Robert Santana. I am your host along with Trent Jones, my co-host. Hola. Yeah, you understood that. I did. Because you speak Spanish, right? I can speak Spanish. Con un acento. I am, I'm sad to say that I grew up in Texas, and I've lived in Texas for at least 25 years, and I can't speak any Spanish. Well, it's a shame. It's shameful. My parents, both my parents were born in Cuba and both learned Spanish first, but my mother raised me with English and I went to school in Illinois.

So, you know, I'm not a Cuban, you know, I'm kind of an American. Illinois. Illinois. So it used to be I-L-L, now it's I-L on the map, but I just choose to speak English because, you know, I was born here. That's fair. I've never been to Cuba. Yeah. So can I speak it at the kindergarten level?

Sure. My vocabulary is, I should give myself more credit than that. I have a decent vocabulary, but my pronunciation is spot on. You know, I have an accent and all that fun jazz, but I don't like to speak Spanish, so I just don't. That's fair. That's fair. Tengo un acento. Well, that's, you know, normally, normally this is the section of the podcast where we would be like, well, that's related to our topic today, but it's not related whatsoever. Instead, we have a much better topic for you. We have a guest on the podcast, the very first guest we've had on Weights and Plates. Drea Wild is joining us. Hey, how you doing? Hello. We are doing well. Drea is a, well, Drea, I'll let you introduce yourself actually, but Drea is going to join us

and talk today about the restaurant problem. So this is something we've talked about on the show at length about why restaurants are a trap for if you're trying to eat clean and you're trying to hit your macros and all that good stuff. So Drea has worked in kitchens and she has some professional experience that she's going to share with us today. And so welcome to the podcast, Drea. experience that she's going to share with us today. And so welcome to the podcast, Rhea. Hey, thanks much. I appreciate being here. This is really cool. Yeah, there is a restaurant problem. I love that you put it that way. There's actually a very large gap of knowledge out there between how we get trained in the restaurant business and how nutritionists are trained. And there isn't really a connecting

piece between them. We don't really talk. Those places don't talk. So thank you for having me. I appreciate it. Yeah. And so tell us about your background. So you went to culinary school, right? Yes. I went to Lake Horton Blue. It was the school that was in Oregon. It was really awesome. It was in the middle of the city. I really enjoyed my time there and graduated with honors. It's a certificate program and then went on to do a degree in culinary operations through the same, through the, yeah, through the Scottsdale campus, which is kind of cool. And then I have a previous degree in human factors. So it's kind of fun to marry all three of those together to really see how we are in the kitchen and then add the cooking piece onto it and just make everything way more efficient. So that's kind of my jam. I really like doing that. So you're really good at mise en place, right?

Mise en place. Mise en place. Yeah, see? I don't know French either. It is. Yeah. So you're talking about fish. That's cool. If you want a filet of fish, that's really awesome. A little mise en place there. But yeah. So mise en place or mise. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Absolutely. So that's just preparing everything and have everything ready in advance, which is what a lot of restaurants do. And that's a really good point because I think a lot of people, when they go to restaurants, they think maybe when they cook at home, they're not good enough or something else. And we kind of get down on ourselves for cooking at home, which restaurant cooking there, they have everything. They've done everything in advance. They've done their needs. So they spend the entire day cutting everything, chopping everything,

putting everything into small little containers, chopping everything, putting everything into small little containers, into everything else. So when you go to a restaurant and you order something, you're just basically getting the finishing dish. All they do is throw everything into a pot or a pan or whatever they need to do, and they serve it to you. So that's why you can get your food in 15 minutes in a restaurant, whereas at home, it feels like it takes forever. Very interesting. I never thought about that. When I go there, I literally can get it in under an hour. But if I were to try and do that, it would take five to six times as long. Well, it would. And that's true. That's really one of the big things. I mean, I think sometimes people have a psychological block about cooking at home because we think we're not good enough. Everything in our

culture right now has pointed us to the fact that we're not fast enough, that we're not good enough, that we can't chop good enough. 30-minute meals, we can start on that. Yeah. I was about to say like... That'll be another rabbit hole that we can go can start on that yeah yeah i was about to say like that'll be another rabbit hole that we can go down oh yeah so you're telling me that they don't have like a rachel ray in the kitchen that's just like you know and we just need a little evoo oh and a little this and a little of that and okay how do i make the pretty bowls appear on my on my camera top you know there's so many bowls there's so many bowls and i don't know who has 12 dishwashers to do that.

She has like a bowl for like, we're going to need an eighth cup of chopped chives. And she's got a little bowl that's the exact eighth of a cup. Come on. Chop that shit and throw it in. What the hell are you doing? We got to do an episode on cooking. Yeah.

Oh, we can do an episode on cooking. Absolutely. And, yeah. We can do an episode on cooking. Absolutely. And it's called make room on your cutting board. Put as many things on your cutting board that can touch. Don't put raw meat on your cutting board at the same time as vegetables. Everybody knows that. But other than that, use that stuff.

Be efficient. But yeah, getting back to the restaurant thing. Yeah, they do that. The 30-minute meal at home thing. Rachel Ray and all these cooking shows, right. They get there and they're like, yeah, you, you can do this in 30 minutes. Well, the thing we have to remember is it's just like the restaurant culture. They have been trained. They have been trained. They have been doing this for a long time. They have the muscle memory. So it's a lot like your training that you guys do, right? You have the muscle memory after a while's a lot like your training that you guys do, right?

You have the muscle memory. After a while, you do that, you do it, you do it, you build it up, you build it up, you have it. That's it. Like I can chop an onion with my eyes closed. Cool. That's great. Hopefully not cut off my finger.

But like you're able to do these things faster because you have built up that skill and built up that muscle memory, you know, and people forget that when they go to cook something at home. So they see that it's supposed to take them 20 minutes. It takes them 40 and they think they're failures and they don't want to do it again. And that's just bullshit. Yeah. You know, as you're talking, I just totally just want to just turn this into a cooking episode. But.

Dude, we can. Yeah. I got roasts for days. Let's go. We're going to have that. That's for sure. Because now you've just made me realize. I'm like, man, we've been talking about this restaurant thing in pretty much every episode.

And it's, you know, which I'll elaborate on for the listeners. Yeah. But it's the thing I deal with the most. But then as you're talking, I'm like, hey, I got all these questions now, you know, like. Right. For one, why does the damn onion slice stick to my knife, and when you do it, it doesn't happen? What the hell is that? Oh, it does. So when you grip it,

and I know we're actually talking on a Zoom right now, so you can see my hands, but when you claw grip it, you pop it down on the other side, and then it doesn't. Oh. That's like some Houdini shit there. It is, yeah. I bet drea like actually like hones and sharpens her knives and you probably haven't done it since like 2008 oh fuck no i got an

ikea knife that i bought oh that's a problem you got to get a wustoff man the fact that you know the difference between honing and sharpening means that you your wife has definitely taught you well it's 100 my wife, I can't do it. She watches me chop and she's just like, every time. She's like, just let me do it. That's it. I have multiple steels in my kitchen. I actually have a steel for my kid.

My kid has her own steel. Oh, wow. That's cool. Yeah, it's cool. She's seven. It's awesome. She sharpens her plastic knives on it yeah good practice introduction so so the the reason we brought you on here initially well so i moderate the starting strength boards and uh your buddy on there

uh i forgot what we were talking about i was trying to pull the thread up while you were talking. Oh, yeah, Bill. Bill's excellent. He made a comment on a thread. I think it was an unrelated topic, and he had just said something to the effect of, when you cook a steak at home, it doesn't taste the way that it tastes at the restaurant. And I have a friend who explained this to me, something I'm paraphrasing. So I see this, and I'm thinking about some of the things we talk about here and what I deal with for a living. And I'm like, well, you think we can get her on the podcast. And that's how you kind of ended up here. So to elaborate, the most common thing that I find myself coaching people on, so let me back up. I'm a diet coach. I'm a dietitian, an RD. And I'm a

strength coach like Trent. And when I'm coaching people on diet, they typically want weight loss. And then I get a percentage of people that want weight gain. Then there's a good chunk of people that need to gain weight and don't want to gain weight because they're worried about their abs, and that's a whole other issue. So most of the time I'm spending coaching people's diets are people that have weight they want to lose. And I learned early on that their number one issue most of the time is that it's not that they don't understand what they need to be doing. They understand they need to be in a calorie

restriction and they've tried several, low carb, low fat, paleo, whatever you want to call it. They tried every diet in the book that restricts calories. And, you know, I'll put them on something pretty balanced, typically high in carbs, high in protein, low in fat, because that tends to work well for people who are training for something hard. In our case, lifting weights, barbell training, power lifting, strength lifting. So they'll follow it during the week, just like they'd follow the low carb during the week if I threw it at them. Then the weekend rolls around and they go to a restaurant and their weight goes up Monday and stays up Tuesday. And then I get the freak out emails throughout the week. And I have to explain to them that, you know, you're probably

eating your day's worth of calories in a single meal. And I'm just talking, you know, pulling this out of my ass, you know, I don't actually know what the hell's in it. I don't think you do either, because nobody's actually measuring that, you know. But what I know is there is a tight correlation between restaurant eating on weekends and lack of progress losing weight, you know, unless, of course, you're a metabolic furnace, and you can lose weight on many calories, but those people aren't the ones that hire me. Typically, those people tend to stay lean too, you know. So I never really actually dug deep into what's in it. Has it been measured? You know, I haven't tried to get actual numbers because nobody's going to take all these entrees and sides and things and run them through chemical analyses and get a bomb calorimeter and do all

this scientific stuff that in some ways isn't so scientific to figure that out. So a lot of it's estimated. But what I do know just from general observation is if you look at a plate at a restaurant, fast food place, or even at your house, you could probably estimate, you know, the carb content and the protein content, but you cannot estimate the fat content because that's invisible. You know, you got with meats, you have intramuscular fat inside the meat that, you know, you can't count because I always get guys say, oh, I trim the fat off. Well, that's the, you know, that's the subcutaneous fat. There's still the intramuscular fat that you can't see. And then this is where you come in. There's the preparation methods where basically anything healthy can become very high calorie

very quickly. I remember sitting in a class and professors like, you know, these people that say fast food kills, they're just totally ignoring the fact that restaurants have way more calories than fast food. And he brought up this salad dish at the Cheesecake Factory that was over a thousand calories. I'm like, well, but those are veggies, you know? So we want you to speak on this, you know, and educate us, you know, in more detail than, you detail than my oversimplified explanation. Actually, it wasn't. You actually hit on about four or five really awesome facts right there.

And the first one is you're completely right. That's really what it is. You can't go to a restaurant and – You're not going to dazzle us with bullshit? Well, I'm going to get some more bourbon here and maybe I'll dazzle you after that. But like, you know, you are right because the way that we're trained when we cook is that we add enough salt, enough fat, and enough sugar into everything that we do to make sure that we dazzle your taste buds so that you come back. Because the thing you have to remember is that your goals, your nutrition goals, your personal goals are not in line with restaurant goals. A restaurant wants to make money, which is not a bad thing

because they are a business. So we're not going to label them as bad people that are out to get you. They're actually a business, right? So I mean, from the highest tier to the lowest tier restaurant, everything else, their main goal is to get you to come back because they want to make money. So the way they do that is by making sure that the dishes that they send out are balanced specifically with fat, salt, and sugars, which is what we learned in culinary school to make your palate go, Oh my God, I want that again. And that's what we do. And that's what it is.

So most pan sauces are finished with butter. I mean, it prevents the pan sauce from breaking. But I mean, also, it gives that velvety mouthfeel that when you put that pan sauce, it could be like a fish with a pan sauce, or it could be a sauce over a meat or anything else that you have. And thatvety mouthfeel that you're like oh i can't get that at home like yeah you can't because you probably don't finish it with butter and a whole bunch of other stuff too and you haven't been salting it the entire time that you've been doing it either so that's you know what i mean so so that's we we we layer flavors is what we do which is another really

good thing that you that you touched on there. Like, well, so salads, great. So you talk about salads, Cheesecake Factory. I've never personally worked at Cheesecake Factory, but the restaurant that I used to work at was farm to table restaurant, a hundred percent. I mean, we got, I mean, we got local, I mean, it was Portland, man. Like you watch Portlandia, we're there a hundred percent. We knew the names of the chickens. We knew everything else like that. And I was the butcher's assistant. So I was breaking them down and all that kind of stuff. It was great. And so I got to work guard manger for a while, which is a fancy way of saying salad station. And you time it, but I mean, if you were someone that was maybe concerned about

sodium intake and you're talking about weight gain. A lot of that is because of sodium intake when you go out to eat. So let's say you order a salad. Let's say you order a pickled beet salad. All right, great. Which is actually one of our spells cheese when I was there. So first you've got the pickling. So the pickling is actually a salt with sugar process that those beets are in for a very long time. So they've absorbed that salt and that sugar, right? Which I don't know how much is actually passed on to you. I'm not really sure, but it's pickled. So I mean, what are you going to do? Then we actually season the greens that go into it too. So you actually season your salad. So I'm putting salt and pepper on whatever that base green is, either that lettuce or that arugula or whatever we're

serving it onto. And then I have maybe a salty cheese, something else going on too. And then I actually have a dressing that's been seasoned on top of that. So we've got five, four or five layers now of actually salt and seasoning that are going into this one amazing salad. Now, will it make you cry? And will you want to come back? Abso-fucking-lutely. Is it great for your diet? No. And it's a salad. Yeah. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. So yeah, I think that's a really great point. So we know that just very basically, if you have something that's really salty, then, like, you're naturally going to start to gravitate towards something sweeter. And then if you have something really sweet, you want something salty. So, you know, the extremes on the palate can lead you to overeat.

And that's really interesting because you're talking about that. And I'm just thinking, I'm like, yeah, you know, one of the problems with the restaurant is it's not necessarily the flavor itself. It's that that flavor keeps you coming back to the plate. And then we get onto like portion sizes, right? So like maybe everything on the plate is not a good portion size for you. But if it's so flavorful, then how can you stop yourself?

And that's true. And see, what we do, and that's what culinary school is, it teaches us to balance these fats, salts, and sugars to the point where you don't feel like it's overwhelming, so you keep coming back. That was a very salient point. it's overwhelming so you keep coming back that was a very salient point you keep coming back and keep coming back because you don't feel like you've been overwhelmed by any one of those three flavors you hit that like peak point where you can just keep going and slide on through you know well the interesting thing so when it comes to mixing something sweet with something salty, it can basically create the state of what we call disinhibition, where you can just keep eating. It's amazeballs. It overrides your satiety signals, so you can keep eating.

It's a survival mechanism, because remember, famine was historically the problem for us humans. So it was one way in which we can battle that. So it was one way in which we can battle that. So if you eat something salty and follow it up with something sweet, you can keep going and override those satiety signals and create a state of disinhibition. So you just can keep eating far more than you would otherwise. You absolutely can. That's why the Oreo is great. Well, yeah, but the double stuff is too much.

See, that's the thing. That's why it's too much because it lost that balance. But you're true because, I mean, we need our palates. That's why fat, salt, and sugar, that's why they have people at agencies that go crazy over the exact measurements of what we put into these processed foods that we have now because our bodies are like, well, we need salt. That's salary. That's the whole Roman soldier type of thing. They were paid in salt. That's where the name salary came from because we know that our bodies need salt and we need sugars and fats because that's energy, that's slow versus fast burn energy. So that's our flight or fight that we've got going on there. So our whole body is designed to go, I want these three things. And we have an industry that's figured out that they can make a lot of money off of that. And that's where we are right now, you know, and that doesn't necessarily coincide with your nutrition goals and your weight training goals and everything else, you know? So the, you just, you just can't do it.

Like there's, there's just, you're, you're trying to, to, to answer your question. You're trying to shove a square peg into a round hole. You can't go out to eat and order the same exact thing that you would make at home and think that it's going to be the same as though you made it at home. It's it, you just absolutely can't you're fucked that's wrong and you're just wrong you just have to own it you should be like i'm just gonna make a bad decision today and then own it on tuesday when the scale moves in the direction that you don't want it to to go sure that's pretty much it which is what i essentially tell people i'm just like that's true i'm like you're fucked you're just gonna have to eat it or you're gonna have to go

there and torture yourself and eat very little. But even if you go and eat very little, like it's not like that even because even the amount of sodium. Volume has no correlation with calories at that point. It doesn't. It doesn't, you know. But I mean, there's a psychological thing to going out to like just own it. If you're going to go out because you need a break, because you need a psychological break to reduce your stress, then own it. Say, I'm going to do it and just know it's going to affect the scale on Tuesday. Yeah. Yeah. That's a, yeah. And that's, that's one of the interesting things about humans and food, right? Is like, uh, food isn't just functional for us. You know, it doesn't just fulfill the purpose of, you know, making our body work. It also fulfills, you know, a lot of important social roles. So, yeah. So, we're not necessarily

down on restaurants, dear listener. We're not down on restaurants. It's just we need to be wide-eyed and aware of what we're doing when we go in those restaurants. So, you kind of mentioned this that, you know, the volume of food that you get at a restaurant is not, you can't estimate how many calories you're going to get by the volume of food. And one of the big factors in that is the fat content of food. So I'm really curious. So when you make, when you were making those salads and it had a particular dressing on it, like how are the dressings prepared? Like, are you doing it for every salad or do you create like a bunch of it? And then that is, you know, distributed to other salads or how does the preparation work you know you have actually uh hit on a really really really really good point there

i have people ask me what is a good thing to eat when you go out to a restaurant like what is better or or not you know okay and like like can you give me across the board as squareness ties in like can you give me an across the board thing like if i go to rust and if i order this instead of this you know it's you know it'll be better for me type of thing kind of like trying to circumvent the whole you can't shove a square peg in that whole thing right and yeah come back to reality hi hi yeah there we go but um the answer is i can't answer you on that because every rationale prepares everything differently. So when you ask about dressings and salads and stuff like that, like we at the restaurant that I worked out, it was a farm to table restaurant. Like I said before, like we made everything from scratch,

including all of our dressings and everything else. So every time a salad would come up to order the chef, there'd be ordering for the table. And if there was a salad included in it, the chef would have an eight minute timer and he would pop it up there on the side of the wall. We had an open kitchen, but there was like a part that we could see that nobody else can see. And you had to fire your salad within the last two minutes, because whenever you add salt to anything like that is a lettuce, it will wilt. So we had the type of stuff, but when we made the salads, you did it to taste. And I tasted every single salad. So every single salad, I had my own bowl. I had my gloves on. I had everything else. I mixed all the ingredients. I did all the salt,

everything else. I would take a piece. I would taste it. I would, you know, pop that part out, put my glove on. I mean, obviously I wouldn't go back in the same bowl, all that kind of stuff. So that was dressing to taste, everything to taste every single time. And if I need to adjust it, I would. So there were no set dressing amounts. At large scale restaurants, like your very outback or something else like that, you had the exact amount of dressing that's supposed to go out with it. You had the exact amount of stuff that's supposed to go out with it.

out with it yeah the exact amount of stuff that's supposed to go out with it so calorically could you maybe track that because you maybe had an idea of that type of dressing and how much you're putting on it or dipping maybe a little bit but like it's a lot of error it's different in every restaurant like some restaurants could like over like put a lot of salt on their chicken some could not so it's it's really just a there's no set like and when you see these caloric things on menus right when you see the this is 343 calories i just i want to be like oh my god it's a bunch of bullshit are you fucking kidding right now that's that's a plus or minus maybe five or six hundred calorie wag depending on like but it's human error like it's human error like you know that the person grabs a little bit more and in some restaurants they actually do

portion out to the point where they've measured these things out and people are literally just taking these things that are measured out and dumping them in addition doing that but even then like uh okay even food labels are full of shit they you know they measured these things a hundred years ago and they've extrapolated since you know they're not paying chemists to analyze every item of food that goes in the grocery store and has a label on it they're not doing that it's it's expensive it's laborious and it's unnecessary but um you know you made me think of something there trent you know when it comes to carbohydrates and uh, the volume of food, you know, it's probably correlated with the amount of food to some extent. You can probably look at it and kind of estimate what's there.

Yeah, like a fist of chicken or something. Yeah, something like that, right? You know, a deck of cards, I think, was an analogy at one point. All that stuff works with protein and carbs. When it comes to fat, forget about it. You know, the volume of food could be very small. The caloric content could be very high. And that's essentially what we're all kind of hitting at here. So it comes back to goals, right? Again, most of the people that hire a diet coach want weight loss. That's usually what it is. They have

weight they either need to lose or think they need to lose. That's a whole nother topic. And when it comes to weight loss, you have to eat fewer calories than you're consuming. And that's a very, very hard line in the sand that you really can't get around. You have to maintain a caloric deficit, not just Monday through Friday, you know, Monday through Sunday, and then you do it again. This is a weeks at a time effort. Fat comes off over the course of weeks, not days. It's a cumulative process. It can come on a little bit faster, but typically that is also a cumulative process. You don't gain 50 pounds in a few days. It happens over months and years. People have a hard time understanding that. If you're in a

deficit Monday through Friday and create a surplus on Saturday and Sunday because you ate at a restaurant, you're going to probably not lose weight that week. You know, are you going to gain fat that week? You're probably not going to do that either. You know, it's not going to completely destroy you. But this is what I try to explain to people when I say, you know, you're going to lose body fat over a longer timeline because of your lifestyle. And that's fine.

Just accept that. You have to break out of this mentality that every time you get on the scale, it's supposed to go down. You know, and I have people like that, you know, They'll weigh several times a week, and if it ever goes any other direction, they go insane. And I have that conversation. It's not supposed to go down every time. And if it does, it's probably not body fat until it's been at least a week. So to contextualize that to our conversation, it's what you said earlier. Just go. You're fucked. You're going to go over your calories. You're probably going to have a flat week, and that's fine because realistically, let's say it tends to be more of an issue with females versus males because women tend to have lower metabolic rates than men on average.

There's exceptions. You get some girls that are metabolic furnaces, of course. metabolic furnaces, of course. But, you know, if you're a woman and you have to lose weight on 1,500 or less calories, which is, you know, this is all self-reported, by the way. We have no idea what the fuck people are actually eating, which is a whole other podcast we need to talk about at some point. But, you know, according to what people say they eat, you know, a lot of females report having to lose weight on 1,000 to 1,500 calories, you know, and that number can go up with body size, you know, and genetic endowment and all those other factors. That's a whole other topic that we're not going to get

into today, but let's assume that's the case. You need to eat 1,200 calories to lose weight. Well, you know, when that's just the appetizer or the alcoholic beverage that you ordered, the cocktail, how is that going to work, you know? I mean mean you could uh you know you there's some little tricks you can do but to keep a restaurant meal let's say you let's say that's the only meal you have the day and you fast all day you know 1200 calories could be one item on the menu you know yeah that's your whole day i will tell you as a woman you're totally right and that's what they tell us they're like is's 12 to 1500 calories, depending on like what else you're doing too. So if you're working out, it goes a little bit

higher, all that kind of stuff. But I mean, if that's something that actually is your goal and you're committed to doing it, you know, you just, you just can't like, I don't, I don't know. It's like, and actually, actually you kind of hit an interesting point there. Alcohol might be the safest thing to have at a restaurant when you go out, as long as you don't have anything else. Because that is probably the one thing that you might be able to measure and track the calories in. Because it comes out of a bottle that you can kind of predetermine where you are.

I mean, I'm going to say like within a plus or minus 100 calorie type of thing, because, because restaurants are very specific about their pores. You've either got a six or a nine ounce pour, probably in a glass of wine. And they're pretty specific about it because that is a money making or losing thing for them. So they know exactly where their pores are and they watch their bartenders for that fact, because you need to make sure that you're not losing money in that. So if it was a thing where you just wanted to go out and socialize, get that social niche, just have a break, whatever else. So like, as long as you don't touch the food, alcohol might actually ironically be your way to go if you're actually rushing your calories and nothing else. Like, cause that's the only thing that's measurable.

So what you're saying is I should just go get hammered instead of eating any food? I am not. If Bill's listening to this right now, he's going to laugh his ass off. I am not the person to ask that question. But yes, 100% what I'm saying. Understood. Go for it. I'm going to put this into practice.

I'm Russian. I have a Russian background. I can go for days, man. Super liver. That too. Yeah. As the dietician in the room, I have to agree with her that it's much easier to measure alcohol. And you don't even need a food label for that.

You look at the alcohol content of the liquor or wine or beer that you're drinking. And then you multiply that percentage by the amount of milliliters in the container. So usually a shot is going to be 1.5 ounces. That's 45 milliliters. So you multiply your ounces by 30 to get milliliters. And then a glass of wine, they're going to give you five ounces. So that's 150 milliliters. And a beer is where you can get a little bit more. They'll probably give you a pint. It's about 16 ounces. So you got to multiply that by 30. You're probably really getting a beer

and a half when you order that out, which is fine. And you're assuming four to 6%. So now if you're drinking these IPAs or these barrel-proof whiskeys, that number goes up, right? So when I do my nutrition camps, this is where I depress people. When I go through the calculation and I explain, okay, here is a pour. A pour is 1.5 ounces, 45 mLs. And the assumption when you say the word one drink is that it's 80 proof, even though everybody in this podcast probably likes to drink higher proof than that. I typically start at 90. Yeah, yeah. I'm at 95 right now, but we're not counting. If I'm cutting weight, I'm not touching barrel proof, though. You know, I'm not drinking 9% beers. And, you know, if I'm drinking wine, wine's a little bit more narrow, somewhere in the

low teens, you know, 12 to 14%. So you don't have to worry about that. But, you know, when we say one drink, we meaning healthcare professionals, doctors, dieticians, nurses know, when we say one drink, we meaning health care professionals, doctors, dieticians, nurses, etc., we're referring to 45 mils of 80 proof spirits or an ounce and a half, that's a shot, five ounces of wine or 150 mils, or a 12 ounce can of beer, which is four to six percent. Anything higher than that is going to be more than one drink. So one drink is around 130 calories or so when you math that out. So scale that up, right? If you're drinking barrel-proof whiskey, you're around the 200-calorie mark, somewhere around like 190, 2, I think. I remember last time I counted barrel-proof in the 120s. So, you know,

you could calculate this just by looking at what you're ordering and just do the math. And yeah, everybody always talks about, oh, but the sugar in beer or the sugar in wine, the carb content's actually very low. Most of those calories come from alcohol, so it just blows my mind when I'm talking to people about drinking. And they refer to alcohol as though it doesn't have calories, you know, like, oh, I just, you know, I just drink a pint of, you know, this stout, you know? Yeah, the double chocolate oatmeal milk stout. How do you think that doesn't have calories? What are you talking about?

Well, I only had one, you know, and I think they know it has calories, but they don't realize that it's probably close to a meal. Like, I mean, one of those beers could have 350 calories, you know, between the, with most of it coming from the alcohol. That's the funny part. Very cool. But the carbs. Honestly, I don't think a lot of people actually know that. Yeah. I mean, really like you have something along with your dinner or something else like that. It's like, that is actually like, you just had your appetizer. That's what it is. And, and to your point too, I mean, like, I know, like I know that the dietician measurement is like a five

ounce pour for a glass of wine, but most restaurants actually do is six to nine ounce pour. So like, even if you get a glass of wine in a restaurant, you are over just that. You're at probably, depending on your restaurant, the pour and how much you've tipped your waiter or whatever kind of shirt you're wearing, like you're probably at least're depending on your restaurant, the poor and how much you've tipped your waiter or whatever kind of shirt you're wearing. Like you're probably at least a serving and a half, you know, on the first pour. So, I mean, that's something you just need to put in your mind and just know that, okay, I've just drank my appetizer. What am I having for dinner?

Or am I having an appetizer for dinner or what else? But like you're, you're, you're past that point. That's good. Yeah. That's a great point. And in my, uh, in my professional experience, having none of these credentials that y'all have, uh, when one drinks a, a given amount of alcohol, then one also tends to eat a given amount of food. A hundred percent. And you're amazing at billiards. Go for it. And everything else. Yes.

For 20 minutes. Yeah. I know that if I get the bison blue cheeseburger, if I've had a double chocolate oatmeal milk stout with that burger, I'm going to eat the sweet potato fries with it. And, I'm going to eat, I am going to eat the sweet potato fries with it. And it's just, it's just going to happen. Right. You know, but maybe, maybe if I didn't have that beer, then I'd just be like, well, I just want the burger today. No, you should always have sweet potato fries. I don't know. Yeah, that's true.

I don't want to head like, I don't know. I just don't have the beer and have sweet potato fries. That's right. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. That's a poor example. Poor example. It was. But yes, you're right. I'm curious again. So I want to talk a little bit more on the preparation side because I just think this is really interesting. I just know so little of it. So what about when we're talking about like meat preparation? So when you order at a restaurant like a, you know, a filet of fish or a not the McDonald's filet of fish, but or like, or like a burger or a steak or something like that. Like how, um, like what are the kind of grill conditions? How is it generally prepared at a restaurant versus like you might do at a home? Uh, well, I will caveat that with every restaurant is different. So I have to like throw it out there, you know, right now, but I, um, I was

the butcher's assistant at the restaurant that I did my externship in. And we would actually do a lot of sous vide stuff in advance so that we could fire it faster. And it's actually safer too. So your first semester in culinary school is how to not kill people, basically. Yeah. That's actually what it is. But we don't learn anything about nutrition, which is so crazy. There's zero nutrition classes in culinary school. How to not kill people quickly. Not about killing people slowly, right? It's basically like, I mean,

you're talking about like hysteria, food safety, all that kind of stuff. So all the quick ways to like not kill people. A sous vide is actually one of them. You got to be careful about vacuum sealing or something in there too. But so, and knife skills, that's actually all we do our first

semester we don't like I think we cook maybe one thing at the end I think the chef cooked it for us just because maybe he felt bad that we were at culinary school and we hadn't eaten anything but um yeah that's all we do so at the restaurant um that I was and we would go through and we would cut everything in advance a lot of the stuff that um even sometimes steaks too, like when we had a farm to table dinner, like we would actually see me like the whole tenderloin and everything. So it was, it was cooked to where it needed to be before we even got out there. We just finished on the grill. So when you're talking about protein preparation or restaurant,

you are talking about proteins that have been put into the form that is easiest for the line cook to cook right when you order. And that's it. So they could have been par cooked. They could have been pre-cooked and just being warmed up, which actually happens quite a bit, you know, or finished. We call it finishing. So I say warmed up, but we call it finishing. So maybe you have a side of chicken or a quarter chicken and it was sous vide. So it's been brought up to temperature. So the wine cooks don't have to worry about killing you, which is cool. Yeah. Yay. Or poisoning you, salmonella, whatever, because we want you to come back, right? So we don't want to make you sick. That's really cool. And they take it out and you order this like

quarter chicken seared over a pasta and all that kind of stuff. All right. So someone's dropping the pasta. Maybe you're dropping the pasta at the same time that you've popped this already cooked sous vide, the temperature chicken quarter out of a bag or whatever we had it like, you know, stored in, we're popping into a pan. We're giving it that golden sear that, you know, nice crisp, all the flavors probably finishing with a pan sauce. It's really cool. Blah, blah, blah. We put it over our pasta that we just made and boom, you have a quarter chicken and some pasta in like 12 minutes. So, uh, so a lot of your proteins are being finished with fats and salts

and everything else is, is I think is what you're going for it. Yes. To give them that flavor at the end. Um, there you go. Okay. Yeah. It's interesting. And I've heard, I've heard rumors that, uh, some places which will remain unnamed that are like big chain restaurants that are in like every city everywhere that they actually like, they have a lot of frozen food. restaurants that are in like every city everywhere that they actually like they have a lot of frozen food so that it's like a lot of times just like freezer to fryer or whatever yeah you're getting it dumped out of the bag absolutely if you're in a restaurant that actually isn't getting like half their ship than that of a bag congratulations i'm impressed that at your selection and i wanted to know how you did it. Oh no. And, but it's true. Like, I mean, seriously, like, okay.

So like during the pandemic, like I, so I'm like, I love butchering. Right. And the thing that we broke down a lot at the restaurants were lamps, whole lamps, which is like, it's my passion. It's got actually have a tattoo on my arm right there. Yeah. You're like, that's really cool. Yeah. So that's like the primals you're broken down. And so during the pandemic, one of the restaurant stores that you can only go to if you're a restaurateur opened up to the public because they were like, crap, we need to make money and people actually need to get food. So I was living in a place where my mom was there with me and I was like, dude, come on, you're going to love this store. It's going to be great. So we go, we get this whole lamb, everything else. And she's walking around the store and she's seeing these things like homemade pierogies and homemade this,

homemade that, and these, these whole forms of these things that they sell at restaurants. And she's just astounded because she's like, wait, they don't make them there. And I'm like, hell no. No, they don't buy them here. What are you talking about? Everything under the sun is in a big package or a big can at these restaurants and they just come by them here what are you talking about everything under the sun is in a big package or a big can at these restaurants and they just come by them man like they come by them yeah that's that's interesting um so so first of all i want to uh i want to like go over to your place and eat lamb that you have cooked over a spit or whatever, however you cook lamb. So that's, that's number one. So the second thing is, yeah. So I think that's interesting about the meat preparation. So is, um, what's the use of like, so obviously, you know, here's the limit of my cooking knowledge. When you, when you put something on a grill or in a pan or something

to cook it or to sear it uh you need some sort of fat on there to get it to not stick right but is there also like in terms of like getting the color and stuff is there you know or or like the flavor are you going for a certain kind of finish with the type of fat and the amount that you're using on there uh it really depends on what you're okay that that's a that's a huge let's say we're doing like a steak a steak for instance all right so you're talking like a quick cook finish stick okay so you've got your fast cook and your slow cook proteins and so you're talking about a fast cook protein that you would order and to do it you know there what you're going to do is um you're

actually the oil that you're going to use is going to be a high heat oil okay so it's going to be something that can withstand because usually those burners and those errands are on and they're on all the time because we're not turning them off. So you need to have like an olive oil with smoke out relatively early. You know, that would, that's a low smoke point oil. So you're going to be using like just a really, maybe a canola oil or like a peanut oil or like a lot of restaurants avocado maybe depending on the restaurant that you're in like yeah so maybe that one avocado is more expensive so it depends on where you are and what restaurants can afford right yeah yeah

well i know that actually there are some restaurants that actually they will sear a steak and then they will actually dip it in butter, like melted butter. I think Ruth's Chris does that. I don't know. Maybe there's some other ones that do that. They will actually do that. They will dunk it and do that. So you got the sear and then they actually dip it in butter and then they put it on your plate. I'm not shitting you right now.

It's like the butter machine at the movie theater. It is. butter and then they put it on your plate i'm not shitting it's like the butter machine actually at the movie theater you know it is so like when you have a uh when you have like a protein and you have a fat it's called the meyer reaction that's what actually causes that crispiness on the outside and that's kind of what you're looking for because it creates that amazing mouth feel everything else like that but you want it seared at i mean they're so you're searing in a relatively high temperature and any type of uh like your quick proteins and any type of a restaurant that you're doing. So you're going to have those burners just on high all the time. So you're going to be using very, I hate to say it, but probably highly processed, highly refined oils because like your grapeseed or your avocado

oils are very expensive so a lot of restaurants are not going to be buying those in bulk unfortunately so you're not going to be you want to do that at home that's cool you're not going to see it at a restaurant yeah what about pans are you always use cast iron or what are the restaurants typically use my friend is convinced that the steaks are always cast iron but i I'm not sure. That's why I'm asking for a friend. Yeah, they're stainless. They're stainless pans in the back and they're good. I have much cast iron at home and I was actually listening to your podcast earlier about cast irons and good on you for that.

We have cast irons too. I love them. I don't have to add much to it. No, you don't. That's what I like. They're phenomenal. They're great. We have actually a flat one we use for pizza my husband is actually a phenomenal baker

and he does all of our breads and he does pieces it's it's amazing but um some restaurants might use cast iron it depends on the restaurant most of them are going to do stainless that they can just pop out and then they can pop in the dish, the dish being the dishwasher in the back, and then they actually recycle. So there's usually at a restaurant, there's multiple dish stations. And whenever you're cooking, you just pop your stuff in the dish. That guy comes forward, he grabs your dishes, he puts them through a high temperature wash, which is sanitizing at over 180 degrees for more than 10 seconds, which is usually what it is, pops it out. That's great. And then comes back and then we'll deliver those pans back in stacks to where

you need them. And you just pull them, pull them, pull them, pull them, pull them, pull them as you're doing dishes. So yeah, it's nice to cook in a restaurant. Everybody knows this is free. Sounds like fun. Yeah. Exactly. Do you get the bowls? Yeah, too. No, you can put anything in the dish, man. The dish is great.

That's why you always have to be nice to your dishwasher, man, because they can really, they can fuck you if you're not nice to them. Yeah, yeah. Don't fuck with people that handle your food, man. Exactly. What was that, waiting? Or your dishes, your dishes, yeah. Yeah. That's exactly it.

Did you ever see that movie, Drea, Waiting? Yes. Yes, I have. I remember that line. And so I worked back at the house, and my husband and a younger time in his life worked front of the house. And we love that movie because it is so accurate. It is.

I mean, there are stories of stories stories allegedly i will say at the chain restaurant that he worked at when when he was a younger pup and i will not add names to this but uh you know just when someone didn't like their steak they'd be like cool they send it back they pop in the microwave for 30 seconds and be like here how you go there you go i grilled the first time but since you don't know what medium rare is, here you go. And they would just put it back on the plate, send it right back out. That's amazing. That's hilarious. It's totally true too. I totally believe that. Yeah. We do not have your best interests in mind. We just want to have a fucking job to do right pretty much i

will say i mean there are some restaurants there there are amazing that so i okay i i have to do a small plug there the craft is incredible at some of these restaurants it is freaking amazing i mean it is just it what some of these places do is just eye watering and is, it is wonderful. It is not going to fit into your training diet, but just go and love it for what, like love the craft, just love it Chef's Table? Is that the one that does all the... Oh, yeah. I mean, it's basically food porn is what it is, but it's great. It is. It's great, yeah.

It is. It's just like, I know so little about like cooking and that whole world, but it's just, I'm like fascinated by it. And I don't really, like I do not watch documentaries

about other topics that I'm not interested in or that I have no experience with, but I will watch a food documentary. Oh, yeah, it's just, it's really interesting. Yeah. Um, you know, I think that, that, that brings me to another point. I'd be curious to, to get your thoughts on this. I've been thinking while you're talking, like one of the things that is weird about our restaurant experience here in the, in the Western world is that for most people, like we're talking about the restaurant, the problems of the restaurant.

It's pretty clear, you know, that you're just not gonna fit this into a macro diet that's going to work for training long-term. But we're also assuming here when we're talking about this that you're going out to eat once a week or more, right? You're going out to eat on Friday night or Saturday night or both nights, maybe on Tuesday night too, right? And so that's a big part of our food culture in the U.S. right now is that a lot

of people go out to eat every week, sometimes multiple times a week. So then that wasn't always the way. So, you know, I can certainly see like this restaurant experience being, you know, this is like a celebratory experience that we're supposed to have like on your birthday and then like, you know, major feast days. You know, we used to have feast days back when the, you know, yeah, there used to be like the church has like feast days. I want a feast day. Yeah. And, but, you know, but anyway, basically, there were kind of designated time periods throughout the year where we would have these big blowout dinners, right?

That were from this amazing craftsmanship. And we've kind of outsourced that from the family and from the community into commercial restaurants that need to serve every day in order to be viable businesses. So to turn that into a question. You have turned that into like five questions. So I'm gonna hit on- We have so many questions. Yeah, okay.

So many. So many questions, I don't know. So take it off from there. You know, I'm curious about your thoughts about like, okay, so how do we bring the restaurant experience and this amazing craftsmanship of great food back a little bit into the family? The simple answer to that, and that was a great way to phrase it, but the simple answer to that is by understanding and integrating the time it takes to cook into our daily lives

is your answer to that. Because what we have now is a progression, a really awesome progression, because I've actually had two careers in my life that I wouldn't have been able to have before the 1990s or 80s, which is really cool. So one of those progressions has started with the feminism movement of women going like, hey, we're not actually cool only having one job. We actually want to... We're kind of smart. We want to do other things.

This is really cool. Let's go do things. So we did that. But unfortunately, we built our society on only women cook and nobody else does. Right. So when we were afforded the opportunity, which is a really awesome opportunity, there was a huge rush to go out and go, Oh, I can do this. I could do everything else, all these kinds of things. And the buffer back in the house wasn't put in there either through

it, through teaching men, through teaching spouses, through teaching anybody else, through teaching the entire household, like, Hey, we all have to figure out how we're going to cook. So that was gone. So enter in processed food, which the other part of it is, you know, like when McDonald's and stuff were started, they were actually just making hamburgers. Like it was really cool. So it was the same hamburger that you would get at home. As fast food and processed food progressed those years, specifically through like the early

80s through like the mid 90s, they were allowed to add a lot of stuff in there to preserve their foods longer, trans fat. Let's just go with that one because that's a big thing that people know about now. And they didn't have to tell anybody. So we have generations of people teaching their children like, oh, you know, it's okay because McDonald's is the same as me cooking at home. Or these foods that I'm getting at the store are the same as me cooking at home, these processed foods. And originally they were, but then they weren't. And now we have a lot of people, you know, between 70 or probably 50 and 80 with metabolic syndrome, other things like that that are happening. And a lot of that is because of all the additives

that were put into food that they didn't have to tell people by law until it came law. And that was driven by, obviously, the feminist movement of women going like, hey, I want to do something else besides these two career options you've given me, which, yay, that's really cool. It's awesome because it's allowed me to do some cool things in my life, but we've left a large gap there. Right. Yeah. That's a great point. It's generational, right? It is. Yeah. So now we're at a point where we need to go, okay, you know what? I want to bring food into my home and that has to be a conscious choice. Okay. Most of us have our days planned out to the minute or to the half hour. And do I think that's healthy? No. We've lived on other continents. We've lived in Europe. We've

lived in Korea. We've lived in other places in our career travels. And I'll tell you in Europe, they don't do that. They don't open stores before nine. They have siestas in the middle of the day. They really enjoy their time, their space, their weekends. And I'm like, where did we go wrong? Because those times are where you cook family meals, where you do these things, where you enjoy people and everything else. In Germany on Sundays, you can't do jack shit.

Like you can't even buy a bolt at the grocery store. Like nothing. They're like, nope, this is a day down day, forced down day. We're done. And I'm like, you know what? It's wonderful. Cool. It was hard when we first got there.

And after about three months, I was like, this is the best thing ever. It's great. You just sit and cook, enjoy your family, have a great time. After about three months, I was like, this is the best thing ever. It's great. You just sit and cook, enjoy your family, have a great time. So the first part of the answer to your question is adding that time in and going, I'm okay with spending this time cooking. I'm okay with spending this time bringing food to my family.

And when you get past that, then everything else kind of falls into place, actually. When it's not a chore, when it's something you choose, when you're like, yeah, I'm going to do this, then it's fine. Don't fit it into your day. Make space. That's great. That's great. It's something, as you were saying, that's something that struck me, is that how many food choices we make in the home every day, right? Something as simple as like, what am I going to have for

breakfast? What am I going to have as a snack in between breakfast and lunch? You know, what am I going to have for lunch, right? You've got at least three meal decisions you've got to make every day, plus like snack decisions along the way. And, you know, all of these are preceded by some amount of preparation. If you're actually going to cook the meal as opposed to go out and get it from a restaurant or to cook it out of a box, right? You've actually got to like do some planning and be like, well, do I have onions? Do I have potatoes? Whatever. But there's so much because all of that happens in the home.

There's so much of that knowledge that gets passed on generationally right so what what what grandma does you know the granddaughter's gonna learn and grandson right and if that's and if that's not there or if that gets distorted over time because of the other factors in our food culture then you can see you can kind of see it happens very slowly but over over generations um yeah so good answer so we got to make time first i know that's uh that's hard for a lot of people but uh i guess it's just something you got to dive into uh this is i mean this is a whole i mean like like robin was saying earlier he makes his vegetables in the morning for everything else he's he's meezing so in an earlier podcast he was saying he makes his vegetables for the day

and everything else like that he does that right that, right? So that's actually, that's, that's your mise en place for the day. That's what you've got. You have your mise there to bring it back to the meaning of the conversation that we were talking about. You start adding those small things into your day and having it just be part of your routine. Be part of, have your, have it be normal that you're in the kitchen. Make it an awesome place that you want to be. Like we have, we have like a booming speaker,'re in the kitchen. Make it an awesome place that you want to be. We have a booming speaker, Alexa, in our kitchen. We have flat. Our overhead light can actually turn different colors depending on what mood my kid is in. Totally, she can ask Alexa for it.

It's just a fun place. Do your knees. Have a great time. Make it a great place to be. I like it. I like it in there and you know we talked about you know how it's nice to have cleanup it helped i actually like cleaning up after myself in the kitchen it's something that's developed recently because i'll

you know i'll make breakfast and i got to let the cast iron cool down so just sit there on the stovetop then i'll put everything in the dishwasher and you know just pour from the french press throughout the morning but then after i'm done with my first block of work, middle of the day, and I have to go in there, then I like cleaning the cast iron skillet. I got the little chain mail scrubber and like putting the seasoning on it, heating it up at like, I don't know, helps me clear my mind in between the first, what I would call my first shift of the day to my second shift of the day. Yeah. And it's the same thing.

Before I go to bed, you know, I'm working, you know, 9, 10, 11, sometimes later, and I won't go to bed until I've done that same process again because I'll typically have to cook something else in the evening, at least every other day at the very least. And then, you know, I'll have to let the pans cool off and I'll forget about them and work. Then I'll go back over there and just that whole process of cleaning that. I can't leave the kitchen unless all that stuff is put away. But then it also makes me forget about my work. Yeah, yeah, that's great.

And our family, since my wife, my wife is a pretty good cook, so she handles most of the cooking duties. But I love cleaning up too. That's the one area I'm useful in. Actually, Jace loves it too. He's actually, he's a fanatical, like to the point where if we have guests, like he'll go into the kitchen, I'm like, sit your ass down.

Stop. You need to talk to them and then you can go clean. As soon as they drain their glass, it's taken away. No, he's like, I'm done, bye. He's in the kitchen. I'm like, sit your ass down.

Now. Socialize. I know. Well, this has been a fantastic conversation. Oh, yeah. And I hope that we can, you know, if you have time for us, we would love to have you back on the show to talk more about, I want to talk more about cooking because I think this is a, this is in our, in our world of strength training and health and fitness. Uh, we talk a lot about what to eat, but we don't,

we don't really talk too much about like how to make it. And, uh, that seems to be a big hurdle for a lot of people is just like, they're not sure where to start and what to do in the kitchen. So, um, and you know, and it's, and it's, there's clearly a lot more to it, like kind of foundational principles besides just like, Hey, just pull up a recipe and do that. So I'd love to have you back on and talk about that and whatever else comes up in our conversation. I would actually love that too. That'd be great because, I mean, you nailed it. Actually getting to the point where you're cooking something in the kitchen is the last step.

So there are so many steps in between there. And, you know, like Robert and I were talking about, like, there is a gap between, you know, the knowledge of a nutritionist and the knowledge that we get when we're learning cooking. Like we, we have no nutrition courses when we're actually in culinary school at all. Like we don't, like the only thing we learn is how not to kill you immediately. Like I was kind of saying earlier and, and that's it. Like, that's like, other than that, we're like, oh yeah, slowly killing you. Like, yeah, sure. Whatever. That's not like, actually not my problem. Like you actually just need to come back and do that. And, you know, and I don't think they, cause I've had several nutrition courses too, and they don't actually

talk anything about how, you know, restaurant cooking actually happens either. So there's a huge gap of knowledge there. And now there's a way we're talking about just that gap of just, you know, women going into the workforce and then everything else. So we've got multiple gaps there where people haven't been trained how to cook. And now we have these, bringing it all together. Now we have these, you know, recipes online, these 30 minute meals that tell us that we should be doing these, these things in 20 and 30 minutes. And then when we don't, we feel like failures. So then we don't go back to the kitchen and it's like, Oh dude, you're not failing. Like you just haven't been trained for, I don't know, years and years and years on how to make, like, it's just going to take time.

So there are definitely steps on being more comfortable, being able to get into the kitchen, being able to do these things that I think are going to be great for people who have goals in there to be able to just even get in there a little bit, you know? Can you teach me how to cook without 28 bowls? I can. Okay. Yeah, I can. bit you know can you teach me can you teach me how to cook without 28 bowls like uh i can okay yeah all right can you teach me how to cut an onion i still can't do it i can do it too actually i know i cut an onion in a completely fucked up way that is not my culinary school way i think it's so bad it's just like my way of doing it. I don't know why,

like I'm obsessed with doing it that way. And it's just like, it's like, I'm going to cut my finger off one day. This is how innovation happens. Yeah. Pretty much innovation to go to the ER maybe. Well,

well, Drea, thanks. Thanks so much for joining the show. We really appreciate it. And we'll look forward to having you back on very soon to talk more. Oh, thank you, sir. I have very much enjoyed my time.

I appreciate the invite. Yeah, we totally have like 10 episodes out of you if you wanted it. Oh, 100%. This is great. Let's talk about it because this is an area that there is a huge gap there. That's actually what I'm writing my book about right now. There's a huge gap there. That's actually what I'm writing my book about right now. Like there's a huge gap there, huge gap. So we need to fill in that gap to get people in the kitchen doing their stuff

so that they can like make their goals that you guys are talking about, because if they can't do the other side, then like, what are you doing? Right. So. Amen to that. Amen. All right. On that note, let's close out here. Thank you for tuning in to the Weights and Plates podcast. You can find me at www.weightsandplates.com or on Instagram at the underscore Robert underscore Santana.

Or you can follow my gym at weights double underscore and double underscore plates. You can find me, Trent, at marmaladecream.com. Email me there if you got any questions about training. Don't email me if you have any questions about cooking because I can't help you there. But maybe Drea can help you. I will pass it. Tell you what, tell you what, I'll make you all a deal out there. If you want to email me questions, I can forward those to Drea. And we'll talk about some of those on the next show. Absolutely. you