Well with Arielle Lorre - 334: What Living with Cancer Can Teach Us About Life & Overcoming Addiction to Wellness with Kris Carr

Episode Date: July 22, 2024

Kris Carr is a New York Times bestselling author, host of the Made to Thrive podcast, and wellness leader who's been thriving with stage IV cancer for over 20 years. She joins the show to discuss what living with an incurable cancer has taught her about life, how it has changed her perception on aging, and how to become the CEO of your own health. She shares candidly about overcoming an addiction to wellness, her five pillars of wellness, how to have a sustainable practice, finding blessings in challenges, micro habits she loves and more.Subscribe to Patreon for exclusive weekly content: patreon.com/ArielleLorreRead Kris’ book: https://amzn.to/4bQsQL4This episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services. Individuals on the show may have a direct, or indirect financial interest in products, or services referred to in this episode.Go to alomoves.com and use BLONDE30 for an exclusive 30-day free trial, plus 20% off an annual membership. Visit ritual.com/BLONDE for 25% off your first month. Go to DrinkLMNT.com/BLONDE to get a free sample pack with any purchase.Go to boncharge.com/BLONDE and use BLONDE for 15% off.Visit purelyelizabeth.com and use BLONDE for 20% off your first purchase.Produced by Dear MediaSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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would auto-huees-on-sor-sondergare. Go to your rise-adviseur or sunnycars. The following podcast is a dear media production. Welcome to the Blonde Files podcast. I'm your host, Ariel Lori, and I'm here to talk all things wellness. From how to achieve

optimal health and well-being to the best beauty tips and everything in between, no topic is off limits. I know there's so much information out there, so I'm bringing on expert guests and sharing my own experiences to help you sift through all the wellness stuff without the BS. Enjoy the show. Hi, everybody. Welcome to the show. I have a great episode for you today. I found this conversation and my guest to be really inspiring. I am talking to Chris Carr. She is basically a wellness activist. She is also a multiple New York Times bestselling author. She's a wellness advocate. She's a public speaker. She's an entrepreneur. And she has been living with incurable cancer for 20 years. And this has really informed, of course, understandably her whole life,

her approach to wellness, her career, all of that. And we get into a lot of these topics today. So we talk about her initial diagnosis and how she became addicted to wellness. I think that this is something that a lot of people can probably relate to. She talks about how she thought that she could cure herself. And she became the CEO of her own health, which I think is something that's really important and something that we can all learn how to do. And she has some great tips in this episode. But she also talks about how she had to shift her approach from that addictive place to having a more sustainable, joyful wellness practice, how to find blessings in the challenges. I mean, I cannot even imagine living with stage four incurable

cancer. I'm sure that that is unfathomable to a lot of people listening. And she just has such an amazing perspective and attitude. She talks about her five pillars of wellness. We talk micro habits. We talk aging and her perception of aging, living with a chronic terminal illness, and so much more. It's such a powerful conversation. So please enjoy Chris Carr. Welcome, Chris. Thanks for having me. Thank you for being here. Really looking forward to talking to you. I was actually just listening to you on Melissa's podcast as well. Such an amazing conversation. I feel like you two really bibed on a lot of the topics that you were talking. talking about. Yeah. So I'm really looking forward to talking to you today. There are so many things I want to

cover, but maybe to start, you can just give the audience like a little background on you. Absolutely. So I'm a New York Times bestselling author. I'm a wellness coach, really wellness activist. And I'm a cancer thriver. So for people who I've never heard that term before, I've been living with stage four cancer for 21 years now. And that was really my end. into the world of wellness. I think a lot of us come to it from having either a warning sign, something going on in our lives, or a massive wake-up call and life-changing experience. And mine was that massive wake-up call. And so I have a very rare and incurable stage for sarcoma. And, you know, it inspired me to become what I talk about as the CEO of your health because

there are so little known about my disease, especially when I was newly diagnosed, because with rare cancers, there isn't a lot of cash, right, for research. Right. So few people have them. And so the first doctor that I went to suggested a triple organ transplant. And yeah, I love your eyebrows raised. I didn't know much about wellness, but I was like, that's nuts, right? And the next doctor gave me 10 years to live and so forth and so on. And that's when I decided to become my own patient advocate and to build my team and to really treat it like a business. Like I'm, I'm hiring, I'm firing, I'm finding my second in command. And hopefully that person has his finger or her finger on the pulse of research and maybe even is involved in like creating the cure and also

had a good bedside manner. And so the thing is, is that there still isn't a cure for my disease. But it can be slow growing, it can become aggressive. And so I've just been tracking it for 21 years. It has been slow growing and stable. And that has given me the time to explore how I want to take care of myself, what that's going to look like and how I'm going to live like a mean it. Wow. So much that I want to unpack there, but maybe we can rewind to the beginning. And how did you even arrive at that diagnosis to begin with? I wasn't feeling well. And I was blowing it off. because I was 31 at the time and I was like, you know, I'll figure this out later. Hold on. I'm sorry, 31. Yeah. And how old are you now? I'm trying to do that much. 52. Bananas.

Well, thank you. Insane. I mean, okay, we need to know everything you're doing, but go ahead. I think bananas is probably going to be my new favorite term. Thank you. That's bananas. That's when you know I'm really blown away. Pull out the bananas. very sweet. I wasn't feeling well. And so like most of us when, you know, we're younger, we're just like, ah, it's nothing. I'll just keep on going. I was trying to build my career and my life and, you know, find the person. And, and I figured, you know, fiber later. But then it got to the point where I was really doubled over in pain, had a hard time walking and breathing. And that's when I went to my GP and the rest is history. And did they know immediately? Because I know that a lot of

women have the experience of having symptoms, whatever they are, especially with kind of non-specific symptoms and going to their doctor and being dismissed. I had this happen. Last fall, I had a major health crisis and I went to like nine different doctors and they were all like, oh, it's anxiety, you know, it's stress. It turned out to be not. So how did you get that diagnosis? Did they just know based off of your symptoms and they took you seriously or did you have to really advocate for yourself. No, in the beginning they're like, it's gas. Oh my God. It's constipation. It's the sudden the other thing. Maybe it's your gallbladder. Maybe it'll have to come out this weekend, but, you know, I'm golfing, so we might have to push it. Literally, these were the words. And so, but then, thankfully,

there was an ultrasound, right? And so I actually got to look under the hood. And if it wasn't for that, then I wouldn't know. And it probably would have been something that we continued to put off. The thing my disease is that because I don't have an aggressive version right now and that could change, there wouldn't have been much they could do anyway, but you have to know. You have to understand what's happening in your body. And I think to your point, you have to be willing to say, I know there's something up. And it just means that this is not the right colleague for me, because we are colleagues. And so I'm going to keep looking because we're not in alignment, because I trust what my body is telling me that there's a problem.

Yeah, yeah. We know our body's best, and I love that you approach it as a business and that these are colleagues and that you're collaborating. It has to be collaborative. It's not you are the God and you dictate everything and tell me what's happening in my body. It's a given take. Yeah, I love that you said that. I think it's because medicine can be very intimidating for the layperson.

So we think that everybody's got the answers. We're all figuring it out. And so to just be able to say we're on the same playing field, we have the same objective, how are we going to reach that objective? What was getting that diagnosis like for you? I tend to have a little bit of health anxiety to begin with. So I would imagine hearing the C word, it's everybody's nightmare. So what was that like and how has it evolved over the years for you?

I mean, it was terrifying at first, absolutely. It changed everything. I left my career. I started a whole new life. It inspired me in many ways, and it was very traumatic as well. And it wasn't until many years later that I was even aware of how much trauma was involved in my diagnosis. But I think that, and you'll probably relate to this as a creator, I was so frustrated that there were so little out there for people like me. and at the time young, vibrant, you know, like I was one of probably the early members of the

young adult cancer community of young adults trying to say, wait a minute, this isn't our grandma's cancer. We're at a whole different stage of life and you're literally treating us the same way. And so it inspired me to create my film, I write my books and really, you know, go on a deep journey for people like me. And so I think fear was also a driving factor and I needed to put my focus someplace else and making and creating and being curious and saying, you know, I'm going to do something with this to not only help myself but help others, help get me out of that place of fear and anxiety, help take the focus off of me. I can relate a lot to that in a different way. I mean, I just think about like my experience in recovery. I've been. sober for 10 years and I talk about it a lot. And a lot of the reasons why I drank and used drugs were because of fear and anxiety about various things. And so I had to learn in the past 10 years

how to abandon self. That has been the greatest thing for me. And creating certainly is like kind of a means to do that. And then obviously there are other things. Like I try to focus on other people because that's the only way that I forget myself. But it's such a powerful thing to be able to do. And I would imagine, you know, living with this diagnosis, there would be anxiety of like, is it getting worse? Is it getting better? I mean, just always feeling like you have this thing living in you. Yeah.

And on any given day, you don't really know what it's doing, right? True. I just had my 21-year scan. Mm-hmm. And it was wild because it's, I'm still doing really well. Wow. But it took me probably a decade before I could really learn. and how to live with cancer because it's a mental game.

And so to your point about anxiety, I just wrote a book, which I'm sure we'll talk about, but I explore the big messy emotions that happen when life falls apart, right? And anxiety is one of those. And I think that when we start to get curious about our emotions and we understand that there are two things, their information and their energy, information has something to teach us, energy needs to move, energy needs to go someplace or it implodes. And so getting curious about anxiety, I realize that it's here to help me survive. Every single one of our emotions serve a purpose. We can't amputate any of them and expect to be whole. I'm sure both of us

have tried. Absolutely. And then you find another way. And so I know for me, anxiety is usually that rumination. So if I'm sitting here with you, but I'm finding myself spiraling out, because let's say I just felt something weird or I have a strange cough. I have tumors in my lungs and my liver. And I start to tell myself stories about what's happening. I've completely stepped out of the present moment here with you. And now I'm going down this rabbit hole of fear and anxiety. Right. And so in some ways, we can create new mental health habits. to say, oh, this is what my brain does on anxiety. In this moment, I feel my butt on the cozy velvet couch. You know, I'm, I can take a deep breath and I can come back here where that

spiraling isn't actually present. And so I think there's lots of tricks and tips for us. And, and no, this, I'm not not talking about clinical anxiety. I'm just talking about the day-to-day stressors that every single one of us go through. I'd say cancer has taught me how to handle those more and to snap out of it when I need to come back to present. It's also, we can't always solve the problems of the mind with the mind. Right. So sometimes you're just like overthinking and you're like, I know I shouldn't be ruminating, but what the F I am. And that's when getting into your body, you know, going for that run or playing with your dog or whatever it is that helps you.

come back into the tactile space can be really useful. Yeah, there's that saying something along the lines of like the same brain that's experiencing the anxiety isn't the same brain that's going to get yourself out of it. I mean, I always learned like, especially in recovery, I need to act my way into feeling different or feeling better because I can't think my way into feeling different or better, maybe momentarily, but it's not a sustainable thing. So I need to act. Usually that involves contrary action, doing something I don't want to do, picking up the phone and calling somebody and asking them about myself when I want to talk about myself and my anxiety, you know, things like that to kind of disrupt that ruminating cycle. And I know that there's so much research around walking as well and how that disrupts rumination and anxiety. When it comes to my health and wellness essentials, I really only have a few foundational things that I do on a daily basis that I consider to be non-negotiables.

And one of those is supplementing my electrolytes with Element. I have been taking Element for years now. And it is truly one of those little micro habits that had such a massive effect on my body. So when I was working with a nutritionist years ago, I felt like I was always puffy. It wasn't really bloating, but it was this water retention. And he said that I had to be adding salt to my water to help balance the fluid in my body. This seemed very counterintuitive to me at the time. And I just could not stomach just adding plain salt to my water.

So I started taking element. And it was a massive game changer, not just in that fluid balance area, but also. in how I felt overall. I think that there's a big misconception when it comes to hydration, which is that the more water, the better, and water is the key to hydration. And this is simply not true. So hydration isn't just about drinking water. Being optimally hydrated is about optimizing your body's fluid ratios. So this fluid balance depends on many factors, including the intake and excretion of electrolytes. So Y Element. Element is a science-backed electrolyte ratio, 1,000 milligrams of sodium, 200 milligrams of potassium, and 60 milligrams of

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helps me keep up my wellness routine wherever I am. I love it because they have literally everything on this app. So when it comes to fitness, you can do everything from beginner to advance. They have the flow or the class that will fit your schedule. It's so great for travel. because their classes range from five minutes to an hour. So if I'm on the move or at home or I'm traveling where I know I'm going to be walking all day, but I just want to squeeze something in in the morning to get my body moving, I can always take the time for my wellness routine. And then, of course, they have yoga, Pilates, strength workouts, all of that. But they also have meditations, sound baths, nutrition tips, self-care tutorials, so much more. I learned how to dry brush from

Allo Moves. So thank you, Allo Moves, for that. And it's just so easy to see why Allo Moves is an award-winning app for a reason, whether you want to start a guided program, try a new style of workout, or just stay on track with your wellness goals while on the go. Allo Moves has it all. They have over a hundred new classes every month. They keep me hooked and motivated. I really think that variety is the key to motivation. So it's really hard for me to just do the same thing over and over again. And when I have a lot of choices. It helps me to just stay consistent. It's like a constant stream of fresh vibes for your wellness journey. So stay on top of your wellness routine, no matter where you go. Sign up for Allo Moves today. You can join Allo Moves.com and use the code Blonde 30 for an exclusive 30-day

free trial. Plus, you can enjoy 20% off an annual membership. It's such a good deal. Again, it's Allo Moves.com. The code is Blonde 30 for a 30-day free trial and 20% off. You an annual membership. Allo Moves.com code blonde 30. I'm curious if, I don't know how to phrase this, but at any point, did you or have you felt like this was a gift in disguise, obviously, I mean, just in how it's informed how you live your life, the direction, your purpose, all of that. Yes, I don't use the word gift because it's obviously not something I would give to you and there's no return your seat and I would return it. It's, you know.

Yeah. But to your point, I think that there have been some blessings. And so when we talk about that, I think many of us, when we go through our dark nights, when we hit rock bottom, when the rug's been pulled out from under us, when life kicks us in the teeth, you know, can you find those moments of growth, of expansion of, okay, this is a detour in a direction that I didn't want to go, but what can I find in this direction that will help make my life richer. And I think we get that opportunity as opposed to just sinking into the despair of the circumstance. I wouldn't have learned how to take care of myself the way I do now.

I wouldn't have met so many incredible people. I wouldn't have met my husband. I wouldn't be living a life that I find has a lot of meaning and purpose. I probably would be doing my old career, which I wasn't that happy in. You know, so it was sort of like, hey, life is short. What are you going to do about it? Yeah. How are you going to live when you know your life could be cut shorter than you ever imagined? And that gets you motivated to get busy living.

It's also a lot to hold. Yeah. But I tend to put my focus in the place that creates more momentum in my life as opposed to stagnation. Mm-hmm. I think that's so inspiring because ultimately, you know, we have a choice. of how we react to things and how we utilize things. And, you know, we have this saying in recovery. Again, I always reference these sayings, but that's where any of my good ideas come from, but like the seemingly bad becoming good. And it's like what you're saying, not something that you would choose, not something if you could go back and have that happen again or anything like that.

But sometimes they become the biggest growth opportunities and redirections and character building and all of that. So that's kind of what that reminds me of. And I think it's, you know, just inspiring for everybody listening to hear that. Thank you. Yeah. It's that invitation to go inward. Yeah.

It's that invitation to say, how do I want my life to feel? Who do I want to be in this life? And for me, a lot of that comes from not just what I put out into the world, but a big driving factor for me is learning how to enjoy my own company. Because to me, that is what wholeness is. And so what are the barriers keeping us from enjoying our own company? And when we put our attention on those barriers with the intention of dissolving them, not instantly, but over time, that becomes our wellness practice, that becomes our spiritual practice. And I think that ultimately it's how we learn how to have our own backs. I love that. So I'm curious what wellness is to you and what that journey has been like as well. I've heard you talk about kind of being addicted to wellness. And I would imagine that there's probably some inclination to try to do all the things, you know, especially with your health circumstances and all of that. And so how has that? And so how has that? journey been from I guess that time of diagnosis and where are you with it now? I'm so much more

relaxed with it now 21 years in but when I was newly diagnosed wellness was like first of all it was exciting it was new yeah wait a minute Burger King is an awesome what tell me more about this you know and so again like I shared with you it helped me take my attention off of my fear I started to feel better when I started to eat better and I started with my diet because it was something I could control when I felt so freaking out of control, you know. But then it got to a point for me where I was making choices based on fear, right? So I was becoming very perfectionistic. And I was afraid that if I did it wrong, I'd make cancer worse. And that's no way to live. And we know that, so what I teach is basically an anti-inflammatory approach to health and well-being. And so we know that

stress is a huge creator of inflammation. So here I am, micromanaging myself and putting myself in a wellness box that I felt was so small and so tight, but I had to get it right, you know, because for quite some time my goal was to cure myself. I was frustrated. I was like, well, if you can't do it, I guess I'll have to, you know. And so that was my approach. And I wasn't really honest about it. I think that even after my first, second, third book came out, I was still feeling like an imposter. Like I can't possibly be sharing this information if I haven't fixed myself. And it was at my 10-year scan when literally one of the doctors had said, you will be lucky to live 10 years. And I was doing very well at 10 years where everybody was happy but me. And it was because I felt like a

failure and that I was letting not only myself down, but people down. And, And I've talked about this a bunch recently, but that's when I really had to figure out how to redefine wellness and redefine my goal, which was healing versus curing. Because curing may happen. It happens in the body, but we cannot predict it. You know, it may or may not. But healing can happen at any time and stage of life. And so that actually took a lot of pressure off of me.

You know, and then I was like, okay, you know what? I'm not going to do this for cancer. I'm going to do this for Chris because it feels good to feel good. It feels good when my gut feels good. You know what I mean? When I'm not bloated, when I'm not feeling uncomfortable, when I'm not lethargic. It feels really good. And I want to be here.

And while I'm here, I want to feel good. So that shift allowed me to kind of open up my practice. And I think it works for people more so than all of the fads and all of the craziness that we can see happen and all of the restriction that we go yo-yoing on with that latest influencer or whoever is talking about the latest craze. And it's not sustainable for most people, right? And so we want a practice that is sustainable and joyful. Yes, I know. I always refer back to a quote that Liz Moody said on my show. I don't know if you know her. And she said, when wellness is making you miserable, it's not wellness. And I think that so many of us have the

experience of making these habits so rigid. And that's a stressor in and of itself. I certainly went through that journey years ago where I was like, I'm going to get healthy. And I'm counting macros. And I'm bringing my Tupperware to the restaurant with the boiled chicken and broccoli or something. And I'm doing the intense, high intensity, pliometric workout seven days a week. And my period is gone and I'm bloated and I have gut issues because I'm eating a pint of halo top at night with the microwaved quest bar, you know, all the things, all the trends to your point. And I was miserable, but I didn't know any better at the time. And I had to hit a rock bottom myself with that. I think rock bottoms are amazing. So, you know, that's where all the growth happens. And that's how I

kind of figured out, like, how to adjust and how to make wellness work and feel good. So how do you recommend people kind of attuned to themselves and find what works for them when there is so much noise out there. I love that you talked about attuning to yourself. So let's get the basics. So I teach what I call the five pillars of wellness. And they're about being mindful of what you're eating, what you're drinking, what you're thinking, and how you're resting and renewing. And those pillars sit on a foundation of stress management because stress creates inflammation, which is the root cause of many of our chronic illnesses. And so if we just say, okay, here are these different buckets.

Here are these different pillars. Am I tending to them more often than not? Now, it's about being mindful. I didn't say it's about dominating them. I didn't say it was about hacking them. I didn't say it was about crushing them. It's about being mindful. Am I tending to these pillars more often than not?

Am I hydrating myself? Right? What is the skin test? The skin test is when you just pull, you know, like your skin and it should, you create a little tent. It's a little pinch test. And it should bounce back relatively easily like you. You're hydrated. You can also just look in the toilet.

Yeah. You know what I mean? Does it look like a logger? Probably I need to drink water. I've never heard that one before. Yellow color. And so how can we create practices that are filled with ease so that we do what? Do them.

Right? So even with food, what I teach is a plant-based diet, but the vast majority of people in my community or read my books are not 100% plant-based. The goal is to eat more vegetables, to eat more real food because plants have the medicine. So what I like to teach is, okay, you're new to this or you're not new to this, but you're frustrated with it. How about we approach this by adding before you subtract? You don't have to take anything out of your diet that's going to make you feel deprived. It's going to make you feel like you're doing shit wrong. Like, you're just going to add a smoothie to your day.

We're going to start there. And then we're going to build overtime. I think there's a lot of power and micro habits as opposed to these all or nothing approaches. Totally. And I love that concept of adding instead of subtracting because I think that we tend to get so overwhelmed by things that we need to restrict. And, you know, especially now, everything is like, quote unquote bad. and there are so many things that we need to avoid. And certainly I think some of those, depending on the person, should be cut out.

But by adding, I think that that creates momentum, right? Yeah. And one micro-habit then inspires you to do the next micro-habit. And that's like a really sustainable way to build lasting habits, which turn into routines, which turns into your lifestyle, right? A hundred percent. And to say something. is bad and to label it as bad, I mean, granted, like when we're only eating the standard

American diet, and we know some of the basics of like what is not healthy or sustainable for our bodies. But to label something bad and to get into this extreme wellness mindset, to me, is a disservice to the body, but it's also a just, it's very disrespectful too, because, you know, your body is more powerful than we could possibly ever imagine. And I think when we come back to the basics, literally, am I hydrated? Am I eating my fruits and vegetables? Am I getting enough real food? What's my mental health look like?

You know, I mean, am I tending to my emotions? Am I caring for myself in a way where I'm building that relationship where I actually spending time with myself is a joy? Am I moving my body through space and time more often than not? Not in a way that's, you know, creating injury or in a way that's making me feel like I'm, this is punishing, this sucks, but I do it because I have to. but in a way that's actually joyful for me. I'm checking that.

Yes, I actually am. Oh my gosh, am I sleeping? And if I'm not sleeping, can I start to work towards better sleep and say, okay, if that's the real thing that's happening for me right now, then the main thing that's happening for me right now, that's where I'm going to put my energy. We start to be in conversation with our bodies. And again, just going back to those pillars,

we're checking in on them and saying, okay, more often than not, I'm taking care of these areas. And as a result, I can start to see better results. What was the most impactful thing if there was just one that you could pick? Or is it just kind of a combination of all of these five things? I think it's a combination. I think they work in synergy. I think when one or more of them are really off, then it's really hard to feel good.

So it's like you're eating well, you're moving your body, but you're really struggling with sleep. it's going to be hard for us to feel good. So that's the pillar that needs the most attention. I think start, if you were to approach it, start in the place that you're struggling with the most. So, you know, in the beginning of my journey, I was focused on what I was eating because, again, it was something I could control and I was eating a really crappy diet and I felt terrible. And so, but I'd say 20 years into my journey, I've been focusing more on what's eating me. And that's been the focus of the work that I've been doing recently because I think we have to look at things in a very holistic way. It's kale is actually easy. Yeah. You know what I mean? Anger, grief, anxiety, not so much. Yeah.

Yeah. I think that when it comes to wellness, it is so easy to focus on the green juices and, you know, the sauna and the workout and not look at the rest of it. And the rest of it is so foundational because to your point, you can be doing all the things. But if you are grieving, if you're stressed, if you have like negative self-talk, if you're anxious, that is going to have more influence over your body, I think, than what you're putting into it. And I remember, like, years ago working with somebody when I had really bad gut issues, which was in turn causing hormonal issues and skin issues and sleep issues and everything. And I wanted all the stuff.

I'm like, tell me what supplements to take. Tell me what to eat. Tell me what to cut out of my diet. And he's like, no, we got to work on your stress. And I'm like, oh. And it's like, no, you know, we don't want to look at these things. So can you tell us a little bit about like your journey with that? And I know that that really influenced your latest book, right?

Yeah. So my latest book is called I'm Not a Morning Person. It's about. M-O-U-R-N-G, everybody. Yes, exactly. Exactly. And it really is about those big emotions. And I've written seven books, and this is my seventh. So a few years ago, my publishers were saying, okay, it's time to write another book. It's been a bit. And, you know, there's all these ideas about what kind of book I should write. And I thought to myself, the only thing I can write about is grief. And I remember them being like, grief, really? Oh, oh, God, that's not going to sell. Nobody wants to talk about that, even when they're grieving. Yeah. That's true. Okay. But this is. the only conversation I feel called to have because it's what I'm going through. You know, again,

global pandemic. I was approaching my 20-year anniversary of living with stage for cancer. My father, who is my chosen father, who adopted me, was dying of cancer. And my business was struggling in many ways because I was, you know, making the choice to be, to kind of pull back. And I hadn't life-proofed my business at the time. Unless I was doing, you know, my business wasn't thriving. Right. So I was like, I have to write from this place because I know I'm not the only one experiencing these devastating losses and changes and uncertainty and not understanding how to navigate it, but also all of the trauma that can come up when our life falls apart. You know, my therapist has a saying, and she taught me, which is the grief train pulls into

the station and brings all the cars. You know, your life falls apart and you're like, oh, my gosh, why is all this old shit coming up? I thought I was a, over him. I thought I was over that rejection. I thought I was over that betrayal. And here I am, feeling it all. And then I'm also feeling these things like rage. I'm feeling things like utter, you know, despair and depression. And why am I so jealous right now? Oh my gosh. So it's really like I think of it as, you know, the stuff that we hold back. There's that great saying, what you resist persists. And because we live in a griephobic, messy emotions of our society, few of us have the tools to survive these storms. We drink, we take drugs, we overeat, we, you know, you overwork.

It's so easy for me to throw my energy into work and hustle and to dilute myself into thinking, but what I do is good, so it's okay. Right? And it's opposed to being like, what's really going on under the surface? And so that was the journey that I decided to embark on first and foremost for myself, but also because I think as a collective, we were really in a lot of pain and still are. Yes, for sure. What did you learn from that process? I think it was very similar to how I experienced cancer. So many stigmas, something that is not normalized in any way, shape or form, something that people are so terrified by, and understandably so. But like we were talking about earlier, this is a natural process. And we can't amputate our emotions and expect to be

whole. And again, wholeness is the goal. So if there's something that you're pushing back, what I have found is that it's still going to come out because energy needs to go somewhere. It will come out, but it's going to come out in destructive ways. Right? Or maybe it's going to necessarily itself into the nooks and crannies of your body, and it's going to potentially contribute to manifesting in some sort of disorder or disease. It's not the sole reason why you got sick. And look, we know that illness comes in many shapes and forms. A lot of it is genetic, but there are ways that we can participate in our disease as opposed to participating in our well-being. So that is what I've found. I've found that to normalize these conversations,

much like you're doing is giving each and every one of us permission to feel so that we can actually heal. You guys know I never miss my breakfast and my go-to breakfast is usually my protein yogurt granola situation. I actually just had it right now and when it comes to granola, not all granolas are created equally. A lot of the granolas that you can buy are just filled with sugar and not great ingredients, which is why I love purely Elizabeth. So I love their original ancient grain granola. It's my favorite of all of them. The recipe is made with organic oats and nutritious ancient grains and superfood seeds like chia, quinoa, and amaranth. They are these delicious, crunchy clusters with a unique, salty, sweet taste, which I love. It's not overly sweet.

It's also certified USDA organic, gluten-free, vegan, and non-GMO project verified. There's no artificial flavors. It's baked with coconut oil and sustainably sourced coconut sugar, so it's an unrefined sugar. And I just love it. I sprinkle it on my bowls. Sometimes I'll just have it as a snack, just straight from the bag, or I'll have it with a little bit of macadamia milk for dessert and some berries. It is just chef's kiss so good. I am such a fan of Elizabeth Stein, the founder of purely Elizabeth. She was on the podcast a couple months ago. You guys should definitely go back and listen to that episode because it's so fascinating to hear about her own personal journey, the evolution of her brand, and how her own wellness has kind of tied in with the evolution of purely Elizabeth. So you guys can go to purely Elizabeth.com and you can use the code blonde at checkout for 20% off your first purchase.

Again, that's purelyelisabeth.com and the code is blonde at checkout for 20.com. percent off your first purchase. I know you guys will love it as much as I do. I just recorded a fascinating episode with a Stanford psychologist about cynicism. That episode is going to come out in a couple months, but we were talking about the difference between cynicism and skepticism. And I know that a lot of people have become skeptics. Skepticism is a good thing, whereas cynicism is not the best thing. And I know that I have a lot of help skeptics. And I know that I have a lot of Help skeptics who listen to my show, and this can be a good thing. So if you can spot a too good to be true health hack from a mile away and read labels like it's your job, congratulations. You are a skeptic. And ritual knows that every good skeptic deserves a multivitamin that exceeds your standards. They're clinically backed essential for women 18 plus multivitamin has high quality, traceable key ingredients in clean bioavailable forms. Why is it important to be a skeptic when it comes to your health and especially supplements? go back and listen to my episode with Kat Schneider, the founder of Ritual from last September.

You will be shocked by what really goes on in the supplement industry, what really goes into and does not go into most of your supplements, and what's in things like the capsules, so many things that you don't even think about when you are taking supplements. So why I love ritual is because, like I said, clinically backed multivitamin. It has high quality, traceable key ingredients. This is very important. in clean bioavailable forms. So they have nine key nutrients in two delayed release capsules per day that optimize your body's

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which is a little bit troubling. Also, ritual multivitamins are vegan, non-GMO, Project Verified, Gluten and Major allergen-free, certified B-Corp and made traceable. So no more shady business. Rituals Essential for Women 18 Plus is a multivitamin you can actually trust. get 25% off your first month at ritual.com slash blonde. Start ritual or add Essential for Women 18 plus to your subscription today. That's ritual.com slash blonde for 25% off. If I had to pick my one desert island health or wellness essential, it would probably be my bond charge sauna blanket. I truly think that

this is one of the most impactful health hacks that is out there. Why, I don't. love my sauna blanket. Well, you can do it anywhere. I like to set mine up either in my bed or on the couch. It kind of looks like a sleeping bag so that you guys can picture this and you get in it and your head is out and you can multitask. You can read. You can watch TV. You can work. You can meditate. Whatever you want to do. And it's very enjoyable. I usually do 50 minutes so I can stay in it much longer than I would a traditional sauna. And the way that it works is basically by raising your heart rate to that of physical exercise. So it burns calories while you relax. You can burn up to 600 calories in just one session. And then, of course, it has infrared heat, which elevates your heart rate while relaxing. So you get

this release of endorphins. You can feel euphoric after your session. And you sweat. Sweating helps flush out heavy metals and other toxins. And the infrared light heats the body directly rather than heating the error around you like a traditional sauna. So you get the same benefits at a lower heat. You don't have to have your head in. You can do it for longer. And it's just amazing. The bond charge sauna blanket, I think is the best because it heats up quickly. It's actually the quickest on the market. Like I said, so easy to clean. It has a sleek and lightweight design. It's low EMF compared to other brands. It has higher temperatures compared to other brands. And they ship worldwide and rapid time. There's free shipping on every sauna blanket. There's no hidden costs. Easy returns and exchanges.

you can get a 30-day free trial and a 12-month warranty. They also have other amazing products. I love their LED mask. It's one of my favorites. So go to bondcharge.com slash blonde and use the coupon code blonde to save 15%. That's B-O-N-C-H-A-R-G-E.com slash blonde and use the coupon code blonde to save 15%. Do you feel like you let go of the grief or that you're still experiencing it, but experiencing it in a different way? I haven't let go of it because I think it's not something I can let go of, right? I think it's part of me. Just like, you know, we all have little parts of ourselves and it's like saying, well, only certain crayons are okay to use. Yeah. You know what I mean? It's like, but I like red.

Yeah. No, red bad. No, I think it's softened, but it's absolutely still there because as a saying goes, grief is love. And the more we love, the more we're going to greed. But coming back to this idea of tending to our hearts, when it comes up, I have tools to sort of ride that wave. And the wave will recede, but the ocean is still the ocean. Yeah. I love that analogy. I had somebody on yesterday and we were talking about grief as well. She's actually a medium and she had a near-death experience. She works with a lot of parents who lost kids and kids who had near-death experiences and it was really fascinating. But she was talking about grief and she said, you know, we think that we decide when we're done with it. No, grief decides when it's done with you. And, you know, she said the things that you try to control are controlling you. And when we try to control and to your point resist these things, they take hold of us. Yeah, 100%. It's so beautiful and I completely agree. How do you recommend people confront some of this stuff that they don't want to face?

I mean, we're all running from something, I think, at some point in our lives. And we can be so distracted and we can just distract ourselves from the second that we wake up to the second we go to bed. So do you have any tips from your experience with this that the listeners can try to apply to their own lives? Absolutely. many. Let's go meta though because I feel like, you know, we've talked about some really good ones about getting in your body and actually giving yourself permission to face your feelings. I think if we come back to that idea of creating a relationship with ourselves, a relationship that we honor, that we love, that we're willing to nourish because we want to feel good in our bodies and in our minds while we have an opportunity to have bodies and minds, then our, our Attention is very clear and very strong. That means if you and I are like best buds, I am going to show up for you. I'm going to take care of you. When you're having a hard time, I'm going to call you. I'm going to be present for you because you mean something to me. Right. That is the same way we want to approach how we care for ourselves. I mean something to me. And therefore, this pain that I'm feeling is worth tending to. And I think also what happens for most of us is When we actually allow ourselves to feel the pain, it might not be as bad as we think it is. Yeah.

I think it's the fear of the pain. Yes. And the barrier that that fear creates to fully alive living is what trips us up. So it's the fear of the pain versus the pain itself. For sure. Right. And so if we go, okay, I'm going to thaw into that idea. You know, we're just starting to talk ourselves into a new way forward.

Yeah. And taking those baby steps, first it can just be the aware. of maybe you're not even really aware of how you're feeling. I don't know if you've ever had that experience. I have where I'm like, I don't know. I'm just out of sorts. Something's off. Disturbance in the force. But I want to keep moving forward because I'm feeling the flutters or I'm feeling the discomfort to actually take that moment and say, okay, my first step here is to name what I'm feeling. Because if I can't name it, I can't address it. And so the naming of it could be, I feel really embarrassed. Oh, okay. Why? And then starting to have that dialogue with self.

So also we can't always do the stuff alone. So depending on what we're going through, I mean, therapy is so helpful having, to your point, those good friends that you can reach out to and you can have those honest conversations with that starts to create that break in the storm. I remember when my dad was dying and I was in a CVS because my mom had asked me to go get some insure because it was the only thing that he could have. And I came up upon the bottles and I was thinking, how many should I get? And I wasn't aware that I was doing math saying like, will he be here to drink the rest of them if I get too many? But that was the first time I really allowed myself to feel and I had no choice because it was coming in hot and heavy. You know what I mean?

And I'm running through CBS like, get that fuck out of my way because I got to get to the car because I don't want to break down in front of people. How embarrassing. I get to the car. I totally break down. And it feels good. It feels like a break in the storm. It's like the moment the medicine kicks in or the fever breaks. And I was like, oh my gosh, if I'm giving myself a little bit of a reprieve right now, where else in my life am I holding back this feeling of feeling better? the world didn't fall apart because I fell apart in the car. Yeah. Wow. So powerful. I think that, I mean, I have that experience too. The fear of feeling the feelings is so much worse and causes so much more destruction. Again, back to my addiction. I didn't want to feel. And so for 10 years, I was trying to numb out these emotions that felt too big for me to deal with. So I needed something and, you know, ultimately almost killed. me all because I didn't want to feel and you know confronting all of that stuff like I think that when you do you realize that you have the resources you know I remember a therapist that came on my show a few years ago and she said the version of you that can handle that thing is born into existence in that moment that you experience or deal with that thing you know I think that we're so much stronger than we give ourselves credit for and fear is like a big liar so true I love how you're saying

And I think what's interesting is we equate strength with like this Teflon approach with being, you know, like armoring up and, you know, never let them see you sweat and not showing emotion and whatnot. And what I have found is that the true strength lies in our softness and our willingness to be vulnerable. And then some of the most vulnerable people that are vulnerable and you say, oh my gosh, I look up to that person so much because she's willing to be real. Yeah. They're like, when was realness the best commodity? You're like, oh my gosh. You mean I don't have to do any of this shit? Mm-hmm.

Wow, that's so liberating. Yeah. Yeah, it's so true. I want to close, I guess, by just talking a little bit about aging. It's a very relevant topic with my audience. And we are in Los Angeles where everybody resists aging happening. What has your diagnosis and your perspective and everything? done to your perspective and your experience of aging. Well, it might sound cliche, but for me,

aging is a privilege. I'm like, wow, I wasn't supposed to be here and I still am. And I think the idea of aging vibrantly is saying, what feels good? You know, taking care of myself in a way that actually feels good. That's unique to me. That doesn't make me look like every single, you know, other person that allows me to show that, hey, there's wisdom in this base. There's wisdom in this body, you know, and to become more okay with that. It's truly a deep act of self-love and self-acceptance. And it doesn't mean you can't do what you want to do to feel good. It's just each and every one of us are given that opportunity to figure out what it's going to look like for us. You know, for me, I want to feel good in my body. I don't want to.

like throw out my neck when I reach for the laundry basket. You know, it's like having the functional fitness. You're probably too young. Like when somebody will say, what happened? How'd you injure yourself? You're like, I read. I read a book. No, I'm starting to approach that age. I'm sliding into my 40s and things are hurting and creaking that aren't, that weren't before. Exactly. So it's like I want to slow the creaking process. But more so, I want to be able to do what I want to do. Yeah. And I want a body that allows me to do that. Yeah. And that to me is what aging vibrantly is. And it's also, I think the older we get, and granted, I'm 52, but as I listen to women who are older and wiser than me, and there are many in my life, what I love about them is they don't give a fuck. Yeah. They can give two shits what you think about them. Yeah. And I think that is so liberating. And I think, each and every one of us have that opportunity to go, you know what matters is that I care about me, is that I like what I'm saying and I like what I'm doing and I like the person that I'm becoming,

not what you think about me. Granted, I don't want to be a jerk. That's not what we're talking about here. But I think it's about comparing ourselves less to others and more to who we are now, who we were yesterday, who we want to become. And that gives us that instrument. inspiration to keep growing. I love that. And something that I find really reassuring is I have a lot of older friends also from recovery. Everyone's like, we get it. You're sober. But friends in their 50s, 60s, 70s, even 80s. And they all say that they have never felt better at whatever age they're at. Maybe physically, you know, they have a few more things popping up. But I think to your point, there is this zero F's attitude. There's wisdom. There's life experience. I just know for myself even from like late 20s to late 30s, crazy shift. I would never go back if I could ever, ever, not even to my early 30s. Like just in the last year, like 38 was such a big year for me in terms of just like accepting myself. And then I hear from everyone, no, 40s are so much better because you just care less and then 50s and 60s.

But we're so resistant to it, I think. I think the more of us having the conversation and you see such a huge conversation happening right now around menopause and perimenopause. And it's so liberating because these are conversations that even your gynecologist hasn't, you know, literally there is information in studies and research that says how many. gynecologists have actually only had, you know, a couple hours of classes on a very important stage of women's life. And you go, oh my gosh, how have we been left out? We have, we always have to fight, right? But in the best possible way, and I love seeing the conversation changing in so many pioneers now, because half of us are going to experience it if we're lucky enough to live that long. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And it is a privilege.

And I think that we lose sight of that. And then when you have a health thing come up, like I know from me, even though it wasn't obviously as serious as cancer, overnight, I went from being one way to being another way in a brain and a body that I didn't recognize. And I didn't know what was happening. And I didn't know if I was ever going to get better. And that was like, that shook me to my core because you understand at some level health is wealth. Health is the most important thing, but we take it for granted until we're faced with,

you know, something out of our control. I think that I wouldn't go through that again either, but it did definitely change my perspective and just, I think, appreciate the good and the health that I do have and the life that I do have and all of that. So I think it's so amazing what you're doing and having these conversations. It's like, I think it's just incredible and so valuable. for the listeners and for women of all ages. Thank you. So tell everybody where they can find your book and follow you and all of that. So my book is everywhere books are sold.

I'm not a morning person. And I am at Crazy Sexy Chris on Instagram. I love the handle. So good. Thank you so much for coming on. Thanks for having me. Thank you. I hope you enjoyed that episode.

And if you liked it, and if you like the show in general, please take a second to rate, review, and subscribe. It goes a long way, and it's actually the best way to support the show. Also, if you want to see more about each episode, you can head over to The Blonde Files podcast on Instagram. You can go to Arialore.com. And I'm always posting about each episode over on my personal page at Ariel Lurie. Please note that this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services. Individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to in this episode.