Well with Arielle Lorre - 84: Dr. Amy Shah - Fasting, Hormones, Gut Health and Optimizing Our Circadian Rhythm!

Episode Date: November 18, 2020

In this episode I’m talking to Dr. Amy Shah about how to optimize our circadian rhythms to support our health and well-being. Dr. Shah shares about the car accident that served as a wakeup call and galvanized her to change her own lifestyle; what we can do for optimal gut and hormonal health; intermittent fasting; and simple shifts that we can make in our own lives to feel our best. She takes questions at the end and answers your most pressing questions when it comes to our hormones, microbiomes and overall wellness.   www.BluBlox.com/BLONDE for 15% off your order plus free shipping. www.HelloNed.com/BLONDE for 15% off your first one-time order or 20% off your first subscription plus free shipping. www.PublicGoods.com/BLONDEFILES to get $15 off your first order. And visit www.Nurish.com to take a 5-minute assessment and receive a supplement recommendation tailored specifically for you!   Produced by Dear MediaSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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is a dear media production. Hey, welcome to the Blond Files podcast. I'm your host, Ariel Lori, and I'm here to talk all things wellness. From how to achieve optimal health and well-being to the best beauty tips and everything in between, no topic is off limits. I know there is so much information out there, so I'm here to help you navigate it all and live your best life. Thanks for listening. Let's get into it. Hi, everybody. Welcome to the show. Today, I am talking to Dr. Amy Shaw. She is a double board certified doctor and wellness experts specializing in food allergies, hormones, and gut health. And she is a proponent of intermittent fasting and circadian fasting.

And she breaks it all down in this episode. So she changed her own lifestyle after having had kind of a moment of awakening after a car accident, which she talks about. And she talks about how that changed her life, what lifestyle practices she implemented after that that made the biggest changes. And she gives lots of great tips for simple lifestyle hacks that can make a huge difference when it comes to our overall health and well-being. So enjoy. Okay. So welcome to the show. I'm so happy to have you here. Thank you so much for having me. So excited to chat. You know, I was looking at your website earlier actually, and I was reading your story about your car crash. I would love to kind of go back, get some of the history of your training and your medical background, and then also your own

personal journey with health and like how that moment, I think you said it kind of jolted you and how that has steered you to what you're doing today. Great question. So like many of us, I think all of us can relate to this. We have such busy lives. And, we're just doing everything all the time, almost like just checking off the things on our to-do list for that day and going on this path. And sometimes we lose sight of what we really want, what really makes us happy and energized, what really is worth our time and energy. And I think what happened to me is that's exactly it. So I went to college for nutrition. And I thought, because I was so obsessed with nutrition, that was just like the only choice for me that

made sense. So I did nutrition. Then after finishing nutrition school, I actually applied to med school. And after finishing med school, it was like this thing after thing after thing. Then it was like I did internal medicine residency, which is like very intense hours. I was in the Boston Harvard Hospital. It was the craziest three years of my life. Then I decided to go to fellowship, which is like another two years of craziness. And then I ended up getting a job in medicine, which was amazing. I was super busy from day one. And shortly after I started that job, I realized, wow, all of this that's happening around me is great, but I'm on this treadmill to, I don't know where. And I'm really not happy with how I feel. I was always tired. I was cranky.

And I had already had my littlest baby was already two years old, yet I felt like I was postpartum. I was bloated all the time. I just didn't feel myself. Mostly I didn't feel happy. Like I was anxious, I was moody, and I wasn't acting the way that I felt I should feel and act. And so one day, when I was driving home from work, and this is so classic, right, impromptu meeting, I'm the only female physician there, the partners, and I couldn't say no. It was at 5 o'clock, and I knew I had to pick up my kids from karate. So I sat at the meeting, so afraid to say anything. And when it ended, I literally ran, like, as fast as I could to the car and sped away trying to get to karate because karate closed at a certain time. And I was really cutting it close. And I didn't want my kids just to be

standing out there. And so it's like that, you know, treadmill. So many things going on. My mind was like on, you know, overdrive as it always was. And as I was about to turn into the complex, there I got into a huge car accident at the intersection. My car went spinning. I have never been a car accident where all the airbags in the entire car went off. There was glass everywhere. All I know is I was spinning and spinning. And thank God there was a divider somewhere in that intersection and I was able to stop that spinning before I crashed into another car. When I came out, I was bleeding. I was hurt.

But the only thing I kept thinking about was, oh my God, I need to get to this karate place to pick up my kids because they'll be waiting for me. And I knew that all of this made me realize that something was very off. I wasn't even able to go back to work for two weeks. I was hurt, the car was totaled, you know, there was all that aftermath that happened. Luckily, it was something that I was able to recover from and was cuts and bruises and no broken bones, but what it made me realize is, wow, I need to change something. That brief break from my crazy life for the aftermath of that accident, it just made me wake up. And I said, okay, I need to do something,

different. I'm not happy. I'm not energized. I'm not feeling the way I want to feel. So that's the start of my journey. Really, like that's how it all started. So I started to do my own research. And as I started to heal myself, I wanted to share it with people. And that's how I kind of came up with all the things that I talk about today. I get a lot of messages about where to find clean personal care and household products, where to buy everyday necessities, and how to be more environmentally conscious and sustainable while doing so. So if you're looking for all of that, look no further because public goods checks all of those boxes and more. They are the one-stop shop for sustainable, affordable, healthy household products ranging from personal care to household items to supplements,

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and all topics and offer our take on the matter with plenty of humor, heart, and bad assery along the way. We launch a new episode of Press Send every Wednesday. We'll see you there. It's interesting as you were talking about that. I was thinking of this moment that we're all kind of going through now where it's not like the trauma of a car crash, but I think a lot of people feel like, at least I can only speak for myself,

we've kind of had this like break almost this year from the hamster wheel, the distractions. I mean, there's still, you know, I'm still working remotely and in school and all of that, but it kind of strips away everything else and really forces you to take inventory of your life. And I think a lot of people are coming to this point where they're like, man, something has to change. Absolutely. And I think that a lot of us, you know, fulfill all our promises to everyone else. But we never really think of what we want to accomplish or where we want to be and try to kind of fulfill the promises to ourselves too. So this is exactly what you said. COVID-19, I've met so many people and myself that have

re-evaluated their lives and their goals and both personal and career and health. I'm curious what your lifestyle was like prior to the car accident when you said that you were feeling tired and you were feeling like just crappy. Yeah. Okay. So exactly the opposite of what I talk about now. So what I used to do is that I would come home from long day of work and I would eat a huge dinner late at night, probably around 8 or 9 p.m. because I was so busy putting the kids down and all that stuff. And then I would start studying because I had my board, my second board exams that were coming up and I would stay up super late on the computer, reading. And then I would skimp on my sleep because I thought,

who has time to sleep? Like, I'll sleep when I'm dead. It's fine. I can't only be superwoman. If I am not sleeping. And so I know a lot of women do that because they think that they would be lazy or like, you know, not working hard enough if they actually got a full night's sleep. So I would skimp on sleep. I would have tons of caffeine to try to keep me going. Then I kind of skimped out on my workouts and my personal time. So in the past, my workouts were my headspace where I kind of, you know, thought about things. Like it's like therapy. for me. And what I really was doing during that time is I'm like, there's no time to work out. That's a waste of time. And if I did, I would do it on a treadmill at home, like never outside. So what I learned

then through so many years of trial and error and changing my diet, which at that time was a very processed diet because I was always in a rush in the car, in the office, lots of coffee drinks, lots of to-go things. What I learned through all of my trial and error, all of my research into fatigue and why people feel tired, why women especially have hormonal imbalance, what I realize is that I needed to change all of that

in order to get any kind of results. Because when I checked my blood testing, nothing came up. And I think a lot of women can relate. Like, you look into your, or men too, you feel tired, you feel like something's off, you check your blood testing, and nothing really comes out at you so bad. And they just told me, oh, you're a busy mom, you have this practice. You know, this is in the realm of normal. And I just left their dejected and confused. And so when I did my own research, I found out maybe I had hormonal imbalance and maybe I had gut imbalance

and maybe I had, you know, insulin, dysregulation. So those are all these three things that I was thinking about at that time. And as I started to change my lifestyle, my diet, supplements, etc., I was able to find kind of a combination that started to work for me. And so I wanted to share that. And surprisingly, I wasn't, surprisingly, there's so many people who were in my same position. And so they found a lot of value in what I had to share. And so that's why I continue to do so. And that's when I hopped on social media.

Can you talk about some of those changes that you made? I mean, understanding that everybody is different and bio-individuality and all of that, but were there certain lifestyle and dietary changes that really made a huge difference? There's three big things that I really changed. I started following circadian rhythms. So I found out from my research that circadian rhythms has such a huge impact. on our hormones, on our gut health, on our brain health. And I realized, oh, wow, these are easy things that I can do that I used to do back when I had more time. And I didn't, I stopped doing at some point. And then the second thing is I changed my diet. I realized through all the research, you can be on any diet. Like, I've tried every diet because I was trying to figure myself out. And nothing was

working for me. What I realized is that the biggest things that help your gut, is to have a diet filled with plant fiber. And what I realize is that when I was eating my processed diet, I was barely getting any fiber at all. So reducing the amount of sugar and caffeine that I was having in a day and increasing the amount of plants, vegetables I was having in a day, was a huge impact on my health. And I saw it almost immediately within a few days.

as you know, the gut microbiome changes super, super fast. They've done studies that if you drastically change your diet, you can change your gut microbiome in three days. So I changed my diet. I started living with circadian rhythms, which I can get into a little bit later. And then I started to do this thing called circadian fasting, which basically meant that I didn't eat those late night dinners anymore.

I moved up my dinner time. I realized that two to three hours before bed, I should be done with my dinner. done with computers and electronics, I put the blue light filter on my phone and starting to wind down and really, really clean up my sleep hygiene before bed. Because for me, the sleep factor was life-changing. And that's part of the kind of the circadian rhythm thing. So those two things were, I mean, I did a bunch of other things as well, but those were kind of the big needle movers for me. Yeah. So let's get into the circadian rhythm and circadian fasting. Can you explain that

to everybody. Yeah. Circadian rhythms, you know, we often think of them as sleep and wake cycles, but we don't realize that there's actually a clock in every single one of ourselves in our liver, in our GI tract, in our muscles. We cannot be doing everything at once. So our genes in our cells have to decide, okay, well, it's daytime, so let's work on processing the glucose, let's work on metabolism. And when it's nighttime, the cell works on renewal and repair and all the housekeeping functions that they need to do. Kind of like you're never going to deep clean your house if there's constantly guests coming to your door all day and all night long.

But when the last guest leaves, you're like, okay, now I can clean up my house, right? So the same is your cells are programmed to do the same thing. So circadian rhythms, we realize, wow, it's impacting hormones, it's impacting cellular function, it's impacting brain health and mood and fatigue metabolism. So the way we really found that out is that shift workers, night shift workers, like nurses, firefighters, policemen that had night shift jobs have diseases at two times the rate that non-night shift workers, they died 10 years earlier on average, even when matched

in terms of other things. they have higher diagnosis of diabetes, anxious, anxiety, depression, fatigue. And then they also found that if you take people who are jet lag, which is also a circadian rhythm disruption, that they have similar symptoms. And now we have mechanisms. So why circadian rhythms really alter our mood and our attention and not just our sleep. So circadian rhythm science is just budding today. It's like everything we look at is connected to circadian rhythm.

in rhythm. So it's super exciting. There was a study that I think was so impactful for me from the SOC Institute in San Diego. What they did is they took two groups of mice. They were obese. They were the same mice genetically. They worked out the same. They ate the same. But one group was circadian fasting, meaning like eating in a time restricted fashion, meaning not eating, you know, during sleep hours. And one was eating 20, hours a day whenever they felt like it more like an American typical diet. And they fed them the same high fat, unhealthy chow. And they found out within three months, there was a huge difference between the two groups. They ate the same number of calories. They exercised the same. Yet one group that was

eating 24-7 was fat, had diabetes, heart disease, brain disease. The other group did not have those diseases, yet they were identically the same otherwise. So that spurred a lot of interest in circadian rhythms and eating in a circadian fashion. That's where intermittent fasting started to become really popular. And what we're finding out now that there's all these different protocols that people use, I still believe in circadian fasting because to me, the circadian rhythm science is so strong that overlapping that with timing my eating is not so hard. And it really is something that has changed my energy levels and my focus and my health. And so that's what I talk about. This episode is sponsored by Nourish by Nature made, the number one pharmacist recommended

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your nourish vitamin intake. Visit nourish.com to take a quick five-minute assessment and receive a supplement recommendation tailored specifically for you. So Dr. Shaw talks about the effects of blue light and the importance of being cognizant of our exposure to it. And you guys doing this has been such a game changer for me this year. And I always say that using blue blocking glasses is one of my best wellness hacks that I have implemented so far. So I'm in the habit of just putting on my blue blocks when I start my day on my phone or computer and I basically don't take them off until I'm done with my day. And what I've noticed is less eye strain, less headaches, insomnia, anxiety, tension, all of that. I can tell such a difference when I don't wear them.

Even after just an hour on my computer, I feel totally wound up and like my brain hurts. So Blue blocks has high quality lenses for daytime, nighttime, and for color therapy exactly in line with the suggested peer-reviewed academic literature. They are created in optics laboratory conditions, and over at blue blocks, they truly understand how blue light affects our biology. Their glasses come in over 20 stylish frames to choose from. My favorites are the crystal, and they come in prescription, non-prescription, and readers. Additionally, they can turn almost any pair of your glasses into custom blue blockers. They just take your existing frames and fit them with their lenses. So if you want to get your energy back, sleep better, block out the unhealthy effects of blue light.

Go to BlueBlocks today and get free shipping worldwide and 15% off with the code Blonde. That's B-L-O-N-D-E. Or go to blueblocks.com, B-L-O-X.com slash blonde, B-L-O-N-D-E for free shipping. worldwide and 15% off your order. Can you talk about the science behind the, like, for example, the study that you were talking about where they ate the same amount of calories, but it had a different effect because there are so many doctors and scientists and people who are of the thermodynamics camp, right? Like at the end of the day, it's energy in, energy out, and this doesn't really have any

kind of discernible effect. And then there are people of your camp, obviously, who are proponents for fasting and the science behind it. So it can be kind of confusing. So you kind of talk about that for the audience. 100%. So humans are a lot different than mice. We just found out in a new study from JAMA that humans can out eat anything, right? If you think about it, especially overweight modern Americans, you tell them to restrict the time that they eat in and they can easily eat all their calories and more in that time. So what we found is that you can't just time restrict probably in humans. You also have to change their diet. And that makes sense because when they did this study, they said, you know, they didn't really check how many calories

that time restricted people were eating. So it's really complicated in humans. I definitely think that, you know, at the end of the day, calories do matter. But timing also matters. meaning that we know for a fact that eating a meal late at night, say 10 p.m, has a higher insulin spike and a greater insulin resistance than a meal eaten in the morning, the same meal. That's a fact. So that being said, you could say, oh, yeah, well, over the course of the day, you know, if you're eating a little bit in the morning and a little bit in the evening kind of evens out, if you're eating all your calories later in the day, especially late at night, that's when

things start to go astray, as we see in the circadian rhythm studies. So I don't think it's just about intermittent fasting. I think it's the timing, meaning that it makes sense, right? Our genes, our bodies are not built to be eating a huge metabolically challenging meal late into the evening. Melatonin, the hormone that secreted two to three hours before bed, tells the pancreas. We have melatonin receptors on our pancreas that tell the pancreas, okay, it's time to shut down that insulin production because it's night and we don't need that much insulin anymore.

So you can imagine how challenging it will be if you eat that huge big meal late at night. Yeah, I'm just sitting here thinking about how crazy it is that humans were one way for so long and evolved to be this way. And then all of a sudden, technology and all these processed foods and electricity and, you know, eating meals at 10 o'clock at night instead of when the sun goes down. I mean, that's been going on for such a, you know, a blip in the radar. So I just wonder how we're going to evolve around the world as it is now. That's so true, right? If you think about it, we didn't have microwaves and people weren't very occasionally having anything really after sundown. And so it's not such a huge surprise that this would be healthy.

And I also, there's a big breakfast studies. So there's a study that shows that there is a benefit in modern people to have some kind of food in the morning hours versus skipping that breakfast altogether and having a late. lunch. So in contrary to many intermittent fasters that say skip breakfast and, you know, eat a late lunch. What I say is, hey, actually, you know, if you follow circadian rhythm science, you should be having something. It doesn't have to be first thing in the morning, but at some point in the morning, whether it's 9, 10, 11, have something. So break your fast around then. That means that you would start your fast a little bit earlier in the evening. And that makes more sense metabolically.

Do you have any, I mean, are there specific foods that are better than others to either break the fast with or to end the day with? There's a study that looked at like 11,000 human gut samples. And they found that the healthiest microbiomes were those that were eating the most variety of plants. So that included nuts and seeds and but really the fiber from plants. The fiber from plants is something that will rebuild your gut lining that will increase the strength of the communication between your gut bacteria, your immune system, and your brain. And so what I recommend to people is that when you are trying to improve your health, you are following circadian rhythms.

When you are eating, you should eat a ton of plant material, meaning vegetables, six to eight servings a day and you will see your health really transform. What about timing of exercise? I mean, should you do that first thing in the morning or do it at a time where you can eat right after? Exercise is a really great one. Obviously, I'm going to tell you as a physician, any exercise is better than no exercise. So if you're telling me, you only have time to exercise at blah hour.

just go for it. Okay. That being said, if you're like, hey, I want to optimize it a little bit more, then you look at the science of a fasted workout. So a study in the New England Journal of Medicine showed that when you are fasting, it's not just that you're not taking in calories. It's that your body has to strengthen this muscle. This muscle is the fuel switch. So we use glucose as fuel primarily. That's our preference. But when we run out of glucose, we go to the liver and we get the stored glucose, the stored guiccogen. So maybe your pasta dinner from last night or whatever, your sweet potato. And then once that's done, we go into this amazing phase where it has to use fat for fuel. And so it breaks down fatty acids, uses that for fuel. And the process of going from

glucose to fat for fuel and then back. It's called metabolic switching. In the literature, I call it a fuel switch. That is a very powerful signal to the body to turn on all of these other molecular mechanisms, to turn on all of these stress resistance genes, to turn on these mitochondrial strengthening genes. So we think that it's like, exercise. You know, exercise is not just good for your muscles. They turn on all these like downstream effects. And that's kind of what happens when you metabolic switch. And so if you started fasting at 7 p.m. the night before and at 8 a.m. the next day, you're like, you know what, before I break away fast, I'm going to go do a fastic workout. Your chances of getting into that

metabolic switch are much higher. And you will have stronger chance of, you'll have stronger chance running out of glucose and using that fat for fuel. And then once you break your fast with a meal after the workout, you replenish that and go back to glucose. Can you talk about the effect that all of this has on things like hormones and the gut and your body overall? Yeah. So that circadian rhythm I was talking about,

it actually is connected. It's in the same area of the brain as our master hormone, G and RH. So gonadotropin releasing hormone, this hormone that is pulsatile. It starts everything. So GNRH will go to the pituitary and release all the hormones and I'll go to the thyroid. Then the next stop is the adrenal. So ovaries.

So the GNRH pulse is so important in starting that kind of cycle. The GNRH pulse is very sensitive. It's sensitive to circadian rhythms. It's sensitive to stress. It's sensitive to starvation. it's sensitive to, you know, all kinds of external signals and internal signals. And so that's why you'll see women who are really, really stressed not get their periods because that G&RH pulse is disturbed. It stops.

And that's why you'll see people who are working out too much, women especially. They will also lose their period because of that G&RH pulse. So if you think about it, that GNRH pulse is really protecting our body. It does not want a woman evolutionarily to get pregnant in a time of stress or famine. And so it becomes quite responsive to external signals. And circadian rhythms has a huge input on GNRH. And it's almost in the same area of the brain. And so they've seen like there's so much influence on that.

So that's why for me, when I'm talking about hormone balance, it's not just about diet. It's also about changing the timing of waking, getting sunlight in the morning, stimulating those retinal receptors, and also getting less light in the evenings and having good nights. My guests and I talk a lot about anxiety here and the potential ramifications of it. And I think it's something that we are all experiencing at a. another level this year. I know I personally have really struggled and my usual solutions haven't always been a match for the magnitude of anxiety that I have felt between the pandemic, school, work, old trauma, new trauma. Currently, I have these health issues I'm experiencing, which have been very anxiety provoking. And all of this is to say that I was looking for something to help

my body and mind deal with this in a natural way. And I found that in Ned. So Ned is a is a science-backed, naturally sourced CBD wellness brand. As you may know, CBD helps with all sorts of things from insomnia to stress and anxiety, pain relief, nausea, and so much more. And Ned has the highest quality, full-spectrum CBD extracted from organically grown hemp plants, all sourced from an independent farm in Colorado. Ned does not cut corners nor spare expense when it comes to CBD production and their extraction process and their packaging, everything. And on top of that, they are fully transparent and share third-party lab reports, who farms their products, and their extraction process all right there on their site,

which was super important to me. Since I have shared about Ned, I've also gotten some messages from you guys about how impactful it has been for you. And those messages are just so nice to get. I got one recently from somebody who said she went. off all her meds that she was on for a particular issue since using the full spectrum CBD, which is just mind blowing. So if you want to check out Ned for yourself and try their CBD, just go to www.com slash blonde, B-L-O-N-D-E, or enter the code Blonde, B-L-O-N-D-E at checkout for

15% off your first one-time order or 20% off your first subscription. order plus free shipping. Again, that's hello ned.com, h-E-l-l-O-N-E-D dot com slash B-L-O-N-D for 15% off your first one-time order or 20% off your first subscription order plus free shipping. There are a couple of questions that I have. First one that I will go with because they're both relevant is can you talk a little more about the effects of blue light, especially at night? One bout of blue light is going to delay your melatonin by 90 minutes. Wow. So if you go to the grocery store or the mall or whatever with big fluorescent lights at night, that is going to delay your melatonin secretion. And so there's going to be, it's going to be more difficult to go to sleep.

A lot of people who consider themselves night owls are just bathing in blue light, into the evening and not able to sleep, right? So they're just over stimulated? It's overstimulated. Like we should not, our brain is confused. Like they're like, okay, we have these clocks and we're constantly looking for cues from the external world. And the cues are telling them something different than what their internal clock is

telling them. There's like confusion there, right? So we want to maybe use yellow lights in the bedroom at night, maybe turn off all the blue fluorescent lights as much as possible. Maybe we put on the blue light, like on the iPhone, we already have that blocker. Maybe an hour or two before bed, you just stop everything. You know, you just do your nighttime routine. What I do is I use about an hour to do skincare, my nighttime routine, talk to my kids, maybe read a book, but really no electronics for one hour, at least. It makes such a huge difference. That's one of the things that I really struggle with.

as I think a lot of us do, we're always available. We, you know, we're glued to our phones. And I do make a point to like always wind down at night. I'll take a bath. I read a book. You know, I'm in bed probably like nine o'clock realistically. So I, you know, I have pretty good sleep hygiene, but it's hard to not have the phone right there. And if it's near me, I just have that kind of invisible tether. And it makes such a big difference. If I can just put it in the other room, like an hour or two before I go to bed, I start to fall asleep so much earlier. It's crazy.

100%. And, you know, sometimes I don't pressure myself to do one hour. I'll just pressure myself to do 15 minutes. You know, like, you don't, just for people who are listening or watching, it doesn't have to be three hours or two hours or even one hour. It can be just 10, 15 minutes.

Yeah. And similarly, it can have kind of the same effect in the morning. right? If you look at your phone, first thing with the blue light at six in the morning, it tells your body that it's a different time than it really is. Right? 100%. I honestly think that, you know, getting that morning sunlight, whether it's cloudy or sunny, it doesn't really actually seem to matter because our body seems to know natural light. Getting that in the morning and at some point, I say even anytime before 10 a.m., is going to

to make a huge difference in your overall energy and health for that day. Okay. So the other question that I had back to when you were talking about GNRH and hormones, are there people who this is not appropriate for because of hormone imbalances where it can exacerbate it or is it always beneficial? I think of it like exercise, right? If you're injured, probably shouldn't exercise. Or maybe you should start with something super, super easy. You don't want to jump into a marathon training if you have a bad hamstring, right? So if you have a hormonal imbalance, you probably want to take it really easy and probably want to fix that issue before you really try something that's another

stressor. The way intermittent fasting works is the same as exercise. It's a slight stressor, and that's how it works and that's how it benefits us because just like exercise when you stress the muscle you get all these beneficial effects in the recovery and same thing that's doing kind of circadian fasting or any type of intermittent fasting you're kind of stressing the metabolism to get those downstream beneficial effects and so but you can't stress something that's severely injured so that's how I think about it you really have to individualize it but if you are someone who's like I want to try it but I'm not sure just go super, super slow. Start with 12 hours of fasting like 7 to 7, something super easy and see how you respond to it.

How's your energy? How's your cravings? How's your mood? How's your periods? Do that for a couple of weeks and see how you respond to that. And then if you want, you can move up a little bit. For me, the week before my period, I only do 12 hours or maybe nothing at all because that's a time in a women's cycle. that we're quite sensitive to stress, as most women can relate.

You feel more stress, you feel more anxious, you can't fast as well, you can't work out as hard. And so that's kind of a week I gave myself a little bit of recovery from fasting and aggressive working out. That was actually going to be my next question, and it's something that a lot of people asked me, is how do you accommodate those fluctuations that women in particular have throughout the month? Exactly. So day one of your menstrual cycle is considered day one of your hormone cycle. So from day two or three, you know, when you start to regain your energy to midway, day 14, which is the day of ovulation for most of us, that is a time that you are super resilient to stress. You can exercise a lot. Eat and train like an athlete is how I think of it for the first. weeks. And then, you know, the third week is kind of similar. There's a few changes, but really that fourth week, days 21 through 28, is when most women start to feel the symptoms of PMS or start to have a little bit lower energy. They start to have a little more cravings. We actually are more insulin

resistant at that time, which means, sadly, the sugar that we eat during that time is even more dangerous or more bad for us than it is at other times. times in the cycle. But if you tone down your exercise and you tone down the fasting, turn it down the volume, you'll notice that the cravings aren't as bad. You'll notice the PMS isn't as bad. And it's a nice natural rhythm to your eating and exercise routine that I found really life-changing, honestly. Isn't that so cruel that we are more insulin resistant during the time when all we want It's sugar. You know, I have a 10-year-old, and luckily she, you know, asks a lot of questions

that I've told her all about women's menstrual cycles and periods and all. And I mean, there's just no nice way to go about it. It sucks. And there's always that week, whether, I mean, you can make it suck less. But it's like, you know, pretty much many, many years of, you know, one week, at least of your every month is preoccupied. Right. I'm curious with your practice,

what kind of issues you're seeing a lot of right now and if you think that we are kind of like lifestyling ourselves into these similar kind of universal problems. Yeah, if you think about it, we are those rats that I talked about earlier in the talk. We are the ones that are eating ad lib, like staying up whenever we feel like it, eating a high fat, high process, sugar diet, it's very clear that if you follow that plan,

what the outcome is going to be. You're going to be sick and be obese. You're going to have high blood pressure, diabetes, brain diseases, and feel tired. So the status quo is leading us to a path that is not favorable. And unfortunately, that's what's considered normal in this day and age. So I think that it's really shocking to me why our health system, our food system, our public health officials won't look at the science and say, hey, this makes reasonable sense. And there's really no negative side effects, but it could be really life altering. Why don't we recommend it to people? So I think that there's a little bit of a pushback because of altering. interests. You know, people obviously, you know, in my medical fields are super smart and they say,

oh, well, there's just not enough data yet to know how many hours to recommend to someone who is really safe for, you know, we just don't have enough huge trials and they're all in happening now. But I think that in my mind, there's almost no negative outcome from at least the circadian stow. And so doing between 12 and 15 hours of a nightly fast is something that I feel is pretty natural for most people. How long total have you been doing this? And how has it changed your life? So I started probably early into, so it's been about eight years since that accident. And probably about two years into it, I started to do both this changing my diet and then starting the circadian rhythm, stinking and fasting. So I've been doing it for a good six, seven years now.

And I would say that it's become a habit. It's not hard. I mean, if you think about it, some days I only do a 12 or 13 hour fast. So it's nothing crazy at all. It's almost some people probably do that as we're listening that don't even call it circadian fasting, right? But I do notice that now, if I eat in late dinner, like one night a week, I take it off because, you know, you want to go out to eat with your friends. Like, you want to go out or whatever. So I noticed that if I eat that meal really late into the evening and it's a big meal, I feel really sick. It's kind of like, I'm sure you can relate Ariel. Like, when you see junk food, you didn't really notice how it would affect you. But then when you stop and you eat it again,

you're like, oh, I feel disgusting. Like bread and, you know, all that stuff makes me feel gross or pizza or whatever. So I realize that it's kind of a lifestyle thing for me where I prefer not to eat late at night. I will do it once a week because the effects of social interaction, the benefits of that for your health are just so plenty that for me it's worth it to take one night off just so I can enjoy that. But then the rest of the days to stick to my circadian fasting. Now that may be just ending my meals before seven or eight o'clock or that night. be something like ending my meals at 5 o'clock some days when I'm feeling like I really want to push it a little bit. I'm kind of laughing sitting here because I normally eat dinner at like 5.30.

Like I just eat so early because I go to bed early. And when I was in New York, I went out to dinner at like 9 o'clock and we were, you know, it was a long drawn out dinner. We were still eating at like 11. I got home at like 12, went to bed at 1. You know, and the next day I was like, it was like I was hungover. Like I had to hangover. Because how do you bring that? So you're doing this already. I mean, eating a 5.30 dinner and going to bed at 9, you are doing circadian fasting. Like that is. That's what it is.

And now if you wanted to even optimize it more, you might get some morning sunlight. You might do your workout outdoors on some days. That's kind of giving yourself a little more next level kind of circadian input and then do the blue light thing in the evening. But you're pretty much on it because people find it through their own journeys almost feels. healthy. Totally. I mean, I used to, I've been through so many different phases in my own health journey, but I used to really, I felt like I had to eat right before bed. So I would eat dinner at a reasonably early hours, six or seven, and then at like nine, I would have my dessert. And I don't know exactly, I don't know how I really changed. It wasn't even an intentional thing, but I just did. And it,

it helped so many things. My sleep, my bloating, my anxiety. It was really beneficial. Yeah, I think that's very, very, it changes everything. Just changing your timing of how you do things has such a huge impact on so many parts of our health. Definitely. Okay. So I want to get to some questions here. Let me pull them up. So our body's main source of fuel is glucose, right? That's preferred, but do you have thoughts on sugar? We kind of touched on that, but starch and carbs and timing of all of that? So as a physician, I'm pretty diet agnostic, meaning that if someone comes to me, they're on keto, they're on carnivore, they're on paleo, they're on vegan, they're on vegetarian, kind of have to work with them. So what I tell them is that if you are

trying to improve your gut health and your brain health, that cutting down how much sugar that you have in your diet. It's probably the number one thing. And with the sugar, I would put starches as well. So really highly refined foods like gluten and rice and processed flowers would be high on that list. I just posted on Instagram today, actually, a plate that I recommend. So it's like more than half is fiber, so vegetables, because that's what feeds your good gut bacteria. And then there's a portion for fat. So that could be the, it could be nuts, it could be avocado, it could be the oil that you use for the veggies, whatever it is. Then there's another one that's called the filler. The filler is approaching something that keeps you full, like the protein can be

plant-based or it can be animal-based depending on your body. And so there's fiber, there's fat, there's filler and basically you have a plate that's full of and then make it like a shake, scramble smoothie or soup because I say that those kind of shake scramble salad or soup are the four S's and that way you can really, really design your meals to be helpful for your gut and your hormones. Somebody asked about taking probiotics during the fast. Should you take it or doesn't matter if you take it during your fast or with food? You know, we don't have the science to give us definitive answers on that. We can say, you know, probably if you are worried, wait till you eat food. That's my blanket answer because we just don't know. So you have a background in

nutrition. Do you have any thoughts on food combining? So the things that I talk about when we talk about food combining is more science-based. So things like chimerick and black pepper with oil, like tomatoes and olive oil, like to increase the lecopene. These are the things lentils and rice are a complete protein. So these are the scientific food combining that I. I like to do. I don't really do other ones. I'm so skeptical of that having no science background. Yeah. That's the thing. I'm not like opposed to it.

I just don't think that there's, we have so many things that are science back that we aren't using that I'd rather use first and tell people, you know what, if you want to do this other stuff for fun or because it helps you, great, but get the basics right first. Like make sure you're eating a ton of fiber and low sugar. And then you can add on all these extra things. Mm-hmm. Intermittent fasting in case of hypothalamic amannaria, PCOS, etc. Good or bad idea. So PCOS is a problem of high insulin. And we know that things like intermittent fasting time restricted eating actually lowers our insulin levels. So PCOs can respond very well to intermittent fasting as long as you go low and slow.

Like I said, start with 12 hours, start with every couple of days, and then move up from there. When it comes to amenorrhea or severe thyroid issues that aren't treated, I think that that's going to be an area that you'd have to work with your practitioner individually to decide if it's right for you or whether you should fix those problems first, which I would assume what they'd want to do before you started any kind of other plan. What are your thoughts? What is the science, if there is any behind eating between meals? Do you recommend just doing three meals and minimizing snacking?

Or does it not really matter as long as you're kind of within these circadian windows? Yeah. That's also a good question that we don't have science to tell us definitively either way. I can tell you that personally, the less I snack, the better I am, meals, but that's anecdotal, and it may not work for someone else. In my family, I grew up in a family where there was lots of snacks around all the time. So I realized as an adult that I was just relying on snacks as my calories, and I never really ate much at meals. And so as I've shifted into a healthier mode of eating, I've added more calories and filling, you know, fuller meals

so that I can skip turn down those snacks. Because some of those snacks start out really, really healthy, but some of them end up being quite processed. Is fasting beneficial for those with thyroid disease? So it can be or it cannot be. Again, it's like saying, is exercise good for thyroid disease? It can be or it cannot be.

It can exacerbate the issue or it can help the issue. Really, really just depend. I mean, it's like saying there's such a wide range. Right. somebody said that they get hunger pains whenever they're fasting. Should they ignore this or listen to it? This is a great question. So one of the first things I will tell you is that as you decrease the sugar and the process of flowers in your diet,

you will notice that your hunger pains are much less because when we're constantly on a sugar high, when that sugar drops, you feel like a sense of hunger or almost like lightheadedness because you're so dependent on that sugar high. And then you'll want another sugar high. And it's like this roller coaster. And as you start to detox yourself from the sugar, you will notice that you're a little more even with your hunger, with your mood, with the lightheadedness.

And then the other thing is that hunger is cyclical. So what I notice myself is that, for example, when I'm in the office at about 3 o'clock, I am automatically hungry. I automatically want a snack. whether I've eaten at 12, whether I've not eaten at 12, whether I've eaten, you know, it's just kind of timed in my life that way. And I think people can relate because there's times where you just feel hungry because that's what your body is saying. But if you maybe push it, maybe have a drink,

maybe drink a lot of water, maybe have a tea. For me, nine times out of 10, by 4 or 430, I'm no longer hungry because hunger is cyclical. It's not always linear where it's going to be telling you, oh my God, you need to eat or you will die. Like most people feel that that's what's going to, what's going to happen, but it's not true. It'll actually pass. And of course, I don't want to like empower these people who have eating disorders because this is not for them. Because if you cannot listen to your body and you ignore the signals, then that kind of intermittent fasting or any kind of restriction, time restriction, whether food restriction is not really healthy for that population.

Okay. I think we covered a lot of these. So I like to close by asking my guests, what is one thing that you think people should stop doing, that you wish people would stop doing? And one thing that you wish people would start doing? Okay. One thing I wish people would stop doing is trying to do everything. right in their health or mindset. Oh, I want to eat really clean. I want to eat keto and paleo and I want to not have FODMAPs

and not eat after eight and I want to meditate and, you know, like, whatever. I think we get so many opposing messages on social media and the internet that we're failures unless we're doing all of those things. And so I wish people would start to pick out as I outlined with you three to five things

that seem to make the biggest difference in their health and stick to those. And when things go awry for me, I often find that I'm off my three to four basic things. And so stick to something that's simple and don't obsess over food or body image and break the cycle of dieting and find something sustainable for yourself.

I love that. So does that include what you want everyone to start doing? Yeah, no. What I want everyone to start doing is do what energizes them. If eating, for me, the science is clear that eating high amounts of vegetables and low sugar in a time that matches sunrise and sunset loosely is something that will improve health and improve energy. And so experiment with it. See how you feel. Love it. Well, thank you so much for coming on. So fascinating. And you're also such an amazing Instagram follow. So where can everybody

find you? Yeah, I'm over at Fasting MD on Instagram, and that's where I kind of hang out a lot, but I have Twitter on Amisha MD and Facebook, AmyShaMD. You can find me kind of, ABMD Wellness, is my website. Oh, I have a free three-day circadian fasting challenge, which is great for someone who's like, let me just check this out, see if it's right for me. It's like free on my website. So we'll link that in show notes so everybody can find it. And thank you again. It was so good talking. Yeah. Thank you so much for having me. I hope you enjoyed that episode. If you liked it, and if you like the show in general,

please take a second to rate, review, and subscribe. It goes a long way and it's actually the best way to support the show. Also, if you want to see more about each episode, you can head over to the Blonde Files podcast on Instagram. I'm always posting about each episode there or over on my personal page at Ariel Lori.