wellRED podcast - #165 - RIP John Prine or (Bye Bye Bernie)

Episode Date: April 15, 2020

The boys pay tribute to the late great John Prize by recalling their favorite songs. Also Bernie dropped out of the race and Corey had to leave the podcast to hide in a bathtub from a tornado. Be sure to check out our special Tiger King Retrospective.. Tiger By The Tale: A WellRED Podcast Special. Available wherever you get your podcasts AND on video form right HERE TIGER BY THE TALE Sponsors this week:bluechew.com promo code RED ADAMANDEVE.COM promo code WELLRED

And we thank them for sponsoring the show. Well, no, I'll just go ahead. I mean, look, I'm money dumb. Y'all know that. I've been money dumb ever, since ever, my whole life. And the modern world makes it even harder to not be money dumb, in my opinion, because you used to, you, like, had to write down everything you spent or you wouldn't know nothing. But now you got apps and stuff on your phone.

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lovely little app where you could, you know, put your friend's faces onto funny reaction gifts and stuff like that. So obviously I got it so I could put Corey's face on those two, those two like twins from the Tim Burton Alice in Wonderland movies. You know, those weren't a little like the Q-ball-looking twin fellas. Yeah, so that was money. What was that in response to?

What was that a reply gift for? Just when I did something stupid. Something fat, I think, and stupid. Something both fat and stupid. But anyway, that was money well spent at first, but then I quit using it and was still paying for it and forgotten. If it wasn't for Rocket Money, I never would have even figured it out. So shout out to them.

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All righty guys. This is the, uh, fuck me. I forgot how I start podcast. What's up everybody? It's your boy the show. What's up everybody? It's your boy the show. and this is the well-read podcast W-E-L-L-R-E-D.

That's also our website, well-redcommonautcom, nothing to promote on there because unfortunately all the dates are canceled because of this bullshit. I hope you guys are staying in and staying safe. One thing that we do have to promote is our epic new little podcast saga, Tiger by the Tail,

a Tiger King retrospective, which is on Trey Crowders. It's on your YouTube page there, Trey, correct? Yes, yes, it is. Yes. So y'all can go click air and watch all that lunacy. But other than that, here's the fucking podcast. Phew!

They're the... They're the... They're all right. But sex, they care way too much, but don't give a fuck. Next that makes some people upset, but they got three big old dicks that you can suck. Well, here we are. If you're wondering, if you feel like Corey sounds a little bit

It's because he's calling, he's joining us from the middle of a maelstrom. It's apparently storming really bad and there in Chickamauga there. Is that accurate, Cho? We go to the man on the scene, show. Yeah, that is accurate. I'm standing out here with an umbrella and there's a cow above my head. No, yeah, it is accurate. I think that the worst of it's, like we had a tornado warning and it was in effect

until like 8.30 my time and then I haven't heard any other updates. So I think it's now just like insane wind and lightning. But like it's just, you know, why wouldn't it be this? Yeah, yeah. That's a fact. And it's like, well, at least, at least going outside tomorrow is also canceled, the one good thing. Yeah, that's a, you know, it's been like drizzling a lot here. So, I mean, I hear you.

It's like, it's pretty rough. Well, your motherfuckers need that shit. No, no, I don't mind it at all when it rains here. It has been raining here a lot, like for here. It's been raining a footload. But to me, it's like everybody's locked up anyway. So, and the earth needs it. So fuck it, bring it on as far as I'm concerned.

Yeah, for people that don't know the plight of like no rainfall in Burbank and L.A., like the last time I was out there, which was literally right before this pandemic shit started, the day before I left, it rained like a lot. And I had to walk somewhere. and I was like walking. And of course I was like, God damn it, having to walk in the rain. But like I saw like three to four different people

who were like looking up at the sky with smiles on their faces just getting douched in rain. Like, oh my God. Yes, this is amazing. So like it's much needed. Yeah. Drew, you there? How you feel about it?

About the rain. About whatever. Drew's lost his mind. I'm saying that based on just, he shaved his head bald, not slick bald. He didn't razor it, but I mean, he did the closest thing you could do without razoring it. I went for a little.

Yeah, you went Brittany. Yeah, man, it was pills, it was drunk, it was crying in a bathroom, it was not listening to my daddy, even though he probably had my best interest at heart, although I'm not sure that dude seems pretty evil, not my dad, hers. Did you stare into the mirror while doing it with your shirt off? Well, I mean, you know, I understand how much that because of scenes in movies. Yeah, that's how you cut your hair. Oh, you're right. That's true.

Damn, all those scenes seem so much different now. They're always framed so like, oh, man, this is some heavy shit right here. And it never once occurred to me like, well, how the fuck else they're supposed to do it? Well, the last time I did something like this, I was real anxious and I was smoking a lot of weed. And I gave myself a haircut. And I didn't do it like this, but I kind of fucked it up and had to go further. But I did a bit about, like, walking by the mirror and hating my fucking face, you know? You, uh, Trey, I know you remember, but do you remember Elliot Ray Hall?

Yeah, it's my boy. I was texting. Literally the only person who ever laughed at the bit. And I mean falling into the floor, holding his belly, laughing at me because I hate myself so much. I gave myself a haircut while an audience. I mean, you know, this was years ago. Maybe I just wasn't good enough at comedy. But I feel like what was happening was everyone was going, we don't relate to this.

at all. You're going to give us a wordplay or something because we don't find it funny. Anyway, let's know what happened here, guys. I did have a run in with pills, but that had nothing to do with the haircut as far as I can tell. I've been, I do think being cooped up had a lot to do with it, and I do think my anxiety probably had something to do with it. But mostly, man, I just been thinking about doing it for a while because I know I'm going

bald, and I was like, oh, quarantine, no dates, no public appearances. this is a chance to just see what my head looks like so I can get my brain right. And Andy reminded me, she was like, you did this, like our second year of dating. And I was like, oh, yeah, I could have just looked at pictures. Are you worried at all that it ain't coming back? Well, she's worried that the front won't grow in quick enough, you know?

Yeah, yeah. But I looked at it. Well, that is the first thing, yeah. I looked it up. That's not how it works. Okay. Your hair grows until it falls out. There's no like, right?

Yeah, that's. It's either there or it's not, right, is what you're saying. Like if your follicle still works, it's going to grow as it should. Right. Until it just stops working and then it's gone. I will say I'm pleasantly surprised by how thick it is where it is. The hairline is not in great shape, but where the hairline starts, it's not as bad as I expected. Well, that's something.

Take what you can get at these trying to. times because, boys, it's another week, another hero to mourn. John Prine succumbed to COVID-19 last week. It was actually, it happened before our last podcast came out, but after we'd recorded it, so we have not yet addressed it as a group. I know we all addressed it in our own way on social media, but just, I mean, a monumental loss, and one of the absolute goats. singer songwriters that they ever has been.

Yeah, it's like, it's doubly worse too in my, like, just for me personally on account of, I won't say that I'd written it off, but like, once I found out he was stable, I was like, okay, a man in John Prine's health, like, if he was critical and it was able to go from critical to stable, then like, the worst of it's over, my boy's going to be fine. So, like, it hit me like a fucking ton of bricks, man, because I'd already been like, Hell yeah. There ain't nobody taking down fucking John Brine. It really, really sucks, man.

Like you said, he was the goat. He's the dude that, like, during these times, you know, we lean on and shit. So it just, it don't hit. Very Raven of the Earth to have done this. So Raven of the Earth. I did, I had a similar thought process as you. Like you said, I didn't ride it off either. But he went, it was announced he was in critical condition.

And if I'm not mistaken, the very next day it says his condition was stable. And they did say they were like, stable doesn't mean improving, just so you know. But it's better than, you know, critical, obviously. But then it stayed that way, at least publicly, as far as anybody knew, for days. Whereas like Joe Diffy, you know, and it may just been the way the news got out. But Joe Diffy found out one day that he had it and then he found out the next day that he died from it. And with prine, he had it, was critical, then was stayed. and then it was like a week, I think, or like right at a week or more than it, because I was getting

up, it's so grim, but I was getting up like every morning and checking my phone, like, first thing to see what had happened with John Prine. And after like a week of nothing happening, which, you know, none of this is good news in that scenario. I also got to a point where I was like, okay, I think, I think maybe he's going to be all right. And it's like as soon as I started thinking that, you know, there. I guess I was Andy, Andy cried, first of all. It was a rough moment in our house.

I guess for me, it was a little different because I was sort of going the opposite in that every day that they didn't say he was released or that he was improved, I was scared because I, and I recently in life learned that Stable didn't mean improved. I knew that Stable on its own doesn't mean improved, but I thought if you went from Critical to Stable, that was, an upgrade. And what I've learned recently it just means you're not getting worse. I also have been watching Breaking Bad

and learned that remission sometimes just means your cancer stop growing. Yeah. So it's like fuck doctors. You know what I mean? For this false hold bullshit they're peddling. But that aside, every day I was like... They've said it right the whole time, but we're stupid and heard it wrong, I guess. I guess with stable, that's fair. With remission?

I don't know, man. like maybe I need more maybe that's the only context I know that word so that's why anyway for me it was more like every day that I didn't hear good news and because of his age and the fact that he had cancer before

and all that I was like oh man he's not he's not gonna get out but I'm also sometimes kind of negative well no no I mean I hear you dude like well dude the second that they said John Prime has coronavirus, even before I saw that he was critical, this first, as soon as I heard that, I was like, well, John Prime said, like, I didn't even, it wasn't even a question because of his age

and because he's had cancer and because of, I mean, frankly, like, fuck his age, like the lifestyle that he lived and still made it to that age. Like, so, so no, I don't think that's being grim. That's just being, you know, that's just, it is what it is. Well, and when I first heard that he had stabilized, I did get hopeful. It's just that as the days go by instead of improving my attitude because they didn't say anything other other positive things I got I got less and less I wasn't that surprised you know it's like just to speak more positively about it where John Prine is concerned and it's like anybody that knows anything about present-day Americana music as as it's called like probably already knows this but like

it's kind of wild in my opinion because prime has been around for so long you know since like the 70s but he's like such he's like such a clear and direct predecessor and influence of your like you know your Jason Isbells and your oh yeah all of them Tyler Childers the truckers I mean all of those guys hugely influenced by John Prime but like not just influenced by him but I'm saying like, I don't know, in a way, it's extremely clear. Do you know what I mean? You can listen to like Bruce Springsteen and listen to the early gaslight anthem. And clearly they're like, these guys are influenced by Springsteen,

but like in a way that wasn't as like pronounced in my opinion as John Prine was the kind of like forbearer of what we call Americana music right now. Yeah. And I'll say too, to piggyback off that, I mean, When you pipe me in earlier, you may have noticed I had on my wife's Brandy Carlisle Beanie. You know, I'm not not going for woke points, but to make the point that he was championing women in that, in that circle, in that world, whatever, before it was cool. You know, it's very cool. But before it was cool, he was doing that.

I mean, he's just signed Kelsey Walden, who I fucking love to his label. And that's another thing that sucks. You know, it's beautiful like you were pointing out, Trey, and that is positive. but part of the emptiness that's gone with Prime is not just the man and the songwriting. I mean, Oh, Boy Records will never be the same. Right. No, and you're right, man.

I mean, dude, Iris DeMint is synonymous with John Prime. I mean, you don't think about one without the other, and that was his deal. I mean, he was just, you know, he was before, he was before his time of his time, after his time, all those. I mean, he's the fucking. He was timeless. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

He's the, you know, as his song, He's the oldest baby in the world. Dude, you mentioned Dement. I mean, the first time I heard her voice probably was on his song. My friend Ben used to play me her stuff. And Ben was a big fan. And I was like, who is, you know, who is? And he's like, oh, Iris Dement.

She was on the John Pry. I was like, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Why isn't she huge? And he's like, oh, she's too weird. And at the time in country music and before Americana was what it is, you know, that was a death knell for a woman, especially. And Prine didn't give a fuck, man. No, hell no.

We did this with Joe Diffy, but I know it's hard to name one, but pick your personal favorite, Prine song, and no repeat. Somebody picked yours, announce that fact, but then pick something else.

Okay, okay. Man. Either one of y'all go first. I mean, I'll probably end up throwing another answer in there after y'all go, because right now I'm not going to say necessarily that it's my favorite,

though, Every single one of his songs I could say is my favorite at some at one point during the week or depending on the mood I am. But in my opinion, the best thing you ever did was Sam Stone. I think it's beautiful. It's heartbreaking. It's, I mean, you know, nothing, nothing quite sums up American warfare and what it's done to soldiers on a personal level and the real struggle back home more so than Sam Stone. and that was also, I'm fairly certain, on Prime's, like, fucking debut record.

Like, he wrote that when he was, like, 21. Like, it's crazy. His debut record's unbelievable. It's a greatest hit. It's literally a greatest hit. Like, it's nuts. The shit that, so I'm going to say Sam Stone right now. I may change that after y'all go, but right now, Sam Stone.

All right. Man, I think, I don't know if it's recency bias. This latest album is, to me a triumph and a masterpiece. It's unbelievable. I'm starting to get emotional. It's unbelievable that a man could do that at his age.

Yeah. Remain so relevant and in tune with the zeitgeist or whatever. I sound full of shit, but I mean every word of this. And Summer's End is probably my favorite song on there. I really like, what's the last song on the aisle? It's called, going to open up a, when I get to heaven. I really like when I get to heaven, which is obviously. timely.

But I think Summer's End is it's like it's like all his songs. It's so sad and so hopeful. Yeah, that song is fucking insanely good. I tweeted something that the, you know, obligatory but also heartfelt

you know, RIP tweet that I put out after he died called out that song. I said a version of what you just said was like, this is This dude never lost it at all up until the end. His most recent album is some of the best shit he ever did. And Summer's End off of that album is among his very best.

So I agree completely. I mean, I feel like I'm going to take one of the, but he's got so many damn good songs that there's like, I think a lot of them would feel. It's impossible. I think a lot of them would feel obvious. I had two in mind. I thought one of y'all might say one of them,

but I'll say it. We mentioned Irish Dement, so I'll say in spite of ourselves. Yeah. Because it's like such a unique love song, but still like such a love song. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, absolutely.

I feel like it also. It's a true love song. Right, yeah, exactly. That's what love actually is. Right, right. Yes. And like, Katie, God bless her. She don't have the best taste of music,

but like even Katie, like, loves that song, you know? It's one of those that like just connects with people, I think, despite the fact that it is so, you know, like I said, singular. Like it's not like most songs that, you know what I mean, you say something, it's like, oh, everybody can dig that. And what you're talking about is something that's real like, you know, mainstream or just. The tune or the hook, I think is timeless in mainstream. But like you were mentioning, and then what we were talking about earlier, it's using to put. Dement on the track. All that made it extra.

I mean, it almost sounds like the tune of a kid's song, but not an annoying one. Yeah, I agree with that. And the other one I was going to say that it was going to be my, I guess a little bit more of a deep cut, maybe. But it's because how I relate to it personally, and I'm sure y'all do too. If it's the other side of town, I'm going to lose my fucking mind. No, it's not. It's crazy as a loon.

Yeah, yeah. I love that song. It's about, it's like, it's about L.A., man. L.A., Nashville, and New York City. But really, it's just about, like, you know, being a dreamer or whatever. And, you know, going for it and how that feels, you know what I mean? Like, this shit will make you crazy. If you don't watch it, you end up on the wrong end of a broom, yada, you know.

The shit will make you crazy, crazy as a loon. I just, I love that shit. That's awesome. I'm going to go ahead and say, that song is the best industry or whatever you want to throw at it, creative type song that I know of. And I can think of a few off the top of my head, and I don't want to disparage anybody.

They're all great, but like that one's better. You know, I mean, a lot of artists make songs and references to Nashville or L.A. being crazy, but that one's... Yeah, it's good. I'm going to chat. Oh, go ahead. I forgot you hadn't gone. I've gone, but I was just, I thought you were circling back, but if that's the case, you would be up. Go ahead.

Well, I wanted, yeah, I wanted to change mine, as I said, that I probably would as we're going through. And it's not that I don't believe that Sam Stone might not be the most beautiful and the most meaningful and the most poetic of his song. It, it's hard to argue. But I think the song in my mind, like Sam Stone doesn't represent Prine's prineism all the way, like every single thing Prine's about. and I say that because there's no point in Samstone where you laugh, which is you shouldn't. It's about a soldier coming home and losing his goddamn mind.

But like the perfect prime song, the way Prine was was that he was a dude that was able to make you think, laugh, cry, remember all in one fucking song. And in my opinion, the other side of town does that better than anything because, I mean, if you just read the lyrics at first, it starts off, why must you always seem to criticize me?

Seems like everything I do just turns out wrong. why don't you come on out and despise me so I could pack my bags and baby I'd be gone and you're like, God damn, man. This dude's really fucking going through it. And then he says one of my favorite lines ever. A clown puts his makeup on upside down so he wears a frown even,

where's a smile even when he wears a brown. And then you find out throughout the whole song that he's just explaining to his wife that whenever she's bitching at him, he's actually playing dominoes with his buddies in his brain. It's just tremendous. I hear that song. I hear that song all the time.

and I hear that song mainly when Amber is sitting there saying some shit to me. And I'm just like, I'm doing exactly what he's saying in the song. It's just so perfect. It's cute and it's sad and it's sweet. And God damn it, it's just so fucking prime. It's phenomenal. What, if you know, do you know what album that's off of or around the time that he wrote that? No, I really don't.

I think honestly, I want to say that that's like an 80s or 90s hit for him. It seems like it. I'm not 100% sure. My number two. Fair and square from 2005. Oh, fine. Okay, wow. Go to them.

My number two or my 1A, and it was, you know, summer's end, again, I might have some recency bias just because it's new and I think it, you know, is timely and appropriate. But I've always thought for, you were talking about Corey, with the prioniness of it, the Spanish pipe dream was so fun and so funny and not. sad, but I guess real. It's like there was so much realism in there. It's like, it's

fun and funny and it's not sad, but like you know, this dude just picked up a girl at a strip club and now they're trying to have some kids and they ain't going to make it. You know, it's like that whole. Right, yeah. And just... I'll tell you what, if you followed that song to a tee, you're doing good right now, uh. I'll tell you what, you are. I will say

too, that's on his first album, uh, the first album that I know of, the 1971 album that Sam Stone is on that you referenced. It's self-titled And just You know, I'm not, I don't remember I'm sure there's bigger hits on here

But just to give anybody who's a prime fan An idea of your favorite prime songs That are on his first goddamn album Illegal smile Spanish pipe dream Hello in there Which Jesus God

I can't really listen to that song No I can't either Especially with my relationship My grandmother dude Fuck me Like put just just bury me I can't hear that song All right on

Sam Stone, as you said, and yeah, hell in there is insane. Paradise. Your flag decal won't get you into heaven anymore. That is a point, a version of that point I've heard made in open mics in 2016 like it was new. In 1971, this dude was like, fuck, just because you put something on your bumper sticker. And it goes, this is one of those things, you know, I usually throw my eye towards conservatives deservingly. So this is one of those things that goes both ways, though. Like, you can't just slap.

your identity on your bumper sticker and now you're a good part anyway my man was talking about and then sorry i'm gonna i'm i'm i'm going on a on a prime cheer rant uh angel from montgomery is yeah and this is a part like i think that's undeniably his most like universally success yeah yeah man and you know that actually that song it's very that's a very important song because i don't know if y'all knew this. Jason Isbell credits that song as the song that made him realize that you could write songs that weren't about you. Yeah. He said he was sitting there and, you know, he was a 20-something songwriter, blah, blah, blah. And he was, he heard the song before, but I guess he'd never really like took it in. And he was sitting there and he was like,

wait a minute, he's not a goddamn old woman, you know, what is this? John wasn't named after his mother. Exactly. He's like, oh, wait a minute. It doesn't have to be first person. I can just fucking write about whatever I want. So, you know, there's a lot of, if it wasn't for that song, there's a lot of fucking Isbel shit that you wouldn't, wouldn't see. Also on that album, you said Paradise, that's the first prime song that I ever heard.

And the reason it was the first prime song I ever heard is because that's like one of the most covered songs for like a bluegrass band to play. And my dad and his band, that's what they played Paradise. And dad would always wear in his Jeep when I was a very, very little kid. dad would be driving down the road, like practicing harmony to a recording of Paradise by Prime. And so that's the first one I ever heard. And so I love it so much.

That's a good memory, man. Yeah, it's awesome. How about we, we're not the jet set. That's a banger. I love that song. Hell, yeah. They're all bangers. I fucking James Dean went out to Hollywood.

Picture show. God damn, I love that song. He's got so many songs about L.A. that I bet he wrote before he ever fucking went out there just because he knows. He's smart and he hits. What's the one? I think I'm getting the name wrong.

Oh, no, it's some humans ain't human. Yeah. That one and like. Just give it a little time. That's the way the world goes around. That's a jam. Also timely, please don't bury me. That's a good song.

I love that song. That's his most bluegrassy sounding one in my opinion. I love that song. It's also the one that's closer in philosophy to prop me up beside the jukebox, which I feel like should be no. Yeah, give my stomach to Milwaukee if they run out of beer. Yeah, send my mouth way down south and kiss my ass goodbye. I do.

It's so fucking great. You know what? Fuck it. That's my favorite one. God damn. Also, it's so great that he says Venus de Milo can have my arm. That's a great little line. I really enjoy, who's going to take the garbage out?

God damn it. Parenthetical, God damn it, that I added myself just now. But yeah, I like that one. Who's going to take the garbage out when I pack my bags and gone? Yeah, man. Christmas in prison. That's a good one. It is.

60 o'clock news was also on that first album, by the way. Yeah, man. Again, like that first. album you could just repackage I'm sure they probably did actually I've got Prime Prime which is the first greatest hits album he ever put out and I'm fairly certain that like

seven of them were just off his first album well he did and I'm certain they probably just had to be like oh we can't put them all on there because then they'll know what we're doing so give us some other ones well anyway no yeah what else is there to say other than it's just a monumental loss

it fucking sucks but you know like he left thought them songs aren't going nowhere you know what I mean like that's fucking nearly 50 years worth of just what if they did you have not that would do that would suck so sorry I'm so bad I'm sorry I'm stunned I was about to pitch a black mirror episode where when you die and everything goes with you but it takes a little while like in some instances that would hit sure it takes a little while like the machine has to get fired up it takes it what it does is it takes away everything but your best contribution to the world and your worst?

Oh, no. Oh, man. One would outweigh the other one so bad for me. Did any of y'all watch, and I did not, that yesterday movie? No, I heard a no, because I... Yeah, it's like the premise of it is something happens in the next day the Beatles never existed, but except for one guy remembers all their shit, so he starts playing it. Yeah, I mean...

this is very raven, but I didn't watch it because I saw the preview, and I was like, this is so fucking contrived. There's a, there's a, there's a, I was kind of excited about it, but yeah, once I saw like an extra, the second trailer came out, and I was like, oh, right, that's what that is. Okay, cool, and so I didn't watch it. Yeah, I didn't either, but you just maybe think of that when you said that, but yeah, I don't know.

Rest and peace, prime. I don't know what else to say about it. Yeah, well, I do, and I'll get up on my soapbox here for a second. I still, if you're out there and you're still not taking the fucking social distancing very serious, and you're still thinking, oh, well, it don't matter if I do this or whatever. Don't do it for yourself. Don't do it for me, anybody. Do it for fucking John Fryan.

We don't need John Prine's death to be in goddamn vain. So take it serious and lice all all your shit and sit at home and jack off and read a book. Kind of on that note, not the jacking off part, but because we're all doing that but literally to God not the read a book part no no no just the taking it seriously part did y'all see where uh hang on let me I could look it up I've tried

uh Bisselli you ever Tony Besseli from Jacksonville Jaguars he was absolutely Hall of Fame Hall of Fame Limeon yeah yeah fuck the Titans up a few times that's why I remember him right yeah his his son now plays for Florida State something Besseli so this kid is, you know, 20, 21, maybe 22, if he's a senior. I'm not sure what year he is.

But he just, he just had it and was like hospitalized with it, I think. And he's fine and everything. But he put out this statement about it that was just saying like, you know, another thing in the vein of trying to get people taking seriously. But he was saying like, look, I'm a, you know, 21 year old collegiate athlete, albeit an offensive lineman. So he's a big old boy, but still. The athletic motherfucker, he's like, and trust me, I don't care who you are, what shape you're in. You do not want to get this shit.

He was like, he's like, don't, like, it's been downplayed a lot for young people. But, you know, take it for me, coronavirus don't hit, basically is what he said. You saw what Sturgel said, didn't you? Right, yes. Yeah, but Sturgeon, well, I mean, Sturgle, he's a young guy, How old is Sturgel? I'm saying, dude, a 20-something or an early 20-college college athlete is like,

that's why. No, I hear you. I just realized that like when people say young people, I'm not necessarily. No. No, dog. I'm so glad we got to have this moment on the podcast. That was real bad to feel.

That was a bad feeling to have. Hey, for real, though. Trey, like I know what you and he is trying to say, which is like, if it gets bad, even if you survive it, it's fucking horrendous. And you got to go to the hospital where you might kill a fucking doctor or nurse. Right. Right.

Yeah. All right. So moving on but not from the subject of death. Andy just got back from walking Mick in the park where no one was at and she's social distance. Andy, come here. I muted when she got here because I was like, why are you making

so much noise what's wrong? Tell the well red nation what you just told me our dog Mc Jagger pulled a gopher out of the ground and flung it across the park and I carried it halfway home because why I wanted to save it and what happened it died oh no it died in your arms it died right in my hand it flicked its little leg right before it died it probably also gave you rabies so you always so bad. It's not funny that something died in your arms.

It's just so funny, like you thought something else would happen. Andy, Andy, are you still there? Yeah. I know I just kind of laughed at you, but please know that I would literally be falling apart right now.

So I was just, I was talking to- pick up a dying gopher. No, me too. I wanted to save it. I couldn't deal with not being able to save it. No, no, no. Dude, like, again,

I have hit, like been driving down the road sober as a judge as you should be when you're driving down the road but like hit a squirrel and had to pull over and cry and it ruined my whole day like literally ruined my whole day so i don't want you to think that my making fun of you was sincere you did the right thing and i'm sorry because i don't know if you've seen gophers but they're so adorable they really are they look like me there's a they do there's a there's a uh for infestation in the park and they are adorable. And sincerely, I'm only saying, like, I'm not making fun of you for Karen.

I just, I wouldn't have tried because I couldn't have handled it. Now, Trey, we know you would have stepped on the gopher's face and laughed. No. Well, they're dog-like. No, but a dog murdered it. It was a fight between a gopher and a dog. You would have killed the dog for murder. Well, I thought once I got it home, if I couldn't save it and it looked very like,

Like it was dying slowly. Please don't say we would have eaten it. No, I was going to put it in the freezer to euthanize it. What? What? Is he freezing it to death? Is the way to euthanize it? Who the fuck told you that?

I don't know. That would just... Wait, did you read it on one of those websites that also tells you that the moon decides your personality? No, there's this woman who has a bunch of... Has a monarch farm. She has a monarch farm? When she...

When a monarch... when she has them that like break their wing or something? Butterflies. Not kings and queens. Monarch butterfly. So when they hurt, get hurt or like break a wing, she puts them in the freezer to euthanize them because it's the fastest and most sane way.

For a butterfly. Yeah, they're tiny and like, they don't have the same central nervous. They're not mammals. Yeah, they're not mammals. That was last case scenario. Well, luckily, everybody is listening who's horrified. Had she got to go for home, we tried to say that we knew we

couldn't. I would not have let her put it in the freezer, but I just, unless you stopped you saving it for later. I would have had to have dealt with it. I would have had to kill the goddamn gophers when I would have had to have done. Yeah, I just, I just imagined a scene where Andy got the gopher home and it was bleeding and she put it down and her and Drew were sitting there arguing. And she's like, I thought I'd do the right thing. I was going to try to save it. I'd euthanize it in the free freezer. And Drew's like, what the fuck? What kind of fucking witch witch doctor told you that horrid? about five minutes of them arguing, you just hear the tiniest stool kick over,

and you look back and the gopher had hung itself. I kind of wanted to save the gopher and then have a pet gopher. Well, Corey, before we talking about not getting a pet gopher, I want to say that joke was a lot like my suicide. It took a long time to get there, but it was satisfying. Lord. Thank you. No, we would not have had a pet gopher.

But also freezing mammals cannot be the most humane way. I was trying to save the gopher. Let's just focus on that. Yeah, I believe you and I respect you. It's just I would have done what Drew. I would have done what Drew did, though, thinking like, I know good and well. I won't be able to save it. And then I'll be like freaking out.

And I'll be like, am I really in the middle of social distancing going to call a vet and risk all this shit over a gopher? I'd have to just leave it. Or I'd have to stomp its head and put him out of its misery. I've done that to a cap before. misery and then I would have had nightmares for a week. Yeah, yeah, for sure. So, you know what this makes me think of?

And it's about to be a plug, a tie-in plug here. Andy had Mick, Mick murdered that creature in cold blood. Absolutely. But Mick is Andy's baby. Right. Mick is Andy's baby who she loves dearly, right? But she still felt so bad for this animal that he killed, right? And that's why it was so.

fucked up when Carol Baskin's homegirl took them pictures of those dead rabbits that they were, they killed to feed to these tigers. And she acted like it was the most normal thing in the world. And it was like, no, it's not like I get a tiger has to eat. I get what you're saying. That's still weird. And yes, you have to explain that. Yes.

And that's the kind of shit you get from Tiger by the Tail, our spin-off podcast out available right now. Right. On Trey Crowder's YouTube page, it's where it's available. Yes, Tiger by the Tail, great plug. Trey, I thought you were trying to smoothly transition into this week's sponsors. And you talk about horrified. I did too.

I did too. I swear to God. I swear to God, I was like, uh, bro, I don't know about this, but I'm being broke. Like, I was with it because you my day one, but like, you know. No, see, we'd already gone long, so I was just going to go ahead and put him in there later. Speaking of day one, Adam and Eve. Oh, man, I thought you were going to go. Speaking of his sponsors, I thought he was doubling down, boys.

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Anything that is a piece, like when they number it with the pieces, like if it's chicken and if it's dicks, I'm in to all that. It's three pieces? Shit, yeah. I bet it's dark. I guarantee you.

We've got that three-piece dark meat. And best of all, y'all, y'all, it's free shipping, delivered discreetly right to your... I think Cho cut out, just in case you guys can't hear him. I'm going to go ahead and jump in here and say that Andy and I have already taken advantage of Adam and Eve. We've been staying at home, playing at home. We typed in the code, W-E-L-L-R-E-D, that's well-read at checkout.

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Both of our sponsors this week are just hell bent on getting you a better dig. And I got to, and so, hey, this is a true story here, guys. So I forgot just how fast Blu Chu kicked in because right before we started this podcast, Amber was like, what are you going to be? I was like, well, you'll take an hour unless surely we won't have technical difficulties up front. You know, that'll never happen. I was like, so, you know, I'll come back down here and she's like, okay, why don't you? you know, pop a blue shoe, that way you'll be ready to go right as soon as you get done.

I guess what I'm trying to tell you guys is, I'm hard as a fucking rock right now. I'm talking, boy, I'm talking, son, dialing it. Woo! Boy, my dick is, I can't, I mean, it's rough down here. It's hard as fuck, boy. So hard. That's why the tornado's coming. It's coming from my dick.

Yeah, it's a magnetic thing. like the whoosh. Yeah. Well, hey, I mean, we got a little bit of time left for Cho just to go put that dick into motion. But so, I mean, I guess we should probably talk about the elephant in the room, right? The old soap-eating Jewish elephant in the room or no? Yeah.

Yeah. I got another, in addition to one of my songwriting idols dying, I got another birthday present when Bernie Sanders dropped out of the race, although this one was I met more expected. I say more expected. I didn't expect it like when it happened necessarily. I felt like it kind of came out of nowhere, but maybe that's me. I don't know, but it did happen.

And thoughts. Go ahead, Drew. You asking what we thought when it happened? or what do we think about it overall? Just the whole situation. I was just doing a poor job of teeing up that it happened. But yeah. Well, I think we should start, Trey, sincerely, from your take and your tweet,

because I generally agree with it. Okay, here's what I tweeted after it happened. I said, and this is all completely true. I said, I voted for Bernie in 2000. 2016 and this year. But if you think that I am not now, meaning post him dropping out, I'm not now 100% pro Joe

till they bury me, then me and you're just two different kinds of liberals, I guess, and in parentheses I said, I'm the type that wants to win. So, yeah. Yeah, I agree with that. Do you have more to say? I don't know if you do.

Yeah, I mean, well, I do. Honestly, I wanted to hear, well, uh, God damn it. I want to get this beer out of the fridge, but it's all the way over there. Get that beer out of that fridge. Go get it. You're real tall. Walk your ass over. I mean, you know, you kind of got to.

You can see what we're talking about. Oh, God damn it. What? Man, dude, so this is about to sound super raving, but I've been like firing off some pretty sweet farts. and every single time I've held my phone up to my butt thinking that would work, but I've got the fucking ear, the microphone is on my earbuds, man.

You got a fart on your ear, but you're going to give yourself pink mouth. I don't know, but like, and I think I'm out of farts. That boy's got pink ear. Yeah, he ain't out of farts.

That boy's got pink ear. He ain't out of farts. He ain't out of farts. I'm just saying, like, I've been popping off some, like, really good ones. I don't think I have any left that, that are going to sound like they've,

Like the parts I have left are like the, you know, danger, danger, danger, parts, like the ones right before it's over. So, all right, well, I'm back with this bear now. And yeah, okay, here's basically how I feel about it. I just, look, again, I'm a Bernie supporter. I voted for it. Bernie was my guy. Dude, I made a video, I made a video before Super Tuesday,

because that's when everything changed. I made a video before Super Tuesday that was saying, And basically the thrust of it was, look, y'all, it's looking like Bernie's going to win. And some of y'all need to get with that and get over it and get ready to vote for this motherfucker in November because this is going to be our dude. And it was directed at the more like moderate Democrats or whatever who weren't comfortable with Bernie because I thought he was going to win at the time. So like it's so hard to say anything in the contrary about this because people immediately just like, I don't know. jump to conclusions, and I'm trying to give the disclaimer of saying, I love Bernie and I wanted Bernie to win, but he didn't, he conceded, it is over. Joe Biden is the nominee. And basically, for me,

fundamentally all it comes down to, all the shit about the DNC and all that, there's valid arguments there. I understand why people are pissed off. I really do. But for me, for me, it comes down to one bottom floor fundamental thing. We have got two legitimate choices in November and one of them is Donald fucking Trump. And I don't, I really don't give a fuck what you say or what you think about Joe Biden.

I really don't. I don't know how you could ever convince me that he is a worse option than Donald Trump. And yes, I'm sorry, if you self-identify as someone on the left, If you've been a libertarian or something your whole life, that's different. But if you call yourself a Democrat or a liberal or any of that at all, and you don't vote for Joe Biden in November,

I think you are complicit, and Donald Trump may be winning again, and that's the single greatest crime any of us can commit, and you'll never convince me otherwise. I just won't hear it. I'll say this, and that's pretty much all I have to say on the subject. And then I know Drew's got a lot, which I can't wait to hear, but basically it's this. Yeah, I was a Bernie guy too.

Really liked Bernie. I liked Elizabeth Warren, but she was out and now Bernie's out. And to me, this isn't like when you're watching college football and Georgia doesn't make it up to the championship. So you're like, well, I don't give a fuck who wins the championship because my person ain't in there. That is not this. This is not that.

Like everything Tray just said is 100% true. And to piggyback on top of that, let's just say hypothetically you don't like Joe Biden. What you're voting for in November is so much more than that because it's fucking Ruth Bader Ginsburg's replacement. All right. It's the entire cabinet. It is fucking every single other thing that because of Donald Trump has happened, not just directly as him being a president and his pen to paper, but all the other fundamental things that have kind of, you know, waved their way through the fucking country since he got elected because of Trumpism. You're voting to get that shit the fuck out.

Like, is Joe the best? Fuck no. Do I like everything he says? Fuck no. But at the end of the day, I'm, dude, four more years of Trump is just so much, it's so much insanely worse than any alternative that I can think of. And yeah, if you don't agree with that,

I mean, I think you're a fucking moron. This motherfucker is trying to shut down the U.S. Postal Service right now as we speak. Like, dude, like, we cannot have four more years of this. We can't. I know Joe is a fucking. neoliberal and he loves the banks and all that shit or whatever, but like we cannot have this for four more years.

We just can't. Like it's an existential crisis. I really feel that way. Yeah, I mean, just vote Joe in. And if he sucks, you know, a moderate fucking Republican will beat his ass in four years. And then it'll start getting real wonky. But like, yeah, dude, I just don't, I don't see how four years of like, dude, you think Donald Trump don't give a fuck now, son. Right.

You know what I mean? Like, imagine if this COVID virus had happened in his fucking lame duck ears, man. Like, imagine he wins in November and that's in, and fucking January of next year was when the fucking virus started, son. Like, God damn, man. He would still care about approval ratings, I think. Yeah, I guess you're right. But I'm saying what we're seeing right now is how he's handling it trying to get elected.

I agree with that. Are you guys done? Yeah, yeah. I'm trying to decide. I don't know if this is going to take. Like, I don't know this is going to take like a minute or like another hour. No, go ahead. Do your thing.

I have interacted with mostly online, but but in person to a lot of people on the left, on the farther left. The last two to three years, part of that is our platforms introduced me to people. Lee Baines, I'll go ahead and say, was a big part of introducing me to a lot of these people, both literally in terms of him literally introducing me and then also just following him. and following people who, you know, retweet him or whatever the thing is. My interaction with the far left in this country, the Democratic Socialists and other folks, has been mostly positive and hope-inducing. Their mantra is not me, us.

Just one little example, and this is anecdotal, it doesn't prove anything, but this is just one example. I went to hear a guy speak who was running for Senator in the Knoxville area for state senator. And Nazis had shut him down a few times, literal Nazis, literal neo-Nazis, and the Antifa, as they're called, prevented that from happening the time I went so that we could hear him speak. And up until that point, all I'd heard about Antifa was that they're just as bad as the neo-Nazis. And I, you know, I got to be honest, I don't know. What I do know is that that day, a bunch of kids who looked like they got sickle cell or some shit,

bandanas on their face before the COVID virus. We're riding around on bicycles telling me and everyone else, we'll fight those neo-Nazis if we have to. And I was like, well, I appreciate these kids being here. First of all, let me say, I should have started with this. I agree with almost everything you said, Trey, I think except for the last part. I'm definitely going to vote for Joe Biden. There's no universe where I won't.

I've said it for a long time. I'll vote for a literal sweet potato. But some of those people I just brought up, the left, they were never, ever going to vote for Joe Biden or Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama. They were either too extreme already or they got brought into the political world and politics in general by the work some of those extreme people did. Now that doesn't make it okay that they don't want to vote for Joe Biden over Donald Trump. You're still allowed to be mad at them. And by you, I mean, you, Trey, but I mean anyone out there listening, if you think that's stupid, if you say to them that's selfish or

that's wrong or whatever, that that's fine, but frame it appropriately. And what I mean by that is understand that they only were ever going to vote for Bernie. And for them, that's not taking their ball and going home. That's, this wasn't my ball game. I came because a new guy invited me. And now I'm going back to the house because I have never in my life thought the American political system was for me. And what Bernie, one thing I liked about Bernie was he was bringing those folks in. And so for me to be like, we're going to lose the election because these people who've never voted aren't going to vote. Well, it's like, wait, what? No, they've never voted. They've only ever voted in a primary for Bernie Sanders. They're not the missing votes. That's not why Democrats are

losing, in my opinion. It's still okay to be mad at those people. And here's why. Here's my big disappointment interacting with the left over the last three years. And by the left, I mean the far left, the left side of our party. They seemingly, and I've talked to some friends of mine, Brendan Gallagher is a writer out here who I've talked to about it, and he tells me I'm wrong that I have to go to more meetings and stuff, and I'm sure that's true. But if you look at their mainstream big dog media,

Chapo Trap House comes to mine, frankly, the Trulbilly Worker Party out of Kentucky, who I love, and I've plugged them here before, come to mine. they don't seem to hold the court in as much of a level of importance as I do. Perhaps I'm biased because of law school training, but I have been surprised to learn how, and I'm not talking about truebillies necessarily here, because I know them personally.

But when I go to meetings in L.A., I'm surprised to learn about how little people in DSA out here sometimes, know about the courts. Now that's a failure of our fucking school systems for sure. But you should vote for Joe Biden simply because of Ruth Bader Ginsburg. Like that's literally true. And I think very online left us hear that

and they kind of recoil because they've seen these RBG t-shirts that are super cool. And they associate that with this sort of. of yes queen leftism where it's like identity politics where someone's like i'm pro women and then you talk to them about what they mean and then they're like and that's why i'm voting for joe and they fairly go you know i'm not sure he's the most pro women candidate but it's like okay maybe that person you talk to has shallow politics but the truth is the courts in this system are very important and it's not just the supreme court it's also a

the large swath swaths what the fuck is that word tray help me out of republican federal judges that Trump has already put into place at the appeals level that are literally just appointed by the executive branch now do i think that joe biden is going to appoint people that these leftists i'm talking about love no he's not and to be fair to some of the people i've talked to it's not been all of them they know very well about it they're very informed and also to be fair to be fair to to some of the people I'm talking about. They're going to vote for Joe Biden. Where I disagree, I think, with you, Trey, is I don't think we can lay if he loses this loss

at all those people's feet. Number one, a lot of those people, like I said earlier, have never voted for a Democrat. They're not taking their ball and going home. Two, some of them are taking their ball and going home. and I will tell them to not do that. I will continually tell them to not do that. I'm not going to make phone calls for Joe Biden. I don't think.

I mean, hell I might. But I'm not excited about him, but I will tell those people, don't take your fucking ball and go home. But if they decide that the neoliberal pro-bank candidate that Joe Biden is, who's also pro-prison industrial complex, who also has increased crime bills, who also is pretty credibly accused of sexual harassment,

not rape. I'll acknowledge, but sexual harassment. If they say I'm not voting for that guy because I can't, you know, I'm not going to vote for Trump. I'll say to them, that's kind of a vote for Trump depending on what state you live in. But I'll not say to them, it's your fault that we lose when we perhaps should have done better. Number one, number two, and this is a part where we might have some back and forth, and I welcome it. It's on Joe Biden now to get some of them. I know that the stereotype is that there's all these toxic Bernie supporters, and that's like anything else, man.

Being from the South, Trey and Corey, tell me you can't understand what it's like to be judged by the loudest, most ignorant of your people. Yeah, absolutely. Quick PSA here, since you brought it up. Corey is no longer with us. He's not dead, or at least not yet. That's a joke. I hope I don't regret making. Corey had to drop out because I guess the weather there's gotten so bad.

They got another tornado warning, and he said they got a shelter in place. So our prayers up for everybody in Chickamauga. But obviously ain't trying to put a further damper on this, but that's just what happened. Corey had to go. So it's just being you now. But he knows we are going to continue, and I'm going to send him the files. And, you know, I'm sure everybody will be okay. But anyway, he's not here.

But anyway, that being said, yes, 100%. And I've told you before, and I can't remember if I've said it on here or not, but like I've said, I've said to you multiple times before, like, man, I got to get the fuck off of Reddit. Because like, because Reddit where Bernie Sanders is concerned, dude, it is the, it is the epicenter of this version of Bernie support that you're talking about. And I'm not saying they don't exist. And the ones that give Bernie supporters a bad name.

And it's like, I'm a fellow Bernie supporter and I go on Reddit and read their shit. And it, it upsets me. You know what I mean? And I'm not saying those people don't exist. And I'm also going to acknowledge that I probably have a lower threshold than you in terms of what would offend me that they might do. And I know that we have listeners out there who have an even lower threshold than me.

Because in their mind, we're fighting for health care and for people who are poor to have a fucking chance. And so people's lives are on the line. So I don't give a fuck if you're offended at my. my online thing, and I get them not giving a fuck, but I want them to understand that it's not helpful. I do. But my point is that shaming those people won't work. It won't bring them into the fold. And my second point, and this is what I think is important right now, I am sick and tired of reading on the internet. Bernie Sanders supporters grow up, blah, blah, blah, support Joe Biden. Here's what I would like. I would like Joe Biden and his top line supporters,

to grow up. And I mean that. And not just as a way of critiquing a guy who now we all need to get behind. I'm behind him. I am. I want him to win and I'm going to vote for him. I want him to appeal to people. I have seen no less than 10 clips of Joe Biden telling people to go vote for Donald Trump who weren't there to troll him, who weren't there to tell him they were Republican and that in this country, who were there to challenge him on issue. and he would call him a Bernie bro and then tell him to go vote for Trump. Now, I know that that excites some people in his base because they're sick of Bernie brothers, Bernard brothers,

as we like to be called when we're being professional. I get that. I sincerely empathize with your emotion. I am the fucking king of being fucking self-indignant, you know, self-righteous indignation. Are you shitting me? I was a public defender and now I'm a comedian. That's been quite literally my job, my whole adult wife.

I hear you. But I have to throw it back to you, Trey. Do you want to be right or do you want to win? Joe Biden is not gaining any more votes by ignoring or antagonizing the progressive wing of the party. And neither are his supporters. You guys won. Centrist Democrats. One, the primary.

And you should be trying to reach out to these people. And if they're rude to you, you should try to reach out further because they're engaging. And another thing I'll let you know is that if you are engaging with these people and they keep being rude to you and you keep being nice, there are people watching who did like Bernie. And they're coming around to your side when you do that. when you engage with these admittedly existent asshole Bernie bros and you're polite and you're referencing facts and you're saying you know what some things he could be better on but here's why I like him people are listening that's how you win votes to Joe Biden's credit

his campaign has shifted a little at least from what I've seen not enough for me in terms of what I want but enough for me to go the dude's trying to fucking win. Do you know what I mean by that? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think I was... For anybody listening, what I mean by that is I'm still not in love with his policies, but I'm in love with the fact that Joe Biden seems to be serious about winning and engaging him. He stopped picking on young people. He used to make fun of young people, I guess, to get the older vote. Maybe he was trying to win the primary. You know, that's a thing old people like is if you shit on young people. That's fine, dude. Shit on him. But now he's

trying to win him over. I like that. I dig it. I'm in. Yeah, no, I agree with all that. Here's the thing. First of all, I think you're very right. And I think that it bears repeating and bears pointing out the thing about this is not them taking their ball and going home. These are people who never intended to play in the first place and only considered it because of this guy. And now that this guy is gone, they're back out again. I think that when it comes to the like stereotypical Bernie bros or whatever that the toxic members that you're talking about that people think of, I think that that is largely true for most of them. And so that further makes me think that like it goes back to this like electability argument that depending on what what section of the internet you're trafficking in.

you see different versions of it. And what I mean is, again, I keep saying, I got to get off Reddit when it comes to politics. Well, on there, during the primaries, for a long time, they had this whole, they were really pushing this whole argument about how much more electable Bernie was versus Joe Biden. And the thing is, I saw a lot of validity in that for me because of like the midterms where you had like candidates like Phil Bredesen

in Tennessee who like tried. to tow that line and be this really, really moderate Democrat and got his ass blasted. And I remember I tweeted the night of the midterm, something like if one, if there's one thing I've learned from the midterms is that you can't be half a liberal, you know, you either got to go, go big or go home or it ain't going to work. And I felt like that was kind of the message that the midterm sent. But having said that, like now we're in the general election for president. and I just, I'm from the South, and I know a lot of other Southern Democrats,

and I mean present-day Southern Democrats, not the classical definition of Southern Democrats. And I've had so many of them say to me some version of, like, dude, like, sincerely, for me, a lot of people that I know back home that are Democrat, I mean, I'll just, my sister, my wife, multiple friends of mine, said things to the effect of, it during the primary, like, I love Bernie. I don't know that I can vote for Bernie, though, because I just can't see him winning.

And Biden, I think, is our best chance to beat Trump. And, like, with my wife in particular, we live in California now, so she voted for Bernie. I don't know for sure who my sister voted for, and that's not a cop out. I don't know. She sent me this existential question. Like, I don't know what to do.

And I told her that I said, I thought she should vote for, you know, whoever her heart said, which was Bernie, but I don't know who she actually voted for. But my point is, I know why these people feel that way. It's because I feel like if you're a Democrat from the South, you think of like what is more untenable to more people. And it's like on the internet, on Reddit, it's like Joe Biden is as untenable as Donald Trump is, you know, by a mile. just like your average day-to-day person throughout or in you know across most of America um for Democrats it's like it's voting for a guy who represents the establishment but the establishment is represented by fucking Obama and bill Clinton and you could shit talk both

of them if you want to but they both represent colossal upgrades from Donald Trump right and you got well Joe Biden who's an animal to that versus a guy who a lot of people very erroneously and very stupidly, but still, that a lot of people look at as a like fucking socialist radical, like a straight up communist basically. Right. But that's absurd. And I don't like I understand why people feel that. So I've always thought the electability argument was weird because even though I was pro Bernie, I always was kind of like.

like, I don't see how Bernie is considered more electable because the only people he's bringing to the table are the people you're talking about who are not part of the classic electorate in the first place. So you have to keep the electorate and hopefully bring in a couple more new people. Right. But if you're losing, is it worth losing a big chunk of the classic electorate to bring these new unrepresented? people. Do you know what I mean? Like, how do you balance that? Why would we lose the people who right now are screaming vote blue no matter who? I mean, the idea was Bernie would bring in these new voters and everyone else would grit their teeth and vote for him if he became the nominee. But he didn't. So you and I can argue electability all night long. And if I seemingly brought

that up, I didn't mean to. It's over. Bernie's out. and it's Biden. So the electability of Bernie Sanders is moot to me at this point. At this point, the conversation is about two things. If I'm talking right now to people who are thinking about not voting for Joe Biden

because they have a problem with him and I'm trying to convince him to vote for Joe Biden just so Donald Trump doesn't, man, what's my case? A, the second relevant point is what is Joe Biden doing to do that? If I'm out here, doing it on my podcast. If I, a guy who supports Bernie Sanders and supports his policies and

thinks Joe Biden's policies are a joke, also, I'm not even sure what his policies are, frankly, if I'm out here and that's how I feel, but I'm still trying to get people to vote for him because I think he's going to be way better than Donald Trump, and I do, I've acknowledged that, then that's the first issue to talk about. How do we do that? How do we convince them? but I think to me the second and to me more important issue is what does Joe Biden need to do to help that. And I have been pleasantly surprised by some of his turns. I've been disappointed in some of his turns, if I'm frank. But that's just me.

Let me ask you this as far as that goes. And I'm genuinely just asking a question here. Like when it comes to Joe Biden in this whole dynamic that we're talking about, do you think that there's a way, because I imagine, I don't know, but I imagine what's going on at Biden headquarters is a conversation about, yes, we can court those hardcore Bernie people on the far left. We can go out of our way to appeal to them. But in doing so, we might lose some of the appeal that we have to some of the people

more towards the center because another thing that was part of, part of that equation I mentioned a minute ago with people from the South that I didn't explicitly say at the time was that Katie and Page and other people have both said to me like that they know, they know Republicans, like lifelong Republicans, most of them younger Republicans who don't like Donald Trump, right, who would, some of whom, and I know some of these people personally, some of whom have said, and this is anecdotal, admittedly. But some of them have said, like, they could see themselves voting for Joe Biden, but these people that I'm talking about, these like moderate Republicans, would never in a million years vote for Bernie Sanders, right? And I think these people exist.

But again, this is moot. And I'm not like, I don't want to go. No, no, but it's not because you're talking about Joe Biden courting, you're talking about what can Joe Biden do to appeal to these people who are. Wait, you think he can win. Republicans? You really believe that? I think that there are Republicans. I believe, and again, anecdotal, I know some personally, Republicans who at the very least will sit their ass at home if it's Donald Trump versus Joe Biden, who, if it's Donald Trump versus Bernie Sanders, will go and vote for Donald Trump because they're more scared of Bernie Sanders than Donald Trump. Those people exist.

Tennessee. Yeah. He's not ever going to win the state of Tennessee. I know, but there are, but the South is not a monolith, but I know people like this. I'm sorry. There are some southern states that are up for grabs. I think these people are real. So, but what's your point, that if he reaches out to the progressive wing of the party,

that will go away? I think it's a conversation you have to have if you're Joe Biden or if you're in that, if you're in. Okay, but is he a Democrat or? a Republican. So you're saying, I mean, what are you saying? Because I have expressed the point that it's moot what would happen Biden versus Bernie. But I think what you're saying now is, if Biden courts progressive ideals too much, he will lose these. No, okay. Actually, what I said was, I don't know what if. I said I'm literally just posing a question here. And the question I was trying to pose is how much of that do you consider, which is what you're talking about right now.

I'm not saying I think you shouldn't do it. I'm saying, do you not think that's part of the conversation that they are having? I got two or three, I got so many ways to answer that because there's the context of our conversation and then there's the context of the national question, which is I think what you mean. So in terms of literally, should Biden think, about that. I guess you mean in order to win. Yeah, like, to him, the idea of going out of your way to like hardcore woo the lost voters that Bernie had that are going to, you know, pay at home because of it, trying to get those people versus losing, even just the people who don't vote for him, but who might not vote for Trump

if it is him. I don't think no longer calling young people with three jobs, millennials, lazy, is going out of his way. I agree. I don't think that explaining and being honest about how the medical system in this country is fucked up is going out of his way. I agree with you. If he does those things and loses these former Trump voters or they decide to go vote for Trump, then I just, I just like a voice. I think we're mostly, I think we're actually mostly on the same page. I think what he needs to do is drag his platform a little further to the left in pursuit of this exact thing,

but not to the extent of just like trying to become, you know, the Bernie campaign or anything like that, which he was obviously never going to do. But I think that adopting some of these policies as part of his, his official campaign platform is what logically should happen. And honestly, I think it's what we, I think he will do that. I mean, I think that that will happen.

But I don't, but I'm not convinced that these people that we're talking about on the far left. I'm not convinced that that that will be enough for them. I'm not either at all. Now, now I go back to the conversation of, you know, are we talking about in the context of the national thing?

or mind your conversation. I'm not sure it'll be enough for them either, but it's bullshit to me, if he doesn't do any of that, to then just lay all the blame at these supposed non-voted feet. By the way, I've never met, I've heard people talk about it online.

I've never met a single Bernie supporter from 2016 who didn't vote for Hillary Clinton. Just by the way. Not saying they don't exist. I've never met a single person who voted for Jill Stein outside of the state of Tennessee who clearly Trump was going to win. So what I'm getting at is the straw man bullshit excuse for losing Wisconsin, Minnesota, Michigan,

Georgia to a certain extent, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, Florida, these fucking swing states, Ohio, I don't know the answer. I mean, that's just me being honest. I don't know. Let me ask you this. Hold on. I don't know if staying the course, you know, going back to the people you're talking about who like Trump, who would stay their ass home if it was Joe Biden, I don't know if that would work there. I don't know if leading further left would work there.

Here's what I do know. If he stays the course and or skews kind of more towards the center or right in order to hopefully gain people who voted for. Trump or keep them home and in doing so loses people on the far left and then blames them for it. Fuck that. Fuck that to me, not just because like, not just like morally fuck that. Right. It's dumb. It's stupid.

No, I agree with you. That would, that would be, look, he is not, if he at any point tries to like equate himself with any of Donald Trump's philosophies explicitly as in the, attempt to court those people, that's a colossal mistake. The number one best thing he can do is to hammer home the fact that Donald Trump is the untenable alternative, which I feel like he's going to do that. But what I was going to ask you is, well, shit, now I forgot. Give me just a second. Oh, oh, okay, yes.

All right. So do you think, all those, that narrative of, you're talking about if they're going to to sit there and blame all these people for them not winning. That's fucking bullshit, right? And I agree with you. I think there's a difference. And I think it's that, you know, like it or not, it's just the reality and it's misogyny or it's just history or it's whatever you want to call it.

But Hillary had this added element of distaste and dislikes. amongst a huge segment of the American population in 2016. And I think that contributed, because what really happened, I feel like what most of the data has ultimately shown since 2016 is that sure Trump, you know, he mobilized rural America and all that shit, whatever. But what really happened was people who came out for Obama

didn't come out for Hillary, right? Like, Democrats didn't come out in the numbers they did. And part of that narrative was, yeah, well, it was people who wanted Bernie and were comfortable staying at home. But I think a larger part of it is just that there were just, Hillary just had this thing about her, whether it's, you know, again, her vagina, her last name, or a combination of the two versus, you know, her record as a politician up until that point,

all of the above, it led to people, staying at home, right? And I don't think that in the, in the majority of the Democratic electorate, that same stigma or whatever exists for Joe Biden, right? I think it's a different demographic of the Democratic Party that it exists for. I shouldn't say Democratic Party. I mean, we're really not talking about the Democratic Party. If you stay home because you don't like Hillary Clinton or because she has a vagina, you're not really in the Democratic Party.

You just sometimes vote Democrat. You sometimes vote and when you do it's Democratic. Yeah, I could totally imagine large percentage of that group votes for Biden, but I could also imagine a large percentage of different groups not voting for Biden for other reasons. I mean, he's been on TV, I think twice during this whole lockdown. I think people are generally starting to wonder what's wrong with him. A, B, I can't name a single policy of his. I'm not saying he doesn't have them.

I know he just said he was going to lower Medicare to 60 and forgive student loans for lower middle income students, which he hasn't defined. That's brand new. And that's the first thing that, you know, sort of Bernie latched onto, which is probably why I know about it. I don't know what his policy. And I'm not saying that, again,

I'm not trying to insult the guy who's running. I'm trying to say, I do think people are going to have a problem with him, man. Like, that's my honest opinion. That's not, you know, people are going to have a candidate. Another reason Bernie supporters are going to stay home is they feel like he was railroaded by the DNC to a certain extent to liberal media.

And depending on which Bernie supporter you're talking to is what level they think that that happened. The level that I think it happened, I don't think it was a conspiracy. I don't think, I mean, were there meetings? Yeah, there's always meetings. It's politics. That's how politics works is meetings.

You know, you call that a conspiracy. I call it politics. Like, that's how it works. Bernie was going to have to defeat that. He didn't. He lost. That's where we're at. So I say to those people, and I know we've been long-winded here,

I say to those people, not me, us. And I mean that sincerely and without, any judgment. I have empathy for working people who this is the only candidate they ever believed in. I have empathy for grocery store workers who were like, Bernie Sanders is the only person who's ever talked about my life in an honest way. I have empathy

for people who had people die of cancer and then they went bankrupt right after. And Bernie Sanders was the only major presidential candidate who had a fucking plan that would actually help them. And to a certainty, St. Elizabeth Warren, rest in peace. I empathize with you. But

it was not me. and us includes people who will be so detrimentally affected by four more years of Donald Trump via the court system. And is that a winning argument? No, it's not what I want Joe Biden to run on. He better not campaign on I'll help the courts. He fucking better have better ideas and that. But I hope it's enough to sway enough people. I hope you will remember that not meet us includes women who want abortions for a variety of reasons.

and it's going to be harder to get them if they keep stacking the courts with Republican judges. People who get arrested for drug charges. Fucking gay and trans American citizens. And I know you're sitting there and you're going,

so you want me to vote for the guy who is accused of sexual assault because of women? And the fucking shitty, horrible, maybe you're right, we do need a revolutionary answer is, yeah, that's where we're at. You know, we're go get your gun.

and I'm not saying that, FBI, I'm not saying literally go get your gun. I'm making a hypothetical scenario where those are literally your choices right now. And then the second thing I'll say, though, to Joe Biden supporters or just people who want Democrats to win is you have been saying to Bernie Bros for fucking months. You've said it to me.

You've said it to me. Is this the best way to get people to vote for your candidate? And I've been fucking nice, especially by my standards. you've said to me, well, I just feel like his supporters are the reason. You've said online, well, I'm just not sure I could vote for a candidate whose supporters don't seem to give a shit about me. It's your time, and it's Joe Biden's time to be everybody's candidate.

Yep, I agree completely. I have nothing else to add to that. I think we should wrap up at this point, because you said it, baby. Well, I know we should wrap up because Andy went to another room after cooking, and she never does either of those things. Rest in peace, gopher. She just screamed, fuck you. To me, not you. She didn't hear what you said.

All right, well, thank y'all very much. We'll see you next week. Skee? You? I hope Chow ain't done. Thank you all for listening to the well-read show. We'd love to stick around longer, but we got to go. Tune in next week if you got nothing to do.

Which is a shit ton of us. lately. Thank you, God bless you. Good night and skew.