wellRED podcast - wellRED Presents Bubba: "Maybe It Was Memphis" w/ special guest BJ Barham

Episode Date: January 21, 2022

What an episode we have for y’all today! We are joined by the frontman of American Aquarium, Mr. BJ Barham, to discuss Pam Tillis’ 1991 hit “Maybe It Was Memphis.” BJ is very familiar with the hit, as he covers it on his unbelievably good 90s country cover album Slappers Bangers & Certified Twangers Vol. 2. Check that album out and get ready to learn about the ins and outs of songwriting, what makes a reference acceptable vs. corny, and why Pam Tillis is a GROWN A*S WOMAN. Find BJ’s info at AmericanAquarium.com.

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Bubba shot the podcast and that's right. A show about country at a time. Welcome to Bubba shot the podcast. Gentlemen, first of all the facts. The first fact I want to start off with today is that we have as our very special guest, one of the best and one of my favorite songwriters in the history of country music and a man we're lucky enough to call a buddy, Mr. BJ Barham, the frontman of American Aquarium, BJ. How about you? Doing good, man. I'm putting that in the next press release.

Put it in there, dude. I praise, my man. Yeah, man. Hell yeah, dude. We were talking about you on the plane yesterday. We had a realization I did. It wouldn't have mattered because of the timing, but you had asked us to be a part of one of your shows and we couldn't do it. And the reason we couldn't do it got canceled, but like very recently. Well, it was very recently. It also got replaced with a new thing pretty much immediately. So we asked, but, you know. Oh, so you're still out is what you're saying.

Yeah. Yes. Okay. I'd have canceled the new thing. Honestly, now that we're saying it all out loud, I wish we had remember. I wish that I had remembered that because I'd be like, no, no new thing. Right. that. Well, that's what I get

for calling you guys in December and asking if you can do something in February. Most people tend to be booked. Man, that's fair. Matter of fact, that reminds me, stay on the horn afterwards. I need to talk to you about June. Well, anyway, welcome to the show. The first thing I want to talk about, you were an obvious choice for a guest, obviously because

we're huge fans, and obviously because you're a great country music singer, but also because you and your band have just put out back to back volumes one and two. Let's see here. I'm going to say it wrong. Slappers, bangers and certifies twangers, volumes one and two. Did I get it right? Nailed it. Crushed it.

And for people who don't know, their cover songs of 90s country music, when you put that out, we had been planning Bubba for about two months, maybe three. I have to think that you, unless you've been planning this for years

and maybe you have, this popped into your mind your CDs around the same time we were like I think we should do a 90s country podcast. I think the actual idea to bring it to fruition happened slowly at the around the same time. I've been threatening my bands for 10 years with this project. I've just never had time. And if the past couple years gave us anything, it gave us time. It gave me zero excuse not to live the most ridiculous 90s true self of mine that I could. We decided in August of 2020 to make these things. We got in the studio in November of 2020 and cut the first one,

and then everything came out in 2021. And it was, you know, it's my childhood dream. Because I've sang these songs my entire life. And I know based on all of y'all's videos on the internet, that y'all have sang these songs your entire life. Yeah, by you. Yeah. Oh, trust me.

I know you. Trust me, friend. How old are you, BJ? I am 37 years old. So I'm kind of in that prime time. I was eight, nine, 10 years old when all of these songs were massive hits. And, you know, I didn't realize it.

Because obviously you hit your teenage years and you run from everything your parents listen to. So like once I became 13, I was into hip hop. I was into punk rock. I was into everything but country music. But recording these, I realized how much of my musical bedrock was based on the stuff I heard on FM country radio.

Like my sense of melody, sense of storytelling, all of that came from, you know, fucking Joe Diffy, you know, just as, just as much as I'm influenced by Towns Van Zant, I'm influenced by Joe Diffy, you know.

Rest in peace. RIP, RIP, Mollett. It's, it was a crazy. realization to come to, but I fully embraced it for this project, and I quickly learned because I thought about half of our fan

base would kind of dig it and half of them be like, what the fuck are you guys doing? Wholeheartedly, grossly underestimated the demand for this thing. I only printed up like a thousand vinyl records, and those were gone in less than eight hours. And I was like,

and they went on sale at midnight. So that means people were at 4 a.m. are buying 90s country tribute records. And I'm like, what the fuck? It was 1 a.m. on my side of the country, and I was drinking, BJ. Me too. Me too. I got the tape and I play it in my Bronco and it makes me feel like I'm a better man than I am.

I feel like the best men from our dad's generation. I drive around that Bronco and pretend to have a real job. It's pretty cool. For sure. I think the only way, I think it says it on the cassette, the only way they play are in Bronco 2s. I think that's actually the only way that the cassette, it's like it unlocks the cassette, you know, it's pretty much.

I think blazers work too. I think if you're driving around in an 86 S10 blazer, I think you can still rep it pretty hard. Well, for folks, listen, and we're going to get into this week's episode, but go check out all BJ's music. We go way back with you in American Aquarium, even before we knew you.

Trey and I went to your shows. maybe even before we met you, Corey, or right afterwards at the very least, we've been American Aquarium fans for a long time. Everyone out there listening, also go see them live. Man, you all have always been great, but maybe it's because, like,

you were my first or second concert back from the pandemic, but I feel like your band is tight as hell right now, man. The band's firing. I've had nothing but good bands over the years, but this band is different. They're special. I put our live band, band up against pretty much any live band out there.

Those boys cook. Hell yeah. We're going to get into it. At the end, I'm going to make you tell your Greg Gerardo story, if you don't mind, though. I'm always down for the. Anytime I can talk about previous life doing cocaine with fucking comedy legends. That's much of the story. Let's get into it. Gentlemen, first.

All right, hold on. I messed up. I didn't, I had it pulled up, and then I was doing something earlier, and I forgot to pull it all back up. Here we go. First, the facts. Maybe it was Memphis is a song recorded by Pam Tellis on two different occasions. The second recording is the one she released in 1991 as the fourth single from her second album,

Put Yourself in My Place. It happened to be her first country album, which we will get into. The song was first recorded by Phil Seymour, whose bass player Michael Anderson, wrote the song, as best I can tell, This is Michael Anderson's only accredited hit across any genres. He has some interesting things to say about the second verse. We will get into that later. She was nominated for a Grammy for Best Country Vocal Performance in the Female category,

and she was nominated for Country Music Association Song of the Year in 92. It peaked at number three. I love it. BJ loves it. We love it. BJ put it on volume two. It's a wonderful version of it. let's get right into it.

I'll go to Trey. I think it was you, Trey, who was talking about how much you love this song pretty much immediately when we started talking about doing this podcast. Yeah, so, you know, Spotify does that thing at the end of every calendar year

where they show you your top songs that you listen to on Spotify, if you listen to Spotify. I remember, I think it was 2017, then in 2017, it generated mine and showed it to me. And number one that year was humble by Kendra Lamar. And number two was maybe

it was Memphis by Pam Tillis in like 2017. And there's an actual reason for that. And this is about to be head up my own assy, I guess. I'm just trying to establish my... I know, never. I'm probably not. I know. Not like me at all.

But I just want to establish my bona fides with loving this song. One of my numerous failed pilots when I was working on at that time, my character was married to this girl They had, and I had this whole backstory for their relationship that you didn't even see in the pilot. It's just something that, like, I came up with and working on the characters and whatnot,

but in my head, it was very real. They met at Rhodes University in Memphis. That's how they met. And my characters from, my characters from, like, trailer park, trash, you know, and I was, like, lost and intimidated by Memphis and met her. That's how we, like, hit it off initially or whatever. And so... Were you a lonely boy too far from home? Yes, that's exactly right.

So you see, Drew gets it already. And so this song was like the characters, their song in my head. This was their song. So I used to listen to this song all the time when I would be like on my way to the writer's room or something. Like this song would be how I would sort of get into thinking about that show and stuff. And so it just like, I always loved this song, but I hadn't thought about it really in a long time. until that whole process and then I just got like almost obsessed with it again at that point

to the point that it beat out everything but Kendrick in that year for me on Spotify but yeah so this is a this a big one for me and BJ obviously it's a big one for you you put it on the record you know tell tell me about this song whether now or growing up what it means to you or meant to you it's it's a huge song for me um you know obviously pam is the daughter of a country music legend mill tillis um and it was kind of a hate the 90s were the last real heyday of female voices on country radio yeah um if you look at today's country charts there's probably about four women that are always in the top 20 and it's it's only when they come out with a new single that it goes to the top 20 so you got your mirandas you know and uh but back

Back then, hell, I've covered 10 of them over the course of the last year, countless others. There was still a pretty gross disparity between women and female, I mean, between female and male vocalist on country radio. But it seems like, you know, at any given time, you can look back at the chart. So it was at least two or three women in the top 10 every week, and they were always different women. And so we wanted to make it a very clear goal to show off just as much female talent from the 90s as we did for male talent. And our goal, you know, we had a bunch of parameters for this thing because the songs had to be recorded between 92 and 95. We made two exceptions. I mean, 91 and 95, sorry, we made two exceptions.

And they had to be, we didn't want to do like Hugh, the biggest song of the person's career. We didn't want to do their number one hit. We wanted to do kind of that obscure, you know, top 10 single. And we didn't want to cover anybody that was still successfully touring at stadium. So there's no Shania, no Riba, no chicks. Oh, that's funny. I genuinely was like, I guess fancy cost too damn much to cover. That was what I assumed.

Believe it or not, all the songs cost, like, pretty much the same amount. Like, you're paying a publishing house to cover it. And they have zero idea if you're going to do anything with it. So it's a pretty low number. It's a couple hundred bucks to record any of your favorite country songs and sell them. What? Oh, it's pretty amazing. I didn't know if we were going to get into the chronic.

Yeah, I didn't know if we're going to get into the business part of it or not, but I definitely was curious about that. That's crazy. I would have thought it was more. It depends on how much the song success was and how much the publishing house wants to be an asshole about it. Right. So the good thing is we have pretty good relationship. of a lot of these publishing houses.

So they're like, yeah, you can put it on your ridiculous 90s country cover record. They had no idea we're going to go out and stream millions of copies of this thing. It helps them though, right? I mean, really? Well, it helps the songwriter a lot because the songwriter gets 50% of every dollar made. So the family of Dennis Lindy, who we've recorded five of his songs for these two volumes. We've covered Lundy. They are super stoked.

Did you guys lose me? No, we got you, buddy. Oh, cool. We were all talking about it. We were all talking over you because we've covered Dennis Lindy so much on this podcast because that son of a bitch, just banger after banger. And a whole universe. Remind me when we get off the phone, I've got to send you all of his demos, all of his work tapes.

Oh, my God, yeah. I've got like an entire folder full of his work tapes. I've got the map that was hanging in his house of his fake town. Yeah, we're Earl and everybody live. Oh, dude, I've got like a picture of the map. I'm so excited. Oh, it's a drop box and it's full of like the weird. Because he just lived out in the middle of nowhere and recorded these songs.

And his publisher said they would go six months to a year without hearing from him and then just get a bag of cassette tapes. And they just had nothing but number one hits on him. Like what a, what a, he was like this recluse who also just was like, oh, here's a song I wrote called Bubba shot the jukebox. Here's, you know, John Deere Green. Here's, you know, Earl had a, pretty nuts how he, his career. But anyway.

So when you're going to these publishing houses, you just have to kind of tell them how many, you have to give them the number you're pressing. So you have to be like, we're doing a thousand CDs, a thousand vinyl. And then you pay basically a small percentage per pressing. So that means that no matter whether you sell those pressings or not, they're getting paid X amount of cents per pressing.

So they're getting the mechanical royalties no matter what. And so once you pay that, you know, it's pretty, you can do it all online. It's pretty, pretty easy. But with, so when we were going to do this song, volume one had all the songs I felt really comfortable singing. Volume two was all the ones that was like,

these are going to be some stretches. Volume two is the, the, Martina McBride's, the pant, the ones that we had to change all the keys and I had to really do some vocal warmups for. But she does have a great voice.

It's real sultry. I think you did a great job with it. She's amazing. And the biggest thing we got from both of these volumes was, there aren't no George Stry. There ain't no Tim McGrawl. I don't know Raba. And basically our rule was, if they're playing a chili cookoff in your town this summer, we're going to cover them. If they're still playing the local civic auditorium, we're not going to cover them. Right. And so these are kind of, in all respect, these are kind of the B-level country stars of the 90s. These are the ones that would definitely be. be on a reality show about country music right now.

I think that's a great rule. She actually has been in seven episodes of Nashville as herself, which is borderline reality show. So you just fucking nailed it. I don't know if you knew that. I had zero idea about that. I didn't know that. I just learned it yesterday, I think,

or maybe this morning looking at some of this stuff. You brought up her dad, and I wanted to note real quick, before we get even further into it and bring up the lyrics, that she put out a pop record in the, 80s and it didn't go anywhere. And then she became a singer, excuse me, a songwriter with a publishing deal and had some hits, including for Shaka Khan. And then in the 90s, at about 32 or 33, starts her country career. Now, obviously, if your dad is Mel Tillis, it's easy to start a

country career in your 30s. But the fact that she was hitting in a songwriter, I don't care who your dad is. If Shaka Khan records your song, you got the juice, kid. You know what I mean? So I just thought that was interesting. We're going to get into the video in just a minute. We're going to bring up the lyrics first. And the reason I'm bringing up the video now, though, is thinking about how old she was, well, I don't want to get too far into it. I don't want to, this is a, let's keep it a G-rated podcast.

She's so fucking sexy in this video. But, all right. You've already talked about how talented she is. It's okay if you slip it in. We know you're, we know you're a good person. Exactly. looking at you through a misty moonlight. Katie did sing like a symphony.

Port swing saying like a Tennessee lullaby, melody blowing through a willow tree. What was I supposed to do? Standing there looking at you. Lonely boy far from home. Maybe it was Memphis. Maybe it was southern summer nights. Maybe it was you.

Maybe it was me. But it sure felt right. Now that's the first verse and chorus. Let's start with that first verse. very poetic a lot of metaphors in there a lot of poetic metaphors which this time

in country I would say is a little rare I don't know as far as what we've covered so far on it there's been a lot of literal stuff going on in most of our songs and now we've got some of these very pretty metaphors BJ you're shaking your head the songs you covered

would you find that that's true 100% most of this stuff was straight ahead fictional narrative they tried to be kind of funny and quirky, you know, we were just talking about Lindy, you know, throwing in, you know, he mentions onion rings, he mentions, you know, Charlie Daniels and Torquenance, these kind of funny lines. But like, this is, who is dead now. Yeah, this is, this is, like, really, like, I didn't realize it because as a kid, you're just sitting in the back of your dad's car singing these songs. When you're going through and you're recording these songs and you're memorizing

these lyrics, you're like, holy shit, like, that's, that could, that, that could, that, that could, That could be in a book of, like, you didn't hear this on 90s country radio. You're definitely not hearing it on a 90s country radio today. That is, that's poetry. That's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, dude sitting there journaling and it's, I think it's beautiful. Like, all the verses, I think he crushed, second verse, we'll get to that later. Not so much.

The first and last verse are, are incredible. It's funny, you said that about the second verse. We will get to it. I'll go to Corey real quick. Corey, the first thing I noticed is she didn't change the lyric. when he wrote this song for a man, Philip Seymour first, he was the lonely boy far from home. What was I supposed to do looking at you?

I'm a lonely boy far from home. Right. She didn't change that lyric. And I kind of like it better. I kind of like it better. Her, because now it sounds like neither of them are, both of them are traveling or both of them ended up in Memphis somehow. Yeah, I didn't even think about it like that. But you're right.

And that does make it better. And this is, you know, just on this first verse and course. us. This is one of those songs from, 90s country that is in a distinct category for me, which is songs from the 90s that I actually like better as an adult. Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, there's obviously some that I listen to now as an adult,

and I'm like, oh, well, I liked that when I was a kid, but whatever. And then there's some that have kind of remained the same for nostalgia purposes. But like, as a kid, I heard this song a lot. And like, especially because, oh, it's, oh, this is Mel Tillis's daughter. My granny was a huge Mel Tillis guy. We used to watch the Ralph Emery show all the time when he was on there. And anyhow, like kind of probably around the same time as Trey, maybe because of Trey, because you had put it in heavy rotation, I started listening to it.

It was like, oh, my God, I didn't know what I had. I knew I liked it, but I didn't know what I had as a kid. Yeah, I messed the lyrics up as a kid. As a kid, I didn't know, you know, I just called him grasshoppers or big-ass grasshoppers. I didn't call them Katie Dids. I thought the line was a friend of, Or it's like Katie did sing it like a symphony. So I also thought that.

And also before this episode, if you Google, at least when I Googled, maybe it was Memphis lyrics and Google just pops up the lyric sheet at the top. It said Katie did like that girl Katie did sing. And I know that's wrong. It's definitely Katie did. But like apparently it was a bit of a normal misinterpretation, I guess. You weren't the only one because I thought it's saying. thing. I thought it was some girl Katie who did sing. Well, it is

grammatically incorrect because the lyric is absolutely Katie did sing like a symphony, but it's one word. Like I've confirmed that. I've checked multiple websites. It's one word, so they're talking about Katie Dids. Yeah, I think. Katie did sing like a symphony. And that might be her interpretation of the song. I never went and listened to the original version. Maybe Katie Dids is what they say. But that is hard to say, right?

If you're singing Katie Dids sing. I feel like the S is just run together, you know, because you got one at the end of the word and one at the beginning of the next one. So it's like it could sound that way. But surely it's, I mean, that's what the talk is. This is going to be the dumb red neckery in me. Is plural Katie did? Is it kind of like deer?

Is it just Katie did? I don't think so. Is it Katie Dids? It's always been Katie Dids at my house, but I have no idea. I'm just throwing out there for reference. I don't think. Actually, yeah, I don't think it's like deer or moose. I don't think.

I think it's Katie did. Me and Andy listen to that Regan bit this the other day. Moose and. Mooseon. Mason. Mooseon. Box. They put it in a boxing.

Call him somebody else. All right. I was going to go to the video now, but I want to get through this second verse before we go to the video because we already brought it up. And I think it's a really interesting backstory, and we have a songwriter on here to talk to about it. So let's read the second verse first. Read about you in a Faulkner novel, met you once in a Williams play.

Heard about you in a country love song, Summer Night Beauty took my breath away. Now that's a reference to a Glenn Campbell song called Summer Nights. Michael Anderson, the writer of this song who's referencing it, says he doesn't like that song. He said it just rhymed. and he wanted to throw it in there. He also says he hates this verse that he imagined the first verse and the second verse,

but he knew he needed a third one. He said he wrote the first and second one in one night. Imagine himself being in L.A. looking back on somebody he had met in Memphis while being on the road. He knew he needed a third verse to make the song radio-friendly, so he put it in there,

hated it, it was Filler. He takes it to his band leader, Phil Seymour, and Phil goes, what are you talking about? I agree with you that this is the worst part of the song as a songwriter. But you've got to understand that for radio and making hits. You've got all these references in there.

That is the move. BJ, how do you feel about that with Seymour, right? It's the same reason every shitty country singer mentions Hank Williams or Merle Haggard. It's immediate, you're naming stuff that's immediate, like, you can talk about obscure writers. You're immediately throwing someone out there. when you're writing pop music, when you're writing songs for large demographics of people, you have to really dilute it down to common denominator stuff.

You can't make an obscure poet reference or an obscure writer reference. Most people who have got a high school education know who William Faulkner is. They know he's at least a writer. You know, they know who Tennessee Williams is. They know, like, if they don't know anything else about playwrights, they know about Tennessee Williams.

So you're throwing out these really generic kind of names that you kind of have to know. Yeah. It's like mentioning like Michael Jordan, if you're talking about basketball, it's like everybody knows who Michael Jordan is, whether or not you know the stats or the game. You know who Michael Jordan is.

Right. And that's the one thing that you can tell is just kind of, in my opinion, lazy songwriting. But I understand why it works in a number three country song. Like, it's immediately, like Corey said,

it immediately gives you this credibility. Well, one thing I was, say about it in a positive light is it's a Glenn Campbell reference instead of Hank Williams. And then with Faulkner and now, this is probably because he wrote this to be a pop song about the South. In other words, he wrote it for a pop jazz band instead of for a country player initially. But I like that it's a Faulkner reference in a country song. Yeah. I like a Tennessee Williams reference in a country song instead of a Hank Williams when obviously I love Hank Williams, but these broader references like William Faulkner.

I mean, I would argue that William Faulkner and Tennessee Williams are, other than maybe Shakespeare, as famous as anybody in their respective fields. So I like that we've got southern references that supersede the South and that this guy and then therefore Pam referenced them instead of my truck was down there and we were listening to Hank or whatever. Yeah, at least it's good writers. You look back on, there's a lot of today, if that was a thing, you know,

they'd be mentioned like Joe Rogan podcast and fucking Miller Light. And instead, you're talking about Faulkner and Williams who like universally are, don't get me wrong, they're universal, but they're also wildly great. Like there's a reason they're universal when it's because their talent supersedes it. I wanted to do a quick aside because I'm curious. So Drew told that story about the songwriter for this. He said this was basically like a placeholder. He didn't even really like this.

it ended up just sticking around, you know. And I know like as a comedian, that type of thing happens sometimes. You'll have like a filler line or something that you think. But you just end up not being able to get rid because it like it hits or what it works too good. You just didn't like. And that happens a lot where it's like something you thought was just offhand ends up being like an integral part.

And BJ may be a little different for you because you're such an independent artist and in charge of your own ship. but like do you ever have that happen with lyrics? Do you ever just plug some lyrics in? You're like, okay, I'll fix that later. But then you end up leaving them or they end up working. One of the biggest songs of my career is that entire process. I wrote, I had a show and an ex-girlfriend was at the show, front row with a boyfriend.

And I went backstage during the opener and I wrote down these scathing lyrics. And none of it rhymes. None of it fucking rhymes. song goes hard though and none of it rhymes and I got up on stage the encore just to sing it to her

for her acoustic somebody you somebody you this fucking rules yeah somebody I never had any intention on putting this song out and somebody YouTubeed

and then people started requesting it it shows it's I hope you breaks your heart yeah like one of the big one of the biggest that's so fucking awesome one of the biggest songs of my career was this like

like improved thing backstage and the guys are like we don't know it. I was like, fuck it. I'm playing it acoustic. And I walked on state, it's three chords. It's D-A-N-G. And I walked on stage. It's the same three chords. It's the whole fucking song. And I just yelled at her.

And like I said, you can listen back to the song. None of it rhymes. It's not, and that's what I think makes it so universal. It's like it's super cathartic and it's super direct. Like, I had zero. I wish I could have wrote a poetic version of that. Nah. I always thought. What are he doing? The years now I've known you, I never knew that back story, but I always thought that that all totally played because, like you said,

it seemed like, I thought that was very much intentional. It's never even crossed my mind that it didn't rhyme. Right. It's like, well, it's cathartic. Just laying it out there,

just giving it, saying how it feels, you know, because we've all been in that scenario before. So it's very much like, it's stream of conscious anger is what it is. What did he do? What's that?

What did the, I do. Oh, they just, they slowly left after like every, after everyone realized that like, because that was, there's a whole YouTube video about me being like, you know, I hope your trailer burns down, you pieces of shit. Like, I hope you never find happiness. I don't know if the YouTube video is still up, but it's like, go about the fucking South Carolina, you pieces of shit. I hope the South Carolina stereotype's true. I hope your fucking trailer burns down. I hope you never find love or happiness or any, any amount of, of contentment. In my opinion, to see, second draft is a little better, but I understand that you had to work through all those lyrics

first. Yeah, I was, I was, that's exactly how old bits get made. Well, that was the whole story leading up to the song. I think I talked about her mom. I told her that the whore apple didn't fall far from the whore tree. And like, like, there's, they're used to, I don't know if it's still on there, but there's, there was a video of me, and I was hammered, obviously. Yeah. And I was just yelling and finally, I was, here's a song for you and him. I hope you're fucking happy and I played literally I hope he breaks your heart from start to finish and I had zero intentions of recording it because I played

that was probably the antique hearts era when I wrote that and so every show we were going to there'd be somebody who's like play a hope he breaks your heart and I'm like how the and then it would lead to this how do y'all know that song they're like it's on the internet and and so then when we were recording dances for the lonely chris stamy who was the producer was like do you guys have any like really big sing-along rock songs and I was like no and then somebody in the band was like, well, we've got that song

that everybody sings it shows. And we're like, fuck it, I'll play it for you. I played it for him. He's like, that's the song you need to record. And so we recorded it, put it out. And now it's kind of this giant blessing and curse because the songwriter in me wishes I could go back and like write a super bird's eye view

poetic song about breakups. But instead, it's just you've got this drunk early 20 year old looking face to face with his problem and yelling at it for three and a half minutes. I'm so glad you asked that phone. fucking question. God damn. All right. I'm going to do a screen share and play some of the video and then we're going to bring our

other our other host on. First let me do that. Let's see if I can do it quickly and correctly. Okay. There you go. Okay. Or swing, swing, like a Tennessee, love by a day going to do will All right. Sorry, I don't want to get in trouble with the YouTube or we'd watch the whole thing. The first thing I want to say about this video, and I alluded to this earlier,

and I mean this with all due respect to Ms. Tillis. So for the 90s for a country star to have a new album, I'm sorry, their first album come out in their 30s, I don't know, I guess what I'm trying to say is when this video came out, I was of a certain age. I'm 37 as well. I was just starting to notice. This was a grown woman, though. Those eyes, good.

Lord, maybe it was Memphis. And for me, I think that was part of the appeal of this song. Her sultry voice. Yeah. It's one of them songs that made you nostalgic for a thing that didn't happen to you. Yeah. Which is one thing. I made up a thing that happened.

You know what I mean? Yeah. I like fabricated a whole thing and acted like it happened to me. Just because of that song pretty much. I think that. I think to add to your point that this could have been some 22-year-old country pop starlet trying to sing this song and it would not have had the weight it has. Right.

When you have literally, this is kind of like the same reason like, what was it, Gretchen Wilson got big in the mid-20s, like the early 2000s. She's a grown-ass woman singing about grown-ass things. Yep, right. And like I said, like if a man sings this, for instance, it's a different story. If a young woman sings about this, it's a different story. But when you have a mid-30-year-old, maybe a mom of two, maybe divorced singing this song, it adds such an amount of like weight to the song, emotional weight, where it's,

not is it just more believable, but you're, I don't know, it's, it's more real to me. And then watching that video, you're like, that is, that's a grown-ass woman. That's not a 22-year-old girl who just signed her first record deal trying to find herself. That's a girl who's been through some shit. Right. Speaking of grown-ass people. There he is. DJ's cringing.

What's love y'all? The Indian Outlaw on Tushar Singh is joining us. Oh! What's up? Hey man, I'm the Indian Outlaw. I was the same. I guess there's really no other, that's the song, I guess. That's the song, yeah.

That's how we bring in Tuchar Singh, the Indian Outlaw. It's the only time. The song isn't racist. Sometimes it's a... But you know how sometimes there's things that are a little too on the nose? Yeah. You're like, oh, oh, oh, yeah, we pretty well know

that's one of them, but, you know, it is what it is now. I already have it goes so far that... Have you guys done the podcast on that song? No, but in some ways it is the genesis of this idea because we got to talking about it on the well-read podcast, I think when Tushar was a guest. And it... We broke it.

down and we got a lot of requests to do more of that where we were breaking down the lyrics. And then, as I recall, Trey and Corey didn't know that he had sampled a song from the 70s that is like the liberal but still racist version of the same song. It's like so hilariously. Like it's very pro-Indian but still super fucking white and racist. It was progressive. It was progressive in the 70s. Right. Right. Yeah. It's the best, because I, whenever I get on the road with these guys, and get to do their show,

I come out to that song. And the faces in the audience are, just like yours a few minutes ago. It's good time. And then he says, they won't let me do the show unless I come out to that song, which is not true.

Not true. And makes us look bad and laugh every time. All right, well, Tushar, you're here, buddy. We brought you in. We've already burned through the first two verses. I guess my first question for you, did you,

do you remember this song at all growing up in Alabama? No. at all. Sometimes he does, BJ. About 50% of that. I, man, this video, I look at, BJ, look at everything through quite a racist lens if you can't, if you didn't notice. But this video is, it's the, it's the, it's the, it's the whitest video we've seen so far in the sense that in the first 12 seconds, cottonfield for no reason. okay well Memphis you're trying to establish right right and then there's like white sheets in the background

just flapping around there's cut of ways to ships it does have a garden and good vibe too yes but I mean the I mean just what you said to open this the video especially like I don't know who Pam Tillis is and I and I she is a

like she's like the she's like a hot wide bartender. Like that vibe you've been through everything and you're just like just talk to me and just I want to look at you and you know Shania Twain you want to like marry and maybe deified

this girl you want to like choke slam with all due respect with all due respect you want to see your tattoos you want to see what's happening now there man DJ sorry buddy Oh, wow. Yes.

Yeah. That's why he's an outlaw, baby. Now, the ships and boats, I think, just established Memphis. The rest of it, I think it's a little on the nose. I agree with you, Tuchar. Even they're rolling around later in the grass in front of a church, which, look, I started it talking about her sultry voice and eyes. Tushar literally slammed it home with that very, very graphic. explanation of what he wanted to do.

But when you're rolling around on a blanket in front of a church, I genuinely can't believe they got away with that on CMT back then. Like, like, it's a wide shot. So maybe it didn't register for people what's happening. Maybe it didn't register for y'all even when you were watching it.

But there is a scene of them. They're zooming out. It's very wide. And they're rolling around on a blanket like they're making out in front of a little white church. This song is thematic. radically similar to strawberry wine, which we did a couple of weeks ago,

but it is a little bit more, I guess, subtle. It's very much about, not necessarily a one-night stand, but a summer fling. Well, you know, I don't know. I guess I didn't have a question there. I just rambled,

but like, does it surprise y'all that they put that on the video? It was the 90s. They could do pretty much the fuck they wanted to. Really? Even on CMT? these kind of songs were like there were some there were some nod shit on cm t in the early 90s like as a kid who you know only had a few hours a day with a satellite with your parents not there there was some there was some there were some there was some

there was some risque stuff because you got to think this is country music videos CMT late 80s early 90s is the first time that you start seeing like real sex symbols on like before you had to have a good voice and if you were pretty it was great but if not, you could still have a career, not be pretty. Once you started getting in the age of music videos, you had to be hot. Talent was not a necessity. You could add talent. You had to be visually attractive.

And so in these videos, like, especially in the early 90s for females, you better believe, go back and watch half these videos. It's always low-cut shirts. It's always super sexy scenes, whether it's in a bar and they're dancing, like risque on a man. Like the female videos from the early 90s are extreme. Like they would not be made today. Or maybe they would still.

Well, it's funny because I think that a lot of the male videos in the 90s were the same thing. It's just that the aesthetic doesn't hold up quite the same. Right. For those dudes, you know what I mean? Like with the painting on jeans and the long curly hair and all that shit they had going on. But those dudes were like, that was pure sex.

And this is. Travis' shirt definitely dressed like a slow. Absolutely. Oh, dude. Sure. Right. Yeah. Dude, my grandma would, she said the most ungodly things about Sammy

Kershaw. Like, she would talk about, like, he's the only man. Oh, that your grandpa could put his boots into my bed. Until I realized what that meant, until I realized that my grandma wanted a raw dog fucking Sammy Kershaw. I was like, oh, she must really, really like that guy. And then I realized. She did.

Yeah. Just going to let him get her bed dirty. Everybody's grandma wanted raw dog Sam and Curshaw tonight. I bet he did it a few times. I thought like Sammy Curshaw would have been on board. You don't sing, you don't sing Vidalia and not get a blowjob behind a fucking Ferris wheel at the state fair. Absolutely. That's right.

If he didn't want to, it's because he didn't want to. Yeah, heard that. And all our grandmas learned it from their moms talking about Conway. Now, Tushar, we've gotten into the sensuality of this. Is there any equivalent Blywood movie scene or song? It's one thing we always do, BJ, is make Tushar try and compare this. You know what the funny thing about the question is? I don't know enough about Bollywood to really give a good answer, but I throw something out there.

That's my favorite. That's my favorite part. You're like, I don't really know a lot about Bollywood. So they're not, they're not going to know the difference. So I'm just going to give an answer. Yeah, this is news to us. We didn't know he was making it up. I don't know.

I can't. So before I can answer that question, I got to think about what the song's about. And I know we're going to get through the rest of lyrics. Yeah, we can get through the rest of the lyrics before I make you answer that question for sure. Trey and Corey and Corey, have y'all put any thought into what rap? song to compare

I mean, I'm going to steal my own answer for strawberry wine, but I actually think it applies even more directly to this song than Strawberry Wine, really, and it's wet dreams by Jay Cole. There you go. There you go. That was mine, that was mine too. Reminiscing about, you know,

the young love and how passionate it was and whatever and just looking back on it fondly type of thing. Absolutely. All right. Well, let's finish out these lyrics and then discuss the end of this song. Every night now, since I've been back home.

I lie awake drifting on a memory. What a great fucking line. Think about you on my mama's front porch swing talking that way so soft to me. What was I supposed to do? Standing there looking at you. Lonely boy far from home. Maybe it was Memphis.

Maybe it was southern summer nights. Maybe it was you. Maybe it was me, but it sure felt right. Then we just repeat that. That's the sexiest fucking line of the whole fucking song is when she gets that really soft. we're just like talking that way so soft so soft yeah yeah

that is fucking that's whispering in somebody's ear rolling around on a blanket in front of a church out in the middle of fucking nowhere yeah and I go back to what you said about how this would be different if it was a man or a younger woman singing it that's a grown woman line

talking that way so soft to me I mean that that sounds like something you would over here as a young man your grandma say to your grandpa talking that way and you didn't know what they were talking about yeah it's uh that that's the third verse for me is the first verse it sets it up like that's a super poetic verse that third verse i don't care who you are whether you like country music or not if you like songwriting if you like writing that's a great fucking verse that's a great verse well we skipped that

first couplet a little bit i said it was a great line but i lie awake drifting on a memory this is a song that i think that if we if i if i if i if i was jimmy fain me if i if i if i if i was jimmy and I had the Tonight Show. One of my shows that I did would be where I hand people that claim they don't like country music, just lyrics. You know what I'm saying? And it's like, tell me if this is a country song or if this is a, and this is one of those that I think a lot of people who claim to hate country music would just read this and be like, there's no way this is a country song. It's too beautiful. You know what I mean?

Yeah. I think it's got this could this could be an Americana song. This could be like real like somebody. would give this artistic merit. Right. They're not just trying to sell coal beer and Dodge trucks. Like this is like a,

this is a, this is a, this is a banger, man. Speaking of, I wanted to give you credit earlier when you were talking about including, you know, men and women on the albums,

Morgan Wade is killing it. And I only know who she is because of you. So in that whole, what is Americana, what is country. I love the people who are knocking those walls down. And kudos to you.

And y'all also go check out Morgan Wade. Sorry, go ahead, Tushar. I meant to do that. I think it's a beautiful song. The more I kind of hear you reread it and then talk about it. It kind of changes from my initial of like the through line here is what am I supposed to do? Like what is she ashamed of?

I think that's built in, you know, I have to assume. I've always assumed that that was the building. built-in sort of southern, you're not supposed to have sex outside of marriage. And she couldn't help her sex here. That's what I've always told on. What was I supposed to do? Yeah, what was I supposed to do? Not break him off a pace?

Come on, man. Did you hear how you talk about? Just that question of like, especially. I had to let him choke slam me. What was I supposed to do? BJ, I think he froze when you went to say something. What were you going to add about that? I was just saying, like, the chorus is, it's the, it's the, it's the, it's the, I

didn't have any other choice but to fall in love with him. I didn't have any other choice. You know, it's like, and I love the, the southern way they say it. Like, what was I supposed to do? Like, you know, I, man, anytime you can put regional dialect into stuff, uh, and colloquialisms into stuff and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, that's my, that gets me going. Uh, uh, and I think that it's such a great, it's simple. It's such a simple chorus, but it's such a big, chorus. Like, I think, and I think why this song translates so well, here we are, you know, 30 years later is because everyone's had that moment of this is about, I don't think this is about a summer. I think it's like a one-night stand. That's what it feels like to, that's what it feels like to me. Like, it feels like I didn't have any other option but to do this thing for

this one night. And then now, here I am. And in my case, I'm watching Pam Tilla sing this song. Here I am, you know, maybe I'm married now. Maybe I got kids. maybe my life's not the way it was. And this is the one thing I go back to so often to find a shred of fucking happiness. I know that I know that's fucking dark. But I love the idea of like someone who is in a fucking real like a divot in their life looking back on just one night in Memphis with some dude that, you know, tipped 30%. And, you know, this is what happened.

That's all it. I also like, I like how it's a love letter to the city. It's very rapper-esque of the song to shout out kind of like, was I fucking the city or the man? I don't know. It was, you know, this is how much I love, you know. Yeah, it could have been, it could have been the person I was fucking. It could have just been Memphis, you know.

I love that they didn't make any, any huge references. They didn't, they, all the references were to, to writers. They didn't mention Beale Street or they didn't mention, You know, all that shit. Like it was, I thought that was super cool. The only time you get a sense of place is, you know, maybe it was the city. Maybe it was the night we met. Maybe it was the, here's all these circumstances that could have led to us meeting for one night.

Maybe it was you, maybe it was me. But whatever it was, it led us together. It obviously was a good thing. Yeah, it was all of it. It was just like the stars aligning because that's how it goes in those moments. You know what I mean? It's like the time and place we both were in our lives and ended up in the same place. together and it all just, it all just worked.

It's such a great song. I actually agree with BJ that it's like a mother of two looking back. The only disagreement I had there is I don't think it's a one-night stand because it references southern summer nights. And also, I would argue that allowing somebody to look at you when you're on your mama's front porch swing, I don't think that's a one-night stand thing. True, true. You're right.

But I definitely got that dark looking back like this was. This was a lot of people wouldn't necessarily remember this, but I'm remembering it right now because things ain't going right for me. Yeah, I mean, I don't know. Like, that definitely is an interpretation, but I think also you can just like be getting older or whatever. You know what I mean? You think back on like things like this happened in your early 20s,

and it's not like, I mean, some of them, you were like, well, that was regrettable. But like, but the good ones, you know, some of which were you look back on me like, that was a good time. know if I'd write a whole goddamn song about her or whatever. But my screen went out of her face. You can be like nostalgic or whatever for a positive experience back then without being

in a complete fucking gutter right now. It could also be that. I think it's awesome because I think everybody's had that relationship like it was fun until it wasn't. Yeah. They burnt really bright and then they didn't burn long kind of thing. Right. Those are like everybody's had those.

I think that a young 20-year-old who just had like that fucking summer loving shit can relate to this song. And then you can have a 40-year-old woman relate to this song. You know, I think it is the reason this song got up into the top five on country charts. And it wasn't because it was a beautiful poetic song about the South. I think it was, I think the feeling, the emotion that it evoked in people was pretty universal. I think everybody's been in that spot. Well, it just reminded me of something I wanted to bring up. I'm going to go a little meta here.

but the song is nostalgic. This podcast is nostalgic. Your albums that we've been referencing are nostalgic for people. I know they are for me. I think we're in a sweet spot for nostalgia right now probably because of how shitty the last couple of years have been. And maybe it's just because we're all of the age where they can just start selling nostalgia to us.

Yeah. Yeah, I think that's definitely. I was going to say we're all roughly the same age and I think it's just a part of the age we are. Yeah. In the 90s, the 70s were big because those people were 35 and in charge of stuff. Right. Yeah, that was the one thing we found out when we put this record out is that we had tapped

into one of the most addictive drugs ever, and it's nostalgia. Like, we, don't get me wrong, I'm really proud of the band on this volume one and two, and I'm really proud of tipping the hat to all the music that influenced me growing up. But, like, at the end of the day, like, the reason these records did so well, both of them charted on the billboard charts like cover records from a from a from a you know a band like ours and I think it was because nostalgia was the number one reason I give for it is there's a lot of people our age that have got lost in their jobs in their relationships they're not finding a lot of new music they're just listening to whatever's on the radio and they're not really happy or content or finding any fulfillment with what's on the radio and then all of a sudden you're reminded remember how good these songs used to be. Yeah. And I think everybody, especially, you know,

in the middle of the summer when we put these records out, like, I think people really tapped into, holy shit, but if he was great, Pam Tillis was great, you know. Well, we've also seen. I mean, everything you just said is true, but also,

but you all crushed. Crushed it. So you had to happen. That all works, but none of that would have worked if y'all did a half-ass job of it and you didn't, but yeah, I mean, you're right about all that. You did do a great job. I do have a hard out.

Y'all finished. Corey, you know, my rating. I told you. B.J. Love you, buddy. And I'll talk to you soon. I'll see you soon. And song rules. See you all later. I wanted to just add quickly to the nostalgic conversation. You're right and you're right

about the age. I also, though, that think that the moment we're in as a nation is part of it. And to back up that argument, I'll point out that because of TikTok, Gen Z's discovered 90s country and they're very into it. And they're very into how it

sings about a time that is not what they're living through. You know, it's a happier version of pop music because even pop's gotten a little dark, you know, with Billy Elish and stuff like that. I saw Winona a couple weeks ago, BJ, and there were about 20 teenage girls there who knew all the words to about four of her songs and knew nothing about the rest of them. You know, and it was definitely like they had found her somehow and then gotten, you know, into that, you know, kind of more positive version of pop

music. There's a huge resurgence in obviously all things, 90s, whether it's fashion or music or whatever, but I think it's, there's way worse eras of music to bring back than fucking 90s country.

Like, when they start bringing back early 2000s country, I will fucking move. I don't think it left. How do you bring it back? Yeah, right. I have this argument with a lot of people about this because I've done a bunch of interviews for these records. And I truly think that the fucking 9-11 killed any remnants of like

really great storytelling songwriting. After that, it was super nationalistic records. And then they just kept dumbing it down. And then it led to the birth of the brocountry stuff. And we haven't bounced back. We've still, we've got a couple people that have pulled through. We've got, you know, the Stapletons of the world. But, like, Tyler Childers ain't getting played on the radio.

Sturgle ain't getting played on the radio. They still don't play Tyler on the radio? No. Like, maybe AAA, maybe a few, like, rogue, you know, radio stations. But, like, as far as the stuff that we all listen to, I feel like most of us have. Well, the kids love Tyler. Well, I went to watch Tyler and Sturgel, and, like, a bunch of young people left when Tyler got done playing, which surprised the shit out of me.

So I've said this before on podcast, and I'm. so glad that BJ agrees with me. So you've heard it here now twice. The worst thing about 9-11 is what it did to country music. I've been saying it. BJ, the quarter of the year. Man,

I'm glad you said that, not me. I'm glad I just let up to it. I've said it before. I've said it before. We know what you, we know what you meant in your heart. It's fine.

I've said it. For sure. And I feel really bad about it because, like, you know, we put a Toby Keith song on him. here. Yeah.

Hey, I always tell people like, I want people to listen to Toby Keith without having to listen to Toby Keith. Right. Yeah, for sure. Like, he wrote that song by him damn set. Like, no, there's not a co-write. He came in Nashville, that fucking song in his back pocket.

And that shows you how true most of those guys are. They come wanting to be serious writers. They come wanting to be serious singer-s singers. And then you have to make these choices along the way. What part of yourself you're willing to see? sell. And Toby Keith's a great, like, story about what happens when you sell too much. Yeah.

Well, damn. Not to get too fucking heavy on that. No, that's right. It's just this time to go. And you're fucking right. I think we all had an existential crisis there. It's a good time to close on 9-11. I always say, I always say that.

We're going to give it a rating. I'll start. I give it a 9.1-1. You mean? It's, it's a. That took me a couple seconds. No, I give it two towers. No, all right, all right.

All right, all right, all right. I give it two and two thirds earned hearts. The middle verse is partially where I'm losing a third. And then the other thing is, for me, this song did a great job. You know, as a songwriter, I'm sure BJ would have something to about this. And as a writer myself, I'm impressed with how general the song is. And then he

made it feel specific. And the way she sang it made it feel specific. But this song is thematically like strawberry wine, but way more general. And for me personally, what I love about 90s country, I want a little bit more specificity. So I'm

going, based on that and the middle verse, two and two thirds Earnhardt. It's so close to perfect. But it's not quite as good as, because, you know, Queen of my double wide for me. Right. Corey, I'll have you go next, buddy. For the same reasons, and I wouldn't have, like, I came in prepared to give it the standard Corey Forster three out of three Earnhardt's, trying to make everybody happy being a baby face, Hogan of the 80s.

But because of what you just said, it's like, yeah, I have to say because I wouldn't have thought about that before when you pointed out to like, you know, it's different than referencing Hank Williams. but at the same time, it's kind of maybe lazy writing. I'm going to have to go with two and two-thirds of an Earnhardt as well. Give him Trey's rating, brother? And Trey gave it three out of three Earnhardt's. That's what he texted me before the show, so I don't know if it would have changed, but that's what we're going to go with, three Earnhardt.

I mean, I don't think his was going to change. It was his most listened to song of 2020. This is his jam, dude. He wrote a whole pilot around this song. Yeah, right. And I love it too, but yeah. All right. Tooshar, Indian Al-I'll go two and one-third.

Okay. Here's why. So you, I was always going to go a little lower, but you convinced me a little bit lower to go a little bit lower than that. But I also, when I found out that the original was sung by a man, it took away from the song from me. If so, if she had written it or a woman had written it from the perspective of a woman, you would be like, God, damn. Well, because I'm watching this, that's what I'm presuming when I watch it.

I'm like, this lady wrote it, and she's an old lady, and she bang some boy. Love it. And now it's all of a sudden. 10 out of town. Oh, man. That's not real. I have to take a little bit away. Okay.

Jokes aside, that is a very interesting perspective. How what the piece of art means to you based upon what somebody was feeling or thinking when they wrote it. That is so wild. I've had this argument with somebody whose name I won't mention about Jason Isbel, because she is in the business, about how she prefers Isbel songs where he lived them, and he's gotten away from that as he's gotten older. And then there's a big part of me that's like,

well, that's more impressive. The fact that he wrote Elephant about someone dying of cancer, and he never really knew someone that personally who went through it like that, that's more impressive. For sure. She was saying, sure, but I prefer those songs where I know he felt them in his And that's also a valid argument. BJ being the only songwriter on here, I'll put you on the spot.

You don't have to talk about your friends one way or the other. Oh, so I don't write songs now just because they're stupid and funny and aren't really good. They're not songs. Those are called bits. Those are called bits. Okay. If I'd have said that you didn't write jokes, you'd be mad about that. Yes.

Look, I don't know what you want, man. You know, you want it all. You've got the baby face, the cute, the song, and now you have abs. Why don't you go fuck yourself, Corey? Why don't you do that, okay? Just let BJ have one thing that you can't do. I know you won't let me, Tray or Tushar have one thing that we do and you can't, but let BJ have a thing that you can't do.

Fair. As a songwriter, what Tushar's point was. How do you feel about that? Coming from writing songs about yourself is easy. Okay. Because there are stories that you just have to make rhyme. You already know the stories they're embedded in you. I think that is less impressive.

than being able to write a really great story and pluck it out of the air. Because it's harder. It's harder. It's much harder to do because. But to be fair to what you sure was saying, he wasn't necessarily saying it was less impressive. It just meant less to him. Of course.

That too as a listener. Okay, I feel the same way if, let's say, somebody else sang Jason Isbell's elephant. I would feel the same way. I was like, the only way you get a pass for me about singing about something that didn't happen to you is if you wrote it. right

like i because that's where the i think that's where the town is like some of my best songs i haven't lived i haven't lived them i made them up and the ultimate tap you can give a songwriter is not knowing whether or not they lived or not when the song is so good to where you have to ask is that real then that means i did my fucking job as a songwriter like when i write oh sorry when i write a song

whether or not i lived it or not if i put enough effort into it, enough detail into it, and enough narrative into it, if it makes you question whether I lived it or not, if there's even a little bit of, I think he went through that, I did my job as a song life. Hell yeah.

So two things of that. First, let me respond that Tyler Mahenco has made a point about country music that I didn't know I agree with until he made it, where we talk about authenticity, but what we're really looking for is sincerity. And I think you just highlighted that where you're talking about, you know, you're sincere about what you're expressing there.

But the other thing I want to say, for Pam, I think Pam lived this. She didn't write this song, but I think she, the way she performed it, either she's so incredible and they need to give her more acting jobs or some part of her connected with this story and she was putting it through with her voice. Yeah, like for me, so I'm going to give my score. I give it a two and a half earned hearts. the writing is where I pull some of the the second verse pulls me

pulls me away a little bit I like the discussion here because I think it's lazy when you make those kind of like you know I was sitting on the truck I was listening to Springsteen and you know stuff like that but when you're making references to really talented stuff not just generic good

but universally good I think that is that's pretty awesome. And I didn't think that going into this because I only had I only originally had this is two Earnhardt's. So two and a half Earnhardt's from me. One, she didn't write the song and as a songwriter, I'm a sucker for that thing where you don't, where you're not a part of writing the song that you're trying to sell emotionally. I think you have to be somewhat like for me, I like being vested in my songs and maybe that's why I don't have a largely top 40 successful career is because I refuse to let other people write my music for me or because I sound like

the rock eater from the never-ending story sometimes. Hey. Hey. But it's certainly not because there's YouTube videos of you screaming out your exes because that's fucking rad. Yeah. I'll have to, I'll look it up and see if it still exist. But it existed as of a couple years ago.

And it was, it's dark. I'm going to go ahead and warn you when I send it to you. It's... Well, I know your backstory. Yeah, I didn't hear that. I didn't hear that story and think that's who you are or anything. I was just like, yeah, but, you know... I went through some shit.

I went through some shit. I got fucking choke slammed a few times. Hey, BJ, we will put this out next week. Go ahead and plug your dates and what you got going on otherwise if you want to, brother. Killer. We're doing a quick tour in March through the South. And then in June, we have a new record coming out called Chickama Comico. We'll be doing a nationwide.

tour, a tour of Europe, tour of Australia if everything goes through. But we'll be on the road pretty much till the end of the year, starting in June with the new record. So, yeah, just Americanacquarium.com. We're on all the socials except for things that

30-year-old shouldn't be on. So, yeah, check us out on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter. Hey, I know what you're saying, but you should get on TikTok because the kids love music, dude. They fucking love it. You don't have to scroll. You just post. Um, all right. I'm going to convince you to get on TikTok eventually.

You are going to be... Ask the mountain goats if you should get on TikTok. Oh, Jesus. I've seen that blow up pretty big. Yeah. I've had a bunch of proponents tell me about it. And the Gen Z loves country, dude, and they crave authenticity and all that stuff. You don't have to message them or anything, BJ.

Just put your music up. Or even do it. Just have your wife do it for you. Just make her sit the account up. Yeah, just don't sue me when I put your music up. And I'll my shit up. dude. And by the way, I'll be opening for BJ in Australia. I can't wait

for that. You are going to be at the Bijou Theater five days after us. I'm supposed to go to Knoxville and see my family leading up to the show. I am strongly considering flip-flopping those and seeing you at what is probably my

favorite music venue because of nostalgia and how good it is in the world. Anybody got anything? Any more closing thoughts? I love Pam Tillis. Pam, I would die for you. me too i got one thing b jay nice to meet you i've never met you for me too as well yeah uh i really want to hear the song or the recording where you mentioned the horror apple falling from the hore tree i'll see if i can whatever that was i'll see if i can dig that youtube up like uh i was

i was riding pretty high on fucking blowin jameson that night so you'll have that And William Jameson, I promised the fan something we got to deliver. Can you please tell your great, do you have time to tell your Greg Gerardo story? Yeah, I can tell my Greg Gerardo story. So this is three weeks before Greg Gerardo dies. He's in Raleigh, North Carolina. I'm sitting at my favorite watering hole, which is a place called Slims. Landlock Nights down at Slims.

Landlock Nights. And we're sitting at the bar and this guy walks in and he's a huge, overgrown beard. almost homeless looking, walks in, sits beside the bar, orders a drink. And I looked at him and I was joking. And I said, man, has anybody ever told you you look like Greg Geraldo?

Like a homeless Greg Gerardo? And he said, I am Greg Gerardo. And I said, bullshit. And he's like, yeah, I'm playing Charlie Goodnights for the next five nights.

I'm just in town. Do you know where I can get some blow? Just like right like that? Yeah. And I was like, I was like, I was like, yeah. And like he asked for like a large, like a unhealthy, like you might die from this amount of blow in three weeks kind of look on his face.

Yeah. BJ Gil, Greg Gerald. I did not aid in the health of that man. So we went to an ATM. He pulled it out. We did copious amounts of drugs that night. And then we were talking about what I do for a living. I'm a musician.

He's like, well, when are you playing again? I was like, well, I'm actually doing like a benefit cover set tomorrow night. we're doing the entire we're doing springsteen's born to run from start to finish the whole record and he's like Bruce Springsteen's like my favorite artist he's like I'm gonna be there I was like bullshit and he's like no seriously here's my ID you can have my ID so he gave me his ID like his driver's license let's say that's a coke move I'm just a stranger my ID this will work and so his handler was like obviously like the person with good nights was like this is a horrible idea you shouldn't do this He's like, I'm going to his show tomorrow night.

I'll just get my ID back at the show. There's nothing I need an ID for before the show. And so sure enough, like I put Greg's, you know, ID in my wallet and put it in my pocket. And I think I'm never going to see this man again. This is going to be a really great story. And sure is shit, like the next night we're going on at like 11 o'clock. And he walks up to the front. And he's like, hey, I need my ID to get a drink at the bar.

And I was like, holy shit. It's like to bring this in, like as soon as I realized it was Greg Droddle, I called my entire band. Because we were huge. Because when you're doing, when you're in a band and you're driving overnight, eight, nine hours, stand-up comedy is the greatest thing in the world for not falling asleep. And we do the opposite. We listen to you. Man, there's something about comedy that like makes me listen to every single line and you can't get,

there's not, there's a rhythm, obviously, but there's not like a musical rhythm that can low you. there's this like you're waiting to see what's next and like this is the early mid 2000s like 2008 2009 when it's Patten Oswald and David Cross and Brian Passain and Greg Gerard like some like really well I guess what are legends now they were just really like edgy funny comedians that told really fucked up jokes and so the whole band came and we literally sat in if you've ever been to Slims in Raleigh they used to have this they had a pisser and then they had this giant toilet that was way too big for just one toilet. It was almost made for like six guys to stand in the circle around the toilet and pass

around drugs and do without anybody. It was almost like this toilet was made for drug use. Yeah. Yeah. So obviously the greatest, and not the greatest, but like this is, you got to think, you know, you're talking to someone who is almost eight years in recovery. So this is a different human being than I am now. But it was, like, he didn't use.

keys. He just dumped it on his hand and put it up to everybody's face. Unboy, yeah. And it was just like, it wasn't like doing, I've got an idea of how wild that is. It wasn't like doing like a couple key bumps for fun. It was like, we're getting fucking demolished tonight. Right, right. And so we did that. And then he came to our show. And we, we afterwards, we went to Slims and did the same exact thing. Went to the ATM, called the guys, got really fucked up. And then he was like, hey, I've got two more nights at good nights. Every night, sold out, I want you guys to come to the VIP, bring your

friends. So he gave us that little, you guys know the VIP thing up at Charlie Goodnights. It's not there anymore because they've moved, but yeah. Yeah, it's not a comedy club. Well, I guess it's in Kerry now, maybe. But, no, it's still, anyway, go ahead. I know it's not where it used to be. Where the events took place.

But he literally came and like, just talked so much, like, talk shit about everybody in the audience, but was like, American Aquarium's Best Band in Raleigh, fuck all if you don't know who they are. It was like this really awesome moment. And then so the next time I was in New York, which was like a week later,

we were playing Arlene's grocery. He came to our Arlene's grocery show. We went and saw him at a comedy club. It was like a downstate, like a cellar. You have to go downstairs. Was it actually called it, was it the seller?

It might be the seller. Or black cat or was it black pussycat? Yeah, fat black pussycat. It was the cellar. It was very on the nose. what it was. We were going down into a place. Yeah. And we went and saw his set and hung out with him in New York, did the same stupid shit. And then like two weeks later, or a week later, two weeks later, we get the phone call.

And, you know, I've still got voicemails on my phone from Greg Geraldo saying, like, great show last night. Like, I've still got his number saved. And this was, you know, a decade ago. Right. And I remember we were all just gutted because not only was he one of our favorite comedians. we also had this like really fun time. Like we had this experience with like one of the fun, like one of the people that have made me laugh the most in my entire life. And we got to, you know, you hear that story about meeting your idols and never wanting to do it because, you know, they'll ruin it.

They did not ruin it. Like it lived up to, because in my head I was like, he's just a fucking whiskey-fueled Cokehead who is hilarious. And then you meet him, you're like, holy shit, he is a whiskey field Coke. Yeah. It would have been more impressive if he wasn't. But he was living out those songs. Yeah, he was, man, it was, it was so great because like we got, we got four of the five nights when he was in Raleigh of just kind of untethered access to what I consider one of the funniest people I've ever listened to.

And we went to, so he did two sets a night. So he did the early set, the late set for five, so ten sets. And we got to see four of them. and they were all completely different, didn't do any of the jokes off of the specials, and most of his jokes, you could tell, were just immediately crowd reaction. Somebody said something stupid.

He riffs on that until somebody else says something stupid. It was watching an artist. It was watching someone who was so good at what they did that for an hour and a half, they could get up there and just make fun of people, and people felt like they got their $40 worth or $50 worth. and it was drugs and booze aside it was truly inspiring to watch someone that good at their game like like it was it was pretty special and then obviously when we lost them it was you know i want to

say like what is it patten oswald tweeted out like why couldn't you have taken dane cook or something like that it was like god could have took dane cook and he took gregg geralda and uh it was it was It was really special. And like, you know, it was all because I was a whiskey-fueled co-cad who happened to be at a bar at the same night. A like-minded individual walked in and asked where he could find some blow. Blow dogs. Yeah. If you don't know, if you're not familiar with Greg Gerardo, look up his stuff, find his roast clips on the internet.

I loved watching him roast. And I know a lot of comedians wouldn't want to hear that. They want people to watch their jokes. But I think what he did on the Comedy Central roast was as close to. art as you can do on those roads. Other than maybe Patrice, he went harder than anybody. You could tell he did not care if someone was going to ruin his career after that, maybe because he knew he was going to die with American Aquarium in a bathroom. But still, look him up. Great, great comedian.

Yeah, lawyer turned comedian. You might know something about that. I don't know anything about that. I don't know drugs either. All right. This has been Bubba shut the podcast. Thanks to everybody. Love you guys. Thanks for having me all. Love you, brother. Thank you, man.