We're All Insane - Dove in a Lake and Broke My Neck

Episode Date: July 19, 2026

At 20 years old, Zach Cheremski dove into a lake he'd grown up on and instantly became paralyzed from the neck down. In this episode, Zach shares the moments leading up to the accident, what it was like to survive a catastrophic spinal cord injury, and the physical and emotional challenges that followed. He reflects on resilience, hope, and how one split-second decision changed the course of his life forever. Check Out Zackary:  → https://x.com/Geodezics Topics Discussed: → Surviving a life-changing diving accident → Living with a spinal cord injury and quadriplegia → The physical and emotional challenges of recovery → Navigating addiction, chronic pain, and healing → Finding purpose, resilience, and hope after trauma On This Episode We Cover:  → 00:00:00 - Introduction  → 00:01:20 - Why did they decide to go night swimming? → 00:04:29 - What was going through his mind while trapped underwater? → 00:05:26 - How was he finally rescued? → 00:11:26 - What happened after he arrived at the hospital? → 00:18:38 - Who helped his family find hope during the darkest days? → 00:20:20 - What unexpected complications happened after the accident? → 00:23:30 - Why did he ask to "pull the plug"? → 00:27:38 - How did the support of others change his mindset? → 00:36:50 - Which unexpected visitor gave him hope? → 00:41:46 - What was recovery in the ICU really like? → 00:52:12 - How did pain medication become another battle? → 01:01:48 - What was it like returning to college after paralysis? → 01:13:20 - Why was going home harder than the hospital? → 01:16:42 - Did the hallucinations change the way he saw life? → 01:20:00 - Why did he question what was real after the accident? → 01:35:20 - How did he finally overcome addiction? → 01:51:20 - What does healing really look like after surviving trauma? → 01:57:45 - What message does he hope others take away from his story? → 02:01:10 - How has this experience changed the way he lives today? Show links: → Hung From a Power Line By My Leg for an Hour More We Are All Insane!  - OFFICIAL MERCH NOW AVAILABLE - code INSANE10 gets you 10% off for a limited time - Join We’re All Insane Mailing List for EXCLUSIVE Content + Discounts  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Don't worry, we get it. Every $20 ticket could win you $3,000 a month for life and supports life-saving cancer research at the Princess Margaret. Feel free to buy your payday for life ticket today. Raffle number 155-214. Please play responsibly. My name is Zach. I'm 36 years old from Chicago. I'm here to tell a story of a neck injury I had about just over 15 years ago.

I dove into a shallow part of a lake at 1 o'clock a.m. when I was 20 years old. Just after my sophomore year of college, I was with my brother, a lot of our friends. When I dove in, I was immediately paralyzed from the neck down. I remain conscious of the entire experience, well, at least until I got into the ambulance. But as I was underwater, I fully was aware of what was happening. Obviously, I wasn't able to surface. I was completely helpless. It was, like I said, 1 o'clock in the morning.

So pitch dark, everyone was drinking. I wasn't, thankfully. But I pretty much had given up hope that anyone would be. able to locate me. There wasn't any way for me to like signal anyone. Pitch black, I'm assuming, right? I'm sorry? It was pitch black outside of my swimming. Yeah. And actually it was, there were storms coming in. It was already kind of like there's lightning in the sky, but someone had the idea, hey, let's go night swimming. We are at my brother's girlfriend's house at the time. And her dock was like at the bottom of a hill. So like the main house was not far, but out of like shouting

distance. There were only a few of us actually down on the dock. I had actually just gotten there. And it was late in the night, but at 20 years old, it was still pretty early, you know, like fully intending to like start drinking at some point that night. We were up there for, there's like a country music festival that was pretty big in the area in south-eastern Wisconsin. We would go to every year. So you were not in your hometown. No. Okay. Yeah. Our family has a house on the same lake or across the street from the lake, but I grew up on that lake. I taught sailing school on the lake, learned how to water ski there, spent all my summers there. I worked. So you were familiar with the lake in the area, and you had obviously been in it plenty of times. Yeah. And actually, our dock was maybe 100 yards from the one I dove off of that night. I didn't do anything differently. It's just that little difference in. depth made all the difference in the world.

Yeah. And it was myself, one of my best friends, Jake, my brother's girlfriend, and maybe a couple other people that were down there initially at least to just jump in, like cool off. You know, and then we had the whole weekend to look forward to with the concert. And there was probably 30 of us up there from, mainly from our high school. And my brother's girlfriend, she went to high school with us. She was a year in between us. So my brother's two years younger.

She was in the year between. So our friend groups kind of blended together. And that's what we were doing all summer. It was just during the week, like I had a painting job, make some extra cash for the semester coming up. And then we just do teenager things like all weekend. So my parents weren't up there at the time because this was a Thursday night. So we went up a little bit early for this concert specifically. So myself, my brother and a couple of our friends just crashing at our family's place.

No adult supervision there. There were adults at the house we were at, though. And it wasn't like they, like, facilitated or like, you know, like, I mean, I'm sure they were aware, but like not really what, like, what was going on. It was just a different kind of lifestyle up there. It was kind of like, you know, Wisconsin, like nothing bad could happen. Nothing bad ever did happen. And that was kind of like the event that broke that illusion in more ways than one. So when I dove in, like I said, I'd given up pretty much all hope.

It wasn't like how you hear about it in the movies where like your life flashes before your eyes. You don't like think about like you're at least myself. Like I wasn't like thinking about like my loved ones or like regrets or is like very peaceful surprisingly. I was, it just felt like that was what was supposed to happen. Do you think you were going to die? I did, yeah, for sure. And I remember thinking, for some reason, I was aware that, you know, when you drown, it's not because necessarily you can't breathe.

It's because when you do try to breathe, you inhale all the water in your lungs. And that's what is like, you know, what ends up killing you. And so I was trying as hard as I could to not do that, but knew my time was running out. And apparently what happened was, at least this is the story. I don't know how true this is because I don't even see how it's possible. But I bit Lindsay's leg. Lindsay was my brother's girlfriend. And she thought I was like flirting or, I don't know, like playing around.

And then realized I wasn't responding at all. I was face down in the water. She flipped me over, brought me above, and, you know, screamed for help. Was she the only one in the water at that time? I think so. There might have been one or two others, but there were only a handful of us down there at the time. So she screamed for help. Her brothers, her older brothers ran down.

They pulled me out, put me on the dock. You know, obviously everyone else came running down. and I was just laying flat, like, kind of thinking, like, I was in shock, and that was the reason I couldn't move. And it quickly became apparent. Like, it was a much bigger issue than that just based on the reactions of everyone around me. You know, it's like, obviously, like, call 911, like, get Lindsay's parents. Like, you know, my brother came down. I actually don't have like a specific memory of him being there, which obviously I know he was there.

He's the one who had to make the phone call to my parents who were in Chicago, you know, about an hour and a half away at close to two o'clock in the morning, which it took me longer than it should have to tell him. But that was the hardest job anyone had that night. You know, I was kind of just there, like trying to survive. but there's nothing for me to do other than that. I can't imagine having to have had made that call. Being on the receiving end of, like, especially my dad, like, I can't imagine what his reaction was over the phone. That was, would have just, that would have broke me.

And, you know, I'm sure it's had a lasting effect on him. And it wasn't until, like, maybe a year ago, I finally told him that. And when the parents were, Maddox got there. It took them a long time because we were kind of in rural Wisconsin and we were at the bottom of a hill that had like a narrow staircase so they had to like come down the actual hill with the stretcher and I was lying there. I couldn't feel anything and at that point it started to rain. I saw an umbrella holding over me which was I think my buddy Jake and I was like I could still talk actually and like one of my diaphragms was still working for some miraculous reason and so I could still

breathe one girl I think tried to administer CPR but I was like I can still breathe like I think I'm just in shock like this is going to be fine but then I saw the umbrella I'm like what's that for like like and it was pouring rain and I couldn't feel anything and that's when I was like oh no like if I can't feel anything, like not moving, like maybe that's just me being in shock, but like if I can't feel anything, like this is bad. Were you in pain at all? No pain. Not at that point.

So when that happened and I couldn't feel the rain, I really started to almost get embarrassed more than worried. Like, I, like, ruined the party. Like, the weekend was ruined. And that was, like, the biggest sin you could commit as a 20-year-old. Like, it felt like I didn't want the attention. I just wanted to go back underwater. It felt like that's where I was supposed to be. And I was almost angry at being saved. It felt like I want, like I was, we were just delaying the inevitable. Like, I wasn't going to survive this. Like, the paramedics, like, were taking a long time to get there. I just felt like it was just a matter of time. And I was okay with that, which I would have never expected. I don't know if it was like the rush of like the like the DMT rush you get

when you're close to death or some other, like, chemical process in the body that, like, made me okay with it. But I really just wanted it all to be over. And when the paramedics finally got there, they loaded me on the stretcher. My uncle who lived nearby showed up at the request with my dad because they were an hour, at least an hour away. My parents were split up. So it was actually two separate calls. My brother had to make. My dad rushed up.

His stepdaughter's boyfriend drove him. And my dad just had a bottle of vodka in the passenger seat all the way up. My mom, she was living on her own. So she had to make that track herself. And like I said, like everyone around me had a much more difficult

job than me in that moment and probably in some ways a more traumatic experience that night. Once I got loaded onto the stretcher, the paramedics were trying to encourage me to stay awake. I was drifting off a little bit and that's what kind of led to me thinking like, all right, I'm going to slip away at any point and this will all be over and that's okay. like the party will go on without me and I won't have to worry about anything anymore. But when I finally got up to the ambulance, you know, my brother wanted to get in. Paramedic said no. So he got in a car with my uncle.

They followed. And one of the last things I remember that night was the, I asked the paramedic, like, is it okay to sleep now? And he said, yeah, we got you. you can rest. And I thought that was the last time I would have my eyes open. So being in rural Wisconsin, there weren't many options as far as elite medical care. Or I was taken to like a rural emergency room. And I did come back into consciousness at least once that night. Now there were more people around other aunts and uncles that lived somewhat in the area.

They made it there before my parents. I remember opening my eyes in the emergency room, you know, chaos, like, doctors, everything. But my brother was there. He was not as distraught as I would have expected, which gave me comfort, just like, you know, that he was able to, like, be there and watch that, which, like, I wouldn't be able to do. I was like, okay, we can, maybe we're making progress. Like, maybe this is something that can be fixed. But that's when the pain, like the actual physical pain started to set in.

And actually it was more just like a soreness. I think like me, like laying flat on my back the entire time. This was several hours in. And, you know, I couldn't reposition myself naturally. So like, I just remember my glute was like super sore, probably from so much pressure being on it consistently. And I asked my aunt to just like rub like that part like because it was like that was like the biggest point of discomfort for me. We're still waiting for my parents to arrive. My brother, my other brother, a lot of people coming up from Chicago.

And they wanted to airlift me to Milwaukee, a hospital called the freighter. It's actually one of the top spinal cord surgery centers in the country. the storms made that impossible so i was put into another ambulance driven there my dad showed up at that emergency room before so immediately had to leave again to milwaukee which was at least another hour away and it was it wasn't just a storm it was a really really bad rain event and then them having to do that it was it almost felt i can imagine at least like biblical like was just like the storm's coming down and like it's just probably felt almost destined like to happen that night it's like there's a storm happening in more ways than one at least in our lives and

we finally made it to Milwaukee the first thing I remember there was I woke up in the late afternoon. My mom was there. I could still talk. I wasn't shaked yet, but I was like, I forgot what it was called, but like the oxygen was being delivered through my nasal cavity. And more my friends were there and my friends from college. He lived right outside Milwaukee.

So he came and I remember him specifically walking like into the hospital room door and just he went white. You know, like it was like he knew what to expect but didn't. And he walked in but then like stood behind my hospital bed. And obviously I couldn't see myself the condition that I was in. You know, like tubes coming out. My friend Jake actually took a picture like of me that more. morning, which I didn't see until years later. And he's like, I don't know why I took this picture, like, but I have it. And I was like, I want to see it. And I'm very glad he took that

picture because it was, it gave me a sense of what everyone was looking at and helped me relate to their experience a little bit more. And anyway, like that when my friend Ben did that, I, that was like another sign that I was in rough shape. And at this point, did they tell you that you were paralyzed yet? Oh, yeah. Did they give you any information? Yeah. I think the ER was especially lacking optimism.

You know, it wasn't really their specialty to know, but it's kind of like he has a broken neck. Like we can see it on the x-rays or the cat scans. Like, he's not going to walk again. I think my injury level was C3, which usually means death, like instant death. Walking again was out of the question. Surviving was very much in doubt. And when we were in the hospital at Freighter, I got there now was Friday, and it was kind of just a lot of waiting around now. There was a lot of water in my lungs, which caused infections.

They obviously had me pretty sedated. They started me on fentanyl. At that time, they were using dopamine IVs for trauma patients to spike blood pressure so that your heart rate stays elevated and you don't. you basically just survive. I think there's a different type of drug they use for it now, but I just found out I requested all my medical records a few months ago to just kind of try to figure out, like,

what are all the drugs that I was on? I knew about the fentanyl, obviously. That was a year of fentanyl, hydromorphone, the Tramidol, hydrocodone, a whole ton of benzodiazepines, the worst of which is a drug called Versailles. said that they basically just give you, it's like a really powerful Xanax, but it is really just meant to make you not remember what's happening from the traumatic experience.

And that was, that drug I did not like, obviously the fentanyl, I liked a lot. That was, yeah, I was on a dose that was really not like. oh, like, he's in pain. Like, we need to give him something to help with that. It was, let's make him comfortable, like, for these, like, last couple days or whatever, last couple hours. And I guess the next steps weren't really known to anyone yet. Was it worth doing, like, a surgery that I know now costs close to a million dollars?

Wow. And it was the weekend, the top surgeons weren't even on. staff. So there was a nurse, though, that was with me for most of the time I was in the ICU, at least she's the one I remember the most. And she went above and beyond, not just with me. I guess more importantly, she went out of her way to help my family through it. And I never really appreciated it. But just because I didn't remember it. or it was more like helpful to like my family and I finally reconnected with her actually a few weeks ago because just in preparation of kind of like coming here I wanted to like fill in some gaps

but more importantly just say thank you because nurses like I've had a lot of bad ones but there's a few very very good ones and being able to act in a way that you're not only doing your job, but you're making people comfortable in a time where that's almost impossible, just offering reassurance. She works with those types of patients every day. So, you know, she had seen it all. And while the outlook might not have been good, there was at least a little bit of hope, which was something for everyone to hold on to. But as we went through the weekend, there was, like I had a stroke. They found out actually what happened was...

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And my spinal cord was essentially like, very, very badly bruised on one side. I was still paralyzed my neck down on both sides of my body, but when the vertebrae is exploded outwards, it severed arteries in my neck, which caused a stroke, at least one stroke. And that was another point where I flatline. They wanted, I think, to do the surgery at that point, but it was really, it was my option, like, because the other option would have been, you know, have a halo for six months or however long it was. And I don't remember picking or choosing, but I guess I said surgery. And I know the odds weren't great.

There was experimental technology at that time being used, which is basically like a live MRI. So with a halo, would they still have needed to do surgery with that? No. Actually, what the surgery was, they fuse my spinal. column back together. Okay. And they cut out a piece of my hip to rebuild my spinal column with that bone. And there's like a tiny, tiny bit of metal.

But it's like my spinal column was actually rebuilt from a piece of my pelvis that they cut out. Gotcha. Now did they say to you if you did the halo, you definitely would never walk again. But if you did surgery, there was a chance or with both they were like, probably not. The surgery definitely gave me better odds. Okay. But it was also, it was kind of just like you like, you had like, like, you had like like, you have to do one or the other, like you're not going to walk.

This isn't going to help you walk again, but we can't leave your spinal column exposed, like your spinal cord exposed like that. It's like the halo is essentially like a cast where like the bone tissue would, you know, heal around it, not perfectly, but it would be something to just provide a little bit of protection, you know, it was, the prognosis was still quadriplegia for life. But anyways, I guess I chose the surgery. I remember being, like, rolled out of the ICU, like, towards the surgery center. And it was kind of like, and this could have all been entirely a hallucination.

And that's what's kind of so difficult about this is separating that from the reality of what happened. But, you know, everyone was, like, lined in the hallways, kind of, like, cheering me on. But, again, like, I don't know how accurate. It could have been a couple people. It could have literally been everyone from. my high school, college, and extended family, I'm sure it was a lot of people. I had a lot of support, and that's the only reason I made it through. I would have given up. I had memories asking Amy, my nurse, if, like, she would, you know, quote-unquote pull the plug. Like,

there's no value in this. Like, I'm staring at the ceiling. I can't live the rest of my life like this like I can see the anguish on everyone's face like I don't want to be a burden on them for the rest of their lives it'll just be so much easier if like I'm just out of the equation and looking back on that now is very short-sighted but obviously I was not thinking with a clear mind and when I went into surgery the doctor his name was Dr. Wolflaw he was one of the top surgeons in the country, was using this new technology, at least at that time. And I guess he had like a little bit of optimism going in, like in the conversations that him and his team had with my parents. You know, he was kind of like, oh, this is a Monday for me.

Like, yeah, I'll go in there and fix it. Like, I don't know. Like, it could go well. It could not. Like, we'll see. Like, it was supposed to be, I think, a couple hours. it ended up being like six. And how many days after the accident was the surgery taking place?

The surgery was on a Monday. And so it was like three or four days. And that was one of the things I was having trouble figuring out. And when I talked to Amy, she was able to pull up the exact day because when I got all these medical records, it was kind of scattered, you know, coming from 2010. Like they gave me anesthesia. The first day I was there, but then several pages later, I saw it was stopped and canceled. So they must have thought they were going to do the surgery and stopped, maybe because I think that might have been like when the stroke happened. And they were like, okay, like we can't go in there yet.

Like, he's not stable. And then Amy said it was mostly a function of just that's one the best surgeon was available. And there's no reason to do it right away. So with the surgery being on a Monday, ended up going like six hours and everyone was just, you know, waiting and praying. I remember seeing like my brother's Facebook posts, like when I went into the surgery, I couldn't tell you like verbatim what exactly it said. But, you know, just like, you know, you got this. And that was kind of like in the primitive days of social media. So everything kind of got put on there, which was good and bad.

add. I don't really have anything on social media these days. I've come to find that not really productive in life, but that's just me. And but like looking back on all the support I was getting, like having the records of that was kind of surreal to like see almost in real time like everyone's reaction. is one of my best friends, Peter, he wasn't with us that night. He was at the University of Illinois, stayed there over the summer, and he was getting mixed messages from everybody that was actually at that party that night, like, of what exactly happened.

Obviously, like, wasn't talking directly to my brother, because my brother was talking to my family, and he was just, like, he had a feed on his side, Facebook page. Like, he, he was messaging me directly, like, posting on my page. Like, where are you? What's happening? Please be okay.

Please be okay. And just seeing how, like, the word of everything, like, traverse through cyberspace. All my college friends who obviously, like, they were scattered all over the country for the summer. People I would have never expected were, you know, expressing concerns, saying prayers. You know, like, they were in my fraternity, but, you know, not, like, people I hung out with every day or even regularly at all. And seeing that, you know, weeks later was so beneficial, just knowing that I really couldn't let go

because that would be worse than taking myself out of the equation, unlike what I had previously thought. And that became my main driving force was like if I'm not going to like at least try to survive for myself, I have to do it for them. Like I can't just be a bad memory for all these people. Everyone like, like they tried to hide it like but there's just no possible way you could. Like I could just like see the despair. It was demoralizing. But, motivating at the same time and still not being able to react like physically in any sort of way my voice it was starting to go because I had strep throat as a result of just like all the bacteria that was in my lungs which was very uncomfortable actually probably the most

uncomfortable part of those first few weeks I was on plenty of painkillers to numb the pain in my neck and like the stiffness in my body, muscle relaxers, antidepressants, anti-anxiety meds. Like I was loaded up in that sense. But for a strep throat, you know, like usually I would drink tea, you know, have NyQuil, but sleeping wasn't really something that was possible. Like I would fall asleep for maybe an hour at a time. But there was, you know, doctors coming to do tests, the noises of machines, beeping and blaring,

all around me, but it was also my only form of escape. And that's why the surgery took longer than expected was, like they made an incision in the front of my neck at first, like a very, like almost dime size, did the repair that way from like that side. And then you're like strapped to the table and they like flip you over. And when they did that, it was like the surgeon said like, the whole lake came out of me like it just you know empty out of my lungs so lindsay got to me

just in time because i definitely inhaled a lot of water and was probably seconds away from drowning and not recovering but that's what caused the strep throat and i even told amy this like that was the most uncomfortable part of for me at the beginning because all i wanted to do was drink something even if like not tea or something soothing like it was just like so dry and scratchy and my ears hurt and i just couldn't find a moment of peace even with the painkillers is at that point they did do the trache which was an incision like right in the front of your uh like what this is called esophagus throat yeah like right in the front of the throat it was called the tracheotomy and they cut a hole put in like a breathing tube and like that's where you see like you know the thick tube coming in

and that's something that quite most quadriplegics have for life yeah because if your muscles aren't working below the point of your injury there's nothing to move your diaphragms in and out so I thought that was going to be a forever thing and the surgeon who did that was a different surgeon and I guess I like this was the last point where I could talk Because once you have the trache and you can't talk, but I didn't want to do it. I was like, one surgery was enough. And I knew what that meant. Like, that's like going to be in there forever.

And the surgeon, he was actually like very calm, relaxed and just almost encouraging because he was a veteran of the army or Marines. and he's like, he said, I used to do this with a broken pen to my buddies who were just shot, like, in the middle of the desert, like, you are going to be just fine. Like, don't worry about it. So I went into surgery for that, and that was, you know, another large expense on the medical bill, but after that point, I couldn't talk. And my only way of communicating.

was through like a board that, you know, my mom or someone else would hold up with just the alphabet on it. And they'd run their finger across and if whatever I need to say started with an F. Like, I would blink or nod like when they got there and then you started over and have to spell out the whole word. That was super frustrating. How long did you have to do that for? that was the entire time I was in Milwaukee so about two months as I was in the ICU at Milwaukee for six weeks maybe five weeks and then like three weeks and like the rehab wing and but yeah going back to that board I guess like one time I spelled out like when my mom was trying to do it like

you suck at this because she's like without like she'd stop on the wrong letter and like couldn't like figure out what I was trying to say but nobody could be good at that like that like did he blink did you not blink like did you mean to blink right there like that was seems like way too primitive even for that time for 2010 like there had to have been a better way I'm sure they have a better way now at least I hope they do but there's also no space bar so all the words would blend together and like I always joke like I really wanted this they'd always ask me like what movies I wanted to see and I was like I want to see despicable me but there's no space bar so it's like they're trying to find me a French film like despic displic about Blame or something is like just a very

tedious process and but that's like how everything was I couldn't communicate in any meaningful way couldn't gesture couldn't verbalize couldn't express anything of what I was feeling how I was feeling and as the people like came in and out I almost started to find comfort in that because then I could just lay there and it wasn't like I had to give any feedback to like so many people came out of the woodworks which I'm appreciative of but like there's some people are just like I don't want to talk to you right now like I don't want you to see me in this condition you know we haven't talked in years like but I get it like you know you want to come show your support and I was like

always very shy and never really said much, like, growing up. So I was like, maybe there's an upside to this. Like, I can, I can just be a little bit more reserved and people won't, like, say anything about it. They can't. And my teacher has always said, like, growing up, He's a good student, but he never says anything. So that part almost fit my personality a little bit better and was still frustrating at the same time. But as people were coming in and out, like some people that I didn't want to be there, You know, like, maybe, like, my dad's, like, business associates or, like, like, it's kind of like, they're more so here for him or, you know, like, my mom's friends or, you know, my brother's friends, like, people that I didn't know. It's like, you know, you're very vulnerable in that spot.

And then you realize, like, they're not here for me. They're here for them, which is just as important. There's actually like the people you least expect that have the biggest impact is I had, we called him an uncle growing up. It wasn't really my uncle, but was definitely in my life a lot more when I was younger than at that point. And he was in a very bad motorcycle accident, maybe a year prior or maybe a little bit longer. other than that, but he was in rough shape. He, you know, maybe in his 50s at the time, wasn't paralyzed. I think, like, he just, like, shattered both of his legs.

Doctors sold him the same thing. Like, dude, you're in your 50s, like, you're never going to walk again. Like, there's just no way. But he got through it, was able to walk. It took a long time. But he was the one person who came into the hospital room, I remember. And he had like a huge smile on his face. And that was one of the most powerful things.

Because as I said, like everyone was just sad. And while that had a motivating effect, it also just like created an environment that like didn't really foster hope. And when he came in, like he just stood at the foot of my bed. And he's like grinning ear to ear, at least that's how I remember it. And he's like, you're gonna get through this. He's like, you're 20 years old. You're in the prime of your life. Like, you know, at that time I was working out twice a day, like,

by far in the best shape of my life, lifting, running. And he's like, if I could get through what I went through, he's like, you get through this. Like, you don't have anything to be worried about. about, and I was like, oh my God, that's like a really good point. And I like, obviously I couldn't respond to it at that time. And it wasn't until I think at my cousin's wedding, like, it was during COVID. So a few years ago.

And I, you know, finally told him, I was like, that had a huge impact. And I don't, like, you probably don't remember it. But that was one of the most beneficial things that anyone, ever did. And that's somebody who like could very easily just made the decision like I don't need to go. Like yeah. Like we weren't super close at that time and there was no reason for him too. But when you got out of the surgeries, did they have hope that you would walk again still now? It was just like it just simply rehab and recovery at that point. Yeah. So I was in the ICU for about five weeks and it was about maybe three weeks before, you know, I could like have like slight voluntary

movements in my right fingers. And that was like the first sign of hope. But it's also kind of hard to measure like how much of that is like auto reflexes and just kind of like almost like a signal like trying to get through that like can't. And it's just like, kind of like spazzing out like your muscles and I couldn't really communicate like that oh yeah that's me trying to do that okay gotcha and I don't fully remember the first time like being able to move my right hand but my goal at the time was I just want to be able to change the channel myself because that's all I had to do was just watch TV endlessly movies TV shows and what I actually found to be the most therapeutic was music.

And it was a friend of mine, another friend who we weren't incredibly close, but knew I loved at the time this band OAR. He brought in some of their albums, just put them on. And that I just found like super peaceful. And they actually, someone in my family reached out to them. They sent me like a whole like, signed poster that with like a note like they wrote me personally I had it all framed and actually exactly a year after the date of my injury our basement flooded and it got ruined but god at least you

had it yeah it was very cool to see that level of support from you know a group that I admired Mentally, where were you at during this stage of your recovery? In Toronto, every arrival is a statement, and nothing says it better than this. Cadillac Optic was the number one selling luxury EV in Canada for 2025. Find your rhythm across a seamless 33-inch display and an immersive 19 speaker AKG surround audio system. This city demands agility, and Optic delivers with precision to make every drive extraordinary. Let's take the Cadillac. Find out more at Cadillac Canada.ca.ca.

Luxury sales claim based on S&P Global Mobility Canadian New Vehicle Total Registrations for calendar year 2025 for the Cadillac definition of luxury. Whether life serves you an ace or an unexpected backhand, the high protein yogurt, Oikos Pro, is there to feed your strength and help you turn every challenge into a smash. Oikos Pro helps build strong muscles and support muscle recovery with high protein and contains no added sugar because true strength isn't about being able to take the hits. It's about being able to bounce back. OICOS Pro, feed your strength. Visit OICOS.C.C.A for more details. So while I was still in the ICU, I was heavily reliant on the fentanyl. And in order to move out of the ICU, you can't be on fentanyl.

Like, if you're going to a rehab wing, like, you can't be on that level of painkiller. if you're really trying to rehab and recover. So they started to like try to wean me off of it. Didn't take well to that at all. I just remember the rush of euphoria that I got, which some people debate me on because like even though it was a lot, it's not like street level like heroin. Like you're not like that's not the purpose of the drug.

So you wouldn't have felt like. such a high level of euphoria, but I remember that so specifically because, you know, I was on like a time drip. I think the dosage was like 100 micrograms, which is high for a hospital dose, but again, it's not like a street level dose, like that someone who would be abusing it. And I just remember like it would come in and you'd feel like your arm would get warm and it'd travel like down your toes first and like like your feet would literally be happy like and then and then you feel like circle back up and know it's like about to hit your brain and then it's just like snap and then like everything just like every problem concern it all just faded away which is a good reason like why you shouldn't be

on it if you're trying to recover right it just it's like oh like this is good enough for me I don't You don't have to deal with anything else. I don't have to walk again. As long as I feel like this, yeah, right. But that is also detrimental in the sense that, I mean, to this day, like, I know that's the happiest I'll ever be. Like, that having that drug is, I think just doing it once changes your brain chemistry forever. it's very almost surreal to know like the highest level of happiness I'll experience is while completely paralyzed only staring at ceiling tiles and just not being able to know at all

what my future or even tomorrow would hold but that drug just washed it all away And I loved it. I loved that drug. I said for a long time, I was like, everyone should try it once just for the experience. That's not a good idea. Don't do that. But at the time. Yeah.

But, yeah, they eventually made the decision like, okay, well, we can't take them off of it. Like, there was too many downsides. Like, I would withdraw. And, like, that doesn't help well either when you're recovering. if you're in withdrawal. So they would taper down the dosages and also the entire time I was on a patch. And it's like every 72 hours it was changed. And that would deliver an equivalent of, I think like an additional 50 micrograms every hour.

And that also would like taper down. But I didn't start tapering that down until I got out of the hospital. So I went home with that in all patches in addition to a whole bunch of other stuff. And yeah, that was, like, I remember friends asking me, like, do you need all, like, can I try one? I'm like, do not touch those. Like, those are mine. And like at the end of the 72 hours, I remember, like, you know, like the patch would like start to peel off. And I would just take it off and just like start licking it.

like didn't have any effect but it's just like kind of typical drug addict behavior and my dad took me to florida a few months after i got home from the hospital and he forgot to bring him with i wasn't happy with him and obviously it's not like you can't just like call wallgreens and we need more fentanyl patches so that was one of like the first times i realized like the effect that drug had on my mental state because when I didn't have the patches for like it took a day or two to get them and I was just in bed like terrible pain

but not even really like pain more just like discomfort like nausea and I think it was my little brother pointed out like we need to get you more fentanyl patches and I was like yeah dad's working on it but that's not what this. It's just like a side effect of whatever my injury is. Like the fentanyl patches aren't going to fix this. And that was just me being naive as to like what the whole opiate epidemic really was.

And I struggled with fentanyl a lot. Coming off of it was a very difficult experience. and actually it was like the week of my 21st birthday when I was still at home. But going back to the ICU, my mental state there, I really tried very hard to not think about the future. It was just very painful to try to do that with so much uncertainty. You know, growing up, you know, all the way up to the point of my injury, I never really had to think much about the future.

It was all kind of just, like, laid out for me. And I grew up in, you know, upper middle class household, like, got good grades, went to a good college, you know. It was all like, okay, you go to college, get a good degree, you get a good job. You meet a wife. You have kids, house, picket fence, like, just never really thought much about it. you're kind of just like on this track that that you never plan to deviate from and there was an illusion that like you were kind of owed that like that was something that's just supposed to happen and nothing terrible would ever happen growing up I didn't deal with much tragedy like my

parents split up, but I was maybe seven years old. I don't remember, I don't remember my parents ever living together. So that was just like, plus everyone's parents were divorced. Like growing up it was such a common thing. It's unfortunate. It happened so much. But my whole mindset on that was, I think it was good for us just because my mom and dad are so different people. And if they would stay together. One would have overpowered the other. But I feel like me and my brothers all got like a little bit of their good qualities and learned about their bad qualities and kind of were able to mix and match the best of both. I'm much more like my mom. I work with my dad, but I relate to my mom a whole lot more in the sense that we just enjoy peace and solitude.

My dad can't be alone for five minutes. Like he'll, and if he is, he's constantly calling, texting on Facebook. Like, and that's more like my little brother. But we both, and my older brother included, we all kind of learn together, like, what the good quality. of each of those types of personalities are. I'm not saying like we perfected it, but I think there's some people who should get divorced and my parents were one of them.

But yeah, other than that, like I had an aunt that passed away when, I think it was before the divorce. So I don't really remember that. She died super young, my mom's sister. And yeah, like, other than that,

it was all just like happy goals. lucky like you know there were sad times or like difficult situations but looking back at it it's all like minor high school drama shit or college drama like that just didn't matter and that that night is what kind of like broke that illusion not just for myself but I think for my friend group as a whole and it was actually like a few months later one of my good friends at the time he went back to the University of Missouri

and was just like in his dorm room leaned up against the window and it gave out fell like he was in real bad shape I think he fell three stories yeah and so like it was like all of a sudden

like the wheels are starting to come off like there are bad things that can happen in this world. Like, we've been living in kind of a bubble. And he went to the same high school I did. He was my brother's age, but he actually, we worked together the summer of my injury, so we were super close. And we had two very different experiences in recovery.

Obviously, my injury was a lot worse, but, you know, he got prescribed painkillers. and one day his doctor was like you don't need him anymore and he started to go through withdrawal he texted me a couple times do you have any spare hydrocodones i'm like do i like yeah and it's like even his mom like would call like offered to like pay me for them like oh he just needs like a couple to like get through the like the week or like they just like cut them off cold turkey and it he's not taking it well and it didn't

take long for him to be living on the streets buying heroin and now he lives out of the country now I think like he survived that I don't know honestly I don't know how he's doing now or if he's still alive but

because that's not an addiction that ever goes away but you know we tried reaching out to him and it's just you can't help people who don't want to help themselves. And my whole experience with that was the exact opposite. I could click a button. It was like when like the Walgreens app became a thing and like I had an app with my doctor, like request refill an hour later, get notification.

Your refill is ready at Walgreens. It was like my doctor had no problem just like prescribing me whatever. and however much I wanted, which maybe that was not the best thing to do, but at the same time, maybe it was. I don't think there's really a good way to come off of those painkillers. It's a very, very addictive feeling. And I took it completely upon myself to stop, like probably two years. on heavy painkillers.

It was like a year of fentanyl and then mostly hydrocodone after that, the norcos. But yeah, I'll definitely get into that. That's like kind of goes into when I returned to college. But going back to like when I was in the ICU and trying to get ready to move on away from that. There was like one friend to this day, the best friend I've ever had, were not in touch as much

as I'd like to be anymore, but for we actually did go to high school together, but weren't really friends. Like we see each other at parties maybe, but we both ended up going to Purdue and ended up becoming close there. He's the one who encouraged me to join the fraternity,

which I thought my only knowledge of fraternities at that time was like Animal House, American Pie. I'm like, that's not me. Like, I'm not going to join a fraternity. But he got me into that. Basically, oh, my entire college experience to him.

He was actually the first person I asked for when I woke up in the emergency room. I mentioned when my aunt was there with my brother. I was just like called Joe and him being like an early rise. I think he was like a wife. lifeguard that summer, like, was already awake and got the call, immediately drove up to Milwaukee.

And he's, you know, one of the ones who looked out for me, like, when I did end up going back to school. But for those first two years of college, we were, like, as close as any two people could be. And while I don't talk to or see him as much anymore, like, when I do see him, I do see him, It's like one of those things you pick up right where you left off. And it's just having people like that is the most important thing is I don't think many people do have that sort of relationship. It's also like me not being on social media.

For example, I saw him a couple months ago. He lives in Nashville now. He came back to Chicago. I saw him. I was like, oh, you have a kid now. And he's like, I have two kids. I was like, oh, my God, like, can I see pictures? And, you know, like, you show me the pictures and, like, you know, actually having a

genuine conversation where, like, I saw all the pictures on Facebook, you know, like, I'd have one eye on that and one eye on whatever game was on at the time. And it's just, like, the whole social media thing keeps us connected, but also disconnected at the same time. So at what point from when you were in rehab, did they start seeing, you know, that your recovery was going in the right direction, or did you really start seeing a difference when you went back home?

So, yeah, I finally got into the rehab wing, much smaller room, much smaller TV, kind of like a more, almost a more depressing setting because you don't have 24-7 care from the staff there. They kind of leave you alone a little bit more. And that's when, like, they tried to, like at least just sit me up like let's get him upright and like getting him used to like supporting his own body weight again and that was a miserable experience it wasn't pain i mean

there was pain but it was more like your blood pressure just plummet and it's like this nausea like it's like ringing in your ear like complete and utter disorientation and And I was like, no more. Like, we can't, like, this is, this is literal torture. Like, my grandfather was tortured, like, in World War II. I'm like, I'm pretty sure this is worse than whatever he went through. Like, it, it just felt, like, so pointless because I'm like, I'm never going to walk again. Like, just, like, get me in my, like,

quadriplegic chair. I don't need to support myself in that. So like, why are we doing this? It's just, just like, stop, please. Like, I want this to end. I want to go home. Like, I don't want to be here anymore. And it was, I remember, like, during the week, I had, like, a certain set of, there's both physical therapists and occupational therapists and respiratory therapists. Because you have to learn how to breathe on your own again. And every once in a while, they would, you know, take the trache out for 10 minutes. Like, let's see what happens. One time I flatlined. And the occupational therapists, they're more like, they try to, like, teach you how to, like, live again or like, in adaptive ways.

Which that felt pointless because, like, I can, like, maybe move my right arm a little bit at this point. And, like, I got, like, some, like, muscle function in my ankles, my calves on my right side only, my left side. completely nothing so and and one of my physical therapist actually coincidentally ended up being my pledge brother's mom was like oh you went to at Purdue like I produced up all in my room like do you know I can't remember his name Jason and it's like like and I probably to spell it out like pledge brother and so then like yeah small world and it wasn't until actually I had a different physical therapist on the weekend, like on a Saturday.

And I was, like, laying on a mat. And they would just kind of, you know, like, more or less, like, stretch me out, like, and, like, move my muscles and limbs in a way that, like, might trigger, like, my body to remember how to, like, activate that again. And he was doing it with my leg, just kind of, like, extending and bending my knee, like, while I was on my back. and he's like, I remember he's like, like, look like a motorcycle, like, biker dude. And he's like, hey, man, like, I can feel your glute firing.

He's like, it's not a lot, but like, your glute is definitely firing and it's voluntary. Like, he's like, you're going to walk again. I'm like, no. Like, like, why would you even put that in my head? And he was, I mean, extremely confident about it. because he's like if that's firing like i mean i guess just the way like your nerves circuits run like that's like a huge indicator that more is going to come back and once it's firing you can build it up and he's like i think you're going to walk again you know that brought like a huge amount of relief

to my parents and family i was still very much doubtful how am i going to walk which is just one side of my body. Guessing is for game shows, not your business. Workday is the enterprise AI platform for HR, finance, and IT, with AI grounded in your context to get work done and done right. It's a new work day. Ever feel like healthy eating is harder than it should be? I get it.

Nutrition can feel complicated, but it doesn't have to be. On Be Well by Kelly, I simplify the science of nutrition so you can feel better, balance your blood sugar, and build healthy habits that actually live. Last. Each week, I talk to leading experts, doctors, and researchers about practical ways to nourish your body and make wellness accessible in real life. Listen to Be Well by Kelly wherever you get your podcasts. New episodes every Wednesday. Yeah, he was the first one to express any sort of confidence that I might walk again. I still wasn't in that mindset. I couldn't think about that

possibility. In fact, I almost trained my brain to not think about the future. And that's something honestly I still struggle with to this day, just like acting in a way that like for the long term rather than the short term, it became just too painful, not even painful, just difficult to like try to think about the future. There's so much uncertainty. So it was like my whole mindset was let's just get through the day like do what the physical therapist tell me what the doctors tell me and if I can get through the end of the day

I'll be happy and that was my goal I was living day to day and I think in a way I still kind of am it's hard to undo that change in mindset especially with all the drugs I was on

and really up until recently I mean even the pot like smoking weed way more than I should have been. I didn't finally stop until just about a year ago. And I think I was carrying a lot of that addiction mentality, even though it was literally prescribed by doctors.

It was just more or less a cop-out or a different way to enter an altered state of mind and have something to look forward to. at the end of the day is every day. I mean, there's still something I deal with. Like, waking up in the morning is, you know, still hard. Most days I still, like, one of the first things I think about is our painkillers. Like, why did I give those up? Like, that, you know, that's how I started my day for a really long time.

And just undoing that has been one of my biggest challenges. is, but I think the final hurdle was finally quitting pot, which was something, I was like, I don't be smoking this the rest of my life. Like, there's no downside of this. I used to be of that mentality. I'm not anymore. I think there are good things about that drug, but there's a lot of bad that comes with it too that I think is easy to overlook.

But that was, yeah, just, I think a lot of personal stuff for me, because, I literally use pot to get off of painkillers. And it was like, you know, instead of coming home from class and popping more pills, I would wait 10 minutes, go outside, smoke a joint, and then maybe pop one pill instead of two. And then I kind of just blended it all together, which was kind of like, had like a psychosomatic effect of like helping. me get off of it, which maybe it was worth it for that sense. But going back to my time in the rehab wing, you know, I was still on every sort of drug. I think that's when they started me on the Lexapro. That I think is one of the drugs I have the biggest problems with, more so than even

fentanyl. It takes away the highs and the lows, but that's kind of the best part of life. And it kind of just puts you on improves control, especially as like a spinal cord patient or someone with a spinal cord injury. Like everyone thinks of it as like, you know, it's like a physical effect. Like you have a physical disability now. But, you know, it's it also has a mental effect, obviously it has an emotional effect and has a spiritual effect because the hormones that you're producing in your body the the endorphins like they're all produced outside of your blood brain barrier and if your nerve pathways can't deliver those endorphins those hormones from your body into your brain you're not receiving the same

reward system that you were prior to the injury or like that anyone else might be like it's just not as effective it's like oxytocin and something like that works that way like i noticed like even as i went through the rehab and was able to actually do significant significant cardio where i would be exhausted i could never and still can't really achieve that runner's high which i think that's more like endocannabinoys that are produced in your muscle system, but like they just don't get to my brain because of my diminished nerve pathways. And that was like one of my favorite parts of working out, you know, like run to the gym, work out, run home, and you just collapse in like the state of euphoria. And when you don't have that, it takes away your motivation to work

out and it also felt a lot more like a job than it did like for enjoyment, which made it harder. And, you know, that was one of my bigger regrets was while I was in the rehab wing. And then later at RIC Hospital in Chicago for another three months there, I could have pushed myself a lot harder. I don't know how much more it would have gotten me. but not being able, like, working out, like, not feeling like that reward after. Like, and then also not really knowing where it's, like,

leading to why you're doing it and, like, how much is this really going to help me? Like, I just want to get home. Like, being in the hospital is just really just a draining experience. It's hard to sleep. It's hard to, like, focus on anything. it's just hard to be in a good mood. Like there's other people around you that maybe they're in better condition,

maybe they're in worse, but either way, it's like you either have like survivors remorse or you wish you were like in that person's shoot. And like just yeah, being in that setting was not fun. And then the Lexapro on top of that, I think it kind of just like made me okay with like being in the state that I was.

Like it took away my serotonin receptor's ability to like receive those. endorphins and I didn't want to tell my doctors because like I thought like they might give me like no you need to go back on that drug and kind of just felt like they were pedaling drugs over and over again and I mean obviously they all had good intentions but it's just like it felt like something more personal especially with pharmaceuticals like I need to figure out like what works for me and what doesn't. And so I was at RIC in Chicago finally. I got there Labor Day weekend 2010. Now obviously my family was closer. But there was like there were set visitor hours. I had a strict routine. Like if I didn't follow that routine, like insurance was going to stop paying for it.

So I got really depressed there, like not having a constant support system. from the outside, the nurses and physical therapists weren't really there to, like, coddle you. It was more like, we're here to do a job. And if you don't want to do the job, then, like, you can leave. I'm like, okay, yeah, I want to leave. And like, obviously my parents and everyone was like, not going to let me do that. I was there for about three months. And that's where I stood for the first time.

I think maybe took like a couple small steps while I was there. That was like, you know, first they put you on like a board that like would automatically like go up to this level and this level. And like you do that for like a few minutes at a time and slowly like regain enough strength. I actually did start to like have some muscle movement my left leg. But still no feeling to touch and stuff. Did you have numbness at all? No, actually. So my feeling on my skin.

Actually, I forgot to mention that. It came back while I was still on the dock. Okay. Which. So you could feel touch, but you just couldn't move. Right. Interesting. Okay.

Yeah. Is that pretty normal? No. Okay. And so that was something they finally diagnosed while I was at RIC. It's a condition called Brown-Souquard. Okay. So this, not many people have this.

and if they do, they're usually like, I don't know if it's like more related to strokes, but they were never like completely paralyzed from the neck down. So what it is, like my spinal cord is bruised on the right side. And it's like, so like your spinal cord is criss-cross. So like movement on my right side is mostly normal. My left side, not at all. but on my right side I can't feel pain or temperature

I can feel like if you touch me or if you were to like hit me like I can feel blunt force and blunt pain but if you poke me with a pain I can't feel it at all I can't feel temperature in the traditional sense at least my brain kind of like figured out

how to like warn me if something's hot but it takes a few seconds if I grab a hot pan I won't notice it until like a shock like literally like go through my arm and so like everything's kind of like crisscrossed and

my left side I can't move at all but my right side I can't feel certain things so like that creates a lot of difficult situations where like I can't grab something

with my left hand to feel if it's hot or cold and I can't when I grab it to grab it with my right hand it's like it kind of it's always like uh

game of roulette but that's something that took a really long time to get used to especially at home like you know walking on a tile floor eventually like without socks it was like you feel like the cold on your left foot but then not on your right and it's like one of those annoying things where like you wouldn't like think of it as anything that like would bother you but it was like things like those that really like added up and just like really played into my whole frustration because coming home was the hardest part of the whole process that was like my goal throughout all of it you know first it was like I just want to use a TV remote and then it was I just want to be able to drink something again they actually had to cut me off of water the first time I was like clear to drink

anything because I just drank so much and then my uh when I finally finally got home. Like, I was still in a wheelchair. I got on my bed and was like, oh shit, now what? Like, you know, in the hospital you're supposed to be sick or not in good shape. And you're home and you're like, oh, nothing's changed since I was in the hospital. And that was a super depressing feeling. That was, I think, the only time I was like truly depressed.

That was the most difficult. thing for me because I didn't expect it to be difficult. And all those little frustrations really started to add up. Like, oh, like my bedroom, I moved back in with my dad because he had a full-time nanny for my little sister who was like two at the time, or half sister. So that just made sense my basement or my bedroom was in the basement, but couldn't go there. So set up a bedroom on the ground floor, you know, just like not being able to like get my

cereal, not being able to drive anywhere, not being able to move around like certain corners. Just like showering like was like not enjoyable. It was like a chore. Everything started to like feel like a chore. It's like I didn't have like a 24 or 7 support staff anymore. Sleeping became really difficult. I mean, in the hospital, it already was difficult. and that, I think, lack of sleep, I think, is like the most powerful hallucinogen is I would sleep for maybe an hour at a time.

Like, it was just impossible for me to sleep any longer than that, even when I got home from the hospital. And, I mean, maybe, obviously it was an effect of the drugs as well. But I had some very powerful hallucinations. that honestly like I didn't even know we're hallucinations up until maybe recently one like I told my dad and my family I was like I was read my last rights in the hospital like I remember that like there was a priest there's like you know a Catholic sacrament like priest comes in blesses you before you know you pass on I was like that happened like I have a very vivid memory of that. And my dad was always like, no way. Like, it never got that bad. Like, if you

were read your last rights, like, I would have known about it. And so we were always like, okay, like, let's just agree to disagree. And it wasn't until I talked to Amy. And she's like, describe that memory to me. I was like, I don't know. It was like me in the hospital room. Like, and it was like just the priest there. She's like, yeah, no, that didn't happen. Like, you were never in that room alone. I know that for a fact. Like, someone was there with you. And I was like, okay, okay, good point. And then like, it's like, yeah, like I did have this hallucination probably around the same time of my grandma, my dad's side. She was certainly passed away at that point.

So I know this was a hallucination. But she came in and told me I had to live for 10 more years. Heaven wasn't ready for me. and that drove me nuts for a long time. Like, why 10 years? Like, when that 10 years came up, I was like, oh, no, like, what's about to happen? Like, actually, that was when COVID happened. Like, I was like, never understood.

Like, I mean, it's probably just as simple as, like, a hallucination. But, like, I tried to find meaning in that for the longest time. Like, why was it 10 years? why I was a 10 years and never could understand that. I guess there really isn't anything to understand, but that's just the nature of being human is like you want to find meaning in anything you can. And I wasn't particularly close with my grandma. She passed away when I was 11.

So it just felt like it was something that stuck out that I couldn't make sense of but wanted to. And then when I was able to sleep, the dreams I had were they felt insanely long and I was almost like creating like a separate like life in my dreams to kind of escape to and it would be like nothing like super crazy or super natural. It was just like I went to the grocery store or like I got home and did this or we went to visit this person and there was just nothing that like really stuck out about it except for the fact that when I woke up I knew I was in that universe and it felt like a very long time had passed

I don't know if you've ever seen the Sopranos like it was like when the main character's Tony gets shot he goes through something very similar where like he's a separate guy like Kevin Finnerty and that like they nailed that on the head like because he was in a coma and like had this like lived this whole separate life in his dream and then that's when like the whole concept of time really started to blur for me because like it felt like I just like was asleep for weeks maybe the months and now like I would like look at the clock and like an hour has passed maybe 90 minutes like it just none of it made sense and that really like started to throw me off as far as just being able to understand like what our perception of reality is and I started

to use that as like a coping mechanism kind of like you know like there's not really a whole lot of physical stuff I can do right now, but I can read, I can research, and kind of went down like rabbit holes of like... My name is Peter Parker, but I'm also Spider-Man. This July, we're faced with a threat. That can be anyone. The world may have forgotten Peter Parker. I'm just a neighbor, friendly neighbor.

But he hasn't forgotten them. Sometimes Spider-Man has to do the hard thing. That's my responsibility. Talk to Banner? I didn't know you could get that big. Spider-Man, brand new day. In theaters, July 31st. Ever feel like healthy eating is harder than it should be?

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Listen to Be Well by Kelly, wherever you. get your podcasts. New episodes every Wednesday. Like theories of like quantum immortality and what dreams are and what like time is and gravity and theoretical physics. Like I mean I went to school for civil engineering so I have like a little bit of like background in that but like I was just like trying to like understand things and like honestly like I'm not 100% convinced that I'm I'm not still underwater and this has been entirely a dream since. Like there's really no way to know, which sounds kind of trippy.

But it's true. It's like those dreams felt as real to me as anything else. Those hallucinations did. And it's still like every once in a while, I'll like have a dream and I wake up and like, no, I was in that same universe. And this has been like one of the hardest things for me to explain to people, therapist, doctors, friends, family. I'm like

what is like what's going on? Like I know it's like it sounds insanely outlandish and doesn't make any sort of sense but it is like this like separate universe that

I'll go visit in my dreams every once and a while. And that was one of the hardest parts about stopping cannabis use because when you smoke before bed, it suppresses dreams. And then when I stopped, I started having a lot of dreams. Not all of them like that, but some of them were.

And I would just wake up terrified. It was a very, it still is a very, like, uncomfortable experience when it feels like you've dreamt for a very long time in the span of a couple hours. It's just, I don't know if it's a combination of the drugs or the, like, the trauma, but something happened. And, like, my brain just, like, created something to escape. Like, I just wanted, like, because that was the only escape was sleep. And, yeah, that really started to just make me uncomfortable with, like, what, I understood as reality and like like now I'm okay with it.

So like it's just like now I look at like life a little bit differently, like what the meaning of it is and like obviously like I don't have that answer but I think that is kind of the meaning of life is just to search for meaning. And that whole experience kind of put me on the pathway towards finding it. And it's just, I think something we all need to be like kind of like looking for is just what is the meaning of life? Like, why are we here? You know, growing up we were, at least I was like on a predetermined path. And then like this was just something that like threw me way off of it and gave me a chance to kind of like look at my life from like a bird's eye perspective and think like, okay, like what am I actually doing?

like why am I going to school for engineering? Why am I doing this? Like what like really needs to be like my priorities and I wasn't looking at it so much in like a personal sense more just like kind of like a metaphysical sense and wanted to like understand like what motivates people. what drives like just the reason people do things and I think that's one of like

the most interesting kind of like philosophical topics because one thing that happened after the injury was you know I lost like all sexual function and that obviously being a 20 year old now was less than ideal

but it made me realize that's kind of what drove most of my motivation. It was, you know, like, why was I going to the gym twice a day and working out? Like, yeah, it was that runners high and then endorphin rush, but it was also, like, make yourself physically more attractive to the opposite sex. So it's like, why am I going to get, like, why am I, like, driving myself through a wall at engineering school. Like, oh, like, ultimately, like, I want to make myself more marketable and, like, the dating arena, like, make myself seem more intelligent, provide a good life for, like,

a potential wife. And then, you know, like, even, like, some of, like, the male friends I was selecting, or not selecting, but, like, gravitating towards was, like, just to, like, provide, like, a better opportunity to, like, hang around, like, a certain subset of girls. and like I was like there was like so much of what I did

that was like driven just by like I mean maybe not like pure sexual desire but like definitely like just desire like a mating desire almost and like now all of a sudden like that was gone and I'm like what now. like what what am I doing this for like why get up every morning and I think that's something like a lot of people don't realize is just like maybe they do but like that how much of our life is driven by just I don't desire for like

Others. Yeah. It's like, you know, like going out to bars and drinking. It's like, are we doing that because we like the feeling of getting drunk and like being at a loud crowded bars? Like, there are other reasons to that. And actually, like when I got back to college, it was kind of sobering in the sense that, like, yeah, I tried to like go out to the bars a couple of times.

I went back to college with a cane, so I was out of wheelchair, you know, still, like, hopling a lot more than I am now. Did it take you to get to that point from when you got home? So I went back to college. It would have been the fall of 2011, so about 14 months post-injury. Okay. And are you still continuing to improve, would you say? Okay. Yeah.

Not as much, but, like, small things. So, like, I still had a cane, like a brace on my left ankle. I found, like, a physical therapist in West Lafayette where I was going to college and would see them, like, a couple times a week. I was, like, try to do stuff on my own. But college quickly became, like, I said, like I went out to the bars a couple times. Then I actually got kicked out of a bar for being too drunk, even though I wasn't drinking. but like I had like a collapsible cane and like I would fold it up and put it in a girl's purse or like shoot hold it for me like because I didn't need it like you know I found a seat at like

inside the bar even if we were just standing around but like you know a bouncer saw me like stumble a little bit like trying to like get into the bar he's like no like you've had too much you can't come in and that really upset me and I was like I tried to explain like I'm not drunk like that would like I like like tried showing the scar on my neck like my friends tried advocating for me and then it was like a lost cause so like you know obviously I didn't get in but what surprised me is like most of the people I was with did go in and I'm like okay okay so like I guess I'm just going to go hang out back at I was living in the fraternity house which that probably wasn't the best idea

considering all the painkillers I had. I was still on. I was on Norcos at that time. But yeah, it was like it felt like I almost became like more

less like a prop. And it's like, oh, like Zach's back. Like let's get a picture with them like post it on Facebook and I'm like okay, see you later. Like we're going to go out to the bars now. And that kind of became demoralizing. But like everybody had to move on at some point.

So it was one of those things where I just like tried to find like an identity off to myself. Like I had my like close group of friends who, you know, they all had their own things going on. And at the time I didn't realize like how much attention they really were paying to me. But I grew to be kind of resentful, like kind of just felt like left. behind like while I was living at the paternity house. I really leaned into like the pot smoking because it was it gave me an identity in a reason to like not be going out to the bars other than my injury. I never wanted to be viewed as like the guy like just I didn't want that to define me.

And that also kind of pushed me towards like the wrong crowd. You know, I had pretty much. much an unlimited access to Norco's, the hydrocodone painkillers, I would trade them for something as simple as like a Chipotle burrito or Adderall or pretty much like anything. It was like a bartering system and got probably like to the worst point where so like the Norcos, like the actual opiase, like embedded in aspirin or acetametaphene. So like, if you take too many of those, you'll overdose on aspirin before the actual painkiller. But then somebody taught me like the method of like cold water extraction, which was you would like boil them in hot water and then let it cool.

and like when it's all dissolved when it boils and then cools down the actual opiates would fall to like solidify first so then you filter it like through a coffee filter and now you have like pure opiates and it was like that's still after a semester i was back at school my like i had my own room my door was like completely open one other guy in there with me and we were doing that and literally just snorted it off my desk like people walking by like no shame in it whatsoever and my buddy uh bobby is another one i went to high school with and also Purdue very close with him you walked in saw what was going on didn't really comment on it like and just like went back to his room down the hall waited for the other guy to leave

And immediately walked in with my friend Ben, I mentioned. He's the one who came in and stood behind my hospital bed. And they're like, Zach, we need to have a talk. And, you know, I was, like, immediately defensive. I'm prescribed like this. Like, doctors gave it to me. And it's actually better for my liver if I take it, like, without the aspirin in it. Like, so what's the problem, guys?

I don't understand. And like, like, maybe like that guy is like not the best one to be hanging around with. Like, well, I can't go out to the bars with you guys. You know, it's like, what else am I supposed to do? Like, you don't understand like what I'm going through. Like, very typical just addicts behavior response to like an intervention. And that's when I was like, all right, I'm like, I'm done. Like, I'm moving out of the fraternity house.

And luckily, I found other guys. guys in my fraternity who were actually the perfect ones to move out with. They wanted to move out too, but for different reasons, they were all kind of in relationships, were just over the like frack guy lifestyle and ended up moving out with them in the middle of the semester. And that was the best possible outcome of that whole thing. They weren't guys like I were, was, particularly close with at the time, but they wanted to move out, and so did I. And it just made sense, and the pieces fell in the place. You know, they're like pot smokers, but all engineering students, like, super responsible. Like, I not only had them, but, like, their girlfriends

who two of them are now married to and still married to, like, looking out for me. And then even, like Bob, Joe and Ben, who were still living at the fraternity house. Like, I didn't find this out until, like, years later, but, you know, they all got together and, like, what do we do? Like, do we, should we, like, let Zach move out? Like, should we, you know, encourage him to stay here? Like, do we need to, like, maybe hang out here a little bit more if, like, we're going to encourage him to do that?

Like, there was, like, I'm sure, plenty of discussions amongst them, like, about what to do, like, in my best interest, which I didn't see at the time. I was like, you know, kind of like screw those guys. Like, I'm just going to go, like, find my own thing. And they're like, okay, like, I'm moving out with, or he's moving out with, you know, Mike, Scott. Like, he'll be fine. Like, they're not going to, like, let him go off the rails. And sure enough, it was, like, a perfect situation.

Like, they were kind of like my guardian angels throughout, like, that whole process. and they graduated that semester. I had to stay another year, but a couple of those guys also had to stay longer, so I ended up getting close with them, and they helped me get over my painkiller addiction that semester. They, you know, would encourage me, like... Looking to strengthen your health and well-being,

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New episodes every Thursday, produced by Drake Peterson and Wellness Loud. Even if it was like smoking pot instead or I even started smoking cigarettes, It was like, and the feeling of cigarettes and norco was an incredible feeling, but they were like, hey, like, you know, instead of like taking a painkiller, like, let's go out and like have a cigarette, like that pill will be there when you come back. Like, okay. And then after a while, you just like, oh, I forgot to take my pill. And it was that in combination with, you know, a lot of other people that helped me get through that addiction. but ultimately it was just one day. Honestly, like, it was after that semester, I was like, I'm done.

I can't do this anymore. And I don't know what it was that motivated me to do that, but it just got exhausting after a while, like waking up and relying on that to get me out of bed. There's still plenty of other things I was addicted to. like Xanax that lasted a lot longer. Pot obviously lasted up until very recently. The cigarettes that stopped shortly after college, but it was kind of just like a revolving door of different substances that I was using

just to kind of like live my life on a day-to-day basis rather than plan for the future because that's kind of what my brain was trained to like think for. I just didn't want to think about the future. I didn't want to plan for the future. There's too much uncertainty in it. And I think one of the hardest things was realizing that everybody has that uncertainty. It's not unique to me. Life is all about ups and downs.

You can't have joy without sorrow. like it's and it's never like a straight line progression like you kind of have this mentality like I need to be like constantly improving and moving forward but you're going to have setbacks like some are going to be more significant than others I think just my whole experience is kind of like an extreme situation that kind of like allows us to like put a magnifying glass on like that whole human phenomenon where it's not all about just like planning for like the best case scenario like you have to plan for the best case scenario but like you also like have to be okay when it doesn't go that way it's okay to be sad like when it doesn't or like when something

tragic happens it's obviously okay to be sad like sadness is a part of life. life and that's like one of my least favorite questions is like are you happy like if a therapist ever asked me about that or asked me that question as like I would move on because it's it just doesn't make like there's going to be some days where you're not happy that's like really not what life's about it's about like putting yourself in situations where you have more happy days than not and surrounding yourself with. people that allow you that opportunity and will help pick you up when things aren't going your way. And there's like so many things that you can't plan for. And just accepting that is extremely difficult, but I think extremely worthwhile. So that's one of my most difficult things remaining in my recovery process because it's going to always be ongoing is just learn how to plan for the future while also being okay when it doesn't. You know, hopefully I've lived the worst experience I've ever had and like that part's behind me. but I have to be like okay if it isn't and at least now I like know I have the tools to get some get through something like that or help others get through something like that and there's like various coping mechanisms I used aside from the drugs to kind of like try to get myself to that point and you know one of the biggest thing I think is

kind of just like telling this whole story out loud. And like, I guess I tried to do that in a way. Like I used to do like random open mic nights like stand up comedy like before COVID. And that was like kind of just like a way to like talk about my injury and like a light way. But I think it was more so to kind of like just get people to like more aware of certain things. and also like take some of like the taboo away from it specifically like hemoplegia like there's a lot of things that like are adapted to for paraplegic people but hemaplegic people is like not so much like if I'm at like a cocktail function or like a work thing and like

I'm holding something like I could drink in my right hand and like I have a to like think ahead of like I'm like constantly aware of like where there's like a table I could put something down if like I have to shake somebody's hand and like that's something I'm like constantly thinking about because I can't like transfer it to my left hand and just like little things like that like one of my jokes of my stand-up comedy routines like you know like I eventually like I wasn't like a motorized wheelchair that like first I would use with my breath and then I could use my right hand. But then they had me just like the standard

roly ones and I was like mostly just traveled in circles because like yeah like I could only move my right arm and my right leg because they don't really have an adaptive device for someone who has hemiplegia to get around.

I also got outcast from the paraplegic like basketball team at the hospital I was at in Chicago. they like approached me to join and I was like I had like movement in my right leg but I was just in like a standard wheelchair and like they saw me move my right leg and they're like oh like sorry like you can't join us since like one thing to be like kind of like discriminated against but it's another thing to be discriminated against by a group that was formed because they were discriminated against like There's a lot of little hurdles like that that I have tried to explain to people and get people to understand about the nature of not just like the trauma, but like the recovery process because that was the most difficult part.

And the trauma, like that actual night, like looking back on the night of the injury, like I walked down that dock or even like when somebody like invited me to join like I didn't give a second thought it was like I'm like that sounds like fun and then walked down the dock I handed Jake like my cell phone and wallet and just dove in like I would any other time and like it's impossible for me to regret that because there was no like decision in the moment it wasn't like oh like maybe I should like go down the ladder to get in or like do a cannonball instead of dive. It was just something that happened. And so it was like that was like the one like piece of solitude I guess I found was there's like

no regret in that situation. It wasn't like somebody pushed me or like so like I couldn't really be angry at anyone for that. But that also was like I've had a lot of. trouble allowing others to, I guess, carry my burden. And I've always been in the mindset, like, this is mine to carry and mine alone. I made the decision to jump that night. I was, like, you know, like, there's no other reason, like, for somebody else to, like, have to carry this with me. That also, like, plays into my problem with relationships, not just,

romantic relationships, but friends and family too. Another one of my coping mechanisms was just isolation. Like, I just don't want to be a burden on anyone. I'll be fine just, like, on my own. I don't want to be, like, an influence on anyone's plans. Like, you know, a lot of my friends are big golfers and, like, oh, like, let's go on a golf trip. And then, like, they see me sitting there and, like, you could, like, see, like, on their face, like, oh, shit. Zach can't like come to that and then they try to like pivot right away and so I would just

kind of try to remove myself from those situations all together I just like yeah I don't want to be like a reason for anyone to like do anything or not do anything and that's been a personal struggle for a long time I don't know if there's like a very like articulate or centralized message behind everything I've experienced but when I did stop smoking pot it led me to just start journaling and writing was like one of

it's something like I actually enjoy and am passionate about and I think I'm a pretty good writer so I just like I just started to do it just to like fill my time at the end of the day and then I was like well maybe this could be like a book someday but like I never like there's still haven't been able to figure out like what would

like make people want to read this or like hear about my story because I'm still trying to figure it out myself. Isn't everybody? What's it? Is it but isn't everybody? No one has that's kind of thing. Yeah. It's like no one has everything figured out.

You know? For sure. And yeah, it's like I think just like. the whole injury gave me a level of introspection I never would have had otherwise. And honestly, like, if I could go back in time and change would happen that night, I don't know that I would. Because it made me who I am today. It gave me a lot more depth, a lot more just, like, I think personality and it caused me to look at the world and a completely different way, which I'm very grateful for because not that I didn't like

who I was before, but I just think I was doing a lot of things for the wrong reasons. And I think the one good thing to come out of it was just how it changed my perception on people both good and bad but people society and it's like the various aspects of life like the value of like love and like friendship like I would have never gotten through what I did without that level of support because there wouldn't have been a reason for me to it's like the value of it's like you know modern medicine and also the the like perils of that like you have to you know take what a doctor says but also understand like everyone's a little bit unique and I think that was something that took me a long time to figure

out because I went through like another I guess period of depression like after I graduated college and I was living downtown with my little brother, like downtown Chicago, and I decided to just move back home with my mom and, like, kind of reset. And my doctor was like, here's a month's supply of Lexa Pro. Like, you're obviously depressed. And I just remember, like, looking at, like, staring at that bottle, like, on my dresser. Like, and I was just like, no, I can't do it again. And I just flushed it. And it was like, that was one of the best decisions I made.

And just like, yeah, the various drugs, like I mentioned, my doctor, like, basically gave me, like, carte blanche, like, had as much as you want. And that worked out for me. And the opposite didn't work out for my friend. But it's kind of like you have to have, like, a level of, like, introspection to know, like, what's best for you. And while at the same time taking advice from loved ones and professionals, life's hard. And it's just, it's kind of relentless. But like all the down times or the low points are what makes the high points, like, worth it.

And that's what ultimately, like, what makes life beautiful is, like, those ups and downs and like the various emotions and the various like I don't know wins and losses and friends that come and go and it's just been a very uh introspective experience to kind of like take a step back now with like a sober mind and try to like piece together everything I've learned as best I can, but it's just, it's like one of those things where I knew like I've like had a story to tell for a while. We never really knew like what it was exactly I wanted to say. And like even with my family, there's stuff on here like that they probably never heard before. But it's kind of like I've always wanted like somebody to say.

like just ask the right questions, but obviously now I realize like that's not fair because I don't know what the right questions are. And I think too that's the beauty and you being able to write things out because there are no questions. It's kind of just putting and pouring all of your thoughts out on paper. And I think too when you said like who would read it or who would want to read it, I think any person that has gone through an experience where they've had trauma or they've had this situation, even if it's not necessarily a physical accident, you know, just somewhere where they felt like they had to completely start over and feelings of helplessness and like you can't do things on your own or like your life has completely changed. You know, I think that anyone would want to

read that as a form of understanding or a coping mechanism or for motivation for themselves. And you might, I'm sure there's been plenty of times, like you mentioned, that you didn't feel those ways yourself. But I think that relatability is what people would want to read. and would relate to. Yeah, that's a very good point. And actually, there was like something that happened recently, someone I know going through a divorce at, like, a pretty young age. It was like trying to find ways to relate to the situation myself,

but like don't have many, like, I've had one serious relationship in my entire life. And so I was, like, struggling. myself to like figure out how to like be a support and then he said like oh you have no idea what it's like to like you know you have your whole life like you know you think you have you figure it out and like this like specific one was like literally overnight it just like ended like no one saw it come and he's like it's like it's like and now it's just like it's just over like i i have no idea what like to do with my house and this and that and I'm like okay that I can relate to like I like I've been there like in a very different way but like right but

it's those types of feelings of having no idea what the feature holds or what's next and having things change in the matter of a day yeah it's it's I think just in today's society like really hard for people to like relate on like a truly like personal level is everything there's so much that's just like so I don't know like not fake but just kind of like yeah and I think people are losing the ability to communicate in meaningful ways and I think this is a great forum to like keep that alive I've heard like so many interesting stories on the show where it's like I see the title on like I don't like I don't know how like that, like, how I can, like, see any interest in that.

But then, like, I listen to it. I'm like, oh, my God. Like, it's just, uh, something like, I think, I hope, like, continues because, like, we're going to need, like, just meaningful conversations to continue if, like, we want to just, like, maintain our humanity. And like I mentioned that nurse, like, I'm sure, like, there's going to be fewer and fewer of those as life goes on like but you need those like so people that give you hope you know it allows you to get through tough days tough times in life

and you know like you mentioned you it's interesting what it does to be able to hear people's stories that you think you would never relate to and then you're like wait a second i get that or i can understand that and it's cool to you know we we are so often in our own little bubble and just going through the emotions of life. So to hear somebody else's story, it can put things into perspective and it can just make you, you know, it allows you to relate to another human being without even really speaking to them, but still in a very authentic way, you know, not through pictures or, or whatever somebody wants to portray themselves as. It's a very like real and raw conversation. Yeah. I was like, I think like at the beginning I was like, not sure like how much I really

could open up but it's like felt more and more comfortable as like time went on and I mean honestly I could go on for hours and hours yeah there's so many parts to your story and to anyone's you know yeah and like I see like it's just like I'm kind of like looking for like in a conclusion more or less but like also know that I'll like never find it but I think there's meaning and just searching for it Yeah, absolutely. Everyone is, and you know, it depends on the day. You could have days where you feel like, all right, I think I'm starting to figure this out. And then two days later have a day where you're like, you know, I have no fucking idea. You know, it's always changing. And I think that is part of being human. You know, we never know, things are always changing. Whether it's because we're changing it or because it's just, that's just how life is, you know, dealing our cards. But I think obviously, like you've mentioned by listening to stories and I always, always encourage people, you know, there's no story too big or too small. Everyone has one. always share it, always talk about your story, always write it. I always encourage people if they enjoy writing, write a book, even if it's just for yourself. It's a really incredible, powerful thing to do and to be able to share your story is extremely moving. And it's something that it's a very

vulnerable experience. It's incredible. It's no small thing. Yeah. It's very easy to get distracted by like AI and like everything and that as like kind of a crutch for everything like even like I started putting together these journals into a very loose book structure and then like I wrote like a prologue to like and I spent like a lot of time on it and sends it to one friend and then like I put it through AI and like just make this better oh man that is better like so it's but it also So, like, I mean, it was mostly my words that went into it, but it's, it takes a humanity out of it a little bit too. Like, like, okay, like, maybe that sentence wasn't worded perfectly, but, like, that was how I experienced it, you know. And I think there's something to say in just, like, actual human creativity.

I don't know if that will ever be able to be replicated or human care, especially. Like, the top surgeons in the world are going to be replaced by AI before. like the nurse at like your local hospital is, it's something that I hope we can figure out a way to maintain because it's what saved me. And I'm sure it's going to save a lot more people. Yeah. Well, you did an incredible job at telling your story. Are you just saying that?

Did I actually do it? Yeah, I'm completely lying to your face. No, you did an incredible job. It's, you know, everybody tells their stories in different ways. And that is what you were just saying. That's the beauty in being human. You know, there's all different ways to tell your story. There's all different parts of your journey that you're at when you're telling your story. You know, there's people that can tell their story when they are very much in everything that's happening. Maybe when they're right out of it, maybe when they're 20 years down the road healed, you know. And who knows where you'll be at that time, whether it's, you know, you've kind of moved on and left it behind or you're still sharing your story. And it's a completely different perspective then than that it is today. But there's no part of your journey and telling your story that is negative or bad. So you did incredible. You know, there's people that aren't even able to articulate into words how they're feeling.

So the fact that you're able to even do that, you know, that you're able to sit here four hours and say, like, this is how I felt in this moment and recall the memories and the traumatic experiences and how you felt and the people around you. That's very moving and powerful. It's important. Yeah. And I wouldn't sit here and lie and say that if I didn't mean it. Yeah, no, I've been watching your show for a while is, it's like one of those things where, you know, you go through, like, your day-to-day life and, like, yeah, like, that pays the bills. But this is, like, what's, like, truly, like, meaningful or, like, has, like, value is, like, like, I mentioned. I was at a work conference in Austin that I left early.

And I had no problem just saying, like, okay, like, Keith, you're on your own. I'm leaving early to go do this. That's what matters. Like, work will be work. Like, that'll be there at the end of the day. You'll lose clients, gain client. Like, this is like, and I wish I could do a better job at like, doing like outreach like other spinal cord injury patients because I did it a little bit,

like when maybe I was a little too fresh off of it. And it just was very difficult to like, relive that experience, like walking to a hospital room and see someone like maybe even in worse condition than I was and try to tell them that's going to be okay. Because at the end of the day, I just got super lucky. Like, I should be dead. Like, I definitely shouldn't be walking or like, have been able to like fly here on my own and drive here on my own.

But all I ever wanted was just independence and I have that. And it's like, I always say, like, if I can get up and. like and get my own glass of water. That's all I need because like having to rely on other people to do simple things is, it's a very like demoralizing experience. And I just, yeah. I think you survive for a reason. And whether it's to prove to yourself that you can get through anything or if it's to inspire others and share your story and to change other people's lives, you know, or both.

else, but you survive for a reason, you beat the odds, you know, and that's that. You can say, like, oh, I should be dead, but like, no, you shouldn't because if you were supposed to be, you would be. So there was a reason why you're here. And I think you should continue to tell your story. You'll only get better at it. And, you know, there could be a time, whether it's, you know, next month or in 10 years from now that you're able to help other, you know, other people that were in the situation that you were in. And it's not a process to rush. You know, you'll know when it feels right and when you're ready for it. And that's that.

You know? But I think this is a huge thing to do. And it's incredible that you were able to do it all on your own. Seriously. One of my favorite sayings is, I like to say I made it up on my own, but I probably heard it somewhere. It's like everything that's meant to happen will happen. And everything that will happen is meant to happen.

It's just, it's not to say like everything's predetermined. like we decide our own fate but it's kind of like there's a reason behind everything and you may not realize it now but like that bad thing that happened to like this morning could be like something like lead to something amazing down the line and that's my whole view with like this injury is like yeah that was a shitty situation and a tragic moment for myself and a lot of other people but I think like like I said I wouldn't I wouldn't go back in time and change it