We're All Insane - Living with Autism

Episode Date: June 26, 2023

Thanks HelloFresh! Go to HelloFresh.com/ALLINSANE16 and use code ALLINSANE16 for 16 free meals plus free shipping! NOTE: The content of this episode is not medical or psychiatric advice. Please seek professional help if you have questions or concerns relating to this topic. Undiagnosed autism in females refers to a significant yet often overlooked phenomenon where girls and women with autism spectrum disorder (ASD) go undetected or misdiagnosed. Historically, ASD has been primarily associated with males, leading to a gender bias in diagnosis and research. Females with autism often exhibit subtler, less stereotypical symptoms, making their condition harder to recognize. They may camouflage or mimic social behaviors, leading to a delayed or missed diagnosis. Undiagnosed autism in females can result in various challenges, including difficulties with social interaction, sensory processing, and mental health. Increasing awareness, understanding, and tailored diagnostic approaches are crucial for identifying and supporting these undiagnosed individuals effectively. Daisy's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/im.daisy.mo/ Daisy's TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@its.daisy.mo  Autism in Adults: https://www.helpguide.org/articles/autism-learning-disabilities/autism-in-adults.htm  Samantha Craft's Unofficial Autism Checklist (says it's for females but can apply to anyone): https://the-art-of-autism.com/females-and-aspergers-a-checklist/  New York Times article detailing David Sulzer's research on synaptic trimming: https://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/22/health/brains-of-autistic-children-have-too-many-synapses-study-suggests.html  Prevalence of Autism Spectrum Disorder: https://www.nimh.nih.gov/health/statistics/autism-spectrum-disorder-asd  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Enjoy today's episode. Hello, my name is Daisy, and I am going to be talking today about my experience with being autistic and ADHD. First of all, I wanted to ask you what you think of when autism comes up. Like, what is your first reaction? That's a really good question, actually. Yeah. And to be completely honest, I can't even give you an actual answer because, like, I don't know.

And well you can give me literally anything. Okay. Because I will say that I feel like when it comes to anything, especially autism, like at least I've heard from what I've heard, there's a spectrum of it. Right. So, but I don't even know like what that be. I kind of think of it as somebody who's like very smart but also maybe like doesn't have the same social skills.

Like I don't, you know what I mean by that? Yeah. Like it's, um, how do you, how would you describe that, Julie? Like, not socially awkward, but like, I feel like there's a different, like the brain is operating in a different way. Like, I almost feel like this is going to sound funny, but to compare it to myself, like, I feel like Julie's going to get mad at me. I know, I know I'm smart, but like, I think that my smartness has like limits in a way.

I think I'm more like emotionally intelligent and I think I am really, I have really good social skills and things like that. But when I think of somebody with autism, I think that they're kind of the opposite. it like they're like super smart but maybe that their social skills aren't as clear or maybe they're not as comfortable in social situations yeah that's how and i that is literally like i've never looked it up i really don't know but i guess if i really if somebody were to ask me that's what yeah my perception kind of has been but i've also never it's interesting because when i say like i heard that there's like a spectrum of it i've i don't think i've ever met someone like on the lower end

medium and higher end to really compare, you know? So that's... So you'd say you've never really had any exposure to have a real basis of what autism would look like in real life. Yeah, that seems to be a lot of people's experiences where they go through life and they never interact with a disabled person ever. Or if they've had an interaction, it's not been very good or they don't think highly of disabled people because even the word disabled. Like, it's so othering from them. But you touched on some things that we're definitely going to talk about. So for the way that autism is classified is a neurodevelopmental disorder. I don't like using the word disorder, but that's neither here nor there. So it

mainly impacts interactions with others, communication, learning, and behavior. So it could look something like a smart person who just doesn't really understand social cues very well. It could also look like somebody who really can't handle a lot of sensory input and cannot speak because of that stress that goes on in their lives. So what you were talking about with like the low, medium, and high ends, lots of people, because of, because of, of older studies that have been done. Think of that in the high functioning and low functioning ends. We don't use functioning labels anymore because it is very minimizing to the abilities of those of all autistic people, regardless of their experiences. So we, instead of saying functioning, like I to a neurotypical person would look like a high functioning autistic or what

used to be known as Asperger's. You might have heard of that before. We also don't use Asperger's as a label because that Asperger's as a syndrome was developed or was named after a Nazi. So a doctor who worked with a Nazi party in Germany would find autistic people and categorize them with the ones that they did not want and the ones that they did want, which were the Asperger's. So the higher functioning people were the ones that they didn't kill. So that's why we don't use Asperger's anymore.

So instead, we choose to use needs labels. So I have lower needs in the sense that I need less support to be a independent individual. Whereas somebody who is nonverbal who doesn't, who it doesn't have the ability to speak consistently in their life would be on the lower needs. Right. Or on the higher needs end, excuse me. So that's kind of the beginning of what you might know about autism. When it gets a little bit more in depth is when you start to dive into the experience of autistic. living of what being neurodivergent looks like in real life.

And the way that it works is that it is a genetic thing. You start to develop symptoms around the age of two to three, depending on the child. Some have more obvious symptoms. Some have less obvious symptoms. Because they say an example of a symptom could be like lack of eye contact. lack of eye contact. Yeah, that's a very popular stereotypical autism indicator. Yeah.

But not always the case. It is not always the case. Like, for example, right now I'm making eye contact with you. And that's another thing that we'll get into. The another, a lot of people look for the very obvious symptoms in children because the way that autism has been researched has been for young boys. specifically. So the way that it looks like in young boys is going to look a lot different than the way that it looks in young girls, which hasn't been researched nearly as much. So you might think of a really stone cold little kid who doesn't empathize with other people,

who doesn't talk, who might throw a tantrum if the lights are too bright. So the avoiding eye contact, the lack of play or not playing like a normal, normal, neurotypical kid would, you might see the lining up of toys, like, from biggest to smallest in like a perfect little row. Yeah. I used to do that a lot. But because I, as a female presenting person, the way that it, both the way that autism impacts me and the way that I was socialized growing up has an impact on how obvious autism.

autism looks like in the difference in boys and girls. Right. So for me, my, like, I would make eye contact and I was sociable because I was trained to be that way. I was trained to value relationships to think that interacting with other people is really important. So that way, my ability or my masking, the way that I pretended to fit in to, interact with others was seamless enough that it wasn't caught. I think this is also partially because

my mom works with special needs kids. So she didn't see the obvious things. Like she was trained to see the obvious and I wasn't obvious. So I got overlooked in that capacity. So it's very complicated. some of the things that I experience on a day-to-day basis that I actually made a list for my therapist. I made a really long list to prove that I had something going on with me. And these are just some of the things from that list. Wait, so to kind of go back to that, so did your therapist did not diagnose you with autism? Okay. So the first therapist I had, I had just come from my background of not having ever gone to therapy until I was 18, 19.

And then I had just assumed that I was just depressed and anxious my entire life. And that was it. And that was what was wrong with me. I had that confirmed by my primary care doctor. They gave me a cute little assessment and said, oh, you're depressed and you have anxiety. That's okay. We can give you medicine for it. I didn't like the medicine because it didn't work.

But when I went to my first therapist, she was a therapist who worked with children and a lot of autistic children as well. So when I had the inkling that something might be a little bit neurodiverse about me, she said there's no way there's no possible way like you maintain eye contact with me you hold conversations really well you're very sociable you're friendly you're empathetic none of those things are autistic which is not true yeah um she just seemed to have a very shallow concept of what autism can look like in adults and like you said too kind of just looking at the stereotypical normal I guess you could say symptoms or signs. Well, I think from her perspective, obviously I don't know because I'm not her.

But because my autism wasn't impacting her, it wasn't enough that made her uncomfortable, she didn't think that there could have been anything that would have been going on with me. like with her other clients perhaps that had more obvious symptoms that had higher needs. Those ones are like, oh yeah, obviously that kid is autistic. Right. You just weren't obvious. I just wasn't obvious, yeah, because I had spent 20, now 22 years of my life, hello, training myself to blend in, to look like the perfect neurotypical person to the best of

my ability. Now, that didn't save me from anything. I still was bullied. I was still the weird kid. I was still outed or ousted from my peer group because I was different and they could tell, but I didn't know what was wrong, what was different about me. And it wasn't obvious to me. It wasn't obvious to them, except the fact that I just behaved a little bit differently. I wasn't blending in quite as well as they would have wanted me to. So I was punished for my imperfect ability to blend in, which really is terrible. Yeah, for sure. But some things that autistic people experience, not all of, I'm not obviously.

not speaking for all autistic people or all ADHD people. But here are some words that you could use to describe some of these things. And I will also preface by saying that autistic, ADHD, neurodiverse behaviors are, in fact, just human behaviors. It is the volume, frequency, and impact that it has on your life, which does make a difference in whether or not you do or do. don't have autism, ADHD, other neurodiversity. So is this the list that you made?

This is part of the list that I made. I have a list. I had the names and I had all the examples. Some of them had like lots of examples. But starting with a few important ones, Echolalia, do you know what that means? No. So Echolalia can refer to one's need to repeat sounds

phrases or words or scripts, you know what scripts means, to just blurt things out. Like, for example, if someone said something that reminded me of a line from SpongeBob, I would just blurt it out immediately. Or if, like, one word from a song came up, I would start singing the song. Sometimes it's just random words that pop into my head that, oh, this would feel good to say right now. And it just comes out of my face. So it's one thing about autism versus ADHD. Autism is more of like a self-soothing necessity.

Like there's a lot of things that autistic people do specifically to relieve some of the sensory anxiety that is brought up by existing. ADHD, this has similar, a lot of similar sensory issues, but the way that it's dealt with is a little bit different. There's a lot more impulsivity in ADHD, whereas autism is more like you need a routine to be consistent. So I do have a question. Yeah. So what's the word that you just said again?

Echo Leelia. Okay. So how you said it's like this urge to like blurt out words. obviously Tourette's is way more, I guess, intensified version of that in a way because it's similar, right? It would be like a similar kind of thing. I was going to talk about this actually. So there's a few words that can be used with both Tourette's and autism. Okay.

So you might have heard of coprolalia, which is, it's more common in Tourette's where it is the blurting out of inappropriate phrases or words. Echolalia is just copying things. Okay. But they're simply like fall under. They're very similar in the way that they're presented outwardly, but the way that they're processed in the brain is very different. Okay. Got it.

Same thing with ticks with Tourette's. The echolalia coprolalia ticks, they're involuntary. The brain has synapses going that shouldn't be firing in those moments. Because you don't really have control over what's coming out. control when you have Tourette's. So those things just happen to you, through you, through your brain. Whereas with autism, echolalia ticks, I'm not sure if coprolalia is a part of it. Most likely it is since echolalia is a very entwined part of coprolalia as well. But the way that it functions in autism is more for self-soothing. Like the person does have control over when it can come out.

Okay. For the most part, for people with lower needs, they might have more ability to control that, whereas someone with higher needs might not have as much ability to control that. It just kind of depends on the person. There's, I like to, instead of thinking of it as a, the light spectrum, you know, there's the rainbow and it goes one, it goes one dimensional. I like to think of it as like a color wheel instead where there is, it's almost three-dimensional in how every person with autism, every person with ADHD, every neurodiverse person is so very different from another neurodiverse person, the way that it impacts them, the way that

they present themselves to the world, all of it is just so different from person to person. So this is just my experience. And my experience might be very similar to someone else's experience, but I have a lot. can never talk for someone else. Yeah. Hey, I'm Jeremy Schwartz from American Criminal. On this season, robbery gone wrong or cold-blooded murder. Either way, Boston will never be the same.

Listen to American Criminal, the murder of Carol Stewart, wherever you get your podcasts. Or to get early ad-free access, subscribe in Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or at American Criminal.com. That's why I like that it's like everything you're explaining is like, very educational too. Yeah. Because it gives a really good perspective.

Right. On everything as a whole rather than just because it's good to, it's good to know too, like how you personally experience things. But I think also it's good to educate people because even like me, for example, like I didn't know. You know, and I think that it goes so much deeper than just the term autism as well, which is really interesting. Yeah.

And the way that I realized that something was different was by talking to people who had ADHD and autism who had their experiences drawn out for them. I have one more question. Go ahead. I don't want to forget. It's okay. So because I noticed you keep referring to ADHD and autism together. So do those usually come hand in hand or sometimes it can, I mean, I know some people can

just have ADHD, but with autism, is it usually both? Or can you just have autism as well? So that's one of those fun things that we don't really know a whole awful lot about. There are, ADHD is the. most common childhood diagnosed disorder. It is like something that people just throw that diagnosis on a lot of kids. And shit, I got diagnosed with the last year. And I was like, I don't know about that.

But yeah. It's a very easy thing to just throw on someone. And yes, that person very well could be ADHD. it could be that that is impacting them in such a way. But it's kind of a cop out in a lot of ways. Right. And I don't think too, I think a lot of people when they seek out therapy or help is because they want help.

They don't want just a diagnosis and to slap some medicine on it. Like so, yeah. Yeah. My therapist actually was more cautious about diagnosing me with certain things. She wanted to hear my reason for why I. I wanted a diagnosis before she just went ahead and did the tests. And she validated that. Me getting a diagnosis would be very validating for my existence for how I can interact with the world

and to have a name for what I'm experiencing. Yeah. Well, I think too because like you said you knew growing up, you felt different. I felt different. But you didn't know what it was. I think that in a way that was something that could help you kind of close that curiosity of, okay, so what's going on? Yeah.

I think there's also just a lack of, like, I guess, noticing what the experiences of children and teens are. Like, a lot of adults will sort of just brush off what children are talking about. Oh, they just really care about this topic. They're not obsessed with it. That's not a special interest. They just really like talking about it. It's okay.

Or, oh, you're just being dramatic. you're not actually stressed out by the fact that you can see the lights flashing. You're not stressed out by the fact that there's a car running, car driving by. It's very dismissive of the way that children express themselves, which is really frustrating and has led to me being undiagnosed for more than 20 years of my life. Because nobody believed me when I told them that there was something wrong. or when I expressed that the things that my peers were doing to me was not okay. Like, I remember the first time I felt specifically othered by my peers was when I was six.

I was in kindergarten and I was just trying to play with my friend for a couple minutes before we had to sit down for a little group circle to talk about the days of the week or whatever. And one of the kids looked at me and said, stop doing that. You're so weird. And just like walked away. And I was like, I don't, I couldn't understand. I couldn't fathom why that would be coming out of a six-year-old. Yeah. Much less what I was doing that was so offensive to them.

Who also is a kid that's going to hurt your feelings naturally? And those kind of things stick with you. Hi. Hello. You're moving my microphone. I know. She is adorable. She is the star.

She is the star. It's so funny, I had somebody tell me that they listened to the show, but they didn't watch it. And that they heard me talking about the cats. And then as I was on FaceTime, the cats were walking by and they were like, okay, I guess that's the cats that you talk about. That's actually the exact one that always makes the appearance. She loves the camera. Okay, sorry. No, yeah, it's okay.

No, but yeah, I was just saying as a kid that, you know, stuff like that sticks with you. And it hurt, I mean, we're sensitive when we're young. So things like that are going to hurt our feelings and really make us think, is something wrong with me? Exactly. Yeah. And that was a running theme throughout my childhood. That there was, I was trying so hard to do all of the right things to fit in. To fit in to be like my peers.

But I just couldn't quite make it work. And that's because I'm not like my peers. I'm not neurotypical. I'm different. And that's okay. And that should have been okay, but it wasn't. It wasn't to them. And that meant everything to me because of the way I was socialized, the way that I was taught to value other people's opinions of me, to value friendships, to value relationships, even more so than I valued my own opinion or my own comfort in a situation.

the way that I was brought up and a lot of undiagnosed autistic ADHD people as they grow up, they're taught how to fit the little cookie cutter of what society wants from you, how to have a conversation, how to not be weird. The main thing that people called me, weird, weird, weird, weird, you're so weird. I know I'm weird because I'm not like you. But you shouldn't say weird to mean something worse to put me down. Right. Like I can be weird because I'm just different.

But weird has such a negative connotation. Maybe pick another word. Like the way that I do that is not the same way that you do that. Right. And that's okay. Now, that is to say that nothing I should do. should be passed off by the fact that I'm autistic, that I'm ADHD. I can't just say whatever I'm thinking to someone and it hurts their feelings.

And they tell me that it hurts their feelings. And I say, oh, I'm autistic. Didn't mean it. Right. It doesn't matter. That's not true. My words have just as much impact on someone who's neurotypical as a neurotypical person's words have on me. So it doesn't denounce what I do or what I say.

Yeah. But it does create a foundation for misunderstanding between me and the world. Because the way my brain functions is so different from the way that the majority, the neurotypical, abled, cisgender white man is the way that I functioned, is so different from the way that they function. So me trying to put myself into that is really damaging. And it's doing that causes your identity to kind of just disappear. Like with masking,

masking is the term that autistic people use to refer to how they have to pretend, how they have to behave to cover up what their natural way of being is to blend in with society. And everyone does it. If you don't do it now, then you have in the past. Everyone, to some degree, has put on a mask to go out and be in society in an appropriate manner that doesn't hurt other people's feelings to sort of cater to the social game that you have to play. But the difference between a neurotypical masking and an autistic person masking is the way that masking occurs.

So for a neurotypical person, you might say, for example, if you meet someone for the first time, oh, hi, how are you? My name's so-and-so. and they would respond with the appropriate way to respond. The like, nice to meet you too, my name is so and so. That's the right way to respond, right? That would be considered masking. But a neurodivergent person, an autistic person, an ADHD person, would be thinking about

how long they've been making eye contact. They think about how their face moves. They intentionally curate the situation, the way that their body is presenting in order to cater to the neurotypical person. So even now, as I'm having this conversation with you, I'm having, I am counting how long I'm looking into your eyes, an eye contact thing. I count and then I look away and then I think about how long I've been looking away and then I come back to eye contact and then sometimes it goes a little too long and then I look away

again. It's this innate thing that happens for neurotypical people that doesn't happen for me. If I have the option. It's not as natural to just like have it happen. Exactly. Yeah. It doesn't it doesn't just come to me. I have to think about those things. If I had the option, I would only look at your lips because I have what's called audio processing disorder. which impacts my ability to understand speech. So if you said something that I didn't understand, I would look at your face to catch it on your lips. But that's the choice of looking at your face

that I would give for the most part, unless I was analyzing your face. So it's a very interesting dance that you have to portray. to the world to fit in, to have interactions that feel safe. Yeah. Because that's a huge part of masking is safety because you don't know your audience. If you meet someone for the first time, you don't know them. There's no way to know how they're going to react to you.

So putting on the pretty little neurotypical mask prevents something dangerous from happening potentially because a lot of times, Even after the mask has come off and you feel comfortable with somebody, they might take advantage of you as a neurodivergent person because of the way that autism works in the brain. I and a lot of other autistic people are very gullible. The way that English works is very figurative. So there is oftentimes where something in the language itself isn't very direct

and it doesn't make sense. So if someone's trying to play a trick on me, I wouldn't know that immediately unless I had experienced it before. So that can be a very dangerous situation if I'm coming to someone for the first time and I'm just totally myself, mask off, they can take advantage of me really easily, which is not something that I want. So that's one potential benefit of masking is just for the sake of introductions for safety in knowing the person that you're doing this social dance with. Beyond that, masking is really harmful because it can impact your sense of identity.

You don't know who you are without the mask. You put on this persona of, oh, I'm a nudge. nice person. I speak very calmly. I am not very blunt. I try to word things in such a way that are pleasing and appealing to the neurotypical audience. But that's not who I am inside. That's not who I have been. I am naturally a very blunt person. That's a lot of autistic people's experience. It's, I like direct communication. I like knowing what's going on. Hello, kitty.

I like it when other people speak directly to me. I like very clear, concise knowledge about what I'm being communicated. Hello. You're moving, you're moving the microphone. And now for a quick commercial break, and a word from our sponsor. Who doesn't want a delicious, tasty meal that can be made quick but is also fresh and you have all the ingredients you need pre-portioned right in front of you.

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something that I cannot stand is going to the grocery store and getting way too much than I actually need, which I feel like all of us are guilty of, and then having to waste food or the food goes bad. And that is something great because now you're not going to waste any ingredients and you always use only what you need because everything is pre-portioned out in the meals. Go to hellofresh.com slash all insane and use code all insane for 16 free meals plus free shipping. Again, go to hellofresh.com slash all insane and use code all insane for 16 free meals plus free shipping. Now, back to the episode. The way that neurotypicals mask is very infrequent. It's the way that social interactions come to them is much more natural.

But as an autistic or a ADHD person, masking is very intentional and is exhausting. It takes a lot of energy to pretend. Like for actors, if you're acting for eight, ten, twelve hours in a day, that's tiring. You're doing a lot of work pretending to be someone else. It's the exact same way for autistic people, but they're just going about their lives. They're just going to work. And they have to put on this front in order to be safe in order to go about life without being punched in the face. because there have been times where I have just said something because someone asked me something

and I tell them the direct answer and they get mad at me for telling them what I observe, what I see as the truth is in that situation. And it hasn't gone well, which I think is terribly ridiculous. Why should I have to soften myself for your sake, for someone else? sensitive. Exactly. Yeah. And the funny thing is that I am the definition of sensitive.

Like there is something that a lot of autistic and neurodivergent people deal with is called RSD rejection sensitive dysphoria, which is the fancy way to say if any, if any at all or even perceived rejection happens in any situation, you immediately feel crushed. Yeah. Like, you feel like they hate you now, which might not be true at all. They might not even be rejecting you or they might not even, they might be inviting you to do something. Yeah. I feel like to it, like, it kind of seems like like the fear of like disapproval. Exactly. Yeah.

Yeah. Mm-hmm. I don't know if that's a genetic part of autism or ADHD. But I know that it impacts me every single day. Like, for example, something that is a combination of a few things, not understanding social cues, the rejection sensitivity, dysphoria, is when somebody say, hey, we're getting lunch. I take that as, oh, you guys are getting lunch and you haven't invited me yet. But we're getting lunch.

They're saying where I'm inviting you to come. with us to go to lunch. But they didn't say that. So I misinterpret that as, oh, I guess you're just telling me about your plans. And I'm not invited. And that's okay, I guess, but I'm hurt because you're not inviting me. So the way that that's resolved is, hey, we're getting lunch. I want you to come with me.

Yeah. Because that's clear. That's direct. These are the plans. I'm straightforward. I explicitly want your present. in this interaction. But apparently that's just something that people know.

You say, hey, we're getting lunch and people just know that that's an invitation. But that was never something that was obvious to me. I had to be taught that. I had to study that. I spent years studying human behavior. I did a lot of research just to tweak my mask a little bit more to fit what was being expected of me at the time. And currently, I still use a lot of those techniques that I learned from the research that I did. So it's just a lot of training yourself

to be something that you're not, which is really not good for you. It's not good to pretend to be something that you're not. It's not good for your mental health. It's not good for other people. there have been times where I have the mask on and then it just drops. And the person that I'm talking to notices a shift in the dynamic of our relationship. And that sometimes has been friendship ending, relationship ending, where I am so different from where I started in our relationship that the change is too much for that. Yeah, they don't know how to be friends with that. They don't know how to be friends with me.

Yeah. because I was putting on this front that I was more independent, that I was less sensitive, less needy, whatever negative thing that they might say about it. So there have been a lot of times where I think that it's okay to be myself around them, but it's actually not. Because I think in part I had never tried being myself around them before that, but it was too late. So it's very frustrating in that capacity. I think that was also a contributing factor as to why I never got diagnosed, why it wasn't noticed in me earlier. I think one of the main factors as to why I particularly went unnoticed is, well, first and foremost, that I am a less, a lower needs person. I don't need a lot of support in order to function.

But also because the ratio of boys who are diagnosed is four times that of the amount of girls that are diagnosed. Wow. Yes. So in 2020, the ratio of diagnosed children to neurotypical children is one in 36. and from those 1 in 36, four times more diagnosed below the age of 8 were boys than girls. Now, it used to be less. I believe in 2000, it was one in 26 children who were diagnosed with autism. But they attribute it to better screenings, things like that.

And it was, 2020 was the first time that the, percentage of girls aged eight was above 1% who were diagnosed with autism, which is awesome. We love that girls are being noticed in their struggles sooner. But that's still a really small percentage. I, again, think that's just a lack of research that they haven't looked into it enough because there is... Like, they're not expanding the research past what they've known. Exactly.

Yes. If they are, it hasn't come out yet and it's not widely spread. So it impacts the way that girls grow up. It impacts the way that boys grow up. One thing that I noticed about the difference between autistic boys and autistic girls, even the ones who had been diagnosed later in life, is the socialization of both or either, feels like it's heightened a little bit.

For example, the way that masking works for both of them. The having to put on pretty words in order to appease people for girls is much higher in autistic girls. That might be why it's a little bit different for them, like why they're noticed as being weird. Like, oh, you speak? like why are you using such big words? Because that was that was trained in me to to speak above what even my peers were, which is very like ableistic and linguistic superiority complex, which is a whole other topic. But in the same but opposite way, there is a lot of entitlement in autistic boys and men.

They take that socialization of because I'm a man, because I'm autistic, I should get these things. And it's even worse in autistic boys than it is in neurotypical boys, in neurotypical men and autistic men. It is wild. That's been my experience. I don't know if this is true of all autistic men and boys, but the ones that I have interacted with have been so terribly entitled that it is intolerable to interact with them. Even as someone who understands them on a fundamental level, their experiences fundamentally, very similar to mine, but socially, so different.

that it's impossible to interact with them. There's just no empathy and the entitlement is beyond acceptable, much less tolerable. So I think that's also one of those things that those who are more low needs tend to fit that, oh, you're such a perfect little neurotypical person that there's no way that you could be autistic. I speak very clearly. I can communicate how I'm feeling.

I can communicate when I need something. So I just got swept under the rug in that way. The socialization is really a huge thing that they haven't really looked into on girls. Because in young girls, they tend to play more than autistic boys. one of the very stereotypical symptoms would be that they don't play, that autistic kids don't play that way. They don't play with other kids. They don't interact. They don't show you things.

They don't present something that they made to you. Autistic little girls do because they're socialized that way. And it might also be that they're genetically impacted differently. Right. So it changes the way that they are perceived. by their parents. They are perceived by adults. Like, all throughout school, I was a pleasure to have in class because I would sit there and be perfect and then I go home and melt down if I didn't have a snack.

Yeah. An hour before dinner, which my mom thought would ruin my appetite, but I just was hungry because it had been too many hours since lunchtime. coupled with all of the stress of going to school on top of being autistic, I would just have problems. There would just be more problems. I would lash out at my parents. There would be meltdowns, crying,

just because the one thing that I needed in the afternoon wasn't being given to me or my schedule changed. Right. Like, oh, we have to go to the doctor's office right after school, so you can't have your snack. Ooh, that would be a problem. And even to this day, stuff like that happens where I am going about my day and, oh, the ADHD, time blindness has befallen me and now I'm late and now I'm crying on the way because I'm

late and my plans were ruined because I'm late. And I haven't even gotten there yet. It's the beginning of the day and I'm late and I'm crying already. So it, I think because of that, the threshold for stress is so much, like, lower for autistic and ADHD people because they have to deal with so many more executive functioning issues. Do you know what executive functioning is? So executive functioning refers to starting and completing tasks. So your ability to function in executing things. Okay.

So because there is executive functioning issues for both autism and ADHD, literally everything that is started and has to be finished requires more energy. Yeah. If you have... And like if that gets messed up in any way, then it's like a meltdown. Yes. Okay. Or you just run out.

Yeah. You just run out. Something that the disability, community coined the spoon theory I like to use for autism as well. I mean, I am disabled because I'm autistic, but it applies for ADHD as well. If you have 12 spoons for the day and getting up requires one spoon, you've used your spoon, you can't have that spoon anymore, you have 11 spoons. Brushing your teeth requires two spoons because it is such a terrible sensory experience. So you've used those spoons. You've used those spoons. You've

have nine spoons. Making breakfast, three spoons. You keep going, you keep going. You have one spoon left to do all of the activities for the rest of the day. Right. Before you've even gotten out the door. So that's, I believe, the main reason why a lot of autistic people don't have jobs. There is, I forget which year the survey was taken.

Only 30% of autistic people have jobs, full-time jobs. At least 60% of autistic people are entirely unemployed. So that's a whole 80% of autistic people who just are in limbo about where their standing is in life. Now there are some higher needs autistic people who will have care for the rest of their lives because of their needs. But there's a lot of low needs autistic people who just kind of have to figure it out in a world that's not meant for them. So I have a full-time job. I work as an American Sign Language interpreter. But I have been burnt out for the last year and a half.

So just existing, masking constantly causes burnout. And I haven't even begun my job yet. So that's the tradeoff. You have a job, you're burnt out constantly. You don't have a job. You can't live. Yeah. It's really an unfair world that autistic people have to deal with because is it worth being burnt out constantly to have a job?

Well, is it worth your mental health to not have a job? you know? Yeah. Why should we have to make that decision? Why should that have to be a question at all? Yeah. That's really frustrating. And I'm privileged in that way.

I'm low needs. I'm functional enough that I can go to work. I can maintain a job. I haven't accidentally offended my boss to the point where they fired me. I haven't just walked. out from the job because it was too much. That's very well something that could happen to me. I would ideally like that to not happen,

but I'm privileged in that way where I can maintain a job at my own expense. So that was one of the things that made me notice that something was different, that I was just constantly in a state of exhaustion, that something was different about the way my brain worked. This came about in part just from the way that I felt about myself, about the world, but also because of talking to other people, talking to neurotypical people who weren't experiencing burnout and how their life seemed so perfect and happy and neat.

Like they can maintain their houses. They don't have to worry about. about tripping over something on accident. Yeah, it's like your brain, it's like constantly the wheels are like spinning. Yes, my brain does not turn off. Right. And I don't have any medication. I'm trying to get some, but of course there's a national shortage right now.

That was going to be one of my questions for you. If there is medication. For autism? Yeah. No. Okay. If you. It's just something to deal with.

Not for like lower needs autism. Okay. For higher needs autism, you can take something like a mood stabilizer, which would be more for like bipolar or for something along those lines. You can, there can be medications that you can take, but there's not something for autism that lessens the sensory experience. Because that's really what it boils down to. My sensory experience is so intense. Yeah. And there's no understanding of why there is.

is lower and higher needs people, right? It just depends. From what I've seen, there has been research that came out recently that studied the neural pathways in the differences between neurodivergent populations and neurotypical populations. They discovered that neurodivergent people, when they're growing up, when they're developing, their neural pathways are trimmed by about 30%. Neurotypical neural pathways are trimmed by half. There's about 50% of the connections that were made as a baby

that were trimmed throughout childhood. So there are more synaptic pathways in the brain, which they attribute to having more synaptic pathways to having disabilities. Yeah. Specifically cognitive disabilities. They have no idea why. Okay.

They just know that the more you have, the more problems you have. That's just like so crazy to me that like, yeah. There is such a wide spectrum of that. Mm-hmm. That's crazy too. It is very crazy. And even in general, I feel like there's people too who I feel like can, like we were kind of saying before, you can have just autism or you can have autism and then

another five things along with it. So it's just so interesting how that can just happen, literally. And we don't know why. Yeah. There's not really been enough research. It has been proven that people who have more cognitive disabilities have more neural pathways, but they don't know why that impacts people so heavily. I feel from my perspective, my untrained, uneducated perspective,

feel like it's because the more your brain has to process, the longer it takes to process everything. Right. So when I was getting my diagnosis, I took a processing speed test where I had to find the symbol, and among a group of symbols had to indicate which symbol matched or if there was no matching symbol from the options. And another one that I took where there was numbers and symbols associated with the numbers. And I had to draw the symbols next to the numbers. I had my score for those tests was like way higher than average, way higher than what a neurotypical's processing speed would be.

Um, so because of that, that makes me think that the, the quote unquote, impairment comes from the fact that there is so much information coming into my brain. I have to filter out all of that information in order to make sense of what the world is around me. Yeah. Um. So you in the beginning, correct me from wrong. Mm-hmm. You said autism is genetic. Yes.

Okay. So this is a very controversial. question. Feel free. But because I've heard that or people sometimes have been making assumptions that autism can come from vaccines. Yes. That is not true at all.

I wanted your opinion on that. Yes. There is no scientific evidence. The person who made that research and spread it across the country, that research was proved to be false and that researcher was removed. of his doctorate license. So that's, it's totally falsified information. And it has been used for years to fear monger with vaccinations.

Please, please, please vaccinate your kids. Yeah. And I think too, there's definitely, just like with animals, there are definitely vaccinations that I think that babies, animals they need. Because if they don't get them, I mean, I've lived. literally seen, I don't know which one it is for dogs, but like I've seen many studies of dogs that didn't get, I think it's maybe distemper. And like genuinely, like their faces change, their brains don't develop. It's a whole thing. Yeah. But I do think too, just like in animals and kids, if you

don't do it correctly or you do too much at once, like that can have negative effects too. Yes. So I do think that there's good and bad with everything. But, you know, I- But vaccinations don't have any impact on autism. Right. It is genetic. It is something that you're born with. And with the developmental process, the symptoms start to show, but your baby is born with autism. Like you can't, there's no curing it. There's no giving it to the kids.

It's just not scientific. So there's no kids that have autism that like, I guess, down their genetic line someone didn't have it as well um it's hard to say that like i don't know the research on that based on the fact that it is genetic yeah i want to say yes okay because i know sorry you're not a doctor no yeah i don't know i don't have the research on that yeah but the it might also just be like how you're both your one of your parents has blue eyes the other has brown eyes you might get brown eyes, you might also get blue eyes because there might be a recessive gene in the brown eyed parent that causes the blue eyes to come out. Genetics is so complicated. So I don't

really know how that works with autism, but it is a genetic thing. That is a scientific researched fact. So I think the main thing that people need to get in their brains is that autism isn't a death sentence. It's not so horrible. Like a lot of people view autism as, oh, the poor little baby who can't talk. Oh, they'll never be able to grow up and have a good life. That's not true. There are some people who are disabled in such a way that their quality of life is impacted by what they have going on. But for a lot of autistic people, for a lot of disabled people, being disabled, being autistic is not a death sentence.

It is not as terrible as it's made out to be. I understand maybe not, like, you know, you can grieve that your expectations for your child's life may be different than what they actually. actually end up being. But it's not okay to not vaccinate your kids because you're afraid that they're going to get autism. I don't know exactly how to word it, but if you're afraid of your kid getting autism, it's because you have some internal ableism in you because the autism, yes, impacts me,

impacts autistic people in a huge way, but it doesn't, it's not terrible. It doesn't have to be a terrible thing. It doesn't have to be scary. You have resources. It's 2023. There are so many resources, especially for parents of neurodivergent people, of autistic people. There are community groups. You can talk to adult autistic people, how they deal with their lives.

because it's it's not fair to those kids to treat them like there's something so terribly wrong with them for being autistic. I even pretending to be neurotypical was treated terribly for being autistic. So we need to switch our mindsets about what a good life looks like,

what disability looks like, and how it can be okay. It's okay. to be disabled. It's okay to be different. Those things are really important to acknowledge and to change our mindsets about because going through life, looking down on disabled people will only impact you negatively. Because 80% of all people will be disabled eventually.

Those 20% of people die before they become disabled. You're going to need a mobility aid. You're going to need some cognitive help, perhaps, when you're older. You become disabled when you get older, or you might become disabled when you're young. So looking down on disabled people needs to stop. Yeah. And the acceptance of support mobility, AIDS, help from friends, help from therapists, it should be normalized and supported.

And the way that society looks at disabled people is abhorrent. There should be no reason why disabled people should be looked at in such a negative way. We do not support Autism Speaks. We do not. Explain what that is because I don't know. So Autism Speaks is a autism, I'm just going to be blunt, is an autism hate group. Okay. They disguise themselves as a support group.

Uh-huh. They, they are like, they want to cure autism. Basically, they believe that autism can be cured. Do they say how? They haven't figured it out. Oh, okay. I mean, they try a lot of different things, like avoiding vaccinating your kids. Okay.

And the, like, medications, training your kids to mask. That's like one of the main things that they support that you should train your autism out of your kids, which is not how that works. It is traumatizing. Especially if, I mean, like you said, in a way, fortunately, you were able to have more control to be aware of when you were going to mask. And even though it was exhausting for you, you were aware of that. Yeah, I have that privilege. There are some people that don't. That literally cannot control that.

Yeah. Yeah. It's interesting. Yeah. It is so frustrating. Yeah. They coined the like the blue thing, blue for autism awareness. But they like to use like blue lights, blue lighting.

Blue lighting is terrible. It is so overstimulating. and why would you pick blue? Because you didn't consult with anyone who's actually autistic. You just picked a color and, oh, that's now what represents autism. Ask an autistic person. No autistic people enjoy blue lighting unless they don't have a concept of what blue lighting is. It's terrible.

They also coined the puzzle piece, which implies that there's something. something fragmented, something missing about autistic people, like that there's something that needs to be filled in that space where the puzzle piece has been left out. Which is not true. Autistic people can live totally beautiful, fulfilling lives, regardless of needs. Yeah.

Their lives can be fulfilling. So you don't need to imply that we're broken. and that we need something to help us be fulfilled. It doesn't work. So autism speaks is an no-no. They're a no-no. We do not support autism speaks. They are like the worst, arguably,

because they're trying to eradicate autism, which isn't possible because it's a neurotype. Hello, Kitty. That was the, wow, that was an amazing spring-up onto the table. That's one thing that helps autistic people is animals. Um, what, one of the reasons why I noticed that I might be autistic is because of my preference towards animals. Anytime I would go over to like an event. I mean, honestly, same. Like, I always will prefer. Yes. If there's a dog at the event, I will go pet the dog. Yeah. I will talk. I will introduce myself to the dog before I

introduce myself to the people at the party. For me, I feel like that's like kind of like an anxiety thing. Like I feel like it's more soothing. Like if you see an animal somewhere, it almost, because it can be, even for me and I feel like I'm somebody that, like I said, I feel like I am really social and I'm good at doing the social thing, even if I'm not in the mood. But I think that being someone that's grown up with anxiety and stuff like that and feeling uncomfortable, mainly because of like all my stomach issues and stuff like that.

But seeing an animal always is something that kind of like eases that stress. It eases that. Isn't so funny. It's cute that like animals can really do that. Yeah. It's because you know that they're pure. They're not. They have no judgment towards you.

So to us like I feel like that's what. That's part of why autistic people, ADHD people, neurodiverse people gravitate towards animals because our, the way that. You don't have to put that mask on. Exactly. the way that our experience is is so much more akin to an animal's way of experiencing

life. Very blunt communication the you don't have to play the social game like you can communicate with each other without talking all of these reasons why a lot of autistic people feel like they are more like their pets than they are like their neurotypical peers

because the neurotypical is so foreign. Right. Even though they're a person compared to the animal being not a person, but so much more personable. Yep. Which is really ironic, but it's just the way that it is. Like if you always find yourself gravitating towards your pets, if you feel like you yourself may feel more like your best friends with your pet than you are with. your best friend. That might be an indication that you have some research to do. That, yeah, there's a lot of things. For example, I'm going to spout off a list of things

of things that feel very neurodivergent, but are not actually, like, you can like these things without being nodivergent, just for a disclaimer. Dinosaurs, trains, trains are a big one. Dinosaur chicken nuggets, specifically. Mac and cheese. Mac and cheese is also a big one. Space, just outer space as a whole concept. Clocks, numbers, time. There are so many different things that are just like...

Like these are things that are more like intriguing to, you're saying? That if you have a particular... leaning towards. Okay. Like, if you were given the option of like a beautiful sirloin steak or dinosaur chicken nuggets, which one would you pick? If you pick the dinosaur chicken nugget, I would pick the dinosaur chicken nuggets. That's, that might indicate something.

I mean, there's just sort of childlike nature of autism that really, if you unmask, comes out and is so much fun to feed into. Like I've started buying myself fidget toys and stuffed animals and like, you know, squish mellows. If you like squish mellows, you might have some research to do because those things are just so soothing. They're so pleasing to the mind of a neurodivergent. Now, of course, none of these are mutually exclusive. you can like them without being noradivergent.

But there's just something about certain topics, certain food, certain things that are very home-like for autistic people. And you can find other autistic people or find just an autistic person to talk about being autistic with if you search these specific things. Like if you look up squish mellows on TikTok, you will find a neurodivergent person. I can guarantee it because those people who have rooms full of squish mellows are not neurotypical. There's just something about it.

I don't think I could find a neurotypical person who has an entire room full of squish mellows unless they're just like a collector. Yeah. But why would you be a collector if you're not neurotypical? I got it. So kind of going back to your therapist. So basically, after you kind of listed off things, yes. How did she decide to diagnose you?

Okay, so before I even got my therapist, I looked her up on psychology today, which is a great website for finding therapists. She, in her little bio, had listed that she had worked with autism and ADHD before. and that was really important for me because my previous therapist, yes, worked with autistic people, but wasn't very neuroaffirming for people who weren't obvious. So, excuse me. So I sent her an email to be like, hey, I want to get an autism diagnosis. What are your thoughts? And she responded very warmly.

and very neuroaffirming, and there was no pushback. I was really looking for the pushback. If there was any pushback, then I wouldn't have gone for it. Right. Because the first way that you know that a doctor, a therapist, anyone that you're going to isn't going to listen to you is if they don't even believe you when you put out that word in the first place. same thing with doctors if you think you say hey i might have this thing and they say i think you just have anxiety that's a red flag because they're not going to believe you their brain their mind has already shut you out right before the conversation has even started

so i wanted to look for an open conversation for something that i could easily go into and get a diagnosis without worrying about it at that point, I wasn't concerned about if I was going to get a diagnosis or not. I just wanted some answers. If it wasn't autism, I wanted to know what it was. So I explicitly said that I wanted a diagnosis. I wanted some assessment done. So we went through the process of what that would look like, and I took the assessments.

I think, I want to say there were like eight or so different assessments that I took. some of them were in person, some of them were online questionnaire style. The online questionnaires, there was over 300 questions that I answered about myself. The in-person, some of them were interviews, some of them were written things. I did a little computer test as well where basically you see letters flashing on the screen. and if it comes up with a specific letter, you're not supposed to press the space bar. For all other letters, press the space bar.

That letter don't press the space bar. That is the ADHD test for impulsivity. I did not do very well on the impulsivity thing. I was just like, there's a letter, press up. Right, wasn't supposed to. Exactly. So you did the test. So I did the tests and.

And then did you meet, you met with her? I did, yes. I meet with my therapist in person. So we, after she was done doing all the assessments, I had sent two different people their perspective of me, like a questionnaire about me. She was done analyzing all of that. And we had to sit down conversation about it. And I was diagnosed with four different things.

Okay. Shoot. So these impact me all in very different ways. and will definitely change my perspective from other autistic and ADHD people. So I was diagnosed with autism spectrum disorder, ADHD combined type, anxiety, generalized anxiety disorder, and otherwise specified trauma disorder. There's a longer name than that, but it's basically complex PTSD. It's not actually in the DSM complex.

The DSM is the official diagnostic. book. So complex PTSD is the sum of what that last one was. So basically I experience all of what PTSD is, except I've never experienced a what they call a criterion A event, which could, which is a more intense experience, like going to war, seeing someone die, stuff like that. So you experience the symptoms but haven't really had. I've never had something. that has been as intense as those things that are specifically for Criterion A. I have experienced much like, like, quote unquote, smaller things over a long period of time. And I think in general, like everybody experiences different sort of traumas.

Yeah. That can affect people in very different ways. Exactly. I was talking with my therapist about this. And what the conclusion, even she has, is that. because I have never experienced something to that degree, my experience is subjective to my own life. So just because I haven't seen someone die in front of me doesn't mean that I don't experience the symptoms of PTSD, of post-traumatic stress disorder. Now, this does not at all discount those people who do have PTSD, who have experienced those criteria in A experiences.

their experiences are different from mine. But within my subjective life of the things that I've experienced, the way that my brain and my body have reacted is very similar, if not identical to a lot of the people who have experienced those things. So they're not allowed to call it PTSD. So it's not PTSD. It's just a really long name. Yeah, got it.

So me having anxiety causes the, the way that masking and other things gives me a little bit more of a heightened sense of anxiety within myself. So if I didn't have anxiety disorder, my level of anxiety naturally would probably be higher than the average person because of being autistic. You just experience anxiety as an autistic person. But for myself, it is heightened from my own. my, from my standard level. So that's why I was diagnosed with that. So that, those four diagnoses, at first I celebrated.

I was so happy that I was right that I had almost like deduced it in my, in myself. And I left the therapist and then I felt so sad. Yeah. Because being autistic is really hard. Anyone who's seen an autistic person knows. Anyone who knows an autistic person knows that that autistic person's life is really hard from the way that they experience things. It's interesting too because I think it kind of gives a different perspective of like how hard it is.

Not even, I guess, to like, like not people might not see it on the outside, but how hard it is for you within. Like mentally. That is the whole reason why it went unnoticed for so long because autism, ADHD is all inside. It's so subjective to the person's experience, the internal workings of the mind. Yeah. And like there could be things here and there that come out that could be a red flag or make you be like, oh, well, that might be different. Right. But like overall.

But from an outside. Right. Exactly. Because I was able to hide it so well because I had been trained so. Yeah. like in such a perfect way. Right. To pretend to fit in.

And that's why two people will label it as like you being weird. Or that or different. Even most of the time if you go to a psychologist, psychiatrist, they will say, oh, you have borderline personality disorder or you have OCD. They just throw these labels on you instead of actually looking into what your experience is like. Yeah.

Because a lot of therapists historically have just been afraid of diagnosing autism because it doesn't look like autism. It just looks like you're a very emotional person or you're really obsessed with numbers. So OCD, you have these weird obsessions with people. BPD, it's just a cop out. But what is going on is so much more personal, so much more. in depth. And there are names for things like echolalia. For example, audio processing disorder. Sensory issues, having intense special interests, perseveration. These are all words that very aptly describe a lot of processes that go on in the mind. But if you have no idea what these words mean,

then how can you possibly tell your provider what's going on with you? That's one of the reasons why I think it's so important to talk about your symptoms, to talk about what you're experiencing, to have a label to put on those words so you can exchange the information with other people. Because if you can't, if you don't have the language to reach out for help, you can't reach out for help. And I think too to even understand your triggers in a way, like things that do affect you and bother you so that you can not put.

yourself in situations that might be harder for you. Yeah. So that's one of the things that has changed my life. Getting a diagnosis has naturally, I had been suspicious that I was autistic before I got my diagnosis, but having it confirmed and like gaining so much more access to resources has changed my perspective on myself, on the world, on how I have to exist in society. And even to educate like you're doing now. because I feel like it's so important.

Right. Because like you said, there's probably so many people that might not even know what's going on and might have some idea like, oh, like something might be different. But what, you know, and it's sad too because seeking out help through therapists might not even give you those answers right away if they don't even, if they're not really educated. Which is why I'm a firm supporter of self-diagnosis. There's a lot of people who say that self-diagnosis is like, oh, you're just making things up. you should really go to a doctor.

Well, sometimes doctors aren't accessible to people. No, I agree. Yeah. I think doing your own research is just as important as getting a professional opinion. Exactly. And multiple opinions too. The diagnosis doesn't even matter. For some things, it does in the sense of insurance.

You can get a diagnosis to get prescriptions for things. But if you're able to apply coping mechanisms for, for something, for autism, without a diagnosis and it works, that's all that matters. That's all that's really important. Is what's going to help you helping? Is what you're trying helping? That's really the important part. Because you can, for example, I am suspicious that I am suspecting that I have what's called

Eller's Danlos syndrome, which is very common comorbidity in. in neurodivergent populations, which is the fancy way to say I have tissue connectivity problems. So all of my joints hurt all the time. And I have partial or full dislocations of a lot of my joints as well, which can be very painful. For some people, this is entirely like they can't go places without mobility aids. It's very disabling. For me, I am privileged enough that it hasn't gotten that bad yet, yet, which is the important part. But because I'm able to quantify my experience with words, I can go to the doctor next week when I have my appointment and tell them about the fact that I'm having subluxations or partial dislocations of my doctor.

my joints. It is very uncomfortable when I'm walking and my toe dislocates in my shoe and I can't do anything about it. Same thing with like mental health problems. If you have words for it, it's really helpful, beneficial. It can change your life to get a diagnosis. Or like I've been doing, I have been buying supportive clothing. So, for example, I have knee braces, I have ankle braces, I have wrist braces that I use to help prevent pain before it happens. Like, if I wake up and I'm feeling like my kneecap is going to shift out of place sometime during the day, I can pull on one of my knee sleeves and not be in pain all day anymore. So I haven't gotten that diagnosis yet. but because I have a name for what's going on and I've looked up ways to solve it and I've tried

applying methods of dealing with the symptoms and it works for me, that's all that matters. Yeah. Now, the diagnosis would be very helpful again, for insurance purposes and just to make sure that that's actually what's going on and it's not something much worse. But, yeah, again, if fidget toys help you with your sanity, buy some fidget toys. It's really okay. Universal design is something that helps all of us. So, for example, doorknobs that have the L-shaped doorknob instead of the twist doorknob, help everyone. You don't have to have that twisting ability in your wrist.

You can use your fist to push the door open, like to push down on the knob and get the door open. You can use your elbow. If you're holding something, you can get it open without having to use your hand and twist. Same thing. Fidget toys, if they help calm you if you feel like they're improving your life, then that should be accepted. That should be something that we all choose to do more readily in our lives.

Have you become a part of any like support groups for autism or anything like that? I have yet to seek out support groups. I personally all of my friends are autistic and or ADHD. So I have built my own little support community. Yeah. Because. Which is important because everybody deserves to feel understood. Everybody.

Yeah. That's one of those things that's super, super important. Talking about your experiences with other people who share your experiences is really validating. You can find resources from them. Like if you're, say, for example, you're 15 and you're like, I don't know what's going on with me. You can talk to somebody who's like me, who's 22, who's experienced life as an autistic person and is now figuring out all of these cool ways to deal with things and all these resources that you can look up and you can take online assessments. They're not always the best, but you can do the

self-assessment checklists. Those are really awesome for being able to have an inkling of if you know what these words are, this might be what you're experiencing. And I've taken checklists for a lot of different things. I've taken self-assessments for a lot of different things. Anxiety, depression, autism, ADHD, OCD, even like I've gone into research on Tourette's and all kinds of other things, even though I don't necessarily have all of those things. Right. It checks off certain boxes and gets rid of things that I don't need to think about. Yeah. Like OCD, I don't have OCD. I've never experienced that.

So I was able to say, these are all the words that describe how OCD feels like in your body. And I don't experience that. So I don't have to worry about dealing with that. Same thing. If you resonate with me, you can look up an autism checklist. I think where is? I have a name. There is a name for a checklist that I have.

Let's see where it is. Samantha Kraft, unofficial autism checklist. So this is one of the checklists that I found after my diagnosis, but I resonate with a lot of the checklist. So I definitely recommend the Samantha Craft Autism Unofficial checklist. And if you resonate with it, you might seek a diagnosis or you might seek resources for yourself, even if you don't want a diagnosis or can't access a diagnosis. Just acceptance that something might be different even is important.

Like, it's okay to be different. It's okay to choose yourself. Right. You choose your healing journey by researching ways, by finding resources, by talking to people. And if you don't have autism, that's okay, too. You don't have to have autism. If you don't have autism, that might be better for you. I don't know.

I don't know what your experience is like. You don't know what my experience is like. So just be curious and open, you know, to the idea that doing something for yourself might help you or help someone else. Because even if you take the check list and say, I'm not really autistic, you can tell someone else who's curious about it. Right. Someone, one of your friends, one of your family members who starts talking. about it. It's like, I've been thinking about that I might be a little bit different. Oh, how are you, how are you thinking about? What do you mean? Why do you feel like you're different?

I just feel like I don't really understand social cues very well and I don't really get sarcasm and I feel like the lights are too loud. Oh, oh, I have something for you. You know, you can help people without being part of the community. You can be involved. You can be an. You can be an ally in that way. And I think too, like I said, I really like how you went about the episode, because I feel like there's so many different ways to carry each episode. And I always tell my guess, like, do your thing, however you want to approach it and feel comfortable doing that. But I really like that you shared your experience, but also it was very educational for me. And then I'm sure so many people watching and listening. So I appreciate that. I really do think

that there's probably going to be at least one person that watches that might not have a diagnosis or might not even, might not have even thought twice. It might be like, wow, like I really resonate with some of these things that she said, which I feel like is always the most important thing because I think, like I said, it's so important for people to feel heard and to feel like they can relate to people. Yes. So that's why I love to have so many different types of people on because I feel like there's always someone that someone can relate to, which is important.

I just think it's so important to talk about it. Yeah. To be open and everything. Especially in medical, mental health, all of those things are. just talking about it because if you if you don't talk about it you'll never know I agree if you don't think about it if you don't look into yourself you'll never you'll never you'll never know you'll or understand because a lot of people don't understand like I feel like even you know some people might some people might know that there's different levels and needs of autism some people might

not. Some people might generalize it as nothing. Some people might generalize it as like being completely disabled. Like who knows the people think. So I think that I always say education is key because understanding is the first step. I think in making people more accepting of everyone, which is important. Yeah. Because we live in a very evil world. We do. Yeah. And having the language to have community is so, so important. And it's it's not just for people. people in the community. It's also for people outside of the community. You might not experience autism, but you can be involved. You can support your friends who are autistic. You can learn how their brains work because, well, we spend our entire lives learning how neurotypical brains work. So

it might be nice for you to spend some time learning about how your autistic friends brain works. And it might even help you. You might discover that something helps you, you know. Yeah. So, yeah. Well, you did amazing. And thank you so much for coming on and educating and teaching us all something. It was great.

You did a great job. Yeah, thank you so much. Of course, of course. Enjoy today's episode.