We're All Insane - My Family Stole My Identity

Episode Date: March 23, 2026

-We're All Insane Plus for Bonus Episodes, Ad-Free Listening, Access to New Show, Guided Mediations: https://wereallinsane.com Growing up in Brazil, things looked pretty normal on the outside—but there were always weird things happening. Letters showing up in her name, people coming to the house asking for her… and none of it made sense at the time. When she was 12, she found out why. Someone in her own family had stolen her identity and created companies in her name, leaving her with a massive amount of debt before she was even a teenager. We talk about what that actually looked like growing up—dealing with legal issues as a kid, having her assets frozen at 18, and spending years trying to fix something she didn’t do. Renata’s Links: Instagram: @safewithrenata Documentary: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tU-lC6_801E Resource for victims of child identity theft: https://www.idtheftcenter.org/recover/ - Join We’re All Insane Mailing List for EXCLUSIVE Content + Discounts: https://mailchi.mp/6d0e5d7a3998/were-all-insane If you have a unique story you'd like to share on the podcast, please fill out this form: https://forms.gle/ZiHgdoK4PLRAddiB9 or send an email to [e-mail] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey guys, it's me Devorah. I just dropped an all new bonus episode inside my new subscription channel, We're All Insane Plus. This week's bonus episode is called My Brain was slipping into my spine. Listen now by subscribing to We're All Insane Plus inside your Spotify or Apple Podcasts app or go to we're all insane.com. Hi, my name is Renata first. And I had my identity stolen when I was six years old. and when I turned 18, I discovered that I had over $400,000 in debt in my name. And I was, the best way I can describe, I was prosecuted nonstop by the Brazilian justice system to pay debts that were never mine. So this is my story.

So I grew up in Brazil, in the south of Brazil, in a city name, Puerto Allegri, is right, like if you look the map is like the last state in Brazil right at the bottom border with Argentina and Uruguay so like the culture is very similar and I have a twin sister her name is Raphaela and she's like my best friend we're yeah super close and I had a happy childhood especially early childhood my mom she comes from a very big family they're like six kids between them and my grandfather and my grandmother from my mom's side, they're just amazing people. And yeah, you know, those families that there are gatherers, that you just have like Sunday lunch all the time and dinners together and super close.

So we grew up, me and my cousins is about 10 of us. And we are like brothers and sisters. You know, we're like extremely close to this day. We kind of grew up together. and the reason being is that we joke that there is a family curse but all the women get divorce so yeah most of us were raised in the quote-unquote broken home but it didn't feel that way because they almost like created their own little community like the sisters yeah like the sisters just raising their kids together and having that support system right so it was

was yeah amazing happy childhood I can only say that but I have this memory when I was about five or six I can't remember exactly because you know when you're at that those early memories is it's hard to pinpoint the exact age I remember that a family member a man took me my sister to a government agency and we were We had to sign some papers, right? And the way that it was said to me, it was like a cool thing. You know, I was becoming responsible. I was becoming, I was having adult responsibilities.

And I was six, right? Six or five, I can't remember exactly. And I signed a document, which was the equivalent of the Social Security here in the US. But there in Brazil is the CPF. and at the time you were not born with it. So you only had to get it when you were 18 unless your parents needed to open before that. So for whatever reason, they wanted to open

the Social Security in my name at the time and my sister. So how did they do that though if it wasn't your parent? No, so my mom authorized. Oh, yeah. So it's part of the story is that she did. alter eyes later I found out why okay so they alter eyes and then I signed it and I remember that I was learning how to write and I was like so nervous to sign my name in this document that it was gonna be with me and like for some reason I knew that and

I made a mistake so like I was like oh no I made a mistake they're like no it's okay just write over it and I wrote over it and I signed my life away at the time and I had no idea, right? I have this document with me to this day with like my child, little child letter. It means a lot to me because it just reminds me where I came from and where I am now.

So that happened, and then things just got out of control. That's the best way I can say it. And nothing with your twin though, right? Yes, for her. It was the same thing. Okay. Yes.

So it wasn't just to you? No, it was me and her. So at the time, the best way I can describe my mom is so funny what the memory, the way you remember things. I remember her, like, she's so beautiful. And I remember her just being so beautiful and so caring and so loving. But like in my memory, she has no voice. Like she was just, like I, in my memory, I remember her black and white. no voice and it was because she was in a very abusive relationship where she didn't have a say right

she didn't and i don't know to this day everything my mom been through in that relationship but i know it was tough because she couldn't stand up for herself and many times she couldn't stand up for us you know as little girls but then the the person that was in in her life left. And I have this very specific memory that in Brazil is like very part of the Brazilian culture, like especially for the woman to get your nails done in the saloon. And I remember when my mom was like then, it was just her. Her and her kids, we were little still like eight about that time.

She's like, we're going to go to the nail salon, we're going to get our nails done. And we went. And I remember my mom got her. her nails, the color she chose was like bright red. And I remember thinking, Mom, that's not allowed. Because the person that was with her used to say that that was something that a woman that is right, is correct, doesn't do. Like use red nails or red lipstick.

It was not allowed. And she was doing it. And she said, she told me, Renato, we can do whatever we want. And she painted her nails bright red. And every week she'll go to the salute. and she'll paint her nails bright red. And every time that I need to feel strong, I have bright red nails.

Now when I do that, my husband looks at me and say, oh, she's ready to fight. You know, it's when I need. Because it became like a symbol of independence and strength. And it was from that moment that my mom started to fight for me. I didn't know everything that was happening. I was just a kid. The things that I knew was that.

and I started to notice is, you know, at the time, male was everything. We lived in the house with an uncle and a cousin, and the male man will come and bring the letters, and then we will go through the letters. We were kids, and there were many, many letters in my name. And I could recognize my name, Renata, first, Galvon, that's my full name, and my sister's name as well, but just focusing on my story, so I could see a lot of letters arriving in my name all the time and my mom told me not to open because there was adult things and I wouldn't understand but I was a little girl so I very I used to dream that it was a prince writing to me and he wanted

to take me to a castle and I love the Cinderella story so I would steal some letters and hide under my pillow so I could open at night and try to read but whenever I would open I would just find a bunch of numbers and words that made no sense to me at a time, like final notice, violation, death. And that was it. I had no idea what it meant. It was adult things. I thought that it was normal.

That was it. The other thing that I started to notice is that some men would knock in our door and very aggressively say, Renata first go, go, come to the door. Renata first go, go, like, boom, boom, boom. And I was told by the adults around me to hide. when that happens but sometimes when they were not so aggressive in their approach I will come to the door like oh it's me and they will always be shocked like you are and yes and they would like didn't know what to say but it happened once that they made some notes in the paper and then

they came in and took our TV in our couch and for me as a little girl looking all of this I had no idea what it was happening around me. Later, I found out that those men's were government officials looking for, how'd you say, looking for things that I owed so they could take it to contribute towards the payment of a debt. Which I'm sure, too, like in a child's mind, you obviously have no idea what any of that means and what's happening. And I can see how potentially that would lead to a child feeling like, what am I doing wrong, that things are getting taken because of me? Exactly. I didn't associate that it was because of me, but I knew it was something because they would say my name. Right.

You know, and I became very anxious. I was a very anxious little girl because it was just so much mystery around me. But at the same time, at the time, it was just me, my mom and my sister. We were happy. You know, my mom is amazing. I even get emotional. And she gave me an amazing childhood despite all this craziness. But it happened that I don't know for sure, but I think that one government official discover all our story. I think maybe my mom told him. And he just, yeah, he really felt sorry. So I think he made sure that all the time was him getting our case because then he would

go to our house all the time and I think he would write in his paper not at home. And he will come in and will make coffee. and cake and he would hang out for a little bit and then he would leave and that was it so like angels also appeared in our lives along the way so when I was 12 years old so this kind of continued but it was like periods that would slow down and then other periods that would like it will become again letters letters people coming but we had periods years that nothing would happen. So when I was 12, I started to happen again the letters and I was already old enough that I could open it and kind of understand that this was something that didn't make sense.

So one day I went to school and I asked my best friend, do you get letters in your name like by the government or something? She's like, no. I described to her how the letter looked and she Nope, that doesn't happen to me. So I ask everyone in my classroom that day, do you get letters? You get letters. It looks like this. Nope, nope, nope, nope. I'm like, okay, this is not normal.

Because when you grow up in that situation, you don't know anything else, right? So I'm thinking, this is part of life. You're a citizen in this country and the government comes check on you. You know what I'm saying? Like, I had no idea. but at 12 I found out that it wasn't normal. So I went to my house that day and I was waiting for my mom to come back from work with the letter open and then she came and I said, mom, what is this?

I ask everyone in my school today. They told me this is not normal. And she's like, okay, I think it's time that I tell you. So she sat down with me and she explained to me. Renata, when you were six years old, two companies were opened in your name. It was a pizzeria and a ceramic shop. The person that did it was the family member and I authorized under... She didn't say that at the time, but I know now that it was coercion.

Like, she didn't mean... She didn't know that all of this would happen. I authorized because I thought it was going to be a good thing for you. that's what it was said to me, that you were going to grow up already with assets, with already a lot of assets in your name and a name in the market, and I thought I was signing your name for a bright future. But that's not what happened. The companies failed after two years, and a lot of money is owned to the government. In Texas, and also those entities, those companies, there were actual people that worked for them, and then when it fell, they stopped getting paid,

they had their labor rights violated. So there were also lawsuits against the company from former employees or business partners. And what happens is that when you're suing a company and the company is not under operation anymore, it felled. It was open when I was six and fell when I was eight. and so there were no assets against that company so what they do in the brazilian justice system and i think here is also similar is that they disconsider the the physical entity of the company and they look for the owner the owners so they can go after the owners to pay the debt

and i was there as a six-year-old girl there was another business partner there which was was the person that did it, but he disappeared from the country. So they would look for him, wouldn't find it, and so they would go after me, and I was just a little girl. But my mom told me at the time, like, but don't worry about it. I'm fighting this, and I will make sure that this is resolved so you can start a life, have a normal life, because it starts to become a big problem when you are already an adult and you work and you have your own assets and then they can take it from you so at the time i was still a child i had nothing in my name right i was a 12-year-old girl girl so my mom was going to fight it to make sure when i turn 18 this was resolved but hearing that

like imagine this you're like 12 you're building your identity just figuring out who you're you are in the world you're a teenager you're you know I always been the type of personality I always been is like someone that I like to be good I like to study I like to get good grades like my thing was reading books and I was very proud of who I was of like being always the good student and I take I took so much pride in that and I'm not never getting in trouble like that was so important to me and I know now why. Like I never wants to be in trouble and to always be correct.

And just to learn at 12 that that was taken for me, that I was already in trouble. Like the government was already looking for me. They already, I had so much debt in my name already. I had already done something bad even though it wasn't me. And that's the thing with identity

is that I always say, identity theft is and what happened to me was identity child identity tough but identity death is a crime where the victim is guilty until you can prove that you were not because is your name there is your social security and it was just so crazy to me I would say to my mom but a mom they can see the dates right obviously it wasn't me like I was born in 1990 this all happened in 96, 97, 98. Of course it wasn't me. Just like, I know, that's what I'm trying to fight it.

But I'm going to talk a little bit about the emotional side and then go back to like the the loss side of the things. Hearing that, that I was already in trouble, it broke me. I entered into a severe deep depression at 12. I didn't want to live anymore because. I remember thinking, what is the point of trying? What's the point of even trying to be someone? If it was already decided for me that I have this amount of debt and I'm already in trouble

and government officials look for me is very traumatic. So I was severely depressed. I couldn't get out of bed. And again, the memory is so interesting to me how your memory. things because I remember that period of my life. Everything was black and white and it was always raining. Every day was raining. I know it was not true because I was in that state for a year, so it's impossible to rain every day for a year, especially in Brazil, but that's my memory. And I was just really sad because I felt betrayed by the people that were supposed to protect me.

So it was a really tough period for me. But my mom, when she got out of that abusive relationship, she was working a lot, like in companies, doing different things, and then also studying at night to be a psychologist, which was her dream to be a psychologist. And I was in her graduation, actually. I was nine years old when she graduated, and I'm very proud of her. So at the time she was already working as a psychologist,

so she immediately knew what was happening and she put everything to take me out of that state. So I had a psychologist and I started to take medication because it was needed because I was in a mindset that was really dangerous of not wanting to live, really. So after a year of therapy and taking the right medication, I finally got out of that. so I was about 13 and I think I was fine for a year and then at like around 14 I developed anorexia so I was it started with like the need to control what I put in my body and through therapy and looking back I know that that happened because I lost control of my identity in society financially I was already in ruins even though I hadn't even started my life and it wasn't me so it was a need to I need to I need to control what I can control because that mess was already

decided for me I can't change that I don't know what to do so I had this obsession of controlling the food I'll put in my body and then it started like with just a normal diet and lose some weight and then it developed to know today I'm only going to eat two apples and I would like beat myself up if I didn't do that you know even though it was so unrealistic goals but it was all everything was a way of me to try to control my my person my being because I felt that I had lost control of that if that makes sense so that happened and then I again my mom put all efforts to take me out of there, go to a different psychologist to deal with that. And my teenage years were really, really tough. And it was not the usual tough teenage years

of like, you could part of too much and you experience drugs or whatever. It wasn't that. It was just me dealing with this realization of what had happened to me, the betrayal. I'm Anna Garcia, host of True Crime News, the podcast. Every week we bring you in-depth coverage on cases making headlines as well as those that go under the radar. Tune in for murders that defy explanation, mystery seeking exploration, and shocking secrets that will leave you breathless. Each week, we honor the victims by going beyond the salacious in our search for justice. Crime never stops, and neither do we.

Listen to true crime news available now wherever you get your podcast. A lot of emotional and psychological consequences out of it. So I was able to... be I think there was one specific day that I considered that I was good like I wasn't depressed anymore I wasn't didn't have anorexia anymore I never got to a dangerous level of thinness even though I did get very thin because my mom was very quick to act and get me the support that I needed so it was I was 16 when I finally got out of that because I got better from the eating disorder quite quickly, but then I kind of went into the depression again, and it was kind of like back and forth.

But there was specific day when I was 16 that I remember walking home from school and thinking, I think I'm okay. And I look at the ground and there was a leaf, and I'm like, I took the leaf and I'm like, this is the day that I'm good. I'm out of this mess and I have this leaf with me to this day. Yeah, it's just my little treasure box to remind me of my past. But going back to the judicial side of things, so I didn't really know everything that was happening because I was in that state of depression and anorexia and it's just like dealing with so many emotions.

So my mom kept me out of it for all this time. while she was in the background fighting it with lawyers and everyone that could help her resolve this. So what was happening was that my mom was fighting it and she went to the Child Protective Services like this was done with my daughters and they were like, we don't deal with that. We don't deal with that type of problems. They didn't know how to help us. So she went to different lawyers and they tried to fight it. in the justice court.

And she told me that there was a session that the judge said, I recognize she was a child, but there is no precedence. In Brazil, you can do that. And there is nothing that would allow me or tell me that I can clean her name or write off this debt that just isn't. There is no precedence. That makes me so angry. Because sometimes things are just obvious.

Yeah. I was eight. Could I have done this? Absolutely not. I was playing with Barbies at that age. But you're not going to help me because there is no precedent. Right. That's just ridiculous.

And I feel like, you know, you're not the one to blame. You didn't have any idea. Yeah, exactly. So my mom fought, fought, fought, thought. Nothing. And they couldn't do anything to the family member? Well, they were looking after him, but he just was gone from the country. Okay, so he left too.

Yep. Him and then the other, there was somebody else working with him, right? You said? So there was somebody else. There was a business partner. I only know the name because I can see in the court documents. But they both kind of flood. Yes.

Okay. I just have no idea about this other person, actually. Got it. And then as far as your sister goes, was she? kind of asking the same questions you were around the same age or was she not as like with the letters and stuff like that was she not looking at them yeah she was not looking at them as much we are twin sisters but we have different personalities completely right i was like a little investigator and i was also very sensitive so everything that i've been through in my child in my teenage years she she didn't go

through that. She was being a normal teenager. She was going to school and being happy and but it affected her later in life. I think that breaking that, realizing that we were betrayed because we were. It happened at different stages in our life. Yeah. But was it explained, like when your mom was explaining it to you when you were 12, was it kind of, was it a conversation with both of you guys or just you? It was just me. Okay. So, when did she find out? No, she also found out around the same time. Okay.

Then my mom was like, you know, I can tell one and tell others. So she had the conversation separately with my sister. Got it. But I think my sister was just like, whatever. Yeah, she didn't think much into it. Okay. Can I go back? Which I feel like most kids would because it's like why deep dive into something you can't

understand. But when you have a personality, you know, that you care about those things. It's almost like it reminds me of an old soul, you know, like you knew. I've always been an old soul always been so yes because yeah like if I look back could I have ignored and just yeah I could have

then I wouldn't have been you yeah but I just couldn't right I knew that something was wrong and I needed to find the answers so my mom tried to fight it all our childhood all our teenage years and it was just nothing to be done

and but she paid a lot lot of it. So my mom worked and worked and worked and worked and she paid a lot of it. My grandfather, her dad, paid a lot of it as well and then at some points a lot of the issues prescribed because they just couldn't find assets. Not in my name, I was still a kid, not in the family members name, so they kind of just prescribed and I went dead. So turn 18 decided that I wanted to be a journalist because you know a little investigator and me so I started college and started studying it and I was very happy I got a job and I was working for like a teenage magazine like writing writing for them and I was had my credit

card and you know I had a little bit of money not much because it was just you know initial phases of your working life but I have my money there and then one day I'm driving to school because I used to work all day and then study at nights at the university like during night time so I could work during the day so I was driving to the my university I used to go at night and then I got a phone call and it was my bank and they asked are you are not to first go phone said yes that's me they verified it was mean and they said look we got a court order and all your assets were frozen to contribute towards a payment of a debt. And I'm like, okay, so everything is gone.

They're like, yes. And I remember feeling so ashamed and like so affected. And then I said, but I try to explain it. I said, but look, if you look at the dates, you know, I was just eight, like it wasn't me. And she said, and I was just trying to explain myself. And I remember she said, it was a woman. And she said, sweetie, it doesn't matter. It was a court order.

We have to follow it. And then it just froze my assets and everything was taken to contribute towards his debt. And there was nothing I could do. When I tell this story, no one can believe me that I had no defense, but I'm here to tell you I had no defense. It didn't matter that I was a girl. There was no freaking precedent. It was allowed.

It still is. That's the other part of my story, but it still is allowed in Brazil. The civil code permits parents to use their child's names. As long as you have the parents' authorization, you can do it. But if anything goes wrong and that child turns 18 and they start working and have their own assets, those assets can be used to pay. Got it. towards the debt because someone needs to pay that's right now right once you start building things

up and you have something they're like oh well we're going to start taking exactly but it was nothing to do with those companies like I didn't inherit anything yeah I had no money from that mess nothing right I inherit 400,000 dollars in debt that's what I inherit so then okay that happened then the law of my mom's lawyers would check and they were like okay I think things prescribed it's fine so then I would have a bank account again and I was working and this is like 18 19 20 and then out of nowhere another debt would appear and a court case would be reopened because they can do that if they want and then court order boom freeze my assets and everything was taken for me again and then that just kept

happening like so every time you'd like save up money they would just take from it yes court order i'd like open my bank accounts like a like at the time i didn't have an app but like i would just check my bank account would be like court order money taken and it was i just felt like it was just a never-ending story also it's like you can't grow that way you can't build anything for yourself exactly so then my mom just said to me I am so sorry, but the best way is for you not to have anything in your name, because whatever you have, they would take. So I just decided that I was not going to have anything in my name.

But what that means is that I became a financial ghost. I had no name. I didn't have rights to my name because whatever I tried to build, they would take for me. so that meant thankfully I have an amazing mom so I could use her name so like I would work get paid and then I could transfer to her or I would use her credit card but I had no rights to my own name because whatever I would do they would take it and I think to answer her question I think that's when I hit to my sister okay because the same was happening to her right and she also didn't have rights to her own name, she also couldn't have anything in her name. Nothing, nothing, nothing, nothing

in your name. Even like if you want to later in your life do a financing of a house and you buy a house, they can take your house, they can take your car. So you have nothing in your name. You just become non-existence, non-existent in society, which is so emotionally damaged. And what? What do you do when you don't have a good mother that you can rely on their name? You know, you start to rely on other people, maybe, you know, a boyfriend or whatever. And it's a very dangerous precedent. So to answer that freaking judge, there you go. This is a dangerous precedent to set.

But that was our lives. So I was 21 and I was just like so done with that. I'm like, I'm just, I can't live like this. Like, I can't have anything in my name. Like, I just can't pay all this debt. It was just too much money. So I was still studying, working also during the day, and I was searching online. I'm like, I just want to try, like, travel somewhere, go to a country.

And I always loved South Africa. I learned about the story of Nelson Mandela, and that was just something that resonated with me and gave me sense of hope and freedom. So I just remember searching like journalism, internship, Cape Town, South Africa. Because I really wants to go to Robin Island, which is where Mandela was in prison for so long

is in Cape Town. So I remember searching that and then a peer internship opportunity for a magazine. The big issue, South Africa, that's the name. So I applied and I got the position. And my English was like really not the best And I'm like, I'm just going to go there figure it out.

Yeah. Like it was basic. I could kind of communicate, but like to be a journalist. I'm like, I'm just going to make it work. Right. So I told my mom and she's like, I support you, go for it. So I booked my trip, got my visa. I was like the visa process.

Oh my gosh. I've been through hell because I'm like, they're going to see that I have all this debt. They're not going to accept me in the country. Who would? Right. Who would accept someone that has so much debt? But either they didn't check or they just didn't care, but I got my visa. Yeah, I got my visa.

And how long did that take? Was it pretty quick? It was pretty quick. I think it was maybe two months. Okay. Yeah. So then I got it. But I was like going to stay for four months to do.

The internship was for four months. And I'm going to go just for that period and then come back. That was the idea. So I went and I just fell in love with Cape Town, the most beautiful city. in the world. I love it. I recommend everyone going, and I started to work,

and it was, yeah, I was renting a room in this big house with a lot of people, and there was a lot of international students, and there were, like, girls from the U.S. and Canada

and other countries in Africa. And I remember that they were all there for different internships as well, but they were like, I mean, we're all 20, 21, so they were like, kind of doing

their internship was like partying all the time right and as always me I was like no party yeah just work I'm like working and I'll go arrive early I will leave late and I wanted to because my English was not that good so I would you know do my best at work with the English I had but then come back home and study study English and try to improve myself and I just would never go out and then my second week there my friends were like we're not you need to go out like you just work like this is ridiculous you're in south africa like let's just go have fun i'm like i don't feel like like okay so let's just go to this bar that is like in the corner of our house we have a drink that's all i'm like okay fine and i went like i really didn't feel like it i felt

like i wanted to work but i went with them so i met this bar and then this guy comes to me and he's like hi i'm brian and he was a south african guy very good looking And I started to talk with him and I fell in love. And we've been together for 13 years. Wow, that's incredible. I love that. Yeah. So I met my husband that night.

It was my second week in South Africa. And that's why I just believe, like, throughout my journey is always God there. You know, like, I'm in Brazil, south of Brazil. He's in South Africa. What are the chances of us meeting? And I met the love of my life. So we fell in love like in three days. And I'm like, guess I'm staying.

I'm not going back. So I told my mom, mom, I fell in love and I'm staying in South Africa. Think about that. I was 21. My husband was actually 20. And she's like, okay, it's a bit soon. And I'm like, I know, but I just, I'm so sure. And he had the same conversation with his parents.

Like, I'm just so sure. she's my wife my future wife and then we moved in together like in a few months we started living together and i you know sorted out my visa to stay longer and he was still studying at university i drop off university in brazil didn't continue and i yeah i had to find jobs to to support myself and stay so like i got a job like in the call center and i would work through the night and but then during the day I would do my freelance journalism and it was just like it was I love that period of my life because it was just like hustling and just being with this man I loved and I was just so happy but I was just always afraid of when are they going to freeze my assets here when are they going to figure it out that I owe so much money in Brazil and they're going to start to freeze my assets

and I remember thinking well I need to tell my partner this because it's important so I sat him down and I told him and I said I'm just really afraid that because I'm working here and at the time I was supporting both of us because he was studying so in South Africa I think is similar to here when you go to university is like a full day yeah you can't choose to just study at night like in Brazil you could so he had to start study and he would do like our jobs working like restaurants and bars but like I was the main person supporting both of us and our rent so I just said I think I'm going to have to start when I get money from the company I'm working maybe I transferred to your name and it was just such an awkward conversation to have and then he said I'm pretty sure that doesn't transfer from

one country and another and I'm like really like I didn't know so he spoke with his dad his dad is amazing he is my dad you know I didn't really have a dad but he became my dad and I love him and my my mother-in-law, so she's amazing, my second mom. So he told me he's an economist, so, you know, Brian, my husband spoke with him, and he confirmed, yeah, no, it doesn't. And for the first time, I could have a name. Like, I just, I could be a normal adult. Yeah.

It was incredible. Like, and that's just such a basic thing, isn't it? Just to be able to. Right, it's something we take for granted. We don't even realize the value at holds. Exactly. Like just to have a bank account, just to work and be able to get, have things in your name without the fear of that being taken by the government, by court orders.

And I could just have a normal, completely normal life. And it was just amazing. And I was, I lived there in South Africa for 11 years. Me and my husband, we built a life together eventually. Hi, guys. you can subscribe now to We're All Insane Plus for only $5.99 a month. And it includes ad-free listening, bonus episodes of We're All Insane, guided meditations, exclusive access to my brand new show We're All Healing,

and first access to new merch drops and discounts on merch. To get instant access to We're All Insane Plus, you can subscribe inside of Apple, Spotify, and YouTube, or you can go to we're all insane.com. So, okay, so then we had a normal life, and then the problems in Brazil never got resolved. My sister was still there, and she could never have anything in her name. She's still there to this day. She could never have anything in her name, and there was just nothing we could do. But one day we were talking, like thinking, because, you know, I want to resolve this,

I don't want to have this ghost in the back of my mind. You're like hanging over your head. Yeah, and also I want my sister to have a normal life. So you start to consult with other lawyers. What can we do? So there was this lawyer. And at that time I was in Brazil because I would go often to visit. So we had a meeting with her and she said, look, I think there is a way.

It's risky because it's risky to try. And I don't even know if it's going to help you. But what you and your sister can do is that you can go to the police. station and open a case of identity theft but it's going to be against the person who did it but also your mom because she authorized so you can try that and then if it's proven that it was the case then maybe maybe I can try to ride off the debt and it goes to your mom and we just heard that I said nothing my mom said nothing We drove back home and we never spoke about it.

Like we both knew that that was just not an option. I would never do that. And speaking with my mom, I just said, tell me like what happened. You know, why did you alterize? And her answer surprised me. Like it surprised me so much because I thought she was going to tell me, I just trusted this person and they said that you were going to have a name in the market and I thought it was going to be good for you.

And it was kind of that, but she also told me that that person was extremely manipulative. And my mom was going through a really tough time in her relationship. And things were just falling apart and she was lost. And then this person kind of said, God wants this because your kids will then have a name and things will stay within the family. And we're going to be able to grow in the pastor from the church, that they would go agree that that was a good idea. So talk about manipulation and coercion to a woman that was already beaten down

and didn't have a voice. And to hear that from a pastor as well, like someone that said to her that this was going to help whatever we were into. And I know that it's not making much sense because I don't say publicly who it was and I'll explain later why. So it's kind of like a bit weird, but like that's what happened and what I feel comfortable sharing publicly. And my mom has so much guilt to this day. But I know that it wasn't her fault. I don't blame my mom. I do not blame her for a second. She was also a victim. And I think we're, we love.

lack so much protection for children, but also for women and man. There are in positions of a relationship where they don't have a voice, you know, and they don't understand. And I love that you're giving me the space to come here because you talk a lot about abuse. And I think we, as society, we don't talk enough about financial abuse. And it's real and it's happened. and is not recognized so people don't even know that they are going through that right like they don't know the signs of what to look for exactly yeah exactly so my only

possible defense was just impossible for us so we laughed it but then I'm in South Africa I have a normal life and then I was working as a journalist during the day like freelance journalism to Brazil, two publications in Brazil, I'll go live on TV to report about South Africa and then at night I would work on that cow center which was the thing that made me the most money so it was very busy life but I loved it and then when I was I was always on the field looking for stories during the day and in South Africa you have what they call the townships so it's like you have like the city center and then quite far from the city you have what they call the

townships which were built during apartheid government to kind of exclude people based on race, which is absolutely horrible and is obviously illegal, but it's still like that. Like the majority of the poor population still lives on those townships. And that's where I would cover a lot of the stories that I was writing as a journalist of like abuse and a lot of child abandonment and things like that, and I would be there often, right? And I promise you, I was, whenever I went, I was the only white person around, so much so they would call me lungu. So that's like white person in Kosa, which is the local language. So I was just known as the lungu in Kailicha is the name of the township that I was always in.

So then one day I was there just looking around and someone told me that they found a baby in the trash. and this baby was going to be taken to a shelter to a mama's house. So the way that there's a lot of unfortunate kids abandonment and things like that in that area. And then the way that it works is that they found a shelter. And all the shelters in those areas safe houses are run by mamas, which are like this older African woman that just help the kids and take them under their own house. It's not an orphanage, like their own house. they take them.

So someone told me that and I'm like, I'm gonna go see maybe there is a story. So I get there. You know, it's just this shack is like a zinc house. Like just a zinc house like made out of zinc. Very, very simple, but it was like big inside. And I was just full of kids. And I arrived and there's just this mama with like the biggest smile.

Just welcome me. And that's when I met Mama Sylvia. and I met the little boy that was found, Kamvaletto. And I sat down with Mama and she was telling me about how she does things and she takes the kids. And then she told me, I'll never forget. She said, you know, we have a problem in the township because people don't register the kids. So when they grow up, they have no name. And that was like, I know how that feels like.

Yeah. You know, I've been through that in a different way. but I know how that feels like and that just hit me and she's like but I don't do that because your name you're like your certificate your birth who you are your ID number is not just that it's like who you are in society it's how you kind of exist in the system so what she did is when a child would arrive with no registration she registered them as their her kid and she would just welcome them and I promise you that was like a very poor house very poor conditions but the happiest kids and she like had this little thing that she kept that was like all their documents and she was

so important to her and that resonated to me in a way that I can't even explain to you because I knew how important that was to have someone that would care for your identity and like really care for that that resonated with me and I'm like mama what do you need she's like no I think I'm okay just this house is a bit hot during summer and when it rains it pours because it's the zinc house so it would just flood inside and I was so reckless I was so young it was 23 at the time I looked at her and said mom I'm going to build you a house and she's like no don't say that sissy I said, I'm going to build you a house. Just write that down.

And I left the day and I said, this woman is already a mom. She has 21 kids at her care at that time. And she gives them the best life. All she needs is a concrete house. I'm going to build them a house. I don't know how yet, but I will. And so I did an online campaign, a crowdfunding campaign. I got some friends in Brazil like, let's do this.

and I was good at storytelling. So I went there and I recorded Mama telling her story and I used the skills I had as a journalist and recording a video and just putting the story on YouTube and started to share and last raise money. It was a Brazilian website because most of my contacts were there.

But it's like a go-fund me type of thing. And it went viral. Wow. And we raised the money and we built her house. That is incredible. Yes. It's the thing in my life that I'm the most proud of. It was a pivotal moment.

It was a pivotal moment. And I think it's incredible too because like you said, it resonated with you so much. You understood it. And it was something where it seemed like someone understood you when probably a lot of people either wouldn't or it wouldn't even cross their minds. Yeah. Like how important an identity is. Exactly. And I never told Mama my story, and I think to this day she doesn't know, I'm still in contact with her.

But, yeah, she just understood me. And I just, I wanted to help someone like her that stands up for children in a way that I wish it would have done to me. Yeah. You know? So, yeah, we built her house. It was crazy because do you know what it takes to build a house? Right. Yes.

I did it. I'm like, I'm going to build her house. Right. I'll do it myself. Yeah. I kind of learned on the way. So it was like, it's good to tell now when people are like, oh, that's amazing. But like, it was so stressful when I did it.

Because then when we got the money, I'm like, now I have all this money. And now like I need to build this house and then look for architects. And then I look someone from the community like in Kylie to do it. So we could also help the community and create jobs. How long did it take? It was actually quite quick. But I think it took about like eight months. Okay.

Yeah. I wasn't that bad. Yeah. But then I'm like, where are they going to live? Right. I needed to build in the place that she owned that piece of land. Right. I'm like, oh my gosh, I didn't think about that.

And then one day I'm like, okay, so I go there. I'm like, Mama, where are we going to live? Uh-huh. Because my apartment is very small. I can't have a twin ticket. Right. She's like, no, no, no. It's all sorted out.

You come here. You help me take all the zinc out. and the neighbor has a piece of land that I can build another zinc there house temporarily and we're going to live there and I'm like okay and then I get a bunch of friends

we all go to Kyleita one afternoon and we destroy the zinc house and get all this stuff and put to the other piece of land and then the community is coming to build the zinc house temporary and they like put it up in like hours it's like crazy right

and then they live there while we were building it and yeah I have many beautiful videos of that period of us taking out the zinc house and then mama like in the middle of her land they're like hugging me and all their friends that were helping and saying like I'm going to have my house here and we built her a house and now they have that and I remember mama used to call me a lot and I remember we built her house that had been a few months already there in that house and then she she called me. It was a day that it was raining a lot in Cape Town. And she called me. I'm like, Mama, is everything okay? She's like, sissy. Do you know how good is the smell of rain?

And I'm like, what? She's like, do you know that all this years, whenever rain, I would just be stressed and taking buckets because it's going to flood the zinc house, right? It's like, it has a lot of openings. So water will go inside. And now I can just enjoy the smell of rain. And I'm like, yeah is the things we take for granted you know so that was like a beautiful moment of of my life and it kind of already started to resignify my pain helping others it's the pain that that just gives us the energy to move forward right so it was a way to help when i couldn't really help myself or my sister to be honest because there was nothing you could do so but yeah so i was already a little bit tired of being a journalist. I was not seeing it. So mind you, at the time,

I was 26, 27, and then I was still doing freelance work as a journalist, but they had to pay me in Brazil. Okay. So like I had a bank account there for that, but my mom's lawyer told me, I think it's fine. Everything prescribed has been so long. There's nothing we can see in your name. but it's like I call it what I've been through and people that go through identity staff go through as remission you're never cured it's like there's nothing appearing right now so I think you're fine but something might appear out of nowhere so I never really knew so but then I'm like okay I need to find a job that I really love because this life of doing what I love during the day and then working on a call

center at night to just killing my vibe So I start looking for like a full-time job that is going to give me good money to support myself and I like. So I started looking and I find this job for a research analyst for a company in Cape Town to research criminal cases in Brazil. And I'm like, wow, this is so interesting. I never heard about this. So I applied and I got the job because I spoke the language and I needed to research. never knew how to research criminal cases. So I started it and that's where I discovered the industry that I work right now and I fell in

love, which is the anti-financial crime industry. So there is a whole industry that provides data and solutions like to banks so they can protect people and the institutions from financial crime, from money laundering, from identity tap from fraud. So I was a researcher for a database that collected information of cases to the banks. And I was working and I loved my job. I was so proud and I had to research criminal cases. So every morning I would arrive at work and the first thing that we would do is to look at the court orders that for that day that were freezing money. Because most of the times when you have a court order to freeze a bank account.

It might be related to a criminal case, especially for money laundering. So, like, we would get that court order the name of the person and do further investigation. So one day I arrived at work, and my name is there. Uh-uh. Mm-hmm.

In that website. Court order against Renata first go home. Freeze all her assets. So how old at this point? 27. Okay. So all the money I had in Brazil. from my freelance journalism gone.

They took everything. And it just came up again out of nowhere, basically. Out of nowhere, yes. And then, but that was the year that I was going to get married. So it was like that money that they took was the money I was saving to buy my wedding dress. It was not a lot, but it was a lot for me at the time. But that was not even the worst part.

It was seeing my name in that site. And everyone in my company saw it. so they asked me to be only for two days so I couldn't work for two days until they investigated and then they asked me to come and explain myself to the head of research I can't tell you how nervous I was I'm sure because at the time I'm like it's just such a difficult thing of like it's not me but the system doesn't care they say it's me so everything everyone's going to think I'm guilty. No one's going to trust me. Now I need to go there. Tell the story

that sounds like everything is alive because it's so crazy. But, you know, I was just so anyway, so I go there and I tell my story and I was like shaking. Like shaking. And I tell them everything about the story.

They're like, okay, not your fault. I start working again. And I had some restrictions though. Like I couldn't research criminal cases in my state. where it happened in case they found something in my name and then it was me covering and then I was gonna you know yeah so it was still embarrassing because I could continue to work with restrictions and that was emotionally devastating again so at that time I was like strong emotionally but just my body

was like no this is just too much so my my body started attacking itself I started to lose hair and like So I developed allopetia. I had like ball spots all over my head. And it was from stress. From like, I finally found a career that I love and I'm so proud of it. And now I have. It's ripped away again. Yeah.

Like I can still work, but I have restriction. People look at me with suspicion. But it was my life. And I just continue. But then that same year, my mom's lawyers, because then they took my money. And then my mom called me. say oh good news we got the money back and she sent me the money back but I know she didn't I know she took her money and gave it to me so I could buy my wedding dress it was from her own

account and then actually one of my aunts she she bought my wedding dress for me as a gift and then that same year my mom called me and she's like your name is clear and I said what she's like we cleared your name and I'm like no you're lying she's like yep it's done So my name was finally cleared and nothing was going to come back. They could prove it. And the reason was because my mom paid everything. She just worked and worked and worked and with my grandfather's help. They cleared my name.

That was the year, like literally it happened, I think, four months before my wedding. Wow. And I'm like, my name is finally cleared. And I told my husband, I'm not shooting my surname. Yeah? No, I thought too much. I thought so much for this to be done and for me to be me and be Renata first go home. Like four months isn't long enough yet.

Yes. I need to be able to have my surname. Like I'm just proud and he's like absolutely don't change your surname. So you got married, didn't change my surname, never did. And then through my company I got stronger. We start talking. and we figured out that we are not talking enough about child identity theft in my industry. And I said, I want to use my story to do that because we are not looking at those cases.

And it's still allowed in Brazil. So my company invested a lot, and they did a documentary about my story. Wow. It's on YouTube. The name is 1 in 50. It's like a short film. So we did it. It was released this year.

That's incredible. Yeah, and then it was nominated to Indy Shorts Film Festival, Holly Shorts Film Festival. It was like really well done and it was the first time I spoke about my story publicly, so it was nerve-wracking, but it was empowering, I'm sure. And from that, things just blew up. And so many media reports were done about me in Brazil, and I start going to the media and talking, because this is still a lot of, out in Brazil and my sister to this day didn't clear her name because for her it

was it's just too much you can't just pay it so to this day she can't have a name so I've been talking a lot in Brazil about this and then since I start talking this has been five months now that I've been actively going to the media I think now I can tell you it's been over a hundred victims they reach out to me same story is mine in Brazil same story and some of them like with 28 million in their name and that like that's the worst case and so we got together and we formed a movement the name is children without debt and we're fighting for our rights collectively because my case was resolved but they're most of them wasn't and probably never will and they all live like financial

ghosts don't have the right to their identity and that is a violation of human rights yeah and anything that they make can be taken everything is taken yeah you can't build a life for yourself at all and i'm sure for many it makes you just want to give up you like i can't do anything so we have most all of them struggle mentally psychologically so now we're organizing ourselves as we speak but like we are 82 victims now that got together. We have a support group. We have help from psychologists. We can't get legal help because there's still no precedence, but we are fighting that. And we got attention from the Senate in Brazil. And now they're looking to introduce a law reform. And our cases are finally being recognized, slowly being recognized for what it is, which is child identity

tough is not recognized that way in Brazil but what happened to me was exactly that and what happened to all of them is the same one of the victims only one she did what is so emotionally devastating to have to do but she sued her parents for having used her name she won and even then she can't get rid of the debt if you can't believe it that is why because it was a lot of it was a lot of out and they can only find assets in her name so then they need to get paid. Right. So I just have to ask them from somewhere. And that's the thing too is I feel like, you know, I'm sure one of the big reasons why

there isn't a lot of information on it is because these victims probably feel like they're hopeless with, you know, law. So why even speak out about it? Like they probably just don't even try. It's a financial abuse that comes first from the family. Mm-hmm. And then from the system, right? That doesn't recognize you as a victim.

They don't care about age. And a lot of people are scared to speak up. And that's what I've been hearing from all of them is like, this is the first time someone's talking about this. This is the, like I thought I was alone. People think that because no one is talking about it. So it's been also healing to be able to do that. And I will say many, many victims contacted me from the U.S. as well.

So it happens here too, but here it is recognized. a child identity tab. Okay. But here we have data. We know that 1 and 50 children have their identity stolen before they turn 18. That's 1.25 million children within a year period in the United States. And in 73% of the cases comes from the family. So here you have cases where a stranger steals your identity when you see you have your social

security as being used as a child. But in 73% of the cases is a... type of abuse that comes within the household. And I started to study that. I'm doing that in my work as well. And we know that is because all the cases, the parents' name is already compromised, so they already have back credits.

They can no longer get loans. They can no longer operate. So then they look at their child, oh, there is a clean social security number, and they start to use it. The creditors in the United States, they're putting a lot of protections in place, but they still don't check for age.

They still treat the Social Security as a unique number. So that's why it still happens. But what happens is that child turns 18. They want to apply for a college loan. They want to, you know. Yeah, can't do it. And then you're like, what? My credit score is this bad, but I just turn 18.

And that's when they find out. Okay. And then their option is go to the police station and open a case for a child identity test, but then you're going against your family. Well, there's that, But also, I'm sure it takes a long time to fight that. It takes a long time and it's up to the victim to fight it.

Right. So it's like emotionally devastating, damaging. And there was one victim that reached out to me from here, the United States. And her social security was used by her entire family. So when she turned 18, her credit was like under 200. She couldn't do anything with her name. And then her option was to open a case of a child identity type. She knew exactly who it was.

It was her mom and also her dad. But she told me, Renata, if I did that, I was going to lose everyone. My grandmother was going to be angry with me. My grandfather, I was going to lose my entire family. So think about the emotional weight for that victim. Like, your only hope is to go against your family. Like, here is better than Brazil, but there's still problems because it shouldn't be up to the victim to first,

have to go through that and then we also finding through studies that is very cultural so like in the south of brazil where i'm from there are specific industry of business owners that this is just common practice to the point that they ask each other how many social securities do you have as a way to ask how many kids you have because that's how many documents they have to be able to operate and then is a generational violence because then your name is completely in Brazil we call your name is dirty so your name is already compromised just security you can't have anything in your name so then what do you do use your kid's name and then your kid turned 18 same story so what they do they use their kid's name and then it's like a generational violence so I am in great place now I turn that into my work

into purpose and I want to raise awareness and I started this movement in Brazil let's see where it goes but it's it's getting very like we're getting a lot of momentum and in a in a week in two weeks I'll be talking in a webinar and a panel with UNICEF and Homeland Security to bring awareness about this and it's so important I think awareness is the it's I feel like it's one of the first steps but it's the biggest step because if you build an army and a community that won't stay silent someone's going to have to listen exactly and i feel like the right to your identity and to being who you are is just like such a basic human right yes and to have that just taken from you and you have a system that doesn't support you right is just is unacceptable and the fact that it can even somehow be allowed

Like it should, in my opinion, it should be treated where if that person is underage, even if it's the parents, that the rule should just be, no, I'm sorry, like, they're not of age to make that choice themselves. Exactly. Like, just, you know what I mean? If you're going to give the right to sign it away, it should have the right, you should have the right not to until you're of an age that you can give that, what's the word? Authorization.

Exactly. And that's what I'm pushing is for, for, for, for, for, for, for, for, for, for, for, for, you know. kids to have the systems protection because not every child has parents that care about that and have their best interest at heart we see with other types of abuse yes that also most of the time come from the family you know we see that a lot with even sexual abuse and physical abuse and it's so much of the cases come inside the household so we need a system to be able to speak up for that kids so that's what i'm fighting for and now i have the army of victims that are fighting for the the same with me. And you, I think, you know, not only by you speaking out with your voice and sharing

your story, but by creating this community, you're giving these people confidence to share their story. You're giving them purpose. You know, even if right now they're not in the place that you thankfully have gotten to, it definitely makes them feel like they aren't alone. You know, you don't have to be ashamed of something that wasn't in your control. And I think that by having that community and those people that can really understand and have gone through the same thing, that's going to make people want to keep pushing and fighting and speaking out and owning their story to the best of their ability. Because obviously, this is an issue. You know, this whole thing, obviously it leads to so many, you know, hardships. But one of the main things you mentioned for you

that you struggled with when you were younger was control. And being able to speak out and use your voice is a way to get that control back. And I think in a way that's so powerful. Amen. Absolutely. That's exactly what I'm trying to do. And obviously, I didn't say because it's not related to the story,

but I have a little boy. His name is Luca. He's four now. Love of my life. So I'm a mom. And I just... Congratulations. And if I can just finish.

with one thing. First of all, I want to thank you for giving me the space. Of course. What you do is amazing and I really want to come here to talk about child identity theft and financial abuse. And I am almost 90% sure that when this episode goes live, you're going to see in the comments, people saying the same thing happened to me. Absolutely.

It's so underreported. It really is. So I want to tell, you know, the listeners that you're not alone. Here in the U.S., there are resources. You can go to the identity theft center. They have an army for child identity theft and it's really hard to fight it. So I don't want to give anyone false hope. It's still hard, but at least there is a way.

Yes. And what I will say, especially as a mom for other parents listening, is that here in the U.S. you can freeze your child's social security number. So you go to the three creditors and you ask for that social security to be frozen and no one can touch it. Okay. And then only when you decide that they, you know, are old enough to use it, then you can unfreeze. So it's a simple thing to do, but it can really save them. Yes.

And protect them for sure. So important. Thank you so much. You did incredible. And please share those resources with me so that I can link them in the description and obviously anything of yourself as well. So the people can get in touch with you and kind of follow along with your journey as well. but you're incredible. I think that, you know, I try not to get repetitive,

but like I'm so proud of every single person that comes on here. But, you know, to turn your story into something where you can fight back, you're fighting for yourself and you're fighting for so many other people that, you know, we're all one at the end of the day. And I feel like by you fighting for yourself and for all these other people that even people you might not even know or haven't even spoken to, do. You know, it just, it's almost like you're fighting for yourself again. 100% when you were that age or something, you know.

I'm fighting every day for little Renata. Yes. I agree with you. Yes. Well, thank you. You did amazing, seriously. Thank you so much for coming out here. Thank you.