We're All Insane - My Mom Committed Murder

Episode Date: September 2, 2024

At just 2 years old, her life was shattered when her mother committed a heinous crime, leaving her to be raised by a father with a dark and twisted mind. In this gripping and emotional story, we follow the journey of a girl who was thrust into a world of chaos, manipulation, and fear at an early age. As she grows up under the influence of a sociopath, she faces unimaginable challenges and battles to find her own identity amidst the shadows of her past. Join us as we delve into her story of survival, resilience, and the search for light in the darkest of places. Lauren's Links: @LAURENEAGERWIf you have a unique story you'd like to share on the podcast, please fill out this form: https://forms.gle/ZiHgdoK4PLRAddiB9or send an email to [e-mail] Inquiries please contact: [e-mail] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey guys, it's me Devorah. I just dropped an all new bonus episode inside my new subscription channel, We're All Insane Plus. This week's bonus episode is called My Brain was slipping into my spine. Listen now by subscribing to We're All Insane Plus inside your Spotify or Apple Podcasts app or go to we're all insane.com. Hello, my name is Lauren Eager. My mom killed somebody when I was two years old and I was to live with my genius but sociopath dad. And that kind of set the tone for my childhood and upbringing. And sort of the reason that I wanted to come on the podcast was because I noticed that when I would talk about this story, good things would happen.

And what I mean by that is people would either come together or they would feel comfortable opening up about their own stories or trying to connect with people or find help in the ways that they needed it. So that's the main reason. And then I think a lot of people can relate to being in a place that they don't want to be in or in a situation that's less than ideal for them. And I guess it sort of serves as a reminder that no matter where you come from, you can always start over. You can always change your life. As long as you can think about it, it's possible.

And yeah, you're only one decision away from having a completely different life. And that's truly my story. So I think the last thing that I want to say is the only reason I'm able to live. like a remotely normal life, and I would actually say I'm living a very privileged life, abnormally so, is because people were kind to me when I was a kid. If I didn't have the community or people around me that decided to be kind to this young child that was going through something, I don't think that I would have turned out the way that I am. And so I guess as a call to action, I want to ask people to be nice to the kids around them because you never know what they're

going through or what's happening to them in their life. And you can genuinely change their life. These are the people that are going to be part of our society as you get older. And so you should think about that when you're treating kids a certain way. Speak. Preach. Amen. I agree with you 100%. So I guess I could start out by talking about my mom and her crime. Since normally growing up when I would talk about my mom, people would say, oh my gosh. So what happened? You know? Someone, she killed somebody. And so here's the story. So my mom was a stripper and she was really deep in the drug and alcohol scene, alcoholic, the whole nine.

And without telling too much of her story, she had her own traumas as a kid. So grew up with five other siblings, all of them having their own problems as well. My grandmother had run away with her stepdad and had all these kids. And there was a huge age gap. I would say that my biological grandfather maybe is. is not the most respectable person in the world. I never met him and didn't care to. And so anyway, they had six kids together and one of them was my mom. Like I said, my mom grew up with a troubled childhood. My aunt decided to be a stripper with her sister, and they started working at this

club together. And they did this for a few years. They both had drug and alcohol problems. My aunt actually ended up dying a month before I was born in a drunk driving accident. And so that sort of set the tone for where my mom was, right? She was pregnant with my dad, who all get into how they met, which was at the club. But they got together, had me, and, you know, of course, eight months pregnant and her sister dies in this drunk driving accident. And I think that this sort of started really unraveling my mom and bringing back a lot of trauma from her own life. And during the between when she was pregnant with me and when I was two years old, when the murder happened, she was really, again, unraveling.

Like I can't think of a better word for it. Everything was triggering for her. It was just really a difficult time. And plus add my dad into the mix who's a sociopath and also a genius. It just wasn't a good combination. So that being said, my dad sort of manipulated her into having a relationship and she ended up going back to her drug dealer's house at the time. And I don't know 100% what happened that day. I don't know where I was. I don't know any of the details, really. We just know what she said when she turned herself

in the next day. So she fled the scene of the crime. The guy was stabbed 47 times. And what we've heard from my mom is that she was being restrained or abused in some way. Again, I don't know. like we'll really never know what happened that day, except for my mom, who doesn't really talk about it. So essentially, she was triggered into this event happening. The way that I understand it is she was restrained, he let her go and sort of pleaded with him. And he said, okay, if I let you go, will you be good? And she let her, he got out and ran and grabbed a knife and stabbed him, obviously a lot of times. And this was the drug dealer. This was the drug dealer. When my mom turned herself in, it was like a full-blown ops.

Like she immediately went to prison. She was sentenced to, I believe, 30 years. It could have been 20 to life. I don't know the exact sentence, but she served around 20. So she got out for good behavior in the end. That's what happened, right? Like that's in a nutshell. And I know that was a long story, but that's how it started.

Yeah. Yeah. And you were two, right? I was two when that happened. And who were you living with? So I was really pushed around between my grandparents and my parents and different people in the community, like an aunt or something like that, my whole life. So when I was two, I went to go live with my dad and his mom. The reason I say my dad is a genius is because he did take the MCAT when he was going into medical school.

He graduated high school early. He also was part of Mensa, so 150 plus, which is considered genius, and decided to go to med school when he was 15. When that happened, he passed the exam, but eventually got kicked out of school for drug sale and basically distribution. So he was always just pushing the envelope of what he could do. And part of the reason for him doing that was because he was diagnosed with antisocial personality disorder earlier in his life, which my grandmother, his mom, was aware of. So growing up, I knew that my dad had these diagnosis. I didn't know what they meant, obviously. growing up with my dad was a horrible time. It was just the worst. I mean, pretty much anything you can

think of. We didn't always have the lights on in our house. We always had running water, but I mean, mildew in the shower. I mean, barely any food in the fridge. If there was, it was old or stale. A lot of times I would get up and put myself on the bus and eat like the same box of blueberry morning, which I don't know if anyone remembers that cereal from the 90s, but that's what I would on the way to school. Teachers would brush my hair. They would bring like toothbrushes to school because I wasn't brushing my teeth, which was really sad. So that went on for quite a while until I was around six years old. And then I was kidnapped by my dad's drug dealer. So there's sort of this ongoing theme through my life of being affected by my parents' drug dealers, apparently.

So the way that that happened is my dad owned a car lot with this guy. I'll call him Jay. And my dad was having a relationship with Jay's wife, who I'll call Kay. So Jay and Kay have two kids together, a boy and a girl. The girl's my age. I grew up around her, but her mom was also addicted to heroin. So she was always at our house, like, shooting up. It was really bad. I, like, watched her do it when I was a kid and so did her daughter.

And still to this day, I can't get blood drawn out of my inner elbow because it bothers me. And so I just have like a lot of weird little things like that because of it. but I think I turned out roughly okay. So anyway, Jay and my dad had this car lot, and they were also running this drug deal through it. And again, my dad is a sociopath. He's always trying to think of, what can I do next? What exciting scheme can I come up with or get away with, right?

And so he started having an affair with his partner's wife and had a drug deal going on with him. eventually Jay finds out that my dad is sleeping with his wife and shows up with his older son to the car lot and I'm at the car lot with my dad so this is after school one day and he gets out of the car and he's swinging a bat at my dad the older brother gets out or Jay's son and they're both swinging at my dad my dad's pretty big so he takes them both down the kid ends up going to the hospital. I think he was in his late teens at the time. I don't really remember. But late teens, I think, ended up going to the hospital, like severe injuries. Jay is obviously pissed,

and my dad flees the scene of the crime with me. Again, a theme of my parents. And goes to my grandmother's house. So we get to my grandmother's house and my dad hides in the closet. And he's like, all right, my grandmother is always protecting my dad. So she was like, all right, be quiet. Don't tell anyone where a daddy is. Police come to the door and I immediately point to the closet. I don't know to this day, like if you ever found out that I gave him away that he was in there. But yeah, no regrets.

So they pull him out and my dad basically gaslights the police, who, by the way, are people that he grew up with in the same town. So this is like his high school friends that are now cops that have been like trying to catch him for various crimes over the years. And he's really intelligent. So he's pretty good at getting away with them. and covering his tracks. And so they're like, you know, we got you, Todd, whatever. And they're like, no, you're coming with us. And he says, so you're going to arrest me because I slept with my partner's wife.

That doesn't make any sense. Like he came to my work in front of my little daughter with a baseball bat and in front of all of our customers and my family and you're going to try to arrest me. So he basically gaslights them and they're like, fine, we'll let you off. and they go to find Jay, and of course Jay is like pressing charges because his son's in the hospital, all this crazy stuff. So that sort of starts to die down. And Jay ends up trying to frame my dad for breaking into his house. So my dad drink a lot of Mountain Dew growing up. And so he's like planting Mountain Dew cans around his house, like trashing his house, throwing cigarette butts

everywhere, because my dad also smoked, just making it look like he did it, calls the cops and says, this guy, you know, broke into my house, whatever. And up into like 10 years ago, this was the only crime that my dad ever got convicted of. And it was one he didn't even do. Oh, my God. So they ended up sending him to jail. He gets out after a couple days because they can't prove that it was him. And my dad at the time had a good lawyer.

And so Jay's pissed. Like, rightfully so, like, but also it's not illegal to sleep with somebody's life. Yeah. So anyway, Jay comes to my school one day and picks me up. And that was not out of the ordinary. They always shared cars. Again, they worked at a used car a lot. So it was like always different cars, one or the other.

Maybe one of them would be in the lot and needed to come get me, whatever. So Jay comes to get me. I did think it was weird that his daughter wasn't there because usually he would pick up his daughter and then me and we would go together to his wife's house, right? Because they were friends even before the affair. and before the drug deal and before the car lot. So it was all kind of just in the family, I guess you could say. So I thought that was weird.

Jay ends up pulling up to this house that I don't know. So it's not Jay's house, the one that he, you know, fake broke into. And it's not my dad's house. I'm like, where are we? And so we get out and he's like, you're going to stay here and wait for your dad to pay me. And so I guess like after that fight happened, they seized all the drugs and the money that was at the car lot. So it was like a big investigation into what.

they were going to do. And you could actually still find information about this, like, online. So anybody listening, you could probably Google it. Yeah. But so anyway, they, they all get seized. And I guess he wanted my dad to pay him back for, because he, like, blamed him for the situation. And he didn't even get caught, like, didn't go to jail for sending his son to the hospital. So he's basically holding me ransom in this house. And again, I have no idea what house this is. I walk inside. There's a couch in the living room. I'm six years old. So, I don't know how I remember all of this, but I think it was just really traumatizing. There's like 14 people sitting on a small sofa.

Like some of them are like shooting up. Other people are like doing Coke. There's people having sex and watching porn like in the corner. Just like all this crazy stuff like happening in this living room and house. And so I walk through and there's like, here's the living room and you walk around to a kitchen. So he pulls me to the kitchen. I'll never forget the smell of the kitchen. There were just dishes everywhere.

It was just this like reeking smell. Like if you've ever smelled that smell of like dirty dishes, you know exactly what I'm talking about. It's like burned in my brain. So we walk through that kitchen and there's another like little garage area where he had pulled his car in where Jay had pulled his car in. And there was a bunch of kids on this mattress. And I think that maybe they were, I don't know what was going on with them, to be honest. Like I think that there were police involved in this situation to like years later. for maybe some other crimes that were happening.

But without going too deep into that, there were kids on these mattresses, maybe some of their children that were in this house, like basically living in this trap house because they couldn't afford their own apartment or whatever. So we're all in this mattress room. And I don't know how many days I was in there. I think I was in there for maybe a couple days. Like it wasn't immediately. It was all, it was not all in the same day.

I remember being hungry. I remember like wondering how I was going to get out. Eventually, Jay leaves the house and pulls the house. and pulls the car out. And when he does that, I'm faking like I'm asleep and we push the mattress underneath the car door so that it prevents it from closing. So these little kids are like in there with me. Some of them are like older, you know, like maybe 10, 11. I don't know, maybe some younger. It's kind of hard to remember. But anyway, so I go out the garage door after he leaves and sneak my skinny little ass out the door and walk all the way back to my dad's mom's house, my grandmother's

house. When I get there, I find out a police officer had seen me on the road and followed me all the way back back. I still don't know, like, how I found my way back there. But either way, I walked all the way back and my grandmother's like freaking out, had no idea I was gone. My dad basically had come to find out, told him, like, keeper, I don't care. Like, I'm not giving you any money. I'm not doing anything. Like she'll figure it out basically. I'm six. So anyway, doesn't come to get me. My dad had fled.

So because he was in trouble for this other crime, I guess he had gotten out on like parole or something. This is also Googled, and it's hilarious. You can find it. It's like Todd Stephen Porter is found at a barbecue place in 2007 because he's cooking barbecue. Remember I told you my dad is a very high IQ, but he's also very full of him. himself, right? Like, antisocial personality disorder, like, kind of makes you want to be charming and impress people. And so he cooks really good barbecue and he was working at this place where he had fled. Meanwhile, he just left his daughter with basically my grandmother and God knows who.

And the FBI finds him and arrests him in 2007 for this crime. And he goes to jail. That is sort of ongoing. And I lived with my dad's mom for a couple more years before my other. grandmother, my mom's mom got full-time custody of me for like the rest of my life, basically. So during this time, did you have any contact with your mom? Like, were you visiting at all? Yeah. I visited my mom a couple of times in jail. One, when I was really young, like maybe I was two or three. So my dad would let me, or I guess not let me, but he was forced to let me see my mom's side of the family. I think it was every two weeks. So I would get like a weekend there. they would meet halfway and then drop me off.

And I loved going there. And that's part of the reason I ended up, she ended up getting custody because I was so eager to always go home to, you know, my mom's mom. So I did visit her a couple of times. My mom's very emotionally unregulated. Like, think about it. You know, you go to jail before even Google is a thing. And then you're just stuck in there, right?

And you're coming off all of these drugs, alcohol. Like, she'd been drinking since she's. She was like, and maybe not even a teenager yet, like very, very young. So I guess from that perspective, she was just sort of unhinged into a little kid that's very scary to see and to understand. And when you visit a prison, it's not easy and it's not fun. There's like bright lights in your face. They search you.

They like make sure because she was at like a state prison, right? Like it wasn't like a jail. So it's just really overwhelming for me as a kid. And I think my grandmother was just like, I don't want to make you do this again. So I maybe did it a couple more times and then never did it again. Okay. Yeah. My mom also decided to be like a born again Christian when she went to prison, which sort of affected our family in a way.

Hey, I'm Jeremy Schwartz from American Criminal. On this season, robbery gone wrong or cold-blooded murder. Either way, Boston will never be the same. Listen to American Criminal, the murder of Carol Stewart, wherever you get your podcast. or to get early at free access, subscribe in Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or at Americancriminal.com. She would send me, she's very good artists. So she would draw me like pictures when I was, you know, six, seven, eight of her memories, which are incredibly disturbing. Like I told you about her life, right?

So she would draw these memories and send them to me, which I don't think was appropriate for like my age. I was told when I was probably like three or four what had happened to her. So, I mean, I grew up knowing she had killed somebody. My dad would tell me, like, mommy killed somebody. And the only thing, I remember comparing it to, like, cartoons. Because, like, Wiley Coyote, did you ever watch those? So I would compare it to that because it's all I could compare it to it as a toddler. So, I don't know.

It was just a weird situation. Right. And you had that, like, mindset about your mom from really young. Right. I knew she, like, had killed somebody, right? pretty powerful thing to, yeah. Sure. So at this time, you're, so did your dad end up going to jail?

My dad went to jail in and out. He's never been sent to prison. Okay. Which is. And that was after they called him at the barbecue place. Right. And then they ended up basically figuring out that he wasn't guilty of the crime that he'd been set up for.

But he had been harassing Jay's wife the entire time. So she had like, I don't know, some kind of restriction on him where he couldn't, I don't know if it was exactly that he couldn't come near her, if it wasn't, if it was that he couldn't see the kids or something. There was some restraining order in place. And he just kept breaking it and harassing her and seeing like what he could get away with. And anyway, that being said, it was basically because he was violating that, that he ended up going to jail. And then you lived with his mom for a little while? Yeah. So my grandmother on my dad's side was very protective of my dad his whole life.

Like that was her bright, shiny star, this really smart student. It's really sad because there's a lot of wasted potential. And my dad, like, incredibly high IQ, like incredible discipline if he wanted to, right? And could be very charming and persuasive of people and at the end of the day, manipulative, because those are the traits of someone with antisocial personality disorder that has. a really high IQ. And so my grandmother just let him get away with whatever. And a lot of times, like, people would ask, like, why didn't your grandmother get you out

of that situation? But my dad didn't let her. Like, it wasn't something that he was, like, telling her about, right? And I wasn't allowed to say, you know, daddy didn't keep the lights on or I haven't taken a shower. I've been in the same jeans for six weeks. You know, that wasn't like something I could say. I just kind of lived it day to day.

It was just something I dealt with. And what age did that stuff? continue for. I mean, I lived with him basically from two, so like when my mom got arrested, to like eight-ish. And then it all sort of starts to morph together. So between six and 12, there was sort of some ongoing battles between my grandmother trying to get custody of me and my dad trying to keep me, which eventually resulted in my dad having to let go. And it was your mom's mom's mom, who's an angel. Like she's perfect in every way. I love her to death. But But my dad's mom has since passed away.

She actually died from COVID, so not that long ago. I tried to talk about this story in 2019, and I had written a book. I was going to publish it, and she threatened to sue me because of what I said about my dad. And I was really scared. I was in college at the time, like about to graduate. I was like, I don't need this in my life. So I didn't.

And so I waited to talk about it publicly until basically now. Right. Yeah. Have you published the book or not yet? I have the book. I'm waiting for a literary agent. I've got a couple people, but nothing lined up yet. So, I mean, if it publishes, great.

And if not, I think I'll just think of it as like kind of a memoir. If my kids ever want to know, like, the history of their family or something, they can read it and understand where they came from. So even though it would probably be depressing, I won't give it to them when they're three. Right, exactly. Give them some time to drop a little bit. So at this, at the time that you were 12, that's when you moved with your mom's mom. And then did life, like, drastically change at that point for you? I mean, I grew up really poor.

My grandmother didn't have much. And I don't know if she would say that. Like, she gave me everything that I needed. And I would say my life was a little bit sponsored by the community. Like, people would notice what I was going through and try to help me out a little bit and our family out. But I was like, girl, we're living on the land out here. Like, you're growing your own onions. Like, we're timing our trips to the grocery store.

Like, I don't think that we're, you know, not poor. But she just didn't see things that way. I'm really glad she didn't. But, yeah, I grew up with nothing. You know, I mean, I didn't have internet. No AC for a long period of time. We did eventually get it when I was later. But, yeah, no internet my entire life, no TV.

We did have one television, but it didn't have cable. It had like Sherlock Holmes DVDs that we had. So that was about it. I learned to knit, which is great, great passion for someone that's raised like they're Amish, but is it? Oh, my gosh. Yeah. But yeah.

Yeah. So it was great. I mean, like I said, really poor, but that's not a bad thing. I think it just taught me to be really grateful for what I have now. And I do kind of get overwhelmed by my life a little bit sometimes. It feels like a lot of responsibility to, I mean, you know, neither of my parents went to college. My grandparents didn't go to college. I'm the first one.

This is like I'm treading new ground in a lot of. ways and there just wasn't a lot of people to look out for me. Like in my earlier years, I had to do it for myself. And sometimes when I look back, I just, I feel like I don't deserve it in a way. Or like something's going to be ripped out from under me. And so it's formed all of these interesting little personality traits that I have. Like, for example, I can't sleep alone. I've never been able to sleep in a bed alone. Like, I'm married now and when my husband's gone, I have to sleep with a TV on because I won't sleep through the night. I slept with my grandmother when I was younger, like in our house. I had my own bedroom, but I would crawl into bed with her as soon as she

would fall asleep. She'd be like, you have to sleep in your own bed. No, because I would get these horrible nightmares about this van that would come pick me up in the middle of the night and do all these insane things to me that I had seen people do to each other, unfortunately, including Kay's daughter and her brother. So I would just have like those types of nightmares and I would tell my grandmother, can I just tell it to you? Just let me say it. So then you can tell me it's not real. It should say, no, you scare me with those. Those are terrifying. Don't tell me. Please let me sleep. I got to tell you. She's like, all right, fine. Go ahead. So I'd tell her. But then she'd be like, gosh, I'm not going to be able to sleep with the nightmares that you have.

So can't sleep alone. Really hard time doing it, even to this day. I'm 28. know. So I also have kind of this fear of like missing out on stuff. I think because I watched my parents waste so much of their life, I was just like, that would suck to die. Like we only have one of these. And I mean, to anyone that's like has a victim mentality that's like, oh, like I'm depressed or this horrible thing has happened to me or something, I'm like, wouldn't you do anything to change that? I'm terrified of being stagnant. Like that, I don't know. that there's anything worse. And people say, like, how have you gotten by, like, with these horrible things? Um, honestly, I think it's that I'm just terrified to not experience every human

emotion by the time I die. Like, I want to travel to every place I can. I want to be friends with people and have like deep lasting relationships. I want to have meaningful, a meaningful marriage or kids one day or just like every experience that I am given I'm willing to take. I would much rather feel the full spectrum of emotions and like including trauma and pain and see some of the worst things that a child can be exposed to. I would rather all of that still than live a completely boring great life. I would rather experience the whole spectrum. And it's crazy to me that people sometimes don't. Right. But it is an interesting way to reframe it. Right. It's like, okay, well, that's true. I have seen the worst. So yeah. You have a different perspective on it. Yeah. Like it should

remind people that like you're resilient. If you've been through that, why can't you accomplish extreme things? Right. So. And do you have a relationship with your mom now? No. She did come to my wedding. She called me like not long ago and was like, they didn't serve enough water at your wedding. There was too much alcohol there. I was like, it was a wedding. Like I don't know what you want from me. I was the bride, you know? My husband and I paid for it ourselves and my family came, but not for very long. And they were just so preoccupied with their own thing, which is, you know, another, we've always, I've always kind of been the black sheep of the family because of my mom, which is funny, because they all have their own

problems in one way or another. Like my uncle's homeless and schizophrenic. It's like, it's like, I'm not, you guys. Like, I don't know. It's just really weird. It's a weird family dynamic, for sure. But she just, like, got upset that there wasn't enough water being served to her at our wedding. And there's too much alcohol and telling me that I'm going to become an alcoholic. I mean, you can't really blame her, right? Because she's had no time to adjust to the way that the world is. I mean, I would be so overwhelmed if I was out here. When did she get out? How long ago? I want to say like five-ish years ago, a few years ago. Yeah. But I don't know. She's gotten a lot from it. Like she got out of jail. Her first job out of jail was at Goodwill, which I'm a

fan of. Love me some Goodwill. And, you know, got a job at a hotel cleaning after that, did really well for herself, had a cleaning business of her own. And one day she was walking in my hometown, where my grandmother lives, her mom, and was stopped by this guy, and it was her high school boyfriend, and they're married now. Wow. And he just saw her walking, and they're now married. Isn't that insane? Yeah, that is crazy. Talk about, you know, yeah. And also like a redemption arc. Mm-hmm. Like.

So how is she doing, would you say in life now? I mean, she's great. She just, the biggest problem for her, I think, is the emotional dysregulation. Yeah. She just has no idea how to regulate anger or happiness, like joy. She also, the way she expresses things to me is sort of coming from a place of jealousy, which I think is really common for mother and daughter relationships. There can be like some resentment where it's like, oh, you're younger and I want to,

control the way your fate turns out because I made you and I didn't do what I wanted with my life. And so now I have to pass it on. It's like you can't, you can't live like that with your child. And so she has a little bit of that, which I've told her, right? But it's just been a long and winding road for her. I think she needs time to adjust the outside world and she needs to look a long, take a long look in the mirror and think about the way that she affects other people. I think because of what she's been through, she's like, oh, I can get away with this now because of what I've been through. It's just not the case. And no one has ever let that happen for her.

So I don't know why she'd think that now would be any different, which is sort of sad in a way, right? But, you know, it is what it is. And then what about your dad? My dad, the other day I was at a Starbucks, and I saw this call come up. And I was like, hello? Because, you know, sometimes I answer spam. You never know, right? It's like it could be something that I need.

I was in the process of buying a house. Hello. And it's my dad. And I just sat there and I was like, I don't know what to say. What do I say? And I just sat there on the phone and he was like, I just wanted to let you know I was thinking about you. And how long had it been since you talked to him? Eight, nine, ten, maybe probably ten years.

Wow. And he just randomly called. Yeah. I mean, I was probably 19. Okay. Or, yeah, so maybe seven, eight years maybe. Yeah. I mean, it's just.

What did you say back? Thanks. And then I hung up. Wow. And blocked the number. In case, that was a new one. I have a long list of blocked numbers on my phone. But...

So would you say your relationship with him really kind of like ended after... Yeah, well, the last thing that he said to me, so obviously I've had a bunch of relationships in my life just like anyone else. I mean, not everyone else, but most. And during one of them, he really... didn't like the way the guy was treating me and got really aggressive toward him. Come to find out for good reason, but he ended up scaring the guy so bad that he actually like broke up with me.

And because my dad said, I'm going to kill you. And the guy believed him, which he should because my dad's insane. Actually, side story on that. So my dad had this girlfriend a few years back. You can find this online too. And so he was living with her. The name was Julianne. And she had diabetes.

And so he was living with her, taking care of her. She also had her own daughter who he was living with. So he had this kind of like new family, basically, that started, I don't know, when I was maybe 14, 13. And it had been going on for a while. And she ends up dying from an insulin overdose. And if you take a moment to her. reflect on the story I've shared, my dad took care of her and my dad also graduated early to go to medical school. And I don't know about you, but that sounds pretty suss to me. He did nothing

happened to him. I did, there was a case opened on my dad because of all of the crimes that he was like kind of connected to, but no one could really do anything about. And I was like, I literally, I can't prove it, but I know that this was my, I know that this is what happened. Like I just know. her daughter ended up calling me and was like your dad did this and I was like girl like I know like I support you like whatever you want me to do I'll do but it was her mom you know can you imagine like your mom just is being taken care of by this guy they're together and then all of a sudden this happens and she just has this like gut feeling that my dad did it which me too like you're not alone in that so we talked for a while but she really resents me I think

just because my dad is my dad, you know. But there's nothing. That's been a long theme in my life, too. Like when I was growing up, like in high school and stuff, my mom published a journal in our newspaper in our hometown. And it was about her crime and how she was coming back from it and how she was a Christian and she was encouraging people to convert to Christianity and that faith saved her and all of these things.

So it's just like an outreach thing. She published it in our newspaper and a bunch of people from my high school saw it and we're like, uh, what? Like, and I hadn't really talked about my story before. And it kind of forced me to just embrace it and be like, yes, my mom killed somebody. And this is how it, it affected me in the following ways. Here you go. Make your decisions. And unfortunately, a lot of those decisions were people's parents saying you could no longer be friends with her. Um, so I lost a lot of friendships. And this was, I think then I was like, you know, 13, 14. I was right about to go into high school. Um, and because of that my grandmother, my mom's mom, sent me to live with my aunt in El Salvador because she lived

there. She married a guy from El Salvador. So my cousins lived there. And I was sent away to live there for like two years so that the news would blow over and I could maybe save some relationships in high school. And then I ended up having like it was fine in high school. I mean, a lot of people didn't like me still. We grew up in a small religious town. And then you moved back after the two years there? No. Yeah. So I lived in El Salvador and then I moved back. to the U.S., back to my hometown. Yeah. So I'm glad I got that experience because I feel like it helped me see the world in a new

way. And if I ever had the chance of being a victim, like that definitely took it away. Just seeing another country that lives completely differently and understanding, you know, trying to learn another language and being humbled over and over again by not knowing the culture or how to act in certain situations or how to form friendships in that culture. It just, it was very humbling. So I think it made me a better person for sure. Yeah.

And then when you got back, you said that it was, you were in high school and then it was fine pretty much with the people around you. Yeah. I mean, I still, the guy I dated in high school. I dated him from high school to college. We were together for quite a while. And great guy, but his mom just would never let it go. There's always something. She just like would give me a hard time.

Anytime I was at their house, I mean, I dated him for years. every Christmas I would hear about it. She would make like remarks at my grandmother, like any holidays we would spend with, you know, if my grandmother would come around his family. She would just make comments about like how she wouldn't know what good wine tasted like or like how to act in certain situations because of our pedigree in some way. It was just like a very odd situation. And eventually I got really sick of it and the guy like never stood up for me.

So I just eventually like came into myself and I was like, I can't be with somebody like this. is not going to work for me. And I really thought I was going to be with him forever. But at the end the day, that's why our relationship ended. So kind of affected me for a long time. And I do think that sorry, I do think that it's interesting and incredible. And I always say this that, you know, the way that you grow up, it's like you have this decision of, for the most part, I feel like you have a decision of what path you choose to take. You know, you either let your childhood and the things that have happened to define you or kind of make you and build you up and lead you to a better life and kind of like you said like embracing it and speaking out about it and making

other people know that you know this happened to me and it's traumatic but I'm living as normally as I can and I'm kind of you know I'm open about it and that's great but it really is interesting to me like how different like you even said how how different your life could be because of the things that you experience at such a young age because, you know, obviously being dealt those types of cards, that's one thing. But then even seeing the things that you saw, I feel like that on its own could have easily led you down such a different path. I think I've just been terrified of it. Yeah. I just like seeing it from such an early age, I was like, this is not ever something I want to be involved with. Like I watched my parents be addicted to all kinds of different things,

watched my dad's girlfriend shoot up heroin and how ugly that made her, like, truly. And I really do think it's sad because people get sucked in by this addiction. And I was actually just talking to somebody the other day, like a therapist and she was saying, do you think you have the addiction gene? Because it's a gene that actually can express itself in your own body. And I said, no, I don't have it. There's no way. Like I can, I have like a drink of alcohol once in a while, like just for fun, you know, go out, party. Like I went to college, you know. It's just, never affected me abnormally. Like, I like my weed gummies to go to sleep. They're legal in my state. Yeah, I just, I've just never had an issue. And so I was like, oh, I certainly don't have it.

And she's like, I raise you this. I think maybe you do. It's just as something else. Because like my all of my aunts and uncles have their like one thing. Like one of them is like really into schooling. And she like can't let that go. She's just been, she has like a doctorate now. She's like super smart, but is addicted. to like that next phase of her life, like achieving more and more from a professional setting. So I don't know if I do. I think maybe, you know, I'm sort of addicted to like experiencing everything that I can. Like if that's one. But like I genuinely feel like it might be out of fear.

Like I'm just terrified of dying too soon or dying before I can do everything. If I, if there was like something that could turn me into a vein. vampire and I could live to 150, I would. I would do it instantly. I want to live like for as long as possible. And people are like, well, what about when you're old? Like, are you going to be in pain? I don't care. I want to be as old as I possibly can be experiencing everything. So I don't know. It's just expressed itself in these weird ways. Yeah. And I think too for some people, I'm sure, you know, growing up around that and seeing that, even if it does scare them, they might be intrigued, like, because I feel like some children would have the mindset of like, well, why did my parents

choose this type of lifestyle over me. Like, let me try it and see why, like if it really was worth it. That's a good point. I've never even thought about it like that. Yeah, because really, if you think about it, so many people can take these different paths, not even like thinking, oh, well, I'm, like, knowingly, I am choosing to go down the worse of the two. Like, it could just be curiosity because you grew up seeing it or because it caused so much

trauma or you felt like this specific experience or drug or whatever. or addiction took a parent away from you or took an experience away from you. That's a great point because I actually found Kay's daughter who I'll call Mia like a few months ago because I went looking after I started like thinking about this story again and like reflecting on it and I was like, I wonder what happened to her. So I did find her. And unfortunately there was like a big background there on like different things that she was connected to and arrests.

And I remember thinking back, my dad, who kind of served as her dad because her dad was also not around that much. But my dad would drop us off at the skating rink in the town that we lived in at the time and go hang out with, you know, her mom. And, you know, I guess they would act like they were taking care of the kids. And meanwhile, they just dropped us off at a skating rink. There was a manager working there that definitely was into little kids. And would always give us free stuff.

We'd come back there and he'd give us like free skates every time because obviously, you know, my dad, I mean, my dad made some money. He was working in a car lot, but like, you know, wasn't rolling in dough, that's for sure. But they would give us money to play with like the games, like the machines that, you know, those like 90s machines they have like those arcade games. That's their call. So, you know, play with arcade games. He would give us Sharpies to like write in the stall to like write things and be bad. you know, he'd like encourage bad behavior. Yeah, give us skates, give us free lockers.

And I was always like, this is weird. And the girl, who I'm referring to as Mia, would spend a lot of time with him. And only now looking back, do I realize what was going on? But back then, I was just like, this seems weird. I don't think we should do this. Like he seems, I don't like what I'm feeling. And I remember one time. we snuck out of the house and went to the skating rink. So we were supposed to be at the house

with them and we'd snuck out, went to the skating rink to play and he let us go up this hill like that was in the neighborhood. So drove us up there and let us skate down the hill. And I ended up falling and like really scraped up my shoulder and my knee. And to this day, I still have scars from it because it was such a hard fall. And when I got, my grandmother picked me up that next day from school and she was like, what happened? I saw I felt the skating rink. She said, this doesn't happen to the skating rink. And so I remember her having a heated conversation with my dad and saying he took them up there and let them skate and look what happened. And he's like, okay, I'll take care of it.

And I don't know if these two things are related, but knowing my dad, it seems like they would be, the skating rink ended up closing down. And we never saw that guy again. I don't know. But I'll just say that. The whole rank shut down. The whole rank shut down. The genius in him. I don't know, man.

I don't know. So I know that you said that I guess kind of like when everybody started finding out about your mom, it was kind of something where you were like, all right, I'm just going to embrace it. Like this happens to me, whatever. Yeah. But then I also know that you mentioned that you post on TikTok about your story as well. So what kind of made you want to do that? Was that kind of like the same mindset of like, okay, social media is a thing now.

Yeah. Let's talk about it. It's actually the silliest reason. So my friend and I had a competition because she like went viral on TikTok one time. And she was like, and I said, it's easy to go viral on TikTok. That's ridiculous. Like going viral on TikTok tomorrow. She said, no, you can't.

And so we had this like little bet. And to see who could get more follows and likes like in a month. And she was and so I was losing. And I was like, all right. It's time to pull out. I got this. It's time to pull out the big guns. So I posted it being like, oh, it'll just go viral and it'll just blow over. It didn't blow over. There were people from the town that I lived with my dad that were messaging me. Like, I remember this drug bust. Like, I remember the lady that worked at the front desk at their car lot messaged me.

And it was like, I have thought about you every single year my entire life. I cannot believe you've turned out so well. Like, you're so well spoken, whatever. I've always thought about you. I always wondered what happened to you. And yeah, so it was just like crazy how viral it went. I mean, I think it was like $3 million or something. I mean, that's not even in the grand scheme of things. Not crazy, but 3 million people are like a lot of people.

Right. And the fact that it reached like people in your hometown. Well, oh, it definitely did. Because I know that the algorithm is supposed to be like kind of random, but it's not. Like it was pushing that shit out to my family and stuff. So did you just make one or have you like kind of stuck with it and talked about it in depth. So I made the one and it went really viral and people just had so many questions.

And they were like saying you can't say toddler about like certain things that were happening during the time I was growing up with my dad. And I was like, yeah, but that's because I said toddler because I started living him with him when I was like two. Yeah. But people worked up about random things as the internet does. And so I made another video to clarify and then another part because people were like, Like, I mean, when I say thousands, like it was like tens of thousands of comments, I think.

If people, like, I had to use one of those online systems that would like go through comments, like tell you what they were saying to like filter them out, like an AI tool to like tell me what to answer. And so I ended up making like five or six parts. But then I privated them because I was like, I don't really need these to stay here. and I won the challenge. I won the challenge. And then I figured I would talk about it in the podcast just to have it, like, out there and say it all in one place. And because right after I posted those, hundreds of people were reaching out to me. I mean, I had my TikTok messages open by accident.

I was a new to TikTok, okay. And so there was like hundreds of messages. Some people were telling me stories that were like so sad. And I took time to read them all and reply. because it really seemed like they needed somebody to tell. Like one girl was like, I've never told anyone this my whole life. And I feel like I need to tell somebody and I feel like I can tell you and told me. And it was just like a heart wrenching story, like so dark.

And I just, I sat there like all night. I stayed up and talked to her and I was like, you know, this is like, okay. They can get through this, whatever. And so anyway, she's been following me ever since. But just things like that, I was like, if I can do that on a grand scale and make people feel like that, that they can tell their story too. Because what happened to me had nothing to do with me at the end of the day. I didn't choose any of that.

I didn't choose who my parents were. I didn't choose that people in my hometown hated me because of what my parents did. I think, like, I do live with guilt about it, which is weird. Like, it's a weird thing to experience. You always question things you did as a kid. Like, oh, did I look weird when I did that? or did someone not like me because of X, Y, or Z of the way I said the story? Or did I overshare or did I undershare?

And what I've realized after looking back is a lot of people are just reflecting on their own experiences when they're like looking at you like that. Because I'd get some weird looks. But I think a lot of the time they're just like realizing that they've forgotten about something that they don't want to think about. And it's coming to the surface. And I really am a believer. that you shouldn't put things so far tucked away in your own self. I really think that's not good.

Yeah. And I think, too, like you just mentioned, it is so important for other people. It doesn't even matter the age at this point, but for other people to know that obviously not everybody grows up the same, you know, and some people grow up, there's like a spectrum of how dark things can get, for sure. And it's heartbreaking and it's scary. But I think that it is so important, especially especially if there's people like you in the sense that I feel like turn out to be so well spoken and so open and so good. But at the same time, not everybody, I feel like people still try to suppress things, especially if they turn out one way because they're like, I don't want people to know

that there's even remotely another side of me. Yeah. Like, you know what I mean? That's negative. Yeah. Because I think that that can become a fear also. Like, I feel like you want to be so opposite of what you were raised to see. and the people that you were raised around,

that it like becomes something where you almost become shamed of it and you don't want to talk about it. But like you have been mentioning basically this whole episode is it's important to just embrace it and not be ashamed of it because it happens in so many different ways more than we think. And I feel like if there's shame around what happened to you or, you know, different experiences or traumas you've had,

then I feel like it kind of just makes you feel more isolated. Like even if you're doing, well deep down within yourself. I feel like you're going to feel some form of isolation or like, well, these people don't really know who I am or what I went through. And what's the point of that? You know, I think it's better for people to know who you are and what you've been through because then they can appreciate where you are today. And that's so true. That's speaking about it. That's really true. I think that's happened to me a lot recently. It's been a theme of my life because, you know, as I've built my different relationships and I have like my best friends

that I've been friends with for, you know, 10, 11, 20 years, it starts to come out more that the people that really do know you the best that can really be there for you are the people that know every side of you. And I think when you've, you know, spent your life in a mildewy shower with lights that don't turn on or hungry stealing school lunch or watching your dad's girlfriend shoot heroin and not know what's going on, no matter what it is, or if it's all three or even more than that, it really comes down to the people that know you, know that that affects you, even if it doesn't look the way you expect it to. Absolutely. Yeah. And my husband always tells me, you know, whenever it comes up, I always say, like, you know, should I share that? Like, somebody asked me

this, should I say? Like, I mean, it's kind of related. He's like, I mean, it's part of everything that you are. Like, it's part of every part of your personality is defined by what's happened to you. As much as you have tried and failed to escape that fact, but I think that at the end of the day, you have two choices. You can let it define you and let it guide you to be whatever you want because you recognize your own resilience. Or you can let it define you and you can follow the path or you can fall off, right? And so I think it's just that choice.

If you can't have the choice of it happening to you or not, you might as well have the choice of how you recover from it. I guess that's just always been the way I look at it. Yeah. And I 100% agree with you. And it's sad because I think that, you know, some people don't have the strength and the mental strength, the physical strength, whatever it may be. Or maybe, you know, they're around it so much and they don't feel that there's a way out that they're almost like predestined for that future. And it's so sad because I feel like, especially with addiction and drugs. and lifestyles of all of that sort, even like with, I feel like the dancing, the stripping.

It's like it's not easy, I feel like to get out of. I think it's for a lot of people that didn't grow up that way. It could be easy for them to say like, oh, there's so many different things that you could be doing. But like that's all that they were, that's all that they know. Yeah. That's what they were raised on. You know what I mean?

So it's like it is sad too that I feel like some people, you know, I feel like at a certain point you have a choice. but like if so much happens so young, it's almost like your brain doesn't even understand the other choice or the opposite of what you've seen or experienced. That's so true. And I think, yeah, a lot of people don't realize that. I think I have a friend that I've been friends with for like 20 years and she didn't grow up the best either.

But I always text her when I feel a certain way or like if I get imposter syndrome or I feel guilty or like I don't deserve something good that happens in my life because I feel like I've made some kind of deal somewhere along the way. I get this like weird, another weird part of my personality. Right. And that's the thing. Like you said, it really is all part of what you've gone through. Yeah. Like that's why your body and your mind reacts the way it does. Yeah. So we just bought a house and I texted her the other day and I said, why do I get this? And I was just like crying because I just, you know, after my life, I was in a Lowe's parking lot the other day and I went in there to look at like shower drains like because I wanted a brass one. How stupid is that? Like I'm not

happy with my black builder grade perfectly fine, never used like shower drain. That's insane. Like my drain didn't use to even work when I was a kid. I would stand in dirty water. But I think that too, it's. I think the interesting and special thing about that, though, is that you realize it. Like, you're aware of it. How could you not? But that doesn't mean you're not deserving of it. It's true.

I always feel like it's kind of, it's one of those things that you could look at it and be like, this is so stupid. Like, I know the opposite of this. But it's also one of those things that you kind of can look back and smile and see, like, how opposite and how far you've come and be like, wow, like, I grew up this way. and now I have these opportunities. I think people describe it as something called survivor's guilt. Like I have this feeling of like this other girl I went to school with

or my dad's girlfriend's daughter or so-and-so. And it's like, I watched all these horrible things happen to them. And why didn't that happen? I don't know. It's a weird thing. But so I asked my friend the other day I said, you know, why me? Like, how do I get this? And she responded.

And it's usually my screensaver. She said, you never stopped believing you were still going to have the life you dreamed of and deserve. You worked hard anyways. You showed up anyways. You smiled anyways. You loved people anyways. You kept trying as hard as you possibly could always. You were grateful for your life even when it was absolute shit.

That's why you get it. Yeah. And like I guess that helped. That helped me reframe something. And I guess anyone that has survivors guilt, that's a good way to look at it. Like maybe you deserve it if you just do it anyway, just show up anyway, just smile anyway, get through it anyway. And then eventually one day, the challenge has passed.

And because you did all those things, you've earned this life that you can now enjoy. And I know that's kind of a fucked up way to look at it, especially for someone that maybe like from the outside doesn't have their own trauma or survivor's guilt. but if you do, like maybe that's a good way to look at it. But too, I think that you're, even by you coming on here and sharing your story, that takes a lot. I mean, I tell people this all the time. It takes a lot of courage and strength to do.

Even if it's something that you kind of have accepted and embraced and you're like open about it, it still takes a lot to sit down and just lay everything out there and just be like, kind of from start to finish, like, okay, this is how I grew up. This is the things I saw. You know, this is what my parents did because a lot of times, I think you mentioned this well but people will or not and they shouldn't do this but people will define who you are by someone else's actions just because like you surround yourself with them or they're your parents or they're your friends and that's not really a fair thing like we're all individual we're all

our own people but you know for you to come on here and share what you've been through even if you're accepting of it it's not easy like you know there is still like anybody could look back at that whether it's yourself looking at the young you or or me, like, listening to it, it's heartbreaking and it's sad and it's not an easy thing to reflect on. So the fact that you're willing to be so open and share those things, like I said, it makes other people feel like, okay, like I'm not alone or what I went through, you know, it's not okay, but she gives me hope that I'm not a failure because of it or I should, I'm not a certain

way because of the decisions that my parents made. Exactly right. And the other thing that I noticed is when people would talk to. to people about this. If they were teachers, they saw it a little bit differently because they see so many kids that go into school and they like don't have their teeth brushed or their hair brushed or they realize they've been in the same outfit or their parents aren't picking them up or they go to the principal's office to try to get their parents to come in and their parents still don't come. And they just have absolutely no connection to their children. And being a teacher,

like if you really care like that, must be so difficult because I had some teachers. like that that were like trying to watch out for me and just like failing over and over again at like trying to get this kid help and they just don't get it that must really I mean that must suck right because it's like as a teacher there I feel like there's only so much you can do yes and it's like you have to become like the parent but in a teacher way which is so sad and it's even harder now because there's like all these laws and people get upset if you take their kids somewhere right versus back then like teachers would drive me to my grandmother's house right because they'd be like her dad's not going to get her like it's 6 p.m. You know what I mean? Like she's walking or I'm taking her.

So I think like nowadays you can't you can't do that. Someone will be like, I don't know what you did with my kid or what snack did you give them. It's like, I don't know, I just think it's really too bad because teachers really do so much. They put so much on the line every day just to give children like a barely normal life away from home that they a lot of times don't otherwise get. And Yeah. It's just a real shame. It is. It's heartbreaking. It's sad. It's really unfortunate, the different things that children go through and people in general and, you know, all we can do is spread awareness and talk about it. And that's what you did. And that's important and incredible. Yeah, you can do it. That's right. And you have this platform too for that reason, right?

Like you are passionate about bringing people's stories to the surface and not letting them just stagnate and become nothing. It's like, let's just embrace what's happening in the world and the real day-to-day life of people or their backgrounds or their childhoods. And I mean, I listen to some of those. And I'm like, gosh, it couldn't get any worse than that. But like people say that. It's just, you can't compare it, right? They're all like in their own way special in a way. They're special.

And the thing is you never know how something big or small is going to affect somebody. That is so true. Everybody takes things differently. Like what could affect me? in a certain way could be so much better or worse for somebody else. So that's another reason why you can compare. Yeah. Because it's like you don't know what that did to someone or didn't do or, you know, how they did

or did not get through it. So, but that's why too, I think that's the beauty of, you know, and what makes it so unique is that we are all so different. So we have, we can relate in different ways. And that's why I tell people all the time, I'm like, look, when you come on here and you talk about what you've been through, just because somebody hasn't experienced exactly your story or exactly what you've experienced doesn't mean that they can't relate or they haven't had similar feelings. And that's why it's so important for people to speak up and talk about it.

And I think, you know, feelings sometimes too, like talking better emotions, it's like, I don't know, not everybody wants to do it. It's hard. It's not easy. And, you know, I think a lot of times you can be looked at as like sensitive and emotional, but that's the beauty of life. Like, who wouldn't want to be that? Why would you want to be cold and dry and not relate to people? I can't imagine not being like wanting to relate to somebody. That's like, I mean, that's what I do. That's what I want to do. You know, so it's important.

And I think it makes human connection really, really special. So true. I was talking to a girl the other day. And again, one of the people that reached out. And she was like, yeah, I went through a divorce when I was 10. My parents went through a divorce. And she said, I know that might sound silly compared to you. And I said, it really doesn't because I, that seems.

so incredibly hard to me because if you think about for me it's like my care my parents are characters in my life I never was emotionally bonded to either of them I was able to separate myself right and become my own person and who I wanted to be versus for her she had this incredible attachment to both of her parents and their relationship with each other and then it breaks and people change during a divorce right that seems incredibly difficult to me I don't know how I would have handled something like that versus, you know, just being able to say, well, they're characters. I never bonded to my mom. And so that's why it hasn't affected me. Or my dad has antisocial personality disorder. So I can kind of just put that in a box and call it what it is.

Versus, I don't know, I'm just. Yeah. And it is different. Right. And it's almost like too. It's interesting because I feel like you kind of, because you viewed your parents as characters, you kind of were able to form your own, like, lifestyle on choices. Right. I would. want this for myself. And like you kind of molded and meshed what you wanted for yourself. Exactly. You didn't let, you know what I mean. Yeah. I will say my grandmother is a big part of that. Like I think the older I get, the more I'm like, I'm just my grandmother. Yeah. Like I love animals, as you know. And I'm very in touch with nature. And so is she like when I would be upset as a kid, she would tell me, go tell the trees about it. Yeah. And they can handle it. Do it to one of the bigger ones.

though, because the little ones are a little sensitive. You don't want to talk to them badly. We want them to grow. I love that. And so I would do that. Like, that sounds so crazy to some people. But, you know, we were just always like, that's just how my family was. Or I guess me and my grandmother, not really about our family.

But, yeah. So the older I get, the more I just see myself, like, I'm watering my little money tree. And I'm like, okay. Like, how are you doing this morning? Right. And my husband's like, okay. No, but yes. Like, yeah.

She's good. No. Yeah. That's great. That's really sweet. Awesome. Well, seriously, you did such a good job. Thanks.

And thank you for coming on here and opening up and sharing your story. Well, I'm happy to be here. So thank you.