What Now? with Trevor Noah - Dulce Sloan: Will You Be My Valentine?

Episode Date: February 12, 2026

Trevor and Eugene sit down with comedian and former Daily Show correspondent Dulce Sloan for a wide-ranging, candid conversation about life. Along the way, they dig into the loneliness that can come with fame, the challenges of dating, and the unspoken pressures men and women bring into relationships. When it comes to the emotional math of choosing between independence and intimacy, is staying home the only good option left? Funny, sharp, and disarmingly real, the episode captures the contradictions of modern love in a world that rarely slows down. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

to my homeboy that I was in cell one day and he was like, that's not true. I said, of course it is. I said, I am celibate and it is very involuntary. These are, this is what insolentilent. Yes. I would love to be having sex time. There's nothing better than having your legs in the air.

And yet, Trevor, do you agree? Get up. Can I tell you what's funny? Tell me. Is that your legs in the air? You made me picture my legs in the air. That's what I hate about what you did to me there. That's what good friends are for. That's what you did to me there. Sure. And you made me. Because you asked it, my first instinct, my first instinct was to defend myself.

But the first thought I had, the first thought I had was me with my own legs in the air. Whenever I hear something enjoyable, I think of who could enjoy this more? And my friend comes to mind and I'm thinking, look, there's an opportunity for someone's legs. Who would enjoy? He's an idiot. Who would enjoy this? Stop talking. Who would enjoy this more?

So, okay. No, no, no, no, wait. I appreciate that about you. You're a fool. So let's go back. You're afraid of that dumbed-up. This is What Now with Trevor Noah. Only difference between me and a Dominican is a boat stop.

That's it. I could have been Mexican. I could have been Dominican. I could have from Costa Rica. But instead, we landed here. So if I go to any of those diaspora places, no one's questioning my existence. But if I go back to the Motherland, all of a sudden it's, well, what is she doing here?

And I'm like, I think planes fly daily. That's why I'm here. If you kept quiet and you came to South Africa, no one would know you not from there. Probably is me keeping quiet. You know that. Have we met?

You've never been to South Africa. Now he was supposed to take me in Roy. Yeah, but what are you? What do you mean supposed to? No, no, not you. I'm saying, yeah, no, what do you mean supposed to? You said to me. You know what I love?

Do so I'll let you finish your sentence. Acuse me so that I may respond in full. Because he always says, like, you know, like an American black people, we don't have a lot of noises. We do have one. Ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah. No, sir. You said, oh, I want to take you.

Because talking to me and Roy, oh, I would love to take you out of South Africa. Roy was like mothers. Mothers too. Bring everybody. All of a sudden, this nigga don't call the amnesia. Talking about he don't remember telling me, let me say something. I always remember when a man tells me something he didn't intend on doing. That's what I will always remember.

something the nigger was really going to do I don't remember that Like what? I don't know calling me back I'll always remember that one Yeah because I know it's not going to happen Guys don't call you back It's very confusing

You see these tities I don't know what's going on Very nice We're rolling Perfect moment You see these titties That's the best place to start a podcast ever You see these tities

Because I'm sitting here going Why would they not call back? Welcome to the show You see these tities Hey man Go to church That's how I got them. There are a few people in this world.

I would love to hear the last part of a sentence from then Dulce Sloan. No, I'm serious. When I think about it, I go, like, you know when you just catch the tail end of a conversation or something someone said, you will never beat Dulce. Listen to the end of that sentence. You see these tities and now you go, what was the beginning of that sentence? Fill it in. In my head, I was like, can we see more of those tities?

What are you doing when someone says, see these tities? You're like, all right. You just fell into a doce trap. Here's the thing. I will always remember you said to me, I'm the blackest person, you know, which is crazy because I'm not the blackest person that I know. So I was like, how am I the blackest?

And I was like, oh, you don't know a lot of niggas. That's the difference. You know black people. You always say that to me. Who are you friends with? No, no, no. You always say that. Josh?

Wow. You just took shots at Josh. He's not even here. And he deserves it. Wherever Josh Johnson is right now, he's like, oh. Oh. Oh. Oh.

Wow. Wow. Dulce. I love Josh. It's my favorite thing. But, you know, Josh doesn't have any siblings. Josh owes you half of everything. Oh, because I braided his hair.

Yo, Dulce made Josh over. Josh will even attest to the. Josh Johnson, the way we see him today, that's a Dulcee makeover. I made him. Full makeover. He made him. You, Josh, that was a fool. Dulce was like, she sat him down one day.

his afro was stressing me out yeah but it was like a like yo man there's afros and then there's whatever's happening wait so there was an afro intervention yeah but it was it was african intervention no this one was it was a black woman intervention because one day he came to work and it was when after was smaller and so it was like it looked like he had his hair cut into like an old box like an old school box yeah yeah but he'd just been sleeping on different sides of his head so it just turned into So I called him a sleepbox And so we started giving him a bonnet And all the stuff and stuff

Because like during the Emmys one time He came up to our room Because when I took my mom the first time we went She was showing him how to shape it up Because we were talking about trying to get Like different hair styles he could get I said well your head is too small for cornrows And he was just like

Oh the shots keep coming I'm just trying to be helpful Because like I said he has no sibling So he doesn't have an older sister To terrorize him Or to educate tomato potato So one day it was like one Christmas And it's like during COVID, I was like, hey, come to my house because he didn't go home.

I didn't go home. I didn't go home. And so, you know, the day after Christmas is the first day of Kwanza. So I made him come to come to my house and say I'm going to wash and deep condition your hair. And so I'm talking about kitchen sink, whole nine, like old school doing your hair. And then I braided it up. And the whole time I'm just like, this motherfucker's got so much more hair than me. And the whole time I'm braiding his hair.

I'm annoyed by it. But I just was like, I just needed something to moisturize and condition his hair. I didn't know it was going to style he was going to keep. It was beautiful. So it was, it was like those movies where the person walks, you've known them like for years. And then just before the prom, they get a makeover and they walk through the halls. And Josh Johnson walked down the hall with like that one braid, that one braid falling over his face. And we're like, Josh, is that, is that you?

He even got a new, a new bass in his voice. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I didn't realize until like one day we were at the cellar and a bunch of the guys at the cellar. Started hitting on. We're telling him. He's a black.

man they were, they were. No one's more homophobic than a black man. And so, like, it's male, like, black male comics. Like, your hair looks great. And he kept going, Dulce did it. Dolese did it. And I'm like, really? Like, yeah.

And so when he started getting, like, compliments from, like, black men, I was like, oh, this was a great. That's when you knew it was the upgrade. And I was like, oh, he's keeping this. Has anyone done something like that for you in your life? Who's Ducey Sloaned your life? Nobody. What do you mean? Nobody?

I just, me, niggas. I do me. I'm the dole-say-slo-for-me. I guess my mom, maybe, I don't know. No, but moms don't count. Mom's don't count. No, don't take that out of context. Moms count very much.

Yes. Don't clip that. Don't clip that. Do-over. Do-over. Do-over. What I mean is in this conversation we're having now. We're saying moms already are the most amazing thing in the world. Right.

We don't count moms in this case. Moms can't dole-S-S-S-lone. Yeah. So we're saying who's du-s-slawned you? Probably you. No, don't say that because I'm here. No. Like if you're asking...

I didn't do say slow in you. What are you talking about? What I'm saying is that if you were talking about someone who has come in and changed my life, it was probably you or Big Kenny who got me into stand-up. But I didn't do you a favor. You did Josh a favor. There was no benefit for what you did to Josh. There was all the benefit.

What was the benefit? I didn't have to look at that afro. He was stressing me and eating it out. How long did it last for that new hip-ha? Yeah. What do you mean? It's still there. It is Josh's hair.

So he goes to a lady now and gets it washed and braided. It is the greatest thing that ever happened. Oh, so he's stuck to it. Yeah. Like the style he has now. So I did his hair. The one? Yeah, the one braid.

I'm responsible. Have you seen a TikTok where the girl was like she was trying to get dressed and she realized she was just Josh Johnson? No. Because she had a twist out. She had twists in. And she said she was put on this gray hoodie and then a braid fell down. And she's like, when you're getting dressed and realize you're Josh Johnson.

That is so. So funny. Truly. You two have like one of the best dynamics I've ever come across. You know when you meet people who it feels like they've known each other their whole lives? Because how long have you known Josh for? I met Josh June like 2016. Yeah, you see, that's not, that's like now.

But I feel like you two are like siblings. I met him a year before, like a year, maybe a year or two before I started at the show. Is that because you both from the South? We were doing NACAs together. I'm sorry, what? So NACA, so you've never had to do this whole stroll. So NACA, it's the National Association of College Activities. So basically there's all these different.

So they cut the whole United States up in the regions. Yeah. And then like comedians, musicians, those companies that just make like little kitchy shit, anybody with a bouncy house will go to, you pay to perform in front of them. And then you just kind of stand there and just wait for them to, pick you. It's very much like you were very much a hooker on the stroll. So my college agent, you had to apply to this and then you

You applied to NACA. You applied to NACA. You pay money to audition. And then, but here's the thing. So Josh broke the record for one of the regions because Josh booked like 70 schools. Wow. So I think I but I think he booked like, so Josh paid off his student loans performing at colleges. I think I did, in the two years I did NACA's, I did 60 schools. So that's why I've almost died in the state of Pennsylvania like four times.

Wow. So you would go to these knackas in different, so there was like the north reason, the southern reason, the mid and all of that. And so you'd do 15 minutes on stage. And then afterwards they had this thing called camps. So you're doing these big convention centers. And then my college agent, aka the pimp, would stand there with a list of all of the schools. And then every school that came up to talk to you, she would notate. And then the kids want to talk. So she'd be the bad guy, be like, oh, she's got to talk to more people. And so she'd be the bad guy and kick these. And so she would just keep track of every school that came to talk to you.

And then I got to me in one of the meetings that I wasn't supposed to be in, apparently. And so they would do something called block bookings. And so the longest block booking I ever had was I did 13 schools in 14 days in six different states. 13 schools in 14 days in six different states. Yes. And I was living in L.A. at the time. And a lot of schools I had were out here. So I, one time I flew out.

So I flew out to New York. And then my homework picked me up to the airport. And then we drove to Connecticut and we had a show that night. And then the next day we drove to Maine. And then the next day, because the most you could drive in a day was five hours. And so every day, because the grouting was like, well, here's all these states that are really close. And so we would wake up, drive two to four hours, do a show, stay in a hotel, wake up the next day, drive two to five hours, do a show. And so I did that for four.

So there was like one night we stayed in two places, but it was stuff like that. Or I did a booking where it was like seven days in just the state of Massachusetts, just bouncing around doing schools. And so that's what I was doing before I booked the show, was performing for these little motherfuckers. There's moments where I missed those grinds. We've all had them. You miss struggling? No, like...

Did you have fun doing it? What? Sometimes. No, what do you mean? Why would you say struggling? She nearly died. Yeah. But that was because of the snow.

Yeah, that's different. Why are you making it like it's a comedy thing? I almost die every day. I'm a woman in America. I'm almost dead 90% of. Damn, Dulce took it there. Yeah. It's just death for death.

Thank you. Yeah, but his death was a joke. Yeah, but he ain't caught me up. Yours is real. Yeah, well, you know, sometimes you got to get out of an apartment. You know what I mean? So, me and my friend were talking about this. Like, men do not realize how much danger women are in a regular basis. Because one of my friends asked me the other day, he's like, you think you kill somebody?

I was like, yeah. He was like, that was fast. And I was like, you've never been a apartment. You've never been a woman. One of the greatest jokes I ever heard was it was just like a small throw way thing. It was Dave Chappelle on stage and he was talking about one of the first gigs he ever did in New York that he was getting paid for. And he performed for some, I don't know if they were gangsters or not gangsters. Long story short, they paid him in cash and they gave him $10,000 in cash. And he was like in one of the boroughs long before New York was like easy in most places. And he tells the story of having the cash and he puts it like in his pants and then he gets on the train and he's riding the train. Why would you get on the trail with $10,000? Get a cab.

Yeah, but this is... Get a cab. Don't victim blame. And then Dave Chappelle's... And then... No, but he says... And that was the punchline of the joke. Obviously, I'm truncating it.

But basically he says, everyone was looking at him. He felt like he was in danger. And he's like, he's never felt more like a woman in his life. Absolutely. That's... You don't know what I mean? Absolutely. Every day.

So it's just like, so, you know, you start carrying a knife. Wait, wait. So, wait, let me ask you a question. So, because I threw that thing online and I didn't ask anyone about it when it was happening. who would you rather be in a forest with a man or a bear? You can throw food at a bear. You got to throw pussy at a man. You can answer the question.

A bear. A bear? Yeah. Because I know what, because the thing is it's like a bear is not inherently dangerous. Unless it's hungry. Okay, so let me ask your question here. I'm glad you're here, Dilsay. You're the only person I'll probably ask this to.

Because you'll be honest. Could it be? that men struggle with hearing that answer because as men, we don't see ourselves as a monolith. No, men struggle with seeing that answer because men don't want to think they're the bad guy. So here's the thing.

Women are told to take self-defense classes. Yes. Don't dress provocatively. Yes. Don't be a whore. Okay. Carry a knife. Carry pepper spray.

Carry all of these things. So you're telling me to do all of these things to make sure that I'm not assaulted or attacked. Right. But then if I get assaulted or attacked, you don't believe me. But you told me to do all of these things. And so, if I'm being attacked, somebody's doing it.

But we're never talking about who, we're not telling the attackers not to attack. We're telling the victim don't get attacked. So every man that heard that was just like, well, I would never. But every woman you know has either been sexually harassed or sexually assaulted. So we're not doing it to each other. So how is it that no man has done it, but it has happened to every woman? So when men hear that, it's, well, I wouldn't do that.

Because I was talking to Kabooka about this one time. And Kabooka was like, he's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's crazy. He said, you don't think that your friend, he's like, he says, your friend that's talking to all the women, come to find out, he's raping everybody. That was a good impression of Kimukkah. Thank you. Thank you. Yeah, the thing. He's doing the thing.

He's doing the thing. And you don't know, he's doing the thing. He's at the bar. He's talking to the lady. You don't know what I'm saying? Right. is like that. There's men that have assaulted people.

It's like, well, I didn't do anything wrong. So if you as a man think that a woman would rather be with a wild animal in the forest than you, because here's my thing. I think all the men that got upset by that, there's always a saying that I would hear growing up, a kicked dog will holler. If I didn't kick you, you're fine. But if you felt like you got kicked, then you are somebody who has been harassed and terrorizing women.

Point blank. Hmm. Because if I wasn't talking to you, you wouldn't have gotten upset. And the same reason why people would go, well, I'm not racist. And I was like, I wasn't even talking to you. But anytime somebody pops up, I can't believe that women would feel this way. Yes, I said I would rather be in the forest with a wild animal. Because here's the thing.

Bears aren't inherently going. They don't want to be bothered by humans in the first. Right, yeah, yeah, right. That's the thing. That's their default. The default is, ah, oh, person, blah. then, but if they need something, it's just like, well, I'm kind of hungry.

I wonder if this human got snacks. This human smell like snakes. Which is why I don't wear any food-scented fragrances. I don't want to trick nobody. I'm a floral bitch, right? So that's the thing. I hear your logic, but. But you see what I'm saying?

No, I hear what you're saying. But the kickdog hollering thing, the reason I don't think it necessarily applies is because we are speaking to everyone. But why's what I'm saying? No, so this is what I mean. So let's let's let's, let's, let's, let's, let's, let's, Let's move it to another category, right?

Let's, for instance, let's say somebody says, I don't like white people because white people are racist. Yes. Right? There's a lot of white people who would respond to that going, why would you say that? I'm not racist. Right.

Because they're not racist. And some who are racist would respond as well. I'm not saying they wouldn't respond. Right. But if you speak to a collective, you shouldn't be shocked when some from the collective respond to you. I'm not shocked, but when I'm saying it, there's a level of going,

oh, why would you say that I'm not racist? but what that sentence is also acknowledging is that yes I'm talking to white people but if you're not racist I wasn't talking to you so you see what I'm saying so it's like well white people are racist I get what you're saying you want to finish yourself so in the same reasons like well you know they're used to you know black people are criminals

I don't crime so you wouldn't respond to that no because you're not talking to me because I'm not a criminal also know this is a blanket yes it is a blanket statement yeah but you also have to remember this is pure hyperbole Somebody said, would a woman rather be in the forest with a person or a bear and you started a TED talk about why

if you saw that and you went first of all, stop typing. Stop typing. This is already goofy. That's saying, would you rather be in the ocean with an octopus or a shark? I'm at the beach. It doesn't matter. Right. I know one of them might inherit. Because that's the thing. There's no Inherent danger in a shark.

But you know what? You know what I think it is? I think it reveals something about us as people in general. And that thing is, I love that you said hyperbole, right? Oftentimes, any statement of protest, provocation, any statement that's meant to elicit something from people is often blunt and provocative. Right. Right?

Like, that's not the place for, like, nuance in a way. That's why text messaging needs fonts. Yeah. So you go, you just say the thing. So I remember, for instance, when Black Lives Matter first came out, like, Black Lives Matter. And then the first thing a lot of people said was like, why only Black Lives? Why are you saying Black Lives Matter? What about the other lives?

And then Black people went, no, that's not the point. The point, we're not saying that because no other lives matter. And then it became this whole, do you know what I mean? It's like a game of semantics now where you're actually arguing. But it's interesting when you say that because I go like, oh, that's an insight. that I don't think I've thought of until you said it that way about hyperbole, that any group that is saying something, whether it's two people, a nation, ethnicity, you know, gender, a religion, or whatever it is,

the people who are not in that group that are speaking can think completely differently and like it's not about them in a way. Does it make sense? Yeah. Because I think there's a lot of black people, if somebody said, let's say a white person came out and they were like, I'm not safer around black people because black people are criminals

there's no hook that they would be let off you with me 100% there's like there's no hook that they would be let off there's none none and they can't be like

no no no don't respond if you if you're not a criminal then why are you offended then you're like hey you didn't say you have a problem with criminals you said black people are criminals right and so then if they said

if they said no no but if you're black and you're not a criminal you shouldn't be offended people would go no hell no you're not the day you're still on that hook right but here's but here's the difference it's one is ridiculous one is not right so bear versus human man yeah same thing on ticot it was uh they were talking about like who would win a hundred americans or a hundred british people 100 British people oh i think you're talking about the gorilla one i was just a good for

The gorilla. First is, but see this so Wednesday? Back up then. The gorilla thing. It makes sense to me why men were upset. It was like, well, she would rather be in the, with a bear. So it was bear versus human men, right? Women picked bear.

Yes. And a bunch of men said, hey, one gorilla versus a hundred men. Yeah. And a bunch of men were like, yes, we could do this. And you're just like, have you ever, have you ever watch PBS? The strength. of a gorilla. You know how you can squeeze the orange and get juice?

A gorilla can do that with an apple. A human man can't squeeze an apple and get juice out. But a gorilla all day, boom, ha-ha. But there's a hundred of us. Right. But there's a hundred of us. I understand that. There's a hundred of us.

Right. And so this isn't movie rules. Yeah, but I'm saying there's a hundred of us. I get it. You can pile on them. I get it. Yeah. But at least 20 y'all are dead.

Yeah, but 80 have one. I'm not saying 80. one and I'm not saying that here's the thing Are you saying a gorilla would beat a hundred men? I'm saying this is going to be the most controversial podcast we've ever put out from the jump Which men are you sending? No, but that's going to know what I'm okay which gorilla

Are you sending your best man? Are you sending your best gorilla? Absor fucking lootly. Then absente fucking lootly. But we also didn't ask what men are you going to be stuck with in the forest instead of a bit? No, no. Chusha. No, any man's a problem.

Any man's a problem. Listen, I mean, we're going to spend a tiny man. You send me a tiny man Peter Digglage in this bitch Yeah, spin Peter Digglidge I might have him But if he catch me in the shins, it's over You see what I'm saying? Like I don't know, I don't know his moves

I don't know he got a weapon on him You just sit one man, I don't know what's on him Okay, maybe I should ask A bear, grizzly or black bear They start there first And what kind of man Would you choose to be not to be stuck with In the forest?

Here's the thing. I exist. And I'll tell you why I'm asking you this. I exist in a body where a lot of men aren't paying attention to me anyway. Hmm. So. Huh? That's crazy.

This man got Foley? Your boys over here doing a sound effect. Did you call it Foley? Yeah. That is one of the deepest cuts. That's amazing. Most people would say sound effects. That's when you know someone's in the movie industry.

She said she called it Foley. Foli. Oh, yeah. No, no, your jeans got hella folly. Outside. Crazy. Man, nuts. He's thirsty.

I don't. Here's the thing. I thought it was such a silly question. Yeah. That I didn't really think about it. Like, so, like, I started a newsletter because you have to always constantly be talking to people. And I put, like, a silly thought at the end of it. And the one I put in it this week was, is an asae bowl fruit soup?

Huh. So that's the level. But I saw that bear man versus bear thing or 100 men versus a gorilla. Wait, wait, wait, don't just move on. Is an assaye bowl just fruit soup? Right. What makes a soup a soup a soup? Is it a fruit stew?

You see what I'm saying? So it's silly shit like that. So I used to tell one of my friends that I think a doctor is a body mechanic. I think that's correct. Right. So just goofy shit like this is just a dumb thing I think of? So like is a doctor a body mechanic? Is that fruit soup?

They don't put, you know, there's numbers in math, but there are no, there's letters in math, but there's no numbers and words. Had a full-blown argue with my brother for 20 minutes about this until my mom was like, just say there's no numbers and words. Damn. But yeah, there's numbers. How long has your brain been like this? Mm-hmm. I don't have a husband or children to take up space, so I think to think about goofy shit. You think your brain would stop if you had them around?

I think I would have other things to think about other than Asai-I-Bel. Well, it was fruit suit. When was the first time, you noticed that your brain wasn't working like most people's brains were working? Because you're an interesting combination of things. You have like the what I call the leaky brain of a comedian. But then you also are like one of the most genius people I know when it comes to like learning, retaining information, expanding on that information. I mean, even in school, you were in... I was in gifted classes.

Yeah, you were in, like, all the gifted classes. You were the solving the puzzles. Yeah, it's like, which is so funny because physics has never clicked for me. But I think that the thing that was bothered me about physics was it was like, they wanted us to calculate the, like, you had to learn about vectors.

And they're like, okay, somebody's throwing this ball off a cliff and calculate. I remember going to class going, but he can't get the ball back. So why am I doing this? That's where your brain went? I went to my seat. I said, excuse me?

why are we calculating this? He can't get the ball back. My teacher went, what? I said, what? If he threw the ball off the cliff, he ain't going to get it. So why do I need to know how fast it took to get down? What was the acceleration of the shit?

It's gone forever. Why do I need to know this information? So I need things that make, that's why like geometry made sense for me. Chemistry made sense for me because there was too much, as much I was a theater kid I could suspend a disbelief.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, okay. Some stuff is, this is busy work. This is real middle management bullshit. You're not trying to get. I'm not getting it. I'm never, there's a difference between I'm never going to use this

and this man needs a job. I didn't like me participating. It just keeping some white man employed. I did not like that. Because I need certain things to make sense. Even if they're ridiculous, I love science fiction, but sometimes it has to be like,

that's why every joke, they're like, well, every joke has a bit of truth to it. Some of it doesn't. Some of it's just purely goofy. Some of it is purely funny. It's just words put together that makes a person laugh. It's an ascible fruit suit.

Goofy shit. Like that I understand. But it's like, I think the first time I was like, I remember never believe it in Santa Claus because the logistics didn't make sense. That was your big gripe as a child. Like, not even from the beginning. There was no point where you believed in it.

They explained it to you once and you immediately went. What part of the logistics didn't make sense? One, I knew my mom wasn't going to let some random man in our house. Okay. That was first. Two, I know some random. But you don't have to let him in the house. That's the first thing, Santa Claus.

Well, I knew like when we first, like, a first place we didn't have a chimney. And I was like, we're already out. That's true. I thought that in South Africa, because we basically, no one had chimneys essentially. And then when we live somewhere with the chimney, I was like, this definitely isn't going to work. Also, my mother never told us he was real, but my mother never told us he wasn't real. Wait, how did you account for the magic, though? Because remember, there's magic as well.

Right. Santa Claus makes sense because of the magic. The logistics bug me. Yeah, but the magic. The magic covers the logistics. It's like, you've got to think of Santa, like, okay, think of Amazon. Right. Let's say we told somebody about Amazon 2,000 years ago.

They would go, this doesn't make sense. No, they wouldn't. What do you mean in one day, something can get to you from where? And you'd be like, yes, so I think of something that I would like or need. And then a day later, it is here. And they would say to you, so you can just dream of Odysseus's brush. And it shall appear. And you're like, yes, it will appear.

But home delivery, y'all, but things were getting delivered to homes forever. So even in Rome, somebody was like, hey, I, bought some bread. Oh boy from the bakery is bringing bread. You know when the shadow hits this part. Yeah. So then Santa Claus's home delivery. But I think it never made sense to me because nobody was, because everybody was depending on the fact that I was a child. And they're just like, oh, you can tell kids anything. Okay, okay, okay. Okay. So you didn't like that? Well, it was like, when you start asking questions and you realize they have no answers. That's what gets you. That's when I'm just like, well, what the, I was like, well, how does he get here on a sleigh with reindeer?

Fine. I can accept the magic of that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right, but I'm just like, well, what kids do he know to come to? Because I was sitting there going, I was like, well, not every kid is a Christian. So I'm like, there's a whole country he ain't got to go to there. So they gives him more time because not every country got Christians. Isn't he going to India? Right.

That's Christians in India. Right. He's going on about his business. I don't know the logistics that are information behind that. But I'm like, okay, he's not going to the whole world because there's not Christians that live everywhere. Fine. And then the news in Georgia, they would have, you ever see, in America, they would do the same. Santa Tracker. So they would be like, oh yeah, and then they'd show you where he is in the world right now.

Right. And I'm like, yeah. On Christmas Eve, they would have the Santa Tracker. Yeah, and you could see where he is and they'd be like, oh, he's crossing over Iowa right now. Right. And I'm like, well, he knows. He would have to go to bed. Yeah, you have to go to bed. It's like, you knew where he was because it was, I guess, midnight there or something. So, yeah. So, yeah. So, that's where Santa was now. But he was never, but like, you would never be like, it wasn't like, he's in Georgia. Go to sleep. You're like, you're not going to bed. It's like, oh, he's over. Like, oh, he's over. Like, oh, oh, oh, he's. He's flying over Kenya. He's going to be in America soon. And you're like, all right, maybe.

But we need you go to sleep. So, but as soon as you go to sleep distrustingly. Okay, maybe. What did you go to? Sure. Why did you go? Why did you go to sleep with her? Because it could trust.

Okay, wait, wait, but so much to you, Jesus' point is like, did you, I'm trying to understand young Dulcee. That's what I'm trying to understand. So I see like, I see this little girl who is very logical, wants things to make sense. but like what part of your imagination did you go crazy? Were there things that you did believe in or did think about that, you know what I mean? Weren't logical in that way. Well, like, I remember like finding out about like imaginary friends and I was like,

oh, I should get one of those. But then I kept forgetting about it because I'd give myself one and be like, oh, fuck, I had an imaginary friend. Oops. You basically like, these are like tamagocchi's that you were killing. Yeah, like Tomogocchi. So I was like, Duce forgot to water her imaginary friends. Right.

And I'd be like, You know there's a Pixar movie in this somewhere, a kid who keeps forgetting their imaginary friend. Yes. And then the imaginary friends are like dying because they aren't remembered. Because if you, if you're not imagined, you can't live.

Right. But if you were a better, if you were a better imaginary friend, yes. You might not have gotten forgotten. Wow. You're blaming the imaginary friend for not being imagined. But I'm also six.

So it's like how much, how can I maintain? Like, you know, if you watch like DW for Arthur, she's had an imaginary friend for at least 15 years. Nadine's doing a lot of work. I, on the other hand, had human friends.

So I would also have cousins and stuff. So I had people taking up my time. I had a little brother. I didn't have time for an imaginary friend. I had a little brother I had to keep a lot. When you don't have siblings and imaginary friends, I asked, what you? So how many of these imaginary friends did you have and let go?

I don't know. I had one for like 30 minutes. It just seemed like too much work for me. I love that you imagine somebody who was annoying. That's a special way to see the world is that you get to make up your own person and you're like, and you make them annoying.

You're like, man, get the hell out of here. This is too much, because I'm like, how much I got to play with you? Why couldn't you imagine like a person who was like self-sufficient and just chill? Because it's like, there's still no one here. It's like every time I think about like, like it's the idea of me wanting to get married.

The idea of my husband is an imaginary fucking friend. Yes. Like every damn just like, I hope you should like, please God. I've been losing eggs. You want to get married. Absolutely. What do you like about the idea of getting married? I want to make people and I don't want to do it by myself.

Okay, okay. Yes. So that's why I got my eggs from. I like this. So you don't want to get married. You just want to make people and you don't want to do it by yourself. I absolutely want to get married. But it's also, it's like I think we have, I think Western culture has sold us so much of the love of a thing.

My God, now I sound like a kibooka. But it's, it makes sense for a long time that like marriage was a contract between people. Yeah. And then we made it. it a love thing, right? And so now we've kind of lost the idea of this is two people, because once like the emotions can fall out of a thing, so it's like we're not doing the work

anymore. Right, right. So it's like as much as a friendship as work as opposed to any relationship with a person is work. It's like, for instance, I had a friend breakup last week, right? As opposed to I can't be friends with this person. The real friend. Mm-hmm. And so because of just things going on in our friendship that I was like, this isn't working for me anymore. And it was but we don't talk about friend breakups as much we talk about relationship breakups

because a friend breakup is like this wasn't never supposed to happen you're supposed to be forever which also doesn't make any sense so like I one I've always wanted like the last time I had a boyfriend was I was 30 I'm 42 and so 12 yes yeah but last boyfriend I had cheated on me and so but then like I started so like around so I was like 30 but around like 33 I started being on the road like full time and then I moved here and then I was in it so it was just like it was things and then that's when I found out men don't like when you're gone all the time you're on the road because my homeboy said to me

one day he was like listen he said you might not have had a boyfriend but you weren't alone and I was like well that's true there was some Negro wasted my time or white don't worry somebody would pop up a gentleman you talked to for a little bit right but it's I want to be I want to be in a long-term relationship. Right? And one of my friends I was talking to her about that and she said, she asked me, she's like, do you think you're ready to be your wife? Damn. No one asked you that question.

No one ever asked you that question. But no one asked men if they're ready to be a husband. No one asks anybody if they're ready to do these things. You just think, you fall in love and you find somebody and you don't think about the fact whether you're ready. And I, but one of the issues that I've had is that I have been asked repeatedly. And I was talking about one of my friends about this last night.

I don't know if this is something we just do to black women or all women, but because I am in the position that I am in, right? And because I have the career that I have, it's sometimes frustrating for me, right? Because it's like, I have an Emmy at my house. They can count all the people that have Emmys. You can't really count all the people that are married, right? Yeah.

So I am doing well at a very hard thing. Yes. But I'm failing at something people do every day. And so that in my brain is where my disc is where I get upset because I can't, I can't shake the feeling that I'm failing. But also it's like, I had to think, I was like, is there anything I want in my life that I couldn't get on my own? And this is the only thing that I truly want that I have to be like,

need someone else. I need someone else. And then I was like, well, that's not. true because I was doing like doing stand-up and I'm acting, but like you have to get agents. You have to get a manager. Someone has to see you and go, I want to help. So it's like, and especially as comics, because this doesn't happen with actors. As comics, some of your first opportunities as a comedian is someone going, hey, you're funny, come do a thing. Hey, come, you're funny. Come get on this show. come do this.

And I don't think, and so it's funny for like as lonely, quote unquote, as much as like comedy is like you're doing a lot of work on your own, all your opportunities come from other people, especially when you first start out. And so it's like, oh, so I need the opportunity to be like, please, sir, make me a mother. Because then there's also the thing that people go,

why don't you do it on your own? I was like, I don't want to be a statistic. That's why. And I watched my mother do this on her own. It didn't seem like it was fucking fun. And so now I was just like, because I'm either being, I'm either towing, oh, I can do it on my own or, or I can be with a man who is not, who cannot pay the bills in my house. So pause there. But hold on.

Well, wait, wait, wait, don't, don't, don't, I'll tell you why, wait, pause, because I don't want us to lose the beginning part, which I think is really insightful. important and then we're going to go through it. We'll put a pin in that part. Pay the bills. Listen, you don't know a breakdown. I don't pay the bills. Because you have to remember, most people get divorced in America because of finances. Not because somebody cheated.

Not because somebody fell in love. Most people in America get divorced because of finances. That's the number one reason I'm ever getting divorced. People get divorced. So I'll go backwards. One of the first things you said when talking about this was about getting married. and you said it's something that you have to do with somebody else. It's something that you have.

I think you've tapped into something that a lot of people are experiencing across the board. But I love that you brought it up the way you did because I do feel like the weight is felt differently between men and women. Absolutely. Right? But men are definitely feeling it. Just at a way less. Male loneliness. No, no, no, no.

No, on a way less level. But it is, let me tell you something. You say goofy. Goofy is what starts militias and crazy armies. Listen, I said to my homeboy that I was in cell one day. And he was like, that's not true. I said, of course it is. I said, I am celibate and it is very involuntary.

These are, this is what insult means. Involuntary celibate. I would love to be having sex time. There's nothing better than having your legs in the air. And yet. Trevor, do you agree? Get up. Can I tell you what's funny?

Tell me. Having your legs in the air. You made me picture my. legs in the air. That's what I hate about what you did to me there. That's what good friends are for. That's what you did to me. Sure. And you made me. Anytime. Because you asked it, my first instinct, my first instinct was to defend myself. But the first thought I had, the first thought I had was me with my own legs in the air. Whenever I hear something enjoyable, I think of who could enjoy this more? And my friend comes to mind and I'm thinking, look, there's an opportunity

for someone's legs. Who would enjoy? Who would enjoy this? Stop talking. Who would enjoy this more? So, okay, so no, no, no, wait. And I appreciate that about you. You were a fool. So let's go back.

Your friend is a dumbed-d-up. So let's go back. He's an idiot, bro. So. Also, that is also the biggest form of respect from an American black person. They run away because it's something you said. So just no, you did well today. So there was no bed.

They go, if you go. Your snacks in my purse, though, no. If you go back to what you said, like you long for a time when it wasn't about love, I actually think that's probably one of the biggest things we're grappling with now in society. And we didn't understand it as a second system effect. Right. We, in the same way that people didn't understand what would happen when the globe became connected via trade. There were many things that would improve. Oh, money's going to cross borders.

People will become wealthy. But then it's like, oh, poverty is also going to speed up. And white people were spread illness. Okay. But like... Second families. Yeah. No, no, but all of these things.

These are second system. Yes, disease. These are second system effects. My uncle did have two families. There you go. So... In the same city, it was crazy. So now we got a pin in that as well.

Please remember this. He paid two bills. Pin, pin, pin, pin. I don't know about all that. These are all pins. He's dead now, so it's fine. But I think that's what we haven't fully grappled with, right? is the curse of choice

is that it increases the amount of time that you need to choose. I don't think there's any human being out there who is not trying to find the perfect person for them. But that's, I think that, but that's the problem. It's the perfect person. But that's what, no, but listen to what I'm saying. Right.

It is a lot easier to assume that you have made the perfect choice once you've exhausted your choices. So when we grew up in a village where there were 20 people like in our age range, at some point you assumed that you had made the best choice because you had exhausted your choices. You went, okay, number 17. The hottest person around here.

Or the one for me, the personality and the heart or the combination. But you were done. Then you made it a town. Then you made it a city. Then you made it a country. Now you've made it infinite. Literally infinite. Dating apps.

Social media, etc. Like we talked about this with Esther Perel on the podcast, but the fact that people have a constant deluge of other human. human beings being put into their head and the option of them, by the way. Because remember, you'd walk in the streets before and you didn't know whether people were or weren't single. So it's not necessarily the same thing. But a dating app is an infinite scroll. You know for a fact. No, you don't. No, no, no. No, no. That's funny. I know what you're saying. But I'm saying,

still, it is advertised as they're single. Yes. Here's an app. It's what they're selling. It is advertised. It is advertised. Now, I think we haven't fully grappled with the price that society has paid for that infinite choice. To your point, because I'll tell you now. Because people think they have better choices than they do. They think they have more options than they have. So for instance, I got off of dating apps because I was tired of my phone hurting my feelings. So every time I'm a log in, I'd be like, man, a city doesn't want to fuck me.

That's crazy. And then I put my phone down. Were you at the Daily Show when we did? No, you weren't. We did a piece on this early on in the Daily Show when I was hosting was we did a thing on how, And we actually had one of the guys, funny enough, who released a study, they showed that black women and Asian men have the worst results on dating. Like, terrible.

Oh, yeah. Terrible, terrible, terrible, terrible. That's why I used to do a bit about the fact that, because I think I sometimes do it and sometimes don't. I said we should come up with our own app and call it black and yellow. And so. You know what it is? Yeah. And make the smartest basketball players the world has ever seen.

You see what I'm saying? Like, well, we should just date each other, right? because we get the worst we truly do black women So like for instance My friend was like somebody get on match I was living here I got a match match match cost money right

And so I was watching people Pick every single ethnicity But black women Like really Pacific Islander You don't know no fucking Pacific Islander When are you gonna meet this bitch You're telling me that you would rather meet Moana than me Get the fuck out of here

You are not gonna meet her bro Monna's never home, though. She's on a seat. She's out here with grandma, being a mantelry. So if I'm looking on that, because one of my friends' same thing. Or people are like, oh, just get on Raya, just get on Raya. Stop talking to me. I was on Raya.

I was on Raya. It's all you on Raya. And try to take a screenshot. And Raya goes, hey. Don't do that. Don't do that. Don't do that. Oh, because somebody doesn't have another phone.

Don't do that. Listen. Yeah, but Raya was just trying to stop the people who weren't thinking fine enough in advance. Right. They were just trying to stop impulse people. Don't do that. They don't do that. So then my homegirl took a picture of my phone and I texted you.

It was like, ah, you're outside. So you hurt your wrist. Do you say it's so unruly. We're going to continue this conversation right after this short break. In the same way, there was like an industrial revolution. I think we're now entering into a new phase of sort of like a relationship revolution. And what I mean by that is we are still grappling with the effects. that we don't know are going to start to affect the changes that we've made in society.

Right. Right. So if you look back, as you said, to a time when marriages weren't about love, a lot of the people who were in that time did not like it. Yes. Because the thing they said was, I hated that I didn't have a choice. Right. I hated that I couldn't choose who I was going to be with.

You would listen to grandparents. You'd go, did you love? I wanted to be, I don't want that time either. No, no, no. I'm not saying you do. I wanted to be a combo. No, no, I'm not saying you do. I'm just saying people would say, you know, you talk to your grandparents and they go,

do you love my grandfather? And they'd be like, I never loved that man. But I mean, yeah, we just had to do a thing. We had to do a thing. Right. And then you move forward a generation, you move forward another generation. And I find it interesting. It's really poignant that you brought it up that now we're searching for the opposites.

It's like before the people had ultimate certainty. and so all they yearned for was a little bit of opportunity for something to pop up just something that wasn't predictable don't define my path for me and then now it almost feels like we've gone so far down the world

of you have choice, whatever choice you want that now people yearn for the certainty I wish I knew I wish I could get with somebody I wish I knew when I've had more conversations with friends in every walk of life women who are going I'm freezing my eggs But like in a way, now it's becoming just ubiquitous.

Oh, yeah, your insurance better be right because that shit costs me $35,000. I end up with two eggs. But what I'm saying is, no, but this is a real conversation. Yeah. It's like, eggs is like, but it's a thing. It's, you know. But for the first time in history, there's more women in their 40s than women in, that are teenagers in their 20s.

For the first time in history, there are women who are financially stable having kids. Now, that's, yes, that's the point. So now this is what I'm trying to get to. I want to go to something you said. And I know some things you're, say as a joke, some things you say being real. So I actually want to get to- You never know.

That's what I was about to say. No, but like... And I knew you. Which one? No, when you said, when you said, I, because I don't want to be with a man who doesn't pay the bills, this is like what I mean about that. Not doesn't, can't.

Can't. Can't. That's fine. Can't. That's fine. But Kant. Call down. Can't.

Can't. He loves trying to get an American accent right. Well, I have a Southern accent. We're good to go. We're good to go. So. I don't know why that was my first reaction. So.

That's what the pilot said. So. We're good. So if we, so if we look, let's break the time. You go like, I don't want to be with a man who can't pay the bills. Let's start with this. The wise intrigue. Like, why do you say that?

Because he will. you will end up with your enemy in your own bed because you have to think about this. Men have been told and this is not to the benefit of men or society at all. Right? So

men are told that they have to operate in a certain way by other men. The confines of society because we're like, I don't even talk about toxic masculinity.

I'm talking about what a man is supposed to be doing. He's supposed to be providing. He's supposed to be taking, he's supposed to be doing these things, right? If he cannot do these things, he is either going to find fault in himself or fault in you.

So if my mortgage is X amount of money and you cannot pay this mortgage, you're either going to find fault in yourself or find fault in me. And usually speaking to my friends who have been through this and women who have been through this, they find fault in you. And so now you're dealing with someone who resents you because I've dealt, because people are like, well, what if he's a nice guy and I've dealt with men who, weren't as successful as me. And it always ends up with them being hurtful towards me because they resent me for the fact

that they can't do the thing that society's told them they're supposed to be doing. In the same way, they're just like it's, you talk about white privilege and there are white people that get upset because they're like, well, I grew up poor. I didn't have white privilege. But they don't understand the full scope of what white privilege is because all they knew is they grew up poor. So I can't have a privilege of being white. because my white experience is that I grew up poor.

You can't tell them, but you can inherently fix this thing, which is by the bootstrapping myth makes sense for them, right? In the same way that I know that also, when I have children, I want to be able to take time off of work, I'm not going to let love make me homeless. So if I'm not working, someone has to pay the mortgage. Someone has to, if I at least have savings, fine, I can pay half the mortgage, but I'm not working.

Someone has to keep us indoors. So if I'm dealing with somebody who can't keep the lights on in here, then I have another dependent in my house. Then I can't do the things that I need to do as a mother. I can't do the things I do anything to do as a person. I can't do the things I need to do as an adult because there's a fucking man in my house

who cannot pay my light bill. He cannot pay half the mortgage. He cannot do the, he can't do. So what is he here for? Because I already have, People in my, my mother's retired. My mother's just got a job for fun. So it's just like I have people in my house that I'm already taking care of.

I need a partner. I don't need another dependent. Because if that's the case, I'm putting you on my taxes, bro. Give me your social. Because here's the thing. I have never made a dick that I've never met a dick that would make me send my mother to work. You see what I'm saying? My mother works because she wants to.

Trevor? Do you say? Trevor. I can't. I can't. Welcome to my life. What is... I remember the number of times

some random girl would be like, oh my God, I can't... Trevor's so handsome. How can you work? I said, first of all, he's my boss. First of all. So I don't see him like that. Where were you when these conversations were happening?

At the stand, at the cellar. There's always some girl that's like, oh my God, do you have Trevor's number? And I was like, wow. We're getting distracted, though. No, we get distracted because I want to be distracted because I have to make sure I don't cry on your podcast. So my brain just needs to...

kick somewhere else, and then we have to come back. And so, but I'm being told repeatedly, it's, well, what if he has potential and da-da-da-da-da-da-da. And I was like, I want to know if other groups of women are being asked to go, well, what if this man has potential? Because one, it's the only men I've ever seen worried about gold diggers or the men that don't have gold. I have never man a man. On to my new American phrase. God damn. Good to go.

Oh, God damn. That's a combo. Oh, okay. Somebody watched BET yesterday? Oh, man. God damn. Because you have to think about it. I'll tell you what.

Yeah, but you're telling men they have to provide. Right. You know, you know, there is something that I think it's painful because it's true. But in the same way, the sugar lobbies got us to hate fat and tricked us into not focusing on what was actually happening. in food. I do find it really sad that we talk about relationships and most of the things that we're bringing up about relationships have nothing to do with the dynamics of a relationship. They have to do with the dynamics of late stage capitalism. Yes. You know? Because everything you said is true. Yes. But everything you said isn't really supposed to be the real, real, real crux of a

relationship, you know? Right. Can you pay the bill? When I'm a mother, I don't want to be. homeless because of that that's a very true and real thing because i have to keep my children inside right but that's why when you go to scandinavian countries no but that's why when you go to scandinavian countries for instance they don't really have that issue and i know there they have the i'm not saying it's like a perfect place but you realize that the issue is minimized because there's a certain contract that people have with the state where the state goes no if you're a mom uh if you're a parent in fact man or woman you'll get a certain amount of paid leave your child will be able to go to school.

Your health care is not dependent on whether or not you have a job because the state has an interest in keeping you healthy. Right, but you have to remember that the reason we do not have universal health care is because of racism. If you look at a lot of the practices of the state of Mississippi, right, a lot of things that they do is to oppress black people. The problem is white people also live in that state. So if you don't want to have...

have universal health care in a country because you don't want black people, how are you punishing 87% of the people for something that, because you don't want 13% also, I've never believed that was really part of the population, but we won't answer the census. So you don't want 13% of your population to have something. Right. So you won't give it to the other 87% of your population. Tipping. It comes from, there's a racist history of tipping because you weren't paying black people correctly, when we started getting like, it's the whole thing when we started working on railroads and stuff like that,

it was the end up we have a livable wage, they started tipping them. That's why service to this day do not get a livable wage because you can survive on tips, right? And so, this is a thing that's still hurting people today, but because of a racist start of it, and then we lose the history of things. And so

the problem is, is that if I let love carry me in certain places, I would be devourable. I would be divorced from a broke man if I let love dictate and if I let the thing if I let because I'm already we know I make bad decisions. Let me ask you a question though before you move on from there. If I mean by the you know last reported wherever numbers if they say 50% of all marriages end in divorce anyways then doesn't it mean that even if you get into a marriage are not you but as a

person there's a 50% chance that you're already getting divorced regardless of what the other person's income is or isn't and like even broken. wickedness. People can become broke. Mm-hmm. Do you know what? Like, people can come in with money and then end up broke. People can... Do you think I make the same amount of money I did when I worked a day with you? I'm assuming not because I don't.

Listen. So, listen, I got to start paying attention in the store now. It's crazy. Oh, my God. Yeah, but... I had to look at the price or something. Oh, I was so mad. Whenever I think of conversations about relationships, and I think relationships only permanent ones, long-term ones, only make sense based on a stage. of life that you are at. Right. So, for example, I've told you the story before.

My daughter's turning 17 now and we've been together alone since she was five turning six. Right now my brain is going, I would love to have someone around because I've had her and I didn't feel like there was room for someone else. But now I feel like if I had made that decision 10 years ago, I would have had to accommodate the both of them in my life. Absolutely. And some of the things that I wanted to do in the last 11 years that I got to do anyway. Right.

But right now I'm thinking about it differently because I would want. someone more than anything to tolerate me. Right. And so I'm having to ask someone to so you have to also look at the dynamics of things, right? Yeah. I remember being at a show and I was talking to a comic.

I was talking to Nick Getta about this. Wait, before you go into the story, I want to respond to something because I don't want to forget it and I think it's important for you to hear this. Right. I have heard from many women who do have the same story. In fact, you go like, I wonder if it's just me or women like me. I remember speaking to a woman.

This was in Sweden. and she was a very wealthy businesswoman, like, and I mean, like, has done a phenomenal job and helps people start businesses, and she can't, I mean, like, killing, like, by all metrics, great kids, living the life, you name it, you name it. And the biggest thing that plagued her was she said, I feel like my life is a failure.

And I said, well, I never got remarried, and now I can't find a man. And I said, what do you mean, can't find a man? Just elaborates on that. And she said, well, if I meet some of the men I meet, we get along well with, but they're also in a high-powered position. And they're not flexible and I'm not flexible because they can't leave what they do and I can't leave what I do. And so it just ends up fizzling. And then I said, okay, but what about men who aren't successful?

And she said, I'll be honest with you, I'm not attracted to them. I'm not, I just can't be with a man who's not like doing something and not, you know what I mean? Yes. And so, no, I just want you to know that, like not to shift anything or to shape, but I'm not. But you asked a question, and I don't have the answer for everyone, but I do know, and I think it's important for us to know this in life, because we generally don't post how we are actually doing and feeling on Instagram and social media, we don't really know how anyone is or isn't. We know what the advertisements of people's lives are.

We know what the highlights are. Right. Right. We very seldom know the low lights. Well, that's why I posted the other day and I was just like, how was everybody doing? Because I'm having a hard time right now. And I don't like the fact that sometimes if I get on Instagram, I realize Instagram will sometimes make me feel bad. Yeah.

Because I'm just like, now it's just like, here's the good, everybody's doing great, everybody's doing fine, these are things you aren't doing. Yeah. And then I get on TikTok and it's just like, hey, so my coloring book. So like I see a bunch of craft stuff. And then I see the Maori doing hawkers. And it's like so a little good little Middle Eastern song, right? So now I know a little bit of Arabic, the whole boy, Womon Chi singing in the Chinese. So TikTok is still fun because hasn't figured me out yet.

Instagram, it's like you're, I don't like the fact that I'll get on TikTok and Instagram and be like, this is why our industry is dying because you want to see somebody make a cake for six episodes as opposed to a well-written thing. So it's like we don't see the real, we don't see people's real lives. And it's to everybody's detriment in the same. It's like a dating app. Yes, it is. You go through, you see a man holding the fish, you see another man holding the

a fish. So you see white man holding fish and a black man sitting in the passenger side of a car. Or the pictures that you see on dating apps, if you're wondering. It's white dudes holding fish. Black man on the wrong side of a car. I was like, I don't know if this is flipped because he's in the driver's seat. I don't know if I never see a drive. Dude says it's just in white man holding a fish, right man holding a fish.

But here's my, maybe you can help me with this. I'm trying to figure out. Isn't being in a meaningful relationship about someone else tolerating you? Absolutely. the other person and you tolerating them. Right, but the thing is I'm trying to be inflexible. What I'm trying to do is because here's the thing you have to understand. It's I have to get past meeting a man.

I have to get past him one being insecure about what I do. Oh, you at war shows. Are you doing all of this? Yes, sir, I am. So do you want to put on a suit or do you want to talk shit? What are we doing? Because if you can't, if you don't figure out. hold a hold a fork because I can't be sitting somewhere nice

and you're sitting up eating like a convict. We need to, so let's do that first. Second, oh, you're making all this money. Are you doing big things? If I hear you're doing big things, I'm blocking your number. Because what that lets me know is you're not, I don't need you to do big things. But what I need you to do is not

talk shit about what I'm doing. But do so what if that was just a question? It's not a question. The thing is you're not, so because I am a person who listens to people, I know what all of these things, I know what all of these things made

because there have been in enough conversations where, oh, you're doing big things. Fast forward to a week later. Oh, you think you better than me. No, nigger, you think I'm better than you. Anybody who's ever asked me that question, you think you better than me, I don't know you. So no.

I'm not thinking about you in the way you're thinking about me because I don't know you. I'm not excited to meet you. I'm not doing any of these things. You're excited to meet me because I'm on television, but you don't know who I am as a real person. Because you saw me a daily show. You saw me in a clip.

So people are like, oh my god you're so much nicer in person you are on stage you think i'm doing this you think i'm performing at all times are you paying me in this conversation so i go on a date so god i was like and i've had men go to me oh man i haven't such a good time it's like so you're acting right now bitch are you paying me i don't perform for free also a pussy costs more than appetizers so let's go so get that out the way god damn see when you walk you're gonna sit over walking in a room so right there's there's a question i'd love to ask him I'll maybe ask it by sharing something from my life.

One of the hardest things I learned from therapy was that... It's expensive. Yeah, it's expensive. But I also learned that there's a filter that we can apply on the world because we are constantly moving towards or partially creating the reality that we do exist within. So I would find myself having one idea of women because I was going there all like this. All women do this.

All women. And then I would talk to a friend who's in a healthy, happy relationship, married, whatever. And they would go, I don't actually know what you're talking about. And I'd be like, oh, no, that's because you, you're an outlier, man. Let me tell you how it really is. And then I would meet somebody else at some point. And I'll get to know them and I'll go, you know how? And they go like, actually, I don't know what you're talking about.

And it took me a while. And I think it takes all of us a while to then ask ourselves because of where we are from, how we're raised. Like we had Roy on the podcast. And one of the conversations that we had with Roy, like, you know, he gets into it in his book is you realize how many of the cycles and patterns we've inherited. Mm-hmm. And don't even know we're in. Right. and then we ask ourselves why they keep repeating.

What's the difference between that and a generational curse? No, it's the same thing. It's the same thing. But I'm coming back to what you're saying. Like I notice just when I'm listening to you, you go, you have an assumption that the man you're meeting you've already met. No, no, no, no, no. That's the thing.

It's I take everyone at face value. I'm not going to have an issue to you, give it to me. I'm with you. So let me put it this way. This is what I'm saying. this is exactly what I mean in therapy because I remember I was so defensive about it right when my therapist was saying

I was like no no I was like no I start from scratch I start then she's like no one's starting from scratch we all think we're starting from scratch we're starting from our scratch yeah but the best way to think of it is if I was to use an analogy think of it like food a lot of us in life will say man why do I keep getting fast food why do I keep getting greasy food why do I keep getting this type of food

Why don't I get wholesome meals and what, you know? But what we never ask ourselves is, why is our eye attracted to that bright pink logo? Why is our nose attracted to the smell of that, you know, crispy, you know, fried chicken flesh? Why is I, we don't ask that question of ourselves as people. Oh, I always ask the question. No, and so what I mean is,

if we end up with the same outcome that we don't want, the hardest thing for us to like try and figure out is which part of it is us participating in the story and which part of it is the story existing on its own. So I'll tell you what I found in the therapy. So my therapist said to me, she's like, you're very self-aware. You're supremely self-aware.

She said, I'm very self-aware. She said honestly, and it makes it a lot easier to have these sessions with you because you're very self-aware. Yeah. She said, but because you're so self-aware, you analyze everything. Oh, so you're hyper-self-aware then?

Right. You're too self-aware. So I'm always going. So my thing is like, I remember saying to my ex one time. Because, you know, talk about him in the book. Yeah, yeah, yeah, right. And so I said to him one day,

because I was talking about, because it was like years into this back and forth because I couldn't see better for myself than this situation, right? And I said to him one day, I said the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and over again and expecting a different result.

Right. I said, so from you, I expect you to do the things that you are doing because I would be crazy, to think that you're going to do something else based on the information and the years that I've spent going back and forth with you, right? So for me, it's never, why don't I have this thing? My issue is, my thing is always, what is wrong with me? I'm rarely ever thinking was when things start going slightly, I'm always looking for a pattern because it's like, I'm going

for you, you catch me, right? Because I know I make bad decisions. So now I have to go, now I have to be extra vigilant asking these questions and getting to know some man because I know I can't always trust the decisions that I make. I can't always trust the fact that I've picked this. I'm talking to this person. Also a lot of, like, because my friends, I was saying to know my friends that I said, if you line up all the guys that I've dated, they don't make sense. I have one of my homeboys, I can't tell these girls apart. He's got a new girlfriend. I didn't know it wasn't the other light skin, bitch. He had been dealing with a year ago. I didn't know it was a new girl. because my ex is the same way.

He had a picture of a girl. I looked down and I was like, when did I take this picture? It wasn't me. Damn. But I was like, okay, then I am the fucking archetype. If you look at all the dudes I've messed with,

all of them don't make sense. But the thing was, it's more instances in my life where a man is like me than a man I've liked is like me back. So it's now I'm just dealing with the men who like me. So then I'm dealing with that part of thing. You're dealing with yourself?

Are you dealing with yourself? What do you mean? Like you're saying, if you're saying you're dealing with the men that are... So the men that are attracted to me... Yeah. And more times as opposed to, oh, I like a man, I think he's attractive. Yeah. Nine times out of ten, that man doesn't think I'm attractive.

So he doesn't talk to me. So a lot of times I'm dealing with men who come to me first. Okay. And then it's just like, okay, well, this is where I'm at. These are the men that are attracted to me. Oh, you're their option. They're not your option. Right.

Got it. So it's just like, well, and then I had to go, well, you can't keep entertaining these dummies. because it's, there is the consistency of the manner that are coming to you. Versus what? Versus the men that I want to be with. So the men I just want to talk to. So the men that are coming to me are the men that aren't, the men that aren't, they just have jobs. They don't have careers, right?

It's just they're just doing a thing. And so they're just surviving every day. And so you see me, you're like, well, at least there's food at the house. I know that much, right? So she's got a place to stay She got food at the house I'm a deal with her So I seem to catch men that are in their struggle

And so you came to me Because you need a head to lie on Or you need a place to stay You can't stay with me like that I'm not going to feed you like that Because the thing is So we always think about that Because I always remember this

Like growing up It's always the term equally yoked Right Yeah And so I think about that In a lot of different ways as in like if you can't understand

if you can't understand where I'm coming from on a regular basis as in you don't understand the words that I'm saying. So in my book, I talk about an ex that I had, best boyfriend I ever had, but he grew up very poor. And so I remember telling him about

like we had gone on vacation one time as a kid and I was like a teenager or something. My mom, I brought a friend. You know, we were all hanging out. And so he was like, oh, you're trying to shine on me. I was like, I'm trying to shine on you. Basically, he's trying to say,

I was trying to brag. And I was like, I'm not shining on you. You asked me about something about me being a kid. He asked me about something as an experience as a kid. And I was like, oh, my mom took us on vacation. And so he thought I was bragging. About going on vacation. And I was just like, we were staying at a days in in Savannah.

We didn't go to Europe. We weren't still in the same state. What are you talking about? But, and he also asked me one day what an aquarium was, because I went to the aquarium for my birthday. And he asked me when an aquarium was. And I went, what? And he's like, is it a muse? And I was like, yeah, for fish, let me call you back.

Because he was inherently not wrong. An aquarium is a museum. But I still had to call him back. More like a zoo. But what I'm saying, so I had to go, I have sex with this, man. And that's why I had to stop. So it's like, whoa, wait, wait. I want to know.

Wait, wait. You go ask you a question first. I want to disturb. But my thing, because I found what you said very interesting. So if the men, correct me if I'm wrong. It's a zoo. If the men that are attracted to you Look at you as a soft place to land

Right? Yes. If you are flailing? Right. So if you want a very successful man And you're an artist Do you think sometimes they think that of you? Like if there's a banker or a successful lawyer goes You're a comedian.

What if your things are not popping and I'm doing very well? Are you looking at me as a way out of your situation? They need to Google me. No, but that's not. You know, that's an interesting, it's an interesting point because it brings up the conundrum of life, right? And that conundrum is that the arrows are often pointing. You know, I remember once seeing a motivational speaker, you know, and you know, they, sometimes they're like very cheesy gimmicks. They play on the audience.

But sometimes it really sticks with you. And there's this one motivational speaker, and we're in an audience. And he was talking about love. What his teeth look like? And he went, say again? What his teeth look like? His teeth were perfect. Fuller.

Go ahead. So I was talking about love. And then talking about being chosen. And then he said, you know what I want? I want everyone to turn to the person on their left and notice something about their face. And so everyone in the audience turned to their left. And then he's like, okay, now everyone face the front. And he's like, raise your hand if you know the details of their face.

And then no one could raise their hand because everyone was looking at the back of somebody else's head. And he said, that's like the paradox and the conundrum of life and being chosen sometimes, is that everyone is trying to see this person's face. the person behind them is trying to see their face the person being trying them is trying to see their face the person who you know what I mean and so now like what Eugene is saying is interesting because it's like I know that I've experienced that

now way less obviously but I remember when I was starting in comedy I would be on a date and someone would go so what do you do and I go like I'm a comedian and they're like no no but what are you like like what are you going to like do

but what you're listening? No no I'm just saying like it was interesting it would be like what are you going to like what do do do Like when you could they almost wanted to say what are you going to do when you grow up though? Right. Like when you become an adult, what are you going to do? But you have to remember I'm a woman.

So no one is looking for me to do that thing. No one asks women. That's the thing. And this is so you have to remember. No, no, no. He's not saying that. No, no, no. I'm saying what's so he's talking about like a banker or something worried about that.

But you have to also remember is that men. inherently aren't, they do not have to, men aren't running around looking for, I need a successful woman. No, no, no, no, no. I think that's where you may be wrong. I'll tell you. I'm not saying, hold, let me finish. Let me finish.

Okay. I'll speak for some men. Wait, wait, wait, let me say this. I'll speak for some men. I think there's a misconception that is often spread amongst people where they go, men don't care. No, that's the biggest lie that we've been told is that men don't care. Yeah, but what I'm saying is, I think, this is what Eugene is saying.

If you listen to the kernel of it, it's really interesting. It's like we take for granted that we ourselves are the most stable thing in our lives often. And then we are presented with somebody who we feel brings instability into our lives. But then we are still thrown by somebody else when they treat us like we are the instability that could potentially come into their life. That's what he's saying. No, no, I understand that. But what I'm saying is like I've never had, I've never been in a situation. where a man has been worried about what I do for a living,

that he's worried that I'm going to bring him financial instability. Might not be financial. He's been worried about that I would bring him emotional instability. That's been the biggest where it's just like, well, I need a woman to be my peace. But you terrorizing bitches on a daily basis. You ain't nobody's peace. There's always some, I need a woman to be my peace.

I need a woman to be right or die. First of all, I just met you. I'm not going nowhere. I'm certainly not going to perish for your needs. So it's because, and so that's when I think about the fact the old, because like I said, I've met more men worried about a gold digger. Yes. Then I've met, worried about where, because I've met men's like, oh, I don't worry about a woman does. I'm like, once you find out what I do.

Because the man in Atlanta was trying to holler at me when my mom are out. And he was like, well, you know, I'm doing this. I'm doing that. And I was like, great. And my mother's like, oh, well, my mother was trying to talk to him. He's like, oh, I don't care what she does. And I was like, you will when you find out what I do. because I am, I travel a lot for work.

I'm successful because a lot of the issues that I've had, it's the traveling for work. And I'm in a male-dominated industry. Yes. And so, and I said to one of my friends the other day, if you're a dirtbag individual, you think other people are doing dirtbag shit. Yes.

Right? Okay. So since I'm not a dirt bag. Or if you've been dirt bag. Or if you've been dirt-bagged. I think we always have to include that. So if you've been, like, it's like, you know. Because if you are a dirtbag, yes.

You will constantly think that people are doing the same thing as you. But also if you've been dirt bag Yes. People also, because like, you've been dirt bagged, so you're like, so we should also always include that, I think. I've been dirt bagged, I've been sandbagged, I've been fucking, quicksanding, all of that. Tea bagged. Let's, I'm a Christian. So for me,

maybe just calm down. Um, so I have, but it's like traveling for work or it's, if I tell a man what I do, you're either challenged because he's like, oh, you're funny. But I'm saying, do you hear, Even in your, you're making a like a full on. I'm not saying, I'm only talking about my experiences.

But that's, that's what I'm saying. But that's all I can do is go off an experience. So I have so with I, so I'm not saying that I haven't met men who weren't interested. It's like, oh, that's really great. Yeah, yeah, right. So I'm not saying that I haven't met men who haven't been intrigued by it or haven't been impressed by it or haven't thought that was interesting. I have. But things did not progress with that person.

Right, right, right. And sometimes, and so it's like, oh, this is great. And it's like, oh, but you're gone a lot. Well, yeah, that's how I, but I work. So now it's like, I'm not trying to be inflexible. I'm just trying to understand. In the same way of just like, I need Santa because here's my thing. What's the fix?

I travel a lot. So doesn't it make sense if we're trying to be together? What if you, okay, I'm going to be in, I'm gone twice a month, right? I'm going to Iowa and I'm going to Seattle. What if you came to Iowa or Seattle, right? I'm not trying to be inflexible. I'm trying to help. I said this to Eugene the other day.

You remember we're in the car. We're in Johannesburg. And I said to you, I don't even know what brought it up. But I said to you, I said to you, I didn't forget. You told me you're going to take me South Africa. I didn't forget. You changed the subject. You do what you want.

This is your podcast. I said, I said to Eugene, as much as I love what I do, and as much as we love comedy and all these things, I said, man, do you ever think about how wonderful it is for some people that their jobs don't require them to leave constantly, right? And we're speaking about this and I'm talking to Roy about it. And I remember saying one day, someone was shocked. They said to me, and I'm glad that this has diminished over time. But I remember someone once being shocked saying like, man, a lot of comedians commit suicide.

Right? They'd be like, no, there was like an outsized number of comedians who'd commit suicide. If you look at like per industry. I can't say in the summer of 2022. two, it was like a lot at the same time. I don't know what happened, but it was. But this is like constant. Or just dying.

But then I said to a friend, I was like, yeah, I get what you mean about like, you know, a lot of comedians commit suicide. And I think there's many factors that probably contribute to that. But one of the glaring parts that sticks out to me is how and where is like everyone would focus on that the fact that they committed suicide. I would focus on the fact that they were always alone in a hotel room. It was always like alone in a hotel room in a random place. and very seldom, not never, obviously,

but very seldom did I read a story of a comedian committing suicide at home, with their friends, with their family, with their... And in that one moment, I realized how insidious isolation is. And I think what you're talking about, which I think many people can relate to, is the isolation that we might experience

for a variety of reasons. Because I'll tell you now, as somebody who's experienced it, Fame is one of the most isolating experiences a human can have. Right? And I didn't think of it as isolating because you go, people go, everyone knows you. You're like, yes, that is isolating in a strange way. Everyone knows.

Everyone knows of you. Yes. They don't know you. Exactly. But that's what I mean is isolating because everyone else gets to walk into a room and not be known and write their story. You walk into a room. People have an assumption of you.

That's isolating. Exactly. And I'm not saying it like as a woe is me thing. I'm just saying isolation is an interesting. concept to understand. Because every, because now every interaction, because one of my friends, she was saying to me, she's like, well, when I first met you, I didn't like you. And I was like, okay, I don't know why people tell me these things. We're friends now. Why are you telling me this? She's like, well, when you first met me, you know, you weren't excited to meet me. I said, why would

I be excited to meet you? I don't know you. I don't know you. You should like, my mom had the Essus magazine with you in it. I said, yeah, you know me. I don't know you. You're excited to meet me. Of course I wasn't excited to meet you. I don't know you. I'm not excited to meet strangers even before this. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because you're like, you're a stranger. I don't know you. Right. So it's, and I had this conversation when like, when you left the show and they were looking for a new host, right? And you don't notice, but as soon as this came out, I went, I went to plans his office. I was like, not me. No, thank you. I know I'm probably not in the running. Don't even ask me. I don't want this. I don't want this. I don't want.

it, I don't want it, I don't want it. And if I said that to any, do you want to do that, I was like, no, every comic I'm talking about would argue me down. I can't believe you don't want this. And I was like, it's a great opportunity. And I said, for you. Because you don't know the logistics of this thing. You don't understand how this works. I don't want, and one of my friends asked me, one of them was really pushing me and I had to go, I don't want to spend my career asking other people what they're doing with their careers. Damn. That's why I don't want that job.

I don't want to sit at a desk every day and go, so what are you doing? Because that's because I told you when we got to my first host a week, when I went to, when I did that camera turn going from act two to act three, I said, never, fuck it, never, never. But that's the part of it that you felt the most? I mean, that's like five minutes in the show. No, no, no, no. What I'm saying is that it was just, it was confirmation. Okay.

So for you, that's, that was the confirmation that is. It's not for you. That wasn't for me. Completely with you. Right. And I'm just like, oh, this is, because that's why I couldn't do factory work because it's a repetitive thing. And so I was like, I'm going to be sitting here forever asking people, all right, Orlando

Bloom, what's this next movie? All right, Lou Pita, what's this new book? Let me, let me ask you a question. Because I'm noticing something about, you know, like reading the stories in your book. You read the whole book? When you'd fight with the teachers. Yeah. Reading the stories about like, you know, your mom joining the school and then having to

like discipline you from. inside the school. Yeah, she was my ass at school. Yeah, and then you fighting and like the jobs that you would go and have afterwards. And like, it find, I found myself asking the question. I was like, because now even when you're saying,

like at the daily show, it wasn't your piece, I'd love to know, like, where has your piece been? Where do you find you've like, is this, is there even a moment or slither where you go like, this is, this is it. This thing that I tap into is my piece. So I have a craft room. Crafts.

You had a, that was like your first Facebook post ever was selling Crofts. I, oh, you was digging deep. I, so I've been working since I was nine years old, right?

You've been working since you were nine years old? Mm-hmm. So you read that in the book. So I've been working since I was nine. And I, everything had to become a business, right?

Mm-hmm. So, like, the craft thing was like, I enjoy this. Because my mom would always get me a little crafty things. And so, it was like making little paper beads or making little hair bows and stuff like that I've always been like a maker because I like

that was like I was talking about my friends about like British baking show and I like I think and I like that show because it's you know sometimes you watch cooking shows it makes you hungry that's my mama that doesn't watch them I never first of all I don't get hungry

watching those shows but especially that show because it's literally about the technicality of making a thing as opposed to there's a finished product but it's about the technicality of everything right And so when it comes to crafting, it's like I, so for instance, coloring talk hopped up on my TikTok,

and so now I got in like coloring books, right? And I say adult coloring books and then people think I'm coloring adult stuff. No, no, no, no, no. There's a bear going to get coffee. You see what I mean? From a man. No? That's an industry that is waiting to be tapped.

Oh, no, no, no. They've got those books, too? That's an industry. Wait, they all? Oh, there's all kind of nasty little books. Oh, adult coloring books. Yeah. Like adult coloring books.

Oh. You can color in curse words. Wow. But you only need like, what, four color crayons and then you're done? Four. How many colors do you mean? I was asking. Okay.

I mean, listen, that's why I don't like porn with white people because everything's pink. So I don't know who starts for finishes. I don't know who's where. Everything's pink. I don't want it. So I have like my craft room. Yeah. Right?

And so my house in L.A., there's three bedrooms upstairs and one of those, me and my mom share a craft room. right and so this place of like it's I need to be able to have a thing that makes sense and then the other place of peace I think I sometimes have is on stage depending on the show yeah but it's where like I understand I understand everything that's happening right now

I understand what I'm saying I understand what the reactions are I understand how people are going to take me in. I understand that like no one's going to misunderstand me. No one's going to judge me. It's like I can under, I know what I'm doing. And I know what the reactions are going to be. So like while I'm performing, great. After a show, sometimes it's great. Sometimes it's like, what did you hear? Why are you asking me these things, right? Not the chick and Maurice. So I have these moments where it's like I have my piece in that or it's like just sometimes, you know, being

at shows sometimes. Yeah. Because it's like I understand how this works. I understand how this goes. Like if I'm on set, I understand because this is like boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. Because when it comes to like, because one of the hardest things for me about relationships, like romantic relationships is like with work, I knew the steps to get to what I'm wanting to do. Yeah.

If I need to do something, it's like, okay, I had to sell more tickets. All right, fuck, we got to do this promo because these clubs aren't promoting us. like they used to, but you're still charging me for marketing. So it's just like, okay, I have to do this and I can do this. I know it's some things, even in this industry isn't input in and input out. I can still understand the steps of this. When it comes to relationships, I feel like somebody gave me dipsy cups and string. And we're like, okay, now go to the moon.

Because I don't have enough experience with successful relationships that a lot of times I don't know what I'm doing. And so sometimes I have to be quiet because I also have to stop because I've been in so many bad relationships that I know what the trigger is. So sometimes I have to stop myself and go, hey, hey, hey, hey, that might not be what he's doing. That might not be what he's doing.

You need to calm down. But you need to calm. I'm so familiar with it. But I'm so familiar with the, because I see the pattern now. Right. Oh, I haven't heard from this man in five days. What usually happens is this is like,

oh, you've disappeared, you've done this, da-da-da-da. Yeah. But if I'm dealing with someone who's communicated to like the, last guy I was talking to, he had a family issue. That's why we're not talking anymore. You get a wife? No, he had a, something happened with his mom. And so I hit him up and I said, hey, I haven't heard from you in a while. So I just want to make sure, is everything okay with your family? That was my first thing, because something did happen. And I said, is everything

okay with your family or is life just lifing? And if so, if you need space or time, just let me know because I've been in this situation too many times and somebody didn't tell me what happened, right? And he texted me back and goes, I'm sorry, I'm not trying to ignore you or trigger you. And then he was like, but there's stuff going on with my life right now with my family. I need space and time. Thank you so much.

There are so many times I've been in relationships with people where I said, hey, I can fully understand that you need space. Just tell me you need space, and they wouldn't give me that. And so then I'm just in a spiral because now I'm sitting up trying to go, what did I do, what happened? What did I do? What happened? And a lot of times I have to go, but I also have to be aware of the fact sometimes this isn't me.

But the only thing I have control of is what I did and what I said. So sometimes people don't happen. But since I have a lack of information and the only input of information I have is things that I did, you told me nothing. So now I just had to go, okay, well, did I do this and I do this? And then you just have to go, wait, you do the fuck, you get to the end. I was like, I didn't do shit. There's a common thread I see coming from that.

And it's predictability and control. Which I don't have. No, no, I'm saying in stand-up and in crafts, two worlds where you have direct control and immediate feedback. Like if you're a comedian and you say something that the audience does not agree with or like, they will instantly let you know. It's either information or confirmation. Yeah.

This joke's either works? Or it doesn't. They let you know. So you then know immediately. There's almost no audience out there. Maybe in Japan. That's the only time it happened to me where what they were doing didn't relate to how they were feeling. Oh, you've never performed for black lesbians.

They are the hardest audience to perform for. Yeah, I cannot say that I've done a show solely for black lesbians. In Atlanta, there was a place called my sister's room and they would do shows there. And every comic would get off stage going, you can't crack them. So wait, so let me go back to what I was saying. And then they get off stage and you go, you had a great set. And we were like, tell your face, ma'am. Don't press anything.

We've got more. What now after this? Trevor and I've had this conversation so many times before and we were talking about hobbies. And one day he was saying to me, I was asking me why I have so many hobbies. And I've just recently discovered hobbies. I used to think we're just things of interest.

And I said one thing I discovered about hobbies and the people that are hobbyists is they're usually good at one thing that they do for a living. The surgeons, police, whatever. but a hobby humbles you constantly because something that you try you love it but you keep failing at it and you come back again

you dedicate time to it apart from the thing that you're already good at so the more time you dedicate to a hobby the better it becomes and the better you become and as soon as you master it you start another hobby right so if you're coloring or making beads

once you're done with this bracelet you'll start another bracelet you never go this is my ultimate bracelet Well, the conundrum is when you are talented, that's the only bracelet that you'll ever make. Standing on stage, making people laugh, you get better at it, but it's not like you're going to go become a famous welder afterwards. So there's this thing that you can always go back to. And my thing is, and why I said earlier on, my mission now is to be with someone who can tolerate me. It's because I've realized that the best version of me is the intolerable version of me.

Right. So when I'm doing hobbies, I don't judge myself. I don't criticize myself as much. And I'm not seeking perfection. And why wouldn't I be that version to someone else? And they accept that. And then they can also see that sometimes I'm a comedian who does comedy and stands on stage and over-analyses. So my thing was, when you present yourself to the partner that you would like to have, are you presenting Dulce who does arts and crafts?

Or are you presenting Dulce who over-analyses? who over-analyses and stands on stage and tries to find the punchline to life. All of it. Because if you're going to be with me, that's why it's like there's no, anything less than that as a performance. So it doesn't behoove or benefit me to be performing for people in my personal life. Yeah. Because then I never get to be myself, right?

Like, you know, I told you I went to that friend breakup. And the thing that was so hard about that. was like being with him, I got to be a woman. So I didn't get to me and I got to be soft. And I got to get taken care of. And I got to kind of like just, you see what I'm saying? Yeah.

Because like other openers I would bring with me, I'm taking care of this person while I'm taking care of. So it's like, okay, now we're doing this. Now I'm going this. Okay, we got to get a run, we got to that. And the benefit of him was I didn't have to. It's okay. What's the idea?

it's like, oh, you're, because I don't have a tour manager, right? So it's like, it's the benefit of us as a person. It's someone is making sure we're doing this and making sure we're doing that. Oh, you're hungry. Let's find something to eat. Let's do all of these things, right? And so I said them, I was like, I get to be a woman around you. I get to be soft. Because like, if you talk to like, especially like older women and it's just like every day before her husband, she had to go do this and do that. And like you have to, you were constantly performing. you constantly were doing things for this person's benefit and it wasn't mutual. It wasn't it wasn't y'all taking care of each other because when I've, you know, dated in, it's just like,

you know, what would you want to say? Why don't want someone to take care of me? Oh, well, you want trying to take all my money. That's the only care that you know is financial. You're not thinking about emotional. You're not thinking about, that's only thing. So I've said this to be, it's like, oh, you only think money. And a lot of times people only think about care. They think about, money. But if we've taught men that most of our situation, it's transactional with people, that's what we teach men, that love is transactional. We teach women that love is emotional. We treat men that love is transactional. You have to give things to be loved. Women is like, you have to be quiet and let this man do these things. You have to accept whatever he does.

Even if you don't like it, I didn't like this ring. I didn't like what he said to me. I didn't do any of these things. But if you want to be with somebody, you have to accept these things. And so I don't want to be in a situation where I can't tell you how I feel, or I can't tell you what's going on with me, that I can't pray with you. Because people ask me, well, these have to be a Christian. I just did the Daniel fast. I just did a religious fast for 21 days from the Old Testament. If my husband does not understand what I am doing, if my husband cannot do it with me, my mom is also fasting at the same time. My house is fasting.

If he does not understand my faith, he doesn't understand me as a person. He doesn't understand what I do. He doesn't understand me as a person. So I don't understand if this person I'm trying to build a life with, because that's the thing. You're always going to, like, because I had changes in my face. I didn't do the fast last year because I was mad at God. So I was like, I can't be in this place anymore because if I'm mad at God, I'm mad at everything that exists in the world. So I have to then, but I was mad at God because I was mad at myself.

And so I had to find forgiveness for myself in a crazy way. It's like I had to forgive God in my mind for me being in the position that I'm in. Because for some reason I'm here. And I don't know what that is because I don't. I don't know what God does. I don't know where they are at. But at least have to accept as a person of faith, all I can do is go out and do stand up, leave my house, and just hope that the work that I'm doing benefits in the way that I want it to. Because you don't know what God's plan is. All you know is you go outside your house, hope you don't die. And maybe what you want and what God's plan is matches up

somehow. But I can't lie. I don't lie to my friends. I'm who I am with my friends. I don't know why I wouldn't be that with my. I'm going to spend more time with it. He's going to be in my bed every night. I can't lie to this man. That's exhausting. I'm already tired. I was in six cities in a week and I'm supposed to come home and be like, all right, let me go lie to this, nigga. Who wants to do that? That's, I just, and so I don't want to also say, I'm not trying to change nobody. You can't change a person. Because I've heard people say that when I met him, but I can just change him. bitch, do you know how successful you can be in your life if you didn't spend all your time trying to change somebody else? Do you know what you could possibly be doing?

That's why I was talking about like truly crazy people are never successful. They're too busy being crazy. People who are obsessed because I realized at one point I was like, oh, I think I'm addicted to people. When I was younger, I was when I was addicted to people because I don't want to think about myself. So it was always thinking about what my friends were doing and were they okay and how were they and but da-da-da-da-da-da. Because when you stop thinking about other people, you can think about yourself. But we've been told as women thinking about yourself is selfish. So I had to figure out, oh, it's okay for me to think about me.

Oh, it's okay for me to worry about me. I had to learn about self-care because we grew up. You get your nails done. You get your hair done. Bitch, I have self-care. No one's talking about my emotional welfare at all. My hair is done and my nails are done. Bitch, you're fine.

So all of these things you have to learn as a person, because I realized if I had gotten married before I went to therapy, I would be divorced. Definitely. Because anybody I would have married before I went to therapy would not have been a healthy relationship no matter who it was because I was not in a good place and I didn't care about myself the right way and I didn't think about myself the right way. So I would have married somebody who was at the point of where I was in my life and that was not a good place. So he was either going to treat me the way I treated me, which isn't good because I had a friend

tell me one day if somebody spoke to you the way you spoke to you, I would fight that person. So let me ask you this then as we leave you. I've heard you talk about happiness. I've heard you talk about peace, your vision for your life, et cetera. If someone was to wave a magic wand and give you exactly what you wanted, what do you think that would look like tomorrow? That's the first part of the question. What would that look like tomorrow? First of all, I'm a bad bitch.

I'm playing. I'm already a bad one. I know why my first thought was my mom. If you wane and one tomorrow, I am married, happily married, with someone who understands me. I have children. Three. My brother is better. My mom is married.

I'm in a house that accommodates everybody. and I have because I don't think this it's not that the situation gives me peace is that I have a place of I don't have that sadness in me anymore I think that's the wand it's like I have the things

it's because this is what I think about all day is what I don't have and it's so and me taking care of everyone else and so I think of a wand is waived it's I have a partner who can help me take care of everyone else and someone that takes care of me and someone that I can take care. But it's also, it's like I need help and I'm past apart of my life where I'm afraid for asking for help. I'm afraid of my life where I don't feel ashamed asking for help. but I think if a wand is wave,

I get the help that I need because I'm not, because the goal is to stop feeling like I'm failing. It's really the goal. To be like, you did enough just because things didn't work out because no one's ever told me that I'm failing.

My manager tells me on the time you're not failing. But I can't. Don't go for, sorry to interrupt you. But I can't shake the feeling. So that's the wand wave is that feeling. is that feeling of, because someone asked me,

like, well, how do you know that you made it? I was like, I've never felt like I've made it. I've never felt like I've made it. Because like, oh, you got a daily show, you made it. I'm like, this is one job. Your career is your whole life. So it's, for me, it's like the wand is I don't feel like I'm failing anymore, and I have the things that I want to make me feel like I'm not failing.

What's the next question? So, no, no, no. The second part of it isn't necessarily a question. It's more an idea that I hope to leave you with. When my production team was asking me, they're like, so like, why, like, why Dulce? They asked me about everyone to try and understand. They're like, why do you want this person on? And why do you want that person?

And say, why Dulce? And I said, because I've met few people who embody the real idea of heroism than Dulcee. Me? Oftentimes, we are. sold heroes as people who have overcome an idea. Oftentimes I get frustrated because we're sold people who have overcome voluntary ideas. I climbed Mount Everest. I ran 100 marathons. And I'm like, yeah, this is my hero. I'm like, no, no, no, they chose a thing to do. In my opinion, heroes are the people who are not choosing the thing, but have to climb the mountain anyways.

Heroes are people who have to run 100 marathons, but there's no ribbon on the other end. and I won't change it overnight for you emotionally, but I genuinely hope you know. And it's something that somebody said to me that, man, stuck with me and it hit me hard, because I think I've experienced. I think everyone who's going to listen to this or watch this can at some point acknowledge feeling what you're feeling

and sharing with us. It was the feeling of want, the want, and I don't have and I don't. And they said something really, really, really impactful and beauty. And at the time, I just, I resisted it. And I was like, no. And they said, my one wish for you in life is that you realize everything you want is everything you already have. Where is he? And I, you know, I took it as trite.

I took it as like, whatever, whatever. And you know, you and I've spoken about these things. But I've gone, you're not wrong. Whoever you are in life, you're not wrong to go, I don't have. Because you don't. But you're also wrong if you only think you don't have. Right. Because we all don't.

I've talked to people who have found the love of their life and then they died. That's so. And let me tell you something. You think you're lonely because you haven't met the love of your life. Meet the love of your life and have them leave this earth permanently. Oh, I think about that all the time. No, no. And then you'll understand a different type of loneliness and a different type of pain.

And I'm not saying this minimizes because I'm not one of those people who goes, other people have it. worse. I do think perspective is a wonderful thing because it allows us to see parts of ourselves in our lives that we are otherwise unable to see. And the simplest analogy I'll give is Eugene and I have laughed about this for years. We'd always go, nothing would make you appreciate your car more than the guy at the car wash driving it away. You know that feeling we'd always talk about. You'd have your car, you used to this car and it's annoying. I've got to fix this and I got to. And then there's a moment where the guy at the car wash would drive it and you'd look at him in your car

and you'd go, that's my car and there'd be this and we'd literally laugh about this feeling and yeah the one thing I say to you as as we wrap up here is I think it's like broken down into parts one is thank you

because I think you don't realize sometimes that you doing is helping others It's like even on like the smallest level, which I think is a big level, like comedy, man, let me tell you something. The amount of times people have told me what they came into a comedy show with and how they left a comedy show changed like my perspective on it, you know. Think about it with good food.

I think about it with with anything, you name it. And you doing for your family, you like, I hope you don't, I hope you don't take for granted. that part of it because I know the burden is intensely upon you. And I hope genuinely, I just, I hope that the feeling you just felt now is a feeling that you'll constantly be able to dip into, regardless of what does or doesn't come into your life. Because the feeling is all that we're pursuing. That's the thing I've learned and has taken me years and years.

And I'm not perfect at it, by the way, I still slip. But the feeling is the only thing we're pursuing. we feel like we want to be married with kids. We feel like we want to have kids. We feel like we want this job. We feel like we want to do that. We feel like we're not wrong. But the thing is, to your point, we don't know.

You've never met that man. I've never met my wife. The person might never exist. But you know what does exist? The feeling that we have when we think of them. And so I think that's like one part of you that I think you might not be able to see all the time is how optimistic you are. is how much of like the lining you're seeing

because you want it. To want it is to believe that it can even possibly exist. I know what happens when I don't. And so that's the thing. It's like I don't know if you saw this clip when I was hosting the show, the lady asked me what was the hardest part of your career and the hardest thing you had to do

and all this other stuff. And I said, oh, hope. Yeah. People never talk about how hard hope is. Hope is the hardest thing to have. patience is easier than hope. Because at least when you're waiting for a thing, it's coming.

And that's the thing. You're only patient for things that you know are coming. Hope is you waiting for a thing that you don't know is coming. And so there's a amount of faith that you have to have in that. And I can't offer you this. If you think seeing somebody drive off with your car, that a car wash is a feeling. your car on a tow truck, that's a worse feeling.

Because here's the tow truck, because here's the one. I said the car thing's a good feeling. So when someone's taking, he's like, man, the car, why I'm taking the car? No, I'm saying it's a good feeling. You get to appreciate it. Yeah, I was saying it's a good feeling. Oh, no, no, no, no. I appreciate my car more.

Every time I had a car in the back of a tow truck, I had to appreciate the fact that it is going to be fixed. That's the moment you have to go. When you see a car in a tow truck, you have two options, Either you never see this car again because she's gone. Because I told you a day to number length canning for a long time because I could only Ford you's cars. And sometimes you got to go to some man's house to pay for oil change.

That's not the point. You love him. But real hope is seeing your car in a tow truck and going, I'm going to drive the car again. Yeah. No matter what's wrong with it. Also, car to car. Somebody else.

I've never been to a car wash for somebody had to drive my car off. So I just hope just one day to get like you. Oh, no, no. It's quite common in South Africa. Don't get interested. No, no, no, no. No, no, no. No, no, no.

No, no, no, no. No, they have them here. I just haven't gone. Oh, it's like pouring gas. You don't like in America. People are like, they pour your gas for you. And you're like, oh, no, no, this is not, this is not the way it seems. No, in New Jersey, they pump the gas for you and know what I'm just one of those funny things.

You know, but don't say this was a, I know we're going to. Yeah, we have to wrap up. But yeah, it's, uh, listen, this is the longest I've ever spoken to you. Don't lie. We've never talked for two hours straight before. Yeah. But I don't talk to anyone for two hours straight. I'm fully aware.

That's what I'm saying. Oh, okay. I was going to be like in our lives we've spoken for way more than two hours. Yes, you put it all together. It was three hours and 15 minutes. In fact, I'm going to challenge you. When we were backstage in Atlanta,

I had the fried chicken and we were sitting, remember I had the Nashville spicy hot chicken and we were backstage and you came to the show in Atlanta. We stayed backstage until they kicked us out of the backstage. Yeah, because that's the only time I leave somewhere that we kicked out. But that was hours. And I'm happy. But that was ours.

It was. How dare you forget me? I did not. How dare you erase me from history. See, look at this man. You see what happened? he had what now mind you that's the longest we ever talked how long are on this man how many how many presidents i don't know you for Trevor zekeo noah only one real president

because the other one stole the election listen i everyone who's watching is like i know who he he means Biden um stolen but no i'm glad i was uh worry you were gonna uh i'm proud of myself for not crying. I'm glad I got to I'm glad I got to do this because I do I do like your perspective on things because you weren't born here

and so there's a certain amount of optimism and perspective that you have that especially black people born here don't have because one most Americans

Americans don't leave America. But also, too, there is a, there is a, when you come from a place that was colonized and stolen from you, but the majority of the people in your country still look like you. Then you're watching a minority run your country, right? Yeah. And so you can see the theft. You can see that y'all shouldn't be running this shit. We just didn't have guns. It's the only reason y'all are here

is because you caught us slipping. How dare we not have weapons, right? Here it's, you took over and brought us with you and stripped us of who we are. And every time we try to create who we are, you tell us we're not, you try to convince us this whole time that we're lesser than what we are.

And we've accepted that to a certain point. But we spend all this time, Because if you notice what black people do all day is look at white people and go, that's not us. How do you not know who we are? We know who y'all are. We've been with y'all the whole time. So black people spend all this time going,

no, that's not us, that's not us, that's not us. And you're coming from a place where, oh, I know who I am. And so there's a certain fight that you don't have to have mentally, that we have to have. Because not only are we fighting the population at large, we're also fighting for each other, be like, no, no, no, no, we're in this together.

But I don't know, you niggas. But we're in this together, but I can't, are we, we, and so you're always trying to figure out friend or foe. Because sometimes it's like skin, funk and kinfolk. So there's a perspective that you have because it's like you have the basis of I know where I'm from. And I know where I'm from. I'm from here. But everyone's telling me I have no part in this. And then I know where I'm from as a continent.

But I have multiple tribes in me who could have been at war. I'm just the descendants of these people. So I'm walking around with nations in me, but everyone's telling me that I'm lesser than I am. So I spent all this time going, no, no, no, no, no, no. I'm big, I'm big. Look, I'm big. See me.

And so that's a perspective. So I think that's why you get to see people the way that you see them. And I think sometimes that's why I see people this way that I see them because, like, oh, I can see that you're hurt. You're mad at me because you're hurt. That has nothing to do with me. And I think you can see the hurt, but sometimes I only see the hurt. because that's the only thing I'm trained to see

and you get to see the happiness and the hurt and I'm sometimes I always, a lot of times I miss the happiness but I always see the hurt. You always see both. So that's why I was appreciate talking to you because you can see all of a thing. But I'm descended from people who were constantly in pain.

And if you think of, so we spend all this time trying to be happy because the default is, well, fuck. I didn't die. Because you can't be upset Because it's like We can't be depressed Because my ancestors are slaves

Oh you niggas can read Why are you sad Or y'all can buy houses and earn money They used to beat us to death You can't be sad So I just always appreciate talking to you Because I feel like you see people as a whole while As a sudden I'm just like

I just a nigga sad Let me go help him Sit in his makeup chair looking like that I would give you my left hand But I don't have one Friend What happened? Are you playing tennis or some shit?

Yeah. Don't start. Do you say thank you for joining us. Thank you for having me. I'm sorry I took up on your tape. You didn't take up any tape. There's no tape. The future.

The SD card. I'll tell you there's a Dr. Wayne Dyer. I don't know if it's better of him. Who? Dr. Wayne. Dr. Wayne. Now I've no Dr. Wayne. He said, he quoted from the Dowda Ching, the book.

He said, you don't have to do anything because you're already being done. Who doing me? That quote relieved me from a lot of stress and anguish from thinking I need to do something because everything is already happening. Say it again? You don't need to do anything because you're already being done.

That sounds like a translation issue. Well, it was Chinese. Don't say Sloan, everyone. She already done had hers. What Now with Trevor Noah is produced by Day Zero Productions in partnership with Sirius X-M. The show is executive produced by Trevor Noah, Sanaziamin, and Jess Hackle. Rebecca

Chain is our producer. Our development researcher is Marcia Robiu. Music, mixing, and mastering by Hannes Brown. Random Other Stuff by Ryan Harduth. Thank you so much for listening. Join me next week for another episode of What Now.