What Now? with Trevor Noah - Welcome To The Julia Louis-Dreyfus Brain Museum [VIDEO]

Episode Date: June 20, 2024

There’s probably only one actress who can try to strangle, burn, and eat “Death,” and still manage to make us laugh. And that’s Julia Louis-Dreyfus in her new movie Tuesday. Trevor and Julia dissect their own experiences with grief, explain why all American politicians should be required to take drivers’ education, and share their hope for the future of comedy. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Okay, as soon as you're ready, I'm ready. I'm ready. Alright, let's do it. Action. And action. Do you like the and when they do and action or do you just like action? And. Doesn't and just become, isn't it like saying action, action basically?

No, because and is before action. So it's half the beat before. It's like saying, one, two, three, go. Same thing. Same idea. Okay. So it just gives everybody like a moment to... Yes, as opposed to action. Oh, yeah. I can feel that. You feel that? I can feel that. Does the way a director kick off a scene influence how the scene goes?

It can. Like if you're doing like a really intimate, calm scene or like a... And someone's like, action! Does that throw everything off or... Ha ha ha. What do you think? I don't know. I genuinely don't know. No, yes, it would absolutely throw it off.

It would be a disaster for everyone. Oh, I want to be the director who stretches it up. And action Will Smith. Ha ha ha. That's great. That's great. Love the way you ran across the bridge. This is What Now with Trevor Noah. FanDuel Casino's exclusive live dealer studio has your chance at the number one

feeling winning, which meets even the 27th best feeling saying I do. Who wants this last parachute? I do. Enjoy the number one feeling winning, which beats even the 27th best feeling saying I do. Who wants this last parachute? I do. Enjoy the number one feeling, winning, in an exciting live dealer studio, exclusively on FanDuel Casino, where winning is undefeated. 19 plus and physically located in Ontario. Gambling problem?

Call 1-866-531-2600 or visit connectsontario.ca. Please play responsibly. Wild Card is a new podcast that asks big questions you won't hear anywhere else. Famous guests like Jenny Slate, Chris Pine, and Bowen Yang have to answer whatever question gets drawn from a special deck of cards. What's a goal you're glad you gave up on? What's a belief you had to let go of? Oh. What's the biggest sacrifice you've ever made? Listen to Wildcard, wherever you get your podcasts, only from NPR.

Welcome to another episode of What Now? The podcast where we have interesting conversations with interesting people who oftentimes make us think or feel. And I think our guest today is honestly, you know, the pinnacle of that. If you watched everything or anything, you'd know her from Seinfeld, the character Elaine, the best dance move ever in history. If you watched HBO, or if you had access to the show, you know Veep, the show that satirized American politics and then American politics was like, well, we're just going to do that. Sorry. Sorry, everyone.

Oh, wow. Um, if you watch movies, you know her from really wonderful, fascinating movies that oftentimes don't match up with what you think she would be doing from what you've seen her doing on TV. And today we're having a conversation about one of those movies. It's a film called Tuesday, a fascinating story about a mother and daughter who are grappling with death that is knocking at their door in the form of a macaw. So Julia Louis-Dreyfus, welcome to What Now.

Thank you, Trevor. It's so good to have you, especially considering like A, how busy you are, and then B, how famous you are. I like, do you ever, no, I was thinking about this and it sort of framed, you know, what I'd want to talk to you about today. It's evolution in all forms.

And it's not really about the fame, it's just about like, so let's call it impact even. OK. You know, you have Impact in the 90s starring in one of the most successful sitcoms of all time. And then, you know, you have Impact in the 2000s on Veep as one of the, you know, it's the most successful,

like hardcore, you know, HBO, like, you know, just go all in. But that's the vibe at the time. SNL, I even forget SNL. Like hardcore, you know, HBO, like, you know, just go all in. But that's the vibe at the time. SNL, I even forget SNL. Think about, like, because that was before my time as in I wasn't watching American TV. And then now you're doing it again in film and you're in the podcast space, which makes me feel good, by the way.

Why? Well, because if you're doing podcasts, then I think I'm in the right space at the right time. You're perfect for podcasts because you're such a conversationalist. Oh, thank you. You are. Yeah. I mean, I've heard your podcast. You're quite good at it. Thank you. Thank you very much. Throw some back at you. Thank you very much. I like to start with a little self-compliment. Thank you very much.

But no, seriously, let me ask you this. Selfishly, maybe. Okay. But also for people who are like evolving or trying to evolve in life, like how do you keep your finger on the pulse of what will be versus on just what is? I don't know. Have I done that? I mean- You don't think you've done that?

Well, I don't know. I haven't ever thought about my life like that. I mean, I've been, I know you're going to think it's bullshit. I think I've been pretty lucky, but I'm also incredibly ambitious. I don't think it's bullshit at all. Yeah. I mean, it's been, it's been both. I've also failed by the way, but carried on from it because I just like to do this.

That's all. But, but I would add that I don't feel regret. I don't, I don't feel regret. I don't have regret. So even the things that didn't work in the way I had hoped that they had worked, I can stand by proudly. Like even SNL, for example, I stunk on SNL, but it was not a good experience for me. But guess what?

I just, I met a lot of people and I learned a fuckton on that show. I did, I really learned a lot. And that, but I learned the hard way. It was hard. It was hard. Do you bounce back quickly from those? I guess I do wish. Sometimes it takes some time. You know, you can get a little bruised. from those? I guess I do wish. Sometimes it takes some time.

You know, you can get a little bruised. I take it to, sometimes I cry and stuff and then it's okay. Yeah, because I know for standups, we try and find that next joke or the next moment that will make us feel like we're in the right place. How do you help yourself bounce back? What's the thing? Because with stand up, it's easy. You go tell another joke and then it sort of helps you get over the previous failure.

Yes. I walk away from it completely. Oh damn. Yeah. So I can just, I get out of that head space. That's the thing that's so nice about like, since we're not, you know, we're not brain surgeons here, we're actors. And so you can like be like, all right, fuck it. It's just movies, it's just TV.

I'm gonna go focus on something else. And so I do. And that's good for me too, for real. You know, one of my favorite people I've seen speak about this is Denzel Washington, where he like, he doesn't take it as seriously as people would think he does. Right.

But he loves doing it and he respects the craft. But he also goes, what a fun, silly thing to be doing. It's ridiculous. You know what I mean? Yeah, you're making a living doing pretending. Yes, pretending, but then making people feel real. Yeah, which I love. I remember when I was little, really little,

and I was in the car with my mom, and she was driving and she was, I don't know, talking to somebody in the front seat, and I was listening to the conversation, and I was noticing how it didn't sound like people acting. It was people acting. It was people talking. So I've already started to notice things like that. How old were you when this was happening?

What do you do? Maybe eight. Wow. But I remember noticing that. And anyway, I don't know why that just popped into my head, but it did. You're just sitting in the car. Listening. And you're going, this sounds real. This you're going this is this sounds real.

This sounds real. Yeah, this sounds real. When did you know you wanted to do that? Like I from the get go. I mean, I don't remember knowing that I didn't want to do it. I've always wanted to do it. But what did you want to get into the show or the business? The show.

I wanted to be in a show. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I wanted to, you know, play a part. I was listening to your conversation with you know, play a part. I was listening to your conversation with Conan, which was really great. And the two of you talked about how there used to be like a linear path to success. It was like, you do, you make a sitcom, and then you hope that another one comes, and

then maybe there's a movie, and then your life is over. You've broken that mold time and time again. And when I speak to people who are in the industry, like if I say, oh, I'm going to be talking to Julia Louis-Dreyfus, it's amazing how they all admire you for forging like a new idea of what you can do. Do you feel that for yourself as well? Do you ever, like what I mean is, do you think to yourself, I'm going to do something new

purposefully or is it the luck that's coinciding with you just wanting to work? It's not necessarily something new. I wouldn't sort of characterize it as such. I would say, I'm going to do something that gets me going and I'm going to find that again. Does that make sense? That makes complete sense. Yeah. That's what I'm gonna find that again. Does that make sense? That makes complete sense. Yeah, that's what I'm looking for, that. And it's exciting. It's kind of like fishing, you don't know what's gonna bite. Do you fish? I do.

Really? Yeah. What kind of fishing? Any kind I can do, if I'm on a boat or if I'm near a river. I'm not very good at it, but I do love it. There's something about the excitement, you don't know what's coming. I feel that way about jobs, touch wood. I'm also superstitious. I like that. So you just go,

I don't know what's going to happen, I don't know what it's going to be, but I'm going to jump into this excitedly and then see. Yeah, totally. What do you like about working? Because I feel like everyone has a different thing. Some people are running away from something, some people are running towards something. So what do you like about working?

I like, well, there are a few things I like. I like being part of a team because when you're working on something, you're, you know, as actors and with crew and the director and so on, you're part of a team, you're all working towards this common goal of making whatever this is. Right, right. And, you know, I'm making the assumption that everybody's on the same page. That's not always the case. Sometimes people are bumping heads. But let's just assume when it's really working, that part of it is incredibly satisfying. And then I like the play of work. I like playing. I like the playfulness of being an actor. That just really

appeals to me. And were you like, I've met you out and I feel like, like at the club, I want everybody to know this, you were partying hard, we were at the club. Yeah. It was a good time. It was a great time. I was like, wow, I was like, JLD, what you doing in the club? She's like, I can't hear you.

I was like, that's because we're in the club. Yeah, I know. But when we met. And we were wasted. No, but when I met you out, I was pleasantly surprised at how close you are to some of the characters you play. Obviously not as crazy and as quirky as some of the moments, but there's the underlying current of you in everything.

Sure. You know, and then, like in this new movie, for instance, that you're in, Tuesday, I don't recognize you, to be honest. Okay. No, which I think is a good, like I see parts of who I think you are, but I don't see you, you know? The me that you know. Yes, exactly, exactly.

Who do people think you are versus who you are? Like how far do you think those two are from each other? Well, they always think I'm going to be funny, which I'm not. I mean, I am, but I'm not, you know? Yeah, but you are. But you know what I mean. Yeah, okay, yes. I'm sure it's the same for you.

People are expecting something to come from you. I often disappoint people. Yes, I do the same. I do the same. I'm actually kind of, I'm an observer. I'm listening to those conversations in the front seat. This is what I try to explain to people. If you're always performing, when are you absorbing what you're going to put into the

performance? Correct. That's exactly right. Okay. Okay, I see this. Yes. Yeah, Tuesday was, first of all, thank you. Oh, wow.

I know it's a weird thing to say, but thank you. Oh, wow. So I, because I watch things before the interview and then sometimes they're terrible. Yeah. And I don't mean that in like a, like a, like a disparaging, it's just like they're terrible. Oh, they can't all be good, right? Yes, exactly. You know, half of my stand-up, I'm sure is terrible.

So I understand, but I don't put it out. But this was like, it wasn't just amazing. It was also way deeper than I thought it was going to be. And I didn't know what out. But this was like, it wasn't just amazing. It was also way deeper than I thought it was going to be. And I didn't know what to expect. Oh, good. Oh, good. I'm not going to lie. So I watched it cold. You had no idea? No idea what I was getting into, which is like, which is how I like to watch movies. Sure, that makes sense. Yeah. And then I got into it and I was like, is this a horror? Then I was like, no, it's not. No, wait, what is happening here? It's really disconcerting. Yeah. Well, I mean, it's, yes, it's a fantasy. like, no, it's not. No, wait, what is happening here? It's really disconcerting.

Yeah, well, I mean, it's, yes, it's a fantasy. It's a sort of a fairy tale with magical realism. And you go on this journey with the sort of three main characters. My character, Zora, my daughter daughter Tuesday, and of course Death. I almost don't want to spoil it for anybody, but I want to talk about the themes and the story. I will say things that hopefully will make people watch the movie. Okay, that's good. But it won't make them understand the movie.

Okay. We won't be able to pick it completely apart anyway, because it's multi-level that movie, I think. But anyway, I'm so curious to know what appealed to you or didn't or whatever about the movie. I really am. So the first thing for me is, I couldn't tell whether or not it was a comedy, which I genuinely think is one of the best things you can create in life is a story where people

are unable to discern whether or not it is or isn't funny. Because I think that's what life is, depending on how you're looking at it all the time. Couldn't agree more. You know, like if somebody falls in the street and it's like that funny splaying fall, it's funny if you're not the person. When you're the person, it's not funny until they have a little time away from it, then it becomes funny. And I feel the same way about like stories and movies and things is depending on what moment you're watching it from, you go, man, this is funny. No, it's not funny. This is very sad. This is deep. This is hilarious.

Yeah. It's got a little bit of everything, but I would say it's much more dramatic than it is comedic. But by the way, completely off-subject but somewhat related, have you ever seen that footage somewhere on the internet where they took like The Shining and they put a comedy soundtrack to it? Yes, yes, I have seen that. Isn't that fascinating by the way? Yeah.

But I talked to, it was Jordan Peele about this. And I said to him, please don't be offended. Sometimes I say things, I understand people might take them wrong. So I said, don't be offended. But sometimes I watch your movies and I go, this is a very funny comedy. And he said, in his opinion, all horrors are comedy with scary music. It's the same pacing, it's the same rhythm, it's the same. That's fascinating.

So I wonder when- I need to work with him. I would love to work with him. Yeah. When you're reading the script for a movie like Tuesday, are you seeing it as something because they've told you it's that, or are you going, oh no, I can make this what I want it to be because I'm going to be in it?

Neither. I read it cold, so I did not know what it was. And you can imagine, I was just sort of like blown away by what was on that page and was really quite immediately intrigued, but had to get some understanding of what the writer-director, what her vision was here. And because there is animation in it, I wanted to make sure what she was thinking about vis-a-vis the animation. Because like if that animation doesn't work, this thing is going to be a piece of crap.

I didn't even think of it as animation now. I know, although it was played by this extraordinary actor named Arunzai Kenne, who is this great British actor. And he was with us the entire time. He is a cast member in the movie. And then they animated over him. So we were playing scenes with him. Okay. So I thought it was a parrot,

but then I was told it's a macaw. It's a macaw, whatever. But it's a kind of exaggerated version of a macaw. It's a fantastical version because macaws don't really look like that. They're not that color. They're not blah, blah. And of course, he morphs throughout the movie size and color wise.

It's very disconcerting. Yeah, it is, in fact, because in the beginning of the film, my character is completely in denial about what is happening in her life and more importantly, what's happening with her daughter and is making very, very bad decisions because of that denial. Denial is not a great response most of the time. And yet it seems like the most natural one. Yes, exactly. I think we all do it to a certain extent.

I think it would be weird if we didn't. Yeah. But you know what else is weird? We're all, I mean this movie, you know, it's a conversation starter, I suppose, about death and dying and afterlife and all of that. And it is extraordinary to consider that we're all gonna die and we don't really think about it too much. But it's funny to think that all the people in this room, you know, we're all gonna be dead one day. You hear that folks? Weird.

Did I freak you out? That's what I loved about the movie was you were playing, in my opinion, everybody's idea of who should and shouldn't die. Mm, mm, mm, mm, okay. Like you represented the idea that we all have of who, like we all think we know who should and shouldn't die and when they should and shouldn't die.

Yeah, I'm negotiating with death. Yes. Yeah. I have a friend who always says, you don't know that you're going to die. He has this theory and I actually believe him. He goes, we all do not know that we're going to die. We think like we as a theoretical idea, we understand that death is the conclusion of life.

Yes. But he argues, and I felt it in this film in a way, he argues that nobody knows that they're gonna die. Like, we, I know, it seems like it's... Well, would he agree that your body will stop working at some point? No, no, no. He says, but he just says as people... Because if that's not the case, your friend needs some major help. No, no, no. So this is what he said for me tied into the film because every day people are dying. Yes.

Right? I would argue that most people are shocked when they die. Shocked. And the people around them are shocked. Yes. And that's what he's saying is because nobody knows. It's like we don't know that it'll happen. We don't believe that it'll happen. We're believe that it'll happen we're told it like a theoretical thing that's right and everyone goes yes of course

death is yes of course and then it's like wait me what my family exactly isn't that amazing isn't that amazing to think about yeah yeah it really is me no no no you mean them over here no no no not me we're gonna continue this conversation right after this short break Fandu casino's exclusive live dealer studio has your chance at the number one feeling winning which beats even the 27th best feeling saying I do wants this last parachute I do Enjoy the number one feeling. Winning in an exciting live dealer studio exclusively on FanDuel

Casino where winning is undefeated. 19 plus and physically located in Ontario. Gambling problem? Call 1-866-531-2600 or visit kinexontario.ca. Please play responsibly. Okay, so this is what I wanted to ask you about comedy-wise. I'm fascinated by physical comedy. It's really fun, isn't it?

It is both the lowest form of comedy and simultaneously the highest. Yes, yes. And so I wanted to know from you, like, how are you thinking of physical comedy in a movie about death that's really sad, but you're still doing something really funny, but it's not the same way you would do the funny as Elaine. Like okay, like the scene for instance where you grow to the size of the room. It's very funny. You think?

You didn't think it was funny? No, I didn't think of it as being funny, but I'm delighted you did. It's fine. Oh, damn. I might have that comedian brain thing where I laugh at the wrong things. It's okay. You know, you're the winner. You laughed. Well, I didn't laugh. I thought it was funny. Oh, I see what you're saying. It didn't make me laugh, but I went, this is a funny... It's weird. I would say it's weird.

Yes, yes. It's weird. But that's different than physical comedy, you know, I think. I would say it's weird. Yes. It's weird. But that's different than physical comedy, you know, I think. I mean, in my view. Well, but you're the expert. I would defer to you. Well, I mean, when you say physical comedy, I'm thinking of using your body sort of physically to get the laugh, to enhance a joke, as opposed to in this film film there's all this crazy physical stuff that happens but

it wasn't in service of a joke necessarily. Does that make sense? That makes complete sense. Okay. And so the way I interpret physical comedy as I go, how does somebody do something with their body that can make you laugh whether or not the intent, that's why I talk about falling. Yeah, falling is great. Like I think, I think falling is the best physical comedy. Yeah.

But no one who's falling intends for you to laugh. It is not punctuating a joke. They're walking and then there's a joke at the end of it. But there was not a joke, no one wrote a joke. Yeah, right. Walking, walking, walking, no more walking. There was a scene that we did on Veep. It was in the last season and we are, I think it's the convention, maybe it's the final

episode, I don't really remember. But anyway, in which my character's having, I can't even talk about it, it still makes me laugh. My character's having a really bad time, per usual. Nothing's quite going her way and she's flipping out. And I'm sitting at a couch and Tony Hale, who plays my beloved, or would like to think he's beloved assistant, comes up to me and he says,

and I'm out of my mind, and he comes up to me and he goes, do you want six almonds? Sort of a nod to, do you remember? So the Obama almond story. Yes, which was seven almonds for him. Do you want six almonds?" Sort of a nod to, do you remember? So the Obama almond story. Yes, which was seven almonds for him. And so he goes, do you want six almonds? And this is physical comedy that I thought really

helped that joke because it was written, do you want six almonds? But then what happened was Tony comes up sort of behind the couch and into my ear and I turn and I scream at him, full pitch scream in his ear, no, I'm telling you this now, it's not funny in the telling, but it's a huge scream at him and he fell backwards behind the couch. And I honestly to this day, as you can tell, I think it's one of the funniest things I

have ever been a part of. His fall, and it made me think of it because it was a fall, because he also falls out of frame, which is, you know, it doesn't get better than that. Falling out of frame. Was it planned? Oh, we planned it in rehearsal. So in other words, it was written, do you want six almonds? Selena screams no.

But then I had this idea, well, how about he comes over, he whispers it and we do it in such a way so that my no knocks him out. And I mean, it was very Tex Avery cartoon-like, but in the scene itself, it seemed to make sense. Anyway, watch it, you'll see what I mean. This is what I'm now understanding. What I find funny oftentimes in life is not the intention of the person. It's not whether the thing will or won't be a joke and it's whether they said it's how ludicrous the action is. And how it, like when you literally when you eat the head of a fully charred creature thing, it is it's so like, and there's and there's a thing you do with your eyes,

which is like, it's almost like you're thinking like, this is, but you know what? It's done. It's done. Totally. I've done what needs to be, and you even pause while chewing it. There's like a mid-chew pause and then more chewing. And that's what, I don't know, that's what I find funny. I think it's- Yeah, I guess that is funny. I mean, I think in the theater people laugh or they're like, oh, Jesus.

You know, I mean, it's also, I guess, disgusting. I don't know. Yes, and I think that's a great story. That's a great performance. I'm humbly saying as an audience member, please, I'm not a director. I would shout action at the wrong times. So-

I don't think so. You strike me as a clever person. I couldn't help find myself wondering. when I was watching the story about Tuesday, I couldn't help wondering how much of it you drew from your life or how much of it like reminded you of your life. You've shared your story of like the pain of loss in your life, losing your dad, for instance, and just how much he meant to you, his love of poetry, and the way he connected with you as a human being and shaped you into who we see you as today. And you've shared your journey, for instance, diagnosed with cancer and how that affected

you, etc. When you're watching the movie Tuesday, I feel like everyone can and will connect with it because everyone has or will deal with loss and grief in some way, shape or form. And I wondered when you were doing that, was there a part of you that was either remembering or processing or feeling or you know, did it connect with you in a way that went just beyond the story? Oh, without question. The entire movie.

I tapped into my experience as someone who is, I've lost a number of people who are very close to me. I certainly tapped into that. I tapped into the ferocity that I feel as a mother and my bond with my children. Yes, I would fight death to save my child's life. I would fight death. I wouldn't even hesitate.

So I tapped into all of that stuff, all of it. And to, because that's your job as an actor, you have to bring honesty. And so that's what I was, I did. It was not easy. How do you move on after loss? Like loss. Well, I mean, in my experience anyway, and people suffer all kinds of different loss,

and of course, but in my experience, you know, it obviously, it takes time. And then something that sort of helped me and I've found it to be the case is that it's not like the relationship with the person that you've lost has ended, it's just shifted. So for example, you mentioned my father, so I think of my father all the time. I feel as if I still have a relationship with him. And it's maybe more of a mysterious spiritual relationship, but he's very much in my being. And so it's a shift. It's a shift. What about you? Have you had a lot of loss? The only loss I've experienced in my life, I think, is my grandmother. I remember thinking

about this. When it happened, I didn't realize that I'd never experienced grief until that moment. Were you with her when she passed? No, no, I wasn't. But I remember when my grand passed, it was almost like there was a door inside my chest that had never been opened. And all of a sudden somebody opened it. And I was feeling something that I couldn't, you know, it's like a color on a wheel that doesn't have a name or label attached to it. So you go, it is neither sadness nor is it a joy, but it feels like both at the same time. I can't explain it. I found myself crying but also smiling.

Because I was like, I don't know, it was like every memory of her, every moment when I would walk into a room and she would smile at me, every dish she would cook for me, every, it felt like her life was playing again in my head. And I was celebrating that with tears. It was a very, very strange feeling.

You still think of her a lot? Oh yeah. Yeah. All the time. Whenever, whenever I'm feeling lost is the wrong word, but whenever I'm feeling a little unmoored, there's just moments where I go, go to a mirror and look at yourself the way your grandmother looked at you. Oh, that's very moving.

Do you know what I mean? Yeah. Because I feel like that's oftentimes what it is. Going back to the film, funny enough, I think sometimes what we're not trying to lose is not the other person per se, but it's what the other person holds of us in them. Yeah, totally, 100%. And that's something that I loved in the way you were portraying this mom. At the beginning, she seems overwhelmed, overworked, doesn't have time for it all.

Can't even have the conversation. When your daughter in the movie says, can we speak? And she's like, let's speak tomorrow. And then it's amazing to see that shift. When we, going back to we know we're going to die, or we know somebody's going to go. It's like, oh, actually, I do have the time. Actually, I should make the time because I'm not just losing you, I'm losing a piece of me that is in you. And so that was, yeah, that's why I say thank you, because I, you know, I mean, I clearly laughed at moments where it wasn't funny. I still say thank you though. Don't go anywhere, because we got more What Now after this.

So you're also the host and creator and driving force behind a podcast that has become really successful, Wiser Than Me. It's different because it's not the same type of project. It's not attached to a giant studio. It's not a machine. Right. But it still excited you, I'm assuming. It did. Yeah. not a machine, but it still excited you, I'm assuming. It did, yeah. I mean, it excited me because that decision

was really driven by my own curiosity, I mean, for real. And sort of like consternation at the fact that older women become invisible and older men, particularly older white men, are not invisible. And that irritates me, but it's not really being driven by irritation. It's being driven by curiosity because I saw this documentary about Jane Fonda, which if you haven't seen it you really should because you'd really be interested in it. And so it got me thinking like, wow, I didn't know all of this about Jane Fonda. She's got this

huge life. She's done all so many different things. And I hadn't really given that consideration. And then I thought, well, who else is there must be so many older women in the universe who have done so many things and we're not hearing from them in an in-depth kind of way. I wish that somebody would do that. And I thought, okay, I guess I'm gonna do that. Cause I was very curious about it. But it's hard work doing a podcast in case you didn't know. Yeah, but yours seems like it's particularly hard because you have a conversation with a person

who you admire that sort of like starts in the benign and really blossoms into this beautiful examination of like starts in the benign and really blossoms into this beautiful examination of life and how you see yourself and the stories you'll tell and the stories they'll tell and the advice that they'll give you like on the show. Yeah, it's amazing, right? Do you know what I mean? Like there was one episode, I forget who it was, and she was basically like chastising you for being worried about death and aging and everything.

Isabel Allende. Yeah, but it was really amazing. It feels like you are, in a way, connecting us with a... It's spiritual, that's the way I put it. It feels spiritual to me as I'm doing it, even though it just takes so much time. But it does. It feels every time I finish one of these conversations, first of all, I'm exhausted. But I am, you know, half the time I'm weeping and I feel better for it. If you were interviewing you as like the young you, let's say it was, let's say you were on your podcast as you now, but then speaking to you when you were like kicking things off, is

there anything you would change? It doesn't seem like there's anything changeable in your life. Oh, that I would tell myself? Yeah. Oh, absolutely. Sure. No, like what? Well, you think I'm making a joke, but I'm not. I would say wear sunscreen. I'm not kidding you, wear sunscreen.

I know. It's not deep, but it's really practical. And I would say trust your instincts. When did you ever not trust your instincts and regret it. I was not as self-assured as I wish I could have been when I was, I had an interior monologue of questioning myself a lot when I was younger and I felt more self-assured, you know. It was a different time too, I think, to a certain extent. So what do you think changed? Because now you carry that swag.

I mean, I don't know you without that swag. So what changed? What changed? Experience? I've learned a lot. Yeah? Yeah. I've learned a lot.

You know? For example, when I first started to try to produce the television that I was in, I felt nervous about asking for it. And I sort of wrung my hands about that. And then if they, the powers that be pushed back, that would sort of make me feel self-conscious in a way. And now I know that that's ridiculous and that I have a lot to offer and yeah, I'm going to produce it. You're Julia Louis-Dreyfus. Fuck off, yes.

That's what you do now. That's what I do. So I was reading this thing about, I think it was a profile in the New York Times and they were asking you a question that I feel like everyone is getting asked all the time. I don't remember people not being asked it in the last, let's say like seven-ish years. And the question was, do you think that there is comedy that cannot be told? And you know, do you think that comedy people are becoming more sensitive? And I really loved your answer. Good. I'm glad.

No, I really loved your answer because Good, I'm glad. No, I really loved your answer because, maybe because I agree with it. It'd be funny if I like, I loved it and I think it's wrong. But I, no, I loved it because I agree with it. I loved it, you're full of bullshit. Yeah. I love the fact that you said, there is nothing wrong with being sensitive

to how comedy is or isn't affecting people. Right. Right. And I also agreed with the sentiment that it's not like you can't make the jokes. Exactly. People are making jokes. People are continuing to make jokes. Yes. It's continuing.

We're not being hamstrung. And I'm in big favor of being, of evolving, of evolving. Think of what entertainment was 50 or 60 years ago. I defy you to look at that. We have evolved from then. And I think we must continue to evolve. Yeah. Yeah, I completely agree.

Yeah. I also don't think there's anything wrong in accepting that evolution does not necessarily mean that the past was bad. I think sometimes we're unfair to ourselves as people. And I go, especially as a comedian, I'm like, comedy is going to evolve. Society evolves. Like there are things that society, you know, used to deem very acceptable that it doesn't anymore.

Like right now we could be doing things in comedy or in conversations that people think are cool today. And then in 20 years, they'll be like, oh, we might even go, huh, I can't believe I spoke like that. Oh, I can't believe I said that. I hadn't realized. I hadn't realized. I wasn't looking at it through that lens. Yes. There's more to understand. There's a lot we don't understand. That's true. I do also wonder, maybe you think about this, do you ever think about how we find the balance between caring what everybody thinks about everything we create and also creating because we think something is worth creating. Yeah. I do. That balance is, that's the balance right there. Because if you start to care too much about how it's received, you will be paralyzed by that.

So it has to come from within about what appeals to you. You know, you come at it from that. And if it lands, fabulous. Right. But if it doesn't, well, at least you're true to yourself so you can walk away with your head high. That's what I think. How is, like, so here's what I think. I always think it's about acknowledging the possibility that you might share the world

with somebody else, but then still moving forward with what's true to you. Yeah. You know, so it's like I try and do comedy the way I drive, like when I'm on the road. I drive because I'm trying to get somewhere and I, you know, I'll change lanes when I feel it's appropriate, but I acknowledge that there may be other people using the road. So I am amazed that you've brought this up because I have often thought that if government and people in societies, let's see, I'm going to want to articulate this just right. I wish very much that politics could work exactly as you say because in other words, you want to get ahead of the car in front of you, okay, that's fine.

But you're not going to do it so that you, unless you're out of your mind, you're not going to do it so you're going to drive that other car off the road, right? So there are parameters of respect that are built in and self-preservation. Yeah. We all want to get somewhere quickly, I assume. Yeah. But there is an understanding that we're all doing it at once and that has to be understood. Anyway, I don't know. It sounds maybe silly, but-

No, I love that. I think it's because here's what I... I mean, I could be wrong. I think what's happened in the world is we are... in many ways, we've become so insulated from each other that we no longer believe that other people are actually moving in a direction that is similar to us. There was something that we should never take for granted about everyone watching the same show, even if you didn't like it, but having a similar point of reference about what reality is and where you want to go and how you see other people. And I think politics is the same now.

We now exist in a space where people go, it's me and it's you, and you not trying to do the same thing. I don't even think your kids are real human beings. Are they kids? It's me or you. Yes, exactly. Zero sum. And I feel like going back to the beginning of this, like with comedy, I don't think comedy is a zero-sum game. I think it is possible to laugh with and at people with them knowing that it is like they're doing it with you as well. Does that make sense? Totally. And to that point, so I had the great

opportunity, honor to meet Supreme Court Justice Elena Kagan. Oh wow. This was a number of years ago. This was back when Veep was on the air. And she told me that she and Justice Scalia, who was alive obviously at that time, they would get together weekly and talk about the show. No way. Swear. And they would talk about the show and what they loved and blah, blah, blah,

and laugh about the episode. And that was a dream. That is a dream to me. That is a dream to me. I'm pretty almost 100% sure. Nothing about any decisions Scalia ever made is lines up with how I think. However, the fact that he was able to enjoy it and she was and they were both able to laugh at it. That is magic. That's magic. That is magic. That's magic. Yeah. So there you go. Mm-hmm. All right. There's a question I ask everybody on the podcast. Okay. Because of the name of the podcast, What Now? And everyone has a different What Now for me. After speaking to you, I feel like the What

Now question for me is more like, What Now as you go into this stage of life, if we want to call it that, because it, you know, it feels like now you're in a different movie vibe, but also like a different person vibe. Is there a what now for you? Where do we find you and what is the now that you're moving on to? Well, I feel like I'm just starting. I feel like I've got a lot more to get done. In life?

Yeah. Yeah, I do. I feel like I'm still going. I am still going, but what I mean is is that there's a lot more from that I would like to be able to chew on. Oh. Sink my teeth into. Do you know what it is? No, but I just feel that way. That's a great way to be. I'd like to do a musical on film. Yeah, that would be really fun. I like this for you. I also ask you because I've noticed in a bunch of your interviews, people, you'll say something like this and then it happens.

I don't know if you've noticed that about yourself. No, I haven't. Someone asked you if you'd ever do a Marvel movie and then you were like, yeah, I'll do it pew pew. And then you were in one pew pew. Yeah. And I just, I just wrapped like a week ago. So this could be... Pew, pew, pew, pew. That's the movie guys. I just gave like a week ago. So this could be- Pew, pew, pew, pew.

That's the movie guys, I just gave it away. Spoiler alert. But this has been fun. Really fun. I mean, it's really nice to just have a conversation and talk. Yeah. Well, that's what I have selfishly always wanted to do with you. I think your brain is probably one of the most powerful and interesting brains. And because it's like society, it's not acceptable to like take brains out of heads. And I like

to then speak to the person who has the brain in them and try and understand a little bit of the magic that it contains. Do you want me to like when I die, do you want my brain to examine it? I wouldn't be able to understand it. I would like that, but I wouldn't be able to understand it. So then I would just have a mushy thing. In formaldehyde sitting on your bookshelf. Yeah, it's not great. This is what I would like and this is what you gave me. I hope one day there's just like a museum of all your works.

Yeah, I'd like there to be a museum too. You know what I mean? I'd like a museum. That'll be my next thing. I need a museum. I think it would be great. Think about it. We walk through the museum of your performances, your comedy, your drama, your life, your impact. I think you might even be shocked at how amazing that museum would be.

Can I tell you something? First of all, you have a lifetime membership to that museum. Thank you very much. Just giving that to you right now. And if anyone's listening and they want to donate to the Louis Dreyfus Brain Museum Fund, we will get you the HTTP, blah, et cetera. Right. Yeah, we'll put the link up. We'll put the link up. This was so much fun. Thank you. Likewise. I feel the same. Yeah. Thank you for being. I hope there's not too much selling of the movie as you carry on. No, but also just the right amount so people see it. Go and see it.

That's the one thing I will say to everyone. Go and see it because it is a fascinating, funny for me in more parts than maybe for you, possibly disgusting, but all around beautiful exploration into the meaning of life by Examining death at our door. There we go Perfect. Thank you What now with Trevor Noah is produced by Spotify studios in partnership with Day Zero Productions and Fullwell 73. The show is executive produced by Trevor Noah, Ben Winston, Sanaz Yamin and Jodie Avigan. Our senior producer is Jess Hackl, Marina Henke and Claire Slaughter are our producers. Music, mixing and mastering by Hannes Brown.

Thank you so much for listening. Join me next Thursday for another episode of What Now. Thank you so much for listening. Join me next Thursday for another episode of What Now?