What's Your Drama - "F-CK, PEOPLE"

Episode Date: March 21, 2017

Welcome back to the Sasha Answers Podcast!Every week is important to us, but on today's show I think there is an even bigger opportunity for you guys to get in on the conversation, so please send us your input as we'd love to hear it!On the show: When feelings for a co-worker get out of control, how to heal after being sexually abused, and if changing a child's name can be seen as empowering or surrendering. These are the links we discuss in the second answer for “Juliet” and anyone else who has been abused and needs a resource: www.casac.ca/ and www.rainn.org.Thanks again for listening and keep your questions coming to me at [e-mail] and/or tweet us at @sasha_tong and @laineygossip. And of course give us some feedback love on iTunes and Google Play.S.xx  Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hi, this is Lainey and welcome to the Lainey Gossip Podcast for Sasha Answers. Hi, Sasha. Hi, how's it going? It's good. Another week. Another week. I've actually been meaning to ask you what you think, like if you were Jennifer Lopez's best friend, Leah Remini.

Who I love. Who you… I know. That's what I'm thinking. I really love Leah Remini. I mean, what would you say to her about A-Rod? Because I don't think there's anything… If you're J-Lo's friend, I think that you have learned that her taste in men is equivalent

to dog shit, right? So you just kind of give up. What advice do you give her when, like, consecutively she just picks big old dumpster, like, dumpster diving losers? I feel like a lot of people out there must be in the same scenario where they watch their friends only go for the worst people. Yeah. And…

What do I need to know about A-Rod? Like, I know that he dated Cameron Diaz. Like, I don't really care who J-Lo dates, right? Because, again, it's, like, so uneventful and lame. But, like, is he a loser? Well, I think that if you want to start professionally, he's a doper. Right. Yeah.

So, you know, some people would say that that speaks to character because he doped and then he lied about doping and then when he got caught lying about no wait when he got caught doping and then lying about doping then he blamed other people so there's definitely that aspect and they pushed him like the yankees were like they like fuck off whatever he had like a one year suspension or he had some kind of suspension that he served and he was like a bitch about it right you know as if like i don't deserve this and blah blah blah and other people made me do like whatever I mean all you're saying I'm sorry and I'm not sorry kind of bullshit so number one professionally like he's not an upstanding um I don't know professional okay yeah but he's dated

Cameron he's dated Cameron I think he put his dick inside Kate Hudson a few times Minca Kelly um wasn't that Minca Kelly or no that was Derek Jeter same difference well no no no because Derek Jeter didn't dope. That's fair. Fine. Like, Derek Jeter's probably considered one of the greatest Yankees of all time, and he played for the same team, and he played clean. But personality-wise.

Fuck the professionalism. Another… So, here's one detail about A-Rod. He apparently has in his bedroom a portrait of himself as a centaur and sleeps underneath it or facing it. See, that's… So they're not going to last, right? The only reason why J.Lo has established longer relationships than most in Hollywood is because

she gets like the backup dancer, right? The kind of the second rate person. She's the star. The waiter, the backup dancer. This isn't going to last with A-Rod. Not that there's anything… Like people are like, you're such an elitist and you made fun of her for dating a backup dancer.

No. I would want to dance backup dancers. There's nothing wrong with that. But in terms of stardom. Well, don't give him, like, a CEO position in your fucking company. Fuck the backup dancer. Fuck him eight times a day if you want, but keep him in the fucking chorus line. You don't have to make him the director of your tour, is what I'm saying, and buy him

a truck and, like, basically pave his career for him. He can do that by himself. That's the problem with the backup dancer. Yeah, but the same could be said about, like, not that Jacek's a backup dancer, but, like, you guys merged a business together. Like, you know what I mean? He's not like, he's like your fucking right-hand man. Why couldn't Casper also be her right-hand man?

I think that the difference is that J-Lo built J-Lo all by herself. Right, that's true. Lainey Gossip was not built just by me. That's true. Fine, fair. Thank you. Yeah, it's like you're not a backup dancer. You're not Casper.

But thanks for, you know, thinking that for 30 seconds, Ash. That's comforting. Well, no, because I was just thinking, can't you bring your partner into your, like, into your world and also, like, forge a business, forge, like, your creative path together? I don't think… Because that's what she did. He fucking choreographed her whole fucking tour. Yeah, and it was shit.

Like, as soon as she started working with other choreographers, her moves… Shit got better. Oh, way better. That's true. Like, do you remember? What was that performance? He just lift… Like, there was lots of lifting with her, right?

He was bullshit. He also did Nicki Minaj's videos, too, which were bullshit. Yeah. Okay, but A-Rod, good for her. It'll last, like, one hot minute. I don't know. Like, A-Rod is giving me some serious Ben Affleck vibes. That's funny because, well, I feel like he's already Ben Affleck.

He's, like, a very pretty boy. Pretty, pretty, pretty boy. I, whatever. I think he's gross. Okay. Like, in the face. But they're just, like, I mean, every other guy she's dated has been short except for Ben Affleck and A-Rod.

I mean, I'm just basing this on height. But do you remember when she was Ben Affleck, she kind of like melted into his body and was like, protect me and like shoulder me and shelter me. And I feel like the A-Rod thing is giving me the same vibes. Anyway, so… So what's your… Okay, then let's just give a… J-Lo is just like us, I guess.

Goes for bad men or just, you know, there's her… I mean, she's otherworldly in so many ways in terms of her empire, her career, her fucking skin. Like the woman… insane. Has not changed in 25. She looks more beautiful. Yeah. More beautiful. So maybe this is her way of like showing that she's human after all. Okay. Is her eyes and her heart suck. Like. Okay, wait. Then give me just like what's your fortune telling? How long? How long are you giving it? How long are you giving it? I bet you she's going to

marry him. Oh, God. Really? Fuck yeah. Or at least get engaged. Oh. Wow. Okay. I'm giving four months tops by the end of the summer it's over oh my god no i think that she loves really she's hanging out with his sister now like there's meeting of the families yeah it's whatever and he's fucking using her too because he's starting a career in broadcasting yes oh so now he gets to like hype up his career he's like the big man on the new big man on the set and with his like you know marquee girlfriend and whatnot he's a fucking control freak as soon as like I mean, I don't think he's going to be done with her in four months, is what I'm saying. Okay, fair.

Anyway, shall we? Okay, so, dear Sasha and Lainey, I desperately need your straight talk and practical advice for a situation that's been causing me heartache for the better part of the last two years. Here are the quick points, but strap in for the full story. I've fallen for a co-worker. My husband knows. The co-worker doesn't. I'm trying and so far failing to find a new job.

Jesus. Okay. Wow. Okay, so here are some details. She's been married for 10 years. They married young and they're different people, but by and large, I was happy with our relationship and stupid in love with my husband. Let's call him B.

Most of the time, our differences helped us grow into better people. I started with J, working with J, almost four years ago. We got along great from the start. It was definitely a case of friendly work spouses. Oddly enough, his personality is almost a blend of mine and B's. Suddenly, a couple of years ago, I found myself developing feelings for Jay and not just sexy time feelings, because if that's all this was, I would happily use that as fantasy fuel and carry on.

No, I've got capital F feelings. Tried to shake the feelings, but then instead of that, just saw all of B's flaws, that's the husband, magnified and things started to get rough. I didn't say anything to B about J because I have no intention of acting on them. I wanted to make my marriage stronger, so I brought forward my concerns. We briefly went to marriage counseling, but it was a bust. I just got more bitter and resentful and angry. I started to imagine divorce, but knew that the stress was taking a toll on me emotionally,

so I went to a psychologist on my own. She helped me work through a lot of stuff, and I was finally starting to feel like I could make clear decisions and choices. I knew this wasn't a matter of choosing B or J. it was about deciding whether I wanted to stay married. Then B read a notebook of mine last summer and the truth about my feelings came to light. For the record, how he found out has created some other trust issues that we need to work through, but just run with me here. The time right after this all exploded was a truly shitty period, but it gave B a bit of a

wake-up call and we've been working hard on our relationship. I'd already set up all the boundaries I could with J without making things weird around the office, which I explained to B. By that point, I knew I needed a new job and that when I left, I would have to completely cut ties with Jay. B, the husband, asked me to avoid spending time with Jay alone, which I agreed to, but we haven't talked about that whole situation since July or so, and God knows I don't want to bring it up. I've never discussed this with Jay because there's no good outcome to that conversation.

Like, what's the best, like, what's the best case scenario? Break up two families and have our own relationship, which could well fall apart too. I've been mourning the upcoming loss of Jay's friendship for months now While also trying to improve my marriage Looking for a new job in my small city And terrible economy And keeping up boundaries with Jay All to varying degrees of success

And still the feelings persist I miss Jay being just my friend Someone I could crack jokes and commiserate with Someone I could rely on for support Someone I didn't have to police myself around To make sure I'm not laughing too hard Or talking to for too long about non-work things Frankly, I'm fucking exhausted and I don't know what else is there to do.

I've talked, thought myself in circles over all this for months and years and have no solid plans to help me move past this aside from this elusive hope of a new job. My friends have been a great support, but all of us are stumped on how to improve things. I'm not sure I have a solid question I want to ask, but any help or advice you can offer is welcome. Signed, Tired. I'm tired listening to that. Yeah.

Okay. Oh, in short, she's married to B, she's in love with J. J doesn't know B knows I guess they're trying to work on their marriage she needs to find a new job find a goddamn new job like what stands out to me is like I get it finding a new job is difficult but you've been trying for four years and you haven't managed to get a new job like I feel like that if if in fact you're working on your relationship and B is who you want to be with and as she says it's so this is so fucking exhausting like having to like I don't know deal with your emotions with Jay, but not deal with your emotions with Jay. Like get a new fucking

job. Get a new fucking job. I don't know. That doesn't feel, I feel my spidey senses are just kind of tingling here telling me that I don't know if she's really putting in 110% effort to find a new job. Maybe I'm being a biatch, but just that's how I feel. You? Well, my question is, okay, so she finds a new job. Is that going to help her marriage? No, but at least the temptation is cut out of it, right? So that you're not constantly distracted by seeing this person that you feel all these feelings for. How do you know there's not going to be a new person at the new job?

Like, I think I don't think the… Oh, okay. I don't think Jay is really the problem. The problem is that I don't know that you, tired, want to stay in this marriage. Like, you know, I'm not sure that you've been to therapy together. you've been to therapy by yourself, you are exhausted now because you still have feelings for this other person. So clearly, I don't know if you are doing anybody justice. You're not doing your husband, but she won't… Barely. Right. But she won't know if the husband that she's with,

B is really her ride or die until she completely cuts out J, right? Until she can forge a new path with B, work on the relationship, and then see at the end where it's going to go, that's kind of, you know what I mean? Like, that's the first step. I don't think we can be like, well, how about if you get a new job and you find someone else you want to fuck? Like, I feel like we need to give her the benefit of the doubt and the relationship a benefit of the doubt.

Who's to say she's going to stop thinking about J when she gets a new job? But you at least have to fucking try that. I don't know. Like, the way that she's talking is like, I miss talking to him. I miss joking with him. I miss laughing with him. I miss this. I mean, like, she misses it already and she hasn't even left the job yet.

She's going to miss it even more. Well, out of sight, out of mind a bit, don't you think? Like, the temptation is so there. Not after four years. Okay, so what are you saying? She should leave B&B with Jay? No, because I think that Jay's in a relationship too. She talked about two families.

Yeah, no, I know. I think you need to sort yourself out and be on your own or at least have some sort of trial separation. Like… Wow, that's bold. I totally didn't think you were going to say that. Okay. I wouldn't say it if she hadn't told us that she has already tried joint therapy and

that she's already been through therapy by herself and she's still so unhappy and so exhausted. and her husband is now like asking her, please, can you not see Jay? And because I don't blame him. I don't blame, would you blame him? Of course not. Of course. He's the victim in this.

Exactly. And then she talked vaguely about some trust issues and finding a diary. So then there's that on top of everything else. Like I, I'm not convinced that removing herself from the Jay situation is going to miraculously fix this marriage. All right. Hit me up for one second on, again, I know we've talked about this before, but the way that you and Jacek started. You were dating someone, correct? Correct. Okay, so play it out

this way, right? You were dating somebody who I guess you loved? Clearly not. Okay, but in the idea of wanting to… I thought that it was… We've been together for two, three years, like a long time. So Jacek then comes in, sweeps in, and you blow off the boyfriend you're with to be with him, right? Oh, fuck no. I lied for six months. Okay. So I feel like you would know… you must kind of feel tired's pain a bit, right? Oh, I… look, my pain or exhaustion was different because I was like fucking lying to Jacek and lying to the other dude. So it's a different kind of like exhaustion when you're like lying to everybody. Of course. I don't think that her exhaustion is coming from, like, lying to everybody else. The exhaustion is coming from

lying to herself. But how about if her Jay is like your Jay? Like, is like Jacek? How about if she really is fighting off the feelings of wanting to be with Jay even though it's just not ideal? I'm not here to encourage her to go with Jay. I'm… You went with Jay. Yeah, but he wasn't married. Okay. So that, right. That adds a different layer. Like she's talking about ruining two families. So my assumption here is that Jay has a family. Otherwise there wouldn't be two relationships. So I, I feel like, listen, in my situation, thank God, nobody was married. Nobody had pieces of paper, nobody had kids, whatever. But in this situation, I'm getting the impression that Jay has his own life. And I'm not here to encourage her to just

run from like the husband over to somebody else. Like we always talk about needing space for yourself. She's talking about how they were sweethearts from a long time and they grew together, but then they grew apart. And so there's a lot here about trying to figure out who she is on her own. And I think it might be time to answer that question. I'm not in disagreement with you at all on that, but I think there are a few steps before getting to a divorce, which is kind of what you were advocating here. I said trial separation. Trial separation. Trial separation. I don't think the type of person that she seems to be, I don't think she's going to pull the plug so quickly on that. That's why I'm saying at least

get a fucking new job. And then see what bubbles up from there. Yeah, maybe you still look at B and you're like, fuck this shit. I don't want to be with this shit. And then you can go into the trial separation. I think there has to be a few more steps of, like, understanding where you are, who you want to be with, who you are when you're by yourself, all that good stuff. You know what I mean? Like, I agree, but she needs to do some other moves before she does the big move. Yeah. I mean, that's… I understand that, like, you can't just jump right into a big move. That's why I'm suggesting a trial separation. My feeling here, though, is that because she's been through therapy, because she's been through all kinds of, you know, iterations of, I won't do

this, I've pulled back, and this, we've already lost, quotes, in quotes, four years. So you go through another whatever stages that you're suggesting and then what happens? Then to arrive at the same place? Like she, there is no point in her letter where she says, I love my husband, he is my ride or die. She hasn't said, she hasn't used any language to describe B in a way. Rather, she's using that language to describe Jay. I love laughing with him. I can be myself with him. I don't have to hold back. I just think that's a bit of the grass is a bit greener. Like, I don't think she has allowed her relationship, her marriage to actually really heal from this because she's still in an environment with the guy that she is enamored by. And that's impossible

to do. When you see the grass is greener every goddamn day, how are you able to concentrate on the relationship that may or may not matter to you? You know, I couldn't do it. If I was, I was at work and there was some hot piece of ass that just, and was wonderful and like attractive and funny, I would have a hard time, I would have a hard time concentrating on my relationship that I felt was kind of broken. I wouldn't be able to heal my relationship if I fucking wanted to get healed by the coworker. But dude, don't you hear what you're saying? Like, then what is the point? Like, if something is not important enough for you to be able to focus on it no matter what the distraction is, then how important is it to you? Well, I just feel like

people are flawed and people are weak sometimes and it's so much easier to go for the it's so much easier to go the easy route which is to just fantasize about someone instead of putting like like knee-deep hard work into the relationship that you are in currently I'm not sure that like removing herself is if you're talking about weakness here I'm not sure that removing herself from this situation is going to, like, cure the weakness. Okay. So we're basically her friend group here. We haven't, we're not helping.

No, but think about it. Like, for four years, she has developed feelings that have, she, you know, has not acted on. So she has had nothing to go on, not even scraps. All she gets from this person is seeing them at work. And that's been enough for her. Like, not a kiss, not whatever. And so it's going to be the same when she leaves. When she leaves the job, she's still not kissing him.

She's still not holding his hand. She's still not fucking him. She's still in her head with him. I don't know how that's going to change. I just feel like a lot of relationships go through some bad times. And four years, while seems like quite a bit, isn't that uncommon. Like people have like solid like six-year droughts in their marriage until they're like, oh, fuck, right.

You know what I mean? Like, they've taken advantage of all the wonderful things in a relationship and have tossed them to the side. And then six years later, they realize that who they have is who they should be with. I agree. And then it flourishes. I agree. I'm just not sure that I'm feeling the want from…

Right. …from this woman. So, hey, tired, you have two choices. The first choice is Sasha's recommendation. Sasha does not believe you that you have tried hard enough to find a new job. So try harder to find a new job. This doesn't sound like you're into my choice. No, you know, try harder to find a new job and get one, and then remove Jay from your

immediate consciousness and refocus yourself on your marriage. Yes. Option A. Option B is me, trial separation. I don't believe you that you want to fix your marriage. It doesn't sound like to me that you do. It sounds to me like you might want to ruin Jay's marriage or relationship. don't do that. Instead, work on you. This is gangster advice from you today. I enjoy this.

That's it. So good luck. Let us know how it goes. You said you wanted some tough talk and that's hopefully what you were looking for. And we're sorry if it wasn't tough enough or we're sorry if it didn't help. Right. Next. Hi, Sash and Lainey. I'm going to try and make it simple. My parents divorced when I was young, and my mother remarried Vitalik after that. Their marriage didn't bother me at all. I was happy to see my mom happy, and at the time, I had nothing against Vitalik. Two years later, my mom got pregnant, and my father, who had custody of me and my brother, told us that we will go to Canada in 10 months, which was in October. So just to make it clear, my mom stayed in Moldova, which is my country. Yes, it was hard for her to sign the

papers to allow us to go to the other side of the world, but everyone knew that it was for our best interest. My problem begins in September, one month before coming to Canada. My mom just had my little stepbrother and I was sleeping at her place in the weekends. This one night, I woke up and Vitalik's hand was touching my private parts. I was 11 at the time. I pretended I was sleeping and tried to turn over, but he kept me in place and continued playing with my clitoris. So I just did nothing and pretended that I was sleeping till my mom, 10 minutes after, woke up because my stepbrother was crying. Vitalik then moved away and went to the bathroom. I insisted after that I wanted to sleep next to my mother. The morning after, I was really thinking to tell my mom what

happened, but I knew that this will cause their marriage to fall apart and my stepbrother of one month had to live with separated parents like me. I didn't want that for him because I knew how much it sucked and I was going to Canada in one month anyway. Why destroy the happiness of my mom and her new baby? Fast forward 11 years later, I am 22. I know now that I didn't manage the whole situation the right way and it damaged me even more. My mom divorced Vitalik five years ago because he was partying too much and was an irresponsible person. I went to Moldova when I was 15 and he did like nothing happened and wanted a hug from me and the polite stuff. I played the game and said nothing. After that, I was so mad at myself for not standing up for myself. This

winter, I went back in Moldova and I promised myself that I didn't want to see him. I couldn't do that. He was always there because, oh, I have to stay with my son. So it really troubled me at first that I had to stay at the same table with him, but at least I was making it very visible to everyone that I didn't like that person. I didn't talk to him. I wasn't smiling and I wasn't giving goodbye kisses on the cheek. No one really understood why I was acting this way with him, but they were respectful of my decisions. My dilemma is coming from this burning rage that I have inside me. It has been so long.

It's not like he did something really bad. Sorry, I just need to reread that. It's not like he did something really bad. It was bad, yes, but there are kids who are living worse. And it has been 11 years, but I can't get over it. It frustrates me that no one knows about what happened, But in the meantime, if I tell someone now, what for? It has been 11 years telling my mom or my older brother who is in Canada with me will

do nothing good. I can't really find a reason to speak up. Maybe it won't even help me to get this rage out of me. I'm really trying to move along, but I think seeing him this January really triggered something in me. I was mentally preparing myself to go in Moldova, and now I realize it didn't help at all. I'm thinking about what he did to me all the time, and then the tears and the frustration come along.

So what should I do? Do I tell my mother and my older brother, or I just seek help from some special organization to help me go through my thoughts? By the way, I am speaking with my mom by Skype every month or two. Thank you for taking time to read this long message. She didn't leave a name, so I want to give her my favorite name in the world. Okay. Or a name I really love.

I love the name Juliet. Okay. Okay, Juliette. Thank you for sharing that with us. That was, wow. Okay. Where are you at? Well, I mean, the thing that strikes me the most is obviously I feel so horrible for her. And I'm also angry that she's had to carry this burden for so long. And that like most victims, she is continually kind of blaming herself. And I hate that. I hate that, that that can happen to somebody and then it plagues them for that long. So I just am thinking about that right now. But first and foremost, I think that, I think she's in a place where she doesn't think that

expressing her feelings is going to help her. But I feel like you and I both will agree that it absolutely will. It will set her on a path of healing these wounds. And I don't think she has to tell her mother and brother and also seek a therapist all at the same time. I don't think she needs to fucking do all that. But the first thing she needs to do, though, I would say is go to therapy, talk your feelings out, leave that to the professionals. And in that way, you can process your feelings and process your emotions, and then you can be able to share that information. Yeah. I totally agree that you don't have to do everything all at the same time, Juliet. In fact, I think that that's what's overwhelming you. Part of it is, you know, you're talking

about whether or not you should tell your mom, whether or not you should tell your brother, whether or not you should seek help for yourself. It doesn't have to be a group decision all at once, just make one decision. And that decision, though, has to be you. Choose you. And the reason I say this is because you have written in a couple of places here, you've said, it's not like he did something really bad. It was bad, yes, but there are kids who are living worse. I understand what you mean, and I think that that is very generous of you. You seem like a very big hearted person and you're like, hey, you know, like I, I have, I'm healthy and I have friends, so I must not be in the worst place.

But the thing is, Juliette, this is your worst. This is the worst thing that's ever happened to you. So that's how you have to switch your perspective here. Your worst is what happened to you when you were 11 and it's been 11 years. so for half of your life, for 50% of your life, you have not addressed the worst thing that's happened to you. Don't let another 50% of your life go by by not prioritizing you. So that's number one. Number two, I feel like you said, I can't really find a reason to speak up as though this isn't important or the result would be meaningless. And again, I go back to you and

your wellness. The reason to speak up or at least to talk to somebody is because you should be important to you. So when you start prioritizing yourself and your wellness and your mental health, these are the decisions you make. That's not a statement you make anymore. I don't see what the point in doing that is. The point is, is that it's time for you to take care of you. So, I need a little bit more time if we need, like, if you need more research on this, then let us know because we really just read your emails cold, so we don't have time to, like, look into. But there is the CASAC, which is the Canadian Association of Sexual assault centers. So within that, I think that there are recommendations and there are links

that you can start reading. If you don't want to see someone right away, you can at least read the information on this page that will help you at least gain some understanding, get some insight, hear about others who have been through the same thing and who've made it through in terms of their recovery and are still working on their recovery we've recommended rain before that's rain r-a-i-n-n dot org um and uh there's lots of resources at rain as well i mean i think rain is primarily in the u.s um but still the information yeah um and if you need more recommendations because in every neighborhood, there are organizations, community groups that help victims of sexual abuse. This is what's happened to you. So let's call it what it is. That's the first step.

Victims of sexual abuse talk about their issues, get help, go through treatment. Yeah. In every community, there are amazing people doing amazing work. And so we encourage you to definitely look into that. And more importantly, the reason, let's start repeating this over and over again, the reason you're doing it is because it's time to take care of yourself. Okay. And keep us posted, please, Juliet. Last question. Okay. I need some advice regarding my son. I will give you some background. I'm Brazilian, married to an Iraqi, and we have a 13-year-old son. I chose a very Arabic name for my son because I love it. I think it's a beautiful name. He's been having problems at school, especially now, with kids calling him names, calling

him a terrorist, telling him to go back to his country, he was born in Canada, asking if he carries a bomb inside his backpack. The school is no help, and I confess that I wasn't any help in the beginning. The bullying started when the Boston bomber was caught. The kids started saying my son looked like him and started calling him the Boston bomber. My son complained to me, but I laughed and said, you do look exactly like him. wrong answer my son was never able to really get over it and i deeply regret that i wasn't able to understand his feelings he's a genius kid with adhd who has social issues so friendships are

not easy for him now he wants to change his name before going to high school he says he is not a muslim not arab proudly canadian his words and that he should be able to make his own decision regarding his name my husband and i think he shouldn't give in just because some people are shitheads. He's very proud of his Latino ancestry, and we think he should be proud of his Arab ancestry too. As a Latina, I understand prejudice. My husband always has problems getting back into the country after going to see his family back home, but it is okay because we understand national security. But it is like the racists are coming out of the woods. The bullying is getting so much worse. People who are not minorities are not seeing this. How is this possible? I'm so confused

and hurt for him. Should I just give in and change his name? Please help. Fuck. I know. Like, fuck people. I fucking hate people. Yep. It's just… Fuck people. Sorry. I just have to, like… Yeah. It's just such a… It also… This story just is so… It's just so present day. It's what we're all dealing with, what we're all fighting against And it's just such a shame that, oh, that it, like a person, like a little kid had to face that. And now going into high school, they want to rid themselves of their identity because they don't think they're good enough or they'll fit in or, you know what I mean?

I just, I'm, I, I hate this so much. I just, I mean, I, I'm torn as is she. I am torn too. She's torn too. And I just, I don't think that you can be anything but torn. Like, I understand why he wants to change his name. And I understand why he wants to change his identity. Like, on a very, on a much smaller level, and I've discussed it here before, when I

grew up Chinese in an all-white community, like, I wanted to, like, perm my hair. You wanted to be Kelly. Not exactly. No, no, of course. I wanted to perm my hair and, like, change my eyelids. and I remember Jacek telling me that like there were times, his name is Jacek, it's actually not pronounced Jacek, like the proper pronunciation, he's going to roll his eyes because I don't know, apparently I never do it right, but the proper Polish pronunciation

is Jacek and like he goes by Jacek just because like, you know, it was easier for others. Canadian, like non-European people fuck it up all the time and it was just easier for him not, like easier for him to stop correcting people. Right. And I remember him telling me, like, there were times that he even went by his middle name, like, which is very standard and everybody can pronounce it. And that's, like, on the, like, that doesn't even come close to what this kid is going through. So I get it. Well, isn't this very similar to, I feel like you posted this, but maybe I'm wrong, Mahershala Ali, how he shortened his name as well when he moved or when he started getting jobs in Hollywood.

Yeah. And he is Muslim. Yeah. So I wonder if, I mean, that was probably a pronunciation thing because it's like 15,000 syllables, his first name. Well, Mahershala is shortened from an 18-letter first name. And so he was finding that in some, like on some movie posters, it wasn't fitting. And so he struggled with it for a long time. Right.

But Mahershala, and then for fucking Jimmy Kimmel to go and fucking make fun of him at that. Fuck you too. Anyway, I'm just fucking everybody now. Yeah. Yeah. But anyway, so, um, but we both get like, we get the idea. I'm torn and you're torn. I don't know what the answer is here. I feel like, but before we get into that, do you accept that the school is not helping? Cause I don't know if I don't want to, like, I don't know if I want to accept that. And look, I don't, she didn't give any more details about the school. I get that.

But what happened then is you start causing a fucking, and it's not fair either, but you start causing a fuss. And then it just becomes this big fucking drama at school. And then you were putting even more attention on your son going, like your son at high school. Do you know what I mean? I get that. I see that. And yet I worry that if the school isn't taken to task or at least asked to mediate this situation, how many other kids are going to be affected? So are all the kids who are getting bullied because they're, you know, they have, they come from Muslim or Arabic backgrounds? Are all of them going to change their names? Well, it's the struggle of fighting the fight. How do you fight the fight without making it a hundred times worse for

yourself? I don't know what the answer to that is, right? We're all stuck in this time of exactly this? How do you, how do you push back against stupidity and evilness and ignorance? How do you do that in a way that you actually can make a positive change? Did she say that they're changing schools? I don't know. I don't think so. Because, you know, like I, the fact of the matter is, is that at this point, if he stays in that school and he changes his name, those kids who bully him are still going to know him from his old name. So, I kind of, like, wonder if there is going, like, this whole identity change or this name change is accompanying, like, a school change as well, right?

He's 13. So, I wonder if, like, that is kind of the age where you go from, what, middle school into high school. So if he's going to be going into high school and for him, I can imagine I want a fresh start, right? Like I'm going to go into a new school. I don't know any of these. I'm going to say goodbye to those motherfucking assholes. And then I get to go into a school with a new identity and a fresh start. I mean, that, dude, that sounds appealing to me too. Who wouldn't that sound appealing to? I just, you want to, but you want to stay true to values and being proud of where you come from. And no

No shame from, yeah, where your ancestors are from and where your name comes from. Like, that is the struggle, right? The struggle is how you can do that. And I wonder, oh, I hate even having to give this advice, is I wonder if you can do two things at the same time, which is, I guess, change his name. I'm just talking this out. Change his name, but at the same time, like, being there for him, still educating him on why you're doing this and the times that we live in and all that like being able to combine both

of those so that he doesn't end up you know 10 years down the line looking back and being like I don't know who the fuck I am I totally whitewashed myself because of the stupid society we fucking live in right now I would hate that I would hate that regret of flash forward when he's an adult and realizing that what he did was by changing his name was maybe something that he didn't want to do do you know what I mean but but if at the same time you're giving him that you're giving him um like I don't want to say education but like giving him um knowledge of where he's from and being proud of that but at the same time uh trying to navigate the time that he's in high school with fucking bullies yeah I don't know I don't know either I just you know I

think about when I was 13 and the stories I hear still about what it's like to be 13 and that age period. And nobody wants to stand out at that age. No. You want to blend in. You want to blend in and you want to be part of everybody else. You don't want to be different. So this is that being different magnified by one million and then basically being punished

over and over again by people that you just want acceptance from. It's awful. Yeah. And so I don't know if that desire to fit in is any match at 13 for cultural pride. You know, I just don't know if I'm 13 and I hate what's happening to me, all I can think of is I just need to fix it. I just don't, wouldn't want that hate in that moment to carry on for a lifetime because there are a lot of people who started to hate who they were at a very young age and continue to hate themselves into adulthood. I guess what, I guess I totally

agree. And that's why this is so hard. And yet we have seen that the only way to address or to balance out the hate that you've received is to feel love and acceptance from people who are kind and who are sensitive. And right now, he doesn't feel like he's getting any of that. I want him to have a chance to be able to go into new friendships and new communities, hopefully, and new environments where the people he meets are going to be like, oh, hey, let's play let's do video games i don't know what a 13 year old boy does right now but like let's talk about this let's talk about that i want him to have that and be confident yes so and i feel like when he has more of that and if he's able if he gets the chance to go into those spaces where

he feels safe then that will start to maybe fight the hate that he's received the only way right They say the only way to fight hate, and I'm sorry to get corny, is with love. So where is he going to find that and how is he going to get that? Right now, he thinks that he's going to get that by changing his name. There's something that you could do, which is he is half Latino as well, right? Yeah. And seems very proud of this right now. He's embracing that side of him.

Yep. So instead of giving him a generic white name like Adam or something like that, maybe go into your Latino roots and find something that has a little spice still, but is school generic friendly so that at least you're not completely taking him out of his roots. And the one that he's feeling more affinity to right now, which is Latino, then maybe he can be more proud of that so that we're not completely taking him outside of who he actually is. You know, as someone who is like half Yugoslav and half Chinese, like I had a struggle between those two. I didn't want to be Chinese for a long time. So it was great that I got to lean on the Yugoslav side and have

the name Sasha. But as I grew older, I really do, I really embrace a lot of my Chinese roots. So do you know what I mean? Like you fluctuate as you grow older. So I wonder instead of just giving him a generic name, you at least appease him with a slightly nickname-y different name. That leans into the Latino roots. It leans into the Latino roots. I mean, I, and I, like, let's be clear here. I don't know that you and I are going to find an answer. And I'm actually thinking of, like, shooting this over to Duanna and having her write a

response to this as well, given that that's why she wrote a book about names and how important they are and how attached to identity we are with our names. I like that suggestion. I would go even further. I mean, I like it. I don't know if the people listening are going to agree. So if you don't agree, please send us your emails. Tell us you're wrong.

Yell at us. Like, this isn't, there's no easy answer here. And we're sorry. We're struggling too, just like this family is. But I feel like in that scenario, in the most ideal sense, he goes into a new school or a new, at least a new environment with, you know, a name that he still has family connection to, leaning into the Latino roots. But in the end, I think that his strongest connection to the other side of his identity,

his Arab identity, is going to be dad. And so it means that the relationship between dad and son is, I mean, of course, it sounds like it's already very strong, but you and your husband are going to have to look at that as one of the most critical ways that your son is going to stay rooted to his Arabic ancestry is that the man that is the most important man in his life and will be forever, his father is Iraqi and is Arabic. And maybe you just have to trust that his love for his father and his father's love for him will overcome in time this, I hate to say it, but this self-hatred, this shame that has been foisted on him, that people have just bullied into him.

It's just awful. But remember, like that's, in many, many years when he thinks about being Arabic and where his Arabicness comes from, it's going to be dad. so at home I think that you that's going to be your priority your priority is going to be that relationship and you're right and and maybe it won't be absorbed by your son now but obviously if it's continued over his lifetime you know it will by osmosis become something that he cherishes and um and embraces and I just want to say I agree with you Sasha because I feel a tremendous amount of discomfort advocating for a name change because we don't want to give

in to the dark side. We don't want to give in to what's wrong. And in a sense, it does feel like they've won when, when they can, their bullying can force you to shed what is fundamentally part of you. I agree. This is why this is so hard. And yet at the same time, this is a 13 year old child who just wants to feel safe. Yeah. And obviously doesn't feel safe right now. And clearly doesn't feel safe and thinks that safety is in just,

you know, letting go of that label. And I just, shame on the people who like have kids who are doing that. And it's just, it's also just so sad because this is just one instance of I can't even imagine how many examples there are of this. You know what I just heard on the read?

It's one of my favorite podcasts. And at the end of the last episode, Crystal did a read about a school in New Jersey and they were doing this colonialism project where they had to study and reenact things from the colonial past of the United States, which included like, I don't know, talking about the wartime and like historical incidents.

And part of the school project was replicating slave trade advertisements. So these students put together posters. Oh, God. This is so gross. That they used to have all over the place in the U.S. And again, this is credit to the read where I learned about this. They put posters up around the school on the website, slave trade posters where they're like, I don't know, black girl, 12 years old is handy or whatever.

And they put it up. And this was in New Jersey. And nobody, and this has been something they've been doing for 10 years. Not just this year, but for 10 years. And nobody thought in all that time from the school board to the school administration to the teachers until I think a parent this year complained. It took, first of all, a parent. And then, so imagine all the teachers involved, right? Then all the school administrators and all the board people not to care about the fact that black kids would be walking up and down these halls and being like,

oh let's celebrate colonialism when posters of people like us were put up on the walls. It is fucked up. It is fucked up. And that's what's happening. Like this kind of like attitude. So my point is that like yeah

let's I think fucking we all need to do better. Us included. We're not perfect. Oh my god no. Fuck us and everybody. On that note thanks for listening. Yeah. And I think that what's been interesting you know this is this has generated a lot of i think this will generate i hope a lot of discussion

within your groups of friends and your families so if you have feedback for us um and other takes we would love to hear them please do because again we've said repeatedly we don't have the answer and we don't know correct us school us give us wisdom we're here to talk with us talk with us. We're here to learn. And thank you to all of you who have written in to share these really, really serious issues that you're dealing with. And we're honored that you somehow have asked us to help you. And again, this last letter, I'm going to shoot over to Duanna and hopefully she'll be able to have some names, some kind of a response on that too. And we'll post that under the Duanna Names page too.

Okay. Thanks again for listening. Check us out on iTunes, on Google Play. Keep sending us your letters to Sasha at NamesGossip.com and we'll talk to you next time.

Bye. Bye. Thank you.